Speaker 1: Hi, everybody. I'm Stephanie Wilder Taylor, and this is Drunkish.
I wrote a book called Drunkish where I told my
sobriety story, and now I have a podcast so I
can hear other people's stories that you don't even have
to be sober to listen. So curl up with a
mocktail or a beer. There's no judgment here, and please
please give me a review on whatever platform you listen
to your podcast. It really will help me out. And
today I'm so excited about my guest, Lisa Lampanelli. She
had a long career as a stand up comedian. She
was known as the Queen of mean, but you guys,
she's retired from stand up and she's nice now, which
you're going to hear all about. She also currently hosts
the iHeart podcast Shrink This, where she and her co
host Nick discuss real life issues submitted by listeners. And
we had such a good conversation about food issues, codependency,
and so much more. So let's do it.
Speaker 2: Hello.
Speaker 1: I'm thrilled to be here with Lisa. How are you, hey, girl?
Speaker 2: So good to reconnect.
Speaker 1: I know I had you. You made a couple of
appearances I feel like on for crying out loud my
podcast with Lynette Corolla. But now I get you all
to myself.
Speaker 2: Yes, but I wouldn't know what's wild though you are
going to die. I have these long drives sometimes to
see relatives, and I am so speaking of addiction. I'm
so addicted to books audio books about women overcoming something.
So I see your book called It's Drunkish, Yes, drunkish. Yeah.
So I see this and I didn't even look at
the author. I'm just like, oh, this is right up
my alley. I'm listening to it. I'm like, why that
boy sounds so familiar, and then I don't say it's
your name, and I'm like, well, of course it is.
I love that book so much.
Speaker 1: Oh thank you.
Speaker 2: I was so upseessed with that. I think I listened
to it like in one shot on a drive. I
was like, this is the best. It was very honest.
Speaker 1: It's very easy writing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I mean it was easy listening because
I was like fascinated and I just thought it was
so revealing and honest and I just love vulnerability. So
good for you, man, and congratulations, listen.
Speaker 1: It's what I'm interested in. I write, what I want
to read or or listen to. And one of the
things I think for me that's helped for me with
like twelve Step and this kind of recovery is just
other people's stories, you know, I say it in my
intro to this podcast, but I really mean it like that.
To me, it's not the God stuff, it's not the
I'm just not just keeping it real. I'm not a
super spiritual person. I mean, I wish I was more so,
but it's the fact. It's that feeling of just not
being alone in the crazy yes thoughts, not feeling like
I'm the only person.
Speaker 2: Yeah, not feeling othered all the time because we think
we're crazy. And it's like, wait a minute. I think
that's why I love those kind of books. It's like, oh,
she went through that, this person went through that, and like, okay,
Like I fully hate celebrity bios or celebrity you know,
biopics or whatever. They're just about their career. Least interesting
thing about anyone is their career, and I'm like, no,
I want to hear what they struggled with. Like even
like Christy Brinkley's book, I mean, at first, I was like, oh,
this is just me light and it's not so I
just love that you went in there, man, and I'm
sure it was helpful to so many people.
Speaker 1: Well, when I'm writing, and same as when I'm speaking,
I really try to go, what would I want to
hear I was listening to me, or if I was
reading this book, and therefore I write the stuff that
makes me feel really uncomfortable to write. You know, I
know I'm doing something when I feel really icky about
what I'm writing, and I go, I could I could
not write this part, and then I write it anyway,
and I always go, you know, I can always delete
it later. I could always change my mind before it
gets published. And usually by the time I'm done, I'm like, ah,
fuck it, I don't care correct.
Speaker 2: Mention it all one. Yeah, yeah, most of the people.
I mean, I was saying when I wrote my autobiography,
I guess they are memoir or whatever. I was like,
Oh I write, Oh, I mean, I was really revealing
about codependency and about food stuff and all that. I
was like, Oh, it'd be a way different book if
my parents were dead, you know, because I knew they
did the best they could. But there was some stuff
that was not cool. Rage wise, et cetera. I'm like,
you know, at the end of the day, if we're
helping somebody else with their secrets then and taking a
little shame out as our job.
Speaker 1: So you did mention some stuff about it, but you
kept it tamer than you would about your pit with
your parents.
Speaker 2: I definitely said my mother was a yeller and stuff,
but I sort of glossed over it a lot because,
you know, joking around a little, and I just found
writing it. I was like, this is she's going to
read this. It's not you know, and back then, I mean,
they were raised during the depression. Like if you said
the word I need therapy, like they'd put you in
a straight jacket and throw you somewhere. So I'm like,
I get it. It's very easy, by the way, or
easier to work on not being mad at your parents
anymore when they're dead because they're not constantly reopening wounds.
And I was lucky enough that my parents were pretty good.
But I get why they did what they did. I
get that my mother had rage. I get that's that's
how she probably grew up. You know, hurt people, hurt people, Okay,
but it was pretty good to work on it when
they were gone, because they're not doing it to you.
Speaker 1: I mean, that's so true for me. I not contact,
no contact with my mother and stepfather for many years now,
which is but I have let a lot of stuff
go too, just in the not I completely relate with
the not opening those wounds all the time and then
refeeling mad about stuff or disappointed. And now I just
feel like, at my age, I'm just too old to
feel disappointed with how I was parented. It's like enough,
I'm a full grown adult. It's really on me now.
So then it becomes more about boundaries and like what
you don't want to be around and what you will
be around.
Speaker 2: I love that. Yeah, it's just taking care of yourself.
You accept them that this is how they are, but
doesn't mean you have to accept being open to it.
Speaker 1: Yeah for sure, But you know, tell me a little bit,
like let's just go back. For people that don't know you,
I mean, I don't know how you could not know
Lisa Lampinelli, I would really mean, but not anymore right
the former, So you had a whole career before you
even started doing stand up as a journalist.
Speaker 2: Right right, I would say a half asked one. I
think I think a lot of being raised like I was,
or the middle child or whatever it is, whatever family
system was going on. I was the rebel of the family.
So I always tried to do things, of course, not consciously,
you don't know, that were interesting or unique or made
me special. I think the least the less special you feel,
the more you have to try to make yourself feel special.
So I was like, oh, I'll be really cool to
interview bands and work at Rolling Stone and this and that.
So of course I did those things. And I remember
Tom Wolfe, the great novelist, would come in as so
many years ago in the eighties and he was publishing
Bonfire the Vanity's at Rolling Stone and we would type
it as assistance. We would type it in and uh,
I was like, I'm never going to be tell wolf
Like I just knew. I. Oh, he's you know, iconic.
Well what am I going to do? So I think
that's when I sort of was like, oh, maybe I can.
I've always wanted to do stand ups, so I'll try
it once, Like I'll take a little class and try
it once. If I bomb, then I'll just won't do it.
And Lucky, oh, lucky for the world, No, lucky for me.
The first time went well enough that I was like, Okay,
this is something I want to pursue. But yeah, I
think it was always me trying to find a career
or a job that made me feel special.
Speaker 1: It's funny that you say that I want to let
you do all the talking, but I have to interject
that I have that thing too though, where I was like,
I didn't feel special, I didn't feel talented really in
any I didn't feel gifted. I never had a passion
in high school or earlier. A lot of my friends did,
and I always just felt like I just don't think
I'm especially good at anything. And my father was a comedian,
which made me want to do stand up because I
liked comedian and I loved being made to laugh, and
I was like, what if I could do that? You know?
But I do remember because I waited, So I waited
tables like cocktail waitress at comedy clubs, and I had
that same thing of like, well, I'm never gonna know.
I'll never be like that, I'll never be like For me,
it was like Paula Poundstone, you know, I'll never be
Paula Poundstone, so like, what's the point. But then I
had the same thing of like, well, I just want
to try it, like before I die, Like I just
want to try it once and you know, and then
I'll know, I'll know I'm terrible at it and I
can move on.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it went well for me too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's just like and then you get sucked
into it and honestly, like I really wish that that
was something I hadn't felt the need to do. But
yet no shade on the career. It was good and
like okay, and then I get to have enough money
to go to therapy all the time. I really think
like money is about getting help. And you'll thanks thankfully,
you know, I can now afford to just look at
myself and go why do I act the way I act?
Or my relationships with other people or family, And it's
nice to kind of go, oh, I am kind of
privilege that it worked out.
Speaker 1: So when you were first doing stand up, do you
feel like you were struggling with some stuff like food codependency.
Were you already struggling at that time, or do you
think that doing that kind of life brought some of
it out in you?
Speaker 2: No. I think like I wasn't aware of like food
issues or you know, serial monogamy and never having a
break in between a boyfriend or whatever. Like I think
I went from thirteen to fifty without having a break
from a guy, Like come on, I mean we call
that codependency. Now. I thought I was just popular, so
I think. And with the food stuff, it was always
the way. It was always up and down and down.
It was eating for comfort, which again there's nothing wrong
with emotional eating, nothing wrong with eating for comfort, but
I didn't like how that was coming out with me,
like it was binge. Thank god, it was never a disorder,
but it was binge enough that it's like, oh, let
me look at this compulsive eating thing and see what's
going on. So I don't think I was quote aware
of it enough to be like, oh, I'm a codependent
food you know, addict or whatever the thing is. But
they were always there, like since college. I remember all
this stuff. Ever since going away to college, all that
stuff came up.
Speaker 1: Tell me about it.
Speaker 2: I think it was like my first year of college
I went away. I know for a fact, I was
not ready. I think when you're smart and you're raised
where I was in Connecticut. Not like we're classy or
anything or wealthy not, but you just kind of you're smart.
You got good SAT scores. Of course you're going to college.
And now people take gap years or they stay home.
I like, know, I wasn't emotionally ready to go away,
but I did obviously, and I just hated it was
super lonely. My housing situation was awful. It was with
three seniors in an apartment and I was stuck with them.
It was just like a mistake, and I was so miserable.
And I remember just food, food, food, food, because I
was never a drinker because I didn't like the taste.
I also had the distinct memory of going, well, if
it's going to be calories, I might all eat them,
Like why waste it on booze? It doesn't even taste good.
This stuff tastes good. And then I think I started
to notice obviously weight gain, and then the diet culture
kicks in, where you know, you know, on the fad
diet and you get underweight, and thank the Lord, I
never I was very to having anorexia, but then God
escaped it. And then I was like with every binge
or purge or not purge. With every binge of restriction
comes the opposite. So I was just like, screw it,
I'm just going to eat, and I was dealing with
food stuff for the next however many years, still do
but I mean, thankfully I work on it a lot.
So yeah, it was kind of wild what we use
for comfort.
Speaker 1: So did you drop out of college or did you know?
Speaker 2: I speaking at codependency. I had my high school boyfriend,
which probably no shade to anyone I was married to
or involved with, but probably was the only good guy
I've ever dated. He was at Cornell. I was at
Boston College, and, by the way, a school that I
could never get into. Now. I love that the standards
were low enough back then to let me in. He
was at Cornell, and I was like, oh my god,
I've got to get closer to someone who's grounding, because
he was a decent human for real. So I transferred
to Syracuse majored in journalism, and it's like an hour
and a half from Ithaca.
Speaker 1: Was that in a new house?
Speaker 2: Yep, in new house.
Speaker 1: Yeah, my husband went to Oh yeah.
Speaker 2: Back then your husband's young. But the major I had
was newspaper journalism, so like it's newspaper stuff. And again
I don't even think. I think. I just I had
a real talent for editing. I had real talent for writing.
I was like, Okay, this feels safer. I wouldn't have
even back then to Noble put it together, but I
know it felt safer because I was near ish to
this guy who was very grounding, you know, and I
was lucky enough that, like man, nothing horrible happened to
me in college. There was no date rape, there was
no assault, no nothing, no robbery. I just hated every
second of being so at sea, and the only anchors
were really the food, the guy, and that continued for
a while through comedy and everything. Always had a boyfriend.
That's why I think I was never me too. Part
of it is that always had a boyfriend or husband,
always protected somehow, and not that that protects all women,
but it was part of it. I know what you're saying.
Speaker 1: I know what you're saying. You weren't probably fortunately in
a lot of situations where you were available.
Speaker 2: Never never. I was always like I don't know there
was and also somebody up there was looking out for me,
just like why she doesn't have to deal with this,
So yeah, I had to deal with the codependency.
Speaker 1: And also did you recognize it though? So I mean
for a while, like because for me, I had food
stuff too. I was bellimic, went sixteen to like early twenties.
I got help for it and I got over it,
but then I would have another but then like the
alcohol kind of took over for me. Also didn't like
the taste, but pushed through. You know it work for you, yeah,
not aquitter, but you know, then the food stuff would
come back. But that was like my first love. But
I recognized it really early on. I was trying to
get help for that. But then maybe because bolimia is
more like black and white, it's like you're either doing
that or you're not. So it's pretty hard to go like, no,
I'm fine with food when you're making yourself puke.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, there's no real that's a real black and
white thing, like with compulsive eating is what they would
call it. Years ago, I was like, I just feel
out of control around food. Binge eating disordered diagnosis hadn't
been created yet, so I remember going, wait a minute,
people go to rehab for drugs and alcohol. Let me
look up if there's some rehab for food. So I
look up this place and it's called Rosewood Ranch and Wickenburg, Ohio, Arizona,
which is like where the meadows is a lot of
the famous rehab joints. And I'm like, I'm going to
go there for thirty days and kick my compulsive eating.
Speaker 1: How old were you at this time, though, Like were
you a standard.
Speaker 2: For Yeah, I was like forty five. It was right
after Carnegie Hall, so it was I forget what the
data that was, but I was like already established and everything,
and I was like, all right, I'm just gonna go
to this thing. And you had to have a roommate,
but I lied and said I was important and I
needed to take some personal business or business call. So
they let me pay extra to have my own room,
because gotferbid, I don't control something in rehab, right, So
I go and it was literally one hundred percent Antirexica
Bleamic women and me, and so I'm like the only
fat chick. So at the time, I was probably two
hundred and forty pounds, and you know, it just was
again another place I didn't really fit in. They were
told to behave certain ways to work on their food issues.
My advice should have been the opposite. But like they're
being told they have to eat dessert, and I'm like,
well what about me? Like do I? And they and
the Innerexit girls were so cute. They were like, yeah,
like we're supposed to have dessert. I'm like, okay, I
guess I will. So I don't remember learning a lot.
Speaker 1: You lit left there heavier than you started.
Speaker 2: I probably did, honestly. Honestly, I probably did. And I
think the thing I did learn there, though, was that
community is really good for these things. Twelve step stuff
is amazing, even though I did not subscribe and still
don't to OA, I don't agree with because a lot
of the different meetings ban certain foods and demonize certain things.
And I'm like, okay, I love the twelve step model.
I love the acceptance piece and the you know, serenity
prayer stuff, and okay, so at least I'm open to it.
And I think that's what It still resonates a lot,
Like I'll look at twelve step books on codependency and
things and I'll be like, yeah, they're right, Like the
principles I really think are very sound.
Speaker 1: I want to know before you went to rehab. So
you're living your life. You're getting accolades for stand up.
I mean you were very popular, were you. You were
obviously already doing roasts yep. I mean tell me about
like the behavior with food that would drive you to
actually go I need rehab.
Speaker 2: I think it's that I had a I mean the
big like bottom was I was in Vegas and I
was very food. I mean, I love food. I still do,
so I love food so much. And I remember it
was with my two openers, these two girls who were
pretty small and were at like some like diner or
something in Vegas. And the whole time we're like looking
at that you know, the last case.
Speaker 1: Oh, I already knew before. As soon as you said
I'm looking at I'm like, oh the dessert thing.
Speaker 2: That the carousel, like you just want to jump on
the carousel and ride.
Speaker 1: The pope the caves and eat everything.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's those tall pieces of ca Oh my god.
The whole time we're like fantaside, like, oh my god,
I want that one. That's what I'm gonna get. I'm
gonna get that. So we're I'm fully trusting these two
bitches that they're going to have dessert. So I remember
they we eat or whatever, lousy caesar salad, shit or whatever.
And so the waitress comes over and she's like, oh,
what do you have for dessert? And one of them goes, oh,
no dessert for me, thanks, and the other the other
ones like me neither. I'm like, wait a minute, like
you two fucking horns said you were gonna have dessert.
Like I had so much anger and we're not hungry,
and I'm like, what does dessert have to do with
being hungry? Like, no one's hungry for dessert. I was
like literally furious, and it was so disproportionate and crazy.
It was like, look somebody would do if they were
on drugs or alcohol. I just remember I threw down
the money on the table. I stormed upstairs. I sort
of got and I go I called my manager and
I was like, listen, get my flight changed. I'm leaving tonight,
and those tickets of Cerctaisalon, fuck those girls, we're not going.
I'm out here and I'm at the airport like waiting
for my flight, and I'm like, yeah, I think I overreacted.
And I was like, oh, and that's when I go,
that's how people act when they're on drugs or they're
ruled by a substance like booze. And that's when I
looked up. I literally typed into the Google thing food rehab,
and that place came up so again, like those girls
would laugh at that now maybe they wouldn't even remember it,
but it was so disproportionate in my head. I was like, oh,
this is all about you, Like you've got to work
on this. And again, like I don't demonize any type
of food. People give me whatever size they want. I
just could not accept that the shape I was in
physically was not what I wanted to match what I
saw in the mirror. I didn't like the food seemed
to rule my life and different circumstances like just being
so like, ooh, I need to have this all the
time and I always have to have this in the
dressing room or whatever. I'm like, well, let's look at that,
and I will make fun of that rehab place. But
it definitely made me look at some of that.
Speaker 1: I mean, I still struggled as well. But when I
was dealing with the active eating disorder, I remember I
did go to OA and I didn't get a spot.
I didn't do it the way other people did. I
was really young. I mean I was probably twenty when
I started going to meetings. And at first I was
just going to regular meetings and everybody was pretty large.
And then I felt weird because I felt like people
were looking at me like why are you here? And
I was really at a low. I mean, I was
being ruled by food, and I was, you know, timing
shopping trips and you know, grocery shopping and going to
different stores so that they wouldn't see me at the
same store every day. I mean, it was really ruling
my life. And the first thing that I did was
started to realize my trigger foods. And so I had
a thing where like if I if I had peanut
butter in my house, I would eat an entire jar
peanut butter, like one spoonful at a time. That comfort eating,
and it was if it was there, it would just
call to me. And I couldn't just leave a jar
of peanut butter. It's funny to almost funny looking back,
because I don't have that at all. But I had
to eliminate a bunch of foods. But it wasn't because
OA made me do it. It was like My abstinence
was my own. It was like, no throwing up at all,
have none of that. But then I got very perfectionist.
I'm wondering if you had this too. So once I
was like thought I was in recovery, I was like, okay,
three meals a day. I just got really strict and
then that wasn't healthy either, because then it was ruling
my life in another way. It was just constantly thinking
about what I'm not doing, and I'm even when I
was starving, I was like, well I can't. I can't
have a snack because it's not prescribed in my day.
Speaker 2: Right ps. I think that's the only way to do OA,
by the way, which is great. I went to one
meeting once that I thought was great that they were
like whatever program you subscribed two, meaning we're not going
to tell you not to eat sugar and white flour
that's how it used to be, and gray sheet and
all that crazy stuff. You did it like the way
that one should. Right. I never sort of was able
to handle food without huge intervention, like I had to
get weight loss because I was like, I am not
and I do not promote weight loss surgery because it
really hurts a lot of people. I was lucky enough
that it didn't, but I would never tell somebody to
get it. But dude, I was like, I am of
the age that I will never like how I look
at this weight. I love that people are now able
to work on body acceptance, body neutrality, body positivity. I couldn't,
and I think it was growing up when I did.
If I was born twenty years later, maybe I could
be like, oh, I'm finding a size, whatever it is.
But I was like, Nope, never going to feel that way.
No matter how much I try to bullshit myself, I'm
not going to like myself bigger. Got the surgery, lost
one hundred and seven pounds, and.
Speaker 1: So wait kind of so you go to the rehab,
you get out, but you're not feeling better because it
was not really the best place for you. How long
in between getting out of rehabit and deciding to do
the surgery, and what was happening in your career and
how are your relationships with other people? It's a bunch
of questions at once.
Speaker 2: Well, No, I remember being in the food rehab and
nothing really changing food wise, but knowing that at least
I picked up a few tools about acceptance and things
in there and twelve Step and being open to that
kind of philosophy. So I think like Radio City was
around then, you know, all the specials and all those
things are going on, and I think I met my
husband my ex husband now, but we're friends at age
around forty nine, so it was like a three years
after that, after that rehab, and he was a big,
fat guy and I was fat, but we had this
awesome sweetheart. I always hate trainers, but she was like
a yoga woo wu chick and she would come to
the apartment and then she'd like, she'd say, we were
doing yoga, but I thought we were just laying there,
and like she'd let me just take walks instead of run,
like she was just so nice. And she mentions one
day and it's almost like I never had heard the
words weight loss surgery. Maybe I hadn't, and she just goes, oh, yeah,
client of mine just had weight loss surgery. I literally
was like, what what is that? And she's like yeah,
and I go send me some info. And I remember
doing the Celebrity Apprentice. I was still fat, and Jimmy,
my husband at the time, goes, oh, I ran into
a guy at Gotham Comedy Club, where Jimmy had been
a doorman, and he goes, uh, he has a great
weight loss surgeon. Do you want his number? I'm like yeah,
And right after Celebrity Apprentice, I was like, I'm bucking
meeting doctor Trevetti. And again, it's not the greatest option,
but at the time, it's all that existed to like
for me to be able to get my head around
hatred of how I looked. Look, my face is my face.
I'll never do anything to my face, not because I'm
morally opposed to it, because I'm a pussy and I'm scared,
because I will never stop so I can accept from
the neck up. I wanted to be able to accept
from the neck down, and my flaw is I could
without some kind of intervention.
Speaker 1: It's interesting that your husband was like, hey, I found
a great weight loss surgeon for.
Speaker 2: You, so oh no, for him too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh you do Oh he did it too.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The funny thing was, this is fantastic. We went
to meet this doctor who we met through the guy
he was he met him through was the guy Carolyn
Manzo's husband from The Jersey Housewife. Huh huh, So how
Carolyn's husband had gotten that surgery. So we go to
meet this doctor and I'm going to just pay for
it myself because I'm like, I'm not going to insurance,
like they're not going to pay it. My BMI isn't
high enough. It's such a racket. But Jimmy BMI was
really high, so he had a weight three months and
he goes, yeah, he goes, you get it. If you
don't die on the table, I'll get it too. And
what's funny is since then, Jimmy's gotten fat again because
we got divorced and he got remarried, and I think
he just found acceptance and he, you know, has a
great wife. I was at the wedding and I'm just like, cool, cool,
you know, have good time. But yeah, we both got it,
and for me it kind of stuck.
Speaker 1: So do you feel like when you have the weight
loss surgery. I mean there's a lot to that, right,
like the recovery and then does it did it change
the way you felt about food or did it just
change your weight and then your weight changed the way
you felt about food?
Speaker 2: Well, no, the weight goes off, but your stomach's so
fricking small. And I always joke with the surgeon that
he made mine smaller because I was in the public
eye and he wanted me to stay thin. I'm like,
fuck you, doctor Zavetti. He made me, you know, half
a couple of food a meal, but literally my stomach
never stretched out, so it was a little bit easier
to keep off. But like in my house now, you
couldn't name a food that isn't in my house because
it just doesn't fit. Like there's never a danger of
needing an entire bag of anything because it just physically
will not fit. It's extreme. It kind of sucks that
you're full so fast, But for me it was worth
the price because I hated being fat more than I
hate eating small meals every day. And again, were I
born later, I may have been like, oh my god,
I just love food and I'm fat and it's okay.
I almost that's like the perfect situation, but I wasn't
in it.
Speaker 1: So did the obsession though, lift about food.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean for me it did because I had
no choice. Like, of course, then it transfers to shop
because you lose one hundred and seven pounds, you pretty
much go through your clothes pretty quick. But now what
I work on. Is not doing that, not needing the
hit of the package, arriving on the front step, not
medicating with overactivity, busyness, too much friend stuff, any drama.
Like I work really hard on noticing if something feels
medicating and not doing it. Do I win all the time? No?
But more times than I lose.
Speaker 1: So tell me about the codependent stuff? Did that start?
Speaker 2: Was that?
Speaker 1: Did you feel like that was happening a lot before
the food stuff concurrently with the food stuff.
Speaker 2: That was at the same time. I don't think I
knew the word for codependency until later and when it
really hit me hard, and this was an angel appearing
for me. Is dating a really terrible guy? Obviously this
is before I got married, And again, now that I
think about, maybe not a terrible guy. I was dating
a guy who was a pot addict and not good
not a good fit, okay, but you know, at the time,
it felt like he was horrible and I was being
obsessed with keeping that relationship alive. We must have broken
up fifty times, and I was like he he was
like a drug. So I remember going to like Kenyon Ranch,
which is like a health spot, and I would be
saying to the therapists or stuff there, like but like he'll change, right,
I mean like I can help him change, right. And
they'll be like, no, if you want to rescue something,
make it a dog. And I'm like what, and they're like,
he's your beer. I'm like, oh, he's an addict. I'm
addicted to him. So I still going to codependence anonymous
meetings and also alan On because they had the same
principles and I was like, oh my god, I'm addicted
to a person. So I went to this awesome place
and I do promote the hell out of this place.
It's called the Karen Foundation cron in Pennsylvania because this
angel of a man appeared to me in La once
at a comedy club and we're talking with him and
my friends about this sky I'm addicted to and he
looks at me and he goes Karen Foundation. I'm like
what and he goes it's a rehab. But they have
a fifty get this, fifty one weeks out of the year.
This is how in demand it is. They do a
codependency week, so it's so full that they do it
every week except one each year.
Speaker 1: You need this, you just go for a week it's
not thirty days.
Speaker 2: No, it's so intense though, like it feels like a month.
You're just going crazy because you're really attacking what they
think is the root of all addiction, which is codependency.
Oh my god, I tell you what. After this guy
I'll never forget him told me about it. I went
home that night. I was staying at a hotel in
La I look up Karen Foundation, left them a message
at midnight. They called me in the morning. I was like,
sign me up, and I paid and I went. Within
a few months or weeks, I have never had a
more life changing experience in my life. Because they were
doing family systems and like all this theory about why
who you know, why we developed this codependency of looking
to other people for meaning and to looking for other
people that change our lives and not looking inward. I'm
telling you that we clean my clock. I knew when
I got out of there. I said, I won't even
notice the wrong type of men anymore, and I never have.
It is just something they some magically way a the
therapy they had group or whatever. I forget. It was
a lot of group and individual I was like, I
will never notice problematic man again are the ones who
are problematic for me. And that's why when I met
I took a year and a half off from dating
like they prescribed. They prescribe a year. I took a
year and a half and Jimmy I met him and
he was just a nice guy. Jimmy's a very bless
his heart guy, like nice, good, jolly good person. And
I was like, ever since Karen Foundation, I've never dated
a horrible man again.
Speaker 1: So were you still with the guy you were addicted
to when you went to a foundation?
Speaker 2: You'll love this? When because I had told him, I said,
I'm going to this thing, and thank god, you're not
allowed of phones. I said, never contact me again. And
I but I changed his name in my phone to Paine,
and I said, if I'm answering, I'm for pain. So
whenever his number would come up, it it'd say pain
and I wouldn't answer it. Like something happened right before
I went and there, I was like, you're going to
this frickin thing you're committing and I've never heard from
her talk to him again? And again it was fifty
to fifty. I volunteered. There's this great saying in codependency rehab.
Every time I got fucked, I bent over, So it's
half our fault.
Speaker 1: It's an mighty place.
Speaker 2: I like that. Oh no, it was badass, Like I remember,
they were just tough, and boy did I, thank goodness
learn my lesson and never dated any be bad again.
It's because it's so based in like recovery stuff in
twelve step and ooh, I'm so grateful for bumping into
that guy who mentioned it. I would have never known.
Speaker 1: I mean, do you think a lot of people can
get over it that quickly? I definitely have codependency stuff.
And but like my husband and I are, we're codependent
with each other and we make fun of each other
for that. We're like, oh being mc cod right now.
Speaker 2: Yep. And I think that's okay, because is there healthy
codependency where you're just like need the other person and so,
you know, I definitely see it though sometimes when I
don't have control in other areas and I start micromanaging
my husband, and I also notice it that he can.
Speaker 1: He will do that with me sometimes when he's feeling
anxious about other things, and then he'll start micromanaging me.
We recognize it. I think we're both fairly healthy people.
So we do recognize it in each other and we
don't really fight about it. But I have definitely had
it in relationships before my husband. My husband's the first
like nice guy, I did it, oh good, And I
wasn't even I didn't have that same that thing, that
attraction thing at the beginning with him because he wasn't
not a good guy. I mean I had a sixth
sense for guys that would be asked for us.
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh, I loved it. I love danger like even now,
like in the old spank Bank, the old because I
don't I'm not interested in dating. I swear to God,
the edgy guys that I'm attracted to, I would never
date them, like I am attracted to Season one Richie
from the Bear, not season four when he's a good guy.
I don't want to spank it out to Richie who's
nice and polishing the forks. I want the Richie who's
a fucking dangerous guy who's selling heroin in the back.
So I think, what's good about it? It's like you
and your husband, you have interdependence. You know, you laugh
about it. You can be like Ugh being codependent again.
But I noticed with me since I don't want a
date and I don't want a relationship, and I probably
know actually was probably the type who if I was
born again twenty years later, it would have been like
marriage wouldn't have occurred to me. I just think my
generation did it. So I think it'll show up in
friend things, in nieces and nephews where I'm like, are
you okay? Is everything okay?
Speaker 1: Do you need help?
Speaker 2: I'm overly helpful. So that's where the codependency shows up.
And I go back to a meeting, I'm just like, yeah, no,
you don't need them to include you in everything. You
don't need to interrupt their journey. And that's where the
codependency comes in. It doesn't just disappear. It's like always
top of mind to notice that and still work on
it just because it's not It shows up with other.
Speaker 1: People, like with friendships you're saying yeah, or.
Speaker 2: Family like I'll I have this little writing group and
we don't even write. It's like four of us comics.
I'm retired. The three of them don't even want to write,
and we just have gotten together every Tuesday night. It's
like wild. For the past four years. Every Tuesday, it's
the same place and one of them. I swear to God,
I love the girl he's dating, but I know she's
not right for him, She's not ready. She absolutely is
going from one thing to the next like I did.
And I have not said one word to him about it.
I go that sounds great, good for you, And inside I'm.
Speaker 1: Like, oh, you fucking I want to tell you.
Speaker 2: None of my business. It's his journey to figure it
out on his own. That's where it shows up when
that stuff drives me nuts. So I got to police
it all the time. Because a good friend doesn't do that,
doesn't tell you what to do.
Speaker 1: I feel like I just want to go back a
little bit, because this is a you know, it's it's
a long process to get rid of some of these
toxic things. But I'm so interested in the fact that,
you know, so you make your career being the queen
of mean you know, being a roaster and probably just
getting out there with the guys and getting a lot
of you know, good validation for being like, oh you
can handle like the mean joke about you and you
can dish them out and all that. But I know
that when you had the weight loss surgery and when
you lost the weight and really started working on yourself.
You stopped wanting to do it, and it was kind
of a sudden thing when you retired from comedy. Well
it wasn't, said Howard Stern.
Speaker 2: Well, I announced it, because an announcement should be sudden.
It shouldn't be teased, you know, p r y. But
it was like a five year knowledge that I was
going to get out, Like meaning between me and my
business manager and manager were like planning, saving and some
very like old school. My parents were always about saving money,
make sure you don't have to work again, whatever it is.
So it was like a five year noticing of like,
oh I don't really love this anymore. I don't hate it.
I want to get out before I hate it. I
want to I got a divorce from Jimmy before I
hated him. I sold a big house before I hated
the house, Like I always know, Oh, okay, be an
adult and get out in a moral way.
Speaker 1: This is so interesting to me because I mean, so
you're doing stand up and you're doing so well, like
people loved to your sought after making a lot of money,
I'm sure, But was there a time, I mean, I
remember talking to you about this on for crying out
loud because I had this with stand up myself where
I was just like, don't I don't like it. I
don't Well for me though, it was the feeling of
I don't like the before part. I don't like I
always am nervous. I don't like what this does to
my self esteem. I do not like bombing. But you weren't.
You were like an established, well known, sought after performer.
So at what point I want to hear like when
it just started to not fit for you?
Speaker 2: Oh? I just started noticing my life because I wasn't
running from anything anymore. So basically a really pivotal moment
was I said done Radio City. What happened was we
announced Stunstern that I was doing Carnegie Hall. It's sold
out really fast because you go on Stern and your
favorite so Live Nation was like, well, let's do Radio
City like two months later, and I'm like, you sure,
because that's like sixty seven hundred and thirty two seats.
I love how I know the exact numbers, and he's like, no,
we can do this. So I remember it Radio City
and I was like, okay, it was sold out. Obviously
it was really fun. I give me a stand where
the roquets stand, and I have my niece and her
friend come out and do a dance like it was
just like my whole family's there. We're having a blast.
And I remember the head of Live Nation, because it
was a big deal, comes up to me backstage and
he's like so happy and we're friends and goes next
Madison Square Garden and he expects me to be like yeah,
And I'm sure I said that outwardly and in my
heart though, I was like, it's never going to be enough.
It'll then be Madison Square Garden twice. And at something
in me I had the wisdom of noticing, oh, this
will never be enough. So if I don't love it
like I'm supposed to, let's stop chasing some high that
I'm never going to get. And I was like, oh,
I didn't bring it up then because I didn't know
this was percolating to get out. I was like started
noticing over the years as I did more work on myself.
I went to retreats and different things. I was like,
every time I go to pac for a weekend, I'm like, uh,
I want to be home with the dog, and I
want to be in the house, and I love my
friends and family. I don't want to miss things. And
I was like, oh, guys, I'm going to retire, and
my business manager was like, Okay, we'll figure out like
a savings plan or whatever. So that's when it started noticing.
Speaker 1: But was it the actual performing, because no, it's such
a high right when you're performing and people are laughing
at something that you thought of. That part never went away.
So it was just the everything around it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like the business like the life of it,
and it's isolating because hey, you bring your opener, but
like you're not with family or real friends, and like
I'd scare up friends all over the country or like
I had a nephew who was at school in I
think Cincinnati, which is like five hours from Louisville, and
I was playing Louisville. I sent a limo for him
and his friends. I was like, Oh, there's somebody to
hang with. But I think I was just like growing
And I said on a podcast right after I retired,
I said, I don't think I was ever a comedian.
I think I was someone who wanted to connect but
didn't know how. Other than that, and so now I
just connect one on one small groups, like I'm still humorous.
I don't have to be funny. I sell a good time.
We laugh like me and my friend on our podcast,
like we have a good time. But there's no pressure
to do anything. I'm just not performing. I'm just being
who I am. So that's kind of nice.
Speaker 1: I remember when I stopped doing stand up. I would
still do it sometimes, but I stopped having the dream
of like being a famous comedian. I think it occurred
to me at some point, I'm never going to be uh.
I just think my humor's not for everyone. But that's okay.
But I was also just like going, you know, to
a comedy club and staying in a shitty condo and
just like, I don't know if this is for me.
I think I'm similar to you in that way. And
then I got a job writing on a game show
and I was like, oh, this is fun. I have camaraderie,
I have co workers, we're together all the time. I
write a joke and I don't even have to be
the one to risk whether it works or not. The
host does it. And then that to me once I realized, oh,
I don't like to be the one that has to
have the pressure of telling the joke. Well, I think
I'm a better writer than performer, So when somebody else
performs the joke and gets a big laugh, it gives
me every bit of a good feeling.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think it's the same validation for me as do
it myself. And once I realized that, it was very
freeing because I was like, oh, I could do this,
and then I always wanted to be on the radio
or like when podcasting came along, I was like, oh,
that's for me because I also love the no pressure
to be funny.
Speaker 2: Yes, Like why should we have to perform anything? Like today,
I teach stand up and storytelling at this college and
I went to their little showcase today, not the stand
up one, but like the singers and the dancers and
the actors, and I was just watching and you get
telling someone's performing tears instead of actually having emotion. I
was like, I never wanted people to think I was
performing comedy or being funny. I just wanted to be
And I was like, oh, I just get to be
Like I get to like be quiet, I get to
like not in my house like I do tons of
game nights and stuff. I don't have to be the
center of attention. I could listen to other people, like
it's just so much fun. Like even on the podcast,
I really it's my podcast, it's not me and Nick,
but it's just like this comic who's a friend of mine,
and I let him do a lot of the talking.
I'm like, I don't need to be front and center.
I want to make him famous, you know, even though
I don't know if you even wants that. So it's
just nice to not need or be chasing anything.
Speaker 1: So I don't want to ease A podcast what's it called?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it's called Shrink This with Lisa Lampinelli on
High Heart. And the thing about the only reason it
happened was because I was retired and this woman who's
a sidekick on Elvis Durant's show, said oh, could you
be on my podcast as a guest, And I'm like sure,
And I was just very serious, like we're just talking
about like I coach people, like like stuff and advice.
And Elvis was like, oh, you need a podcast for
our network about that's advice but funny but just being you.
And I was like ooh good, Like all right, nobody's
gonna listen because I was like, no one's I go, dude,
well my age, my fans don't listen to podcasts, and
he's like, I don't care. I believe in it. Well
expect three listeners because I don't EGO care anymore and
doing pretty well, but I'm like, oh, it's just kind
of fun and not looking at numbers. I don't need
one more thing. If I never get applause again, which
I hopefully never will, that's okay, like that, it's also
fucking bullshit. It's it's so fake. And I coach a
lot of girls now, recent graduates of this college, like
creativity coaching, and I'm like, you think you need applause,
You don't. You need applause of the heart. You need
your own nobody else's and they're not going to listen
to me. But at least I could say it.
Speaker 1: Did you find it hard though? You know? I mean
you sound very healthy, uh, and you know you've adapted
to this new life. But when you stop doing stand up,
was there any withdrawal? Were you like, oh wait, wait,
I'm just never going to do it again.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, not for stand up. But I'll tell you where
the problem came in. I just I never get out
of anything too early or too late. So I knew that.
Like it's like driving by a house you sold and
going what did the new people do to the house,
Like I don't care, like what? So I never missed
stand up, but I missed having a identity. I had
no zero identity. I have no hobbies because to become
famous and rich, you think you do that? Why quilting
on the side, You fucking do this and that's all
you do. It's like an Olympic athlete. Like I saw
a documentary right after I retired, and I was sobbing
about these Olympic athletes who commit suicide because they're done.
They don't have anything to do. And I'm like, oh fuck,
I'm certainly not suicidal, Thank the Lord. I'm like, yeah,
I got no purpose. I got no freakin identity. Who
the f am. I So I start experimentings, start being
a better friend and start doing game nights, start doing
a little podcast, start writing this one solo show, take
acting classes. It's a little experiment. These gifts I've been
given of this college getting in touch and saying you
want to teach here, I'm like, yeah, the little gifts.
That took eight fricking years to have what I would
consider a semi fulfilling life. And I'm like, oh boy,
it takes a long time because I neglected everything except comedy,
and that's way. I would hope people don't do that,
but they do.
Speaker 1: And do you have do you ever recognize in other people?
Like I don't miss stand up at all? It's funny
because not at all in the least. And as soon
as I stopped doing it, I just felt I felt
nothing but relief. I was like, oh, when I would
see people doing stand up, I would go, oh my god,
I'm so glad that's not me. Especially in like high
stakes situations. I would be like, oh, I don't like
that risk factor. I did not like risk. And you know,
I had a TV show for a while, which was
such a fluke because I was in my mid forties.
I was given this TV show and they asked me
if I would go go and do stand up to
rehearse for like doing monologues, and it was awful. I
was like, oh my god, I don't want to do that.
I did it a few times because I because I
had to. My coep was Hugh Fink, I don't know
if you know him, he's.
Speaker 2: All, I love you.
Speaker 1: But he was all for it. He was like, come on,
you got to go do it. I'll do it with you.
And I was so thankful that I don't do I
was so thankful that the risk wasn't really there because
I was like, well, I'm just doing this to remember
how to talk in front of an audience, you know,
live on a stage. But it wasn't until you know,
the first like h taping the eight shows, I had
that feeling again where I had too high an expectation
of myself, you know, where I was like, I have
to be perfect, has to be so funny. I don't
want to let these people down. And it wasn't until
I actually did a little bit of inner work of
and I was sober at the time, thank god, so
I was already doing some of that work. But it
was really about going it's okay if like a joke
doesn't work, it doesn't mean that I'm not a good person,
you know, it doesn't mean I'm not funny and don't
deserve this show. And it was sometimes you'd have to
repeat a joke right because you're you're doing a TV show,
so they had to do a pickup and the first
time I ever had to repeat a joke, I was like, oh, no,
I can't do that. That goes against everything. They've already
heard it, you know, and they're like, well, you have to.
And the first time I realized like, oh, they're on
my side. I can just tell them, you guys, I
have to. I'm going to have to do this thing again.
Can you guys laugh again like you've never heard it before?
And then I would do it and they would all
laugh even more than they did the first time, And
I was like, oh, why can't I go back to
when I was first doing stand up and take some
of the pressure off of myself, like my life could
have been better.
Speaker 2: I think I would argue it wouldn't be better because
you wouldn't be here exactly where you are now, which
is where you're supposed to be, because I, first of all,
I think that's so cool and brave to be like, guys,
I'm going to do this over. Like I tell the
girls that I coach, like when they're do auditions, just
start over. Look at Adele did it on the Grammys
that year when she was doing the George Michael thing,
and she goes, no, I'm starting over because it's I'm
off key like so I love that whole like, look
at us, we're fallible thing. I think it's humanizing. But
also I think we did exactly what we needed to
do to be sitting here like this. And boy, sometimes
I'll be like, I wish it was never comic because like,
I'll get recognized now and people say insulting things thinking
they're funny, and I'm very thin skinned now that I
don't do comedy. I always probably was, but then you
have to take it could tradition out like they'll say
it and I'll just be like, oh so, But then
I'm like, yeah, but if you didn't do comedy, you
wouldn't learned this shit. If you didn't do comedy, you
wouldn't have enough money to get all the therapy and
the help and not even think about it. Some people
have to like worry about where that money's coming from. Yeah,
fuck it, I guess it was what was supposed to happen,
you know, so do you?
Speaker 1: That just makes me want to ask this and to
have you so when you were doing roast. I mean
I talk about this with some of my comedian friends
all the time. I mean, people were very insulting. You
were doing it too, but and you were really good
at it. But did it hurt your feelings?
Speaker 2: I always say, and this is so true, like I
was worse to anyone than they were to me because
I was just so I was. I mean my only
I say, I had two talents in my life. I'm
the best parallel Parker in the world.
Speaker 1: I'm a good one too, right, I love that.
Speaker 2: And I was just lovable, so I could get away
with shit that those guys couldn't. So I could say
something that was so nuts that you would be like,
oh my god, why aren't they mad? So I never
was like, oh now I'm hurt. I would get hurt
if the joke was lazy, if it was something freaking
so stupid and so basic, but a joke that was
well written about me, I felt like honored. It's a weird,
old fashioned Friars Club kind of way of thinking of things. Wow,
you took the time to write this really smart, funny,
clever thing that was brutal. Thank you. But when it
was lazy, I'd be like, ugh, come on, like I
feel like not worthy or something like oh they didn't
think I was worthy of a good joke. So yeah,
I mean now I can't take a joke at all
all my I mean, they know because I've been through it.
I don't need that with my podcast now. I told
them I don't want to hear any comments on social media.
Comments are closed I because people think they're being funny,
like they're fans, and they'll say something and I'll be
like hurt, and it's like I protect myself from that stuff.
My friend Anthony, who's sober I think forty years, he's like,
I hate being teased. Oh I got me too. Me,
So that's my authentic self. I don't like that. But
I did notice today though, this is interesting. When I
went to see the high schoolers in my little program perform.
The head of the school, who I like ish but
I know he's always going to say something to them,
said something about the pants I was wearing, and I
noticed that I didn't feel a hit. He didn't hit.
So I think by me knowing I can't take a
joke and then knowing that's something that would have hurt
my feelings a month ago, ooh, something's loosening up. Maybe
I will come to where I could take a joke
once in a while, you know, because I was very
impressed that I wasn't hurt. So I think it's just again,
it's all noticing. It's all noticing without judging myself or
judging anybody else. Because he thinks he's connecting. He doesn't think, oh,
I'm going to insult Lisa. He's going, oh, I'm funny too,
which is, by the way, the kiss of death, because
no one's fucking funny.
Speaker 1: Stop it. It's interesting because like I've been podcasting for
a long time and there's a lot of listeners, and
a lot of times people will say stuff that's negative
or whatever. Point something out. People love on my other
podcast to point out when I've mispronounced a word, and
you know, listen, I didn't even go to college, so
I'm always like, give me a break. I got my
education from like reading Nancy Drew Mysteries and you know,
reading books, and I was always with a book in
front of my textbook. You know, I always fail that
out high school. The point is, like I want to
pat myself on the back for pronouncing the words that
I do pronounce correctly, and like the thing is, people
get they do point out that I do have very
thin skin, but I feel like other people don't understand
that if people are constantly, if you're always open to
people's negative comments, it's damaging. It's after a while you're like, enough,
I get it. I mispronounced a word, Okay, move on,
And I don't think it's that funny to go, oh
my god, Stephanie mispronounced a word again. And that's why
I don't read comments. I don't read reviews on my
books because it's what they say, Like if you if
you want to hear the good ones, you also have
to take in the bad ones, and I just don't
want to. It's it's Stimy's like, what I my ability
to be vulnerable and honest if I have to worry
that I'm going to have to hear feedback?
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like why should we have to hear anything I say?
You read either none of them obviously or all of them.
It's just like it's it's their damage that's making them
comment that. And I get it. Most of the time.
If I would read something, I'd be like, oh, I
see where that's coming from. Like once I got a
really terrible review on a show, I did it wasn't
stand up, it was a play. And then I looked
up this person who wrote the review and I saw
that she was a failed performer, and I was like, oh,
and it hurt like hell. And by the way, she's
since taking it down because she said she was wrong,
So yeah, it was pretty really amazing growth on her part,
and she goes, I was absolutely wrong. I misjudged that show,
and I was like, oh, my god, thank you. So
but I was able to look her up and go oh,
and honestly, I don't think I got to poor thing
in less than a year, but I got there where
I go, oh, she did the best she could in
any given moment, like the rest of us. But why
do I have to read that now, Like I'm I
shouldn't have to read comments? Yeah, you know. So I
think we know how to protect ourselves and not be delusional,
because I think the difference is if we were then
but everybody loves me, trust me, thirty percent of people
hate us, thirty love us, thirty couldn't care less.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't have any of the like, oh everybody
loves me, it's oh, we would never And if I
was more delusional, I think I could have done stand
up for longer. It was the problem was I wasn't delusional,
and I felt every bit of every time I bombed,
like I was like, well, I'm just not funny, Like
I'll be the first person to tell you that I'm
not that good, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: So I was.
Speaker 1: I wish I'd had more of that. Like you know
the people that do stand up and when they get
in the when when they say like, oh, it's my
birthday and people clap, they think they got a real
applause bry, Oh.
Speaker 2: My god, that's so funny. My favorite is the one
who comes off stage and he goes, I killed and
I'm like, were you Were we in the same room
because I didn't hear shit? Okay, But that delusion, I
think it is a superpower. It's just on that. We
just did an episode on delusion. Because I'll have like
a friend who says they're gonna have their's anniversary at
and they they will name literally the most expensive place
in like this huge resort or something. I'm like, you
don't have any fucking money, but we're all delusion a
little and they say like j Lo and I love her,
but they're like She's not the greatest singer, she's not
the greatest answer, she's not the greatest actor, but her
delusion of thinking she is has a superpower quality to it.
I'm like, yeah, and that's fantastic. I just we all
have it about something. I'm sure I have delusion that
I am the best dog mom in the world. I'm
the best coach in the world. I'm the best this
in the world. But I guess we have to have
it sometimes.
Speaker 1: We have to have it to get through life. But
this has been so delightful. Okay, so tell us tell
us the podcast again and give us your social media
and what day does the podcast come out, et cetera.
Speaker 2: Yes, every Tuesday. Shrink This with Lisa Lambinelli comes out
on iHeart and they like to say, listen on the
iHeart app. I could give a fuck. Listen where you
want because it's everywhere. Also, I'm on social media but
rarely do anything on it, but Lisa Lampinelli that's my name.
I'm just on Instagram and the TikTok.
Speaker 1: All right, thank you for so much for doing this
and for being so honest. It was really fun and
I want you to come back.
Speaker 2: Yang. I love you. This was so cool and I
just I just love the book so much and it
makes me laugh that I'm reading it and I'm like,
voice is familiar, but holy sha, I know her. So
thank you for writing.
Speaker 1: Thank you. Okay, everybody, I will see you next week.
Speaker 2: It's you can't be dealing li