WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.640 --> 00:00:02.799 Hudson River Radio dot com. 2 00:00:03.080 --> 00:00:08.919 It beats listening to nothing. My goodness, Frank, Being Frank 3 00:00:09.199 --> 00:00:14.880 right where the only way to be is Frank. Hello everyone, 4 00:00:15.000 --> 00:00:17.679 and welcome to Being Frank. We're the only way to 5 00:00:17.800 --> 00:00:21.559 be is well Frank. I'm your host, Frank Lebonno, and 6 00:00:21.559 --> 00:00:23.519 I'd like to thank you for joining us on what 7 00:00:23.559 --> 00:00:28.039 we like to call the Intelligent Conversation podcast, where no 8 00:00:28.160 --> 00:00:31.239 conversation is out of bounds and all points of view 9 00:00:31.559 --> 00:00:34.960 are welcome. Our listeners are familiar with our routine. We 10 00:00:35.000 --> 00:00:37.799 record live to tape and I give you the dates 11 00:00:37.840 --> 00:00:40.479 so you have context and relevance. It is the twenty 12 00:00:40.560 --> 00:00:44.679 fifth of February, and we continue our celebration of Black 13 00:00:45.200 --> 00:00:49.479 History Month here at Being Frank. The Trump Administration's attempt 14 00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:54.520 to rewrite history to suit their vision of America continues unabated. 15 00:00:55.039 --> 00:00:57.560 That was on full display during the President's State of 16 00:00:57.600 --> 00:01:01.439 the Union address last night, and with the possible exception 17 00:01:01.679 --> 00:01:07.040 of our LGBTQ plus and immigrant communities, no group has 18 00:01:07.120 --> 00:01:11.159 been more targeted for this revisionist history than Black Americans. 19 00:01:11.680 --> 00:01:15.280 We have seen the video and the attempts to desecrate 20 00:01:15.359 --> 00:01:19.799 memorials dedicated to the Black experience in America, and perhaps 21 00:01:19.879 --> 00:01:23.760 the sting of these policies is felt mostly through the 22 00:01:23.799 --> 00:01:28.239 cuts in federal subsidies with minority art communities and the 23 00:01:28.280 --> 00:01:32.400 programs associated with them. The irony of these cuts is 24 00:01:32.439 --> 00:01:35.400 that they eliminate the very means by which minorities can 25 00:01:35.480 --> 00:01:38.920 lift themselves out of poverty that plagues so many of 26 00:01:38.959 --> 00:01:42.280 their communities. In just a minute, we'll welcome back to 27 00:01:42.359 --> 00:01:45.239 being Frank, a man who has dedicated his life to 28 00:01:45.359 --> 00:01:48.959 improving the lives of young people in underserved communities through 29 00:01:49.079 --> 00:01:52.799 theater arts. We'll be having some intelligent conversation on how 30 00:01:52.840 --> 00:01:55.599 he is coping with these changes now and what they 31 00:01:55.680 --> 00:01:58.879 might mean for the future. And for the second portion 32 00:01:58.959 --> 00:02:01.439 of our program, will see Witch Gears and we'll meet 33 00:02:01.439 --> 00:02:04.840 one of the creators and organizers of the nineteenth annual 34 00:02:05.439 --> 00:02:09.280 Polar Plunge that has raised hundreds of thousands of dollars 35 00:02:09.280 --> 00:02:14.000 for medical needs of local children. Okay, now, please welcome 36 00:02:14.039 --> 00:02:17.240 back to being Frank. He's a playwright and the artistic 37 00:02:17.319 --> 00:02:21.120 director of the Shades Repertory Theater in Havistrow in New York. 38 00:02:21.319 --> 00:02:24.199 And he returns to being Frank. My friend, mister Samuel 39 00:02:24.280 --> 00:02:26.199 Harps Samuel, thanks once again for joining me. 40 00:02:26.280 --> 00:02:28.719 Always it pleasure to get a chance to talk to you. 41 00:02:28.960 --> 00:02:30.000 Love coming on your show. 42 00:02:32.360 --> 00:02:35.879 We appreciate that, Samuel, and we'll have some intelligent conversation, 43 00:02:35.960 --> 00:02:38.759 that's for sure. Let's again, it's been a while since 44 00:02:38.759 --> 00:02:40.400 you've been on the program. Tell us a little bit 45 00:02:40.400 --> 00:02:44.039 about Samuel Harps and your involvement with the rep theater 46 00:02:44.159 --> 00:02:45.680 of the Shades Repertory Theater. 47 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:51.439 Yes, yes, indeed. Well, first of all, Shades came about 48 00:02:51.840 --> 00:02:56.400 about twenty three years ago. I realized that I was 49 00:02:56.479 --> 00:02:59.360 living in the community of community theaters and none of 50 00:02:59.400 --> 00:03:03.319 those people doing any plays that with anybody to look 51 00:03:03.400 --> 00:03:05.120 like me or any of the kids that I was 52 00:03:05.159 --> 00:03:09.719 teaching at the time. Therefore, of course, like necessity is 53 00:03:09.800 --> 00:03:15.599 the creator everything, you know, I created a place in Habstaw, 54 00:03:15.879 --> 00:03:19.840 an underserved community where kids could first of all come 55 00:03:20.400 --> 00:03:24.439 and enjoy theater, and that broadened out into actually doing 56 00:03:24.639 --> 00:03:28.520 theater with the kids in the community. So it was 57 00:03:28.759 --> 00:03:32.400 just organically happened, just by no one else around here 58 00:03:32.400 --> 00:03:34.240 would do it. They were doing guys and dolls and 59 00:03:34.319 --> 00:03:37.759 damn Yankees in Oklahoma, and a lot of the kids 60 00:03:37.800 --> 00:03:40.599 in my community didn't sing, didn't even know where Oklahoma 61 00:03:40.800 --> 00:03:44.080 was and really didn't care. So we started doing original 62 00:03:44.120 --> 00:03:49.199 pieces in Habitstraw and it continued off for twenty two years. 63 00:03:50.360 --> 00:03:54.240 SA mean, why is it important for young people to 64 00:03:54.280 --> 00:03:59.479 see literally see people that they can relate to and 65 00:03:59.560 --> 00:04:04.199 hear music and lifestyles that they understand. Why is that 66 00:04:04.240 --> 00:04:05.159 so important? 67 00:04:05.319 --> 00:04:11.080 Well obvious, I think it's crucial, especially now historically or 68 00:04:11.199 --> 00:04:15.159 we it seems like a lot of possibility for a 69 00:04:15.240 --> 00:04:18.560 culture to be erased. We see what has happened to 70 00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:21.560 the Native American and looking at it from the outside 71 00:04:21.800 --> 00:04:26.279 looking in, it's like that couldn't happen. But slowly, but surely, 72 00:04:26.399 --> 00:04:30.680 especially in the last twenty years, we've been slowly been 73 00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:35.519 attempted to get erased, unless something like the George Floyd happened, 74 00:04:35.560 --> 00:04:39.120 of course, which kind of brings the black people back 75 00:04:39.759 --> 00:04:42.639 into the light. You know, we just kind of mows 76 00:04:42.680 --> 00:04:47.199 you along. But history has become important because it is 77 00:04:47.360 --> 00:04:51.639 possible that in one hundred years black people could be 78 00:04:52.360 --> 00:04:54.680 a blip on the radar, and we're not a blip 79 00:04:54.720 --> 00:04:55.240 on the radar. 80 00:04:57.800 --> 00:04:59.680 Same with that in mind, talk a little bit about 81 00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:03.240 some of the goals of the Theater of Shades Ultimately, 82 00:05:03.279 --> 00:05:06.160 what do you look to accomplish with the theater? 83 00:05:07.120 --> 00:05:10.920 It again, it took on a life of his arm 84 00:05:11.000 --> 00:05:14.360 Frank in a sense that we started doing original plays 85 00:05:15.120 --> 00:05:17.959 again because a lot of the high schools in the area, 86 00:05:18.680 --> 00:05:23.360 in Rockland in general, we're doing plays that were had 87 00:05:23.399 --> 00:05:27.240 no African Americans, no Latinos, and it's important for people 88 00:05:27.279 --> 00:05:32.560 to see themselves in theater or otherwise it means absolutely nothing. 89 00:05:33.199 --> 00:05:36.399 So the necessity came about with just doing original plays. 90 00:05:36.639 --> 00:05:39.240 What do you kids want to talk about? What's important 91 00:05:39.240 --> 00:05:43.480 to you? And that's where it began. After each performance 92 00:05:43.519 --> 00:05:45.360 we would do a Q and A where the kids 93 00:05:45.360 --> 00:05:50.120 would stay in character. Usually our plays centered around conflict 94 00:05:50.199 --> 00:05:53.800 resolution of some degree because that's what most of the 95 00:05:53.879 --> 00:05:56.839 kids were doing with dealing with in their lives, some 96 00:05:56.879 --> 00:06:00.480 sort of conflict. So with the Q and A, kids 97 00:06:00.600 --> 00:06:03.279 got a chance to remain in character and talk about 98 00:06:03.319 --> 00:06:09.000 their choices. And that became our signature with the theater 99 00:06:09.439 --> 00:06:13.040 with Haberstrow Youth Theater, and that carried on into Shades 100 00:06:13.399 --> 00:06:17.839 where I started to do it primarily historical plays. February 101 00:06:18.000 --> 00:06:21.319 is the I've always joked, the coldest and the shortest 102 00:06:21.360 --> 00:06:25.560 month of the year. For African American and for years, 103 00:06:25.639 --> 00:06:30.720 even back as far as I can remember, it was important, yes, 104 00:06:31.399 --> 00:06:34.720 but it always stopped that the civil rights movement. It 105 00:06:34.800 --> 00:06:42.279 was we came here, went through slavery, reconstruction, overcame, and 106 00:06:42.319 --> 00:06:45.240 then slid back down again and look at where we are. 107 00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:51.480 So again, the importance of art theater in particular is 108 00:06:52.120 --> 00:06:58.879 how we tell our stories through music, through dance, through theater. 109 00:07:00.120 --> 00:07:03.319 And if we don't have that and it's getting stripped 110 00:07:03.319 --> 00:07:05.800 away through budget cuts, I'll get to that in a minute, 111 00:07:06.240 --> 00:07:11.199 because again, our funding came from the community itself. You know, 112 00:07:11.279 --> 00:07:15.240 we start to get grants just from longevity contuity, just 113 00:07:15.279 --> 00:07:18.439 from being there. We get small grants here and there. 114 00:07:18.480 --> 00:07:21.279 But to keep the doors swinging open, we had to 115 00:07:21.319 --> 00:07:24.079 create an audience and the people did come. 116 00:07:26.120 --> 00:07:29.360 Well. With that in mind, Sam, let's talk about success 117 00:07:30.120 --> 00:07:32.319 first of all, and you can be personal with it. 118 00:07:32.680 --> 00:07:36.319 How do you define success? And then within your theater 119 00:07:36.720 --> 00:07:40.600 and the zeitgeist if you will love the theater, how 120 00:07:40.600 --> 00:07:42.759 do you define success there? And can you give us 121 00:07:42.759 --> 00:07:43.759 some examples? 122 00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:49.079 Yeah, twenty two years is success. We started out with 123 00:07:49.439 --> 00:07:54.160 audiences with the youth theater. You have grandmothers, you have aunts, 124 00:07:54.199 --> 00:07:58.079 and you have their siblings and kids they go to 125 00:07:58.079 --> 00:08:00.439 school with that came to play they slowly it came, 126 00:08:01.199 --> 00:08:06.079 but Shain's Repertory Theater when we started to do plays 127 00:08:06.120 --> 00:08:11.800 by lesser known African Americans. We've been writing plays for centuries, 128 00:08:13.360 --> 00:08:18.439 so we started to do plays that spoke to the community. 129 00:08:19.560 --> 00:08:23.560 People started to come and that became our success. Just audience. 130 00:08:24.519 --> 00:08:27.439 Soon we were getting, you know, audience of one hundred 131 00:08:27.519 --> 00:08:31.319 hundred and fifty people, and that is how we measured 132 00:08:31.360 --> 00:08:34.440 our success, just lunge heavity, just being there in the 133 00:08:34.480 --> 00:08:39.519 community of community theaters and developing an audience. That's how 134 00:08:39.519 --> 00:08:40.879 I measure our success there. 135 00:08:42.080 --> 00:08:45.399 And you mentioned dealing with budgets, and that's the reality 136 00:08:45.600 --> 00:08:47.519 for everything. I mean, everything has to be paid for. 137 00:08:48.240 --> 00:08:51.639 Even when they say not for profits, there's still costs 138 00:08:51.720 --> 00:08:56.039 associated with it. You know, it doesn't run itself. And 139 00:08:56.639 --> 00:09:02.200 I know, especially with the slashing of the EI, you know, 140 00:09:02.240 --> 00:09:05.519 and that that certainly trickles down, and sometimes it's more 141 00:09:05.559 --> 00:09:10.399 than a trickle, it's a flood where you're in danger 142 00:09:10.440 --> 00:09:14.440 of being washed away. And this this past weekend was 143 00:09:14.679 --> 00:09:18.919 a prime example. I know, you you salvaged something that 144 00:09:18.960 --> 00:09:22.440 you had planned by doing a reading at ROCCA, the 145 00:09:22.519 --> 00:09:25.600 Rockland Center for the Arts set that up for us 146 00:09:25.639 --> 00:09:28.120 a little bit what that was supposed to be originally 147 00:09:28.559 --> 00:09:31.120 in how you managed to salvage it and do something 148 00:09:31.200 --> 00:09:36.679 positive too, working within the framework of of this budgetary restraints. 149 00:09:36.720 --> 00:09:37.840 Now if you can't. 150 00:09:37.960 --> 00:09:42.360 Yes easily, well, you know, every Black History Month for 151 00:09:42.399 --> 00:09:46.240 the last eight years, we've had funding from disca h 152 00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:50.799 New York Council of the Arts that was part of 153 00:09:51.960 --> 00:09:56.360 what they call a uh sort of a sub grant. 154 00:09:56.759 --> 00:09:59.919 Arts Council of Rockland gathered money and they were able 155 00:09:59.960 --> 00:10:03.159 to distribute it amongst people in Rockland County, so we 156 00:10:03.200 --> 00:10:05.480 would get a trickle of a you know, two or 157 00:10:05.480 --> 00:10:09.440 three thousand dollars, which is a theater at our level, 158 00:10:09.559 --> 00:10:13.120 which is good money. Our actors rarely get paid, but 159 00:10:13.360 --> 00:10:16.679 it's costuming because there are historical pieces and designers and 160 00:10:16.720 --> 00:10:21.679 things like that. But this year, actually last year, I'll 161 00:10:21.679 --> 00:10:24.679 go a few years back when it started with the pandemic. 162 00:10:25.519 --> 00:10:30.960 You know, the theater. Theater always finds a way to survive, 163 00:10:33.559 --> 00:10:37.720 always after for the American theater on that level of 164 00:10:37.759 --> 00:10:41.080 the total pole, we have to find a way to survive. 165 00:10:41.559 --> 00:10:45.279 But those money so it's a few dollars help. But 166 00:10:45.360 --> 00:10:48.480 suddenly we had moved up to Garnaville and the pandemic 167 00:10:48.559 --> 00:10:50.919 hit and we weren't able to get into our theater. 168 00:10:51.080 --> 00:10:53.240 We couldn't even get into the building for a year, 169 00:10:54.000 --> 00:10:57.200 so we weren't able to do anything. And again, if 170 00:10:57.399 --> 00:11:01.159 people aren't buying tickets, we're not getting any come. But 171 00:11:01.320 --> 00:11:04.519 the grant that came from a Corps thirty five hundred 172 00:11:04.559 --> 00:11:07.960 dollars sometimes five thousand, that would get us off the 173 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:11.919 ground for every Black History Month this year. Last year, 174 00:11:11.960 --> 00:11:17.840 actually NISKA didn't give us a grant at all. A 175 00:11:17.960 --> 00:11:22.159 Corps didn't get large enough grant, so we had to 176 00:11:22.799 --> 00:11:25.039 of course scratch the Burning of New York, which is 177 00:11:25.200 --> 00:11:29.960 a historical peace. But it's sixteen characters and they're coming 178 00:11:29.960 --> 00:11:32.720 from all over, from Manhattan, they're coming from Westchester, so 179 00:11:33.480 --> 00:11:36.279 you know, how did they get here? Funding? It takes money, 180 00:11:36.919 --> 00:11:40.840 but we just got, you know, basically nothing last year, 181 00:11:41.519 --> 00:11:47.559 which led us to do a community poetry reading, which 182 00:11:47.600 --> 00:11:55.679 it's called reached out to community leaders, pastors, the assistant 183 00:11:55.720 --> 00:12:02.039 director of NAACP, lawyers, teachers, actors, and said, let's celebrate 184 00:12:02.639 --> 00:12:08.240 our literary figures, our James Baldwin's Our Langston Hughes r 185 00:12:08.440 --> 00:12:12.320 W B do bos Our County colin and for the 186 00:12:12.440 --> 00:12:21.960 public and talk about the last one hundred years of literature, poems, speeches, dedications. 187 00:12:22.759 --> 00:12:25.200 A two hour event and we put it out there. 188 00:12:25.240 --> 00:12:27.320 We had people that come to read. We had eleven 189 00:12:27.320 --> 00:12:31.360 community readers, and we always we get good audiences at 190 00:12:31.440 --> 00:12:35.200 ROCA because Black History Month, respectfully, all of our liberal 191 00:12:35.200 --> 00:12:38.840 friends or black friends, our Latino friends. You know, people 192 00:12:38.879 --> 00:12:42.080 come out for that one month because the focus is 193 00:12:42.120 --> 00:12:47.200 on African Americans. The other eleven months, you know, you know, 194 00:12:47.360 --> 00:12:50.879 we have to somehow get in the news probably other ways. 195 00:12:50.919 --> 00:12:52.840 So well, I was going to ask you, how do 196 00:12:52.879 --> 00:12:56.360 you continue that momentum? Sam You'll have you know, you 197 00:12:56.480 --> 00:13:00.440 build it. How do you continue it? 198 00:13:00.440 --> 00:13:02.960 It's what I do. I mean that sounds almost cliche, 199 00:13:03.200 --> 00:13:07.320 but you know, thirty three years I've been doing this. 200 00:13:07.360 --> 00:13:09.600 I mean it came to New York on an internship 201 00:13:09.759 --> 00:13:12.519 in my thirties. I didn't even grow up until I 202 00:13:12.559 --> 00:13:17.600 was thirty four, you know, mentally anyway, and I'm. 203 00:13:17.240 --> 00:13:18.759 Working on it, Samuel, don't feel. 204 00:13:18.639 --> 00:13:21.799 Yeah, you know. So anyway, I came to New York, 205 00:13:22.519 --> 00:13:25.279 I was raised as an army Brad Frank as you know, 206 00:13:27.080 --> 00:13:29.519 you know from way back. You know, my father fought 207 00:13:29.519 --> 00:13:33.159 in a couple of wars. I thought I didn't fight 208 00:13:33.200 --> 00:13:35.000 in the wars, but I was in the military. Both 209 00:13:35.080 --> 00:13:39.080 my sisters were wars my cousin's uncles, which brings me 210 00:13:39.159 --> 00:13:42.840 to that whole patriotic thing. People always talk about, how 211 00:13:42.879 --> 00:13:46.679 could you be patriotic? How could I not be patriotic? 212 00:13:47.240 --> 00:13:49.480 You know what I mean. We've been fighting in wars, 213 00:13:49.559 --> 00:13:53.440 my actual my family had been fighting wars on the 214 00:13:53.559 --> 00:13:57.720 soil since the Civil War, So of course I'm patriotic. 215 00:13:58.120 --> 00:14:01.279 And when I do historical pieces and drag out these 216 00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:04.519 bits of history that people had never heard of, never 217 00:14:04.559 --> 00:14:07.519 read about. We didn't get in school. People didn't talk 218 00:14:07.559 --> 00:14:11.279 about the kids now, you know, even though we have Google, 219 00:14:11.320 --> 00:14:14.679 they can find out what they want. But for generations, 220 00:14:14.919 --> 00:14:18.480 you have this ignorance about who we are as a culture. 221 00:14:19.159 --> 00:14:23.679 You have your top ten figures, but you have generations 222 00:14:24.120 --> 00:14:29.399 of history that African Americans have stamped on the United 223 00:14:29.399 --> 00:14:32.840 States of America. And when you get scorned, when you 224 00:14:32.960 --> 00:14:37.159 get you know, I guess, for lack of a better term, 225 00:14:37.720 --> 00:14:40.120 you know, not the realm. You know, what I mean, 226 00:14:40.440 --> 00:14:46.159 in a country that you died for that continues to 227 00:14:46.200 --> 00:14:52.080 treat as second class citizens or even third class. You 228 00:14:52.120 --> 00:14:55.840 know now, So you know, Frank, when you touch, when 229 00:14:55.919 --> 00:15:01.480 we talk, when anyone touches on that chord, it it 230 00:15:02.639 --> 00:15:07.080 spurs me into passion. I won't say rage. Rage was 231 00:15:07.080 --> 00:15:08.879 in my thirties and forties. 232 00:15:09.120 --> 00:15:09.559 I hear you. 233 00:15:10.000 --> 00:15:12.120 I'm in my seventies now, so it's. 234 00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:13.000 Not rare too. 235 00:15:13.240 --> 00:15:15.840 You know, I'm gonna be seventies. 236 00:15:16.120 --> 00:15:17.600 But it welcome to the club. 237 00:15:17.960 --> 00:15:22.159 Yeah, it's turned to something else, which is again why 238 00:15:22.320 --> 00:15:27.080 I have to as a storyteller. I have to maintain 239 00:15:28.159 --> 00:15:35.679 a legacy of literature, poems, theater and movies. African Americans 240 00:15:35.919 --> 00:15:37.759 that are now doing movies. I don't know if you 241 00:15:37.799 --> 00:15:40.600 saw Sinners yet, but have you did you get a 242 00:15:40.679 --> 00:15:44.320 chance to see Centers? I did, Yes, Okay, it's it's 243 00:15:44.720 --> 00:15:47.399 everyone should see it. My daughter told me about it, 244 00:15:48.039 --> 00:15:50.360 and she told me about I thought it was a 245 00:15:50.440 --> 00:15:54.559 vampire fleet, but it's a lot deeper than a vampire fleet. 246 00:15:55.279 --> 00:15:58.919 And I heard Coopler on a show talking about it. 247 00:15:59.000 --> 00:16:03.080 Then all those subliminal meanings in it, everything that's going on, 248 00:16:03.200 --> 00:16:07.480 and it is again him screaming out. Look at us. 249 00:16:07.600 --> 00:16:11.600 We are here. It's screaming at screaming, and we've been 250 00:16:11.639 --> 00:16:14.759 screaming for how long? For one hundred and sixty six 251 00:16:14.879 --> 00:16:18.360 hundred years or so. But now's the time. You know, 252 00:16:18.519 --> 00:16:23.200 we have a broad audience and our music is changing. 253 00:16:24.360 --> 00:16:29.080 Our rappers are growing up, you know, into men who 254 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:33.399 have experiences. There's something about experience. I wasn't a big 255 00:16:33.480 --> 00:16:36.759 rap fan when it came out, but what these brothers is. 256 00:16:36.799 --> 00:16:43.440 The comedians, the rappers, the composers, the playwrights, the writers, 257 00:16:44.039 --> 00:16:47.720 They're actually speaking and saying something. Now. I'm so proud 258 00:16:47.799 --> 00:16:53.039 of our literal our literary tradition. Moving on, so proud 259 00:16:53.039 --> 00:16:53.759 of what's going on. 260 00:16:55.039 --> 00:16:58.720 A perfect segue, Samuel. With that mind, I asked to 261 00:16:58.759 --> 00:17:01.679 prepare reading for it, and I know you have. I 262 00:17:01.759 --> 00:17:06.319 have two. I'd like to get to one. Now. Would 263 00:17:06.319 --> 00:17:09.519 you set it up for us and then read for us? Yes? 264 00:17:10.240 --> 00:17:16.400 I will. This poem is a short poem written by 265 00:17:16.480 --> 00:17:23.079 Content Culin called Hillburn the Fair. It's about Hillbury, New York. 266 00:17:23.599 --> 00:17:28.000 In brief. In nineteen forty three, Thirgood Marshall won a 267 00:17:28.039 --> 00:17:32.920 disparity case regarded integration in the schools of Hillburn. This 268 00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:37.119 is eleven years before Brown versus Board of Education, right 269 00:17:37.160 --> 00:17:41.359 here in Hillburn, where young black kids weren't allowed to 270 00:17:41.559 --> 00:17:46.160 go to the white schools in the areas. They had 271 00:17:46.160 --> 00:17:48.559 to go to a school that had the library, the 272 00:17:48.640 --> 00:17:53.599 indoor bathrooms, no gymnasium. Marshall came to Hilbert, New York 273 00:17:54.240 --> 00:17:58.720 and bought this case had won content. Colin wrote this 274 00:17:59.119 --> 00:18:04.960 poem they reference to that. It's called Hilbert the Fair. 275 00:18:07.759 --> 00:18:13.319 God have pity on such a city where parent teachers 276 00:18:13.480 --> 00:18:18.319 child to hate. God looks down on such a town. 277 00:18:19.160 --> 00:18:25.920 We're prejudiced. The great Bruise truckingly and evily. What should 278 00:18:25.960 --> 00:18:32.519 be liberties at state? It's by Kanti Columns, you. 279 00:18:32.440 --> 00:18:36.640 Know, I should mention also Joe Allen, Uh, the producer, 280 00:18:37.240 --> 00:18:40.640 created a wonderful documentary on that whole thing, called Two 281 00:18:40.640 --> 00:18:44.200 Schools in Hillburn. I highly recommend it. I believe he's 282 00:18:44.200 --> 00:18:46.880 going to be having a showing at the Nayak Library 283 00:18:46.920 --> 00:18:50.720 coming up soon, and I highly highly recommend it for everyone. 284 00:18:51.480 --> 00:18:53.880 What should what should people take from? You know, that's 285 00:18:53.880 --> 00:18:56.559 the beauty of poetry. They can take whatever they hear 286 00:18:56.680 --> 00:19:01.000 out of it. What do you think, uh, people might 287 00:19:01.240 --> 00:19:06.720 want to take from that poem acknowledgement. 288 00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:13.319 Basically, this is a nineteen that was in nineteen forty three, Frank, 289 00:19:14.000 --> 00:19:15.759 it could have been nineteen sixty three, It could have 290 00:19:15.799 --> 00:19:18.559 been nineteen seventy three, it could have been nineteen eighty 291 00:19:18.599 --> 00:19:23.720 three in a place like Hillburn. So I think people 292 00:19:23.759 --> 00:19:27.039 basically take from that. I mean, he was writing his poem. 293 00:19:27.359 --> 00:19:33.759 The last line what should be Liberty's it stayed is 294 00:19:33.839 --> 00:19:38.400 what people should read from that poem. Poetry is elusive, 295 00:19:39.000 --> 00:19:39.599 you know what I mean. 296 00:19:40.400 --> 00:19:45.400 But yeah, it's it's wide open for interpretation. I think 297 00:19:45.480 --> 00:19:49.160 those people that's why the practitioners of both arts, it's 298 00:19:49.200 --> 00:19:52.119 a joy because it's the challenge of it, you know what, 299 00:19:52.519 --> 00:19:55.480 you know, as perspective to say, we can discuss a 300 00:19:55.519 --> 00:19:58.440 little bit. So for people who are not familiar. We're 301 00:19:58.440 --> 00:20:01.599 from Rockland and that's w where this show emanates from, 302 00:20:01.640 --> 00:20:03.920 but because we stream it goes to other parts of 303 00:20:03.960 --> 00:20:06.279 the country in the world for that matter. You know, 304 00:20:06.519 --> 00:20:09.240 Hilbert is this tiny little place, and it ain't down 305 00:20:09.319 --> 00:20:13.759 south either. When we're thinking civil rights events and stuff, 306 00:20:13.759 --> 00:20:18.359 we think of Selma, a plant, so on and so forth. 307 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:21.799 This is a tiny little village about what thirty five 308 00:20:21.920 --> 00:20:25.440 forty miles from town Manhattan. That's kind of almost like 309 00:20:25.480 --> 00:20:28.720 a one stop like town. So it's amazing how this 310 00:20:28.759 --> 00:20:31.599 has played out in America, but all over America. And 311 00:20:31.599 --> 00:20:33.839 I don't think people realize that your thoughts. 312 00:20:34.200 --> 00:20:40.359 Yeah, yeah, the place the poem starts with, God have 313 00:20:40.559 --> 00:20:42.680 pity on this on such a city. 314 00:20:43.480 --> 00:20:51.680 Yeah, yeah, it's interesting. So you know, I mentioned a 315 00:20:51.720 --> 00:20:55.240 little bit about the State of the Union address last night, 316 00:20:55.279 --> 00:20:58.000 which was the longest in history. It already broke his 317 00:20:58.119 --> 00:21:02.880 record that he already held. Uh and certainly mixed feelings 318 00:21:02.920 --> 00:21:05.640 depending on what side of the aisle literally you were on. 319 00:21:06.200 --> 00:21:09.720 But but I thought the reaction, particularly with when al 320 00:21:09.799 --> 00:21:16.400 Green walked through the body of the of the event 321 00:21:16.880 --> 00:21:20.519 with the sign that you know, against the video that 322 00:21:20.799 --> 00:21:23.720 black people are not apes, and the reaction of what 323 00:21:23.920 --> 00:21:26.799 someone tried to grab it away. I forget the congressman 324 00:21:26.839 --> 00:21:29.599 who centered his name, and but but talk a little 325 00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:33.319 bit about how that all went down, and your feelings 326 00:21:33.680 --> 00:21:36.680 about the video itself and the reaction to it, the 327 00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:40.519 denial by the president and the refusal but most people 328 00:21:40.759 --> 00:21:43.599 to simply accept it. What what first you made? 329 00:21:43.720 --> 00:21:51.400 You made, of course mean the Obama Obama Michelle video. 330 00:21:51.599 --> 00:21:55.640 Right, Yes, of course, yes, I call it. I call 331 00:21:55.680 --> 00:21:57.720 it the video because I don't like to give it 332 00:21:57.759 --> 00:22:03.640 more credit race this piece of turk if yeah, I 333 00:22:03.680 --> 00:22:07.799 mean this show otherwise I would, but yeah, I call 334 00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:11.400 it the video. What was again? I could? I was 335 00:22:12.599 --> 00:22:15.039 shocked and heart But as a black man, when you 336 00:22:15.079 --> 00:22:18.759 see something like that, is it rage? Is it righteous rage? 337 00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:24.759 It's I talked a few minutes ago about at seventy uh, 338 00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:30.160 I take nothing this man does I take with the 339 00:22:30.240 --> 00:22:35.359 great assault? What was most simple? I mean my thoord 340 00:22:35.400 --> 00:22:38.400 When I first saw the video, it's Obama that he's 341 00:22:38.440 --> 00:22:44.480 talking about, and you know, he's become a national institution 342 00:22:44.640 --> 00:22:48.680 in himself and as well as his family, and him 343 00:22:48.720 --> 00:22:53.079 not responding to it was a huge response. But now 344 00:22:53.200 --> 00:22:56.839 it's social media, so it's a it has a life 345 00:22:56.880 --> 00:23:00.880 of his own. It's bigger than Obama, includes all of us, 346 00:23:01.039 --> 00:23:07.039 me included. Whenever I see a caricature now, I if 347 00:23:07.039 --> 00:23:13.119 it came from a source, Frank, it would it would 348 00:23:13.240 --> 00:23:17.640 feel a lot worse being called the Inward on Main 349 00:23:17.720 --> 00:23:22.400 Street right here in town than it is coming from 350 00:23:23.079 --> 00:23:28.200 this guy, the actor math. Someone actually expected him to 351 00:23:28.279 --> 00:23:33.279 apologize for it. And fire his whoever linked it out 352 00:23:33.319 --> 00:23:37.400 there not taking responsibility at off of doing it, or 353 00:23:37.960 --> 00:23:44.160 you know, it's it's tough to talk about this guy. 354 00:23:44.319 --> 00:23:47.079 I can't even mention his name, and I think I 355 00:23:47.160 --> 00:23:50.079 got that from my mom. She can't mention his name. 356 00:23:52.519 --> 00:23:58.599 I take no. With what he's doing and or attempting 357 00:23:58.640 --> 00:24:01.680 to do to the country is just so baffling. I mean, 358 00:24:01.720 --> 00:24:08.119 everyone knows and sees this. For he's not missed out 359 00:24:08.240 --> 00:24:14.160 on any demographic women blacks. Ah, you know. Now you've 360 00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:17.160 got poor White's not liking him. And that's when it 361 00:24:17.240 --> 00:24:21.039 really gets scary, you know, because he's touched on everything. 362 00:24:21.079 --> 00:24:26.400 He's touched on everyone, you know. So I'm passed being 363 00:24:26.480 --> 00:24:30.640 angry with him and more angry with the country. But 364 00:24:30.799 --> 00:24:36.039 on the other end of that, I'm not an eternal optimist. 365 00:24:36.880 --> 00:24:44.599 But to see Americans, soccer moms, athletes, black white, young 366 00:24:44.720 --> 00:24:50.920 olbgqs or whatever are speaking against their turning away invitations 367 00:24:50.920 --> 00:24:57.079 to the White House. There the courts are making their 368 00:24:57.119 --> 00:25:01.079 way slowly, but surely you have a army of lawyers 369 00:25:01.119 --> 00:25:04.440 that are fighting against what he's doing. Uh, you know. 370 00:25:04.680 --> 00:25:11.720 So it's it's disheartening and sometimes encouraging to see a 371 00:25:11.799 --> 00:25:16.880 no King's rally in a place like Oregon or Memphis 372 00:25:17.680 --> 00:25:22.240 or Alabama, you know, with the Rainbow people. That kind 373 00:25:22.240 --> 00:25:24.799 of gives me that hope that we might be able 374 00:25:24.839 --> 00:25:28.799 to last at least in the midterms and possibly after. 375 00:25:29.319 --> 00:25:33.480 But they will last this mstruck other than them getting 376 00:25:33.559 --> 00:25:37.960 us into a war. I came into I came into 377 00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:40.480 today saying I'm not going to be heavy on the politics. 378 00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:45.640 But you brick at that. In God, this guy, you know, 379 00:25:46.759 --> 00:25:50.799 I everyone's political. You cannot be political and living in 380 00:25:50.839 --> 00:25:52.160 America anymore? 381 00:25:53.000 --> 00:25:55.720 Well yeah, you know. And again even with this show, 382 00:25:55.759 --> 00:25:59.839 and obviously we're discussing arts in it, but it's our lives, 383 00:26:00.119 --> 00:26:03.319 you know what I mean, talk politics, Well, then you 384 00:26:03.359 --> 00:26:07.079 can't talk about living in America. Yeah, not anymore, you know, 385 00:26:08.640 --> 00:26:10.319 early on now surely. 386 00:26:10.480 --> 00:26:17.519 Like with the opioid epidemic, when African Americans went through 387 00:26:17.519 --> 00:26:22.240 the crack epidemic, and what we got was just say no, okay, 388 00:26:22.640 --> 00:26:28.240 but respectfully, Once a young white girl of one white 389 00:26:28.279 --> 00:26:33.039 boy in suburban Cleveland gets addicted because they hurt their 390 00:26:33.200 --> 00:26:37.799 lead playing soccer, it's a pandemic, you know, it's an epidemic. 391 00:26:38.599 --> 00:26:43.319 You know, because now they're suddenly looking at it. I've 392 00:26:43.480 --> 00:26:47.359 seen people in New York City in an eight year 393 00:26:47.400 --> 00:26:51.240 period in the eighties, thirty three thousand people died of 394 00:26:51.279 --> 00:26:54.920 an overdose. And we got just say no, I'm going 395 00:26:54.960 --> 00:26:56.519 to get off this high horse in a minute. I 396 00:26:56.559 --> 00:27:01.160 just want to give them picture of the fact, the 397 00:27:01.200 --> 00:27:06.400 fact that we've had an epidemic, an opioid epidemic all 398 00:27:06.480 --> 00:27:10.160 of a sudden, because it's reached the suburbs. Now say 399 00:27:10.279 --> 00:27:16.480 with them stripping people off the street, now okay, and 400 00:27:16.519 --> 00:27:19.279 suddenly white people are like, oh, they're they're they're snatching people, 401 00:27:19.359 --> 00:27:22.480