Speaker 1: This is the Poet Speaks, a show all about.
Speaker 2: Or tradition, hip hop and cardboard boxes on the Bloc
Speaker 2: rege Bandolero so your heavy metal punk rock and La
Speaker 2: Junior Hyde pop.
Speaker 1: What makes poetry so amazing, so incredible is this absolute
Speaker 1: fascination and ability to change our lives, the old tradition,
Speaker 1: the reason why we speak.
Speaker 3: This is the Poet Speaks. Hello everyone, and welcome back
Speaker 3: to the poet Speaks podcast. Now our next Best is
Speaker 3: a spoken word smith, lyricist, teaching artists, and a published
Speaker 3: author from Queen's New York. She's been writing poetry for
Speaker 3: over two decades and performed on many stages including The Bowery,
Speaker 3: New York, and Post Cafe, Lemon College, Poetry met Please,
Speaker 3: jc Al and Wan Poetry Us, to name a few.
Speaker 3: Now they're also published author of Chris Sales Not Quite
Speaker 3: the Butterfly, poetic memoir now available on i Amazon. Everyone, please,
Speaker 3: welcome to the Post Speaks podcast. Keys Well, Keys.
Speaker 1: How are you?
Speaker 4: I'm good? I'm good, Thank you, Thank you for that intro.
Speaker 4: Man that beautiful.
Speaker 3: I feel like everyone everyone needs an intro. Everyone deserves
Speaker 3: a nice intro to whether you're starting.
Speaker 4: Your day ending your day, Milia day.
Speaker 3: It also feels good, right, yes, yes, absolutely, we alls
Speaker 3: need that reminder of how great we are. But no,
Speaker 3: it's such an absolute pleasure to have you on the
Speaker 3: show today. Tell me, I mean, first and foremost, I
Speaker 3: ask every guest on the podcast, where are you speaking
Speaker 3: to us from today? We're in the world.
Speaker 4: I am in bestar Brooklyn, New York today.
Speaker 3: Okay, Brooklyn, New York, all right, in the borough?
Speaker 4: All right?
Speaker 3: How's New York?
Speaker 4: Teeing you?
Speaker 3: How's New York these days?
Speaker 4: With a lot of time.
Speaker 2: Well, first, first and foremost, it's weather is trash. This
Speaker 2: is the fakest spring summer I've ever seen. As I
Speaker 2: mentioned earlier, I did just get back from Jamaica. So
Speaker 2: to come from beautiful ninety degree weather to this, I
Speaker 2: don't know, seventy degree cold weather not exciting. But aside
Speaker 2: from that, I mean, New York is New York, man.
Speaker 2: It's overpriced, crowded, but still good vibes, still good vibes
Speaker 2: for sure.
Speaker 3: Okay, but of course for sure tell us a little bit.
Speaker 3: I mean, tell us what is I mean? I think
Speaker 3: everyone knows New York is the epicenter of culture. I
Speaker 3: swear I've been all around the world. I don't think
Speaker 3: many places still to this day are like the hub
Speaker 3: that is New York City as a poet that lives
Speaker 3: there and as just the artist that lives there. What
Speaker 3: is it like to be in the place that is
Speaker 3: the envy I believe of many other creatives from around
Speaker 3: the world, What is it like to be in New
Speaker 3: York City as an artist?
Speaker 2: So to be in New York specifically in Brooklyn, because
Speaker 2: I'm originally from Queens and I moved to Brooklyn for
Speaker 2: that reason, because especially in Bedstide, it's it's still a
Speaker 2: lot of culture here despite the gentrification.
Speaker 4: But one thing that I do love.
Speaker 2: And appreciate about New York is that there's always something
Speaker 2: to do, especially for creatives. Like there's always an outlet,
Speaker 2: there's always an open mic, there's always some type of
Speaker 2: event for us to go and be able to, you know,
Speaker 2: express ourselves and share our artwork.
Speaker 4: And the community is very supportive everyone.
Speaker 2: I haven't experienced any like conflict or like any envy
Speaker 2: or any jealousy or it's like, oh, your poem is whack,
Speaker 2: or it's like very much like we go out to
Speaker 2: each other's shows and support each other.
Speaker 4: So the community here is really great.
Speaker 2: I've built a lot of great relationships with people, And yeah,
Speaker 2: I think that there's so many different platforms that you know,
Speaker 2: you'll you have the opportunity to be able to share
Speaker 2: your creativity regardless of what day of the week it is.
Speaker 2: There's something from Sunday through Saturday with time of the day.
Speaker 2: You have early days, you got weekends, and the evenings
Speaker 2: they have after hour spots.
Speaker 4: Like it's just it's it really is here.
Speaker 2: If you want to be able to, you know, put
Speaker 2: yourself out there, the opportunities are absolutely here.
Speaker 3: You had mentioned earlier how expensive it's still overpriced for
Speaker 3: people that let's say, you know, you hear the kind
Speaker 3: of famous you know, famous lore move to New York
Speaker 3: City with ten dollars in my pocket.
Speaker 4: Here you can make it anywhere.
Speaker 3: Do you suggest, I mean, do you suggest what just
Speaker 3: how expensive it is for like an artist that wants
Speaker 3: to make it moving to New York City. It's just
Speaker 3: so many pros and cons I would.
Speaker 2: Think, Yeah, yeah, I think I think the pro to
Speaker 2: that would be, as I mentioned before, the community.
Speaker 4: You know, like if you come out here and.
Speaker 2: You're really on your grind, you really will get the
Speaker 2: support because once people see how you know, how into
Speaker 2: what you are, and they see how much you want,
Speaker 2: you make those connections and people will start plugging you in.
Speaker 4: So in that sense, yeah, I would recommend it on the.
Speaker 2: Expenses part, as far as like living here for real,
Speaker 2: I mean, like you got to have about four or
Speaker 2: five jobs just to you know what I'm saying, be
Speaker 2: able to like really see your money because just the
Speaker 2: cost of live in even for like, for example, if
Speaker 2: you wanted to rent a room.
Speaker 4: Let's say someone comes.
Speaker 2: Here, they just want to rent a room somewhere, You're
Speaker 2: easily looking at paying maybe like thirteen fourteen hundred just
Speaker 2: for a room.
Speaker 4: This ain't even for a whole apartment, you know.
Speaker 2: So it's just like you don't really get your bang
Speaker 2: for your buck in that sense. But if you're if
Speaker 2: you're someone who's going to be on your grind and
Speaker 2: really are committed to your craft whatever it is, I
Speaker 2: think definitely you'll you'll do good here.
Speaker 3: No, No, that's a I think that's just valuable information
Speaker 3: for people to know because people don't always talk about
Speaker 3: that side of you know, especially a romanticized city like
Speaker 3: New York City. But kind of moving a bit along.
Speaker 3: Tell us a bit about I mean, tell us a
Speaker 3: bit about I mean your name Keys, Will tell us
Speaker 3: is that stage name or is that you for real?
Speaker 3: Tell us what is the kind of origination of Keys?
Speaker 4: Will you name?
Speaker 2: So it is my stage name, But it didn't start
Speaker 2: off that way.
Speaker 4: A long time ago.
Speaker 2: I was living in a youth shelter and this was
Speaker 2: like my late teens, early twenties, and there was a
Speaker 2: staff member there that I got really close with, and
Speaker 2: he just started calling me Keys. Like I don't know why,
Speaker 2: but that's the first I had ever heard anyone. Because
Speaker 2: people got all types of nicknames from me, but Keys
Speaker 2: was the one that stuck with me for several reasons.
Speaker 4: One because Alicia Keys is like my like I love
Speaker 4: Alicia Keys.
Speaker 2: That speaks for itself, you know, And when she came
Speaker 2: out I had that was around the time I had
Speaker 2: started writing poetry, and like, I just that stuck with me,
Speaker 2: and I was like, hey, so whenever I introduced myself,
Speaker 2: I'm like, he's like Alicia, and you know, it's like.
Speaker 4: A like a whole thing.
Speaker 2: But it's also I would say, like a derivative of
Speaker 2: my full name, like my given name, which is Ikea Williams.
Speaker 2: So I kind of just like took that and Keys
Speaker 2: will and it just it just stunk.
Speaker 3: So yeah, for sure, that's what's us. Okay, Yeah, since
Speaker 3: you live in Okay, So Alicia Keys, since you live
Speaker 3: in the city, and have you seen her the Broadway.
Speaker 4: Play Where is it Our Hell's Kitchen? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Have you seen it?
Speaker 4: I have not yet, but it is on my summer
Speaker 4: bucket list.
Speaker 2: I have been trying to get to that show for
Speaker 2: months now, but I absolutely will be going this summer
Speaker 2: for sure. I've heard nothing but great things about it,
Speaker 2: and I just feel like, as a New Yorker and
Speaker 2: an Alicia Keys fan, I have to go.
Speaker 4: So I'm definitely going.
Speaker 3: Absolutely. No, I've heard great, great things about that one too.
Speaker 3: It's interesting, though, it's kind of you know, you talk
Speaker 3: about how that name kind of came to be and
Speaker 3: how it's been inspiration from obviously your love of you know,
Speaker 3: the artist Alicia Keys, just derivative of your actual given
Speaker 3: born name. It's kind of interesting how that kind of
Speaker 3: plays a role as we are as artists, you know,
Speaker 3: we take from different parts of our life to create
Speaker 3: what has kind of been your main inspiration for how
Speaker 3: you write poetry. Is it very similar to how you
Speaker 3: kind of crafted together your stage name, you know, in
Speaker 3: terms of you know your whether it be from your
Speaker 3: memoir to your day to day writing. What kind of
Speaker 3: is your inspiration to create and write?
Speaker 4: Most importantly, mainly, my poems have been about.
Speaker 2: Just anything that's happening, like current events, social justice issues,
Speaker 2: just anything that I feel like, you know, it's happening
Speaker 2: to either myself or just.
Speaker 4: A community or people around me. I like to speak
Speaker 4: to that mainly.
Speaker 2: But my vision is to get a little bit more personal.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of my work is more broad,
Speaker 2: and I feel like as long as I've been performing,
Speaker 2: I feel like people still don't know me. So I've
Speaker 2: been wanting to tap into, like geting a little bit
Speaker 2: more personal, telling more of you know, my story through
Speaker 2: my poetry.
Speaker 4: So that is what I've been working on, because.
Speaker 2: I mean, being on the stage is a vulnerable position,
Speaker 2: you know, and I really applaud the people who really
Speaker 2: get out there and bear their souls for real, for real,
Speaker 2: and I just feel like as an artist, I have
Speaker 2: a responsibility to really just share more of myself.
Speaker 4: So that's the direction that it's going. But typically it's.
Speaker 2: Usually like social justice issues or just you know, some
Speaker 2: current event stuff things of that nature.
Speaker 3: For sure, how do you for you, I mean, like
Speaker 3: you said, you mentioned something really pivotal. They're getting on
Speaker 3: stage is such a vulnerable act. Talk to me a
Speaker 3: little bit about how for you you did you ever
Speaker 3: have anxiety jumping on stage being a poet, And if
Speaker 3: you did, how did you ever get over that vulnerability
Speaker 3: to really open up that part of your self performing poetry.
Speaker 4: Interestingly enough, I.
Speaker 2: Never really had stage fright, like even when I started,
Speaker 2: so I started performing really like in school, like high school,
Speaker 2: they had opportunities for us to like do spoken word.
Speaker 4: And it was just so it came so natural to me.
Speaker 2: I don't have a problem like speaking in for the
Speaker 2: crowd and and you know, big rooms of people, like
Speaker 2: for some reason, I just I.
Speaker 4: Just enjoy it.
Speaker 2: I don't know, I know, and that's weird, like certain
Speaker 2: people like what I can never do, but I don't know.
Speaker 4: For me, it's it's always been second nature for me.
Speaker 2: I do still get like that little bit of nervousness
Speaker 2: right before I perform, and that's I feel like that's normal.
Speaker 2: But I actually embrace it because I feel like, because
Speaker 2: I'm feeling that way, that means that I still love
Speaker 2: what I do.
Speaker 4: That means that I still care.
Speaker 2: You know, if that feeling is not there, then I
Speaker 2: don't I don't even want to do it. So yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's that's so true though, because it's you know, when
Speaker 2: you don't have that feeling of it, like if you
Speaker 2: just felt whenever you jumped on stage, it's whatever, let
Speaker 2: me just try.
Speaker 3: I'm ready to go, that means that you don't really
Speaker 3: have much to work towards cause you're already You've already
Speaker 3: reached the finish line, right, So it's like, I possibly
Speaker 3: still have that feelings of butterflies and things like that
Speaker 3: means that you know, you definitely you still love, you
Speaker 3: want to perfect what you do, so I guess that
Speaker 3: plays a big, big role in it. Tell us a
Speaker 3: bit about I mean, you have a poetry collection out
Speaker 3: called Chris Sales Not Quite the Butterfly. That's a very
Speaker 3: kind of the gravity of that title alone, Not Quite
Speaker 3: the Butterfly. Tell us a bit about that. You describe
Speaker 3: it as a poetic memoir. Tell us a bit about
Speaker 3: how that came to be. That's your first that's your
Speaker 3: first publisher.
Speaker 4: Correct, Yeah, tell us how.
Speaker 3: That came to be when that came out, and just
Speaker 3: kind of the DNA of that project for you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure. So Chrysalis is the so.
Speaker 2: As we know it as a cocoon, right, Like, that's
Speaker 2: the stage that the butterfly or the caterpillar rather is
Speaker 2: and as they're becoming the butterfly.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: Hence the reason why I put not quite the butterfly,
Speaker 2: because I was still in that phase of like growing
Speaker 2: and you know, changing, right. I chose that because that's
Speaker 2: where I felt like I was at in my poetry
Speaker 2: journey at that time.
Speaker 4: The book is the book will.
Speaker 2: Be nine years old this year, So at that point
Speaker 2: in my journey, I was still in the beginning phases
Speaker 2: of performing. I don't think I actually even started performing yet.
Speaker 2: I was just writing. And I just wanted to show
Speaker 2: that growth from when I was younger, because I started
Speaker 2: writing at nine, So from I have poems in there
Speaker 2: for when I was like nine, ten eleven up until
Speaker 2: I believe I was like when I published the book,
Speaker 2: I might have been like twenty three, twenty four or
Speaker 2: something like that. So you know, I just wanted to
Speaker 2: show that evolution. And I think the butterfly, because I
Speaker 2: also love butterflies. But I just think that that was
Speaker 2: just the perfect metaphor to show like the evolution and
Speaker 2: the growth, but not quite the butterfly, because I haven't
Speaker 2: yet arrived at where I want to be yet. So
Speaker 2: that was that was kind of how that all, you know,
Speaker 2: came into play man.
Speaker 3: That's insane though, I mean, poems from when you were
Speaker 3: nine years old to the age of twenty four. How
Speaker 3: did you even unearth those poems? Where'd you get them from?
Speaker 3: Did your just from your Where did you even get
Speaker 3: them from? How did someone on poems from nine years old? Oh?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I still have Luckily, I still have like all
Speaker 2: my poetry books. I think I might be missing about
Speaker 2: two which got lost and like you know, moving around.
Speaker 4: But for the most part, I've always made sure to.
Speaker 2: Keep all of my notebooks and poems and everything with
Speaker 2: me because that's, like I said, like I love poetry,
Speaker 2: you know, and that's like if my house was burning down.
Speaker 4: I'm grabbing my poetry books first, you know.
Speaker 2: So yeah, so I just kind of sifted through, you know,
Speaker 2: which poems I wanted to select and I thought would
Speaker 2: help to create the picture because I want to show.
Speaker 2: I wanted to show it's a biography or autobiography rather,
Speaker 2: so you know, showing like my thought process at this
Speaker 2: age and how I felt.
Speaker 4: About it as I got older.
Speaker 2: There are some to post poems in there where you'll
Speaker 2: see a poem from where I was at a certain
Speaker 2: age and then later on my new perspective on that
Speaker 2: same you know.
Speaker 4: That same topic.
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, that was just it just kind of
Speaker 2: fell into place that way. I didn't really plan it
Speaker 2: out like that, but to me, it was the only
Speaker 2: thing that made sense.
Speaker 3: So tell me a bit about what that kind of
Speaker 3: process was for you then unearthing those poems and you
Speaker 3: really at that point. I don't even know what your
Speaker 3: distributor who that was in terms of press or publishing,
Speaker 3: but tell me about what that kind of even just
Speaker 3: journey was for you to see from age nine to
Speaker 3: now you were twenty four to twenty five, whatever may
Speaker 3: have you early twenties, What was that even processed? Just
Speaker 3: was it cathartic for you to look back on that?
Speaker 3: What was that feeling like seeing stuff you wrote from
Speaker 3: then and now, like, do you see how much of
Speaker 3: a change you've made?
Speaker 4: What was that like? I think for me.
Speaker 2: When I read some of the poems from when I
Speaker 2: was younger, I really sat with them and I was
Speaker 2: just like, I wrote that, like just to think like
Speaker 2: my mindset, like what was I going through at that time?
Speaker 4: Like why why did I Why did I write that?
Speaker 2: And just seeing how powerful those pieces were, because even
Speaker 2: though they were simple, they were still powerful, like they
Speaker 2: spoke to whatever I was going through at that time,
Speaker 2: and I didn't even believe that I had wrote them.
Speaker 2: Like reading back at them, I was just like I
Speaker 2: wrote that. Like I still feel that way about some
Speaker 2: of my pieces. I'm just like my mind at those
Speaker 2: times was really just like there's so much depth to
Speaker 2: it and it still shocks me even but I loved that,
Speaker 2: being that I picked poetry up at such a young age,
Speaker 2: being able to really craft it in a way where
Speaker 2: it speaks to who I am, and that was something
Speaker 2: that was consistent.
Speaker 4: It has been consistent throughout all of my poets.
Speaker 2: Like I can hear my voice and I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 2: that that rang truth for me, Like that was me.
Speaker 2: It wasn't me making up this, you know, poem just
Speaker 2: for the sake of like, yeah, I wrote a poem.
Speaker 4: It's like no that's that's me. So it was very reflective, and.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the experience was I don't I don't even know
Speaker 2: where I got the idea to create a book out
Speaker 2: of it. I think I just felt like it was
Speaker 2: time and I did self publishing.
Speaker 4: So you published self publishing through Amazon. It's called uh, I.
Speaker 2: Forget the name of the program, but it's a self
Speaker 2: publishing program through Amazon that I did. And I just
Speaker 2: did research on, you know, how to do everything, how
Speaker 2: to get the ISBN number and the bar code. I
Speaker 2: worked with an illustrator on fiver to do some of
Speaker 2: the little images in the book. But it was pretty
Speaker 2: much a DIY process and I was very proud of
Speaker 2: myself at the end of that. You know, it was
Speaker 2: just seeing something through to completion and yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was. It was a dope experience.
Speaker 3: Where'd the name chrysalist come from?
Speaker 2: So that is the that is the name of the
Speaker 2: So it's the I guess the just for lack of
Speaker 2: better better words, the correct term for what a cocoon is.
Speaker 4: It's called it's actually called the chrysalist.
Speaker 3: Yeah, got you got you? Okay, Wow, tell me out
Speaker 3: of that whole process. Now, you said that was about
Speaker 3: nine years ago, you said, I believe that that got published.
Speaker 3: What is the most what is the most profound or
Speaker 3: most important thing you learned about yourself during that whole
Speaker 3: process of getting that book published, reclaiming some of those
Speaker 3: poems that you wrote in childhood. What was the most
Speaker 3: what was the most significant or important thing you learned
Speaker 3: about yourself?
Speaker 2: Definitely like perseverance, you know, and like I mentioned, just
Speaker 2: seeing something through to completion because it's tangible, right, It's
Speaker 2: something that's like, you know, I did this thing. I
Speaker 2: had this idea and I followed through with it. I
Speaker 2: complete it, and now it's something that lives on forever,
Speaker 2: Like you know, you have a book, and it's just
Speaker 2: like it's not something that expires. It's like, no, I
Speaker 2: have this thing that really represents like this is me.
Speaker 2: This is at some point in my life, I wrote
Speaker 2: a book. So I really just learned like that perseverance,
Speaker 2: that determination. Not making any excuses, especially because during the
Speaker 2: time that I published the book wasn't the best living
Speaker 2: experience for me either. But throughout that time I still
Speaker 2: was like, this is the goal and I'm gonna get
Speaker 2: it done. There's I have no excuse, there's no reason
Speaker 2: not to do it. So yeah, I would say that
Speaker 2: perseverance in the determination.
Speaker 3: Absolutely and tell us how was that kind of how
Speaker 3: was that poetic memoir even nine years later? How is
Speaker 3: that still received? How is it still being received and
Speaker 3: kind of how is that still such a epicenter of
Speaker 3: your your career as a spoken word artist today still interesting?
Speaker 2: Interestingly enough, because I don't talk about the book and
Speaker 2: up a lot of people still don't know that I
Speaker 2: have a book.
Speaker 4: Like I have people that are like, wait.
Speaker 2: What, you got a book, and I'm like, yeah, the
Speaker 2: book is almost like you know, ten years old now,
Speaker 2: it's over a decade old.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 2: The only topic because I also have this thing where
Speaker 2: and I've spoken to other artists and poets as well,
Speaker 2: it's like when I release something, even if I perform
Speaker 2: a poem or I write a poem after our performance
Speaker 2: and if it's recorded, I won't watch it. Like it's
Speaker 2: like once I let it go, it's gone. So that's
Speaker 2: kind of how that went with the book. So it
Speaker 2: was just over time that like I would do events
Speaker 2: and they'd be like, oh, if you have any merch
Speaker 2: or any books for sale, make sure you bring them.
Speaker 2: And I'm like, oh, I do have a book, and
Speaker 2: then I would like go order a couple copies for sale.
Speaker 2: But aside from that, I'm still getting better at like
Speaker 2: promoting the book like it exists.
Speaker 4: You know, something that I did.
Speaker 2: I create it, and I'm still just like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: by the way, I have a book, So.
Speaker 3: Tell me what's up with that? Why?
Speaker 4: Why?
Speaker 3: Why? Why? Why is that? I'm so curious because you did.
Speaker 3: The way you describe it, it seems like such a passion project.
Speaker 3: I mean from I mean you literally birth that, I mean,
Speaker 3: you created the illustrations, the self publishing. Those are such
Speaker 3: labors of work. Like I said, the pull poems from
Speaker 3: when you were childhood till now, that's like even an
Speaker 3: emotional labor that. So what what made you? Then?
Speaker 4: What's up with that?
Speaker 3: I'm just so curious what made you not want to
Speaker 3: press that as much as I like, I.
Speaker 2: Don't know, honestly, I really don't know. Like in the beginning,
Speaker 2: I did, like I had two book releases, you know,
Speaker 2: book signings and everything, and then I celebrated it on
Speaker 2: its one year. I did like a one year birthday
Speaker 2: party for it, and then like after.
Speaker 4: That, it just kind of was just like Okay, onto
Speaker 4: the next thing.
Speaker 2: I think for me, because I'm so creative and I
Speaker 2: have so many different creative ideas that it's hard for
Speaker 2: me to just hold on to something when I know
Speaker 2: I have way more to do.
Speaker 4: So I think that's what it is for me. I
Speaker 4: just kind of just like move along, like once it's done.
Speaker 3: So that's an interesting thought process because when I think
Speaker 3: of the things I've done, I always look at it
Speaker 3: from the perspective and this isn't even good, but like,
Speaker 3: this is just my perspective. Keep talking about the things
Speaker 3: you've done, because it's easier to get more when you've
Speaker 3: done things already. So if I had a book, I
Speaker 3: keep mentioning, oh yeah, I have a book to them,
Speaker 3: people are like, oh, you're trying to write a second one.
Speaker 3: I can give you even more, you know what I mean?
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: But then I guess there's also the side of me,
Speaker 3: the well mental wellness. Just celebrate the fact that you've
Speaker 3: even accomplished this. Most people can't even self publish a book.
Speaker 4: That's hard as.
Speaker 3: Heck, you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm getting I'm getting better, you know,
Speaker 2: celebrating my wins, I'm learning. If that in itself is
Speaker 2: a process. But yeah, I'm learning.
Speaker 3: Well, tell me more about kind of you know, moving
Speaker 3: on from your first poetic memoir?
Speaker 4: What it for you?
Speaker 3: I mean in between you know, as we see you know,
Speaker 3: you've been writing poetry now over two decades. You've performed
Speaker 3: in places like New Riekn's posts, cafe, colleges, poetry me.
Speaker 3: Please tell us now kind of what is that journey
Speaker 3: looking for you? Are you interested in you know, you know,
Speaker 3: just becoming more solidifying your place as more of a
Speaker 3: performer or do you really plan I want to write
Speaker 3: another memoir taking a more of an introspective Look, where's
Speaker 3: the kind of your direction now that you want to
Speaker 3: aim your talent at?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so there's it's it's several different areas, but all
Speaker 2: in alignment. As far as the second book goes, I've
Speaker 2: been in my mind for years like I'm going to
Speaker 2: write the second book, going to write the second book
Speaker 2: because I want it to be like a part two
Speaker 2: to Chrysalist. But I didn't feel like I've grown enough,
Speaker 2: or I didn't feel like I had enough new experiences
Speaker 2: to talk and write about, you know, to even just
Speaker 2: show the evolution, you know. So I was given myself times,
Speaker 2: which is why it's been almost ten years, because I
Speaker 2: mean a lot happens, you know, in ten years, my mindset,
Speaker 2: my perspectives on things, you know, everything. So I do
Speaker 2: want to do a two part to that to just
Speaker 2: you know, continue to show.
Speaker 4: That evolution I have been.
Speaker 2: I've been performing, but I also started slamming a couple
Speaker 2: of years ago, So doing more of the slams for
Speaker 2: people who may not know, Like, it's different from just
Speaker 2: performing because it's competitive, right, Sometimes it is for you know,
Speaker 2: cash value, or other times it's just for like you know,
Speaker 2: bragging rights, depending on the platform, you know, and that
Speaker 2: does push you to sharpen your pen for real, because
Speaker 2: I mean the New York scene alone, these poets out here,
Speaker 2: which are some of my friends, but like their pen
Speaker 2: game is crazy, you know.
Speaker 4: So it pushes you to grow because you can't just
Speaker 4: be like, oh, oh yeah I wrote.
Speaker 2: It's like nah, like you gotta do some reading, you
Speaker 2: gotta do something, some research, you gotta like you know,
Speaker 2: really put put put in that work. So just for myself,
Speaker 2: despite aside from just the competing part of it, it's
Speaker 2: just for myself to be able to grow as a writer.
Speaker 2: And then also I do perform private events. So I
Speaker 2: actually have a wedding this Thursday that I'll be performing at.
Speaker 2: So I customize poems for like the you know, the
Speaker 2: briding groom or the you know, the people getting married
Speaker 2: because it's not specific, but to anyone's getting married, I'll
Speaker 2: you know, customize a poem for them and then surprise
Speaker 2: them at the wedding. They don't get to hear the
Speaker 2: poem until live the wedding gage and that's been that's
Speaker 2: been one of my favorite things to do because I
Speaker 2: by nature am a gift giver, Like I love giving gifts,
Speaker 2: especially personalized gifts, and being able to use my poem
Speaker 2: as a gift, and you know, being able to create.
Speaker 4: That memorable moment for people.
Speaker 2: Has been like, it's just one of my favorite things
Speaker 2: to do and I really enjoy it. So that's more
Speaker 2: I guess, I would say, like on the professional side
Speaker 2: of it. And then in addition to that, I also
Speaker 2: started my greeting card company, so I do, Yes, I
Speaker 2: do make greeting cards.
Speaker 4: You know, for all occasions, all events.
Speaker 2: Right now, I have an Etsy shop for it, and
Speaker 2: I'll be eventually moving that to my own website, which.
Speaker 4: Is being built right now. So yeah, all in all
Speaker 4: in alignment. You know, different different little little pockets.
Speaker 3: But absolutely no, I see, I see the absolutely uh,
Speaker 3: all of it is all in alignment. It's about that
Speaker 3: poetic expression, right. A little bit more about that. I
Speaker 3: remember I talked to a guest on this on this podcast,
Speaker 3: like about two years ago. I remember her telling me
Speaker 3: one thing she loves about poetry, and one thing she
Speaker 3: advits people is, you know, expand your read of poetry
Speaker 3: beyond just writing a book, right beyond writing and performing.
Speaker 3: And it's like, when I hear you talk about that
Speaker 3: from the greeting cards to You're the first person I've
Speaker 3: seen a poem, a poem wedding agrapher, you know what
Speaker 3: I mean.
Speaker 4: I love that one because.
Speaker 3: I've never heard of someone a poet doing that, I think.
Speaker 3: I mean, I've heard I've definitely seen poets perform. I
Speaker 3: guess maybe it was like in a movie, but I
Speaker 3: don't think I've ever seen that in real life. I
Speaker 3: don't think think people think enough of that, right, tell
Speaker 3: us a bit about how you've been managing to really
Speaker 3: expand poetry outside the bandwidth of what we consider just
Speaker 3: what a poet does you're in so many your hands
Speaker 3: in so many pots that are so creative and innovative.
Speaker 3: I really think tell us a bit about how you
Speaker 3: kind of got to this point.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So going back to your point of like you know,
Speaker 2: you're saying like you've never heard or seen it in
Speaker 2: that arena before and not just plishing a book, right,
Speaker 2: because that's everyone's go to, right, Like, you become a poet,
Speaker 2: you write a book, you perform, and for me, my
Speaker 2: mindset has always been like, but is that it?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 4: Like, is there more?
Speaker 2: Because for poets, even though musician music and poet goes,
Speaker 2: poetry goes hand in hand for poets.
Speaker 4: Like so, for example, as.
Speaker 2: A musician, right, like, if I was to be making music,
Speaker 2: the goal typically is to be mainstream, right, and like
Speaker 2: be you know, at this pinnacle, right, I want to
Speaker 2: get a Grammy, I want to do.
Speaker 4: All these things.
Speaker 2: But for poetry we kind of hit a ceiling very
Speaker 2: fast because as far the furthest we get typically is
Speaker 2: just on like major stages, which is great, right, but
Speaker 2: you do have to constantly do it and do it
Speaker 2: and just you know, put yourself out there and be like, Okay,
Speaker 2: you're one of the top poets in the country or
Speaker 2: the world even, but then what else, you know what
Speaker 2: I'm saying, like what comes from that? And even thinking
Speaker 2: of it from a monetization standpoint, because this is our craft,
Speaker 2: Like this is an art and we get to not be.
Speaker 4: The starving artists, know stereotype.
Speaker 2: It's like, no, we really can monetize this and in
Speaker 2: ways that are that are tangible and actually like sufficient
Speaker 2: for us. So that was what my mindset was when
Speaker 2: I was really thinking, like what can I do with this?
Speaker 2: Where can I take this and how can I do
Speaker 2: it in a way where it's actually like wanted and
Speaker 2: needed and beneficial, you know, because I'm like, yeah, I
Speaker 2: can write poems for people, but like, okay, you know,
Speaker 2: how do how do I do it in a way
Speaker 2: where it's actually impactful? And for me, I had first
Speaker 2: did it for one of my really close friends for
Speaker 2: her wedding, and to this day, I think she got
Speaker 2: married maybe three or four years ago into this day.
Speaker 4: I mean, people are still like that was.
Speaker 2: Like the best part of the whole you know, ceremony,
Speaker 2: and it was.
Speaker 4: It was It's still one of my.
Speaker 2: Favorite things that I've done so far because the way
Speaker 2: that I'm able to craft these pieces in a way
Speaker 2: where it's super personal for you know, both partners, but
Speaker 2: also including the families and friends in it as well.
Speaker 4: And it's all like immersive experience with the poetry.
Speaker 2: And that's my way of exposing people to like, because
Speaker 2: people I still meet people that are like, I've never
Speaker 2: been to a poetry show.
Speaker 4: I've never seen it. You know, it's like do people snap?
Speaker 2: Do they And it's like people have this idea of
Speaker 2: what poetry is, but it's just so much more. It's
Speaker 2: so much more, you know, even from a creative writing aspect.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think my my thing is always just
Speaker 2: like what's the next thing?
Speaker 4: And how can I do it in a way where
Speaker 4: it's innovative?
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I guess the next natural question for anyone
Speaker 3: that's listening would be kind of how does someone even
Speaker 3: begin to get inside those spaces? Because I'm sure it's
Speaker 3: like a lot of people that'll hear that, but they'll
Speaker 3: be like, well, how do I even find people that
Speaker 3: would want me to perform my poems at a wedding?
Speaker 3: How do I even get a greeting card business with poetry?
Speaker 4: How do I even get that off the ground?
Speaker 3: So what is your advice for people to even start
Speaker 3: that want to be more innovative with their craft.
Speaker 4: This is where like unity comes in for real.
Speaker 2: You know, just you in any arena that you're in,
Speaker 2: whether you're an artist and anything that you do, culinary, whatever,
Speaker 2: you have to put yourself out there, right, people are
Speaker 2: not coming to you, especially in the age of social media.
Speaker 2: It's an oversaturated place and it's really hard to like,
Speaker 2: you know, stand out. You got to really push out
Speaker 2: the content and you know, maybe even put some money
Speaker 2: behind it, you know, marketing and all of those things.
Speaker 2: It really is one of those things that you have
Speaker 2: to really put in the time and the and the
Speaker 2: work into. I think for me, I love talking to
Speaker 2: people so and I and I still believe in like
Speaker 2: that interpersonal connection as opposed to digital.
Speaker 4: So for me, like I'll just be.
Speaker 2: Talking to people or I have I'm at that age
Speaker 2: where a lot of my friends are getting married, right,
Speaker 2: so it's like I'll hit them up like, hey, I
Speaker 2: would love to write a home for your you know,
Speaker 2: your wedding kind of thing, and just being in the
Speaker 2: top of their mind and reminding them like this is
Speaker 2: what I do and I can do this for you.
Speaker 2: So it's still that like, you know, reaching out to
Speaker 2: people individually as opposed to just putting up a post
Speaker 2: and hoping that, you know, it finds you.
Speaker 4: And I'm not saying don't do that.
Speaker 2: You know, it's a both and kind of thing, but
Speaker 2: I think going back to like hitting the ground and
Speaker 2: really putting yourself out there to be like, hey, this
Speaker 2: is what I do, this is the service I offer
Speaker 2: kind of things.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I mean, yeah, I think it's really like
Speaker 3: a networking game.
Speaker 4: I completely agree with you, and like.
Speaker 3: It's not even who you know, but who knows you
Speaker 3: kind of score those types of jobs and things like that,
Speaker 3: and that's why, Yeah, I think that's the tough part
Speaker 3: for most people, you know, if you don't have that
Speaker 3: kind of and it's one of those things I'm with
Speaker 3: you on that. It's the in person vibe is so
Speaker 3: much different than sending an email. That setting email really
Speaker 3: like I could go straight up in someone's spam people.
Speaker 3: Someone gets that on a Friday afternoon, they'll forget all
Speaker 3: about it. Next week, they'll be like.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm not responding.
Speaker 3: They'll never respond back to it. So it's like with email,
Speaker 3: it's very tricky, right, So it's all those things and
Speaker 3: then some kind of starting from the network that you
Speaker 3: have on the ground in person and really build it
Speaker 3: from there. But I think that's the issue too. It's
Speaker 3: a grind. It takes time to really make relationships and
Speaker 3: really get on people's radars. For you, I mean, what
Speaker 3: what does that grind look like? You know? Have you
Speaker 3: ever found yourself being having that kind of maybe impatience
Speaker 3: and being like, dang, this is this is a lot.
Speaker 3: This is not love my dream, but this is a lot.
Speaker 3: I think a lot of artists maybe face that, like
Speaker 3: I've been you know what, someone may say, I've been
Speaker 3: grinding for the past ten years. Where's my break? You
Speaker 3: know what I mean?
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2: I think for me what helps because I'm big on
Speaker 2: timing and like I feel like, oh, it's been this
Speaker 2: amount of time.
Speaker 4: Why isn't this happening yet? Right?
Speaker 2: What I've learned and this is within I would say
Speaker 2: the last the most recent year to two years, is
Speaker 2: not comparing my journey to anyone else's and just knowing that,
Speaker 2: like the opportunities are gonna come right, Like I am
Speaker 2: who I am, the people who know me and know
Speaker 2: what I.
Speaker 4: Do, like the opportunities come to me.
Speaker 2: Right in the beginning, it was very much like, you know,
Speaker 2: you got to reach out and say.
Speaker 4: Hey, can I you know, perform or things of that nature.
Speaker 2: And that's in the beginning, right because you're still you know,
Speaker 2: putting yourself out there. But now it's like people will
Speaker 2: be like, hey, I got this event, can you come perform?
Speaker 4: You know, So that.
Speaker 2: Already is a testament of itself of like, Okay, I
Speaker 2: got you know, I got that part down packed.
Speaker 4: I don't still have to go looking, which is a
Speaker 4: blessing absolutely.
Speaker 2: But like I said, not comparing my journey to anyone else's.
Speaker 4: So whenever I'm working on something, I just know that I.
Speaker 2: Have to commit to at least ten years, right, Like,
Speaker 2: if I'm going to do this, it could take ten
Speaker 2: years for this to pop off for real, you know
Speaker 2: what I'm saying. But being okay, being okay with that
Speaker 2: and being realistic about that, because like, if I know
Speaker 2: myself and I know that I'm not putting in that work,
Speaker 2: I can't expect this thing to just pop off.
Speaker 4: In a year, right, Like I haven't put enough work,
Speaker 4: I haven't.
Speaker 2: Put it out there enough for people to really know, Like, oh,
Speaker 2: she's doing this thing, you know. So for me, it's
Speaker 2: just you know, remaining consistent and knowing that really, consistency
Speaker 2: is the name of the game for real.
Speaker 3: No, you're totally You're completely correct. It really really is.
Speaker 3: And it's like I said, yeah, it's it's consistency, and
Speaker 3: it's it's keeping that positive attitude. You're right, But also
Speaker 3: I like what you said being realistic about it as well.
Speaker 3: It's like I really yeah, ten years is definitely probably
Speaker 3: the benchmark. I mean, people see people see overnight success,
Speaker 3: but you don't really see what they've been through that mark.
Speaker 3: And even when you quote unquote hit the mark, it's
Speaker 3: always well, how do I.
Speaker 4: There's always something else right, right? How do I maintain that? Yeah?
Speaker 3: I mean, and maybe because you can speak more on that,
Speaker 3: you know, it's one of those things, you know, people
Speaker 3: talk about getting to your dreams, climbing up there, but
Speaker 3: then once you achieve your dream, how do you now
Speaker 3: maintain your dream?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, I think.
Speaker 2: For me because someone someone wants to ask me like, oh,
Speaker 2: like how are your dreams going, or like are you
Speaker 2: living your dream or something like that, and I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm living the part of the dream that I
Speaker 2: had before, right in terms of like me being able
Speaker 2: to get on stages and travel and perform and people
Speaker 2: know who I am. It's that right, Like that's part
Speaker 2: of the dream, but that's not it. I think knowing
Speaker 2: what your end game is is really is super important, right,
Speaker 2: Like you gotta have some type of like this is
Speaker 2: where I see once I reach here, I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 2: I'm good, but taking everything into consideration and like I
Speaker 2: said before, financially right, because the goal isn't just to
Speaker 2: be out here like Okay, I'm performing, that's cute.
Speaker 4: But like, how is this going to sustain me? For real?
Speaker 2: Yeah, like this this gets to go from just a
Speaker 2: dream to like a lifestyle. So really just being intentional
Speaker 2: around why you're doing it.
Speaker 4: If it's just for the joy of doing it, that
Speaker 4: is great too.
Speaker 2: Write not saying that it has to be like this
Speaker 2: big old turn it into a business, this empire or whatever, right,
Speaker 2: but if you're gonna be in it, and if you
Speaker 2: really this is what you see yourself doing whatever, that
Speaker 2: is really having an end goal and then creating those
Speaker 2: micro goals along the way to reach that. So I
Speaker 2: think for me, because I have that end goal in mind,
Speaker 2: and it's very clear to me everything that I'm doing,
Speaker 2: regardless of how tired I am, regardless of how frustrated
Speaker 2: I get, regardless of whatever, it's still in alignment and
Speaker 2: it's still working towards that goal. And I know that
Speaker 2: those emotions are a part of the process.
Speaker 4: Right. It's not always gonna be yeay I get to
Speaker 4: get up and write a poem.
Speaker 2: There's days I'm just like, I really don't want to
Speaker 2: perform today, But you.
Speaker 4: Know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: But it's like that's part of you know, you just
Speaker 2: never know what could come out of that, whether it's
Speaker 2: exposure where you connect with someone who connects with you,
Speaker 2: someone else somewhere else, you know what I'm saying. So
Speaker 2: this is part of that grind. This is part of
Speaker 2: the process. And for me just reminding myself, like this
Speaker 2: is something that I chose to do, but I mean, honestly,
Speaker 2: I feel like it chose me and it's a gift
Speaker 2: and I feel like it's only it's only.
Speaker 4: Right to share that gift.
Speaker 2: So any opportunity that I get to do so I'm
Speaker 2: like this, as long as it's in alignment with the goal,
Speaker 2: I'll do it.
Speaker 4: So absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 3: Now kind of talking about that gift, I mean, can
Speaker 3: you pinpoint a time when did you know you were
Speaker 3: a writer? Was there a time in your life, just
Speaker 3: an exact moment where you said, I know now that
Speaker 3: I am a writer.
Speaker 2: Well, I started, I mentioned before, I started at nine,
Speaker 2: and I literally, like I can still see the day.
Speaker 4: I literally just picked up a notebook.
Speaker 2: That I had laying around, and I remember it was
Speaker 2: raining outside and I just started writing about the rain
Speaker 2: and I was so excited because I was just like,
Speaker 2: I don't I just did something like I wrote this
Speaker 2: thing and I love it. And I remember going to
Speaker 2: show it to my older sister and we have an
Speaker 2: eight year age gap, so she was like sixteen seventeen
Speaker 2: at the time, so she's kind of just like I
Speaker 2: showed her a poem and it was just like go.
Speaker 4: By, like you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: Like she wasn't even like pay me no, like she
Speaker 2: was going through whatever she was going through, so like, oh, okay,
Speaker 2: you know, and I was just like, Nah, she don't
Speaker 2: even know, like this is dope, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4: It wasn't until I think, maybe like high.
Speaker 2: School, where I really realized that like I had a gift,
Speaker 2: or maybe even earlier than that, because I remember writing
Speaker 2: poems in elementary school or like little raps. I would
Speaker 2: write little raps and like all my friends would like
Speaker 2: to learn the words and stuff like that, and I
Speaker 2: was just like, oh, like this is this might be
Speaker 2: actually this actually might be good.
Speaker 4: This is pretty good, you know.
Speaker 2: So I would say definitely from nine was a moment
Speaker 2: where it started, I think where I really pinpointed that.
Speaker 4: I was a writer writer for real. Might have been
Speaker 4: in college.
Speaker 2: Because and this is before like the era of chat GPT, right,
Speaker 2: so I was chat GBT. I have people who literally
Speaker 2: are like, oh, you don't use chat GBT right because
Speaker 2: you are chat ept because I can bang out a
Speaker 2: ten page paper in like a few hours, you know
Speaker 2: what I'm saying it, and it'll be like grammatically eloquent,
Speaker 2: everything is, you know, like and it just it comes
Speaker 2: easy to me.
Speaker 4: It's natural to me.
Speaker 2: So for a long time I didn't see it as
Speaker 2: a gift because I thought that gifts were something that
Speaker 2: you really had to work hard at, and for me,
Speaker 2: I didn't have to work hard like I have to
Speaker 2: work at it. Don't get me wrong, but it's not.
Speaker 4: Something that I have to like, it's not forceful. It
Speaker 4: just comes so easy.
Speaker 2: So for a while I didn't really I didn't really
Speaker 2: see it for what it was, you know.
Speaker 4: I think until I started like getting on stage, and.
Speaker 2: That's when I was like, oh, okay, like this is
Speaker 2: really an art, you know, this is really a gift.
Speaker 3: So yeah, wow, okay, awesome, awesome different points in your life.
Speaker 3: All right, now, Keys, the last question I have for
Speaker 3: you on today's podcast, all right, please tell me why
Speaker 3: do you need to get your words out? Hmm.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So, going back to what I said about the gift,
Speaker 2: that goes right into that, you know, it's not gifts
Speaker 2: are meant to be given, you know. And I think
Speaker 2: that in the beginning it was more so just about like,
Speaker 2: you know, me wanting to.
Speaker 4: Get my thoughts out there.
Speaker 2: But one of the joys of my journey so far
Speaker 2: has been people who have come to me and said, like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, you really inspired me, like that pone
Speaker 2: that you said, I love that, like I would love
Speaker 2: to write like that one day, or just you know,
Speaker 2: ask me about.
Speaker 4: My process to support them with their journey.
Speaker 2: So because it's bigger than me, and it's not about
Speaker 2: me is why I feel like I have to write,
Speaker 2: I have to create, I have to share my work
Speaker 2: because it's it's it's not just about me.
Speaker 3: So yeah, absolutely all right, not just about her? All right,
Speaker 3: Thank you so much, Keys, We really appreciate you being
Speaker 3: on the cop podcast today. Now before we end, and
Speaker 3: for real, for real, please tell us what is next
Speaker 3: for you in twenty twenty five as the year is
Speaker 3: almost halfway done. What's next for you? Any projects? And
Speaker 3: give us where we can check out all of your
Speaker 3: amazing work websites, social media handles, all that good stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so potentially the second book may be coming
Speaker 2: that's in the works.
Speaker 4: Definitely check out my ATS store.
Speaker 2: It's that right occasion, as I also have my Instagram
Speaker 2: page right occasion for that for the business page for
Speaker 2: my personal work. Most of my work is on Instagram,
Speaker 2: which is at only keys will to underscores.
Speaker 4: That's only keys will to Underscore.
Speaker 2: And yeah, I mean, who knows, something may come up
Speaker 2: and I'll just drop a project, so just you know,
Speaker 2: be on the lookout for that.
Speaker 3: Absolutely all right, and everyone. All of keys links to
Speaker 3: all of her descriptions as well as her website, all
Speaker 3: of her social handles will be down in the description
Speaker 3: box below, no matter where you're listening to this podcast.
Speaker 3: All right, Keys, thank you so much for being a
Speaker 3: guest today on the Poet Speaks Podcast. Thank you absolutely
Speaker 3: all right, everyone again, check out off Keys will amazing
Speaker 3: work again. All of her links will be down below
Speaker 3: in the description box. Everyone listens the Poet Speaks Podcast
Speaker 3: will talk to you soon.