Speaker 1: Get ready, eighth day of October twenty twenty four, allegedly
Speaker 1: according to that thing we call a calendar, this the
Speaker 1: O'Kelly effect, and you hearing it because you decided to
Speaker 1: find it.
Speaker 2: So appreciate you for tuning in at o'celly dot com
Speaker 2: on the radio stream live all that good stuff. We
Speaker 2: are an online radio stream where you might be hearing
Speaker 2: this twenty four hours a day on replay and all
Speaker 2: that good stuff. But as I speak to you live,
Speaker 2: it's about ten minutes after eight pm Eastern in what
Speaker 2: we used to call America on that eighth day that
Speaker 2: tearsday Tuesday of the week. So there it is. There
Speaker 2: it was, and that's what it is. Who do I
Speaker 2: have with me tonight? Well, a guy that has earned
Speaker 2: himself a nickname from last year's conference. Some people call
Speaker 2: him a scooter Joe, and gee, I wonder why they
Speaker 2: do that. Maybe I'll get into that in a minute.
Speaker 2: But he's going to be part of the Lancer Conference.
Speaker 2: Joe Borelli, of course connected to the Lone Gunman, not
Speaker 2: so loan Gunman. Considering now there's two guys on there, well,
Speaker 2: maybe is that the loan is the lone Gunman the
Speaker 2: podcast or is it about the reference to Oswald or
Speaker 2: is it all the above? I don't know. I gotta ask.
Speaker 2: I got to ask our longtime friend over there what
Speaker 2: this means. Now there's two guys. You can't be a
Speaker 2: lone gunman. If there's two guys, maybe it's just me.
Speaker 2: But anyway, Rob Clark, of course, who is for you?
Speaker 3: Sir?
Speaker 2: Excellent? We're gonna get there. Rob Clark, of course is
Speaker 2: who I'm talking about. Who's been on many of the
Speaker 2: Myths shows, been a guest on The Ocelli Effect before,
Speaker 2: but today no Rob Clark, no Doug Campbell, no quick Hits,
Speaker 2: no just Scooter Joe, Joe Borelli And again, as I said,
Speaker 2: he presented at the sixtieth anniversary, the twenty seventh Lancer
Speaker 2: Conference November in Dallas and all that, and he'll be
Speaker 2: there this year at the twenty eighth, So he's going
Speaker 2: to have to put up with me being the live MC.
Speaker 2: And there you go. Although I'm not on the presenter list,
Speaker 2: I'm just the MC. And when you look at the
Speaker 2: schedule you don't see my name, but that's okay. Anyway, Joe,
Speaker 2: how you doing tonight? Before I get into what I
Speaker 2: want to talk to you about. Jfkland, what is new,
Speaker 2: what is hot and happening? And maybe what's not happening
Speaker 2: so hot, But we'll see anyway, Joe, how are you doing.
Speaker 3: I am doing well, sir, and it is great to
Speaker 3: be back on the Achelli effect. We did have a
Speaker 3: great time at Lancer twenty twenty three last November, which
Speaker 3: is where I met you, and you were MCing then
Speaker 3: as well, right, sir.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was and doing like ten other things at
Speaker 2: the same time, because every time I turned around something
Speaker 2: needed to be done. At one point I was even
Speaker 2: grabbing a table and hauling it over everybody's head and
Speaker 2: running it to the stage for those other podcaster guys
Speaker 2: from YouTube. But I don't think they're going to be
Speaker 2: there this year. But I don't know if you'll.
Speaker 3: Remember that, but I was ben getting to it later.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was all over the place.
Speaker 3: But well, you know what, I'm gonna push back on
Speaker 3: something you said when you said I'm gonna have to
Speaker 3: put up you with you this year, because I have
Speaker 3: a completely different take. And you might be surprised by this.
Speaker 3: You are kind of a guardian angel in a sense
Speaker 3: because and I guess we can get into the scooter story.
Speaker 3: I crashed a scooter on my way to get tobacco
Speaker 3: as I was nervous before my Atlancer presentation, and Chuck
Speaker 3: was the first person to put it together. He's like, wait,
Speaker 3: Joe left on a scooter. He came back, he was
Speaker 3: like rushed in the building. He didn't say hi to anyone.
Speaker 3: And then you saw the scooter not even parked on
Speaker 3: the side street, just like pushed over. And then later
Speaker 3: in the Lancer, so like I was rushing back, I
Speaker 3: danced the front desk to give me bandages, bandaged it up,
Speaker 3: I changed it to my shirt, I did my Q
Speaker 3: and A, and you were like, Joe, you're bleeding through
Speaker 3: your shirt. And I didn't even notice that. And if
Speaker 3: you noticed that, Chuck, it was probably pretty bad.
Speaker 2: Well here's the thing, right, he's getting ready to go
Speaker 2: on and I'm getting ready to introduce him. So I
Speaker 2: take a look and I realized he's bleeding, and I'm like, yeah, okay,
Speaker 2: I know why, but dude, you might want to get
Speaker 2: a control of that before you go on stage.
Speaker 3: It wasn't like bleeding profusely. It was like a couple
Speaker 3: of red dots on like a button down shirt, so
Speaker 3: it was like folded up, so it was like leaking
Speaker 3: a little through it. So we just want to make
Speaker 3: the audience give them all the facts that I wasn't
Speaker 3: like bleeding out or anything, but I was definitely leaking
Speaker 3: a little bit for sure.
Speaker 2: But yeah, but it was what I was concerned about.
Speaker 3: Yeah, my adrenaline was going. My first time presenting Rob
Speaker 3: and I actually did a virtual presentation because he was
Speaker 3: not there last year. I then did a Q and A,
Speaker 3: and like my adrenaline was going, I was handing out
Speaker 3: documents of the relevant ones from last year's presentation and
Speaker 3: I had not even noticed, and you pointed it out
Speaker 3: to me, so thank you, sir.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and that's what I was actually worried about,
Speaker 2: is like, look, he's running around trying to hand out,
Speaker 2: you know, these things so people could follow along and
Speaker 2: ask their questions and go through this whole thing because
Speaker 2: they did, you know, meet the Martins and this whole
Speaker 2: thing about all these guys named Martin in the case.
Speaker 2: It was really cool, But I was worried that you
Speaker 2: were adrenaline was going to get up, your heart was
Speaker 2: going to start pumping and you were going to really
Speaker 2: start to bleed a lot on stage. Not that you
Speaker 2: were bleeding a lot beforehand, but if you got moving
Speaker 2: around and you know, worked up, you might bleed a lot.
Speaker 2: So you got to get a hold of that before
Speaker 2: you go up there. That was my whole thing, And
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, I wasn't going to make a
Speaker 2: big deal out of it, but I didn't want you
Speaker 2: to have that.
Speaker 3: You know, I had gotten control of it before, but
Speaker 3: it had like seeped through bandages a little bit. Well
Speaker 3: that My other nickname is Joey Scars. Joey, I know
Speaker 3: you like Joey Scooter. Joey Scars was my official The
Speaker 3: Longe Coming podcast name. Nice and we even have some
Speaker 3: silly merch on it, so it's funny.
Speaker 2: Oh cood. It's actually more of a street level sounding
Speaker 2: thing actually, but either way, actually Scooter joe would be
Speaker 2: a thing that was.
Speaker 3: That was the goal. Yeah, Amafio's type of name, right.
Speaker 2: True enough, true enough. And I did know a guy
Speaker 2: that was named something Scars. I'm not going to mention
Speaker 2: his name because he didn't like the nickname, but people
Speaker 2: knew him.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: It was one of those deals, like people never called
Speaker 2: al Capone's scarface to his face, that kind of thing.
Speaker 2: So I did know a Jersey mob guy who was
Speaker 2: a part of the Dicabo camp Conti family that was
Speaker 2: known for scars, and he never liked it if people
Speaker 2: mentioned it. So, you know, just a thing.
Speaker 3: I don't mind. I mean, I don't know where his
Speaker 3: cars were, minor like kind of on my arm, and
Speaker 3: I've had a few before then, So yeah, that it
Speaker 3: just lends credence to the nickname. But I think it's hilarious.
Speaker 3: I love it, and like I told you, I think
Speaker 3: I was on here in February last I will be
Speaker 3: going back on the scooter this year now. My presentation
Speaker 3: partner Doug Campbell said that's fine, but you can't do
Speaker 3: it before our presentation.
Speaker 2: Ah okay, you scared up and hurt myself again.
Speaker 3: So not sure when the scooter ride will happen, but
Speaker 3: it will be documented, videoed and put up I'm sure
Speaker 3: on the long gumb and feed at other places.
Speaker 2: Excellent. So we will see a scooter Joe on a
Speaker 2: scooter on YouTube sometime after November. Excellent. Perfect.
Speaker 3: So anyway, get the best, I mean, you can't love it.
Speaker 2: Right, So let's let's get into the topic that that
Speaker 2: that people do want to hear about. And I want
Speaker 2: to first start with you know, last night, right, I
Speaker 2: get a little notice that, hey, you know, did you
Speaker 2: hear that there's going to be this thing with you know,
Speaker 2: a prominent researcher, right, Jefferson Morley is holding a press conference.
Speaker 2: He's gonna make some big announcement regarding the case. And
Speaker 2: I said, oh, great, you know, and look, I've been
Speaker 2: invited to a lot of press conferences. People don't know
Speaker 2: it because I don't always stand up and ask a question,
Speaker 2: but other people have noted that I've been invited to
Speaker 2: press conferences, and they wonder why because they think I'm
Speaker 2: not part of the press. But I've gone on you know,
Speaker 2: like yeah, kind of sort of but virtually now, mostly
Speaker 2: because they do these things via zoom and everything most
Speaker 2: of the time. And last time, when the Mary Farrell
Speaker 2: lawsuit was going on, they certainly invited me, but they
Speaker 2: didn't invite me to this one. So I said, Okay,
Speaker 2: I guess I'll just have to wait for the substack tomorrow.
Speaker 2: And this morning it came out, right, so, you know,
Speaker 2: a big announcement here it is. We got a whistle
Speaker 2: blower all these things, and I said, okay, and I
Speaker 2: went and I read through an article about it first
Speaker 2: by somebody else, and then realized I could actually access
Speaker 2: because I'm not paying Morley to access his substack. I'm sorry,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm willing to buy his books, but I
Speaker 2: don't want to do the substack thing. I can't afford
Speaker 2: all this stuff. So bottom line is, I'm thinking, let
Speaker 2: me read the article. I read that, and then I
Speaker 2: found out I had access to Morley's substack for this
Speaker 2: particular issue. So I went and read through it and everything.
Speaker 2: And I know that a lot of people in the
Speaker 2: community will follow stuff like this, will be on it
Speaker 2: regardless of whether the press covers it or how they
Speaker 2: cover it. So I know you had to have taken
Speaker 2: a look at this stuff without me going in any
Speaker 2: more detail. What were your thoughts about Morley and his
Speaker 2: announcement and you know what was going on there today.
Speaker 3: So I follow Jefferson Marley on Twitter. I've actually never
Speaker 3: personally had any dialogue with him, but you know, I
Speaker 3: definitely respect him and his work, and I think he's
Speaker 3: been in the community for over thirty years and he's
Speaker 3: definitely one of the most I don't want the famous, most,
Speaker 3: you know, recognizable names when it comes to the JFK assassination,
Speaker 3: mostly because he was a reporter for the Washington Post,
Speaker 3: and you know he's written a few books, and you know,
Speaker 3: loved all his works. So you know, I've been following
Speaker 3: these tweets for I think like two or three days now,
Speaker 3: and you know, it's it's interesting because you know, he
Speaker 3: has tweets like this is the most significant JFK story.
Speaker 3: And this is a quote I've ever done. It indicates
Speaker 3: CIA is hiding records related to a still classified operation
Speaker 3: involving Oswald them the photographs. But I you know, to
Speaker 3: people like you and me, Chuck, that is a particular
Speaker 3: news that the CIA is hiding records or that they
Speaker 3: had tried to hinder the HCA or or the Garrison
Speaker 3: investigation or looking to their jurors. I mean, this is
Speaker 3: like a pattern here.
Speaker 2: In fact, Jefferson Morley is a walking, talking exemple, you know,
Speaker 2: the exemplar if you will, of the hsca's interference, because
Speaker 2: he was suing for the documents related to a guy
Speaker 2: named George Joe and Edes for years. Of course, Brett
Speaker 2: Kavanaugh finally put his lawsuit to sleep against the CIA.
Speaker 2: Brett Kavanaugh, Yeah, that's same. Brett Kavanaugh made the final
Speaker 2: decision to kill Jefferson Morley's lawsuit in case you didn't
Speaker 2: know it. And the deal is he was suing for George,
Speaker 2: Joe and Edes records because the HSCA had been given
Speaker 2: Joe and Edes as a liaison, okay, regarding the Kennedy
Speaker 2: assassination in the nineteen seventies. And you know, Joe and
Speaker 2: Ed's and the CIA both claimed he had no connection
Speaker 2: to the case previously, and we come to find out
Speaker 2: that at the very least that is not true. You know,
Speaker 2: ge Robert Blakey has certainly learned he was lied to
Speaker 2: by the CIA regarding that as the head of the HSCA. Okay,
Speaker 2: and we know this, we know that, and Morley made
Speaker 2: an example of this and tried to sue to get
Speaker 2: the records for years and years. I had him on
Speaker 2: my show first time in twenty fourteen, when I barely
Speaker 2: knew him, but I knew his work, and obviously I
Speaker 2: was extremely happy to have him on because here's a
Speaker 2: guy taken on the CIA, going after records they don't
Speaker 2: want to give up. This is one of those guys
Speaker 2: we should always, you know, pay attention to. And I
Speaker 2: love Morley's work. I really do, you know, not saying
Speaker 2: I agree with every single conclusion, etc. But it's great
Speaker 2: because he's a legitimate reporter from the mainstream media who
Speaker 2: came kind of, you know, over into our section of town,
Speaker 2: uh to do the conspiracy thing. People like that, and
Speaker 2: we need him and he's you know, what is it,
Speaker 2: the vice president of the Mary Faraoll Foundation or you know,
Speaker 2: vice chair whatever it is, second highest position of the
Speaker 2: Mary Faraoll Foundation. Uh. He's a guy who's actively involved
Speaker 2: in trying to get things done. So I appreciate the
Speaker 2: man I do, despite the fact that him and I
Speaker 2: had a little back and forth a couple of years
Speaker 2: ago and he was supposed to show up on my
Speaker 2: show and didn't and all that, I'll forgive it. I
Speaker 2: love you, Jeff, I really do. And I love the
Speaker 2: work you do. And I appreciate JFK. Facts and I
Speaker 2: appreciate your books, all of it. But yeah, I'm looking
Speaker 2: at this going.
Speaker 3: And Jane the Jane Roman lead with I believe he
Speaker 3: went there with doctor Newman and I was a lady
Speaker 3: I believe who was working in Angleton's office, who said
Speaker 3: who confirmed they had the operation interest in Oswald. I
Speaker 3: mean that's big, that's prob Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, exactly, groundbreaking stuff, right, go ahead, good.
Speaker 3: No, No, I'm saying it's just great work.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, great work. And again I appreciate him.
Speaker 2: But about this particular thing, Yeah, it's not a big
Speaker 2: shocker to us that, gee, the CIA is holding stuff back. Now,
Speaker 2: if there was a legitimately existent skiff, okay, that contained
Speaker 2: a whole bunch of records that they were very concerned
Speaker 2: about keeping classified, then that is also revelatory. But what
Speaker 2: do we have here at the end of the day, right,
Speaker 2: and there's this thing about a video case of some kind,
Speaker 2: you know, some sort of video material that's there and
Speaker 2: says it's Oswald in Mexico City. Now, we have been
Speaker 2: given to understand that there are no pictures of Oswald
Speaker 2: and Mexico City, even though Ed Lopez and Dan Hardaway
Speaker 2: found out that there really should be, though there wasn't
Speaker 2: because cameras weren't functioning, et cetera, et cetera, all kinds
Speaker 2: of bs. Read the Lopez report, I'm not going to
Speaker 2: recap it. You know, there's a lot of things that
Speaker 2: went on here. So is their video exists in you know,
Speaker 2: existing at some point or did it exist at some
Speaker 2: point in the recent past with the Cia of Oswald
Speaker 2: in Mexico City. Wouldn't that be an assassination record? Should
Speaker 2: it not be part of the releases from the JFK
Speaker 2: Records Act. All of these are pertinent and important questions.
Speaker 2: But at the end of the day, right, what does
Speaker 2: Jeff say he has and what do they say they
Speaker 2: have altogether? Here? That is this tremendous announcement that needs
Speaker 2: to be made. What do you think?
Speaker 3: Well, you mentioned skiff earlier, and that is of course
Speaker 3: a secure compartmentalized info facility for which Jeff alleged that
Speaker 3: some documents related to the jfksssassination and some not really
Speaker 3: the assassination, right, that were not filed under that. I
Speaker 3: believe that's what he said. Had to do. There was
Speaker 3: a box with Mexico City, either videos or pictures, and
Speaker 3: chull correct me if I'm wrong, didn't you do? I
Speaker 3: remember these things? A great episode recently on Mexico City
Speaker 3: with Larry Hankong.
Speaker 2: Yes, I did an extensive episode with Larry on Mexico City.
Speaker 2: I've done a couple in the past too regarding this,
Speaker 2: because it's always fascinated me that there's this, you know,
Speaker 2: handful of pictures and this guy who has been called
Speaker 2: the mystery Man and all that, and he looks like
Speaker 2: Alex Carros from Webster, you know, from the nineteen eighties
Speaker 2: to me, you know, the guy who played Webster's adopted
Speaker 2: father in the show. That's what he really looks like.
Speaker 2: And he has been later identified as you know, possibly
Speaker 2: a Soviet agent and etc. Et cetera. But this is
Speaker 2: the weird thing for.
Speaker 3: Mac Wallace's football teammate according to America's unsubstantiated stories.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well there's always that too, but Mac Wallace poof anyway,
Speaker 2: all of that, but definitely not Lee Harvey Oswald. And
Speaker 2: this was submitted as supposedly pictures of Oswald. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean there's a lot there. And you know, do
Speaker 2: we have absolute proof of Oswald being in Mexico City.
Speaker 2: I started out not knowing and then feeling like there
Speaker 2: was no proof of him being there, you know, for
Speaker 2: several years, and as I've dug deeper and deeper, it
Speaker 2: seems like he must have been there. But there should
Speaker 2: be more material that exists somewhere, and where is it. Well,
Speaker 2: I can't answer that because we don't know where it
Speaker 2: could be or would have went, or has it been destroyed,
Speaker 2: et cetera, et cetera. So this is remarkable if some
Speaker 2: sort of visual evidence exists right of walled in Mexico City.
Speaker 2: But then again, is it just you know, like you said,
Speaker 2: is it photographs? Is it video? Even the person who is,
Speaker 2: you know, blowing the whistle here has stated they didn't
Speaker 2: open the box, they didn't look in the box to
Speaker 2: see what was in there, So we don't know even
Speaker 2: from the hearsay now from this person, right, So I'm
Speaker 2: kind of left, you know, feeling this wasn't such a
Speaker 2: big announcement, you know what I mean. Maybe it's interesting,
Speaker 2: but again, you know, we have a million stories in
Speaker 2: the Naked City, and there's a lot of people who claim,
Speaker 2: look I saw this, I saw that. And at the
Speaker 2: end of the day, if all you have is the
Speaker 2: testimony of one individual, and you don't have corroboration, you
Speaker 2: don't have documentation, you don't have something else to go
Speaker 2: along with that, then honestly, you can only weigh it
Speaker 2: as hearsay. I mean, that's the way I look at it.
Speaker 2: Other people take things more seriously and go with it. Well,
Speaker 2: this person told me this, so it must be true.
Speaker 2: And you start weighing people's hearsay against other people's hearsay.
Speaker 2: What can you do at this point? Is there an
Speaker 2: interesting passage in this whole discussion with morally regarding you know,
Speaker 2: here's your non denial denial and how it is the
Speaker 2: CIA words things. I think that's extremely instructive. You know,
Speaker 2: where they're explaining, look, we have no knowledge of Now
Speaker 2: that doesn't mean it doesn't exist, right, because they didn't
Speaker 2: say explicitly it doesn't exist. They're saying I don't have
Speaker 2: knowledge of that. We don't have knowledge of that, so
Speaker 2: that if later it emerges that they do have that material,
Speaker 2: well we just said we didn't have knowledge of it.
Speaker 2: We didn't say it didn't exist, you see, But it's
Speaker 2: meant to be taken as the denial that it exists.
Speaker 2: So that's instructive. You got to be careful about how
Speaker 2: these statements are worded, because I assure you there with precision.
Speaker 2: You know, this isn't like Donald Trump running the CIA,
Speaker 2: where the word salad is all over the place, and
Speaker 2: you interpret it. Okay, this isn't Kamala Harris's weird vagaries.
Speaker 2: This is very precise language that CIA people put out
Speaker 2: when they allow a statement to come out. Okay, and
Speaker 2: so you do have to recognize that. But at the
Speaker 2: end of the day, once again, has anything moved forward?
Speaker 2: Is there anything actually new in this announcement outside of
Speaker 2: the naming of this alleged whistleblower who should have had
Speaker 2: some sort of access here but again didn't open the box,
Speaker 2: doesn't identify exactly what a lot of things are, et cetera, etc.
Speaker 2: Just claims that there is a room, so to speak,
Speaker 2: or a particular area of a facility dedicated to some
Speaker 2: of these records. I'm not surprised by that either. But
Speaker 2: that's about all I get out of this. So I
Speaker 2: don't know how to feel. You know, I want Jeff
Speaker 2: to come out with something that is a real bombshell,
Speaker 2: But to me, it's not so much of a bombshell.
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm just saying, maybe it's just me, Joe,
Speaker 2: But look, I don't want to sit here in cast
Speaker 2: dispersions or judgments on anything in any progress we can make.
Speaker 2: It's all welcome at this point, which is why we're
Speaker 2: going to Lancer and why it is we participate in
Speaker 2: these things in my estimation anyway, and why it is
Speaker 2: you're going there is to add to the you know,
Speaker 2: the the knowledge database, so to speak, the collective knowledge
Speaker 2: that can be accessed, to share it, to inform people
Speaker 2: about things that you might have discovered on your own,
Speaker 2: et cetera, and put it all together so that we
Speaker 2: can begin again every single year to sort of assess
Speaker 2: how far we've gotten, what have we learned that's new,
Speaker 2: have we examined something that was mis examined or missing before,
Speaker 2: et cetera, et cetera. So again participating in Lancer, which
Speaker 2: will be at the Dallas area at Downtown this year
Speaker 2: November twenty second to the twenty fourth in Dallas, Texas.
Speaker 2: And if you go to Assassinationconference dot com, just saying,
Speaker 2: and you want to sign up either to go to
Speaker 2: the conference in person or for a virtual ticket, you
Speaker 2: can get ten percent off with the with the the
Speaker 2: code o'celly ten, just saying, so that's always nice, ten
Speaker 2: percent off, and you also have a student discount there
Speaker 2: there is discount tickets available. There is the information about
Speaker 2: the hotel, which will be in the show notes with
Speaker 2: this podcast as well. So I'll give you the phone
Speaker 2: number for the hotel, the sign up for the website,
Speaker 2: and everything you need to know to join us at
Speaker 2: Lancer this year, either virtually or in person. But I
Speaker 2: will be there in person, and so will Joe Borelli. Anyway,
Speaker 2: back to the discussion, what is it that you're going
Speaker 2: to throw at us this year? I mean, you and
Speaker 2: Doug working together on it.
Speaker 3: Let me let me stop you there, because I want
Speaker 3: to follow up on something you said about the morally
Speaker 3: thing in Mexico City, and I think students of the
Speaker 3: assassination know Mexico City is one of the most complex
Speaker 3: areas of the assassination that you can kind of study.
Speaker 3: It's all over the place. Was Oswald? There was? He
Speaker 3: not there? Obviously the picture was not Oswalt. But we
Speaker 3: know there were operations photographing the embassies everyone that came
Speaker 3: into now, so why why wasn't this picture taken? We
Speaker 3: know there were recordings wiretaps, but the voices was not Oswalt.
Speaker 3: So it's something I have not completely made up my
Speaker 3: mind yet about Chuck. I mean, and your episode gave
Speaker 3: me a lot of things to think about actually actually
Speaker 3: with Larry, and.
Speaker 2: You know, I.
Speaker 3: Have the feeling that there was this operations running within operations, right,
Speaker 3: an OP hidden within an type of thing. And it's
Speaker 3: just and I might have heard this on your episode,
Speaker 3: but I kind of lean towards this now. Is because,
Speaker 3: of course, the Warrant Commission would have loved to publish
Speaker 3: a picture of Lee Harvey Oswell leaving the Russian Cuban
Speaker 3: embassies right, It would have just helped their case so
Speaker 3: much like there's no reason not to disclose that, of course,
Speaker 3: other than to protect operations or protect personnel. And what
Speaker 3: if Oswalt wasn't alone, Now, then that doesn't go towards
Speaker 3: the loant narrative. And what if the person he was
Speaker 3: with was someone Cia or whoever else didn't want to
Speaker 3: disclose was with Oswalt's That's seems to be like where
Speaker 3: I'm leaning towards because I am I do think he
Speaker 3: was probably in Mexico, z And he was probably impersonated,
Speaker 3: so that that screams to me ops within ops. And
Speaker 3: you know, we could spend a long time on this.
Speaker 3: I mean, your past episode on this went way deeper
Speaker 3: than I'm going to but it just that's kind of
Speaker 3: my inkling right now. But back to the Morley thing. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I mean, when you have anonymous sources, it's never going
Speaker 3: to sit well with the document researchers, like the serious
Speaker 3: document researchers, right, if you can't produce a document and
Speaker 3: it is hearsay, like you said, it's it's hearsay, it's
Speaker 3: another story. It's very interesting and maybe there's more more
Speaker 3: to come. But to your earlier point that there was
Speaker 3: a press conference that mister Morley did early and it
Speaker 3: was only for working journalists or media, and but for
Speaker 3: for JFK researchers it wasn't. It wasn't for them. So
Speaker 3: that makes me think it might be more of a
Speaker 3: I don't know how to say this a mainstream topic
Speaker 3: revelatory thing than a researcher, you know, a big, big
Speaker 3: revelatory document that's coming out. But that's what he he
Speaker 3: he described it as it was going to be. So
Speaker 3: but if and I know he was on a few
Speaker 3: shows today and I know some of the authors of
Speaker 3: Chokeholds are going to be doing some media hits and
Speaker 3: stuff like that. Anything that raised this is awareness on
Speaker 3: this topic. And the documents, and the government both democratic
Speaker 3: and Republican of not you know, doing the adhering to
Speaker 3: the JFK Act in nineteen ninety two is all good
Speaker 3: for me. So I'm not sure exactly how this is
Speaker 3: going to play out. I'm hoping it's all good things.
Speaker 3: Maybe there's more to come. Maybe if like a congressman
Speaker 3: or a senator somewhere else gets involved, and maybe this
Speaker 3: whistleblower can get protection and he comes out, maybe that
Speaker 3: opens Pandora's spot and we get documents. As you know,
Speaker 3: and I'm sure you know Trump and RFK Junior have
Speaker 3: been talking about releasing the documents now. For of course,
Speaker 3: Trump is now saying this for the second time after
Speaker 3: he did the first time, and I got on Trump
Speaker 3: for that on the Long Woman Podcas asked, and this
Speaker 3: is not a pro or anti Trump thing, It's just
Speaker 3: he said he was going to do it and he didn't.
Speaker 3: I do. I do think he is very likely to
Speaker 3: do it with r K on his kind of team, now,
Speaker 3: you know, I don't. I think if you were to
Speaker 3: say what percentage chance Kamali release it or what percent
Speaker 3: has with Trump and RFK and some capacity to release it,
Speaker 3: I don't think it's a conversation, right, So, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I'm the timing is interesting because it's coming up a
Speaker 3: lot in the in the campaigns, the JFK files, and
Speaker 3: say anything that that brings awareness to to what we study,
Speaker 3: I'm all down for. So I just kind of want
Speaker 3: to like give that contrarian view there.
Speaker 2: Right. Look, I'm more than happy if anybody comes out
Speaker 2: and pushes this forward. If either one of the past
Speaker 2: two sitting presidents had done the right thing, I would
Speaker 2: have been pleased and I wouldn't have cared who did it.
Speaker 2: You know. Of course, Trump could have done nothing instead
Speaker 2: of bending to the whims of the of the intelligence community,
Speaker 2: which is what happened in twenty seventeen. Okay, I mean
Speaker 2: that's the truth of it. At the last minute, the
Speaker 2: intelligence community came to him and said, look, we need
Speaker 2: to hold onto these things for longer, even though we
Speaker 2: knew there was twenty five years where these things, you know,
Speaker 2: were sitting waiting to be released. Trump could have done
Speaker 2: nothing and those things would have had to tumble out,
Speaker 2: but he decided to do what they asked him to do. Okay, Fine,
Speaker 2: Then Biden comes in and people go well, maybe Biden
Speaker 2: coming in. I heard this in real time as it
Speaker 2: was happening. Biden comes in, He's going to do it. Now,
Speaker 2: well what does he do? He kicks the can so
Speaker 2: far down the road. Now we have no idea when
Speaker 2: it'll be revisited. So therefore the lawsuit came in. And
Speaker 2: that's why the Biden administration was the one that got sued. Okay,
Speaker 2: because both administrations were given a chance to do that.
Speaker 2: And my wonder is just because RFK Junior is on
Speaker 2: Trump's team now I think they're dangling it there as
Speaker 2: an attractive thing for us. But the truth is, what
Speaker 2: is going to change with the intelligence community between twenty
Speaker 2: seventeen and now twenty twenty five, as far as you know,
Speaker 2: what is really going to change that's relevant between that
Speaker 2: seven year time period from then to now that's going
Speaker 2: to allow this to be well, it's okay, now, let
Speaker 2: it come out. Or is the intelligence community going to
Speaker 2: again implore the Trump administration or the Harris administration either
Speaker 2: one to again look hold off because still and I
Speaker 2: don't think it's even about Oswalt. I think it's about
Speaker 2: something connected to Oswald that might lead to bigger things
Speaker 2: because The thing is, I don't think Oswald is the
Speaker 2: key here, but he might have been in proximity to
Speaker 2: something that they still I do not want to allow
Speaker 2: outs because it would allow us to know something brand
Speaker 2: new and the old theories, the old problems with whether
Speaker 2: it is or isn't. And they're going to answer Jeff
Speaker 2: Morley's appearances on these shows with probably the likes of
Speaker 2: a Gerald Posner, who's gonna come out and guess what
Speaker 2: make the kind of argument I did. We have hearsay here.
Speaker 2: We don't have anything outside of hearsay. So what has
Speaker 2: changed from the time I wrote my book Case Closed,
Speaker 2: which you know, again I contend I'm not certain that
Speaker 2: mister Posner wrote that book, But anyway, point is that
Speaker 2: book came out with his name on it, and he's
Speaker 2: later caught as a plagiarist and everything. But you know,
Speaker 2: Enjoy Posnor appears on the MSM and always counters this stuff,
Speaker 2: and only because Boogliosi's dead, because otherwise they would haul
Speaker 2: him back out. I'm sure to say. Look, I solved
Speaker 2: this case in my book already end a story, and
Speaker 2: by the way, Oswald did it because he was a
Speaker 2: Communist sympathizer blah blah blah blah blah blah blah, and
Speaker 2: crazy kid Oswald wanted to make history because he was
Speaker 2: a loser, and the loser wanted to make history. And
Speaker 2: people don't want to believe a loser killed Kennedy and
Speaker 2: Da dah da da da, and that's what they're gonna
Speaker 2: do because that's what they've always done.
Speaker 3: So well, that's interesting you say that, Chuck, because I
Speaker 3: don't know what the reaction is going to be to
Speaker 3: the story. And this is my conspiratorial mind thinking here, sure,
Speaker 3: but if there was something to it, they might call
Speaker 3: up Posner to try to, you know, say exactly what
Speaker 3: what you just said. And it's interesting. It will be interesting,
Speaker 3: I think, in the coming days to see how the
Speaker 3: MSN or deep State or whatever you wanna call it
Speaker 3: kind of counters it or if they pay no attention
Speaker 3: to it. I have no idea, but I just thought
Speaker 3: of that as you brought that up.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, here's the thing. If they bring out
Speaker 2: pow though, it's an indicator not that there's something to it,
Speaker 2: but actually that there isn't. And I'll tell you why.
Speaker 2: Because the last time, when they were hauling Posner out
Speaker 2: here in uh I think it was. It was it
Speaker 2: last year. I think it was last year. They hauled
Speaker 2: him out because there were some revelations and there were
Speaker 2: some documents that did come out, and there was some
Speaker 2: stuff that was released in twenty seventeen that finally people understood,
Speaker 2: and then there was some stuff released even last year,
Speaker 2: even last year, right that people understood. And what happened
Speaker 2: was Posner comes out and says, look, you know, he
Speaker 2: was countering this whole thing about this document says there
Speaker 2: might have been a shot from the front. And the
Speaker 2: document that says there might have been a shot from
Speaker 2: the front is from an unnamed source, okay, who makes
Speaker 2: a claim. If you really dig into it, it's a
Speaker 2: big old piece of here. Say that was given to
Speaker 2: a report that the FBI had and they don't follow
Speaker 2: through on it. The document trails off into nothing and
Speaker 2: rightly goes out and says, this document doesn't show you anything,
Speaker 2: but the MSN produced it. As is this real information
Speaker 2: that could be proof of a conspiracy? Is it the
Speaker 2: actual smoking gun? They were out there doing that on
Speaker 2: the news and then they would bring out Posnor to
Speaker 2: fill that slot again to make the same argument, So that.
Speaker 3: For clicks, is that for clicks?
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. It was just for that. It was let's
Speaker 2: take you down the road that goes nowhere, Joe, because
Speaker 2: that's the best road for you to go down. Let's
Speaker 2: go down the road that goes nowhere. I like how
Speaker 2: they always pick apart the most ludicrous of things. They
Speaker 2: never face down the real information on the MSM. They
Speaker 2: always go after, well, there are people that say this,
Speaker 2: there are people that say that the driver shot him.
Speaker 2: You know, they'll go all the way back to that
Speaker 2: and never address some other things. Like I've always said,
Speaker 2: I'm waiting for Ceeing to have the guts to put
Speaker 2: somebody on to say, you know this, Lady Sherry Feaster
Speaker 2: was a blood spatter expert, went and did some work
Speaker 2: here and nobody's disputed it yet, and it was scientifically analyzed,
Speaker 2: and she realized that we have proof here in the
Speaker 2: publicly observable records that there are shots from the front
Speaker 2: and they will never face that because nobody in her field,
Speaker 2: even after her death, has challenged her work. So that
Speaker 2: should just stick in there and be a problem that
Speaker 2: you know, explain this to me if you only have
Speaker 2: a low nut mister Posner. But they don't do that.
Speaker 2: They face down. Here's this half assed report. Here's this,
Speaker 2: you know, only a partial thing where somebody has an
Speaker 2: account that they think this happened, et cetera. And it
Speaker 2: turns out that the hearsay is actually from somebody else's
Speaker 2: here say they were told this when you actually read
Speaker 2: the document with the MSM said oh, there might be
Speaker 2: proof of shots from the front, when they know, damn well,
Speaker 2: just read the rest of the document. It's no good.
Speaker 2: So it's literally staged. You know, when when you're gonna
Speaker 2: throw a fight, if it's going to be a boxing match,
Speaker 2: you gotta show up and you gotta look like you
Speaker 2: took some punches, so you know, you got to you
Speaker 2: gotta land a few so that it looks like you're
Speaker 2: trying to fight, and then you actually throw it. And
Speaker 2: that's what they're doing in my estimation, and that's when
Speaker 2: they and they obviously haul out Posner and make sure
Speaker 2: he's read in once again, because he never knew anything
Speaker 2: about the case. He didn't even know about stuff in
Speaker 2: his own book when he was doing his book tour,
Speaker 2: so give me a break. But you know, thirty years later,
Speaker 2: let's bring him out. Oh yes, of course I know
Speaker 2: all about this, Yeah, because somebody gave you exactly what
Speaker 2: it was. It was like when the CIA briefed everybody
Speaker 2: before the documents came out and got all the newspaper
Speaker 2: people together and said, listen, there's gonna be a bunch
Speaker 2: of stuff released, but I'm gonna explain to you what's
Speaker 2: in it. Since you guys aren't gonna understand it, it's
Speaker 2: no big deal. So every newspaper pretty much word for word,
Speaker 2: went along with what the CIA told them to say,
Speaker 2: including Tucker Carlson. Thank you very much, But you know
Speaker 2: what can I say? Look, Tucker Carlson said that blah blah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: but he went out and said there was nothing to
Speaker 2: it with the CIA and everything. And you know why,
Speaker 2: because the CIA briefed all these people about listen, these documents.
Speaker 2: You guys aren't going to understand them. It's difficult to read,
Speaker 2: so let us explain to you what's in it. We're
Speaker 2: the CIA, you can trust us. And they briefed them
Speaker 2: before the documents were released, so you know, here we
Speaker 2: go again. And I'm sure that there was a pre
Speaker 2: briefing on any of this too. You know with the
Speaker 2: agency anything that's about to come out, you know, thirty
Speaker 2: days before. They'll tell the reporters for the Washington Post
Speaker 2: and New York Post, you know, the everything, the Chicago
Speaker 2: Tribune if it still exists, whatever, the mainstream electronic media.
Speaker 2: They'll get them all together and say, listen, here's what's
Speaker 2: actually in these two thousand documents. Don't worry, we're gonna
Speaker 2: dump them. But it doesn't mean anything. If you want
Speaker 2: to call attention to something, here's something you can look at.
Speaker 2: And they're going to give them a guidebook because these
Speaker 2: guys who have never gone into study on this stuff
Speaker 2: and don't know really don't know anything about the case.
Speaker 2: So what word are they going to take? You know, Well,
Speaker 2: I got briefed by a CIA officer, Yeah you did,
Speaker 2: and gee, I wonder if they're trying to protect not
Speaker 2: only themselves but others. Anyway, back to it, and I
Speaker 2: want to get to this before we run over an
Speaker 2: hour talking here, you know, I want to get into
Speaker 2: what it is you're going to be talking about. Give
Speaker 2: us a hint, a preview, a little bit of a teaser,
Speaker 2: if you will, about what you and Doug are going
Speaker 2: to cover at the conference.
Speaker 3: Please sure. Well, I'll just back up a little bit.
Speaker 3: Last year, Rob Clark and I, who is my co host,
Speaker 3: I'm and founder of the Longomer and Pot Cast, did
Speaker 3: presentation on the coincidence of the name Martin, but specifically
Speaker 3: Jay Martin coming up in the assassination. We found over
Speaker 3: thirty instances of that, but it really evolved not into
Speaker 3: whether it was a coincidence or an anomaly or whatever.
Speaker 3: It evolved into a detailed study on a couple of
Speaker 3: Martin's in which we took deeper than anyone had ever
Speaker 3: had before. One being John Thomas Martin, the former minuteman
Speaker 3: who seventeen year old kid at the time who had
Speaker 3: took the famous film of Walker's House and the Lee
Speaker 3: Harvey Oswalt friends on the same reel of film. It's
Speaker 3: on the six Floor website. It's fascinating. And also James
Speaker 3: Rover Martin, who Marine and I moved in with six
Speaker 3: days after the assassination, and Rob and I had found
Speaker 3: documents that no one else had found before that proved
Speaker 3: that not only did James River Martin have a direct
Speaker 3: line in his house which Marina moved into six days
Speaker 3: after Lee was killed. I'm sorry about the assassination, but
Speaker 3: also that his wife, Wanda, was under oral contract of
Speaker 3: the CIA, and that was actually, I believe it was
Speaker 3: the April twenty twenty three releases. As we were preparing
Speaker 3: our Martin thing, I searched the new releases for Martin
Speaker 3: It's name, and I found this, one of the Martins
Speaker 3: we were studyings released document that his wife was under
Speaker 3: oral contract on the CAA. And you know, that's that's
Speaker 3: that's the bombshell. You know that that's that's very fascinating.
Speaker 2: And you know, a weird thing came up after you
Speaker 2: did your presentation too, And I don't know what you
Speaker 2: ever did with this, I forget, but I sent you
Speaker 2: a scan of a press photo I have, and I
Speaker 2: have a little collection of stuff from different media outlets
Speaker 2: over time, and I'm gonna bring it with me to
Speaker 2: the conference. I'll probably just give it to you when
Speaker 2: I see you. But this picture which claims to be
Speaker 2: of James Morton, and there he is, and he's somehow
Speaker 2: connected to the Kennedy assassination. But the image is weird
Speaker 2: because it doesn't match up with any of the guys
Speaker 2: that I think are supposed to be matching this up
Speaker 2: to in the case. Did you ever take a look
Speaker 2: at that or get into that any because I sent
Speaker 2: you there?
Speaker 3: You know what, do you remember that now that you
Speaker 3: mentioned it? I can't. My memory is terrible. I can't
Speaker 3: remember if I didn't any follow up rings a huge bell.
Speaker 3: I do remember it didn't look like the James River
Speaker 3: Martin pictures that we have. We have a picture of
Speaker 3: him escorting Marina into the warrant commission, right, and a
Speaker 3: couple other ones. But this, if my memory is correct,
Speaker 3: did not look like him.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm gonna bring it to you because it's either
Speaker 2: a up I AP. I have a few from CBS television.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna bring a small collection of these things with
Speaker 2: me to the conference because I know people will be
Speaker 2: interested in these in these photos. But I'm gonna try
Speaker 2: and give you that James Martin photo because I'd love
Speaker 2: for you guys to follow up and tell me about
Speaker 2: you know, who the hell this guy is, because it's weird.
Speaker 2: He's actually giving testimony to something here in the descriptor.
Speaker 2: You know, they put little like a paragraph under, under
Speaker 2: or on the back of these photographs all the time
Speaker 2: you've seen them. I mean, do you own any of these, like,
Speaker 2: you know, archive photographs from any of the press agencies.
Speaker 2: Do you have any of that stuff yourself?
Speaker 3: A couple not many time.
Speaker 2: Okay, well, I'm gonna bring this one because it's the
Speaker 2: first time I've ever seen Martin show up in one,
Speaker 2: and I just happened to notice it in my collection,
Speaker 2: which is why I thought you guys would find it interesting.
Speaker 2: Maybe you and Rob can do some follow up on
Speaker 2: it on The Lone Gunman because I'd love to know,
Speaker 2: just you know, a little shout out. I'd appreciate if
Speaker 2: I give you the photo. You know, Kelley gave this
Speaker 2: to us.
Speaker 3: And you can come on. You can come on and
Speaker 3: chat about it once we do it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely, so okay, But anyway, Yeah, you did this
Speaker 2: whole thing on the Martins last year, so what's up
Speaker 2: with this year? Yeah?
Speaker 3: So yeah. So of course Rob Clark and Doug Campbell,
Speaker 3: my partner for this year, are podcast partners as well
Speaker 3: of the book Hits podcast right, which debut is about
Speaker 3: once every month. And I'm you know, Doug and I
Speaker 3: did not really plan this. It was kind of an
Speaker 3: offhesis of of something we were looking into. I'm gonna
Speaker 3: get to in a second, and.
Speaker 2: Uh, you know, we.
Speaker 3: You know, I just want to thank actually Kenneth and
Speaker 3: Gabby because we were initially scheduled for Sunday, but I
Speaker 3: am flying out Sunday, so they moved us to Saturday.
Speaker 3: Before Bill Simpach and after Gail Nicks Jackson. Of course,
Speaker 3: Doug Campbell wrote the chapter in Gail's book, Pieces of
Speaker 3: the Puzzle, And you know, we're going to get into
Speaker 3: Cuba Shocker and Cuban prisons.
Speaker 4: MM and and and what effect.
Speaker 3: That might have had on the jfk A. But you know,
Speaker 3: we have a few characters we're going to explore, and
Speaker 3: we are we're going to do it live, which you know,
Speaker 3: Rob and I did it virtual this last year, as
Speaker 3: in it was pre recorded, so it's going to be
Speaker 3: a little different challenge. But we are just so excited because,
Speaker 3: you know, we're going to get into a lot a
Speaker 3: few characters that were in the prisons that I know
Speaker 3: almost all of your listeners will recognize. I'm not going
Speaker 3: to name them all, but they're they're going to be
Speaker 3: very obvious and some that might not be as obvious.
Speaker 3: And you know, we're gonna ex you know, there isn't
Speaker 3: really a definitive timeline of of Cuban prisons and who
Speaker 3: was held there and what their overlap was, right, what
Speaker 3: these characters like, were they in the same prison, did
Speaker 3: they share a cell, did they refer to their stays
Speaker 3: or to each other and say they're hsea testimonies and
Speaker 3: you know it's I'll give you one name, Santo Trafficante Junior.
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, that was the first name that popped in
Speaker 2: my mind because I'm thinking about the the slew of
Speaker 2: Italians that were in the prisons in Cuba for various reasons,
Speaker 2: and Trapiccanti is one of the biggest names. So yeah,
Speaker 2: there you go.
Speaker 3: Yep. Yeah. And so when Pastro really took over in
Speaker 3: like mid kind of nineteen fifty nine and like you know,
Speaker 3: march into Cuba, he imprisoned a lot of mafioso's, right,
Speaker 3: a lot.
Speaker 2: Of them when he officially took the place on New
Speaker 2: Year's Eve if I remember correctly, right, you know, very
Speaker 2: shortly thereafter. I mean it's almost like, you know, the
Speaker 2: reason why they played it out the way they did
Speaker 2: in the movie The Godfather is to give Michael Corleone
Speaker 2: the ability to get out of there, but not everybody
Speaker 2: escaped via a private plane that night, just saying would
Speaker 2: would you agree with that? Joe? Yes?
Speaker 3: Yes, And you know a lot of the characters we're
Speaker 3: going to talk about really were imprisoned I'm going to say,
Speaker 3: like mid nineteen fifty nine over the summer, including soundtra
Speaker 3: Tafa Conte. I don't want to give too much away.
Speaker 3: Maybe someone by the name of John Martino.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and there were maybe some deals struck with some
Speaker 2: other characters you might know who went down there to
Speaker 2: assist in getting their releases as well. Is that correct, Joe?
Speaker 2: Just in general?
Speaker 3: Yeah, of course. Louis McWillie was one of the ones
Speaker 3: who was alleged who admitted in his AHCA test that
Speaker 3: he visited Persconia On Prison, which was the immigration center
Speaker 3: where the mafiosas were held up, and he brought a
Speaker 3: fellow with him. And this name will probably be familiar
Speaker 3: to I hope everyone who's listening right now, and that
Speaker 3: would be Jack Ruby.
Speaker 2: Yes, sir so. And that is only the beginning actually
Speaker 2: of what you could learn tracking this. So this will
Speaker 2: be fascinating because to my memory, I mean, outside of
Speaker 2: a few people have gone through, you know, some of
Speaker 2: the adventures in Cuba. Joan Mellen comes to mind. You know,
Speaker 2: she discussed some of this in one of those books.
Speaker 2: It might have been The Great Game in Cuba where
Speaker 2: she discussed part of this, but again, nobody's gone in depth.
Speaker 2: And even if they did, they mentioned the mafia guys,
Speaker 2: but there was more to it than just the mob guys.
Speaker 3: There were the mercenaries, yeah, were I mean there, I mean,
Speaker 3: and there are people that were just yeah, I mean
Speaker 3: working on rigging slot machines for for uh Cuban casinos
Speaker 3: that were then when cast Up took over, they were imprisoned.
Speaker 3: I mean, you have such a big discrepancy from some
Speaker 3: people like and we'll get into in our Lancer presentation
Speaker 3: in the exact dates, but soundra traffic content. He spent
Speaker 3: like two months in a Cuban prison, and even when
Speaker 3: he was released and he had to go attend his
Speaker 3: daughter's funeral which was in Cuba, like then he like
Speaker 3: didn't want to go back to the US because he
Speaker 3: had like wards on him. I mean, there, we're going
Speaker 3: to give a really definitive timeline of all these characters
Speaker 3: uh in this presentation, And you're right, Truck, there is
Speaker 3: nothing about this. There's nothing about the overlap. There's nothing
Speaker 3: about who like who and who acknowledged knowing the other,
Speaker 3: and UH, it's going to be fascinating. I think it's
Speaker 3: Uh it's still we're still working on it, of course,
Speaker 3: UH being the the procrastinator that I am, Dougson, but
Speaker 3: it's it's going to be really good. And I you know, UH,
Speaker 3: people like David Boylan and Larry Hancock, who I know. Oh,
Speaker 3: by the way, I want to say this, your episode
Speaker 3: on what's the difference between an informant and UH an
Speaker 3: agent and and what's a soft file that you did
Speaker 3: a couple of months ago with them or a month
Speaker 3: or two ago was was great because I just loved it.
Speaker 3: And but that those people really know the most about
Speaker 3: UH Cuban affairs and UH and you know we're consulting
Speaker 3: with them, and UH, we hope it's going to be
Speaker 3: a really enlightening and educational presentation forever for for maybe
Speaker 3: more amateur researchers, for the most serious researchers, because even
Speaker 3: I've been a lot of money chuck that the most
Speaker 3: the top researchers can't put dates on when these people
Speaker 3: were in when they got out, who they were in
Speaker 3: there with they might have an idea, but.
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, it would take me a while to
Speaker 2: assemble a timeline like it would take me a few
Speaker 2: months worth of work for sure. I don't have anything
Speaker 2: like that at my fingertips or in my mind that
Speaker 2: I could draw upon. And usually I'm pretty good with
Speaker 2: this kind of stuff. But no, I don't think it's
Speaker 2: ever actually been laid out with any sort of documentation,
Speaker 2: with anything to really back it up again, And you know,
Speaker 2: people connect a few pieces of hearsay together and drop
Speaker 2: it normally that's what happens, honestly when it comes to
Speaker 2: this issue. Uh So, no, I'm looking forward to this.
Speaker 3: Because this will be and h no, I'm sorry, and
Speaker 3: uh yeah, everything we have it is backed up by
Speaker 3: documents with you know, none of it is going to
Speaker 3: be here, say, and you know, we have a drop
Speaker 3: offs full of documents that that will make public at
Speaker 3: some point for interested researchers. But uh, you know it's
Speaker 3: I guess at heart, I'm a document researcher. And I'm
Speaker 3: going to credit this Hilarry Hancock when when I met
Speaker 3: him last year, because you know, and I made a
Speaker 3: joke about this a little lone gum and I was like, man,
Speaker 3: I feel bad for Larry because, like, do you know
Speaker 3: how many decades he said to deal with listening to
Speaker 3: every crazy theory And these days it's like if you
Speaker 3: don't have the documents, like, don't waste my time?
Speaker 2: Well yeah, basically yeah, I mean, and look, you can't
Speaker 2: you can't argue. I loved Larry's presentation, by the way,
Speaker 2: uh last year, which this year, Larry will be there virtually. Uh,
Speaker 2: David Boylen will be present. As a matter of fact,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna give you guys the whole schedule real fast. Uh. Friday,
Speaker 2: you got Mike Swanson, Sarah Jordan Hines, Brian Edwards, Casey Quinlan,
Speaker 2: and then there's a dinner in a presentation. Uh. On Saturday,
Speaker 2: you got Dick Russell, will of Hallerin who you've heard
Speaker 2: on this show. Jacob Hornberger, who you've heard on this show,
Speaker 2: Bob Nelson, Uh, Paul blow who has been on this
Speaker 2: show but not in a while, Jeff Meek, and David
Speaker 2: Boylen altogether.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 2: Then you have uh, let's see Saturday continuing Carline Sabastano,
Speaker 2: Gail Nick Jackson, Doug Campbell, and Joe BURRELLI as he
Speaker 2: mentioned Bill Simpitch and then a banquet okay, and then
Speaker 2: on Sunday, Gary Fanin, Daniel Sheehan, uh Andy Keel leave
Speaker 2: is how you pronounce that we got a lunch break?
Speaker 2: Then Fred Litt, when Alex Harris, okay, Larry Hancock and
Speaker 2: David boy lyin. Although Larry will be there virtually and
Speaker 2: David will be there in person, Matt Doutitt, Brent Holland,
Speaker 2: Robert Groden, Janet Groden and Paul Blau will close it
Speaker 2: on Sunday, just to let you know. That's the total
Speaker 2: schedule as it stands right now. But Larry'll be there
Speaker 2: virtually this year, kind of like what you guys did
Speaker 2: when Rob did virtual and you were there in person.
Speaker 2: Larry'll be doing that with David boy Lin, so and
Speaker 2: that ought to be interesting. I don't even have a
Speaker 2: preview on their presentation actually, although I think he's gonna
Speaker 2: have to talk about the Oswald puzzle pieces because the
Speaker 2: Oswald puzzle is out for pre order now, as I
Speaker 2: let you guys know last week on the show with Larry.
Speaker 2: So anyway, I'm looking forward to this man. This is
Speaker 2: gonna be really good and it'll be a unique piece
Speaker 2: of work, so you know, and I don't say that
Speaker 2: that often, to be honest with you, a lot of things,
Speaker 2: it's just we're rehashing something, We're going back over something. Okay,
Speaker 2: you think you can find something that hasn't already been found,
Speaker 2: maybe you can. Okay, great, But frankly, this is unique.
Speaker 2: So I really do look forward to you guys doing
Speaker 2: this and you're gonna have handouts this time too.
Speaker 3: Or what well, I mean, I'm not sure what the
Speaker 3: audio visual or the visual setup is going to be
Speaker 3: this year at the Marriott, so I can't say. Last year,
Speaker 3: I did kind of like an audible and realized that
Speaker 3: some of the people towards the back wouldn't see because
Speaker 3: I didn't blow up the documents enough the specifics that
Speaker 3: I want them to see. That I and shout out
Speaker 3: to the Lorenzo Hotel for accommodating me. They printed out
Speaker 3: like thirty document for thirty copies of four different documents
Speaker 3: like one twenty. It didn't charge me a cent and
Speaker 3: also gave me advantages after my scooter falls, So nice
Speaker 3: to you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm hoping, I'm hoping we won't have to print
Speaker 4: out documents for this, but you know, we we we
Speaker 4: take it as it goes, you know, it depends.
Speaker 3: But I can't wait, Chuck, I mean, I can't wait
Speaker 3: for you to MC. I know I've been talking to Alex, Harris,
Speaker 3: Kenneth and Gail and you know we're going to be
Speaker 3: following Gail and it's just a great spot for us,
Speaker 3: the Lone Gunman, the Dallas Action which is Dougs podcast
Speaker 3: and Quick Hits and yeah, we're hoping we can make
Speaker 3: it a really fascinating presentation. And the great thing about
Speaker 3: it is Bill Simpach is a real expert on this
Speaker 3: topic and he's going to be there in person presenting
Speaker 3: after us. So we're hoping. I have a little Q
Speaker 3: and A. So I know Larry is moderating the Facebook group.
Speaker 3: I was emailing with him this week. I think he
Speaker 3: told me so maybe he could submit a question and
Speaker 3: Builk and chime in in person and we can just
Speaker 3: have a really great conversation. And that's what it's about.
Speaker 3: And that's why I think Rob and I are are
Speaker 3: our to our horns, but just are really good because
Speaker 3: like we really don't have a agenda here right, a
Speaker 3: certain faction or element, like we just kind of follow
Speaker 3: the fact, same thing for Doug and I know with
Speaker 3: a lot of people and the Oswald puzzle. And I
Speaker 3: hope that some of the help I gave Larry earlier
Speaker 3: in this year makes it through editing and into the book,
Speaker 3: because that would be really cool. I already gave some
Speaker 3: hints about what those could be earlier in theisode, but uh,
Speaker 3: you know, I'm last year. I didn't mean a researcher.
Speaker 3: Even if we completely disagreed on everything, that wasn't completely
Speaker 3: nice to me. And and that's just the vibes Lancer
Speaker 3: and it's great. And I know there's a couple of
Speaker 3: conferences more like you know j the Very Baker and
Speaker 3: some other conference, but like Lancer is the best by far,
Speaker 3: and I can't wait to be there. I can't wait
Speaker 3: to see you again, mister Chuck. I hope you can
Speaker 3: be my spotter and fill me when I uh, when
Speaker 3: I go with my scooter conkering mission there.
Speaker 2: Well, look, any anything I can do, I'll actually have
Speaker 2: missus O with me and and Frankie, so I'll have
Speaker 2: a couple of extra pairs of hands to do a
Speaker 2: few things. So we'll get it done one way or another.
Speaker 2: And it's it's gonna be a good time. So I
Speaker 2: definitely urge people to get this, to get in on it.
Speaker 2: There's a graphic out there, it's kind of funny. One
Speaker 2: of the graphics has you, Me, Doug and Brent Holland
Speaker 2: on it. That's an interesting little graphic out there. And
Speaker 2: there's some other schedules and things out there. But I've
Speaker 2: been trying to share this stuff on social media, and
Speaker 2: I really hope that you know that anybody listening is
Speaker 2: going to participate. Like I said, you can get online
Speaker 2: and participate virtually. Assassinationconference dot com. You sign up over
Speaker 2: there and if you want ten percent off and show
Speaker 2: them that you're supporting my show, Ocelly ten is the
Speaker 2: is the code you can use and you get ten
Speaker 2: percent off. More than happy to get a discount for
Speaker 2: anybody on anything, but whether you're going there virtually or not,
Speaker 2: I appreciate it anyways. So Joe, in closing though, why
Speaker 2: don't you tell people where they can find the Loan Gunman.
Speaker 2: Of course, there's the YouTube channel now, but you guys,
Speaker 2: of course are out there in your podcast form, your
Speaker 2: regular podcast form or anything else you want to go
Speaker 2: ahead and plug, go right ahead, and we'll close it
Speaker 2: out now as we've been at it for about an hour,
Speaker 2: which is good enough, I think, and I'm looking forward
Speaker 2: with this too.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm surprised. Usually we go on tangents and it's
Speaker 3: much longer. But yes, sir, The Lone Gunman Podcast l
Speaker 3: O n E. Gunman Podcast on YouTube dot com and
Speaker 3: Twitter and spreaker and all their Apple podcasts, all of
Speaker 3: their podcast platforms. We go live every seven pm Eastern
Speaker 3: every Friday night. I know you have a show on
Speaker 3: Friday Night Live as well, so for o Chelly listeners,
Speaker 3: check us out on the replay of course, right.
Speaker 2: Well, either that or tune in over there at seven
Speaker 2: o'clock and then come on over before I'm done at ten,
Speaker 2: and you can call in and tell me about what
Speaker 2: you heard on the Lone Gunman if you want, because
Speaker 2: I'm more than happy if anybody wants to pop on
Speaker 2: there and even promote other Sometimes people come on and
Speaker 2: promote other people's podcasts. I like it better if they're
Speaker 2: coming on to talk about their own. But you know
Speaker 2: that was happy. I had Gail nick Jackson on my
Speaker 2: Friday night call in a couple of weeks, like maybe
Speaker 2: last month and I loved that because it was right
Speaker 2: after I had just been asking Gail, you got to
Speaker 2: come to the conference this year, you know, blah blah blah.
Speaker 2: And the next thing I know is she called in
Speaker 2: to let me know that they had put her on
Speaker 2: the schedule, and I was like, oh, perfect, because I
Speaker 2: wanted her there this year. And I also made sure
Speaker 2: to get Jacob Hornberger on there as well as a speaker.
Speaker 2: And I'm really really grateful that Mike Swanson is actually
Speaker 2: leading off the conference. So it's going to be a
Speaker 2: good one and really interesting. I mean, especially if we
Speaker 2: get some unique stuff like Joe and Doug are gonna do.
Speaker 2: But Lone Gunman you can get on most podcast platforms,
Speaker 2: especially on YouTube. Go ahead and search it out. But
Speaker 2: you're live on YouTube on Friday nights or what.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So we go live every every Friday night at
Speaker 3: seven pm Eastern, and we've been doing that every week
Speaker 3: since Lancer last year or I guess the twenty second
Speaker 3: was like a Monday, right so ever since then. And listen,
Speaker 3: it's a grind to come up with interesting topics every
Speaker 3: week because you know, a lot of our audiences I'm
Speaker 3: sure like yours, like very having a lot of knowledge
Speaker 3: on the JFK assassination, so you can't just recap things
Speaker 3: every week and expect to get attention. So we were
Speaker 3: always trying to come up with with new topics, new ideas,
Speaker 3: new guests. We hope to have a couple of answer
Speaker 3: guests on as well in the coming weeks and after Lancer,
Speaker 3: And yeah, I mean, it's it's just I mean, Lancer
Speaker 3: is just a great networking event. I mean I would
Speaker 3: have never met Larry. Larry, for example, I would have
Speaker 3: never sat down with him for over an hour on
Speaker 3: Sunday morning and showed him the documents I found. And
Speaker 3: you know he's blown away by a couple of them.
Speaker 3: And you know that that would have never happened if
Speaker 3: I was in Dallas. And I might be newer to
Speaker 3: this community than most. You know, Rob's been grinding away
Speaker 3: at the Long Gun in for over ten years, like
Speaker 3: I know You've been grinding away a long time. So
Speaker 3: I'm just happy to be a part of the community.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: I respect everyone that that does good research in it.
Speaker 3: I respect the friends I made, like like you Chuck
Speaker 3: last Lancer, like Kenneth, like Alex Harris, like Doug Hampbell.
Speaker 3: I met him in person for the first time. It's
Speaker 3: just it's a great community and by far the best
Speaker 3: conference out of the three. I might be biased, but
Speaker 3: I can't wait to see you again and to see
Speaker 3: everyone else, and yeah, what's connection. For sure, I'm thank
Speaker 3: you again for having me on, sir.
Speaker 2: Absolutely. Another highlight, by the way, is you get to
Speaker 2: hang out with Robert Broden one of those days too,
Speaker 2: because you know Groden as much as you know. Look,
Speaker 2: you can argue with his books or whatever, but nobody
Speaker 2: has released more photographic evidence to the public. Nobody has
Speaker 2: participated in these things. I mean, he was part of
Speaker 2: the HSCA, the photographic work that was done there and
Speaker 2: all of that, plus part of many legendary documentaries, et cetera.
Speaker 2: And I enjoyed being able to sit down with him
Speaker 2: because I've encountered him a few times over the years,
Speaker 2: but was able to sit down and talk with him
Speaker 2: at Lancer, you know, at length if I wanted to.
Speaker 2: I think I actually ate dinner next to him too.
Speaker 2: At the one night we had dinner, no, actually twice
Speaker 2: because Dealey Plaza UK people went over to oh Man
Speaker 2: went over to the restaurant Campes. He's over there, and
Speaker 2: Bob was at the end of the table too, and
Speaker 2: then I went and sat down with him. Thursday, I
Speaker 2: definitely want I don't know what night I'm gonna go,
Speaker 2: but I'm definitely going to Campezes one night while I'm there.
Speaker 2: I love going over there. The original location, by the way,
Speaker 2: the one where Jack Ruby actually used to eat uh,
Speaker 2: is the one that I go to. Uh. And yeah,
Speaker 2: there must have been like thirty people from Dealey Plaza
Speaker 2: UK there when Bob sat down and I sat down
Speaker 2: at the end of the table, and it was just
Speaker 2: like this long line of very cool people including uh,
Speaker 2: oh Man, Johnny, Johnny Carnes, Cairen's what however you pronounce that?
Speaker 2: You know? Uh? And he he's great uh. And I
Speaker 2: was like, oh, good, I see one of my own.
Speaker 2: There's tattoos and uh, you know and something like that,
Speaker 2: and I said, oh, it's one of my guys. Felt
Speaker 2: really good. And I even brought Pepete with me last year.
Speaker 2: He's not gonna make it this year. But but instead
Speaker 2: of that, miss is O with me, So you guys
Speaker 2: will meet the missus. That'll be different. Anyways. First, yeah,
Speaker 2: me too, and my son will be with me. It's
Speaker 2: going to be an interesting time in Dallas November twenty
Speaker 2: second to the twenty fourth. And like I said, you
Speaker 2: can also attended virtually Assassination Conference dot com and one
Speaker 2: more time, Ocelly ten is the code you can put
Speaker 2: in to get ten percent off. So I want to
Speaker 2: thank Joe Burrelly for being on have youse expressed by
Speaker 2: callers schools. There anyone else who happens to get on
Speaker 2: the air of Jelly dot com.
Speaker 5: You've not necessarily reflect the views of Kelly dot Com
Speaker 5: or Juck Kelly, and we are not responsible.
Speaker 2: We're getting stupidity which might have students.
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