WEBVTT 1 00:00:12.919 --> 00:00:16.039 It looks like it's the seventh day of August twenty 2 00:00:16.120 --> 00:00:19.079 twenty four, allegedly according to that thing we call a calendar, 3 00:00:19.480 --> 00:00:22.239 This the Ocelli effect. And you, if you're hearing us live, 4 00:00:22.600 --> 00:00:24.559 are hearing us a little late going to the stream 5 00:00:24.679 --> 00:00:26.640 on a Wednesday, wodn's day, middle. 6 00:00:26.399 --> 00:00:29.399 Of the week. That's what it is. So what it is, 7 00:00:29.399 --> 00:00:30.719 what it was, and what it's gonna be. 8 00:00:30.800 --> 00:00:34.000 I'll tell you strange days ahead, and we're gonna probably 9 00:00:34.039 --> 00:00:36.479 have to do either an extended show on Friday for 10 00:00:36.560 --> 00:00:38.840 the call in, or I don't know, maybe I'll have 11 00:00:38.840 --> 00:00:41.520 to do a separate show. There wasn't really enough news 12 00:00:41.799 --> 00:00:45.960 today or yesterday in my mind to report to you. 13 00:00:46.079 --> 00:00:47.479 I mean, what do you want to hear about? You 14 00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:49.240 want to hear about Kamala Harris's campaign? 15 00:00:50.240 --> 00:00:52.640 Do you guys want to hear about that? I don't 16 00:00:52.679 --> 00:00:54.640 think you do, you know. 17 00:00:54.759 --> 00:00:56.920 I look, I'm not on Trump's side, I'm not on 18 00:00:56.960 --> 00:00:59.719 her side, but it is a little more entertaining. 19 00:00:59.799 --> 00:01:04.000 Now anyhow, what are we talking about tonight? Not this? 20 00:01:05.319 --> 00:01:08.359 So everybody calm down, don't get ready to snap webb 21 00:01:08.359 --> 00:01:10.280 your radios, because you know the next thing is I'm 22 00:01:10.280 --> 00:01:11.760 going to be either too right wing or too left 23 00:01:11.760 --> 00:01:14.799 wing for you, because I'm neither, so good luck with 24 00:01:14.840 --> 00:01:18.239 all that. But anyway, No, we're going to go to 25 00:01:18.400 --> 00:01:22.920 one of my favorite topics and the upcoming conference in November. 26 00:01:23.040 --> 00:01:26.680 November in Dallas, the JFK Lancer Conference will be held 27 00:01:26.680 --> 00:01:29.760 on the twenty second to the twenty fourth, That is 28 00:01:29.799 --> 00:01:35.439 that Friday, the twenty second. It actually coincides comes together synchronicitatively. 29 00:01:36.120 --> 00:01:40.200 Is that a word synchronizatively? Anyway, with synchronicity, it comes 30 00:01:40.200 --> 00:01:43.319 together with the exact date, which means we're going to play, 31 00:01:43.400 --> 00:01:45.840 you know, during that conference some of the news events 32 00:01:45.840 --> 00:01:48.000 that were announced to the world as they were announced 33 00:01:48.000 --> 00:01:51.079 at the time, they were announced locally, and that's the 34 00:01:51.079 --> 00:01:54.079 breakout room, which I think I'm going to be running 35 00:01:54.079 --> 00:01:55.439 a lot of. But I'm also going to be the 36 00:01:55.519 --> 00:01:58.920 MC at that conference. Anyhow, a lot of presenters more 37 00:01:58.959 --> 00:02:02.680 to be announced very un Larry Hancock plans to work 38 00:02:02.719 --> 00:02:05.519 on it remotely. We'll be hearing from Larry again next week, 39 00:02:05.920 --> 00:02:09.319 but we're gonna hear from a lot of upcoming presenters, 40 00:02:10.080 --> 00:02:13.199 and tonight is guess what one of those people. 41 00:02:13.319 --> 00:02:15.599 And I'm really happy because nobody else has. 42 00:02:15.520 --> 00:02:18.479 Had this guy as a guest before, because I'm willing 43 00:02:18.479 --> 00:02:20.520 to bet that ninety nine out of one hundred of 44 00:02:20.520 --> 00:02:23.719 you JFK guys who are into the case at any 45 00:02:23.800 --> 00:02:25.280 level have never heard of him. 46 00:02:25.879 --> 00:02:27.680 Want to know why because I hadn't. 47 00:02:28.400 --> 00:02:32.240 Okay, And look, it's not I'm not trying to offend you, man, 48 00:02:32.560 --> 00:02:35.639 but the thing is, I can't keep track of everybody. 49 00:02:36.240 --> 00:02:38.840 And you don't have a website, you don't have a book. 50 00:02:39.319 --> 00:02:43.000 You know, you're not trying to sell something, but you're 51 00:02:43.000 --> 00:02:46.800 going to do a presentation and your focus is nice. 52 00:02:46.879 --> 00:02:49.120 I'm going to spoil the focus for everybody, real fast 53 00:02:50.400 --> 00:02:51.919 medical evidence photographs. 54 00:02:52.000 --> 00:02:53.280 I love this anyway. 55 00:02:53.319 --> 00:02:55.639 His name is will o'haleran, and I want you to 56 00:02:55.680 --> 00:02:58.479 remember that name because, first of all, is a younger guy, 57 00:02:58.919 --> 00:03:01.840 which means, you know, or I shuffle loose this mortal coil, 58 00:03:01.879 --> 00:03:07.280 which could be anytime. You know, he might actually still 59 00:03:07.319 --> 00:03:09.520 be at it for a while, and I don't know, 60 00:03:09.800 --> 00:03:12.439 taking a quick glance at some of what he's working on, 61 00:03:13.280 --> 00:03:14.960 kind of happy that he's going to be now he 62 00:03:15.039 --> 00:03:17.080 might actually have something to expand upon. 63 00:03:18.240 --> 00:03:19.240 Even though I would. 64 00:03:19.080 --> 00:03:21.479 Argue that even in the nineteen eighties we had a 65 00:03:21.479 --> 00:03:25.639 fairly good handle on some of what it is that 66 00:03:25.680 --> 00:03:31.439 he presents. However, he wasn't alive then. The internet was 67 00:03:31.479 --> 00:03:35.159 not a thing. Then there was a lot less released 68 00:03:35.199 --> 00:03:38.960 officially and even unofficially back then, and even in the 69 00:03:39.039 --> 00:03:41.560 days when I worked with, you know, some people that 70 00:03:41.599 --> 00:03:45.879 were rather strange characters in the JFK research community, and 71 00:03:46.439 --> 00:03:49.599 there were new revelations seeming to get splashed across the 72 00:03:49.639 --> 00:03:53.759 planet here and there. It was nothing like it is today. 73 00:03:54.000 --> 00:03:58.680 So Will has an interesting spot here because he might 74 00:03:58.719 --> 00:04:01.919 be primed to actually accomplish more and clarify at least 75 00:04:01.960 --> 00:04:04.120 part of the record from what I can tell, but 76 00:04:04.159 --> 00:04:04.840 who knows. 77 00:04:04.639 --> 00:04:07.039 Maybe it goes a lot further. And by the way, 78 00:04:07.120 --> 00:04:07.560 a lot. 79 00:04:07.400 --> 00:04:10.919 Of people started with one small area, as did I. 80 00:04:13.080 --> 00:04:15.159 You know, My whole thing was like, what can I 81 00:04:15.199 --> 00:04:18.399 do with this Oswald character to you know, prove or 82 00:04:18.439 --> 00:04:22.720 disprove what happened here? And can I make a reasonable argument? 83 00:04:23.560 --> 00:04:26.079 And I don't mean argument as in conflict. I mean 84 00:04:26.079 --> 00:04:30.759 it in its very very scholastic educated sense. How can 85 00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:33.279 I make an argument? How can I construct a narrative 86 00:04:33.279 --> 00:04:38.120 to either support the Oswald guilt or nullify it entirely? 87 00:04:38.639 --> 00:04:40.959 That's how I started out on the case and ever 88 00:04:41.000 --> 00:04:45.399 since then well self educated on medical evidence. I wound 89 00:04:45.480 --> 00:04:49.279 up observing autopsies. I wound up, you know, going through 90 00:04:49.399 --> 00:04:52.160 medical evidence on one hundred other things. X rays had 91 00:04:52.199 --> 00:04:54.720 to talk to X ray technicians, had to learn almost 92 00:04:54.720 --> 00:04:58.040 how to read some of this stuff. Myself, the blind 93 00:04:58.040 --> 00:05:00.000 guy reading all that, plus the hundreds. 94 00:04:59.720 --> 00:05:01.720 Of books, plus the textbooks. Yeah, all that. 95 00:05:02.120 --> 00:05:05.240 Anyway, enough out of me, will holleran, this is a 96 00:05:05.360 --> 00:05:07.399 name I think you're going to hear again and again, 97 00:05:07.759 --> 00:05:10.319 and you're definitely going to hear it at the conference 98 00:05:10.399 --> 00:05:13.319 in November. I don't know what days presenting it, but 99 00:05:13.720 --> 00:05:15.519 I'll probably be announcing him and it'll be a lot 100 00:05:15.560 --> 00:05:17.920 shorter than what I just did here when I. 101 00:05:17.959 --> 00:05:18.439 Do, so. 102 00:05:18.560 --> 00:05:21.720 Will first off, how you doing tonight. 103 00:05:23.199 --> 00:05:26.360 I'm doing good, Chuck. Thank you very much for having 104 00:05:26.360 --> 00:05:30.079 me on. It was a big surprise to me when 105 00:05:30.079 --> 00:05:34.040 I got the invite because, as you kind of alluded to, 106 00:05:34.360 --> 00:05:39.920 I have not made any public appearances talking about this. 107 00:05:40.079 --> 00:05:44.199 I've been mostly on Facebook and YouTube with my research. 108 00:05:44.360 --> 00:05:45.759 So this is new right. 109 00:05:45.879 --> 00:05:48.360 Kind of a strange area too, because you're not an 110 00:05:48.439 --> 00:05:50.480 older guy, which is weird for you to be on 111 00:05:50.519 --> 00:05:55.000 Facebook anyway, you know, So I know, but a lot 112 00:05:55.040 --> 00:05:56.720 of the people that are interested in this are still 113 00:05:56.759 --> 00:06:00.439 on Facebook, which is why I exist there. Oh god, 114 00:06:00.480 --> 00:06:05.199 but I do hate Facebook. The thing is, it's weird. 115 00:06:05.240 --> 00:06:07.279 How old are you, first of all? And can you 116 00:06:07.360 --> 00:06:10.240 tell us how it is that you even got interested 117 00:06:10.279 --> 00:06:12.319 in the case, because once you tell people your age, 118 00:06:13.040 --> 00:06:15.439 you know you're closer to one of my kids ages 119 00:06:16.560 --> 00:06:17.079 than mine. 120 00:06:18.319 --> 00:06:19.439 So you know, help me out. 121 00:06:19.279 --> 00:06:21.399 Here, you know, tell everybody how old you are, and 122 00:06:21.480 --> 00:06:23.639 tell us how it is that you got interested in 123 00:06:23.680 --> 00:06:25.480 the JFK subject to begin with. 124 00:06:26.839 --> 00:06:31.040 Sure, So I'm twenty six and a half. I've been 125 00:06:31.079 --> 00:06:36.000 studying the case since the fiftieth anniversary, almost immediately after 126 00:06:36.480 --> 00:06:41.279 was when I started looking into it. And I started 127 00:06:43.639 --> 00:06:47.560 partly because John Tannedy has always been a hero of mine. 128 00:06:47.600 --> 00:06:51.720 I've always admired him, and in fact, several years prior, 129 00:06:51.959 --> 00:06:57.839 i've studied him and his life and presidency, but I 130 00:06:57.959 --> 00:07:01.680 never really took an interest in his death until the 131 00:07:01.720 --> 00:07:05.800 fiftieth anniversary. Prior to then, I just accepted the official story. 132 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:07.759 I didn't really know much about it. 133 00:07:09.680 --> 00:07:11.439 Well do you think it was the media blitz at 134 00:07:11.480 --> 00:07:11.879 that time? 135 00:07:11.959 --> 00:07:15.040 Because I can tell you the same story almost being 136 00:07:15.079 --> 00:07:18.560 a teenager, and it was the twenty fifth anniversary for 137 00:07:18.639 --> 00:07:21.720 me in nineteen eighty eight, right where I was in 138 00:07:21.800 --> 00:07:24.319 high school, going, you know, this is interesting. 139 00:07:24.600 --> 00:07:26.319 The guy is interesting because to me. 140 00:07:26.319 --> 00:07:30.839 Kennedy was like a rational liberal, which is what I 141 00:07:30.879 --> 00:07:32.480 thought of a mass or a middle of the road 142 00:07:32.600 --> 00:07:35.680 kind of liberal. So he wasn't an extreme liberal, but 143 00:07:35.720 --> 00:07:38.240 he was also a cold warrior. He was a mixed bag, 144 00:07:38.279 --> 00:07:41.199 and I thought he was actually a better choice than 145 00:07:41.199 --> 00:07:44.560 what I was seeing politically in the nineteen eighties. So, 146 00:07:44.759 --> 00:07:48.600 you know, as a teenager, and then the twenty fifth anniversary, 147 00:07:48.639 --> 00:07:51.360 all those programs came out, and you know, it was 148 00:07:51.399 --> 00:07:53.680 on radio, it was on television, it was all over 149 00:07:53.759 --> 00:07:56.319 and I went, hmm, this is very interesting to me. 150 00:07:56.480 --> 00:07:59.360 And that's how I actually got dragged into it right 151 00:07:59.399 --> 00:08:02.399 then in eighty So twenty five years later with the 152 00:08:02.439 --> 00:08:07.160 fiftieth anniversary blitz in twenty thirteen, mind you guys, that's 153 00:08:07.199 --> 00:08:08.000 what dragged. 154 00:08:07.680 --> 00:08:11.480 You in then. Huh yes, okay, well so. 155 00:08:11.839 --> 00:08:14.319 Now now that you you get dragged in because you 156 00:08:14.360 --> 00:08:17.519 see what documentaries, news reports. I mean, there was a 157 00:08:17.560 --> 00:08:21.000 lot going on back then. The demonstration in Dealey Plaza 158 00:08:21.040 --> 00:08:22.199 what was going on in Dallas. 159 00:08:22.199 --> 00:08:22.480 Good. 160 00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:27.160 I remember vividly what got me into it, and that 161 00:08:27.399 --> 00:08:30.600 was I sat down with my mom to watch this 162 00:08:30.680 --> 00:08:35.480 documentary called JFK The Smoking Gun, which, shirt you students 163 00:08:35.480 --> 00:08:38.480 of the case we are listening, you'll know, talks about 164 00:08:38.519 --> 00:08:41.879 the theory that a secret Service agent accidentally fired the headshot, 165 00:08:43.559 --> 00:08:47.720 and it really gave me this sort of light bulb 166 00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:51.480 kind of moment because, as I said before then, I 167 00:08:51.519 --> 00:08:55.679 had never heard any alternative explanation. You know, I was 168 00:08:55.759 --> 00:09:00.320 a strong believer in the you know, Oswaldback's the looney 169 00:09:00.440 --> 00:09:05.240 because I had no reason to believe otherwise. But so 170 00:09:05.480 --> 00:09:09.039 immediately after seeing that documentary, I said to myself, wait, 171 00:09:09.120 --> 00:09:11.799 there are actually people out there who don't believe it, 172 00:09:11.919 --> 00:09:14.320 who don't believe that I was that's alone. Maybe I 173 00:09:14.320 --> 00:09:16.639 should look into this myself to see if that's true 174 00:09:16.679 --> 00:09:20.440 or not. And I went in with a completely open 175 00:09:20.519 --> 00:09:26.000 mind and just gradually looked at and looked through as 176 00:09:26.120 --> 00:09:28.879 much information as I could get my hands on and 177 00:09:29.320 --> 00:09:29.960 went from there. 178 00:09:30.440 --> 00:09:33.759 Okay, so this is really weird, because see I started 179 00:09:33.759 --> 00:09:36.639 out working on this stuff and actually digging into it 180 00:09:36.679 --> 00:09:39.600 for real, because honestly, I said to myself I want 181 00:09:39.600 --> 00:09:41.399 to put the conspiracy theories to rest. 182 00:09:41.879 --> 00:09:42.159 Now. 183 00:09:42.360 --> 00:09:45.120 The one you're talking about didn't emerge until a little 184 00:09:45.120 --> 00:09:48.600 after I got into the case, because it really started 185 00:09:49.000 --> 00:09:53.200 it germinated from this book called Mortal Error, which later 186 00:09:53.240 --> 00:09:55.840 on there was a lawsuit because Hickey went and sued 187 00:09:55.840 --> 00:09:58.879 the author. And there was a guy named Donahue for 188 00:09:59.039 --> 00:10:02.279 years that went around one who was a ballistics guy, 189 00:10:02.320 --> 00:10:05.159 who was explaining, you know, the different ways that this happened. 190 00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:07.080 And it was a wild theory. 191 00:10:07.120 --> 00:10:10.440 Actually, it was sort of a revolutionary thing that the 192 00:10:10.480 --> 00:10:13.000 Secret Service agent accidentally shot him in the back of 193 00:10:13.000 --> 00:10:16.960 the head with an ar you know, from a car 194 00:10:17.039 --> 00:10:19.000 further back in the motorcade. 195 00:10:19.159 --> 00:10:20.080 That was the idea. 196 00:10:20.159 --> 00:10:22.840 Now, now look, I'll tell you this, I don't believe 197 00:10:22.840 --> 00:10:25.799 in that theory. I didn't accept it to begin with. 198 00:10:26.279 --> 00:10:30.240 But long before the Smoking Gun, I had read that book. 199 00:10:30.320 --> 00:10:33.480 I had listened to Donahue. Donahue was on radio, Donahue 200 00:10:33.519 --> 00:10:36.879 was on TV. He was writing in newspapers. I think 201 00:10:36.960 --> 00:10:39.360 the Baltimore Sun is a lot of places where his 202 00:10:39.480 --> 00:10:43.559 articles came out. And I was acquiring newspapers from across 203 00:10:43.559 --> 00:10:45.080 the country because I was in New York and New 204 00:10:45.159 --> 00:10:48.039 Jersey at the time, and we could do that again 205 00:10:48.200 --> 00:10:53.039 no internet. But still it's fascinating because this came back, 206 00:10:53.240 --> 00:10:56.720 this theory after it sort of had been debunked. It 207 00:10:56.840 --> 00:10:59.799 comes back around and you're dealing with the second wave 208 00:10:59.799 --> 00:11:03.240 of the theory around the fiftieth anniversary, which was a 209 00:11:03.279 --> 00:11:05.360 strange time period for me. I had kind of stepped 210 00:11:05.399 --> 00:11:08.559 away around the fiftieth anniversary because. 211 00:11:08.799 --> 00:11:10.080 I saw a lot of hoopla. 212 00:11:10.159 --> 00:11:12.519 I saw that they were going to block us in 213 00:11:12.600 --> 00:11:14.679 Dealey Plaza as far as going there to do the 214 00:11:14.679 --> 00:11:17.120 Moment of Silence. It looked like there was a struggle there. 215 00:11:17.159 --> 00:11:20.320 They kept arresting Robert Grodin. It was a mess, And 216 00:11:20.600 --> 00:11:23.720 I just said, you know what, maybe I've had it 217 00:11:23.759 --> 00:11:26.840 with this because we're not making the progress we need 218 00:11:26.879 --> 00:11:29.360 to make. We need to wait for twenty seventeen because 219 00:11:29.360 --> 00:11:32.159 I was waiting for that since the nineties. You know, 220 00:11:32.240 --> 00:11:34.840 twenty seventeen, we're going to get our stuff to come out, 221 00:11:34.879 --> 00:11:39.360 because that's when this stuff has to come out. See 222 00:11:39.399 --> 00:11:42.080 how I could really read the future so well, you 223 00:11:42.120 --> 00:11:45.000 know it's got to come out in twenty seventeen. Thank you, 224 00:11:45.159 --> 00:11:47.559 mister Trump, and thank you mister Biden. That's why you're 225 00:11:47.600 --> 00:11:50.039 being sued by the Mary Farrell Foundation as we speak. 226 00:11:50.080 --> 00:11:54.440 But anyway, Will, this is an interesting time period, so 227 00:11:54.679 --> 00:11:57.200 that is what engaged you. But what did you learn 228 00:11:57.200 --> 00:11:58.159 about that? To begin with? 229 00:12:01.279 --> 00:12:06.840 Well, after I watched that documentary, I really, to be 230 00:12:06.879 --> 00:12:10.200 honest with you, I started by reading the Warren Commission Report, 231 00:12:10.240 --> 00:12:13.679 because actually my mom bought me a copy from her 232 00:12:13.759 --> 00:12:17.919 garage sale and I got halfway into it and then 233 00:12:18.159 --> 00:12:21.799 stopped because I had heard that, you know, so many 234 00:12:21.799 --> 00:12:24.879 people had said, you know, this gets the story wrong, 235 00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:28.120 and there's you know, a lot of misinformation in it. 236 00:12:28.159 --> 00:12:30.519 So I said, well, maybe I should look at other sources. 237 00:12:31.200 --> 00:12:37.360 So I looked for and read several other books, I 238 00:12:37.519 --> 00:12:42.840 watched several documentaries, and then really just looked at any 239 00:12:42.879 --> 00:12:46.279 and all information I can get my hands on. And 240 00:12:47.080 --> 00:12:51.000 within a year or two after starting with after I 241 00:12:51.039 --> 00:12:56.120 started looking into it, I just started to notice this 242 00:12:56.200 --> 00:13:02.759 pattern of just contradictions and inconsistencies and the evidence against 243 00:13:02.799 --> 00:13:11.200 Oswald that it really made me doubt it and morally 244 00:13:11.200 --> 00:13:12.879 and psychologically, I guess you could say. 245 00:13:15.080 --> 00:13:17.600 So what you found is that in the official record, 246 00:13:17.799 --> 00:13:20.360 what you found is sorry, in the official record. And 247 00:13:20.399 --> 00:13:24.279 then also the dissense that people had publicly published. You 248 00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:28.039 found that the guarantee was that you couldn't make a 249 00:13:28.080 --> 00:13:31.000 solid case against Oswald. The government didn't make a solid 250 00:13:31.000 --> 00:13:35.519 case against Oswald because upon any sort of real examination, 251 00:13:35.600 --> 00:13:39.200 it falls apart. You probably had just the Warren Report. 252 00:13:39.240 --> 00:13:42.600 You didn't have the twenty six volumes, so you weren't 253 00:13:42.639 --> 00:13:46.360 looking at the evidence and the hearings, right. But maybe 254 00:13:46.399 --> 00:13:48.320 you got to hold the pieces of those along the 255 00:13:48.360 --> 00:13:49.600 way and said, wait a minute. 256 00:13:49.360 --> 00:13:51.519 There's something wrong with this. There's something wrong with that. 257 00:13:51.960 --> 00:13:54.120 How come it says that this is concluded in the 258 00:13:54.120 --> 00:13:57.159 Warren Commission? And meanwhile, when I read what these people 259 00:13:57.200 --> 00:14:01.039 actually said, that's not what they said, you know, And 260 00:14:01.399 --> 00:14:04.440 it's a weird thing. And your mom might have picked 261 00:14:04.519 --> 00:14:07.360 up an official one from the government printing office, or 262 00:14:07.559 --> 00:14:10.240 what's more likely, which is strange, is that you might 263 00:14:10.240 --> 00:14:11.879 have gotten one that was printed by the New York 264 00:14:11.879 --> 00:14:14.759 Times or Double Day or something like that. And you're 265 00:14:14.799 --> 00:14:17.320 looking at this thing going, you know, I'm just strained 266 00:14:17.320 --> 00:14:19.679 to read this. And what I have is the government 267 00:14:19.720 --> 00:14:23.559 telling me that, despite whatever evidence they collected or didn't collect, 268 00:14:23.960 --> 00:14:28.279 this is the conclusion. So something is wrong here, Okay, 269 00:14:28.440 --> 00:14:31.200 but you're still dealing with the smoking gun, probably in 270 00:14:31.240 --> 00:14:32.120 the back of your head. 271 00:14:32.200 --> 00:14:35.120 Can I prove that? Can I disprove that? Okay? 272 00:14:35.159 --> 00:14:38.399 If I can't prove the case against Oswald, what can 273 00:14:38.440 --> 00:14:42.360 we conclude? Because I think almost nobody, although today there 274 00:14:42.399 --> 00:14:48.200 are contradictions to this, unbelievably, almost anybody would conclude that 275 00:14:48.320 --> 00:14:53.360 ultimately Kennedy died, Connolly was wounded, okay, and James tag 276 00:14:53.519 --> 00:14:57.919 was struck by something. But you know, at the end 277 00:14:57.919 --> 00:15:00.759 of the day, every argument comes after that, right, I mean, 278 00:15:00.799 --> 00:15:02.519 I know there's people out there that say his you know, 279 00:15:02.559 --> 00:15:04.600 his body was switched and he actually came back as 280 00:15:04.679 --> 00:15:07.519 Jimmy Carter and everything else. Uh, you know, we are 281 00:15:07.559 --> 00:15:11.759 in the age of you know, disinformation squared, so you know, 282 00:15:11.840 --> 00:15:14.320 it is what it is. But most rational people would 283 00:15:14.360 --> 00:15:18.559 conclude Kennedy died, Connolly was wounded pretty badly, and so 284 00:15:18.639 --> 00:15:23.039 somebody shot at the Motorcade for sure, at least one somebody, 285 00:15:23.399 --> 00:15:27.440 if not two, if not three. And in some people's cases, 286 00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:28.879 you know, there's twenty shooters. 287 00:15:28.519 --> 00:15:31.240 Everywhere, you know, and all of this. 288 00:15:31.360 --> 00:15:34.759 But no matter what, you can easily conclude that somebody 289 00:15:34.799 --> 00:15:38.440 shot at the Motorcade Kennedy died, Connolly was wounded, and 290 00:15:38.600 --> 00:15:41.840 this did change things in America one way or another. 291 00:15:42.480 --> 00:15:43.080 Absolutely. 292 00:15:43.399 --> 00:15:46.639 So you're now with that, and where do you go? 293 00:15:46.720 --> 00:15:50.440 Do you try to find a path to some sort 294 00:15:50.480 --> 00:15:53.120 of way, like what evidence makes the best sense? Do 295 00:15:53.200 --> 00:15:58.000 you go with the David Lifton thing, which again is produced, 296 00:15:58.039 --> 00:16:00.519 you know what fifteen years before you were the first 297 00:16:00.559 --> 00:16:03.559 copy of Best Evidence came out. I think, you know, 298 00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:07.159 do you go with that? Okay, what's the best evidence? 299 00:16:07.320 --> 00:16:09.600 Let's say? Is that where you went next? 300 00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:18.480 I eventually did read Best Evans I think around what 301 00:16:18.639 --> 00:16:23.759 was it twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, But for the first 302 00:16:23.759 --> 00:16:27.320 few years my focus wasn't necessarily on the medical evens. 303 00:16:27.360 --> 00:16:31.320 That wasn't until twenty seventeen, shortly before the files were 304 00:16:31.360 --> 00:16:34.320 supposed to be declassified. But prior to that, I was 305 00:16:34.399 --> 00:16:38.960 just looking at the case just in a very general sense. 306 00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:45.039 After looking through the one report, I read Headshop by 307 00:16:45.080 --> 00:16:49.960 Paul Chambers, They Killed Our President by Jesse Ventura, Richard 308 00:16:50.000 --> 00:16:53.519 Belzer's hit List, and several other books, and then I 309 00:16:53.559 --> 00:16:57.360 eventually found the JFK. Lancer's site and Mary Ferrell and 310 00:16:58.039 --> 00:17:02.080 come through their collection if documents and just as I said, 311 00:17:02.240 --> 00:17:07.480 the more I learned, the more I became disturbed and 312 00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:11.400 convinced that the official story was wrong. 313 00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:15.960 Okay, so you're aware of the expansive universe of evidence 314 00:17:16.000 --> 00:17:19.759 that is available, which is kind of amazing because you know, 315 00:17:20.599 --> 00:17:22.839 if you look at this abruder film, it's less than 316 00:17:22.839 --> 00:17:27.279 thirty seconds of film, and the majority of what people 317 00:17:27.359 --> 00:17:31.799 study occurs in that thirty seconds, absolutely, you know. So, 318 00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:34.640 and then there's the universe of things after that. 319 00:17:34.759 --> 00:17:37.960 Right, what happened to the body? How was the body handled? Right? 320 00:17:38.839 --> 00:17:42.759 Exactly? How was Oswald arrested? You know, what did he 321 00:17:42.799 --> 00:17:45.240 say when he was in custody? How did he die? 322 00:17:45.319 --> 00:17:48.559 Jack Ruby shoots him? Gut shot? Weird gut shot? Would 323 00:17:48.559 --> 00:17:51.079 you have actually died had not an idiot been pumping 324 00:17:51.160 --> 00:17:53.400 up and down on him with a you know, with 325 00:17:53.480 --> 00:17:56.440 a torso wound, et cetera. You got to go through 326 00:17:56.480 --> 00:17:59.119 all this stuff, and what did the Parkland doctors say, 327 00:17:59.599 --> 00:18:03.200 And what did the doctors who actually performed the terrible 328 00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:06.400 autopsy that you know, Michael Bodden and even the late 329 00:18:06.480 --> 00:18:10.599 Sarah Weck could agree was a terrible autopsy? You know, 330 00:18:10.839 --> 00:18:14.960 the official record, what does this reveal? Okay, but how 331 00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:17.720 do you eventually get to focusing on the medical evidence 332 00:18:17.920 --> 00:18:19.079 you cut to the chase force. 333 00:18:20.440 --> 00:18:26.359 Sure, so I had become the first suspicious of it 334 00:18:27.759 --> 00:18:31.000 after reading the first few chapters of Jesse Ventura's book, 335 00:18:31.000 --> 00:18:35.720 which focused on what the doctors from Parkland Hospital said, 336 00:18:35.759 --> 00:18:39.279 and then I discovered best evidence and looked through that, 337 00:18:39.319 --> 00:18:44.559 and it was specifically the head wound that interested me 338 00:18:44.640 --> 00:18:50.160 the most because it seemed so important and the most 339 00:18:50.799 --> 00:18:54.559 arguably the most controversial aspect because of the direction of 340 00:18:54.599 --> 00:18:57.759 the shot that caused it. To me, it seemed like 341 00:18:57.799 --> 00:19:02.440 that was the whole central point. And so after reading 342 00:19:02.440 --> 00:19:05.400 those books, I went and found the testimonies of the 343 00:19:05.440 --> 00:19:08.920 Parkland doctors from the Warman Commission volumes I've read that. 344 00:19:09.559 --> 00:19:12.759 I learned their names, and then I searched further and 345 00:19:13.160 --> 00:19:15.960 tried to read and listen or watch to every single 346 00:19:16.160 --> 00:19:20.480 testimony or interview that they ever gave, and then eventually 347 00:19:21.480 --> 00:19:24.480 found that the people at the autopsy said almost the 348 00:19:24.480 --> 00:19:28.480 same thing that they did. After watching the you know, 349 00:19:28.559 --> 00:19:33.680 the nice Needy eight Carol and show Jfkun Salt Murder, 350 00:19:34.400 --> 00:19:35.680 that was my introduction to that. 351 00:19:36.440 --> 00:19:39.839 Okay, so all right, so now you've seen the videos, 352 00:19:39.960 --> 00:19:43.519 had you gotten to the HSCA yet and the interview 353 00:19:43.519 --> 00:19:45.759 of the doctor's there by the medical panel and all 354 00:19:45.839 --> 00:19:49.880 that and that strangeness yet or did that come later? 355 00:19:51.200 --> 00:19:55.119 Yes, that was around twenty twenty one when I read 356 00:19:55.480 --> 00:19:59.440 High Trees, and chapter two of High Treason focuses a 357 00:19:59.440 --> 00:20:03.039 lot on as well as the Parking doctors' reactions to 358 00:20:03.079 --> 00:20:06.640 the autopsy photographs, which is to him as the focus 359 00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:12.400 of my presentation. So that also really disturbed me and 360 00:20:12.640 --> 00:20:16.519 got me interested in the autopsy photographs themselves. I'd seen 361 00:20:16.559 --> 00:20:21.960 them prior to that, specifically the James Fox photographs, but 362 00:20:22.039 --> 00:20:27.039 then I had started going through and trying to find 363 00:20:27.359 --> 00:20:31.200 every version of the photographs that were publicly available, because 364 00:20:31.759 --> 00:20:35.359 I don't know if many researchers know, there's several different 365 00:20:35.440 --> 00:20:38.960 versions as far as clarity, and some are cropped, some 366 00:20:39.000 --> 00:20:43.000 are uncropped, and then some are better quality than others. 367 00:20:43.599 --> 00:20:47.200 So that's what led me to the autopsy photographs, and 368 00:20:47.240 --> 00:20:52.599 ever since twenty seventeen, I've been focusing on the medical 369 00:20:52.680 --> 00:20:54.480 levens in the head boond. I know a lot of 370 00:20:55.440 --> 00:21:02.039 writers have already talked about it at nauseum, but my 371 00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:08.640 focus was not just that, but also comparing the descriptions 372 00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:12.519 of the wounds to the autopsy photographs, comparing and contrasting them. 373 00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:16.799 And it wasn't until I've read High Treason that I 374 00:21:16.880 --> 00:21:22.079 became interested in finding what the Parkland doctors originally said 375 00:21:22.759 --> 00:21:25.960 about the autopsy photographs, specifically those at the back of 376 00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:30.480 Kennedy's head. Because if for those of you who have 377 00:21:30.559 --> 00:21:35.079 read High Treason, we'll know in chapter two, Groden and 378 00:21:35.119 --> 00:21:39.160 Harry Livingstone discuss interviews that they had done with the 379 00:21:39.160 --> 00:21:42.480 Parkland doctors when they showed them the photographs of the 380 00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:45.200 back that I had for the first time. And apparently 381 00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:49.160 those conversations were taped, so I went about trying to 382 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:51.920 find those tapes. So we'll talk about that later. 383 00:21:51.920 --> 00:21:53.759 Right, Yeah, we'll get into that in a minute. I mean, 384 00:21:53.839 --> 00:21:56.480 but there is an evolution here, because Groden has a 385 00:21:56.559 --> 00:22:00.960 version of these autopsy photos, yes, and the Fox version 386 00:22:01.000 --> 00:22:03.440 that it took me twenty years to get, by the way, 387 00:22:03.480 --> 00:22:05.400 I didn't get mine until like two thousand and eight. 388 00:22:05.799 --> 00:22:07.200 My good copy. 389 00:22:08.440 --> 00:22:11.920 And mine I got from that negative that was produced 390 00:22:11.920 --> 00:22:16.079 from the original Fox photos where somebody created a negative afterwards, 391 00:22:16.079 --> 00:22:19.799 because initially he just had photos and they were bought 392 00:22:19.799 --> 00:22:24.799 by a researcher and then a contact negative was created, 393 00:22:25.160 --> 00:22:29.079 and that to me is the best set and has 394 00:22:29.119 --> 00:22:31.200 been very difficult to get hold of, and it has 395 00:22:31.359 --> 00:22:34.400 just devolved in quality over the years. The stuff you 396 00:22:34.400 --> 00:22:37.400 can find on the internet is representative of the photographs, 397 00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:40.839 but there is all types of variations. Like you said, 398 00:22:40.839 --> 00:22:45.839 it's cropped differently, there's different saturations of color of the 399 00:22:45.880 --> 00:22:48.039 black and whites, there's different I mean, it is a 400 00:22:48.160 --> 00:22:52.839 real crazy universe now of variations on these photos. 401 00:22:52.839 --> 00:22:53.640