Speaker 1: Welcome to Stories of Special Forces Operators Podcast. Listen to
Speaker 1: some of the bravest and toughest people on the planet
Speaker 1: share their stories, Sit back and enjoy.
Speaker 2: Welcome back everybody. Well, today we have a very special show.
Speaker 2: Co hosting with me is Tier one operator and the
Speaker 2: co host of The Collective, which you can catch on
Speaker 2: YouTube at eleven am Pacific every day of the week
Speaker 2: kiding it every day, seven days of the week. His
Speaker 2: name is Sean Taylor.
Speaker 3: Welcome Sean, Hey, great to be back. Thanks for inviting
Speaker 3: me into this conversation.
Speaker 2: Buddy, thank you very much for being here. Folks. You
Speaker 2: might have heard him and Master Corporal Chants Burls in
Speaker 2: our last interview. But today we have somebody who's returning
Speaker 2: as well, but its returning is Green Beray Ryan Hendrickson.
Speaker 2: He'll be here shortly and we're going to be talking
Speaker 2: a little bit about his story it's amazing really, and
Speaker 2: then we'll be talking about resilience and a whole lot more.
Speaker 2: So before I get started, you know what to do, share, subscribe,
Speaker 2: hit that like button and join us. Now as we
Speaker 2: go into the green room, talk a little bit about
Speaker 2: resilience before Ryan gets here. So Sean resilient to something
Speaker 2: that's kind of interesting. There's two things I always see
Speaker 2: in the world of trauma that you don't see a
Speaker 2: lot of I guess me phrase it that way. And
Speaker 2: two of the things I don't see is usually protective factors,
Speaker 2: which is usually the opposite of a lot of the
Speaker 2: factors that cause problems. And some of you can control,
Speaker 2: some you can't, obviously, But and then the other one
Speaker 2: is resilience. And this is the one I guess we'll
Speaker 2: be talking a little bit about today, and we'll probably
Speaker 2: cover a little bit of protective factors too, because I
Speaker 2: like to explore that. And now pabably ask Ryan what
Speaker 2: he thinks something what happened to him during his development,
Speaker 2: during his early years that might have helped him he
Speaker 2: so resilient and whenever he overcame, But what do you
Speaker 2: think about resilience?
Speaker 3: Well, before I give my opinion on resilience, which is
Speaker 3: a great topic to discuss, I'm curious as to how
Speaker 3: you would define protective measures or protective portions I'm assuming
Speaker 3: coping mechanisms to some degree or or how would you
Speaker 3: define that?
Speaker 2: Yeah, protective book factors would actually how would you say,
Speaker 2: increase the efficacy of coping mechanisms. I always say there's
Speaker 2: three things I might approach you before coping mechanisms, support systems,
Speaker 2: and resources. Resources are the easiest now, thankfully fifty years
Speaker 2: ago is a lot harder. So we'll just stay focused
Speaker 2: with trauma for instance, trauma, PTSD, whatever it may be,
Speaker 2: and resources a lot more now. So if you're a
Speaker 2: victim of domestic violence, of shelters, if you're PTSD, there's
Speaker 2: places to go. Support system that's the hardest. We'll get
Speaker 2: to that in a second. Coping skills are the one
Speaker 2: you usually therapists will help you with if not, parents
Speaker 2: can if they've raised you accordingly, And I'll talk about
Speaker 2: that a minute form the protective factors. But the third
Speaker 2: one support system is the toughest one is do you
Speaker 2: have those friends that really can how you talked about
Speaker 2: this on the collective about the social connection engaging with individuals,
Speaker 2: but it's not just simply engaging with somebody's actually somebody
Speaker 2: who really I don't care what you tell me, Sean,
Speaker 2: I'm still your friend. You all have something, and those
Speaker 2: aren't that many.
Speaker 3: That's true.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you tell somebody something and all of a sudden, shit,
Speaker 2: this guy's going to turn on me, or she is
Speaker 2: or whatever it is, and then they're going to turn
Speaker 2: and or they're going to look at me differently now,
Speaker 2: And that's a problem. That's not really an unconditional type
Speaker 2: of Christianity. He likes to use a conditional love. For instance,
Speaker 2: that's gone and for human beings, we tend to want that,
Speaker 2: even as children want this unconditional love from our parents.
Speaker 2: And I think that's where the protective factors. One of
Speaker 2: the protective factors is having parenting, good parenting. And this
Speaker 2: could be single bombs. I know people are going to say, oh,
Speaker 2: it just have to be both families. Doesn't have to be.
Speaker 2: It's much easier if you have both parents, But those
Speaker 2: are one of the major protective factors. Teaching them is
Speaker 2: one of the key things about parents. So if it
Speaker 2: gets a phone call and they're upset about something, how
Speaker 2: does the parent handle it in front of that four
Speaker 2: or five year old. These are early lessons that they
Speaker 2: started learning. Well, dad's flipping at him, yelling, he's smashing things,
Speaker 2: he's hitting mob whatever it may be that's not protected.
Speaker 2: But dad says, you know what stuff happens ticket as
Speaker 2: it goes go with the blows, roll along with it.
Speaker 2: We learn from our mistakes and learn from this d D.
Speaker 2: And they start explaining that. One of the things plugs
Speaker 2: me the mostions when you see parents sometimes in the
Speaker 2: grocery store where the kids throwing the cereal box all
Speaker 2: over the place and the parent yells of them not
Speaker 2: to do it, and then grabs them and takes them away.
Speaker 2: And I'm looking at it, going, she didn't tell them?
Speaker 2: Why you didn't tell them? It was the kicks that think,
Speaker 2: maybe it's just cereal boxes. I just grab the oatmeal
Speaker 2: box and throw that. He has no idea what the
Speaker 2: heck is going on, So there's no understanding of why
Speaker 2: you don't do this because it hurts other people. This
Speaker 2: is why you don't smack other kids in the head
Speaker 2: when you're five. That says so. Protective factors are that
Speaker 2: good moral values taught by the family, love staying away.
Speaker 2: Obviously for substance us that's another one. It's the opposite
Speaker 2: really of anything that's going to lead into making the
Speaker 2: individual handle trauma effectively. Trauma.
Speaker 3: That's a that's a good that's a good lead in
Speaker 3: for an idea that I've been considering recently. I didn't
Speaker 3: know that. I haven't really considered it in the way
Speaker 3: that you just put it across. But it's something that
Speaker 3: I'm actively pursuing with the collective. And so to your point,
Speaker 3: if if someone never learned how to do these things
Speaker 3: when they're a kid, which I didn't, I wasn't I
Speaker 3: didn't learn these things. I wasn't taught these things. I
Speaker 3: didn't know how to do, uh, these kind of things. Well,
Speaker 3: but I've I've started to learn how to do them better.
Speaker 3: I now do it better, I feel. And it's we're
Speaker 3: trying to demonstrate over on the collective. And I know this,
Speaker 3: this is not a shameless plug. I had no intention
Speaker 3: of talking about the collective per se. But we're trying
Speaker 3: to demonstrate how to connect with humans on a deeper
Speaker 3: level now, how to communicate in a more effective way
Speaker 3: so that we can feel the love for each other
Speaker 3: to some degree. And if we weren't getting those connections
Speaker 3: in our childhood, we can get those as adults. But
Speaker 3: you've got to go find the right places to get
Speaker 3: these connections. And I'm not talking about connections on a
Speaker 3: shallow level. I'm talking on a much much deeper level
Speaker 3: where you allow that person to express themselves and then
Speaker 3: through that expression, you can dive deeper into those expressive moments.
Speaker 3: I feel that it's really powerful when you can connect
Speaker 3: with people who not only care, but it's a communal
Speaker 3: car ring. So one on one sort of situation can
Speaker 3: be powerful, but a group connection, I feel, is much
Speaker 3: more powerful. So again back over to the collective, we're
Speaker 3: really trying to connect on a deeper level as humans.
Speaker 3: It's a powerful thing.
Speaker 2: Absolutely. I think it's great that you bring that up, because, again, folks,
Speaker 2: I feel like the collective and I are connecting in
Speaker 2: different ways and it's really funny. So I have no problems,
Speaker 2: and you know before I've plugged other podcasts as well,
Speaker 2: but I think it's a great podcast because it generates
Speaker 2: conversations for me, it makes me seek out other individuals
Speaker 2: and maybe vice versa as well.
Speaker 3: For sure, we're really benefiting from hanging out with you.
Speaker 3: As I'd mentioned to you just before we went into
Speaker 3: this recording, I really appreciate the depth of knowledge that
Speaker 3: you bring on a technical level, but also you've spoken
Speaker 3: to so many people on so many subjects at a
Speaker 3: deeper level that you have an innate, deep wisdom within you.
Speaker 3: That is a multi factorial combination of all of your
Speaker 3: stories that you've listened to and all of the relaying
Speaker 3: of information to a variety of individuals. You need to
Speaker 3: listen and talk to so many people over the course
Speaker 3: of your life that to become better, and you have
Speaker 3: done that not only through your professional career, but in
Speaker 3: your own personal time through podcasting. To communicate better and
Speaker 3: to listen better, you have to do it more.
Speaker 2: So, thank you very much. You know what's one of
Speaker 2: the interesting things I always tell the students is that
Speaker 2: I've found out over the years that human behaviors everywhere
Speaker 2: and every discipline, that they look at it differently. And
Speaker 2: that's why I got it so involved in so many podcasts.
Speaker 2: Because there's behavioral economics that look at how we behave
Speaker 2: with money and that varies, and how we havethropology, sociology, criminology,
Speaker 2: and then this world's psychology and you have different levels
Speaker 2: of that, and it's sports psychology as well. There's just
Speaker 2: so many facets of understanding human be here. Even physics
Speaker 2: gets in the way. Everybody joins in the game, right, chemistry, physics, nutrition,
Speaker 2: everything plays. So for me, it's been a wonderful journey
Speaker 2: just to be able to talk to people and learn
Speaker 2: just like ourselves. The show is interesting because I get
Speaker 2: more of a almost like a qualitative study. I get
Speaker 2: a bunch of people that I can listen to, hear
Speaker 2: their stories and see how they're viewing the world. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's not a research study like a quantitative one. You're
Speaker 2: not getting a controlled study. But still I get to
Speaker 2: hear the anecdotes that are coming out. How's like Tanya,
Speaker 2: for instance, very insightful individual. I know she's doing something,
Speaker 2: she's up to something, she knows something out there, she's
Speaker 2: been doing research, and she's passionate about topics. Sev is
Speaker 2: another one we talked about before. He has a lot
Speaker 2: of insight too. So back to resilience. I've always liked
Speaker 2: the the simple ter definition of bouncing back, the ability
Speaker 2: to kind of bounce back from a situation. And I
Speaker 2: grew up. I'm a little younger than you. It looks
Speaker 2: better than I'm a little younger than you, but I
Speaker 2: remember listening to watching Actually, sorry, folks, I don't plugging
Speaker 2: my own, so hopefully the quality is better now.
Speaker 3: Sounds tight.
Speaker 2: You know, we don't do much with editing around here. Well,
Speaker 2: Rocky was one of my first experiences with resilience. Everybody's
Speaker 2: probably seen the movie or a lot most people at
Speaker 2: least listen to this podcast depending where you're from, but
Speaker 2: even other countries have caught up. Now I've watched a
Speaker 2: lot of them. But the ability of him to come
Speaker 2: back from Apollo Creed, the ability from the guy to
Speaker 2: come from nothing to go somewhere, and we've seen it
Speaker 2: constantly and the mma boxing, and that to me takes
Speaker 2: the special quality of an individual because there's a difference
Speaker 2: there between them and other individuals that are not champions.
Speaker 2: It's that ability to say, Okay, I got knocked out,
Speaker 2: but I got to get back up and I got
Speaker 2: to get to my goals somehow. However, that is I
Speaker 2: don't know, what do you think about that? Did you
Speaker 2: like Rocky?
Speaker 3: I did? I did, And as you mentioned that movie,
Speaker 3: I was already preliminary considering how I would best use
Speaker 3: an example. Rocky didn't come to mind. But it was
Speaker 3: a combination of No movie came to mind. It was
Speaker 3: just simply a combination of the observations that I've had
Speaker 3: throughout my life of other individuals, real humans on our planet,
Speaker 3: not actors. Even though the movie Rocky acts as a
Speaker 3: great representation of all the humans out there on the
Speaker 3: planet who are resilient. And I think the first thoughts
Speaker 3: that come to mind are breaking it down into the
Speaker 3: individual domains of are we talking physiologically resilient, mentally resilient,
Speaker 3: emotionally resilient? Or are we talking about all three? Is
Speaker 3: the perfect multi dimensional combination of resilience. It's a really
Speaker 3: interesting question. So which one would you like to speak
Speaker 3: about first?
Speaker 2: Actually, know what We're going to stop the green room folks,
Speaker 2: and we're going to bring in our guest. Fantastic welcome
Speaker 2: back everybody, were I guess is here Ryan Hendrickson. I
Speaker 2: mentioned him earlier. The book is called Tip of the Spear.
Speaker 2: Incredible Story, and I'm not kidding it. It really is the
Speaker 2: incredible story of an injured green Berets return to battle.
Speaker 2: This is the story that really defies the odds. You
Speaker 2: just don't hear what happened to him and he just
Speaker 2: goes back to battle. Amazing story. Nonetheless, you can learn
Speaker 2: more about him over at the Tip of the Spear
Speaker 2: the book, great book, and catch him also on Instagram. Actually,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna have to ask him his handle on Instagram
Speaker 2: because I don't have his hand on, but we'll get
Speaker 2: to that a minute. Also check out line landmine Removal
Speaker 2: dot org Landmine Removal dot org. You're probably wondering what
Speaker 2: that is. Well, we're going to talk about that a
Speaker 2: little bit later on in the show. Let's not wasting
Speaker 2: any more time and welcome to the show, Ryan Henderson.
Speaker 2: Welcome back, Ryan.
Speaker 4: Hey, I appreciate you guys having me back on.
Speaker 2: Definitely, thank you very much for what you're doing as
Speaker 2: well in the Ukraine. I mean that's extremely honorable. Maybe
Speaker 2: we'll start off with that. Tell us a little bit
Speaker 2: about landmine removal dot org because that's right now. You've
Speaker 2: been doing this for what is it almost a year.
Speaker 4: Over here.
Speaker 5: Yeah, we So I started going over to Ukraine last March.
Speaker 5: The mission there was to evacuate civilians out of areas
Speaker 5: that the Russians were moving into. As the Russians started
Speaker 5: to move east, civilians started going back to their homes
Speaker 5: and hitting uh land mines, booby traps, explosive devices and
Speaker 5: stuff like that. So yeah, as you know, as as
Speaker 5: civilians started to come back to kind of survey the
Speaker 5: damage she was left of their livelihoods, they're they're getting
Speaker 5: you know, they're getting hit and from what we call
Speaker 5: the leave behinds or the you know, just the the
Speaker 5: land mines and all that other stuff that the Russians
Speaker 5: put out there to slow the Ukrainian forces down. It's it's,
Speaker 5: you know, pretty pretty typical where hey, we're we're we're
Speaker 5: moving east.
Speaker 4: Now we're gonna mine everything in our path.
Speaker 5: To slow down the the the counter offensive or whatever,
Speaker 5: you know, whatever you want to call it, the pursuit,
Speaker 5: I guess for lack of better words. And but in
Speaker 5: the end it's you know, civilians get caught up in
Speaker 5: that too, and so there was a lot of casualties
Speaker 5: being taken. And that's when you know, I I decided
Speaker 5: I was going to try and help out as much
Speaker 5: as I could their last April in May. And you know,
Speaker 5: just from my background as a eighteen Charlie Special Forces engineer,
Speaker 5: I've definitely found my fair share of IDs and minds
Speaker 5: in Afghanistan. So I decided, you know, just for first
Speaker 5: first thing I was going to do was was awareness
Speaker 5: for the children. Don't grab this, don't touch this if
Speaker 5: you see this, report this stuff like that. Trying to
Speaker 5: keep these kids safe because you know, PFM one butterfly
Speaker 5: mine looks looks like a fun toy to play with,
Speaker 5: and then that's then that's it for your your hand
Speaker 5: or your arm or whatever. So started off as awareness
Speaker 5: and then training. A lot of the Ukrainian forces were
Speaker 5: not really sure how to use handheld detectors, sweeping techniques,
Speaker 5: clearance techniques, stuff like that. So I kind of moved
Speaker 5: into that when I had time, because I was also
Speaker 5: simultaneously working with a missionary group bringing food and medical
Speaker 5: aid out to areas that the Russians have just left,
Speaker 5: and so we were we would go in and try
Speaker 5: and help them out the best that we could. So
Speaker 5: and then from there it turned into okay, yeah, I
Speaker 5: can I can train these guys advise them in a system.
Speaker 5: So I went home in middle of May, and then
Speaker 5: I came back in August and I linked up with
Speaker 5: the group and we started doing we started doing battle
Speaker 5: area clearance in farm fields so the farmers could you know,
Speaker 5: get back out there, start cutting harvests and stuff like that.
Speaker 5: It and so basically, you know, I did what Green
Speaker 5: Bereys do best, trained up a group of Ukrainians and
Speaker 5: then advised them on the minefield and assisted them on
Speaker 5: the minefield. And then all the equipment that I brought over,
Speaker 5: I donated it all over to them. And you know
Speaker 5: that that was when I realized like, yeah, I can
Speaker 5: I can actually do this. I could do the trained
Speaker 5: advice assists bring over detectors, remote pole equipment, safety equipment,
Speaker 5: medical equipment.
Speaker 4: I can. I can bring all this over. I can
Speaker 4: train these guys up on it.
Speaker 5: I can go and d mine with them, which is
Speaker 5: my way of vetting the unit, making sure that they
Speaker 5: are going to actually use the equipment for humanitarian d mining.
Speaker 5: And then I donated over to them. That gets me
Speaker 5: out in the minefield. I get to have some fun too,
Speaker 5: and we and we're we're pulling land mines and and
Speaker 5: you know, we're we're making areas safe for the the
Speaker 5: civilians so they don't have to worry about their next
Speaker 5: step or you know that that tractor he doesn't have
Speaker 5: to worry about, you know, rolling over that mine and
Speaker 5: and stuff like that. So that turned into the five
Speaker 5: oh one C three tip of the Spirit landmine removal.
Speaker 5: And yeah, I went back again November December to uh
Speaker 5: here Sun region and then April to July. All Right,
Speaker 5: I'm sorry April to.
Speaker 4: Late June.
Speaker 5: I got home, like think the twenty eighth of June,
Speaker 5: twenty ninth of June, but and all that was up
Speaker 5: in Harkiev region and just landmine removal doing a doing
Speaker 5: some some good work, helping some people out, donating some equipment,
Speaker 5: and and yeah, having some fun.
Speaker 2: So remind everybody against landmine Removal dot org. I think
Speaker 2: you're down playing how important the work is that you're doing.
Speaker 2: I mean, to me, it's inportally amazing that I haven't
Speaker 2: seen anything I don't think on any of mean major
Speaker 2: news network is about these landmines being left behind and
Speaker 2: innocent children and people just being victims to this is
Speaker 2: incredible to me. They talk about a lot of other stuff,
Speaker 2: but this is another one that should have been highlighted too.
Speaker 2: I guess my first question before I hand it over
Speaker 2: to Sean is well, you and I have, first of all,
Speaker 2: have different definitions of fun. I was gonna have some
Speaker 2: fun to get out there. It's like, all right, right,
Speaker 2: but what motivated you really? What was the impact that
Speaker 2: had was it all your years as a Green Ray?
Speaker 2: What was it that said I got to get out
Speaker 2: here and help these people.
Speaker 5: So the number one motivator for me was the fact
Speaker 5: that I've stepped on I stepped on an ied in Afghanistan,
Speaker 5: and I know the pain and I know the life
Speaker 5: changing circumstances that come comes as after a fairly traumatic
Speaker 5: incident like that or or situation, I guess you would say.
Speaker 5: And so as i'm you know, as I'm seeing and
Speaker 5: I'm I'm hearing reports and civilians, mainly, you know, children,
Speaker 5: whether it's Afghanistan or Iraq or Ukraine. But that's you know,
Speaker 5: children don't need to go through that. I mean, nobody,
Speaker 5: nobody needs to, but especially children.
Speaker 2: They don't.
Speaker 4: They don't need to have their lives, you know, basically.
Speaker 5: Destroyed or changed, catastrophically changed through through a landmine. I
Speaker 5: think destroys the wrong word, because you could, you could,
Speaker 5: you know, be, you can make your you you could
Speaker 5: do a lot of great things in life, regardless of
Speaker 5: the situation, injury or circumstance that you're under. So destroyed
Speaker 5: was the wrong word. But a catastrophic injury like that,
Speaker 5: it changes your life. And especially when you're just a
Speaker 5: kid and you're kind of you just want to go
Speaker 5: out there and play and be a kid in this
Speaker 5: warm you know, in this war torn country and and
Speaker 5: you know, you have I mean, there's there's just tons
Speaker 5: and tons and tons of instances of kids stepping on
Speaker 5: anti personnel minds, picking up those PFM one butterfly minds,
Speaker 5: and there's not a lot of reporting about it because
Speaker 5: it's it is it's the ugly part of war and
Speaker 5: and people don't have the stomach for it. People don't
Speaker 5: you know, the it's just it's heartbreaking, especially when it
Speaker 5: comes to the children. But yeah, that was that was
Speaker 5: my drive to get over there and do what I
Speaker 5: was doing. Was because I mean, it goes back to
Speaker 5: September twelfth, twenty ten, when I stepped on my you know,
Speaker 5: ID and it changed my life forever. And I know
Speaker 5: that I could have I could have I could have
Speaker 5: become a I could have became a victim of it,
Speaker 5: and you know, you know, let that IED become you know,
Speaker 5: who I was, and and and you know be you know,
Speaker 5: and and let that I ed you know, my I
Speaker 5: never you know, I could have been victimized and never
Speaker 5: left September twelve, twenty ten. I could have you know
Speaker 5: that that could have been me for the rest of
Speaker 5: my life. But and I headed down that path for
Speaker 5: a while. But I chose. I chose to use that
Speaker 5: situation and in those dark times that I went through
Speaker 5: and the mental struggles that I went through, I chose
Speaker 5: to use all that to to make myself stronger, but
Speaker 5: not for myself, but to but to help other people.
Speaker 5: And and as I continued to help other people, it
Speaker 5: gave me more strength and and and and that purpose,
Speaker 5: that purpose that I needed as as a veteran that
Speaker 5: worked at you know, a certain level.
Speaker 4: And then I got out and it's like, who is
Speaker 4: Ryan Henderson? What? What?
Speaker 5: What is my purpose? What am I supposed to do?
Speaker 5: I I don't even know who I am right now?
Speaker 5: And I found it in Ukraine and it was it
Speaker 5: was it was helping people. So yeah, that it all
Speaker 5: just kind of came together for me. And yeah, it's
Speaker 5: that it's that higher purpose of helping other people with
Speaker 5: a little bit of danger, a little bit of excitement,
Speaker 5: and and yeah, it's that's that was the ticket for me.
Speaker 5: So and you're helping people, especially kids.
Speaker 2: I can see. It was definitely personal, Sean, I guess
Speaker 2: is a good segue to you.
Speaker 3: Well, Holy moly, I think that what Ryan just dropped
Speaker 3: there is so legit. I've heard it in a variety
Speaker 3: of different ways from a variety of different veterans that
Speaker 3: I've spoken to, But it's almost categorically picture perfect stated.
Speaker 3: And I mean, I'd love to ask questions and I'd
Speaker 3: love to add more, but I mean, that was such
Speaker 3: a freaking mic drop. I'm not even sure where to
Speaker 3: go with it.
Speaker 2: No, I get it. You covered a lot of territory
Speaker 2: in our.
Speaker 3: There's no questions go forward, No, No, not at all.
Speaker 3: I I I, well, I suppose I do have one
Speaker 3: if I if I'm going to add some nuance to it. Ryan,
Speaker 3: Now that you have formulated what works best for you
Speaker 3: and you're you're demonstrating the resilience and the results that
Speaker 3: that are making you happy, how best are you? Have
Speaker 3: you started to engage with other veterans in a way
Speaker 3: to expand that awareness or to demonstrate your path is
Speaker 3: a good path and have other veterans pick up on
Speaker 3: our traction, up on that uh that path forward?
Speaker 4: Yeah, all the time.
Speaker 5: I mean mental mental health is huge with me, especially
Speaker 5: the crisis we have going on in the United States, England, Canada,
Speaker 5: Australia mental health in the way that I'm not I'm
Speaker 5: not going to go into how we left Afghanistan, but
Speaker 5: it does segue into a lot of the mental health
Speaker 5: crisis we have going on right now. I do I
Speaker 5: talk to veterans and and and first responders whoever's going
Speaker 5: to listen. I do talk about having that purpose and
Speaker 5: but the biggest thing is there there's a lot of
Speaker 5: tough love that goes with with with taking charge your
Speaker 5: mental health. And that tough love is nobody owes you shit,
Speaker 5: and and and so and what veterans have a you
Speaker 5: know what what they have in let me let me
Speaker 5: see all I say. One of the issues that I
Speaker 5: see veterans haveing right now is a sense of entitlement
Speaker 5: because of there because of the you know, their service
Speaker 5: to this country.
Speaker 4: And so you'll be and you'll hear it.
Speaker 5: You you know, I served the country, I protected your freedoms,
Speaker 5: your way of life, you know, filling all filling all
Speaker 5: the blanks that you want. So what happens now is
Speaker 5: veterans become you know, and I'm not saying all veterans,
Speaker 5: but I see this trend in the veteran community is
Speaker 5: that there is this sense of there's this sense of
Speaker 5: entitlement that turns into a victimization. And that victimization is
Speaker 5: when your titlement, when your entitlement void. You know that
Speaker 5: that hole in you that can't be filled by anybody
Speaker 5: but yourself, But it's this entitlement void. When you can't
Speaker 5: get that filled, there's no thank you for your service
Speaker 5: at Applebee's that's.
Speaker 4: Ever going to fill that void.
Speaker 5: When when you can't get that void filled, you become
Speaker 5: a victim of it. Nobody understands me, nobody respects what
Speaker 5: I did. They don't know what I've done for them,
Speaker 5: And then you become a victim of this entitlement. And
Speaker 5: it's not just veterans. The United States is full of victims.
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, watch the news. But you become a
Speaker 5: victim of your perceived entitlement, of what you think you
Speaker 5: did for everybody around you, or the level that you
Speaker 5: operated at.
Speaker 4: You have no idea what I've done. Well, of course
Speaker 4: they don't.
Speaker 5: They weren't there, and even if they were there, they
Speaker 5: weren'tn't you, So then you become a victim of it
Speaker 5: at And as you become a victim of it, you
Speaker 5: start to push people away, and people will try and
Speaker 5: Russian to help you, and you'll push people away, push
Speaker 5: people away, push people away until you're all alone. And
Speaker 5: then that's when that's when veterans are making really really
Speaker 5: bad decisions and because they're trying to fill that entitlement
Speaker 5: void in their life with that quick fix, and that's
Speaker 5: usually alcohol, drugs, or something else. So that's what I
Speaker 5: talk to you know people about it is you you
Speaker 5: have to take control. There's a lot of help out there,
Speaker 5: but nobody is going to hold your hands all the
Speaker 5: way through the process.
Speaker 4: You have to take control of your own life.
Speaker 5: And the best way to take control over your life
Speaker 5: is to find that higher purpose.
Speaker 4: Who are you? What can I do? And usually in
Speaker 4: my experience.
Speaker 5: There is not a lot of fulfilled people out there
Speaker 5: that have just focused on me. It's usually people that
Speaker 5: understand the we over me. And once you understand that,
Speaker 5: you know, helping other people and and and and making
Speaker 5: yourself vulnerable, not being afraid to fail, try new things
Speaker 5: and get out there and find what your purpose is,
Speaker 5: that's when you start to heal your life. And that's
Speaker 5: when you start to you know, you start to fill
Speaker 5: that entitlement void. And I mean to me, people say,
Speaker 5: is there a cure? For PTS, and I say, yeah,
Speaker 5: there is find a purpose that's bigger than yourself and
Speaker 5: go and help people.
Speaker 4: That's the cure.
Speaker 5: But no I do I I reach you know if if,
Speaker 5: if someone wants to.
Speaker 4: Listen, I could talk to him about it.
Speaker 5: But a lot of the times it's you know, it's
Speaker 5: what are you doing to help yourself? You know, I
Speaker 5: I got it here calling me all the time with
Speaker 5: this issue, this issue, this issue. What are you doing
Speaker 5: to take care of yourself? No one's going to do
Speaker 5: it for you because guess what, as much as you
Speaker 5: think you're owed something, you're not old shit.
Speaker 4: It's just the facts of the matter, nobody the.
Speaker 3: Facts of the matter. And you're like a younger, smarter
Speaker 3: version of me, I think, because what you just said
Speaker 3: is what I say all the time. You crystallized it
Speaker 3: so well. So thanks for that. Now I understand the
Speaker 3: main theme of how to get someone moving generally tends
Speaker 3: to be you've got to give some tough love. And
Speaker 3: if they're not willing to do it for themselves, and
Speaker 3: if they do genuinely want help it, it's usually a
Speaker 3: bit of a rocky road. They have to be prepared
Speaker 3: to get some tough love. So have you found an
Speaker 3: effective way to Obviously, you calibrate yourself to the individual.
Speaker 3: You don't go in with a chain mail fist and
Speaker 3: punch everyone straight in the face even if you don't
Speaker 3: know them. So obviously you move your tough love around
Speaker 3: a little bit. But have you found a I don't
Speaker 3: want to say the most effective way, but a more
Speaker 3: effective way that will hit the general population?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Through my actions?
Speaker 2: Beautiful?
Speaker 4: Oh man?
Speaker 3: Okay, I could just leave what is even going on
Speaker 3: here right now? You're reading in my mind?
Speaker 1: Or what?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 5: People, you know, I mean, if you want to, if
Speaker 5: you want to, I guess see why I say the
Speaker 5: things that I do and why I guess you can say,
Speaker 5: preach the way I do. Look at it through my actions,
Speaker 5: look at it through my past. I mean, there was
Speaker 5: a time in my life that I definitely could have
Speaker 5: been one of the twenty two a day easily because
Speaker 5: I didn't take control over my own life. Everybody else
Speaker 5: owed me something except for me. Why, because look at
Speaker 5: what I did for you? Look at all this. You
Speaker 5: know I was a green beray blah blah blah blah blah,
Speaker 5: and the list goes on. I didn't take responsibility of myself.
Speaker 5: I thought I was owed something until I finally got
Speaker 5: to such a low place in my life that it's like,
Speaker 5: if I don't change, I'm not going to make it.
Speaker 5: So it's not like i'm pret because I'm holier than thou.
Speaker 4: I'm not at all.
Speaker 5: I've been there, and it's not like I got this
Speaker 5: revelation and I wake up every day and every every
Speaker 5: day is fucking great.
Speaker 4: It's not.
Speaker 5: I continue to fall on my face and I continue
Speaker 5: to fall into self induced pitfalls, and I have pity
Speaker 5: parties and then I drag myself out of them.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's life.
Speaker 5: Life is hard, and life could be ugly, and life
Speaker 5: beats you down and it doesn't really it doesn't matter
Speaker 5: all the great things you've done, and it doesn't matter
Speaker 5: how many people you've helped.
Speaker 4: None of that matters.
Speaker 5: Life is still going to hit you with right hooks
Speaker 5: all the time because it's life. And once you understand that,
Speaker 5: and once you understand you're not owed anything, and once
Speaker 5: you understand that helping people it is it is extremely therapeutic.
Speaker 5: Then life starts to make sense and it becomes a
Speaker 5: little bit easier and a little bit easier, and then
Speaker 5: the next time you fall flat on your face, it's
Speaker 5: a little bit easier to get up.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I agree, that's me. That's that's slightly how I run
Speaker 3: my life. That's precisely how I try to explain it
Speaker 3: to people. There is no there is no easy path,
Speaker 3: and if you're on the easy path, you're on the
Speaker 3: wrong path. And so life can be hard, and engaging
Speaker 3: in that hard path is the only way to move
Speaker 3: forward in a positive manner. Man I was in phases
Speaker 3: of my life as well, where as you've described some
Speaker 3: pretty low lows. And in order to look out and
Speaker 3: see a brighter sun, you're more colorful world. It takes work,
Speaker 3: and so obviously in order to explain that to someone
Speaker 3: or line it out for someone, you've got to have
Speaker 3: been there. You can't do it from a book. You've
Speaker 3: got to do it from worldly experience, which obviously you have.
Speaker 3: So when someone pushes back against your not your message
Speaker 3: but your wisdom, do you just shrug your shoulders and
Speaker 3: walk away, or do you do you take a different
Speaker 3: tact or how do you face those kind of moments.
Speaker 4: I'll be here when you I'll be here when you're ready,
Speaker 4: all right, Nice you know right, I'll be here when
Speaker 4: you're ready.
Speaker 5: But there people need to understand there there is something
Speaker 5: extremely therapeutic about understanding we over me.
Speaker 4: There is not a lot of mes that are happy
Speaker 4: in this.
Speaker 5: Life, even regardless of how successful they are, regardless if
Speaker 5: they think they're at the top looking down and they're
Speaker 5: looking down on all these people that they think are
Speaker 5: less than them, and they are happy and content and
Speaker 5: fulfilled because they believe in the we over me. But no,
Speaker 5: you can't force anything on a person. The minute you
Speaker 5: become so invested into that person's misery, you're gonna you're
Speaker 5: gonna get drugged down yourself.
Speaker 4: You when you.
Speaker 5: When you're when you're dealing with people and the mental health.
Speaker 5: The best thing that you can do, besides being understanding
Speaker 5: and having that tough love, you do have to take
Speaker 5: charge of your own life. No one's going to take
Speaker 5: charge of it for you. But the best thing that
Speaker 5: you can do is to make sure that you remain
Speaker 5: mentally healthy and happy or else, because you can't help
Speaker 5: anybody out. Regardless of the great speeches you give on
Speaker 5: you know, on whatever podcast it is, You're not helping
Speaker 5: anybody out if you're miserable.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree, mm hmm.
Speaker 4: So I I I can't. I don't entertain it as
Speaker 4: just say, man, I'm you know, I'm here when you
Speaker 4: need me. I'm here when you need me.
Speaker 3: That's a great.
Speaker 4: Because you got to stay mentally healthy yourself. You have to, Yeah,
Speaker 4: in order.
Speaker 3: To fight the fight, You've got to be prepared to
Speaker 3: fight the good fight. And the only way to do
Speaker 3: that is be good for yourself first before we can
Speaker 3: go out and help others. But I it's a it's
Speaker 3: a tricky balance and you're you're it is powerful to
Speaker 3: be part of the Wii. It's it is powerful to
Speaker 3: be part of a big team and want more for
Speaker 3: the big team. But at the same time, you've got
Speaker 3: to look after yourself. I'm not talking to you specifically,
Speaker 3: I'm speaking to anyone who's listening. You need to look
Speaker 3: after yourself to be strong for the Wei and finding
Speaker 3: that right balance is a little different for everyone, would
Speaker 3: you think.
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, no, absolutely.
Speaker 5: But the biggest thing people need to understand about taking
Speaker 5: control over their life is it is extremely easy to
Speaker 5: be a victim. Victimization is one of the easiest things
Speaker 5: to do. It's everybody else's fault by yours. This is
Speaker 5: the reason why I am the way I am. It
Speaker 5: is because of you, guys. Being a victim is simple.
Speaker 5: You have to understand that because taking control of your
Speaker 5: life is hard. It is very hard to be To
Speaker 5: take control over your life and to actually own it,
Speaker 5: own your decisions, own your mindset, own it and actively
Speaker 5: try to help yourself. That's extremely difficult. What's really easy
Speaker 5: is becoming a victim. That's why we have so many
Speaker 5: victims in America today. It's simple.
Speaker 3: Well, it's the same up here in Canada. And funnily enough,
Speaker 3: I'm up at a drop zone right now. I'm about
Speaker 3: nearly a thousand kilometers away from my hometown. I'm out
Speaker 3: here with my son, and the drop zone that I'm
Speaker 3: at is it's a gathering for this whole week of veterans.
Speaker 3: And last night there was a mental health talk by
Speaker 3: a mental health professional, we'll call it. And as he
Speaker 3: was describing, and I fully agree, the biggest problem out
Speaker 3: there is a lot of veterans are really angry at
Speaker 3: everything else but themselves. They're eager to point the finger
Speaker 3: at the guy down the street, the guy on the TV,
Speaker 3: the guy on the commercial, the guy at the car wash.
Speaker 3: It doesn't much matter. It's everyone else's fault. They're angry
Speaker 3: with everyone not giving them the respect, not giving them
Speaker 3: the nod, and not giving them the free coffee, whatever
Speaker 3: it is. They don't feel like the world is giving
Speaker 3: them what they deserve, when it's quite the opposite. You
Speaker 3: deserve nothing. What you deserve to do is give more
Speaker 3: of yourself for the team. And the moment that you
Speaker 3: can shift the anger away from the world and shift
Speaker 3: the focus into your own internal world, that's the moment
Speaker 3: that you can start to get a little bit better.
Speaker 3: Stop laying the blame elsewhere, start looking at your own
Speaker 3: feet and lay the blame right there. You don't have
Speaker 3: to be really tough on yourself, but it is tough
Speaker 3: love over a period of time. I think that the
Speaker 3: responsibility that we all have is to own up to
Speaker 3: our own nonsense, get right with the program, and then
Speaker 3: start delivering more good out into the world for the team.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 5: Entitlement is very, very dangerous. It is very dangerous road
Speaker 5: to go on. It is very once you become so entitled,
Speaker 5: is very hard to undo it.
Speaker 3: Trust me, true, it is true. And by the way,
Speaker 3: one way to improve in that area. One way to
Speaker 3: modify that that habit or limitation or mistake is just
Speaker 3: to hang out with cool people. Go find cool people
Speaker 3: who look not who fake happy but are putting out
Speaker 3: good into the world. I don't take much interest in
Speaker 3: people who are happy in their own tiny little lives.
Speaker 3: I take interest in people who are happy by being
Speaker 3: a big part of other people's lives, like yourself, as
Speaker 3: you've just described, and over the last twenty four hours
Speaker 3: of me learning more about you, that's what I see.
Speaker 3: One of the more recent videos that you put up,
Speaker 3: I believe there was a bunch of line land mines
Speaker 3: in the back of your vehicle as you were moving around,
Speaker 3: and I just thought, like, you know, who drives around
Speaker 3: with a pile of land mines, whether they're inert or not.
Speaker 3: Who does that. That's a guy who's in the game
Speaker 3: of working for the team. He ain't in the hobby
Speaker 3: of transporting land minds. He's in the hobby of doing
Speaker 3: better for the world. And that is the distinction between
Speaker 3: the victim mentality. You're either in it for yourself or
Speaker 3: you're in it for the team.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: No, that was a crazy day, and I'm really glad
Speaker 5: we found them all on that route because.
Speaker 4: We drove it.
Speaker 2: So by the way, folks, again, it's Landmine Removal dot Org.
Speaker 2: Landmine Removal dot Org. The name of the book is
Speaker 2: Tip of the Spear, the incredible story of an injured
Speaker 2: Green Beret return to battle. I get the funny feeling, folks.
Speaker 2: We probably have another book in the making here sooner
Speaker 2: or later in the upcoming years. Right, Ryan, you get
Speaker 2: the funny feeling.
Speaker 4: I don't know. It's the first book was hard enough, so.
Speaker 2: You know. I have a couple of questions for you.
Speaker 2: You got a great conversation. It made me think between
Speaker 2: you and Sean, I guess the first one is this
Speaker 2: time of the question. It's a statement you mentioned earlier.
Speaker 2: Both of you have mentioned you have to take care
Speaker 2: of yourself if we can help others. This is actually
Speaker 2: something we always tell a therapists before you work with
Speaker 2: somebody with trauma, and you have to be able to
Speaker 2: deal with it. Somebody having resolved their own trauma and
Speaker 2: then they go and work with somebody but they can't
Speaker 2: deal with it. So if they've been abused or something
Speaker 2: of that sort and they work with somebody else who
Speaker 2: has doesn't work well. It overwhelms the therapists and then
Speaker 2: nobody's benefiting out of that. So that was interesting to
Speaker 2: see that comparison. But I guess the other question I
Speaker 2: have for you, I have two questions. I'm trying to
Speaker 2: figure out how to organize this, but let me start
Speaker 2: off with this one. That discovery that you had what
Speaker 2: you needed to do. Nobody owes you anything, did you
Speaker 2: have it as a Green Beret? Did they instill it
Speaker 2: in you as a Green Beret? And did you lose
Speaker 2: it temporarily and then it came back. I'm trying to
Speaker 2: figure out the origin of that now.
Speaker 5: The origin the origin of that came in the hospital
Speaker 5: after I got blown up, and and it was it was,
Speaker 5: you know, I was going through a really dark time
Speaker 5: and it was my dad that actually had talked to
Speaker 5: me about it, and it basically he said, hey, you know,
Speaker 5: we got to have a talk because you're you're going
Speaker 5: to a really dark place right now. And he said,
Speaker 5: you know, the injury that happened to you, let's face it. Yeah,
Speaker 5: I mean it was bad, but it's not the worst
Speaker 5: injury that that's ever happened, and it won't be the
Speaker 5: last one. Plenty of guys have gotten hurt, and there
Speaker 5: nothing makes you special about it, he said. But you
Speaker 5: have two choices right now, he said. You can you
Speaker 5: can become a victim of this injury. You can let
Speaker 5: this injury run your life. You can be you. You
Speaker 5: will always be stuck September twelfth, twenty ten. You'll never
Speaker 5: move on from that day, and you'll push people away,
Speaker 5: and you'll and you'll go into you know, the depression
Speaker 5: in these dark places because you'll be entitled and victimized
Speaker 5: by your injury. Because you want to force people to
Speaker 5: know what you've been through and what you sacrifice for them,
Speaker 5: and they can't. They can't even you know, someone can
Speaker 5: tell you, you know, thank you so much for everything you've
Speaker 5: sacrificed for me until they're blue in the face. But
Speaker 5: you can never feel entitlement. It's impossible. And he said,
Speaker 5: So as you continue down that road, you're going to
Speaker 5: continue pushing people away, and and you're gonna segreate. You know,
Speaker 5: you're going to segregate yourself and next thing you know,
Speaker 5: there's going to come a time when you're all alone.
Speaker 5: You're at a very very dark place in your in
Speaker 5: your mind and in your life, and you're probably going
Speaker 5: to end it, because that's what happens when people go
Speaker 5: down the route you are, and it starts off with
Speaker 5: what you're doing right now. You're being an entitled victim.
Speaker 5: Nobody owes you anything, all right, So you got you
Speaker 5: got blown up in Afghanistan. Congratulations. A lot of people
Speaker 5: get hurt all the time. Why do you know, Why
Speaker 5: do you think you're owed something? You think you're the
Speaker 5: only person that's ever gotten hurt. It's like, that's that's
Speaker 5: pretty selfish, and you need to get over yourself. He said,
Speaker 5: what I recommend is you have another path. The road
Speaker 5: is forked right now. And he said, the other path
Speaker 5: you can take is you can use this injury to
Speaker 5: make yourself stronger. You can use this injury to you know,
Speaker 5: renew your relationship with God. You can use this injury,
Speaker 5: you know all those things when you were you were
Speaker 5: laying on the ground there by the helme and river,
Speaker 5: thinking you were going to die and wishing you didn't
Speaker 5: do this, this or this. He's like, you got the
Speaker 5: You got the the reset button. Most men in life
Speaker 5: will never get to reset and go back and and
Speaker 5: and change their ways.
Speaker 4: You got it.
Speaker 5: You were you should be dead you're not. You got
Speaker 5: the reset button. All those things, those regrets that you had,
Speaker 5: you can change all that. You can make yourself stronger.
Speaker 5: And he said, but don't do it for you. Make
Speaker 5: yourself stronger to help other people. You have that you're
Speaker 5: you're at that fork in the road. I know we
Speaker 5: were going to get here. You're there, but it's up
Speaker 5: to you which direction you want to go. I highly
Speaker 5: warn you against taking the entitled victimized route because you're
Speaker 5: not going to make it through it. You're not strong
Speaker 5: enough mentally to live to be an old man. So
Speaker 5: that conversation there just you know, and again it's it's
Speaker 5: not like my entire life change, And I mean, it's life.
Speaker 5: You're you're constantly battling. But that's what kind of got
Speaker 5: me started on the path of you know, taking my
Speaker 5: life back and understanding that you know, you're not out anything,
Speaker 5: and yeah, I can.
Speaker 4: Okay, So you got hurt.
Speaker 5: That's life, man, Lots lots of people get hurt and
Speaker 5: banged up in life. Lots of people go through some
Speaker 5: really really bad times. It's life. Get over yourself. You're
Speaker 5: not any more important than anybody else out there, So
Speaker 5: quit thinking you are. Quit thinking people owe you something
Speaker 5: and so that that was.
Speaker 4: What kind of you know.
Speaker 5: I didn't realize that I had an entitled, victimize you know,
Speaker 5: type of mindset until I went through that really dark
Speaker 5: time after getting injured.
Speaker 4: That's when I.
Speaker 5: Realized like, oh, I've got some I've got some major
Speaker 5: holes in my life. I need to I need to
Speaker 5: patch up here. And it took an injury for me
Speaker 5: to actually see that. And a lot of people, you know,
Speaker 5: they may not understand this when I say it, but
Speaker 5: stepping on that ied probably saved my life because I
Speaker 5: was forced to. I was forced to take care of
Speaker 5: myself mentally when I never had the chance to do
Speaker 5: it before because I was so busy with being a
Speaker 5: Green Beret in life that I never really focused on
Speaker 5: who I was. And again, it wasn't an overnight thing.
Speaker 5: I mean, hell, it's thirteen years later and I'm sitting
Speaker 5: back and I'm still learning lessons like oh wow, yeah
Speaker 5: that makes sense now, got it? Or you know, I
Speaker 5: need to adjust fire here or tighten up my shot
Speaker 5: group there. But that's the amazing thing about life is
Speaker 5: we're constantly learning. It's not borring if you don't let
Speaker 5: it be.
Speaker 3: I agree do you mind if I ask a question dot? Thanks?
Speaker 3: So what your dad gave you as advice was freaking amazing.
Speaker 3: Now can you put someone else in that position? Not
Speaker 3: your dad? Was it only your dad that could have
Speaker 3: said that for you to in that moment get some
Speaker 3: traction on it. What if it would have been a
Speaker 3: random guy down the street or or in a hospital,
Speaker 3: if someone would have sauntered down and walked into the
Speaker 3: wrong room and they didn't know you and they saw
Speaker 3: that you were struggling a bit. What if someone else
Speaker 3: would have delivered that message that you weren't too familiar with.
Speaker 5: It wouldn't have been It wouldn't have been the same
Speaker 5: as coming from my dad, because I know, you know,
Speaker 5: I know my dad's passed, and I know that you
Speaker 5: know he's been through some through some very very tough
Speaker 5: times in his life and he and he never.
Speaker 4: Took the victim role of it. So it is. It
Speaker 4: is one of those conversations that you have to.
Speaker 5: Be you have to be very careful with how you
Speaker 5: deliver it because you you can definitely come off hostile.
Speaker 5: But no, with all the medication I was on and
Speaker 5: the narcotics I was on, no that that came at
Speaker 5: a perfect timing from the only person that it probably
Speaker 5: would have got through to me.
Speaker 2: How sure that that's incredible stuff? Well that's a good segue,
Speaker 2: I guess once again Landmine Removal dot Org. The name
Speaker 2: of the book is Tip of the Spear, The Incredible
Speaker 2: Story But injured Green Beret return to battle. I know
Speaker 2: we're heading towards the tail end here. We got about
Speaker 2: another ten or fifteen minutes. I think, are you good
Speaker 2: on Seien's chill?
Speaker 3: Sean, yeah, I've got about another fifteen minutes myself.
Speaker 2: You two right, You're good? Okay. You mentioned empowerment. I
Speaker 2: thought this was a very interesting because you said working
Speaker 2: or living not for me, but living for we empower
Speaker 2: as individuals. And how did that How would you describe
Speaker 2: the empowering for you? What did you feel like when
Speaker 2: you did you feel like you could do more things?
Speaker 2: Did you feel more liberated? What did empowering feel for you?
Speaker 5: So, when I realized that it wasn't about me, the
Speaker 5: world and people have heard this a million times, but
Speaker 5: it's different.
Speaker 4: There's a difference between hearing and listening.
Speaker 5: But when when I finally was able to to understand
Speaker 5: the saying that we've all heard the world doesn't revolve
Speaker 5: around you. When I finally understood that, and when I
Speaker 5: finally understood the fact that you're only a part of this,
Speaker 5: you are not the whole thing, and and it and
Speaker 5: it is it rolls back to that entitlement. A lot
Speaker 5: of entitled people think that the world revolves around them
Speaker 5: or they're owed something because of filling all the blanks
Speaker 5: that you want to when you're when you realize that
Speaker 5: you're only a piece of the puzzle or you're a
Speaker 5: part of something, and you are stronger when it's we,
Speaker 5: then it's me. That's that's again, that's when life starts
Speaker 5: to become just the just a little bit easier.
Speaker 4: I mean, it's still hard, but.
Speaker 5: When you can when you don't have to take that
Speaker 5: burden on alone, when they're when when when you understand
Speaker 5: we and that tribe mentality, yeah, life, life becomes a
Speaker 5: lot simpler and we and that and and and that
Speaker 5: that tribe mentality, that understanding with you understanding that you're
Speaker 5: also helping other people too, because it is it's it's
Speaker 5: it's a we.
Speaker 4: It's a we over me. And I know and I
Speaker 4: know in the teams we over me.
Speaker 5: Is it. I mean, it's critical. Especially in combat. There's
Speaker 5: not a lot. There's not a lot of me's running
Speaker 5: around special operations. I mean there's there's some, but there's
Speaker 5: not a lot because we's don't I mean, we's is
Speaker 5: how you know, the WEI mentality is how you're going
Speaker 5: to survive. There's I don't know, it's just yeah, we
Speaker 5: over me is yeah, it's.
Speaker 4: It's simple to say, but it definitely is. It's it's it's.
Speaker 5: And there's also there's also a there's also a vulnerability
Speaker 5: that you have to accept. A lot of people they
Speaker 5: think that being vulnerable is a negative thing, Being vulnerable
Speaker 5: is dangerous. But there's strength through vulnerability, and you can't
Speaker 5: take chances and you can't take risks healthy healthy risks.
Speaker 5: I'm not I'm not saying, you know, go running through
Speaker 5: a through an anti personnel minefield to see what happens,
Speaker 5: but you know you're you're not going to test the
Speaker 5: limits of your life and really be able to help
Speaker 5: other people if you don't understand strength through vulnerability. So
Speaker 5: and and it is, and part of part of that
Speaker 5: is also opening yourself up. Another part of we over
Speaker 5: Me is is you have to be emotionally available for
Speaker 5: for people, No one's gonna know there's there's not a
Speaker 5: lot of people that are going to trust somebody that
Speaker 5: is just telling you something straight out of a book,
Speaker 5: whether it's mental health or self help or anything like that,
Speaker 5: and they're reading it to you and you go.
Speaker 4: Home and you're like, wow, that was horrible.
Speaker 5: There is there is, there's there's an emotional there's an
Speaker 5: emotional aspect to it, and emotions are vulnerable, are vulnerabilities.
Speaker 5: So that's another thing that you know, I mean, I
Speaker 5: struggle with it a lot because you know, not a
Speaker 5: lot of team guys like to like to be vulnerable,
Speaker 5: but their strength through vulnerability, and and you.
Speaker 4: Know, that's another thing that I talked to guys about.
Speaker 5: But part of being we is there is some vulnerability
Speaker 5: to it, and you're taking a risk, but it's it's
Speaker 5: worth it, and it's and it's and it's really the
Speaker 5: only way you're going to be able to go at this,
Speaker 5: whether it's mental health or just life in drum in general,
Speaker 5: because not one person can burn in the entire load.
Speaker 4: It's it's impossible, agreed.
Speaker 3: And And on the on that vulnerability point, I think
Speaker 3: it's critical that everyone understands that if you are being vulnerable,
Speaker 3: you're being courageous, and as you're being courageous, you're building
Speaker 3: your resilience. And it's a funny little loop that builds
Speaker 3: on itself. The more you can be vulnerable, the more
Speaker 3: courageous you are. Is the more vulnerable you can be,
Speaker 3: the more courageous you are. And it's a self fulfilling
Speaker 3: prophecy almost that you are going to become resilient. You
Speaker 3: are going to become a better person if you just
Speaker 3: stay in the loop of adding a little bit of
Speaker 3: vulnerability out there into the world. That vulnerability. Myself, I'm trying,
Speaker 3: like yourself, I struggle with it. I'm trying to be
Speaker 3: really open and transparent and vulnerable to the internet and
Speaker 3: in the roles that I have lived in through my
Speaker 3: various careers, and it's tough, man Like. The ego is
Speaker 3: a wicked thing that will fight against the ability to
Speaker 3: be vulnerable, but it does take a lot of courage,
Speaker 3: and I think that that's a really really powerful tool
Speaker 3: for sure.
Speaker 4: Yeah, ego is all me that revolve around me.
Speaker 3: And one of the great things about that what you
Speaker 3: said in respect to being vulnerable within a we team
Speaker 3: is the moment that you start or not specifically for
Speaker 3: speaking to yourself, I'm speaking to anyone out there who's listening.
Speaker 3: The moment that you're more vulnerable is an opportunity for
Speaker 3: those around you to see that it's okay to be vulnerable,
Speaker 3: and then the we team starts recognizing that, well, we
Speaker 3: can all be just a little bit more vulnerable. It's
Speaker 3: okay to do it as a we. And I find
Speaker 3: that building a team of vulnerable individuals who are respected
Speaker 3: either leaders in their community or are respected amongst their
Speaker 3: peers to some degree, simply builds the team up and
Speaker 3: to be more transparent and caring for each other.
Speaker 4: Yep. But yeah, for people listening, vulnerability doesn't mean weak.
Speaker 4: It doesn't mean weak.
Speaker 3: Agreed.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the the.
Speaker 5: The strongest people in the world that I know are
Speaker 5: the ones that are capable of inflicting mass violence if
Speaker 5: they needed to, but they don't.
Speaker 4: They're the people that are.
Speaker 5: They are emotionally there, and they have compassion, they have empathy,
Speaker 5: and they have all that. But it doesn't mean you're weak.
Speaker 5: Don't ever be weak, because being weak will make you
Speaker 5: a victim. You have to you have to be able
Speaker 5: to understand that vulnerability does not mean weakness.
Speaker 3: I agree. Some of the language that has used, some
Speaker 3: of the words out there that are used are are
Speaker 3: It's when I first started using them myself, I struggled, Man,
Speaker 3: I was feeling a bit weak by talking about being
Speaker 3: weak and it's not weak at all. But initially, in
Speaker 3: the early phases, these words are being vulnerable, like I
Speaker 3: wanted to turn turn a one eighty and run away.
Speaker 3: The first time someone said, dude, you just got to
Speaker 3: be vulnerable, it was just it was these were words
Speaker 3: that I wasn't used to. But you have to have
Speaker 3: the courage to embrace the the adversity of the moment,
Speaker 3: the psychological disconnect from really what we should be doing
Speaker 3: in life, and that's being courageously vulnerable for sure.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 4: Interesting, No, that's no. Absolutely.
Speaker 2: I was just gonna say it's interesting because it's reminded me.
Speaker 2: I don't know how I got over here, but I
Speaker 2: got over here. The ethos of an old TV show
Speaker 2: called Kung Fu. You guys remember that one?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, David Garden, No.
Speaker 2: Remember that? Yeah? One of the few shows at Why
Speaker 2: Chang Kane, Why Chank, that's right, One of the few
Speaker 2: shows that showed martial arts in the way that I've
Speaker 2: always embodied it or envisioned it, which was just like
Speaker 2: Ryan said, I know I can hurt you, but he
Speaker 2: didn't want to. He didn't want to engage in any
Speaker 2: of the fights. Unless there was some kind of severe justice,
Speaker 2: he was going to jump in, but most of the
Speaker 2: time he didn't want to get involved. In Every black
Speaker 2: belt that I've ever talked to, soft guys included, they
Speaker 2: don't get into things they don't need to get into.
Speaker 2: They don't worry about the ego. I know I can
Speaker 2: destroy you right now in probably half a second, but
Speaker 2: there's no point. There's a point in doing this. Maybe
Speaker 2: this person's drunk, maybe this person's that I'm not going
Speaker 2: to engage, And to me, I see, you're putting yourself
Speaker 2: on the line vulnerably right because everybody's gonna look at
Speaker 2: you or you're a whimp or this and that. But
Speaker 2: in your heart, you know you're strong enough. I can
Speaker 2: take care of this guy and everybody else around me
Speaker 2: if I had to, but I don't because that's the
Speaker 2: stronger guy in me. I don't know it reminded me
Speaker 2: of that. I don't know if that resonates it all.
Speaker 2: Maybe I'm too far off with me.
Speaker 5: No, No, it absolutely does. I mean being able. You're
Speaker 5: being able to immediately inflict violence of action on somebody
Speaker 5: if you need to protect your family, or your way
Speaker 5: of life, life, limbit, eyesight, or somebody else. You know
Speaker 5: that that can't do that for themselves. That is absolutely
Speaker 5: critical to not becoming a victim. But being vulnerable doesn't
Speaker 5: mean that you're weak and walking around and kicking everybody's
Speaker 5: ass because you think you can.
Speaker 4: That's that's weakness. That's weakness.
Speaker 5: You have something going on that you're trying to make
Speaker 5: up for. But no, that's that's what I tell guys.
Speaker 5: You know, strength through vulnerability doesn't mean that you know
Speaker 5: you're gonna let somebody walk all over you.
Speaker 4: That's that that's not the case at all.
Speaker 5: But it also doesn't mean you know, if a guy
Speaker 5: walked in to the bar and wanted to pick a
Speaker 5: fight with me and I can walk out, I was like,
Speaker 5: all right, man, yeah, you're you're you're a badass. I'm
Speaker 5: out of here. I don't care is that I don't
Speaker 5: have anything to prove to you, and I'm not gonna
Speaker 5: I'm not going to involve myself in that the you know,
Speaker 5: maybe I'm maybe it's the forty four you know that
Speaker 5: I am or whatnot, But the the ego that I
Speaker 5: had as a kid, which was which surrounded me, not
Speaker 5: we it just it doesn't It doesn't serve anything. But
Speaker 5: you corner me or you put your hands on my family,
Speaker 5: well then you're going to see that. You're going to
Speaker 5: see exactly what I'm talking about. That being vulnerable doesn't
Speaker 5: mean you're weak. And so that's the one thing that
Speaker 5: I tell guys, Vulnerability doesn't mean weakness. It just there's
Speaker 5: strengths of vulnerability and you have to understand that. And
Speaker 5: and that word vulnerable is it's it's it's a nasty word.
Speaker 5: And a lot of you know, either special operations or whatnot.
Speaker 5: It's the same thing as fail. You know, fail like,
Speaker 5: oh man, you're you're ruined. Why what happens if you
Speaker 5: learn from that failure? What happens if you take to
Speaker 5: you if you take the lessons from from you know,
Speaker 5: that failure, and you make yourself stronger than it was. Failure?
Speaker 4: Actually that bad.
Speaker 5: A lot of people, a lot of people that are great,
Speaker 5: great leaders in life have failed more than they succeeded,
Speaker 5: but they learn from them. But vulnerability and failing they're
Speaker 5: just taboo words.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I actively pursue failure most days. And I
Speaker 3: have a little motto in my head, I like to
Speaker 3: kick ass. I'm sixty years older this year, and I
Speaker 3: still like to kick ass. But the ass that I'm
Speaker 3: kicking is my own. I'm kicking my own ass in life,
Speaker 3: and I've said it before to other folks, But there
Speaker 3: is also the part where I'm trying to kick my
Speaker 3: ass in life, sass, And that means all the people
Speaker 3: around me, Like I'm trying to pursue a pace that
Speaker 3: raises the boats all around me through kicking my own arson,
Speaker 3: demonstrating that that's just how I live my life. And
Speaker 3: someone wants to hop on board of kicking life sass
Speaker 3: as well, then I'm a big fan of that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, Well, then we're down to the last
Speaker 2: for few minutes again, Folks, you can find more information
Speaker 2: on land Mine Removal dot org land Mine Removal dot org.
Speaker 2: Feel motivated, and I hope you do donat and help
Speaker 2: them out in any way possible. Tip of the Spear
Speaker 2: is the name of the book, The Incredible story of
Speaker 2: an injured green Berets return to battle. You know, we're
Speaker 2: down in the last few minutes, and I don't want
Speaker 2: to get to deep into engage any big questions. But
Speaker 2: you mentioned fail Did you have anybody who told you
Speaker 2: when you said I want to go back after the
Speaker 2: Ied incident and you went back again to return to battle.
Speaker 2: Did you hear people tell you Ryan, you ain't gonna
Speaker 2: do it, brother, just let it go.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah?
Speaker 2: And if you did, what did you say to yourself?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, no, no, I I mean I had people
Speaker 5: telling me, hey, look, you're setting yourself up for failure
Speaker 5: management expectation. This is huge. You're you know, you're not
Speaker 5: You're not going back this injury. You're you're gonna be
Speaker 5: lucky to ever walk unassisted again.
Speaker 4: You know it.
Speaker 5: Just you need to control your mental health management expectation.
Speaker 4: Get this out of your head.
Speaker 5: This you know, you need to understand that it's done,
Speaker 5: even to the point to where I was medically retired
Speaker 5: and then I came back to active duty on a waiver.
Speaker 5: But yeah, it's I mean, there there there was definitely
Speaker 5: a lot of people that were trying to look out
Speaker 5: for my mental health, saying, hey, like you need to
Speaker 5: understand it's done, you need to refocus on something else,
Speaker 5: and you know. But then there was a few people
Speaker 5: that said, hey, why not give it.
Speaker 4: A shot, man, you never know, you know who knows.
Speaker 5: And and it was and it was that drive. It
Speaker 5: was just a couple people, my my physical therapist and
Speaker 5: my orthopedic surgeon. It's just a couple people that said, yeah,
Speaker 5: I mean, it's life, man, give it a shot.
Speaker 4: You never know. Maybe. And then I ended up going
Speaker 4: back to Afghanistan seven times.
Speaker 5: So so it's you know it and it's and it's
Speaker 5: not you know this, oh man, and you're you know,
Speaker 5: you did something that was absolutely unheard of. Blah blah
Speaker 5: blah blah blah, you're this superhuman or anything? Not at
Speaker 5: all that not even close What it is is I
Speaker 5: you know, the biggest thing.
Speaker 4: I stopped doing was feeling sorry for myself.
Speaker 5: And I started understanding, like, you know what, I'm going
Speaker 5: to give this everything I got. I'm going to dump
Speaker 5: everything I have into it, and if it works, great,
Speaker 5: If it doesn't work, at least I know I tried
Speaker 5: and I gave it everything I had. I didn't hold
Speaker 5: any reservations back. And if it doesn't work, then let
Speaker 5: me figure out what my path is. But right now,
Speaker 5: this is my path and people, you know, a lot
Speaker 5: of people say that my mindset on this is wrong.
Speaker 5: But they said, well, what was your backup plan or
Speaker 5: your alternative? And I said, I didn't have one, because
Speaker 5: when times get really, really tough, if you have a
Speaker 5: backup plan, when the pain into despair and everything gets
Speaker 5: to it gets it's overwhelming, you're going to take that
Speaker 5: backup plan.
Speaker 4: If you don't have a backup plan.
Speaker 5: Then you're going to continue moving forward until you just
Speaker 5: physically there's just no way in God's green earth that
Speaker 5: you're going to be able to continue on.
Speaker 4: It is not possible. Period.
Speaker 5: Well then, okay, you gave it everything you had. You
Speaker 5: had no backup plan, you had no alternative anything.
Speaker 4: This was it. It didn't work out.
Speaker 5: And in the end, like my dad told me, you know,
Speaker 5: when you're that old man sitting on your rocking chair
Speaker 5: looking back at your life on the things that you
Speaker 5: did or the worse, what you didn't do, you'll be
Speaker 5: able to look back on this and know that you
Speaker 5: gave it everything you had and it just wasn't in
Speaker 5: the cards, and that you'll sit back and you'll feel
Speaker 5: good about yourself. You did it, life worth are well lived,
Speaker 5: and he gave it everything you had.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love that. That's a man that's so powerful.
Speaker 3: You crystallize how I'm trying to live my life. You
Speaker 3: just said that so much better. I do have a
Speaker 3: quick question for I know we're running out of time, Doc,
Speaker 3: would you would you mind just quickly touching on your
Speaker 3: observations of the folks who were telling you, no, you
Speaker 3: can't do this, man, it's impossible and all of that
Speaker 3: good stuff, just trying to really discourage you from heading
Speaker 3: down the path that you chose to, like get after it.
Speaker 3: How did those people respond.
Speaker 5: So they they thought that they had my well being
Speaker 5: and my mental health in mind. Hey, you're setting yourself
Speaker 5: up for failure. You are putting all of your emotions
Speaker 5: into this and it's.
Speaker 4: Not going to happen.
Speaker 5: You're getting you're getting medically retired, like you need, you
Speaker 5: need to focus on something else.
Speaker 4: Let us help you.
Speaker 5: So they you know, they thought that what they were
Speaker 5: doing was beneficial to me. And in a way, you know,
Speaker 5: you do have to have management expectation of your life.
Speaker 5: But when you know, as as as as things started
Speaker 5: to take shape, and now you know, okay, I'm uh okay,
Speaker 5: I get read. The army decides, okay, yeah, we'll we'll
Speaker 5: give you a waiver to stay on after duty. All right, Yeah,
Speaker 5: you're moving through physical therapy. Things are going in this direction.
Speaker 5: Then you know, the the cheerleading squad gets a little
Speaker 5: bit bigger and bigger and bigger. But I do understand,
Speaker 5: you know there the motive behind what they were doing
Speaker 5: is because management expectation is extremely important for mental health.
Speaker 4: But yeah, no, it wasn't.
Speaker 5: I mean, there were there was a couple of people
Speaker 5: at the end that were just like I just didn't
Speaker 5: think this was possible. Like I, okay, I was wrong.
Speaker 5: My apologies, I was wrong, but I didn't do it
Speaker 5: for them. You know, whatever people I had to say
Speaker 5: say for me, and nobody was malicious about it.
Speaker 4: So yeah I did it. I did it for me.
Speaker 4: If you you.
Speaker 5: Know, there's no way in hell I would have played
Speaker 5: but that kind of blood, sweat, tons of tears into
Speaker 5: something like that if I was doing it for somebody else. Now,
Speaker 5: now you got to do it for yourself or you're
Speaker 5: you're not going to do it.
Speaker 2: Roger that awesome stuff again, folks, and it's really an
Speaker 2: amazing conversation. Sean. You brought this interview to another notch,
Speaker 2: another level. I can't thank you enough for that. Ryan.
Speaker 2: Like always, it's always a pleasure and honor to speak
Speaker 2: with you, my friend. Again, Folks, is Landmine Removal dot Org.
Speaker 2: Tip of the Spear, the incredible story of an injured
Speaker 2: green be Raisee we turned to battle. Ryan. I can't
Speaker 2: thank you enough for doing this. Thank you so much
Speaker 2: again for coming back.
Speaker 5: Yeah no, this was awesome. I appreciate you having me
Speaker 5: back on. I love love talking with you.
Speaker 2: And by the way, Ryan, I don't think I've ever
Speaker 2: told you. I show clips of your incredible story to
Speaker 2: my class every semester when we deal about resilience and
Speaker 2: trauma and how people overcome things. And each and every
Speaker 2: time the classes gets blown away when they see the
Speaker 2: clips the interview and they're like.
Speaker 4: Blown away. That's that's no puns.
Speaker 3: That's a great way to end it.
Speaker 2: Thank you Sean as well for joining me on the Thanks.
Speaker 2: Thank you everyone for listening. You know what to do, share, subscribe,
Speaker 2: hit that I like but you know we like it,
Speaker 2: and go check out Landmine Removal dot Org.