WEBVTT 1 00:00:10.119 --> 00:00:14.240 Thousands of people have mysteriously vanished in America's wilderness. To 2 00:00:14.400 --> 00:00:17.039 join us as we dive into the deep end of 3 00:00:17.120 --> 00:00:20.160 the unexplainable and try to piece together what happened. 4 00:00:20.760 --> 00:00:56.600 If you are listening to Locations Unknown, what's up everybody, 5 00:00:56.640 --> 00:01:00.560 and welcome back to another episode of Locations Unknown. I'm 6 00:01:00.640 --> 00:01:02.679 your co host Joey Rodwen with me as always as 7 00:01:02.719 --> 00:01:06.239 a guy who always zipper merges properly. Mike Bandaboguard. 8 00:01:06.439 --> 00:01:09.079 Oh, thank you Joe, and thank you once again to 9 00:01:09.680 --> 00:01:12.599 all of our amazing listeners for tuning in. My voice 10 00:01:12.680 --> 00:01:15.480 is almost back, maybe another few weeks. It just sounds 11 00:01:15.519 --> 00:01:17.719 like you're hitting puberty a little bit every time. The 12 00:01:17.840 --> 00:01:23.120 Ripe Ripe old age. No, but thank you for tuning 13 00:01:23.159 --> 00:01:26.599 in and supporting the show. Just a few announcements before 14 00:01:26.640 --> 00:01:27.200 we get going. 15 00:01:27.799 --> 00:01:28.280 If you want to. 16 00:01:28.280 --> 00:01:33.359 Call the show, you can call two eight three six three. 17 00:01:34.359 --> 00:01:37.040 We also have some cool shows on our new and 18 00:01:37.159 --> 00:01:40.599 upcoming network, Unknown Media. So Off the Trails, Who runs 19 00:01:40.599 --> 00:01:45.439 this Park? Crime, Off the Grid? Relish Patreon, Relish Patreon 20 00:01:45.519 --> 00:01:48.480 not Patreon. If you want to support us, you can 21 00:01:48.519 --> 00:01:53.400 head over to Patreon, YouTube memberships, premium subscriptions on Apple 22 00:01:54.040 --> 00:01:57.519 or head to our store buy some stuff hats and 23 00:01:57.560 --> 00:02:02.120 shirts and things like that. And if money's tight, you 24 00:02:02.159 --> 00:02:05.879 can always leave a like or a comment or subscribe 25 00:02:05.879 --> 00:02:08.680 wherever you listen to us, and that will help us 26 00:02:08.719 --> 00:02:09.520 out more than you know. 27 00:02:11.159 --> 00:02:14.240 I just love how sick and tired you are, not 28 00:02:14.439 --> 00:02:17.520 like in a vat like you're just sick and tired. Yes, 29 00:02:18.080 --> 00:02:23.879 just like full in it fatherhood. Yes, I'm laughing because 30 00:02:23.919 --> 00:02:26.960 I remember the pain. I actually feel pretty good today. 31 00:02:27.000 --> 00:02:30.439 I just voices sound like it hasn't come back Yetet 32 00:02:31.280 --> 00:02:33.840 it's better than the last episode. 33 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:38.800 That was fun. Yeah, it was something. Yeah, all right, 34 00:02:38.960 --> 00:02:43.039 you all good with your updates? Yes, all right, everybody, 35 00:02:43.120 --> 00:02:46.680 let's gear up and get out to explore locations unknown. 36 00:02:47.400 --> 00:02:51.960 September twenty twenty five, two experienced elk hunters traveled to 37 00:02:52.000 --> 00:02:55.280 the rugged backcountry of southern Colorado for what was supposed 38 00:02:55.280 --> 00:02:58.520 to be an eight day hunting trip in the remote 39 00:02:58.879 --> 00:03:03.400 South San Juan Wilds. Both men were seasoned outdoorsmen, equipped 40 00:03:03.400 --> 00:03:07.400 with modern navigation and communication devices, and familiar with the 41 00:03:07.479 --> 00:03:11.120 challenges that come with operating deep in the wilderness. When 42 00:03:11.199 --> 00:03:15.240 scheduled check ins suddenly stopped, family members quickly became concerned. 43 00:03:15.840 --> 00:03:20.680 A massive search effort involving helicopters, search dogs, drones, horseback 44 00:03:20.759 --> 00:03:24.039 teams and hundreds of volunteers was launched across miles of 45 00:03:24.039 --> 00:03:28.919 steep mountains, dense timber, and storm battered terrain. For nearly 46 00:03:28.960 --> 00:03:32.080 a week, rescuers search for the answers, as worsening weather 47 00:03:32.319 --> 00:03:35.439 and lack of clues deep in the mystery. What began 48 00:03:35.479 --> 00:03:39.800 as missing persons cases soon captured national attention, leaving many 49 00:03:39.840 --> 00:03:43.080 to wonder how two capable hunters could seemingly vanish only 50 00:03:43.120 --> 00:03:46.479 a short distance from their vehicles. This week we investigate 51 00:03:46.560 --> 00:03:53.360 the disappearance of Andrew Porter and Ian Stasco. So let's 52 00:03:53.400 --> 00:03:56.360 talk about this episode brings us to the Rio Grande 53 00:03:56.439 --> 00:04:02.400 National Forest and the South San Juan Wilderness in Conejos County, Colorado. 54 00:04:02.719 --> 00:04:04.599 I'm sure I said that wrong, and I think I 55 00:04:04.599 --> 00:04:10.120 think it's Conijos Conihos County, Colorado. A little bit about 56 00:04:10.120 --> 00:04:12.800 the area they were hunting. The area where Andrew Porter 57 00:04:12.840 --> 00:04:16.279 and Ian Stasco went missing is high elevation, very rugged 58 00:04:16.319 --> 00:04:20.319 section of southern San Juan Mountains in far central Colorado, 59 00:04:20.680 --> 00:04:26.040 centered on the Rio Delos Pinos drainage and Trujelio Meadows 60 00:04:26.079 --> 00:04:30.000 Reservoir near New Mexico's border, So we'll talk about some 61 00:04:30.079 --> 00:04:34.480 interesting facts about the area headwaters of Rio Grande. The 62 00:04:34.879 --> 00:04:38.800 one point eight three million acre Rio Grande National Forest 63 00:04:38.920 --> 00:04:43.600 exists largely because the eighteen hundred mile Rio Grande River 64 00:04:44.160 --> 00:04:46.600 begins high in the San Juan Mountains on the forest's 65 00:04:46.639 --> 00:04:49.040 western side, then flows all the way to the Gulf 66 00:04:49.040 --> 00:04:53.319 of Mexico, an undiscovered jewel with huge elevation ranges, so 67 00:04:53.360 --> 00:04:55.839 the forest is described by the Forest Service as one 68 00:04:55.839 --> 00:04:59.600 of the true undiscovered Jewels of Colorado, spanning everything from 69 00:04:59.639 --> 00:05:02.439 highday desert Sand Luis Valley floor at about seven thousand, 70 00:05:02.519 --> 00:05:06.040 six hundred feet to rugged peaks over fourteen three hundred 71 00:05:06.079 --> 00:05:11.279 feet in the Sangre de Cristo Mountains. It is home 72 00:05:11.879 --> 00:05:14.720 to the world's largest alpine valleys, so the Rio Grande 73 00:05:14.800 --> 00:05:18.560 National Forest wraps around the San Louis Valley, often cited 74 00:05:18.560 --> 00:05:22.279 as the world's largest agricultural alpine valley and one of 75 00:05:22.319 --> 00:05:26.120 the world's largest high deserts. Flat farm and ranch country 76 00:05:26.360 --> 00:05:30.439 ringed by mountains. The South San Juan Wilderness, about one 77 00:05:30.560 --> 00:05:32.920 hundred and fifty eight thousand acres, is built from ancient 78 00:05:33.040 --> 00:05:38.000 volcanic carved by glaciers into steep volcanics and carved by 79 00:05:38.000 --> 00:05:41.639 glaciers into steep slopes above broad u shaped valleys with 80 00:05:41.720 --> 00:05:46.120 high peaks, cliffs, jagged pinnacles, and ragged ridges that make 81 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:50.600 travel legitimately difficult. Sounds like a great place to go hiking. Yeah, 82 00:05:50.600 --> 00:05:53.800 it does, sounds super difficult. But I've never gone that 83 00:05:53.920 --> 00:05:56.959 far south in Colorado. No, I've never been to that 84 00:05:57.160 --> 00:06:01.120 corner of Colorado. Yeah. A famous grizzly, often cited as 85 00:06:01.160 --> 00:06:04.199 a last known Colorado grizzly, was killed in the South 86 00:06:04.240 --> 00:06:06.959 San Juan Wilderness in nineteen seventy nine, and if any 87 00:06:07.000 --> 00:06:11.519 grizzlies still survived in Colorado afterwards, biologists long pointed to 88 00:06:11.600 --> 00:06:15.240 this area's recess as the most likely refuge. So I 89 00:06:15.240 --> 00:06:17.959 didn't answer the question, Could there still be grizzlies in 90 00:06:18.000 --> 00:06:22.240 Colorado in that area? Sounds like maybe? Sounds like maybe. 91 00:06:22.879 --> 00:06:26.360 President Theodore Roosevelt established the Rio Grande National Force by 92 00:06:26.399 --> 00:06:29.839 proclamation in nineteen oh eight, and decades later, Congress formerly 93 00:06:29.879 --> 00:06:33.000 designated the South San Juan as Wilderness in the Colorado 94 00:06:33.000 --> 00:06:36.439 Wilderness Act of nineteen eighty, part of a broader push 95 00:06:36.439 --> 00:06:40.800 that also protected the nearby Wheeler geologic area. So a 96 00:06:40.839 --> 00:06:43.639 little bit about the climate. This part of the southern 97 00:06:43.639 --> 00:06:46.879 San Juan Mountains has a high mountain semi arid climate, 98 00:06:47.079 --> 00:06:51.079 lots of sun overall, but with frequent convective storms during 99 00:06:51.120 --> 00:06:54.079 the warm season and long, cold, snowy winters at elevation. 100 00:06:54.839 --> 00:06:57.319 The broader San Juan region is known for loads of 101 00:06:57.360 --> 00:07:00.680 sunny days and relatively mild, dry air, but the high 102 00:07:00.680 --> 00:07:03.519 peaks in a wilderness yilind seem much cooler temperatures and 103 00:07:03.639 --> 00:07:08.879 significantly more precipitation than lower surrounding valleys. Midwinter is typically 104 00:07:08.879 --> 00:07:11.800 the wettest time of year in the high mountains, with 105 00:07:11.959 --> 00:07:16.120 deep snowpacks coming along the divide in in headwater basins. 106 00:07:16.639 --> 00:07:19.720 Early September in the high San Juans is often described 107 00:07:19.720 --> 00:07:22.319 by local hikers and backpackers as one of the most 108 00:07:22.319 --> 00:07:26.240 comfortable times of the year. Daytimes high daytime highs commonly 109 00:07:26.319 --> 00:07:29.399 run in the sixties to low seventies at mid elevations, 110 00:07:29.439 --> 00:07:31.920 with nights in the thirties and forties depending on the 111 00:07:31.959 --> 00:07:34.920 exact elevation and weatherfronts. That actually is like perfect hiking 112 00:07:34.920 --> 00:07:38.120 weather at ten thousand feet and above, where Andrew and 113 00:07:38.160 --> 00:07:40.839 Ian were hunting. Those same patterns translate to cool days 114 00:07:40.839 --> 00:07:43.680 and cold nights, with typical overnight lows in the thirties 115 00:07:43.680 --> 00:07:46.120 and occasional dips into the twenties. When storms are cold, 116 00:07:46.160 --> 00:07:50.199 air masses move through. Community reports from people who regularly 117 00:07:50.240 --> 00:07:52.800 backpack in the San Juans in late August and early 118 00:07:52.839 --> 00:07:56.079 September note that you can see frosty mornings, a few 119 00:07:56.160 --> 00:07:58.879 nights near freezing, and even a couple of inches of 120 00:07:58.959 --> 00:08:01.319 early snow that melts quickly once the sun is up. 121 00:08:01.800 --> 00:08:06.040 Even during this good weather shoulder season, afternoons and evening 122 00:08:06.079 --> 00:08:08.879 thunderstorms remain a key feature of the climate. May we 123 00:08:08.959 --> 00:08:13.839 got that wrong. It should have Beddle since my cousin 124 00:08:13.959 --> 00:08:15.879 was listening to the show and he's like text me, 125 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:21.920 he's likestraddle Seasons Forecasters and local guides warned that the 126 00:08:21.959 --> 00:08:25.639 San Juan high Country routinely sees showers and thunderstorms building 127 00:08:25.680 --> 00:08:29.319 most days, with higher chances earlier in the monsoon, which 128 00:08:29.399 --> 00:08:32.120 is July to August, and still significant but somewhat lower 129 00:08:32.200 --> 00:08:36.519 frequency into early September. The National Weather Services own forecasts 130 00:08:36.559 --> 00:08:39.399 for the southwest and eastern San Juan Mountains above ten 131 00:08:39.399 --> 00:08:43.000 thousand feet routinely shows patterns like mostly sunny than a 132 00:08:43.080 --> 00:08:46.440 chance of showers and thunderstorms in the afternoon, and showers 133 00:08:46.480 --> 00:08:49.759 with a chance of thunderstorms on many days, underscoring how 134 00:08:49.759 --> 00:08:55.200 embedded convective activity is in the seasonal pattern. Those storms 135 00:08:55.279 --> 00:08:59.320 often bring lightning, its brief but intense downpours, gusty winds, 136 00:08:59.440 --> 00:09:04.639 rapid temptre drops, especially near the Continental Divide. User reports 137 00:09:04.679 --> 00:09:06.960 emphasize that there is a thirty percent chance of rain, 138 00:09:07.279 --> 00:09:10.360 it will rain, and even in early September, lightning and 139 00:09:10.399 --> 00:09:13.600 wet snow and high peaks are very possible. So this 140 00:09:13.759 --> 00:09:15.720 is exactly the kind of pattern that was reported in 141 00:09:15.759 --> 00:09:17.919 the days Andrew and Ian were in the field, Bad 142 00:09:18.039 --> 00:09:21.480 cold storms and fog rolled through with lightning and deteriorating 143 00:09:21.480 --> 00:09:25.960 conditions that concern both family and rescuers. Because temperature generally 144 00:09:26.039 --> 00:09:29.039 drops with elevation, high basins and ridgelines above ten thousand 145 00:09:29.039 --> 00:09:32.480 feet in the region experienced significantly colder nights than nearby 146 00:09:32.559 --> 00:09:36.519 valley towns, even when the valley forecasts look mild, Clear 147 00:09:36.639 --> 00:09:40.840 dry air can produce strong radiational cooling after sunset, leading 148 00:09:40.879 --> 00:09:43.799 to frosty mornings and thin ice on puddles. Even when 149 00:09:43.879 --> 00:09:47.639 daytime temperatures feel comfortable, When storms move in, wind, chill 150 00:09:47.679 --> 00:09:51.000 and wet clothing quickly increase the risk of hypothermia or 151 00:09:51.039 --> 00:09:55.440 cold stress for anyone caught far from shelter. So that's 152 00:09:55.519 --> 00:09:58.120 just the weather. Now, let's talk about the terrain. The 153 00:09:58.240 --> 00:10:01.440 terrain where Andrew Porter and Dan went hunting is classic 154 00:10:01.519 --> 00:10:06.159 high San Juan Wilderness, steep glaciated mountains above Timberline Valley 155 00:10:06.159 --> 00:10:10.000 cut by the Rio delos Pinos and its tributaries near 156 00:10:10.039 --> 00:10:13.759 the Colorado New Mexico border. The area sits in the 157 00:10:13.840 --> 00:10:17.320 South San Juan Wilderness, an adjacent Rio Grande National Force 158 00:10:17.480 --> 00:10:21.159 in Conejos County, part of the Southern Rocky Mountain Ecosystem 159 00:10:21.399 --> 00:10:25.080 or Ecoregion. Elevations run from roughly eight thousand feet in 160 00:10:25.120 --> 00:10:27.639 the lower river valleys up to thirteen thousand feet on 161 00:10:27.679 --> 00:10:32.000 surrounding peaks and ridges, with steep slopes dropping into broad 162 00:10:32.120 --> 00:10:35.919 u shaped glacial valleys that are then insized more deeply 163 00:10:35.960 --> 00:10:41.159 by modern streams. So the Rio delos Pinos itself rises 164 00:10:41.240 --> 00:10:44.240 high into the wilderness near the continental Divide, then drops 165 00:10:44.279 --> 00:10:47.679 thousands of feet towards its confluence with the Conejos River, 166 00:10:47.799 --> 00:10:52.000 crossing the Colorado New Mexico line more than once. Gay 167 00:10:52.080 --> 00:10:55.519 Management Unit eighty one and the adjoining valley supports strong 168 00:10:55.600 --> 00:10:59.919 populations of elk, mule, deer, black bear, and other large mammals. 169 00:11:00.399 --> 00:11:03.840 The real de Los Pinos Valley itself is described as 170 00:11:03.960 --> 00:11:08.159 prime el cabitat, with resonant HER's using the river corridor 171 00:11:08.200 --> 00:11:10.480 and surrounding slopes, so it's like the best spot to 172 00:11:10.519 --> 00:11:14.200 go out hunting. So yeah, for bow hunters, that's really 173 00:11:14.200 --> 00:11:17.759 hard to do. I'll hunt with bo. The country offers 174 00:11:17.799 --> 00:11:20.519 a mix of thick cover, open meadows, and broken ridge 175 00:11:20.519 --> 00:11:23.639 lines that let annals move between feeding areas betting, timber, 176 00:11:23.679 --> 00:11:26.279 and water, but visibility can be limited and the terrain 177 00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:30.440 quickly becomes complex once you leave established trails. So, Mike, 178 00:11:30.440 --> 00:11:32.399 why don't you tell us a little bit about Andrew 179 00:11:32.399 --> 00:11:32.840 to start? 180 00:11:33.440 --> 00:11:36.159 Sure, So I'll try to go through character profiles for 181 00:11:36.279 --> 00:11:38.320 both pretty quickly here so we can get the timeline. 182 00:11:38.360 --> 00:11:43.320 So first character is Andrew Porter. He was twenty five 183 00:11:43.639 --> 00:11:47.279 at the time of his disappearance. He had last contact 184 00:11:47.399 --> 00:11:51.240 on September eleventh of twenty twenty five, and he was 185 00:11:51.279 --> 00:11:56.039 reported missing around September twelfth, or thirteenth of twenty twenty five. 186 00:11:56.120 --> 00:11:59.080 He was a male age twenty five. He was about 187 00:11:59.120 --> 00:12:04.559 six feet tall, very physically fit. Wait was not publicly mentioned, 188 00:12:04.559 --> 00:12:09.159 but he had light brown blonde hair. No detail about 189 00:12:09.159 --> 00:12:14.200 what eye color he had or any other distinguishing marks, clothing, 190 00:12:14.279 --> 00:12:16.559 and gear. Last scene in so he was bow hunting 191 00:12:16.639 --> 00:12:20.960 elk in early archery season and was reported as carrying 192 00:12:21.000 --> 00:12:26.320 an archery gear, bow arrows, knives, game bags, light hunting clothing, 193 00:12:26.480 --> 00:12:30.159 and a garment inReach device. He and Ian were not 194 00:12:30.360 --> 00:12:35.120 carrying firearms and their vehicle was back at the trailhead. 195 00:12:35.120 --> 00:12:39.279 It still contained other gear that they brought with Medical 196 00:12:39.279 --> 00:12:43.360 issues for Andrew, there was nothing reported, no chronic conditions 197 00:12:43.759 --> 00:12:46.840 or anything that would have been a hindrance in him 198 00:12:47.000 --> 00:12:51.279 piking out in the wilderness occupation. He was living in Asheville, 199 00:12:51.320 --> 00:12:53.480 North Carolina, and he was described by a lot of 200 00:12:53.480 --> 00:13:00.600 people as passionate bowhunter, outdoorsman, backcountry enthusiast, and just pretty 201 00:13:00.639 --> 00:13:04.039 much all about being out in the wilderness and hiking 202 00:13:04.039 --> 00:13:08.919 and backpacking experience in the wilderness. Multiple people described him 203 00:13:08.919 --> 00:13:13.360 as a very experienced outdoorsman, experienced hunter. He was familiar 204 00:13:13.440 --> 00:13:18.879 with multi day backcountry trips and modern tools like satellite messengers. 205 00:13:19.720 --> 00:13:23.279 He was also very comfortable navigating rugged high elevation train, 206 00:13:23.600 --> 00:13:28.320 camping off a trailhead for extended archery hunts, and coordinating 207 00:13:28.360 --> 00:13:32.320 with SAR appropriate gear like in reach for check ins 208 00:13:32.399 --> 00:13:36.519 and local sharing. So it seems like pretty knowledgeable Joe 209 00:13:36.600 --> 00:13:40.320 might be pulling up some pictures so experience at this location. 210 00:13:40.480 --> 00:13:43.679 So Andrew was a non resident hunter in Colorado. So, 211 00:13:43.720 --> 00:13:46.600 like I said, he's from North Carolina and he came 212 00:13:46.679 --> 00:13:50.679 to hunting the GMU eighty one, which Joe had briefly 213 00:13:50.720 --> 00:13:54.759 talked about earlier. While this wasn't his home area, he 214 00:13:55.000 --> 00:13:58.960 was prepared with mapped trailheads, he had the satellite device, 215 00:13:59.000 --> 00:14:01.440 and he had planned an eight trip into the South 216 00:14:01.519 --> 00:14:06.480 San Juan Wilderness, So he was prepared seconds. 217 00:14:06.600 --> 00:14:08.679 And they seemed like they knew what they were doing. 218 00:14:08.720 --> 00:14:10.600 They had all the right equipment to do it. Yeah, 219 00:14:10.679 --> 00:14:13.000 there's people that do successfully about half the stuff that 220 00:14:13.039 --> 00:14:13.879 they came in there with. 221 00:14:14.039 --> 00:14:17.039 Oh yeah, so I mean much more prepared than a 222 00:14:17.039 --> 00:14:20.120 lot of the people we discuss on the show. Subject 223 00:14:20.120 --> 00:14:24.639 two of tonight was Ian Stasco, and he was also 224 00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:29.120 twenty five at the time of his disappearance same, you know, 225 00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:34.720 last contact and reported missing because he was hunting with Andrews. 226 00:14:34.720 --> 00:14:36.840 So a lot of this stuff is going to be 227 00:14:36.919 --> 00:14:39.600 kind of the same for both of them. Body description 228 00:14:40.279 --> 00:14:44.559 again very similar, six feet, weight wasn't described. He had 229 00:14:44.679 --> 00:14:48.600 blonde hair. Again reported very kind of fit and athletic. 230 00:14:49.320 --> 00:14:53.879 He was again experience with the outdoors, a strong backcountry hunter. 231 00:14:54.879 --> 00:14:58.080 He didn't have any distinctive tattoos or scars or anything. 232 00:14:58.279 --> 00:15:01.759 Geary was last scenon very similar to Andrew. They're bow 233 00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:03.799 hunting elk between the two of them. They had that 234 00:15:03.879 --> 00:15:07.480 garment in reach device. Looks like we got some pictures 235 00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:10.240 of them right here. Yeah, I mean they're pretty much 236 00:15:11.080 --> 00:15:14.440 very similar, same age, same height. Nothing jumps out at me. 237 00:15:14.480 --> 00:15:19.399 They look just standard year old guys that that would 238 00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:20.360 hunt in Colorado. 239 00:15:20.519 --> 00:15:21.360 Yeah. 240 00:15:21.559 --> 00:15:24.840 Yes, if you're imagining getting your head, you're correct. Yeah, 241 00:15:24.879 --> 00:15:28.639 you think about it. You gotta be pretty physically fit 242 00:15:28.799 --> 00:15:33.559 if you're hunting elk with a bow at elevation. 243 00:15:33.919 --> 00:15:37.080 Oh yeah, just hauling the meat out of backpacks. If 244 00:15:37.120 --> 00:15:39.799 you don't have like livestock to help you, it's just 245 00:15:39.879 --> 00:15:41.519 a ton of work just getting there. 246 00:15:41.600 --> 00:15:43.320 You got a hike, maybe a day or two just 247 00:15:43.399 --> 00:15:46.559 to get to your spot. Yeah, so it's not something 248 00:15:46.960 --> 00:15:48.679 just Grandpa I can do. 249 00:15:49.679 --> 00:15:52.679 Though, You're gonna have an angry grandpa call and it's like, 250 00:15:52.679 --> 00:15:54.480 all right, I'll cut the sand moms all the time. 251 00:15:55.480 --> 00:15:59.759 Like we weren't talking about you, We're we're generalizing most grandpas. Yes, 252 00:16:00.120 --> 00:16:01.360 most grampa's could do it. 253 00:16:02.039 --> 00:16:06.480 So personality wise, so Ian described him as again dedicated 254 00:16:06.480 --> 00:16:10.159 outdoorsmen and hunter who deeply loved the mountains in backcountry. 255 00:16:10.399 --> 00:16:12.240 I mean, you're gonna find a lot of similarities between 256 00:16:12.240 --> 00:16:14.440 the two of them. If they're willing to go into 257 00:16:14.480 --> 00:16:17.480 the back country to hunt elk with a bow and arrow, 258 00:16:17.960 --> 00:16:22.559 they probably have very similar passions with hiking and going outdoors. 259 00:16:22.600 --> 00:16:26.919 And Yep, again no chronic medical or physical limitations that 260 00:16:26.960 --> 00:16:32.720 would have caused the disappearance occupation hobby. So Ian was 261 00:16:32.759 --> 00:16:35.360 actually living in Salt Lake City at the time, and 262 00:16:36.279 --> 00:16:40.200 he's framed in reporting is passionate about el counting, back 263 00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:47.080 country travel, wilderness adventure, and articles about his disappearance very 264 00:16:47.080 --> 00:16:50.320 similar to Andrew. They'd rather be doing elk hunting or 265 00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:53.360 hiking or backpacking than pretty much anything else. Sure sounds 266 00:16:53.360 --> 00:16:59.039 pretty awesome. So I'm just gonna jump right into timeline here. Yes, 267 00:16:59.159 --> 00:17:04.079 our story starts. It's early September twenty twenty five. Andrew 268 00:17:04.119 --> 00:17:09.559 Porter and Ian Stasco converge on southern Colorado for an 269 00:17:09.599 --> 00:17:13.519 eight day el hunt. Like I said earlier, they're both 270 00:17:13.559 --> 00:17:17.519 physically fit, they have all the gear. They've done it before. 271 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:22.359 Their target was Game Management Unit eighty one. Joe briefly 272 00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:26.039 described this. It's a rugged swath of country stretching from 273 00:17:26.079 --> 00:17:29.680 the Continental Divide eastward to the Rio Grande and south 274 00:17:29.759 --> 00:17:33.799 to the state line. He has steep ridges, deep drainages, 275 00:17:33.839 --> 00:17:38.240 heavy timber, and it's a pretty rugged place. Joe's looks 276 00:17:38.240 --> 00:17:40.119 like he's pulling up pictures or Google Maps. 277 00:17:40.200 --> 00:17:43.839 Yeah, I'm live right now. I mean, yep, middle of nowhere. 278 00:17:44.640 --> 00:17:47.920 That's desolate. It's very desolate. And you can see kind 279 00:17:47.960 --> 00:17:50.400 of this horseshoe ridge that they always talk about the 280 00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:51.880 like just catches weather. 281 00:17:52.480 --> 00:17:55.799 Yeah, it looks pretty nasty, but also be cool to hike. 282 00:17:56.000 --> 00:17:59.799 Absolutely, I'll see if there's any Google street View images 283 00:17:59.799 --> 00:18:02.839 from literally anywhere. It doesn't look like it. No, yep, Oh, 284 00:18:02.839 --> 00:18:04.519 here's one on the ridge. Oh, here we go. We 285 00:18:04.559 --> 00:18:07.720 can look down upon see that it does this all 286 00:18:07.720 --> 00:18:10.599 the time, like goes to a different spot sometimes weird. 287 00:18:11.160 --> 00:18:13.000 All right, you can keep going. I'll try and get 288 00:18:13.000 --> 00:18:16.920 this door. I want to see if this works. Yeah, 289 00:18:16.960 --> 00:18:20.960 that's weird. Maybe they because usually those are private photos. Yeah, 290 00:18:21.079 --> 00:18:24.279 they could have made them private. I'll try and get 291 00:18:24.559 --> 00:18:26.319 at least one in the area so we can get 292 00:18:26.319 --> 00:18:28.200 an idea of what we're looking at. What is going 293 00:18:28.240 --> 00:18:31.519 on here? All right? You keep going, I'm gonna figure 294 00:18:31.559 --> 00:18:32.279 out what's going on. 295 00:18:32.599 --> 00:18:40.359 So they drive to the Rio Delos Patos trailhead in Canaos. 296 00:18:41.599 --> 00:18:42.440 Did I get there wrong? 297 00:18:42.920 --> 00:18:48.160 I just Rio Delo's Pinos Cananos. 298 00:18:49.640 --> 00:18:51.920 Now you know how I feel. You do this to 299 00:18:51.960 --> 00:18:52.480 me all the time. 300 00:18:52.480 --> 00:18:52.680 I know. 301 00:18:53.160 --> 00:18:53.839 That's awesome. 302 00:18:54.319 --> 00:18:58.839 So Canos Canaos County, and they use their garment and 303 00:18:58.920 --> 00:19:01.640 Reach satellite device so they can check in regularly with 304 00:19:01.759 --> 00:19:04.839 loved ones from out in the back country with no 305 00:19:04.960 --> 00:19:08.440 cell service. Before they leave. Andrew and his fiance Bridget 306 00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:12.319 Murphy agree he will send routine check ins roughly every 307 00:19:12.359 --> 00:19:16.400 twenty four hours so family can track the hunts progress. 308 00:19:17.039 --> 00:19:21.759 Now a little excessive, don't you think every twenty four hours? 309 00:19:21.880 --> 00:19:24.920 Yeah? I mean, if you have an inReach device, you 310 00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:26.119 just send text. 311 00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:27.880 I know, but I mean we used to hike all 312 00:19:27.880 --> 00:19:32.480 the time off grid in like with no lessons of communications. 313 00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:35.119 That's and that's why we didn't check in. Yeah, but 314 00:19:35.200 --> 00:19:38.240 I mean it's kind of nice that you don't have Oh, 315 00:19:38.279 --> 00:19:39.079 I get what you're saying. 316 00:19:39.519 --> 00:19:42.240 I mean, obviously you want the device so if something happens, 317 00:19:42.279 --> 00:19:44.880 you can contact the authorities. But if I'm like out 318 00:19:44.880 --> 00:19:46.319 in the back country, I don't want to be checking 319 00:19:46.359 --> 00:19:47.359 in every twenty four hours. 320 00:19:47.400 --> 00:19:50.039 Yeah. Well maybe you wouldn't care as much if you 321 00:19:50.119 --> 00:19:53.319 went all the time. I guess it sounds like they 322 00:19:53.359 --> 00:19:56.359 go all the time, so it's like just a Tuesday. Yeah. 323 00:19:56.359 --> 00:19:58.640 For us, it's like we never get away. Yeah, so 324 00:19:58.720 --> 00:20:00.720 let's get away. Yeah, I want to off the grid 325 00:20:00.759 --> 00:20:02.400 for a week. I'm not talking to anyone. 326 00:20:03.000 --> 00:20:08.000 Look at this. I finally got it to work. That's beautiful. Yeah, 327 00:20:08.519 --> 00:20:13.240 it's a little less rugged than I would have thought. Yeah, 328 00:20:13.359 --> 00:20:15.480 Like the way it described this area, it seemed way 329 00:20:15.480 --> 00:20:17.759 more aggressive. I would think. I would have thought the 330 00:20:17.880 --> 00:20:21.759 Rackies would have been a little more racky at John 331 00:20:21.839 --> 00:20:22.799 Denver's full of it. 332 00:20:24.799 --> 00:20:26.559 That's kind of how I'm feeling a little bit, like 333 00:20:26.599 --> 00:20:28.519 they made it seem like it was super steep in 334 00:20:28.559 --> 00:20:29.440 the descriptions. 335 00:20:29.599 --> 00:20:34.640 But yeah, okay, I mean it looks I mean you're 336 00:20:34.640 --> 00:20:36.720 in the middle of nowhere. So I mean that Google 337 00:20:36.720 --> 00:20:40.920 Earth never looks as rugged. That's true. That's true. Oh 338 00:20:41.039 --> 00:20:46.519 that one didn't work this time. This is the basin 339 00:20:46.599 --> 00:20:49.079 that they would have been around. Okay, so yeah, this 340 00:20:49.119 --> 00:20:52.319 is probably amazing. L hunting hard with a bow. If 341 00:20:52.319 --> 00:20:54.240 you'd a rifle, you could prop up right up here 342 00:20:54.279 --> 00:20:58.039 and like shoot right down in the valley. Yeah, this 343 00:20:58.160 --> 00:21:00.559 is beautiful. I mean that looks pretty far. We have 344 00:21:00.640 --> 00:21:02.960 to have like a bear it. Oh yeah, there's some 345 00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:04.240 you should watch Alkiny video. 346 00:21:04.279 --> 00:21:06.079 There's some dudes that shoot across like this and it's 347 00:21:06.079 --> 00:21:08.079 like they got to aim like four inches up. 348 00:21:08.279 --> 00:21:11.960 Yeah, and it like takes a few seconds. So this 349 00:21:12.079 --> 00:21:15.759 is beautiful. What time of here is this picture? June 350 00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:19.440 twenty twenty three. I would have thought, like January. I know, 351 00:21:19.519 --> 00:21:21.920 it looks like it's still like not spring yet. Yeah, 352 00:21:22.519 --> 00:21:25.319 but okay, that's just probably how dry and hot it gets. Yeah, 353 00:21:25.759 --> 00:21:27.119 my desert. 354 00:21:27.400 --> 00:21:30.480 Okay, where was I So, like I said, before they leave, 355 00:21:30.599 --> 00:21:34.559 Andrew agreed to check in every twenty four hours with 356 00:21:34.680 --> 00:21:40.880 his fiance through the inReach device. And that's fine. If 357 00:21:40.920 --> 00:21:45.160 I'm going backcountry hiking, I'll make the agreement. If something happens, 358 00:21:45.160 --> 00:21:49.640 I'll message you, But otherwise I'm I'm going off grid. 359 00:21:49.839 --> 00:21:50.119 Yep. 360 00:21:50.359 --> 00:21:54.359 It's now September seventh to the tenth of twenty twenty five. 361 00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:59.839 GPS data later assembled by investigators shows Andrew and Ian's 362 00:21:59.880 --> 00:22:03.720 trip unfolding in a fairly methodical pattern. They spend a 363 00:22:03.839 --> 00:22:07.920 night at or near the Rio de Los Pinos trailhead, 364 00:22:08.559 --> 00:22:12.200 then move on foot to a backcountry campsite roughly two 365 00:22:12.279 --> 00:22:15.720 miles north, where they remain for several days while hunting 366 00:22:15.759 --> 00:22:19.920 nearby drainages and ridges. During this time, Andrew has been 367 00:22:20.039 --> 00:22:24.279 using his inReach device to send brief positional updates and 368 00:22:24.559 --> 00:22:28.279 messages back home, reassuring family that the hunt is underway 369 00:22:28.319 --> 00:22:33.440 as planned. But things don't go as planned because weather 370 00:22:33.599 --> 00:22:37.480 in the high country is very unstable. By mid September, 371 00:22:37.720 --> 00:22:40.759 storms and fog are moving through the San Juan backcountry, 372 00:22:41.799 --> 00:22:45.039 dropping temperatures and bringing heavy rain to the mountains. The 373 00:22:45.079 --> 00:22:48.880 men continue hunting despite the changing conditions, relying on their 374 00:22:48.920 --> 00:22:52.240 experience and the garment to stay linked to home. 375 00:22:52.920 --> 00:22:58.119 So this is two miles like give or take Yeah, 376 00:22:58.519 --> 00:23:00.440 so they would have went and that's the start of 377 00:23:00.440 --> 00:23:03.160 the trail head, so they would have ended up kind 378 00:23:03.160 --> 00:23:05.400 of right where we were looking at. Yeah, so I'm 379 00:23:05.400 --> 00:23:06.920 gonna get a train and get a better view of 380 00:23:06.920 --> 00:23:09.519 that went through the Yeah, this is actually kind of 381 00:23:09.559 --> 00:23:11.720 perfect right here, if we can pull that up again, 382 00:23:12.160 --> 00:23:14.480 because it went from down in the trail head directly 383 00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:16.319 north two miles. They would have been right on top 384 00:23:16.359 --> 00:23:18.680 of this. Okay, So they went from down here up 385 00:23:18.759 --> 00:23:19.720 there and. 386 00:23:19.720 --> 00:23:22.200 Now in this picture that doesn't look that hard, but 387 00:23:22.240 --> 00:23:24.440 that's probably like seven hundred feet. 388 00:23:24.559 --> 00:23:28.720 Yeah, that's a lot elevation. Those are full sized trees. Yeah, 389 00:23:28.759 --> 00:23:33.680 and like not tiny ones, No, those are the big ones. Like, yeah, 390 00:23:33.720 --> 00:23:37.640 and they look like nothing. Yeah, maybe not seven. 391 00:23:37.480 --> 00:23:40.720 Hundred feet a couple hundred feet, Yeah, don't get it wrong, 392 00:23:41.240 --> 00:23:42.519 don't eyeball that wrong. 393 00:23:45.640 --> 00:23:48.519 Probably has an elevation filter. Well, I'm going to try 394 00:23:48.559 --> 00:23:51.559 and get it on all trails, but like it's so remote, 395 00:23:51.680 --> 00:23:53.519 it's all trails, like, yeah, no one does this. 396 00:23:53.759 --> 00:23:58.400 Yeah, all right, it's now Thursday, September eleventh, twenty twenty five. 397 00:23:58.759 --> 00:24:04.559 This would be the final electronic contact. So Andrew keeps 398 00:24:04.599 --> 00:24:07.960 up his pattern of periodic updates through the morning and 399 00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:11.279 into early afternoon, he sends short messages and location pings 400 00:24:11.319 --> 00:24:14.559 to Bridget, which is his fiancee and his family from 401 00:24:14.799 --> 00:24:19.960