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<v Speaker 1>Hey, this is Chris with Hacking your Leadership on today's

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<v Speaker 1>discussion on employee engagement. I want to go over some

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<v Speaker 1>content that I saw on LinkedIn from Susan David. She's

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<v Speaker 1>a PhD and a psychologist, best selling author, uh, and

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<v Speaker 1>she's a lot of a lot of influence on LinkedIn,

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<v Speaker 1>and I saw something from her recently that I liked

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<v Speaker 1>because I think it calls out something that a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of leaders have kind of been kind of put into

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<v Speaker 1>a box. You know. We talked about over the years,

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<v Speaker 1>how it used to be these you know, hard skills

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<v Speaker 1>that that leaders had to have with them accountability, you know, results, uh,

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<v Speaker 1>and then we moved into this kind of era of

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<v Speaker 1>where softer skills are are required, and no one likes

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<v Speaker 1>using that term anymore because some because they are harder

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<v Speaker 1>for a lot of people. If you're really good at

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<v Speaker 1>at the at the accountability piece and the driving results

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<v Speaker 1>and numbers piece, you might it might be more difficult

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<v Speaker 1>for you to have softer skills like empathy, which makes

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<v Speaker 1>those kind of the harder skills. But the part of

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<v Speaker 1>this I want to talk about is that I think

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<v Speaker 1>that the word empathy and the skill of having empathy

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<v Speaker 1>has become this almost umbrella term for the softer skills,

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<v Speaker 1>the people skills, the ability to get people to follow

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<v Speaker 1>you and to do what is necessary to get the

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<v Speaker 1>job done, not because they're afraid of losing their job,

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<v Speaker 1>but because they have made a commitment to the relationship

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<v Speaker 1>between their leader, you and them. And I know a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of leaders out there who are very good at this,

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<v Speaker 1>who have empathy, but they lack other areas of these

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<v Speaker 1>you know, kind of softer people skills, and yet it

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<v Speaker 1>becomes like this get out of jail free card of

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<v Speaker 1>having empathy. And this post by Susan David kind of

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<v Speaker 1>called this out. She talks about things like emotional regulation, values,

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<v Speaker 1>aligned responding, and authenticity as equally important hearts of what

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<v Speaker 1>matters to leadership, and that kind of really struck a

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<v Speaker 1>chord with me because I started thinking about leaders in

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<v Speaker 1>my life. For leaders that I know who are very

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<v Speaker 1>empathetic people, but they're not great at regulating their emotions,

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<v Speaker 1>they're not great at being authentic there maybe they don't

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<v Speaker 1>respond aligned with a with a perceived value system, and

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<v Speaker 1>so they kind of have this like box checked of

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<v Speaker 1>soft skills, but it doesn't make them as impactful or

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<v Speaker 1>as as productive in terms of the leadership space as

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<v Speaker 1>they could be. And so I kind of want to

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<v Speaker 1>kind of dissect this a little bit because these skills

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<v Speaker 1>I think.

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<v Speaker 2>Are just as important. Yeah, and I think too, I

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<v Speaker 2>like about the pie chart that she's got here, this

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<v Speaker 2>is like the whatever you want to define this quote

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<v Speaker 2>unquote hard skills, whether it's accountability or driving business or

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<v Speaker 2>whatever that might be. That's also a part of the

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<v Speaker 2>pie chart of course. So again, yeah, but I think

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<v Speaker 2>sometimes we have this thing where it's like it's one

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<v Speaker 2>or the other, or it has to be fifty to fifty,

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<v Speaker 2>or like they know all of that these things are

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<v Speaker 2>required around having great leadership. I think all of these

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<v Speaker 2>things have an element of emotional legility. While there's a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of things that I do as a leader over

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<v Speaker 2>the years where I've learned how to, you know, kind

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<v Speaker 2>of connect with people and and be consistent in my

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<v Speaker 2>own emotions for the most part. For the most part,

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<v Speaker 2>I will say that, you know, to be authentically who

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<v Speaker 2>I am, to to have, you know, an element of empathy,

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<v Speaker 2>to engage with people, meet them where they're at. There's

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<v Speaker 2>still very much a part of me that is driven

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<v Speaker 2>in regards to making sure that we have consistent things

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<v Speaker 2>like accountability and responsibility and that we are understanding how

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<v Speaker 2>all of this work ties to the outcomes that we

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<v Speaker 2>are responsible for. So again it's I think even the

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<v Speaker 2>and I like that we're even kind of challenging the

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<v Speaker 2>idea of the words soft, like you know, you think

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<v Speaker 2>of now these soft skills and how it got labeled

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<v Speaker 2>that way many decades ago, you know, which was really

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<v Speaker 2>just kind of you know, code for like people that

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<v Speaker 2>are you know, doing well at connecting and understanding and listening.

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<v Speaker 2>And these are not bad things. I just think they

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<v Speaker 2>were very h They were very against the grain when

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<v Speaker 2>it came to that old authoritative leadership, right, and the

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<v Speaker 2>realization that if you really want people to show up

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<v Speaker 2>at their best, if you really want people to take

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<v Speaker 2>smart calculator risks and want to learn and to grow

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<v Speaker 2>and to push the agenda, you have to find a

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<v Speaker 2>way to connect with them. Besides just work really hard

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<v Speaker 2>and do these things and check these boxes. You've got

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<v Speaker 2>to connect with them in a way that allows them

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<v Speaker 2>to be curious and to ask more questions, and to

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<v Speaker 2>show elements of humility and and and show the elements

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<v Speaker 2>of courage, and these are all things that I think

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<v Speaker 2>matter a lot when you're trying to grow your business.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, I agree with that completely. I think you know,

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<v Speaker 1>as as everything or almost everything human beings do, it's

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<v Speaker 1>a pendulum and it has to swing wide before it

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<v Speaker 1>finds it. It's you know, kind of happy medium. And

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<v Speaker 1>so you know, if you if you think back to

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<v Speaker 1>you know, the last you know, call it thirty years,

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<v Speaker 1>the percentage of the pie chart that would be you know,

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<v Speaker 1>soft skills like empathy and emotional regulation would be you know,

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<v Speaker 1>zero percent or one percent of that of that required

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<v Speaker 1>pie chart. And then over the years it became a

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<v Speaker 1>larger and larger requirement in terms of the ability to

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<v Speaker 1>lead people to the point where it where it overshadowed

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<v Speaker 1>or even replaced the you know, harder skills like accountability

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<v Speaker 1>and the expectation of results. And I think there were

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of leaders, you know, over you know, maybe

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<v Speaker 1>ten years ago or or you know, five to ten

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<v Speaker 1>years ago who who indexed so much higher on those

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<v Speaker 1>skills that they actually didn't know how to hold people

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<v Speaker 1>accountable or drive for results. And it became it went

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<v Speaker 1>too far. And I really like that. I think the

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<v Speaker 1>pendulum has swung back a little bit without losing the

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<v Speaker 1>requirement of those other things. I think we're in the

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<v Speaker 1>process of finding our happy medium where you have to

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<v Speaker 1>have skills like empathy and emotional regulation, value aligned responding, authenticity,

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<v Speaker 1>and you have to hold people accountable, you have to

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<v Speaker 1>drive for results and get the results that are expected

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<v Speaker 1>out of the job. It's the way you get those done.

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<v Speaker 1>The expectation of results has never gone away. It's the

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<v Speaker 1>way you get those results that has changed. And I

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<v Speaker 1>like that that we're getting there. I don't think we're

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<v Speaker 1>one hundred percent there yet, but I know a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of leaders who have really threaded that needle well, and

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<v Speaker 1>they have these skills and they still get the results

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<v Speaker 1>that they're looking for, and they're by far the most

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<v Speaker 1>effective leaders from a long term standpoint of any leaders

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<v Speaker 1>I've ever known. The ones that indexed higher on the

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<v Speaker 1>accountability you know twenty five years ago, they got the

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<v Speaker 1>results there, but they had higher turnover because people didn't

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<v Speaker 1>want to work with them for long period of time.

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<v Speaker 1>And then people who indexed a lot higher on the

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<v Speaker 1>you know, on the softer skills, but didn't have the

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<v Speaker 1>ability to hold people accountable or drive for results, they

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<v Speaker 1>ended up having higher turnover because no one wants to

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<v Speaker 1>work for a person who can't tell them what the

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<v Speaker 1>expectations are or hold the accountable. People want to be

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<v Speaker 1>held accountable because they want to move up. They want

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<v Speaker 1>to see where they where they sit compared to their peers,

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<v Speaker 1>or their likelihood of getting a promotion. And that's a

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<v Speaker 1>lot harder to do if you don't have the ability

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<v Speaker 1>to hold people accountable. And so the leaders that do

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<v Speaker 1>all of this are definitely, you know, the better ones.

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<v Speaker 1>I want to talk specifically about these, these concepts of

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<v Speaker 1>emotional regulation, authenticity and values aligned responding and how people

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<v Speaker 1>do it well versus how many maybe they don't do

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<v Speaker 1>it so much. But first I want to give up

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<v Speaker 1>forard to one of our sponsors. All Right, the first

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<v Speaker 1>one of these I want to talk about is this

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<v Speaker 1>this concept of values aligned responding. Now, I've always believed

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<v Speaker 1>that everybody has their value system, and whether or not

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<v Speaker 1>you can articulate it, it doesn't matter. There's something intrinsically

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<v Speaker 1>in you that is your value system, and it may

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<v Speaker 1>or may not align with somebody else's value system. But

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<v Speaker 1>when you act in any way, people will assign a

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<v Speaker 1>value system to you based on that action, and largely

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<v Speaker 1>it's through the filter of their own values and what

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<v Speaker 1>they what the expectation is. And then the more they

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<v Speaker 1>see you act or respond, the better picture they are

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<v Speaker 1>painted of what your values system actually is. And the

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<v Speaker 1>less they interact with you, the less information they would have.

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<v Speaker 1>If you are responding in a way that is not

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<v Speaker 1>aligned with your own values, or if you don't see

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<v Speaker 1>yourself doing that, I don't think that means that you

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<v Speaker 1>actually aren't responding and align with your values. I think

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<v Speaker 1>what that means is that you have articulated inaccurately to

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<v Speaker 1>yourself what your values are, and if you respond differently

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<v Speaker 1>than that, then it means that what you thought your

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<v Speaker 1>values are are not actually that it's something else. If

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<v Speaker 1>you're a leader and you want to be consistent with

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<v Speaker 1>your people, I think it's important to really be clear

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<v Speaker 1>with yourself on what your values are, and the way

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<v Speaker 1>to do that is to think of situations where those

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<v Speaker 1>values would be tested and how you would respond and

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<v Speaker 1>really be honest with yourself about how you'd respond.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And it's a very I think deep practice. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>because it's one of those things that we think about

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<v Speaker 2>our values and we want to hold tight to them,

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<v Speaker 2>and we think about what we've learned over time and

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<v Speaker 2>what we gain from our our our families, what we

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<v Speaker 2>gain from peers, from we gain from mentors, and we

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<v Speaker 2>feel very strongly that we all live our values. And

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<v Speaker 2>it can be really hard to think about times when

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<v Speaker 2>you didn't live your values or when you you know,

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<v Speaker 2>when you're not showing up in the way that you

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<v Speaker 2>feel that you should show up, when you're allowing things,

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<v Speaker 2>whether it's your emotions or your ego or whatever it

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<v Speaker 2>might be, to have to impact a decision or an

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<v Speaker 2>action or behavior that you're going to have, and it

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<v Speaker 2>can be really hard to consider that think about it.

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<v Speaker 2>It's much easier to deflect it. It's much easier to

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<v Speaker 2>give you all the reasons why you did it the

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<v Speaker 2>way that you did it, versus just owning the fact

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<v Speaker 2>that like, nope, like no matter what was going on

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<v Speaker 2>around me, no matter what may have been influencing this,

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<v Speaker 2>I still made this decision. I still did this thing,

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<v Speaker 2>and I have to own it. And that can be

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<v Speaker 2>a really hard practice. I think that one of the

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<v Speaker 2>ways in the leadership space to make sure that these

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<v Speaker 2>are coming to life is as you are connecting with

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<v Speaker 2>your people, as you are building those relationships over time

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<v Speaker 2>and creating places of trust and everything. It's to share,

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<v Speaker 2>share these values, share these things that you feel mean

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<v Speaker 2>the most to you, and then ask people like am

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<v Speaker 2>I living this? Or can you think of a time

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<v Speaker 2>when maybe this value that I hold really dearly to

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<v Speaker 2>me is that didn't come to life in a way

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<v Speaker 2>that it should have. Like because to your point, the

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<v Speaker 2>the not just living the value, but working with other

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<v Speaker 2>people and how they see the value that you did

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<v Speaker 2>or how they perceive it through their own values is

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<v Speaker 2>also a big part of building the trust needed with

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<v Speaker 2>a team to have you know, the best relationships possible

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<v Speaker 2>and to be able to do the best work possible.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think that's I think that's spot on. It's

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<v Speaker 1>it's easy to come up with hypotheticals about how you

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<v Speaker 1>think you would respond in a situation, and usually what

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<v Speaker 1>those result in is an aspirational values system. And that's okay. Like,

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<v Speaker 1>if you don't have the experience to have gone through it,

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<v Speaker 1>then there's no way to do this besides hypotheticals and aspirations.

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<v Speaker 1>What's important, though, is to make sure that you debrief

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<v Speaker 1>with yourself after something happened to see did this align

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<v Speaker 1>because because if you're stating what your values are to

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<v Speaker 1>people and then you do something that doesn't align with it,

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<v Speaker 1>it doesn't mean that you went against your values. It

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<v Speaker 1>means you were wrong about your values. It means you

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<v Speaker 1>were wrong about what your actual what's actually important to you.

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<v Speaker 1>And that doesn't that isn't necessarily a bad thing. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>life is a learning process, and leadership is a learning process.

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<v Speaker 1>But the goal is to make sure that what your

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<v Speaker 1>stated values are and what you actually value are the

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<v Speaker 1>same thing. And the only way to do that is

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<v Speaker 1>through that debriefing process and and kind of you know,

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<v Speaker 1>kind of doing this this self, having the self awareness

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<v Speaker 1>to go through the actions and if you are and

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<v Speaker 1>if you're unhappy with the result, if you don't like

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<v Speaker 1>that you responded in a certain way, it doesn't necessarily

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<v Speaker 1>mean that you would do it differently next time, because

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<v Speaker 1>if you don't like the way you responded, that's the

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<v Speaker 1>inherent headbutting of what you thought your values were to

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<v Speaker 1>how you responded. Kind of meeting each other in the street, Right,

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<v Speaker 1>it's this like, uh, oh, I thought I was I

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<v Speaker 1>thought I believed this. It turns out I don't believe it.

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<v Speaker 1>Enough to actually do something about it or whatever that

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<v Speaker 1>whatever that is, but that doesn't mean that you would

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<v Speaker 1>do it differently next time. If you would do it

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<v Speaker 1>differently next time, then you have to find out why

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<v Speaker 1>it is that you didn't do it this time, what

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<v Speaker 1>what kept you from doing it, what other elements were there.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's fine too, you go through that, but but

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<v Speaker 1>it's but having the skill of being able to do

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<v Speaker 1>this process matters just as much as any empathy you

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<v Speaker 1>might have for your people, because this will pay picture

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<v Speaker 1>to them about what your values actually are, because they

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<v Speaker 1>are going to start trying to predict how you respond,

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<v Speaker 1>how you will respond in situations, and the more predictable

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<v Speaker 1>you are, the better you will be perceived as a leader,

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<v Speaker 1>because they want to know what they can come to

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<v Speaker 1>you for and what they can't come to you for.

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<v Speaker 1>They want to be able to know how you're going

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<v Speaker 1>to respond in any situation, and if you are aligned

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<v Speaker 1>with your values and clear both of those are, and

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<v Speaker 1>they can predict how you're going to respond based on

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<v Speaker 1>the situation, then they will see you as a far

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<v Speaker 1>more effective leader than a person who is, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>kind of unpredictable but maybe still has empathy and so

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<v Speaker 1>I think this is a it's a very important process

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<v Speaker 1>to go through as a leader. It does take time,

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<v Speaker 1>but it can be done as long as each opportunity

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<v Speaker 1>you have you take advantage of it. Thank you for

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<v Speaker 1>joining us in this discussion on employ engagement. We'll see

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<v Speaker 1>you next Thursday for the next one. Have a great day.