WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:02.799 You're on the bus an hour from home in bumper 2 00:00:02.839 --> 00:00:05.400 to bumper traffic, creeping forward a few. 3 00:00:05.240 --> 00:00:09.119 Inches at a time. Someone's kids are screaming, and suddenly 4 00:00:09.119 --> 00:00:10.160 your back is too. 5 00:00:11.599 --> 00:00:15.720 Luckily, Panadal extra film coated tablets are boosted by caffeine 6 00:00:15.759 --> 00:00:17.600 and they get to work in as little as ten 7 00:00:17.760 --> 00:00:22.000 minutes for powerful relief. That's more than just paracetamol. That's 8 00:00:22.079 --> 00:00:26.359 one for Panadal speed based on absorption data contains paracetamol. 9 00:00:26.440 --> 00:00:27.839 Always read the label or leaflet. 10 00:00:30.440 --> 00:00:33.840 Heyologites, what's up it to me? It's Ali Ward, here 11 00:00:33.880 --> 00:00:36.679 we are. It's finally time. It's the moment you've been 12 00:00:36.679 --> 00:00:43.079 waiting months for a Cephala podcast. Oh okay. Toothology comes 13 00:00:43.119 --> 00:00:47.719 from tooth, which is Greek for cuttlefish or squid. What's 14 00:00:47.719 --> 00:00:50.759 a cephalopod mean? Well, that comes from cephala, which means 15 00:00:51.119 --> 00:00:55.039 head and pod feet because they essentially look like a giant, 16 00:00:55.119 --> 00:00:57.960 long brain with a mop of feet glued on. So 17 00:00:58.039 --> 00:01:01.280 this week's episode sawba squid and squids and squids and 18 00:01:01.280 --> 00:01:06.760 octopuses and cuttlefish. They are adorable, shape shifting, possibly alien, 19 00:01:07.480 --> 00:01:11.680 creepy alive cartoons. I love them even more after recording 20 00:01:11.680 --> 00:01:14.280 this I would hug every one of them if I could, 21 00:01:14.280 --> 00:01:16.840 But first I want to say thank you and give 22 00:01:16.879 --> 00:01:20.040 you all an audio hug. To everyone who's bought merch 23 00:01:20.120 --> 00:01:23.200 at ologiesmarch dot com there's pins and hats and all 24 00:01:23.319 --> 00:01:25.920 kinds of things and totes. And to all of the 25 00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:29.000 folks supporting for even twenty five cents in an episode on 26 00:01:29.079 --> 00:01:33.480 Patreon dot com slash ologies. That gets you some exclusive content, 27 00:01:33.599 --> 00:01:37.480 it gets my undying affection, and also your questions go 28 00:01:37.560 --> 00:01:39.959 to the front of the line to theologists. Thank you 29 00:01:40.000 --> 00:01:42.200 for supporting the show. Also, you can give back for 30 00:01:42.319 --> 00:01:45.000 no money, zero dollars, just a little bit of effort 31 00:01:45.319 --> 00:01:48.879 when you rate and review and subscribe. That keeps ologies 32 00:01:48.959 --> 00:01:51.079 up in the iTunes charts, so more people see it 33 00:01:51.120 --> 00:01:53.280 and say, what's this shit and then listen to it, 34 00:01:53.319 --> 00:01:54.640 and then there are more of us out there to 35 00:01:54.719 --> 00:01:58.400 delight in primate butts and laughter, science, etc. So I 36 00:01:58.519 --> 00:02:01.519 read each and every review weeks. I creep on them 37 00:02:01.560 --> 00:02:02.000 so hard. 38 00:02:02.040 --> 00:02:03.120 They mean so much to me. 39 00:02:03.439 --> 00:02:05.159 Just the fact that I get to make this podcast 40 00:02:05.159 --> 00:02:10.719 and you guys listen is like page CWS says, fantastic podcast. 41 00:02:10.759 --> 00:02:12.319 I recently had a dream that I was an uber 42 00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:16.240 driver roll around, I'm listening to ologies. I stopped and 43 00:02:16.319 --> 00:02:17.560 ali Ward got in my car. 44 00:02:17.680 --> 00:02:18.360 I got really. 45 00:02:18.199 --> 00:02:20.560 Embarrassed, and her show was streaming while she was in 46 00:02:20.560 --> 00:02:22.719 the car, so I tried to slightly change it without 47 00:02:22.719 --> 00:02:26.520 her noticing. I just want to let Peage know that 48 00:02:26.520 --> 00:02:30.360 that wasn't a dream. What if we actually did that 49 00:02:30.400 --> 00:02:32.879 in another astral plane? Anyway, thanks for the reviews. 50 00:02:33.199 --> 00:02:34.960 Okay, back to squid. Who squid? 51 00:02:35.240 --> 00:02:37.919 They look like swim and dicks with parrot beaks and 52 00:02:37.919 --> 00:02:40.080 they are alive invisibility cloaks. 53 00:02:40.280 --> 00:02:41.520 But are they aliens? 54 00:02:41.759 --> 00:02:42.879 How do they change color? 55 00:02:42.919 --> 00:02:44.520 Can they kill you? What's a kraken? 56 00:02:44.759 --> 00:02:47.639 I very excitedly met with a squid scientist that I've 57 00:02:47.639 --> 00:02:51.120 been fawning over on Twitter for months after a post 58 00:02:51.120 --> 00:02:54.879 of hers about squid went viral. What happened was multiple 59 00:02:54.960 --> 00:02:58.080 Jabbronis tried to tell her that her squid were cuttlefish, 60 00:02:58.120 --> 00:03:03.080 and she's like, n I'm a squid scientist, there's quid. 61 00:03:03.319 --> 00:03:06.639 So I've become a huge fangirl of her general knowledge 62 00:03:06.680 --> 00:03:09.840 and passion about squids, so much that I took a 63 00:03:09.919 --> 00:03:13.560 train two hours from New York to Connecticut and back 64 00:03:13.639 --> 00:03:16.719 in one day just to spend an hour with her. 65 00:03:17.080 --> 00:03:19.240 She picked me up from the train station and told 66 00:03:19.240 --> 00:03:21.599 me i'd recognize her car because it had her Twitter 67 00:03:21.639 --> 00:03:25.120 handle and email plus the words. 68 00:03:24.840 --> 00:03:26.080 Ever wonder about squid? 69 00:03:26.199 --> 00:03:29.919 Ask me anything octopus two written on the back window. 70 00:03:30.560 --> 00:03:34.919 Her license plate reads simply squids. It's thirty nine degrees. 71 00:03:35.000 --> 00:03:40.800 I can see my breath. I'm outside new Haven, Connecticut. 72 00:03:40.840 --> 00:03:43.520 First time in Connecticut. I'm looking for a squid car. 73 00:03:43.960 --> 00:03:47.000 I'm so nervous. I've been trying to be her friend, 74 00:03:47.120 --> 00:03:49.159 so hardcore for months online. 75 00:03:49.319 --> 00:03:51.560 What if she doesn't like me? Oh my gosh, I 76 00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:53.280 think I see her. This is so exciting. 77 00:03:57.800 --> 00:03:58.439 Squids. 78 00:03:58.599 --> 00:03:59.360 Oh my gosh. 79 00:03:59.599 --> 00:04:01.960 Hi, Oh my gosh, it's meeting Hi. I'm getting in 80 00:04:02.000 --> 00:04:02.319 your car. 81 00:04:02.919 --> 00:04:03.599 Oh my gosh. 82 00:04:03.639 --> 00:04:06.520 Your life's might really sesselate. We drove around New Haven 83 00:04:06.560 --> 00:04:06.919 a little. 84 00:04:07.039 --> 00:04:10.560 She's a PhD candidate and scientist at University of Connecticut, 85 00:04:10.840 --> 00:04:13.360 and found a library basement to record in and we 86 00:04:13.400 --> 00:04:18.600 talked about iridescent bioluminescent sea creatures and crafty cuttlefish cross 87 00:04:18.680 --> 00:04:24.199 dressing octopus brains. They're shaped so weird again, Alien DNA 88 00:04:24.319 --> 00:04:29.279 weird dating stories both human our own and stephalopod related 89 00:04:29.519 --> 00:04:32.360 and what happens when you blindfold a cuttlefish. So please 90 00:04:32.399 --> 00:04:36.240 get ready to become obsessed with quite possibly the world's 91 00:04:36.319 --> 00:05:00.800 most charming and impassioned squid nerd pathologist Sarah McAnulty. Do 92 00:05:00.800 --> 00:05:02.519 you know that I, for some reason, every time I 93 00:05:02.519 --> 00:05:05.360 want to say your name, I want to say McNulty. 94 00:05:05.720 --> 00:05:07.680 Most people do. Yeah, why do I do that? I 95 00:05:07.720 --> 00:05:10.160 don't know phonetics, Irish phonetics make no sense. 96 00:05:10.199 --> 00:05:12.120 Okay, you are a toothologist. 97 00:05:12.160 --> 00:05:16.680 I'm a touthologist. Yes, so glad you know that word. Yeah, teuthologist. 98 00:05:16.920 --> 00:05:18.399 Do people do you ever say that? Or do you 99 00:05:18.439 --> 00:05:19.800 ever drop that? Cash? 100 00:05:20.240 --> 00:05:22.800 No one knows what I'm talking about. One time someone 101 00:05:22.839 --> 00:05:24.399 asked me if I was a touthologist, and again I 102 00:05:24.439 --> 00:05:26.879 got very excited, but it barely comes up normally. I 103 00:05:26.920 --> 00:05:28.040 just say I'm a squid biologist. 104 00:05:28.240 --> 00:05:28.680 Okay. 105 00:05:28.839 --> 00:05:30.839 You're kind of boned by phonetics because it sounds like 106 00:05:30.879 --> 00:05:31.879 you're an orthodonist. 107 00:05:32.120 --> 00:05:34.759 Yeah, it does sound like you study teeth, and squid 108 00:05:34.800 --> 00:05:37.439 don't even have teeth, so the poor things. 109 00:05:37.240 --> 00:05:40.439 They just have beaks. So yeah, we're hose there. 110 00:05:40.920 --> 00:05:45.519 So you are a squid scientist. Yes, how long you've 111 00:05:45.519 --> 00:05:46.600 been into squid. 112 00:05:46.920 --> 00:05:48.720 So I have been interested in squid since I was 113 00:05:48.759 --> 00:05:52.240 a little kid, but I started actually working with stephalopods 114 00:05:52.279 --> 00:05:54.879 when I was in Right after my sophomore year of college, 115 00:05:54.920 --> 00:05:58.839 I found out about this lab in Woodshole in Massachusetts 116 00:05:58.839 --> 00:06:01.600 that was working on cuttlefish camouflage and I thought that 117 00:06:01.680 --> 00:06:04.120 was like so insane that you could have a career 118 00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:07.480 working on the coolest animal there is. So I like 119 00:06:07.639 --> 00:06:09.800 basically followed the scientist around to places that I knew 120 00:06:09.839 --> 00:06:10.720 who was giving talks and I was. 121 00:06:10.680 --> 00:06:12.959 Like, Hi, I'm Sarah. Please let me work for you. 122 00:06:13.000 --> 00:06:14.399 And he was like you're too young, and I was 123 00:06:14.439 --> 00:06:16.959 like please, though I would really like to work for you. 124 00:06:17.079 --> 00:06:19.199 Sarah sent the lab a very passionate letter where she 125 00:06:19.240 --> 00:06:22.160 basically said, look, if you don't hire me this year, 126 00:06:22.240 --> 00:06:24.439 you're just gonna hear from me next year and the 127 00:06:24.519 --> 00:06:25.160 year after that. 128 00:06:25.439 --> 00:06:28.639 And he was like okay, crazy and gave me an internship. 129 00:06:28.680 --> 00:06:32.839 Sarah has worked with cephalopods ever since octopuses OCTOPI more 130 00:06:32.879 --> 00:06:35.439 on that later in college, and now she works with 131 00:06:35.519 --> 00:06:40.120 little credits called bobtail squid, which are an evolutionary in 132 00:06:40.160 --> 00:06:45.360 between octopuses and cuttlefish. Bobtail squid are little, they have 133 00:06:45.439 --> 00:06:49.240 a shorter, rounded mantle, and they can be these beautiful 134 00:06:49.560 --> 00:06:55.240 iridescent collars. They're also called dumpling squid or stubby squid 135 00:06:55.480 --> 00:06:58.560 because of their shape, and the general consensus is that 136 00:06:58.600 --> 00:07:02.319 they are the cutest things on planet Earth. So I'm sorry, slots, 137 00:07:02.519 --> 00:07:05.240 you've been replaced. Super side note, if you look at 138 00:07:05.240 --> 00:07:08.000 a photo of a bobtail squid and simply cannot even 139 00:07:08.399 --> 00:07:10.560 or you need to scream or punch yourself in the face, 140 00:07:10.839 --> 00:07:14.279 this is something that Yale researchers have dubbed cute aggression. 141 00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:18.560 One hypothesis is that the brain simply cannot deal with 142 00:07:18.639 --> 00:07:22.000 that much positive stimulation at once and turn some of 143 00:07:22.000 --> 00:07:25.680 it into the opposite, just some negative emotion, which for 144 00:07:25.720 --> 00:07:28.720 most people ends up being aggression or screaming or squealing 145 00:07:28.759 --> 00:07:33.519 or slapping themselves. So google bobtail squid and then bury 146 00:07:33.560 --> 00:07:37.040 your face into a couch cushion and shriek with abandon. 147 00:07:37.120 --> 00:07:40.199 It's fine, it's okay, it'll be helpful. What's the timeline 148 00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:43.000 between octopus and squid and bobtail squid? I know that's 149 00:07:43.040 --> 00:07:45.839 a stupid, stupid question, but like, what did one come 150 00:07:45.920 --> 00:07:47.839 first and then another? What happened. 151 00:07:47.920 --> 00:07:51.199 So, okay, first we had like amanites, and those are 152 00:07:51.199 --> 00:07:53.560 those things that look like Nautilus's, those like spiral shells, 153 00:07:53.680 --> 00:07:56.319 I think a common ancestor of those, we had bellamites, 154 00:07:56.839 --> 00:08:00.240 and those are basically squid with shells like long, skinny 155 00:08:01.399 --> 00:08:05.120 cone shells. And then they brought the shells inside their 156 00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:07.240 body instead of outside their body, and then they most 157 00:08:07.240 --> 00:08:11.360 of them lost the shells completely and some keep them inside. 158 00:08:11.360 --> 00:08:14.160 So there's like squid, like the kind of squid that 159 00:08:14.160 --> 00:08:16.319 you eat, and calamari still has something called a pen, 160 00:08:16.399 --> 00:08:19.160 which is like a clear, bendy. 161 00:08:20.519 --> 00:08:21.319 Version of a shell. 162 00:08:21.759 --> 00:08:26.480 And cuttlefish have cuttlebones, which are these actually birds eat 163 00:08:26.519 --> 00:08:28.000 them for like calcium, but they have they're like little 164 00:08:28.000 --> 00:08:31.399 buoyancy devices right in the back of the animal. And 165 00:08:31.439 --> 00:08:35.559 then our bobtail squid have absolutely nothing at all. But yeah, 166 00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:40.440 so octopuses diverge from squid and cuttlefish a long time ago, 167 00:08:40.519 --> 00:08:42.919 I don't remember exactly how many millions of years ago, 168 00:08:44.480 --> 00:08:48.159 So they're off on their own branch with vampire squid, 169 00:08:48.279 --> 00:08:53.240 which are not either. They're more like octopuses than squid. 170 00:08:53.879 --> 00:08:56.279 What is a vampire squid? Vampire squid are dope. 171 00:08:56.320 --> 00:09:01.559 So vampire squid are these deep sea cephalopods that look 172 00:09:01.679 --> 00:09:04.360 kind of like a Dumbo octopus if you've seen those, 173 00:09:04.360 --> 00:09:08.720 But they're dark maroon red and at each at the 174 00:09:08.799 --> 00:09:10.279 end of each of their arms, they have a little 175 00:09:10.840 --> 00:09:14.000 organ that has biluminescence, so each of the tips of 176 00:09:14.000 --> 00:09:16.120 their arms are biluminescent, and then they have these big 177 00:09:16.159 --> 00:09:18.519 spots on either side of their head. They are biluminescent 178 00:09:18.679 --> 00:09:21.159 to give the impression that they have huge eyes to 179 00:09:21.200 --> 00:09:23.639 make other animals think they're way bigger than they actually are. 180 00:09:23.799 --> 00:09:26.320 Okay, I just look these things up. Who boy, they're 181 00:09:26.360 --> 00:09:30.399 this deep crimson color, and their arms are more webbed, 182 00:09:30.559 --> 00:09:35.039 kind of like a bloody umbrella with a head. And 183 00:09:35.080 --> 00:09:40.960 their Latin genus and species name is vampirate toothist infernalis, 184 00:09:41.120 --> 00:09:43.360 and it translates to something that sounds like a title 185 00:09:43.399 --> 00:09:47.159 to a grindhouse film, Vampire squid from Hell. That is 186 00:09:47.200 --> 00:09:49.799 what their Latin name means, vampire squid from Hell. Do 187 00:09:49.879 --> 00:09:53.399 they have knives and lengthy rap sheets of criminal offenses? 188 00:09:54.159 --> 00:09:54.879 Not so much. 189 00:09:54.960 --> 00:09:57.840 And they are non violent little animals that basically just 190 00:09:57.879 --> 00:10:01.399 eat dead shit that falls from them above because they 191 00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:03.559 live so deep that when things die above, it just 192 00:10:03.559 --> 00:10:04.120 sinks down. 193 00:10:04.159 --> 00:10:05.440 That's called marine snow. 194 00:10:05.919 --> 00:10:10.840 And they oh god, which is quite a euphemism, is disgusting. 195 00:10:10.840 --> 00:10:11.559 It's just like dead stuff. 196 00:10:11.600 --> 00:10:13.320 And they're just calling the vampire squids because they're maroon. 197 00:10:13.559 --> 00:10:15.919 They look really scary, so like each of their arms 198 00:10:15.960 --> 00:10:18.279 has these little spikes sticking off of it, so they 199 00:10:18.360 --> 00:10:20.960 look really intimidating. You would think I wouldn't want to 200 00:10:21.639 --> 00:10:23.519 run into one of those, But they're just eating dead 201 00:10:23.519 --> 00:10:25.120 stuff and floating around, so it's. 202 00:10:24.960 --> 00:10:27.279 Not too bad. I think it's more they got more 203 00:10:27.320 --> 00:10:28.159 bark and bite. 204 00:10:28.679 --> 00:10:31.840 There's when you talk about marine snow, there's pooh in 205 00:10:31.879 --> 00:10:32.600 there too, right. 206 00:10:32.480 --> 00:10:35.399 Oh totally okay, ye, okay, why squid? 207 00:10:35.440 --> 00:10:38.879 I mean, obviously squid are the coolest, but like what 208 00:10:39.679 --> 00:10:42.000 illuminated you to how cool squid were? 209 00:10:42.360 --> 00:10:45.240 So when I was when I first realized that squid 210 00:10:45.279 --> 00:10:48.399 were awesome, I was about eight and I was watching 211 00:10:48.399 --> 00:10:51.320 this natural geographic like video. 212 00:10:51.159 --> 00:10:52.120 That I got from the library. 213 00:10:52.320 --> 00:10:56.559 It was all about the ocean fish, coral reefs, reeves, reefs, 214 00:10:56.759 --> 00:10:58.799 not sure, dolphins and what have you. 215 00:10:59.080 --> 00:11:01.960 But there was segment about halfway through where they play 216 00:11:02.000 --> 00:11:04.679 twilight Zone music and then they introduce the cuttlefish, and 217 00:11:04.720 --> 00:11:05.120 I was. 218 00:11:05.120 --> 00:11:08.519 Just like, what the fuck is that? 219 00:11:09.399 --> 00:11:14.200 You are entering another dimension, a watery world between time 220 00:11:14.279 --> 00:11:22.919 and space, where strange creatures whose bizarre pounds the alien zone, and. 221 00:11:22.840 --> 00:11:24.799 I was like, I need to know more about that animal. 222 00:11:25.279 --> 00:11:28.679 So in the video, it's doing this like passing cloud maneuver. 223 00:11:28.879 --> 00:11:31.879 So cuttlefish can change color as quickly as they think 224 00:11:31.919 --> 00:11:37.399 about it, because each little color changing cell is controlled 225 00:11:37.399 --> 00:11:40.120 by neurons, so it's as if you think it, you 226 00:11:40.159 --> 00:11:43.559 can change, which is really cool. So they're called chromatophores, 227 00:11:44.159 --> 00:11:47.799 and these little sacks of pigment, little circles spheres of 228 00:11:47.840 --> 00:11:51.519 pigment that are surrounded by little cellular muscles that can 229 00:11:51.519 --> 00:11:54.240 stretch the pigment out like a pancake and then let 230 00:11:54.279 --> 00:11:56.279 it release and go back to a little teeny tiny 231 00:11:56.320 --> 00:11:56.759 beach ball. 232 00:11:56.919 --> 00:12:01.080 So they can turn these on in pattern. So I 233 00:12:01.080 --> 00:12:04.759 saw that and was like this is bananas. And yeah. 234 00:12:04.759 --> 00:12:06.480 So I had been into dinosaurs, but then I switched 235 00:12:06.480 --> 00:12:09.200 over to sephal pods pretty much right then and there, 236 00:12:09.240 --> 00:12:10.679 and I checked that video out all the time. 237 00:12:11.679 --> 00:12:15.000 You're like, sorry, dinos, sorry, yeah, we don't even know 238 00:12:15.039 --> 00:12:17.240 what color you were, let alone, if you could change 239 00:12:17.240 --> 00:12:20.679 like an LED screen like that nat Geo video which 240 00:12:20.720 --> 00:12:26.039 Sarah posted on her tumblr, Squid Scientistas dot tumbler dot com, 241 00:12:26.240 --> 00:12:30.960 shows cuttlefish flitting about doing what's called dynamic displays, so 242 00:12:31.000 --> 00:12:35.159 they're blinking and changing colors. There's like bands of black 243 00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:39.879 flashing over their body, like if clouds were overhead zooming 244 00:12:39.919 --> 00:12:42.879 past you and through bands of shadow across you, so 245 00:12:43.039 --> 00:12:47.240 it looks like hypnotic and it confuses their prey. It's bananas. 246 00:12:47.279 --> 00:12:51.320 They're like living squishy disco lights. I get why this 247 00:12:51.440 --> 00:12:54.559 video was life changing. When you're obsessed with squid, I 248 00:12:54.559 --> 00:12:57.399 think that makes other people obsessed with your obsession with squid. 249 00:12:57.799 --> 00:12:58.559 That makes sense. 250 00:12:58.679 --> 00:12:59.240 That makes sense. 251 00:12:59.320 --> 00:13:02.159 Yeah, when people are kind of obsessed with cephalopods, do 252 00:13:02.200 --> 00:13:06.039 you think it's their huge brains or their dexterity or 253 00:13:06.039 --> 00:13:08.120 their instant camouflage if people are drawn to. 254 00:13:08.559 --> 00:13:09.919 It's probably different for everybody. 255 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:13.240 But I think one thing that's really drawing and interesting 256 00:13:13.240 --> 00:13:17.720 about cephalopods is that they're really complex animals that diverge 257 00:13:17.840 --> 00:13:19.960 so long ago from us that they've come up with 258 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:23.240 all these really wacky cool ways to get around the 259 00:13:23.279 --> 00:13:25.879 same problems that any other organism has to get around, 260 00:13:25.919 --> 00:13:29.879 but in a super different way, Like you know, camouflage 261 00:13:29.960 --> 00:13:32.559 is the most crazy different one. 262 00:13:32.799 --> 00:13:33.600 But nuts. 263 00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:36.080 I mean, I believe you watch videos and you're like. 264 00:13:36.399 --> 00:13:39.840 Are so fast it's crazy. 265 00:13:39.960 --> 00:13:44.039 Are we ever going to develop technology to like give 266 00:13:44.120 --> 00:13:46.519 us invisibility cloaks in case we see like someone we 267 00:13:46.559 --> 00:13:48.399 don't want to see at Costco or something. 268 00:13:48.519 --> 00:13:48.799 Yeah. 269 00:13:49.000 --> 00:13:51.200 One thing that is really really hard to figure out 270 00:13:51.360 --> 00:13:55.120 is how cephalopods look at their environment and then pick 271 00:13:55.159 --> 00:13:57.559 what to do. Because it's not as though they're saying, okay, 272 00:13:57.919 --> 00:13:59.879 I bet I could do a pretty good rendition of that. 273 00:14:00.320 --> 00:14:04.159 They take the whole like environment, and then they kind 274 00:14:04.159 --> 00:14:06.240 of like say, okay, I bet this would fit. It's 275 00:14:06.279 --> 00:14:07.960 like looking for a new piece of furniture in a room, 276 00:14:08.039 --> 00:14:09.960 not to match what you've got, but to kind of 277 00:14:10.000 --> 00:14:11.240 go with the flow of the room. 278 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:12.519 But there are scientists. 279 00:14:12.120 --> 00:14:14.399 Working on that in Woodsholl, in that lab that I 280 00:14:14.440 --> 00:14:17.240 used to work for, understanding what cues they're using from 281 00:14:17.279 --> 00:14:19.519 the environment to pick what to look like. 282 00:14:19.960 --> 00:14:22.759 And getting back to that stretching the pigments out like 283 00:14:22.799 --> 00:14:24.919 a pancake and then smushing them like a beach ball. 284 00:14:25.200 --> 00:14:27.440 Does that change the way that the light reflects on 285 00:14:27.440 --> 00:14:29.159 the pigment or how does that change the color? 286 00:14:29.519 --> 00:14:33.360 So ink? Okay, So we've got multiple layers of cephalopod skin. 287 00:14:33.480 --> 00:14:37.320 On the bottom base layer for some cephalopods like cuddlefish, 288 00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:41.519 there's this really really white cell type called lucafors, and 289 00:14:41.559 --> 00:14:44.559 these cells never change color. It's just whatever color you 290 00:14:44.559 --> 00:14:46.240 shoot at them is the color that they give back 291 00:14:46.279 --> 00:14:48.879 to you. And it's like the purest white in the 292 00:14:48.879 --> 00:14:52.200 animal kingdom. So there are grants working to study this 293 00:14:52.360 --> 00:14:56.600 to make e readers better so that the back of 294 00:14:56.639 --> 00:15:00.639 the page is the whitest version. Your eyes have more 295 00:15:00.679 --> 00:15:03.600 pigment or more contrast to pick up on words, which 296 00:15:03.639 --> 00:15:04.039 is cool. 297 00:15:04.200 --> 00:15:05.720 Okay. So that's that's base. 298 00:15:05.879 --> 00:15:08.039 And then above that we have a ritiphores, and our 299 00:15:08.080 --> 00:15:12.000 ritifhors really are the ones that change color, but they 300 00:15:12.080 --> 00:15:14.480 change color the slowest, so they can go from like 301 00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:18.000 red to blue purple sort of. 302 00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:20.639 And those are changing hormonally, so they change. 303 00:15:20.440 --> 00:15:26.519 A lot slower, but they're the kind of sparkly urdescent cells. 304 00:15:27.200 --> 00:15:28.759 And then on top of those, those are where your 305 00:15:28.799 --> 00:15:33.240 chromatophors are, and chrematophors are one color all the time, 306 00:15:33.240 --> 00:15:35.360 but you have many different colors of chromatophors. 307 00:15:35.360 --> 00:15:36.840 All in your kind of palette. 308 00:15:37.000 --> 00:15:38.960 So there are like brown ones and yellow ones and 309 00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:43.759 reddish ones, so which they choose to turn on will 310 00:15:43.799 --> 00:15:46.840 determine the pattern that you see. So you're using all 311 00:15:46.879 --> 00:15:51.440 of these different cell types to amalgamate pattern. 312 00:15:51.679 --> 00:15:54.559 Is it like a like a TV screen or LED screen? 313 00:15:54.720 --> 00:15:56.240 Like is it similar to that? 314 00:15:56.480 --> 00:16:00.919 Or that would require me to understand how LEDs and 315 00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:02.039 I have no idea. 316 00:16:02.120 --> 00:16:04.519 I tried to check to see if this TV screen 317 00:16:04.679 --> 00:16:07.440 analogy was whack. I was like, maybe that was embarrassing 318 00:16:07.480 --> 00:16:09.240 to say, And then I went down a rabbit hole 319 00:16:09.320 --> 00:16:15.559 of LCD liquid crystal display backlit by LED light emitting diodes, 320 00:16:15.840 --> 00:16:18.519 but also jumbotrons, which is actually a trademark name and 321 00:16:18.559 --> 00:16:22.039 Sony no longer makes them, but LED jumbotrons if those 322 00:16:22.080 --> 00:16:25.240 were like chromatophores, And then I found a published paper 323 00:16:25.279 --> 00:16:29.440 called Dynamic Skin Patterns in Cephalopods published last year, which 324 00:16:29.480 --> 00:16:33.320 said in the opening graph quote with parallels to the 325 00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:39.120 pixels on a television screen, cephalopod chromatophores. So boom, I'm 326 00:16:39.159 --> 00:16:42.960 sticking with it, don't at me? Scientists agree? Now we 327 00:16:43.080 --> 00:16:46.200 have more important squid gossip to address. So I have 328 00:16:46.279 --> 00:16:48.360 two pieces of flim flamm I need you took on 329 00:16:48.960 --> 00:16:54.039 like straightaway. I had an amazing doctor Christacker on icheologist, 330 00:16:54.200 --> 00:16:57.279 and she told me that giant squid live. 331 00:16:57.240 --> 00:16:58.240 Like five years. 332 00:16:58.559 --> 00:17:00.840 Is that true? That squid have really lifespans? 333 00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:03.840 Oh yeah, so some squid leap live even shorter lifespans 334 00:17:03.840 --> 00:17:06.359 than that. So our bobtail squid, we think, live about 335 00:17:06.440 --> 00:17:09.559 nine months in the wild, so really short. And then 336 00:17:09.880 --> 00:17:12.400 we think at the long end of things is like 337 00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:13.279 about five years. 338 00:17:13.400 --> 00:17:15.079 If they could live to one hundred years, would they 339 00:17:15.119 --> 00:17:15.720 take over the world? 340 00:17:15.799 --> 00:17:16.599 Would we be screwed? 341 00:17:16.839 --> 00:17:18.559 One would have to assume yes. Yeah. 342 00:17:18.599 --> 00:17:21.039 The other flip flam I have to debunk is our 343 00:17:21.079 --> 00:17:25.279 octopus and squid possibly alien DNA and that's why they're 344 00:17:25.319 --> 00:17:25.680 so cool. 345 00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:30.119 Let's talk about that one. So yeah, no, cephalopods are 346 00:17:30.160 --> 00:17:33.839 not aliens. So here's what happened. So the octopus genome 347 00:17:33.880 --> 00:17:36.880 came out and there's a lot of weird cool stuff 348 00:17:36.880 --> 00:17:39.000 in that genome, and they were saying, Okay, there's all this. 349 00:17:39.000 --> 00:17:42.119 Weird stuff going on, like it's wait, really different, it's 350 00:17:42.160 --> 00:17:46.119 like it's an alien, they said casually to a journalist, 351 00:17:46.319 --> 00:17:48.839 And then journalists, cephalopods are aliens. 352 00:17:48.920 --> 00:17:51.680 We're like a shit good. No it's not. We're saying 353 00:17:51.720 --> 00:17:53.759 like alien like squid did not come from space. 354 00:17:53.880 --> 00:17:55.680 So talk to me a little bit about your work 355 00:17:55.720 --> 00:17:58.839 with bacteria interactions. I know you work with bobtail squid, 356 00:17:58.880 --> 00:18:02.359 which are these cute, cute little guys, and you study 357 00:18:02.680 --> 00:18:05.759 bioluminescent bacteria that lives on their underside. 358 00:18:06.160 --> 00:18:09.279 Right, So the bobtail squid has this like symbiosis with 359 00:18:09.759 --> 00:18:10.559 the bacterium. 360 00:18:11.240 --> 00:18:13.680 Right, it's bioluminescent. It's called Vibrio fischeri. 361 00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:16.640 So they have this organ that is appropriately called a 362 00:18:16.720 --> 00:18:18.880 light organ and that's where the bacteria live. 363 00:18:19.039 --> 00:18:20.480 It's really cool. Yeah, what a rig. 364 00:18:21.319 --> 00:18:24.799 It's an evolutionary like I just shouldn't use the word 365 00:18:24.920 --> 00:18:29.960 mind fuck, but it's evolutionarily really really complex and cool. 366 00:18:30.079 --> 00:18:33.279 So bobtail squid have these two little crips where they 367 00:18:33.319 --> 00:18:38.119 house one species, one single species of bioluminescent bacteria, like 368 00:18:38.160 --> 00:18:41.720 a bunch of glowing purse chihuahuas, but the purse is 369 00:18:41.759 --> 00:18:45.119 your skin and the chihuahuas help you live. Now, because 370 00:18:45.119 --> 00:18:47.839 it's just one species of bacteria that they have this 371 00:18:47.920 --> 00:18:51.720 relationship with, it's way easier to study and isolate than 372 00:18:51.799 --> 00:18:54.960 a microbiome with a bunch of different species, and in 373 00:18:55.000 --> 00:18:58.119 Sarah's lab they're looking at the communication between animal and 374 00:18:58.160 --> 00:19:02.599 the bacterium and how the immune cells influence it, like 375 00:19:02.920 --> 00:19:07.279 how they recognize their so called good bacteria. So remember 376 00:19:07.279 --> 00:19:11.480 the glycobiology episode with Michelle d'acua where cells use carbohydrate 377 00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:13.440 flags to kind of check each other out. 378 00:19:13.240 --> 00:19:16.400 And we think it's sort of like when the immune 379 00:19:16.440 --> 00:19:19.440 cell and the bacterium first stick to each other, the 380 00:19:19.480 --> 00:19:22.559 immune cells kind of like asking the bacterium a couple questions, like, Okay, 381 00:19:22.839 --> 00:19:25.559 when it comes to lipple polysaccharide, what do you. 382 00:19:25.519 --> 00:19:26.279 Have going on? Okay? 383 00:19:26.279 --> 00:19:28.160 It looks like that, Okay, what do you have going 384 00:19:28.200 --> 00:19:29.599 on for this protein over here? 385 00:19:29.680 --> 00:19:30.000 Okay? 386 00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:32.440 And let me look at this one other thing on 387 00:19:32.480 --> 00:19:35.400 your surface. And with this information combined, I can identify 388 00:19:35.400 --> 00:19:35.880 who you are. 389 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:38.680 Talk to me a little bit about bobtail squid because 390 00:19:39.160 --> 00:19:42.000 they do look like a hybrid between a squid and 391 00:19:42.039 --> 00:19:45.799 an octopus and a cuttlefish. Which is actually how I 392 00:19:45.839 --> 00:19:49.279 got to know and gently stock you is I saw 393 00:19:50.000 --> 00:19:54.319 I saw you tweeted this adorable photo of when you 394 00:19:54.440 --> 00:19:56.440 go check on your squids and like some of them 395 00:19:56.440 --> 00:19:58.519 are totally okay with the checkup, and others pretend to 396 00:19:58.519 --> 00:20:00.640 be rocks, and it was like one bbtail squid that 397 00:20:00.720 --> 00:20:02.559 was covered herself in rocks and was like, now let 398 00:20:02.680 --> 00:20:06.400 us see there, and and then some people tweeted back 399 00:20:06.440 --> 00:20:06.920 at you like. 400 00:20:07.119 --> 00:20:10.400 Pretty sure, you're pretty sure it's cuddlefish. 401 00:20:09.759 --> 00:20:13.960