WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:04.120 Religious fanatics see no issue engaging in the violence, sexism, 2 00:00:04.200 --> 00:00:08.240 and racism, and general malevolent foolishness, provided that they can 3 00:00:08.359 --> 00:00:11.199 end the phrase with but Jesus. Once I was hanging 4 00:00:11.199 --> 00:00:13.320 out with my uncle and a friend of his, and 5 00:00:13.359 --> 00:00:15.839 they thought it would be super fun to start telling 6 00:00:15.880 --> 00:00:20.679 horrible racists and sexist jokes. I out loud said ugh, gross, 7 00:00:21.359 --> 00:00:24.160 And then I was told that it was weird that 8 00:00:24.199 --> 00:00:27.960 I was objecting because I was white, that it's just 9 00:00:28.000 --> 00:00:30.879 a joke. I shouldn't take it so seriously. That they 10 00:00:30.920 --> 00:00:33.240 knew people who fit into the punchline of the joke 11 00:00:33.280 --> 00:00:36.079 that fit those stereotypes, so it was okay, which is 12 00:00:36.079 --> 00:00:39.399 really sort of an admission that they actually believed what 13 00:00:39.399 --> 00:00:42.759 they were saying. And they topped it all off with 14 00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:46.000 someone looking directly into my eyes and saying, but what 15 00:00:46.159 --> 00:00:48.560 really matters the most to me is someone's relationship with 16 00:00:48.679 --> 00:00:51.920 Jesus Christ. I feel like I see that a lot today. 17 00:00:52.119 --> 00:00:54.719 You can just say anything, you can be as unhinged 18 00:00:54.759 --> 00:00:59.159 as possible, provided you end it with but Jesus. Almost 19 00:00:59.159 --> 00:01:01.200 as though it's a challenge to put the person you're 20 00:01:01.240 --> 00:01:03.479 talking with on the back foot, as though now they 21 00:01:03.479 --> 00:01:05.400 have to argue with your whole religion when really they 22 00:01:05.480 --> 00:01:09.239 just objected to you saying something horrible and disgusting. So 23 00:01:10.359 --> 00:01:15.239 I mean, hey, that's pretty gross. I find it really 24 00:01:15.239 --> 00:01:18.519 confusing when I'm thinking about this, because we are told 25 00:01:18.560 --> 00:01:21.159 we're the blasphemers. We're told that we are the ones 26 00:01:21.159 --> 00:01:23.560 who have no morality and that those with morals are 27 00:01:23.599 --> 00:01:27.319 the ones who belong to religion. So I find this confusing. 28 00:01:27.439 --> 00:01:29.319 If you want to call and set me straight and 29 00:01:29.519 --> 00:01:32.719 let me know like that these things actually are, I'm 30 00:01:32.760 --> 00:01:34.760 completely wrong about all of them. Thank if it's a call, 31 00:01:34.799 --> 00:01:36.159 because the show is starting now. 32 00:01:44.400 --> 00:01:45.599 Welcome everybody. 33 00:01:45.599 --> 00:01:48.599 Today is April twenty seventh, twenty twenty five. 34 00:01:48.760 --> 00:01:50.640 How did it already get to April? 35 00:01:50.719 --> 00:01:54.519 It feels simultaneously like it's been two weeks into twenty 36 00:01:54.560 --> 00:01:58.680 twenty five, and also that it's been four years. But anyway, 37 00:01:58.879 --> 00:02:01.799 it is April twenty seven, and I'm your host, Doctor Bennon. 38 00:02:01.799 --> 00:02:05.280 With me today is Sophia Spina. Welcome to the show. 39 00:02:05.439 --> 00:02:07.760 I know is this our we've posted together at least 40 00:02:07.760 --> 00:02:09.439 one of together another. 41 00:02:09.199 --> 00:02:10.800 Time before we hosted together. 42 00:02:11.120 --> 00:02:14.560 Yeah, yeah, I have. 43 00:02:14.840 --> 00:02:16.360 Been all right, I'm excited. 44 00:02:16.400 --> 00:02:19.360 I'm I'm merely graduating from a grad program get them there. 45 00:02:19.439 --> 00:02:22.039 So you know, I'm kind of bragging about that a 46 00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:24.159 little bit because I kept forgetting to tell people and 47 00:02:24.159 --> 00:02:26.400 now I'm like, oh, yeah, like I've been doing grad 48 00:02:26.439 --> 00:02:28.199 school so pretty soaked. 49 00:02:28.599 --> 00:02:32.400 Yeah, And uh we're with regard to your cold open today, 50 00:02:33.240 --> 00:02:35.840 we had some some current events recently, one of them 51 00:02:35.919 --> 00:02:40.000 being of course, related to the pope. And I'm curious 52 00:02:40.039 --> 00:02:42.199 if we have any Catholics in the chat that wants 53 00:02:42.240 --> 00:02:44.840 to number one, tell me why we need a pope? 54 00:02:45.000 --> 00:02:48.800 You know, why, why does a why does one person 55 00:02:49.080 --> 00:02:53.159 get to essentially be you know, infallible and just say 56 00:02:53.199 --> 00:02:57.039 whatever he wants and have that be gospel essentially? Why 57 00:02:57.080 --> 00:02:58.000 do we need to have that? 58 00:02:58.919 --> 00:02:59.400 Why? 59 00:02:59.800 --> 00:03:03.479 You know, why do we praise people who are religious 60 00:03:03.520 --> 00:03:08.159 and who maybe didn't completely genocide anybody? And like why 61 00:03:08.280 --> 00:03:11.000 is why are the other things that they do still Okay? 62 00:03:11.360 --> 00:03:13.120 So we have a lot of a lot of things 63 00:03:13.120 --> 00:03:15.520 we could talk about today about that, and I hope 64 00:03:15.520 --> 00:03:17.960 we get some calls related to it. But of course, 65 00:03:18.000 --> 00:03:20.840 on talk Heathen, we're open to all of your questions 66 00:03:20.840 --> 00:03:26.960 on religion, secular humanism, atheistic morality, philosophy, cosmology, science, abortion, 67 00:03:27.080 --> 00:03:29.759 If you want to talk about that. Anything that's on 68 00:03:29.800 --> 00:03:32.680 your mind today related to religion, we are here for it. 69 00:03:33.360 --> 00:03:36.680 Talk Heathen is a production of the Atheist Community of Austin, 70 00:03:36.800 --> 00:03:40.520 a five oh one C three nonprofit organization dedicated to 71 00:03:40.560 --> 00:03:44.360 the promotion of atheism, critical thinking, secular humanism, and the 72 00:03:44.400 --> 00:03:47.759 separation of religion and government. And like I mentioned, this 73 00:03:47.919 --> 00:03:50.360 is a call in show and we want to talk 74 00:03:50.400 --> 00:03:53.800 to you. So get your calls in at five one 75 00:03:53.879 --> 00:03:57.280 two nine nine one nine two four to two or 76 00:03:57.319 --> 00:04:01.199 from your computer at tiny dot c C call THH. 77 00:04:01.360 --> 00:04:04.120 We still have some open lines, but they can fill 78 00:04:04.199 --> 00:04:06.080 kind of quickly, so if you want to talk with 79 00:04:06.159 --> 00:04:08.960 us and get some extra time, get your calls in 80 00:04:09.080 --> 00:04:11.840 now so we can be sure to answer your call. 81 00:04:12.120 --> 00:04:15.680 And with that, we do have a segment in the meantime, 82 00:04:16.160 --> 00:04:18.920 Talk Heathen to me, which will bring up the welsh 83 00:04:18.959 --> 00:04:22.360 Man Richard deliver to deliver this part. He's laughing at me, 84 00:04:22.439 --> 00:04:25.600 but I'm gonna keep saying this every time I'm done. 85 00:04:25.680 --> 00:04:27.680 Just it's not going away, is it this? 86 00:04:29.120 --> 00:04:32.120 And if someone wants to and someone wants to call 87 00:04:32.240 --> 00:04:34.680 in and argue with us and tell us that Richard 88 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:37.120 does not in fact Welsh you can't. 89 00:04:37.360 --> 00:04:39.000 You can't prove me wrong. 90 00:04:38.920 --> 00:04:41.360 Like I don't think you have the documentation to prove 91 00:04:41.399 --> 00:04:43.680 me wrong. H So anyway, if someone wants to call 92 00:04:43.720 --> 00:04:46.120 in and say that Richard does not Welsh, you know, 93 00:04:46.199 --> 00:04:47.160 we might take that call. 94 00:04:47.959 --> 00:04:50.800 Apparently Richard's own personal testimony not enough. 95 00:04:51.279 --> 00:04:55.759 Yeah, not enough is not enough. It's time to quickly 96 00:04:55.839 --> 00:04:59.720 move along from Ben's nonsense and so come out then, somebody. 97 00:04:59.720 --> 00:05:02.519 He's like, and where we get into the questions of 98 00:05:02.560 --> 00:05:06.000 the week, and last week we asked you what does 99 00:05:06.199 --> 00:05:10.720 atheist hell look like? And here are top three answers. 100 00:05:11.120 --> 00:05:15.439 Number three is from Daniel Aaron and he says, they 101 00:05:15.480 --> 00:05:21.839 say atheist hell looks like Christian heaven, Well it could 102 00:05:21.879 --> 00:05:25.240 well do. Thoughts guys on that one. 103 00:05:25.319 --> 00:05:27.560 I mean, it makes me think of the book Childhood's End, 104 00:05:27.759 --> 00:05:30.319 where at the end of humanity everyone is just kind 105 00:05:30.319 --> 00:05:33.519 of one singing mass, no individuality, And I'm like, yeah, 106 00:05:33.519 --> 00:05:36.040 that actually does sound like Christian heaven and atheist hell. 107 00:05:36.199 --> 00:05:37.600 So so there you go. 108 00:05:38.079 --> 00:05:39.079 Yeah, I agree. 109 00:05:39.279 --> 00:05:44.240 Number two is why Sally re atheist hell is eternal 110 00:05:44.399 --> 00:05:50.519 separation from Carl Sagan. I'm a big fan of Carl Sagan, 111 00:05:50.639 --> 00:05:53.040 so I'm not sure if I'd go as far as 112 00:05:53.079 --> 00:05:55.600 a hero worshiping, But what do you guys think on 113 00:05:55.600 --> 00:05:56.120 that one? 114 00:05:56.560 --> 00:05:57.759 We do love Carl Sagan. 115 00:05:58.160 --> 00:06:01.480 You know, I discovered Carl Oh sorry, go ahead. 116 00:06:01.240 --> 00:06:02.560 Oh no, no, you go ahead. 117 00:06:03.000 --> 00:06:04.360 Later in my atheist life. 118 00:06:04.519 --> 00:06:08.800 I went to Bertrand Russell first, and so somehow that 119 00:06:08.839 --> 00:06:11.399 became my thing, and Carl Sagan was cool in sciency. 120 00:06:12.759 --> 00:06:16.399 But you know, hey, everybody's got their own little heroes. 121 00:06:16.800 --> 00:06:17.000 Yeah. 122 00:06:17.040 --> 00:06:20.120 I actually my favorite thing about Carl Sagan. 123 00:06:20.160 --> 00:06:23.199 It was like that whole story with where people were 124 00:06:23.240 --> 00:06:25.839 trying to make dolphins learn English and so they were 125 00:06:25.839 --> 00:06:28.879 giving them acid and like jerking them off. 126 00:06:29.920 --> 00:06:34.720 Oh yeah, Balladium, Florida. Yes, and lived with just a 127 00:06:34.720 --> 00:06:35.839 flooding house anyway. 128 00:06:35.920 --> 00:06:39.240 Yes, was like, that's not what I meant. That's not 129 00:06:39.279 --> 00:06:39.800 what I meant. 130 00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:47.399 I first found Carl Sagan, not through the doing anything 131 00:06:47.439 --> 00:06:54.800 Good with Dolphins, Yeah, both through the movie Contact, which 132 00:06:55.000 --> 00:06:57.759 to these days my favorite movie of all time. I 133 00:06:57.879 --> 00:07:01.199 love that film. Jody Foster's in it and that weird 134 00:07:01.480 --> 00:07:06.720 Christian guy from Texas, but it's a really really good movie. 135 00:07:06.720 --> 00:07:08.759 In the book it's really good as well. But I've 136 00:07:08.759 --> 00:07:10.839 found the movie first and then went onto the book, 137 00:07:11.360 --> 00:07:14.639 and they're a little bit different. So watch a movie 138 00:07:14.680 --> 00:07:16.920 and read the book because they're both very, very fun. 139 00:07:17.680 --> 00:07:21.399 And yeah, so let's move along number one, because I 140 00:07:21.399 --> 00:07:25.040 don't want to get onto anybody being Welsh or tossing 141 00:07:25.240 --> 00:07:29.839 dolphins off. Let's keep it just a little bit normal 142 00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:33.079 for one. So if we got number one, Chuck Gados 143 00:07:33.959 --> 00:07:38.439 Gados etheist, Hell is exactly like eightist even after the 144 00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:43.920 first million years. Yeah, I can go with that one. Yeah, 145 00:07:45.199 --> 00:07:50.279 you know, praising God for eternity. Yeah, I can't see 146 00:07:50.319 --> 00:07:53.920 that being much fun at all. The prompt of the 147 00:07:53.959 --> 00:07:57.600 week for next week, how would Jesus' story be different 148 00:07:57.720 --> 00:08:01.199 if he were born to day? And to your best 149 00:08:01.199 --> 00:08:03.680 answer below the video in the comments, and next week 150 00:08:03.759 --> 00:08:07.240 we will reveal our three favorite answers. But of course 151 00:08:07.360 --> 00:08:09.600 I've got what Sophia and Ben first, So let's go 152 00:08:09.680 --> 00:08:12.839 with Sofia first. How would you just story be different 153 00:08:12.920 --> 00:08:15.680 if he was born today, Sofia. 154 00:08:15.240 --> 00:08:17.800 He'd be selling alpha male courses on TikTok. 155 00:08:20.519 --> 00:08:22.439 My answer is going to be also along the lines 156 00:08:22.480 --> 00:08:26.240 of TikTok, like definitely at the resurrection, it would not 157 00:08:26.399 --> 00:08:29.439 be just people showing up at the tomb or like 158 00:08:29.519 --> 00:08:32.080 him showing up to like the five hundred people or whatever. 159 00:08:32.240 --> 00:08:34.799 It would just be him sharing a video to TikTok, 160 00:08:34.919 --> 00:08:38.159 and then that would be the eyewitness account would just 161 00:08:38.200 --> 00:08:39.120 be a. 162 00:08:39.080 --> 00:08:41.639 Little and then he'd pop on and be like it's 163 00:08:41.679 --> 00:08:44.679 really me and just keep Yeah. 164 00:08:47.639 --> 00:08:50.879 Definitely something that was pre recorded. Definitely not something that 165 00:08:50.919 --> 00:08:54.440 was pre recorded before his death and then released afterwards 166 00:08:54.480 --> 00:08:56.440 as a as a way to keep the world you 167 00:08:56.519 --> 00:08:57.080 going no, no. 168 00:08:57.200 --> 00:08:59.120 And then he'd roll into a ground news sponsorship. 169 00:09:01.799 --> 00:09:02.960 Yeah, definitely. 170 00:09:03.720 --> 00:09:07.200 Yeah, we do have calls waiting, so I'm going to 171 00:09:07.759 --> 00:09:10.320 disappear off skirt out of there. Thanks for you answers, 172 00:09:10.320 --> 00:09:13.960 guys and audience answering the comment section below, and we 173 00:09:14.000 --> 00:09:15.600 will reveal you answers next week. 174 00:09:15.799 --> 00:09:18.840 Bye, Hi Richard, thanks for letting us make fun of 175 00:09:18.879 --> 00:09:22.919 you every week. And with that, people that we're not 176 00:09:22.960 --> 00:09:26.320 going to make fun of because we value them greatly 177 00:09:26.720 --> 00:09:28.799 in they're working very very hard behind the scenes. Let's 178 00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:31.759 go to the crew cam. See their beautiful faces there. 179 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:34.679 Thank you so much. Crew. We love everything that you're doing. 180 00:09:34.759 --> 00:09:35.879 Oh and one of them is green. 181 00:09:36.240 --> 00:09:37.200 Oh let's green now. 182 00:09:38.720 --> 00:09:42.759 Thanks crew, and we do have some calls coming in, 183 00:09:42.960 --> 00:09:46.320 so let's take this first one, it seems very interesting. 184 00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:50.200 Let's talk to Steven. He him from New York talking 185 00:09:50.240 --> 00:09:53.519 about the Bible verse that everyone descended from Adam and 186 00:09:53.559 --> 00:09:57.000 Eve is misunderstood. Tell us more about that, Steven, you 187 00:09:57.039 --> 00:09:58.039 are on talk Ethan. 188 00:09:58.679 --> 00:10:03.600 Hey, yeah, I think misunderstood because people think that it 189 00:10:03.759 --> 00:10:08.399 means that everyone was birthed by by Oudam and Eve, 190 00:10:08.879 --> 00:10:13.039 and you know that it's a the but but that's 191 00:10:13.080 --> 00:10:14.480 not what it means. So I just want to I 192 00:10:14.519 --> 00:10:16.240 just want to make sure I know what I'm responding to. 193 00:10:16.360 --> 00:10:17.559 So what's your take on it? 194 00:10:17.679 --> 00:10:22.240 First, Well, the whole passage in Genesis is confusing because 195 00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:26.440 it's contradictory in multiple ways, Like because if you if 196 00:10:26.440 --> 00:10:28.840 the assumption is that Adam and Eve were the first people, 197 00:10:29.720 --> 00:10:32.240 and then of course they had children, but then you 198 00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:36.399 have other people that show up that are also adults. 199 00:10:36.639 --> 00:10:39.519 So I honestly, I don't know what to make of it, 200 00:10:39.759 --> 00:10:42.360 like because I don't take it as true. I don't 201 00:10:42.399 --> 00:10:46.039 take it as logically coherent. So if if you have 202 00:10:46.120 --> 00:10:49.799 an argument that it is logically coherent, let us know. 203 00:10:49.879 --> 00:10:52.399 I'm curious what your take is because I'm kind of 204 00:10:52.600 --> 00:10:55.279 I'm kind of indifferent to to whether or not it's 205 00:10:55.440 --> 00:10:58.240 well understood, because I don't think it happened at all. 206 00:10:58.360 --> 00:10:59.960 Yeah, I think that that's sort of my take too, 207 00:11:00.159 --> 00:11:02.320 is that like looking back, it gives you know, a 208 00:11:02.360 --> 00:11:05.080 specific lineage, which is sort of odd if he's the 209 00:11:05.679 --> 00:11:08.639 father of everyone. So yeah, I would agree that seems unlikely. 210 00:11:09.200 --> 00:11:12.840 But I view it as a legend anyway, And so 211 00:11:13.159 --> 00:11:16.039 it's kind of like asking me to interpret, you know, 212 00:11:16.200 --> 00:11:20.399 folklore about menin angal or something like, do I really 213 00:11:20.440 --> 00:11:23.879 believe that this vampire is well understood or misunderstood? Well, 214 00:11:23.919 --> 00:11:26.080 I don't believe in the vampire. I believe the story 215 00:11:26.120 --> 00:11:28.240 says something about us, not about the thing. 216 00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:31.320 You know, what are your thoughts, Stephen, But I. 217 00:11:31.279 --> 00:11:35.200 Wanted to I wanted to explain what that qualage means, 218 00:11:35.240 --> 00:11:38.159 or that or the adverse means. Basically, it's saying that 219 00:11:38.240 --> 00:11:41.960 everyone descended from Adam and you from a prototypical standpoint 220 00:11:42.039 --> 00:11:47.159 and from a chronological standpoint, like it's it's not it's 221 00:11:47.159 --> 00:11:49.639 not the word with the with the letter I. It's 222 00:11:49.799 --> 00:11:52.360 it's just like like I like, if you, you know, 223 00:11:52.399 --> 00:11:56.919 think of an hour glass and they just came before everyone. 224 00:11:56.960 --> 00:12:00.480 That's what that's what that means. It doesn't mean everyone 225 00:12:00.559 --> 00:12:01.200 want but. 226 00:12:01.159 --> 00:12:03.399 That doesn't But that doesn't work right because if there 227 00:12:03.399 --> 00:12:05.480 were people around at the same time as Adam and Eve, 228 00:12:05.519 --> 00:12:08.159 then then Adam and Eve weren't the first ones, and 229 00:12:08.279 --> 00:12:11.799 chronologically speaking, you could not say that everyone came after them, 230 00:12:12.039 --> 00:12:14.320 So like, sure, that could be a thing, But I mean, 231 00:12:14.679 --> 00:12:17.720 are you saying that this is purely like like purely metaphorical, 232 00:12:18.080 --> 00:12:20.639 or are you saying that there's some legitimacy to the 233 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:21.519 passage itself. 234 00:12:22.639 --> 00:12:26.320 It's it's metaphorical. But Okay, even if they were at 235 00:12:26.320 --> 00:12:30.240 the same time, I would say it was it was 236 00:12:30.360 --> 00:12:36.679 chronologically the first idea for creation. They're the molds of 237 00:12:37.519 --> 00:12:41.440 human of all human beings. That's that's why people are 238 00:12:41.480 --> 00:12:44.320 misinterpreting diverse a lot. I think. 239 00:12:44.600 --> 00:12:47.000 So, first of all, can you tell us specifically which first, 240 00:12:47.000 --> 00:12:50.279 because I'm kind of scanning through early Genesis and there's 241 00:12:50.360 --> 00:12:53.919 a lot that talks about like you know, Adam's descendants 242 00:12:53.960 --> 00:12:56.039 and kind of that lineage and some of the things 243 00:12:56.039 --> 00:12:58.679 they encountered. But I'm wondering you're saying this verse, like 244 00:12:58.720 --> 00:13:00.639 can we look at the specific verse? Which one are 245 00:13:00.639 --> 00:13:01.120 you thinking of? 246 00:13:01.759 --> 00:13:04.000 Something like I don't have it pulled up in front 247 00:13:04.000 --> 00:13:07.919 of me, but it's something like that everyone was descended 248 00:13:07.960 --> 00:13:11.000 from out of an ever I don't, honestly, I don't remember. 249 00:13:11.320 --> 00:13:13.159 Okay, why is this important to you to talk about? 250 00:13:13.200 --> 00:13:16.039 I'm curious because I think that you know, our take 251 00:13:16.240 --> 00:13:18.360 is very much that this is all kind of a 252 00:13:18.399 --> 00:13:21.159 metaphor anyway, this is a creation myth, and so it's 253 00:13:21.159 --> 00:13:23.759 not going to make literal sense. And it feels like 254 00:13:23.799 --> 00:13:26.600 the Bible is open to interpretation, that's for sure. 255 00:13:27.039 --> 00:13:30.080 So like, what is it that you think that would. 256 00:13:29.919 --> 00:13:32.679 Be fruitful from a conversation about this, considering we don't 257 00:13:32.679 --> 00:13:34.840 believe in it at all? Like, what's making you call 258 00:13:34.879 --> 00:13:37.279 in about this today? I guess I'm a little confused about. 259 00:13:37.080 --> 00:13:40.440 That clarification because I don't know. I just wanted to 260 00:13:40.440 --> 00:13:42.600 correct that idea. 261 00:13:42.720 --> 00:13:45.600 Well, and I can see that it's it's reasonable to like, 262 00:13:45.639 --> 00:13:48.080 if you want to say, hey, this is a metaphorical thing, 263 00:13:48.360 --> 00:13:50.320 I don't think we should be taking the Bible literally. 264 00:13:50.399 --> 00:13:52.919 You know that that is a fair argument to make. 265 00:13:53.360 --> 00:13:57.200 The question is, though, like, is that the goal you're 266 00:13:57.240 --> 00:13:59.159 trying to have? Are you trying to say, hey, people 267 00:13:59.200 --> 00:14:01.960 should look at this metaphorically and not take the Bible 268 00:14:02.000 --> 00:14:05.559 literally or do you have a different point of utility 269 00:14:05.679 --> 00:14:08.200 for this particular misinterpretation. 270 00:14:08.720 --> 00:14:11.440 Well, no, even within it. No, I'm not saying it's 271 00:14:11.480 --> 00:14:14.759 like within the Bible. It's not metaphorical. It just means 272 00:14:14.799 --> 00:14:17.759 something other than what what most people think. 273 00:14:18.840 --> 00:14:21.559 Okay, so you don't think it's a metaphor so I'd 274 00:14:21.559 --> 00:14:25.000 love to hear how you rationalize that there is some 275 00:14:25.200 --> 00:14:29.240 form of truth to this. Where you did this idea 276 00:14:29.360 --> 00:14:31.919 come to you, like from your own kind of logical 277 00:14:31.919 --> 00:14:34.519 thinking or do you have like a source that you 278 00:14:34.559 --> 00:14:36.600 were kind of referencing, like did someone say this in 279 00:14:36.639 --> 00:14:38.840 a book? Or like how did you come up with 280 00:14:38.879 --> 00:14:39.679 this idea? 281 00:14:39.960 --> 00:14:40.080 No? 282 00:14:40.360 --> 00:14:42.519 No, I thought of this myself yesterday. 283 00:14:42.559 --> 00:14:42.919 Actually. 284 00:14:43.480 --> 00:14:47.240 Yeah, Okay, so it's obvious, and I think a. 285 00:14:47.200 --> 00:14:51.399 Lot of Christians actually don't necessarily literally believe that Adam 286 00:14:51.840 --> 00:14:55.320 was the father of all humans. Like, so I guess 287 00:14:55.360 --> 00:14:57.519 I'm kind of like, who are you correcting? Who are 288 00:14:57.559 --> 00:14:58.320 you talking to here? 289 00:14:58.480 --> 00:15:04.279 You know, Well, I've heard say that actually. 290 00:15:04.360 --> 00:15:07.879 We think Adam was the father of all humans. 291 00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:09.879 Or that we think because it's true that some Christians 292 00:15:09.919 --> 00:15:13.000 think it, But like that's just us reporting what some 293 00:15:13.080 --> 00:15:13.799 Christians think. 294 00:15:13.879 --> 00:15:16.159 It's not us say you think that's true. 295 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:20.000 Yeah, it's an argument like when atheists are arguing against 296 00:15:20.120 --> 00:15:22.879 biblical literalism, like I think that Adam and Eves story 297 00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:25.879 is a great one to target to say, hey, you 298 00:15:25.919 --> 00:15:28.679 cannot take the Bible literally. And the reason why we'll 299 00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:31.279 attack that whole point is because if you have certain 300 00:15:31.279 --> 00:15:33.720 parts of the Bible that cannot be taken literally, then 301 00:15:33.759 --> 00:15:37.000 therefore the whole rest of the book is up to interpretation. 302 00:15:37.159 --> 00:15:39.720 And so then we get into the discussion of was 303 00:15:39.759 --> 00:15:42.720 the resurrection a real thing or was that a metaphor? 304 00:15:43.320 --> 00:15:46.120 Was Noah's ark? Was that a metaphor? Do you get 305 00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:48.000 into the rest of the book and if you can 306 00:15:48.039 --> 00:15:52.639 no longer say that this is like undeniably true, then 307 00:15:53.080 --> 00:15:55.240 it calls into question the whole rest of the book 308 00:15:55.279 --> 00:15:58.440 and the whole rest of the religion. So that's why 309 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:02.039 a lot of atheists take that position. But for people 310 00:16:02.120 --> 00:16:05.080 that take a more metaphorical stance on this, or if 311 00:16:05.080 --> 00:16:07.240 they say, you know, this story the way it's written 312 00:16:07.279 --> 00:16:10.879 is not entirely true, then we have to scrub through 313 00:16:10.919 --> 00:16:13.000 the rest of the book and say, okay, which parts 314 00:16:13.000 --> 00:16:15.480 of it are true, which ones are not, and how 315 00:16:15.519 --> 00:16:16.200 do we know that. 316 00:16:16.480 --> 00:16:18.000 So that's why I would say this. 317 00:16:18.200 --> 00:16:21.559 I would agree that this discussion is important, but I'm 318 00:16:21.600 --> 00:16:27.080 curious for like how you came to this idea and like, 319 00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:30.279 cause if it's not a metaphor, then it's just misinterpreted. 320 00:16:30.600 --> 00:16:32.440 Do you think that there is some truth to that 321 00:16:32.559 --> 00:16:35.000 story and if so, what parts of it are true? 322 00:16:35.039 --> 00:16:35.960 And how do you know that? 323 00:16:36.240 --> 00:16:37.960 I don't know if it's true, but I'm just saying 324 00:16:38.039 --> 00:16:40.759 that with like, within the Bible, it's not a metaphor. 325 00:16:41.320 --> 00:16:44.639 It's not written to be a metaphor. I'm saying that 326 00:16:47.519 --> 00:16:50.960 it's within the Bible, it just means something else. It 327 00:16:51.080 --> 00:16:55.000 means that, you know, as I said before, it's saying 328 00:16:55.000 --> 00:16:57.600 that everyone descended from out of a news from a 329 00:16:57.720 --> 00:17:02.799 chronological and prototypical standpoint, that's what it's saying. But it's 330 00:17:02.919 --> 00:17:05.519 it's real within the Bible. If you believe in the Bible. 331 00:17:05.200 --> 00:17:07.680 It just it's just okay cool. 332 00:17:07.799 --> 00:17:10.519 I mean, hey, I'm not sure I believe in Harry Potter. 333 00:17:10.680 --> 00:17:12.559 Like that's kind of an irrelevant point. 334 00:17:12.799 --> 00:17:14.759 Yeah, I'm not sure where we're going with this conversation, 335 00:17:15.119 --> 00:17:16.960 but yeah, I guess I'm just I'm sure you could 336 00:17:17.039 --> 00:17:19.079 make that point, but I don't know what to do 337 00:17:19.119 --> 00:17:19.960 with it beyond that. 338 00:17:20.319 --> 00:17:21.880 That's kind of my take to any. 339 00:17:21.640 --> 00:17:23.559 Other arguments you want to bring up. Any other points 340 00:17:23.599 --> 00:17:24.359 kind of related to. 341 00:17:24.319 --> 00:17:30.640 That, Uh, not really like I I lost my train. 342 00:17:30.839 --> 00:17:33.359 Actually problem And you can feel free to call back 343 00:17:33.400 --> 00:17:36.240 a different week if you have kind of more thoughts together. 344 00:17:36.960 --> 00:17:39.839 But thanks for calling in. I appreciate the discussion and 345 00:17:40.039 --> 00:17:41.599 a great risk of your Sunday. 346 00:17:41.720 --> 00:17:43.039 Yeah, interesting first call. 347 00:17:43.319 --> 00:17:46.599 It's one that like, we can argue semantics and argue 348 00:17:46.640 --> 00:17:49.920 like translation and stuff of certain parts of the Bible, 349 00:17:50.000 --> 00:17:51.880 but like, at the end of the day, if we're 350 00:17:51.920 --> 00:17:54.400 not claiming that it's true and we're not using that 351 00:17:54.440 --> 00:17:56.839 to make other decisions, and it's like, okay, you can 352 00:17:56.880 --> 00:17:58.519 have that interpretation and I don't. 353 00:17:58.559 --> 00:18:00.880 I don't know if I need to refute that a 354 00:18:00.920 --> 00:18:01.359 whole lot. 355 00:18:01.680 --> 00:18:04.119 Yeah, I mean I think that back when I was 356 00:18:04.359 --> 00:18:07.640 a Christian, I didn't literally believe in that aspect. I 357 00:18:07.640 --> 00:18:10.200 think I had a similarly squishy kind of take, to 358 00:18:10.240 --> 00:18:13.839 be honest, because it seemed so fantastical. 359 00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:16.279 But I also feel like, I don't know. 360 00:18:16.319 --> 00:18:19.119 There are a lot of apologists who work very hard 361 00:18:19.279 --> 00:18:21.960 on those particular verses to try to make them make sense, 362 00:18:23.079 --> 00:18:25.960 and it kind of boils down to it's literal, but 363 00:18:26.039 --> 00:18:28.079 not really so all right. 364 00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:29.400 Yeah exactly. 365 00:18:29.720 --> 00:18:33.680 Yeah, but if any if anybody does have a belief 366 00:18:33.839 --> 00:18:37.160 in the literal Adam and Eve and the literal timeline 367 00:18:37.440 --> 00:18:40.759 of Genesis, I love to have you call in because 368 00:18:41.240 --> 00:18:45.240 that's a very interesting topic of conversation. So get that 369 00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:47.640 call in, love to hear about it. And with that, 370 00:18:47.880 --> 00:18:50.319 for everyone in the side chat and everyone watching the show, 371 00:18:50.599 --> 00:18:53.759 thank you for being here. You engaging with with the 372 00:18:53.759 --> 00:18:57.000 content does help us get our show out there, does 373 00:18:57.079 --> 00:18:59.559 help us keep doing this. And so there are multiple 374 00:18:59.640 --> 00:19:03.160 multiple ways to help show your support. Watching the show 375 00:19:03.279 --> 00:19:05.119 is one of them. Chatting in the side chat is 376 00:19:05.160 --> 00:19:08.000 another one. Putting your comments in the comment section below 377 00:19:08.079 --> 00:19:10.440 with the question of the week. All of that does 378 00:19:10.680 --> 00:19:14.400 help us out. 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