WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:03.799 Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and is 2 00:00:03.919 --> 00:00:05.639 not intended for all audiences. 3 00:00:06.320 --> 00:00:08.519 Listener discretion is advised. 4 00:00:14.240 --> 00:00:16.000 He was pulling my wrists, and he pulled me in 5 00:00:16.000 --> 00:00:18.879 the vehicle, and he's reaching and he's pulling. 6 00:00:20.079 --> 00:00:23.480 When you are being held against your. 7 00:00:23.399 --> 00:00:28.879 Will and you have no idea what's ahead of you, 8 00:00:29.719 --> 00:00:31.239 it felt like it lasted forever. 9 00:00:34.560 --> 00:00:38.000 Oh boy, you guys not gonna like this one. The 10 00:00:38.119 --> 00:01:25.159 misogyny does run thick here at Sword Scale Enjoy. There 11 00:01:25.239 --> 00:01:31.079 is a line between a man and a monster. And 12 00:01:31.680 --> 00:01:35.319 when I say man, I'm also obviously talking about you. Ladies. 13 00:01:36.280 --> 00:01:41.200 You're not immune from this, But that line is thinner 14 00:01:41.879 --> 00:01:45.640 than we'd like to believe. Most people will never cross it, 15 00:01:46.439 --> 00:01:49.760 living their lives without ever feeling the sharp edge of 16 00:01:49.920 --> 00:01:56.480 true darkness. But under the right or perhaps the wrong circumstances, 17 00:01:57.319 --> 00:02:01.439 even the most ordinary person can unravel. Just look at 18 00:02:01.439 --> 00:02:06.120 my Facebook feed. A moment of rage, desperation, or even 19 00:02:06.280 --> 00:02:12.520 fear can crack something deep inside, something buried, unleashing a 20 00:02:12.680 --> 00:02:16.919 version of themselves they never thought possible. Not every killer 21 00:02:17.120 --> 00:02:23.479 is born a monster. Some are made shaped by pressure, 22 00:02:23.960 --> 00:02:28.000 by pain, by a perfect storm of events that turn 23 00:02:28.039 --> 00:02:33.120 any human into something unrecognizable. That's the whole point we've 24 00:02:33.159 --> 00:02:35.319 been trying to make here for eleven years. It's not 25 00:02:35.479 --> 00:02:40.000 about true crime, it's about human nature, what makes you tick, 26 00:02:40.960 --> 00:02:47.240 and once that line is crossed, there is no going back. 27 00:02:56.759 --> 00:03:02.240 Well, I would like to say on May seven, twenty nineteen, 28 00:03:03.560 --> 00:03:05.919 I had no idea that when I called my brother 29 00:03:06.960 --> 00:03:09.879 that I would be inundated with phone calls from law 30 00:03:09.960 --> 00:03:16.080 enforcement from Clayton County, Georgia. I immediately panicked and feared 31 00:03:16.080 --> 00:03:20.719 the worst. I had no intention on answering those calls. 32 00:03:20.800 --> 00:03:26.479 Due to fear, I answered the phone by mistake, and 33 00:03:26.560 --> 00:03:30.919 within five minutes my wife called me and told me 34 00:03:31.039 --> 00:03:33.280 there was a deputy at the house to see me. 35 00:03:34.800 --> 00:03:37.319 My life from that point has never been the same. 36 00:03:38.560 --> 00:03:43.240 The following day, I found myself repeating to my wife, 37 00:03:43.919 --> 00:03:46.479 I do not know how I'm going to tell my 38 00:03:46.680 --> 00:03:50.360 parents or explain to them how this happened. 39 00:03:51.560 --> 00:03:53.879 The voice you just heard belonged to a man named 40 00:03:53.960 --> 00:03:57.800 Keith Herring. He was speaking about an incident involving his 41 00:03:57.960 --> 00:04:02.360 older brother, Kenneth. On the evening of May seventh, twenty nineteen, 42 00:04:03.120 --> 00:04:05.879 sixty two year old Kenneth Herring was driving on a 43 00:04:05.879 --> 00:04:10.280 busy Highway in Clayton County near Hartsfield Jackson International Airport 44 00:04:10.319 --> 00:04:15.319 in Atlanta, an airport I know very very well at 45 00:04:15.360 --> 00:04:18.639 some point he drove into an intersection that he shouldn't have. 46 00:04:19.360 --> 00:04:24.439 The story begins with Kenneth Harry and his car driving 47 00:04:24.519 --> 00:04:27.720 them all and there's pretty much no doubt that he 48 00:04:27.839 --> 00:04:31.879 runs a red black near Forest Parkway through Riverdale Road 49 00:04:33.079 --> 00:04:36.839 when he runs that red light, and another tractor trailer 50 00:04:37.160 --> 00:04:41.519 were coming toward that intercession, and mister Herring hits the 51 00:04:41.600 --> 00:04:44.439 trailer and everybody pulls off. 52 00:04:44.600 --> 00:04:47.000 To the side to deal with the fact that there's 53 00:04:47.160 --> 00:04:48.680 just been a traffic accident. 54 00:04:49.879 --> 00:04:53.519 Several other motorists saw the crash unfold and some pulled 55 00:04:53.519 --> 00:04:58.279 over to help, including Georgia Correctional officer named Terry Robinson. 56 00:04:58.759 --> 00:05:03.120 Did you witness a vehicle collision on May nineteen, Yes, ma'am? 57 00:05:03.199 --> 00:05:04.519 And where did that collision occur? 58 00:05:06.199 --> 00:05:11.519 Clark Howell and Forest Parkway. As we were approaching the light, 59 00:05:11.800 --> 00:05:16.000 the light was green. The vehicles were turning to the 60 00:05:16.079 --> 00:05:20.199 left and the truck I know, was turning right. All 61 00:05:20.199 --> 00:05:24.240 of a sudden, I've seen this room vehicle come famn. 62 00:05:24.959 --> 00:05:26.439 He decided the truck. 63 00:05:27.360 --> 00:05:30.800 Jerry Robinson wasn't on duty at the time. He wasn't 64 00:05:30.839 --> 00:05:35.600 a traffic copper Highway patrolman neither, but as a correctional officer, 65 00:05:35.639 --> 00:05:38.079 he took it upon himself to control the scene until 66 00:05:38.199 --> 00:05:39.759 the proper authorities could get there. 67 00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:44.040 Now, what damages did you observe to the red maroon 68 00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:45.519 truck after the accident? 69 00:05:47.720 --> 00:05:51.759 The front end of the heavily damage radiator forward, all 70 00:05:52.319 --> 00:05:55.600 water for leaking out, and everything was heavily damage to 71 00:05:55.639 --> 00:05:59.800 the front. Because I was thinking that this can not 72 00:05:59.839 --> 00:06:03.839 go anywhere, I assumed that, hey, the vehicle was disabled. 73 00:06:04.879 --> 00:06:09.839 The pickup truck was wrecked, practically totaled. As for Kenneth Herring, 74 00:06:10.079 --> 00:06:14.319 he didn't appear to be injured, but he was somewhat dazed, 75 00:06:14.879 --> 00:06:15.319 and that's all. 76 00:06:15.360 --> 00:06:18.240 The gentleman's kind of slumped over a little bit. That's 77 00:06:18.240 --> 00:06:21.519 what made me pull over to see if heels okay, 78 00:06:22.519 --> 00:06:24.480 and I when I got a car, that's when I 79 00:06:24.480 --> 00:06:29.000 asked the gentleman's okay, and then just basically making sure 80 00:06:29.000 --> 00:06:31.120 that the gentleman's okay, that's when I called nine one one. 81 00:06:32.240 --> 00:06:36.759 Kenneth was responsive, but there clearly was something wrong with 82 00:06:36.839 --> 00:06:41.199 him and he was possibly drunk. After checking on Kenneth's 83 00:06:41.199 --> 00:06:43.920 well being, Terry Robinson called for help. 84 00:06:44.439 --> 00:06:47.439 As it so happens that just happened to be one 85 00:06:47.439 --> 00:06:51.399 of the worst traffic days in that area. 86 00:06:52.720 --> 00:06:52.839 Too. 87 00:06:52.879 --> 00:06:53.920 Any file was shut. 88 00:06:53.759 --> 00:06:55.639 Down because a battery. 89 00:06:55.680 --> 00:06:59.240 Trump had called on fire, So law enforcement is kind 90 00:06:59.279 --> 00:07:01.600 of blocking the entrance. 91 00:07:01.360 --> 00:07:04.560 And exits for two eighty five. And then there's another 92 00:07:04.720 --> 00:07:06.720 accident somewhere else in that area. 93 00:07:07.240 --> 00:07:11.240 So traffic is piled up, cars everywhere, no one can 94 00:07:11.279 --> 00:07:15.000 really get anywhere, and it's taking law enforcement a few 95 00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:17.360 moments to get to the sea. 96 00:07:18.680 --> 00:07:21.319 More than twenty minutes had passed since Terry called nine 97 00:07:21.319 --> 00:07:25.680 to one one, No cops or emergency services had arrived, 98 00:07:26.079 --> 00:07:27.839 So Terry called again. 99 00:07:28.079 --> 00:07:30.040 Clay in County nine one one, what is the location 100 00:07:30.160 --> 00:07:34.000 of your emergency carcle and Forest Corporate is being a 101 00:07:34.120 --> 00:07:36.759 rare call earlier though we had been over right twenty 102 00:07:36.839 --> 00:07:38.240 minutes round and. 103 00:07:40.000 --> 00:07:43.759 Or no Hamlett that's thrown up. It's this location. And 104 00:07:43.800 --> 00:07:46.279 I can say the ball, a Rady coder and a 105 00:07:46.319 --> 00:07:50.079 semi tractor truck and none has told up at this 106 00:07:50.120 --> 00:07:50.720 moment of time. 107 00:07:51.839 --> 00:07:53.000 Okay, I just get a call. 108 00:07:53.160 --> 00:07:54.439 We already had someone on the way. 109 00:07:55.439 --> 00:07:59.519 The dispatcher assured Terry that help was on the way. Meanwhile, 110 00:07:59.560 --> 00:08:01.639 another witness to the crash also called. 111 00:08:01.560 --> 00:08:03.319 Nine one one Clayton County. 112 00:08:03.319 --> 00:08:07.199 Now one one one is the location of your emergency? Yes, Pam, 113 00:08:07.199 --> 00:08:11.839 I'm w on Forest Parkway and Clark Howell Highway and. 114 00:08:11.959 --> 00:08:13.120 There was just an accident. 115 00:08:13.160 --> 00:08:16.279 I'm sure they've already called, but I was just I 116 00:08:16.399 --> 00:08:18.519 just witnessed it, and I just wanted to make sure that. 117 00:08:20.000 --> 00:08:21.879 I, I guess called the police as well. 118 00:08:21.800 --> 00:08:22.560 In case they didn't. 119 00:08:23.959 --> 00:08:25.560 What were the kind of vehicles? 120 00:08:25.600 --> 00:08:29.480 And Vogue, It's a red Dodge pickup truck. 121 00:08:29.480 --> 00:08:33.600 I think it's a Dakota ver and a semi was 122 00:08:33.639 --> 00:08:38.639 involved and the red Dakota of brandy red light and 123 00:08:38.799 --> 00:08:40.240 plammed into the side of the semi. 124 00:08:41.799 --> 00:08:43.039 Okay, and what's your name? 125 00:08:43.919 --> 00:08:48.519 Funny ms Hannah Anna last name, It's Payne p A. 126 00:08:48.720 --> 00:08:49.240 Y n E. 127 00:08:50.559 --> 00:08:53.960 Terry and the other witness continued to wait. As they did, 128 00:08:54.039 --> 00:08:58.039 they noticed something strange. Kenneth Herring had climbed out of 129 00:08:58.080 --> 00:09:00.559 his truck and began aimlessly wandering around. 130 00:09:01.559 --> 00:09:07.799 Mister Harry appeared somewhat confused after the accident, kept saying. 131 00:09:07.720 --> 00:09:08.279 Who hit me? 132 00:09:09.399 --> 00:09:14.639 What's happening things along those lines, and then started saying 133 00:09:14.720 --> 00:09:16.200 things like I didn't do anything wrong. 134 00:09:17.720 --> 00:09:21.440 Kenneth wandered in circles a few times. Then he got 135 00:09:21.519 --> 00:09:23.960 back behind the wheel of his truck and tried to 136 00:09:24.000 --> 00:09:25.039 restart the engine. 137 00:09:25.600 --> 00:09:27.799 He got back into the truck when I'm calling. He 138 00:09:27.840 --> 00:09:29.519 got through the truck and I said, well, sir, you 139 00:09:29.600 --> 00:09:32.799 okay like that, and he's I'm ready to go, like 140 00:09:32.879 --> 00:09:34.919 I said, so you can't go anywhere. You know, I 141 00:09:35.000 --> 00:09:39.320 can't go anywhere, And all of a sudden he turned 142 00:09:39.360 --> 00:09:42.960 on the vehicle and I'm like, well, sir, you can't 143 00:09:43.000 --> 00:09:46.240 do anything. You can't move, you can't move, and that's 144 00:09:46.440 --> 00:09:50.159 when he put it in, put it in a dry 145 00:09:50.720 --> 00:09:52.399 and floored it. 146 00:09:53.679 --> 00:09:57.519 Kenneth sped off Terry, while still on the phone with 147 00:09:57.600 --> 00:10:00.679 the nine to one one dispatcher, watched as the damaged 148 00:10:00.759 --> 00:10:02.799 pickup disappeared down the highway. 149 00:10:03.399 --> 00:10:05.279 The reason why I'm answering man, because this is the 150 00:10:05.399 --> 00:10:09.120 drama who called the accident. I think he's uncared. Uh, 151 00:10:09.159 --> 00:10:11.279 something's going on with him, and so the thing, if 152 00:10:11.279 --> 00:10:12.919 I were trying to tell him, was a turn of 153 00:10:12.960 --> 00:10:15.799 the gas off from the most He's not following the 154 00:10:15.919 --> 00:10:20.039 name so that's why I'm master. If he's moving it here, 155 00:10:20.080 --> 00:10:22.639 he's going to drive off. Man, he's driving off. He's 156 00:10:22.720 --> 00:10:24.200 driving off. Take a picture of driving like. 157 00:10:24.240 --> 00:10:24.720 Take a picture. 158 00:10:24.759 --> 00:10:29.720 Quack quick, wait wait quick, he's driving off. He's driving off. Yeah, 159 00:10:29.759 --> 00:10:32.279 he's heading for a s he's heading for Riverdale Road. 160 00:10:33.000 --> 00:10:36.600 He has the all the black gentleman, gray hair, blue 161 00:10:36.720 --> 00:10:39.759 shirt on and front end damage, heaving the front end 162 00:10:39.799 --> 00:10:43.000 damage in front. Tame lead. I knew he was coming 163 00:10:43.039 --> 00:10:44.440 wrong with it, gay, I knew it. 164 00:10:45.480 --> 00:10:49.200 As Kenneth had fled the scene, the other witness, Hannah Pain, 165 00:10:49.440 --> 00:10:53.519 didn't hesitate. She jumped into her jeep Wrangler and took 166 00:10:53.559 --> 00:10:54.200 off after him. 167 00:10:54.639 --> 00:10:58.840 Okay, good, cool, God, Now I love the driver who 168 00:10:58.960 --> 00:11:03.720 was and she's going to take a picture of hoping 169 00:11:03.759 --> 00:11:06.799 that the lady. The lady in the street was almost 170 00:11:06.840 --> 00:11:09.279 in the recident. So she turned around and she went 171 00:11:09.360 --> 00:11:11.320 after him. So she's going to take a picture of 172 00:11:11.399 --> 00:11:12.320 the three ears and stuff. 173 00:11:13.399 --> 00:11:16.000 As Hannah pursued Kenneth, she stayed on the phone with 174 00:11:16.120 --> 00:11:19.399 the nine to one one dispatcher and relayed his movements. 175 00:11:19.919 --> 00:11:21.240 Now one one with the location of. 176 00:11:22.799 --> 00:11:24.320 Yes, ma'am, I'm on cars Powell. 177 00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:27.759 It's Worth Parkway, the section I actually. 178 00:11:27.559 --> 00:11:31.720 Called twenty minutes ago for an accident, and no one 179 00:11:31.720 --> 00:11:32.480 has done up yet. 180 00:11:33.399 --> 00:11:35.320 But I am running the intension that the guy that 181 00:11:35.399 --> 00:11:38.559 caused the accident, he ran the red bike, is drunk and. 182 00:11:38.840 --> 00:11:42.639 He got me back in his car and he's looking 183 00:11:42.720 --> 00:11:43.799 like he's trying to drive away. 184 00:11:44.679 --> 00:11:46.320 Hey, can you get a sad humper. 185 00:11:48.480 --> 00:12:02.519 Hold on driving away? Her shots Dakota Hold, Okay, so 186 00:12:02.679 --> 00:12:06.720 he is going we down park No. 187 00:12:06.879 --> 00:12:08.000 Sorry, now Court Parkway. 188 00:12:08.399 --> 00:12:09.720 So you couldn't get the same number. 189 00:12:10.879 --> 00:12:12.559 No, but I'm patting helping him right now. 190 00:12:13.639 --> 00:12:17.080 Hannah followed Kenneth and eventually caught up to him. What 191 00:12:17.240 --> 00:12:22.120 happened next left several other drivers stunned and horrified. 192 00:12:22.799 --> 00:12:25.759 Now did you see any sort of struggle between the 193 00:12:26.159 --> 00:12:29.399 driver of the car that she's standing at in this pain? Yes, okay, 194 00:12:29.559 --> 00:12:30.200 describe what you. 195 00:12:30.240 --> 00:12:32.440 Saw, just like a little pushing back and forth. 196 00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:34.240 What else happens next? 197 00:12:34.960 --> 00:12:37.600 I ended up pulling on my phone and record. Honestly, 198 00:12:37.759 --> 00:12:39.279 I ain't to say it like this, but that was 199 00:12:39.399 --> 00:12:45.080 like another dig in Clayton County. And as I was recording, 200 00:12:45.679 --> 00:12:46.519 I heard a gunshot. 201 00:12:47.720 --> 00:12:51.960 On May seventh, twenty nineteen, a gunshot echoed through the 202 00:12:52.080 --> 00:12:56.720 traffic on Riverdale Road in Clayton County, Georgia. Drivers hit 203 00:12:56.759 --> 00:13:01.200 their brakes, their heads whipping towards a sound. At first, 204 00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:03.879 it seemed like just another case of road rage until 205 00:13:04.840 --> 00:13:11.600 they saw the blood. Someone was shot, someone was dying. 206 00:13:40.120 --> 00:13:43.399 On the evening of May seventh, twenty nineteen, sixty two 207 00:13:43.440 --> 00:13:46.919 year old Kenneth Herring caused a traffic accident on a 208 00:13:47.000 --> 00:13:50.519 busy highway in Clayton County, Georgia. He ran a red light, 209 00:13:50.679 --> 00:13:53.200 driving his pickup truck headfirst into the side of a 210 00:13:53.360 --> 00:13:58.120 tractor trailer. The semi driver was unharmed, but witnesses noticed 211 00:13:58.120 --> 00:14:04.600 something about Kenneth, something off. He seemed confused, maybe even drunk. 212 00:14:05.639 --> 00:14:08.240 Among those who stopped to help was an off duty 213 00:14:08.279 --> 00:14:13.559 correctional officer named Terry Robinson. Was the vehicle operable at 214 00:14:13.600 --> 00:14:13.960 the time. 215 00:14:14.080 --> 00:14:18.399 It wasn't good law, but we see it happened that 216 00:14:19.720 --> 00:14:23.200 he was leaving to turn it on and leave the scene. 217 00:14:24.840 --> 00:14:27.879 He realized at some point mister Robson did that, mister 218 00:14:27.919 --> 00:14:29.480 Harry kind of circling his vehicle. 219 00:14:30.440 --> 00:14:32.799 He didn't know what's going on. He might end in 220 00:14:32.840 --> 00:14:34.200 his car and drive somewhere. 221 00:14:35.240 --> 00:14:37.440 I think he's going to leave the state, And sure enough, 222 00:14:37.840 --> 00:14:40.919 mister Harry does get in his vehicle and he did 223 00:14:41.080 --> 00:14:41.279 try it. 224 00:14:42.399 --> 00:14:45.879 About twenty minutes after the accident, Kenneth did something unexpected. 225 00:14:46.600 --> 00:14:50.159 He climbed back into his truck and sped away. A 226 00:14:50.240 --> 00:14:52.960 short time later, and just a couple of miles down 227 00:14:53.039 --> 00:14:56.440 the road, a frantic driver flagged down a police sergeant. 228 00:14:57.039 --> 00:14:59.519 Yes, I was flagged down by a citizen that informed 229 00:14:59.519 --> 00:15:02.159 me there had in a vehicle accident and someone. 230 00:15:02.000 --> 00:15:02.600 Had been shot. 231 00:15:03.879 --> 00:15:06.840 When you first arrived, kind of describe what you initially see. 232 00:15:07.480 --> 00:15:10.320 There's a large crowd of people, obviously the two vehicles 233 00:15:10.399 --> 00:15:13.919 that appeared to have collided, and there were other vehicles 234 00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:16.279 pulled over to the side to I guess assist with 235 00:15:16.360 --> 00:15:20.399 the situation, and multiple witnesses pointing to a red pickup 236 00:15:20.440 --> 00:15:22.600 truck and that the man inside had been shot. 237 00:15:23.679 --> 00:15:29.399 The officer was directed to Kenneth's truck. Inside, Kenneth was unresponsive, 238 00:15:29.679 --> 00:15:33.159 slumped in the driver's seat, bleeding from a gunshot wound 239 00:15:33.240 --> 00:15:34.000 to his abdomen. 240 00:15:34.600 --> 00:15:35.240 And what did you do? 241 00:15:36.279 --> 00:15:39.440 We're trying to identify where his gunshot wound was and 242 00:15:39.960 --> 00:15:41.840 basically what was going on with him as long as 243 00:15:42.039 --> 00:15:44.000 trying to get the driver's side door open. 244 00:15:45.159 --> 00:15:49.039 And was a paramedics or empty or an ambulance? 245 00:15:49.120 --> 00:15:50.360 Requested, Yes, they were? 246 00:15:51.399 --> 00:15:54.720 And were there also civilians assisting you with mister Herring? Yes, 247 00:15:54.840 --> 00:15:59.120 before the paramedics arrived. Did mister Herring ever say anything 248 00:15:59.159 --> 00:15:59.720 while you were there? 249 00:16:01.480 --> 00:16:05.159 When paramedics arrived at the scene, they rushed Kenneth to 250 00:16:05.240 --> 00:16:10.799 the hospital, but it was too late. Kenneth Herring, a father, 251 00:16:11.360 --> 00:16:16.159 a husband, a brother, and a son, was gone. His 252 00:16:16.320 --> 00:16:22.559 death was sudden, violent, and completely unexpected. His family was devastated. 253 00:16:23.279 --> 00:16:25.200 I no longer have a big brother. 254 00:16:27.759 --> 00:16:33.360 He called me biscuit head all my life because from 255 00:16:33.399 --> 00:16:38.440 a little kid, every time my mom would get up 256 00:16:38.600 --> 00:16:41.919 every morning to make fresh biscuits, I would be there 257 00:16:43.200 --> 00:16:45.960 as the baby. I got the first one, and so 258 00:16:46.159 --> 00:16:50.720 as I got older, he would then just call me biscuit. 259 00:16:52.240 --> 00:16:54.000 I won't get to hear that anymore. 260 00:16:55.679 --> 00:16:56.759 We won't get to. 261 00:16:58.440 --> 00:17:03.799 Laugh at him because he couldn't dance, but he tried. 262 00:17:06.000 --> 00:17:11.400 No more Christmas, no more birthdays, no more family gather 263 00:17:13.279 --> 00:17:14.960 his grandchildren. 264 00:17:15.960 --> 00:17:24.559 Well, no, yes, no children, fair, they don't have a 265 00:17:24.960 --> 00:17:25.799 bother anymore. 266 00:17:27.039 --> 00:17:30.039 After Kenneth had died, an autopsy was performed to determine 267 00:17:30.079 --> 00:17:32.400 the cause and manner of his death. 268 00:17:33.079 --> 00:17:36.279 And did you recover any projectiles from mister Harry's body. 269 00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:40.680 Yes, So the bullet traveled through the abdomen. It struck 270 00:17:40.880 --> 00:17:45.400 the small intestine, the large intestine, the colon, and the 271 00:17:45.519 --> 00:17:49.359 left hiding. Then it came to rest just beneath the 272 00:17:49.519 --> 00:17:53.480 skin of the left side of the back. It resulted 273 00:17:53.680 --> 00:17:55.720 in a massive loss of blood. 274 00:17:57.200 --> 00:17:59.200 And what was the called the death in mister Harry's 275 00:17:59.240 --> 00:18:02.799 case guns one of the abdomen And what was the 276 00:18:02.920 --> 00:18:05.480 matter of death in mister Herring's homicide? 277 00:18:06.839 --> 00:18:09.759 Kenneth Herring had been shot to death in his own 278 00:18:09.880 --> 00:18:13.640 truck on the side of a Clayton County highway. When 279 00:18:13.680 --> 00:18:16.839 police arrived, there was no mystery about who pulled the trigger. 280 00:18:17.799 --> 00:18:19.839 The shooter confessed right then and there. 281 00:18:20.519 --> 00:18:23.440 Did you do anything to see if you could determine 282 00:18:23.680 --> 00:18:24.759 who had fired a shot? 283 00:18:25.079 --> 00:18:27.400 Yes, I asked who shot him? And that's when Miss 284 00:18:27.480 --> 00:18:31.160 Payne stated I did, and handed me her firearm, her 285 00:18:31.279 --> 00:18:34.160 license and her Georgia concealed carry permit. 286 00:18:35.200 --> 00:18:38.920 The shooter was twenty one year old Hannah Payne. She 287 00:18:39.000 --> 00:18:43.039 had witnessed the initial traffic accident and when Kenneth fled, 288 00:18:43.160 --> 00:18:46.799 she made the fateful decision to follow him. When she 289 00:18:46.880 --> 00:18:49.359 first witnessed the crash, Hannah was on her way home 290 00:18:49.400 --> 00:18:51.359 from her job as a property manager. 291 00:18:52.200 --> 00:18:53.839 Typically I'm in the field. 292 00:18:54.160 --> 00:19:00.880 I go from property to property, either collecting rent, sometimes 293 00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:04.880 walking vacant and or abandoned apartments that could potentially be 294 00:19:05.079 --> 00:19:11.119 under construction. And I would show vacant apartments to potential renters. 295 00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:14.519 And because you were going to all these different places 296 00:19:14.799 --> 00:19:17.000 to meet people you don't know, did you do anything 297 00:19:17.039 --> 00:19:17.759 for your safety? 298 00:19:18.559 --> 00:19:18.839 I did? 299 00:19:19.519 --> 00:19:20.079 And what was that. 300 00:19:20.759 --> 00:19:26.000 I registered for a concealed carry permit, and when I 301 00:19:26.119 --> 00:19:28.200 received it, I purchased a firearm. 302 00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:32.880 Several hours after she admitted to shooting, Kenneth Andna sat 303 00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:36.720 down with Clayton County detectives. They wanted to hear her 304 00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:40.200 side of the story. According to Hannah, when she caught 305 00:19:40.279 --> 00:19:42.119 up to Kenneth, she got out of her jeep and 306 00:19:42.279 --> 00:19:45.599 approached the truck. She told him he needed to return 307 00:19:45.680 --> 00:19:49.319 to the scene of the crash. That's when she claimed 308 00:19:50.000 --> 00:19:52.839 Kenneth grabbed her wrist and tried pulling her into the 309 00:19:52.920 --> 00:19:54.759 truck through the driver's side window. 310 00:19:56.920 --> 00:20:01.759 We started along action f and when he pushed again 311 00:20:01.920 --> 00:20:07.799 that he ran into my tired I wasn't washing him, 312 00:20:07.960 --> 00:20:11.200 I was trying to avoid him, and he had. 313 00:20:11.160 --> 00:20:12.960 Driving along behind my shirt. 314 00:20:13.960 --> 00:20:17.279 Hannah told detectives that Kenneth grabbed and ripped at her 315 00:20:17.359 --> 00:20:22.160 shirt as she struggled to break free. As she fought back, 316 00:20:22.960 --> 00:20:27.039 Kenneth's truck lurched forward, crashing into her parked jeep. 317 00:20:28.519 --> 00:20:36.519 Black my shirt, someone grabbed. I don't, honestly, I don't. 318 00:20:36.640 --> 00:20:40.759 I know, I don't remember how myself culture. 319 00:20:41.920 --> 00:20:45.319 Hannah claimed she had no memory of actually pulling the trigger. 320 00:20:46.279 --> 00:20:49.200 As for the evidence, Hannah did have some minor bruising 321 00:20:49.279 --> 00:20:52.359 and scratches on her body, and her shirt was nearly 322 00:20:52.559 --> 00:20:56.240 torn in half, so there were signs of a struggle. 323 00:20:56.359 --> 00:21:00.279 But why would Kenneth attack her? Why would he try 324 00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:03.279 to drag her into his truck? Was he just a 325 00:21:03.519 --> 00:21:07.400 drunk and angry man that day or was there something 326 00:21:07.480 --> 00:21:08.759 else to this story? 327 00:21:09.480 --> 00:21:11.680 Now, when you made contact with the driver in the 328 00:21:11.759 --> 00:21:16.079 maroon truck, what were your observations of him physically. 329 00:21:16.160 --> 00:21:19.160 Physically the scene that he was again out of it, 330 00:21:20.039 --> 00:21:23.839 I like send loads of his eyes for a glassy effect, 331 00:21:25.440 --> 00:21:28.680 and again not being a professional adopt or anything just 332 00:21:28.759 --> 00:21:33.680 saying that was he going through a diabetic situation or whatever. 333 00:21:33.799 --> 00:21:37.799 I didn't smell any alcohol on a sort, but I 334 00:21:37.920 --> 00:21:39.440 just noticed that the gentleman. 335 00:21:39.359 --> 00:21:40.599 Was out of it. 336 00:21:41.680 --> 00:21:43.240 So you didn't smell an alcohol, No. 337 00:21:43.279 --> 00:21:43.640 I did not. 338 00:21:44.759 --> 00:21:47.799 A key witness to the initial traffic accident was an 339 00:21:47.839 --> 00:21:50.440 off duty correctional officer who happened to work at the 340 00:21:50.519 --> 00:21:54.839 jail house infirmary. When the officer observed Kenneth after the crash, 341 00:21:55.240 --> 00:21:58.000 he concluded fairly quickly that Kenneth wasn't drunk at all, 342 00:21:58.119 --> 00:22:01.240 but was suffering from some kind of medical emergency like 343 00:22:02.039 --> 00:22:02.920 diabetic shock. 344 00:22:04.079 --> 00:22:07.440 You notified Detective More that he was walking pretty normal, 345 00:22:07.960 --> 00:22:10.319 but he reminded you of a person like you would 346 00:22:10.920 --> 00:22:13.359 like from when I was working in the infirmary and stuff. 347 00:22:13.799 --> 00:22:15.920 These guys, you know when you're a diabetic and you 348 00:22:16.039 --> 00:22:18.920 go into shock and your mindset, you know, That's what 349 00:22:19.039 --> 00:22:21.599 it reminded me of. He kept asking me what day 350 00:22:21.640 --> 00:22:25.200 it was and stuff like that, and I said, okay, sir, yes, 351 00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:28.480 So based on your observation of mister Herring on that 352 00:22:28.599 --> 00:22:31.839 day and your experience in working in the infirmary at 353 00:22:31.839 --> 00:22:36.359 the drem Defirment of Corrections, did you believe mister Herring 354 00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:38.720 was having a suffering from a medical condition. 355 00:22:40.000 --> 00:22:40.200 Yes. 356 00:22:41.400 --> 00:22:45.319 Later on investigators did confirm that Kenneth was a diabetic 357 00:22:46.039 --> 00:22:47.480 and that he relied on insulin. 358 00:22:48.119 --> 00:22:50.119 And are you related to Kenneth Herring? 359 00:22:50.359 --> 00:22:50.559 Yes? 360 00:22:50.880 --> 00:22:53.319 And how were you related to Kenneth Harring? I'm his 361 00:22:53.519 --> 00:22:58.640 baby's sister. In the time that you spent around Kenneth, 362 00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:03.759 were you ever aware of any medical conditions that Kenneth had? 363 00:23:04.640 --> 00:23:09.640 I knew, I know that he was a diabetic severely. 364 00:23:10.720 --> 00:23:13.440 Were you aware of any type of medications or anything 365 00:23:13.519 --> 00:23:15.799 that he had to do in order to manage his 366 00:23:16.039 --> 00:23:16.960 severe diabetes? 367 00:23:17.079 --> 00:23:18.599 He was insulindependent. 368 00:23:19.920 --> 00:23:24.200 Although Kenneth's medical condition was clear, the autopsy couldn't confirm 369 00:23:24.279 --> 00:23:26.720 if he was suffering from diabetic shock at the time 370 00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:27.359 of his death. 371 00:23:27.960 --> 00:23:31.559 When a person dies, the blood sugar continues to be 372 00:23:31.759 --> 00:23:33.960 metabolized very very quickly. 373 00:23:34.519 --> 00:23:37.480 So even in a person whose blood sugar. 374 00:23:37.440 --> 00:23:41.920 Was normal at their time of death, that test would 375 00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:43.440 show low blood sugar. 376 00:23:43.640 --> 00:23:47.119 That's just the normal course of what we call post 377 00:23:47.240 --> 00:23:48.039 warning change. 378 00:23:48.440 --> 00:23:51.519 So if his blood sugar was already low, there's no 379 00:23:51.680 --> 00:23:55.000 way for me to differentiate if he had a low 380 00:23:55.079 --> 00:23:59.279 blood sugar at the time of death versus the normal 381 00:23:59.519 --> 00:24:02.000 postmar a lowering of the blood sugar. 382 00:24:03.119 --> 00:24:07.400 While the autopsy couldn't verify diabetic shock, it could reveal 383 00:24:07.480 --> 00:24:10.640 if Kenneth was intoxicated on the day he died. 384 00:24:11.359 --> 00:24:16.319 So the comprehensive blood screen at the Georgia Bureau Investigation 385 00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:21.119 tests for all the major and common drugs of abuse, 386 00:24:21.640 --> 00:24:25.440 and there are hundreds of different additional drugs that the 387 00:24:26.799 --> 00:24:27.680 panel covers. 388 00:24:28.839 --> 00:24:34.319 And you say everything was negative, yes, And what about 389 00:24:34.480 --> 00:24:35.880 the blood alcohol kind thing? 390 00:24:36.200 --> 00:24:37.359 It was negative as well. 391 00:24:38.519 --> 00:24:42.599 The results were clear kenneth hering was not high, he 392 00:24:42.759 --> 00:24:45.759 was not drunk, and it was likely that he'd been 393 00:24:45.839 --> 00:24:50.000 in a state of diabetic shock when he crashed. When 394 00:24:50.079 --> 00:24:53.720 Kenneth's wife was questioned, she gave a plausible explanation for 395 00:24:53.839 --> 00:24:57.799 why Kenneth fled the scene of the accident. You probably 396 00:24:57.920 --> 00:25:01.400 knew he needed medical attention, didn't have time to wait 397 00:25:01.440 --> 00:25:03.519 for an ambulance that never came. 398 00:25:04.119 --> 00:25:07.160 And I know he was having a diabetic episode because 399 00:25:07.160 --> 00:25:08.279 he don't just run off the scene. 400 00:25:08.279 --> 00:25:09.680 I knew he was trying to get to the hospital. 401 00:25:10.640 --> 00:25:14.599