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Speaker 1: What is up, fellow Siko's I am Dan Valley coming

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at you as always with my certified Dan Tabia's co host,

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mister Grant Hughes, who I have an incredibly difficult question for.

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But before I ask the incredibly difficult question, you need

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to ask the question everyone wants to be able to do.

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Mister Hughes, how the heck are you?

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Speaker 2: I'm hanging in, Dan, That's usually the harder question for me.

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I'm curious what you think is a more difficult question

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than how are you doing? You know how I love

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that question.

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Speaker 1: One. I'm doing fine. Thank you for not asking?

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Speaker 2: What's my hit rate on asking you how you're doing?

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After you asking me? Is it like five percent?

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Speaker 1: What's the didn't we we threw a cur you didn't know,

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you're a great friend. We did the we had you

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do the intro once randomly, I don't know why, and

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you asked that time. So I would say at least

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zero point five percent of asking.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I'm going to try to bring that number up,

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just not today.

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Speaker 1: I am doing I'm doing okay. You know, I took

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a two week break from the gym and I have

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like two or three days left. Uh, and I'm starting

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to get I mean, you know, I've had we talked

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about this last week, but I'm starting to get a

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little okay, Like how do people not go to the

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gym like all the time? Like I my body does

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feel better, like it's obviously healed a lot of kind

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of just like these not chronic but just like soreness

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that I've had for years because I've never taken an

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extended break. But my god, I'm about I think my

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wife is ready to like, is all right? You need

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to get this mf R out of the house, Like, yeah,

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my difficult question for you, though, Grant, And maybe it's

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not difficult, but I do think it's worth a discussion.

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Who is the second best team in the NBA? Assuming

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and maybe we start here. I'm just gonna default to

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the Boston Celtics. Until forever, I was kind of concerned

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about their defense for a minute, It's like, oh, now

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they're sixth. I know Jalen Brown is injured, but what

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the fuck does it matter? Like they're just killing every

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Their offense is just a five alarm fire, a five

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alarm inferno. So I defer to them as the best

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team in the league because they don't have KP yet

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and they're still arguably the best team in the league.

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Speaker 2: I think that's right, although I was having I was

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thinking about this the other day, where you know, and

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we'll get to them. There are some teams that you know,

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the Boston's numbers so far, just like well, that's the

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best team. But but like there are some teams that

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haven't proved what Boston has that are there's there are arguments.

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We will make them and discuss them, but I find

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myself defaulting to like the cliche of well, I know,

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I just know that Boston can do it. And we're

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talking about the best team in the league. It's like,

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well who can win the championship? And just having seen

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Boston do it, okay, I just that's that gets benefit

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of the doubt. I wonder if that's right now because

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we've had six years that you haven't had a repeat champion,

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so like apparently now having done it doesn't count for

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what it used to. And that's even you know, the

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six year sample is small, so like, oh am I overweghing.

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I just wonder what you think about that, Like do

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you do the same thing where you default to like

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I have seen that happen. So I believe that it

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can happen again more readily than I can believe some

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of these other teams that haven't proved anything can get

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the first one. You know what I mean? Do you

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like that's a weird fall in.

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Speaker 1: Recent years, ever since the Kevin Durant Earraw Warriors, And

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maybe this is more to do with the landscape, I've

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kept more of an open mind when it comes to

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I picked the Nuggets to win the championship the year

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they won the championship, right, And I was scared to

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do it because this is the most popular podcast in

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the industry, and I knew people were gonna get mad

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when they heard that. Take Yeah, and I got the

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point was, well, if you actually believe this, So I'm

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more open minded to it. However, do you ever also

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does this feeling of well, I doubted. I'm gonna use

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Boston as an example. I was skeptical of the offseason

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they had in twenty twenty three. I thought there'd be

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a playmaking deficit. I didn't trust KP's performance with Washington

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or his ability to stay healthy, so I came in

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inherently skeptical. I did not give them the due credit

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that they deserved at the time. And so I'm maybe

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my overcorrecting. Do you ever find yourself doing that for

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lie doubt a dem and they just ran rough shot?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they can't. Don't do it again. Can't do it again.

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Speaker 1: So I mean that would dovetail nicely with this discussion anyway,

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because by asking who's the second best team in the NBA,

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even if you think that BOSS is not the best team,

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well then just apply this same discussion we're about to

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have then to this. And I do believe and maybe

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I think coming in the candidates for this would have

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been Minnesota, Dallas, and OKAC as the primary candidst Maybe

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some people would have said, could the Knick sneak in there?

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Could the Sixers sneak in there? Spoiler alert? The Sixers

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cannot sneak in there? Can the Bucks sneak in there?

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Spoiler alert? They cannot? And so it feels like it

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was Dallas, Minnesota, and OKAC and maybe some people were

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holding out hope for Denver. I still think that the Dallas, Minnesota,

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OKAC teams are the ones with some of the best

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cases and that I do think OKAYC probably has the strongest.

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This is more so my way of directing us towards

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the Cleveland Cavaliers. As grant, they are the second best

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team in the East, right you just you can't undefeated

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teams that we record this number one, But too, they're

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the only team in the league that's top five in

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offense and defense. And by the way, as a side note,

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Boston is coming to that, they're sixth in defense now

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to go along, I think they have the leagu's best

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offense at this moment. But before we sort of like

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dig into just the individual performances we've seen, particularly from

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their big four, do they have a case too? Honestly,

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it seems like it's we're pitting them against OKAC because

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Minnesota and Dallas. I still I don't Dallas has had

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somewhat weird start, and I've somehow never been more confident

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in them, But it does feel like I would default OKAC.

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We just recorded an extensive segment on their defense. They're

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not at full strength yet, they don't have a backup

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big at the moment, and yet they're just have the

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best defense of all time. So I'm curious as to

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before digging into the Cavaliers a little bit more, do

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you think that they have an actual case or worth

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a discussion and relative to what we know OKAC or again,

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even Dallas Minnesota.

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Speaker 2: Can be I think they definitely do. I mean and

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and like kudos to I know we both I think

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I think we both viewed them as like why can't

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they just be number two in the East before the

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season started? So like, I think they are in the discussion.

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I but sort of like the reason this is an

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interesting topic is that they feel like a weird team

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to nominate for the quote unquote second best slot, right,

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And I wonder why that. Maybe that's before we get

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into the all all the validating information to behind this point,

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like what are the reasons that it seems weird to say, oh, Cleveland,

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despite being eight zero is actually the second best team?

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Like what are what if any reservations do you have

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before we get into like, well, actually, here's why this

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might be the case.

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Speaker 1: Is it just I don't know that I have any

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reservations other than I would make the case that Oka

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see when they have Hartenstein is just going to be

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better and more dynamic. But our concerns about their offense

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in terms of do they have enough shot creation outside

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of Shay, they've a little bit, it's so early that

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it might not matter, and their half court offense is

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ticked up since we last were talking about them. I

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honestly think that that should be the only reason that

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no Okac is just as the example is just better.

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But do you think that the reservations at large are

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about what happened in Cleveland last season by the way

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they were injured in still almost won fifty games, or

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is it do people remember what they looked like in

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the playoffs that first season against the Knicks after having

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a great regular season, or is it this idea that well,

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there's still just a little lopsided because they have two

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bigs and they have two small guards, and so I'm

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not going to not that I'm not going to acknowledge,

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but we're not going to invest as much in how

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they're performing right now. We're inherently skeptical because of what

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we've seen. I honestly it feels like the reason would

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be people are just remembering the twenty twenty three playoffs, like, well,

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this is how that ended, even after they looked great together,

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So why should we believe that they're at this level

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just below the Boston Celtics or let alone at the

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level of the boss out there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you played the hits there. I think

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the all of those reasons are like they factor in

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in some and in some to some degree, I also

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think there's and and we can shoot them down, but

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there's the other things that give I think me and

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some other people pause as we discussed this, is like,

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well they just this cap seem just doesn't seem to

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have Oh there's no there's no big wing, right, Like

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that's that's what everybody wants. There's no one in that

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in between the too small and the two big setup

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they have, so like therefore you're just going to be

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at a disadvantage. And it's like, well you have evan

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mobile that can guard anybody, and it's not like okay,

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so the Jokic led nuggets like who was there? You know,

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elite two way wing like that, you know they they

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had role players there like MPJ and I guess Aaron

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Gordon not really a wing. And then I don't know,

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Murray's like, there's just no, they didn't have a Superstar wing, right,

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So like, yeah, Superstar Wars maybe two ways is they

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They definitely did have a two way wing and they

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don't anymore. But I think I think there's a lot

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of those those lingering questions or like I don't know,

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potential perceived frailties that like don't really apply anymore. And

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so having said that, now I think we can get

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into like some of the numbers or however you'd like

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to start discussing, you know, why there is a case

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for the Cavs as number two.

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Speaker 1: My goal then would be to convince you that they

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either have a better case than you thought, or that

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you're ready to pick them as the second best team.

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In me, I want to convince myself yeah, yeah, because

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I get accused of being a thunder homer all the

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time by commenters, which is I love it. I'm not

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gonna I love it like that. To me, that's great.

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But so the biggest thing that has stood out to

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me in terms of like the overall team performance, already

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mentioned their top five in offensive defense, and Boston is

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the only team that's really right now coming remotely close

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to joining that fray. But one of the things that

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stands out to me is that there are only four

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teams that are playing a fast their pace after opponent

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makes right now That is up from twenty seventh for

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Cleveland last season, and they did a good job varying

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the pace, especially during some of their staggered lineups or

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injury periods. So this is a team that is just no,

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they're not the fastest team in the NBA, but they

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can play at all these different cadences, and so that

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stands out. I think I've struggled, and I'll be curious

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to see where you land on this. Individually. I think

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Darius Garland might be standing out to me more than

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Evan Mobley right now. And let's not say Evan Mobley.

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There's been real growth there. But when you look at

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Darius Garland, he's shooting the three ball well, seems very

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comfortable working at the ball, but he is. He's been

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super efficient. He's scoring one point one to five points

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out of the pick and roll right now. He's cut

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down on his turnovers a little bit. Even though it

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feels like he has the ball less, that's still a

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good thing. You watch this guy on drives this year.

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He is just zipping past people and that has been

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huge for his efficiency around the rim. He's up to

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sixty five percent this year. He was at fifty nine

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percent last year, which was actually, I believe above his

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career average. I would have to double check that though.

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And the other thing is just like the scoring in

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those situations, Grant out of everyone who's put in fifty

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points off drives this year, no one has as many

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assists as Darius Garland. And here is just to the

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company he's keeping. Where this is everyone who has right

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now has scored at least fifty points and dished fifteen

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assists off drives. There's Darius, Sga, Trey and Jaw. That's

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absurd company to keep. When you're yes, I do think

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Darius Garland is playing like how people would envision a

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floor general would play. But you have these other two

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options on the court in Donovan Mitchell, who's just your

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best frum scratch creator, although that might be tied Jerome

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because he's just getting buckets right now as well, when

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you also have Evan Mobley, and so the growth or improvement,

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however you want to frame it. For Darius Garland, I

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think he's been absolutely massive for this team because he's

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an outlet when he doesn't have the ball, and this

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stuff he's doing with the ball that year, it's smarter

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it's more efficient, it's crisper, and to me, the biggest

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difference when I see him is never mind like where

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the volume's at, the way he looks when he's attacking

255
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going downhill is just monstrous. And it doesn't it doesn't

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matter what lineup it's in. It feels like, yeah, there's

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some lineups where there's more space, but he's just getting

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through traffic and getting by guys anyway right now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's funny like the path forward or the path

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to Cleveland getting to where it sort of is now

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had always been at least among us, And I said

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it a million times, like, oh mobiley just has to

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become their best player, Like that's how this happens, right,

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and like he's made strides. We you know, that's been

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a real topic of discussion throughout the season. But the

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other way that like we don't really like, I don't know,

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consider as much because it's not as it's not as

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sexy to say, is like, what if like a couple

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of their you know, top four guys just get better

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and it doesn't have to be like, oh Mobile has

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to be transcendent. It can be. Garland improves to this degree,

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which by the way, like it's clearer than ever that

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he just wasn't right last year because it interrupted an

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upward trajectory that his career was like very clearly on.

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And now he's in his age twenty five season and

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is doing exactly what you would hope a player that age,

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with his early career track record would do. So him

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leveling up a little bit, Jared Allen super consistent, maybe

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even a little better this year, Mobiley taking a small

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to moderate step forward, and Mitchell being fairly consistent, making

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forty percent of his threes. All that stuff like it's

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kind of Garland has been to me the most. I

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don't know, Mobil's been impressive, but like the Garland piece

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of it matters a ton because he's just giving them

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that second like plus plus creator. Hopefully that holds up

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because some of the drive stuff you mentioned is really

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interesting to me because if you had a knock on Garland,

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I think in the past, when healthy, it was that

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like he's just kind of too small and he can't

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get to all the passing angles he needs to on drives.

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Like I guess that's not an issue anymore. I guess

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he's gotten that much quicker and seeing the floor that

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much better to where he's just like he's a massive

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asset like that in an area that I had concerns

295
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about him, like nitpicky ones because he's obviously really good,

296
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but like the passing in a crowd and like being

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able to make you know, Luca and Lebron can make

298
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insane passes in jokics because they can just see angles

299
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and access angles smaller guys can't. For him to be

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doing what he's doing driving the ball is like hard

301
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to overstate how it's like profound of an impact that

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can have on an offense, and.

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Speaker 1: It's made I think, in combination what Mobley is doing,

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it's made life easier on Donovan Mitchell, who he's still

305
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had his moments where it's okay, he's trying to do

306
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too much, but we saw this last year. Part of

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that was injuries and we saw his role shift. He

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is better able to read what version of himself the

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Cavs need, I think than ever before. And so when

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he's not responsible, just in a vacuum for as much

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as the playmaking, yeah, he still has to generate a

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ton of his own shots, but like that's probably contributed

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to he's been I guess he's played like in terms

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of a year's long span, this is the best defensive

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version of the image we've ever seen, And so I

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wonder how much of that you know, we talk about

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staminas is it's just like ethereal, but stamina matters. And

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so if he doesn't have to do theoretically as much

319
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as a passer in addition to scoring on offense, what

320
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is that going to do for him defensively? I would

321
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have to think it does quite a bit. And I

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think my only note on him, because he's largely the

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same player is what I said before, Whereas he's very

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good at toggling between existences by possession in a way

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that he wasn't in Utah because he was never really

326
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afforded that luxury. And it's kind of tough to overstate

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that where it's, oh, we have you mentioned this? With

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Garland and the creation we have not one but two again,

329
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Ty Jerome has just been absolutely bonkers. Three alternative even

330
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Caris LeVert has been absolutely great. He feels I don't

331
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know how much of that is playing with Kenny Atkinson.

332
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Do I expect him to shoot a trillion percent on

333
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pull up jumpers forever? No, absolutely not. But he is

334
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someone else who it's just like he feels more plug

335
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and play than ever. And then if you look and it's, oh,

336
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this team has real depth to it, to where Ty Jerome,

337
00:16:01,039 --> 00:16:03,159
this is the most outlandish stat I've seen this season.

338
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He just leads the league in points per possession out

339
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of the pick and roll one point five two. I

340
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don't care how early it is. That's just absolutely nuts.

341
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And so this team has real depth to it, and

342
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I think Donovan Mitchell being able to fit very well,

343
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very comfortably into that larger context is a big deal.

344
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I don't think you and I ever had too many

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questions about that. But this is someone who is kind

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of each season, year over years, maybe had to shift

347
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the way that he's played, and now he's just to

348
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me better. It's more of just an aesthetics or a

349
00:16:32,399 --> 00:16:34,559
feel thing where it's, oh, he's just better at reading

350
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not the game, but the game within the game of

351
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what the Cavs need from him in that moment, that night, whatever.

352
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Speaker 2: And I think for him that's an especially valuable skill

353
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slash development, whatever you want to call it. Because I

354
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never got comfortable with the idea of Donovan Mitchell Colan

355
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best player on a championship team, like, you know, conventionally

356
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because just you know, his defensive impact wasn't there, Like

357
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he's undersized for that role. Great scorer, has like plenty

358
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of amazing playoff stretches, but I never quite got there

359
00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:13,759
where like all things being equal, Ken Donovan Mitchell be

360
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the best player on a title winner, I don't think

361
00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:19,279
he can unless you have a team like this where

362
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there's like three other guys. It's kind of a Boston

363
00:17:21,599 --> 00:17:23,599
theory and some of the same questions that always applied

364
00:17:23,599 --> 00:17:27,440
to Jason Tatum, where Okay, no, if you just have

365
00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:31,480
a conventional contender, Mitchell's probably not quite good enough. But

366
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if you have these other guys that make it so

367
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he doesn't have to be the be all end all

368
00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:39,640
every night and he can sort of diagnose what's necessary

369
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from him, then like, yeah, that picture does clarify a

370
00:17:43,559 --> 00:17:46,400
little bit, and it's sort of that's the theory of

371
00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:49,359
this Cabs team, I think maybe, which is a good

372
00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:52,279
thing to sort of focus on as we talk about him.

373
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It can be any one of those four guys that

374
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can be the best player on the team that night,

375
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and it doesn't have to be it's they're not like,

376
00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:01,519
they're not going to live and die with Mitchell because

377
00:18:01,559 --> 00:18:03,319
Garland might have a huge game and they're not gonna

378
00:18:03,319 --> 00:18:05,079
live and die with their offense if either of those

379
00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,359
guards are off because Evan Mobley and Jared Allen are

380
00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:09,119
great to like they have all these you.

381
00:18:09,079 --> 00:18:11,240
Speaker 1: Know ways that you get by mobilium and Jared Allen

382
00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:13,720
just yeah, it's or vice versa. How does that?

383
00:18:14,200 --> 00:18:17,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not like a true hierarchical here's the alpha

384
00:18:17,759 --> 00:18:19,880
and here's you know, everybody on down the line. It's

385
00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:22,119
there's there's you know, two to three guys every night

386
00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:24,519
that might just be making the biggest difference. And I

387
00:18:24,519 --> 00:18:26,359
think we view that a lot of times when talking

388
00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:28,799
about like championship equity as a negative because you've got

389
00:18:28,799 --> 00:18:31,160
to have the guy. But I don't view it as

390
00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:32,680
a negative in this instant if you have.

391
00:18:32,759 --> 00:18:36,680
Speaker 1: Four, what's better having one top ten player or and

392
00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:41,440
then another top fifty player or just having four top forty,

393
00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:43,119
top three. I don't know. I don't know where Jared

394
00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:45,759
Allen ranks in the hierarchy, even Mobley gets, but right

395
00:18:45,759 --> 00:18:47,480
now the Cavs very clearly have at least two top

396
00:18:47,519 --> 00:18:49,160
twenty five guys in the NBA at least.

397
00:18:49,279 --> 00:18:51,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and so far in the early going, just

398
00:18:52,039 --> 00:18:53,599
this season, it's like probably three.

399
00:18:53,759 --> 00:18:56,400
Speaker 1: That leads me to the Evan Mobley discussion, where I've

400
00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:58,279
always been a little bit higher on his offense. I

401
00:18:58,279 --> 00:19:00,240
think you have a lot of Cavs fans. I still

402
00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:01,839
would like to see him take more threes. He's at

403
00:19:01,839 --> 00:19:04,640
about two game he's been hitting him. But I never

404
00:19:06,079 --> 00:19:07,920
I don't want to say I didn't subscribe to the

405
00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:10,079
idea that featuring him more on offense meant you had

406
00:19:10,079 --> 00:19:12,079
to throw it down low. But I always thought that

407
00:19:12,279 --> 00:19:14,319
was is that what it meant? That was what I

408
00:19:14,319 --> 00:19:15,799
was most curious is what does it look like if

409
00:19:15,799 --> 00:19:18,680
you're giving Evan Mobley more agency over the offense and

410
00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:21,200
this version of the Cavs it has looked like, yeah,

411
00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:23,640
there's more of the grab and go, like the full

412
00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:25,880
length of the floor stuff, but it's just the face

413
00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:28,519
up stuff he's gone from. So last year, Grant he

414
00:19:28,599 --> 00:19:30,880
was at I want to get this right, five point

415
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:33,960
six drives per thirty six minutes. He's up to ten

416
00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:38,000
point seven this year. And the big takeaway for me

417
00:19:38,039 --> 00:19:40,119
from that is he's not super he'shooting like forty seven

418
00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:42,960
percent in those situations, which is it's fine, he's not

419
00:19:43,079 --> 00:19:45,880
passing a ton out of those situations, but it inherently

420
00:19:45,880 --> 00:19:49,240
puts extra pressure on set defenses. And I think it's

421
00:19:49,279 --> 00:19:52,640
also showcased and we've seen this even after he's setting screens.

422
00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,359
He is so much I'd like to know if there

423
00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:57,599
was a measure of how much stronger he actually is.

424
00:19:57,759 --> 00:19:59,880
But he is so much because he doesn't necessarily look

425
00:20:00,279 --> 00:20:04,119
like a lot stronger, but he is so much more comfortable,

426
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:08,200
so much better at facing contact, going through contact, getting

427
00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:11,759
still being aggressive in spite of that contact. He's averaging

428
00:20:11,839 --> 00:20:14,119
one point one to three points per possession as the

429
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,960
role man. And again we're seeing like this isn't a

430
00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:18,519
Cavs team when you have him and Jared Allen on

431
00:20:18,519 --> 00:20:20,640
the court and he's your screener, like Jared Allen's kind

432
00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:23,599
of off to the side, and in theory should make

433
00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:26,960
you easier to defend. He's had some tough finishes in

434
00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,799
those situations, so to have a career high mark in

435
00:20:29,839 --> 00:20:32,720
points per possession as the roleman, that to me has

436
00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:34,640
shown and along with the drives, like this is someone

437
00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:38,559
who is more comfortable working within the confines of Cleveland's

438
00:20:38,599 --> 00:20:40,799
half court offense, if defense are gonna collapse on him,

439
00:20:40,799 --> 00:20:44,079
if he's gonna face traffic never before now, I still

440
00:20:44,079 --> 00:20:46,400
think there are levels he needs to explore. The playmaking,

441
00:20:46,599 --> 00:20:48,720
like from the face up spots, getting going downhill, making

442
00:20:48,799 --> 00:20:51,400
quicker decisions that way. I think he's capable of it.

443
00:20:51,640 --> 00:20:53,799
Will we ever see more of it, We'll have to see.

444
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,319
But the minutes that he's like to him, the staggering

445
00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:58,680
minutes where you're gonna pair him with uh, like, they're

446
00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:02,000
just absolutely slaughtering people right now. And that's the This

447
00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:04,920
is just a fun aside. Funniest side is Dan Wade

448
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:07,039
didn't play the other night, so they started as Aga Korro.

449
00:21:07,519 --> 00:21:10,000
They're starting five on the season grant, so it's those

450
00:21:10,039 --> 00:21:11,960
four plus team way they have a negative net rating.

451
00:21:12,279 --> 00:21:15,079
Speaker 2: I'm gonna bring that up as like in.

452
00:21:15,039 --> 00:21:19,079
Speaker 1: Theory they Max Strews hasn't played yet. They haven't even peaked,

453
00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:21,920
is my point. And it's not Oh, Evan Mobley can

454
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:25,559
continue to get better. Another fun aside too, Jared Allen

455
00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:27,799
leads this team in minutes per game. He's the only

456
00:21:27,839 --> 00:21:31,839
one averaging thirty. So that's just I don't expect that

457
00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:33,920
the whole all year. But so you're gonna make it

458
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:35,640
through the first what ten games or so of the

459
00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:37,720
season where only one of your players is to average

460
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,680
thirty minutes per game. Kevin Durant would kill to have

461
00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:42,279
teammates like that. I feel like at this point in

462
00:21:42,319 --> 00:21:45,839
the front court, so I look at this team just

463
00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:49,640
the macro of it all. It's it's deep, it's functional depth.

464
00:21:49,839 --> 00:21:51,680
And yes there will be tough. They're not gonna if

465
00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:54,640
they go eighty two and oh, I mean congratulations, it's

466
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,640
not happening. I the reason I'm asking you now this question,

467
00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:01,599
this is where we if you have to we mentioned

468
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:04,640
the other teams. I don't have an answer. Which team

469
00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:06,200
is supposed to be the second best team in the

470
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:08,680
East other than them? Like that discussion is no longer

471
00:22:08,759 --> 00:22:11,400
mentally stimulating for me, and I know Nick Sahans will

472
00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:13,559
probably be. We need time to come together. The offense

473
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:16,279
is still third even though no it's there's no depth

474
00:22:16,519 --> 00:22:19,680
there I have. This is why you should join our discord.

475
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:21,200
I don't know if you saw the message where I've

476
00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:23,480
just been sitting on a thought that I'm still not

477
00:22:23,559 --> 00:22:26,440
even ready to share, like super publicly there's gonna come

478
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,559
a time where I might be prepare to say some

479
00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:32,599
preposterously spicy things about where the Knicks are at, despite

480
00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:35,359
with some of them, because I don't think they've shown

481
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:37,039
enough and I feel confidence saying this. You don't get

482
00:22:37,039 --> 00:22:38,599
to default. The Knicks is the biggest threat to the

483
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,640
Boston Celtics in the Eastern Conference, and you certainly can't

484
00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:44,440
say that it's still even gonna be healthy enough. What

485
00:22:44,559 --> 00:22:46,440
have you seen from Milwaukee that would make you want

486
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:49,640
to pick Milwaukee? Orlando loses, Palo Bankaro, the Miami Heat.

487
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:52,359
Just have I feel confidence anything? They have zero identity.

488
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:56,000
They have zero identity right now. The only answer is

489
00:22:56,039 --> 00:22:58,200
the CAFs. You don't get to talk me into any

490
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,200
other team as of right now, which is why I'm

491
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:04,160
asking you, like, would you be prepared? But how how

492
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:05,839
sweet are you now to say, you know what, they

493
00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:07,559
might be the second best team in me? Or is

494
00:23:07,599 --> 00:23:09,759
it just man? The thunder exists? I can't get there.

495
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:13,359
Speaker 2: No, I definitely there is no counter argument. If you're

496
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,160
talking about today, I'd like, that's just the stats are

497
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:19,759
what they are, that they're health, the calves are healthy,

498
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:23,799
they're the depth is like shockingly goods over all, like

499
00:23:23,839 --> 00:23:27,839
everybody up and down, like carrosel Vert's making half his threes. Uh,

500
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,640
sam Merrill's making thirty nine percent of Chorros make They're

501
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:31,160
all just like.

502
00:23:31,079 --> 00:23:36,119
Speaker 1: Every Georgia row is invading Doc Rivers's sleep. Doc Rivers

503
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:39,079
is thinking about it, Like Doc Rivers mentioning Sam Merrill

504
00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:41,039
a conference.

505
00:23:41,039 --> 00:23:45,319
Speaker 2: I will I and I think, like, cause I guess

506
00:23:45,759 --> 00:23:49,559
you would, you would say, well, what part of Cleveland,

507
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:51,839
like do you not believe in? Like, we definitely believe

508
00:23:51,839 --> 00:23:53,880
in the defense. We just know that the defense is

509
00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:55,960
going to be great and the offense you have more

510
00:23:56,039 --> 00:23:58,319
questions about. But if Garland's going to play like this

511
00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:01,039
and Mobiley is going to sustain this like moderate step forward,

512
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:04,640
let alone like continue to expand his game, then I get, yeah,

513
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:06,559
you have Donovan Mitchell, Like how bad is the offense

514
00:24:06,599 --> 00:24:09,680
going to be? There's not really like an obvious weakness.

515
00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:12,480
I still get hung up on, like, well, what if

516
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,079
the Knicks like figure it out, you know, and in

517
00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:20,000
a playoff series just having Brunson and you know, I'm

518
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:23,240
hesitant to say that, like the Cavs have the best

519
00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:27,559
chance to meet Boston in the Conference finals, for example,

520
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:30,559
but they're definitely going to have the number two seed,

521
00:24:30,839 --> 00:24:32,880
if not number one, So like that helps, you know,

522
00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:35,640
I'm one hundred percent on board with at the moment

523
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:38,359
and through these you know, first couple of weeks in change,

524
00:24:38,839 --> 00:24:40,759
they've definitely been the second best team in the East

525
00:24:40,759 --> 00:24:43,559
and second best team in the league potentially Okay See

526
00:24:43,599 --> 00:24:45,599
is still just I don't know what to think about them.

527
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,920
Speaker 1: The fair thing might be to say then that they

528
00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:52,039
to me, because I'm still picking okay See over them.

529
00:24:52,079 --> 00:24:53,920
Spoiler alert. I think the Caaves have been impressive, but

530
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,519
it's going to be that I've seen more Okac's body

531
00:24:56,519 --> 00:24:59,240
of work, and it feels like they're leaving there's more

532
00:24:59,279 --> 00:25:01,359
on the table from the then this might be close

533
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:03,000
to the peak version of the Calves even with maybe

534
00:25:03,039 --> 00:25:06,119
I'm wrong, even without Max Strews, but you would have

535
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:10,240
to really sell me hard on them not being the

536
00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:14,079
third best team league right now, and that's with Minnesota

537
00:25:14,079 --> 00:25:17,200
and Dallas. I'm super optimistic on still at the moment,

538
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:19,279
I don't know. I don't even remember where we put

539
00:25:19,279 --> 00:25:21,359
Cleveland our standings. I know we acknowledge they could be

540
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:22,920
the second best team East. I don't think either of

541
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:23,680
us predicted it.

542
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:26,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, though you know the thing maybe this is this

543
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:28,759
is what's making sense in my brain now that we've

544
00:25:28,759 --> 00:25:32,480
talked it through. It's like the calves. The best thing

545
00:25:32,559 --> 00:25:34,799
you can say if you're trying to be critical is

546
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:38,119
I don't know if what they're doing will sustain in

547
00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:42,119
the playoffs. Like, okay, sure, with teams like the Knicks

548
00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:44,680
and some and the other ones you mentioned, it's like

549
00:25:45,759 --> 00:25:49,720
they're not even doing anything well enough now for us

550
00:25:49,759 --> 00:25:52,720
to ask the question of like can that hold up

551
00:25:52,759 --> 00:25:55,240
in the playoffs? Like they haven't even reached the threshold

552
00:25:55,319 --> 00:25:58,160
where of the calves where it's like this is going great,

553
00:25:58,799 --> 00:26:00,960
So okay, let's just if they could keep it up.

554
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:03,000
Nobody else has even gotten to the point where we

555
00:26:03,079 --> 00:26:05,079
ask can they keep it up? Other than Boston in

556
00:26:05,079 --> 00:26:07,720
the East. It's like so the Knicks in the you

557
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:13,000
know whatever, Pacers, Magic Sixers, Bucks, like on down the line.

558
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:15,200
It's like, at least show us the first thing. At

559
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:17,000
least show us that you are a theory of how

560
00:26:17,039 --> 00:26:20,279
this is gonna work successfully, so we can then question

561
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:23,200
it like over a long stretch of games and post

562
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,759
seasons stuff like that. That's the differentiator. So far. To

563
00:26:26,799 --> 00:26:29,559
me more than anything is that we get it. Calves

564
00:26:29,599 --> 00:26:31,680
are great. Just the only question is can they continue

565
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:32,920
to be Nobody else is great.

566
00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:35,039
Speaker 1: I'm even wondering, and this is in the best spot

567
00:26:35,079 --> 00:26:37,599
of being and I we'll have to move on from here.

568
00:26:37,599 --> 00:26:39,319
We spend way too much time with the Cavs slash.

569
00:26:39,519 --> 00:26:41,319
But who's the second best team in the NBA? Let

570
00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:43,240
us know in the comments if you're still listening or

571
00:26:43,599 --> 00:26:45,279
in our discord, and if you're not in there linked

572
00:26:45,279 --> 00:26:48,559
to that's in the podcast and YouTube description. I would

573
00:26:48,599 --> 00:26:50,200
have a questions about their offense, but they can also

574
00:26:50,279 --> 00:26:52,559
they can stagger more. I think when I was looking,

575
00:26:52,559 --> 00:26:54,400
I think, well, we've played like half of his possessions

576
00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:56,039
alongside Jared now at this point, and so if you

577
00:26:56,079 --> 00:26:58,519
get into a point where the offense is in persisting,

578
00:26:58,599 --> 00:27:00,480
like you can play the heavily stack or a card

579
00:27:00,519 --> 00:27:02,359
and that might be the I think they've done a

580
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:05,440
good job playing those two together. But like Evan Mobley

581
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,759
shooting forty seven percent on two is right now when

582
00:27:08,599 --> 00:27:10,680
Jared Allen's on the floor, that's way lower than it

583
00:27:10,759 --> 00:27:13,880
was last year. But it's just like, oh, they still

584
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,359
have this up like they have more room to explore,

585
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,079
but that would be the fair I think doubt is

586
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:21,880
does the offense because, by the way, Evan Mobley might

587
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:23,839
just be the defensive player of the year right now.

588
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,039
I know Wemby exists, and it's weird to say that

589
00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:29,279
with OKAC kind of floating around, but it's that feels

590
00:27:29,319 --> 00:27:31,000
like more if you had to pick the best, like

591
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:33,960
the most valuable defender on OKAC is chet Holmgren, I

592
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,880
guess the award would go to Probably it's more of

593
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,279
like a feels like a by committee thing because they're

594
00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:41,480
just like so small and scrappy and chaotic and for

595
00:27:41,559 --> 00:27:45,440
neetic as hell. So the causes of right now were

596
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:47,880
one of the like two or three just eleven or

597
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,720
maybe just one of the two eleven of they are

598
00:27:50,759 --> 00:27:53,519
they the only because we have qualms about Okayc's offense.

599
00:27:53,559 --> 00:27:55,680
There's been some weird stuff with Boston at points, but

600
00:27:56,039 --> 00:27:57,559
they are one of the two or three teams that's

601
00:27:57,599 --> 00:28:00,759
just like no notes, right yeah, supposed to pick at

602
00:28:00,759 --> 00:28:03,079
and be like, oh this because what is not Okay

603
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:05,680
caris LeVert Ty Jerome, who, by the way, eighty one

604
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,200
percent of Tijerome's buckets are going on assisted right now,

605
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:09,960
just and he's still shooting the hell out of it.

606
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:13,000
Maybe those guys they're shop making pulls back, but like

607
00:28:13,039 --> 00:28:15,680
there's calves have margin for error right for that to

608
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:16,920
happen and still just be fine.

609
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,880
Speaker 2: Yep. No, there just aren't that many teams that are

610
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:22,119
in a position like Cleveland where it's where you just

611
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:25,160
have to start looking for like, well, this will change

612
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:27,720
for the worst, and that's why they're not good. You know,

613
00:28:27,759 --> 00:28:30,519
they just have done everything you could ask to this point.

614
00:28:30,319 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 1: Which team did you want to talk about next? On

615
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:34,039
this edition of the Bounce Around, Mister.

616
00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:36,680
Speaker 2: Hugheston, We're gonna really go the other way a little

617
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,079
bit here. I want to talk some Wizards. And this

618
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:41,240
was you know, we were joking trying to decide what

619
00:28:41,279 --> 00:28:44,240
to talk about today when we were texting. I guess, yes,

620
00:28:44,359 --> 00:28:47,359
yesterday the day before, and we're both thinking Wizards. So

621
00:28:48,039 --> 00:28:51,680
that's one a problem because group think is a terrible disease.

622
00:28:51,759 --> 00:28:55,000
But it feels necessary and I want to couch this

623
00:28:55,079 --> 00:28:58,240
first in like Washington's Tune four. They got the worst

624
00:28:58,279 --> 00:29:01,440
defense in the league. They're twenty ninth in net rating,

625
00:29:01,559 --> 00:29:04,960
Like this is just this team is bad, but that's

626
00:29:05,319 --> 00:29:08,319
one kind of the point and to the expectation given

627
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,279
like where they are post Bradley Beal and finally turning

628
00:29:11,319 --> 00:29:15,240
into like a functional rebuild. So I want to start

629
00:29:15,279 --> 00:29:18,960
with the biggest difference maker on the team, which is

630
00:29:19,039 --> 00:29:21,720
Jordan Poole, Defensive Player of the Year candidate, who is

631
00:29:21,799 --> 00:29:24,799
hilariously averaging four stocks per game, which is like third

632
00:29:24,799 --> 00:29:27,720
in the league. That's insane. No, we're not going to

633
00:29:27,759 --> 00:29:30,599
talk about Jordan Poole. That's the last I'm gonna mention him.

634
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 1: Probably, Well, Jordan Poole has been better a little bit

635
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:36,599
of a corner at the end of last year, and

636
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:37,880
it feels like most of that is.

637
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 2: Just persisting, right, Yeah, No, he's been better hard it

638
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:42,680
would hard to be. It would be difficult to be

639
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,880
worse than he was for most of last year. But

640
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,400
this is about the three rookies that are playing a

641
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:51,799
ton and uh, the second year player that like this

642
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:54,079
Core I don't know. I've heard Core four on the

643
00:29:54,119 --> 00:29:56,519
broadcast the other day, so I'm going to just go

644
00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:59,519
with it. But it's bilall cool. But I'm gonna say

645
00:29:59,759 --> 00:30:02,119
I'm I have been saying, Kola Bali, have you been

646
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:06,200
saying Kouli Bali I have it's kulibali and that's just

647
00:30:06,279 --> 00:30:07,920
way harder to say, and I don't love it, but

648
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:09,799
I'm going to really try to get it to just

649
00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:13,920
make that Bali kulabalie like emphasis on the last syllable.

650
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:18,079
So he's kinda he's the most known of these four commodities,

651
00:30:18,079 --> 00:30:20,519
obviously because he's got a year of experience. But and

652
00:30:20,559 --> 00:30:22,119
he's the guy that we've kind of been in the

653
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,599
bag for, you know, really since he was barely into

654
00:30:25,599 --> 00:30:29,039
his rookie year, just because of the potential of the size,

655
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:32,039
the sort of black box, like I don't know what's

656
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,720
what's in there, what are we going to get? He's

657
00:30:34,839 --> 00:30:37,079
just you know, he's coming off now as we're recording

658
00:30:37,079 --> 00:30:38,400
this his worst game of the year. He was three

659
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:42,039
eleven against the Warriors, still averaging almost eighteen points a game,

660
00:30:42,079 --> 00:30:44,920
almost six boards, two and a half assists, making fifty

661
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:47,240
five percent of his shots, forty four percent from deep,

662
00:30:47,279 --> 00:30:49,759
eighty percent of his free throws. That's a sixty seven

663
00:30:49,839 --> 00:30:53,039
percent true shooting percentage, which for him, for anybody, that's

664
00:30:53,039 --> 00:30:54,839
phenomenal for a guy that you're like, I don't know

665
00:30:54,839 --> 00:30:57,960
about the offense, Like that's ridiculous at that level, at

666
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:02,160
that volume. Despite that, he's still to me, I'm telling

667
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:04,720
me what you think about this a guy that like

668
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:09,720
has so much room to expand what he's doing offensively

669
00:31:09,759 --> 00:31:12,279
because his usage rate is like just under eighteen percent,

670
00:31:12,359 --> 00:31:16,279
so he's just like not taking up a lot of possessions.

671
00:31:17,079 --> 00:31:21,200
It just the athleticism, the size, the flashes of like,

672
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:22,960
oh my god, he can handle the ball in the

673
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:25,480
pick and roll. He's become a better cutter, his spot

674
00:31:25,559 --> 00:31:30,119
up has improved dramatically. Like there's just so much unexplored

675
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:33,039
territory with him. And that's really I think that's where

676
00:31:33,079 --> 00:31:35,000
you start when you talk about the Wizards. There's these

677
00:31:35,039 --> 00:31:37,279
other guys we'll get into, but like, isn't would you

678
00:31:37,319 --> 00:31:41,559
still view him as like, this is like the guy

679
00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:45,200
if there is one at this early juncture for the Wizards.

680
00:31:45,599 --> 00:31:48,559
Speaker 1: I think I would. And part of that too is

681
00:31:48,599 --> 00:31:50,319
and I don't think you mentioned this is so you

682
00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,119
mentioned all just the offense that they've tapped into and

683
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:56,279
maybe not tapped into just yet. And it's also okay,

684
00:31:56,319 --> 00:31:58,559
now you go guard the best player on the other team, and.

685
00:31:58,599 --> 00:32:00,839
Speaker 2: Right the defense is the given we like, I think

686
00:32:00,839 --> 00:32:02,720
that's well understood about him already.

687
00:32:02,839 --> 00:32:05,519
Speaker 1: It just is the floridnavigation on defense and the ability

688
00:32:05,559 --> 00:32:07,559
to just I don't again, he's someone who looks a

689
00:32:07,559 --> 00:32:09,640
little bit stronger and he's to continue to get stronger.

690
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:12,119
But oh no, you go defend like smaller point of

691
00:32:12,119 --> 00:32:15,240
attack guards or just go guard these bigger power power

692
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:17,640
wings and he's going to do it. And it's just

693
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,000
I know, the Wizard's defense isn't good. I think, what

694
00:32:20,039 --> 00:32:24,319
is it thirtieth? I don't care because when you watch him,

695
00:32:24,359 --> 00:32:26,599
it's okay, am I going to predict defensive player of

696
00:32:26,599 --> 00:32:28,400
the year. No, But is this someone who can kind

697
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,440
of be the infrastructure of your perimeter defense? I would say.

698
00:32:31,359 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, and these can be noisy. But to that point,

699
00:32:35,319 --> 00:32:38,000
if you just break it down by time spent defending,

700
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,160
his most common matchups this year, in order are Trey Young,

701
00:32:41,279 --> 00:32:44,279
Jason Tatum, Jimmy Butler, Donovan Mitchell, and Steph Curry. Those

702
00:32:44,279 --> 00:32:47,720
are the top five. So these are tiny samples, right,

703
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:51,880
But when you said, like him against smaller guards so far,

704
00:32:52,119 --> 00:32:54,799
to me, that is where he is like an A

705
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:57,920
plus difference maker. So Trey Young is two for fifteen

706
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:01,440
on the season, when Kolbally is asgnated as his primary defender,

707
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:05,079
Steph is one of seven. Like his length and mobility

708
00:33:05,119 --> 00:33:08,240
against smaller guards is just death. So like, if you're

709
00:33:08,279 --> 00:33:11,640
thinking of the theory of the Wizard's longer term, you've

710
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:14,640
got the guy that you can just throw at the

711
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:18,799
primary creator. I'd like if it's a wing, sure, but

712
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:20,720
if it's a smaller guard, I think he can just

713
00:33:20,759 --> 00:33:22,680
a limit. He can just erase. That guy is what

714
00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:25,480
it's starting to look like on now. He's he's a

715
00:33:25,519 --> 00:33:29,440
second year player, he's young, he's inconsistent, but the outlines

716
00:33:29,519 --> 00:33:33,000
of like, okay, this is how our defense will potentially

717
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:35,599
be built. Alex Sarr behind him, we'll talk about him.

718
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,440
It's looking like a at least at least a very

719
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,839
good shot blocker. But he can coolibal. He can just

720
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:45,039
be the guy that takes your best offensive player out

721
00:33:45,039 --> 00:33:47,039
of the game. And and like, I don't know that

722
00:33:47,039 --> 00:33:49,880
that's that's a pretty powerful asset to have if you're

723
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:53,039
trying to like put together a team and just imagine

724
00:33:53,039 --> 00:33:55,400
what all these you know, sub twenty one year olds

725
00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:56,759
are going to look like down the line.

726
00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: I think most people would still default to that the

727
00:33:59,759 --> 00:34:02,119
guy has yet to be drafted, and that might be

728
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:05,000
true given where what this draft class is projected to

729
00:34:05,039 --> 00:34:08,440
look like. But to be here and kind of like

730
00:34:08,519 --> 00:34:10,760
the overarching question will get to is whether the Washington

731
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,599
Wizards are ahead of schedule. But to be here and

732
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:16,760
like cool bai is that's a real answer right now.

733
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,119
And I actually don't think maybe you and I haven't

734
00:34:19,119 --> 00:34:22,400
fully appreciated it, but I think writ large, this isn't

735
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:24,840
fully appreciated in general when you're talking just anyone who

736
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,079
follows the entire league gets the Wizards are kind of

737
00:34:27,119 --> 00:34:30,719
still waiting on finding that person, and you had to

738
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:32,679
really read into I don't know that either of us

739
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:34,760
we would have said, Okay, sure he's their best chance

740
00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:37,079
at having that guy last year. I think now he

741
00:34:37,159 --> 00:34:39,119
might have reached the point you can actively just predict

742
00:34:39,199 --> 00:34:42,360
that there's a not inignificant chance that their best player

743
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:44,559
of the future isn't someone they've yet to draft or

744
00:34:44,559 --> 00:34:46,440
that they've yet to acquire, like, it might just be him.

745
00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:49,920
Speaker 2: And I think at the very very least you have,

746
00:34:50,159 --> 00:34:53,000
if you have watched him at all, you've got to

747
00:34:53,079 --> 00:34:56,880
say that guy's going to be a phenomenal role player

748
00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:59,039
on a really good team. Like that feels like and

749
00:34:59,199 --> 00:35:02,199
you know that's that's immensely valuable too, right, Like that's

750
00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:06,119
that having that kind of floor to forget the ceiling,

751
00:35:06,119 --> 00:35:10,760
which we both think is super high. That's so when

752
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:12,719
you do get the guy, if you're of the mind

753
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:16,159
that he's not there yet, GLOBALI just fits perfectly next

754
00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:19,280
next to like whatever superstar guy you have not yet

755
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:22,599
drafted or traded for or Whatever's so there's still three

756
00:35:22,639 --> 00:35:25,440
other guys, these three rookies they've got this year, Kishan, George,

757
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:29,320
Alex Aar and Bob Carrington. Just first of all, you

758
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:31,960
love like how spread across the positional spectrum all those

759
00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:33,840
guys are. It just fits, you know, like none of

760
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:36,400
these guys overlap with each other really at all. And

761
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,159
they have such differing skill sets. I mean, we can

762
00:35:39,199 --> 00:35:41,559
go in any order. I think George is probably the

763
00:35:41,679 --> 00:35:46,599
least known and has so far been the least productive probably.

764
00:35:46,519 --> 00:35:48,840
Speaker 1: And he really had a lot in and I'm like,

765
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:49,519
he's got it.

766
00:35:49,679 --> 00:35:50,320
Speaker 2: I've got it.

767
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:53,280
Speaker 1: There's more ball skills to him, more physicality to him

768
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:55,480
than I thought. I think the shots will eventually start

769
00:35:55,519 --> 00:35:58,239
to fall. And he's another guy that's been competing on

770
00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:00,400
defense where he clearly doesn't have the ceiling for them,

771
00:36:00,599 --> 00:36:03,400
uh feeling that Blah Kolabai does on the defensive end.

772
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:05,599
But he's just someone who feels when you talk about

773
00:36:05,639 --> 00:36:08,039
who's going to be a superstar role player, this is

774
00:36:08,079 --> 00:36:10,199
someone who feels and we're getting ahead of our skis

775
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:12,800
here because he's fewer than ten games into his career.

776
00:36:13,599 --> 00:36:16,800
But I just he feels so plug and play and

777
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:20,239
it's gonna be able to do like jack of all trades,

778
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:22,880
master of none type shit, and that as you're what

779
00:36:23,039 --> 00:36:25,440
fourth or fifth starter at some point and I'm not.

780
00:36:25,599 --> 00:36:28,000
I don't like saying injuries were blessing in disguise, but

781
00:36:28,159 --> 00:36:30,000
they had that they don't have to. But they've been

782
00:36:30,039 --> 00:36:32,559
starting him ever since the Kyle Kuzma groin injury, and

783
00:36:32,719 --> 00:36:34,199
I don't know if he's gonna give that spot back.

784
00:36:35,079 --> 00:36:37,920
Speaker 2: I mean that I have the same thought of like, well, man,

785
00:36:38,119 --> 00:36:40,480
I guess you better just trade Kuzman now because I

786
00:36:40,519 --> 00:36:43,639
don't know that you're gonna I mean, like Georgia's had

787
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:46,440
one and a half good games, I would say so far,

788
00:36:46,559 --> 00:36:50,159
like just statistically, like he had his twenty pointer against

789
00:36:50,159 --> 00:36:52,440
the Warriors, that was Washington his last game. As we're

790
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,480
recording this, uh Draymond Green talked about him and all

791
00:36:55,559 --> 00:36:57,280
the other young guys after the fact and was like

792
00:36:57,480 --> 00:36:59,800
they got our respect because George was just going at

793
00:36:59,880 --> 00:37:03,960
him and like both competitively and like verbally, not always

794
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:05,639
the best idea, but I mean for a.

795
00:37:05,639 --> 00:37:06,880
Speaker 1: Rookie, I favorite.

796
00:37:07,559 --> 00:37:10,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm I'm on board. Like you're you're the Washington Wizards.

797
00:37:10,679 --> 00:37:12,920
You have been a laughing stock for like quite some time.

798
00:37:13,599 --> 00:37:15,519
Talk you talk like I think I think that's a

799
00:37:15,639 --> 00:37:18,400
that's a positive, But you said it like the numbers

800
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:21,519
aren't really there. He's he's averaging like eight points four boards,

801
00:37:21,559 --> 00:37:25,159
a couple of assists. The shooting has been terrible all

802
00:37:25,199 --> 00:37:26,679
in all, but he did you know he got up

803
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:29,280
seventeen threes against the Warriors, made six of them. There

804
00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:31,880
were five in a row that went down. Uh. Just

805
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:35,480
the feel is there, the versatility, the positional size you want,

806
00:37:35,639 --> 00:37:37,599
just all that stuff is really there for him.

807
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:39,800
Speaker 1: It is I forget about that.

808
00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:41,519
Speaker 2: It's it's a deeper cut.

809
00:37:41,599 --> 00:37:41,840
Speaker 1: Right.

810
00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:44,559
Speaker 2: We started with a deeper cut, So we should move

811
00:37:44,599 --> 00:37:46,360
to do you want to talk about sar or Carrington?

812
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:47,360
Which pick your points.

813
00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:50,239
Speaker 1: I have stronger thoughts about Carrington to this point, Oh,

814
00:37:50,559 --> 00:37:51,480
let's let's go with Sar.

815
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:55,039
Speaker 2: So Sar to me, having watched a lot of tape

816
00:37:55,360 --> 00:37:58,000
in the last few days and just kind of marrying

817
00:37:58,039 --> 00:38:01,320
that with the pre draft scouting reports and what we

818
00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:05,360
saw the real lows of the preseason and summer league

819
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:09,719
and stuff. Statistically, I do feel confident that he's just

820
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:12,239
gonna block shots. Five point three percent block rate. That's

821
00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:14,519
ninety seven percent of among biggs. He's blocked at least

822
00:38:14,519 --> 00:38:17,280
two shots in every game in his career. That's like,

823
00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:19,360
you know, short career, but get a couple of blocks

824
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:22,400
a game is never an accident. I think the most

825
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:24,679
interesting thing to me in terms of like what is

826
00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:27,440
this guy gonna be is that Washington is clearly viewing

827
00:38:27,519 --> 00:38:30,159
him as a center so far eighty six percent.

828
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:32,000
Speaker 1: By the way, it didn't seem like they were gonna

829
00:38:32,079 --> 00:38:32,840
do no.

830
00:38:33,039 --> 00:38:35,519
Speaker 2: Why is Valentounis on like that? That was that was

831
00:38:35,559 --> 00:38:37,280
the takeaway was like, Oh, I guess they think Star

832
00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:40,079
is a four or they don't. He's not ready yet.

833
00:38:40,159 --> 00:38:44,480
So he may not be ready, but Washington's defense has

834
00:38:44,519 --> 00:38:47,880
been a fraction above league average with Sar at center,

835
00:38:48,039 --> 00:38:50,840
So that's like you're looking for encouraging signs. That's that's

836
00:38:50,840 --> 00:38:55,320
a big one. Small sample caveats apply. Obviously, it seems

837
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:57,400
as if he's going to be a stretch five. Part

838
00:38:57,400 --> 00:39:00,360
of that's because half his shots have been from deep year,

839
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:03,199
but he's making twenty, like twenty percent of them, so

840
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:06,079
not great. But I do think to just paint a

841
00:39:06,079 --> 00:39:09,559
full picture, he's pretty limited as a finisher, and like

842
00:39:09,639 --> 00:39:12,719
I don't love the hands, I don't love, doesn't elevate

843
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,599
a ton inside, he's very easy to move. Still, like

844
00:39:15,639 --> 00:39:17,320
some of that will change as he fills out, but

845
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:20,760
like it does feel if I had to guess, he

846
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:24,800
seems like a floor stretching five that can block shots

847
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:27,599
and maybe be like a grab and go guy off

848
00:39:27,599 --> 00:39:30,320
of rebounds, like that kind of thing. I don't know

849
00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:32,519
that he's gonna be a pick and roll finisher with

850
00:39:32,599 --> 00:39:35,159
any real volume. It's so early, but just like that's

851
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:38,039
kind of my read on it. And that's all to say.

852
00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:40,360
If you're gonna make you're definitely gonna shoot him. But

853
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:42,880
if you're gonna make threes in block shots and be

854
00:39:43,039 --> 00:39:46,360
like pretty mobile, that's that's gonna work. I think I

855
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,679
don't know that there's anything close to start him in there.

856
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:51,360
But just looking at how he's moved around the floor

857
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:54,519
some of the strengths and weaknesses, I think I think

858
00:39:54,519 --> 00:39:56,519
he's a starter down the line, and I think like

859
00:39:56,559 --> 00:39:58,519
he could have some real pluses. I don't know how

860
00:39:58,559 --> 00:40:01,039
you feel about him, but I think I'm frankly like

861
00:40:01,079 --> 00:40:04,719
a little bit more optimistic than I was on draft night.

862
00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:10,039
Speaker 1: I think I'm probably still skeptical about what he's going

863
00:40:10,119 --> 00:40:13,800
to be Offensively. He's got to make yeah, and if

864
00:40:13,800 --> 00:40:15,440
he's not gonna do that, then you're gonna have to

865
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:17,920
streamline what he's doing even more. And then that becomes

866
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:19,760
of all right, we have to surround him with as

867
00:40:19,840 --> 00:40:21,960
much basing as possible so we can open up his volume.

868
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:24,119
At the rim. He is shooting like sixty nine percent

869
00:40:24,159 --> 00:40:26,480
inside three feet, which I think is fine as a rookie.

870
00:40:27,079 --> 00:40:29,280
But I am I don't I still don't. I guess

871
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:31,039
I get the concept of him on offense. I just

872
00:40:31,079 --> 00:40:32,639
don't know what's going to turn it into. I have

873
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:36,920
been very impressed aside from Vockray, and just like overall defense,

874
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:39,280
he's a lot more physical that I thought he was

875
00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:41,159
gonna be able to be. Like, he's not gonna be

876
00:40:41,199 --> 00:40:43,840
the best rebounding big but I thought he's fought there,

877
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:46,599
fought on the glass a lot better, and fared a

878
00:40:46,639 --> 00:40:48,639
lot better against some guys that are just stronger and

879
00:40:48,639 --> 00:40:52,559
bigger than him in general right now. And again that

880
00:40:52,679 --> 00:40:56,280
in tandem with my preconception coming in was they're not

881
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:58,199
going to treat him as a center, and they've given

882
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:00,559
him the latitude to be that, and I think that

883
00:41:00,559 --> 00:41:03,280
that's ultimately going to be really good for his development.

884
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:05,840
I'm higher on him than I was coming into the

885
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:08,840
regular season, but he's still such and not necessarily in

886
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:11,480
a good way, Like he's an uncomfortable mystery box to

887
00:41:11,559 --> 00:41:13,119
me on the offensive end.

888
00:41:13,400 --> 00:41:15,239
Speaker 2: I think that's right. And I would say too, like

889
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:17,599
we got to just this is more for I'm not

890
00:41:17,599 --> 00:41:19,679
saying you do this, but you're gotta just get off

891
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:22,159
the idea that he was the number two pick, Like

892
00:41:22,159 --> 00:41:23,920
we just have to like that just can't be part

893
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:25,800
of the calculus because that's always going to set him

894
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:28,559
up to be viewed kind of unfairly. Like he he

895
00:41:28,719 --> 00:41:31,159
just that's where he was in this class, and and

896
00:41:31,559 --> 00:41:34,679
it's defensible, Like taking him there remains defensible, I think,

897
00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:37,400
not far from a no brainer, But yeah, I think

898
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:39,239
I I just leave it at I'm I'm with you

899
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:42,039
like I'm slight, I'm encouraged. I'm not like I'm I'm

900
00:41:42,079 --> 00:41:46,000
sold on Coolibali, I'm not. I'm encouraged by sar I would,

901
00:41:46,079 --> 00:41:48,719
I would say, and George for sure. So the last guy,

902
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:53,199
Bub Carrington, I don't know the primary return in the

903
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:57,119
in the legendary Danny Avdia trade. Can we refer to

904
00:41:57,199 --> 00:41:57,920
him as that? Now?

905
00:41:58,440 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 1: I guess? I mean, yeah, what is that twenty I

906
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:01,760
picked in a become It's not gonna be a future

907
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:03,679
Hall of Famer, probably like Bubb Right.

908
00:42:03,599 --> 00:42:08,239
Speaker 2: So ten points, just under five assists, four boards, nothing

909
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:12,639
spectacular shooting split wise, all just undred forty four percent

910
00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:15,360
from deep, making all his free throws ninety three percent

911
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:18,800
there with him, it's just the craft, I feel like,

912
00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:21,599
which just jumps out if you're watching him, you know,

913
00:42:21,719 --> 00:42:25,480
getting to spots, just having great feel like in traffic.

914
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:30,320
Now the Knox might be like he's a little too

915
00:42:31,320 --> 00:42:34,280
reliant on like basically bad shots or like tough shot

916
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:37,000
like mid rangers, these pull ups, these floaters and stuff.

917
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,280
But just like he's a little bit like George uh

918
00:42:40,519 --> 00:42:44,480
in the like passing the eye test thing where just

919
00:42:44,599 --> 00:42:46,400
as a pick and roll ball handler, you can just

920
00:42:46,440 --> 00:42:49,840
see like his ability to manipulate space and opponents and

921
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:52,599
just like it just feels like, Okay, that guy has

922
00:42:52,639 --> 00:42:56,199
an idea and a lot of that's real, like it's natural,

923
00:42:56,280 --> 00:42:58,079
I think, And then you don't teach a lot of

924
00:42:58,079 --> 00:43:00,760
that stuff. Like I remember thinking this about Angela Russell

925
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:03,079
many many years ago, Like someone asked me, this is

926
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:05,599
this is a deep cut when when the Lakers had

927
00:43:05,639 --> 00:43:07,360
him and Clarkson the first time, It's like who do

928
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:08,639
you like better? And I was like, I just think

929
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:11,599
Russell understands what to do, like in a pick and roll,

930
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:14,360
and so I like him better. I Now, I don't

931
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:16,280
want to just compare Bob Carrington to Russell, but the

932
00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:19,119
same kind of like he's not rushed, he can get

933
00:43:19,119 --> 00:43:20,960
the guy on his back, he can just make the

934
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:23,039
pocket pass, he can pull up when you're supposed to,

935
00:43:23,199 --> 00:43:25,320
like it's just kind of there. And I think that's

936
00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:28,880
my main takeaway is that he just looks like a

937
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:30,880
player that has an idea of what he wants to

938
00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:33,719
do and can do it. Like already, who was.

939
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:35,519
Speaker 1: The name you invoked at the top of the that

940
00:43:35,559 --> 00:43:40,079
you compared him to before you went to D'Angelo Russell Carrington, Yeah,

941
00:43:40,159 --> 00:43:41,280
didn't you mention another name?

942
00:43:41,559 --> 00:43:44,119
Speaker 2: Well, it was when people people were comparing, like is

943
00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:48,840
Jordan Clarkson or D'Angelo Russell the better long term prospect?

944
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:51,280
Speaker 1: Well, so mine's probably been a little bit spicy. And

945
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:54,559
when I watch him, I kind of think, like, what

946
00:43:54,599 --> 00:43:58,159
if you just added or like stretched out three or

947
00:43:58,159 --> 00:44:01,920
four inches of Chris Paul? Oh wow? And the ability.

948
00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:04,280
I mean you mentioned the stuff about getting defenders on

949
00:44:04,320 --> 00:44:06,960
your back hip. The I think he's his vision is.

950
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:09,199
I know he's bigger, so it's not you know, he's

951
00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:11,639
not the expert manipulator that Chris Paul is, but he

952
00:44:11,679 --> 00:44:13,360
kind of knows that. He's listed at six to four,

953
00:44:13,440 --> 00:44:15,280
by the way, and I call bullshit, like this.

954
00:44:15,159 --> 00:44:18,519
Speaker 2: Is someone who's like he seems bigger, right, Like he

955
00:44:18,559 --> 00:44:19,639
plays bigger than that.

956
00:44:20,119 --> 00:44:24,960
Speaker 1: So that patience, maintaining your dribble in traffic and just

957
00:44:25,039 --> 00:44:27,239
even the shot profile a little bit where I'm not

958
00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:29,559
getting to the rimiton. He'll take some threes but not

959
00:44:29,639 --> 00:44:31,280
a ton, but he's he's trying to get to that

960
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:32,920
pull up MIDI We'll see if the floater I think

961
00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:34,559
he's like one of four, one or five on floaters

962
00:44:34,559 --> 00:44:36,880
will start to fall. But he looks comfortable, and he

963
00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:39,840
doesn't also also seem like he's seeking it out. It's well,

964
00:44:39,840 --> 00:44:41,800
there's space, I'm gonna dribble into it and take it.

965
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:45,119
But I look at the composure, the poise of maintaining

966
00:44:45,159 --> 00:44:48,320
his dribble, and I can't help but think this is

967
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:52,440
someone who's gonna drive like hyper efficient offenses someday. Now.

968
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:54,800
I'm not going to predict that he's following me Chris

969
00:44:54,800 --> 00:44:57,800
Paul Ark, but I'm I'm just thinking about, so, is

970
00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:01,519
there a chance that so we've just named four players

971
00:45:01,519 --> 00:45:04,280
who are in their second season or or less, three

972
00:45:04,320 --> 00:45:08,679
rookies and one sophomore Black Kulibali, if you asked me

973
00:45:08,719 --> 00:45:10,280
to give the over under a two point five of

974
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:12,119
those guys being long term starters on a good team.

975
00:45:12,199 --> 00:45:15,000
Who's just smashed the over right now? Is this early season?

976
00:45:15,079 --> 00:45:18,000
Kool aid? Is it? What? And maybe this? And I

977
00:45:18,039 --> 00:45:20,320
don't know if you viewed Carrington in that vein of

978
00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:21,880
the sense, do you view him as someone who can

979
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:26,320
kind of drive an entire offense in that regard, I think.

980
00:45:26,599 --> 00:45:29,159
Speaker 2: Three point shooting will just be the swing skill. I

981
00:45:29,199 --> 00:45:31,679
think if he can get turn some of those pull

982
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:33,719
ups turned, some of the just trade some of the

983
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:36,159
twos for threes, some of the two point jumpers for threes,

984
00:45:36,639 --> 00:45:38,559
I think, then it's then it's like, well, I don't

985
00:45:38,679 --> 00:45:42,159
have any notes about him like offensively if he can

986
00:45:42,199 --> 00:45:45,719
do that, so less than ten games into his career

987
00:45:46,159 --> 00:45:48,760
and he's this effective already and you can just see

988
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:51,400
you just see the like outlines of what this might

989
00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:54,679
progress into. I think he could be that guy. I think,

990
00:45:54,760 --> 00:45:58,119
like Kulibally, I have like I'm more convinced than ever

991
00:45:58,159 --> 00:46:00,440
he's going to be a star. I think Carrington is

992
00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:02,719
probably the guy you'd pick second in terms of like

993
00:46:03,039 --> 00:46:05,199
what could be, Like how big of an impact could

994
00:46:05,239 --> 00:46:07,559
he be? Could he have if he hits like the

995
00:46:07,559 --> 00:46:10,360
top range of his possible outcomes.

996
00:46:10,159 --> 00:46:12,559
Speaker 1: And he's look, he's at fifty five percent or fifty

997
00:46:12,559 --> 00:46:14,000
four percent of his pull up twos. And so I've

998
00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:15,360
actually kind of had the same thought where it's he

999
00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:17,320
shooting fine off the catch from three, but he's not

1000
00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:19,639
taking a ton of them. We've seen it from Chris Paul.

1001
00:46:19,639 --> 00:46:21,360
We're like, Okay, Chris Paul had more of that like

1002
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:24,400
darring Do off the like he really wanted to amliate you.

1003
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:27,079
And I don't think Carrington has that type of handle

1004
00:46:27,159 --> 00:46:29,639
or will ever be in that position. But remember how

1005
00:46:29,679 --> 00:46:32,079
Chris Paul, like Chris Paul just kind of methodically dribbling

1006
00:46:32,119 --> 00:46:34,119
into those pull up threes that he would hit, maybe

1007
00:46:34,159 --> 00:46:36,960
like Rockets era Chris Paul or Clippers era Chris Paul.

1008
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:39,679
That seems like something Carrington could do. I feel like

1009
00:46:40,199 --> 00:46:42,800
I'm running too far afield with the Chris Paul Chris Paul.

1010
00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:44,559
Speaker 2: Well, no, I mean it's it's early. You could do

1011
00:46:44,559 --> 00:46:47,199
whatever you want. I would say too, We've focused mainly

1012
00:46:47,239 --> 00:46:49,119
on offense here. I guess with the exception of Sar

1013
00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:53,599
and some cool ball, I talk like I think another positive. Now.

1014
00:46:53,639 --> 00:46:55,559
The numbers just are what they are. This is the

1015
00:46:55,559 --> 00:46:57,760
worst defense in the league. We've said it several times.

1016
00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:00,800
All four of these guys compete, they're all like interested

1017
00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:03,079
in defense. It's not you know, and that's hard to

1018
00:47:03,119 --> 00:47:05,159
do on a team that's gonna be bad is to

1019
00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:07,199
you know, And it's early. Maybe that changes, but like

1020
00:47:07,679 --> 00:47:11,320
the bad defense is more geared, is more stemming from

1021
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:15,199
like mistakes as opposed to just like malaise or lack

1022
00:47:15,199 --> 00:47:18,840
of commitment or whatever like that. I do think eventually

1023
00:47:19,199 --> 00:47:21,320
all four of these guys can be plus defenders. They

1024
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:23,400
all have good positional size, they.

1025
00:47:23,239 --> 00:47:26,880
Speaker 1: All have some bubble. He's been there.

1026
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:31,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, all these guys I think have like there's there's

1027
00:47:31,199 --> 00:47:33,840
a you can envision Washington being a good defense and

1028
00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:36,360
these guys all having a certainly star that's like what

1029
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:38,000
he's hanging his hat on at this point, but like

1030
00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:40,599
they can be a part of a good defense. I

1031
00:47:40,639 --> 00:47:42,320
feel pretty confident down the line.

1032
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:46,719
Speaker 1: So do we think the Wizards are ahead of schedule? Relive?

1033
00:47:46,760 --> 00:47:50,199
Like their rebuild started last summer. You know, so we've

1034
00:47:50,199 --> 00:47:53,480
got one season plus fewer than ten games into their rebuild.

1035
00:47:53,679 --> 00:47:55,400
They are still one of the worst teams in the league.

1036
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:56,760
They want to be one of the worst teams in

1037
00:47:56,760 --> 00:47:59,639
the league. And I think they're gonna be rougher patches.

1038
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:01,760
Rookie might hit a wall when they're not used to

1039
00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:03,679
playing this much. Black kooler Bali is going to go

1040
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:06,559
through some tough stretches. We have questions even Blogkool Bali,

1041
00:48:06,559 --> 00:48:08,599
who I'm highest on. It's like, what is the level

1042
00:48:08,599 --> 00:48:10,719
of self creation that he can actually shoulder downline.

1043
00:48:11,039 --> 00:48:12,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, but where do.

1044
00:48:12,119 --> 00:48:15,320
Speaker 1: You view their rebuild relative to where you thought it

1045
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:18,760
would be or should be based on when and even

1046
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:21,599
how they started, Because look, that Bradley Beal trade, it

1047
00:48:21,639 --> 00:48:23,760
was more about just ripping off the band aid. That

1048
00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:26,119
like they didn't put anything or any asset in place.

1049
00:48:26,199 --> 00:48:29,480
Unless you're really that high on Jordan Poole to say, okay,

1050
00:48:29,519 --> 00:48:30,960
like this is something that's gonna know. That was more

1051
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:33,119
about ripping off the band aid. None of these none

1052
00:48:33,159 --> 00:48:35,559
of these guys are like the product of that trade.

1053
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:38,159
So where do you just kind of like, how do

1054
00:48:38,159 --> 00:48:40,159
you feel about their rebuild relative to how and when

1055
00:48:40,159 --> 00:48:40,679
they started?

1056
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:45,320
Speaker 2: I think you've got to say it's further along than expected,

1057
00:48:45,559 --> 00:48:49,480
just just because all four of those guys we talked about,

1058
00:48:49,639 --> 00:48:51,880
you know, yeah, sure it's fair if you want to

1059
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:54,280
say to circle back, well, they don't have the they

1060
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:56,079
don't have the guy yet that's going to be the

1061
00:48:56,079 --> 00:48:58,559
best player on the next good version of this team.

1062
00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:02,400
I mean maybe that's true, maybe it's not. But like

1063
00:49:02,480 --> 00:49:05,320
they've got these four guys who all sort of fit together,

1064
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:09,119
and you know the pick situation, they owe that twenty

1065
00:49:09,159 --> 00:49:11,480
five to the Knicks with top ten protections and it's

1066
00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:13,480
top eight and then I mean, like maybe that can

1067
00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:16,039
be probably not going to convey. And then they've got

1068
00:49:16,039 --> 00:49:17,880
the latter half of the decade, They've got all the

1069
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,079
Phoenix swaps coming in and all that other stuff.

1070
00:49:20,119 --> 00:49:22,400
Speaker 1: Like so what I do.

1071
00:49:22,599 --> 00:49:25,760
Speaker 2: I think it's possible that because of what they have now,

1072
00:49:25,840 --> 00:49:29,159
which like you know, again, this may change in two

1073
00:49:29,199 --> 00:49:32,000
months when they they still have two wins or something,

1074
00:49:32,079 --> 00:49:34,719
and like it's just look, it looks rough, but like

1075
00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:38,280
what they have now, plus their flexibility going forward, their

1076
00:49:38,320 --> 00:49:42,440
ability to trade veterans for more draft assets, it's like,

1077
00:49:43,199 --> 00:49:46,079
you know, for this being the first full full year

1078
00:49:46,119 --> 00:49:48,519
of the rebuild, because you can't really call last year

1079
00:49:48,920 --> 00:49:51,400
that because they were just starting. Yeah, I mean like

1080
00:49:51,480 --> 00:49:52,920
or maybe I don't know, maybe you can. But like

1081
00:49:53,519 --> 00:49:56,719
they're further along, I think than you would expect. And

1082
00:49:56,719 --> 00:49:58,400
that's because they seem to have kind of hit on

1083
00:49:58,519 --> 00:50:00,440
all four of these guys more than any else.

1084
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:02,639
Speaker 1: Is it weird that, I guess because it's more about

1085
00:50:02,679 --> 00:50:04,079
draft position THO when you told us to throw that

1086
00:50:04,079 --> 00:50:05,960
out the window, it feels like saur is still sort

1087
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:08,920
of the biggest mid of like, oh, was that the

1088
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:09,440
right pick?

1089
00:50:09,599 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, yeah. I mean the other thing I'd say too,

1090
00:50:12,039 --> 00:50:16,719
is they're different from like, take Portland, right, Portland has

1091
00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:18,960
you know, half the roster is older and they need

1092
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:23,159
to trade them and we're not sure about scooting off defense.

1093
00:50:23,199 --> 00:50:24,280
Speaker 1: You're just barrassing, right.

1094
00:50:25,679 --> 00:50:30,159
Speaker 2: Utah doesn't have the guy. Uh, I'm I don't know

1095
00:50:30,199 --> 00:50:32,360
where else do you want? Detroit like, yeah, kid cunning

1096
00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:36,440
M's better than anybody Washington has. But I think maybe

1097
00:50:36,519 --> 00:50:38,400
the thing about the Wizard rebuild that's so appealing is

1098
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:41,000
it's so clean. It's just like they got their picks.

1099
00:50:41,079 --> 00:50:43,239
They you know, they've got these four guys and you

1100
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:45,000
kind of have a shotgun approach, like maybe two of

1101
00:50:45,039 --> 00:50:48,679
them become great. It's just there's no complicating factors, right, And.

1102
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:51,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, no one's rushing them either where I think Utah

1103
00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:53,480
and Portland. Utah's pacifically because they have all those picks

1104
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:55,960
and Lowry it's oh that they if they're not gonna

1105
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:57,159
they don't have the guy, they need to go out

1106
00:50:57,199 --> 00:50:59,239
and trade for the guy. Anyway. In Portland, it's well,

1107
00:50:59,239 --> 00:51:01,719
you have all these they we called them stacked. We

1108
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:03,159
knew they were gonna be bad, but they are not

1109
00:51:03,239 --> 00:51:05,239
as stacked. Or you look at the roster, it's they

1110
00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:07,159
need to hold this fire sale, or they should couldn't

1111
00:51:07,159 --> 00:51:10,199
make a consolidation trade. Washington's not up against that, and

1112
00:51:10,239 --> 00:51:13,880
it's not I mean Portland, they've Portland to have been

1113
00:51:13,920 --> 00:51:17,199
their rebuilds longer. Portland's feels longer because those like Latter

1114
00:51:17,360 --> 00:51:20,920
Dame years were just aimless. But Utah is like, Okay,

1115
00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:23,159
they're in the third season of the rebuild, and it's like,

1116
00:51:23,199 --> 00:51:26,559
so Washington is in a second. They're not light years behind.

1117
00:51:27,199 --> 00:51:30,519
So yeah, I think they're ahead there. For me there,

1118
00:51:30,679 --> 00:51:33,280
I don't think I would have sat predicted. We're sitting

1119
00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:36,559
here in the onset stages of year two and like, man,

1120
00:51:36,559 --> 00:51:38,320
they might have like three or four guys who are

1121
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,199
just gonna be part of the next really good team.

1122
00:51:40,360 --> 00:51:43,679
Speaker 2: Yep, yeah, yeah, no, they're they I mean really again,

1123
00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:46,199
two and four worst defense in the league. That's like

1124
00:51:46,239 --> 00:51:48,840
they're gonna they're bad. They've been bad, They're gonna be bad,

1125
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:52,199
and like that's fine. It's just it's totally okay because

1126
00:51:52,199 --> 00:51:54,559
they've got what looked like some pretty promising guys in there.

1127
00:51:55,159 --> 00:51:57,559
Speaker 1: East Coast bias continues. I don't necessarily want to spend

1128
00:51:57,599 --> 00:51:59,519
a ton of time on this team because they have

1129
00:51:59,559 --> 00:52:01,719
two plays who are injured that are pretty important of

1130
00:52:01,800 --> 00:52:03,960
what they do. So I'm gonna ask you before we

1131
00:52:04,039 --> 00:52:07,119
go into the performance of the squad and two individuals

1132
00:52:07,159 --> 00:52:10,840
who are standing the f out grant? Are the Toronto

1133
00:52:10,880 --> 00:52:12,360
Raptors the fun kind of bad?

1134
00:52:13,519 --> 00:52:17,440
Speaker 2: Are they the fun kind of bad? Well, they're way

1135
00:52:17,480 --> 00:52:20,559
more interesting than I thought they would be for like, so,

1136
00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:23,679
I guess that's fun and at least like, yeah, at

1137
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:27,239
least I don't know. Did they pick this direction to

1138
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:30,280
trot out an old Toronto criticism or is this like

1139
00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:32,559
what's just happened because of injuries but a lot of

1140
00:52:32,559 --> 00:52:35,800
positive signs like big to small. I presume you want

1141
00:52:35,800 --> 00:52:37,719
to start with RJ. Barrett being the best passer on

1142
00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:38,400
the planet Earth.

1143
00:52:38,679 --> 00:52:41,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, seven point eight is is per game. He hasn't

1144
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:43,840
played a ton of games because he began this injured,

1145
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:46,639
this season injured, but you look at what he's been

1146
00:52:46,639 --> 00:52:49,599
able to do, and it's okay. The pocket passes seem smoother,

1147
00:52:49,719 --> 00:52:53,199
they're smarter. His floor awareness is just better in transition,

1148
00:52:53,639 --> 00:52:58,079
Like this feels like a real, like actual legitimate playmaking

1149
00:52:58,199 --> 00:53:00,760
jump from him. And we'll see how it's sustains when

1150
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:03,639
both Scotty and Emmanuel quickly we're both been absent, are

1151
00:53:03,679 --> 00:53:05,719
inside the lineup. But it doesn't sound we know Scotty's

1152
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:07,840
out for a while, doesn't necessarily sound like IQ's about

1153
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:10,280
to make his debut. But I think RJ, I mean,

1154
00:53:10,280 --> 00:53:12,599
he's facing more defensive pressure, more double teams, and his

1155
00:53:12,639 --> 00:53:15,119
decision making out of those has gotten better. Now some

1156
00:53:15,159 --> 00:53:17,400
of the trade off has been all right, his efficiency

1157
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:19,440
at the rim has slipped, but like he is still

1158
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:22,760
creating chaos going down hill on drives, getting out and

1159
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:25,519
transition in general. The other thing that I think makes

1160
00:53:25,519 --> 00:53:27,440
them fun. RJ's a part of this, Grady Dick's a

1161
00:53:27,440 --> 00:53:30,039
part of this. They're just I mean, they're running in general.

1162
00:53:30,079 --> 00:53:32,960
I think they have the fifth fastest average possession time

1163
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:36,239
in the league. No one's going faster after defensive rebounds.

1164
00:53:36,239 --> 00:53:38,159
They just grab a defensive rebound and they're there's not

1165
00:53:38,400 --> 00:53:40,519
pass They're just going and so that to me makes

1166
00:53:40,559 --> 00:53:42,480
them that's the fun kind of bad. But they've had

1167
00:53:42,519 --> 00:53:44,400
some close games where it's, oh, well they beat the

1168
00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:47,519
Nuggets that we can record the blow It Up Denver podcast,

1169
00:53:47,519 --> 00:53:50,119
that everyone seems like they've been waiting on RJ has

1170
00:53:50,159 --> 00:53:51,760
been a huge part of that. Since coming back. I

1171
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:55,119
think he's in under Darko Ryakovic. The way that Darko

1172
00:53:55,239 --> 00:53:57,360
is using him, I honestly think that he might get

1173
00:53:57,400 --> 00:54:00,480
even better. The playmaking will slip, to be clear when

1174
00:54:00,679 --> 00:54:03,679
IQ and Scottie Barnes are there, but just having to

1175
00:54:03,719 --> 00:54:05,519
imagine him, like being able to spend even more time

1176
00:54:05,519 --> 00:54:07,719
off the ball, getting him moving there, I would expect

1177
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:10,280
the efficiency at the rim to climb back up. He

1178
00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:13,519
still is shooting thirty nine percent from three, and so it's, well,

1179
00:54:13,519 --> 00:54:15,679
do we have to wait a while before we call

1180
00:54:15,719 --> 00:54:17,800
this a new normal? But he did okay, or he

1181
00:54:17,880 --> 00:54:20,079
did better than okay from three in Toronto last year.

1182
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:22,880
I think he's gonna kind of settle into maybe his

1183
00:54:22,960 --> 00:54:25,519
ideal role with Toronto, where it's we're gonna get you

1184
00:54:25,559 --> 00:54:27,760
the ball when you're leading these bench lineups that we

1185
00:54:27,840 --> 00:54:30,440
now believe that you can lead because of our play

1186
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:33,440
style combined with your growth as a playmaker and your

1187
00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:36,519
off ball movement. He is just he continues to turn

1188
00:54:36,559 --> 00:54:39,119
my head again, even if some of the inside the

1189
00:54:39,239 --> 00:54:44,239
arc efficiency is waiting, the mindset, the aesthetics, just the

1190
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:47,519
functionality of his game right now to me just looks

1191
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:50,119
and makes way more sense than it ever did in

1192
00:54:50,119 --> 00:54:50,719
New York.

1193
00:54:51,119 --> 00:54:53,840
Speaker 2: What do you think is the what are the most

1194
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:58,400
and least surprising parts of his development viewed through? Like

1195
00:54:58,599 --> 00:55:00,960
here's what he was as a Nick like having watched

1196
00:55:01,039 --> 00:55:03,280
him with the Knicks, like maybe just speak for Knicks

1197
00:55:03,280 --> 00:55:06,000
fans or from in your own personal opinion, like what

1198
00:55:06,000 --> 00:55:08,119
what is he doing now that? Like, what is he

1199
00:55:08,199 --> 00:55:11,320
doing really well now that you could have said, Oh, yeah,

1200
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:13,280
I could, I could, I could have seen that coming,

1201
00:55:13,320 --> 00:55:15,039
and then what could you have just Oh my god,

1202
00:55:15,039 --> 00:55:16,039
where did this come from?

1203
00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:19,679
Speaker 1: So the thing that I'm wondering where it kind of

1204
00:55:19,679 --> 00:55:21,920
came from is and I don't know how much of

1205
00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:24,119
this the playmaking. I want to know where it came from,

1206
00:55:24,119 --> 00:55:26,480
because this is just someone who's dishing out of sists

1207
00:55:26,519 --> 00:55:29,840
in all sorts like this spacing in Toronto isn't pristine,

1208
00:55:29,920 --> 00:55:31,679
And so I could talk about the floor balance that

1209
00:55:31,679 --> 00:55:33,599
the Knicks gave him, and that's where I kind of

1210
00:55:33,599 --> 00:55:36,119
look like some of the stuff he is doing in transition,

1211
00:55:36,199 --> 00:55:38,280
his ability to get moving off the ball. The Knicks

1212
00:55:38,320 --> 00:55:41,440
never tapped into that adequately, but the passing where like

1213
00:55:41,480 --> 00:55:43,639
this is shit that's happening in traffic or in slowed

1214
00:55:43,639 --> 00:55:46,239
down sets. That's even during some of the bench units

1215
00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:48,320
he was a part of that. We're just ripping opponents,

1216
00:55:48,679 --> 00:55:51,639
never something I necessarily envisioned for him. So that's the

1217
00:55:51,679 --> 00:55:53,639
thing I'm looking at, and I'm almost waiting for it

1218
00:55:53,960 --> 00:55:56,239
to come down because it's there's no way it's going

1219
00:55:56,280 --> 00:55:58,880
to sustain. But it's not I mean, not turn the

1220
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:01,159
ball over a ton, even like the Raptors do turn

1221
00:56:01,159 --> 00:56:03,960
the ball over. But he's not necessarily the like the

1222
00:56:04,239 --> 00:56:07,280
the meat and potatoes of those struggles. I don't think

1223
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:10,519
he's an eight assist per game guy, but when he is,

1224
00:56:10,559 --> 00:56:12,920
like the central focus and he's still able to dish

1225
00:56:12,960 --> 00:56:15,400
those kinds of assists on a Raptors team, Yeah, they've

1226
00:56:15,400 --> 00:56:17,679
been about league average offensively, but grant you look at

1227
00:56:17,679 --> 00:56:23,079
the talent remaining without Scotty Emmanuel, like Jamal shed Donovan Mitchell,

1228
00:56:23,559 --> 00:56:26,559
it's just like, like, who are you, Jonathan Mobile? Like

1229
00:56:26,599 --> 00:56:28,679
I just like who is the Yes, Yaka Pertle is

1230
00:56:28,719 --> 00:56:31,119
definitely above average offensive center. I want to make that clear.

1231
00:56:31,360 --> 00:56:33,239
I think he ties in a lot of you know,

1232
00:56:33,480 --> 00:56:37,239
possessions together nicely. But you're talking about like like a

1233
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:39,840
Boji's playing over thirty minutes per game. Like, this isn't

1234
00:56:39,880 --> 00:56:41,400
a team that you would look at and say, oh,

1235
00:56:41,400 --> 00:56:44,800
they're supposed to be average or better offensively right now,

1236
00:56:44,920 --> 00:56:47,800
and they are. So that stood out to me, unless

1237
00:56:47,800 --> 00:56:49,519
you have any thoughts on him. I have another player

1238
00:56:49,719 --> 00:56:50,760
that I think we need to get to.

1239
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:53,280
Speaker 2: Well, I know who you're gonna go to. I want

1240
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:55,519
to you mention both of them. I think Mobo and

1241
00:56:55,599 --> 00:56:59,360
Shed have both been like you know, they're bit players,

1242
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:02,920
but like mobile disruption defensively and his mobility and his

1243
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:04,800
grab and go stuff. Like I think he's I was

1244
00:57:04,840 --> 00:57:07,440
looking this up the other day. So he's only played

1245
00:57:07,440 --> 00:57:09,480
like one hundred and twenty minutes I think, and he

1246
00:57:09,559 --> 00:57:12,199
has more deflections than anyone who has played that many

1247
00:57:12,199 --> 00:57:15,079
minutes or fewer. So he's just like messing stuff up

1248
00:57:15,159 --> 00:57:17,760
in the in the best way. And Shed, I think,

1249
00:57:17,880 --> 00:57:19,639
just looks like a kind of a pro ready. I

1250
00:57:19,639 --> 00:57:21,960
don't know where he'll fit on a depth chart ultimately,

1251
00:57:22,000 --> 00:57:25,239
but like both of those guys have had like actual impacts,

1252
00:57:26,039 --> 00:57:27,920
which is not something you would expect it from a

1253
00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:31,039
couple of rookies this early. But please let us move

1254
00:57:31,119 --> 00:57:34,599
to the I mean the second year guy that I will.

1255
00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:37,840
Speaker 1: Say, mobo, I've disruptive is the word just to absolutely

1256
00:57:37,960 --> 00:57:41,199
use him with shed. I still think that the jumper,

1257
00:57:41,599 --> 00:57:44,039
the three point shooting and like in particular is gonna

1258
00:57:44,039 --> 00:57:47,519
wind up being the like the swing skill for him.

1259
00:57:47,800 --> 00:57:50,119
That dude just defends his ass off. And so if

1260
00:57:50,159 --> 00:57:51,519
you could just get to a point where you have

1261
00:57:51,559 --> 00:57:53,679
this spasing necessary and you want him to kind of

1262
00:57:54,039 --> 00:57:57,239
get going downhill, I'm like, all right, that's fine with me.

1263
00:57:57,320 --> 00:57:59,039
Like I don't have an issue with that. So he

1264
00:57:59,159 --> 00:58:01,679
is someone I knew a ton about other than the

1265
00:58:01,679 --> 00:58:05,440
defensive reputation coming out of college, but just the energy

1266
00:58:05,880 --> 00:58:08,440
that he is going to play with. And I still

1267
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:10,840
think like, there's okay, he's made some nice passes out

1268
00:58:10,840 --> 00:58:12,400
of drives, and is he ever gonna shoot a little

1269
00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:14,760
better on those drives? We'll have to see. We got

1270
00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:17,880
to talk about Grady Dick though, who is already averaging

1271
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:20,679
over twenty points per game. He's entered the most improved

1272
00:58:20,679 --> 00:58:23,440
player discussions. Whether you want to throw sophomores in there, well,

1273
00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:25,480
I guess very quickly, do you think RJ has a

1274
00:58:25,519 --> 00:58:27,840
case for that? As a Right now, we're fewer than

1275
00:58:27,840 --> 00:58:29,679
ten games into the season. But or was that just

1276
00:58:29,920 --> 00:58:31,639
if all right, like this is more a matter of

1277
00:58:31,679 --> 00:58:34,480
opportunity than growth that I well, I.

1278
00:58:34,440 --> 00:58:38,480
Speaker 2: Mean, if he's up over seven assists for like any

1279
00:58:38,559 --> 00:58:41,320
length of this season, that is officially like a new

1280
00:58:41,360 --> 00:58:43,320
skill and we very much enjoyed the new skill and

1281
00:58:43,400 --> 00:58:46,320
the most improved player discussion. So yeah, I mean, I

1282
00:58:46,320 --> 00:58:49,239
think Grady Dick has like the more complete case just

1283
00:58:49,239 --> 00:58:51,280
because all the numbers are up and his role is

1284
00:58:51,400 --> 00:58:54,400
like I don't know ten x in terms of importance

1285
00:58:54,440 --> 00:58:56,719
what it used to be as a rookie. But yeah,

1286
00:58:57,239 --> 00:59:01,159
I mean that's if far j Bar as a primary facilitator.

1287
00:59:01,239 --> 00:59:03,239
I don't know what to do about this. I don't

1288
00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:05,599
know what has happened, but let's talk about Grady Dick.

1289
00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:08,239
Speaker 1: Yeah. So I want everyone who is watching or listening

1290
00:59:08,280 --> 00:59:11,519
to raise their hand if they saw Grady Dick opening

1291
00:59:11,519 --> 00:59:14,440
the year putting up twenty plus points per game. Now,

1292
00:59:14,599 --> 00:59:16,119
for all of you who put your hand up, thank

1293
00:59:16,119 --> 00:59:18,840
you for admitting that you're big fat liars. This is

1294
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:21,239
just like he's not even doing it in the way

1295
00:59:21,239 --> 00:59:24,199
you would have predicted. The three point percentage is like

1296
00:59:24,199 --> 00:59:25,920
it's now it's ticked up. I think he's over thirty

1297
00:59:25,960 --> 00:59:29,280
seven percent now. He wasn't making them at this absurd clip.

1298
00:59:29,320 --> 00:59:33,039
He's done so much damage inside the arc and the

1299
00:59:33,079 --> 00:59:35,880
way he's doing it, like the level of difficulty that

1300
00:59:36,320 --> 00:59:39,840
are on his shots is bonkers. Steph Curry. Grant is

1301
00:59:39,840 --> 00:59:43,280
the only player coming off screens finishing possessions off screens

1302
00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:46,039
more often per game than Grady Dick. That's just I mean,

1303
00:59:46,079 --> 00:59:47,960
by the way, kudos to Darko for putting him in

1304
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:52,320
that situation, but that's just absolutely ubsurd, the stuff he's

1305
00:59:52,360 --> 00:59:56,280
doing inside the arc. Caitlin Cooper had this nutso stat Grant.

1306
00:59:56,400 --> 00:59:59,920
Seventy one percent of Grady shots have been heavily contested,

1307
01:00:00,199 --> 01:00:02,639
which ranks fifteenth among the twenty six players who have

1308
01:00:02,639 --> 01:00:06,159
attempted at least one hundred shots. He leads the entire

1309
01:00:06,280 --> 01:00:09,320
league in screens as the off ball cutter, with one

1310
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:12,199
hundred and thirty three among the twenty three players who

1311
01:00:12,199 --> 01:00:15,800
have seen at least fifty closeouts. Grady ranks third in

1312
01:00:15,840 --> 01:00:18,960
points per chance at one point basically one point one

1313
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:21,639
to nine. That's actually the part of his game. I

1314
01:00:21,639 --> 01:00:25,360
know people have talked about the contested jumpers, what he's

1315
01:00:25,400 --> 01:00:30,199
doing against closeouts. Oh yeah, my god, the drop grant.

1316
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:32,960
He's shooting over sixty percent on drives. But the thing

1317
01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:35,280
that is melting my brain and I didn't see this

1318
01:00:35,360 --> 01:00:37,480
last year. I saw some of the escapism stuff. We

1319
01:00:37,519 --> 01:00:39,119
talked about it with Samson Folk I think you and

1320
01:00:39,159 --> 01:00:42,840
I talked about it in a podcast. Dude is like physical,

1321
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:45,320
like he can finish through contract, he can be at

1322
01:00:45,320 --> 01:00:49,360
these weird angles. He's getting fouled more than seventy percent

1323
01:00:49,400 --> 01:00:51,960
of the time on his drives right now. Do you

1324
01:00:52,039 --> 01:00:55,159
know how insane to be shooting sixty percent on drives

1325
01:00:55,159 --> 01:00:57,400
and getting fouls seventeen percent of the time. I don't

1326
01:00:57,480 --> 01:01:00,480
fucking care how early in the sea than it is

1327
01:01:00,559 --> 01:01:03,360
right now. This is someone who we've kind of seen

1328
01:01:03,400 --> 01:01:05,119
moments of, like okay, can he do a little bit

1329
01:01:05,159 --> 01:01:08,480
more passing here? This is someone who is far more

1330
01:01:08,519 --> 01:01:11,320
complex offensively than we ever could have predicted. And the

1331
01:01:11,320 --> 01:01:13,519
final thing before I throw it to you, I did

1332
01:01:13,559 --> 01:01:15,800
talk about this with Samson and someone told me to

1333
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:18,320
watch this. This was coming out of the draft that

1334
01:01:18,440 --> 01:01:21,360
Grady Dick could be a good team defender. I'm not

1335
01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:23,960
saying he's there, but I am there to where it's

1336
01:01:23,960 --> 01:01:25,960
all right, Like I see it, like he's made a

1337
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:28,079
lot of good off ball plays and he's going to

1338
01:01:28,119 --> 01:01:31,320
be targeted on ball and we've seen it. Yeah, But

1339
01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:33,400
like he's also had these moments where did you see

1340
01:01:33,400 --> 01:01:36,239
the possession it was overtime against the Kings where he

1341
01:01:36,320 --> 01:01:38,639
just locks down dearon Fox, It doesn't lock him down

1342
01:01:38,639 --> 01:01:40,559
like pokes the ball away while staying in front of him.

1343
01:01:41,440 --> 01:01:43,719
Now does that say more about are you concerned about

1344
01:01:43,760 --> 01:01:45,800
what Daron Fox is like Roby Speed is right now?

1345
01:01:45,840 --> 01:01:49,039
I don't fucking know, but this is someone I can't

1346
01:01:49,039 --> 01:01:51,360
put him in the MIP discussion right now because me

1347
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:53,559
and sophomore as you know, how my brain back and

1348
01:01:53,599 --> 01:01:56,199
forth with that stuff. Jay Dubb broke it last year,

1349
01:01:56,280 --> 01:01:58,559
like he just he completely fried my brain him and

1350
01:01:58,559 --> 01:02:01,639
then Daron Fox a few years ago. The Granny Dick

1351
01:02:01,719 --> 01:02:05,119
bandwagon is run officially running out of room because people,

1352
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:07,920
I promise this is the final thing. This isn't just

1353
01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:11,119
like raptors or someone trying to do their like. People

1354
01:02:11,280 --> 01:02:13,920
just understand right now, if you're a cattual basketball fan,

1355
01:02:14,320 --> 01:02:16,280
Granny Dick is lighting it up and he's not doing

1356
01:02:16,280 --> 01:02:18,159
it as a three point shooter necessarily.

1357
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:22,079
Speaker 2: That really is my ultimate takeaway is that like he

1358
01:02:22,239 --> 01:02:26,440
just and I do think you heard throughout the draft

1359
01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:28,920
process and even last year that like he's a oh

1360
01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:31,599
no from people that knew. This wasn't the majority take

1361
01:02:31,639 --> 01:02:34,519
I don't think people would say, like he's more than

1362
01:02:34,679 --> 01:02:37,840
he's not, Like he's not early Duncan Robinson. He's actually

1363
01:02:37,920 --> 01:02:40,159
kind of more like late Duncan Robinson, who can suddenly

1364
01:02:40,360 --> 01:02:41,960
put the ball on the floor and like do stuff

1365
01:02:41,960 --> 01:02:43,559
with it, you know what I mean, Like that he

1366
01:02:43,639 --> 01:02:46,039
really is just more than he's not just a spot

1367
01:02:46,119 --> 01:02:48,719
up guy that you maybe run off screens and he

1368
01:02:48,719 --> 01:02:51,400
shoots threes and you hide him on defense like he's

1369
01:02:51,440 --> 01:02:56,159
he's I mean him coming off screen the heat, I mean,

1370
01:02:56,159 --> 01:03:00,199
the rappers actually do like create a lot of chaos

1371
01:03:00,239 --> 01:03:02,320
by just running him around and using him as a

1372
01:03:02,360 --> 01:03:04,639
screener too. By the way, that's like if you're you

1373
01:03:04,679 --> 01:03:07,159
should use really good shooters as screeners that because of

1374
01:03:07,199 --> 01:03:11,719
all the like all the I don't know problems that causes. So, yeah,

1375
01:03:11,719 --> 01:03:14,360
he's just more than a guy that's gonna oh, you know,

1376
01:03:14,400 --> 01:03:16,920
he might average eight nine points a game, get up

1377
01:03:16,960 --> 01:03:19,880
a couple threes and just hopefully you play the matchups

1378
01:03:19,920 --> 01:03:21,599
right and he doesn't get cooked on you. No, no,

1379
01:03:21,639 --> 01:03:24,079
like he he's doing stuff with the ball. He's had

1380
01:03:24,079 --> 01:03:26,519
these like that reverse layup the other night and he

1381
01:03:26,559 --> 01:03:29,239
had that weird I love his little we strained hanging

1382
01:03:29,320 --> 01:03:32,159
scoops that he should like there's real like. I wouldn't

1383
01:03:32,199 --> 01:03:33,800
go so far as to say Grady Dick has like

1384
01:03:34,199 --> 01:03:37,280
is in his bag, like he you know, cook everybody

1385
01:03:37,599 --> 01:03:40,519
off the dribble or whatever. But you can't. You have

1386
01:03:40,559 --> 01:03:43,039
to close out hard, you have to stay attached. And

1387
01:03:43,079 --> 01:03:45,440
then he's really good or way better than anyone gave

1388
01:03:45,519 --> 01:03:48,239
him credit for, at exploiting the way you have to

1389
01:03:48,239 --> 01:03:50,920
guard him because he is a good shooter, and that's

1390
01:03:50,920 --> 01:03:52,840
allowed him to just show that like he's so much

1391
01:03:53,079 --> 01:03:55,280
more than just the guy who's gonna catch and shoot.

1392
01:03:55,480 --> 01:03:57,360
Speaker 1: I've tried well, actually, I wanted to circle back to this.

1393
01:03:57,440 --> 01:04:01,239
So here's he's attempted sixteen to three through free throws

1394
01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:03,159
coming off of his draw like as the result of

1395
01:04:03,480 --> 01:04:05,920
his drives. Here's everyone in the league currently who is

1396
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:08,320
attempted as many or more free throws while shooting sixty

1397
01:04:08,400 --> 01:04:14,079
percent on drives. Darren Fox, Giannis and Jason Tatum, but

1398
01:04:14,119 --> 01:04:16,159
I was trying to think, do you have a comp

1399
01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:19,159
for him? Because Darko, by the way, he compared R. J.

1400
01:04:19,280 --> 01:04:22,440
Barrett to manage Ginobili the other night. I didn't hate it.

1401
01:04:22,480 --> 01:04:25,920
He made it very clear he wasn't talking about necessarily

1402
01:04:25,960 --> 01:04:28,519
as a usage, but it's someone like the idiosyncrasies in

1403
01:04:28,559 --> 01:04:30,199
his game, and I was like, I don't hate this.

1404
01:04:30,639 --> 01:04:32,679
I was trying to think of Grady Dick and I

1405
01:04:32,719 --> 01:04:34,920
just see all these people there, they've they did it

1406
01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:36,960
before and they're thrown it out like all the Caucasian

1407
01:04:37,039 --> 01:04:42,239
like dudes, right, So I think it was I was

1408
01:04:42,239 --> 01:04:44,280
listening to Raptors Republic podcast. They made a joke that

1409
01:04:44,280 --> 01:04:46,440
some people have been comparing him to Mike Miller. I

1410
01:04:46,480 --> 01:04:48,519
can't think of it. None of the comps do it

1411
01:04:48,559 --> 01:04:50,239
for me. Like I'm just trying to think. I'm not

1412
01:04:50,239 --> 01:04:52,639
saying he's gonna be better than all of these guys,

1413
01:04:52,679 --> 01:04:54,880
but just the stuff that he is able to do

1414
01:04:55,360 --> 01:04:58,360
physically off closeouts and some of the finishes he's had,

1415
01:04:58,840 --> 01:05:01,159
I just I can't Only what he then does is

1416
01:05:01,199 --> 01:05:03,719
like this sort of super threat away from the ball.

1417
01:05:03,800 --> 01:05:06,000
I don't have a good comp for him. Anymore. I

1418
01:05:06,079 --> 01:05:07,800
just don't not that I had one to begin with.

1419
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:10,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm really struggling. I feel like it shouldn't be

1420
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:13,440
that hard to comp with somebody. Well, put put get

1421
01:05:13,480 --> 01:05:16,159
your Grady Dick comp comps in the comments. Please let

1422
01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:17,840
us give it.

1423
01:05:19,119 --> 01:05:21,039
Speaker 1: The one guy that's sprang to mind. And I just

1424
01:05:21,119 --> 01:05:27,920
I don't No, Cam Johnson, I just don't know.

1425
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:30,239
Speaker 2: I think he's got more. I think he's got more

1426
01:05:30,920 --> 01:05:31,559
off the dribble thing.

1427
01:05:32,559 --> 01:05:34,599
Speaker 1: That's what it is, is that because Cam Johnson, I

1428
01:05:34,599 --> 01:05:36,559
feel like we've seen the moments of it, like these

1429
01:05:36,599 --> 01:05:39,119
are now extended flashes of this. So I don't know

1430
01:05:39,119 --> 01:05:42,199
if you have a good comp for Grady Dick. Let

1431
01:05:42,280 --> 01:05:45,039
us know. We love we love Dick comps round.

1432
01:05:47,519 --> 01:05:49,360
Speaker 2: All right, I got one more guy I want to

1433
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:52,400
talk about. If we're if we're through with the Raptors, Yeah,

1434
01:05:52,400 --> 01:05:52,800
we're done.

1435
01:05:52,840 --> 01:05:54,840
Speaker 1: Though they are well to close it. They are the

1436
01:05:54,840 --> 01:05:57,000
fun kind of bad, right, They're just you're kind of

1437
01:05:57,039 --> 01:05:59,360
there are guys who are performing and expect to there's real,

1438
01:05:59,639 --> 01:06:02,119
I mean stuff to take away from it. And well, look,

1439
01:06:02,159 --> 01:06:04,079
Kelly A. Linnik hasn't even played this season yet and

1440
01:06:04,079 --> 01:06:06,320
Bruce Brown still wearing cowboy hats on the sideline, So

1441
01:06:06,360 --> 01:06:07,679
let's see what this team turns into.

1442
01:06:09,360 --> 01:06:12,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and also the you know, root for injuries, but

1443
01:06:12,480 --> 01:06:14,199
having a couple of key guys out, you're going to

1444
01:06:14,239 --> 01:06:16,800
bank some of those losses and let these other fun players,

1445
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:18,960
you know, explore the space a little bit. That's kind

1446
01:06:19,000 --> 01:06:19,559
of a win win.

1447
01:06:20,039 --> 01:06:22,079
Speaker 1: What do you trade them and rebuild around Grady Dick

1448
01:06:22,079 --> 01:06:22,400
and r J.

1449
01:06:22,519 --> 01:06:26,280
Speaker 2: Barrett's That's that's that's a you're saying the quiet part loud. Now,

1450
01:06:26,320 --> 01:06:29,039
that's really clearly the way to go. We're gonna stay

1451
01:06:29,079 --> 01:06:30,840
in the Eastern Conference. I just want to talk about

1452
01:06:30,920 --> 01:06:34,480
Jade and Ivy. I think coming into this season, for

1453
01:06:34,559 --> 01:06:36,559
me at least, he was one of the most interesting

1454
01:06:36,960 --> 01:06:40,400
like maybe just say X factor or sort of unknowns,

1455
01:06:40,840 --> 01:06:44,199
guys that, depending on how they did or did not develop,

1456
01:06:44,599 --> 01:06:47,679
could really have an outsized impact on like what their

1457
01:06:47,719 --> 01:06:51,840
franchise does in the big in the biggest sense going forward,

1458
01:06:52,719 --> 01:06:55,119
you know, and to synthesize it, it's like, is he

1459
01:06:55,199 --> 01:06:57,119
the guy that we can have next to Cade Cunningham?

1460
01:06:57,400 --> 01:07:00,480
And I think so far the indications are like, actually, yeah,

1461
01:07:00,480 --> 01:07:03,719
it's starting to look quite a bit like that. So, uh,

1462
01:07:04,159 --> 01:07:06,760
just the basics, averaging nineteen point six points four and

1463
01:07:06,800 --> 01:07:09,599
a half boards, three point six assists, forty six point

1464
01:07:09,599 --> 01:07:11,719
seven percent from the field, thirty nine percent from three,

1465
01:07:12,280 --> 01:07:14,760
making about three quarters of his free throws. Nothing crazy there.

1466
01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:18,920
His three point ten volume is basically unchanged and has

1467
01:07:19,119 --> 01:07:22,079
stuck around like between seven point four and eight per

1468
01:07:22,320 --> 01:07:24,679
one hundred for his career. So it's not like these

1469
01:07:24,679 --> 01:07:27,119
gains are in three point volume. It's three point accuracy.

1470
01:07:27,480 --> 01:07:30,280
It's specifically catch and shoot accuracy, which I would argue

1471
01:07:30,559 --> 01:07:32,679
if you're looking for the skill that you need him

1472
01:07:32,719 --> 01:07:35,480
to have next Decaid Cunningham and with this roster, that

1473
01:07:35,559 --> 01:07:39,039
skews away from shooting at least with Asar Thompson once

1474
01:07:39,079 --> 01:07:42,559
he's back and Ron Holland like, that's the one. You've

1475
01:07:42,599 --> 01:07:45,599
got to make enough catch and shoot threes to keep

1476
01:07:45,639 --> 01:07:49,599
defenses honest. And this is the other key. It's related

1477
01:07:49,800 --> 01:07:52,079
to just unlock what he can do as a second

1478
01:07:52,079 --> 01:07:55,800
side attacker, which is where he's just that's where that's

1479
01:07:55,800 --> 01:07:58,039
where Jade and Ivy looks special, Like that's where you

1480
01:07:58,079 --> 01:08:00,800
can see, Oh, here's how he was drafted this high

1481
01:08:00,880 --> 01:08:05,079
because when he's downhill and and just is able to

1482
01:08:05,119 --> 01:08:08,199
take off or slither around guys. It's it's there's not

1483
01:08:08,360 --> 01:08:10,440
a lot of players that can do what he does

1484
01:08:11,039 --> 01:08:15,159
athletically going to the basket. And as a result of

1485
01:08:15,239 --> 01:08:17,720
him making a ton of his catch and shoot threes,

1486
01:08:18,319 --> 01:08:20,680
he's hitting half his shot getting half of his shots

1487
01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:22,399
at the rim because he's got to be honored as

1488
01:08:22,439 --> 01:08:24,479
a shooter and he's just gotten better at picking his

1489
01:08:24,520 --> 01:08:27,560
spots and went to attack. His previous career, I was

1490
01:08:27,560 --> 01:08:29,760
thirty five percent of his shots came at the rim,

1491
01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:34,319
So like pretty substantial change for him, and in the

1492
01:08:34,319 --> 01:08:37,680
best way. His drives per game aren't actually any higher.

1493
01:08:37,960 --> 01:08:40,159
He's just finishing better at the rim and he's finding

1494
01:08:40,199 --> 01:08:43,960
other ways to get there. So it's just like the

1495
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:46,159
steps we've seen from him. I think if you're a

1496
01:08:46,159 --> 01:08:51,000
Pistons fan, it's almost like it's like a relieved exhale.

1497
01:08:51,199 --> 01:08:54,399
I think is like the correct reaction because you have

1498
01:08:54,560 --> 01:08:58,840
now some pretty good early season evidence that Okay, this

1499
01:08:58,880 --> 01:09:00,840
isn't going to be a wasted We're not going to

1500
01:09:00,920 --> 01:09:03,840
have to start thinking about trading Jade and Ivy or

1501
01:09:03,880 --> 01:09:06,159
like asking, you know, figuring out like who can be

1502
01:09:06,279 --> 01:09:09,000
that guy, because he like I'm not saying he's going

1503
01:09:09,039 --> 01:09:10,920
to be a superstar, But all the things he's doing

1504
01:09:10,920 --> 01:09:13,800
this year makes sense as a as a one, B

1505
01:09:14,239 --> 01:09:17,079
or two next to Kaid Cunningham in ways they didn't before.

1506
01:09:18,079 --> 01:09:20,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean he's not really good this year, just

1507
01:09:20,359 --> 01:09:22,880
even you mentioned the off ball shooting, but the way

1508
01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:24,600
that he's kind of moved off the ball at points

1509
01:09:24,640 --> 01:09:27,520
as well. I guess not to focus on the negative.

1510
01:09:27,560 --> 01:09:29,359
My biggest question for him moving forward would be you

1511
01:09:29,399 --> 01:09:31,199
kind of mentioned what does he look like in some

1512
01:09:31,239 --> 01:09:33,399
of the tougher s basing lineups? If a sar Thompson

1513
01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:35,479
comes back and you ever want to play all their

1514
01:09:35,520 --> 01:09:38,720
young guys together. I am curious. And this isn't as

1515
01:09:38,800 --> 01:09:40,960
huge of a problem because Kate is there, and even

1516
01:09:41,000 --> 01:09:44,680
like sar Thompson and Ron Holland are are notable because

1517
01:09:44,680 --> 01:09:46,439
of their passing abilities. I don't know what to make

1518
01:09:46,479 --> 01:09:48,680
of him as a playmaker just yet. I would at

1519
01:09:48,760 --> 01:09:51,079
least like to see him be able to find guys

1520
01:09:51,439 --> 01:09:53,520
in more of those second side situations are just coming

1521
01:09:53,520 --> 01:09:55,640
out of drives. Even as we're recording right now, he

1522
01:09:55,680 --> 01:09:58,159
has more turnovers on drives than assists. That might be

1523
01:09:58,199 --> 01:09:59,760
more of a mindset thing. A lot of the pisses

1524
01:09:59,800 --> 01:10:03,279
team mates are new defenses still don't necessarily like they

1525
01:10:03,319 --> 01:10:06,119
have better spacing. But are these all shooters That defense

1526
01:10:06,159 --> 01:10:08,560
in respect depends on the defense that you're going up.

1527
01:10:08,960 --> 01:10:12,720
I honestly, I'm saying this with genuine curiosity. I'm curious

1528
01:10:12,760 --> 01:10:15,520
to see what he turns into as a playmaker.

1529
01:10:15,520 --> 01:10:16,479
Speaker 2: And you don't need him.

1530
01:10:16,359 --> 01:10:18,840
Speaker 1: To be the floor general of Kate cutting him there,

1531
01:10:18,880 --> 01:10:21,039
But if you want him to lead second units or

1532
01:10:21,159 --> 01:10:23,720
just be even more of a dynamic threat and your

1533
01:10:23,720 --> 01:10:26,560
full strength lineups is can he get off the ball

1534
01:10:26,960 --> 01:10:28,079
a little bit more quickly?

1535
01:10:28,920 --> 01:10:31,560
Speaker 2: I think it's in there. I would concede though that

1536
01:10:31,640 --> 01:10:36,239
like the the name that comes to mind for both

1537
01:10:36,279 --> 01:10:39,760
good and Ill when he's attacking is Russell Westbrook and

1538
01:10:39,800 --> 01:10:43,640
likes nobody is athletic, like what like Peak Westbrook was,

1539
01:10:43,720 --> 01:10:46,560
But Ivy does have those bursts where it's like, is

1540
01:10:46,560 --> 01:10:49,079
he at a different speed than everybody else? Like it

1541
01:10:49,159 --> 01:10:52,520
really does it? Like it's a glitchy almost. But he

1542
01:10:52,600 --> 01:10:54,720
also has the thing where like the ball just squirts

1543
01:10:54,720 --> 01:10:57,640
out or like he's you know, gets contact and the

1544
01:10:57,640 --> 01:11:00,520
ball just pings around, and so it's like those are

1545
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:03,439
you know, maybe it's a. Maybe it's an issue of

1546
01:11:04,279 --> 01:11:07,479
throttle back to like ninety five percent instead of one hundred,

1547
01:11:07,560 --> 01:11:10,359
and then maybe we cut some of those turnovers because

1548
01:11:10,399 --> 01:11:13,239
he does just like get downhill and he turns into

1549
01:11:13,279 --> 01:11:15,359
a blur and the ball just doesn't get where it

1550
01:11:15,399 --> 01:11:18,239
needs to go. I still think I don't know that

1551
01:11:18,279 --> 01:11:21,840
he's going to be ever, You're like, he's gonna run

1552
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:24,000
thirty pick and rolls a game and just you know,

1553
01:11:24,119 --> 01:11:26,600
dissected defense that way that I don't think is really

1554
01:11:27,000 --> 01:11:27,560
in the car.

1555
01:11:27,800 --> 01:11:30,119
Speaker 1: Just based off what you've seen this year, feel more

1556
01:11:30,119 --> 01:11:32,640
inclined to settle in those situa where it's like even

1557
01:11:32,680 --> 01:11:34,319
Westbrook would be a good comp here, where it's well,

1558
01:11:34,319 --> 01:11:36,159
why is he taking that pull up jumper right?

1559
01:11:36,199 --> 01:11:39,000
Speaker 2: Why the thirteen footer? Yeah, no, there's some of that.

1560
01:11:39,680 --> 01:11:41,680
I do think he can get to the point where

1561
01:11:42,279 --> 01:11:45,119
the ball's Cunningham is getting all the attention, it swings

1562
01:11:45,159 --> 01:11:47,399
to Ivy and he has like a single guy that's

1563
01:11:47,479 --> 01:11:50,159
in rotation to attack. I think he can make the

1564
01:11:50,279 --> 01:11:54,560
like two to three dribble decision. Like, I think he

1565
01:11:54,600 --> 01:11:56,520
can get to a point where and you know, we

1566
01:11:56,560 --> 01:11:59,159
don't need to make the incredible skip passes or whatever

1567
01:11:59,199 --> 01:12:01,920
but just like either go all the way and finish,

1568
01:12:02,319 --> 01:12:05,000
which he can do really well, or just make the

1569
01:12:05,039 --> 01:12:07,600
simple pass to the open shooter. And now, do the

1570
01:12:07,640 --> 01:12:10,039
Pistons have guys in their long term core that are

1571
01:12:10,039 --> 01:12:12,720
going to make those shots? I don't know that that's

1572
01:12:12,800 --> 01:12:13,960
another complicating factor.

1573
01:12:13,960 --> 01:12:14,399
Speaker 1: I do.

1574
01:12:14,479 --> 01:12:17,399
Speaker 2: It's just a positive that, like, now we've moved on

1575
01:12:17,439 --> 01:12:19,960
to that question, because I do think Ivy's shown enough

1576
01:12:20,000 --> 01:12:21,840
to suggest he can just be that second guy.

1577
01:12:22,399 --> 01:12:24,720
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I think also the game has clearly slowed

1578
01:12:24,760 --> 01:12:27,600
down for him or he slowed down himself, which I

1579
01:12:27,600 --> 01:12:30,520
think helps as well. So I would say I don't

1580
01:12:30,640 --> 01:12:33,319
I would call myself TBD on whether he's the right

1581
01:12:33,439 --> 01:12:34,960
running mate for K moving forward. But I think that

1582
01:12:34,960 --> 01:12:36,760
he has the strongest case that he's had in two

1583
01:12:36,760 --> 01:12:37,279
plus years.

1584
01:12:37,680 --> 01:12:39,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, which is in saying a lot. And you know,

1585
01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:41,800
he was not exactly set up to succeed, so that

1586
01:12:41,800 --> 01:12:44,159
that's another part of it. He's just like being put

1587
01:12:44,199 --> 01:12:45,399
in better positions now.

1588
01:12:45,439 --> 01:12:47,439
Speaker 1: He's also look, I don't know how many people want

1589
01:12:47,439 --> 01:12:49,840
to have this discussion, but advocating for it, he's not

1590
01:12:49,920 --> 01:12:52,000
this front office's guy. He has made himself a more

1591
01:12:52,039 --> 01:12:53,439
valuable trade asset. This season.

1592
01:12:53,520 --> 01:12:53,920
Speaker 2: It's true.

1593
01:12:54,399 --> 01:12:56,319
Speaker 1: I've seen a lot of Pistons fans who want brandon

1594
01:12:56,439 --> 01:12:58,760
Ingram now, and maybe they just think the cost is

1595
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:03,560
so low. But like, you don't actively want brandon Ingram, Cunningham, Ivy,

1596
01:13:03,640 --> 01:13:06,920
Asar and Holland on your butt, right, that doesn't make

1597
01:13:07,239 --> 01:13:08,560
all of those you're not first of all, you're not

1598
01:13:08,560 --> 01:13:09,359
playing them all together.

1599
01:13:09,800 --> 01:13:14,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a little crowded for to me. And like, frankly,

1600
01:13:14,159 --> 01:13:17,439
I just you're not you You need to still learn

1601
01:13:17,479 --> 01:13:20,479
more about Thompson and Holland and like Ivy and Cunningham

1602
01:13:20,479 --> 01:13:21,840
for that and for that matter, I don't know that

1603
01:13:22,000 --> 01:13:23,840
Ingram helps you get a lot of good information from

1604
01:13:23,880 --> 01:13:24,399
those guys.

1605
01:13:24,600 --> 01:13:26,279
Speaker 1: Well, I depending on what the cost is, he's shooting

1606
01:13:26,359 --> 01:13:28,159
enough threes or I would be at least somewhat tempted.

1607
01:13:28,279 --> 01:13:30,840
Speaker 2: Maybe, Yeah, I just wonder, Yeah, maybe I just wonder

1608
01:13:30,880 --> 01:13:32,640
if you run into the same problem the Pelicans have

1609
01:13:32,680 --> 01:13:35,720
where it's like, yeah, he's you know, he's a good player.

1610
01:13:35,760 --> 01:13:37,520
He's gonna take up a bunch of shots and some

1611
01:13:37,560 --> 01:13:39,640
of them will be threes, maybe not enough, and like

1612
01:13:39,960 --> 01:13:42,960
how you know, you're just not learning anything about your

1613
01:13:42,960 --> 01:13:44,800
guys that you want to with him. In the lineup.

1614
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:46,159
It's a weird, weird phenomenon.

1615
01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:48,359
Speaker 1: You ready for rapid fire news?

1616
01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:49,039
Speaker 2: Yes?

1617
01:13:49,840 --> 01:13:52,079
Speaker 1: Uh? Do you have our news doc open? Or do

1618
01:13:52,079 --> 01:13:53,239
you just want me to run through it all?

1619
01:13:53,319 --> 01:13:53,880
Speaker 2: I got it.

1620
01:13:55,239 --> 01:13:59,159
Speaker 1: You'll start with the Hawks. Vit Cragie will be reevaluating

1621
01:13:59,159 --> 01:14:02,039
the second week of Novem after suffering a thigh injury.

1622
01:14:02,399 --> 01:14:04,720
Speaker 2: A lot of injuries in Atlanta for the Celtics, Jalen

1623
01:14:04,760 --> 01:14:08,279
Brown's dealing with a hip flexer Wednesday's game against Golden State.

1624
01:14:08,279 --> 01:14:10,880
That's gonna happen tonight as we're recording. It will be

1625
01:14:10,880 --> 01:14:12,399
the third game he's missed.

1626
01:14:12,760 --> 01:14:15,119
Speaker 1: For the Brooklyn Nets. Trenton Watford, who's yet to play

1627
01:14:15,119 --> 01:14:17,960
with a hamstring injuries, expected to make his season debut soon.

1628
01:14:18,680 --> 01:14:21,000
Per head coach Jordy Fernandez, I'm excited to see grabbing

1629
01:14:21,039 --> 01:14:23,720
ghos stuff from Trenton Watford. Ben Simmons remains day to

1630
01:14:23,800 --> 01:14:26,119
day with back issues. Noma Clowney remains day to day

1631
01:14:26,159 --> 01:14:27,119
with a hip injury.

1632
01:14:27,760 --> 01:14:29,840
Speaker 2: For the Bulls. Zach Levine is expected to miss a

1633
01:14:29,920 --> 01:14:32,159
second straight game. He's got a thigh issue.

1634
01:14:33,079 --> 01:14:35,039
Speaker 1: Nick Richards, by the way, I forgot to include this

1635
01:14:35,119 --> 01:14:35,520
on the dog.

1636
01:14:35,640 --> 01:14:35,840
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1637
01:14:36,079 --> 01:14:39,319
Speaker 1: He is going to miss some time for the Hornets

1638
01:14:39,840 --> 01:14:43,119
with a rib cartilage fracture. They did not give a

1639
01:14:43,159 --> 01:14:45,600
concrete timetable. He's out indefinitely.

1640
01:14:46,079 --> 01:14:48,039
Speaker 2: I think they said they were going to reevaluate him

1641
01:14:48,039 --> 01:14:52,159
every other week, which is okay, that's that's maybe a little.

1642
01:14:51,960 --> 01:14:55,920
Speaker 1: Bit for Chicago. I'll take them since I I don't

1643
01:14:55,960 --> 01:14:56,800
know why I did Chicago.

1644
01:14:56,920 --> 01:15:02,600
Speaker 2: You take Dallas? You did Chicago, Yeah, Zach Lavigne that issue, Oh.

1645
01:15:02,479 --> 01:15:05,319
Speaker 1: Sorry, excuse me, Dallas. Derek Clivey, the second, remains day

1646
01:15:05,359 --> 01:15:07,520
to day with a shoulder issue. Max and Kleeba is

1647
01:15:07,560 --> 01:15:10,680
still dealing with a hamstring injury Wednesday. He's not expected

1648
01:15:10,680 --> 01:15:13,600
to play, so that'll mark his sixth straight absence. And PJ.

1649
01:15:13,800 --> 01:15:16,359
Washington is missing Wednesday's game against the Bulls with a

1650
01:15:16,479 --> 01:15:20,359
right knee sprain, which is that doesn't feel necessarily like

1651
01:15:20,399 --> 01:15:22,359
a one game injury, but we'll have to say.

1652
01:15:22,359 --> 01:15:25,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, big one here. Aaron Gordon is gonna miss multiple

1653
01:15:25,079 --> 01:15:29,039
weeks with a calf strain right calf aggravated it against

1654
01:15:29,079 --> 01:15:33,000
the Raptors this past Monday, and I mean, the hits

1655
01:15:33,039 --> 01:15:35,479
keep coming. Jamal Murray is in concussion protocols. He's gonna

1656
01:15:35,479 --> 01:15:37,359
miss his third straight game on Wednesday.

1657
01:15:37,960 --> 01:15:40,520
Speaker 1: Do you think Calvin Booth is like watching the tape

1658
01:15:40,520 --> 01:15:43,239
from that win over the Raptors in just like a

1659
01:15:43,279 --> 01:15:46,359
dimly lit room that's locked by himself with sort of

1660
01:15:46,399 --> 01:15:49,159
like maybe Barry Manilo playing in the background. He saw

1661
01:15:49,159 --> 01:15:50,600
the kid's division coming together.

1662
01:15:51,279 --> 01:15:54,039
Speaker 2: We man, it's just yeah, real excited. I just like

1663
01:15:54,199 --> 01:15:56,279
we've already had a couple of these. But man, are

1664
01:15:56,279 --> 01:15:58,920
we going to litigate the Denver Nuggets like last three

1665
01:15:58,920 --> 01:16:01,159
off seasons a lot this? I feel like that's just

1666
01:16:01,399 --> 01:16:03,439
that that is going to be a big topic all season.

1667
01:16:04,600 --> 01:16:06,960
Speaker 1: This isn't I didn't include this, but Dantony Melton's still

1668
01:16:07,000 --> 01:16:08,760
out with back stuff for the Warriors. They don't seem

1669
01:16:08,800 --> 01:16:10,279
to know when he's going to come back, but this

1670
01:16:10,359 --> 01:16:12,960
one is something to monitor. Steven Adams is still dealing

1671
01:16:12,960 --> 01:16:15,760
with a right knee issue. He's not expected to play Wednesday.

1672
01:16:15,760 --> 01:16:17,359
This is for Houston for anyone who might not know

1673
01:16:17,479 --> 01:16:20,560
Steven Adams plays for. He's made two appearances so far

1674
01:16:20,680 --> 01:16:21,520
this season.

1675
01:16:22,800 --> 01:16:26,279
Speaker 2: For the Pacers. Man torn achilles number two Isaiah Jackson

1676
01:16:26,760 --> 01:16:28,880
tore his expected to miss the rest of the season.

1677
01:16:28,960 --> 01:16:32,680
Falls James Wiseman's same injury brutal. I mean that, you know,

1678
01:16:32,920 --> 01:16:34,880
forget the oh the big man depth is compromise. That

1679
01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:37,960
just sucks. Like those are two massive injuries to ive got.

1680
01:16:37,960 --> 01:16:40,079
Speaker 1: It sucks for Jackson because he's in a contract year.

1681
01:16:40,239 --> 01:16:42,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, that hurts. Aaron E. Smith is going to miss

1682
01:16:42,760 --> 01:16:45,800
his second straight game Wednesday sprain right ankle. Rick Carlisle

1683
01:16:45,840 --> 01:16:48,880
said he's wearing a walking boot, So I make of

1684
01:16:48,880 --> 01:16:51,279
that what you will. Andrew Nimhard played Monday against the MAVs,

1685
01:16:51,319 --> 01:16:53,319
but he's still day to day. Got a sore left

1686
01:16:53,359 --> 01:16:55,520
knee that has cost him one game so far.

1687
01:16:56,439 --> 01:16:59,960
Speaker 1: For the Lakers, Jared Vanderbilt was spotted practicing with them,

1688
01:17:01,159 --> 01:17:02,680
but he has yet to play this year as he

1689
01:17:02,720 --> 01:17:05,159
recovers from a right foot injury, and they have not

1690
01:17:05,199 --> 01:17:07,800
provided a timetable for his return. It doesn't even sound

1691
01:17:07,840 --> 01:17:11,279
like this was per Kobe Price, who covers the Lakers.

1692
01:17:11,560 --> 01:17:13,680
The way that it's framed is he was spotted practicing

1693
01:17:13,720 --> 01:17:16,479
as Lakers. Makes me think, were you supposed to see that?

1694
01:17:18,800 --> 01:17:22,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, spies in the rafters were able to discern that

1695
01:17:22,199 --> 01:17:25,600
it was ed disguise. Jared Vanderbilt practicing not on here,

1696
01:17:25,640 --> 01:17:27,600
but Anthony Davis had a foot injury that he played

1697
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:30,000
through in his last game, and so anything with Anthony

1698
01:17:30,079 --> 01:17:33,159
Davis is going to be worth monitoring. Well, I don't

1699
01:17:33,159 --> 01:17:34,680
know if that's day to day or not. For the

1700
01:17:34,720 --> 01:17:37,359
Memphis Grizzlies, Marcus Smart has missed the last three games.

1701
01:17:37,560 --> 01:17:40,000
He's got a right ankle sprain. Can you just be

1702
01:17:40,000 --> 01:17:43,039
listened as questionable? The Grizzlies are just like just again,

1703
01:17:43,319 --> 01:17:45,119
up and down the rosters. Everybody's hurt.

1704
01:17:45,359 --> 01:17:47,760
Speaker 1: Okay, it's Scotty Pippen Junior's here to save the day

1705
01:17:48,439 --> 01:17:50,159
for the Miami Heat. How May Hawker's junior will miss

1706
01:17:50,159 --> 01:17:52,640
his second straight game on Wednesday with an illness.

1707
01:17:53,720 --> 01:17:56,159
Speaker 2: Milwaukee Bucks, stop me if you've heard this before. Chris

1708
01:17:56,239 --> 01:17:59,479
Middleton is out indefinitely still he's recovering from dual ankle surgeries.

1709
01:18:00,159 --> 01:18:02,319
Scham's Trani on NBA to Day said the Bucks have

1710
01:18:02,399 --> 01:18:05,760
recognized that this quote have recognized that this is taking

1711
01:18:05,880 --> 01:18:08,600
much longer than they anticipated. Middleton has yet to resume

1712
01:18:08,640 --> 01:18:12,640
five on five action on the court. Everything is super great,

1713
01:18:11,960 --> 01:18:12,920
and I.

1714
01:18:12,880 --> 01:18:14,880
Speaker 1: Don't even he doesn't fix what's ailing.

1715
01:18:14,560 --> 01:18:17,479
Speaker 2: Them the most, Just like, why not you know one more?

1716
01:18:18,159 --> 01:18:22,680
Speaker 1: Uh, We're onto the Pelicans. So Jordan Hawkins missed Monday's

1717
01:18:22,720 --> 01:18:25,640
game with lower back tightness and remains day to day.

1718
01:18:26,199 --> 01:18:29,800
We already covered the CJ McCollum, Trey Murphy, Jontay Mary absences.

1719
01:18:29,840 --> 01:18:32,039
Zion Williamson has missed the past two games with a

1720
01:18:32,119 --> 01:18:36,359
quad slash hamstrings that slash thigh issue. He remains questionable.

1721
01:18:36,880 --> 01:18:39,560
It also whatever's going on with him also seems just

1722
01:18:39,560 --> 01:18:42,319
a little bit more mysterious than you would like.

1723
01:18:42,800 --> 01:18:44,680
Speaker 2: Quad and hamstring at the same time.

1724
01:18:44,800 --> 01:18:47,920
Speaker 1: Not great, I've seen. I was trying to dig into

1725
01:18:47,920 --> 01:18:49,600
it more and maybe we'll have more information by the

1726
01:18:49,640 --> 01:18:52,199
time this comes out, So any wonder the comments who's

1727
01:18:52,239 --> 01:18:55,720
well actually congratulations on existing in the future.

1728
01:18:56,520 --> 01:19:00,840
Speaker 2: It's just like, uh, Zion Williamson's entire leg is fucked.

1729
01:19:04,079 --> 01:19:07,560
Speaker 1: Pelicans are cursed, is questionable, Jesus all right.

1730
01:19:07,600 --> 01:19:10,039
Speaker 2: For the Knicks campaigns questionable with a hamstring injury Wednesday,

1731
01:19:10,079 --> 01:19:12,000
He's missed a game so far. Matt Ryan signed a

1732
01:19:12,000 --> 01:19:14,119
non guaranteed deal with the Knicks, who just need human

1733
01:19:14,159 --> 01:19:15,479
bodies to play.

1734
01:19:15,600 --> 01:19:18,960
Speaker 1: Legally, they need fourteen bodies, You're right, which is a

1735
01:19:19,000 --> 01:19:20,239
tough threshold for the clear.

1736
01:19:20,760 --> 01:19:23,239
Speaker 2: Ariel Hookporti got converted from his two way to a

1737
01:19:23,239 --> 01:19:25,319
standard deal. It's a non guarantee, but he's got it

1738
01:19:25,439 --> 01:19:27,880
includes a team option. Good for him. He's looked. He

1739
01:19:27,880 --> 01:19:29,239
looked pretty good in a few stretches.

1740
01:19:29,279 --> 01:19:31,920
Speaker 1: I saw him play Oklahoma City. I don't have any

1741
01:19:31,920 --> 01:19:33,680
injury updates for them, Grant. I just wanted you to

1742
01:19:33,720 --> 01:19:36,279
know that they still have zero backup centers available but

1743
01:19:36,399 --> 01:19:39,680
continue to own the best adjusted defensive rating in the history.

1744
01:19:39,760 --> 01:19:42,920
Speaker 2: Just thank you for that. Appreciate it for the Magic.

1745
01:19:43,760 --> 01:19:46,520
This has been a few days now, but big deal.

1746
01:19:46,600 --> 01:19:49,800
Paul Bencaro out in definitely with a torn obleak. Wende

1747
01:19:49,840 --> 01:19:51,640
Carter Junior is gonna miss his second straight game with

1748
01:19:51,640 --> 01:19:54,359
planner fasci itis in his left foot. Also just missed

1749
01:19:54,359 --> 01:19:56,560
a game due to right knee tendon itis.

1750
01:19:56,920 --> 01:19:58,800
Speaker 1: And also I would just direct you back to the

1751
01:19:58,800 --> 01:20:00,920
conversation that Grant led on on the Magic after the

1752
01:20:00,920 --> 01:20:02,640
Palot injury that we reacted to. I don't know if

1753
01:20:02,680 --> 01:20:03,960
it was live. It might have been the day after.

1754
01:20:04,479 --> 01:20:07,760
Orlando's offense is dead last inefficiency since he went down.

1755
01:20:07,920 --> 01:20:08,600
Speaker 2: That's a problem.

1756
01:20:08,800 --> 01:20:12,439
Speaker 1: He's pretty important for the run of Philadelphia seventy six ers.

1757
01:20:12,479 --> 01:20:15,520
Paul George Grant made his season debut versus the Suns

1758
01:20:15,800 --> 01:20:17,439
on Monday, and it seems like he's gonna play against

1759
01:20:17,439 --> 01:20:19,439
the Clippers on Wednesday. How about it? This is a

1760
01:20:19,439 --> 01:20:22,680
bigger one. Joelle Embiid has received a three game suspension

1761
01:20:22,680 --> 01:20:25,319
for an altercation with the Philly in choirers Marcus Hayes.

1762
01:20:25,680 --> 01:20:30,359
Embiid reportably shoved, not assaulted or punched, or whatever vernacular

1763
01:20:30,439 --> 01:20:33,039
was going around in the moment. He reportedly shoved Hayes

1764
01:20:33,119 --> 01:20:35,880
during a heated argument that followed an article Hayes wrote

1765
01:20:36,119 --> 01:20:40,600
about Embiid's availability, in which Hayes used a since removed

1766
01:20:40,720 --> 01:20:44,520
reference to Embid's deceased brother and his son to prove

1767
01:20:44,560 --> 01:20:47,840
the article's point. Too many people have gotten way into this,

1768
01:20:47,920 --> 01:20:52,560
but my commentary would be the article itself was. It

1769
01:20:52,600 --> 01:20:55,920
was typical like national columnists like, this is what they do.

1770
01:20:56,279 --> 01:21:01,439
But it was unacceptable that he just invoked needlessly Embiid's

1771
01:21:01,479 --> 01:21:03,720
son and his brother to prove a point. I thought

1772
01:21:03,720 --> 01:21:06,239
that was gross. That does not give Joel Embiid the

1773
01:21:06,319 --> 01:21:10,640
right to push him. Everyone comes off here looking very poorly. However,

1774
01:21:11,000 --> 01:21:15,079
Embiid's suspension does feel like it's going to begin immediately,

1775
01:21:15,359 --> 01:21:18,640
and I questioned whether he was going to play immediately,

1776
01:21:18,920 --> 01:21:21,279
so will there be a follow up investigation there? But

1777
01:21:22,319 --> 01:21:24,560
the Philly inquired by the way they published something that

1778
01:21:24,560 --> 01:21:26,960
made it seem like they were gonna, like really follow

1779
01:21:27,000 --> 01:21:28,760
through with this. I don't know if a lawsuit will file,

1780
01:21:28,840 --> 01:21:32,520
so it's something to monitor. But I very much believe

1781
01:21:32,560 --> 01:21:34,479
that we all, for what we say, should have consequences

1782
01:21:34,479 --> 01:21:36,760
if we come across a player. But the people who

1783
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:39,439
were kind of like raw ry, Yeah, Beid pushed him like,

1784
01:21:39,479 --> 01:21:41,640
shut the fuck up, like you now you're taking yourself

1785
01:21:41,840 --> 01:21:44,039
out of three games in which your teams need you,

1786
01:21:44,079 --> 01:21:46,319
and Beid needs to be smarter. But we also, I

1787
01:21:46,359 --> 01:21:48,119
don't like this idea that we get to say whatever

1788
01:21:48,159 --> 01:21:51,079
we want about these players. They are humans. And finally,

1789
01:21:51,439 --> 01:21:54,520
the idea that EMBIID is somehow responsible for, let alone

1790
01:21:54,600 --> 01:21:57,800
faking injuries or doesn't want to play is just ludicrous.

1791
01:21:57,840 --> 01:21:59,960
Like that is just dumb assery at its finest.

1792
01:22:00,199 --> 01:22:05,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, the the section of that column was unnecessary and

1793
01:22:06,079 --> 01:22:09,159
over the line, and EMBIID is wrong because don't do

1794
01:22:09,239 --> 01:22:13,520
violence to words. You know, that's pretty pretty straightforward for

1795
01:22:13,560 --> 01:22:16,319
the Spurs here. Jeremy Sohon suffered a fracture in his

1796
01:22:16,399 --> 01:22:18,880
left thumb during Monday's game against Clippers. He's going to

1797
01:22:18,920 --> 01:22:22,000
have surgery. Team's going to provide updates as appropriate. That's

1798
01:22:22,039 --> 01:22:26,439
going to be I mean several weeks minimum. Right Devin

1799
01:22:26,479 --> 01:22:29,560
Vessel not expected to make his season debuts. He's recovering

1800
01:22:29,560 --> 01:22:32,680
from right foot surgery until the Spurs come back from

1801
01:22:32,720 --> 01:22:36,159
their current road trip, so his earliest debut is looking

1802
01:22:36,239 --> 01:22:41,039
like November seventh. We'll see also Greg Popovich away from

1803
01:22:41,079 --> 01:22:44,159
the team indefinitely, having suffered a I forget what the

1804
01:22:44,199 --> 01:22:47,319
exact phrasing was, like a health situation or something like that.

1805
01:22:47,359 --> 01:22:49,800
It's all been very vague. The Spurs aren't giving out

1806
01:22:49,840 --> 01:22:54,000
any details as as which is fine. Popovich is seventy five.

1807
01:22:54,119 --> 01:22:56,960
You got to take this stuff seriously. So he's going

1808
01:22:57,039 --> 01:22:58,560
to be away from the team, I would imagine for

1809
01:22:58,640 --> 01:22:59,239
quite a while.

1810
01:22:59,680 --> 01:23:03,239
Speaker 1: And I really hope ESPN has Shams ceased reporting on

1811
01:23:03,279 --> 01:23:06,359
this because he's just saying there's a serious concern and

1812
01:23:06,399 --> 01:23:08,079
with I don't think we need to know the details,

1813
01:23:08,119 --> 01:23:11,239
because that's the fact that we know all these player

1814
01:23:11,319 --> 01:23:14,680
medicals is awkward enough. But let's if we don't know

1815
01:23:14,680 --> 01:23:16,359
what's going on, we don't need to speculator just throw

1816
01:23:16,399 --> 01:23:19,119
around terms like serious, thank you, I did not have

1817
01:23:19,159 --> 01:23:21,159
that in the doc. Thanks for thanks for catching that.

1818
01:23:21,199 --> 01:23:22,800
The Raptors we just kind of talked about this. But

1819
01:23:22,920 --> 01:23:25,239
Kelly Linnock is still a few weeks away from returning

1820
01:23:25,239 --> 01:23:27,159
from a back injury. He has yet to play this season.

1821
01:23:27,439 --> 01:23:30,279
Bruce Brown is not expected back anytime soon following the

1822
01:23:30,319 --> 01:23:33,560
right knee surgery he underwent in September, and Emmanuel Quickly,

1823
01:23:33,600 --> 01:23:35,680
who has not played since Opening Night, remains out with

1824
01:23:35,760 --> 01:23:37,840
a pelvic injury. It does not seem like he has

1825
01:23:38,279 --> 01:23:40,079
a concrete timetable for his return.

1826
01:23:41,600 --> 01:23:43,880
Speaker 2: More time for Grady Dick and Jonathan Mobo to do

1827
01:23:43,960 --> 01:23:44,800
cool stuff.

1828
01:23:45,039 --> 01:23:47,399
Speaker 1: Great Jeff to do his Jason Tatum impressions.

1829
01:23:48,439 --> 01:23:52,079
Speaker 2: That's the comp for the Jazz. Jordan Clarkson been diagnosed

1830
01:23:52,119 --> 01:23:54,520
with left planner fasciitis. He'll be reevaluated at the end

1831
01:23:54,560 --> 01:23:56,880
of the week after missing what will be a total

1832
01:23:56,880 --> 01:23:59,520
of five games. Rookie has a Collier is still out

1833
01:23:59,520 --> 01:24:02,720
with the right hand am string. Man like too bad

1834
01:24:02,720 --> 01:24:05,319
because he might be getting some some minutes here given

1835
01:24:05,479 --> 01:24:08,439
Clarkson's absence. He hasn't played this season. Call here and

1836
01:24:08,560 --> 01:24:11,760
Lari Markin and missed his third straight back issues on Monday.

1837
01:24:12,039 --> 01:24:15,079
His status for moving forward is unclear. I would expect

1838
01:24:15,119 --> 01:24:18,199
Lori markten to miss the odd game here and there

1839
01:24:18,239 --> 01:24:20,600
throughout the season with back issues or something.

1840
01:24:20,560 --> 01:24:22,960
Speaker 1: In fact that they're not listing made up body parts though,

1841
01:24:23,039 --> 01:24:24,399
does have me a little bit concerned.

1842
01:24:25,640 --> 01:24:27,920
Speaker 2: Well, maybe they should trot out the like what was

1843
01:24:27,960 --> 01:24:31,880
the Porzingis injury? It was like a reticular letter to.

1844
01:24:31,760 --> 01:24:33,520
Speaker 1: They should make They should just make up. I mean

1845
01:24:33,560 --> 01:24:36,159
someone will catch it, but like just name the most complicated,

1846
01:24:36,239 --> 01:24:39,920
maybe inconsequential, like part of the body and just have

1847
01:24:40,000 --> 01:24:41,520
that sore bruised.

1848
01:24:42,600 --> 01:24:45,239
Speaker 2: Well, like with Steph Sorry, with Steph Curry's ankle thing,

1849
01:24:45,520 --> 01:24:49,359
suddenly this is a peroneal tendon strain or something. It's like,

1850
01:24:49,359 --> 01:24:51,159
all right, we saw his ankle flip over. We don't

1851
01:24:51,159 --> 01:24:52,079
need to be this precise.

1852
01:24:52,960 --> 01:24:54,279
Speaker 1: Do you have anything else? Are you ready to take

1853
01:24:54,359 --> 01:24:56,039
us out of here? After we won twenty five minutes,

1854
01:24:56,039 --> 01:24:57,800
we said we were just going to do an hour midweek.

1855
01:24:57,880 --> 01:24:59,000
We went out on twenty five.

1856
01:24:59,000 --> 01:25:01,079
Speaker 2: You're welcome, all right. We had we had a lot

1857
01:25:01,079 --> 01:25:03,680
of a lot of Eastern conference, We had a lot

1858
01:25:03,720 --> 01:25:07,960
of market this podcast. Thanks everybody for checking in with us.

1859
01:25:08,000 --> 01:25:10,720
We'll have another episode going up I don't know next week,

1860
01:25:10,760 --> 01:25:13,079
next Tuesday, Dan, is that the deal? I guess I

1861
01:25:13,079 --> 01:25:14,359
should have consulted with you before.

1862
01:25:14,359 --> 01:25:17,039
Speaker 1: We'll have one on Saturday going up Saturday that bailed

1863
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on me this Friday already granted learning you all live.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for listening, thanks for watching. If you have an

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already rate review, subscribe. Make sure you comment on YouTube.

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We've made specific solicitations for comments on this one because

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we need answers on the Grady Dick comps. That's that's

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an important issue. Please please contribute. You can join our

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discord uh and check out our merch links for that

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in YouTube and podcast description. I think that's going to

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cover it. Thanks again, Thank you, Dan, Dan, I hope

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you're doing well. Just to book end.

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Speaker 1: Then, you're such a good friend.

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Speaker 2: Thanks, I appreciate it. Shouts Franklin, the apologies, Jared Allen