Speaker 1: This is pod Popular Podcast for the People, The Great
Speaker 1: Love Debates. It's the Great Love Debate, The Great Love Debates.
Speaker 1: It's a Great Love to Hi again everyone, It's Brian Howie.
Speaker 1: Welcome to The Great Love Debate, the world's number one
Speaker 1: dating and relationship podcast since twenty fifteen. You get just
Speaker 1: me today. Good news for some of you, bad news
Speaker 1: for some of you. And I know podcasts are supposed
Speaker 1: to be evergreen, which means make no reference to events
Speaker 1: or time, so that somebody listening to this show or
Speaker 1: any other show down the road won't feel sort of
Speaker 1: like wait, what I missed something, or or they feel
Speaker 1: left out. But I am recording this on a fall
Speaker 1: day at pod Popular Podcasts for the People. I am
Speaker 1: at the one just outside of Cleveland, Ohio, in a
Speaker 1: place called Legacy Village, in a place called Lyndhurst, Ohio.
Speaker 1: And let me tell you something, it's fall, and fall,
Speaker 1: by far is the best season. It just doesn't have
Speaker 1: as good a publicis as spring, and definitely not summer,
Speaker 1: and maybe not even winter. If you went on Family
Speaker 1: Feud and Steve Harvey Steve Harvey still the host of
Speaker 1: Family Feud, I think he is anyway, if Steve Harvey said,
Speaker 1: top four seasons on the board. Name a season. I'm
Speaker 1: not sure people wouldn't say fall last, but fall is
Speaker 1: the best. And maybe because it has two names. It's fall,
Speaker 1: it's autumn that it dilutes it a bit that sounds
Speaker 1: like a Seinfeld bids are the two names with the fall,
Speaker 1: but it's the best. Spring is so overrated, it barely
Speaker 1: exists in most of the country. It's just an idea,
Speaker 1: this thing of spring. You get these two dreary, soggy
Speaker 1: months of March and April followed by a boiling hot
Speaker 1: Memorial Hey weekend. But people fall in the love, in
Speaker 1: love with the idea of spring. You're like, where's he
Speaker 1: going with this? I'll get there. Because it's supposed to
Speaker 1: symbolize a rebirth or an awakening, and because January and
Speaker 1: February are so miserable in you know, three quarters of
Speaker 1: the country. I think people want to just cling to
Speaker 1: any scrap of sun or the possibility of it. And
Speaker 1: you've earnd me rant about summer before. Summer is so overrated,
Speaker 1: it's miserable. I think we fall in love with it
Speaker 1: because as kids, we have no schools, so we're like summer,
Speaker 1: and we carry that mindset into adulthood. But summer in
Speaker 1: most of the country is really just a sea of
Speaker 1: mosquitoes and humidity, and winter's winter. It's three weeks of
Speaker 1: holiday decorations, maybe five, maybe nine now because they spread
Speaker 1: it out, and then just death, the dead of winter.
Speaker 1: But I'm not here to be a meteorologist. But death,
Speaker 1: that's sort of what I want to get into, not dying.
Speaker 1: So I've mentioned a bunch of times recently that I
Speaker 1: started a new podcast and it is called Dead to Me,
Speaker 1: and it is about estrangement, particularly family estrangement. And people
Speaker 1: ask me, what in the world does that show have
Speaker 1: to do with this show Great Love Debate, And it's
Speaker 1: really the opposite. It was this show have to do
Speaker 1: with that show, and why I consider it not that
Speaker 1: big of a pivot, and I don't even think it's
Speaker 1: the opposite of the love stuff. I consider it almost
Speaker 1: a book. ND, because I've studied this a bit, and
Speaker 1: I have heard for years from hundreds and hundreds of
Speaker 1: people who have reached out and who have brought it
Speaker 1: up at our live shows that one of the main
Speaker 1: reasons that people have trouble getting into relationships or staying
Speaker 1: in one or being in a healthy one is that
Speaker 1: there are issues unresolved or that are linger sort of circling,
Speaker 1: a family disconnect of some kind, And lots of times,
Speaker 1: obviously we too many times put our relationship issues at
Speaker 1: the feet of the previous boyfriends or girlfriends, or marriages
Speaker 1: or ex wives, ex husbands, all that we always blame
Speaker 1: something in our rearview mirror. But a lot of times
Speaker 1: I think it precedes those and a lot of times
Speaker 1: I think those relationships didn't work out because of some
Speaker 1: subtle or some complete disconnect with the family or a
Speaker 1: family member particularly apparent. Sometimes the bow simply breaks. I know,
Speaker 1: you guys who listens for a long time, I've talked
Speaker 1: about my own situation, and on the first episode of
Speaker 1: Dead to Me, I dive deeply into my history and
Speaker 1: it was extremely traumatic to talk about, but it was
Speaker 1: also a little therapeutic. And the response I have got
Speaker 1: for doing so it really was overwhelming. And why I
Speaker 1: wanted to sort of cross the over into this podcast
Speaker 1: because there's so much crossover in the emotions and the
Speaker 1: subject matter and the relationship stuff. So I want to
Speaker 1: explain a little bit more of this and I have
Speaker 1: some studies on it and my theories and opinions on it,
Speaker 1: because what is the great love debate without my theories
Speaker 1: and opinions. But we have to take a quick break
Speaker 1: and we will get into it, all of it right
Speaker 1: after this and we are back. So let's start with
Speaker 1: trust issues, emotional attachment issues, abandonment issues, trauma, abuse, anger,
Speaker 1: on and on and on. And if you think if
Speaker 1: you don't have those towards a mom or dad or both,
Speaker 1: or a sibling, that it won't affect you in your
Speaker 1: your adulthood or a romantic situation, if you do, excuse me,
Speaker 1: don't have if you do have one of these, if
Speaker 1: you have something like unresolved or haven't talked to your
Speaker 1: dad in two years, or something with your mom, you
Speaker 1: don't think that will carry into every aspect romantically in
Speaker 1: your life. Of course it will, but it's weird to
Speaker 1: bring your family into your psyche or into the bedroom,
Speaker 1: so we often draw a line or we put up
Speaker 1: a wall between the two, like one doesn't have anything
Speaker 1: to do with the other. And like I said before,
Speaker 1: you are more likely to blame your college boyfriend for
Speaker 1: your dating issues in your late thirties than you are
Speaker 1: to look back at a fight or a situation within
Speaker 1: the childhood home or since the childhood home. But if
Speaker 1: you can't trust the loved ones, the ones who first
Speaker 1: taught you, hopefully the concept of love, unconditional love, then
Speaker 1: you can't trust the love at all. So I looked
Speaker 1: into how common this was or is twelve percent, which
Speaker 1: is about one out of eight. Twelve percent of adults
Speaker 1: have had or currently have an estrangement situation with one
Speaker 1: or more parents. By estrangement, they define it. The experts
Speaker 1: on this thing, and I'm not sure there are any
Speaker 1: experts on this thing, because it's not really dove into
Speaker 1: that much because people don't want to talk about it.
Speaker 1: They define estrangement as breaking off, a breakoff lasting at
Speaker 1: least six months, possibly as long as to death forever.
Speaker 1: I suppose. Surprisingly, sibling estrangement is less common. The rate
Speaker 1: is about half of that new figure. Sibling rivalry would
Speaker 1: carry on through adulthood. It would manifest itself in all
Speaker 1: sorts of destructive ways jealousy, resentment, anger, guilt, whatever, into
Speaker 1: your thirties, forties, fifties, whatever. But it really tends to
Speaker 1: not statistically, and it also when it does happen, it
Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily affect relationships. When it does, you are sort
Speaker 1: of wired as a baby to trust the unit me, mom, dad,
Speaker 1: Siblings are kind to decide like this is it the
Speaker 1: three of us, this core family. So it usually gets
Speaker 1: back to the parents or the breakdown within the parents structure.
Speaker 1: And if parents get divorced, which they do lots, and
Speaker 1: then one parent ends up basically out of the loop
Speaker 1: for whatever reason, legal or logistical or custodial, or just
Speaker 1: complete indifference, which is the big one. I could see
Speaker 1: how that breaks down trust Where is dad? Why isn't
Speaker 1: there a dad? And it leads to abandonment and attachment
Speaker 1: issues and God forfeit its flip side, it's usually the dad.
Speaker 1: But when a mom leaves my God, does that affected
Speaker 1: things down the road. So I'm not getting into this
Speaker 1: today or on that podcast or you know, or this
Speaker 1: one to play psychologists, but it is something that we
Speaker 1: don't think about or talk about. Sigmund Freud, of all people,
Speaker 1: he certainly dealt with parental attachment issues weird ones, but
Speaker 1: only four times in all of his volumes and volumes
Speaker 1: of writing and philosophy does he even touch on estrangement.
Speaker 1: I've touched on it more, probably on the history of
Speaker 1: this podcast than Freud. So, you know, good for us
Speaker 1: and hopefully good for you guys, because it's rarely thought about,
Speaker 1: it's rarely talked about. It's definitely not you don't, don't
Speaker 1: dive into it, and it's almost always swept under the rug.
Speaker 1: But it really is, and you know, it could be
Speaker 1: the source of so many of our issues, even breakdowns
Speaker 1: within healthy relationships. After a while, they tend to follow
Speaker 1: the patterns of family behavior and the other way. I
Speaker 1: think this matters definitely to me and probably too many
Speaker 1: of you. Is the shame around it and bringing shame
Speaker 1: into dating for whatever it is. Oh my god, you
Speaker 1: don't think that's going to kill a relationship or at
Speaker 1: least stunt it. So many people look into date are
Speaker 1: looking for someone who quote unquote has a healthy, loving
Speaker 1: family relationship. I remember, but years ago we had Ben
Speaker 1: Higgins the Bachelor winner. Are they the winner if they're
Speaker 1: the star? I don't know the guy. He was the
Speaker 1: Bachelor on one of the seasons, and he's done our
Speaker 1: live show in a couple of cities. I know he
Speaker 1: did a Denver, I did it. I know he did
Speaker 1: in La I think he did in New York. He's
Speaker 1: I love Benny's great, but he is adamant that a
Speaker 1: potential partner must have a close relationship with their family,
Speaker 1: and he would bring that up on stage. You'd be
Speaker 1: like this, this is so important, and I'm like why obviously,
Speaker 1: because I'm like, oh my god, that shouldn't be such
Speaker 1: a deal breaker. But lots of people feel that way.
Speaker 1: And when he says it on our stage in front
Speaker 1: of hundreds of people, a lot of the people are like, yes,
Speaker 1: Ben's right, and I just want to crawl under a table.
Speaker 1: But it's not just you know, freaky weirdos like me
Speaker 1: who don't have that close relationship. And when somebody mentions
Speaker 1: it like that out loud, those of us who don't
Speaker 1: have it, we are deeply embarrassed. And so it eliminates
Speaker 1: a whole pool of possible love interest who are turned
Speaker 1: off by that. So even at holiday time, it really
Speaker 1: throws the balance off when you're dating someone and you
Speaker 1: always go to their families and not your own, or
Speaker 1: you get married and one side of the church is
Speaker 1: filled with all the aunts and uncles and cousins and
Speaker 1: the other is just a scattering of college friends, and yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean the reason for that could be, like you
Speaker 1: just don't have a big family, you know, this big
Speaker 1: Italian family. But when it's not that, and it's simply
Speaker 1: a lack of closeness or a breakdown, at best, it's
Speaker 1: embarrassing and at worst it's defining. This is how they
Speaker 1: are defined. They do not talk to their mother, they
Speaker 1: do not talk to their family. They are the black sheep.
Speaker 1: And if you get like you know, over forty, like me,
Speaker 1: and you've never been married and you don't have a
Speaker 1: close relationship with your family, you don't think that's an
Speaker 1: issue for people who might want to date us, no doubt,
Speaker 1: no doubt, and it probably should be. But when do
Speaker 1: you even bring that up or how do you even
Speaker 1: dodge it when it is brought up? Because it could
Speaker 1: be brought up date one, you know, somebody's cutting into
Speaker 1: their salmon on the date and they're going to ask
Speaker 1: right away, so where does your family live? Do you
Speaker 1: see them often? And then that angst and that that
Speaker 1: shame and that you know, nervousness sets in and you
Speaker 1: don't want to go there, and then you seem evasive
Speaker 1: and sketchy, and it all starts to unravel. That is
Speaker 1: why that matters in this love dating relationship space. So anyway,
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to run from the subject. I'm just
Speaker 1: trying to say why it's important to me, why it
Speaker 1: matters in the universe of this podcast, and why I
Speaker 1: think it's relevant to explore it for so many of you.
Speaker 1: Because I've heard from so many of you about this.
Speaker 1: That's why I want to explore it every once in
Speaker 1: a while on this podcast, all the time on that podcast.
Speaker 1: So check that podcast out. As I said before, it's
Speaker 1: called Dead to Me. It is an estrangement podcast. If
Speaker 1: you have something to say on that, you can email
Speaker 1: Dead to Me show show at gmail dot com. And
Speaker 1: if you have some thoughts for this show, you can
Speaker 1: get touch with us as always a great love debate
Speaker 1: at gmail dot com. This isn't the longest episode I've
Speaker 1: ever done, but it's important to I know a lot
Speaker 1: of you. It's definitely important to me, and I hate
Speaker 1: that this is this. You know, I'm kind of defined
Speaker 1: as that now because people have been listening to that podcast,
Speaker 1: and every person I talk to who I know listen
Speaker 1: to podcasts, they do look at me differently, and some
Speaker 1: want to give me a hug, and that's not necessarily
Speaker 1: a good thing either, because I feel some pity and
Speaker 1: some are like that explains everything. That's why you're so
Speaker 1: fucked up and you don't want to be that anyway,
Speaker 1: as you me an. Email to either one of those shows,
Speaker 1: go to Great Lovedebate dot com. Our final I think yeah,
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna stand. I don't be wishy washy Howie. Final.
Speaker 1: Great Love Debate Live show December third, talk about not
Speaker 1: being evergreen. This is the show December twentieth, December third,
Speaker 1: twenty twenty four at the Boca black Box Center for
Speaker 1: the Arts in Lovely Boca Routon in Florida. Take us
Speaker 1: around sale for that at Great Lovedebate dot com or
Speaker 1: at Boca Blackbox dot com. H tenth year of this podcast,
Speaker 1: and we still appreciate your reviews. They mean a lot
Speaker 1: to us in the podcasting ecosystem for this show and
Speaker 1: dead to me. So give us a review click five stars.
Speaker 1: They still matter because, as always at the Great Love Debate,
Speaker 1: we never stopped making love. See you next time, the
Speaker 1: Great Love Debate. It's the Great Love Debate, the Great
Speaker 1: Love Debate. It's a Great Love Debate.