Speaker 1: Hey ask got clouds to day, isolated light, isolated showers
Speaker 1: seventy six for the hind, little fog overnight along with
Speaker 1: clouds in a little sixty free. It's gonna be cloudy
Speaker 1: again tomorrow, isolated afternoon showers and storms seventy eight pills
Speaker 1: to move out Tuesday night it'll go down to fifty
Speaker 1: two and then leaving us a sunny Wednesday with the
Speaker 1: highest seventy three sixty nine.
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Speaker 3: five KRC the talk station.
Speaker 1: Hey thirty nine, Happy Monday too, you try to make
Speaker 1: it happy anyway. Prayers to the folks that struggle for
Speaker 1: the hurricane damage Geese all the way up to North Carolina.
Speaker 1: The devastation that I've seen and all the videos floating
Speaker 1: around on the Internet and the oh towns wiped out.
Speaker 1: A lot of folks need help. And I always suggest
Speaker 1: Matthew twenty five ministries. That's where your dollar results in,
Speaker 1: basically a dollar in the hands of those who have
Speaker 1: been impacted without further ado. I'm pleased to welcome back
Speaker 1: to the fifty five KOSE Morning show, JT. Towns and
Speaker 1: he's a freelance writer, armchair detective, self described lifelong resident Cincinnati.
Speaker 1: Author of the two thousand and nine regional bestseller Queen
Speaker 1: City Gothic. He was on the program to talk about
Speaker 1: that as well as twenty fourteenth Queen City Notorious. His
Speaker 1: work appear in the Cincinnai Enquirer. Since a magazine, World Magazine,
Speaker 1: Crime Traveler and Clues, he has presented over three hundred
Speaker 1: programs here in the Greater Cincinnati area. Is part of
Speaker 1: his true crime lecture series, including Jack The Ripper, Lizzie Borden,
Speaker 1: and the Lindenburg Kidnapping. Also teaches his Cincinnati True Crime
Speaker 1: Detective class for the University of Cincinnati Communiversity Division. Welcome back, JT. Towns,
Speaker 1: and you're going to be doing an empower use summon
Speaker 1: are this Thursday beginning at seven pm on the assassination.
Speaker 2: Of Abraham Lincoln? Could you have it back on the.
Speaker 4: Show, Brian, Always a pleasure to be on with you. Yes,
Speaker 4: I will be doing the Lincoln assassination Thursday at seven o'clock.
Speaker 2: All right.
Speaker 1: I know he was killed by John Wilkes booth Ford Theater.
Speaker 1: We all know the jokes that have come out over
Speaker 1: the here other than the play. You know, how was
Speaker 1: the play? But I've I never looked into this. It
Speaker 1: isn't I mean, I've never viewed it, the same as
Speaker 1: the Kennedy assassination. We help all these conspiracy theorists. I
Speaker 1: just figured this is some disgruntled, like terrorist fanatic who
Speaker 1: is angry that the slavery was over in the North
Speaker 1: one of the Civil War.
Speaker 2: But it's more than that. I understand.
Speaker 4: It's not a bad it's not a bad description of it.
Speaker 2: Brian.
Speaker 4: A lot of similarities to the Kennedy assassination. But the
Speaker 4: characters in the Lincoln assassination are fascinating. You've got John Wilkes.
Speaker 4: Booth stands alone among presidential assassins or attempt or. He
Speaker 4: was not some pathetic loser like Lee Harvey Oswald and
Speaker 4: all the rest of them. This guy was an alpha male,
Speaker 4: a list actor.
Speaker 2: Well a lot of questions.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the most handsome man in America. He was called
Speaker 4: really yes. And here is a case where we actually
Speaker 4: had a conspiracy. Booth not unlike Lee Harvey Oswald was
Speaker 4: killed before he could go to trial, but eight people
Speaker 4: were convicted in the trial of the century. It was
Speaker 4: a military tribunal. Four of those people were executed, including
Speaker 4: Mary Surrat, the first woman ever executed by the federal government,
Speaker 4: and four of them have served long prison terms. So
Speaker 4: we had an actual conspiracy here, just not a very
Speaker 4: good one.
Speaker 1: Now, have you reviewed the evidence that led to their convictions,
Speaker 1: because you know, in the aftermath is something as profound
Speaker 1: as the assassination of a president, you know, looking to
Speaker 1: find those guilty and quick to bring around judgment to
Speaker 1: satisfy people because they want justice served. Was the evidence
Speaker 1: solid against those that were convicted and executed.
Speaker 4: That is an excellent question, Brian. They arrested two hundred people,
Speaker 4: but they only tried eight, and three of these people
Speaker 4: weren't even involved in the assassination. It was more like
Speaker 4: a kidnapped plot that never came about. People have debated
Speaker 4: for centuries. Now was Mary Sarad guilty of helping Booth?
Speaker 4: And doctor Samuel Mudd from your name is mud Fame?
Speaker 4: You know, did he actually help Booth? So there's a
Speaker 4: lot of controversy about just how guilty these people were.
Speaker 4: I suspect in a civil trial, not a military tribunal,
Speaker 4: some of these people would have been acquitted, and I
Speaker 4: don't believe it would have had any executions.
Speaker 1: Kind of figured that was what you were going to
Speaker 1: tell me. You know, it's the lawyer in my head
Speaker 1: with sort of a wheel spinning there, j T. What
Speaker 1: was the I guess the motivation just simply revenge or
Speaker 1: was there something they were hoping to accomplish, you know,
Speaker 1: like people claimed January sixth was going to overthrow the government.
Speaker 1: I might disagree with him on that, but that's what
Speaker 1: the suggestion is that these folks think that they were
Speaker 1: going to bring about something more than just getting revenge
Speaker 1: on the man who was ultimately responsible.
Speaker 4: Right, well, the Civil War had just ended. It's good Friday.
Speaker 4: The whole of Washington, d c. And the North is celebrating.
Speaker 4: It just drove Booth crazy. You know. He was a
Speaker 4: ham actor. Wasn't really a very good actor, but he
Speaker 4: was really good and he you know, jumping around and
Speaker 4: sword fighting kind of way, that kind of actor. And
Speaker 4: I think he just, you know, he was so eaten
Speaker 4: up by the fact that he himself did not fight
Speaker 4: for the South, even though he believed in their cause.
Speaker 4: And he got an opportunity. He was picking up his
Speaker 4: mail at Ford Theater on that Friday, and the clerk
Speaker 4: let slip to him at Lincoln and his wife were
Speaker 4: going to be there that night, and the whole thing
Speaker 4: came together that day. Really not a lot of advance
Speaker 4: planning at all. And I think he thought that the
Speaker 4: South would welcome him with open arms if he kills Lincoln.
Speaker 4: And it was nothing that was nothing like what happened.
Speaker 4: The South was appalled that he did this, really, And yes,
Speaker 4: and unlike the Kennedy assassination, though tragic, we got Lyndon
Speaker 4: Johnson and the same policies went on. Lincoln's murder changed
Speaker 4: the course of post Civil War history through the reconstruction.
Speaker 4: Instead of getting Lincoln's kind and gentle with malice toward
Speaker 4: non charity for all, we've got Andrew Johnson's draconian measures
Speaker 4: against the South. And I think some of those problems
Speaker 4: are still reverberating today. In fact, you know, people think
Speaker 4: our political situation, you know, are our discourse were more
Speaker 4: divided than ever before. Those people really haven't looked at
Speaker 4: the history of this crime. We just came out of
Speaker 4: a civil war over the most divisive issue in history, slavery,
Speaker 4: and nothing going on today can compare to what was
Speaker 4: going on in eighteen sixty five.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I try to take comfort in that in these
Speaker 1: crazy interesting times we live in, ours we find ourselves
Speaker 1: living in because you know, like looking back at the
Speaker 1: Vietnam era protests, the bombings, the terrorist organizations both domestic
Speaker 1: and worldwide, I mean, it was a precarious, precarious time.
Speaker 1: Then this also an unbelievably divided time for our country,
Speaker 1: and yet we managed to persevere.
Speaker 4: Oh, the scope of this, I mean, it was so
Speaker 4: long ago. I don't know if you can compare it
Speaker 4: to really what's going on today in terms of the
Speaker 4: in terms of the ramifications, in terms of it being
Speaker 4: the first great news story in history. And then you
Speaker 4: have the execution of the Lincoln conspirators, which was photographed
Speaker 4: with ten different photos. It was the first major news,
Speaker 4: first news event ever to be recorded in sequential photographs.
Speaker 4: And yeah, we executed a woman. Yeah that led to
Speaker 4: Andrew Johnson's impeachment.
Speaker 2: Oh really, Oh yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well I've learned a lot of this morning and
Speaker 1: just scratching the surface what you're gonna be talking about.
Speaker 1: It's Thursday night. You begin at seven pm and got
Speaker 1: an hour and a half worth of this breakdown from JT.
Speaker 1: Who's remarkable and how he explains things. Are you gonna
Speaker 1: do any Q and A? I know this is we
Speaker 1: can tune in from the comfort of our own home
Speaker 1: by just simply registering the Poweroamerica dot org, or we
Speaker 1: can show up in person at two twenty five North
Speaker 1: and Boulevard at the empower You studios.
Speaker 4: Exactly. Oh definitely we'll do a Q and A. I
Speaker 4: think that talks about an hour, certainly hoping they get
Speaker 4: some discussion and the conspiracy theorists will will probably be there, Brian.
Speaker 4: You should see when I do the JFKs assination.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, imagine that.
Speaker 4: I'm doing that Wednesday night at the del Hie Township
Speaker 4: Library and it gets very contentious.
Speaker 2: Oh no, kidding, Township library. What time on Wednesday?
Speaker 4: That's seven pm at the Dell High Township Library. Oh yeah,
Speaker 4: my JFK talks. I'm a former conspiracy guy, and I'm
Speaker 4: a booth did it alone guy, And when you look
Speaker 4: at the evidence, you know it pretty much was a
Speaker 4: was a crazed loaner situation. There was no conspiracy in
Speaker 4: my opinion. But boy, I appear to be in the
Speaker 4: minority of that opinion.
Speaker 1: Well would you cast yourself in the minority or majority
Speaker 1: when it comes to the Kennedy assassination?
Speaker 4: Oh, seventy percent of the people never accepted the warrant commission.
Speaker 4: I used to be one of those conspiracy guys. And
Speaker 4: then you start looking at the evidence, and it was
Speaker 4: Lee Harvey Oswald all by himself. If this was just
Speaker 4: an ordinary homicide, he would have been quickly convicted. But the
Speaker 4: fact that you throw JFK in and imbuse it with
Speaker 4: all these lofty conspiracy things. But it was a pretty
Speaker 4: simple crime really.
Speaker 1: Well, Ruby didn't help anything by killing kille Harpy because
Speaker 1: that just added fuel to the conspiracy fire he did.
Speaker 4: And in Lincoln we had the sergeant Boston Corbett, a
Speaker 4: I'll say this, a self castrated religious eunuch who shot
Speaker 4: Booth when they were trying to arrest him in that barn.
Speaker 4: So we've had Ruby and Boston Corbett, two just crazy
Speaker 4: avengers who killed the assassin and spawned a thousand conspiracy theories.
Speaker 1: He's self castrated. Okay, that speaks volumes. There's a DSM
Speaker 1: five diagnosis in that one.
Speaker 2: JT. Indeed, indeed, Well, it's great hearing from you today.
Speaker 2: Thanks for spending time, Ryan.
Speaker 4: If I could get in a shameless plug, I think
Speaker 4: a lot of your please, a lot of your listeners
Speaker 4: know I'm constant working the brick and Murders of nineteen
Speaker 4: sixty six. My third book, Summer's Almost Gone, is now
Speaker 4: and it's fourth printing, And if you haven't read this book,
Speaker 4: you should. And on my website www dot JT. Townshend
Speaker 4: dot com. If you order this book and put WKRC
Speaker 4: in the coupon code ten dollars off, be.
Speaker 1: Care seeing the coupon code at JT. Townsend, t ow
Speaker 1: n S e n D dot com get yourself that
Speaker 1: along with the other stuff. I mean, you wrote fabulous books.
Speaker 1: I enjoyed talking about the Queen City Gothic as well
Speaker 1: as a Queen City Notorious. I recommend my listeners get
Speaker 1: those as well well.
Speaker 4: I'd love to see your audience get this book. I
Speaker 4: am working diligently to try to get the DNA retested
Speaker 4: in Cincinnati's most notorious cold case, and I'm I'm still
Speaker 4: working on it. You know, DNA is so advanced now
Speaker 4: you can you can solve cold cases long after all
Speaker 4: the sudden dead.
Speaker 1: It's truly amazing. And anytime you get updated on that.
Speaker 1: When you got a spot here in the morning show, JT,
Speaker 1: trust you on.
Speaker 4: I'm going to take you up on that this fall
Speaker 4: at some point.
Speaker 1: Perfect I enjoy I listened to fascinating conversations. I appreciate
Speaker 1: what you're doing, and I wish you the best on
Speaker 1: getting that DNA evidence.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 4: I would love to talk about the breakercase with you
Speaker 4: at some point on the air.
Speaker 1: Joe Streckers made a note of it, so we will
Speaker 1: definitely do that.
Speaker 2: JT.
Speaker 1: Townsend, It's Thursday night, empower Youoamerica dot org or two
Speaker 1: twenty five North and Boulevard. Make sure you register ahead
Speaker 1: of time. Either way, you slice it great having you
Speaker 1: on JT and enjoy the conversation on Thursday.
Speaker 4: Great thanks Brian.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 1: Eight fifty one fifty five KRCD talk station, be right
Speaker 1: back fifty five krc