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Speaker 1: Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and is

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not intended for all audiences. Listener discretion is advised.

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Speaker 2: I found my daughter and my wife. Somebody killed them

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in the apartment. They have been murdered.

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Speaker 1: It's a little before six pm on a Saturday in Englewood, Colorado.

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It's sunny but still frigid. It's the end of March

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twenty twenty three, and two local Englewood, Colorado police deputies

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are sitting in their cruiser. They're just talking and looking

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over some paperwork. Really. Officer Alouise has been with the

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force for a few years now. Today he's got a

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trainee with him. Englewood is in the heart of the

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Denver metropolitan area. There are over thirty thousand residents and

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a typical crime rate which consists of basically two things,

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robberies and drug related incidents. Maybe a few traffic violations

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sprinkled in there as well. Neither Officer Aloise nor his

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trainee are expecting any crazy calls today, let alone a

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double homicide and a luxury apartment complex.

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Speaker 3: Nineteerho one englel Parkway is going to be a unit

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and in the Nancy three eight right.

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Speaker 1: He's got the cord to his radio wrapped around his finger,

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fidgeting with it as he listens to dispatch Go ahead.

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Speaker 3: RV states his wife and daughter are deceased. He thinks

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they might have been hurtin to it. The wife is

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seventy years old and the daughter is thirty four. RV

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THINGSOS suspect and we're still getting further.

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Speaker 1: They'll be heading to a complex called art Walk at

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City Center. Sounds fancy. There are one and two bedroom

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apartments that go upwards of two thousand dollars a month.

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It's usually pretty quiet over there.

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Speaker 4: I think it's gonna be on the north.

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Speaker 2: Then get a hold off is Kara.

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Speaker 5: Hey, it's Chually from Inglewood. We're not sure what we have,

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but we need you to stage for right now. We

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might have two people that were killed inside of an

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apartment nine o one Inglewood Parkway. So this is like

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a homicide and it's like, yeah, well, I don't know.

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He thinks it's his nephew. He thinks they're both dead,

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seventy and thirty four. I have a ton of officers

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going as I'm sure.

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Speaker 1: You know this is the nine to one one call

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that had come in just moments before.

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Speaker 2: Nine one one.

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Speaker 6: Where's your emergency?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, ma'am, this is Reggie McLaren. I'm calling from

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art Walk apartment. The apartment and Crew eight. I came

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around three o'clock and I phoned my wife and my

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daughter murdered. I'm sorry why I found my daughter and

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my wife. Somebody killed them in the apartment. They have

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been murdered.

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Speaker 7: Okay.

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Speaker 6: How do you know that they're dead?

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Speaker 2: Well, I am here. They are dead, you know, because

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the guy who ever entered, he was trying to take

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them in a trash can or take away, but he

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couldn't do it. So I just your.

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Speaker 6: Wife and daughter still inside the apartment.

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Speaker 2: Inside the apartment, okay.

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Speaker 6: How old are they?

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Speaker 2: Wife is seventeen years old.

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Speaker 6: Okay, and your daughter daughter.

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Speaker 2: Is about thirty four years old. And what is your name, Reginald?

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Speaker 6: That's your name.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's my name, Reginald McLaren.

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Speaker 6: Okay, And are you in the hallway.

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Speaker 2: No, I'm going in the holidacause I want to put

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on my jacket. It's very cool.

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Speaker 6: Okay. My officers are there though, and they need you

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to not be in the apartment.

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Speaker 8: Okay.

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Speaker 1: Well, at the same time, officer Alouise and his trainee

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were running up the stairs to unit and three oh eight.

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Speaker 9: Hey, Honnie, I think it's inside.

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Speaker 1: Which where do you go?

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Speaker 4: Do you go that way? Look out?

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Speaker 2: Well?

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Speaker 4: What are we going to?

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Speaker 1: When they finally get to that unit, the hallway is

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absolutely silent. There isn't a person in sight. They cautiously

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approached the apartment door, hoping they won't have to break

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it down.

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Speaker 10: To confirm me as an Ancyright, please.

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Speaker 9: Tomorrow, it's your hands.

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Speaker 4: Step outside, step outside.

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Speaker 1: They're bracing themselves for a potential showdown with whoever murdered

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this man's family, but instead it's the caller himself who

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answers the door. He's still on the phone with dispatch.

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Speaker 6: So let me know when you stepped out into the hallway,

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because my officers are going to meet you in the hallway. Welky,

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how long ago did you find them? What time did

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you come home and find them?

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know, Okay, I don't know.

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I have no idea.

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Speaker 6: And you're in Nancy.

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Speaker 11: You go.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The man who emerges is frail and hunched over, clutching

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his jacket. Reginald McLaren is eighty one years old, and

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the stress of this situation is making him look even older.

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He's a normal old man, except for the distant look

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in his eyes and a name that doesn't match his accent.

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He doesn't seem injured, just stunned. Officers help him out

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of the apartment and plan to take him back to

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the station to ask a few more questions.

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Speaker 12: Yeah, who's the on call of the technics? Sergeant and

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on call staff? You pick a bad time to be

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on call, supervisor. It looks like a double homicide.

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Speaker 1: The new trainee stands guard at the front door while

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Reginald gets a pat down in the hallway. Meanwhile, the

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handful of officers inside are getting a taste of what

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they'll be dealing with right away. They know it'll be

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more than their little police department can handle.

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Speaker 4: Fuck Carver's cancer.

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Speaker 13: Fine, yeah, Jesus, Jesus, Chris, there's a closet.

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Speaker 10: Tell us it's like at this one confirm too? There's two?

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Speaker 4: Do you want me to stay inside with?

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Speaker 10: Inside?

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Speaker 1: The apartment isn't chaotic? It looks like they're in mid move.

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Boxes are stacked neatly in corners, some are sealed, others

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are half packed with clothes. And books still visible inside

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long on their sides. In the living room are two

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oversized black roller trash cans. The lids are open. With

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his gun and flashlight drawn, one of the officers carefully

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steps over to one of the bins and leans down

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so he can see inside. Immediately you can see clothing, skin, limbs,

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and blood. Both of the victims are women. They've been

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stuffed inside head first. Their arms and legs are bent unnaturally.

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One of the women's legs hangs partially outside its plastic vessel.

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There's a towel covering part of the first victim's body.

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Blood is pooled beneath her. The second woman is positioned

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mostly face down. Neither is moving. The officers don't touch

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the bodies. They don't try CPR. It's already too late.

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Speaker 12: Double homicide UH nine oh one in wood Parkway and

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is in Nora three zero eight in the apartment number.

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Sounds like husband came home, finds his wife and daughter deceased.

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They both have been shoved into a trash can a piece,

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so it looks like by all appearances, it looked like

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whoever did this was trying to put the bodies in

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a trash can and take them whoever. Husband seems to

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think he knows who did it. We're trying to talk

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with him. He's pretty shook up, obviously, but you might

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want to call the troops. Anouncer surveillance in a building number.

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Speaker 1: They don't.

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Speaker 10: They just definitely coming blood.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I saw that.

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Speaker 10: Yeah, I saw that.

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Speaker 12: And if you look underneath the those bed sheets and

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pillows covered in blood, and they probably not think they

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were hiding something as well.

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Speaker 10: Just for our safety, I asked where the suspects could

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live here as to where I said they might aid

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seventy as Jefferson on the station. That's a little part it. Okay,

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they're all game bangers, according to him.

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Speaker 1: Blood spatters fleck the walls, A pillow soaked in blood

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lays on the floor near the couch. In a utility

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closet behind the love seat, they find a knaxe and

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what looks like strains of black hair caught in the blade.

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A handsaw rests nearby. The kitchen sink has hair and

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blood in the basin. The rest of the unit looks

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oddly clean. Just before a deputy is about to drive

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Reginald to the police station to get a formal statement,

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he complains of chest pain. He explains that he has

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a history of heart attacks and has recently had open

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heart surgery. He's eighty one years old. After all, finding

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your wife and daughter brutally murdered is asking for another incident. Luckily,

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paramedics are just arriving. Out of caution, officers have him

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transported to Swedish Medical Center for evaluation. An officer is

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assigned to sit outside his room. If Reginald is right,

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if this really is about his gang banging nephews, then

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he might not be safe even in a hospital. On

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March fifth, twenty twenty three, year old Reginald McLaren called

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nine one one after discovering his wife and daughter murdered

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inside their Englewood, Colorado apartment. The police department and emergency

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dispatch were wholly unprepared to deal with this situation. Dispatch

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scrambled trying to figure out how to get in contact

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with the State crime scene Unit. Officer Aloise's Traynee frantically

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scribbled names into the crime scene log as personnel swept

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in and out of the apartment. A lot of these

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responders were newbies, doing their absolute best. The crime scene

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was now sealed. The victims had been officially pronounced dead.

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Reginald was under observation at Swedish Medical Center, and if

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Reginald's nephews were involved, then time was already working against them.

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As the investigation unfolded, neighbors started noticing it was dinner

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time for most people, and this group of cops who

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were jingling their keys and talking to the hall was

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starting to draw a little bit of attention.

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Speaker 4: So the notes saying that wife and daughter, who's the

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guy who's king out of here?

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Speaker 14: That's the wife or the husband and dad and said

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you think she knows who it is? Something about a hammer,

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So I gotta going back.

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Speaker 4: To the station.

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Speaker 12: We probably need to do at least a quick miranda

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on him and just talk to him and see what

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information we can give. If this suspects out, you know

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what about who's under days in the public, then you

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find that out as quickly as possible.

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Speaker 4: How does he know this?

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Speaker 10: You know, how does he know he knows who did it?

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Speaker 4: That type of thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but.

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Speaker 10: Mirandizing really quick to see it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, can come in.

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Speaker 1: Have you guys.

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Speaker 4: Hurt anything suspicious or anything.

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Speaker 1: With your neighbors saw.

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Speaker 6: Him that's around.

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Speaker 9: Like, so when did I leave.

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Speaker 15: I went to the liquor store around like three or four,

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and he was leaving. He locked his apartment and was

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locking in his car, and then I got in my

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car and then I saw him come back around like

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three o'clock, three or four.

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Speaker 10: Whenever I have texted you, can we get that?

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Speaker 4: Can we get that text?

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Speaker 16: See?

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Speaker 11: What was?

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Speaker 10: Did you guys hear anything? And they're supposed to be

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moving soon.

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Speaker 17: It's told me they're super nice.

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Speaker 4: Okay. Did you know the daughter and the is he

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the husband?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 10: I know there's a daughter, a husband, and what right

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I think?

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Speaker 4: I don't they Have you ever seen any like disturbances?

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Speaker 18: No?

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Speaker 17: I heard talking a lot in the hall, and I've

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heard doors slam, but I thought that they were moving

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and it was just kind.

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Speaker 9: Of okay, yeah, daughter, No, I don't know.

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Speaker 10: I haven't seen them in a while.

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Speaker 4: I only see him.

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Speaker 9: I saw him and daughter. Okay.

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Speaker 15: The last time I saw them, I can tell you

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exactly because the fire alarm went off here and I

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saw them.

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Speaker 4: Leaving and I they were expressing like problems.

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Speaker 16: Nothing.

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Speaker 10: They've always been super nice.

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Speaker 19: I ever thought, never said like watch out for a

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suspicious person.

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Speaker 9: Okay, I saw them on Tuesday.

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Speaker 10: I saw the daughter. Oh yeah, because you said.

244
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Speaker 20: Yeah.

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Speaker 21: They had their door open and they were cooking food

246
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and I started and it smelt really good, and so

247
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I looked in and I saw him.

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Speaker 10: Assuming it's a daughter, she looked younger.

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Speaker 1: Yep, this is what they heard on repeat from all

250
00:14:39,039 --> 00:14:42,519
the neighbors. No one knew the family, well, no one

251
00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,720
even knew their names, but they could always smell delicious

252
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food coming from their open door.

253
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Speaker 4: I see them all the time.

254
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Speaker 10: They've seen fairly friendly. They well, the guy speaks a

255
00:14:53,399 --> 00:14:57,559
woman not so much. See Maybey just kind of come

256
00:14:57,639 --> 00:15:01,039
in and out. I think he works an artid or

257
00:15:01,799 --> 00:15:03,360
i'd go to like like the light rail or something

258
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like that.

259
00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:06,960
Speaker 4: He always on the archide or the light rail stuff. Okay,

260
00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:09,840
and the mom, I don't.

261
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Speaker 10: Really see that much at times. They cook things and

262
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so I kind of think they have to hear out

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their apartment.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's your other neighbor said, like they lea their

265
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door open and you can smell it smell.

266
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Speaker 10: Haven't heard any like issues or plants, or.

267
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Speaker 4: You haven't heard anything non angines allowed or bang that

268
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I'm aware of. Okay, since Wednesday, you haven't seen anybody.

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Speaker 9: No, Yeah, I hope they're okay, but well it.

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Speaker 4: Could be one hundred percent honest with you.

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Speaker 18: Mom and daughter are deceased, and so we're trying to

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figure out what is going on. So that's why I'm

273
00:15:45,279 --> 00:15:50,279
asking you so many Yeah, okay, oh yeah, yeah. I

274
00:15:50,279 --> 00:15:51,879
guess I could have let that before I started asking

275
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when are you coming back? Yeah, So we're trying to

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00:15:54,919 --> 00:15:55,879
figure out what's going on.

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Speaker 1: Police continued canvassing nearby units. One day, who lived just

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00:16:01,039 --> 00:16:04,080
a few doors Dwan from the family, told officers he

279
00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:06,600
remembered running into Reginald in the parking lot.

280
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Speaker 4: I don't even know dude's name, I says, Jim.

281
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Speaker 22: Yeah, he uh sorry. He came over to me the

282
00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:19,879
other day. I was smoking in the garage and he

283
00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:24,000
was like, can you give me a favor? We're moving

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on on Saturday.

285
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Speaker 11: I was like okay.

286
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Speaker 10: He was like, if it's after hours, can I drop

287
00:16:29,519 --> 00:16:31,559
off the keys? See you? And I was like okay,

288
00:16:31,639 --> 00:16:34,440
I told my parking number. Then he saw him walking

289
00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:38,919
around this morning and I did hear all this ship?

290
00:16:39,559 --> 00:16:41,120
Speaker 4: Did you ever make a plan to leave the keys

291
00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:44,159
of you need to put any points? He just said

292
00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:44,759
if he had.

293
00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:45,799
Speaker 10: To drop them off.

294
00:16:46,879 --> 00:16:49,120
Speaker 4: Okay, I can't say he was going overseas.

295
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Speaker 18: I thought he was going to come back.

296
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Speaker 2: And then.

297
00:16:54,919 --> 00:16:58,840
Speaker 4: Did you ever see his wife and daughter? The last

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00:16:58,840 --> 00:16:59,639
time you saw them.

299
00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:05,880
Speaker 14: Yesterday and he never met Did he ever mention anything

300
00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:09,359
about that when he said they were moving overseas.

301
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:14,599
Speaker 22: But I did say I'm going overseas, so I didn't.

302
00:17:14,799 --> 00:17:19,319
Speaker 4: Like I'm as in singular? Yeah, I said, okay.

303
00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:23,480
Speaker 1: The women stuffed inside the trash cans were seventy year

304
00:17:23,519 --> 00:17:27,359
old Bethany McLaren and her thirty five year old daughter, Ruth.

305
00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:31,160
Bethany and Reginald moved to America in the eighties and

306
00:17:31,759 --> 00:17:35,240
really kept to themselves. Back at the hospital, some of

307
00:17:35,319 --> 00:17:38,640
these details were beginning to come up in conversation with

308
00:17:38,759 --> 00:17:43,599
the officer assigned a watch over Reginald's room. Apparently, Reginald

309
00:17:43,799 --> 00:17:47,559
was born in India and his wife, Bethany was from Nepal.

310
00:17:48,519 --> 00:17:52,799
Reginald had a strange son from another marriage, and then

311
00:17:52,839 --> 00:17:54,160
there was his daughter, Ruth.

312
00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:59,839
Speaker 4: I said, back, is her heart feeling okay now?

313
00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:01,000
Speaker 2: A little bit? Yeah?

314
00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:02,680
Speaker 4: Okay?

315
00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:06,279
Speaker 10: And then you just ensured, yeah, well, we'll give you

316
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:10,240
you want a blanket for now? Is that okay? Yeah,

317
00:18:10,359 --> 00:18:10,799
I'll give you this.

318
00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:12,359
Speaker 23: It's kind of a temporation until we can get you

319
00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:16,000
some mother clothes. Okay, but it's better than nothing. Okay.

320
00:18:16,839 --> 00:18:20,079
Speaker 10: So next thing we're gonna do again your.

321
00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:22,960
Speaker 23: Permission to so we get like a hand swab of

322
00:18:23,039 --> 00:18:26,599
the DNA in your hand to show that basically that's

323
00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:28,680
your DNA. So if we find other people DNA and

324
00:18:28,799 --> 00:18:31,880
we know that's not your DNA, you know what I'm saying,

325
00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:36,519
So like I'm touching this right, then you touch it,

326
00:18:37,160 --> 00:18:40,359
then I can compare your DNA to this DNA, so

327
00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:42,400
we won't say, like, who's this?

328
00:18:43,119 --> 00:18:45,039
Speaker 4: So we have yours to show? Is that okay to do?

329
00:18:45,599 --> 00:18:46,240
Speaker 11: Okay, thank you.

330
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,599
Speaker 1: It wasn't just as four prior heart attacks that had

331
00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:54,440
detectives worried. They wanted a full medical evaluation on Reginald

332
00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:57,319
because he told one of the officers that after he

333
00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:00,599
got home after three pm and found Betha and Ruth

334
00:19:00,799 --> 00:19:05,200
in the trash cans, he passed out. It wasn't until

335
00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:07,839
around six pm that he tried to call the apartment

336
00:19:08,039 --> 00:19:12,759
property management's office, and then after that he called nine

337
00:19:12,799 --> 00:19:17,200
one one. Here are the property managers, and you guys.

338
00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:20,880
Speaker 4: Are all hiding back in here. Hi, Hi, I'm.

339
00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:31,000
Speaker 9: Lindsay sure, Oh I do not look great?

340
00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:31,440
Speaker 2: Thank you?

341
00:19:31,559 --> 00:19:32,799
Speaker 4: Okay, how do I look for?

342
00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:40,680
Speaker 1: Remember this is a Saturday night. Everyone, including some of

343
00:19:40,759 --> 00:19:44,400
these cops, had been relaxing at home before all this happened.

344
00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:47,720
Speaker 4: That's my day off. So I'm like, I know, what

345
00:19:47,799 --> 00:19:50,920
are you gonna do? Your short staff? Right? I'm sure

346
00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:52,640
you guys, you guys were playing the same boat.

347
00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:56,720
Speaker 1: Here's the voicemailed Reginald left.

348
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,599
Speaker 10: Of a Sudden that she was left at six or

349
00:20:06,640 --> 00:20:07,160
two pm.

350
00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:10,799
Speaker 1: Okay, now let's swing back over to the hospital.

351
00:20:11,319 --> 00:20:13,839
Speaker 4: It make sure you have no injuries on you, no

352
00:20:14,039 --> 00:20:14,960
arms and your legs.

353
00:20:15,599 --> 00:20:17,640
Speaker 23: Okay, we're gonna take a picture to make sure that

354
00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:19,000
you have no injuries. You're gonna show that you had

355
00:20:19,039 --> 00:20:22,039
no injuries. Okay, can you put your arms up for me.

356
00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:26,759
I'll make sure that you're okay. Injuries if you weren't

357
00:20:26,799 --> 00:20:27,200
hurt at all.

358
00:20:28,559 --> 00:20:31,599
Speaker 10: You weren't hurt at all. No, I wasn't hurt. Okay,

359
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:34,160
make sure I.

360
00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:37,000
Speaker 4: Heard that you you passed out, but you didn't hit

361
00:20:37,039 --> 00:20:37,960
your head or nothing like that.

362
00:20:40,039 --> 00:20:43,680
Speaker 23: Okay, we'll take some pictures lit quick, just to make sure.

363
00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:47,400
Speaker 1: Okay, imagine waking up on the floor three hours after

364
00:20:47,839 --> 00:20:51,720
finding your wife and daughter murdered. You've just come back

365
00:20:51,799 --> 00:20:57,319
to reality. You remember what happened. You're panicked and confused.

366
00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:01,160
Now listen to how Reginald mc claren sounds what he

367
00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:02,880
calls nine one one nine.

368
00:21:03,279 --> 00:21:04,279
Speaker 6: Where's your emergency?

369
00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:08,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, ma'am, this is Greg McLaren. I'm going from

370
00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:14,039
art Walk, the apartment, the apartment and eight. I came

371
00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:17,440
around three o'clock and I phoned my wife and my daughter.

372
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:28,920
Speaker 24: I er my part.

373
00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:30,640
Speaker 25: How do you know.

374
00:21:32,279 --> 00:21:33,000
Speaker 3: My wife.

375
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Speaker 10: Murder?

376
00:21:35,279 --> 00:21:37,759
Speaker 26: So I'm going to call it the English right now,

377
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:41,200
all of a sudden that she was left at six

378
00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:42,079
two hymns.

379
00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,400
Speaker 1: Now that you've heard both the voicemail he left for

380
00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:49,559
the property manager and this nine one one call, don't

381
00:21:49,599 --> 00:21:56,960
they sound you really similar? Almost rehearsed. Here's the rest

382
00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:57,359
of the call?

383
00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,880
Speaker 6: Okay, and how were they injured? Can you tell whence?

384
00:22:02,079 --> 00:22:05,200
Speaker 2: Ma'am? I am very disturbed. I have no idea the.

385
00:22:05,279 --> 00:22:06,000
Speaker 27: Hour is.

386
00:22:08,039 --> 00:22:13,839
Speaker 2: Building. Okay, thank you? Do you know who this weapon?

387
00:22:14,799 --> 00:22:15,000
Speaker 28: Yeah?

388
00:22:15,319 --> 00:22:18,319
Speaker 2: Well, before I before I before I go further, I

389
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,519
want to tell you that our security door in the

390
00:22:22,160 --> 00:22:25,799
gradualor is always open. I mean it's never.

391
00:22:25,759 --> 00:22:29,440
Speaker 6: Lost answer my questions. Okay, I understand this is very

392
00:22:29,559 --> 00:22:32,480
hard and I'm getting lots of help. But how were

393
00:22:32,559 --> 00:22:35,759
they hurt? Were they shot? Where they stabbed?

394
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:43,079
Speaker 2: Can you tell me how they they were saved? Not

395
00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:48,359
to save this? Somebody use a hammer or I don't

396
00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:48,759
know you know?

397
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:51,200
Speaker 6: Where are you? Where are you?

398
00:22:53,039 --> 00:22:54,400
Speaker 2: I am in my apart from them.

399
00:22:54,759 --> 00:22:56,720
Speaker 6: I need you to step out. I don't want you

400
00:22:56,799 --> 00:22:57,400
to be in there.

401
00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:05,160
Speaker 2: Okay, Oh step out? Okay, okay, have you matched anything? Well?

402
00:23:05,319 --> 00:23:09,559
I went into the rooms. Uh, I just looked like

403
00:23:09,799 --> 00:23:13,359
my wife first, my daughter's person. The ideas were gone.

404
00:23:13,759 --> 00:23:15,559
All the things are upset.

405
00:23:15,279 --> 00:23:15,720
Speaker 4: Down, you know.

406
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:22,200
Speaker 2: So okay, so go to the office, to security buildings

407
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:24,559
and they come in here still, Yes.

408
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:26,359
Speaker 6: We have lots of people come in or even have

409
00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:29,599
an ambulance coming. Okay, who did thank you?

410
00:23:30,039 --> 00:23:30,519
Speaker 2: Who did it?

411
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:31,680
Speaker 1: Yeah?

412
00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:36,160
Speaker 2: Well, we had a long enemity with our nephew Regin

413
00:23:38,519 --> 00:23:43,440
Ragina and the another one is Milan Kawas. They are

414
00:23:43,519 --> 00:23:45,119
both my wife's nephews.

415
00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:45,960
Speaker 6: Is he there?

416
00:23:47,319 --> 00:23:51,119
Speaker 2: Oh no, no, he's he ran away from our home

417
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:54,079
and he just goes all over the places. He's in

418
00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:56,319
gangs and here and there, And I just want to

419
00:23:56,359 --> 00:23:56,720
make sure.

420
00:23:56,799 --> 00:23:59,880
Speaker 6: So your wife and daughter are currently inside the apartment

421
00:24:00,079 --> 00:24:00,759
in which room?

422
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:08,000
Speaker 2: Oh, muster bedroom. They're in the bedroom, muster bedroom.

423
00:24:08,759 --> 00:24:11,400
Speaker 6: Okay, do you have any weapons me?

424
00:24:11,839 --> 00:24:11,880
Speaker 27: No?

425
00:24:12,599 --> 00:24:12,920
Speaker 8: Okay.

426
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 6: The wife and daughter are both in the master bedroom.

427
00:24:17,319 --> 00:24:19,599
Speaker 2: No, they are not in the messy bedroom. They were speaking.

428
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:22,759
I don't know what to explain, but they are in

429
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:23,960
the living room right now.

430
00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:25,559
Speaker 6: Okay, in the living room.

431
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:26,359
Speaker 5: Okay, thank you?

432
00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:28,759
Speaker 1: Am I the only one disturbed by the way she

433
00:24:28,839 --> 00:24:33,119
says okay, thank you, Like it's just a routine checklist

434
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:37,880
she's going through, like she's asking for the ingredients to

435
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,279
make a batch of cookies. Maybe it's just me.

436
00:24:41,759 --> 00:24:42,960
Speaker 6: And are you in the hallway?

437
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:46,119
Speaker 2: No, I'm going in the hallway because I want to

438
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:48,240
put on my jacket. It's very cold there.

439
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:49,480
Speaker 5: Okay.

440
00:24:50,079 --> 00:24:52,200
Speaker 6: My officers are there, though, and they need you to

441
00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:56,000
not be in the apartment. Okay, okay, So let me

442
00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:58,200
know when you stepped out into the hallway, because my

443
00:24:58,279 --> 00:24:59,839
officers are going to meet you in the hallway.

444
00:25:00,799 --> 00:25:02,960
Speaker 2: Well, okay, okay.

445
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:05,519
Speaker 6: And when did how long ago did you find them?

446
00:25:05,640 --> 00:25:07,279
What time did you come home and find them?

447
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:11,759
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know. I have no idea.

448
00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 6: And you're in Nancy.

449
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 1: You go, yeah, did you catch any inconsistencies? I think

450
00:25:22,559 --> 00:25:25,680
Owood police were starting to rethink the idea that the

451
00:25:25,839 --> 00:25:29,599
suspects were on the loose somewhere. Now, let's rewind just

452
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:35,039
a little bit. Remember this neighbor. She had mentioned earlier

453
00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:38,720
that she had seen Reginald that day, around the same

454
00:25:38,839 --> 00:25:41,960
time that he said he had discovered his wife and

455
00:25:42,079 --> 00:25:42,960
daughter's bodies.

456
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:45,640
Speaker 15: I went to the liquor store around like three or four,

457
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:48,759
and he was leaving. He locked his apartment and was

458
00:25:48,839 --> 00:25:51,440
locking in his car, and then I got in my

459
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:52,680
car and then I saw him come back.

460
00:25:53,039 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 10: She tested me at three.

461
00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:56,759
Speaker 4: That's where she left.

462
00:25:57,119 --> 00:25:59,359
Speaker 9: Yeah, So I was like, you want to come over? Yeah,

463
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:01,279
And I was at the liquor store when you texted

464
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:02,119
me back, and.

465
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:03,759
Speaker 4: As you were leaving.

466
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,880
Speaker 9: Yeah, Well, he went to his car, Okay, I know.

467
00:26:08,079 --> 00:26:08,440
Speaker 11: I saw.

468
00:26:08,599 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 12: I was like hi.

469
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:12,119
Speaker 9: He didn't say anything.

470
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:16,319
Speaker 4: He just kind of an He said hi, and then

471
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:16,920
kept walking.

472
00:26:17,039 --> 00:26:18,599
Speaker 9: Normally he'll like stop and chat with me.

473
00:26:18,759 --> 00:26:19,039
Speaker 3: Okay.

474
00:26:19,599 --> 00:26:22,039
Speaker 4: So he locked his door and then he.

475
00:26:24,079 --> 00:26:24,359
Speaker 10: Came.

476
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 15: Yeah, and then he went to the parking lot and

477
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:29,240
while I while I was going in the parking lot,

478
00:26:29,279 --> 00:26:31,519
he walked and asked me and didn't say anything, and

479
00:26:31,559 --> 00:26:33,680
then he came back, which I thought was kind of

480
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:35,519
weird because then I was like, oh, he's probably leaving.

481
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:37,680
Speaker 9: That's why I saw you guys out there.

482
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:40,119
Speaker 12: I was like, I need to go talk to you.

483
00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:41,319
Speaker 10: Yeah.

484
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 1: Absolutely, So right after this officer leaves the woman's apartment,

485
00:26:45,799 --> 00:26:50,240
he tells his colleagues they'll be changing course.

486
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:53,279
Speaker 28: Thank you.

487
00:26:57,319 --> 00:26:59,359
Speaker 10: You need to find it, are you good? You need

488
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:00,759
to find a car. We need to find a car.

489
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:06,079
Speaker 19: Why Around three fifty five today she was going on

490
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:09,440
the store. She saw him walk to the car. He

491
00:27:09,759 --> 00:27:13,359
locked the door, locked the car. Doesn't know what she

492
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:15,119
did in the car, but he came back the car.

493
00:27:15,559 --> 00:27:18,079
It's a white sand possibly on the same floor that

494
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:20,079
we're at. They have a gomacfart.

495
00:27:20,799 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 1: So someone goes over to the adjoining parking garage to

496
00:27:23,799 --> 00:27:28,599
find Reginald's SUV, and when they do, everything kind of

497
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:29,799
starts to make sense.

498
00:27:31,079 --> 00:27:35,920
Speaker 16: The three fifty five the place was seen and then

499
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:42,680
she doesn't know when he came back. I didn't see

500
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:42,960
if there.

501
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,319
Speaker 4: Are any warmths of them Ornava I didn't either.

502
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 29: So four, I don't think this was done in two

503
00:27:50,759 --> 00:27:54,519
outports on the sofa some of it, but there's a

504
00:27:54,599 --> 00:27:55,279
lot more missing.

505
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 4: Did you see the stuff this one and then you

506
00:27:59,039 --> 00:28:00,279
see down in the front of the track can.

507
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:06,319
Speaker 26: So not yet, but we just were informed by Bryce

508
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,160
that it sounds like he dad Dad left at three

509
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:14,480
fifty five. Neighbor saw him driving at his car, and

510
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:16,279
so Bryce is going to locate the car right now

511
00:28:16,319 --> 00:28:18,759
with the neighbor that saw it. That was around four,

512
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:22,799
and he's saying, if I'm hearing what Bryce said correctly,

513
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:25,359
he locked this door left of the car.

514
00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:26,079
Speaker 4: And came back.

515
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:30,759
Speaker 10: That might be our Essentially, we're gonna see if Bryce

516
00:28:30,799 --> 00:28:33,400
has it the car. You guys, get here, stay here

517
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:35,000
with the crime SYMGA.

518
00:28:35,599 --> 00:28:39,160
Speaker 1: Detective Alouise walked to the parking garage and spots his

519
00:28:39,319 --> 00:28:42,319
colleague who's peering in through the windows of the s

520
00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:45,079
u V. Just tell it it's flat.

521
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:55,079
Speaker 4: Stay with this card and we touch it. Hey, who's

522
00:29:00,039 --> 00:29:03,160
a The suv is completely flat, so I'm probably sitting

523
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:03,359
on it.

524
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:07,319
Speaker 1: The apartment complex has its own trash system, one that

525
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:10,440
doesn't require any kind of rolling cans you'd leave on

526
00:29:10,519 --> 00:29:13,960
the side of the road. Could Reginald have flattened the

527
00:29:14,039 --> 00:29:17,319
back seats to make room for the new trash cans

528
00:29:17,359 --> 00:29:21,200
that were now in his apartment. With this possibility in mind,

529
00:29:22,119 --> 00:29:24,759
they have to find a neighbor with a doorbell camera.

530
00:29:25,599 --> 00:29:28,400
They need to get footage of whoever brought those trash

531
00:29:28,519 --> 00:29:30,200
cans into the apartment.

532
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:32,559
Speaker 4: Can I come in for a second?

533
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:33,079
Speaker 27: Ye go?

534
00:29:33,799 --> 00:29:35,039
Speaker 4: Are you guys right?

535
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:40,960
Speaker 12: I'm brant with the police apartment obviously, I mean angle

536
00:29:42,119 --> 00:29:43,920
you see you guys might have some video or something.

537
00:29:44,319 --> 00:29:48,319
Speaker 4: Yeah, I have on the video doorbeller there. I'm not

538
00:29:48,559 --> 00:29:50,920
entirely sure what times.

539
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:54,119
Speaker 10: I think he said, like around three thirty.

540
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:58,079
Speaker 4: Was like one of them, okay, but it just catches clips.

541
00:29:58,119 --> 00:30:01,119
I think this was like one that they were like

542
00:30:01,319 --> 00:30:01,799
looking at.

543
00:30:02,359 --> 00:30:06,599
Speaker 26: So you know what I'm looking for is someone dragging

544
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:09,079
a trash can, A couple of trash cans they like

545
00:30:09,119 --> 00:30:09,599
the only.

546
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 10: Ones, yeah, haven't like we hear that sometimes like at

547
00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:15,000
n I D.

548
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:17,359
Speaker 4: Guys get roll trash cans or you put your trash

549
00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:18,240
outside and they collect it.

550
00:30:18,319 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 26: They collect it, but they have like a big like

551
00:30:21,319 --> 00:30:24,440
like one of those ones you see, like yeah, that

552
00:30:24,559 --> 00:30:27,240
they push and then come by and collect them.

553
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,799
Speaker 1: In this nine one one call, Reginald weirdly mentions that

554
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,359
whoever did this must have started the cleanup process and

555
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:40,160
couldn't finish it. Was he talking about himself? I mean,

556
00:30:40,319 --> 00:30:44,119
who breaks into a place, kills people and then tries

557
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,039
to remove the bodies? Why would you do that unless

558
00:30:48,279 --> 00:30:52,200
you live there. The car discovery, paired with Reginald's claim

559
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:55,160
that his wife and daughter's purses were empty, brought to

560
00:30:55,279 --> 00:30:57,759
a search of the big dumpsters on the ground floor

561
00:30:57,799 --> 00:31:03,000
of the apartment complex. Side they found an Exfinity bill

562
00:31:03,119 --> 00:31:07,240
addressed to Reggie McLaren, a credit Union bank statement for

563
00:31:07,359 --> 00:31:12,400
the couple, numerous SidD cards for Ruth, three of Bethanese

564
00:31:12,519 --> 00:31:18,319
driver's licenses, and both women's Social Security cards. All of

565
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:22,799
these items had been cut up. They found bloody clothes too.

566
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:29,240
This all wasn't looking very good. The next logical step

567
00:31:29,599 --> 00:31:32,279
was to find out which hardware store the rolling trash

568
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,440
cans were from. Maybe they'd even be able to get

569
00:31:35,519 --> 00:31:40,319
security camera footage of Reginald buying the items. So the

570
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:44,519
deputy went to nearly every store in the area. Finally

571
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:47,319
he arrived at a particular home depot.

572
00:31:48,119 --> 00:31:55,559
Speaker 10: Yeah, wed By, thank you.

573
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 16: What can you do?

574
00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:03,759
Speaker 2: Well done?

575
00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:08,480
Speaker 24: What I could do is I could go back a

576
00:32:08,599 --> 00:32:13,240
footage of when he's he entered the store without items.

577
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:15,720
Speaker 4: Yeah, if you can follow him from his car to

578
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:17,160
where his car is.

579
00:32:19,039 --> 00:32:21,079
Speaker 10: Most who they didn't go past this because.

580
00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:26,519
Speaker 9: Forget what you're talking.

581
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:28,119
Speaker 13: Is that him?

582
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:32,319
Speaker 9: Yeah, that's him taking longs like his.

583
00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:36,720
Speaker 30: Items while he's in the like in the twelve sections

584
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:44,000
trash cans, trash cans, there is yes, so he's already

585
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:44,960
picked the trash cans.

586
00:32:46,799 --> 00:32:47,599
Speaker 9: It's crazy.

587
00:32:50,759 --> 00:32:53,519
Speaker 21: I never thought like I would have come up to

588
00:32:53,599 --> 00:32:55,799
that because like I would always start because you see

589
00:32:55,839 --> 00:32:59,559
these people with these items, like you wonder what they

590
00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:01,640
use it with the last time when I was cashooting,

591
00:33:01,839 --> 00:33:05,359
I saw a guy in the tar shovel and like

592
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:08,359
blulkins and gloves and I was like, oh my god,

593
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:09,920
looks so sketchy and stuff.

594
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 18: No.

595
00:33:12,119 --> 00:33:16,359
Speaker 1: No, her enthusiasm is cute, isn't it. Bet you never

596
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,119
thought she'd be in a real life episode of CSI. Anyway,

597
00:33:20,279 --> 00:33:24,079
This footage showed him not only purchasing the two trash cans,

598
00:33:24,119 --> 00:33:29,880
but also a Stanley brand handsaw good brand. He paid

599
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:33,160
for all the items with cash. And remember that neighbor

600
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,480
with the doorbell camera. He found footage from March ninth

601
00:33:36,599 --> 00:33:40,200
that showed Reginald wheeling his two brand new trash cans

602
00:33:40,519 --> 00:33:45,359
back to his apartment. Weird. Then there was that long

603
00:33:45,599 --> 00:33:50,720
handled axe. Footage showed Reginald and harbor Frate's checkout line

604
00:33:51,519 --> 00:33:57,279
with his axe in hand. Again he used cash. This

605
00:33:57,519 --> 00:34:01,160
was all on March ninth, just before four pm, shortly

606
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,279
after he got home that day. Door bell footage showed

607
00:34:04,279 --> 00:34:07,119
the three of them, Reginald, Bethany, and their daughter Ruth,

608
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:11,199
all leaving the apartment. Then they get back around seven

609
00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:14,840
to fifteen pm, having just gone on an outing with

610
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:19,960
the man who would soon end their lives. While investigators

611
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:25,039
rewound camera feeds and match timestamps, a sense of disbelief

612
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:29,719
washed over everyone. How could eighty one year old Reginald,

613
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:33,400
elderly and frail have done any of this?

614
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:39,880
Speaker 13: Named doctor? Okay, little bit, can you tell them what

615
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:48,880
happened today? Ooh, I didn't sneaking.

616
00:34:49,679 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 1: So the doctor asked him what happened, and Reginald said, oh,

617
00:34:55,159 --> 00:35:01,119
I made a mistake. And that's why the AUDI isn't perfect.

618
00:35:01,199 --> 00:35:05,119
It's from the body worn camera of the officer. Sitting

619
00:35:05,159 --> 00:35:10,599
in Reginald's hospital room. Reginald calls the doctor, Doc, that

620
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:12,719
might help you follow it a little bit better.

621
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:21,039
Speaker 10: They were thinking and anything to get thistle. The doctor

622
00:35:21,199 --> 00:35:25,840
was saying something that you see I heard that you

623
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:32,480
want one that you okay, well you know.

624
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:36,039
Speaker 4: I'm not trying to be No.

625
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 10: I a lit here for forty years and and I

626
00:35:42,679 --> 00:35:45,440
give up basically and you.

627
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:53,199
Speaker 25: Because the animals of money and this same theme.

628
00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:53,599
Speaker 10: No way.

629
00:35:54,679 --> 00:35:59,159
Speaker 25: And if I'm messing me to dig an apartment, go there.

630
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:02,599
Speaker 10: And I had it, and then I had some money here.

631
00:36:02,679 --> 00:36:05,159
See I have a tolend dollar in my.

632
00:36:06,679 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 2: Week.

633
00:36:07,119 --> 00:36:09,920
Speaker 25: Is a move, but that was only for one month

634
00:36:10,679 --> 00:36:14,000
and from signing hest for fifteen. Anyone who predicts will

635
00:36:14,079 --> 00:36:17,079
be short after. I didn't want to see my family

636
00:36:17,159 --> 00:36:21,840
in the street Eddy. I don't want to see hope happens.

637
00:36:22,519 --> 00:36:27,159
But I just didn't because I see equal on the

638
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:27,719
roles and.

639
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:36,880
Speaker 10: Mom guys and say the situation better and I so

640
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:46,760
you killed them? And then and Leans passed out. Correct.

641
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:52,760
Speaker 1: Then the doctor asks him, so you killed them, both

642
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:58,400
of them? And Reginald admitted that he had and great board.

643
00:36:58,639 --> 00:36:58,960
Speaker 2: He was in.

644
00:36:59,559 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 10: He didn't kid. I even love to see my student

645
00:37:04,559 --> 00:37:09,599
bending brand thee how my daughter even.

646
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:18,119
Speaker 1: After this shockingly calm admission, so creepy, really Reginald continued

647
00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:22,360
telling the doctor that he used to work for HSS

648
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:26,679
Security Company in a hospital setting. During his time there,

649
00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:30,920
he saw the harsh reality of homelessness every day. He

650
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,280
said that after he lost his job, he knew that

651
00:37:33,559 --> 00:37:35,960
he and his family would end up like these people

652
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:40,159
begging on the side of the road. At his age,

653
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:43,239
no one would hire him. To make matters worse, he

654
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:47,519
said that they were being evicted. Bethany and Ruth were

655
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:50,400
pressuring him to sign a lease on a new apartment,

656
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:54,000
and Reginald said he was down to his last eight

657
00:37:54,119 --> 00:37:58,159
thousand dollars, which wouldn't be enough for first and last

658
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:03,480
month's rent, plus us a security deposit in his daughter's medication.

659
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:08,559
Thirty five year old Ruth lived with cerebral palsy and

660
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:13,559
required constant monitoring. Her meds were eight hundred dollars a month,

661
00:38:13,639 --> 00:38:18,079
according to Reginald, who really emphasized that he'd been taking

662
00:38:18,159 --> 00:38:20,599
care of his wife and daughter for thirty five years.

663
00:38:21,639 --> 00:38:27,519
His family depended on him, relied on him. They couldn't

664
00:38:27,519 --> 00:38:32,559
survive without him. Apparently it had just become too much.

665
00:38:33,599 --> 00:38:37,800
He said he'd started planning about ten days prior. He

666
00:38:38,000 --> 00:39:08,960
just couldn't see any other way out. On March twenty fifth,

667
00:39:09,119 --> 00:39:12,320
twenty twenty three, from a hospital bed under police watch,

668
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:16,360
eighty one year old Reginald McLaren calmly admitted he had

669
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:20,280
murdered his wife and daughter. He said he'd spent decades

670
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:23,519
supporting them, but when he lost his job and found

671
00:39:23,559 --> 00:39:27,039
out they were being evicted, he saw only one path

672
00:39:27,199 --> 00:39:28,719
forward everything.

673
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:33,079
Speaker 25: I'm sorry, I can dominate in life everything, you know,

674
00:39:33,599 --> 00:39:36,199
never time when he had her time and making bed

675
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:38,199
sickness problems.

676
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:43,559
Speaker 10: But I think not see my said my heny.

677
00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:45,599
Speaker 2: You know.

678
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:50,559
Speaker 1: According to Reginald, the plan had been in motion for

679
00:39:50,679 --> 00:39:55,159
a week. Here's what investigators believe happened that final day.

680
00:39:56,360 --> 00:40:00,440
Sometime in the early afternoon, he grabbed an axe, the

681
00:40:00,519 --> 00:40:03,679
one he bought at Harbor Freight. He set aside the

682
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:07,079
hand saw that was for later. He purchased everything he

683
00:40:07,199 --> 00:40:10,880
needed using cash, Like the two rolling trash cans. He

684
00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:14,519
wheeled them through the parking lot by himself. They were

685
00:40:14,599 --> 00:40:19,119
now waiting in his living room, lids propped open. Bethany,

686
00:40:19,239 --> 00:40:22,599
his wife of nearly forty years, was likely sitting on

687
00:40:22,679 --> 00:40:26,719
the couch. He struck her first, hard enough to slice

688
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:30,800
through a major artery causing a blood spray that painted

689
00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:35,039
the wall behind her. Then he turned on Ruth, hacking

690
00:40:35,119 --> 00:40:39,360
away at her. She was thirty five years old, and

691
00:40:39,519 --> 00:40:44,400
Reginald said she had cerebral palsy. Detectives believe she may

692
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:47,880
have been standing near the kitchen at the time. Later

693
00:40:48,039 --> 00:40:51,280
they found the sink drain clogged with blood and hair,

694
00:40:52,119 --> 00:40:54,400
clear evidence of an effort to clean up what was

695
00:40:54,480 --> 00:41:00,559
becoming an unmanageably messy situation. After they were both dad,

696
00:41:00,679 --> 00:41:03,519
Reginald used a combination of the axe and the saw

697
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:07,719
to remove one of his wife's legs. It was harder

698
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:12,559
than he imagined it would be, so he abandoned that idea. Instead,

699
00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:17,400
he forcibly bent Bethany and Ruth's limbs at awkward angles

700
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:20,960
so they'd fit. He draped a towel over his wife,

701
00:41:21,119 --> 00:41:25,079
but it didn't cover much. He looked down out of

702
00:41:25,159 --> 00:41:27,840
breath and knew he still had to get both of

703
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:30,800
these bins to stand up so he could roll them

704
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,760
down the hall and into his suv. One of Bethany's

705
00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:38,199
legs was still sticking out, lying on top of the

706
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:42,679
open lid. Blood was starting to pool around each of

707
00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:49,639
the bins. Reginald panicked. His chest felt tight. He knew

708
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:53,559
this feeling. Quickly, he cut up both of the women's

709
00:41:53,599 --> 00:41:58,760
identification cards, driver's licenses, and social security cards. He tossed

710
00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:02,239
the pieces down the track into the apartment's main dumpster,

711
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:07,000
along with bloody clothes and other personal effects. Then he

712
00:42:07,079 --> 00:42:10,840
picked up his phone and called the property manager, followed

713
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:14,119
by nine to one one. In his nine one one call,

714
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:18,199
Reginald said to the dispatcher, whoever did this probably started

715
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:22,400
the cleanup, but got tired and gave up, And that's

716
00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:27,599
exactly what he did. During the process of hauling bodies,

717
00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:32,800
cleaning blood, and lugging heavy plastic bins into position, Reginald

718
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:37,480
over exerted himself. He began to feel the familiar warnings

719
00:42:37,599 --> 00:42:42,719
of a heart attack. He'd already suffered four and had

720
00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:47,920
recently undergone open heart surgery. He just got scared, scared

721
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:52,400
that he was about to die. Getting medical attention for

722
00:42:52,519 --> 00:42:56,880
himself became the number one priority. I wonder how he

723
00:42:57,000 --> 00:42:57,760
was going to pay for that.

724
00:43:00,039 --> 00:43:03,159
Speaker 20: A horrifying crime in Anglewood in the suspect talked about

725
00:43:03,239 --> 00:43:07,000
Colorado's housing crisis with investigators. The eighty one year old

726
00:43:07,039 --> 00:43:09,760
man told them he killed and dismembered his wife and

727
00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:13,239
daughter because he could no longer afford to pay the rent.

728
00:43:13,719 --> 00:43:16,599
They were murdered in an apartment building in the Englewood

729
00:43:16,679 --> 00:43:19,599
City Center just off Hampton Avenue in Santa Fe. Drive

730
00:43:20,039 --> 00:43:22,119
Karen Morphin on the story Tonight and Karen. The man

731
00:43:22,519 --> 00:43:26,320
told police he didn't want his family to suffer through homelessness,

732
00:43:26,719 --> 00:43:27,280
and during his.

733
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:30,760
Speaker 24: Arrest, he reportedly told police that he had no regrets

734
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:33,519
because he felt like they were in a better place now.

735
00:43:33,599 --> 00:43:37,719
Police responding today pleading for anyone who may be struggling

736
00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:40,960
to ask for help. According to the arrest AFFI, David

737
00:43:41,039 --> 00:43:44,440
McClaren confessed to the murders, telling detectives he had recently

738
00:43:44,639 --> 00:43:47,559
lost his job and the family was about to be evicted.

739
00:43:48,079 --> 00:43:51,719
Having worked with the homeless population before, he told police

740
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:55,320
he quote knew what a miserable life that was. Having

741
00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:58,760
planned for several days, he allegedly carried out those murders

742
00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:00,440
the morning they were to vacate.

743
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:03,800
Speaker 8: You know, he seemed distraught maybe, and I don't know

744
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:07,039
what the reasons for his actions were or I mean,

745
00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:10,840
that's part of our investigation. We're trying to determine why

746
00:44:10,920 --> 00:44:14,719
he did what he did, but as far as our

747
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,079
dealings with him, he was more than cooperative.

748
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:21,159
Speaker 24: Now McLaren is expected in court sometime later this week.

749
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:24,079
We know the Rapahoe County Corner's Office will identify those

750
00:44:24,159 --> 00:44:26,239
victims once their family is notified.

751
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:31,119
Speaker 1: Notifying extended family about Bethany and Ruth's deaths was more

752
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:35,880
difficult than expected. Who were these women? The family had

753
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,800
lived in the same building for years, and yet no

754
00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:42,079
one seemed to know them beyond their friendly smiles and

755
00:44:42,159 --> 00:44:44,800
the smell of food wafting from their unit.

756
00:44:45,199 --> 00:44:48,480
Speaker 7: Well, Jim and the sadness over this terrible, terrible crime

757
00:44:48,599 --> 00:44:50,960
is the realization that this family lived quietly in an

758
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:54,599
Englewood apartment building. The mother and victim in this case,

759
00:44:54,719 --> 00:44:59,119
Bethany McLaren, was apparently from overseas, but without the help

760
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:02,880
of her husband, the suspect, finding her family has been difficult,

761
00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:06,159
and so the coroner's office has reached out for help.

762
00:45:06,639 --> 00:45:09,719
Speaker 1: There was no one to claim Bethany and Ruth's bodies,

763
00:45:10,639 --> 00:45:13,880
no one to plan their funerals or give them a

764
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:18,760
peaceful sign off. When leaders at the Colorado Nepal Alliance

765
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:22,079
found out about this situation, they couldn't let it end

766
00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:25,800
like this. There had to be someone who knew and

767
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:27,119
loved these women.

768
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 7: They knew Bethany McLaren first got a social Security number

769
00:45:31,039 --> 00:45:33,880
after arriving in the US somewhere in the eighties and

770
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:37,440
a little bit more, but no one knew her relatives.

771
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:39,039
The coroner's office called you.

772
00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:42,639
Speaker 11: Yeah, they called me the Tuesday after the murders.

773
00:45:42,840 --> 00:45:46,400
Speaker 7: Anne Hines and Sengita Schrotria are both part of the

774
00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:50,400
Colorado Nepal Alliance, and the coroner had found the mom.

775
00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:52,360
Bethany had another name.

776
00:45:52,639 --> 00:45:55,119
Speaker 11: The fact that her name was Pavitra was a good

777
00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:58,000
clue that she might if she wasn't Napoli. That the

778
00:45:58,159 --> 00:46:00,039
ring of Napoli descent was likely.

779
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:02,840
Speaker 7: And so they set to work to find family to

780
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:04,480
remember them and their past.

781
00:46:05,239 --> 00:46:07,880
Speaker 1: They brought a photo of Bethany to a local funeral.

782
00:46:08,840 --> 00:46:12,159
Someone in the Engle Wooden, Nepaull community had passed away,

783
00:46:13,119 --> 00:46:17,000
and six hundred people were in attendance, all people who

784
00:46:17,079 --> 00:46:18,000
might know these women.

785
00:46:18,519 --> 00:46:20,840
Speaker 7: Somebody has to mourn these women.

786
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:21,519
Speaker 11: Yeah.

787
00:46:23,199 --> 00:46:26,880
Speaker 7: With a photo from Bethany McLaren's license, Sangita began to

788
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:29,920
ask everyone she could in the ten thousand plus member

789
00:46:30,119 --> 00:46:31,119
Nepoli community.

790
00:46:31,519 --> 00:46:33,360
Speaker 31: So I took the picture to the funeral and say

791
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:35,440
that do you guys know her? And they were around

792
00:46:35,519 --> 00:46:39,280
like six hundred people and nobody could tell that they

793
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:39,719
knew her.

794
00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:43,880
Speaker 1: Eventually, a man in Kansas responded saying he remembered a

795
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:48,800
woman named Pavitra. She'd helped him find a job back

796
00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:52,440
in Colorado years prior. When he saw her name and photo,

797
00:46:52,599 --> 00:46:55,440
he was pretty sure this was the same woman. So

798
00:46:55,639 --> 00:46:58,480
she was a kind woman, she was yeah.

799
00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:01,440
Speaker 7: Then after a report of the name got out, a

800
00:47:01,519 --> 00:47:05,199
woman reached out from India. One who was a little

801
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:08,679
girl once posed for a photo with Ruth McLaren.

802
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 31: Then she opened up and it happened to be Pavitra's niece.

803
00:47:13,599 --> 00:47:18,239
Speaker 1: The woman confirmed that she recognized both Bethany and Ruth. Apparently,

804
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:23,639
Bethany was originally Pavitra Rana, born in northern India but

805
00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:27,599
of Nepali origin. She worked as a nurse and eventually

806
00:47:27,679 --> 00:47:30,880
moved to the United States, where she married Reginald after

807
00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:32,679
meeting him through a newspaper ad.

808
00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:35,639
Speaker 31: Of all things, it looks like they had been in

809
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:41,119
India for a few generations because both of Pavitrans her sister,

810
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:44,920
were born in India. There are so many uncovered part

811
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:47,760
of the stories that we don't know yet or about

812
00:47:47,800 --> 00:47:50,800
their life. I'm sure they have touched more life than

813
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:51,079
we know.

814
00:47:51,360 --> 00:47:52,159
Speaker 11: I'm sure they have to.

815
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:55,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, they had succeeded in finding a needle in a haystack,

816
00:47:56,360 --> 00:48:00,360
one single member of Bethany's family, but they were too

817
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:04,199
far away to help with the funeral. So these two

818
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:08,000
women from the Colorado to Paul alliance took it upon themselves.

819
00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:11,519
Speaker 11: You didn't have to do this, Yeah, I did have

820
00:48:11,679 --> 00:48:19,599
to do it because these women were so brutally murdered.

821
00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:23,599
Speaker 28: Yeah, and so few people in the Denver metro area

822
00:48:23,679 --> 00:48:26,760
knew them, and I could not imagine.

823
00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:30,519
Speaker 11: That there were people there that were grieving for them.

824
00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:37,000
Speaker 1: There was no family statement, no recent photo, no custom obituary.

825
00:48:38,119 --> 00:48:43,000
Instead just a Bible verse. The Lord is my shepherd.

826
00:48:43,519 --> 00:48:47,360
I shall not want. He maketh me lie down in

827
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:52,920
green pastures. He leadeth me beside the still waters. He

828
00:48:53,079 --> 00:48:56,800
restoreth my soul. He leadeth me in the paths of

829
00:48:56,960 --> 00:49:01,639
righteousness for his namesake. YEA, though I walk through the

830
00:49:01,719 --> 00:49:05,000
valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil,

831
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:09,559
for thou art with me, Thy rod and thy staff

832
00:49:10,440 --> 00:49:14,599
they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me, in

833
00:49:14,639 --> 00:49:20,039
the presence of mine enemies. Thou anointest my head with oil.

834
00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:25,960
My cup runneth over. Surely, goodness and mercy shall follow

835
00:49:26,039 --> 00:49:29,920
me all the days of my life, and I will

836
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:35,840
dwell in the house of the Lord forever. No mention

837
00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:41,760
of her daughter. Her work is a nurse nothing. Bethany

838
00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:47,039
and Ruth mac laren lived quietly, but they died violently,

839
00:49:48,159 --> 00:49:51,159
and if not for the kindness of strangers, they would

840
00:49:51,159 --> 00:49:54,960
have been buried without any one to grieve them. Everything

841
00:49:55,079 --> 00:49:58,159
we know about them comes from the fragments they left behind,

842
00:49:58,920 --> 00:50:04,039
whether it be a neighbor's memory, a community sorrow, or

843
00:50:04,039 --> 00:50:09,199
a killer's version of events. And Reginald's side of the

844
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:15,360
story was built entirely on his lies. Because here's the

845
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:22,559
horrible truth, the McLaren family wasn't facing homelessness. Detectives recovered

846
00:50:22,639 --> 00:50:26,280
several documents addressed to Reginald in Bethany one of those

847
00:50:26,360 --> 00:50:30,039
documents was a statement from a credit union. It showed

848
00:50:30,079 --> 00:50:34,400
an account balance of over eleven thousand dollars. Keep in mind,

849
00:50:34,519 --> 00:50:38,000
this was just one of their accounts. In his hospital

850
00:50:38,079 --> 00:50:41,599
bed confession, Reginald had also mentioned a briefcase with eight

851
00:50:41,719 --> 00:50:45,880
thousand dollars in it. If that doesn't convince you that

852
00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:50,400
his entire excuse was a lie, maybe this will. There

853
00:50:50,519 --> 00:50:53,239
was no evidence that Reginald and his family were about

854
00:50:53,320 --> 00:50:58,159
to be evicted whatsoever. There was no eviction notice, no

855
00:50:58,400 --> 00:51:01,199
court order, and it was it's just that their lease

856
00:51:01,639 --> 00:51:05,840
was up, so that's it. It was all a lie.

857
00:51:06,960 --> 00:51:10,679
This wasn't a man pushed into a corner. Reginald had

858
00:51:10,719 --> 00:51:14,519
made a decision. He was done being the pillar of

859
00:51:14,599 --> 00:51:19,400
his family. He was done having a family altogether. It

860
00:51:19,519 --> 00:51:23,440
was on April third, twenty twenty three, that Reginald was

861
00:51:23,559 --> 00:51:27,559
formally charged with two counts of first degree murder, two

862
00:51:27,719 --> 00:51:32,239
counts of tampering with a deceased human body, and one

863
00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:37,239
count of false reporting. On January twenty third, twenty twenty four,

864
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:41,920
he entered a not guilty plea. His trial began in

865
00:51:42,119 --> 00:51:46,480
June of twenty twenty four. It was a somber, quiet courtroom.

866
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:49,880
No one sat in the gallery behind the defense table,

867
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:54,679
and no one sat behind the prosecutors. Well, at least,

868
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:57,800
there was no one in attendance that really knew the

869
00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:02,599
McLaren family and Hindes, the executive director of the Colorado

870
00:52:02,719 --> 00:52:06,800
Nepal Alliance, attended the entire trial, just like she'd help

871
00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:10,559
plan Bethany and Ruth's burial. She wanted to be there

872
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:15,440
when justice was finally served and sounds like a nice person.

873
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:17,280
We need more ants.

874
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:20,039
Speaker 28: This is Bethany when she was a nurse in the

875
00:52:20,119 --> 00:52:23,000
Indian Army. This is Ruth right here when she was young.

876
00:52:23,239 --> 00:52:26,320
The only pictures that the jury got to see of

877
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:29,960
them were the pictures when they were dead. The hardest

878
00:52:30,039 --> 00:52:35,079
part for me was hearing how many times he had

879
00:52:35,159 --> 00:52:36,599
struck his daughter with an axe.

880
00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:41,960
Speaker 1: The evidence shown at trial was convincing. After about a

881
00:52:42,039 --> 00:52:45,480
week in court, just a few hours of deliberation, a

882
00:52:45,599 --> 00:52:47,840
jury found him guilty on all charges.

883
00:52:48,519 --> 00:52:53,159
Speaker 28: The prosecution had a very good case, and they just

884
00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:57,360
reiterated all the pre planning that had gone into these murders.

885
00:52:58,199 --> 00:53:03,920
He had purchased the acts, the saw, and the trash cans.

886
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:07,559
I think I was hoping to try to understand why

887
00:53:07,639 --> 00:53:11,800
these two murders had occurred that I left without any answers.

888
00:53:12,239 --> 00:53:14,880
I thought maybe having him convicted might make me feel better,

889
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:19,280
but I don't. Ruth and Bethany are still deceased.

890
00:53:19,639 --> 00:53:23,199
Speaker 1: And who had been in contact with Bethany's family in India,

891
00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:27,440
told them about the guilty verdict. One of Bethany's friends

892
00:53:27,519 --> 00:53:31,199
ended up writing a letter for the sentencing hearing. She

893
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:33,559
asked Aan to read it on her behalf.

894
00:53:34,079 --> 00:53:37,199
Speaker 27: I have known Pavichrurana, also known as Bethany, for the

895
00:53:37,320 --> 00:53:41,320
last half a century. We both belonged to Kullimpong, a

896
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:45,079
small hill town in eastern India. She was born, brought

897
00:53:45,159 --> 00:53:47,079
up and did her schooling in one of the famous

898
00:53:47,159 --> 00:53:51,559
missionary schools, the Kalimpong Girls High School. We worshiped in

899
00:53:51,599 --> 00:53:55,400
the same Presbyterian church. After her schooling, she did her

900
00:53:55,480 --> 00:53:59,039
diploma in nursing. In the late nineteen seventies, she joined

901
00:53:59,039 --> 00:54:01,480
the Indian Army as a nursing officer in the rank

902
00:54:01,519 --> 00:54:04,639
of lieutenant. She continued working and was promoted to the

903
00:54:04,719 --> 00:54:09,280
rank of captain. Around nineteen eighty six, she married Reginald MacLaren.

904
00:54:09,880 --> 00:54:12,480
After marriage, she resigned from the army and moved with

905
00:54:12,559 --> 00:54:16,079
her husband to Denver, Colorado and the US. In nineteen

906
00:54:16,159 --> 00:54:18,280
ninety six, she came to visit US in India with

907
00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:22,440
her husband and daughter. Thereafter, we were in occasional contact

908
00:54:22,559 --> 00:54:25,559
over the phone. Last I remember speaking with her was

909
00:54:25,639 --> 00:54:29,199
in twenty fifteen. After that I was unable to contact

910
00:54:29,239 --> 00:54:32,960
her despite trying many times. The tragic news came as

911
00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:35,440
a great shock, not only to me but to all

912
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:38,199
of those who knew her here in India. I would

913
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:41,079
like to remember her as a fine and humble human being,

914
00:54:41,599 --> 00:54:45,719
a dependable friend and a very helpful person. She liked

915
00:54:45,719 --> 00:54:48,480
to do embroidery in tatting laces in her free time.

916
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:53,079
She was warm and friendly, but reserved Socially, she was

917
00:54:53,159 --> 00:54:56,519
observant and we shared many laughs at her impressions of

918
00:54:56,639 --> 00:55:00,400
friends and colleagues. May their souls rest in peace.

919
00:55:01,480 --> 00:55:04,719
Speaker 1: Reginald, who is now eighty three years old, received two

920
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:09,360
consecutive life sentences. On top of that, the judge tacked

921
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:14,079
on two twelve year sentences for tapering with deceased bodies

922
00:55:15,000 --> 00:55:17,840
and one hundred and twenty day cents for false reporting,

923
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:22,760
with credit for time served. In the end, no one

924
00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:27,480
remembered when they moved in. No one noticed the quiet

925
00:55:27,559 --> 00:55:32,519
lives of these women, and when they finally did, it

926
00:55:32,760 --> 00:55:36,559
was because the only person who ever saw them was

927
00:55:36,639 --> 00:55:55,880
the one who made them vanish. Well, we hope you

928
00:55:56,039 --> 00:55:59,679
enjoyed that horrible story. Weirdos. If you like this sort

929
00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:02,599
of thing, these tragic terrible stories, head on over to

930
00:56:02,679 --> 00:56:07,559
our YouTube channel, Sword and Scale TV. There you can

931
00:56:07,639 --> 00:56:13,360
get our visual version of Sworn Scale. Go get it.

932
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:20,239
You can also find us at Swordinscale dot com, where

933
00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:23,960
you can subscribe for ten dollars two plus or twenty

934
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:31,920
dollars two plus including Sword and Scale TV. I know

935
00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:34,639
it's a lot to ask, but this should ain't cheap

936
00:56:34,679 --> 00:56:42,280
to make, so you can keep free loading, or you

937
00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:48,199
can help out your favorite creator. It's up to you

938
00:56:48,519 --> 00:56:50,280
to decide. You know what a good person would do,

939
00:56:51,280 --> 00:56:57,000
what somebody like yourself would do. Don't let me guilty

940
00:56:57,119 --> 00:57:10,400
or anything. Guilt, guilt, guilt, all right, we'll see you

941
00:57:10,480 --> 00:58:00,119
next week. Stay safe, Say how to your mom m

942
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:03,079
hing to live