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Speaker 1: Understand the thinking atheist. It's not a person, it's a symbol,

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an idea.

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Speaker 2: The population of atheists this country is going through the.

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Speaker 1: Rule, rejecting faith, pursuing knowledge, challenging the sacred. If I

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tell the truth, it's because I tell the truth, not because.

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Speaker 2: I put my hand on a book and made a wish.

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Speaker 1: And working together for a more rational world.

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Speaker 2: Take the risk of thinking. Feel so much more happiness.

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Truth Usian wisdom will come to you that way.

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Speaker 1: Assume nothing, question everything, and start thinking. This is the

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Thinking Atheist podcast, hosted by Seth Andrews.

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Speaker 2: I just ran up here. I've been down making lunch.

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Natalie got this meal kit service, and almost every recipe

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wants virgin olive oil. I should do a general knowledge

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show again because I don't know what virgin virgin extra

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virgin olive oil. I don't get it. I don't understand

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what's the difference, and I'm too lazy to look it up.

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I have been I can't believe I'm telling you this.

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I've been medicating my head. Oh that's been a real joy.

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So this is the kind of shit that happens when

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you get older. It's like watching the fly. David cromenin

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Berg's The Fly. Remember, he goes into the teleporter and

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he gets gene spliced with the fly, and all of

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a sudden things start growing on his body. He's like,

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what's that? I don't know. I don't know what this is.

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I don't know what this does. So I was all

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of a sudden, I was out there and I'm scratching

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my head and I felt something. What's that? Natalie said,

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you should get it checked out. Now. I'm sure it's nothing.

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You should get it checked out. Now, I'm sure it's nothing.

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Finally I go get it checked out. It is a

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how do I even say it? Attinic caratosis. Okay, well, whatever,

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and then the dermatologist says it is pre cancerous. Whoa, whoa,

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whoa whoa. Wait a minute, wait a minute, I didn't

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hear pre All I heard was cancer, right, it's all

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your brain picks up. It's cancer. No, no, no, it's

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not cancer. This is a pre cancerous thing. But if

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we don't do something with it, one day it might

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develop into cancer. Wait, wait a minute. Later, all I

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hear is cancer. It's funny how your brain works. I'm sorry.

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All I heard was the word cancer. No, it's not cancer.

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It's no big deal, seth. We'll just freeze it off

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and a biopsied it and they sent it off just

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to be sure that it wasn't something. And I wrote

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this down called squamous sell carcinoma, and it is not.

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It is actinic keratosis, which if left untreated, could grow.

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And then I've become the fly. So anyway, I uh

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just got back from having that frozen off. I've got

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this tiny little stinging dot on the top of my head.

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It's just one of those wanky old people type things.

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It just happens, and it's my own fault. I've spent

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decades in the sun without a hat, without a hat,

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just stupid, just dumb. And so now I've become a

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hat person. Caps on the tennis court, if I'm walking

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the dog, I'm wearing a hat. I'm wearing hats all

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the time.

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: It's a weird. It's like a science fair experiment when

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you watch your body changing over the years. Facebook memories

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is killing me. Whenever a photograph pops up from just

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a few years ago. There was one of Natalie and me.

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We had a photo session in the park here in town.

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And I'm looking at myself five years ago, twenty twenty.

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I don't see one gray hair. I look like I

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just emerged from the womb. For Pete's sake. It's just weird.

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So then I'm like, well, okay, in five more years,

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will I look like the guy at the end of

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Indiana Jones three who drank from the wrong grail and

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he decayed immediately in real time, and then it's over.

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I don't know. These are the kinds of questions I've

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been asking myself. I've been shopping this.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 2: I don't love Christmas, but I do buy a few gifts,

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and my buddy Corey and I do gag gifts for

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each other every season. Just something dumb. I mean, we'll

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see it throughout the year. Something will pop up and

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I'll go and I'll buy it, and then I'll just

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keep it for months in my office until December rolls around,

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and then I'll send it down to Dallas where he lives,

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and go hey, and it could be anything. I remember

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one year I got him. It's a helicopter, one of

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those RC remote control helicopters. It's shaped like a four

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letter word. It's just the word fuck. And when you

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put batteries in it and you grab the remote and

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it goes airborne, then you now have a flying fuck.

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So I've given you a flying fuck, Cory. I just

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thought it was dumb. It was so based in juvenile

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I laughed my ass off. And he still has this

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flying fuck and it flies around his office and I

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get videos from time to time. He gave me a

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hell Raisor cube one year Lament configuration. It was awesome.

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It was awesome. I still have it on my shelf

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back here. Star Trek gifts. We love good Star Trek gifts.

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But I have been shopping, so let me for those

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who were happen to be watching on screen. I've been

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looking at options here. I have a vampire tears candle.

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Apparently when you light it, it's all black and it's

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very goth looking, or gothic is a better way of

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saying it. When it burns, apparently it burns blood because

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the interior wax is a crimson red. Well, that's kind

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of a cool gift. So I thought about, well, you know,

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he's kind of dark, he's very halloweeny. Would he like that?

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I found the Keanu Reeves John Wick Jesus candle. So

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it's Christ with that typical white Jesus pose, but it's

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John Wick's head. It was awesome. That's an option. I

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just made a note of a couple of these. There

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are the vinyl coasters. This is right up my alley

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where instead of just the standard coasters for your drink

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on a table, these look like little forty five vinyl albums.

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And I guess the case for them is a record player.

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Looks like a record player, complete with a needle, stylust whatever.

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It's got the arm and everything. Well, I thought that's

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anti skid vinyl record coasters. That sounds like it might

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be a great gift. Light saber chopsticks. We both love

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us some sushi.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 2: I've tried the plastic chopsticks in the past, and I

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hate them. I'm one of those guys where if I

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go into a fancy sushi place and they give you

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the ceramic ones of the plastic ones, they're impossible to hold.

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Give me the cheap ass, snap open wooden chopsticks any day.

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They're easier to manage. But I like the idea light

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saber chopsticks. You can go in there and while you're

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eating it's like, you know, you can make the noises

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with your mouth. What else? Did I find? Band aids

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that look like hot dogs? Sterile adhesive bandages by Bioswiss.

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Why not stick a band aid that looks like food

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on your ali? I think that's I like it. This

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is a microcloth. It's actually the cleaning cloth that looks

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like dirty underwear. My brain would not be able to

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get by this because even though I know that when

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you pull it out of the package it is it's

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a sterile. It's a clean microcloth that you could use

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to wipe off the kitchen countertops or whatever. But it's underwear.

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It's these dingy, nasty, old school, tidy, whitey men's briefs.

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Your brain can't connect the two dots. All you see

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is dirty underwear. You know in your mind it is

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not just one of those things. There is the dumpster

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fire Christmas ornament. It says everything's fine, little green dumpster

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with plastic flame coming out of the top. Anyway, that's

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the kind of thing that I have been looking at.

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If you have a gag gift idea, stick it in

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the comment section because I would love to know what

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that is. What else is happening in your world, but

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US is on your mind, by the way I am.

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And by the time this goes out, it will have

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already aired, but it will be listed as a recent

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show on the Line YouTube channel. And if you haven't

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subscribed to the Line, you really should do so. It

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is an amazing channel where they're well, you know, a

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lot of the shows are about education. There's a lot

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of science, communication advocacy. Humanism is a recurrent theme, but

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especially on the Sunday shows, the two o'clock The Line

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Sunday Show and then the Line after Dark, it is

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talking to theists who are dialing in to prove their God.

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I am working on. I can't guarantee it's going to happen,

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but I am working on and getting pretty close to

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solidifying an actual tour date with Forrest Valci, Gut, Sick Gibbon,

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and myself in Tulsa, Oklahoma, probably the first Saturday in

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March of twenty twenty six. And we've been wanting to

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do something because we all live in relatively close proximity.

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We just thought it just makes sense. Plus when we

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get on stage, the clock flies and everybody has a

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good time and a great portion of whatever this event

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would be would be audience participation. And so I'm working

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through a venue and I'm looking at ensuring the event

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and how much is that going to cost, and then

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the logistics and the ticket prices and are there, you know,

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do the venues and what other requirements food minimums or

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something like that. We're not doing food. We're just going

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to do the event. My idea is lean and mean

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and fun and fast and March maybe March of twenty

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twenty six. If that happens, I'm going to make a

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big noise about it, put it on the website and

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make sure everybody knows. But tomorrow night, as i'm recording,

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which is a few days ago, for the recorded audience,

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I'm on the line with Forrest Valcai. Three hours of

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us hearing people dial in to defend the faith or

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talk about whatever, and that's just awesome. My point is this,

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if you have not subscribed, the line has a ton

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of hosts, and they've been kind enough to invite me

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to play along. I don't know if it's because I've

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been doing this a while or you know, the I

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don't know. They just occasionally have me come in and

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if you want to go back and see Forest Valci

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and myself in archive. I'm sure it's listed right there

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at the top of the feed switchboard. Wide open your

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calls on any subject. I would love to talk to you.

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I want to be able to roll with those for

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at least a half hour without having to stop. Let

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me take my short break here and I'll be right back.

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So I'm glad you're here. Thank you for listening. We

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are talking to our listeners today about whatever is on

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their mind. I've got six' one nine dialing in from

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not sure. Where, hi what DO i call? You what's your?

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Name I'm, Rick, rick appreciate you so, much my. Friend

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what's on your?

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Speaker 4: Mind i've been sitting on these thoughts for quite a while,

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now but it's been five years since the beginning of the.

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Pandemic and during that time it was twenty twenty and

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the pandemic got. Going and by the end of the,

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year In december, fourteenth my daughter CONTRACTED covid and she

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was perfectly, healthy and she ended up succumbing after a.

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Week suddenly she dropped over. Dead And i've never told

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this story to, anybody, REALLY i, Mean i've been dealing

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with grief ever, since BUT i thought it was, relevant

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SO i thought i'd call in and share a little

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bit of it with.

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Speaker 2: You, Well i'm tremendously sorry for what has happened in your.

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LIFE a little bit of a tonal. SHIFT i almost

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feel bad about bouncing around all of this levity at

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the beginning the opening monologue and then segueing into a

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very serious subject and a compelling, Call BUT i think

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it is something worth talking. About you lost your, daughter

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how long?

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Speaker 4: Ago, well it's been five years, now Come december. Fourteenth

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so it was already like most of the year into

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the pandemic in the first, year and things ramped up

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as far as a lot of people were, DYING a

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lot of typically older people were dying and people that

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had pre existing. Conditions but my, daughter she was actually

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the healthiest one in our, household and she was twenty,

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three and she CONTRACTED covid while she was Visiting, florida

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and she got, back she got diagnosed with it and

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was just at home six for a week and she

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just after a week she just over dead suddenly and

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go to the hospital and she was just, gone this

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sudden like.

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Speaker 2: That do you encounter people who hear your story and

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still discount the danger OF. Covid we had a neighbor

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who passed. Away we had somebody at one of the

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clubs nearby that passed, away AND i remember telling the

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story that they had, died that their families were, Grieving

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and yet many of, them those who still didn't believe

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00:14:30,279 --> 00:14:32,559
THAT covid nineteen was anything but some sort of a

236
00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:37,480
trumped up control conspiracy by the libs or whatever it,

237
00:14:37,559 --> 00:14:40,559
was or just fake they still didn't buy that it

238
00:14:40,639 --> 00:14:43,559
was truly. Deadly have you run into any of that

239
00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:45,039
given your, Case.

240
00:14:45,799 --> 00:14:48,000
Speaker 4: Yeah as some matter of, Fact like there have been

241
00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,399
multiple times WHERE i have shared a little bit of

242
00:14:51,399 --> 00:14:54,840
my story with. People on their first reaction was did

243
00:14:54,879 --> 00:14:58,039
she have to ask me if she had preexisting? Conditions

244
00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,279
AND i, said, well, now not That i'm aware, Of

245
00:15:02,879 --> 00:15:05,200
and what was. It what's interesting about that, IS i,

246
00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,039
mean it doesn't sit well with me WHEN i hear that.

247
00:15:08,159 --> 00:15:12,720
Question and for, one BECAUSE i remember during the, time you,

248
00:15:12,759 --> 00:15:17,120
know this whole uh you, know uh disinformation about wearing

249
00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:21,879
masks and everything was just like really, huge and and

250
00:15:21,919 --> 00:15:24,120
all these parents with their young kids that were in

251
00:15:24,159 --> 00:15:28,279
school were, all oh not the kids breath kick some masks,

252
00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:32,159
off but like they. Don't they didn't realize that anyone

253
00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:35,759
could succumb to, this any age, Person and it happened to,

254
00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:39,000
Us and we were in the, minority of, course uh you,

255
00:15:39,039 --> 00:15:43,080
Know AND i kept very aware of what statistics were

256
00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:46,480
going on at the time people that age and that age.

257
00:15:46,519 --> 00:15:50,120
Category there was only maybe a total of about maybe

258
00:15:50,519 --> 00:15:53,919
eleven hundred people in that first year a year and

259
00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:57,799
a half that. Died, anyway she was one of. Them

260
00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:00,480
and so but it happened to.

261
00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:05,000
Speaker 2: Anyone how many people have a pre existing. Condition it's so.

262
00:16:05,159 --> 00:16:08,639
DISMISSIVE i, mean it could be. Anything you could be immuno,

263
00:16:08,799 --> 00:16:12,399
compromised you could have heart, trouble you could have respiratory,

264
00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:15,559
issues it could be Any, NOW i would think most

265
00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:19,639
people probably have some kind of condition of some. Kind

266
00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:22,639
and for the response to first be, well what else

267
00:16:22,799 --> 00:16:28,600
was wrong with? Him really dismisses the danger AND i

268
00:16:28,639 --> 00:16:33,000
think marginalizes, it, minimizes it sort of discounts the very

269
00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:36,200
real trauma that you are going. Through i'm sorry that

270
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:39,799
that happened to. YOU i can hear obviously in your

271
00:16:39,879 --> 00:16:44,320
voice understandably that all of this is extremely difficult to

272
00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:47,399
talk about and it's very courageous for you to bring

273
00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:51,960
it up. Here did you want other people to understand

274
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:54,799
the dangers of? It is it a good medicine for

275
00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:56,840
you to be able to tell the? STORY i, mean

276
00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:58,759
tell me what motivated you to dial in.

277
00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:03,879
Speaker 4: Today i'm, Curious, Okay i've been thinking about this for a,

278
00:17:03,919 --> 00:17:08,319
while AND I i can't tell you how incredible it

279
00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:10,960
is to be able to share. This but you, know

280
00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:13,839
during the TIME i was, watching you, know during that first,

281
00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:17,000
year and they WERE i don't, KNOW i don't know

282
00:17:17,039 --> 00:17:19,799
how many people that ended up. Dying at least like

283
00:17:19,880 --> 00:17:24,880
one point two million people ended up, dying and most

284
00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:30,400
of them were immunely, compromised older. People AND i detected

285
00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:38,440
a distinct dismissiveness within people in general about the whole

286
00:17:39,079 --> 00:17:44,039
about the loss that this country was going, through and you,

287
00:17:44,079 --> 00:17:47,279
know as though it was an expendable part of our.

288
00:17:47,359 --> 00:17:51,720
Society older people and people are minimal. Compromised these were

289
00:17:51,759 --> 00:17:54,359
people had lives just like you AND i had every

290
00:17:54,440 --> 00:17:58,720
right to, full happy, lives and yet they get this

291
00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:05,880
disease that was being misinformed about on so many levels

292
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:10,079
that it was very upsetting to see this happen where

293
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:16,000
people were just sort of just Saying, okay no big.

294
00:18:16,039 --> 00:18:20,119
Deal they were already old and they were mainly, compromised

295
00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:24,119
so What but the thing, is you, know for, us

296
00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:26,920
it was a reality we were dealing with the reality

297
00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:29,400
is something that could take any of us at any

298
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:32,960
moment in. Time in our, family we have the three

299
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:35,519
of us left, now my wife and my daughter AND

300
00:18:35,599 --> 00:18:41,400
I and, afterwards we were still waiting for the vaccine

301
00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:46,319
to come. Out so when the vaccine became, available which

302
00:18:46,319 --> 00:18:49,640
is about a month after my daughter, died we were

303
00:18:49,759 --> 00:18:54,920
very concerned that maybe there was something that we were susceptible,

304
00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:58,680
to and specifically maybe it was a hereditary. Disposition who,

305
00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:01,599
KNOWS i, mean we didn't know anything about the this

306
00:19:01,759 --> 00:19:04,960
moving target of a virus that was going, around and

307
00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:10,200
so we were desperate to get. Vaccinated AND i literally

308
00:19:10,599 --> 00:19:13,279
like my, daughter which she would get in the car

309
00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:16,119
and she would drive be where she, could with the

310
00:19:16,519 --> 00:19:20,440
miles of, us to a location where people were getting,

311
00:19:20,519 --> 00:19:24,759
vaccinated and she would beg and, plead, please you, know

312
00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:28,640
CAN i get? Vaccinated like this happened to us and

313
00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:31,440
we're afraid and, stuff and she would come home heart

314
00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:36,920
broken and it killed me to see, this AND i

315
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:41,640
couldn't sit back and not take. Action SO i got

316
00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:44,519
up AND i went, out AND i went to the nearest,

317
00:19:44,559 --> 00:19:48,039
location AND i pleaded and begged and. Everything CAN i get?

318
00:19:48,039 --> 00:19:51,559
It you, know and for this reason and. Everything AND

319
00:19:51,599 --> 00:19:55,759
i remember at one point walking unhappily back to my

320
00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:59,039
car through this sparking lot where they were doing the vaccination,

321
00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:03,960
lines and there was there was a news trucks sitting

322
00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:06,720
there with some people just standing around looking for a

323
00:20:06,799 --> 00:20:09,200
story or, whatever AND i, thought for a, moment you,

324
00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:11,640
KNOW i should tell them what my, story you, know

325
00:20:11,759 --> 00:20:14,519
this is, probably but then it was so early in the,

326
00:20:14,559 --> 00:20:17,880
PANDEMIC i really didn't think too much about. It and

327
00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:22,400
then as time went, ON i, thought oh, MAN i

328
00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:26,039
really need to tell this. STORY i, mean you, know

329
00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:32,880
people don't understand that it could happen to. Anyone so, anyway, Really.

330
00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:37,480
Speaker 2: I'm trying to decide whether or NOT i should proceed,

331
00:20:37,559 --> 00:20:39,319
here BUT i. Will and you can tell me if

332
00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:42,839
you want to take the. Baton tell me about your.

333
00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:44,160
Daughter what was she?

334
00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:44,440
Speaker 5: Like?

335
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:51,240
Speaker 4: Sure oh, wow yeah that's a tough. One but, okay

336
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:55,640
well she was definitely a special. Child AND i mean

337
00:20:56,240 --> 00:21:00,799
we as parents have those special, children you, know and

338
00:21:00,839 --> 00:21:03,279
she was just one of, them and she was just

339
00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:05,400
she was a golden. Child and she was the one

340
00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:08,960
that you, know was the joy and and you, know

341
00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:14,000
made being a parent an amazing. Thing and she knows well,

342
00:21:14,039 --> 00:21:18,039
loved she loved, people and she just was just one

343
00:21:18,039 --> 00:21:21,359
of those bright shining. Lights like you hear other people

344
00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:26,480
and loose children who have described their children similars being

345
00:21:26,559 --> 00:21:29,920
this bright. Light and it's just so odd to be

346
00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:33,599
in this position THAT i never, thought you, know a

347
00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:37,759
much unimaginable position of you, know having to live the

348
00:21:37,759 --> 00:21:41,559
rest of my life without. Her and and but things

349
00:21:41,559 --> 00:21:47,880
have changed completely. Different LIKE i you, know you asked

350
00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:50,640
me about, Her BUT i MEAN i can go home

351
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:53,000
AND i can gush all night about and all day

352
00:21:53,039 --> 00:21:57,680
about her and who she was and. Everything BUT i, think,

353
00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:02,160
mmm what now is just like what has happened in

354
00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:07,319
the last five. Years it's like life is totally. Different you,

355
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:12,240
know grief of losing a child is it's so much

356
00:22:12,279 --> 00:22:16,119
more intense than any other kind of. Grief, now people

357
00:22:16,759 --> 00:22:19,920
grieve in their own way and their own time and so.

358
00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:24,000
Forth BUT i give you not grieving over the loss

359
00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:27,160
of a, child especially one that is you, know a

360
00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:30,680
well loved and loved child that you're connected to and

361
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:34,359
you have a, relationship especially an adult. Child she was twenty.

362
00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:36,000
Three it.

363
00:22:37,519 --> 00:22:37,880
Speaker 3: Ruins.

364
00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:42,799
Speaker 4: You it completely destroys you as a, person and you

365
00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:45,960
have to learn to live with. That you have to

366
00:22:46,119 --> 00:22:48,720
rethhold your life from the ground up and rethink everything

367
00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:53,400
because people will treat you. Different you lose, friends you lose,

368
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:57,559
family you love. Connections AND i think one of the

369
00:22:57,599 --> 00:23:00,839
THINGS i really wanted to mention most of all was

370
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,960
to have this kind of thing happen during a time

371
00:23:04,799 --> 00:23:11,039
when politics had become so divisive and with the way

372
00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:16,839
things are with misinformation due to largely probably social media

373
00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:21,359
and ease of. That but for that to have happened

374
00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,079
at a time of grief like, this it's made it

375
00:23:24,079 --> 00:23:28,839
so much. HARDER i could not grieve. PROPERLY i had

376
00:23:28,839 --> 00:23:32,759
to wait eight months to even have a. MEMORIAL i

377
00:23:32,759 --> 00:23:36,160
couldn't even a grieve properly from that. Loss and people

378
00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:40,480
don't get that. Either we Have trump an office again

379
00:23:40,519 --> 00:23:43,960
for the second, time after sitting on his, laurels you,

380
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:48,599
know during the first, administration when the pandemic was starting

381
00:23:48,599 --> 00:23:51,480
to really become a, problem and to see that, happen

382
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,039
and then for things to politically become so divided as

383
00:23:56,079 --> 00:24:00,319
a result of all the misinformation and conspiracy series out,

384
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:03,279
there and now to see him in an office, again

385
00:24:04,079 --> 00:24:07,720
it's like a continuing diamer for, me BECAUSE i honestly

386
00:24:07,759 --> 00:24:11,440
never wanted to be the guy of faith again ON

387
00:24:11,559 --> 00:24:14,640
tv or serious voice, again but here he's from wrecking,

388
00:24:15,759 --> 00:24:20,799
company wrecking our, democracy and it's, like it's like for everybody,

389
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:23,440
else you, know you can either not pay attention to

390
00:24:23,519 --> 00:24:26,640
what's going on or not have to deal with. Priests

391
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:30,200
But i've got to deal with, both and it's it's.

392
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:33,400
Speaker 2: Hard to see the man who said that they had

393
00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,759
pretty much ARRESTED covid when it, began and then to

394
00:24:36,799 --> 00:24:40,400
dismiss it and then spread disinformation about it in the

395
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:45,319
wake of such, suffering including and especially. Yours it's you,

396
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:47,680
know it's like almost like you've you've been dragged back

397
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:51,920
to the scene of the. Crime i'm so. Sorry, YEAH

398
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:57,400
i don't know if YOU'RE ds theis, SPIRITUAL i don't

399
00:24:57,400 --> 00:24:59,880
know where you. Fall are you a s?

400
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:05,559
Speaker 6: PERSON i don't believe In, God, OKAY i MEAN i

401
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:10,160
consider myself a spiritual person and you, know in, essence

402
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,880
but as far as powerful life, force things like that

403
00:25:14,079 --> 00:25:16,559
power you, know in the universe and stuff like, that

404
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:22,319
but can't possibly comprehend, Really but, No i'm not A.

405
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:26,680
Christian I'M i don't believe In, god AND i just

406
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:27,920
look at that as just a.

407
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:32,319
Speaker 2: Fantasy, Well i'm spending extra time BECAUSE i find this

408
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:35,200
a compelling conversation as long as you're okay with, this

409
00:25:35,559 --> 00:25:41,720
continuing to speak okay as a non religious. PERSON i

410
00:25:41,759 --> 00:25:45,240
know a lot of people in our. Culture the language

411
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:49,279
of love that they speak often has religious window dressing on.

412
00:25:49,319 --> 00:25:52,160
It we're praying for, you she's in a better, place

413
00:25:52,839 --> 00:25:55,799
all things work together for, good. Etc did you have

414
00:25:55,839 --> 00:25:58,680
to navigate some of? That i'll admit that much of

415
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:01,920
that is said with the best of. Intentions people often

416
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:04,920
often have a good, heart and it's just how they've

417
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,160
been trained to try to show that they love. You

418
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:10,559
did you navigate some of? That you, know one day

419
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:12,599
maybe you'll see you again kind of.

420
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:12,799
Speaker 1: Thing?

421
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:15,759
Speaker 4: Oh, sure you, Know AND i still do to some.

422
00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:19,880
Extent BUT i definitely went through and had to rethink

423
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:23,240
everything all over again in the ground. Up AND i

424
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,680
can honestly tell YOU I i'm still, back you, know

425
00:26:26,799 --> 00:26:30,440
at square one WHERE i started prior to. That but,

426
00:26:30,559 --> 00:26:32,720
YEAH i. DON'T i. DON'T i don't. Know there's this

427
00:26:32,759 --> 00:26:38,119
whole notion, of you, know of near death experiences That

428
00:26:38,279 --> 00:26:42,200
i've kind of go into a little bit and it's

429
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:46,160
a beautiful thing to think, about and it's you, know

430
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:50,319
BUT i just don't. KNOW i don't have enough. INFORMATION i,

431
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:55,079
mean to take things on faith alone without some evidence or,

432
00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:56,359
NOT i have a really hard time.

433
00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 2: WITH i would think that if and after life, exists

434
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:04,640
that if you'll pardon the, expression she would move heaven

435
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:08,240
and earth to find you, anyway, Right so we have

436
00:27:08,319 --> 00:27:10,960
to work with the evidence that we do. Have we

437
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,240
may not see evidence for a heaven or a life

438
00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:16,799
two point, Zero but what was it hitched?

439
00:27:16,839 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 4: That you?

440
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:21,079
Speaker 2: KNOW i rather like, surprises you, know we understand the

441
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:25,119
attraction of saying one day all the pieces will get

442
00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:28,079
put back together. Again as a secular, person do you

443
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:31,720
have any advice for anybody else who is navigating? Grief

444
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:36,440
this is a common subject in this. Culture that's a

445
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:36,880
really good.

446
00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:43,759
Speaker 4: Question, WELL i would say that grief like this is

447
00:27:43,799 --> 00:27:50,039
a very lonely place to, be and people need to

448
00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:54,680
understand that all we really need as a grieving parent

449
00:27:54,759 --> 00:27:58,200
of a, child all we really need is for people

450
00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:02,039
to show. Up it doesn't matter what you say or

451
00:28:02,079 --> 00:28:04,759
what you don't say as a concern because a lot

452
00:28:04,759 --> 00:28:07,039
of people really don't can't really understand. It and, no

453
00:28:07,839 --> 00:28:10,440
they just have to know to show, up be. There

454
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:13,680
AND i don't mean be there for a little while or.

455
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:20,359
WHATEVER i mean really be loyally there, forever because that

456
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:24,880
grief is, forever is forever, grief and it's unlike can

457
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:29,119
you have? Here and you know what's. Interesting she Died september,

458
00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:34,400
fourteenth twenty, twenty AND i retired In june the following.

459
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:38,079
Year on the third Of june twenty twenty, one and

460
00:28:38,799 --> 00:28:41,359
three four days, LATER i had a major heart attack

461
00:28:42,279 --> 00:28:45,079
BECAUSE i had a from WHEN i was in by.

462
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,720
Forties i'm sixty five. Now WHEN i was in my,

463
00:28:47,799 --> 00:28:51,240
FORTIES i had quadrup of blypas surgery and because my

464
00:28:51,559 --> 00:28:53,640
blood pressure was so high as a result of the

465
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:56,599
stress of, GRIEF i almost died because one of the

466
00:28:56,799 --> 00:28:59,440
grass wore AND i ended up in the hospital and

467
00:29:00,079 --> 00:29:02,160
were able to save. Me and HERE i am. Still

468
00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:05,960
but the point is is that there was so much

469
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:09,279
going on at that time and the stress was so.

470
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:14,599
Incredible but now five years, Later i've lost most of my.

471
00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:18,359
Friends i've lost most of my. Family i've got two

472
00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,960
siblings who are trumps and, addicts AND i can't talk

473
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:26,039
TO i just can't have a. Conversation they're Just my

474
00:29:26,759 --> 00:29:31,119
brother feels like as long as he has his ever Nectins,

475
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:35,559
dash he's. Fine and my sister thinks, that you, Know

476
00:29:35,599 --> 00:29:38,440
biden should be. Shot you, know that's just a kind

477
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:43,720
of lunacy in the, mindset in these mother and, Mindsets

478
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:46,279
and and HERE i am not just like the outlier,

479
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:52,319
here And i'm. Alone i've lost, friends not just because

480
00:29:52,359 --> 00:29:55,400
of the way that they receive and treat, me but

481
00:29:55,519 --> 00:29:58,279
BECAUSE i really don't want to subject them to. ME

482
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,319
i DON'T i don't think it would be. Fair, HONESTLY

483
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:07,839
i know that may sound, strange but after a while

484
00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:10,319
you start to do these, things you start to realize

485
00:30:10,319 --> 00:30:13,440
that people are better off in some cases without.

486
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:13,559
Speaker 7: You.

487
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 4: Well as far as a religious, THING i, NO i,

488
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:24,279
mean saith is a beautiful. Thing it's a beautiful. Notion

489
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:28,920
some people can take things on base value easier than,

490
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:31,319
others AND i just always been one of those that.

491
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:34,680
Can't AND i need to understand more and have more,

492
00:30:34,759 --> 00:30:40,240
scientific solid. EVIDENCE i think religion provides a beautiful a

493
00:30:40,279 --> 00:30:45,519
beautiful way for people to, cope in a beautiful way

494
00:30:45,559 --> 00:30:50,279
for people to feel like a sense of belonginess connectedness

495
00:30:50,319 --> 00:30:54,920
with other. People but that's just not. Me ever SINCE

496
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:56,200
i was a, CHILD i was like.

497
00:30:56,279 --> 00:31:00,519
Speaker 2: THAT i have a. SUSPICION i don't want to be

498
00:31:00,559 --> 00:31:02,839
too romantic about, this BUT i don't think it's an

499
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:07,400
overreach to say that if your daughter was or is looking,

500
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:12,440
down that she would want you to find joy and

501
00:31:12,599 --> 00:31:17,319
connection and purpose and some good. STUFF i know that

502
00:31:19,079 --> 00:31:21,960
these sounds so empty calorie when you say them out,

503
00:31:22,039 --> 00:31:26,759
loud BUT i THINK i would assume she would want

504
00:31:26,799 --> 00:31:27,079
you to.

505
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:30,319
Speaker 4: Live, no the first thing you should say, that because

506
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:33,240
you KNOW i have thought about this a lot about

507
00:31:33,519 --> 00:31:37,319
like what would your daughter want for? You of course

508
00:31:37,319 --> 00:31:39,640
she would want all those. Things she would want me

509
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,079
to live the best, life to be, happy to do,

510
00:31:43,119 --> 00:31:45,680
this do, that and so, forth and that's all. Great

511
00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:50,200
but the reality is it's just not that. Way IT'S i, mean,

512
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:52,920
SURE i think about, that AND i try my best

513
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:58,079
to implement that, mindset but the fact, Is i'm Just i'm.

514
00:31:58,119 --> 00:32:02,400
Devastated i'm a shell Ofwy ding that died that.

515
00:32:02,519 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 2: Day it's easy for other people to, say buck, Up.

516
00:32:06,079 --> 00:32:09,559
Camper you KNOW i understand. You it's not like you

517
00:32:09,599 --> 00:32:13,279
can control the shattering of your, life and you're doing

518
00:32:13,319 --> 00:32:15,759
the best you. Can i'd like you if you, Would,

519
00:32:16,079 --> 00:32:20,640
rick when we're, done to browse through the comments THAT

520
00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,039
i have just sort of barely been able to keep

521
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:26,079
up with out of the corner of my, eye because

522
00:32:26,119 --> 00:32:28,880
there is an outpouring of love for. You there's an

523
00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:32,480
outpouring of sympathy and empathy and. Goodness AND i think

524
00:32:32,519 --> 00:32:35,160
there's just a group hog that is happening here in this.

525
00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:38,160
Audience is they hear the sound of your, voice a

526
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,000
desire to make, you at least for the, moment realize

527
00:32:41,039 --> 00:32:43,559
that you are not, alone or that other people get,

528
00:32:43,599 --> 00:32:46,799
you and they grieve with, you even though they didn't

529
00:32:46,839 --> 00:32:50,599
know your daughter. Personally they understand what loss is and

530
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:53,880
they understand when they hear heartbreak in your, voice and

531
00:32:54,079 --> 00:32:56,799
they want only the best for you and some kind

532
00:32:56,839 --> 00:32:59,799
of path. Forward take a few, minutes when you get a,

533
00:32:59,799 --> 00:33:02,720
few and go back and maybe you'll find some encouragement,

534
00:33:02,799 --> 00:33:05,400
there and just know that you know you've always got

535
00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:07,759
a place, Here, rick for what it is. Worth and

536
00:33:07,799 --> 00:33:12,160
it's extremely courageous to tell your daughter's. STORY i hope

537
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,200
that others carry it with them as, well and remember

538
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:18,440
to seize the, moments you, know because this is a, finite,

539
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:21,319
fragile temporary life and you just never, know.

540
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 4: Right, yeah, yeah, WELL i certainly appreciate your opportunity to

541
00:33:27,079 --> 00:33:29,759
get on here and talk about. IT i actually had

542
00:33:29,799 --> 00:33:33,160
not prepared myself for. THIS i just turned on YouTube

543
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:34,400
and there you, were AND i called.

544
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 2: In you did go, great you Are you're really, honestly

545
00:33:40,279 --> 00:33:43,839
you're an extremely compelling person to speak, with and it's

546
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:46,039
my honor to have had you on the, show AND

547
00:33:46,759 --> 00:33:49,160
i thank. You thank you for sharing part of yourself

548
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:52,519
with all of. Us and we're just hugging you from out. Here,

549
00:33:52,599 --> 00:33:54,519
okay thank, you, Sir thank you.

550
00:33:54,559 --> 00:33:55,759
Speaker 4: AGAIN i appreciate you very.

551
00:33:55,839 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 2: Much All, right thank, You. Rick take. Care navigate the

552
00:34:00,319 --> 00:34:04,039
loss of a loved one, anyway but the loss of

553
00:34:04,079 --> 00:34:09,280
a child and then to tell that story, here that's pretty.

554
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:13,719
Remarkable we've done shows in the past on loss and.

555
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:17,960
Grief maybe we'll have to talk about this again as

556
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:21,639
we approach the new year or get into twenty twenty.

557
00:34:21,679 --> 00:34:24,639
Six it's you, know it's one of those subjects that

558
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:27,880
everybody seems to deal. With it's almost, like you, know

559
00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:30,840
when you talk about addiction recovery or someone who has

560
00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:34,000
been you, know is trying to escape or has escaped

561
00:34:34,039 --> 00:34:37,880
a high control, culture whether it's a high control family

562
00:34:38,039 --> 00:34:41,159
or a cult or. WHATEVER i, mean everybody's if it

563
00:34:41,159 --> 00:34:45,440
hasn't touched them, directly they know someone and maybe that's an.

564
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:49,079
Opportunity maybe we should think about going back and talking

565
00:34:49,119 --> 00:34:53,320
about grief and loss and pointing people to resources that

566
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:58,000
might support them and devastating time in their. Life i've

567
00:34:58,039 --> 00:35:02,679
Got ben dialing in from eight zero. One thanks for your. Patients,

568
00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:03,960
ben are you, There.

569
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:06,679
Speaker 3: YES i am. Here it's nice to talk to you

570
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:09,400
with You seth you. TOO i actually called in before

571
00:35:09,559 --> 00:35:11,719
fifteen years? Ago was?

572
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,679
Speaker 2: THAT i THINK i started the show in twenty, ten

573
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:18,360
that was the first year and you were a. Caller,

574
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:23,400
yeah my mind is. BLOWN i suppose you remember what

575
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,719
we talked about after a decade and a, half BUT i.

576
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:32,920
Speaker 3: Do, actually you had a guest on and the subject

577
00:35:33,159 --> 00:35:37,480
was talking about using science to free you from, religion you,

578
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:42,440
know your mind becoming free because of, science AND i

579
00:35:42,519 --> 00:35:45,519
just wanted to call in and say. That it's like

580
00:35:45,639 --> 00:35:50,679
between your videos and your guest videos that that actually

581
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:52,440
helped me escape the CULT i was.

582
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:55,599
Speaker 2: In can you talk about the, cult what it, wants

583
00:35:55,639 --> 00:36:01,199
what it, Did mormonism high control, Is mormonism is shunning.

584
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:04,039
CULTURE i know JW's are they.

585
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:07,079
Speaker 3: Are, not BUT i still consider them a cult because

586
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,800
they have a lot of other things about them that

587
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:14,599
are very cult like, specifically you're not allowed to question.

588
00:36:14,679 --> 00:36:21,719
Authority if you criticize any of the, leadership you'll get.

589
00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:25,360
Excommunicated you are required to pay ten percent of your

590
00:36:25,400 --> 00:36:29,239
income to fund Their oh, GOSH i think there's something

591
00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:32,559
like five hundred billion dollar. Religion now it's.

592
00:36:32,599 --> 00:36:36,920
Speaker 2: Insane my other wired into businesses all around the. Country

593
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:40,039
it's an, industry The Mormon, church oh very.

594
00:36:40,079 --> 00:36:40,239
Speaker 3: Much.

595
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:42,880
Speaker 2: So, yes that had to have been a rough. Journey

596
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,760
how you doing, Now, Oh i'm doing.

597
00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:51,519
Speaker 3: AMAZING i found my ground and now you, know still,

598
00:36:51,559 --> 00:36:54,880
Atheist no, need no, feel no reason to go back

599
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:59,280
to any type of religious. Thinking SOMETIMES i think maybe

600
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,679
they like the idea of heaven or you, know being

601
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:04,800
able to see your loved ones. Again that appeals to.

602
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:08,159
Me but THEN i have to remember things THAT i

603
00:37:08,239 --> 00:37:10,840
want and things that are are not always the, same

604
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:12,320
AND i just have to deal with.

605
00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:16,599
Speaker 2: It did they promise you your own? Planet seems Like

606
00:37:16,679 --> 00:37:19,880
Jimmy snow said you get your own planet In, mormonism

607
00:37:20,119 --> 00:37:24,440
BUT i can't. Recall is It colob or something along those.

608
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:25,199
LINES i can't.

609
00:37:25,199 --> 00:37:28,639
Speaker 3: Remember, oh, okay, Okay i'll get into a little of

610
00:37:28,679 --> 00:37:34,840
the Weird mormonism war. Here So colob IS i guess

611
00:37:35,159 --> 00:37:40,440
the first star in the cosmos that was created By

612
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:46,480
iloheen Or god The, Father AND i guess his home

613
00:37:46,559 --> 00:37:49,800
is a little planet that goes Around colob that. Star

614
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:53,760
that's how that. WORKS i. See getting your own, planet,

615
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:57,000
yes was part of the doctrine WHEN i was growing,

616
00:37:57,119 --> 00:38:01,280
up and THEN i was really shocked to find this.

617
00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:04,840
Out only a few years ago they changed that. Doctrine

618
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:08,559
so now you don't get your own. Planet what a?

619
00:38:08,679 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 2: Ripoff you, know you signed up for your own world

620
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:16,239
and then they just rip it out from underneath. You

621
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:20,920
a bait and. Switch i'm offended by THE Lds. Church

622
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:24,039
how dare? They how dare? They how long have you

623
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:26,960
been out of The Mormon? Church how many? Years?

624
00:38:27,559 --> 00:38:32,559
Speaker 3: Oh, oh it's fifteen sixteen. YEARS i was having my

625
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:36,440
doubts about the time you started your, show and it

626
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,760
was your videos and, oh. GOSH i WISH i could

627
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:41,719
remember the name of your. Guest i'd have to go

628
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,039
hunting through my YouTube history to find him because he

629
00:38:44,079 --> 00:38:49,119
hasn't made videos in. Years but between you and your,

630
00:38:49,159 --> 00:38:52,039
Guest i'd watched your videos and that just LIKE i

631
00:38:52,079 --> 00:38:54,079
was already having, doubts and that just pushed me over the.

632
00:38:54,199 --> 00:38:55,400
Edge was, Like, Okay i've had enough.

633
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:59,880
Speaker 2: This, wow it blows my. Mind we in the host

634
00:39:00,159 --> 00:39:03,280
chair are desperate to feel like we're not just talking

635
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:06,719
to ourselves or that it actually, matters and you, know

636
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:09,719
does it make a difference or AM i just full of?

637
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:13,880
It and to hear somebody say that that the show

638
00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:18,480
benefited them on their journey is a, massive massive encouragement to.

639
00:39:18,519 --> 00:39:20,920
Me and to know that you've been around for the

640
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:24,880
last fifteen, YEARS i am just honored beyond. Words so

641
00:39:25,599 --> 00:39:28,239
you called to thank, Me, ben But i'm thinking you right.

642
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:30,400
Back i'm glad you bust it. Out i'm glad you

643
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:33,199
found your own. Voice it took tremendous courage to do

644
00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:36,039
what you. Did so hi five from me and my

645
00:39:36,159 --> 00:39:37,000
family to you and.

646
00:39:37,039 --> 00:39:40,639
Speaker 3: Yours, OKAY i appreciate, it, Sir all, right keep doing

647
00:39:40,639 --> 00:39:40,920
what you're.

648
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:43,800
Speaker 2: Doing i'll do my, best take, Care we'll see you.

649
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:47,679
Later you, know it's. Funny after you do this long,

650
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:51,960
enough a couple of things, Happen And i'm not. Complaining,

651
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:54,440
Honestly i'm tremendously honored to be able to do WHAT

652
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:57,840
i do full. Time i've been a full time activist

653
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:00,840
for over ten years. Now to be able to do

654
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:03,079
that a, privilege to be able to do what you

655
00:40:03,199 --> 00:40:05,639
love and love what you do right despite the. Challenges

656
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:09,559
and you, know there's a roller. Coaster anybody who does

657
00:40:09,559 --> 00:40:13,239
any sort of creative work or activist work struggles with life.

658
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:16,719
Balance you, know you struggle with trying to keep up

659
00:40:16,760 --> 00:40:20,199
with it. All but a couple of things. Happen the

660
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:22,719
first thing is is you become aware of those people

661
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:25,280
who sort of dropped off the. Radar he had mentioned

662
00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:27,679
a guest who is no longer making, videos which is.

663
00:40:27,719 --> 00:40:30,639
Fine sometimes you find people will have moved on to

664
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:33,440
the next chapter of their. Lives so they were an

665
00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:37,760
activist back in two thousand and, nine, ten twenty, twelve

666
00:40:38,559 --> 00:40:42,280
and all of a sudden they stopped making videos and

667
00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:46,599
maybe the life changed caused them to just go. Elsewhere

668
00:40:46,639 --> 00:40:48,719
and you're, like, WELL i wonder whatever happened to. Them

669
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:52,519
so that's one. Phenomenon the other one is that the

670
00:40:52,599 --> 00:40:56,159
LONGER i have done, THIS i see the next generation

671
00:40:56,239 --> 00:40:58,960
of activists who are kicking. IN i find a little

672
00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:00,960
bit of this systory WHEN i co host on the

673
00:41:01,079 --> 00:41:05,599
line and these young. Guns they're young and hungry and

674
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:09,760
vibrant and vivacious and so full of, ideas and you,

675
00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:12,880
know these people can stay up twenty hours a day

676
00:41:13,079 --> 00:41:18,079
producing and, creating and you know they're just. Tireless and

677
00:41:18,559 --> 00:41:21,400
they go in AND i find LIKE i could have

678
00:41:21,599 --> 00:41:25,199
fathered all the people on this panel if it's kind

679
00:41:25,199 --> 00:41:27,280
of a kid something that pops, in Like i'm old

680
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:31,039
enough to have fathered the. PEOPLE i did a conference

681
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:34,840
a few years ago Called Faithless, forum which had a

682
00:41:34,840 --> 00:41:38,159
bunch of young gun YouTubers, featured and they asked me

683
00:41:38,199 --> 00:41:41,639
to come out and do a presentation AND i was tremendously.

684
00:41:41,639 --> 00:41:43,719
Honored it was a lot of, fun BUT i said

685
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:46,320
from the, STAGE i almost feel like the elder who

686
00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:49,760
has been asked to come and bless the. Tribe you,

687
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:54,840
KNOW i bless the you, KNOW i passed my baton

688
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:57,400
unto thee and THEN i GUESS i go off into

689
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:02,159
the wilderness and you, know canoes and we baskets AND

690
00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:04,920
i don't know What i'm supposed to, do but you

691
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:10,440
do find that the culture. Changes so then you, wonder,

692
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,800
well you, know what is what is my life as

693
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:18,199
an activist look like in the next ten, Years and you,

694
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:21,039
know WILL i still have something to say or? Contribute

695
00:42:21,079 --> 00:42:23,719
WILL i age out of? It or you, know WILL

696
00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:27,159
i become obsolete or WILL i become like the Elder

697
00:42:27,199 --> 00:42:30,079
statesman and they're, like, oh, Yeah, seth you know he's

698
00:42:30,079 --> 00:42:34,719
been around for twenty five years instead of fifteen. Years

699
00:42:35,679 --> 00:42:38,920
or will they be, like holy, shit that Guy's methuselah

700
00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:42,960
next and they click. Through you just you have these

701
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:47,000
conversations as an activist in your. MIND i don't divide

702
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:51,320
world changing out by. DEMOGRAPHIC i think you can be

703
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:58,119
twelve or one hundred and. TWO i really think it's about, ability, availability, passion.

704
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,920
Desire you, know anybody anywhere can be an. ADVOCATE i

705
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:05,519
think we all have something to. Contribute and so there

706
00:43:05,559 --> 00:43:08,239
are some people, like, well it's a young person's game

707
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:11,760
or it's not a young person's. GAME i don't really

708
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:16,280
divide people like. That do what you? Do, YEAH i Told,

709
00:43:16,360 --> 00:43:21,119
Natalie i'm never going to. Retire, RETIREMENT i think is

710
00:43:21,159 --> 00:43:25,320
the number one killer of a lot of, people the

711
00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:28,239
lack of. Purpose how many people have we seen in their?

712
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:30,119
Lives AND i promise You i'll get to the next

713
00:43:30,159 --> 00:43:33,320
call in just a. Second but how do we get

714
00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:38,320
to the point where the goal is to? Work, work, work, work, work,

715
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:40,880
work work until you get to this specific age when

716
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:44,840
social security kicks in and you quit your, job and

717
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:51,599
then you sit and you put her around and you watch,

718
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:56,519
television and maybe you take yourself out to. Eat you

719
00:43:56,599 --> 00:43:59,199
might take a trip from time to. Time BUT i,

720
00:43:59,199 --> 00:44:03,480
mean where's the? Goal where's the? Purpose not all of.

721
00:44:03,559 --> 00:44:06,119
RETIREES a lot of people who retire are always into.

722
00:44:06,159 --> 00:44:09,480
Something they just start a new. Chapter AND i think

723
00:44:09,519 --> 00:44:13,079
those people Are they're WHAT i want to. Be like

724
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:18,239
you are pursuing. Something you set, goals you achieve, goals

725
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:20,880
you set new. GOALS i don't think age is a

726
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:24,199
limiter of. That and so you, know even IF i

727
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:27,559
won the, lottery as IF i ever play the, lottery

728
00:44:27,719 --> 00:44:31,239
but let's SAY i won the lottery, TOMORROW i would

729
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:34,920
still be an. ACTIVIST i would not be sitting dormant.

730
00:44:35,039 --> 00:44:39,079
SOMEWHERE i, mean WOULD i want to live closer to

731
00:44:39,199 --> 00:44:41,800
water that is not brown and where there are Not

732
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:44,599
trump flags on every other. House, Okay i'll do. THAT

733
00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:48,000
i might, move But i'm always going to be engaged

734
00:44:48,039 --> 00:44:51,199
in some. Way AND i think everybody has something to.

735
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:55,199
Contribute people will sometimes, ask, WELL i want to be

736
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:57,039
a part of. It what DO i? DO i should

737
00:44:57,039 --> 00:45:00,239
start a, PODCAST i should have a YouTube, channel should

738
00:45:00,239 --> 00:45:02,079
write a. Book, WELL i don't know if you should or.

739
00:45:02,119 --> 00:45:04,880
NOT i think the question starts with what are your?

740
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:09,079
Gifts what are you good? At BECAUSE i guarantee you

741
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:13,639
if verbal communication is not your, thing a podcast is

742
00:45:13,679 --> 00:45:19,719
a terrible. Idea if written language is a foreign language to,

743
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:22,800
you it's not something that you do easily or, well

744
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:25,079
or you don't. Enjoy you don't have to write a

745
00:45:25,119 --> 00:45:33,320
book or a, blog a sub stack. Whatever musicians, make, music, painters,

746
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:39,320
paints orators. Speak everybody's got something that they can do

747
00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:43,320
that positively impacts the. Culture AND i always, say start

748
00:45:43,519 --> 00:45:47,599
there and start where you. Are that's WHAT i did

749
00:45:47,639 --> 00:45:51,719
for what it was. Worth and Somehow i'm still. Kicking

750
00:45:53,079 --> 00:45:56,800
the tribal elder has not yet been banished off into

751
00:45:56,800 --> 00:46:06,480
the forest to. Die oh thank, goodness but the day

752
00:46:06,599 --> 00:46:07,239
is young.

753
00:46:08,599 --> 00:46:09,079
Speaker 3: The day is.

754
00:46:09,159 --> 00:46:15,400
Speaker 2: Young my wife did catch me playing bingo on my cell.

755
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:19,559
Phone there's a bingo. App i'll own that. One, YEAH

756
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:26,519
b seven, thing oh sixty, Six, YEAH i was doing.

757
00:46:26,559 --> 00:46:29,920
It i'll own. It i'll own. It, okay hang, ON

758
00:46:30,039 --> 00:46:32,840
i have a lot more people on the switchboard and

759
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:43,000
we're going to have a lot more. Conversations. Next i'm

760
00:46:43,039 --> 00:46:47,400
going To denver speaking For Secular Hub december the. Sixth

761
00:46:47,400 --> 00:46:50,079
that is A saturday doors, OPEN i think around four

762
00:46:50,679 --> 00:46:54,639
and we started five and all our welcome details The

763
00:46:54,880 --> 00:47:02,599
thinkingatheist dot com slash, Events i've got seven one? Seven

764
00:47:03,119 --> 00:47:07,840
is It? Garrison who is dialing? In my name Is? Garrison?

765
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:11,880
Speaker 5: Sir then listen to your stuff for a little while.

766
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:14,119
Now AND i just wanted to start off by saying

767
00:47:14,199 --> 00:47:17,760
that thank you for being as kind as you. ARE

768
00:47:18,159 --> 00:47:20,760
i think that is something that intimidates a lot of

769
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:25,039
people into saying that they're an atheist because of there's

770
00:47:25,079 --> 00:47:26,719
not a Mister rogers like you around.

771
00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:32,119
Speaker 2: Immediately, WELL i have my, moments but, OVERALL i feel

772
00:47:32,159 --> 00:47:34,320
Like i'm pretty level. Headed you. Know HOW i get

773
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:36,360
through a lot of it is THAT i try to

774
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:39,559
think how much power AM i going to give a total,

775
00:47:39,639 --> 00:47:43,480
Stranger like when somebody calls the line and they are

776
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:46,280
saying some of the dumbest Stuff i've ever, heard or

777
00:47:46,320 --> 00:47:48,800
maybe they're just being. OFFENSIVE i don't, know BUT i

778
00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:50,800
always think to, myself how much power AM i going

779
00:47:50,840 --> 00:47:54,480
to give that person over in my, attitude my. Temperament

780
00:47:55,119 --> 00:47:57,800
DO i consider the? Source DO i just sort of

781
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:00,280
shrug and smile and wink and try to have a

782
00:48:00,280 --> 00:48:03,440
little fun with? It or DO i let them push

783
00:48:03,519 --> 00:48:06,360
my buttons the buttons THAT i gave them access? To

784
00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:09,239
AND i think that's been a tactic that has worked for.

785
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:13,719
Me not, perfect but thanks for, Noticing. Garrison what else

786
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:15,480
is on your? MIND i hear some beeping in the.

787
00:48:15,519 --> 00:48:18,039
Background are you? Driving are you getting that out of

788
00:48:18,039 --> 00:48:19,199
a car or? Something or what's?

789
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:22,559
Speaker 5: Up i'm just on my way back to my house

790
00:48:22,639 --> 00:48:26,039
after dropping off my. GRANDMOTHER i patch on my headset,

791
00:48:26,039 --> 00:48:27,599
here SO i apologize for Any.

792
00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:29,360
Speaker 3: You're fun for a road noise, Here you're.

793
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:32,679
Speaker 5: Fine BUT i had on my, mind like my prompts

794
00:48:32,679 --> 00:48:35,800
at a sort of family members in the age Of.

795
00:48:35,920 --> 00:48:40,400
TRUMP i come from a family that is largely conservative And.

796
00:48:40,599 --> 00:48:45,599
REPUBLICAN i have a cousin he is A pentecostal, castor

797
00:48:46,480 --> 00:48:51,559
and they all feel pretty strongly about the current administration

798
00:48:52,480 --> 00:48:57,480
and how sort of righteous it. Is, however myself and

799
00:48:57,519 --> 00:49:01,199
my wife are both, atheists and we're both fairly left,

800
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:05,440
leaning but we both are more, MODERATE.

801
00:49:05,079 --> 00:49:05,599
Speaker 8: I, think than.

802
00:49:05,679 --> 00:49:09,079
Speaker 5: Anything but the sort of side Of republican things just

803
00:49:09,239 --> 00:49:13,519
is so, very so very little to identify. With my

804
00:49:13,599 --> 00:49:17,519
wife Is Korean american and our son is of course Half,

805
00:49:17,599 --> 00:49:24,159
korean and it's very very strange of how people can you, know, say, oh,

806
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:27,119
yeah Mister trump is doing all this good stuff for

807
00:49:27,239 --> 00:49:31,000
us and everything like, that when all you have to

808
00:49:31,039 --> 00:49:34,960
turn around and do is is see how he has

809
00:49:35,039 --> 00:49:40,280
made the country more dangerous for your family. Members BECAUSE

810
00:49:40,920 --> 00:49:45,880
i met my wife after his first, administration but, she you,

811
00:49:45,920 --> 00:49:48,320
know had all kinds of stories of people who felt

812
00:49:48,599 --> 00:49:52,760
emboldened to you, know just be generally ruder to her

813
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,719
and up to just being, rude to being outright. Racist

814
00:49:57,119 --> 00:50:00,920
and it really really worries me for my, son who

815
00:50:01,039 --> 00:50:02,360
just turned one year.

816
00:50:02,239 --> 00:50:03,599
Speaker 3: Old a couple of weeks.

817
00:50:03,639 --> 00:50:07,199
Speaker 5: Ago you know that he's gonna grow up in this

818
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:11,119
era where people feel with you, know just being nasty

819
00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:12,599
is someone that doesn't.

820
00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:16,000
Speaker 4: Look like, them and the fact that a.

821
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:19,199
Speaker 5: Good portion of his family members may sort of fall

822
00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:22,239
into that sort of. Spectrum is is very.

823
00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:25,280
Speaker 2: Troubling it has been a black light at the crime,

824
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:29,679
scene hasn't. IT i have noticed that the racist feel

825
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:32,920
like they can be more publicly. Racist and many of

826
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,880
the people we thought we knew, well we realized we

827
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:37,920
didn't really know them as well as we thought we.

828
00:50:37,960 --> 00:50:40,039
Did and the more we, know the more grieved we.

829
00:50:40,159 --> 00:50:44,840
BECOME i, KNOW i think about some people in my own.

830
00:50:45,039 --> 00:50:49,440
Family i've got one in my brain right. Now she

831
00:50:49,679 --> 00:50:52,320
likes to talk about the blacks and the blacks do,

832
00:50:52,440 --> 00:50:55,360
this and the blacks do, that as if the blacks

833
00:50:55,400 --> 00:50:59,079
are a, monolith like they're all. One you, Know African

834
00:50:59,119 --> 00:51:03,239
americans are the blacks first of, all that's the way

835
00:51:03,280 --> 00:51:07,880
it rolls. Out just sounds tremendously dismissive and. Dehumanizing but beyond,

836
00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:12,400
that she has taken first and what everybody who Has

837
00:51:12,519 --> 00:51:15,360
African american, descent by the, way we are All. Africans

838
00:51:15,559 --> 00:51:19,079
everybody who Has African american, descent they all they all do,

839
00:51:19,239 --> 00:51:21,599
this they all do. That and it tells you how

840
00:51:21,639 --> 00:51:27,679
reductive and simplistic and dismissive and really horrible this type

841
00:51:27,679 --> 00:51:30,760
of thinking is it's. Interesting let me just detour for a.

842
00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:34,159
Second my nephew married a lovely woman From South korea

843
00:51:34,159 --> 00:51:37,199
and moved To South, korea AND i had a chance

844
00:51:37,239 --> 00:51:39,880
to speak to him last. Year he lives there, now

845
00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:42,599
but he came back to The. States she won't come

846
00:51:42,639 --> 00:51:47,280
here now because she's terrified, that you, know something will.

847
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:51,119
Happen we've got an anti immigration, campaign we've got The

848
00:51:51,159 --> 00:51:55,239
American gestapo out, there so it's. Understandable but it's funny

849
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:58,880
because he's like almost six feet tall and so. White

850
00:51:58,920 --> 00:52:02,480
he could be seen from space, right and as he's

851
00:52:02,559 --> 00:52:07,880
walking Through South, korea apparently he really sticks out Like

852
00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:14,400
americans in these you. Know he, says, Hell, YEAH i

853
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:16,880
don't know What i'm hearing in the. Background are you mowing?

854
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:19,199
Now are you an air?

855
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:21,440
Speaker 5: Hanger oh, No i'm just agreeing with.

856
00:52:21,480 --> 00:52:25,159
Speaker 2: You oh, NO i heard something in THE i wanted

857
00:52:25,199 --> 00:52:27,760
my listeners to know what that. Was so, ANYWAY i

858
00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:31,079
understand you are concerned about the very real racism that

859
00:52:31,159 --> 00:52:33,679
is happening in this, country or that at least is

860
00:52:33,679 --> 00:52:34,719
happening more. Publicly.

861
00:52:35,079 --> 00:52:39,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, Absolutely and it's what you're describing of your nephew

862
00:52:39,639 --> 00:52:41,480
is almost exactly what it.

863
00:52:41,519 --> 00:52:41,960
Speaker 3: IS i.

864
00:52:42,039 --> 00:52:45,360
Speaker 5: AM i am as white as white can, get you,

865
00:52:45,360 --> 00:52:49,920
know All german And english, ancestry and frank wife is

866
00:52:50,239 --> 00:52:54,639
both of her parents are expat so she is Full korean.

867
00:52:54,320 --> 00:52:55,000
Speaker 3: But born In.

868
00:52:55,039 --> 00:52:58,400
Speaker 5: America and you know when sort of people see us,

869
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:01,119
together you, know she fits UNDER i Are i'm six

870
00:53:01,159 --> 00:53:04,559
foot two and you know she's four foot, ten so

871
00:53:05,119 --> 00:53:10,440
we we really stick. Out but it's people can treat her.

872
00:53:10,599 --> 00:53:14,760
Differently but then IF i sort of enter the picture

873
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:17,840
or come around the, corner as it, were you can

874
00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:22,719
see the attitude, change and it's just really. Troubling and

875
00:53:22,760 --> 00:53:27,159
then sort of layered on top of that of you,

876
00:53:27,199 --> 00:53:30,639
know the religious rhetoric that often goes along with this

877
00:53:30,719 --> 00:53:33,599
thing of like you've touched upon, IT i think a

878
00:53:33,599 --> 00:53:37,360
lot in the last six months to a year of you,

879
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:40,119
know oh, well this is our manifest, destiny this is

880
00:53:40,159 --> 00:53:42,840
sort of our god given, right and it's sort of

881
00:53:43,880 --> 00:53:46,840
it's so aggravating to me THAT i can't talk to

882
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:52,280
my family members about this stuff because they are very

883
00:53:52,679 --> 00:53:56,719
a very faithful type of. Family and my cousin AND

884
00:53:56,719 --> 00:53:58,760
i mentioned it as a. Pastor he AND i have

885
00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:02,920
sort of coming to an unspoken arrangement that we don't

886
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:06,400
really talk about, religion and unfortunately it's now comes to

887
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:09,679
that we don't really talk about politics, either BECAUSE i

888
00:54:09,719 --> 00:54:12,880
don't agree, with you, know what his politics, are because

889
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:16,280
he falls much more on A republican side of. Things

890
00:54:16,960 --> 00:54:23,360
and it's And i've back in twenty, sixteen twenty, SEVENTEEN

891
00:54:23,400 --> 00:54:25,679
i tried to sort of relate to him of just

892
00:54:25,719 --> 00:54:29,119
sort of what a toxic individual That trump was turning

893
00:54:29,159 --> 00:54:32,239
out to be because he's a. Veteran AND i, said,

894
00:54:32,599 --> 00:54:34,920
well look at this stuff that he said he would

895
00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:38,679
do for, veterans and he's not doing. It he's promised

896
00:54:38,679 --> 00:54:43,119
this but delivered. That and it's, like, oh, well you,

897
00:54:43,119 --> 00:54:46,280
Know i've still got friends in. Military that's not actually what's.

898
00:54:46,320 --> 00:54:50,079
Happening and it's, like but all the reporting is telling

899
00:54:50,159 --> 00:54:52,880
us other than the people on thoughts is now is

900
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:55,519
there may be a little bit of difference between what's

901
00:54:55,559 --> 00:54:58,679
being reported on the news and what's going on inside

902
00:54:58,679 --> 00:55:02,880
the military. Structure absolute and that's absolutely possible to be the.

903
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:06,840
Case but you, know when you're talking about actively pulling

904
00:55:07,079 --> 00:55:10,519
funding from THE va to send it to the border wall,

905
00:55:10,599 --> 00:55:14,920
project how is that benefiting? Veterans? Yeah you can make

906
00:55:14,960 --> 00:55:18,119
the argument, that, oh, well it's going towards home. DEFENSE i,

907
00:55:18,159 --> 00:55:22,800
mean study after study shows that a border fence does

908
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:26,800
not do, much if. Anything it's there to make it feel.

909
00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:30,519
Good most of these border crossings that are quote unquote

910
00:55:30,559 --> 00:55:35,239
illegal are done at legal courts of, entry or there

911
00:55:35,239 --> 00:55:38,360
are boats that you have ower state of, visa or

912
00:55:38,800 --> 00:55:41,239
they are here on in the salmer bust and they're

913
00:55:41,239 --> 00:55:44,159
working their way through. Resistance it's so called right, way

914
00:55:44,679 --> 00:55:48,760
and just sort of time after, time but it really

915
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:52,360
became intensely personal to me WHEN i met my now

916
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:57,199
wife and you, know just seeing how sort of because

917
00:55:57,199 --> 00:56:02,000
we live in a Pretty republican area in Central, pennsylvania.

918
00:56:01,679 --> 00:56:02,480
Speaker 3: And so there's.

919
00:56:04,400 --> 00:56:07,039
Speaker 5: Ooks that act a certain. Way, now we've been very

920
00:56:07,039 --> 00:56:10,920
fortunate that my family has nothing but accommodating and time

921
00:56:11,159 --> 00:56:14,679
to my. Wife that they have accepted her into the

922
00:56:14,719 --> 00:56:18,119
family very, readily and that is a great credit to

923
00:56:18,199 --> 00:56:21,639
her because she's a very personful. Person she gets along with.

924
00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:24,199
Speaker 4: Stuff but there.

925
00:56:23,719 --> 00:56:26,079
Speaker 5: Are times when we leave family events and we're just

926
00:56:26,119 --> 00:56:30,639
sort of, like, whoah that was that was a?

927
00:56:30,679 --> 00:56:34,159
Speaker 2: Thing, well let me ask you a. Question does your

928
00:56:34,199 --> 00:56:35,519
wife ever feel is there?

929
00:56:35,679 --> 00:56:45,639
Speaker 8: Unsafe she she doesn't as much anymore in sort of

930
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:50,559
the battle days of twenty seventeen to twenty twenty and

931
00:56:50,679 --> 00:56:54,440
twenty twenty, one because of COURSE covid snapped.

932
00:56:54,039 --> 00:56:58,239
Speaker 5: In and there was all that Anti asian rhetoric and,

933
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:01,280
stuff you, know it's so called un flu and everything like.

934
00:57:01,320 --> 00:57:03,559
That and of, course because a lot of folks are,

935
00:57:04,760 --> 00:57:08,320
uh let's call it not as, discerning you, know would, say, oh,

936
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:10,960
well Your, chinese go back where you came. From it's

937
00:57:11,000 --> 00:57:14,400
like A i've lived here all my life and The

938
00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:15,719
i'm Not. Chinese.

939
00:57:16,119 --> 00:57:19,400
Speaker 2: Yeah for. Context by the, way this was rooted into

940
00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:25,800
The luhan lab leak conspiracy theory THAT covid was engineered

941
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:30,119
in a lab In, china and So trump called it

942
00:57:30,239 --> 00:57:33,280
The china. Virus it was called by some The kung.

943
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:37,679
Flu and of, course being in a country that is culturally,

944
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:43,159
illiterate Everybody asian or Everybody. Chinese, wait everybody who Was

945
00:57:43,199 --> 00:57:47,320
asian or Of asian derivation was Somehow. Chinese they lumped

946
00:57:47,320 --> 00:57:50,480
them all together in a very pejorative, way very derogatory.

947
00:57:50,519 --> 00:57:54,840
Way would that be a fair assessment or a fair? Representation? Garrison, Absolutely,

948
00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:57,159
okay you hit the nail on the, head all, Right,

949
00:57:57,599 --> 00:58:00,239
WELL i, worry you, KNOW i worry about anybody who

950
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:05,719
isn't you, know a, white usually, Male protestant evangelical trump

951
00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:08,480
or thumper in The United states right, now because you

952
00:58:08,559 --> 00:58:10,440
never know when a van's going to pull up and

953
00:58:10,519 --> 00:58:13,000
some mask agent's going to run, out and who knows

954
00:58:13,039 --> 00:58:14,840
what's going to. Happen AND i think that's WHY i

955
00:58:14,960 --> 00:58:18,519
asked the. Question but as long as you guys feel relatively,

956
00:58:18,639 --> 00:58:20,320
safe that warms my heart for.

957
00:58:20,400 --> 00:58:25,199
Speaker 5: Sure, well unfortunately we have not been sort of hit

958
00:58:25,280 --> 00:58:28,079
with the ice raids in the area that some of

959
00:58:28,079 --> 00:58:31,679
the other areas of the country. Have but you, KNOW i,

960
00:58:31,760 --> 00:58:34,559
say that's, right It's i'm headed WHEN i answered you

961
00:58:34,679 --> 00:58:37,639
to say that if she doesn't feel as unsafe as

962
00:58:37,679 --> 00:58:41,480
she used. To but even, so BECAUSE i am a

963
00:58:42,119 --> 00:58:46,239
responsible gun owner growing up in a family has a

964
00:58:46,239 --> 00:58:49,079
lot of. GUNS i, MEAN i keep in a gun

965
00:58:49,159 --> 00:58:53,280
safe AND i observe proper permits and training and. Stuff, yeah,

966
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:57,679
sure me. Too but she asked me to show her

967
00:58:57,719 --> 00:59:02,000
how to how to shoot a gun and help forget

968
00:59:02,039 --> 00:59:06,159
her Concealed Carrie, turmit so that if she was feeling

969
00:59:06,239 --> 00:59:08,800
unsafe that she could carry a firearm in her First

970
00:59:09,039 --> 00:59:13,840
and fortunately we have not come to that sort of

971
00:59:14,280 --> 00:59:18,239
point that it's it is a concern sort of on

972
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:21,800
the horizon of as these, things you, know here we.

973
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:24,679
Are it seems incredible to say that we are only

974
00:59:24,840 --> 00:59:31,239
nine months into this presidency And i'm, sorry excuse, me

975
00:59:31,480 --> 00:59:32,320
it feels like it's been.

976
00:59:32,320 --> 00:59:38,000
Speaker 2: Forever oh, yeah the national trauma has just. Begun i'm

977
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:41,400
doing the math in my. Mind going another twelve months

978
00:59:41,480 --> 00:59:44,320
till the mid, terms it just seems like the. Moon,

979
00:59:44,719 --> 00:59:47,360
actually it seems like the edge of the solar. System

980
00:59:48,119 --> 00:59:51,679
BUT i feel like, that you, know we learn who loves,

981
00:59:51,760 --> 00:59:54,880
us and we learn who loves us. CONDITIONALLY i think

982
00:59:54,920 --> 00:59:58,199
we learn who accepts us and who accepts us. Conditionally

983
00:59:58,920 --> 01:00:02,920
And i'm you, Know i'm very aware of families that

984
01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:06,199
have an asterisk by all of the love, talk AND

985
01:00:06,280 --> 01:00:09,280
i can too it in another way relate to some

986
01:00:09,320 --> 01:00:11,639
of the challenges that you are going. Through But i'm

987
01:00:11,679 --> 01:00:15,239
glad that you two have each other and you inspire.

988
01:00:15,320 --> 01:00:18,320
ME i think it's it's a remarkable thing that you

989
01:00:18,400 --> 01:00:21,480
are building a family in this crazy culture and your

990
01:00:21,519 --> 01:00:25,800
creatures of reason and humanism and. Humanity so you, know

991
01:00:26,159 --> 01:00:27,559
don't give up out, there AND i.

992
01:00:27,519 --> 01:00:32,400
Speaker 5: Will, Either, okay absolutely. Right i'd be up the Coverbial

993
01:00:32,480 --> 01:00:35,559
creek without. Her she she saves me at a time

994
01:00:35,599 --> 01:00:37,400
in my life WHEN i didn't even KNOW i was,

995
01:00:37,440 --> 01:00:39,320
drowning and she was that white rat for.

996
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:42,119
Speaker 2: Me that sounds like we both married, up you. Know

997
01:00:42,239 --> 01:00:45,480
way people look At natalie absolutely and they look at

998
01:00:45,480 --> 01:00:47,800
me and they look back At natalie and they're, like

999
01:00:48,039 --> 01:00:52,719
did you lose a? Bet like how did this? Happen i'm,

1000
01:00:52,719 --> 01:00:57,119
LIKE i just, Absolutely, garrison thanks so much for. Calling

1001
01:00:57,239 --> 01:00:57,679
we'll talk.

1002
01:00:57,719 --> 01:01:01,079
Speaker 5: Again, okay absolutely so thank, you and thank you for

1003
01:01:01,119 --> 01:01:03,760
doing what you do and making this dark time just

1004
01:01:03,880 --> 01:01:04,440
that little bit.

1005
01:01:04,480 --> 01:01:07,639
Speaker 2: Brighter we got each. Other we'll all stick to each.

1006
01:01:07,679 --> 01:01:11,519
Other thanks a. Bunch we'll see. You some people are,

1007
01:01:11,679 --> 01:01:15,079
like so Did Seth LIKE i don't not say, this

1008
01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:21,840
but did he use his voice on? You natalie has

1009
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:25,039
hurt all my bullshit. Before she is not, Impressed, like

1010
01:01:25,159 --> 01:01:28,679
she's my number one. Fan she's a big. Supporter she's my.

1011
01:01:28,800 --> 01:01:31,280
Cheerleader WHEN i get back and my tank is empty

1012
01:01:31,360 --> 01:01:34,199
And i'm, discouraged and especially in light of you, know

1013
01:01:34,599 --> 01:01:38,519
bio family and the FRUSTRATIONS i feel, There natalie is

1014
01:01:38,559 --> 01:01:42,639
my pit. Crew my race car goes in and she

1015
01:01:42,760 --> 01:01:46,119
fuels me up and changes the tires and tells ME

1016
01:01:46,199 --> 01:01:48,360
i can, win and then she sends me off. Again

1017
01:01:48,559 --> 01:01:51,360
but but you understand WHAT i, Mean, like she's she's not.

1018
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:56,119
Impressed she has seen beyond the, veneer beyond the air,

1019
01:01:56,159 --> 01:02:00,440
brushing beyond the they're ready for broadcast version that we

1020
01:02:00,679 --> 01:02:04,239
often will project in. PUBLIC i, mean you know what

1021
01:02:04,320 --> 01:02:06,800
you see as, me but you're not seeing me When

1022
01:02:06,840 --> 01:02:09,519
i'm walking around with bed head and bad breath at

1023
01:02:09,559 --> 01:02:12,400
five in the, morning you, know grumbling about the fact

1024
01:02:12,400 --> 01:02:14,639
That i've got to clean up cat vomit on the ground,

1025
01:02:14,679 --> 01:02:17,320
again or whatever's going on WHEN i wake up cranky or.

1026
01:02:17,320 --> 01:02:21,920
Whatever but some people are, like so when you Met,

1027
01:02:22,000 --> 01:02:26,239
natalie did you use your voice to try not to?

1028
01:02:26,280 --> 01:02:29,480
Seduce but you know WHAT i, Mean, like did you woo?

1029
01:02:29,559 --> 01:02:31,880
Her that's the Word i'm looking for with your. Voice

1030
01:02:32,199 --> 01:02:35,360
And natalie always calls me the silver tongue devil and

1031
01:02:35,519 --> 01:02:39,400
kind of winks, outline do you stillver tongue? Dead i'm, like,

1032
01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:41,719
NO i don't think it was. THAT i don't think

1033
01:02:41,719 --> 01:02:43,440
it WAS i think it would take more than. That

1034
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:47,239
it's more than a tonal quality to impress the. Woman

1035
01:02:47,360 --> 01:02:51,639
so apparently she saw something AND i am. Delighted we

1036
01:02:51,719 --> 01:02:56,719
hit eleven years of. Marriage we've been together for. Sixteen

1037
01:02:58,079 --> 01:03:01,519
you know what's funny is before we got, married we

1038
01:03:01,639 --> 01:03:07,159
lived together for. Years and my religious parents were. Scandalized

1039
01:03:08,280 --> 01:03:10,960
WHEN i was growing. Up it was called shacking. Up they, say,

1040
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:13,760
oh they're shacking up. Together when people were living together

1041
01:03:13,800 --> 01:03:16,440
without being. Married it was a big deal in a fundy.

1042
01:03:16,519 --> 01:03:21,400
Household they're living in sin and you know, what they're

1043
01:03:21,400 --> 01:03:27,559
having carnal relations Without god because you have to have

1044
01:03:28,039 --> 01:03:31,119
a signature on the marriage. Certificate you, know it was

1045
01:03:31,159 --> 01:03:34,760
scandalous enough THAT i was a, divorcee but then to live.

1046
01:03:34,840 --> 01:03:37,360
Together and of Course natalie AND i were a family

1047
01:03:37,400 --> 01:03:40,320
as much a family then as we are. Now AND

1048
01:03:40,400 --> 01:03:42,159
i always like to talk about, how you, know you

1049
01:03:42,199 --> 01:03:43,880
don't have to, say have a signature on a piece

1050
01:03:43,880 --> 01:03:46,360
of paper to be a. Family actually you don't even

1051
01:03:46,480 --> 01:03:50,760
have to have biology to be a. Family and there

1052
01:03:50,760 --> 01:03:53,800
are a lot of, people myself, included who continue to

1053
01:03:53,800 --> 01:03:55,719
go through this thing where you look at and, well

1054
01:03:55,920 --> 01:03:58,119
there's your mother and your, father and your siblings and

1055
01:03:58,159 --> 01:04:00,559
your cousin and your aunts and your. Uncles blah blah

1056
01:04:00,599 --> 01:04:04,480
blah blah, blah and some of us are related to

1057
01:04:04,559 --> 01:04:08,880
people we don't relate. To natalie is the Family i've.

1058
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:13,440
CHOSEN i would not go. BACK i won the lottery

1059
01:04:14,320 --> 01:04:18,800
AND i know. It she's the person who's going to

1060
01:04:18,920 --> 01:04:23,480
counsel me and tell me That i'm you, know she's

1061
01:04:23,519 --> 01:04:27,599
good as an. Advisor she's a good centering, force doesn't

1062
01:04:27,599 --> 01:04:32,760
put up with any. Bullshit and she's also. Cheerleaders not the,

1063
01:04:32,800 --> 01:04:35,079
word but you know WHAT i. Mean if we If

1064
01:04:35,119 --> 01:04:37,400
i'm out on the tennis, court we go watch each

1065
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:40,679
other play a. Match but if she's she's playing A

1066
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:43,800
usta tennis match, Tonight i'm gonna bundle up And i'm

1067
01:04:43,800 --> 01:04:47,199
gonna go out and watch the match because it's. Fun

1068
01:04:47,960 --> 01:04:50,320
i'm gonna go and cheer her. On great, Shot let's,

1069
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:52,599
go let's. Go you got, this let's do. It here we.

1070
01:04:52,639 --> 01:04:54,440
Go and when she hits a good shot and she

1071
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:58,000
turns around and sees my, face IT'S i don't, know it's,

1072
01:04:58,079 --> 01:05:01,159
good AND i feel the. Same i'm like a little

1073
01:05:01,239 --> 01:05:04,760
kid at little league When i'm out there and something

1074
01:05:04,840 --> 01:05:07,039
happens AND i turn around AND i see her and

1075
01:05:07,079 --> 01:05:09,639
she's high fiving or smiling OR i screw up and

1076
01:05:09,679 --> 01:05:12,360
she's got oh my, god you know or. Whatever it's

1077
01:05:12,360 --> 01:05:15,320
something that we. Share she is my, person she's got my,

1078
01:05:15,440 --> 01:05:20,000
back and you, KNOW i don't, KNOW i don't know

1079
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:23,679
Why i'm going, off but we won the, Lottery, garrison

1080
01:05:24,719 --> 01:05:31,760
we won the. Lottery more, show more, calls straight, ahead stand.

1081
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:47,280
By appreciate you so much being a. Patron your support

1082
01:05:47,280 --> 01:05:51,000
On patreon helps me do WHAT i. Do the website

1083
01:05:51,039 --> 01:05:55,480
is patreon dot com Slash Seth andrews and thank you

1084
01:05:55,679 --> 01:06:03,480
very much for your. Support talk To, karina, yep thank

1085
01:06:03,519 --> 01:06:06,000
you so much for calling. In what's on your?

1086
01:06:06,039 --> 01:06:09,639
Speaker 7: Mind So i've just been thinking about like the rise

1087
01:06:09,679 --> 01:06:13,840
of anti. Intellectualism even though it's been like relatively prelevant

1088
01:06:13,880 --> 01:06:18,159
In american culture for a, while, ever it's really been

1089
01:06:19,320 --> 01:06:22,400
significantly at this. Point and it's very concerning to me

1090
01:06:22,519 --> 01:06:23,159
as a college.

1091
01:06:23,159 --> 01:06:25,039
Speaker 2: Student what are you studying in?

1092
01:06:25,079 --> 01:06:29,639
Speaker 7: College i'm a double major in psychology And english.

1093
01:06:29,280 --> 01:06:33,880
Speaker 2: Studies and you look around at the celebrated ignorance of

1094
01:06:33,920 --> 01:06:36,519
The United. States are so many in The United. States

1095
01:06:36,639 --> 01:06:40,360
my feelings are more valid than their facts and part

1096
01:06:40,360 --> 01:06:42,480
of you dies, Inside is that, Right?

1097
01:06:42,599 --> 01:06:47,280
Speaker 7: Karina, yes it's partially very like annoying sometimes to talk

1098
01:06:47,360 --> 01:06:50,280
to people and they would, reference, WELL i don't feel

1099
01:06:50,320 --> 01:06:53,400
like something, something And i'm, like but the, facts the.

1100
01:06:53,480 --> 01:06:56,320
Facts They, otherwise why don't you like?

1101
01:06:56,440 --> 01:07:00,639
Speaker 2: RESEARCH i think most people believe not for reasons of.

1102
01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:05,400
EVIDENCE i think they believe for reasons of, confirmation bias or,

1103
01:07:05,639 --> 01:07:12,039
identity sometimes, BIGOTRY i, think sometimes. Laziness it's like when

1104
01:07:12,079 --> 01:07:14,599
you AND i speak to somebody about the tenets of their.

1105
01:07:14,599 --> 01:07:18,639
Faith often we know more about Somebody's christianity than The

1106
01:07:18,760 --> 01:07:21,639
christian actually, knows and yet the more we, highlight the

1107
01:07:21,639 --> 01:07:24,760
more they seem to not care or they just reject

1108
01:07:24,800 --> 01:07:29,880
our challenges? Outright was It shaw Bertrand? Russell someone was

1109
01:07:29,920 --> 01:07:34,440
talking about how we don't invoke faith in matters of.

1110
01:07:34,519 --> 01:07:37,239
Fact we don't SAY i believe it on faith when

1111
01:07:37,239 --> 01:07:40,559
it comes to two plus two equals. Four but people

1112
01:07:40,599 --> 01:07:43,880
do it with their gods because they want to substitute

1113
01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:48,039
emotion for. Evidence as a psychology, student do you think

1114
01:07:48,079 --> 01:07:50,320
that would be a way of saying it emotion over

1115
01:07:50,440 --> 01:07:51,719
evidence to an?

1116
01:07:51,760 --> 01:07:56,960
Speaker 7: Extent, Yes but also because religion mostly is childhood, inductrination

1117
01:07:57,119 --> 01:07:59,280
so you kind of have no choice to just trust

1118
01:07:59,320 --> 01:08:02,360
your parents are like caregivers or like who are tells

1119
01:08:02,400 --> 01:08:05,159
you that religion is, real so you don't really question,

1120
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:08,719
It AND i guess there is some evolutionary basis to

1121
01:08:08,760 --> 01:08:12,400
it to an extent that you just trust implicitly to

1122
01:08:12,719 --> 01:08:15,119
people around you who take care of, you and you

1123
01:08:15,159 --> 01:08:17,520
don't question what kind of beliefs they're passing.

1124
01:08:17,600 --> 01:08:21,039
Speaker 2: On do you ever watch The Daily show clips where

1125
01:08:21,039 --> 01:08:24,520
their correspondence go out To trump rallies with a microphone

1126
01:08:24,520 --> 01:08:28,039
and a camera and ask them basic. Questions it is

1127
01:08:28,159 --> 01:08:33,880
anti intellectualism writ, large and you fear for the. Species

1128
01:08:34,119 --> 01:08:37,479
you think maybe we deserve the killer. Asteroid you ever

1129
01:08:37,520 --> 01:08:38,199
see any of that?

1130
01:08:38,239 --> 01:08:41,920
Speaker 7: Stuff, Yes i've seen that a lot on both YouTube

1131
01:08:42,000 --> 01:08:42,640
and other.

1132
01:08:42,680 --> 01:08:47,439
Speaker 2: Platforms, so as someone who studies the human, mind do

1133
01:08:47,520 --> 01:08:50,039
you feel like there's a path? Forward is there a

1134
01:08:50,079 --> 01:08:52,479
way to produce the crack that lets in the. Light

1135
01:08:52,600 --> 01:08:55,239
how do we break through or can we break? Through

1136
01:08:55,319 --> 01:08:55,680
what do you?

1137
01:08:55,760 --> 01:09:00,439
Speaker 7: THINK i think that does depend a lot person person,

1138
01:09:00,520 --> 01:09:03,359
basis because we are so unique in a. Way so

1139
01:09:03,439 --> 01:09:06,039
there's not a cookie cutter way to get someone out

1140
01:09:06,039 --> 01:09:10,720
of religion or like convince them otherwise of, Something and

1141
01:09:10,920 --> 01:09:15,039
it is harder to deconstruct something that you've got into

1142
01:09:15,279 --> 01:09:19,239
emotionally or know logically or something that you've just kind

1143
01:09:19,239 --> 01:09:22,760
of like known because that's what you were. Told but

1144
01:09:22,840 --> 01:09:25,479
at the same, time if someone is willing to do

1145
01:09:25,640 --> 01:09:28,079
the work and deconstruct and look back at what they

1146
01:09:28,119 --> 01:09:31,359
were taught and, WHY i think it is really. Possible

1147
01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:33,880
AND i think a lot of if you learned a

1148
01:09:33,960 --> 01:09:36,880
lot of, psychology that would also be. Beneficial so you

1149
01:09:36,920 --> 01:09:40,800
can also understand that humans are naturally just, Biased so

1150
01:09:40,880 --> 01:09:44,960
that can help you see past your emotional reactions to

1151
01:09:45,000 --> 01:09:47,800
certain things and, realize, oh AM i being just? Biased

1152
01:09:47,880 --> 01:09:50,239
or is this like a valid feeling for the?

1153
01:09:50,399 --> 01:09:55,000
Speaker 2: Response someone in the chant fairly said liberals are not

1154
01:09:55,119 --> 01:09:58,359
immune from, this and you would. Agree we're all human.

1155
01:09:58,439 --> 01:10:02,319
BEINGS i have seen, people And i've been guilty myself

1156
01:10:02,359 --> 01:10:07,239
of leaning into an emotional, response belief in the, brain confirmation,

1157
01:10:07,479 --> 01:10:11,960
bias lazy. Thinking i've shared things that weren't properly vetted

1158
01:10:12,000 --> 01:10:15,960
and got. Burned i've had ideas that were unfortunate and got.

1159
01:10:16,000 --> 01:10:20,600
Burned AND i will make mistakes moving forward BECAUSE i

1160
01:10:20,640 --> 01:10:25,039
am far from a perfect. Thinker nobody's, immune, Right, yes well.

1161
01:10:25,079 --> 01:10:28,760
Speaker 7: Exactly that's kind of like the purpose of human psychology

1162
01:10:28,760 --> 01:10:31,399
in a. Way it kind of preserves our way of.

1163
01:10:31,479 --> 01:10:35,840
Thought and another thing is cognitive, dissonance is that like

1164
01:10:36,279 --> 01:10:39,039
you learn two facts that kind of contradict each other

1165
01:10:39,119 --> 01:10:41,960
and you have to make sense of. That and for

1166
01:10:42,039 --> 01:10:44,960
a lot of religious, people they try to get rid

1167
01:10:44,960 --> 01:10:50,760
of cognitive dissonance by rationalizing things or doing circular reasoning

1168
01:10:51,199 --> 01:10:54,880
to convince themselves that their initial point of view or

1169
01:10:55,000 --> 01:10:58,239
opinion is the most, valid so they discard the other

1170
01:10:58,560 --> 01:10:59,000
facts or.

1171
01:10:59,079 --> 01:11:02,479
Speaker 2: Opinion, karina did you break out of a? Religion did

1172
01:11:02,520 --> 01:11:04,720
you deconstruct out of? Something or?

1173
01:11:05,159 --> 01:11:08,640
Speaker 7: WELL i MEAN i was raised In Russian Orthodox, church

1174
01:11:09,079 --> 01:11:12,920
SO i guess that is kind of like my, background you, Know.

1175
01:11:13,000 --> 01:11:15,520
Christianity but at the same, TIME i don't THINK i

1176
01:11:15,560 --> 01:11:18,720
ever was like that deep in it to ever be

1177
01:11:18,880 --> 01:11:23,640
convinced that it's. Real and ALSO i have like my Children's,

1178
01:11:23,680 --> 01:11:26,840
bible And i've read it several times and it's just

1179
01:11:26,880 --> 01:11:30,119
been more confusing than anything because it was starting Like

1180
01:11:30,199 --> 01:11:33,359
genesis and it would be, like, Oh adam And eve

1181
01:11:33,600 --> 01:11:36,880
and then they got kicked out Of, paradise and then

1182
01:11:36,920 --> 01:11:39,840
they go on and have, kids and then you have to, wonder,

1183
01:11:40,079 --> 01:11:43,600
well aren't be like against, Incess like how did they

1184
01:11:43,800 --> 01:11:46,319
make so many people with just two. People you.

1185
01:11:46,359 --> 01:11:49,239
Speaker 2: Know, NO i WISH i had had a tenth of

1186
01:11:49,279 --> 01:11:52,319
your critical thinking skills WHEN i was a. Kid back

1187
01:11:52,319 --> 01:11:54,680
WHEN i was, young it was, Like oh, great a

1188
01:11:54,720 --> 01:11:59,000
couple of cosmically conjured garden nudists who talked to. Snakes

1189
01:11:59,319 --> 01:12:02,119
meg's perfect sense to, Me and THEN i carry that

1190
01:12:02,199 --> 01:12:05,720
with me into adulthood and beat myself up WHEN i

1191
01:12:05,760 --> 01:12:08,840
finally bust it. Out i'm glad to meet a proponent

1192
01:12:08,880 --> 01:12:12,439
of science out, There. KARINA i think that's something that the,

1193
01:12:12,479 --> 01:12:16,439
world certainly this country needs more. Of so you keep

1194
01:12:16,520 --> 01:12:22,359
sciencing and promoting, intellectualism and we'll do our best to

1195
01:12:22,399 --> 01:12:26,479
try to encourage, everyone including, ourselves to be creatures of

1196
01:12:26,520 --> 01:12:28,479
the evidence as best we. Can anything.

1197
01:12:28,479 --> 01:12:30,880
Speaker 7: Else BEFORE i move, on, NO i just want to

1198
01:12:30,880 --> 01:12:32,840
say thank you for the work you. DO i think

1199
01:12:32,920 --> 01:12:36,960
is very. Valuable And i'm not an, activist BUT i

1200
01:12:37,000 --> 01:12:39,359
say THAT i really want to try to get into that,

1201
01:12:39,479 --> 01:12:42,800
sphere the kind of fear that you're, in to maybe promote.

1202
01:12:42,880 --> 01:12:48,159
Speaker 2: CHANGE i think, you, honestly as someone who IS i

1203
01:12:48,199 --> 01:12:50,279
don't know, you are going to be a proponent of.

1204
01:12:50,279 --> 01:12:52,840
SCIENCE i think that's a great place to. START i

1205
01:12:52,880 --> 01:12:55,199
MIGHT i be excited to see where your journey takes.

1206
01:12:55,239 --> 01:12:58,399
You thanks for the kind words and the, encouragement and

1207
01:12:58,600 --> 01:13:02,359
keep sciencing my. Friend, okay, yep thank, you all, right

1208
01:13:02,399 --> 01:13:07,399
we'll see. You who was it who said we're talking

1209
01:13:07,439 --> 01:13:12,399
about how, gosh forgive? Me this is what happens late

1210
01:13:12,439 --> 01:13:13,800
in the day When i'm trying to put a thought.

1211
01:13:13,840 --> 01:13:17,000
Together but it was, about, well doesn't religion make a

1212
01:13:17,039 --> 01:13:21,840
lot of people? Happy and there was that famous line

1213
01:13:22,399 --> 01:13:25,960
about well is that even an? Argument but a religious

1214
01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:29,119
person is happier than a non religious person is like

1215
01:13:29,159 --> 01:13:32,479
saying a drunk person is happier than a sober. One

1216
01:13:33,119 --> 01:13:38,479
so does that validate being? Drunk you, know be. Inebriated

1217
01:13:38,920 --> 01:13:42,840
there was also another, line the famous quote THAT i

1218
01:13:42,880 --> 01:13:46,520
cannot source off the cuff, here but it was about how,

1219
01:13:46,920 --> 01:13:52,399
intellectuals people who are more, educated who are better thinkers

1220
01:13:52,439 --> 01:13:55,960
about the, world often may be less happy because of

1221
01:13:56,000 --> 01:14:01,199
their understanding of what is actually going. DOWN i think

1222
01:14:01,279 --> 01:14:05,600
happiness is a, goal but happiness is not a determiner

1223
01:14:06,359 --> 01:14:08,840
as to what is true and what is not. RIGHT

1224
01:14:08,920 --> 01:14:13,640
i would rather live a more difficult reality than pinball

1225
01:14:13,680 --> 01:14:16,840
around inside a happy. Fantasy and that's just WHERE i.

1226
01:14:16,880 --> 01:14:19,159
FALL i think some other people might, admit, HEY i

1227
01:14:19,199 --> 01:14:22,079
don't care if you plug me into the matrix and

1228
01:14:22,159 --> 01:14:26,479
it's all, bogus But i'm. Happy then happy for me

1229
01:14:26,680 --> 01:14:28,840
is the end, zone AND i don't care about the

1230
01:14:28,880 --> 01:14:30,960
rest of. It they're honest enough to at least say

1231
01:14:30,960 --> 01:14:33,479
it out. LOUD i myself don't THINK i could go.

1232
01:14:33,600 --> 01:14:36,880
BACK i, think, well you, know it's messier out here

1233
01:14:36,920 --> 01:14:40,640
in the real. World it's more of a. Burden it

1234
01:14:40,760 --> 01:14:43,720
keeps me up at night. MORE i don't have a

1235
01:14:43,800 --> 01:14:47,119
content heart the WAY i did WHEN i was but

1236
01:14:47,399 --> 01:14:50,039
it was only content back then BECAUSE i was. IGNORANT

1237
01:14:50,039 --> 01:14:53,680
i didn't truly understand what was going. On my world

1238
01:14:54,000 --> 01:14:58,880
was a, thimble you, know instead of you could fit

1239
01:14:58,960 --> 01:15:01,079
it in a thimble and stead it being the, vast,

1240
01:15:01,680 --> 01:15:06,720
wild wide and sometimes crazy. Ocean that is the reality out.

1241
01:15:06,720 --> 01:15:08,920
THERE i don't, Know i'm. SOMETHING i was just thinking.

1242
01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:11,520
Of are you happier in some? Ways are you more

1243
01:15:11,600 --> 01:15:15,079
burdened in other? Ways you? Know but let me look

1244
01:15:15,119 --> 01:15:20,479
this up here real. Fast there was this article In Psychology.

1245
01:15:20,640 --> 01:15:26,279
Today we got a couple of extra minutes from four years.

1246
01:15:26,279 --> 01:15:32,239
Ago Psychology, Today thirteen reasons why a HIGH iq could

1247
01:15:32,279 --> 01:15:37,079
make you less happy having superior native intelligence can be

1248
01:15:37,119 --> 01:15:39,840
more alienating than. Endearing, NOW i just want to get

1249
01:15:39,880 --> 01:15:42,399
in front of this and say that If i've been,

1250
01:15:42,439 --> 01:15:45,399
Miserable i'm not saying it's BECAUSE i have a super HIGH.

1251
01:15:45,479 --> 01:15:51,520
IQ i think mostly it's Because i'm mildly. Observant BUT

1252
01:15:51,640 --> 01:15:55,920
i find the article. Fascinating many authors have discussed the

1253
01:15:55,960 --> 01:16:01,239
advantages of being intellectually, gifted and that's hardly, surprising the article.

1254
01:16:01,279 --> 01:16:04,920
Says what is, surprising, though is how many authors have

1255
01:16:05,039 --> 01:16:08,479
also written about the drawbacks of being not so much

1256
01:16:08,520 --> 01:16:12,640
blessed as cursed by possessing a HIGH, iq and a

1257
01:16:12,840 --> 01:16:17,199
particularly super HIGH. Iq it's something like having too much

1258
01:16:17,199 --> 01:16:19,960
of a good, thing in this, case missing the sweet,

1259
01:16:19,960 --> 01:16:23,760
spot not on the, downside but paradoxically on the way.

1260
01:16:23,840 --> 01:16:28,439
Up in, principle at least we admire. Geniuses after, all

1261
01:16:28,479 --> 01:16:31,560
we live in a meritorious. Society i'm not sure we,

1262
01:16:31,640 --> 01:16:35,239
do but, okay. Fine we live in a meritorious society

1263
01:16:35,479 --> 01:16:39,039
and in many ways evaluate people on the basis of.

1264
01:16:39,159 --> 01:16:44,239
Intelligence yet in actuality i. E when we're personally involved with,

1265
01:16:44,279 --> 01:16:47,920
them our reactions tend to be much more ambiguous and

1266
01:16:48,039 --> 01:16:52,199
much less. Positive how else to explain why intellectually superior

1267
01:16:52,239 --> 01:16:57,640
students so frequently develop apprehension about exhibiting their intelligence in the.

1268
01:16:57,720 --> 01:17:02,239
Classroom they may avoid volunteering the right, answer hoping that

1269
01:17:02,359 --> 01:17:06,279
someone else will raise their. Hands for if they routinely

1270
01:17:06,359 --> 01:17:09,399
offer an answer no one can come up, with they're

1271
01:17:09,560 --> 01:17:13,279
likely to have the uncomfortable experience of being glared, at

1272
01:17:13,640 --> 01:17:16,760
or even being made fun of or bullied on the. Playground,

1273
01:17:17,439 --> 01:17:22,359
plus being identified as a teacher's pets isn't, adulatory it's.

1274
01:17:22,520 --> 01:17:28,560
Censoring this post will identify thirteen reasons why gifted individuals

1275
01:17:28,680 --> 01:17:32,199
learn how to manage their intellect. Wisely it can negatively

1276
01:17:32,239 --> 01:17:38,079
affect their performance and interpersonally alienate those around. Them, now

1277
01:17:38,119 --> 01:17:40,520
this is a long ass. Article i'm not going to

1278
01:17:40,560 --> 01:17:43,279
go through all of, these BUT i will name. Them Number,

1279
01:17:43,279 --> 01:17:46,600
one the very intelligent know they're, intelligence so they're prone

1280
01:17:46,640 --> 01:17:50,680
to setting lofty expectations that too often they can't. Meet

1281
01:17:51,640 --> 01:17:57,159
two HIGH iq individuals are more likely to have anxiety.

1282
01:17:57,319 --> 01:17:59,960
Issues they tend to think more about the negative thing

1283
01:18:00,159 --> 01:18:03,960
that happen to, them ruminating and replaying scenarios to learn

1284
01:18:04,119 --> 01:18:09,600
what went. Wrong three very smart people don't necessarily make

1285
01:18:09,720 --> 01:18:14,800
better decisions they're likely to inject personal biases into their,

1286
01:18:14,960 --> 01:18:18,880
transaction and this IS i think a riff. On sometimes

1287
01:18:18,960 --> 01:18:23,399
smart people can outsmart. Themselves number. Four because HIGH iq

1288
01:18:23,640 --> 01:18:27,199
people learn things so easily when they're, young they're liable

1289
01:18:27,199 --> 01:18:30,479
to get so accustomed do succeeding without putting forth much

1290
01:18:30,520 --> 01:18:34,680
effort that they never develop the habit of, perseverance which

1291
01:18:34,720 --> 01:18:39,239
is so fundamental to long term. Success number. Five because

1292
01:18:39,279 --> 01:18:42,399
they're prone to live in their, heads they may largely

1293
01:18:42,479 --> 01:18:46,760
be cut off from their, emotions and because of their

1294
01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:52,079
constantly activated, intellect the feelings they can eloquently express may

1295
01:18:52,239 --> 01:18:56,600
yet be difficult to let go. Of number, Six HIGH

1296
01:18:56,640 --> 01:19:02,520
iq people tend to overthink or over analyze. Things number.

1297
01:19:02,600 --> 01:19:06,520
Seven very smart people have difficulty avoiding the temptation to

1298
01:19:06,720 --> 01:19:11,840
correct others', mistakes since they can be sticklers for getting things.

1299
01:19:12,079 --> 01:19:17,000
Right not, surprisingly this habit doesn't win much favor with other,

1300
01:19:17,199 --> 01:19:21,960
people who can be, embarrassed, annoyed or. Offended number, Eight

1301
01:19:22,399 --> 01:19:26,600
making and keeping friends is often. Problematic it's hard for

1302
01:19:26,680 --> 01:19:31,000
others to feel comfortable getting close to someone whose intellectual

1303
01:19:31,079 --> 01:19:36,359
prowess far outshines their. Own. Nine HIGH iq people can

1304
01:19:36,479 --> 01:19:40,800
easily become frustrated and lose patience when what they share

1305
01:19:40,960 --> 01:19:46,359
is repeatedly, misunderstood despite several attempts to clarify, it even

1306
01:19:46,600 --> 01:19:51,000
dumb it. Down number. Ten their sense of humor may

1307
01:19:51,039 --> 01:19:54,640
be totally out of sync with. Others not only do

1308
01:19:54,680 --> 01:19:58,239
they get a joke's punchline more, quickly but what others

1309
01:19:58,279 --> 01:20:02,439
find amusing to them may seem, insipid, strained or. Tried

1310
01:20:02,600 --> 01:20:07,920
some'm going to throw in also based juvenile and. Stupid number.

1311
01:20:07,920 --> 01:20:14,640
Eleven the intellectually elite more commonly experienced social. Isolation when

1312
01:20:14,640 --> 01:20:18,319
they can't locate others with mentality similar to, theirs they

1313
01:20:18,359 --> 01:20:24,560
sometimes choose. Solitude number. Twelve the intellectually gifted don't simply

1314
01:20:24,720 --> 01:20:28,520
know more than, others but are acutely aware of all

1315
01:20:28,600 --> 01:20:34,520
they don't. Know and, finally number. Thirteen Thomas gray, said

1316
01:20:34,600 --> 01:20:40,199
where ignorance is, bliss tis folly to be. Wise this

1317
01:20:40,399 --> 01:20:44,760
expression suggests how those with EXCEPTIONAL i cues recognize things

1318
01:20:44,760 --> 01:20:47,399
that others do, not and much of what they are

1319
01:20:47,520 --> 01:20:53,640
cerebrally privileged to know and actually, hurt, worry or antagonize.

1320
01:20:53,640 --> 01:20:57,439
Them any of those ring for, YOU i know this

1321
01:20:57,680 --> 01:21:02,159
is a highly intelligent. AUDIENCE i know many people listening

1322
01:21:02,239 --> 01:21:06,920
smarter than, me much SMARTER i. Know any of that

1323
01:21:07,359 --> 01:21:10,479
ring true for. You that is the THOUGHT i will

1324
01:21:10,560 --> 01:21:13,199
leave you, with AND i will see you back here

1325
01:21:13,239 --> 01:21:16,680
on the broadcast next. Time be, safe take, care And

1326
01:21:16,760 --> 01:21:17,199
i'll see. You.

1327
01:21:17,239 --> 01:21:21,000
Speaker 1: Then Follow The Thinking atheist On facebook And twitter for

1328
01:21:21,079 --> 01:21:24,760
a complete archive of podcasts and, videos products like mugs

1329
01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:27,880
and t shirts featuring The Thinking atheist, logo links to

1330
01:21:28,039 --> 01:21:31,840
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1331
01:21:31,840 --> 01:21:36,760
events and. Conventions log onto our, Website The thinkingatheist dot.

1332
01:21:36,800 --> 01:21:39,439
Com