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<v Speaker 1>And with that, let's bring in our leadoff panel, Kat Zakresky,

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<v Speaker 1>White House correspondent for The Washington Post, Jake Sherman ms NOW,

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<v Speaker 1>political contributor and co founder of punch Bowl News, and

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<v Speaker 1>Mark Leviovich, staff writer for The Atlantic. Jake, you've had

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<v Speaker 1>quite a twenty four hour stretch here. I do want

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<v Speaker 1>to get to your great interview with the President, but

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<v Speaker 1>first let's talk about this huge news overnight that Senator

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<v Speaker 1>Murkowski is now saying she's a no on Todd Blanche. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>all of this rest with Bill Cassidy. We've seen this

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<v Speaker 1>is what I was alluding to before. We've seen this

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<v Speaker 1>movie when it came to the RFK nomination and confirmation hearings.

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<v Speaker 1>Where does it look like he's headed right now? What's

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<v Speaker 1>the math?

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<v Speaker 2>Good question, But remember Bill Cassidy's political career is over

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<v Speaker 2>because of Donald Trump, plainly right. Trump endorsed against him,

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<v Speaker 2>and now he has to suffer the consequence and that

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<v Speaker 2>Bill Cassidy owes him nothing zero And that's a tough

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<v Speaker 2>position for the White House to be in.

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<v Speaker 3>Here. I don't know where he's going to end up.

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<v Speaker 2>He's been having endless conversations and all these all these holdouts,

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<v Speaker 2>now two of them have gone.

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<v Speaker 4>No.

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<v Speaker 3>Collins and Murkowski have had.

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<v Speaker 2>Kind of endless conversations with Cassidy and and and sorry

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<v Speaker 2>with Blanche.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know where he's going to end up.

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<v Speaker 2>But unless Mitch McConnell, who has been out now for

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<v Speaker 2>a couple months with you know, I'm not exactly sure

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<v Speaker 2>how they're how they're classifying it, but how to fall

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<v Speaker 2>and is not well unless.

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<v Speaker 3>He somehow comes back.

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<v Speaker 2>Todd Lanche is done if Bill Cassidy votes, know and

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<v Speaker 2>he could stay in his acting age.

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<v Speaker 3>And I talked to Trump about that.

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<v Speaker 2>Trump said, you know, he'll be happy to have him

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<v Speaker 2>as acting, but he should be confirmed.

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<v Speaker 3>But listen, this is the world that the White House.

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<v Speaker 2>Has to live with because they have antagonized so many

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<v Speaker 2>Senate Republicans and and when you do so, you don't

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<v Speaker 2>it's much more difficult to get your agenda through a

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<v Speaker 2>Senate when people are are against you.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, the field he starts to dissipate slight when you

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<v Speaker 1>target an unseat incumbents in your own party. So you

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<v Speaker 1>mentioned that Blanche can hang in as acting ag How

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<v Speaker 1>long can he do that for? Could it be for

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<v Speaker 1>the duration of the Trump administration, and then does he

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<v Speaker 1>have sort of carte blanche to carry out the president's

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<v Speaker 1>agenda with the DOJ.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, those are two questions. I think yes, yes, he

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<v Speaker 2>could stay is acting for the rest of the administration

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<v Speaker 2>because as long as he is a technicality, but as

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<v Speaker 2>long as his nomination is active, meaning at the end

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<v Speaker 2>of this Congress, he would probably have to the President

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<v Speaker 2>would probably have to resubmit his nomination.

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<v Speaker 3>But yes, I mean Biden.

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<v Speaker 2>Did this with Julie Sue, who was the acting Labor

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<v Speaker 2>Secretary for quite some time. The question about whether he

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<v Speaker 2>has any diminished authority as acting AG is not something

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<v Speaker 2>that's really been tested, I mean from a presidential level,

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<v Speaker 2>meaning the president that it's said it's not great, but

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<v Speaker 2>I do think that he could carry out from what

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<v Speaker 2>I've been told, he can carry out all the duties

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<v Speaker 2>of the Attorney General.

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<v Speaker 3>While being acting AG.

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<v Speaker 1>Tell us more about your interview with the President, Jake.

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<v Speaker 3>It was fascinating.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, we talked to him about Congress, which is

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<v Speaker 2>what we cover, and something an institution that he.

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<v Speaker 3>Has a complicated relationship with.

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<v Speaker 2>And I thought one of the clips that you played

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<v Speaker 2>was very interesting because he doesn't really have any grip

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<v Speaker 2>or he's confused, and it is a confusing topic about

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<v Speaker 2>why presidents always lose in the midterm election.

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<v Speaker 3>I explained to him that I think it's because people

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<v Speaker 3>want to check on.

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<v Speaker 2>Power, and Trump thinks that he's done so well that

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<v Speaker 2>he doesn't there that no one should want to check

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<v Speaker 2>on his power. And he said also on top of that,

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<v Speaker 2>he can't guarantee that Republicans will come out, the Republicans

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<v Speaker 2>that voted for him, the voters that put him in

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<v Speaker 2>the White House twice now will come out and support

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<v Speaker 2>congressional Republicans for House and Senate seats.

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<v Speaker 3>And that is a very fascinating.

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<v Speaker 2>Insight into his thinking at this moment in time, as

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<v Speaker 2>we sit, as you said, eighty something days, eighty eight

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<v Speaker 2>days before the midterm elections.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's a bleak assessment. Like I said at the top,

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<v Speaker 1>there for a man who's generally pretty confident, even if

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<v Speaker 1>it's smoking mirrors. Mark Senator Tellus and Cornyn bent themselves

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<v Speaker 1>into a proverbial pretzel to send blanches nomination out of

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<v Speaker 1>the committee. Now you see a rebuke was not just

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<v Speaker 1>Susan Collins. Now it's Murkowski. And you may see Cassidy

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<v Speaker 1>based on what Jake was just illuminating the fact that

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<v Speaker 1>he was unseated by a Trump backed candidate. So what

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<v Speaker 1>does all of this say about the President's leverage on

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<v Speaker 1>Capitol Hill.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I mean it says a few things.

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<v Speaker 5>I mean, first of all, I mean, yes, I mean,

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<v Speaker 5>this is the Yolo Caucus, meaning you know, they don't

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<v Speaker 5>have anything to really, uh, you know, think about re

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<v Speaker 5>election wise, because Trump has already in his own way

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<v Speaker 5>kind of undermined all of them. But as we've learned

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<v Speaker 5>from John Cornet and Tom Taylis, there are ways to

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<v Speaker 5>get these folks on the team and get them back

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<v Speaker 5>on board. I mean, in some ways, Murkowski and Collins

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<v Speaker 5>were certainly there's nothing safe about them, but I think

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<v Speaker 5>Democrats would have probably pointed to them as being the

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<v Speaker 5>two most likely no votes. And then it all comes

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<v Speaker 5>down to Cassidy unless, as Jake mentioned, McConnell somehow becomes

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<v Speaker 5>ambulatory enough to come to the floor and vote for Blanche.

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<v Speaker 5>But you know, it's unclear what mcconnor would even do

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<v Speaker 5>if he got that far. Either way, I mean, Cassidy

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<v Speaker 5>is a wild card. You know, there are two ways

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<v Speaker 5>of looking at this one he owes the president nothing,

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<v Speaker 5>as you mentioned. But on the other hand, I mean,

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<v Speaker 5>do you really want to ride into retirement with this

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<v Speaker 5>whole load of hassle on the way out and just

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<v Speaker 5>getting hated left and right? You know, there is a

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<v Speaker 5>do I really need this headache? You know mindset that

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<v Speaker 5>I think can set in also, so I'll be fascinating.

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<v Speaker 5>We'll see what happens. And I also think, yeah, sorry, no,

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<v Speaker 5>I was just go ahead now. The idea of whether

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<v Speaker 5>you know, he can sort of not be confirmed and

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<v Speaker 5>serve anyway is kind of another wild card here. It

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<v Speaker 5>does seem like he can get a lot done and

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<v Speaker 5>do a lot of bidding for the president if he

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<v Speaker 5>stays on for a long time, whether he's.

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<v Speaker 3>Confirmed or not.

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<v Speaker 1>That really is an interesting dynamic. We need to keep

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<v Speaker 1>a close eye on how long can he just be

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<v Speaker 1>acting and carry out the president's agenda. Kat Trump is

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<v Speaker 1>adamant about pushing through his legislative agenda before Congress goes

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<v Speaker 1>on its very long recess. In August, he told Jake

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<v Speaker 1>that he likes John Thune and he's not looking to

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<v Speaker 1>push him out. But what happens if thuone falls short?

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<v Speaker 4>Certainly we've seen the President willing to go on the

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<v Speaker 4>attack when he feels that he does not have the

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<v Speaker 4>support of his allies. And we've seen just over the

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<v Speaker 4>last few weeks he's put pressure on Thune in public remarks,

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<v Speaker 4>telling his constituents to call the Senator. And so there

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<v Speaker 4>is a lot of pressure on Thune today as Trump

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<v Speaker 4>tells him he needs to bring this to the floor,

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<v Speaker 4>even though it doesn't seem like the votes are there.

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<v Speaker 4>And it just speaks to this bigger challenge I think

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<v Speaker 4>for Republicans in Congress, where Trump really is trying to

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<v Speaker 4>cast a lot of blame on them in this midterm cycle.

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<v Speaker 4>One of the most fascinating parts of Jake's interview to

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<v Speaker 4>me was when the President talked about how voters are

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<v Speaker 4>angry with Republicans but not him.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so, Kat, they may be mad at Republicans and

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<v Speaker 1>not him, but that is certainly not what is bearing

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<v Speaker 1>out in the polling that we're looking at. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>Trump's polling numbers from several different polls in the last

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<v Speaker 1>few weeks have shown him at record lows against himself

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<v Speaker 1>in his first term and now record lows in the

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<v Speaker 1>second term. How does all of that factor into the

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<v Speaker 1>treatment that he's going to get on the hill. Are

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<v Speaker 1>Republicans slowly but and belatedly untethering themselves from the president.

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<v Speaker 3>It seems like.

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<v Speaker 4>As we get closer to the general elections in this

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<v Speaker 4>midterm cycle, they're going to have to do that. If

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<v Speaker 4>you look at the pulling just this morning, we got

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<v Speaker 4>job numbers that are bad for the White House. You

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<v Speaker 4>see what's going on with persistently sticky high gas prices,

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<v Speaker 4>And as you get to this new phase of the election,

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<v Speaker 4>there's going to have to be an attempt from Republicans

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<v Speaker 4>to create some distance between themselves and these policies.

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<v Speaker 1>Jake, it's been a very tumultuous twenty four hours for

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<v Speaker 1>President Trump. Having nothing to do with your interview, a

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<v Speaker 1>candidate that he endorsed, Andy Ogles, lost his primary in Tennessee.

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<v Speaker 1>Ogles has been one of the presidents let's just say,

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<v Speaker 1>staunchest or most loyal soldiers. What is that signal? Is

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<v Speaker 1>his grip on the party slipping or is it just

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<v Speaker 1>a one off example.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, well, also, we'd also be remissed not to mention

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<v Speaker 2>that one of his endorsed candidates in Michigan lost to

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<v Speaker 2>somebody who had stopped campaigning months before and wasn't even

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<v Speaker 2>effectively in the race and was writing handwritten notes to

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<v Speaker 2>the FEC saying I'm not going to be running anymore

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<v Speaker 2>because he couldn't find out how to log onto the

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<v Speaker 2>FEC system. So really quite the string there of political

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<v Speaker 2>events for the president that said. Listen, I mean the

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<v Speaker 2>president likes to say he has a ninety nine percent

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<v Speaker 2>or something like that track record in endorsing people, It's

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<v Speaker 2>not that high. I mean, he endorses a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>people who don't even have races. But I mean still,

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<v Speaker 2>he has an incredible grip on the party.

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<v Speaker 3>Is it loosening, Yes, it probably is. It probably is.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean Andy Ogles was a loyal foot soldier for

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<v Speaker 2>President Trump and against it many times the House Republican

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<v Speaker 2>Leadership member of the Freedom Caucus and lost quite resoundingly.

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<v Speaker 2>But still the vast majority of people who who are

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<v Speaker 2>endorsed by Trump will get Trump's endorsement do win their primaries.

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<v Speaker 1>Mark, While voters have made it very clear that their

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<v Speaker 1>big issue here in this election is the economy the

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<v Speaker 1>cost of living, Trump is still focused, as we mentioned

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<v Speaker 1>off the top, on birthright citizenship voting restrictions, and here

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<v Speaker 1>we go again with vaccines. How will all of that

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<v Speaker 1>go over with his base? But more importantly, how will

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<v Speaker 1>it go over with the coalition that was so critical

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<v Speaker 1>to getting him elected in twenty four? Is that coalition disintegrating?

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I mean, certainly there's no indication whatsoever that any

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<v Speaker 5>of this is a political winner for Republicans. I mean,

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<v Speaker 5>to say nothing of the ballroom and the reflecting pool

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<v Speaker 5>and things that he seems to be occupying a great

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<v Speaker 5>deal of his time with. I mean, this is not

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<v Speaker 5>something that was a big campaign issue, to say the

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<v Speaker 5>least in twenty twenty four. Look, I mean, I think

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<v Speaker 5>to some degree it doesn't matter because Trump's appeal and

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<v Speaker 5>his hold on the party has been so personal to

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<v Speaker 5>begin with. I think it gets to a sort of

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<v Speaker 5>a larger existential problem that Republicans are beginning to deal with.

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<v Speaker 5>They're going to have to deal with more and more,

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<v Speaker 5>which is that when Trump's not on the ballot, their

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<v Speaker 5>voters haven't turned out. They certainly haven't turned out in midterms.

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<v Speaker 5>They didn't turn out in twenty two, they didn't turn

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<v Speaker 5>out in eighteen. And that's a big problem for them.

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<v Speaker 5>And obviously Trump's not going to be on the ballot

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<v Speaker 5>in twenty twenty eight, and they're going to figure out

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<v Speaker 5>a way to solve that. But there's nothing that indicates

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<v Speaker 5>that Trump's appeal and his hold on the party is

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<v Speaker 5>transferable to any one figure, whether it's a down ballot

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<v Speaker 5>candidate or someone running to replace him.