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Speaker 1: The following presentation is del Marvis Studio's production.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to.

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Speaker 3: See you strong around the world. It's time for another

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edition of the Fact Hunter podcast. As we record on

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the Sinko de Mayo, twenty twenty six, it's eleven thirty

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am due southwest of Dover, Delaware. I hope everybody is

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having a great week. Beautiful day here in Delaware. Eighty

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five degrees is going to be are high, lots of

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sunshine and actually not a whole lot of spraying today.

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Knock on wood that we can make it through the

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day without being poisoned from above. Hey, a big shout

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out to Shelby who has sent some contributions to the podcast,

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who also joined us live in Oklahoma City back in

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twenty twenty four. Shout out to Shelby, and of course

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our friend Chuck in Indiana. Good to hear from him,

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and of course our friend north of the border, Don

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in Canada. Thank you all for your kind words, continued

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support and contributions to the podcast. I don't have traditional cable,

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maybe some of you all do. Maybe some of you

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all have the YouTube TV. We have our Amazon Prime

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subscription because we live out in the boonies. It behooves

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us to pay that whatever to get free delivery out here,

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and certainly as much as gas costs. But we have

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the Roku thing, and when you go to the mainscreen,

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they always have an advertise meant for a show, and

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the advertisement the other day was for this show Kara

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Swisher Wants to Live Forever, and I guess the show

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airs on CNN and listen. I have no idea what

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a Karen Swisher is, but apparently it was a six

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part CNN original series where journalist Kara Swisher investigates the

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booming longevity industry, anti aging, and Silicon Valley's obsession with

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defying death. And I've mentioned many times before that that's

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really what these people who are in a different world,

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who don't believe in God, who want to defy God,

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who want to be their own God, and many of

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those people don't want to submit to their creator because

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it would affect their lifestyle and they don't want to

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change who they are. So again, if you have everything

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in the world, well that's what it's all about. They're

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examining the tech bro culture, all of this biohacking and

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all of this blood drinking it's really evil, and they

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don't even hide it anymore. So it's very interesting to

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me to see where they are. I saw some of

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the clips from the Met whatever from last night, and

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you know, these people obviously paying homage to Lucifer wearing

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those ridiculous outfits. You know, it's really an interesting time

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that we're living in. In twenty twenty six. I said,

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twenty nineteen was just seven years ago. And I don't

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think if we were there and saw what we saw today,

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we would recognize what we see. And again, I truly

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believe in twenty thirty we're not going to recognize life today.

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That's how fast things are. Per dressing and you know

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this out and about longevity obsessed billionaires who are concerned

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about worldly things, and that met Gala. Many of the

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posts I saw, here's this lady's eighty two years old

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and she's still wearing skimpy dresses. Look at her. Good

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for her. You know, empower and pride and all the

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things the Bible warns us about, truly, and you know,

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that's one thing you're never going to overcome. You may

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think that you can, but you cannot. That's why, you know,

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faith is so important right now. So we have a

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lot to talk about today. I just wanted to get

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that that shocked me when I saw these people are

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so obsessed.

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Speaker 4: Right, used to be.

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Speaker 3: A conspiracy theory. They used to make movies about it. No,

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people are generally looking for eternal life on Earth. I

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couldn't imagine being one hundred and twenty years old, no

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matter what I look like, right, And I've been saying

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that for years. The whole Jeffrey Epstein was more about

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what's on the surface. It's about bioengineering and wanting to

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live forever, cracking the code, playing god right, and you know,

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kind of a parallel babble instead of getting up into heaven,

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making your own heaven here on earth. That's what they believe.

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But they don't change their ways. They're going to have

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a rough time. Oklahoma City. We have been looking at this,

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you know, for the last couple of weeks and going

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back over some YouTube clips, reading some articles. You know,

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I'm not sure I completely understood back in nineteen ninety

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five and nineteen ninety six how evil the powers that

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be truly are. I think I was still naive at

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that point and believe that our government was looking out

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for their best interests. And sure there were time where

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maybe we had to you know, sacrifice the needs of

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the few for the needs of the many. Right, we

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were fed those lies, and certainly after about the second

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or third tour in Iraq that that's what we kept

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telling ourselves. We're fighting the bad guys over here, so

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they don't mess with our family and our countrymen over there.

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And of course it was about resources and it was

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about division, and sadly, you know, here in twenty twenty six,

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you understand that war is also about killing Christians. You

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have the generation before me who believes that everybody in

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Iran is evil and going to Hell, and they're you know,

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being restrained by evil dictators and this, that and the

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other thing, and everybody in Israel is good. They're just

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we have to do whatever we can to save them.

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But thankfully through the duality. Right, we use that word

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for describing evil things quite often, but you can use

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technology for good as well, and through YouTube and you know, rumble,

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sub stack, and yes, many of those platforms have withheld

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the truth. And again people who you know, support the phrase.

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You know, those words are hurtful, you know, hate speech.

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That's that's the term I was looking for. Well, then,

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who gets to be the arbiter of the truth, Who

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gets to say what is hate speech and what is not?

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The truth?

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Speaker 4: Is the truth?

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Speaker 3: And I said today, you know about John fourteen six.

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You're not saved by your zip code. You're either in

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Christ or you're anti Christ. And again, the generation before

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me believes that you are saved by zip code. If

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you are within the borders of Israel, then God has

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a special plan for you. And no matter how many

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times I I show some of those people John fourteen six,

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Galatians three twenty eight, on and on and on, they

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shake their head like they understand, but they truly don't.

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And that's one of the frustrating parts of where we

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are today, trying to get that across right, trying to

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unprogramm fifty sixty seventy years of indoctrination. I have a

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couple audio clips to kick things off with. The first

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one is April nineteen ninety five and President then President

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Bill Clinton.

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Speaker 5: The bombing in Oklahoma City was an attack on innocent

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children and defenseless citizens. It was an act of cowardice,

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and it was evil. The United States will not tolerate it.

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And I will not allow the people of this country

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to be intimidated by evil cowards. I have met with

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our team, which we assembled to deal with this bombing,

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and I have determined to take the following steps to

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assure the strongest response.

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Speaker 6: To this situation.

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Speaker 5: First, I have deployed a crisis management team under the

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leadership of the FBI, working with the Department of Justice,

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the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, military and local authorities.

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We are sending the world's finest investigators to solve these murders. Second,

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I have declared an emergency in Oklahoma City, and at

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my direction, James Lee Witt, the director of the Federal

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Emergency Management Agency, is now on his way there to

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make sure we do everything we can to help the

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people of Oklahoma deal with the tragedy. Third, we are

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taking every precaution to reassure and to protect people who

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work in or live near.

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Speaker 7: Other federal facilities.

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Speaker 4: Let there be no room for doubt.

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Speaker 5: We will find the people who did this. When we do,

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justice will be swift, certain, and severe. These people are killers,

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and they must be treated like killers. Finally, let me

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say that I ask all Americans tonight to pray, to

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pray for the people who have lost their lives, to

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pray for the families and the friends of the dead

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and the wounded, to pray for the people of Oklahoma City.

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Speaker 3: And who exactly are you praying to, Bill, Because your God,

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sadly is not the one I worship. Going to start

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with an article from Sign of the Times from April nineteenth,

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twenty thirteenth, that would have been the twentieth anniversary of Waco,

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the eighteenth anniversary of Oklahoma City. And again they start

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off with a picture of the image of the Murrah

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Building from April nineteenth, nineteen ninety five. And of course

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that they're like, seriously, a fertilizer bomb. Did this only

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in the black op world where jet fuel can melt

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to skyscrapers, right, And of course I'm laughing out of frustration,

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not out of jest. But on April nineteenth, nineteen ninety three,

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in Waco, Texas, the government And that's interesting, isn't it.

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You know, here's Clinton saying what what should happen to them?

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Knowing full well that he and Poppy Bush and the

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powers that be were involved in this. Right, the reason

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Clinton was appointed to hand over the rains is number one.

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Poppy Bush preferred to do things behind the scenes. He

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did so from the early sixties all the way up

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until the time he died. He orchestrated ninety one the

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original invasion of the golf and remember that is the

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origin of God's creation, with the Tigris and Euphrates meet.

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And he was more. It wasn't just about oil. It

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was about history and preserving Israel, the geopolitical state of Israel,

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and so many other things. But remember during the eighties,

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you know, when Clinton was the power player in Arkansas

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that were running drugs out of Mina, Arkansas, and you know,

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Poppy said, you do this for me, We'll pay you back,

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you know, And that's what happened.

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Speaker 4: Ninety two he.

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Speaker 3: Handed over the reins to Clinton. You saw so many

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terrible things happened ninety three with Waco, ninety five, with

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Oklahoma City ninety it was either ninety six or ninety

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eight with TWA eight hundred. You know, a airplane, commercial

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airplane getting shot down, and they blame it on something silly,

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and they mock us right to our face. And now

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we say God, small g is what they're saying. And

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most people and all their cluelessness just don't quite get it.

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But you know, here we are thirty three years, just

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over thirty three years, Waco, Texas. Our government, the people

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we pay our taxes to, incinerated eighty six of its

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own citizens for the crime of exercising their constitutional rights

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of freedom of religion, right to bear arms, and freedom

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of speech. Timothy McVeigh, who had been at the scene

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to witness some of the events during the preceding fifty

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day standoff with US troops, witnessed the inferno erupt on

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television Two years later to the day. On April nineteenth,

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nineteen ninety five, the Murrah Building in Oklahoma City was

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destroyed by a bomb blast. McVeigh was arrested a short

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time after being pulled over this genius for driving a

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car with no license plate and possession of an unlicensed firearm.

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Several days later, he was identified by witnesses as one

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of the two people seen getting out of a rider

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rental truck that was parked in front just before the blast.

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The other suspect was never identified and his existence was

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denied by the government, even though he was caught on videotape. Now,

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it's interesting how many of you all remember from about

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four years ago, I think the King Soups shooting, and

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let's fact check myself here, King Soups shooting. Now, one

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thing I do remember it was store number thirty three.

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That it's just a coincidence. But it was March twenty second,

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twenty twenty one. Okay, so this was still, you know,

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with the height of the vaccine thing that was going on,

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mass shooting at King Soups, which it's called King Soupers.

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It's the big grocery chain out there in Colorado. When

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we lived in Colorado Springs for seven years, that was

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our little grocery store, not this particular one. But they

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claimed the shooter, a twenty one year old by the

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name of Ahmed al Aloui al Issa, there's your five a's,

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was arrested after being shot in the right leg. And

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again it's interesting that it was a store number thirty three,

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and the headline of March nineteenth, twenty twenty one, of

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I think it was the Denver Post, was that this

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gun bill was dead on arrival, and you know he

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you go three days later you have this mass shooting,

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which listen, it's been a while since I went back

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and relooked at this, But I remember thinking how orchestrated

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much of it seemed to be. And I'm not saying

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that they never sacrifice one or two people for the cause,

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but the numbers fifty five convictions, thirty eight counts of

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attempted murder, a man waiting in line for his COVID

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nineteen vaccine, witnessed the gunman shoot a woman at the

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front of the line, on and on and on. But

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that the biggest takeaway from that from five years ago

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was that, of course because of this event, well, they

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pushed that bill right through. They always if there is

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some type of counter terrorism bill, some type of gun

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bill that is struggling, they will pull this mass event

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and then people will get behind it. Yet, please do

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whatever you have to do, just keep us safe. And

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Oklahoma City was very similar to that. April nineteen ninety five,

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the omnibus counter terrorism bill was struggling to get through Congress,

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and after Oklahoma City, the tragedy looked like it had

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been tailor made to rally public support for the tyrannical bill.

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What other important facts, and I think I mentioned this

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last week. Right the morning of the bombing on that

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April nineteenth, nineteen ninety five, the ATF office that was

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located inside the Murrah Building was empty. That is unheard

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of at nine am on a weekday. Once you start

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getting into these coincidences, you know, it's very much that

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that's quite an earmark for a conspiracy something grander. Look

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at all the conspiracy or coincidences with nine to eleven. Right,

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Oklahoma City Congressman or I should say Oklahoma Congressman Ernest

255
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Istouk told a victim in a tape conversation in nineteen

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ninety five that the Oklahoma City bombing was a failed

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national security operation that used an FBI provocateur associated with

258
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the militia Number four. The ATF was already putting out

259
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a story that the Murrah Building was bombed because of Waco,

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only a few hours after the actual blast and before

261
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McVeigh was ever arrested. Now, once again you have another

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connection to nine to eleven. You have the greatest crime

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scene in American history, and within one hour you have

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Paul Bremer an NBC studio saying Osama bin Laden did it.

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Speaker 7: I mean.

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Speaker 3: They had it all figured out in an hour, the

267
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greatest crime scene. But you know when Joe Schmell on

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the corner gets you know killed. You know, the police

269
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don't want to talk about anything too. You know, we

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have to preserve all this evidence, and we have to

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make sure our eyes are dotted and our teaser crossed.

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Oh no, they had it all figured out within minutes.

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And it was the same here. They were already putting

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out those story number five and again this is a

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big one. An unexploded bomb was found attached to a

276
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gas line inside the building, and a FEMA memo reports

277
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at least two additional bombs were found in the Murrah Building.

278
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Joe Harp, based on his military explosives experience, identified the

279
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additional bombs he saw removed from the building as being

280
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military in nature. Not sure what a non military bomb

281
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looks like, but okay. Number six. General Bent and parton

282
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which we spoke at nauseum last week, stated in his

283
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Oklahoma City bombing report to US Congress that the Murrah

284
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Building was not caused solely by a truck bomb. The major,

285
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the major factor in its destruction appears to have been

286
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detonated by explosives carefully placed at four critical junctures on

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supporting columns within the building.

288
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Speaker 7: We know that.

289
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Speaker 3: Explosives, daisy cutters, whatever they were. NATO thermite was placed

290
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carefully on the twin towers and that is what caused

291
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the implosion of both buildings on September eleventh, two thousand

292
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and one. And everybody just forgets about Building seven, right.

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People just figure, oh, they build all those buildings pre

294
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wirre just in case they have to pull them. Right,

295
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:13,039
you don't set charges in building while it's on fire.

296
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Building one, Building two, and Building seven were all wired

297
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prior to September eleventh, two thousand and one. They were

298
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brought down for insurance reasons. And again I believe a

299
00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:32,160
lot of those had documents that could have exposed some people.

300
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And I think gold was taken. It was such a

301
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wide array of reasons these things were carried out, and

302
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of course the bigger reason was to get America behind

303
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sending people, you know, to cause mayhem in the Middle East.

304
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We have this country has been so detrimental to the world.

305
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Were one of the youngest countries in the world. And

306
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if you look at all the governments we've overthrown and

307
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all the mayhem, and that's the thing that we have

308
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to deal with is understanding that much of our comfort

309
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comes at the expense of so many people. Whether it's

310
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it's just a lot, I'll stay focused anyway. Number seven.

311
00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:21,400
Prior to the Oklahoma City bombing, Arlen Spector, that's another

312
00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:24,240
guy you could do a deep dive on, as well

313
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as Clinton's NSC director, Anthony Lake had been advocating federal

314
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national security operations to stop militias in America. And I

315
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think this is where the deeper conspiracy lies. So Ruby Ridge,

316
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and I was gone through a lot between ninety two

317
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and ninety five. I was not very in touch with

318
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:53,359
what was really going on in the world, you know,

319
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Ruby Ridge, And we're going to talk about that next week.

320
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One of the the most gross, overstepping, evil things this

321
00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:09,920
government has ever done. And that's why we have to

322
00:23:10,039 --> 00:23:17,200
eliminate these tyrannical forces in the name of safety.

323
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Speaker 4: You know.

324
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Speaker 3: Anthony Lake. By the way, he gave a speech to

325
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the Council on Foreign Relations in the fall of ninety four,

326
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just six months prior to Oklahoma City, and he said

327
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that the chief cornerstone of government policy was to pit

328
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our society against militias. Now for the uneducated who think, yeah,

329
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:54,839
we don't need those bad you know, militias. You don't

330
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:58,240
understand the Second Amendment very well that there's still a

331
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plethora of people who think the Second Amendment is there

332
00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,480
for us to go hunting. No back when they wrote

333
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that if you weren't hunting, there's a good chance you

334
00:24:07,799 --> 00:24:12,000
weren't eating, at least not meat. I'm sure they had

335
00:24:12,039 --> 00:24:15,400
places where you could go and buy food and butchers, etc.

336
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But it's not like refrigeration was as handy like everybody

337
00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:27,319
else has. It was to, you know, protect ourselves from

338
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a tyrannical government, and now they've made it to where

339
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you root for your own demise. And my buddy sent

340
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:39,079
me such a wonderful let me pull it out here,

341
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:42,200
something he said yesterday, and I'd like your thoughts on it.

342
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Maybe you don't agree, and that's fine. We text each

343
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other so much here.

344
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Speaker 4: It is.

345
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Speaker 3: To live for a political party is unworthy of a

346
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man who professes to be a Christian. And I do

347
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have an issue with someone who speaks partisan poulolitics from

348
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a pulpit. I don't think something as divisive as politics

349
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now listen, advocating against abortion is not political. I think

350
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every pastor should stand up to evil things like that,

351
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like I was telling my buddy. Maybe half a mile

352
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from my house growing up, there was an abortion clinic

353
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in the seventies. It used to be an old Wilmington

354
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Trust building, which was one of the major bank heres

355
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:39,079
back in the day. Now I think that got bought

356
00:25:39,079 --> 00:25:42,880
out by M and T or something, but the bank

357
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:47,440
closed the location and an abortion clinic took it over.

358
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And every Saturday, and I mean every Saturday, if memory

359
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:56,559
serves me correct, there were people outside picketing that this

360
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abortion clinic, and my father would take water down there beverages.

361
00:26:01,319 --> 00:26:04,880
I don't recall him ever participating, but I remember he

362
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would run into the shop right and grab some water

363
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and pass it out. And I was talking to my buddy,

364
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I was like, when was the last time you saw

365
00:26:14,079 --> 00:26:18,720
someone picketing outside of planned parenthood? There's one thirty minutes

366
00:26:18,759 --> 00:26:24,799
from my house in downtown Dover. We we'll mention it

367
00:26:24,839 --> 00:26:27,640
every now and then, but it's evil. You look at

368
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the numbers you have, I believe, and it's a fact.

369
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After ninety two and Ruby Ridge, I think it was August.

370
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,000
You know, we'll cover it next week. But after what

371
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happened to Randy Weaver and his wife and his child

372
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and his dog and what happened that day it angered

373
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a lot of people. And then of course with Waco,

374
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which we mentioned a few weeks ago, they had this

375
00:27:00,079 --> 00:27:04,079
sexual harassment laws who make national news June of ninety two.

376
00:27:05,279 --> 00:27:07,680
So they said, let's kill two birds with one stone.

377
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:12,960
Let's make you know, militias look evil. Let's take care

378
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:19,400
of these branch Davidians. And you know, in turn, we'll

379
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:21,799
make militias look bad, right, and we're going to make

380
00:27:21,839 --> 00:27:24,759
the ATF look good. We're going to get that budget passed.

381
00:27:25,559 --> 00:27:28,240
And the exact opposite happened. They ended up killing all

382
00:27:28,279 --> 00:27:35,039
those people and descent grew larger. So with that larger descent,

383
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:41,920
they drew larger false flags to bring about more draconian laws,

384
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:48,400
and with the Omnibus, they started infiltrating militias taking down people.

385
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,480
Rudy Davis, God bless them, has been advocating for a

386
00:27:51,519 --> 00:27:56,079
lot of these political prisoners for many, many years. He's

387
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:58,039
not as active as he used to be. I think

388
00:27:58,079 --> 00:28:00,359
he's burned out, but he has done more more than

389
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,880
most people to help advocate and to pray for and

390
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:06,720
to put these people's plights out there who have been

391
00:28:06,759 --> 00:28:16,119
framed by the government. It's truly a shame. And if

392
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:22,440
you seriously believe that McVeigh right, this supposedly rarely employed

393
00:28:22,559 --> 00:28:24,480
drifter who again, I do think he was part of

394
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:27,240
the club. You don't get on the PSD of General

395
00:28:27,279 --> 00:28:33,240
Schwartzkoff and you're some slacker, right, He was broken alone,

396
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,039
and as the government would have you believe, was able

397
00:28:37,039 --> 00:28:41,319
to plan a symbol a sophisticated bomb pull off the

398
00:28:41,319 --> 00:28:44,359
world's largest, you know, to that point, the largest terror

399
00:28:44,359 --> 00:28:49,440
attack on American soil? Why do we keep believing this stuff?

400
00:28:52,039 --> 00:28:54,960
If you look at the details, you'd have to conclude

401
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:59,480
that sure, he was a part of a very large

402
00:28:59,519 --> 00:29:07,240
conspirac see involving pardon me, involving CIA sponsored domestic and

403
00:29:07,279 --> 00:29:11,279
Middle Eastern helpers. Yes, and Middle Eastern two. They all

404
00:29:11,279 --> 00:29:14,839
play a part of it. The FBI's refusal to follow

405
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,240
up and ignore so many leads went beyond its ordinary

406
00:29:18,279 --> 00:29:22,200
incompetence and reaked of reason. And going back to what

407
00:29:22,279 --> 00:29:25,680
Clinton said in that last clip, you're right, they should

408
00:29:26,119 --> 00:29:28,720
be accountable for what they did. The government, the Renos,

409
00:29:28,759 --> 00:29:32,480
the Clintons, the Specters, and many of the same characters

410
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:36,920
who played a part in nine eleven as well, McVeigh.

411
00:29:37,079 --> 00:29:40,000
His attorney, Stephen Jones, who worked on the case for years,

412
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:44,480
believed McVeigh was just a part of a greater conspiracy.

413
00:29:44,799 --> 00:29:48,799
Of course, the last thing McVeigh would do is turn

414
00:29:48,839 --> 00:29:53,000
over information on co conspirators to those he despised. I

415
00:29:53,039 --> 00:29:55,440
do think there is some truth to the fact. I

416
00:29:55,559 --> 00:29:59,079
haven't looked into it very deeply that they faked his death.

417
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,839
There's lots of rumors, the witnesses who were there when

418
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,799
he was quote unquote executed. And yes, there is an

419
00:30:06,839 --> 00:30:08,960
FBI agent who looks exactly like him.

420
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:09,759
Speaker 4: You can just.

421
00:30:09,759 --> 00:30:13,680
Speaker 3: Google McVeigh FBI look alike and you'll see the picture

422
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,799
side by side. It's interesting and it reminds me of

423
00:30:16,839 --> 00:30:21,599
the challengers, right, all those astro Knots who had twins,

424
00:30:22,559 --> 00:30:24,559
Go google that one. I think five out of the

425
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:29,720
six or seven astro Knots had twins. Just a coincidence, right,

426
00:30:31,039 --> 00:30:33,920
But McVeigh wanted himself seen as someone who fired the

427
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:37,759
first shot that would start a revolution against a government

428
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:42,400
capable of atrocities such as Ruby Ridge and Waco. And

429
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,559
it goes so much further than that. Lying about the

430
00:30:47,599 --> 00:30:51,000
Gulf of Tonkin, sending fifty eight thousand men and women

431
00:30:51,039 --> 00:30:55,440
to their death. And you know Agent Orange and the drugs,

432
00:30:56,319 --> 00:31:02,359
the hippie movement, the gold standard being removed, FDR making

433
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,160
you turn in your gold at twenty three bucks, an

434
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:09,599
ounce raising it to thirty. That the government has continued

435
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:15,960
to be parasites to us and we still blatantly defend them.

436
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:19,880
We have to pick a team. No, you don't. You

437
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:21,759
don't have to pick a team at all.

438
00:31:23,119 --> 00:31:23,559
Speaker 7: You don't.

439
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:28,119
Speaker 8: Now.

440
00:31:28,359 --> 00:31:30,440
Speaker 3: The rumor is that he wanted to take full credit

441
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,359
for the bombing. He didn't want to share it with everyone.

442
00:31:33,279 --> 00:31:35,799
In this view, it would make him a mythic figure,

443
00:31:36,039 --> 00:31:39,079
a martyr for the revolution. I don't know about that.

444
00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:44,039
The Murror Building in Oklahoma City again, that was where

445
00:31:44,079 --> 00:31:48,880
all the records of the Waco siege were being kept. Also,

446
00:31:49,079 --> 00:31:54,319
there are rumors that all of the Clinton's Whitewater documents

447
00:31:54,359 --> 00:31:58,160
were there as well. And that hearing, I think was

448
00:31:58,279 --> 00:32:03,519
four days after the bombing, so the focus was taking

449
00:32:03,559 --> 00:32:11,440
off the Clintons. McVeigh was seen with many many unidentified individuals,

450
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:16,359
many with Middle Eastern features. Would you say, Masad the

451
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:19,640
same people who maybe has something to do with nine

452
00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:23,039
to eleven At the trial, these facts were not allowed

453
00:32:23,119 --> 00:32:26,640
as evidence. Also, at his trial, his sister read a

454
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,279
letter from McVeigh to the grand jury in which he

455
00:32:29,359 --> 00:32:32,640
told her he was going into the Special Forces Covert

456
00:32:33,119 --> 00:32:39,359
Tactical Unit. There's also a picture of a mcveyish looking

457
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:45,599
fellow from this depot Army d poet. I want to say, Wisconsin,

458
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:48,440
and you can find that on the internet as well.

459
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:53,799
There's so many, so many ups and downs with this thing.

460
00:32:54,799 --> 00:33:02,319
Survivor Jane Graham tells of three suspicious two three suspicious

461
00:33:02,359 --> 00:33:05,680
men she saw in the Murrah building the week prior

462
00:33:05,759 --> 00:33:09,519
to the bombing in the garage, and she was shocked

463
00:33:10,599 --> 00:33:15,880
by the FBI's disinterest in the matter. Virgil Steel and

464
00:33:16,039 --> 00:33:20,200
elevator inspector at the scene also saw two additional bombs

465
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:23,839
being removed from the building. Reports of additional bombs were

466
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:27,160
confirmed by the Oklahoma City Fire Department, and of course

467
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,400
there's the video of the two explosions, which, by the way,

468
00:33:31,119 --> 00:33:34,000
they have done a heck of a job pulling off

469
00:33:34,039 --> 00:33:39,200
the internet. They use trained explosive sniffing dogs to locate

470
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:43,200
the additional bombs. So not only did the devices found

471
00:33:43,319 --> 00:33:47,200
in the Murrah building have to look like real bombs

472
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:50,279
to full the bomb squad. They had to smell like

473
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:54,759
real explosives to the bomb sniffing dogs. A video of

474
00:33:54,799 --> 00:33:58,039
Timothy McVeigh from a security camera at a McDonald's in

475
00:33:58,359 --> 00:34:02,359
Junction City, along with statements from the writer employees who

476
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:06,119
rented the truck, can be seen as proof that McVeigh

477
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:09,679
did not rent the rider truck used in the bombing.

478
00:34:11,039 --> 00:34:13,440
McVeigh had been filmed by the security camera at the

479
00:34:13,519 --> 00:34:18,239
McDonald's just minutes before the time stamped on the rental agreement,

480
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:23,480
wearing clothes that didn't match either of the men seen

481
00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:28,840
at the truck rental center. There's also no plausible explanation

482
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:31,199
of how he traveled the mile in a quarter from

483
00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:37,320
McDonald's to the rental agency Carlos alone without getting soaked

484
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:41,480
in the rain. Now, the three people interviewed agreed that

485
00:34:41,599 --> 00:34:45,599
John Doe's one and two were dry. According to Stephen Jones,

486
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:50,519
mcveigh's first attorney, who had seen the interview transcripts, said

487
00:34:50,519 --> 00:34:53,920
it took forty four days. Forty four days for the

488
00:34:54,039 --> 00:34:57,440
FBI to convince the car rental agency owner that John

489
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:01,320
Doe Number one was Timothy McVeigh. In other words, they

490
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:04,360
browbeat them. Yeah, Yeah, that's him. Whatever, just leave me alone, right.

491
00:35:04,199 --> 00:35:04,880
Speaker 4: That's what they did.

492
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 3: And in the end they didn't dare put them on

493
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:10,719
the witness stand for fear of what would happen under

494
00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:14,960
cross examination. And that might explain why the initial description

495
00:35:15,039 --> 00:35:19,000
of John Doe one circulated by the FBI, referred to

496
00:35:19,039 --> 00:35:23,079
a man with pockmark skin fairly stocky, stood about five

497
00:35:23,119 --> 00:35:26,679
to ten. McVeigh was six y three then as a

498
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,639
rail one hundred and sixty pounds soak and wet, had

499
00:35:29,679 --> 00:35:34,639
a smooth complexion. The FBI and US Army used National

500
00:35:34,679 --> 00:35:40,440
Security Operation grounds to threaten Army recruiters with court martial

501
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:45,920
if they described publicly the John Doe provocateurs the recruiters

502
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:51,199
had seen with McVeigh in the Murrah Building, twenty miles

503
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:55,639
away from the blast. Seismographs at the University of Oklahoma

504
00:35:56,119 --> 00:36:02,559
recorded not one, but two explosive events just after nine

505
00:36:02,599 --> 00:36:06,880
am on April nineteenth, nineteen ninety five, within just a

506
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:11,880
few seconds of each other. The Omniplex Science Center in

507
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:17,199
Oklahoma City recorded the same dual disturbance, the second one

508
00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:21,599
stronger than the first. Doctor Charles Mankin, director of the

509
00:36:21,679 --> 00:36:26,199
University of Oklahoma Geological Survey held a press conference shortly

510
00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:29,360
after the bombing and told an assembly of journalists that

511
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:35,840
the seismic graph readings clearly indicated two explosions. Clearly. Even

512
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:40,280
the news media reported two bomb blasts initially, but they

513
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:44,760
changed their story. That's why it's important. When these events happen,

514
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:47,679
you have to harness that information, pull it off the

515
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:50,039
Internet and put it on your hard drive because they'll

516
00:36:50,079 --> 00:36:55,400
scrub that anything that goes against the official narrative. So again,

517
00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:59,400
there is a link between the Murrah Building bombing and

518
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,960
the events of No. Pine to eleven. The nineteen ninety

519
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:04,760
three World Trade Center bombing materials had been purchased with

520
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:10,679
a credit card of US Muslim and FBI provocateur named

521
00:37:10,840 --> 00:37:12,079
Melvin Latimore.

522
00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 9: Now.

523
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:18,039
Speaker 3: Lattimore was seen by four witnesses in mcveigh's car at

524
00:37:18,039 --> 00:37:23,280
the Oklahoma City's Traveler Aid office adjacent to the Murrah

525
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:27,960
Federal Building, just one day before the Oklahoma City bombing.

526
00:37:30,039 --> 00:37:35,639
Six FBI agents spent nine months browbeating the four witnesses

527
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:39,280
trying to make them to change their story about seeing

528
00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:43,960
Lattimore at the Traveler's Aid Now Latimore was the roommate

529
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:49,639
of the twentieth nine to eleven Jacker Zacharias Massawai while

530
00:37:49,639 --> 00:37:52,960
he attended the Airman Flight School in Norman, Oklahoma in

531
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:57,440
two thousand and two thousand and one. Latimore was also

532
00:37:57,519 --> 00:38:02,519
the roommate of Al Haasmi and Al Shahey in Norman, Oklahoma.

533
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:07,360
Retired to Air Force. General Benton Parton informed the Attorney

534
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:11,039
General Ashcroft in August of two thousand and one of

535
00:38:11,079 --> 00:38:15,440
the Traveler's AIG story in writing and in person, and

536
00:38:15,519 --> 00:38:17,679
of course nothing done was about Ashcroft.

537
00:38:19,159 --> 00:38:19,320
Speaker 7: Now.

538
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:23,960
Speaker 3: The other thing is what we call mk ultra. It

539
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,199
was reported that McVeigh receive some twelve or more visits

540
00:38:28,199 --> 00:38:33,480
by doctor Jolly Jolly West, the UCLA mind control expert

541
00:38:33,559 --> 00:38:37,920
for the CIA, who pronounced Jack Ruby insane after he

542
00:38:38,079 --> 00:38:43,119
suggested a conspiracy with the jfk assassination. And of course,

543
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:45,280
if you're going to say his name, say correctly it's

544
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:50,599
Jack Rubinstein. He was also the government psychiatrist who handled

545
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:54,000
Sir hansir Hann as he awaited trial. You know that

546
00:38:54,199 --> 00:38:58,079
was a phony shooting. Jolly West was when I say

547
00:38:58,119 --> 00:39:00,880
you with phony shooting, Sir hanser Hann is not responsible

548
00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:04,719
for killing RFK. Obviously RFK was murdered, but it was

549
00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:09,159
a conspiracy, just like eleven twenty two sixty three. But

550
00:39:09,239 --> 00:39:12,800
Jolly West was infamous for his early use of using

551
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:16,760
LSD on unsuspecting victims. He was the head of the

552
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:21,280
CIA's mind control program known as mk Ultra and was

553
00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:26,199
a pioneer of electric brain experimentation. With the numerous sightings

554
00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:29,719
of the John does with the Middle Eastern features, along

555
00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:33,400
with the known CIA links to Middle Eastern terrorist organizations,

556
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:37,800
the statements of explosive experts that the truck bomb alone

557
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:41,920
would have not possibly caused the extensive damage that we saw,

558
00:39:43,559 --> 00:39:47,480
the numerous witnesses claiming that they saw bombs being taken

559
00:39:47,519 --> 00:39:54,920
out of the building after the explosion, the incredible unlikelihood

560
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:59,599
of McVeigh being able to pull this off without help

561
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:05,519
in powerful places, and I mean powerful places, and of course,

562
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:10,159
along with the FBI admitting that they withheld evidence, what

563
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:14,480
you see here is a web of lies and deceit

564
00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:19,920
that was never untangled. And the truth about what happened

565
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:22,760
in Oklahoma City will never be told by the government.

566
00:40:23,119 --> 00:40:27,480
It'll never be written in the history books. They'll never

567
00:40:27,519 --> 00:40:30,199
feel any pressure too. What's on to the next thing.

568
00:40:31,159 --> 00:40:34,360
The federal government did admit in May two thousand and

569
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:39,519
one that critical pieces of evidence and witnesses were not

570
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:44,079
allowed to be presented at his trial, delaying his execution

571
00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:51,599
for another month, but the execution went ahead anyway. The

572
00:40:51,679 --> 00:40:56,719
murders of Ruby Ridge and Waco are free and alive.

573
00:40:57,639 --> 00:41:01,559
But on June eleventh, two thousand and one, there's that number.

574
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:06,079
Timothy McVeigh was put to death by means of lethal

575
00:41:06,119 --> 00:41:09,280
injection at the hands of the US government. He was

576
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:13,360
silenced forever or was he taking the secrets of Oklahoma

577
00:41:13,400 --> 00:41:18,320
City with him? Three months to the day later. Isn't

578
00:41:18,320 --> 00:41:23,079
that interesting? Nine to eleven came with more new laws,

579
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:28,639
new wars, and the new terror that followed the glaring

580
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:32,119
questions of Oklahoma City are now a distant, faded memory.

581
00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:35,159
And because they got away with this and nine to

582
00:41:35,199 --> 00:41:41,039
eleven and COVID, your government continues to lie and falsely

583
00:41:41,159 --> 00:41:46,039
accuse and to kill in order to maintain their balance

584
00:41:46,079 --> 00:41:50,599
of power. And they're probably going to set off some

585
00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:54,320
type of huge explosion in a major city. Blame it

586
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:59,239
on Iran so he can get the people behind us again, right,

587
00:42:00,039 --> 00:42:04,000
because we're saddled with an electorate that is more concerned

588
00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:08,639
with watching the next episode of Cops instead of standing

589
00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:14,199
up for their constitutional rights. These abuses of power continue

590
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:19,920
to grow. Let's go back to the April nineteenth, nineteen

591
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,440
ninety five, when NBC first reported the day's events.

592
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:26,159
Speaker 7: And good morning everyone.

593
00:42:26,159 --> 00:42:27,639
Speaker 10: I'm Matt Lower in New York and we do have

594
00:42:27,679 --> 00:42:29,760
a special report from NBC News. There has been a

595
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:33,840
massive explosion at a federal building in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma.

596
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,199
It happened just a short time ago. A large portion

597
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:38,960
of that building has collapsed and fallen away from the

598
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:41,079
rest of the building. At the moment, we don't have

599
00:42:41,119 --> 00:42:43,960
any specific numbers on injuries or deaths, but we can

600
00:42:44,039 --> 00:42:46,599
tell you that the Red Cross in the Oklahoma City

601
00:42:46,639 --> 00:42:50,039
area has asked for all volunteers to report for duty. Also,

602
00:42:50,519 --> 00:42:52,800
we can tell you that they've asked for donations of blood.

603
00:42:52,840 --> 00:42:55,920
So the situation is obviously serious. We're going to go

604
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:58,159
right now and join our coverage of our sister station

605
00:42:58,360 --> 00:42:59,880
KFLR in Oklahoma.

606
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:01,880
Speaker 4: They're on the air, and maybe they can give us.

607
00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:04,079
Speaker 6: Some more information for our viewers who may have just

608
00:43:04,199 --> 00:43:04,559
joined us.

609
00:43:04,599 --> 00:43:06,239
Speaker 11: Let's go ahead and recap what happened.

610
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 12: There was an explosion. It happened about an hour ago.

611
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:11,440
Speaker 13: As you said earlier, happened at about nine o'clock.

612
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:13,360
Speaker 14: You may have felt it at about nine o'clock.

613
00:43:13,519 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 13: It was at the Alfred Murle Federal Building in downtown

614
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:16,679
Oklahoma City.

615
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:18,440
Speaker 15: Right now, we're about to get a live report from

616
00:43:18,440 --> 00:43:19,079
the news channels.

617
00:43:19,119 --> 00:43:21,000
Speaker 6: Tara Bloom, Tara, what can you tell us?

618
00:43:21,079 --> 00:43:23,239
Speaker 16: Well, Lee, just take a look for yourself. There's the

619
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:26,320
Alfred Murray Federal Building behind me, and you can see

620
00:43:26,599 --> 00:43:28,480
just how badly damaged it is.

621
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:29,719
Speaker 12: It's about half of the.

622
00:43:29,639 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 16: Building that is literally hanging and at the bottom, the

623
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:36,960
bottom two floors are just stacked debris. Now, there are

624
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:39,079
several other buildings right around to give you an idea

625
00:43:39,079 --> 00:43:40,880
of what kind of impact has had. Look at the

626
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:44,440
Regency Towers there. Almost all the windows have been blown

627
00:43:44,480 --> 00:43:46,320
out of that hotel complex.

628
00:43:46,400 --> 00:43:48,760
Speaker 1: There's several block area.

629
00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:52,079
Speaker 16: It's complete devastation. Windows blown out of all the buildings.

630
00:43:52,199 --> 00:43:54,599
Some of these older brick buildings, the brick walls have

631
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:58,599
collapsed and they are still taking away dozens of casualties

632
00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:01,800
of this explosion. They've been running out of ambulances.

633
00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:04,920
Speaker 10: You are watching live coverage from our station kfo R

634
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:07,639
in Oklahoma City. They are covering the explosion that took

635
00:44:07,679 --> 00:44:09,639
place in that city a short time ago at the

636
00:44:09,639 --> 00:44:13,320
Alfred Murray Federal Building. And again we'll have more information

637
00:44:13,440 --> 00:44:16,159
for you on this NBC station as it is available

638
00:44:16,199 --> 00:44:16,519
to us.

639
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:23,199
Speaker 3: There you go, interesting kind of timeline that is more

640
00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:26,920
probably connected to nine to eleven. But I think it's

641
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:30,079
important to be noted that from eighty eight to ninety five,

642
00:44:31,639 --> 00:44:35,400
Khalid Sheik Mohammad's brother worked for a charity, and that's

643
00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:38,679
white so important. You know, for quite some time we

644
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:42,960
got pretty deeply involved into the nine to ninety These

645
00:44:44,760 --> 00:44:49,840
nonprofit tax returns and nonprofits are used, you know, as

646
00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:53,920
kind of these shell organizations to funnel money. To know,

647
00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:57,519
many of these terrorist organizations, a lot of them go

648
00:44:57,639 --> 00:45:01,079
to Israel. You look at what whether it's the Bill

649
00:45:01,119 --> 00:45:09,199
and Melinda Gates Foundation, the American Heart Association, just it's unbelievable.

650
00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:12,599
You know, they pull on the heartstrings of Americans and

651
00:45:12,599 --> 00:45:15,559
they give their hard earned money on top of all

652
00:45:15,559 --> 00:45:17,840
the other money that's been pulled from them through taxes

653
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:20,880
and everything else. And then you see where the money

654
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:25,679
actually goes. It gets a little infuriating. But Zaheed Shaik Muhammad,

655
00:45:26,639 --> 00:45:30,920
the brother of one of the players who was a

656
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:34,199
ground level player who helped carry things out. Khalid shake

657
00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:37,159
Mohammad works as the head of the Pakistani branch of

658
00:45:37,159 --> 00:45:40,760
the charity Mercy International. Now they used to be a

659
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:45,760
much more powerful, well funded nonprofit. I think they kind

660
00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:48,719
of went by the wayside in twenty thirteen. But there

661
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:51,079
was a book published in nineteen ninety nine that alleged

662
00:45:51,119 --> 00:45:57,000
that this charity that is based in the US and Switzerland. Right,

663
00:45:58,119 --> 00:46:00,679
you hear about the city of London, you hear about Rome,

664
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:03,880
you hear about Tel Aviv and Jerusalem, but I'm telling

665
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:09,039
you Switzerland plays such a large role on the world stage.

666
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:11,480
Everything that goes on there, whether it's cern the World

667
00:46:11,559 --> 00:46:15,559
Economic Forum, you name it. But it was used by

668
00:46:15,599 --> 00:46:20,559
the CIA to funnel money to these militants fighting against

669
00:46:20,760 --> 00:46:26,559
US enemies, such as places in Bosnia and Afghanistan. And

670
00:46:26,599 --> 00:46:29,239
it's not known when Zaheed got involved with a charity,

671
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:32,800
but he was heading the Pakistani branch by nineteen eighty

672
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:36,480
eight when his nephew rams At Usef first goes to

673
00:46:36,519 --> 00:46:39,599
Afghanistan and you all know that story. But in the

674
00:46:39,639 --> 00:46:43,199
spring of nineteen ninety three, the story goes that US

675
00:46:43,239 --> 00:46:47,920
investigators raise Zaheed's house while searching for USEEF, documents and

676
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:52,440
pictures are found suggesting close links and even a friendship

677
00:46:52,719 --> 00:46:56,400
between Zaheed and OBL. And again, how much is this

678
00:46:56,760 --> 00:47:02,800
is the CIA leading lower agency on you know, a

679
00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:07,199
goose hunt, a wild goose chase to create a narrative.

680
00:47:07,760 --> 00:47:10,280
I can tell you firsthand that when we were in Iraq,

681
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:13,559
or RS two or G two would get information from

682
00:47:13,559 --> 00:47:16,159
the CIA, and much of it was nonsense to keep

683
00:47:16,199 --> 00:47:19,159
us busy, and I think a lot of this is

684
00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:23,159
probably the same. But despite the raids that Heat apparently

685
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:26,840
kept his job until about February of ninety five, just

686
00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:30,159
a couple of months before Oklahoma City, when Yusef was

687
00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:34,920
arrested in Pakistan, investigators learned he had made a phone

688
00:47:34,960 --> 00:47:38,280
call to the Mercy Office. And there's an entry for

689
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:43,559
USEF Sieve's telephone directory for as a Heed Sheik Mohammed.

690
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:48,079
And again here's another nonprofit that has played a part

691
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:53,159
on the world stage, you know, tugging at the heartstrings,

692
00:47:53,159 --> 00:47:56,760
taking our money and using it against us. It's unclear

693
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:00,440
what subsequently happens does a Heed In ninety nine, it

694
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:02,960
will be reported that he's believed to be in Kuwait,

695
00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:05,800
but in two thousand and two, the Kuwaiti government will

696
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:09,239
announce he is a member of al Qaeda, and we

697
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:12,760
know they're well financed by some of the bigger players

698
00:48:13,280 --> 00:48:18,559
on the world stage. Now, another story about Oklahoma City

699
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:23,639
that doesn't get talked about enough. There was an unknown

700
00:48:23,800 --> 00:48:31,239
DNA sample obtained but was not provided during the Oklahoma

701
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:37,960
City bombing investigation. This story is from December tenth, twenty fifteen.

702
00:48:39,079 --> 00:48:44,199
This is Fox twenty five as Oklahoma failed to honor

703
00:48:44,280 --> 00:48:47,320
one of the victims in the Oklahoma City bombing, or

704
00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:52,840
did investigators sit on the crucial clue to identify another

705
00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:57,159
conspirator for nearly two decades. These are questions about the

706
00:48:57,199 --> 00:49:01,320
bombing that many thought was closed years ago. And of

707
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:05,960
course many of the people they just think, you know

708
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:08,599
what they're told, Well, yeah, McVeigh did it. He was

709
00:49:08,719 --> 00:49:11,519
killed June eleventh, two thousand and one. Moving on what

710
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:17,039
Fox twenty five, working with the Washington Times, has confirmed

711
00:49:17,039 --> 00:49:20,800
that Oklahoma officials have a DNA profile that was never

712
00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:24,639
identified from the April nineteenth, nineteen ninety five bombing of

713
00:49:24,719 --> 00:49:28,800
the Alfred P. Mura Federal Building. That DNA sample came

714
00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:33,920
from the unmatched left leg found at the seam of

715
00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:39,119
the bombing. Oklahomans will likely remember the controversy surrounding the

716
00:49:39,199 --> 00:49:42,960
leg back in the late nineties. Originally, an unmatched leg

717
00:49:43,079 --> 00:49:49,679
was identified as a missidentified body part that actually belonged

718
00:49:49,679 --> 00:49:53,559
to the unknown bombing victim or sorry, a bombing victim.

719
00:49:53,880 --> 00:50:00,920
Airman first Class Lakeisha Levy now Lakisa's body was exhumed

720
00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:05,719
to replace the leg, and officials discovered she'd been buried

721
00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:10,519
with the wrong left leg and that leg was never identified.

722
00:50:11,159 --> 00:50:14,079
The government argued that the leg was not identified because

723
00:50:14,079 --> 00:50:18,320
of a paperwork error. In testimony and reports filed for

724
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:22,599
multiple trials of both McVeigh and Nichols, investigators said it

725
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:27,639
was not possible to obtain DNA from the sample. At

726
00:50:27,719 --> 00:50:31,760
mcveigh's trial, his attorney, Stephen Jones argued, the leg was

727
00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:37,079
proof of a third conspirator. This is huge, and it

728
00:50:37,119 --> 00:50:39,679
was buried. Most people aren't even aware of this quote.

729
00:50:39,880 --> 00:50:42,360
We had no DNA evidence at the trial, and the

730
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:47,000
government did not test for DNA evidence, or if they

731
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:49,920
did test, they didn't want to tell us. And it

732
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:55,320
turns out the state did indeed have a DNA profile.

733
00:50:56,119 --> 00:50:59,559
The Oklahoma State Medical Examiner's office confirmed it was in

734
00:50:59,599 --> 00:51:04,239
possessed of a DNA profile along with tissue samples from

735
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:09,400
the leg. Amy Elliott, the chief administrative officer, told Fox

736
00:51:09,440 --> 00:51:12,840
twenty five that the sample was compared to ten known victims,

737
00:51:13,199 --> 00:51:16,719
but it did not match any of those people. Elliott,

738
00:51:17,119 --> 00:51:19,440
who was not with the office in nineteen ninety five,

739
00:51:19,800 --> 00:51:22,320
said she does not know what process was used to

740
00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:26,360
determine which victims were compared to the sample now. Fox

741
00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:30,360
twenty five also contacted attorneys who represented Terry Nichols for

742
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:34,000
his state trial. These attorneys say they do not recall

743
00:51:34,159 --> 00:51:38,559
ever being provided a DNA sample from the unmatched leg.

744
00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:43,199
Lu Keel, one of the Oklahoma County District attorneys who

745
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:47,079
prosecuted Nichols, said he was unaware if a DNA test

746
00:51:47,239 --> 00:51:50,239
was ever performed on the leg, or if it was

747
00:51:50,440 --> 00:51:53,599
even possible to run a DNA test on the leg.

748
00:51:54,920 --> 00:51:58,559
How did the existence of an unknown DNA sample not

749
00:51:58,760 --> 00:52:02,679
emerge in the twenty years since the bombing. There may

750
00:52:02,719 --> 00:52:05,559
not be an answer to that question, but Jeffrey Scott

751
00:52:05,679 --> 00:52:09,280
Shapiro with The Washington Times told Fox twenty five, quote,

752
00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:13,400
it is my understanding that the relationship between the Oklahoma

753
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:19,360
City and the federal authorities. Was extremely contentious, part me

754
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:24,480
contentious during the investigation and the trials. And I think

755
00:52:27,320 --> 00:52:30,599
there had to be some folks within the Oklahoma City

756
00:52:30,639 --> 00:52:36,320
Police Department that were still pretty upset about what happened

757
00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:41,119
to Terrence Yankee and they wanted no parts of the government.

758
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:46,800
And again, you know, we've been looking at this for

759
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:49,639
the last couple of weeks, reading old articles, listening to

760
00:52:49,679 --> 00:52:56,079
the old YouTube videos, pulling, you know, footage from that day,

761
00:52:56,199 --> 00:52:59,280
hearing the first hand reports when the incident was just

762
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:02,760
a couple hours, you know, when it had just happened.

763
00:53:03,960 --> 00:53:11,440
This is some deep evil stuff. I mean, we in

764
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:14,599
this community we talk about nine to eleven all the time.

765
00:53:15,519 --> 00:53:17,960
We talk about COVID all the time, and rightly so.

766
00:53:21,039 --> 00:53:23,920
But because we allowed this to pass is the reason

767
00:53:24,039 --> 00:53:26,599
nine to eleven was allowed to happen. And because we

768
00:53:26,639 --> 00:53:28,400
gave them a pass for nine to eleven is the

769
00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:32,079
reason COVID happened. And if we continue to play their game,

770
00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:39,079
it's going to continue to happen. We have here people

771
00:53:39,119 --> 00:53:44,119
that today still walk unaccountable for the crimes committed in

772
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:51,760
Oklahoma City, and at that time that that was the

773
00:53:51,840 --> 00:54:04,239
most expensive FBI investigation on record. It's unbelievable, right, you

774
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:09,400
have an unmatched portion of a left leg. You know

775
00:54:09,599 --> 00:54:12,960
it was an issue because another leg was later matched

776
00:54:12,960 --> 00:54:17,599
to the DNA of Lakeisha Levy, whose coffin had to

777
00:54:17,639 --> 00:54:20,760
be reopened because she was buried with the wrong leg.

778
00:54:22,079 --> 00:54:27,320
And then the defense argued, well, there's a good chance

779
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:31,280
it could belong to another bomber because all the victims

780
00:54:31,320 --> 00:54:40,559
had been accounted for. It's a huge issue. I've got

781
00:54:40,599 --> 00:54:43,719
so many things to cover still and were already fifty

782
00:54:43,719 --> 00:54:47,400
four minutes in. You know, a couple of things I

783
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:50,360
will cover. I can never get to all my notes.

784
00:54:52,119 --> 00:54:56,000
Remember that the core of the Patriot Act was drafted

785
00:54:56,039 --> 00:55:00,599
by Joe Biden, you know, before he he turned into

786
00:55:00,599 --> 00:55:03,239
stumbling and bumbling Joe back, you know, five or six

787
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:09,519
years ago. But few people knew that it was Joe

788
00:55:09,519 --> 00:55:13,119
Biden who drafted the core provisions that were included that

789
00:55:13,159 --> 00:55:17,000
bill in nineteen ninety five. This article is from c NEET.

790
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:21,760
In two thousand and eight, months before the Oklahoma City

791
00:55:21,800 --> 00:55:26,079
bombing took place, Biden introduced another bill called the Omnibus

792
00:55:26,199 --> 00:55:30,159
Counter Terrorism Act of nineteen ninety five. It previewed the

793
00:55:30,199 --> 00:55:33,679
two thousand and one Patriot Act by allowing secret evidence

794
00:55:33,719 --> 00:55:38,800
to be used in prosecutions, expanding the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance

795
00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:44,119
Act wiretap laws, creating a new federal crime of terrorism

796
00:55:44,159 --> 00:55:49,280
that would be based on political beliefs, permitting the US

797
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:53,440
military to be used in civilian law enforcement. That that's

798
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:58,760
why our policemen look like, you know, the Marines. Now

799
00:56:00,920 --> 00:56:05,920
allowing permanent detention of non US citizens without judicial review.

800
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:11,239
That's what January sixth, that's why we had people detain

801
00:56:12,079 --> 00:56:20,679
Jeremy Brown. Isn't it interesting? The guy who wrote it

802
00:56:20,679 --> 00:56:24,239
in ninety five was the guy who took these political

803
00:56:24,280 --> 00:56:33,559
prisoners in twenty one. Man, think about that, allowing permanent

804
00:56:34,000 --> 00:56:39,599
detention first of non US citizens without judicial review. But

805
00:56:40,360 --> 00:56:43,519
doesn't really matter, does it. The Center for National Security

806
00:56:43,559 --> 00:56:47,719
Studies said the bill would a road constitutional and statutory

807
00:56:47,800 --> 00:56:50,599
due processed right though in the fourth and sixth right

808
00:56:50,599 --> 00:56:54,840
out the window, authorizing the Justice Department to pick and

809
00:56:54,920 --> 00:56:58,559
choose crimes to investigate and prosecute based on political beliefs

810
00:56:59,280 --> 00:57:04,760
and associations. Biden himself draws parallels between his ninety five

811
00:57:04,800 --> 00:57:07,960
bill and its two thousand and one cousin, the Patriot Act.

812
00:57:08,079 --> 00:57:08,440
Speaker 17: Quote.

813
00:57:09,000 --> 00:57:13,000
Speaker 3: I drafted a terrorism bill after the Oklahoma City bombing,

814
00:57:13,440 --> 00:57:17,199
and the bill John Ashcroft sent up my bill was

815
00:57:17,239 --> 00:57:19,960
my bill. Pardon me, And he said that when the

816
00:57:19,960 --> 00:57:23,480
Patriot Act was debated, according to The New Republic, which

817
00:57:23,559 --> 00:57:29,000
described him as the Democratic Party's de facto spokesman on

818
00:57:29,119 --> 00:57:35,960
the war against terrorism. So again, Biden's proposal probably did,

819
00:57:36,000 --> 00:57:41,480
indeed help lay the groundwork for the Bush administration's Patriot Act.

820
00:57:41,719 --> 00:57:43,639
And it just goes to show you that the left

821
00:57:43,679 --> 00:57:48,840
wing and the right wing belong to the same corrupt birds.

822
00:57:50,639 --> 00:57:54,440
It really is. And we get people still, you know,

823
00:57:54,519 --> 00:57:58,280
watching Fox News eighteen hours a day, getting all invested

824
00:57:58,320 --> 00:58:02,960
in this nonsense where these people, they are not out

825
00:58:03,000 --> 00:58:06,760
to help you, the Center for National Securities reported in

826
00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:10,360
ninety five. On February tenth, nineteen ninety five, a counter

827
00:58:10,559 --> 00:58:13,880
terrorism bill drafted by the Clinton administration was introduced in

828
00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:17,559
the Senate as S three to ninety. In the House

829
00:58:17,599 --> 00:58:21,840
of Representatives, it was HR ninety six or eight ninety six.

830
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:27,599
I should say the Clinton bill is a mixture of

831
00:58:27,639 --> 00:58:35,679
provisions eroding constitutional and statutory do process protections and against

832
00:58:35,679 --> 00:58:41,880
selective federalization. It's just taking away right authorizing the Justice

833
00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:47,000
Department to pick and choose crimes, repealing provisions barring the

834
00:58:47,039 --> 00:58:53,800
military from civilian law enforcement, expanding pre trial detention scheme

835
00:58:54,239 --> 00:58:59,079
that puts the burden of proof on the accused. That's

836
00:58:59,159 --> 00:59:00,960
not it was an you know, I told you about

837
00:59:01,000 --> 00:59:06,280
the fourth loosen the carefully crafted rules governing federal wire taps.

838
00:59:06,360 --> 00:59:11,719
That was a violation of the Fourth Amendment. Then of course,

839
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:15,679
establishing special courts that would use secret evidence to order

840
00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:19,800
the deportation of persons convicted of no crimes, on and

841
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:29,920
on and on, really evil stuff. And you know, I

842
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:32,639
may do a third episode because there's some things I

843
00:59:32,639 --> 00:59:36,679
have to cover, but this week I'm really stringent on time.

844
00:59:36,719 --> 00:59:40,559
As I mentioned, we're also going to cover Ruby Ridge

845
00:59:41,519 --> 00:59:44,079
next week as well. I may do two episodes next

846
00:59:44,079 --> 00:59:46,719
week to kind of get caught up, and then the

847
00:59:46,719 --> 00:59:49,679
following week, the week before Memorial Day, we're going to

848
00:59:49,800 --> 00:59:52,119
kind of do the state of the Fact Hunter podcast

849
00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:56,840
reflection on a few things and where we see going forward.

850
00:59:57,519 --> 01:00:00,199
But I want to play some more classical audio on

851
01:00:00,239 --> 01:00:03,800
the backside of this. I've got to get back to work.

852
01:00:04,239 --> 01:00:06,840
You know, there are so many things to talk about.

853
01:00:06,880 --> 01:00:10,639
We mentioned all the time that you could literally have

854
01:00:10,920 --> 01:00:14,639
a weekly episode NonStop on nine to eleven. And the

855
01:00:14,679 --> 01:00:17,840
more I dig into Oklahoma City, the more I realized

856
01:00:17,880 --> 01:00:23,639
we could do a year long podcast on Oklahoma City

857
01:00:23,719 --> 01:00:25,719
if you break down the individuals and the people, and

858
01:00:25,760 --> 01:00:29,519
the government cover ups and the Terrence Shakes, the mcveigh's,

859
01:00:29,599 --> 01:00:35,599
the Nichols, the John Doees, the Middle Eastern connections. It

860
01:00:35,719 --> 01:00:39,760
is so much. And you know, they take one guy

861
01:00:42,920 --> 01:00:46,400
who they probably am k ultra and got to believe

862
01:00:46,559 --> 01:00:49,880
and to be a hero, to be a martyr for

863
01:00:49,920 --> 01:00:52,159
the people of Waco. Meanwhile, all the other people who

864
01:00:52,199 --> 01:00:56,679
actually cause this walk free. So there you go. God

865
01:00:56,719 --> 01:01:00,239
bless you all. Enjoy this classic audio. Following on the backside,

866
01:01:00,239 --> 01:01:04,039
you have a tremendous week. The email is the fact

867
01:01:04,119 --> 01:01:06,960
Hunter at mail dot com. Again, it's the fact Hunter

868
01:01:07,039 --> 01:01:10,679
at mail, not gmail dot com. Please go to Foundations

869
01:01:10,679 --> 01:01:13,199
in Faith dot net if you'd like to grab one

870
01:01:13,199 --> 01:01:15,559
of our books, grab a couple, give it to a friend.

871
01:01:15,599 --> 01:01:18,880
God bless you. Keep your head on your keep your

872
01:01:18,920 --> 01:01:21,519
head on a swivel, in Christ in your heart, and

873
01:01:21,840 --> 01:01:22,679
enjoy the audio.

874
01:01:32,679 --> 01:01:34,920
Speaker 18: Yeah, I say, Hunter, we haven't been able to dispatch

875
01:01:34,960 --> 01:01:54,800
anybody yet thanks to harm.

876
01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:55,639
Speaker 19: On April nineteenth, nineteen ninety five, as many people were

877
01:01:55,679 --> 01:01:58,920
starting their workday, A beautiful spring morning in the Heartland

878
01:01:58,920 --> 01:02:02,719
became chaos when at nine oh two am, explosions tore

879
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:06,320
through the Alfred Pimura Federal Building in downtown Oklahoma City.

880
01:02:06,800 --> 01:02:09,400
Speaker 11: An explosion at nine o'clock this morning that did that

881
01:02:09,559 --> 01:02:12,119
damage you're looking at right there, blowing off the entire

882
01:02:12,239 --> 01:02:13,840
north face of that building.

883
01:02:14,519 --> 01:02:17,440
Speaker 20: The federal building, located two hundred north West fifth Street,

884
01:02:17,559 --> 01:02:19,000
was almost completely destroyed.

885
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:21,880
Speaker 21: A terrible tragedy has occurred here in Oklahoma City.

886
01:02:22,639 --> 01:02:27,159
Speaker 5: The bombing in Oklahoma City was an attack on innocent

887
01:02:27,199 --> 01:02:30,199
children and defenseless citizens.

888
01:02:30,480 --> 01:02:32,559
Speaker 19: One hundred and sixty eight people were killed in the

889
01:02:32,559 --> 01:02:36,199
blast and over eight hundred wounded. The hospitals were overrun

890
01:02:36,239 --> 01:02:39,880
with casualties. A rescue worker was killed from falling debris

891
01:02:39,920 --> 01:02:43,159
within the first few hours. But what would sear the

892
01:02:43,199 --> 01:02:46,400
bombing in the hearts of Americans was the nineteen children

893
01:02:46,599 --> 01:02:49,360
inside the daycare center in the building who had lost

894
01:02:49,400 --> 01:02:50,000
their lives.

895
01:02:50,760 --> 01:02:54,320
Speaker 22: The most beautiful memorial left by anyone is not in

896
01:02:54,400 --> 01:02:57,400
the rubble of this building, but in the hearts and

897
01:02:57,440 --> 01:03:00,960
the lives that knew them and loved them. We come

898
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:03,599
to day to remember their lives, and we come to

899
01:03:03,679 --> 01:03:06,880
day to offer thanks thanks for the hundreds and hundreds

900
01:03:06,880 --> 01:03:10,400
of people who were involved in the rescue and recovery efforts.

901
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:13,639
Speaker 19: Six years before nine to eleven, it was the first

902
01:03:13,760 --> 01:03:18,199
mass casualty terrorist attack on American soil. The prologue to

903
01:03:18,239 --> 01:03:21,639
a new chapter in American history had been written in blood, fear,

904
01:03:21,719 --> 01:03:26,119
and shock. Terrorism had struck home. From now on, nothing

905
01:03:26,119 --> 01:03:27,119
would be the same again.

906
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:33,400
Speaker 13: We know that more than Veyh and Nichols were involved.

907
01:03:33,599 --> 01:03:36,760
Speaker 23: There were questions of other bombs being found at the

908
01:03:36,760 --> 01:03:37,559
scene of the crime.

909
01:03:38,199 --> 01:03:39,519
Speaker 6: Witnesses to the bombing.

910
01:03:39,840 --> 01:03:44,480
Speaker 24: The FBI, like any government agency, is more concerned with power, prestige,

911
01:03:44,960 --> 01:03:48,440
maintaining its position rather than truth and justice.

912
01:03:48,599 --> 01:03:52,119
Speaker 2: Based on the damage pattern to the building, what the

913
01:03:52,119 --> 01:03:53,920
government sends impossible.

914
01:03:53,559 --> 01:03:57,199
Speaker 8: That life we had back before the bombing, that life

915
01:03:57,239 --> 01:03:57,719
is over.

916
01:03:58,280 --> 01:04:00,880
Speaker 25: For the first time in my fight with them, they

917
01:04:00,880 --> 01:04:03,880
stepped forward and said it would pose a grave risk

918
01:04:04,199 --> 01:04:06,440
to the national security of United States of America if

919
01:04:06,440 --> 01:04:08,239
we release the CIA documents.

920
01:04:08,559 --> 01:04:10,320
Speaker 4: If you know the truth and truthful, such a.

921
01:04:10,360 --> 01:04:13,719
Speaker 26: Fruit, you've got the band together, or it's over for

922
01:04:13,840 --> 01:04:14,400
all of us.

923
01:04:15,519 --> 01:04:17,000
Speaker 4: The man on top will get.

924
01:04:16,840 --> 01:04:20,440
Speaker 27: You if we don't expose the fact that Oklahoma City

925
01:04:20,480 --> 01:04:21,519
stinks to high heaven.

926
01:04:21,800 --> 01:04:22,679
Speaker 7: The same people that.

927
01:04:22,679 --> 01:04:24,320
Speaker 27: Carried it out are going to do it over and

928
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:26,840
over and over again, and they're going to use these

929
01:04:26,840 --> 01:04:29,639
frightening events to drive a stake through the United States

930
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:30,920
and kill our republic.

931
01:04:36,679 --> 01:04:40,239
Speaker 19: Almost immediately, the Oklahoma City Police Department announced a be

932
01:04:40,360 --> 01:04:43,280
on the lookout alert for two Middle Eastern looking suspects

933
01:04:43,360 --> 01:04:47,840
wearing blue jogging suits. Shortly before the bombing, they were

934
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:50,199
seen by a witness running from the Mirror building and

935
01:04:50,280 --> 01:04:53,199
getting into a brown pickup truck, then driving away from

936
01:04:53,199 --> 01:04:56,480
the scene of the crime. It was soon determined that

937
01:04:56,559 --> 01:05:01,199
a truck bomb had exploded directly outside the building, approximately.

938
01:05:00,639 --> 01:05:02,199
Speaker 28: Two hundred feet from the bomb crater.

939
01:05:02,679 --> 01:05:05,920
Speaker 19: A ven number stamped on a twisted axle identified the

940
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:07,719
vehicle as a rider rental truck.

941
01:05:08,880 --> 01:05:11,280
Speaker 11: Two suspects are in custody this evening in the bombing

942
01:05:11,280 --> 01:05:13,360
of Oklahoma City's Murrah Federal Building.

943
01:05:13,880 --> 01:05:16,480
Speaker 19: Shortly after the bombing, a twenty six year old U. S.

944
01:05:16,599 --> 01:05:19,760
Army veteran Timothy McVeigh, was pulled over by an Oklahoma

945
01:05:19,800 --> 01:05:24,079
Highway Patrol officer sixty miles north of Oklahoma City. He

946
01:05:24,159 --> 01:05:26,719
was stopped for speeding in his car without a license plate.

947
01:05:27,599 --> 01:05:31,000
McVeigh would admit to carrying a concealed handgun and was

948
01:05:31,039 --> 01:05:34,360
taken into custody without incident. It was the first time

949
01:05:34,599 --> 01:05:39,480
Timothy McVeigh had been arrested in his life. The original

950
01:05:39,519 --> 01:05:42,639
alert for two Middle Eastern males had been rescinded within

951
01:05:42,679 --> 01:05:45,800
hours of the bombing, and the identification number on the

952
01:05:45,880 --> 01:05:49,039
rider axel was traced to a rental agency in Kansas.

953
01:05:49,880 --> 01:05:52,639
The renter had given a false name, but had listed

954
01:05:52,679 --> 01:05:56,840
his address as a farmhouse in Michigan belonging to James Nichols.

955
01:05:57,079 --> 01:06:00,000
James's brother, Terry Nichols, was a friend of Tim McVay

956
01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:03,360
their time in the US Army. Upon hearing the news

957
01:06:03,360 --> 01:06:05,960
that he was wanted for questioning in the bombing, Terry

958
01:06:06,039 --> 01:06:11,159
Nichols turned himself into the Harrington, Kansas Police Department. Within

959
01:06:11,239 --> 01:06:14,360
twenty four hours after the attack, the FBI had received

960
01:06:14,360 --> 01:06:17,000
a tip from a former coworker of Tim McVeigh in Buffalo,

961
01:06:17,079 --> 01:06:20,840
New York. The tipster informed the FBI that McVeigh had

962
01:06:20,880 --> 01:06:25,079
often espoused militant anti government views and that McVeigh was

963
01:06:25,239 --> 01:06:28,000
very angry over the siege of the Branch Davidians by

964
01:06:28,039 --> 01:06:31,239
federal agents in Waco, Texas, which had ended in a

965
01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:34,639
catastrophic fire two years to the day before the Oklahoma

966
01:06:34,639 --> 01:06:35,239
City bombing.

967
01:06:37,159 --> 01:06:42,360
Speaker 8: That Friday, they showed the FBI Briggan Tam McVeigh out

968
01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:47,719
of the jail in Perry, Oklahoma. And that's when I

969
01:06:47,800 --> 01:06:51,440
got angry. When I saw that it was an American

970
01:06:51,760 --> 01:06:55,760
and it was a Middle easterns I had a hard

971
01:06:55,880 --> 01:07:01,320
time except in the fact that Americans would that Americans

972
01:07:01,360 --> 01:07:05,039
are supposed to love their children. They are not supposed

973
01:07:05,079 --> 01:07:07,199
to murder their children.

974
01:07:07,840 --> 01:07:15,719
Speaker 6: Shaken, disillusioned, angered that that could happen in this country.

975
01:07:17,320 --> 01:07:20,440
Speaker 19: Upon learning that McVeigh was already in jail, the FBI

976
01:07:20,519 --> 01:07:23,880
transferred him to federal custody and an indictment was issued

977
01:07:23,920 --> 01:07:27,719
against Tim McVay, Terry Nichols, and others unknown for the

978
01:07:27,760 --> 01:07:31,960
bombing of the Muraw Federal building. Another army buddy of mcveigh's,

979
01:07:32,079 --> 01:07:35,800
Michael Fortier of King in Arizona, was later arrested and

980
01:07:35,920 --> 01:07:38,519
charged with having advanced knowledge of the bombing plot.

981
01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:47,559
Speaker 29: The last thing I remember was being thrown to the

982
01:07:47,599 --> 01:07:50,719
center of that room and looking up and looking into

983
01:07:52,960 --> 01:07:55,840
the sky, and there was no roof, and everything was

984
01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:57,800
just suspended up in the air in the sky.

985
01:07:58,360 --> 01:08:01,039
Speaker 30: When I came to you stood up stace in the south,

986
01:08:01,119 --> 01:08:04,920
but all the light was behind me. I turned looked

987
01:08:04,960 --> 01:08:09,320
back to the north, and the whole front of the buildings. Yahn,

988
01:08:09,559 --> 01:08:13,599
I'm about four to five feet from where it dropped off.

989
01:08:13,719 --> 01:08:16,880
Speaker 20: In the morning of April the nineteenth ninety five, my

990
01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:19,840
dog Gunny and I arrived at the scene of the

991
01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:22,439
Murror building. There was a great deal of chaos at

992
01:08:22,439 --> 01:08:26,760
the scene, a lot of people being screaming, running work

993
01:08:26,800 --> 01:08:27,399
from the building.

994
01:08:27,840 --> 01:08:30,359
Speaker 8: I lost my two grandchildren. They were in the daycare

995
01:08:30,520 --> 01:08:34,359
center at the Morrow Building. Their names were Aaron and

996
01:08:34,439 --> 01:08:40,079
Elijah Coverdale. Aaron was five years old, Elijah was two.

997
01:08:40,319 --> 01:08:43,960
I was living at the Regency when the bombing happened.

998
01:08:44,119 --> 01:08:47,319
That morning, I was at work. I had custody of

999
01:08:47,399 --> 01:08:50,399
Aaron and Elijah, so they lived with me, and I

1000
01:08:50,439 --> 01:08:53,640
had dropped them off at the daycare center that Wednesday morning.

1001
01:08:54,359 --> 01:08:56,159
I'd get up in the middle of the night and

1002
01:08:56,359 --> 01:08:58,479
get in a shower and turn the water on so

1003
01:08:58,560 --> 01:08:59,560
people wouldn't.

1004
01:08:59,199 --> 01:08:59,960
Speaker 2: Hear me scream.

1005
01:09:00,279 --> 01:09:03,520
Speaker 8: And I just scream at God and ask him what

1006
01:09:03,840 --> 01:09:07,119
was wrong? Why were we being punished?

1007
01:09:07,159 --> 01:09:13,119
Speaker 14: So I knew the Coverdale boys, Elijah and Aaron, these

1008
01:09:13,159 --> 01:09:17,600
two boys, they were characters. They me being single and

1009
01:09:17,640 --> 01:09:19,560
living in this apartment. I was kind of a party

1010
01:09:19,560 --> 01:09:22,119
guy at that time, twenty seven years old. At one

1011
01:09:22,119 --> 01:09:25,720
point in time, I had promised these two boys that

1012
01:09:25,760 --> 01:09:27,079
I was going to give them some toys.

1013
01:09:27,960 --> 01:09:29,520
Speaker 6: And problem with that.

1014
01:09:29,600 --> 01:09:31,520
Speaker 14: Living in the Regency and on the eighteenth floor, you

1015
01:09:31,560 --> 01:09:33,039
leave something in your car, you don't want to go

1016
01:09:33,119 --> 01:09:35,560
back down and get it because it's just a hassle

1017
01:09:35,640 --> 01:09:38,920
unless it's ice cream. And so I left these toys

1018
01:09:38,960 --> 01:09:40,880
in the car for the longest time that.

1019
01:09:40,920 --> 01:09:44,880
Speaker 6: I never did get them those toys.

1020
01:09:45,479 --> 01:09:48,439
Speaker 14: Until you know, after they passed away, when I came

1021
01:09:48,600 --> 01:09:49,479
to Janie.

1022
01:09:49,880 --> 01:09:52,399
Speaker 30: Well, then I got watching the stuff down on the

1023
01:09:52,399 --> 01:09:54,199
street and kind of got mesh maris of what was

1024
01:09:54,239 --> 01:09:56,800
going on down on the street. While I was standing

1025
01:09:56,880 --> 01:09:59,119
up there, there was a little girl that was taking

1026
01:09:59,159 --> 01:10:05,800
out a photography UCO that took a picture of the building,

1027
01:10:06,520 --> 01:10:08,479
and I was in that picture.

1028
01:10:09,319 --> 01:10:13,560
Speaker 12: You could not see anything in front of you. It

1029
01:10:13,680 --> 01:10:16,119
was so the smoke was so thick.

1030
01:10:16,399 --> 01:10:20,239
Speaker 29: And so black, and the only thing I can tell

1031
01:10:20,279 --> 01:10:23,079
you is it smelt like sulfur.

1032
01:10:23,159 --> 01:10:26,520
Speaker 12: If you were in a chemistry lab. It smelt like sulfur.

1033
01:10:27,079 --> 01:10:29,640
Speaker 29: And she said, you can't go that way, And I

1034
01:10:29,640 --> 01:10:32,520
said why, She said, there is nothing out there.

1035
01:10:32,680 --> 01:10:34,640
Speaker 12: It's gone.

1036
01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:45,399
Speaker 19: The reasons for the bombing, the perpetrators, the rumors, and

1037
01:10:45,439 --> 01:10:49,119
the suspects changed depending on whose viewpoint you take. Like

1038
01:10:49,199 --> 01:10:52,199
all controversial events, some of those closest to the event

1039
01:10:52,359 --> 01:10:55,159
and farthest away are bound together by the questioning of

1040
01:10:55,199 --> 01:10:59,079
the official story. The first questions were directed at the

1041
01:10:59,119 --> 01:11:02,159
Bureau of Alcohol back On Firearms, which had launched the

1042
01:11:02,199 --> 01:11:05,439
raid on the branch Davidians. The Oklahoma City office for

1043
01:11:05,520 --> 01:11:08,479
the ATF was located in the Murror building and was

1044
01:11:08,479 --> 01:11:11,920
the supposed target of the attack. Yet no agents were

1045
01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:17,000
killed or seriously wounded. Was the ATF office empty that morning?

1046
01:11:18,640 --> 01:11:22,039
Speaker 31: I asked if I could speak with an ATF officer

1047
01:11:22,079 --> 01:11:24,239
that worked in the building so I could find out

1048
01:11:25,439 --> 01:11:29,840
if they knew anything about my wife. And he told

1049
01:11:29,840 --> 01:11:34,439
me that they were in debriefing and asking, you know,

1050
01:11:35,600 --> 01:11:37,039
I need to talk to one of them. I need

1051
01:11:37,039 --> 01:11:40,159
to find out something. And he said that none of

1052
01:11:40,159 --> 01:11:42,199
them had been in the building, so they weren't hurt.

1053
01:11:42,319 --> 01:11:45,079
They had been tipped by their pagers that morning not

1054
01:11:45,119 --> 01:11:45,840
to come into work.

1055
01:11:47,760 --> 01:11:50,880
Speaker 19: The ATF told several different stories to explain their agent's

1056
01:11:50,920 --> 01:11:55,039
curious absence. The most fantastic story was that two agents

1057
01:11:55,039 --> 01:11:57,680
were indeed inside the building and we're heroes.

1058
01:11:57,720 --> 01:11:58,079
Speaker 28: That day.

1059
01:12:00,039 --> 01:12:02,760
Speaker 19: Agent Luke Freanney claimed that he was knocked unconscious by

1060
01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:06,359
the blast and after an aboard of helicopter Rescue, crawled

1061
01:12:06,359 --> 01:12:07,560
onto an outside.

1062
01:12:07,199 --> 01:12:08,840
Speaker 28: Ledge to escape his office.

1063
01:12:09,199 --> 01:12:11,840
Speaker 19: Frannie reported that he then used his martial arts skills

1064
01:12:11,840 --> 01:12:17,159
to break through several walls and injured his hand. Another agent,

1065
01:12:17,239 --> 01:12:19,760
Alex McCauley, claimed that he was in an elevator at

1066
01:12:19,760 --> 01:12:23,119
the time of the bombing. After free falling for five floors,

1067
01:12:23,359 --> 01:12:26,520
McCauley supposedly broke out and rescued several people.

1068
01:12:28,960 --> 01:12:32,239
Speaker 21: My crews were the crews working on the Murror billing

1069
01:12:32,279 --> 01:12:34,560
the day of the bombing. Immediately after the bombing, they

1070
01:12:34,560 --> 01:12:38,600
called me on the radios and at that point they

1071
01:12:38,600 --> 01:12:41,640
were going in to assist with because the fire department

1072
01:12:41,640 --> 01:12:43,119
hadn't even got there yet. They were going to check

1073
01:12:43,119 --> 01:12:46,159
to make sure all the elevators were clear. They weren't

1074
01:12:46,159 --> 01:12:49,199
aware because they were coming from the south side that

1075
01:12:49,239 --> 01:12:52,960
the building on the north side was gone, so they

1076
01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:56,039
went in to check the elevators and that's when they

1077
01:12:56,560 --> 01:12:58,680
found out how bad the damage was inside the building.

1078
01:12:59,199 --> 01:13:01,439
Not the ellador went the fee fall because the governor

1079
01:13:01,479 --> 01:13:05,199
overspeeds were not tripped. The safety mechanisms on the bottom

1080
01:13:05,199 --> 01:13:07,439
of the elevators were not tripped, so none of the

1081
01:13:07,439 --> 01:13:11,079
elevators had a free fall condition. I think it was

1082
01:13:11,199 --> 01:13:16,079
McCauley indicated that they were trapped in an elevator. So

1083
01:13:16,119 --> 01:13:19,399
at the grand jury investigation, once I got the female

1084
01:13:19,399 --> 01:13:21,279
report that showed to put the elevator they were in,

1085
01:13:21,359 --> 01:13:24,239
I said that there's no possible way they could have

1086
01:13:24,239 --> 01:13:27,319
been in that elevator because my men checked it and

1087
01:13:27,399 --> 01:13:30,159
it was still locked from the top and the doors

1088
01:13:30,159 --> 01:13:34,680
were the wall had came in against the doors between floors,

1089
01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:37,079
so that they couldn't have gotten down the elevator without assistance.

1090
01:13:38,319 --> 01:13:40,640
Speaker 19: Jane Graham worked in the building for over a decade,

1091
01:13:40,960 --> 01:13:44,279
was vice president of the Federal Employees Union, and has

1092
01:13:44,319 --> 01:13:48,079
testified before Congress on labor issues. She knew everyone in

1093
01:13:48,119 --> 01:13:51,399
the building and bore witness to suspicious behavior that morning.

1094
01:13:52,760 --> 01:13:55,800
Speaker 29: On the morning of the bombing. When my husband dropped

1095
01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:58,520
me off and I got out of the car. As

1096
01:13:58,560 --> 01:14:01,600
I was walking toward the end, there were two men

1097
01:14:02,239 --> 01:14:06,640
standing directly in front of the double doors, and there

1098
01:14:06,720 --> 01:14:10,479
was a little uh sitting area there, planter and so

1099
01:14:10,520 --> 01:14:13,000
forth there in front. They were standing right there on

1100
01:14:13,039 --> 01:14:19,359
the sidewalk. They had on ATF jackets which said ATF

1101
01:14:19,520 --> 01:14:19,920
on them.

1102
01:14:20,359 --> 01:14:23,760
Speaker 12: They were talking to a third gentleman who was dressed

1103
01:14:24,399 --> 01:14:25,600
in business clothes.

1104
01:14:26,479 --> 01:14:29,119
Speaker 29: And I saw them. Their backs were to me, and

1105
01:14:29,199 --> 01:14:32,640
I thought, it is not They don't normally. You know,

1106
01:14:33,399 --> 01:14:35,600
all the people we see go up there to at

1107
01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:40,000
and they're never identifiable, you know, they always are dressed.

1108
01:14:40,039 --> 01:14:41,000
Speaker 12: You know, a lot of them.

1109
01:14:40,840 --> 01:14:43,520
Speaker 29: Look like drug people and other things, you know, but

1110
01:14:43,560 --> 01:14:45,840
they're certainly not dressed for you to be able to

1111
01:14:45,840 --> 01:14:46,640
tell who they are.

1112
01:14:48,239 --> 01:14:52,199
Speaker 19: A Paramedica responded to the bombing. Tiffany Bible confirms that

1113
01:14:52,239 --> 01:14:54,640
the ATF were not in their office and in fact

1114
01:14:54,760 --> 01:14:56,800
may have been aware of some type of threat that day.

1115
01:14:58,439 --> 01:15:01,840
In this Affidavid, she's that immediately after the bombing, she

1116
01:15:01,960 --> 01:15:04,439
asked an ATF agent on the scene if any of

1117
01:15:04,439 --> 01:15:07,640
them were in the building. He responded, no, we weren't

1118
01:15:07,680 --> 01:15:11,039
in there today and that the Mirror Building was bombed

1119
01:15:11,079 --> 01:15:15,680
because of Waco. She further states that within the first

1120
01:15:15,680 --> 01:15:18,439
twenty minutes of the bombing, she saw at least eight

1121
01:15:18,520 --> 01:15:22,520
ATF agents outside the building in clean black jumpsuits. To

1122
01:15:22,560 --> 01:15:25,119
this day, the ATF has been unwilling to address their

1123
01:15:25,159 --> 01:15:30,880
prior knowledge of the bombing. Beyond the vague rumors of

1124
01:15:31,039 --> 01:15:35,239
the significance of April nineteenth, some federal agencies were aware

1125
01:15:35,399 --> 01:15:36,439
of an actual threat.

1126
01:15:37,079 --> 01:15:39,520
Speaker 23: One of the most frustrating things about prior knowledge is

1127
01:15:39,520 --> 01:15:43,439
that the media, some in the media and others would

1128
01:15:43,439 --> 01:15:46,279
accuse us of saying that the government blew the building up,

1129
01:15:46,760 --> 01:15:50,079
which we never said, and I do not believe.

1130
01:15:50,680 --> 01:15:54,560
Speaker 19: The US Marshals responsible for security of federal personnel and

1131
01:15:54,600 --> 01:15:59,119
facilities warned that quote Islamic terrorists may be planning suicide

1132
01:15:59,159 --> 01:16:04,760
attacks against federal courthouses and government installations designed to attract

1133
01:16:04,800 --> 01:16:08,920
worldwide press attention through the murder of Nison victims. The

1134
01:16:08,960 --> 01:16:12,680
ATF had placed informant Carol Howe into a white separatist

1135
01:16:12,680 --> 01:16:16,760
community in eastern Oklahoma called Elwim City. Another ATF agent

1136
01:16:16,800 --> 01:16:20,880
admitted under oath that one suspect, Andy Strassmeyer, was reported

1137
01:16:20,920 --> 01:16:24,279
to make quote threats to blow up federal buildings unquote

1138
01:16:24,479 --> 01:16:28,720
before the Oklahoma City bombing. Furthermore, Carol Howe actually drove

1139
01:16:28,800 --> 01:16:33,000
Strasmeyer and other suspects to Oklahoma City to scout bombing targets.

1140
01:16:33,720 --> 01:16:36,720
Was this the source of the ATF suspicious behavior? The

1141
01:16:36,760 --> 01:16:41,840
morning of April nineteenth, US Representative Ernest Istuk of Oklahoma

1142
01:16:41,920 --> 01:16:44,199
also displayed advance knowledge of the bombing.

1143
01:16:44,680 --> 01:16:47,520
Speaker 32: To my left, from the east, I saw Senator Is

1144
01:16:47,560 --> 01:16:50,840
took kind of work his way west. Well, he came

1145
01:16:50,920 --> 01:16:53,960
up to me and we started talking small talk, you know,

1146
01:16:54,359 --> 01:16:57,359
terrible thing all this, and really didn't know what much

1147
01:16:57,439 --> 01:17:00,760
to say, and he said often. He made comment, yeah,

1148
01:17:00,760 --> 01:17:02,039
we knew this was going to happen.

1149
01:17:02,600 --> 01:17:04,920
Speaker 33: I noticed the lady back behind me by back hole.

1150
01:17:04,960 --> 01:17:09,119
They're taking pictures. She identified herself as an attorney, Lani

1151
01:17:09,640 --> 01:17:13,680
Atlanta Tyree, and she was with Ernest his test and

1152
01:17:13,760 --> 01:17:16,439
she made a comment to me that Histock told her

1153
01:17:16,479 --> 01:17:19,039
that they were ware of a tomb thread since April ninth.

1154
01:17:20,000 --> 01:17:22,159
You didn't really think much about it until this Grand

1155
01:17:22,199 --> 01:17:24,319
Juria stuff our probe and into it, and people were

1156
01:17:24,359 --> 01:17:27,239
claiming that there wasn't any prior knowledge you know. I

1157
01:17:27,239 --> 01:17:29,199
started thinking about it, and we got with Dave and

1158
01:17:29,279 --> 01:17:31,399
we put two and two together and he said, Hey,

1159
01:17:31,399 --> 01:17:33,600
somebody knew about prior bomb threat.

1160
01:17:33,760 --> 01:17:34,720
Speaker 4: You know this, I'll be known.

1161
01:17:35,359 --> 01:17:37,920
Speaker 9: Everyone who knows me knows I would not sit idle

1162
01:17:38,159 --> 01:17:41,119
if I knew about a conspiracy of silence. I would

1163
01:17:41,159 --> 01:17:44,600
never rest until such a conspiracy was exposed. But I

1164
01:17:44,720 --> 01:17:46,199
know of no such conspiracy.

1165
01:17:47,119 --> 01:17:49,920
Speaker 19: This took has denied this evidence under oath, but he

1166
01:17:50,039 --> 01:17:53,319
has never answered the Oklahoma County shriff s Deputy's challenge

1167
01:17:53,439 --> 01:17:57,840
to subject his opposing versions of prior knowledge to polygraph testing.

1168
01:18:05,880 --> 01:18:08,960
Many witnesses have officially stated that the Oklahoma County bomb

1169
01:18:09,039 --> 01:18:12,359
Squad was conducting a search at the Federal Courthouse across

1170
01:18:12,399 --> 01:18:15,119
the street from the Murrah Building two hours before the attack.

1171
01:18:16,439 --> 01:18:18,479
Speaker 12: Trish Nicks I ran into her.

1172
01:18:18,560 --> 01:18:22,960
Speaker 29: She was another employee there at HUD and she had

1173
01:18:22,960 --> 01:18:25,880
asked me if I had seen the bomb squad that morning,

1174
01:18:26,840 --> 01:18:31,239
and I had said no, I wasn't aware that they

1175
01:18:31,279 --> 01:18:31,760
had been.

1176
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:32,199
Speaker 12: In the building.

1177
01:18:32,239 --> 01:18:35,960
Speaker 29: And she said yes, she had seen their unit parked

1178
01:18:36,520 --> 01:18:38,920
in the parking lot of the church.

1179
01:18:39,399 --> 01:18:40,239
Speaker 12: Across the street.

1180
01:18:41,600 --> 01:18:44,640
Speaker 19: County Appraiser J. D. Reid saw the bomb disposal unit

1181
01:18:44,720 --> 01:18:49,880
parked outside the courthouse that morning, despite multiple eyewitnesses. The

1182
01:18:49,880 --> 01:18:51,560
Sheriff's department denies this claim.

1183
01:18:52,079 --> 01:18:54,439
Speaker 34: If that building was under threat and they were getting

1184
01:18:54,920 --> 01:18:57,600
bomb threats and this was a daily thing or a

1185
01:18:57,640 --> 01:19:01,720
weekly thing, or if they've gotten many, brand thoroughly one

1186
01:19:02,159 --> 01:19:04,920
that parents and the children and that daycare deserved to

1187
01:19:04,920 --> 01:19:09,439
have been notified. People do not keep children in daycares

1188
01:19:09,479 --> 01:19:12,560
where there are bomb threats made.

1189
01:19:14,840 --> 01:19:18,359
Speaker 19: Under the pressure of mounting evidence. ABC's twenty twenty reported

1190
01:19:18,399 --> 01:19:20,359
on many of these puzzling questions a year and a

1191
01:19:20,399 --> 01:19:21,560
half after the bombing.

1192
01:19:22,000 --> 01:19:25,039
Speaker 35: At issue increasingly for some of the victims and their families,

1193
01:19:25,439 --> 01:19:28,960
What did authorities know? Are suspect before the explosion that

1194
01:19:29,079 --> 01:19:32,159
federal workers and the children arriving at the oral building

1195
01:19:32,279 --> 01:19:35,439
did not know or were not told.

1196
01:19:34,920 --> 01:19:38,239
Speaker 36: There was this fairly large truck with a trailer behind it,

1197
01:19:38,560 --> 01:19:40,640
and it had a shield on the side of the door,

1198
01:19:40,680 --> 01:19:42,760
and it said bomb disposal or bomb squad.

1199
01:19:42,800 --> 01:19:43,159
Speaker 7: Blow it.

1200
01:19:43,279 --> 01:19:47,760
Speaker 37: Authorities now claim in federal investigative reports that the huge,

1201
01:19:47,800 --> 01:19:51,079
ominous truck with its trailer was being used by a

1202
01:19:51,119 --> 01:19:55,560
deputy to run routine errands. Other documents obtained by twenty

1203
01:19:55,600 --> 01:19:59,359
twenty showed that someone called the Executive Secretariat's office at

1204
01:19:59,359 --> 01:20:02,600
the Justice to Department in Washington and said the Moral

1205
01:20:02,640 --> 01:20:05,960
Building had been bombed, But this was twenty four minutes

1206
01:20:06,000 --> 01:20:09,640
before the blast. No action was apparently taken.

1207
01:20:09,880 --> 01:20:13,000
Speaker 19: According to the show's producer, and the Justice Department actively

1208
01:20:13,039 --> 01:20:15,319
intervened to prevent an in depth follow up to the

1209
01:20:15,359 --> 01:20:17,239
segment from Marry Nationally.

1210
01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:23,560
Speaker 23: Twenty twenty did a fifteen or twenty minute segment on

1211
01:20:23,720 --> 01:20:26,479
prior knowledge that was put together by a guy named

1212
01:20:26,560 --> 01:20:31,760
Roger Charles that was so explosive that he was putting

1213
01:20:31,800 --> 01:20:35,560
together an entire hour or whatever for twenty twenty, which

1214
01:20:35,600 --> 01:20:38,399
he would tell you, but the Feds came in and

1215
01:20:38,399 --> 01:20:41,760
stopped twenty two. We wouldn't let them broadcast the larger

1216
01:20:41,880 --> 01:20:44,520
segment that he put together concerning prior knowledge.

1217
01:20:46,039 --> 01:20:48,359
Speaker 38: The New Channel has learned of another strange development.

1218
01:20:48,439 --> 01:20:50,119
Speaker 3: Apparently before the.

1219
01:20:50,119 --> 01:20:53,359
Speaker 15: Bombing, Governor Frank Keating's brother Mark had been working on

1220
01:20:53,399 --> 01:20:55,880
a novel about a terrorist bombing in Oklahoma City.

1221
01:20:55,920 --> 01:20:56,680
Speaker 4: Stranger Still.

1222
01:20:57,199 --> 01:21:00,159
Speaker 39: One of the carriacters in the novel was named Thomas mcle.

1223
01:21:00,680 --> 01:21:03,520
Speaker 19: Despite the official denials, the evidence confirm is that at

1224
01:21:03,600 --> 01:21:07,680
least some amount of prior knowledge existed. More ominously, there

1225
01:21:07,680 --> 01:21:11,239
are suggestions that certain government agencies were fully expecting a

1226
01:21:11,319 --> 01:21:12,520
bombing to occur that day.

1227
01:21:13,520 --> 01:21:19,000
Speaker 20: The Horsetrow, interestingly, was a very small unit and was

1228
01:21:19,039 --> 01:21:26,239
assisted by the County Reserve Mounted Patrol unit for whatever reason.

1229
01:21:26,279 --> 01:21:29,239
On the morning morning of the bombing, they had been

1230
01:21:29,560 --> 01:21:34,359
assigned and had already met at the Ookholm City Canine

1231
01:21:34,600 --> 01:21:36,279
Facility and.

1232
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:38,960
Speaker 6: Had prepared their horses, their.

1233
01:21:38,840 --> 01:21:44,119
Speaker 20: Attack and uniforms to go downtown for crowd control. Rarely,

1234
01:21:44,560 --> 01:21:48,119
very rarely would they go down and patrol or work

1235
01:21:48,279 --> 01:21:50,520
downtown area for crowd control for anything.

1236
01:21:51,039 --> 01:21:55,000
Speaker 19: The importance of exposing prior knowledge cannot be understated. Those

1237
01:21:55,000 --> 01:21:58,800
individuals who understood the danger beforehand and did nothing are

1238
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:01,279
just as guilty as those who lit the fuse on

1239
01:22:01,359 --> 01:22:11,560
the bomb. As the FBI and Department of Justice narrated

1240
01:22:11,560 --> 01:22:14,000
its focus on Tim McVay as the Loane bomber on

1241
01:22:14,000 --> 01:22:17,319
April nineteenth, people seeking truth and justice for the dead

1242
01:22:17,479 --> 01:22:20,199
were dismayed that so many reports of accomplices were being

1243
01:22:20,199 --> 01:22:24,079
discarded by the federal authorities. The first sketches of the

1244
01:22:24,119 --> 01:22:28,319
suspects released by the FBI clearly indicated that two people

1245
01:22:28,359 --> 01:22:30,800
were involved in parking, the rider truck in front of

1246
01:22:30,800 --> 01:22:33,800
the Murror building, and the original bola or be on

1247
01:22:33,840 --> 01:22:37,239
the lookout alert had mentioned three suspects. When the hunt

1248
01:22:37,239 --> 01:22:39,720
for John Doe number two was called off and he

1249
01:22:39,800 --> 01:22:42,439
was dismissed as a ghost, people who knew for a

1250
01:22:42,479 --> 01:22:45,039
fact that they had seen McVeigh with other people began

1251
01:22:45,119 --> 01:22:48,439
to speak out did McVeigh act alone?

1252
01:22:52,439 --> 01:22:56,439
Speaker 20: During that time, broadcasts were being made through the sound

1253
01:22:57,479 --> 01:22:59,960
suspects had been observed leaving the scene in a brand.

1254
01:23:01,399 --> 01:23:03,760
Speaker 14: At this time, people were trying to get together on

1255
01:23:03,800 --> 01:23:07,520
who was going to do what, medical personnel and such.

1256
01:23:08,359 --> 01:23:11,319
There was a police car sitting to my left facing

1257
01:23:11,439 --> 01:23:16,479
west on fifth Street, and as we were all standing

1258
01:23:16,479 --> 01:23:18,439
there conversing and you know, people were doing what they

1259
01:23:18,439 --> 01:23:21,520
were doing, he came out over the radio on this

1260
01:23:21,600 --> 01:23:24,840
police car that they were looking for a brown truck,

1261
01:23:25,319 --> 01:23:27,000
an APB for a brown truck.

1262
01:23:27,920 --> 01:23:30,439
Speaker 6: It was quick, but it was heard.

1263
01:23:30,960 --> 01:23:35,079
Speaker 8: I haven't stopped asking questions because I know that we

1264
01:23:35,199 --> 01:23:39,359
haven't been told the truth. I've talked to too many

1265
01:23:39,479 --> 01:23:44,479
people that saw Timothy mcveay that morning, saw Timothy McVeigh

1266
01:23:44,680 --> 01:23:49,279
in Kansas, and saw Timothy McVey and Oklahoma City not

1267
01:23:49,479 --> 01:23:51,600
one person saw him by himself.

1268
01:23:52,159 --> 01:23:53,800
Speaker 40: Timothy McVay stepped out of the truck.

1269
01:23:53,840 --> 01:23:54,720
Speaker 6: I walked him over to.

1270
01:23:56,800 --> 01:23:59,199
Speaker 40: Let's say, ten eleven feet away from the truck itself.

1271
01:23:59,520 --> 01:24:04,000
I pointed direction downtown, which is tomorrowright. He seemed to

1272
01:24:04,000 --> 01:24:06,560
acknowledge what I was talking about. At that time, the

1273
01:24:06,600 --> 01:24:07,800
gentleman walked back to the truck.

1274
01:24:07,880 --> 01:24:08,359
Speaker 6: I talked to him.

1275
01:24:08,359 --> 01:24:11,199
Speaker 40: I also noticed there was a passenger in the truck

1276
01:24:11,239 --> 01:24:11,600
at that.

1277
01:24:11,560 --> 01:24:14,199
Speaker 2: Time, And mostly it was a John Doe too thing,

1278
01:24:14,199 --> 01:24:17,079
because as you remember, the greatest manhood that has ever been,

1279
01:24:18,279 --> 01:24:20,279
and then all of a sudden, hey, he doesn't em exist.

1280
01:24:21,840 --> 01:24:25,199
If he doesn't exist, I wasn't a man. I mean

1281
01:24:25,239 --> 01:24:27,439
things like that that was continually coming out.

1282
01:24:28,800 --> 01:24:32,760
Speaker 8: I know for a fact Timothy McVeigh was with another

1283
01:24:32,880 --> 01:24:34,479
individual on the morning of.

1284
01:24:34,439 --> 01:24:40,800
Speaker 36: April nineteenth, right before the bombing. Because the evidence is

1285
01:24:40,840 --> 01:24:44,920
overwhelming and compelling, But there were other perpetrators and they

1286
01:24:44,960 --> 01:24:49,079
were not pursued. In the very early days after the bombing,

1287
01:24:50,039 --> 01:24:52,560
the decision was made not to pursue any more of

1288
01:24:52,600 --> 01:24:53,760
those individuals.

1289
01:24:57,199 --> 01:24:59,640
Speaker 19: In the days before the bombing, tim McVeigh was seen

1290
01:24:59,680 --> 01:25:03,479
making preparations with other suspects, not Terry Nichols or Michael

1291
01:25:03,520 --> 01:25:07,359
forty eight, but others unknown whom the authorities seemed uninterested

1292
01:25:07,399 --> 01:25:07,920
in finding.

1293
01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:10,800
Speaker 14: Yeah, the man that I saw on the phone that day,

1294
01:25:11,119 --> 01:25:13,479
that was actually on the phone was McVeigh.

1295
01:25:14,920 --> 01:25:16,239
Speaker 6: I am one hundred percent sure of that.

1296
01:25:16,800 --> 01:25:18,960
Speaker 14: He had a partner with him that had shoulder length

1297
01:25:19,000 --> 01:25:22,359
hair that was leaned up against the wall facing him.

1298
01:25:22,720 --> 01:25:25,119
Then at one point he turned the guy to his

1299
01:25:25,239 --> 01:25:28,520
right who was leaning against the wall shoulder length hair, and.

1300
01:25:28,479 --> 01:25:30,479
Speaker 6: Said, he told us to stay here.

1301
01:25:32,960 --> 01:25:35,479
Speaker 14: I did go up to the FBI at fifty pen

1302
01:25:35,560 --> 01:25:39,479
Place and told him my story. If I remember right,

1303
01:25:39,520 --> 01:25:43,439
I think they actually sketched out the second person that

1304
01:25:44,800 --> 01:25:49,399
I was describing, which was shoulder length hair, tan, stocky build,

1305
01:25:50,880 --> 01:25:55,479
a light plaid type jacket, shirt, kind of mix, kind

1306
01:25:55,479 --> 01:25:56,479
of goofy looking guy.

1307
01:25:57,640 --> 01:26:00,920
Speaker 19: A convenience store clerk reported to the FBI that McVeigh

1308
01:26:00,920 --> 01:26:03,640
had purchased fuel for a rider truck at her store

1309
01:26:03,800 --> 01:26:06,359
two days before the bombing, even pointing out on the

1310
01:26:06,399 --> 01:26:09,720
register tape when the purchase was made. A company in

1311
01:26:09,800 --> 01:26:13,399
McVay was another suspect. This example is only one of

1312
01:26:13,439 --> 01:26:17,520
many eyewitness accounts that diverged from the official narrative, and

1313
01:26:17,640 --> 01:26:20,479
although the government states that McVay never scouted inside the

1314
01:26:20,520 --> 01:26:23,920
Murror building, a secret Service investigator reported that she had

1315
01:26:23,960 --> 01:26:26,920
seen him in the building, also with a second suspect.

1316
01:26:31,399 --> 01:26:34,479
The official narrative dictates that Tim McVay alone rented the

1317
01:26:34,560 --> 01:26:38,000
rider truck in Junction City, Kansas, on April seventeen, two

1318
01:26:38,079 --> 01:26:42,000
days before the bombing. He and Terry Nichols supposedly constructed

1319
01:26:42,000 --> 01:26:45,079
the bomb on April eighteen, but the bulk of eyewitness

1320
01:26:45,119 --> 01:26:48,199
accounts assert that the rider truck was at Geary Lake

1321
01:26:48,239 --> 01:26:49,319
for several days before that.

1322
01:26:50,479 --> 01:26:58,560
Speaker 41: I retired April eleventh, nineteen ninety five, and after finished

1323
01:26:59,279 --> 01:27:01,520
that morning on decided to stop my heir and fish

1324
01:27:02,359 --> 01:27:07,000
at Geary State Lake, which is right in this general

1325
01:27:07,039 --> 01:27:12,560
area here that I was fishing from the pier or jetty,

1326
01:27:12,760 --> 01:27:16,840
and I stayed here most of the afternoon fishing, of course,

1327
01:27:16,880 --> 01:27:23,079
with no luck. And later on that afternoon I had

1328
01:27:23,520 --> 01:27:26,720
decided to maybe go back over this way over here

1329
01:27:27,000 --> 01:27:28,680
to the other point back here and see if I'd

1330
01:27:28,760 --> 01:27:30,479
have any luck I wanted.

1331
01:27:31,079 --> 01:27:33,399
Speaker 7: I noticed a.

1332
01:27:32,800 --> 01:27:35,880
Speaker 41: Rider truck over there. I was sitting at home one

1333
01:27:35,920 --> 01:27:38,000
day and my wife came in from work and she

1334
01:27:38,039 --> 01:27:39,800
said that she had been stopped in a roadblock up

1335
01:27:39,800 --> 01:27:43,760
here at Gary Lake in reference to the Oklahoma City

1336
01:27:43,800 --> 01:27:46,520
bombing and the making of the bomb here at Geary

1337
01:27:46,600 --> 01:27:47,560
State Lake, and.

1338
01:27:48,039 --> 01:27:49,119
Speaker 6: With a rider truck.

1339
01:27:49,720 --> 01:27:51,319
Speaker 41: And I said, well, you know, I had told you

1340
01:27:51,359 --> 01:27:55,560
about the rider truck I had seen there before this,

1341
01:27:56,600 --> 01:27:59,039
and that's how I became aware of it. And then

1342
01:27:59,319 --> 01:28:02,920
the next thing, he told the IF and FBI the

1343
01:28:02,960 --> 01:28:06,439
people at the roadblock that what I had seen, and

1344
01:28:07,520 --> 01:28:09,319
before I knew it, my house was forming with.

1345
01:28:11,279 --> 01:28:12,079
Speaker 6: Agents.

1346
01:28:15,960 --> 01:28:18,960
Speaker 19: McVeigh stayed at the Dreamland Motel just outside the gates

1347
01:28:18,960 --> 01:28:21,560
of Fort Riley, Kansas, while he rented the truck and

1348
01:28:21,600 --> 01:28:25,000
built the bomb. Once again, I witnessed his state that

1349
01:28:25,079 --> 01:28:27,520
he was not alone and the rider truck was there

1350
01:28:27,560 --> 01:28:32,760
for days before. The FBI insists it was. The maid

1351
01:28:32,840 --> 01:28:35,840
at the Dreamland saw mcveigh's friend with the rider truck

1352
01:28:36,119 --> 01:28:38,159
and when showing a sketch of John Doe number two,

1353
01:28:38,439 --> 01:28:41,439
told the FBI, my god, who did the sketch?

1354
01:28:41,920 --> 01:28:44,119
Speaker 28: It looks just like him.

1355
01:28:44,279 --> 01:28:47,000
Speaker 19: All these reports indicate that more than one rider truck

1356
01:28:47,079 --> 01:28:49,920
was involved in the bombing, and more people. Then the

1357
01:28:49,920 --> 01:28:50,920
government is letting on.

1358
01:28:54,079 --> 01:28:55,239
Speaker 4: Justice for these killers.

1359
01:28:55,279 --> 01:29:01,840
Speaker 5: Will be certain, swift and severe. We will find them,

1360
01:29:02,399 --> 01:29:05,520
we will convict them, and we will seek the.

1361
01:29:05,479 --> 01:29:06,560
Speaker 6: Death penalty for them.

1362
01:29:07,359 --> 01:29:09,960
Speaker 19: It was promised to the people of Oklahoma City and

1363
01:29:10,079 --> 01:29:13,560
to the rest of America that every single person responsible

1364
01:29:13,560 --> 01:29:16,960
for the bombing would be caught, tried, and held accountable

1365
01:29:17,000 --> 01:29:20,079
for the harm they had inflicted. It was expected that

1366
01:29:20,119 --> 01:29:24,760
this promise would be fulfilled. Nevertheless, as eyewitnessed testimony and

1367
01:29:24,800 --> 01:29:28,880
other promising leads were being carelessly discarded, replaced only with

1368
01:29:28,960 --> 01:29:34,760
the lies and inconsistencies of federal officials, a deep but

1369
01:29:34,880 --> 01:29:38,720
private suspicion grew in the minds of observers that perhaps

1370
01:29:38,760 --> 01:29:42,000
a government cover up was under way. Was this mere

1371
01:29:42,039 --> 01:29:44,880
and competence or was there something else at work here.

1372
01:29:45,800 --> 01:29:48,640
Speaker 13: I was a police officer in Tulsa Police Department for

1373
01:29:48,680 --> 01:29:52,920
twenty seven years, and in nineteen ninety five, when the

1374
01:29:52,960 --> 01:29:56,520
Oklahoma City bombing occurred, I was requested by the local

1375
01:29:56,600 --> 01:29:59,239
FBI office, through our chief of police, to assist any

1376
01:29:59,239 --> 01:30:02,880
way I could and look into the bombing and using

1377
01:30:02,920 --> 01:30:05,760
my contacts as an investigating journalist, which is what I

1378
01:30:05,800 --> 01:30:08,399
did on the side, to try to find out anything

1379
01:30:08,439 --> 01:30:12,479
we could find out about the bombing. McVeigh, Nichols and

1380
01:30:12,640 --> 01:30:14,920
just kind of followed the investigation any place it went,

1381
01:30:15,039 --> 01:30:17,600
just follow the leads. I was still working in the

1382
01:30:17,640 --> 01:30:21,079
case with Jane Davis and David Hoffman to Oklahoma City

1383
01:30:21,079 --> 01:30:23,199
Police officers and one of them, it was one of

1384
01:30:23,199 --> 01:30:25,479
the first ones in the building and he saw some

1385
01:30:25,560 --> 01:30:27,560
things in the building. He saw the biggest damage to

1386
01:30:27,600 --> 01:30:29,359
the building was the pit which was in the back

1387
01:30:29,399 --> 01:30:30,720
of the building and went down like two.

1388
01:30:30,680 --> 01:30:31,359
Speaker 4: Or three floors.

1389
01:30:31,640 --> 01:30:34,439
Speaker 13: He saw all of that. You know, that never came

1390
01:30:34,479 --> 01:30:38,199
out in the news. It wasn't part of the investigation.

1391
01:30:38,359 --> 01:30:40,880
It just it didn't count. In other words, it didn't

1392
01:30:40,920 --> 01:30:44,359
fit the mold that the Department of Justice under Janet

1393
01:30:44,399 --> 01:30:47,399
Reno set for the FBI. Then it wasn't put in

1394
01:30:47,479 --> 01:30:48,479
the case period.

1395
01:30:49,399 --> 01:30:52,079
Speaker 19: The FBI bragged about its handling of the deadliest terror

1396
01:30:52,079 --> 01:30:55,279
attack in American history, but gigantic holes in the case

1397
01:30:55,319 --> 01:30:59,560
were being ignored by the media. McVeigh was first suspected

1398
01:30:59,600 --> 01:31:01,800
because he rent of the truck under the name Robert Kling.

1399
01:31:02,520 --> 01:31:04,640
One of the first pieces of evidence used to lick

1400
01:31:04,680 --> 01:31:06,520
MCBAG to the bombing was problematic.

1401
01:31:07,159 --> 01:31:09,640
Speaker 8: Yeah, I went to Junction City. I went out to

1402
01:31:09,720 --> 01:31:13,479
Elliott's body shop, and I spoke to mister Elliott. I

1403
01:31:13,520 --> 01:31:18,960
told him who I was, and I said, up, I

1404
01:31:18,960 --> 01:31:22,479
would like for you to tell me what happened the

1405
01:31:22,560 --> 01:31:26,359
day Tim came to rent the right of truck. And

1406
01:31:26,399 --> 01:31:28,840
he said, you mean the day Tim and his friend

1407
01:31:28,960 --> 01:31:34,920
came And I said Tim wasn't by himself. He said, no, man.

1408
01:31:36,079 --> 01:31:39,000
Speaker 31: The FBI has been designated by President Clinton as the

1409
01:31:39,079 --> 01:31:41,520
leading federal latency in this investigation.

1410
01:31:45,159 --> 01:31:49,279
Speaker 19: Incredibly enough, there remains an extra unidentified leg that was

1411
01:31:49,319 --> 01:31:53,520
found in the rubble. Oklahoma State medical Examiner Fred Jordan

1412
01:31:53,640 --> 01:31:57,079
testified in court we had eight people with traumatically amputated

1413
01:31:57,119 --> 01:32:00,720
left legs. However we have nine left legs. We have

1414
01:32:00,800 --> 01:32:06,560
one leg too many. Stephen Jones, mcveigh's defense attorney, detailed

1415
01:32:06,560 --> 01:32:09,960
in his book Others Unknown the significance of this extra leg.

1416
01:32:10,520 --> 01:32:14,159
Former Chief Pathologists for Northern Ireland T. K. Marshall performed

1417
01:32:14,159 --> 01:32:17,640
over twenty five hundred autopsies on bombing victims and told

1418
01:32:17,720 --> 01:32:21,159
Jones that in all the years in Ireland we identified

1419
01:32:21,199 --> 01:32:23,960
every innocent person that was killed. There was never an

1420
01:32:24,039 --> 01:32:30,439
unknown victim. The FBI collected one thousand and thirty four fingerprints.

1421
01:32:30,520 --> 01:32:34,840
During their investigation, but an agent admitted under oath that

1422
01:32:34,880 --> 01:32:38,000
these prints were not run through the National Fingerprint Database.

1423
01:32:38,600 --> 01:32:41,319
Nicki Deutschmann was the jury for person for the federal

1424
01:32:41,359 --> 01:32:42,640
trial of Terry Nichols.

1425
01:32:43,119 --> 01:32:47,960
Speaker 1: I think that the government perhaps really dropped the ball.

1426
01:32:48,039 --> 01:32:51,399
I think that there were a large number of sightings

1427
01:32:51,640 --> 01:32:55,760
right around before the tide, the week before, and the

1428
01:32:55,880 --> 01:33:00,720
days and months after the bombing, and sketches of people

1429
01:33:00,760 --> 01:33:06,159
that were recognizable. In this trial, there even was a

1430
01:33:06,199 --> 01:33:10,680
photograph of someone who may have been involved with mixing

1431
01:33:10,760 --> 01:33:14,920
the bombs, with putting the bomb together, and that person

1432
01:33:15,079 --> 01:33:17,760
it was a photograph from a newspaper. Obviously, that person's

1433
01:33:17,800 --> 01:33:20,760
identity is known. I think there are other people out there,

1434
01:33:21,199 --> 01:33:24,960
and decisions were probably made very early on that Tim

1435
01:33:25,000 --> 01:33:27,800
McVay and Terry Nichols were who they were looking for,

1436
01:33:27,960 --> 01:33:31,800
and the same sort of resources were not used to

1437
01:33:31,880 --> 01:33:33,800
try to find out who else might be involved.

1438
01:33:38,359 --> 01:33:41,800
Speaker 23: Well, in those first couple of days, especially that first

1439
01:33:41,880 --> 01:33:46,279
day of the Oklahoma City bombing, there was immediate information

1440
01:33:46,359 --> 01:33:50,319
that came out about what caused the bombing, witnesses on

1441
01:33:50,359 --> 01:33:53,119
the scene of the crime, things such as that, and

1442
01:33:53,159 --> 01:33:57,640
it changed very significantly and drastically as the day went

1443
01:33:57,720 --> 01:34:00,720
by and the next several days went by. That caused

1444
01:34:00,720 --> 01:34:03,439
a lot of questions in people's minds about, well, what

1445
01:34:03,600 --> 01:34:07,920
really happened here. The reason I doubt started doubting the

1446
01:34:07,960 --> 01:34:10,600
official story that was coming out. You have to understand

1447
01:34:10,600 --> 01:34:15,359
that the state of the local media, we're doing a

1448
01:34:15,359 --> 01:34:15,880
good job.

1449
01:34:15,920 --> 01:34:16,520
Speaker 4: The first day.

1450
01:34:18,119 --> 01:34:21,239
Speaker 23: Local law enforcement maybe also, I believe, was doing a

1451
01:34:21,239 --> 01:34:24,720
good job. But once the Feds came in, things started changing.

1452
01:34:25,359 --> 01:34:29,159
Speaker 37: The police and emergency crews are talking about moving us

1453
01:34:29,199 --> 01:34:33,000
back because of the danger of a possibility of another explosion.

1454
01:34:33,359 --> 01:34:34,840
Speaker 17: I think you said, another pot.

1455
01:34:38,039 --> 01:34:39,199
Speaker 33: Oh my god, another boo.

1456
01:34:39,880 --> 01:34:42,640
Speaker 23: The fire crews and the various emergency crews are trying

1457
01:34:42,640 --> 01:34:44,199
to get in, but we keep getting.

1458
01:34:43,960 --> 01:34:46,560
Speaker 25: Reports that there may be other devices in the area

1459
01:34:46,600 --> 01:34:47,560
and they will use that.

1460
01:34:48,520 --> 01:34:50,600
Speaker 4: Trailer you see the bucket on the back there.

1461
01:34:50,520 --> 01:34:53,399
Speaker 42: Sort of This is how they would transport the explosive device.

1462
01:34:53,119 --> 01:34:55,479
Speaker 1: Away from this populated area to try to do something

1463
01:34:55,520 --> 01:34:55,840
with it.

1464
01:34:56,079 --> 01:35:02,920
Speaker 43: There were two unexploded devices discovered subsequent to the initial explosion.

1465
01:35:03,159 --> 01:35:06,479
Speaker 11: A second bomb was found on the east side of

1466
01:35:06,520 --> 01:35:08,920
that building. A bomb squad is on the scene. That

1467
01:35:09,079 --> 01:35:11,920
second bomb has not exploded. We don't know quite the

1468
01:35:11,920 --> 01:35:14,000
status yet if they've managed to diffuse it.

1469
01:35:14,000 --> 01:35:15,640
Speaker 7: But it has been confirmed.

1470
01:35:15,199 --> 01:35:21,439
Speaker 21: There have been cowards of two explosive devices unexploded explosive devices.

1471
01:35:21,600 --> 01:35:25,079
Speaker 33: Two different explosive devices were found in addition to the

1472
01:35:25,079 --> 01:35:25,960
one that went off.

1473
01:35:26,399 --> 01:35:29,840
Speaker 5: Just an hour after the initial explosion, downtown Oklahoma City

1474
01:35:30,000 --> 01:35:32,760
was shaken up again with word of another bomb or

1475
01:35:32,760 --> 01:35:35,520
maybe two.

1476
01:35:34,399 --> 01:35:37,880
Speaker 44: They've had to back off a couple of times because

1477
01:35:37,880 --> 01:35:41,720
they found I guess two or three other bombs or

1478
01:35:41,760 --> 01:35:45,479
at least explosive devices down there that they've had to defuse.

1479
01:35:45,840 --> 01:35:49,079
Speaker 40: The shut down operation for about twenty thirty minutes because

1480
01:35:49,119 --> 01:35:52,119
of that, and that that was very frustrating because we

1481
01:35:52,359 --> 01:35:54,680
clean right at the point where we had people and

1482
01:35:54,760 --> 01:35:55,560
we had to leaven.

1483
01:35:55,359 --> 01:35:57,880
Speaker 11: With the first bomb that was in the Federal building

1484
01:35:58,000 --> 01:35:59,960
did go off, it did the damage that you see

1485
01:36:00,079 --> 01:36:00,520
right there.

1486
01:36:00,840 --> 01:36:03,640
Speaker 6: The second explosive was found and diffused.

1487
01:36:04,520 --> 01:36:06,920
Speaker 27: The Oklahoma City bombing was one of the first big

1488
01:36:06,920 --> 01:36:09,840
stories that I covered, and it was just shocking to

1489
01:36:09,960 --> 01:36:11,960
know it was an inside job and to know that

1490
01:36:12,039 --> 01:36:15,239
the media was involved in the cover up, and that

1491
01:36:16,079 --> 01:36:19,439
the mainstream television stations they're in Oklahoma City.

1492
01:36:19,840 --> 01:36:21,279
Speaker 7: Knew what had really happened.

1493
01:36:21,560 --> 01:36:23,680
Speaker 27: And then years later I was able to actually talk

1494
01:36:23,680 --> 01:36:25,800
to some of those reporters and they discussed how they

1495
01:36:25,840 --> 01:36:27,600
were told to shut up. I mean, it just showed

1496
01:36:27,600 --> 01:36:30,520
how people were so willing to be part of the

1497
01:36:30,520 --> 01:36:33,800
cover up just because the truth was so frightening. And

1498
01:36:33,840 --> 01:36:36,479
that's really why we've become so enslaved, is that we

1499
01:36:36,680 --> 01:36:39,359
just give in to the lives and they start little,

1500
01:36:39,399 --> 01:36:40,600
but they get bigger and bigger.

1501
01:36:41,319 --> 01:36:45,640
Speaker 24: It's amazing when everyone we can see an event and

1502
01:36:45,680 --> 01:36:49,239
that gets changed into something else simply because the media

1503
01:36:49,720 --> 01:36:52,800
presents it that way. That means the media is complicit

1504
01:36:52,840 --> 01:36:56,399
in the cover up. They'ren't hapless, they're not ignorant. How

1505
01:36:56,439 --> 01:36:58,880
come I can figure this out in a CNN camps.

1506
01:36:59,159 --> 01:37:02,880
Speaker 27: The controlled, corporate mainstream media is essential to a cover

1507
01:37:03,000 --> 01:37:05,760
up like Oklahoma City being successful. And that's why the

1508
01:37:05,800 --> 01:37:09,000
mainstream media has lost so much credibility because all over

1509
01:37:09,039 --> 01:37:11,800
the nation people have seen things like Oklahoma City over

1510
01:37:11,840 --> 01:37:14,119
and over again, where you see the live footage, you

1511
01:37:14,119 --> 01:37:16,800
see them removing the bombs, you see the governor admitting it,

1512
01:37:17,640 --> 01:37:20,199
and then letter the media says, we never said that.

1513
01:37:20,199 --> 01:37:22,039
That's what conspiracy theorists say.

1514
01:37:22,479 --> 01:37:24,960
Speaker 19: At first the media reported on some of these bothersome

1515
01:37:25,000 --> 01:37:27,880
pieces of evidence that they became little more than perish

1516
01:37:27,880 --> 01:37:31,159
for the Justice Department. As the official story was railroaded

1517
01:37:31,199 --> 01:37:32,479
into the public mind.

1518
01:37:32,680 --> 01:37:35,760
Speaker 36: Been listening to Mike McCurry, President Clinton spokesperson at the

1519
01:37:35,760 --> 01:37:36,119
White House.

1520
01:37:36,159 --> 01:37:37,760
Speaker 4: Apparently at this point we know a little bit more

1521
01:37:37,760 --> 01:37:38,760
than that White House does.

1522
01:37:38,600 --> 01:37:40,319
Speaker 25: Because we have been able to confirm it was a

1523
01:37:40,399 --> 01:37:42,960
car explosion, that word coming to us from Mayor Ron

1524
01:37:42,960 --> 01:37:43,600
Nork earlier.

1525
01:37:43,640 --> 01:37:46,359
Speaker 11: Twelve hundred pounds of explosives parked out in front of

1526
01:37:46,439 --> 01:37:47,439
the Federal Building.

1527
01:37:47,199 --> 01:37:48,920
Speaker 45: And ATF has confirmed that as well.

1528
01:37:49,880 --> 01:37:54,840
Speaker 46: Who's going to investigate the investigators, who's going to investigate

1529
01:37:55,560 --> 01:37:58,760
the prosecutors, who's going to hold them accountable, Who's going

1530
01:37:58,800 --> 01:38:00,520
to hold us public officials accountable?

1531
01:38:01,079 --> 01:38:03,319
Speaker 36: And that's all we're trying to do here, trying in

1532
01:38:03,520 --> 01:38:04,880
addition to trying to find the truth.

1533
01:38:05,479 --> 01:38:10,359
Speaker 2: Well, initially that morning, all the media that was downtown,

1534
01:38:10,399 --> 01:38:15,039
they're reporting, were reporting the truth. They reported the truth

1535
01:38:15,159 --> 01:38:20,840
about the unexploded bombs, undetonated bombs being removed the building.

1536
01:38:21,680 --> 01:38:27,520
By afternoon, things begin to ease a little bit. You

1537
01:38:27,520 --> 01:38:30,840
could sense a difference, and by the next day everybody

1538
01:38:30,840 --> 01:38:34,279
but Channel four had changed his story completely.

1539
01:38:34,800 --> 01:38:37,640
Speaker 19: One local station in Oklahoma City KO four or TV,

1540
01:38:37,800 --> 01:38:41,239
did perform its duty by reporting on mcvay's accomplices, the

1541
01:38:41,279 --> 01:38:44,199
evidence of prior warnings, and many of the aspects of

1542
01:38:44,239 --> 01:38:48,119
the case. The New York Times Broadcasting Company purchased KO

1543
01:38:48,159 --> 01:38:51,680
four UR a year after the bombing. The programming director

1544
01:38:51,880 --> 01:38:54,680
was fired, the lead journalist on the bombing, Jana Davis,

1545
01:38:54,760 --> 01:38:58,680
was let go, and all reporting that contradicted the government vanished.

1546
01:39:01,760 --> 01:39:04,560
The victims turned to the government with their questions, expecting

1547
01:39:04,600 --> 01:39:06,239
the full truth to come out.

1548
01:39:06,560 --> 01:39:07,479
Speaker 28: This was not to be.

1549
01:39:08,439 --> 01:39:10,960
Speaker 19: Those who asked too many questions, were knew too much,

1550
01:39:11,159 --> 01:39:13,239
were discouraged from their efforts in other ways.

1551
01:39:14,279 --> 01:39:18,159
Speaker 29: Debbie Nakanashi, who was with the Post Office, she was

1552
01:39:18,359 --> 01:39:23,439
told not to talk to anybody about that. Her job

1553
01:39:23,479 --> 01:39:25,359
had been threatened to her. She went to the union

1554
01:39:25,359 --> 01:39:30,119
over it. Then they apologized. But she and I went

1555
01:39:30,239 --> 01:39:34,199
on a number of occasions to Washington, d C. We

1556
01:39:34,600 --> 01:39:40,920
tried to see every Senator and every congressman from Oklahoma.

1557
01:39:41,920 --> 01:39:45,079
Speaker 12: Not one would give us an interview.

1558
01:39:45,680 --> 01:39:48,399
Speaker 20: I was told by an agent, an EPI agent, that

1559
01:39:50,239 --> 01:39:54,560
big comments that ad made that people like me often

1560
01:39:54,680 --> 01:39:57,560
ended up dead, and you'd be careful what I said

1561
01:39:58,319 --> 01:40:02,920
if I was him, And in the way that he

1562
01:40:02,960 --> 01:40:04,920
put it forth, I felt like, here's a threat.

1563
01:40:05,479 --> 01:40:09,640
Speaker 8: I wrote letters to Janet Reno when she was the

1564
01:40:09,800 --> 01:40:13,520
United States Attorney General. I wrote Lewis free who was

1565
01:40:13,600 --> 01:40:17,399
over the FBI at that time. I wrote Senator Orrin Hatch.

1566
01:40:18,119 --> 01:40:21,560
I wrote everybody I could think of, asking for help.

1567
01:40:22,119 --> 01:40:28,920
Nothing was done.

1568
01:40:29,479 --> 01:40:32,279
Speaker 19: When the government decided that the investigation was over, a

1569
01:40:32,359 --> 01:40:35,119
federal grand jury was in panel to hand down indictments.

1570
01:40:35,640 --> 01:40:39,640
This is usually a straightforward process, but the federal prosecutors

1571
01:40:39,680 --> 01:40:42,560
were not counting on one grand juror Happy Heidelberg, to

1572
01:40:42,680 --> 01:40:44,239
actually ask questions of his own.

1573
01:40:45,479 --> 01:40:48,079
Speaker 2: My name is Hoppy Heidelberg, and I served on the

1574
01:40:48,159 --> 01:40:51,520
federal grand jury that was supposed to investigate the merrabill

1575
01:40:51,560 --> 01:40:55,640
And bombing in Oklahoma City back in nineteen ninety five. Actually,

1576
01:40:56,000 --> 01:41:00,239
the grand jury has two responsibilities.

1577
01:41:00,760 --> 01:41:02,119
Speaker 6: That are outlined in this book.

1578
01:41:02,159 --> 01:41:06,000
Speaker 2: The first one is says the grand jury operates as

1579
01:41:06,000 --> 01:41:09,960
a sword authorizing the government's prosecution of suspected criminals and

1580
01:41:10,000 --> 01:41:14,600
also as a shield protecting citizens from unwarrant or inappropriate prosecutions.

1581
01:41:14,960 --> 01:41:17,279
Now that's not something that the media or the government

1582
01:41:17,319 --> 01:41:21,159
ever points out. But that was actually the reason for

1583
01:41:21,319 --> 01:41:23,680
a grand jury in the first place, to protect citizens

1584
01:41:23,720 --> 01:41:26,359
from the Crown, who at the time had a habit

1585
01:41:26,439 --> 01:41:31,159
of prosecuting their political enemies, or anybody that chose for

1586
01:41:31,239 --> 01:41:34,680
any reason. The grand jury, our grand jury it was

1587
01:41:34,680 --> 01:41:39,399
supposed to be calling witnesses, were not allowed to call

1588
01:41:39,479 --> 01:41:43,319
any And it was my letter to the judge telling

1589
01:41:43,399 --> 01:41:46,319
him that and demanding that we be allowed to call witnesses.

1590
01:41:46,319 --> 01:41:49,359
He got me excused from grand jury. What you will

1591
01:41:49,439 --> 01:41:52,279
hear in what they say that's a lie is that

1592
01:41:52,439 --> 01:41:55,920
the grand jury foreman is the only one that has

1593
01:41:55,920 --> 01:41:58,319
the right to do this or that, and that's not true.

1594
01:41:58,399 --> 01:42:02,640
According to the book, any member can demand anything he

1595
01:42:02,760 --> 01:42:06,399
wants for any reason. Can be just his personal opinion,

1596
01:42:06,479 --> 01:42:10,159
it can be from information he gets. In course, they

1597
01:42:10,199 --> 01:42:12,840
tell us, well, you can't watch TV or you can't

1598
01:42:12,840 --> 01:42:14,319
read the paper. That's nonsense.

1599
01:42:14,760 --> 01:42:15,520
Speaker 6: That's nonsense.

1600
01:42:17,000 --> 01:42:21,119
Speaker 2: Grand jurors need to be well informed if they're going

1601
01:42:21,199 --> 01:42:24,239
to do their job properly. See, we were never allowed

1602
01:42:24,279 --> 01:42:28,000
to see the photo evidence from the cameras on the

1603
01:42:28,039 --> 01:42:32,439
mirror building that would have shown the truck being parked

1604
01:42:33,560 --> 01:42:34,399
and the.

1605
01:42:34,399 --> 01:42:36,239
Speaker 4: People who got out of the truck.

1606
01:42:36,680 --> 01:42:41,079
Speaker 2: That's all on tape, and we were authorized to see

1607
01:42:41,119 --> 01:42:43,960
all of that, but we weren't allowed to see it,

1608
01:42:44,439 --> 01:42:46,560
and in fact, nobody's been allowed to see it. All

1609
01:42:46,600 --> 01:42:49,600
those tapes have been kept under wrapped for fifteen years.

1610
01:42:50,000 --> 01:42:53,359
It was just too important, just too important to the

1611
01:42:53,359 --> 01:42:57,119
American people to know what happened there for me to

1612
01:42:57,199 --> 01:43:00,199
keep quiet because nobody else was going to speak up.

1613
01:43:01,199 --> 01:43:04,640
The other grandeurs were petrified because they observed on a

1614
01:43:04,720 --> 01:43:09,479
daily basis the kind of intimidation tactics that were used

1615
01:43:10,520 --> 01:43:13,640
by the Department of Justice attorneys to tempt to keep

1616
01:43:13,640 --> 01:43:17,319
me under control. And when they found out about the

1617
01:43:17,439 --> 01:43:21,760
FBI visits to my home, I really shook him up.

1618
01:43:21,960 --> 01:43:23,319
Speaker 6: Now that's even scared to talk to him.

1619
01:43:23,319 --> 01:43:26,920
Speaker 19: In a men's ray, Hoppy will never be silenced. In

1620
01:43:27,000 --> 01:43:29,880
nineteen ninety eight, he ran as an independent candidate for

1621
01:43:29,960 --> 01:43:34,079
governor of Oklahoma, intent on reopening the investigation into the bombing.

1622
01:43:34,880 --> 01:43:38,479
After being excluded from the gubernatorial debate, Hoppy walked on

1623
01:43:38,520 --> 01:43:42,239
stage to ask Governor Frank Heating why both they're all

1624
01:43:42,319 --> 01:43:42,680
record to.

1625
01:43:42,760 --> 01:44:01,319
Speaker 47: Saying that you think I should participate that.

1626
01:43:56,920 --> 01:44:00,640
Speaker 24: Thank you audience, mister Jenkins, your fall what now?

1627
01:44:06,880 --> 01:44:09,319
Speaker 19: Two years after the bombing, the trial of Tim McBay

1628
01:44:09,399 --> 01:44:12,439
began in Denver, Colorado. The trial had been moved out

1629
01:44:12,439 --> 01:44:16,760
of Oklahoma despite the constitutional mandate that federal crimes must

1630
01:44:16,840 --> 01:44:19,880
be tried in the district in which they occurred. The

1631
01:44:19,920 --> 01:44:22,399
truth seekers were assured that all of their questions would

1632
01:44:22,399 --> 01:44:23,239
be answered in court.

1633
01:44:24,600 --> 01:44:27,520
Speaker 23: The trial was not handled appropriately, was handled in a

1634
01:44:27,560 --> 01:44:32,239
way that was very prejudice against the defendants. If you

1635
01:44:32,279 --> 01:44:37,720
look at what Judge Match did concerning prejudicing the jury

1636
01:44:38,600 --> 01:44:41,319
toward the people that were being prosecuted. By two weeks,

1637
01:44:41,319 --> 01:44:44,800
he showed them pictures of dead babies and blood and guts,

1638
01:44:45,479 --> 01:44:49,159
and which is all basically my understanding of the law,

1639
01:44:49,199 --> 01:44:52,680
illegal to prejudice the jury like that. Yet they did

1640
01:44:52,720 --> 01:44:54,600
that kind of stuff, apparently on purpose.

1641
01:44:55,079 --> 01:44:59,600
Speaker 8: I was told that about the US attorney that if

1642
01:44:59,640 --> 01:45:06,000
I the trials and Denver, that all of my questions

1643
01:45:06,039 --> 01:45:11,840
would be answered. I gave up everything I had, my

1644
01:45:11,960 --> 01:45:17,279
apartment and everything, and I moved to Denver, and I

1645
01:45:17,399 --> 01:45:20,720
attended both trials, and by the time Terry Nichols trial

1646
01:45:20,880 --> 01:45:26,560
was over, I had more questions and no answers.

1647
01:45:27,640 --> 01:45:31,520
Speaker 19: The trial lasted three weeks. In contrast, the OJ Simpson

1648
01:45:31,560 --> 01:45:35,279
trial in nineteen ninety five had lasted nine months. The

1649
01:45:35,359 --> 01:45:38,840
jury deliberated for less than twenty four hours and sentenced to.

1650
01:45:38,880 --> 01:45:39,760
Speaker 28: McVeigh to death.

1651
01:45:40,920 --> 01:45:44,000
Speaker 19: McVeigh waived all his appeals and was fast tracked to

1652
01:45:44,000 --> 01:45:48,119
be the first federal prisoner executed in decades. Just before

1653
01:45:48,159 --> 01:45:51,600
his execution date, the FBI announced that they had withheld

1654
01:45:51,680 --> 01:45:55,319
thousands of pages of documents that could have influenced his trial,

1655
01:45:55,680 --> 01:45:57,760
which led to a month long stay of execution.

1656
01:45:58,520 --> 01:46:02,439
Speaker 38: I mean they weren't able to get thousands, at least thousands,

1657
01:46:02,439 --> 01:46:05,000
probably a lot more than that of documents from unit,

1658
01:46:05,039 --> 01:46:06,520
the FBI and the DOJ.

1659
01:46:07,079 --> 01:46:08,279
Speaker 31: They just wouldn't turn him over.

1660
01:46:09,000 --> 01:46:11,920
Speaker 19: On June eleven, two thousand and one, Tim McVeigh was

1661
01:46:11,920 --> 01:46:14,680
put to death by lethal injection at the Federal Death

1662
01:46:14,760 --> 01:46:18,479
Row in Terrohooe, Indiana. He left no message and was

1663
01:46:18,560 --> 01:46:22,079
quickly cremated without an autopsy being performed on his body,

1664
01:46:22,399 --> 01:46:28,159
contrary to the standard procedure for executed prisoners. Terry Nichols

1665
01:46:28,279 --> 01:46:30,600
was tried and found guilty in his separate trial and

1666
01:46:30,680 --> 01:46:34,520
received a life sentence without the possibility of parole in

1667
01:46:34,560 --> 01:46:37,199
two thousand and four. Terry Nichols was then tried in

1668
01:46:37,239 --> 01:46:40,439
Oklahoma on state murder charges in the prosecutor's hope of

1669
01:46:40,479 --> 01:46:44,319
imposing a death sentence. Nichols was found guilty, but a

1670
01:46:44,399 --> 01:46:47,000
jury once again refused to execute him.

1671
01:46:47,479 --> 01:46:49,760
Speaker 36: Those jurors did the best job they could with the

1672
01:46:49,840 --> 01:46:52,720
case that was presented to them. I think what their

1673
01:46:52,760 --> 01:46:54,880
statement says is they knew there was something wrong and

1674
01:46:54,920 --> 01:46:57,720
somebody had some involvement here. But they also, as they

1675
01:46:57,760 --> 01:47:02,800
have sat themselves, that there lies. There were mistruths, there

1676
01:47:02,800 --> 01:47:06,560
were bungling, there was arrogance, there was things that were

1677
01:47:06,600 --> 01:47:09,239
not pursued like the other John Doe's, and so they

1678
01:47:09,279 --> 01:47:11,319
felt like there was a reasonable doubt.

1679
01:47:11,680 --> 01:47:15,199
Speaker 19: Michael Fortier became a witness for the federal prosecutors, received

1680
01:47:15,199 --> 01:47:17,960
a ten year sentence, and was released in two thousand

1681
01:47:17,960 --> 01:47:22,520
and six directly into the witness protection program. Justice, the

1682
01:47:22,520 --> 01:47:24,199
government announced had been.

1683
01:47:24,079 --> 01:47:36,159
Speaker 17: Served Carnal's bar.

1684
01:47:42,640 --> 01:47:44,119
Speaker 33: We got a love.

1685
01:47:47,319 --> 01:47:48,159
Speaker 29: In books.

1686
01:47:58,920 --> 01:48:02,439
Speaker 19: As the government proclaimed justice were all impacted by the bombing.

1687
01:48:02,960 --> 01:48:05,960
The people back in Oklahoma still sought the truth and

1688
01:48:06,039 --> 01:48:09,199
knew now that they were on their own. The list

1689
01:48:09,239 --> 01:48:12,439
of questions continued to grow due to the mysterious death

1690
01:48:12,800 --> 01:48:16,840
of Oklahoma City Police Officer Sergeant Terrence Yake. Terry Yeake,

1691
01:48:17,399 --> 01:48:20,279
unlike the rest of Oklahoma, may have known too much.

1692
01:48:21,840 --> 01:48:26,319
Officer Yankee was just over thirty years old at the

1693
01:48:26,359 --> 01:48:28,560
time of the bombing, and the morning of the bombing,

1694
01:48:28,560 --> 01:48:31,760
he was issuing a traffic ticket near the Civic Center

1695
01:48:31,840 --> 01:48:34,159
Music Hall, which is about four blocks to the west

1696
01:48:34,159 --> 01:48:38,119
of where the Murray Buildings did. He dropped the ticket book,

1697
01:48:39,079 --> 01:48:42,520
let the woman go, and I have to obviously give

1698
01:48:42,600 --> 01:48:44,840
attend other things. He heard the multiple blasts coming from

1699
01:48:44,880 --> 01:48:46,960
the Murraough building, sped up there in his black and

1700
01:48:47,000 --> 01:48:49,560
white squad car and immediately started pulling out the first

1701
01:48:49,800 --> 01:48:50,439
of eight people.

1702
01:48:50,920 --> 01:48:52,119
Speaker 28: Mister Tom Hall, being.

1703
01:48:51,960 --> 01:48:56,479
Speaker 19: The first former employee of the GSA. Tom to this day,

1704
01:48:56,840 --> 01:48:58,439
in fact, they talked to him a couple of weeks ago,

1705
01:48:58,640 --> 01:49:00,800
still has the utmost respect for Officer Yeki.

1706
01:49:00,840 --> 01:49:02,159
Speaker 28: He literally saved his life.

1707
01:49:02,720 --> 01:49:07,000
Speaker 19: Officer Yiki, being an astute police officer for seven years

1708
01:49:07,079 --> 01:49:11,119
veteran of the Oklahoma City Police Department, knew that something.

1709
01:49:10,920 --> 01:49:12,000
Speaker 28: Was horribly wrong.

1710
01:49:12,359 --> 01:49:14,680
Speaker 19: He tried to get the official storyline out through his

1711
01:49:14,720 --> 01:49:17,560
commanding officers at the Oklahoma City police department, through his family,

1712
01:49:17,600 --> 01:49:21,439
through his ex wife, and he chose to withhold some

1713
01:49:21,520 --> 01:49:23,800
of the storyline because he was in fear of for

1714
01:49:23,880 --> 01:49:26,439
his family and his wife and his two young daughters

1715
01:49:26,439 --> 01:49:30,079
at the time. What we found out between the hours

1716
01:49:30,079 --> 01:49:33,399
of eight am and one pm that morning, he was

1717
01:49:33,439 --> 01:49:36,399
brutally murdered a mile and a half from the front

1718
01:49:36,399 --> 01:49:41,439
gate of the Areno Penitentiary. From that moment that his

1719
01:49:41,479 --> 01:49:43,720
body was found, we know that the crime scene was

1720
01:49:43,760 --> 01:49:46,600
destroyed and there were space shovels that were used to

1721
01:49:46,600 --> 01:49:49,840
turn over the crime scene, ballistics in a gunpowdered residue.

1722
01:49:49,880 --> 01:49:52,800
Speaker 28: Anything that had to do with his death was completely destroyed.

1723
01:49:52,800 --> 01:49:53,399
Speaker 4: It was corrupted.

1724
01:49:53,479 --> 01:49:56,199
Speaker 13: He started having problems with it, not only at work,

1725
01:49:56,399 --> 01:49:59,319
but his apartment got broke into, his car, got broke into,

1726
01:49:59,479 --> 01:50:03,399
things holding out of his house. He had accumulated reports

1727
01:50:03,399 --> 01:50:05,720
of evidence. I don't know all, but he was going

1728
01:50:05,760 --> 01:50:08,479
to take it out to a mini storage in a

1729
01:50:08,600 --> 01:50:14,479
reno and he left one night and he told a

1730
01:50:14,520 --> 01:50:16,600
friend of his that they were going to go out

1731
01:50:16,600 --> 01:50:17,880
to dinner, and he says, I got to run out

1732
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:20,399
and put some stuff in many storage and as soon

1733
01:50:20,399 --> 01:50:22,680
as I tell I shake these feeds that are following me.

1734
01:50:23,439 --> 01:50:24,840
Speaker 4: I'll be back and we'll go to dinner.

1735
01:50:25,479 --> 01:50:26,439
Speaker 7: Well, he never came back.

1736
01:50:27,119 --> 01:50:29,319
Speaker 13: Instead, he was found the next day by a Canadian

1737
01:50:29,359 --> 01:50:32,239
county sheriff's deputy. Well, they found his car first, and

1738
01:50:32,279 --> 01:50:35,479
then they found him in a field near the Areno Penitentiary.

1739
01:50:36,520 --> 01:50:40,439
The damage to his body was obviously a torture homicide.

1740
01:50:41,359 --> 01:50:42,039
Speaker 4: It was obvious.

1741
01:50:42,800 --> 01:50:45,960
Speaker 13: But what intrigued me the most that he had several

1742
01:50:46,039 --> 01:50:49,720
cuts on both of his wrists, inside both elbows, both

1743
01:50:49,840 --> 01:50:50,720
jugular veins.

1744
01:50:51,520 --> 01:50:52,239
Speaker 7: He'd been beaten.

1745
01:50:53,520 --> 01:50:56,520
Speaker 13: He had ligature marks around his neck, he had handcuffed

1746
01:50:56,560 --> 01:51:00,520
marks on his hands, on his wrists, and he had a.

1747
01:51:00,479 --> 01:51:01,760
Speaker 3: Small caliber.

1748
01:51:03,319 --> 01:51:05,760
Speaker 6: Bullet wound that started above.

1749
01:51:05,800 --> 01:51:09,279
Speaker 13: On the right hand side of his temple and exited

1750
01:51:09,520 --> 01:51:12,720
low on his cheek with no powder brush.

1751
01:51:13,840 --> 01:51:16,720
Speaker 26: The day of his death, when my daughter called me,

1752
01:51:16,920 --> 01:51:21,520
I left work went to El Reno to help because

1753
01:51:21,560 --> 01:51:26,119
I could hear the seriousness in her voice that she

1754
01:51:26,239 --> 01:51:29,399
was getting upset. Why would the police be calling her

1755
01:51:29,520 --> 01:51:32,840
looking for Terrence? And when we went to the apartment

1756
01:51:33,119 --> 01:51:38,239
where he lived, the manager there stated to us, well,

1757
01:51:38,319 --> 01:51:40,479
why are you looking for him? The police have already

1758
01:51:40,520 --> 01:51:45,479
been here and taken his cruiser. I'm not sure what

1759
01:51:45,560 --> 01:51:49,039
was going on. It was strange, and about ten o'clock

1760
01:51:49,079 --> 01:51:55,119
at night, I had put my grandkids to bed, the

1761
01:51:55,159 --> 01:51:58,600
phone rang, and when I picked the phone up, I

1762
01:51:58,600 --> 01:52:03,359
could hear my daughter screaming in the background, and I

1763
01:52:03,439 --> 01:52:07,079
assume something bad had happened, but I didn't think death.

1764
01:52:08,600 --> 01:52:11,039
And my son said, Mom, they found Terry.

1765
01:52:11,359 --> 01:52:11,880
Speaker 6: He's dead.

1766
01:52:13,720 --> 01:52:16,399
Speaker 20: One of the things that surprised me was that there

1767
01:52:16,439 --> 01:52:20,319
was no autopsy performed. The other thing that really bothered

1768
01:52:20,359 --> 01:52:22,359
me was we were being told that Terry was high

1769
01:52:22,399 --> 01:52:27,239
on drugs and drunk, and of course, the Medical Exemitior's

1770
01:52:27,239 --> 01:52:32,319
office did a report on Terry and his injuries, which

1771
01:52:32,359 --> 01:52:36,760
was really not an autopsy but just an overview, and

1772
01:52:38,000 --> 01:52:43,319
it showed that his BAC was zero, meaning no blood

1773
01:52:43,359 --> 01:52:46,880
alcohol content. There was no drugs in his system. It

1774
01:52:46,960 --> 01:52:51,159
bothered me that they didn't treat Terry like place officer

1775
01:52:51,279 --> 01:52:54,960
like it was. He was a good.

1776
01:52:54,720 --> 01:52:58,880
Speaker 26: Guy and he never said to us that I'm depressed,

1777
01:53:01,159 --> 01:53:06,840
you know, I need help, not to me or not.

1778
01:53:06,720 --> 01:53:07,960
Speaker 17: To his sisters.

1779
01:53:08,279 --> 01:53:12,119
Speaker 26: I think it's only fair that we know, as Terence's

1780
01:53:12,199 --> 01:53:14,319
family members, what happened.

1781
01:53:14,880 --> 01:53:19,359
Speaker 19: Officer Yicki's official cause of death was suicide, and that

1782
01:53:19,479 --> 01:53:22,079
was actually laid out in the medical examiner's report at

1783
01:53:22,119 --> 01:53:25,920
the Oklahoma State Medical Office Examiner's office. We've since we

1784
01:53:26,000 --> 01:53:29,960
were able to retrieve that record. What we found out though,

1785
01:53:30,079 --> 01:53:32,960
is that number one, the crime scene was corrupted, went

1786
01:53:33,560 --> 01:53:38,039
completely in the face of a proper investigative procedure. The

1787
01:53:38,119 --> 01:53:41,439
extent and the amount of the number of wounds on

1788
01:53:41,479 --> 01:53:46,039
his body clearly shows that he couldn't commit suicide physically

1789
01:53:46,119 --> 01:53:48,800
and logistically. You just can't do that to yourself.

1790
01:53:49,239 --> 01:53:50,600
Speaker 28: Terry also, we knew was an emic.

1791
01:53:51,279 --> 01:53:53,319
Speaker 19: He would not have been able to traverse over half

1792
01:53:53,319 --> 01:53:55,760
a mile from where his car was to where his

1793
01:53:55,800 --> 01:53:58,439
body was found and not have passed out. His heart

1794
01:53:58,439 --> 01:54:01,239
would have literally given out enough blood pressure in his

1795
01:54:01,319 --> 01:54:02,199
body to survive.

1796
01:54:03,640 --> 01:54:05,359
Speaker 28: The car was locked.

1797
01:54:05,319 --> 01:54:07,640
Speaker 19: The winds worled up, the keys were in the console,

1798
01:54:08,319 --> 01:54:11,800
there was a bloody knife and in the glovebox. You

1799
01:54:11,800 --> 01:54:15,640
don't stay yourself thirteen times and have superficial wounds on

1800
01:54:15,720 --> 01:54:18,840
the along your arms and chest and your upper neck

1801
01:54:19,399 --> 01:54:21,920
and walk a half a mile and decide to die

1802
01:54:22,039 --> 01:54:22,880
next to a tree.

1803
01:54:23,479 --> 01:54:30,279
Speaker 26: Being the family of an officer, I expected some kind

1804
01:54:30,279 --> 01:54:36,279
of care and consideration for us being the family of Terrence.

1805
01:54:36,880 --> 01:54:40,960
There was another detective by the name of Mullanex that

1806
01:54:42,039 --> 01:54:44,880
told my daughter that she looked at too many movies

1807
01:54:45,000 --> 01:54:47,920
and she needed to see a psychiatrist. When we were

1808
01:54:47,960 --> 01:54:53,399
asking questions, wanting to know about his belongings, wanting to

1809
01:54:53,439 --> 01:54:56,880
know about things that happened doing this the course of

1810
01:54:57,039 --> 01:55:02,159
where they say they found my son, and I don't

1811
01:55:02,159 --> 01:55:05,479
think this was very kind of them and considerate of

1812
01:55:05,600 --> 01:55:09,560
us being family, that they should have talked to us

1813
01:55:09,600 --> 01:55:15,680
like that, But they did, and as far as I'm concerned,

1814
01:55:15,960 --> 01:55:18,760
that made me more suspicious of what happened to my son.

1815
01:55:20,119 --> 01:55:23,159
Speaker 19: The brutal torture and murder of Terry Yekey served not

1816
01:55:23,239 --> 01:55:26,079
only to silence his voice, but the voices of other

1817
01:55:26,119 --> 01:55:28,760
first responders who may have seen something that would shed

1818
01:55:28,840 --> 01:55:32,800
light on what really happened. Those who keep their silence

1819
01:55:33,159 --> 01:55:36,159
know exactly what Terry saw. That you will never be

1820
01:55:36,199 --> 01:55:49,640
forgotten by those who ask questions and demand answers. In

1821
01:55:49,680 --> 01:55:53,399
the absence of official action, a group of concerned citizens

1822
01:55:53,399 --> 01:55:58,119
decided to form their own investigative panel, the OKBIC, better

1823
01:55:58,199 --> 01:56:03,039
known as the Oklahoma Bombing Investstigation Committee. Their goal was

1824
01:56:03,079 --> 01:56:05,760
to compile enough evidence that would attract attention by the

1825
01:56:05,800 --> 01:56:09,920
media and the government and therefore compel a more thorough investigation.

1826
01:56:11,239 --> 01:56:15,159
Entirely funded by donations and their own money, the OKBIC

1827
01:56:15,399 --> 01:56:20,279
took Affidavid's recorded eyewitness testimony and paid for private investigators

1828
01:56:20,319 --> 01:56:22,039
to chase down leads.

1829
01:56:22,319 --> 01:56:26,359
Speaker 23: I'm Charles Key, state Representative in Oklahoma City, and I

1830
01:56:26,439 --> 01:56:29,600
formed the Oklahoma Bombing Investigation Committee. I had a number

1831
01:56:29,640 --> 01:56:33,840
of constituents come to me and other people that started

1832
01:56:34,520 --> 01:56:39,560
raising their own questions about the investigation, what direction it

1833
01:56:39,600 --> 01:56:42,520
was going, because it seemed like there was an effort

1834
01:56:42,600 --> 01:56:47,800
to try to change that initial report of what took

1835
01:56:47,880 --> 01:56:49,840
place on the first day of the bombing. As the

1836
01:56:49,920 --> 01:56:50,880
days and weeks.

1837
01:56:50,600 --> 01:56:53,479
Speaker 27: Went by, we look at what state Representative Charles Key did.

1838
01:56:53,680 --> 01:56:56,239
He went on the facts, He went on the information

1839
01:56:56,319 --> 01:57:00,000
the grand jury gleaned, and clearly there was complete prior knowledge.

1840
01:57:00,359 --> 01:57:06,359
Speaker 23: I observed the fact that Charles Key seemed to be

1841
01:57:08,520 --> 01:57:11,880
standing up for the truth in some areas that I

1842
01:57:11,920 --> 01:57:16,800
felt like was not being dealt with appropriately by authorities.

1843
01:57:17,239 --> 01:57:20,960
The Oklahoma Bombing Investigations Committee was formed for one purpose,

1844
01:57:20,960 --> 01:57:22,119
and that's to obtain the truth.

1845
01:57:22,640 --> 01:57:25,039
Speaker 30: First, I thought let's just an know, the politician trying

1846
01:57:25,039 --> 01:57:30,399
to get a little publicity. Then when I met them,

1847
01:57:31,079 --> 01:57:37,960
met Charles Key and Colonel Wallace and They'll Phillips found

1848
01:57:37,960 --> 01:57:41,760
out that they were for real, and they asked me

1849
01:57:41,800 --> 01:57:45,239
if I would join them, and I agreed to join them.

1850
01:57:45,680 --> 01:57:49,199
Speaker 19: I think Charles Key's work is absolutely outstanding, and it

1851
01:57:49,239 --> 01:57:51,840
continues to be even to this day. We're looking at

1852
01:57:51,880 --> 01:57:54,520
what sixteen years on, almost coming this April.

1853
01:57:54,920 --> 01:57:55,800
Speaker 28: Charles took a lot.

1854
01:57:55,640 --> 01:57:58,640
Speaker 23: Of risks when we saw what was going on with

1855
01:57:58,720 --> 01:58:02,319
the investigation and that it was trying to move away

1856
01:58:02,399 --> 01:58:05,920
from the early facts that were presented by law enforcement

1857
01:58:06,000 --> 01:58:06,640
by the media.

1858
01:58:07,640 --> 01:58:09,720
Speaker 4: We pursued establishing a.

1859
01:58:09,640 --> 01:58:13,479
Speaker 23: County grand jury in Oklahoma County, something unique to Oklahoma

1860
01:58:13,520 --> 01:58:16,319
in just a few other states in the country that

1861
01:58:16,399 --> 01:58:20,800
allows citizens grand juries to be impaneled to investigate things

1862
01:58:20,840 --> 01:58:23,680
such as this. The committee meetings were.

1863
01:58:24,960 --> 01:58:25,640
Speaker 4: Very serious.

1864
01:58:26,439 --> 01:58:29,920
Speaker 23: We fought the government at every level, all the way

1865
01:58:30,039 --> 01:58:33,039
through to the Supreme Court of the state.

1866
01:58:33,600 --> 01:58:35,560
Speaker 30: We had a lot of people that came forward and

1867
01:58:35,640 --> 01:58:37,520
brought us a lot of information that we wouldn't have

1868
01:58:37,560 --> 01:58:38,439
gotten any other way.

1869
01:58:38,840 --> 01:58:40,560
Speaker 4: We were pursuing.

1870
01:58:40,840 --> 01:58:43,760
Speaker 30: All the information that we could get our hands on

1871
01:58:44,039 --> 01:58:46,439
about the bombing, and we were trying to get a

1872
01:58:46,479 --> 01:58:48,399
congressional investigation of the bombing.

1873
01:58:49,039 --> 01:58:51,159
Speaker 19: I was in awe at the amount of effort that

1874
01:58:51,199 --> 01:58:52,720
they put in in that first six and a half

1875
01:58:52,800 --> 01:58:54,800
years before the book was released, and then they have

1876
01:58:54,880 --> 01:58:57,520
the book released come out to the general public three

1877
01:58:57,560 --> 01:59:01,520
weeks before nine to eleven, recrued every single obstacle that

1878
01:59:01,600 --> 01:59:03,319
was thrown in their face from all the way from

1879
01:59:03,359 --> 01:59:09,800
the news media to financial to emotional and interviewing over

1880
01:59:09,800 --> 01:59:12,479
three hundred twenty nine victims, family members and survivors, and

1881
01:59:12,560 --> 01:59:16,399
these people were consistently basically saying, I am not going

1882
01:59:16,439 --> 01:59:17,600
to fail. I'm not going to quit.

1883
01:59:17,720 --> 01:59:19,119
Speaker 28: I want the truth to come out on this.

1884
01:59:19,880 --> 01:59:23,479
Speaker 23: So we formed the Oklahoma County Grand Jury to have

1885
01:59:24,119 --> 01:59:30,960
essentially a citizen's investigation into the Oklahoma bombing, and that

1886
01:59:31,439 --> 01:59:34,359
caused us to have to get together a number of

1887
01:59:34,399 --> 01:59:37,800
signatures from citizens of Oklahoma County, which we did. We

1888
01:59:37,880 --> 01:59:41,000
got I don't know eleven twelve thousand signatures we only

1889
01:59:41,039 --> 01:59:46,479
were required five thousand, and by getting all those signatures,

1890
01:59:46,479 --> 01:59:48,640
getting a validated and everything that we then got an

1891
01:59:48,800 --> 01:59:51,359
x amount of money, a lot of money, and the

1892
01:59:51,479 --> 01:59:53,600
opportunity to set up a grand jury. Well, they turned

1893
01:59:53,600 --> 01:59:58,479
the grand jury over to our enemy, which was Bob Macy,

1894
02:00:00,239 --> 02:00:02,800
and basically gave him the money, and then he proceeded

1895
02:00:02,800 --> 02:00:03,880
to investigate us.

1896
02:00:04,199 --> 02:00:08,720
Speaker 29: I wrote a letter to the District Attorney Masey told

1897
02:00:08,800 --> 02:00:11,600
him what I had seen and that I wanted to

1898
02:00:11,640 --> 02:00:14,920
testify in the grand jury. I got a letter back

1899
02:00:14,920 --> 02:00:18,039
from him telling me that the grand jury did not

1900
02:00:18,199 --> 02:00:21,079
want to hear anything I had to say about the bombing.

1901
02:00:21,520 --> 02:00:27,399
Speaker 23: After the Oklahoma County grand jury was actually initially formed,

1902
02:00:28,239 --> 02:00:30,199
then there were some efforts to try to stop that

1903
02:00:31,199 --> 02:00:34,760
by the Oklahoma County DA and others, And at that

1904
02:00:34,920 --> 02:00:40,159
time we organized ourselves in a more formal way. We

1905
02:00:40,239 --> 02:00:44,239
hired private investigators and some others to help us put

1906
02:00:44,279 --> 02:00:47,760
the information that we had gathered together in a form

1907
02:00:47,880 --> 02:00:50,479
that we could present to that county grand jury.

1908
02:00:51,199 --> 02:00:55,800
Speaker 30: Four or five six months into the investigation, we started

1909
02:00:57,720 --> 02:01:03,439
respecting that our phones were tapped, and I don't remember

1910
02:01:03,479 --> 02:01:06,239
how we got the information there. We were given a number

1911
02:01:06,279 --> 02:01:10,680
that we could dial and it would either confirm her doors.

1912
02:01:10,720 --> 02:01:15,159
After that they weren't, and we dial this number, it

1913
02:01:15,199 --> 02:01:17,680
would confirm it. We didn't really have anything to hide,

1914
02:01:17,840 --> 02:01:20,079
so it didn't really make that much difference. It didn't

1915
02:01:20,439 --> 02:01:22,279
affect our investigation too much.

1916
02:01:22,479 --> 02:01:25,960
Speaker 23: I think as we finalized our work, as we got

1917
02:01:25,960 --> 02:01:28,159
to the end, as that grand jury was impaneled, and

1918
02:01:28,199 --> 02:01:32,119
as we put this report together, we had a lot

1919
02:01:32,159 --> 02:01:34,560
of media that was waiting for this report. They were

1920
02:01:34,560 --> 02:01:38,039
ready to give it some significant coverage. And our report

1921
02:01:38,159 --> 02:01:42,880
came back from the book publisher about two weeks before

1922
02:01:43,000 --> 02:01:45,680
nine to eleven. And one of the things that we

1923
02:01:45,760 --> 02:01:49,800
said and some others said during that timeframe, as before

1924
02:01:49,920 --> 02:01:52,640
and after nine eleven, that the reason that we did

1925
02:01:52,680 --> 02:01:55,319
this is because if you don't ask the questions and

1926
02:01:55,359 --> 02:01:59,359
you don't hold government accountable in everything that it does,

1927
02:01:59,560 --> 02:02:03,560
not just bombings like this, but everything, then you'll have

1928
02:02:03,680 --> 02:02:06,319
the same mistakes happen again, and they will get worse

1929
02:02:06,359 --> 02:02:07,239
as time goes on.

1930
02:02:14,239 --> 02:02:16,960
Speaker 19: The official story dictated that the rider truck packed with

1931
02:02:17,000 --> 02:02:20,279
twelve hundred pounds of ammonium nitrate fertilizer and fuel oil

1932
02:02:20,399 --> 02:02:23,600
called ANFO, detonated on the north east side of the

1933
02:02:23,600 --> 02:02:27,720
building and was responsible for all the damage. That hypothesis

1934
02:02:27,760 --> 02:02:30,920
later evolved into forty eight hundred pounds of ANFO, then

1935
02:02:31,000 --> 02:02:34,439
up to seven thousand pounds of fertilizer and nitromethane.

1936
02:02:35,560 --> 02:02:36,159
Speaker 28: In fact, the.

1937
02:02:36,119 --> 02:02:41,039
Speaker 19: Only consistent theme of the official narrative is it's inconsistency.

1938
02:02:41,239 --> 02:02:43,800
Speaker 4: The truck bomb just delivers an air blast.

1939
02:02:44,039 --> 02:02:46,600
Speaker 23: That's all it does. Is called an air blast. When

1940
02:02:46,600 --> 02:02:51,960
you've got eight foot thick columns of concrete filled with

1941
02:02:52,079 --> 02:02:58,279
rebar the size of your arm, an air blast probably

1942
02:02:58,319 --> 02:03:03,319
won't even even break one a break windows, that's about it.

1943
02:03:03,560 --> 02:03:08,520
But some of these columns were ripped up, shredded, tossed around.

1944
02:03:09,199 --> 02:03:14,760
Speaker 2: Because the truck bomb is going to release its energy

1945
02:03:15,600 --> 02:03:23,199
simultaneously in every direction. And so the damage pattern to

1946
02:03:23,279 --> 02:03:26,119
the building or whatever structure it's parked in front of

1947
02:03:26,199 --> 02:03:28,159
and intended to blow up, if it's a big enough,

1948
02:03:28,159 --> 02:03:30,399
big structure, bigger than the truck bomb can take out,

1949
02:03:30,800 --> 02:03:33,680
the damage pattern is going to be roughly a semicircle.

1950
02:03:34,560 --> 02:03:36,600
Speaker 13: Now I looked at the building. I was on a

1951
02:03:36,640 --> 02:03:38,960
bomb squad for a couple of years. I've worked some bombings,

1952
02:03:39,520 --> 02:03:41,199
and I looked at the building and I knew that

1953
02:03:41,239 --> 02:03:44,640
the damage done to that building couldn't have come from

1954
02:03:44,640 --> 02:03:47,159
a truck within foind it.

1955
02:03:46,560 --> 02:03:53,479
Speaker 20: A blasts not termed corners, and it did look like

1956
02:03:53,560 --> 02:03:57,880
that there is secondary explosion or more intense explosion corners

1957
02:04:00,079 --> 02:04:04,760
east side of the building. Explosure that portion of the

1958
02:04:04,760 --> 02:04:09,239
explosion did basically clear everything from the front of the

1959
02:04:09,239 --> 02:04:10,960
building to the south wall.

1960
02:04:11,760 --> 02:04:15,439
Speaker 19: The Oklahoma Bombing Investigation Committee was presented with evidence that

1961
02:04:15,520 --> 02:04:19,680
explosives planted inside the building were responsible for the collapse

1962
02:04:19,680 --> 02:04:22,960
and most of the casualties. In this rarely seen footage

1963
02:04:22,960 --> 02:04:26,279
taken by the Oklahoma County Sheriff's Office minutes after the bombing,

1964
02:04:26,720 --> 02:04:29,359
the north side parking lot has shown littered with paper

1965
02:04:29,399 --> 02:04:32,520
and debris from inside the mirror building. How did this

1966
02:04:32,640 --> 02:04:35,680
volume of paper transport itself against the blast wave of

1967
02:04:35,720 --> 02:04:38,520
the truck bomb and magically appear on the other side

1968
02:04:38,520 --> 02:04:39,000
of the street.

1969
02:04:40,439 --> 02:04:42,680
Speaker 27: And then we look at the fact that you have

1970
02:04:42,800 --> 02:04:45,720
bombs clearly inside the building. It's blown out across the street,

1971
02:04:45,760 --> 02:04:49,159
pieces of it on top of buildings the opposite direction

1972
02:04:49,319 --> 02:04:52,800
that the rebel should have gone in. There was truly

1973
02:04:52,840 --> 02:04:55,560
this high powered truck bomb out front that caused all

1974
02:04:55,560 --> 02:04:56,239
the damage.

1975
02:04:56,520 --> 02:04:58,279
Speaker 2: And I can tell you that the building was blown

1976
02:04:58,319 --> 02:05:00,560
from the inside because all the deri he was piled

1977
02:05:00,640 --> 02:05:03,840
up against the General Record building clear across the parking lot.

1978
02:05:04,199 --> 02:05:07,319
Speaker 19: In fact, several witnesses report that bombs were going off

1979
02:05:07,359 --> 02:05:10,079
in the building before the truck bomb exploded outside.

1980
02:05:10,319 --> 02:05:13,439
Speaker 30: The first thing that I experienced I was setting there

1981
02:05:13,720 --> 02:05:16,880
signings and papers for Ruth. I felt the building start

1982
02:05:16,920 --> 02:05:21,039
shaking and never had anything like that happened before. And

1983
02:05:21,079 --> 02:05:24,840
I just kind of froze, and then the lights went out.

1984
02:05:24,920 --> 02:05:26,119
Speaker 4: It didn't get totally.

1985
02:05:25,880 --> 02:05:29,239
Speaker 30: Dark because the whole front of the building was glass.

1986
02:05:29,880 --> 02:05:33,159
The lights went out, and then the debris started falling

1987
02:05:33,199 --> 02:05:37,159
on my desk and then something hit me in the

1988
02:05:37,159 --> 02:05:39,520
back of the head and knocked me out before the

1989
02:05:39,560 --> 02:05:42,199
truck mom went off. What that tells you is that

1990
02:05:42,199 --> 02:05:44,840
there were other explosive devices in the building that actually

1991
02:05:44,880 --> 02:05:45,840
brought the building down.

1992
02:05:46,520 --> 02:05:52,800
Speaker 29: The building started to sway back and forth. It was

1993
02:05:52,880 --> 02:05:56,000
going back and forth, and I had sat there and

1994
02:05:56,199 --> 02:06:00,119
I thought, no, it doesn't feel like an earthquake. And

1995
02:06:00,399 --> 02:06:02,159
I was, you know, I was kind of stunned. And

1996
02:06:02,199 --> 02:06:08,479
then about seven or eight seconds later, Uh, I felt

1997
02:06:08,760 --> 02:06:15,239
this explosion and you could feel, actually feel the concrete

1998
02:06:15,600 --> 02:06:19,399
floor actually rising from underneath you. You could feel it

1999
02:06:19,439 --> 02:06:21,479
coming up from the inside.

2000
02:06:22,359 --> 02:06:23,359
Speaker 3: It was like slow motion.

2001
02:06:23,520 --> 02:06:26,600
Speaker 43: We crawled under before the glasstart was coming and everything

2002
02:06:26,640 --> 02:06:26,880
to just.

2003
02:06:27,000 --> 02:06:30,119
Speaker 7: Do we just see the fem to roll in on us.

2004
02:06:30,840 --> 02:06:33,840
Speaker 43: I thought it was an earthquake when it started. It

2005
02:06:34,000 --> 02:06:36,520
was just a kind of a shake, and then everything

2006
02:06:36,600 --> 02:06:38,840
started going like this, and I thought, I move under

2007
02:06:38,880 --> 02:06:40,520
the desk, and then all the glass came in and

2008
02:06:40,520 --> 02:06:41,560
the ceilings came down.

2009
02:06:43,199 --> 02:06:46,399
Speaker 19: Three seismic grafts at the University of Oklahoma, the Omniplex

2010
02:06:46,399 --> 02:06:50,000
Science Museum, and in Franklin, Oklahoma, recorded a seismic event

2011
02:06:50,079 --> 02:06:53,319
lasting eight to ten seconds that suggests the possibility of

2012
02:06:53,359 --> 02:06:57,119
two blasts. There were two energetic spikes. One was the

2013
02:06:57,159 --> 02:06:59,760
truck bomb, and the second spike was explained away as

2014
02:06:59,800 --> 02:07:02,600
there blast pushing on the ground or falling to breed,

2015
02:07:03,239 --> 02:07:06,600
But a representative of the Oklahoma Geological Survey stated for

2016
02:07:06,640 --> 02:07:09,319
the record that this spike was not the result of

2017
02:07:09,319 --> 02:07:12,239
floors collapsing and that the last five seconds of ground

2018
02:07:12,319 --> 02:07:22,279
motion did not have air blast associated with it. The

2019
02:07:22,359 --> 02:07:25,359
Kobar Towers bombing in nineteen ninety six and Saudi Arabia

2020
02:07:25,479 --> 02:07:29,119
killed nineteen US airmen. That bomb was several times larger

2021
02:07:29,159 --> 02:07:31,399
than the bomb supposed to have been used in Oklahoma.

2022
02:07:32,000 --> 02:07:34,560
It left a huge eighty five foot crater, yet there

2023
02:07:34,600 --> 02:07:37,239
was no major structural damage on this simple slab building.

2024
02:07:38,640 --> 02:07:41,680
What happened in Oklahoma City to cause the major horizontal

2025
02:07:41,680 --> 02:07:44,520
support beam to fail and the complete failure of these

2026
02:07:44,560 --> 02:07:46,840
two series of columns on the east side of the building.

2027
02:07:47,640 --> 02:07:51,520
This collapse was responsible for most of the casualties. The crater,

2028
02:07:51,840 --> 02:07:54,920
when seen from above, is offset from the major structural

2029
02:07:54,960 --> 02:07:58,399
damage in the building. For some reason, the official story

2030
02:07:58,479 --> 02:08:00,119
has inflated the size of this crater.

2031
02:08:02,520 --> 02:08:05,760
Speaker 20: The bomb, at least I've seen where the report from

2032
02:08:05,800 --> 02:08:09,119
the different agencies have said the bomb extended from the

2033
02:08:09,159 --> 02:08:11,920
cab to the tail of the truck. And one of

2034
02:08:12,000 --> 02:08:15,560
the thing that really bothers me about that is is

2035
02:08:15,600 --> 02:08:19,560
the rear axle from the truck went down and collided

2036
02:08:19,600 --> 02:08:21,600
with the car and from the Regency Tower about a

2037
02:08:21,600 --> 02:08:24,720
block and a half away. The front axle of the

2038
02:08:24,760 --> 02:08:31,479
truck was hurled eastbound and struggled a parking meter about

2039
02:08:31,479 --> 02:08:32,600
a block and a half way in front of the

2040
02:08:32,640 --> 02:08:35,520
w a mc abailing. The bomb was that big that

2041
02:08:35,520 --> 02:08:38,640
the rear axle would have been driven into the crater

2042
02:08:39,920 --> 02:08:43,439
and instead of being with the party as they were,

2043
02:08:43,840 --> 02:08:47,600
and the truck bomb itself, to me, had to be

2044
02:08:47,600 --> 02:08:51,319
between the two axles. It could not have been over

2045
02:08:51,439 --> 02:08:52,239
that rear axle.

2046
02:08:52,800 --> 02:08:56,159
Speaker 21: A surprise from the even the Female report and the

2047
02:08:56,159 --> 02:08:59,920
published reports that nobody could determine what the size of

2048
02:08:59,920 --> 02:09:01,720
the crater was. And that's one of the things I

2049
02:09:01,760 --> 02:09:04,800
brought up at the grand jury investigation, is that the

2050
02:09:04,920 --> 02:09:08,479
criter was half the size that they had proposed in

2051
02:09:08,520 --> 02:09:11,960
the FAMA report. The crater had a five gallon bucket

2052
02:09:12,000 --> 02:09:15,399
setting next to it after they had uncovered, and you

2053
02:09:15,399 --> 02:09:17,800
could extrapolate from the size of that bucket to the

2054
02:09:17,800 --> 02:09:19,399
size of the hole as to what size of the

2055
02:09:19,439 --> 02:09:22,279
crater was, and there was approximately sixteen feet across.

2056
02:09:23,560 --> 02:09:26,399
Speaker 19: August twenty four in nineteen seventy. It was a Monday morning.

2057
02:09:26,600 --> 02:09:30,520
Carlton Armstrong, his brother Dwight, and two other perpetrators, Leobert

2058
02:09:30,800 --> 02:09:34,520
and what an individual drove up to the side of

2059
02:09:34,560 --> 02:09:37,840
the Sterling Hall. It was a math research building. Diw

2060
02:09:37,920 --> 02:09:40,520
Chemical had their offices there. It was federal government as

2061
02:09:40,520 --> 02:09:45,279
well as the university faculty that worked there, and they

2062
02:09:46,239 --> 02:09:49,479
drove a forty knoline van stolen from a math professor,

2063
02:09:50,000 --> 02:09:53,960
laden with four metal drums, fifty gallon drums full of

2064
02:09:53,960 --> 02:09:56,920
ammonium nitrate and fuel oil. The Sterling Hall bombing consisted

2065
02:09:56,960 --> 02:09:59,359
of two thousand pounds of ANFO and it was set

2066
02:09:59,359 --> 02:10:01,760
off right next to to the building. The windows were

2067
02:10:01,760 --> 02:10:04,560
blown in, the facade was damaged, but there was no

2068
02:10:04,600 --> 02:10:08,319
structural damage. In fact, the Army math lab was closed

2069
02:10:08,319 --> 02:10:11,840
for only one day. In Oklahoma City, a similar ANFO

2070
02:10:11,920 --> 02:10:15,079
bomb detonated fifteen feet away from a much more robust

2071
02:10:15,079 --> 02:10:20,600
structure and inflicted massive structural damage. What that case did

2072
02:10:20,720 --> 02:10:22,000
was it said it was a bill weather.

2073
02:10:22,119 --> 02:10:24,319
Speaker 28: It set a standard for us to look at. Us says, Okay,

2074
02:10:24,359 --> 02:10:25,159
If ANFO.

2075
02:10:24,920 --> 02:10:27,479
Speaker 19: Was in fact used in Oklahoma City, why did it

2076
02:10:27,560 --> 02:10:30,880
not have the characteristics that would occurred in Madison. Furthermore,

2077
02:10:31,079 --> 02:10:35,279
the signature of an ANFO explosion is nitric oxide innoxious gas.

2078
02:10:36,159 --> 02:10:37,920
Speaker 6: There was certainly no fertilizer bomb.

2079
02:10:37,920 --> 02:10:40,319
Speaker 2: We know that because there was no ammonia gas in

2080
02:10:40,319 --> 02:10:44,920
the air in every other explosion. They and some students

2081
02:10:44,920 --> 02:10:47,560
blew up and did macan ammonium that great bomb, But

2082
02:10:47,680 --> 02:10:50,279
everybody who rested that build and left explosion had.

2083
02:10:50,159 --> 02:10:51,199
Speaker 6: To be hospitalized.

2084
02:10:51,880 --> 02:10:56,039
Speaker 2: If you ever smelled ammonia strongly, and youre talking about

2085
02:10:56,079 --> 02:10:57,640
going into a heart trait or something like that, that's

2086
02:10:57,680 --> 02:11:00,000
not strong, but that'll gag you.

2087
02:11:00,159 --> 02:11:01,199
Speaker 6: It will sere your lungs.

2088
02:11:01,239 --> 02:11:04,560
Speaker 2: I mean, everybody that smelled that ammonia gas after the

2089
02:11:04,600 --> 02:11:07,640
ammonium not trade bomb at that university had to be hospitalized.

2090
02:11:08,640 --> 02:11:10,560
It would have been thirty minutes or an hour, depending

2091
02:11:10,560 --> 02:11:12,720
on how hard to winness one before anybody could have

2092
02:11:12,760 --> 02:11:14,319
even approached the Murrah building.

2093
02:11:15,079 --> 02:11:16,960
Speaker 6: If there had been an ammonium not treating bomb.

2094
02:11:17,800 --> 02:11:20,119
Speaker 19: There were other search and rescue personnel that were down

2095
02:11:20,159 --> 02:11:23,319
there immediately from Saint Anthony's Hospital in nearby, as well

2096
02:11:23,359 --> 02:11:28,239
as office employees from this running offices. They would have

2097
02:11:28,840 --> 02:11:32,520
approached the crime scene and buckled over almost immediately, vomiting violently.

2098
02:11:32,600 --> 02:11:35,159
If there was ammonium nitrate gas, it wasn't.

2099
02:11:35,359 --> 02:11:38,439
Speaker 27: I was watching General part In, the former head of

2100
02:11:38,439 --> 02:11:41,600
Air Force Weapons Development, point out that the building was

2101
02:11:41,640 --> 02:11:45,199
blown out, that it wasn't the signature of an ammonium

2102
02:11:45,279 --> 02:11:48,039
nitrate fertilizer bomb, that there had been a cover up.

2103
02:11:48,560 --> 02:11:51,560
Speaker 19: The damaged Murror Building drew the attention of retired General

2104
02:11:51,600 --> 02:11:55,239
Benton K. Parton, former director of the Air Force Armament's Laboratory.

2105
02:11:55,840 --> 02:11:59,319
General Parton spent his career conducting bomb damage analysis with

2106
02:11:59,439 --> 02:12:03,560
explosives for the military. General Parton came to Oklahoma City,

2107
02:12:03,880 --> 02:12:07,399
examined the available evidence and rendered a conclusion far different

2108
02:12:07,439 --> 02:12:09,760
than the story being pandered by the government and media.

2109
02:12:12,119 --> 02:12:15,720
Speaker 48: I spent over thirty years in the Air Force. Most

2110
02:12:15,720 --> 02:12:17,680
of that was in research and development. I went to

2111
02:12:17,720 --> 02:12:21,760
a two year graduate program eight Horris or Armament Engineering graduates,

2112
02:12:21,800 --> 02:12:24,079
the first course that was ever set up, and after

2113
02:12:24,119 --> 02:12:26,960
that I worked at the Blissic Research Laboratories at Aberdeen,

2114
02:12:27,000 --> 02:12:30,800
which was two years of hands on work designing developing

2115
02:12:31,199 --> 02:12:34,880
continuous road warriors for the Bluemartin Listle and other weapons systems.

2116
02:12:35,760 --> 02:12:35,960
Speaker 35: Well.

2117
02:12:36,000 --> 02:12:40,359
Speaker 48: The truck bomb, even though it was fed and massive,

2118
02:12:40,399 --> 02:12:43,760
it was somewhat removed from some of the structures that

2119
02:12:43,800 --> 02:12:46,359
were damaged that he clearly has some what you call

2120
02:12:46,399 --> 02:12:50,840
Broussant's damage, where the blast pressure was a way above

2121
02:12:50,880 --> 02:12:52,600
what you would expect to get from the truck at

2122
02:12:52,640 --> 02:12:53,279
that distance.

2123
02:12:53,640 --> 02:12:56,720
Speaker 19: Bissance damage is that caused by an explosive whose blast

2124
02:12:56,760 --> 02:12:59,840
wave is powerful enough to shatter and destroy the material effected.

2125
02:13:00,359 --> 02:13:02,600
The problem with the failed columns at the Murror building

2126
02:13:02,920 --> 02:13:05,359
is at that distance the air blast from an ANFO

2127
02:13:05,439 --> 02:13:08,199
bomb would have been ten times less powerful than what

2128
02:13:08,319 --> 02:13:10,520
was needed to dissolve the concrete and cut the rebar.

2129
02:13:11,159 --> 02:13:14,159
Those columns, had they failed due to air blast, should

2130
02:13:14,159 --> 02:13:17,039
have broken with sharp chunks of concrete connected by rebar,

2131
02:13:17,520 --> 02:13:21,680
not shared off at critical points. Pissan's damage indicates contact

2132
02:13:21,720 --> 02:13:30,399
explosives placed directly on the beams. Even more perplexing is

2133
02:13:30,439 --> 02:13:33,039
the total collapse of column B three, which caused the

2134
02:13:33,079 --> 02:13:35,560
floors on the east side to pancake onto one another.

2135
02:13:36,039 --> 02:13:38,600
The building was gutted to within feet of the other side.

2136
02:13:39,000 --> 02:13:42,079
Column B four, closer to the truck bomb, is completely intact,

2137
02:13:42,600 --> 02:13:44,760
Yet we are supposed to believe that a blast wave

2138
02:13:44,800 --> 02:13:48,359
traveled through before leaving the sheet rock almost untouched and

2139
02:13:48,399 --> 02:13:51,840
completely destroyed. The column farther away, and most of the

2140
02:13:51,840 --> 02:13:54,720
front columns were destroyed when the supporting head or beam failed,

2141
02:13:55,199 --> 02:13:58,399
but the cause of failure, supposedly being air blast, should

2142
02:13:58,399 --> 02:14:01,720
have thrown it into the building. Instead, it fell straight

2143
02:14:01,760 --> 02:14:05,640
down and rolled towards the crater. General Parton's report was

2144
02:14:05,680 --> 02:14:09,079
conclusive the Murow Federal Building was not destroyed by one

2145
02:14:09,159 --> 02:14:12,640
sole truck bomb. The major factor in its destruction appears

2146
02:14:12,680 --> 02:14:15,840
to have been detonation of explosives carefully placed at four

2147
02:14:15,880 --> 02:14:23,760
critical junctures on supporting columns within the building. Many independent

2148
02:14:23,800 --> 02:14:27,079
experts concurred with the Parton report. Sam Cohen, inventor of

2149
02:14:27,079 --> 02:14:30,560
the neutron bomb, issued this statement, I believe that the

2150
02:14:30,560 --> 02:14:33,479
demolition charges in the building that were placed inside at

2151
02:14:33,520 --> 02:14:36,680
certain key concrete columns did the primary damage to the

2152
02:14:36,760 --> 02:14:40,479
Murrow Federal Building. It would have been absolutely impossible and

2153
02:14:40,600 --> 02:14:42,840
against the laws of nature for a truck full of

2154
02:14:42,840 --> 02:14:45,880
fertilizer and oil, no matter how much was used to

2155
02:14:45,920 --> 02:14:50,000
bring the building down. The FBI put all their weight

2156
02:14:50,039 --> 02:14:52,560
behind the lone bomber theory and tailored the evidence to

2157
02:14:52,560 --> 02:14:56,279
fit that scenario. Doctor Frederick Whitehurst, a supervisor at the

2158
02:14:56,359 --> 02:14:59,720
FBI Crime Lab, turned whistleblower over the bureau's handling of

2159
02:14:59,720 --> 02:15:02,800
the evidence in the Oklahoma City bombing, release a.

2160
02:15:02,760 --> 02:15:07,239
Speaker 15: Report today condemning the FBI Crime Lab for mishandling evidence

2161
02:15:07,279 --> 02:15:10,680
and for slanting its analysis. The report is expected to

2162
02:15:10,720 --> 02:15:14,119
specifically criticize the lab's handling of the Oklahoma City and

2163
02:15:14,199 --> 02:15:17,560
World Trade Center bombing cases. It was the allegations of

2164
02:15:17,720 --> 02:15:21,439
FBI whistleblower Frederick Whitehurst that sparked that investigation.

2165
02:15:22,159 --> 02:15:23,039
Speaker 28: Forced to resign.

2166
02:15:23,399 --> 02:15:26,760
Speaker 19: Doctor Whitehurst testified in Terry Nichols trial that a fellow

2167
02:15:26,840 --> 02:15:30,279
FBI chemist had changed his findings and light under oath

2168
02:15:30,319 --> 02:15:34,520
after meeting with federal prosecutors. The Office of the Inspector

2169
02:15:34,560 --> 02:15:39,199
General or OIG, investigated Whitehurst charges and issued a report

2170
02:15:39,199 --> 02:15:42,800
which concluded that the FBI crime Lab had improperly identified

2171
02:15:42,800 --> 02:15:45,760
the characteristics of anfo the weight of the bomb, the

2172
02:15:45,800 --> 02:15:48,960
detonation system, and even what kind of explosive was used.

2173
02:15:49,159 --> 02:15:51,199
Speaker 49: The Oklahoma City case will get a lot of attention

2174
02:15:51,319 --> 02:15:53,600
because what the Inspector General goes on to at some

2175
02:15:53,880 --> 02:15:57,439
length to say in his analysis of an agent testimony

2176
02:15:57,479 --> 02:16:00,079
in some of the pre trial stages is that one

2177
02:16:00,159 --> 02:16:03,079
agent in particular made sort of seat of the pants

2178
02:16:03,319 --> 02:16:06,399
estimates about the Oklahoma City bomb but then couched them

2179
02:16:06,439 --> 02:16:09,039
in his reports and his written reports as being the

2180
02:16:09,079 --> 02:16:10,560
result of scientific evidence.

2181
02:16:11,079 --> 02:16:13,960
Speaker 11: The FBI laboratories built itself for many many years as

2182
02:16:14,000 --> 02:16:14,960
the premiere.

2183
02:16:14,600 --> 02:16:16,119
Speaker 4: Forensic laboratory in the world.

2184
02:16:16,399 --> 02:16:18,600
Speaker 41: The people that did the things they did knew dogg

2185
02:16:18,680 --> 02:16:19,760
on well what they were doing.

2186
02:16:24,000 --> 02:16:26,920
Speaker 19: The Right Armament Laboratory at Egland Air Force Base conducted

2187
02:16:26,960 --> 02:16:29,760
a series of explosive tests to compare their data to

2188
02:16:29,840 --> 02:16:32,799
the bombing in Oklahoma. The Eggland test structure was a

2189
02:16:32,840 --> 02:16:36,399
simple three story concrete slab building with no support columns.

2190
02:16:36,920 --> 02:16:39,799
The engineers at Egland tried to recreate the truck bomb

2191
02:16:39,920 --> 02:16:42,879
as McVay and the FBI claimed. It was constructed with

2192
02:16:43,000 --> 02:16:46,000
four thousand pounds of anfo ACKed into a dozen barrels,

2193
02:16:46,479 --> 02:16:49,360
but they found that each barrel acted as a separate bomb,

2194
02:16:49,559 --> 02:16:52,680
canceling out the explosive force of each other and pushing

2195
02:16:52,719 --> 02:16:55,719
most of the blast upwards. So they constructed a single,

2196
02:16:55,760 --> 02:16:59,399
more powerful bomb and exploded it outside the target building

2197
02:16:59,639 --> 02:17:02,440
to test the effects of air blast. They found that

2198
02:17:02,520 --> 02:17:05,440
their weaker test structure suffered less damage from a more

2199
02:17:05,479 --> 02:17:11,280
powerful bomb than was supposedly used at Oklahoma City. The

2200
02:17:11,360 --> 02:17:14,200
report for the Right Laboratory at Egglin Air Force Base

2201
02:17:14,280 --> 02:17:17,840
concluded the damage at the Muraw Federal Building is not

2202
02:17:17,959 --> 02:17:20,920
the result of the truck bomb itself, rather due to

2203
02:17:21,000 --> 02:17:24,079
other factors, such as locally placed charges within the building.

2204
02:17:24,680 --> 02:17:27,719
The evidence is undeniable, despite the pleas of the official

2205
02:17:27,760 --> 02:17:30,440
story that the writer truck bomb was not the sole

2206
02:17:30,520 --> 02:17:33,200
cause of destruction that day, that there were bombs placed

2207
02:17:33,200 --> 02:17:36,040
inside the building which caused the brunt of casualties as

2208
02:17:36,079 --> 02:17:38,280
floors collapsed on helpless victims.

2209
02:17:44,920 --> 02:17:48,000
Speaker 39: And the rescuers apparently had to abandon the people they

2210
02:17:48,000 --> 02:17:49,600
were trying to rescue temporarily.

2211
02:17:50,000 --> 02:17:52,399
Speaker 21: Were you there a minute ago when somebody yelled, they

2212
02:17:52,399 --> 02:17:54,040
thought they'd say the second advice, sir.

2213
02:17:54,159 --> 02:17:56,959
Speaker 16: We were in close to the parking area trying to

2214
02:17:56,959 --> 02:17:58,559
recover a victim.

2215
02:17:58,760 --> 02:18:01,760
Speaker 19: As rescuers desperately tried to free the victims from the rubble,

2216
02:18:02,280 --> 02:18:05,120
several evacuations of the site due to reports of other

2217
02:18:05,159 --> 02:18:07,079
bombs impeded these efforts.

2218
02:18:07,760 --> 02:18:09,799
Speaker 14: At some point, we got to the corner of Fifth

2219
02:18:09,840 --> 02:18:11,600
and I believe it was Robinson, right at the corner

2220
02:18:11,639 --> 02:18:15,319
of the Mirror building, and we heard second bomb. Somebody

2221
02:18:15,360 --> 02:18:19,559
yelled's second bomb. I stopped, I turned around. People were

2222
02:18:19,639 --> 02:18:23,200
running past me, and I just kind of watched what

2223
02:18:24,079 --> 02:18:26,479
was unfolding. Of course, nothing ever did happen.

2224
02:18:26,840 --> 02:18:30,639
Speaker 19: The Oklahoma Highway Patrol reported that another explosive device was found.

2225
02:18:31,040 --> 02:18:35,600
The Oklahoma City Fire Department confirmed that Defense Department logs

2226
02:18:35,600 --> 02:18:38,840
recorded that a second bomb was disarmed. A third bomb

2227
02:18:38,879 --> 02:18:39,680
was evacuated.

2228
02:18:41,200 --> 02:18:42,280
Speaker 4: The explosive that the.

2229
02:18:43,799 --> 02:18:45,680
Speaker 7: Disarmed last night was even larger.

2230
02:18:46,479 --> 02:18:48,879
Speaker 19: Who planted these bombs and had access to the Mirror

2231
02:18:48,879 --> 02:18:52,760
building before the bombing. A deputy sheriff recorded this footage

2232
02:18:52,840 --> 02:18:55,879
during one of the evacuations. Here are the ATF is

2233
02:18:55,920 --> 02:18:59,040
seeing pulling out several weapons and blocks of what appeared

2234
02:18:59,079 --> 02:19:02,479
to be plastic exploed. Was this the source of the

2235
02:19:02,479 --> 02:19:05,399
bomb scare or did this ordinance come from an illegal

2236
02:19:05,479 --> 02:19:08,959
armory that witnesses report the ATF kept in the Mirror building.

2237
02:19:09,719 --> 02:19:12,280
The ATF denies they kept any weapons or explosives in

2238
02:19:12,319 --> 02:19:13,120
the building.

2239
02:19:15,680 --> 02:19:19,680
Speaker 13: Day one, hour two of the bombing. The most significant

2240
02:19:19,680 --> 02:19:22,600
event that happened is when they said they found other bombs.

2241
02:19:22,280 --> 02:19:22,760
Speaker 6: In the building.

2242
02:19:22,799 --> 02:19:25,639
Speaker 13: The second most significant event was so we moved everybody

2243
02:19:25,680 --> 02:19:28,680
back and held them back. There were still people alive

2244
02:19:28,760 --> 02:19:31,120
trapped in the building. That they came in with two

2245
02:19:31,120 --> 02:19:33,120
trucks and backed them up to the Murror building, and

2246
02:19:33,159 --> 02:19:36,280
a bunch of these guys, dressed in blue jackets with

2247
02:19:36,319 --> 02:19:39,000
no letters on the back, started taking boxes of files

2248
02:19:39,000 --> 02:19:40,200
out and putting them on his truck.

2249
02:19:40,399 --> 02:19:45,360
Speaker 20: We were told by a blonde female agent that there

2250
02:19:45,440 --> 02:19:51,680
were files so serious the government that until the files

2251
02:19:51,680 --> 02:19:54,120
were relocated, it would not be any recovery effort.

2252
02:19:54,559 --> 02:19:58,479
Speaker 30: Do you remember the whitewater investigation in Arkansas? Although the

2253
02:19:58,520 --> 02:20:02,680
paperwork was stored in Themurrabelle had FBI is over in

2254
02:20:02,680 --> 02:20:05,120
the fields to the west of the Murra building picking

2255
02:20:05,200 --> 02:20:07,760
up Piper almost all day long.

2256
02:20:08,559 --> 02:20:11,879
Speaker 13: And it was during this time that early an investigation

2257
02:20:11,959 --> 02:20:15,440
that I started receiving some various phone calls. One of

2258
02:20:15,479 --> 02:20:18,479
them was a phone call from Little Rock, Arkansas. The

2259
02:20:18,520 --> 02:20:20,559
guy said that he was a federal agent. He was

2260
02:20:20,600 --> 02:20:23,680
not an FBI agent, He was not atf But what

2261
02:20:23,719 --> 02:20:27,319
he did say was during their investigation of the Clintons

2262
02:20:27,920 --> 02:20:29,639
on all the drug running that went through me to

2263
02:20:29,840 --> 02:20:32,920
Arkansas and you know Lasseter's ranch and all of that

2264
02:20:33,040 --> 02:20:35,280
stuff that was going on at the time during Iron Contra,

2265
02:20:36,079 --> 02:20:41,200
that those records when Clinton went to Washington were transferred

2266
02:20:41,200 --> 02:20:42,719
from there to the Murror Building.

2267
02:20:42,600 --> 02:20:45,000
Speaker 38: Because of the additional bomb threats are because the building

2268
02:20:45,040 --> 02:20:47,639
was unstable and the firefighters couldn't get to them.

2269
02:20:48,079 --> 02:20:49,639
Speaker 4: So those are a lot of patients I think were

2270
02:20:49,680 --> 02:20:50,399
lost that could.

2271
02:20:50,200 --> 02:20:50,760
Speaker 39: Have been saved.

2272
02:20:51,360 --> 02:20:54,040
Speaker 19: After rescue and recovery had been halted, the building was

2273
02:20:54,079 --> 02:20:56,440
prepped for demolition even though all the bodies had not

2274
02:20:56,479 --> 02:20:59,319
been recovered, and despite the architects report that it could

2275
02:20:59,360 --> 02:21:02,920
be rebuilt. The investigative team from the American Society of

2276
02:21:02,920 --> 02:21:06,360
Civil Engineers was not allowed on site. The defense lawyers

2277
02:21:06,360 --> 02:21:08,920
from McVeigh were able to visit the site one time,

2278
02:21:09,360 --> 02:21:11,680
but even then they were not allowed to view the crater.

2279
02:21:15,559 --> 02:21:17,520
Speaker 20: They were going to halt on the twenty ninth, the

2280
02:21:17,520 --> 02:21:19,840
barefeld that were going to halt the recovery and prepare

2281
02:21:19,879 --> 02:21:22,440
the building to be imploded. We went back in after

2282
02:21:22,520 --> 02:21:26,639
the found demolition to relocate two victims that we knew

2283
02:21:26,680 --> 02:21:29,200
that we had left in the possibility of a third victim,

2284
02:21:29,239 --> 02:21:32,040
which we also located here. I don't know why they

2285
02:21:32,040 --> 02:21:34,559
were in such a rush. GSA, the same building was

2286
02:21:34,639 --> 02:21:36,159
unsafe and needed to be brought down.

2287
02:21:37,120 --> 02:21:40,000
Speaker 19: A month after the bombing, the Alfred Pimura Federal Building

2288
02:21:40,079 --> 02:21:43,319
was completely demolished with less than two hundred pounds of explosives.

2289
02:21:43,799 --> 02:21:46,719
The wreckage was buried under armed guard, and one can

2290
02:21:46,799 --> 02:21:49,520
only think that certain officials breathed a sigh of relief

2291
02:21:49,559 --> 02:21:53,399
as the outstanding counterpoint to the official story disappeared in

2292
02:21:53,399 --> 02:22:04,360
a cloud of dust. Tid Bits of truth about the

2293
02:22:04,360 --> 02:22:07,520
Oklahoma City bombing would often come from the most unlikely

2294
02:22:07,559 --> 02:22:11,760
of places. Another stranger, brutal murder, at first seemingly unrelated

2295
02:22:11,760 --> 02:22:13,920
to the bombing would set the stage for some of

2296
02:22:13,920 --> 02:22:16,600
the most damning evidence that the government was withholding from

2297
02:22:16,639 --> 02:22:17,120
the public.

2298
02:22:18,200 --> 02:22:20,959
Speaker 25: My name is Jesse Trinidau. I'm an attorney from Salt

2299
02:22:21,040 --> 02:22:24,639
Lake City, Utah. My brother, Kenneth Michael Trinidao, was murdered

2300
02:22:25,079 --> 02:22:28,239
in the Federal Transfer Center here in Oklahoma City in

2301
02:22:28,280 --> 02:22:31,879
August of nineteen ninety five. Kenny had a hard life,

2302
02:22:32,280 --> 02:22:35,600
you know, I've often thought about that and how he

2303
02:22:35,719 --> 02:22:37,000
ended up the way he did.

2304
02:22:38,040 --> 02:22:39,639
Speaker 4: He was an.

2305
02:22:39,600 --> 02:22:44,079
Speaker 25: Incredibly bright man, an incredible athlete. He set the national

2306
02:22:44,079 --> 02:22:46,760
record in high school for the two mile runners of freshman.

2307
02:22:48,360 --> 02:22:50,040
Speaker 4: Went into the service, and like so.

2308
02:22:50,079 --> 02:22:52,959
Speaker 25: Many boys did during the Vietnam War, they come out

2309
02:22:52,959 --> 02:22:58,280
on the heroin addicts. He robbed banks or two banks

2310
02:22:58,319 --> 02:23:01,120
to support that Habit was caught me, pled guilty and

2311
02:23:01,159 --> 02:23:04,239
went and did his time. He was a very strong guy.

2312
02:23:05,319 --> 02:23:07,399
He wasn't very big, but he was very tough. It

2313
02:23:07,559 --> 02:23:11,520
was easy going, but he wouldn't back down. So if

2314
02:23:11,639 --> 02:23:13,319
you pushed him, you were going to get a fight.

2315
02:23:13,799 --> 02:23:16,000
It was a fight you were going to lose. We

2316
02:23:16,079 --> 02:23:18,280
loved him and stood behind him, and he was a

2317
02:23:18,319 --> 02:23:22,079
good man. Kenny was supposedly arrested for a probation violation

2318
02:23:22,840 --> 02:23:26,959
and sent to Oklahoma City at the Transfer Center for

2319
02:23:27,000 --> 02:23:32,959
a probation hearing. We now know that that's crap. I

2320
02:23:33,000 --> 02:23:35,520
said to him, Kenny, what are you doing there? And

2321
02:23:35,520 --> 02:23:37,799
he said, well, they sent me back here for probation hearing.

2322
02:23:38,200 --> 02:23:41,840
And we talked about getting my lawyer and the fact

2323
02:23:41,879 --> 02:23:44,280
that we didn't expect him to do more than a

2324
02:23:44,319 --> 02:23:47,200
couple of months. And so my mother called me at

2325
02:23:47,200 --> 02:23:49,920
work it was about seven in the morning and told

2326
02:23:49,920 --> 02:23:54,000
me that And I couldn't believe it that Kenny supposedly

2327
02:23:54,079 --> 02:23:55,879
killed himself because I had just spoken with him the

2328
02:23:55,959 --> 02:23:59,200
night before. There's no way in hell he would have

2329
02:23:59,239 --> 02:24:02,200
killed himself. This is not a guy who kills himself.

2330
02:24:02,760 --> 02:24:05,639
I mean, his life is the best it's ever been.

2331
02:24:06,520 --> 02:24:09,239
I found out later that an autopsy had already been done.

2332
02:24:10,280 --> 02:24:12,879
Now the government, the federal government didn't want one done,

2333
02:24:13,719 --> 02:24:16,000
but to stay to Oklahoma required one for a death

2334
02:24:16,040 --> 02:24:20,399
in incarceration, So the federal government didn't know that there

2335
02:24:20,479 --> 02:24:23,120
was an autopsy done, did not want the autopsy done,

2336
02:24:24,079 --> 02:24:27,559
and the federal government went twice to the Medical Examiner's

2337
02:24:27,559 --> 02:24:29,879
office asking to have Kenny cremated.

2338
02:24:31,239 --> 02:24:35,600
Speaker 4: It took a week to get his body released in home, and.

2339
02:24:35,520 --> 02:24:37,719
Speaker 25: I kept getting the run around from the federal government,

2340
02:24:37,760 --> 02:24:39,479
and finally I just screamed into the phone one day,

2341
02:24:39,479 --> 02:24:42,639
why don't you keep him? And when the body comes home,

2342
02:24:42,760 --> 02:24:45,360
it's totally made up so you can't see the wounds.

2343
02:24:46,200 --> 02:24:50,879
He was beaten head to toe. His gull was smashed

2344
02:24:50,920 --> 02:24:55,159
in in three places. The soles of his feet had

2345
02:24:55,200 --> 02:24:59,680
been beaten. You could see the figure bruises on his

2346
02:24:59,799 --> 02:25:01,840
arm where he'd been held.

2347
02:25:02,959 --> 02:25:07,760
Speaker 4: His throat was cut, and he'd been strangled, and.

2348
02:25:07,719 --> 02:25:10,319
Speaker 25: The federal government said it was a suicide by hanging.

2349
02:25:11,120 --> 02:25:13,479
When his body's turned over to the medical examiner two

2350
02:25:13,559 --> 02:25:16,799
hours later, he's wearing nothing but box the shorts. The

2351
02:25:16,840 --> 02:25:19,079
government said they don't know what happened to the clothes.

2352
02:25:21,559 --> 02:25:25,360
They cleaned the cell that morning, so the medical examiner

2353
02:25:25,399 --> 02:25:29,280
can't do an examination of it. And the medical examiner

2354
02:25:29,319 --> 02:25:33,799
is not allowed into the cell for six months. And

2355
02:25:33,840 --> 02:25:36,040
when he finally is allowed in, he does a test

2356
02:25:36,120 --> 02:25:39,440
this called luminol that will reveal the presence of blood.

2357
02:25:40,159 --> 02:25:42,760
And Fred Jordan told me that the sell lit up

2358
02:25:42,760 --> 02:25:47,120
like a Christmas tree. The logbooks involving my brother disappeared.

2359
02:25:48,000 --> 02:25:51,040
The ones that didn't disappear. The pages from the logbooks

2360
02:25:51,079 --> 02:25:56,799
are missing. The crime scene photographs disappear, the negatives of

2361
02:25:56,840 --> 02:26:04,239
the crime scene photographs disappear. The video camera supposedly malfunctions.

2362
02:26:05,319 --> 02:26:08,239
Within an hour of death, He'd consumed the equivalent of

2363
02:26:08,280 --> 02:26:11,600
the thirty bottles of coca cola, and doctor Jordan told

2364
02:26:11,639 --> 02:26:15,200
me that caffeine is used in a lot of countries,

2365
02:26:15,440 --> 02:26:19,239
like Third world countries, to enhance pain under torture. And

2366
02:26:19,280 --> 02:26:21,239
he also told me that the meetings on the soles

2367
02:26:21,239 --> 02:26:26,399
of the feet were indicative of torture. And I believe

2368
02:26:26,440 --> 02:26:28,840
it was the FBI. I firmly believed that for a

2369
02:26:28,879 --> 02:26:31,639
lot of reasons. Now, I didn't start out believing that.

2370
02:26:32,239 --> 02:26:35,479
I started out trusting them until I could see what

2371
02:26:35,479 --> 02:26:38,559
they were doing, and they would come to me asking

2372
02:26:38,559 --> 02:26:43,680
for information and then immediately go. And the story of

2373
02:26:43,719 --> 02:26:49,079
the evidence threatened the witness do everything they could to

2374
02:26:49,159 --> 02:26:52,000
prevent the case from being made of murder.

2375
02:26:53,879 --> 02:26:55,040
Speaker 4: Information was coming into me.

2376
02:26:55,799 --> 02:26:57,760
Speaker 25: People were leaking me stuff they wanted me to know,

2377
02:26:57,920 --> 02:27:01,159
They want me to know who they were. Late December

2378
02:27:01,319 --> 02:27:03,879
of ninety five, early January ninety six, I get a

2379
02:27:03,879 --> 02:27:08,520
phone call the person won't leave the name. The person said,

2380
02:27:08,559 --> 02:27:11,239
your brother was killed by the FBI. They said it

2381
02:27:11,239 --> 02:27:14,280
was an interrogation, it went bad. It was a case

2382
02:27:14,319 --> 02:27:19,280
of mistaken identity, that he fit a profile of people

2383
02:27:19,280 --> 02:27:22,120
who are robbing banks to get money to attack the

2384
02:27:22,159 --> 02:27:22,879
federal government.

2385
02:27:24,200 --> 02:27:24,879
Speaker 4: Just before he was.

2386
02:27:24,879 --> 02:27:28,879
Speaker 25: Executed, I get a message from Tim McVay and he

2387
02:27:28,959 --> 02:27:31,239
told me he said, when I saw your brother's picture

2388
02:27:32,479 --> 02:27:34,520
and heard what happened to him, I wanted you to

2389
02:27:34,639 --> 02:27:37,959
know that I think the FBI killed him because they

2390
02:27:38,000 --> 02:27:39,200
thought he was Richard le Gussie.

2391
02:27:40,200 --> 02:27:43,200
Speaker 19: Early on, the FBI had investigated the possibility that a

2392
02:27:43,200 --> 02:27:45,760
string of bank robberies committed by what the media dubbed

2393
02:27:45,879 --> 02:27:49,600
the Midwest Bank Robberies, had financed the bombing. Led by

2394
02:27:49,600 --> 02:27:52,639
Peter Langan and Richard Lee Guthrie aka Wild Bill. The

2395
02:27:52,719 --> 02:27:56,239
gang called themselves the Arian Republican Army. The purpose of

2396
02:27:56,280 --> 02:27:59,520
the robberies to finance a race war within the United States.

2397
02:28:00,239 --> 02:28:02,719
Bill closely resembled some of the John Doe number two

2398
02:28:02,719 --> 02:28:06,000
sketches and had a tattoo similar to that reported by witnesses.

2399
02:28:07,159 --> 02:28:10,040
In an Affidavid, Peter Langan revealed that a member of

2400
02:28:10,040 --> 02:28:14,079
the Aarra had admitted to liabilities concerning the bombing. Another

2401
02:28:14,120 --> 02:28:16,879
member had threatened, we're going to get them. We're going

2402
02:28:16,959 --> 02:28:18,520
to hit one of their buildings during the middle of

2403
02:28:18,559 --> 02:28:21,799
the day. It's going to be a federal building. Most

2404
02:28:21,840 --> 02:28:24,399
of the arare was arrested for bank robbery. Soon after

2405
02:28:24,440 --> 02:28:27,639
the bombing, Peter Langen offered to provide information about his

2406
02:28:27,719 --> 02:28:29,719
co conspirator's relationship with McVeigh.

2407
02:28:30,200 --> 02:28:32,360
Speaker 28: This offer was refused.

2408
02:28:33,000 --> 02:28:34,120
Speaker 4: And then I got a call from.

2409
02:28:34,000 --> 02:28:38,239
Speaker 25: A a great guy, JD.

2410
02:28:38,399 --> 02:28:39,719
Speaker 4: Cash.

2411
02:28:39,799 --> 02:28:44,200
Speaker 25: He was a hunting and fishing reporter at the McCurtain

2412
02:28:44,719 --> 02:28:49,440
County News in eastern Oklahoma. He'd had friends that were

2413
02:28:49,520 --> 02:28:53,840
killed in a mommy and family wounded. And one day

2414
02:28:53,879 --> 02:28:56,159
he calls me up and he says, Jesse, can I

2415
02:28:56,200 --> 02:28:57,520
talk to you? I said, well, sure, Who are you?

2416
02:28:57,559 --> 02:29:00,719
He says, I'm JD Cash. He says, I'm investigating the

2417
02:29:00,760 --> 02:29:03,120
bombing in Oklahoma. He said, I'm interested in your brother's death.

2418
02:29:04,360 --> 02:29:06,200
Can I ask you some questions? And I said yes?

2419
02:29:07,120 --> 02:29:09,120
And JD said, well, do you have any tattoos?

2420
02:29:10,280 --> 02:29:12,760
Speaker 4: And I said yes. He says what and where?

2421
02:29:12,799 --> 02:29:18,079
Speaker 25: I said, a dragon tattoo on his left forearm. JD said,

2422
02:29:18,079 --> 02:29:22,200
oh my god. He said, are you setting down? I

2423
02:29:22,200 --> 02:29:25,639
said yeah. He said, let me tell you this. He said,

2424
02:29:25,959 --> 02:29:27,879
when your brother was picked up, we sent to Oklahoma.

2425
02:29:28,479 --> 02:29:30,799
The largest man hunting American history is in place for

2426
02:29:30,920 --> 02:29:34,360
John Doe too. We didn't start out to solve the

2427
02:29:34,399 --> 02:29:35,600
Oklahoma City bombing case.

2428
02:29:36,280 --> 02:29:38,319
Speaker 4: We started out for justice with my brother.

2429
02:29:39,239 --> 02:29:46,680
Speaker 25: But every lead, every trail, every bit of important evidence

2430
02:29:47,000 --> 02:29:48,920
has brought us to the Oklahoma City bombing.

2431
02:29:49,360 --> 02:29:49,520
Speaker 4: Now.

2432
02:29:49,520 --> 02:29:52,040
Speaker 25: The Freedom of Information Act is an act Congress passes.

2433
02:29:52,120 --> 02:29:56,280
It says, the government's supposed to turn over documents and

2434
02:29:56,319 --> 02:30:00,840
information to you that you request, unless there's a good

2435
02:30:00,840 --> 02:30:03,959
reason not to, such as national security. I bring the

2436
02:30:04,000 --> 02:30:07,879
first four you suit saying I want all documents showing

2437
02:30:08,079 --> 02:30:14,479
the link between the FBI and the Southern Poverty Law

2438
02:30:14,520 --> 02:30:22,360
Center in the Oklahoma City bombing. And the FBI comes

2439
02:30:22,399 --> 02:30:28,360
back and says there are no documents. They didn't know

2440
02:30:28,399 --> 02:30:33,040
that I'd been leaked to teletypes from FBI Director Louis Free,

2441
02:30:33,479 --> 02:30:38,559
then Director Louis Free talking about Ellingham City, talking about informants,

2442
02:30:38,639 --> 02:30:41,559
talking about the Southern Poverty Law Center, talking about the

2443
02:30:41,600 --> 02:30:44,959
fact that they had called Ellinghem City two days before

2444
02:30:44,959 --> 02:30:46,120
the bombing asking.

2445
02:30:45,799 --> 02:30:46,399
Speaker 4: For more help.

2446
02:30:47,680 --> 02:30:49,159
Speaker 25: So I said to them. They walk in the court

2447
02:30:49,159 --> 02:30:51,639
and they tell the federal judge there's no documents. Well,

2448
02:30:51,680 --> 02:30:55,079
I file those two. The federal judge looks at him,

2449
02:30:55,079 --> 02:30:58,360
he says, you go back, you do a manual search,

2450
02:30:59,000 --> 02:31:01,079
and you bring everything fine back in the court.

2451
02:31:02,239 --> 02:31:03,719
Speaker 4: Well, then they come back and plead.

2452
02:31:03,520 --> 02:31:07,120
Speaker 25: With the judge, and they said, Judge, we'd promised anonymity,

2453
02:31:07,719 --> 02:31:10,520
and if we have to disclose these documents, it will

2454
02:31:10,559 --> 02:31:13,040
reveal their names and their lives of the in jeopardy.

2455
02:31:13,680 --> 02:31:17,959
Speaker 19: German citizen Andreas Carl Strasmeier aka Andy. The German, came

2456
02:31:18,000 --> 02:31:21,520
to the US in the early nineties, professing neo Nazi beliefs.

2457
02:31:21,520 --> 02:31:23,959
He moved to Elm City, becoming their chief of security.

2458
02:31:24,680 --> 02:31:28,040
He was reported by ATF informant Carol Howe and others

2459
02:31:28,280 --> 02:31:31,639
to make threats about bombing federal buildings and assassinations of

2460
02:31:31,680 --> 02:31:35,840
public officials. It has known that McVeigh called Lmcity twice

2461
02:31:36,040 --> 02:31:38,840
looking for the mysterious German when members of the ARA

2462
02:31:39,079 --> 02:31:42,760
were living with Strasmeier. They also attempted to reach Andy's attorney,

2463
02:31:42,840 --> 02:31:45,600
Kirk Lyons by phone. In the days before the bombing.

2464
02:31:46,079 --> 02:31:47,760
Speaker 13: We started looking at Strassmeyer real hard.

2465
02:31:47,799 --> 02:31:49,000
Speaker 4: And this guy didn't add up either.

2466
02:31:49,360 --> 02:31:51,760
Speaker 13: He was on special assignment and disappears and shows up

2467
02:31:51,799 --> 02:31:55,479
in Elm City. Came in through Texas and was placed

2468
02:31:55,479 --> 02:31:58,799
at Lmcity. Now why loom City? I mean nobody in Germany.

2469
02:31:58,840 --> 02:32:00,399
If I haven't heard of Elois City and I live

2470
02:32:00,440 --> 02:32:03,399
in Oklahoma, how's anybody in Germany here this place? Well,

2471
02:32:03,440 --> 02:32:07,040
evidently it was from a lawyer named Kirk Lyons. I

2472
02:32:07,079 --> 02:32:10,399
start putting dots together, and I start find out who

2473
02:32:10,399 --> 02:32:12,120
these people are and who they know, and who they

2474
02:32:12,159 --> 02:32:14,360
run with, and what their background and what their history is.

2475
02:32:14,760 --> 02:32:19,079
And we create a picture from this. We have Strasmeyer

2476
02:32:20,120 --> 02:32:23,639
doing all this paramilitary training, takes over as chief of

2477
02:32:23,680 --> 02:32:26,600
security of a place that didn't need any security, tells

2478
02:32:26,639 --> 02:32:28,200
them they need to get rid of their shotguns and

2479
02:32:28,479 --> 02:32:31,399
deer rifles and buy assault rifles and sks is and

2480
02:32:31,440 --> 02:32:33,520
aks and stuff like this because they're going to be

2481
02:32:33,559 --> 02:32:36,239
the next Waco. Well he scares them down there. They

2482
02:32:36,239 --> 02:32:38,200
don't know what to do, so they start, you know,

2483
02:32:38,840 --> 02:32:42,079
gearing up for the last days of the Book of Revelation.

2484
02:32:43,000 --> 02:32:46,079
Strassman is an interesting character. These documents we've done from

2485
02:32:46,079 --> 02:32:49,959
the courts. It's my understanding he's a German intelligence officer.

2486
02:32:51,040 --> 02:32:53,840
He is, apparently, after the.

2487
02:32:53,799 --> 02:32:57,520
Speaker 25: Bombings, taken out of the country by a former CIA

2488
02:32:57,639 --> 02:33:01,680
operative back to Germany visa as I understand, it had expired,

2489
02:33:02,399 --> 02:33:05,120
and no one picked him up, and he smuggled out

2490
02:33:05,200 --> 02:33:06,600
to Mexico and back to Germany.

2491
02:33:07,040 --> 02:33:13,200
Speaker 8: I said, why wasn't and Distraussmeier question And one of

2492
02:33:13,239 --> 02:33:16,639
the attorneys said, oh, we did question him. I said, yeah,

2493
02:33:16,840 --> 02:33:20,280
but you waited until he got back to back to

2494
02:33:20,440 --> 02:33:23,639
Germany and then you called him up over the phone

2495
02:33:23,680 --> 02:33:25,879
and asked him did he have anything to do with

2496
02:33:25,959 --> 02:33:26,440
the bombing?

2497
02:33:27,000 --> 02:33:31,200
Speaker 13: At Tulsa and Lady Godivas, which is a strip bar,

2498
02:33:33,559 --> 02:33:38,559
one of the strippers named Sean T said that McVeigh

2499
02:33:38,799 --> 02:33:44,440
and Strasmeyer and several people had come in a few

2500
02:33:44,479 --> 02:33:46,440
days before the bombing and there was a rider truck

2501
02:33:46,479 --> 02:33:47,600
parked out in the parking lot.

2502
02:33:48,000 --> 02:33:51,399
Speaker 38: What we can say about two mcvay's connections to Loking

2503
02:33:51,520 --> 02:33:55,000
City is that he called there at least twice, once

2504
02:33:55,040 --> 02:33:58,000
on April fifth and once on April seventeenth, That he

2505
02:33:58,079 --> 02:34:01,680
checked into a motel within miles from there, That he

2506
02:34:01,760 --> 02:34:04,639
received a speeding ticket within miles from there, and that

2507
02:34:04,719 --> 02:34:12,479
he also calls outlaying areas of Alohim City residents or acquaintances.

2508
02:34:13,040 --> 02:34:19,319
So very briefly, those are his provable connections to Elohim City.

2509
02:34:20,479 --> 02:34:23,319
Speaker 19: The Southern Poverty Law Center, along with the FBI, kept

2510
02:34:23,360 --> 02:34:26,840
informants in lm City. One of these may have been Straschmeyer.

2511
02:34:26,879 --> 02:34:30,280
This opposed Toyo Nazi, known primarily for its work in

2512
02:34:30,319 --> 02:34:34,239
litigating against hate groups and its outspoken Chief Council MORRISDS,

2513
02:34:34,719 --> 02:34:38,600
the SPLC has also become an informal intelligence gathering army

2514
02:34:38,600 --> 02:34:41,479
of the FBI and now the Department of Homeland Security.

2515
02:34:42,079 --> 02:34:44,440
They share the same interest with the federal government and

2516
02:34:44,520 --> 02:34:47,239
suppressing what they knew about prior knowledge.

2517
02:34:47,520 --> 02:34:49,159
Speaker 4: By the FBI is on and massion.

2518
02:34:49,200 --> 02:34:52,159
Speaker 25: They were at least between four and six informants at

2519
02:34:52,159 --> 02:34:54,040
Ellahem City.

2520
02:34:54,200 --> 02:34:56,079
Speaker 4: I don't know what the population of Elham City is,

2521
02:34:56,159 --> 02:34:57,520
but it sounds.

2522
02:34:57,280 --> 02:34:59,399
Speaker 25: Like when they ever three people get together to talk

2523
02:34:59,440 --> 02:35:02,680
about Olathorne the government, two of them were working for

2524
02:35:02,760 --> 02:35:03,280
the government.

2525
02:35:03,600 --> 02:35:07,000
Speaker 19: Andy Strassmayer's roommate at Lwem City was Michael Brescia, a

2526
02:35:07,040 --> 02:35:10,040
young skinhead from Philadelphia who was also a member of

2527
02:35:10,079 --> 02:35:13,200
the AARA. He was later convicted for bank robbery and

2528
02:35:13,239 --> 02:35:15,760
also bore a striking resemblance to the John Doe Number

2529
02:35:15,760 --> 02:35:19,680
two sketches. The FBI and the ATF had something to

2530
02:35:19,719 --> 02:35:21,479
hide in eastern Oklahoma?

2531
02:35:21,520 --> 02:35:24,680
Speaker 28: Was McVeigh and Lowem City? If so, what was he doing?

2532
02:35:26,840 --> 02:35:31,760
Speaker 50: My name's Josiah Stone, and I was on a spiritual journey.

2533
02:35:32,200 --> 02:35:38,200
I integrated quite quickly into Eliheim City and I was

2534
02:35:38,239 --> 02:35:44,879
able to identify with their concept of life because I

2535
02:35:45,040 --> 02:35:49,680
was looking for some answers to my own life. I

2536
02:35:49,719 --> 02:35:56,879
saw Timothy McVeigh at Eliheim City eight weeks prior to

2537
02:35:56,920 --> 02:36:00,440
the Oklahoma City bombing, and I remember him distinctly because

2538
02:36:00,840 --> 02:36:02,040
he has a distinct face.

2539
02:36:03,200 --> 02:36:04,120
Speaker 4: But he was smiling.

2540
02:36:04,360 --> 02:36:06,200
Speaker 6: He was smiling, He was happy as he could be.

2541
02:36:07,280 --> 02:36:10,760
Speaker 50: These people were loaded for bear and they were ready,

2542
02:36:11,040 --> 02:36:16,000
and they meant business. I believe the mindset that Ilahim

2543
02:36:16,040 --> 02:36:19,120
City was. They didn't give a damn whether they were

2544
02:36:19,159 --> 02:36:19,959
implicated in.

2545
02:36:19,920 --> 02:36:20,600
Speaker 4: And their moked.

2546
02:36:21,680 --> 02:36:24,959
Speaker 25: What was interesting, and I think no one has paid

2547
02:36:24,959 --> 02:36:28,239
any attention to it, is that the CIA was involved

2548
02:36:28,239 --> 02:36:31,239
at Elahem City. Not only were they involved, but they

2549
02:36:31,280 --> 02:36:36,799
had this spy satellites, the National Geospatial and Intelligence Agency.

2550
02:36:36,799 --> 02:36:38,959
I never heard of them before they run the spy satellites.

2551
02:36:39,639 --> 02:36:43,319
They had them over Ellaheim City. I think one of

2552
02:36:43,360 --> 02:36:46,520
the things that may be most productive beginning of the

2553
02:36:46,559 --> 02:36:50,559
truth was the discovery of an operation the FBI had

2554
02:36:50,559 --> 02:36:53,319
in place since about nineteen ninety one called pat Con.

2555
02:36:54,120 --> 02:36:59,520
Pat Con is short for patriot conspiracy. It was an

2556
02:36:59,559 --> 02:37:04,319
idea they had to infiltrate every militia group, every neo

2557
02:37:04,440 --> 02:37:07,280
Nazi group, every group critical of the.

2558
02:37:07,239 --> 02:37:09,200
Speaker 4: Government in the United States.

2559
02:37:09,639 --> 02:37:13,280
Speaker 25: The plan apparently was to put informants in with all

2560
02:37:13,319 --> 02:37:19,879
of these groups. And I think Ellheim City was a

2561
02:37:19,920 --> 02:37:25,680
pat Con operation. I think McVeigh was obviously involved in it. Now,

2562
02:37:25,680 --> 02:37:28,760
whether he was a target or an operative, I don't

2563
02:37:28,760 --> 02:37:31,399
know any more than I know whether the government intended

2564
02:37:31,440 --> 02:37:34,079
to blow up the Murrow building, But they knew it

2565
02:37:34,120 --> 02:37:36,639
was going to happen, and then new Vy was going

2566
02:37:36,680 --> 02:37:39,719
to do it, and they don't stop him.

2567
02:37:40,159 --> 02:37:43,360
Speaker 19: As alleged in David Hoffman's book The Oklahoma City Bombing

2568
02:37:43,360 --> 02:37:46,959
Into Politics of Terror, Strassmeyer first aroused suspicion that he

2569
02:37:47,079 --> 02:37:49,959
was an undercover operative when he was caught in Texas

2570
02:37:50,159 --> 02:37:52,719
entering a federal building at night with the key code.

2571
02:37:53,200 --> 02:37:55,040
Did he have access to the murror building.

2572
02:37:55,040 --> 02:37:59,159
Speaker 13: Also, when we interviewed Jane Graham, who was a survivor,

2573
02:38:00,079 --> 02:38:02,079
she said that when she went to work, it was

2574
02:38:02,120 --> 02:38:04,399
either the day before or two days before, I don't

2575
02:38:04,440 --> 02:38:07,520
remember which. She parked in the basement parking and when

2576
02:38:07,520 --> 02:38:09,239
she got out of her card was walking across the

2577
02:38:09,280 --> 02:38:15,000
parking garage, she saw three guys down there wearing coveralls

2578
02:38:15,040 --> 02:38:19,440
and placing putty on the columns and stringing wire between

2579
02:38:19,440 --> 02:38:21,799
the putty. Later, she picks out one of the guys

2580
02:38:22,120 --> 02:38:25,760
from photographs and says, that's him, and it was andrews Strasmeyer.

2581
02:38:26,120 --> 02:38:30,360
Speaker 29: Stratsmeyer was there listening, going over the plans. He was

2582
02:38:30,440 --> 02:38:34,559
listening to everything. He was what they were talking about, looking.

2583
02:38:34,280 --> 02:38:36,239
Speaker 12: At place, pointing to things.

2584
02:38:36,520 --> 02:38:39,040
Speaker 29: But when they were talking whatever, they happened to finally

2585
02:38:39,040 --> 02:38:41,879
be talking about, and when I was looking at him

2586
02:38:42,079 --> 02:38:44,040
at that point, then he left and went over to

2587
02:38:44,079 --> 02:38:45,879
the other side of the building so I wouldn't keep

2588
02:38:45,879 --> 02:38:48,959
watching him. The second man that was there, who appeared

2589
02:38:48,959 --> 02:38:52,319
to be military, he's the one that the man in

2590
02:38:52,399 --> 02:38:54,959
charge told to put the stuff back in the car.

2591
02:38:55,479 --> 02:38:59,399
The second man obviously was taking orders from the first man,

2592
02:38:59,479 --> 02:39:01,840
because he had wire in his hands, which I thought

2593
02:39:01,879 --> 02:39:05,719
was telephone wire. It's that real light color thin wire.

2594
02:39:06,239 --> 02:39:09,159
And he also had what appeared to be gray putty.

2595
02:39:09,399 --> 02:39:14,000
Speaker 13: Well, that's exactly how you string composition C four with debtcord.

2596
02:39:15,120 --> 02:39:16,600
Speaker 4: And the details are chilling.

2597
02:39:17,000 --> 02:39:19,920
Speaker 45: We'll also focus on surveillance cameras, cameras that caught the

2598
02:39:20,000 --> 02:39:22,319
bombing on tape, and maybe the men.

2599
02:39:22,280 --> 02:39:23,159
Speaker 7: Behind the bombing.

2600
02:39:23,360 --> 02:39:25,479
Speaker 45: The news channel has new information tonight that there's a

2601
02:39:25,600 --> 02:39:28,920
chance surveillance tapes could be the smoking gun evidence. Now

2602
02:39:28,920 --> 02:39:31,559
we ask candid questions and a rare face to face

2603
02:39:31,600 --> 02:39:35,200
meeting with ATF officials close to the investigation, we learned

2604
02:39:35,200 --> 02:39:38,159
that video collected from downtown businesses the morning of April

2605
02:39:38,280 --> 02:39:40,959
nineteenth may someday be played before adjuring.

2606
02:39:41,239 --> 02:39:42,600
Speaker 7: Officials won't say who or.

2607
02:39:42,559 --> 02:39:43,840
Speaker 4: What exactly is on the tape.

2608
02:39:43,840 --> 02:39:47,879
Speaker 45: However, numerous sources have confirmed the tapes exist and that

2609
02:39:47,920 --> 02:39:49,760
they reveal more than one bomber.

2610
02:39:50,520 --> 02:39:53,440
Speaker 25: And I said, I want two other things from the FBI.

2611
02:39:53,559 --> 02:39:58,799
I want the tapes from the surveillance cameras leading up

2612
02:39:58,799 --> 02:40:01,399
to the Murral buildings, on the day bombing, on the

2613
02:40:01,440 --> 02:40:04,440
different buildings around the Marrolebilly, and I want the tapes

2614
02:40:04,719 --> 02:40:08,639
from the cameras on the murrlebuilding because I had received

2615
02:40:08,920 --> 02:40:13,719
a government document that said surveillance cameras show the bomb

2616
02:40:13,760 --> 02:40:18,319
detonating three minutes and six seconds after the suspects exited

2617
02:40:18,319 --> 02:40:24,280
the truck. Suspects, not one plural. The fight now is

2618
02:40:24,280 --> 02:40:28,360
over those tapes. They don't deny the exist, they just

2619
02:40:28,360 --> 02:40:29,440
say we can't find them.

2620
02:40:30,959 --> 02:40:31,120
Speaker 4: Now.

2621
02:40:31,159 --> 02:40:35,959
Speaker 25: The notion that this is the biggest crime the Bureau

2622
02:40:35,959 --> 02:40:42,040
had ever investigated at that point in time, the largest

2623
02:40:42,079 --> 02:40:46,200
mass murder in America history. The two most important pieces

2624
02:40:46,239 --> 02:40:49,520
of evidence you have, the rest of McVay and the

2625
02:40:49,600 --> 02:40:53,040
videotape showing McVey delivering the bomb to the Murror building.

2626
02:40:53,360 --> 02:40:58,159
Speaker 4: You can't find incredible.

2627
02:40:59,079 --> 02:41:03,440
Speaker 35: The enhanced thought shows a very distinct possibility of a

2628
02:41:03,479 --> 02:41:07,559
man standing behind that truck, and the time sequenced camera

2629
02:41:07,600 --> 02:41:11,440
took additional photographs. So will those additional photographs show there

2630
02:41:11,440 --> 02:41:14,000
was a man there? Will they show that he was alone?

2631
02:41:14,120 --> 02:41:16,399
Will it show it was the suspect Tom McVeigh. The

2632
02:41:16,399 --> 02:41:18,879
additional photographs in the trial should help point that out.

2633
02:41:19,360 --> 02:41:21,079
Speaker 20: I think one of the things that stands out to

2634
02:41:21,120 --> 02:41:25,079
me is the fact that during that first morning, while

2635
02:41:25,120 --> 02:41:28,600
we were being held at bay from being in recovery work.

2636
02:41:28,639 --> 02:41:31,920
There were FBI agents or at least ben and FBI

2637
02:41:32,079 --> 02:41:36,639
raid jackets dismantling the video cameras off the side of

2638
02:41:36,639 --> 02:41:37,040
the building.

2639
02:41:37,680 --> 02:41:44,040
Speaker 51: I'm Charlie Rose with Legend video transfer and the FBI

2640
02:41:44,319 --> 02:41:48,319
had employed me to duplicate a number of videos for

2641
02:41:48,440 --> 02:41:53,079
them shortly after the Murraor bombing. I was asked to

2642
02:41:53,520 --> 02:41:59,079
duplicate approximately four hundred tapes for the FBI. We had

2643
02:41:59,600 --> 02:42:04,920
to BI agents in the office. We had two studios

2644
02:42:04,920 --> 02:42:11,399
set up for duplication, and each FBI agent was required

2645
02:42:11,440 --> 02:42:14,440
to stay in the room with Each of us that

2646
02:42:14,520 --> 02:42:17,639
were in that room really didn't have the opportunity to

2647
02:42:17,680 --> 02:42:20,760
sit back and watch the videos. There's probably a lot

2648
02:42:20,799 --> 02:42:24,000
to learn, you know, from the videos that they saw.

2649
02:42:24,719 --> 02:42:29,079
Some of them are meaningless, but others, you know, could

2650
02:42:30,840 --> 02:42:37,040
make some powerful impact on what actually happened.

2651
02:42:38,079 --> 02:42:41,399
Speaker 30: The government will not release the film that was in

2652
02:42:41,440 --> 02:42:43,799
the video cameras on the front of the building that

2653
02:42:43,920 --> 02:42:47,440
would show whether I was accurate or not accurate.

2654
02:42:47,840 --> 02:42:50,360
Speaker 13: Of course, the other achilles heel is the videotapes of

2655
02:42:50,399 --> 02:42:52,879
the building itself from the different surveillance cameras that no

2656
02:42:52,959 --> 02:42:58,440
one's seen. If McVeigh was Lee Harvey McVeigh all by

2657
02:42:58,520 --> 02:43:01,879
himself the loan net with a truck. Then why don't

2658
02:43:01,879 --> 02:43:03,680
they show us the video tapes of the truck, show

2659
02:43:03,760 --> 02:43:05,600
us the videotapes of him getting out or was there

2660
02:43:05,600 --> 02:43:06,319
more than him.

2661
02:43:06,159 --> 02:43:06,639
Speaker 7: In the truck?

2662
02:43:07,000 --> 02:43:11,000
Speaker 23: There were like twenty twenty two films in the area

2663
02:43:11,079 --> 02:43:16,559
that were confiscated by the FBI that would have shown

2664
02:43:16,920 --> 02:43:20,200
the truck being pulled up, people getting out of the truck.

2665
02:43:20,200 --> 02:43:22,799
It would have shown what was going on at the

2666
02:43:22,799 --> 02:43:27,600
time the explosions took place, and obviously they confiscated those

2667
02:43:27,719 --> 02:43:33,159
And it didn't take much to figure out that the

2668
02:43:33,200 --> 02:43:35,440
federal authorities weren't trying to get to the truth.

2669
02:43:35,520 --> 02:43:37,040
Speaker 4: They seem to be covering up things.

2670
02:43:37,600 --> 02:43:42,239
Speaker 25: Their first objective is to protect the agency, not to

2671
02:43:42,280 --> 02:43:45,559
do what's right, not to do justice, not to serve

2672
02:43:45,600 --> 02:43:49,079
the American people. It's to protect themselves, and they will

2673
02:43:49,120 --> 02:43:51,159
do anything anything.

2674
02:43:50,799 --> 02:43:51,120
Speaker 4: To do that.

2675
02:44:00,159 --> 02:44:02,760
Speaker 19: Veigh was honorably discharged from the Army three years before

2676
02:44:02,799 --> 02:44:06,600
the bombing, leave him behind an exemplary service record. After

2677
02:44:06,639 --> 02:44:09,399
a brief but intense combat experience in the Persian Gulf War,

2678
02:44:09,920 --> 02:44:13,440
McVeigh tried out for the Special Forces. He pronounced himself

2679
02:44:13,520 --> 02:44:16,440
unable to continue just a few days into the testing

2680
02:44:16,840 --> 02:44:19,680
and returned to his unit demoralized and some say a

2681
02:44:19,799 --> 02:44:20,440
changed man.

2682
02:44:21,280 --> 02:44:25,120
Speaker 38: Through being able to see Timothy mcvay's letters to his

2683
02:44:25,159 --> 02:44:28,760
defense team, this is really behind the scenes stuff. Letters

2684
02:44:28,799 --> 02:44:33,520
to his family, the memos the defense team rights which

2685
02:44:33,559 --> 02:44:36,200
detail his mood from day to day, some of the

2686
02:44:36,239 --> 02:44:39,239
medical reports while he's in prison, which detail his thoughts.

2687
02:44:39,840 --> 02:44:41,920
On the one hand, you have the McVey who's mad

2688
02:44:41,959 --> 02:44:43,760
at the government. On the other hand, you have the

2689
02:44:43,840 --> 02:44:47,040
McVeigh who works for the government. The defense team themselves

2690
02:44:47,120 --> 02:44:52,079
could never obtain his full military records, and even though

2691
02:44:52,079 --> 02:44:53,680
they were ordered by a judge.

2692
02:44:54,239 --> 02:44:56,399
Speaker 13: Where does he turn up. He turns up in Buffalo,

2693
02:44:56,440 --> 02:44:59,760
New York. And while he's up there, he creates what's

2694
02:44:59,799 --> 02:45:03,079
not as a legend. Now legend is when you go

2695
02:45:03,680 --> 02:45:06,239
undercover or you get sheep dipped. Sheep dipped means you

2696
02:45:06,319 --> 02:45:09,840
change your identity, you change who you work for, and

2697
02:45:09,920 --> 02:45:13,000
become a new person, changes his personality up there, and

2698
02:45:13,000 --> 02:45:16,479
all of a sudden he's ranting and raving about the

2699
02:45:16,559 --> 02:45:19,520
Turner diaries and overthrowing the government and all this other

2700
02:45:19,600 --> 02:45:22,280
nonsense to where they're going. This guy's wacko. He works

2701
02:45:22,319 --> 02:45:25,280
up there six months and disappears. Where do we find

2702
02:45:25,319 --> 02:45:28,760
him again, going into militia meetings and doing the same thing,

2703
02:45:28,840 --> 02:45:29,959
making sure he's noticed.

2704
02:45:30,079 --> 02:45:32,639
Speaker 27: If you look at Lee Harvey Oswald and Tim McVeigh

2705
02:45:32,840 --> 02:45:36,000
and other patsy's, they're very similar. They're in the military,

2706
02:45:36,399 --> 02:45:38,360
they've got security clearances.

2707
02:45:39,520 --> 02:45:41,520
Speaker 19: McVeigh wrote a letter to his sister, who turned it

2708
02:45:41,559 --> 02:45:43,719
over to the FBI, in which he admits that he

2709
02:45:43,760 --> 02:45:46,799
was selected out of Special Forces training to participate in

2710
02:45:46,840 --> 02:45:50,280
covert operations, to help run drugs, to fund these operations,

2711
02:45:50,639 --> 02:45:52,680
and to assassinate security risks.

2712
02:45:53,479 --> 02:45:56,040
Speaker 28: Mire Bravado or was McVeigh telling the truth.

2713
02:45:56,920 --> 02:46:01,559
Speaker 38: The FBI had put wired tabs on the McVeigh family's

2714
02:46:01,719 --> 02:46:05,200
phone after the bombing, and so I'm reading this conversation

2715
02:46:05,959 --> 02:46:07,600
back and forth between his mother.

2716
02:46:07,399 --> 02:46:08,040
Speaker 31: And his sister.

2717
02:46:08,360 --> 02:46:10,879
Speaker 38: There's actually a few of these conversations where they say,

2718
02:46:11,760 --> 02:46:16,760
we don't understand why the FBI won't listen to us,

2719
02:46:16,799 --> 02:46:20,479
and why the media is reporting that Timothy McVeigh washed

2720
02:46:20,479 --> 02:46:23,680
out or dropped out as Special Forces. They're saying, no,

2721
02:46:24,200 --> 02:46:27,799
we were told that he was still active in the

2722
02:46:27,840 --> 02:46:31,840
military and that he was working on these covert missions, and.

2723
02:46:31,799 --> 02:46:34,120
Speaker 27: He told his family, He told many others Terry Nichols

2724
02:46:34,159 --> 02:46:37,239
to signed then aff of David that McVeigh believed he

2725
02:46:37,280 --> 02:46:40,159
was out there infiltrating militias and right wing grips and

2726
02:46:40,280 --> 02:46:42,920
was preparing to set him up. And then, of course

2727
02:46:42,959 --> 02:46:45,120
he later learned that he was the guy that got

2728
02:46:45,159 --> 02:46:45,639
set up.

2729
02:46:46,200 --> 02:46:48,639
Speaker 19: If McVeigh was working for the government, what are we

2730
02:46:48,719 --> 02:46:51,280
to make of the involvement of Terry Nichols, the only

2731
02:46:51,280 --> 02:46:53,159
convicted accomplice.

2732
02:46:53,479 --> 02:46:56,840
Speaker 25: When Nichols had been convicted were not given the death

2733
02:46:56,879 --> 02:47:01,719
penalty in federal court and in state court he could not.

2734
02:47:01,680 --> 02:47:08,840
Speaker 4: Be tried again. He wrote to Attorney General then Attorney General.

2735
02:47:08,639 --> 02:47:12,360
Speaker 25: Ashcroft and said, come and see me, Come and see me,

2736
02:47:12,559 --> 02:47:13,159
and I'll tell.

2737
02:47:13,000 --> 02:47:13,719
Speaker 4: You all about it.

2738
02:47:14,840 --> 02:47:18,120
Speaker 19: In his declaration, Nichols stated that crucial parts of this

2739
02:47:18,239 --> 02:47:21,639
terrorist attack remained hidden from the American people, especially the

2740
02:47:21,680 --> 02:47:25,120
identities of others unknown who collaborated with McVeigh and the bombing.

2741
02:47:25,920 --> 02:47:28,360
McVeigh told Nichols that he had been recruited to perform

2742
02:47:28,440 --> 02:47:31,959
undercover missions while in the US Army, always the good Soldier,

2743
02:47:32,200 --> 02:47:34,680
McVeigh revealed only one name in his chain of command,

2744
02:47:35,040 --> 02:47:38,559
Larry Potts, Assistant director of the FBI and the lead

2745
02:47:38,600 --> 02:47:41,639
agent on the Ruby Ridge catastrophe in nineteen ninety two,

2746
02:47:41,760 --> 02:47:44,280
in which a US marshal and fourteen year old Sam

2747
02:47:44,319 --> 02:47:48,680
Weaver and his mother, Vicki Weaver were killed. Larry Potts

2748
02:47:48,719 --> 02:47:50,799
later played an active role in the siege at Waco.

2749
02:47:51,600 --> 02:47:54,600
McVeigh was angry at Pots for going off script and

2750
02:47:54,680 --> 02:47:59,479
changing targets at the last minute. Another telling clue is

2751
02:47:59,520 --> 02:48:03,360
on Tim Vay's death certificate. Despite being officially out of

2752
02:48:03,399 --> 02:48:06,360
the military for nine years and having held many different

2753
02:48:06,399 --> 02:48:12,040
jobs since then, his listed occupation was US Army. So

2754
02:48:12,079 --> 02:48:14,520
why did Tim McVeigh take the fall for his accomplices.

2755
02:48:15,040 --> 02:48:19,120
Perhaps the intervention of a non psychological warfare expert explains

2756
02:48:19,120 --> 02:48:20,319
his silence till the end.

2757
02:48:21,399 --> 02:48:26,799
Speaker 38: The record clearly shows that doctor Johlly and West consulted

2758
02:48:26,840 --> 02:48:32,520
Timothy mcveigh's defense team. Doctor West had previously been psychiatrist

2759
02:48:32,760 --> 02:48:37,399
and consultant for Patty Hurst, Surround Staran and Jack Ruby.

2760
02:48:38,200 --> 02:48:40,719
Speaker 27: We know that Jolly and West was considered to be

2761
02:48:40,760 --> 02:48:44,760
the number two mind control expert in North American under

2762
02:48:44,840 --> 02:48:46,559
only doctor Ewing Cameron.

2763
02:48:47,159 --> 02:48:50,920
Speaker 38: Doctor West came under a lot of scrutiny during his

2764
02:48:51,040 --> 02:48:55,360
time as chief of Psychiaedriy in EUCLA because he was

2765
02:48:55,440 --> 02:49:01,600
proposing using prisoners, the general community, poor people, minorities as

2766
02:49:01,639 --> 02:49:05,559
test subjects. And West career continues to flourish through the

2767
02:49:05,600 --> 02:49:08,959
eighties and he continues his research into hypnosis, branches out

2768
02:49:08,959 --> 02:49:12,719
into terrorism and cults, even consulting and later writing about

2769
02:49:12,719 --> 02:49:13,600
the Waygo massacre.

2770
02:49:14,239 --> 02:49:17,600
Speaker 27: Doctor John Smith, that's even his real name, was the

2771
02:49:17,600 --> 02:49:21,959
protoge of doctor Joey and West, mister mind control, and

2772
02:49:22,239 --> 02:49:27,159
he was mcveigh's doctor in prison. Today it's reported that

2773
02:49:27,200 --> 02:49:29,479
he is one of the head psychiatrists, one of the

2774
02:49:29,520 --> 02:49:31,520
head doctors at Guantanamo Bay.

2775
02:49:31,879 --> 02:49:33,280
Speaker 7: The fact that you've got.

2776
02:49:33,079 --> 02:49:36,120
Speaker 27: The protoger of one of the fathers of modern mind

2777
02:49:36,159 --> 02:49:39,399
control now being the head of psychiatry at Wontanamo Bay,

2778
02:49:39,440 --> 02:49:43,120
which is an admitted mind control laboratory. That's even mainstream news.

2779
02:49:43,200 --> 02:49:46,200
I mean, you couldn't make this up in a spine novel.

2780
02:49:46,479 --> 02:49:49,200
Truth is always stranger than fiction, and it's all hidden

2781
02:49:49,200 --> 02:49:49,879
in plain view.

2782
02:49:56,559 --> 02:49:58,440
Speaker 19: Was the bombing the product of a sting gone out

2783
02:49:58,440 --> 02:50:01,000
of control, with McVeigh taking blame for a series of

2784
02:50:01,040 --> 02:50:01,959
government failures.

2785
02:50:03,280 --> 02:50:06,200
Speaker 23: They kind of set up a sting operation. It appears

2786
02:50:06,239 --> 02:50:10,799
to me that went back. They thought they would stop,

2787
02:50:12,280 --> 02:50:15,920
you know, the efforts of Strasmeyer, Malara and others through

2788
02:50:15,959 --> 02:50:19,840
allowing City. I eventually talked to this Senate staffer and

2789
02:50:19,879 --> 02:50:23,360
he informed me that the Oklahoma City bombing was actually

2790
02:50:23,360 --> 02:50:27,040
a sting operation that went wrong, and that the effort

2791
02:50:27,040 --> 02:50:29,399
to cover it up was because they were not able

2792
02:50:29,399 --> 02:50:33,079
to stop the sting operation when it fell apart, In

2793
02:50:33,239 --> 02:50:35,719
that they weren't able to stop it right before it

2794
02:50:35,760 --> 02:50:39,399
took place and proclaim to the public how great they

2795
02:50:39,440 --> 02:50:42,920
were so they could get new funding for the ATF

2796
02:50:43,000 --> 02:50:46,200
because the ATF had lost so much credibility due to

2797
02:50:46,280 --> 02:50:48,200
the Randy Weaver situation.

2798
02:50:50,000 --> 02:50:53,040
Speaker 25: I don't know if anybody will ever know. I know

2799
02:50:53,120 --> 02:50:55,760
my brother was killed, and often asked why why?

2800
02:50:55,879 --> 02:50:56,079
Speaker 4: Why?

2801
02:50:56,120 --> 02:50:58,280
Speaker 25: I know my brother was killed for information he didn't

2802
02:50:58,319 --> 02:51:02,799
have about the bombing. Why the people in the mirrorbiling

2803
02:51:02,840 --> 02:51:06,479
were killed? As I said, I don't know if they

2804
02:51:06,520 --> 02:51:11,879
intended it or it just got away from them.

2805
02:51:11,920 --> 02:51:13,760
Speaker 4: God, I hate to think that they did it on purpose.

2806
02:51:15,639 --> 02:51:18,280
Speaker 19: Perhaps it was a deliberate attack by a criminal element

2807
02:51:18,360 --> 02:51:21,360
in this government using the range of power to execute

2808
02:51:21,399 --> 02:51:22,319
and cover up their crime.

2809
02:51:23,479 --> 02:51:26,280
Speaker 38: In two thousand and six, the American Behavioral Science has

2810
02:51:26,319 --> 02:51:32,319
published the whole journal on this concept that's being developed,

2811
02:51:32,319 --> 02:51:36,239
called a state crime against democracy SCAD for short. There's

2812
02:51:36,239 --> 02:51:44,840
a recognition, a growing recognition among academia that oftentimes people

2813
02:51:44,920 --> 02:51:49,760
have not pursued culpability into elite crimes for the fear

2814
02:51:49,840 --> 02:51:53,000
of being called a conspiracy theorist. When there is a

2815
02:51:53,040 --> 02:51:57,319
state crime against the people, what generally happens is that

2816
02:51:57,360 --> 02:52:02,159
inquiries into these crimes tend to be highly controlled, tightly framed,

2817
02:52:02,559 --> 02:52:06,799
and I'm totally reliant on agencies who stand to be

2818
02:52:06,799 --> 02:52:08,639
embarrassed by investigations.

2819
02:52:09,079 --> 02:52:11,120
Speaker 27: It's now been to classified that the Gulf of Tonkin

2820
02:52:11,120 --> 02:52:13,959
in nineteen sixty four to get the United States fully

2821
02:52:14,000 --> 02:52:17,040
committed into the Vietnam War, was a staged event, and

2822
02:52:17,040 --> 02:52:20,479
those LBJ tapes have been released. Or days before McNamara

2823
02:52:20,559 --> 02:52:22,760
is telling him on the phone how they're going to

2824
02:52:22,760 --> 02:52:24,719
stage the event to get the United States into the

2825
02:52:24,760 --> 02:52:26,760
war and what he would need to say at those

2826
02:52:26,799 --> 02:52:31,280
press conferences. In early nineteen ninety five, the entire United

2827
02:52:31,280 --> 02:52:36,959
States was politically awakening. The population was angry about Waco,

2828
02:52:37,719 --> 02:52:41,639
they were angry about the United States losing its sovereignty

2829
02:52:41,719 --> 02:52:46,239
and Bill Clinton trying to pass anti Second Amendment legislation.

2830
02:52:46,639 --> 02:52:47,879
Speaker 7: The federal government.

2831
02:52:47,600 --> 02:52:50,639
Speaker 27: Was forced to basically come in and create a crisis

2832
02:52:50,719 --> 02:52:53,719
so they could demonize anyone who thought the government was

2833
02:52:53,760 --> 02:52:55,280
too big or out of control.

2834
02:52:56,520 --> 02:52:57,760
Speaker 7: In nineteen ninety four.

2835
02:52:57,840 --> 02:53:01,200
Speaker 27: In nineteen ninety five, the Congress had tried unsuccessfully to

2836
02:53:01,239 --> 02:53:05,760
pass their Omnibus Crime Bill that expanded federal jurisdiction that

2837
02:53:06,239 --> 02:53:08,639
went after the Second Amendment, that was going to create

2838
02:53:08,680 --> 02:53:13,079
all these new federal agencies to spy on the American people.

2839
02:53:13,319 --> 02:53:14,879
And that was one of the reasons that Oklahoma and

2840
02:53:14,920 --> 02:53:17,920
other states were upset. They understood this was totally unconstitutional

2841
02:53:18,200 --> 02:53:22,520
and a huge federal overreach and it violated the Tenth Amendment.

2842
02:53:23,000 --> 02:53:27,559
But after the Oklahoma City bombing tragedy, suddenly they were

2843
02:53:27,559 --> 02:53:31,840
able to rename it as the Anti Terrorism Effective Death

2844
02:53:31,840 --> 02:53:35,159
Penalty Act, and that was able to sell through well.

2845
02:53:35,200 --> 02:53:36,760
Speaker 42: I think one of the things we'll be seeing over

2846
02:53:36,840 --> 02:53:39,920
the next few weeks and months a new legislation both

2847
02:53:40,000 --> 02:53:44,000
to deal with domestic groups and international terrorism. There's already

2848
02:53:44,120 --> 02:53:47,879
one bill, the Omnibus Terrorism Act of nineteen nineteen ninety

2849
02:53:47,879 --> 02:53:50,719
five that's on the cards. One of the dangers is

2850
02:53:50,760 --> 02:53:52,639
that we stepped a little bit too far, and there's

2851
02:53:53,120 --> 02:53:54,399
this bill is very.

2852
02:53:54,239 --> 02:53:59,399
Speaker 27: Controversial, but we see amazing parallels between Oklahoma City and

2853
02:53:59,520 --> 02:54:02,440
nine eleven. And we see it also being used as

2854
02:54:02,520 --> 02:54:06,680
a mass conditioning tool to launch a new war in

2855
02:54:06,680 --> 02:54:09,280
the case of Oklahoma City, a war against the American people,

2856
02:54:09,440 --> 02:54:11,719
in the case of nine to eleven, a war against

2857
02:54:11,760 --> 02:54:14,959
the Middle East, and an invasion for resources.

2858
02:54:15,600 --> 02:54:19,200
Speaker 24: President Obama's chief of staff Romamanuel recently said that you

2859
02:54:19,239 --> 02:54:22,680
can never let a good crisis go to waste. This

2860
02:54:22,799 --> 02:54:27,239
is an example of real politic taken to its extreme.

2861
02:54:27,920 --> 02:54:31,239
We can quote the words of Robert Shapiro, former Clinton adviser,

2862
02:54:31,399 --> 02:54:35,760
recently wrote an editorial that the only thing that can

2863
02:54:35,799 --> 02:54:40,680
save the Obama administration is another terror attack like Oaklhoma

2864
02:54:40,719 --> 02:54:43,479
City or nine to eleven. So they think of us

2865
02:54:43,520 --> 02:54:44,360
as expendable.

2866
02:54:44,799 --> 02:54:45,680
Speaker 4: They're willing to.

2867
02:54:45,719 --> 02:54:50,159
Speaker 24: Ride our ashes, stand in our graves to preserve their position.

2868
02:54:51,000 --> 02:54:53,600
This is an example of the noble lie.

2869
02:54:53,959 --> 02:54:56,799
Speaker 27: And in the months and weeks building up to the

2870
02:54:56,840 --> 02:55:00,000
Oklahoma City bombing, there was incredible conditioning on the news

2871
02:55:00,159 --> 02:55:03,399
is these people are scared of the federal government. They're terrorists,

2872
02:55:03,399 --> 02:55:05,399
they're going to kill you, they're going to bomb you.

2873
02:55:05,399 --> 02:55:08,440
You watch it's gonna happen. And then sure enough, it happened.

2874
02:55:08,760 --> 02:55:11,120
And then you look at the evidence and government and

2875
02:55:11,159 --> 02:55:13,799
black opp fingerprints are all over it. The establishment is

2876
02:55:13,799 --> 02:55:18,000
going to have trouble in the future orchestrating further atrocities

2877
02:55:18,040 --> 02:55:21,319
like Oklahoma City, because the public is now really getting

2878
02:55:21,360 --> 02:55:24,639
wives of their tricks. Oklahoma City is one of the

2879
02:55:24,680 --> 02:55:27,879
best examples we've got where we can prove clearly that

2880
02:55:27,920 --> 02:55:30,719
the official story is a fraud, that the government was

2881
02:55:30,840 --> 02:55:34,239
involved and is using it to demonize good Americans.

2882
02:55:34,840 --> 02:55:38,440
Speaker 19: April nineteen, nineteen ninety five. We'll live on in history

2883
02:55:38,520 --> 02:55:41,120
as a reminder that we must all take an active

2884
02:55:41,200 --> 02:55:44,920
role in holding our leaders accountable. Its legacy and lessons

2885
02:55:45,040 --> 02:55:48,399
must be rooted in truth, not myth. The victims demand

2886
02:55:48,479 --> 02:55:51,959
truth and justice. We have all witnessed firsthand the harsh

2887
02:55:52,040 --> 02:55:55,600
reality of a government's ability to manifest its will upon

2888
02:55:55,639 --> 02:55:58,559
the people, and it's up to the people to deprive

2889
02:55:58,680 --> 02:56:01,799
governments of the power to commit crimes and profit from

2890
02:56:01,799 --> 02:56:02,239
the lives.

2891
02:56:03,879 --> 02:56:07,680
Speaker 27: It is every patriotic American's duty, every man, woman, and

2892
02:56:07,760 --> 02:56:12,399
child's responsibility to research the facts contained in this film,

2893
02:56:12,399 --> 02:56:15,840
to verify for yourself that this information is true, that

2894
02:56:16,000 --> 02:56:16,840
the rabbit hole.

2895
02:56:16,680 --> 02:56:20,319
Speaker 7: Goes even deeper, and then take action to bring the.

2896
02:56:20,280 --> 02:56:52,239
Speaker 27: Criminals that perpetrated this attack to justice.

2897
02:56:54,040 --> 02:57:00,159
Speaker 3: You are listening to the Fact Hunter Radio network, The

2898
02:57:00,200 --> 02:57:00,799
Facts Mammy