WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:03.799 Oh hey, hey, up top. This is an encore presentation 2 00:00:04.000 --> 00:00:07.639 of one of the most favorite episodes of ologies we 3 00:00:07.719 --> 00:00:10.800 have ever done, because we all want to know what's 4 00:00:10.880 --> 00:00:14.640 in me? Why am I this? And I'm taking a 5 00:00:14.720 --> 00:00:17.800 few weeks off. If you have been following what's been 6 00:00:17.839 --> 00:00:23.280 going on in my life and my family, your Grandpad 7 00:00:23.320 --> 00:00:28.199 has passed into the beyond. So I'll just come out 8 00:00:28.199 --> 00:00:32.479 and say right in the beginning, my dad, Larry Pete Ward, 9 00:00:33.799 --> 00:00:39.520 passed away on Friday, July eighth after a long illness 10 00:00:39.520 --> 00:00:42.200 with multiple maloma, which is a cancer recover. In the 11 00:00:42.200 --> 00:00:46.880 hematology episode, if you're thinking of him or thinking of us, 12 00:00:47.840 --> 00:00:51.759 people have been posting a hashtag critter pick for Grandpad. 13 00:00:52.039 --> 00:00:54.399 He loved sending pictures of critters in the morning to 14 00:00:54.479 --> 00:00:57.880 us every morning and all day, and that has really 15 00:00:57.880 --> 00:01:02.000 meant a lot to me. Tiny ice cream cones, we're 16 00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:04.439 one of his favorites. We sat around eating those a lot. 17 00:01:05.120 --> 00:01:08.560 Have a tiny ice cream cone for your Grandpod if 18 00:01:08.599 --> 00:01:10.560 you feel like donating anywhere, If you've got a local 19 00:01:10.599 --> 00:01:13.680 wildlife rescue. He loved critters, maybe help them out a 20 00:01:13.680 --> 00:01:17.599 little bit. And the IMF myloma dot Org has been 21 00:01:17.599 --> 00:01:19.799 really amazing to us and giving us so much information 22 00:01:19.920 --> 00:01:23.040 through his illness. So if I talk too much about it, 23 00:01:23.040 --> 00:01:25.840 I will start crying a lot. I'll talk a little 24 00:01:25.840 --> 00:01:27.840 bit more about it at the outro. But here is 25 00:01:27.879 --> 00:01:30.319 an encore presentation of a great episode. I hope you 26 00:01:30.359 --> 00:01:33.680 like it. Oh hey, it's your all roommate who always 27 00:01:33.680 --> 00:01:36.400 subscribe to magazines that you read. But we're too embarrassed 28 00:01:36.400 --> 00:01:40.560 to buy Alli Ward back with another episode. Apologies. Okay, 29 00:01:40.719 --> 00:01:44.439 so please imagine me right now. I'm worrying a Sherlock 30 00:01:44.480 --> 00:01:48.040 Holmes flappy wool overcoat that smells like a wet dog 31 00:01:48.079 --> 00:01:51.040 in the rain. Also, I have a Walrus mustache and 32 00:01:51.120 --> 00:01:54.120 a decorative pipe because we're about to investigate the mysteries 33 00:01:54.680 --> 00:01:57.680 of the psyche? What makes you you? Who are you? 34 00:01:58.040 --> 00:01:59.840 Who am I? Why are we like this? 35 00:02:00.040 --> 00:02:00.159 Yes? 36 00:02:00.680 --> 00:02:04.040 First, let's show some goddamn gratitude for one second and 37 00:02:04.079 --> 00:02:07.439 say thank you to everyone on Patreon who supports a 38 00:02:07.480 --> 00:02:09.960 show for a dollar or more a month. Also, all 39 00:02:09.960 --> 00:02:13.199 the folks getting ologies merch at ologiesmarch dot com, and 40 00:02:13.280 --> 00:02:16.439 all the nice people who hit subscribe and who rate 41 00:02:16.520 --> 00:02:20.520 the show, who lead reviews like a friendliness fairy in 42 00:02:20.560 --> 00:02:23.199 the night. For me, to read, For example, this week 43 00:02:23.400 --> 00:02:26.719 from Lala Jujou, who says I love Ali Ward. Thank you, 44 00:02:26.759 --> 00:02:29.400 Lala Jijeu, I love you too. I also love science 45 00:02:29.439 --> 00:02:31.400 and learning. When I heard about this, it was better 46 00:02:31.439 --> 00:02:33.280 than I could have imagined. I can learn about different 47 00:02:33.280 --> 00:02:35.560 ologies while I'm at work or getting ready for work. 48 00:02:35.719 --> 00:02:37.680 Once my eleven year old daughter got wind of this 49 00:02:37.719 --> 00:02:40.439 podcast from me, she started listening to I never told 50 00:02:40.479 --> 00:02:42.919 her to, she just listened on her own. So Lala Juju, 51 00:02:42.919 --> 00:02:44.520 thank you for sharing the gift of ologies with your 52 00:02:44.560 --> 00:02:47.240 eleven year old. I'm very sorry that I am teaching 53 00:02:47.360 --> 00:02:51.840 how to swear okay on word ward personality psychology. I 54 00:02:51.919 --> 00:02:54.919 really wish that there was a weirder documented name for 55 00:02:54.960 --> 00:02:58.000 this ology, and for a second I thought the academic 56 00:02:58.080 --> 00:03:01.599 study of personology could apply. I was like, yes, But 57 00:03:01.719 --> 00:03:06.080 the guy who coined personology, Henry Murray, essentially pete on 58 00:03:06.120 --> 00:03:08.639 the word to make it his forever, and he had 59 00:03:08.639 --> 00:03:11.319 a really heavy hand in founding the study of personality. 60 00:03:11.560 --> 00:03:15.000 That's great, but he's also noted as having done some hella, 61 00:03:15.039 --> 00:03:18.319 sketchy and maybe damaging experiments on a young man named 62 00:03:18.439 --> 00:03:21.599 Ted Kaczinski, who later became a terrorist known as a unibarmer. 63 00:03:21.800 --> 00:03:26.319 Doctor Murray also linked to government mind control experiments mk Ultra, 64 00:03:26.879 --> 00:03:29.479 not to be confused with michelob Ultra. So my point 65 00:03:29.560 --> 00:03:32.840 is personology was off the table for this episode title. 66 00:03:32.879 --> 00:03:35.639 We had to go with the clunkier, well respected and 67 00:03:35.719 --> 00:03:40.680 academically recognized personality psychology. So this ologist had been on 68 00:03:40.719 --> 00:03:44.400 my list for months, and one chilly December day, I 69 00:03:44.479 --> 00:03:47.080 made my way to UC Davis to meet her on 70 00:03:47.120 --> 00:03:50.639 a corner near campus and I drove by one minute 71 00:03:50.680 --> 00:03:53.039 late and I screamed out the window, hold on, I 72 00:03:53.120 --> 00:03:55.919 have to park, thinking it would take like one second 73 00:03:55.960 --> 00:03:58.120 to park because school wasn't even in session. It was 74 00:03:58.120 --> 00:04:02.000 December twenty sixth, but the city was under construction, so 75 00:04:02.080 --> 00:04:04.680 I had to circle the block maybe fifty two times, 76 00:04:04.719 --> 00:04:06.759 and then I was seven minutes late to the corner. 77 00:04:06.840 --> 00:04:10.080 I felt like a very bad, not conscientious person, but 78 00:04:10.159 --> 00:04:12.400 she was so cool about it. We walked to her office, 79 00:04:12.520 --> 00:04:15.120 where she is a professor in the Department of Psychology. 80 00:04:15.479 --> 00:04:18.480 She's also been a fellow at the Center for Advanced 81 00:04:18.480 --> 00:04:21.680 Study in the Behavioral Sciences at Stanford University, and her 82 00:04:21.720 --> 00:04:26.480 focus is on people's own awareness of their personalities and 83 00:04:26.560 --> 00:04:30.680 how personality and relationships influence your life and make it 84 00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:34.319 suck more or less. So she's co authored papers with 85 00:04:34.399 --> 00:04:37.439 titles like others sometimes know us better than we know 86 00:04:37.519 --> 00:04:41.480 ourselves and this salty goodness. You probably think this paper's 87 00:04:41.519 --> 00:04:45.720 about you. Narcissist perception of their personality and reputation. She 88 00:04:45.839 --> 00:04:48.079 studies all the stuff that if you were sitting next 89 00:04:48.120 --> 00:04:49.920 to her on an airplane, you'd be like, tell me 90 00:04:50.040 --> 00:04:53.279 everything before this flight to Japan lands. So we chatted 91 00:04:53.360 --> 00:05:00.279 about first impressions, introverts, extroverts, amberrots, narcissists, psychopaths, whether not 92 00:05:00.439 --> 00:05:06.199 psychology researchers believe self reported data, how parenting affects personalities, 93 00:05:06.240 --> 00:05:09.399 and if you're screwing your kids up, what personalities work 94 00:05:09.480 --> 00:05:13.439 best together? If astrology is in any way on point 95 00:05:13.839 --> 00:05:17.000 some textbooks you'd actually want to read? And I essentially 96 00:05:17.040 --> 00:05:21.000 ask her ten different ways, why am I so get 97 00:05:21.000 --> 00:05:24.120 comfy and gaze into your brain with someone I wish 98 00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:27.360 I could call a personologist, but that Murray dude made 99 00:05:27.360 --> 00:05:29.560 it awkward for everybody, So instead we'll just use the 100 00:05:29.600 --> 00:05:35.720 more common and scientifically acceptable personality psychologist. Doctor Samine Vizier. 101 00:05:54.360 --> 00:05:57.120 Samin Vizier, Doctor. 102 00:05:59.000 --> 00:06:02.720 Of students to call me my first name, so anything's fine. 103 00:06:02.800 --> 00:06:03.000 Yeah. 104 00:06:04.319 --> 00:06:07.120 Do you think there are they uncomfortable with it at first? 105 00:06:07.160 --> 00:06:08.199 Like it's not where of them are? 106 00:06:08.399 --> 00:06:11.560 Yeah? Yeah, but I find that well because of my personality, 107 00:06:11.639 --> 00:06:13.120 I think I have to worry more about not being 108 00:06:13.120 --> 00:06:16.560 approachable enough rather than being too like casual or not 109 00:06:16.600 --> 00:06:19.199 having enough boundaries. So for different people, different things work. 110 00:06:19.240 --> 00:06:21.360 But for me asking telling them they don't have to 111 00:06:21.399 --> 00:06:22.720 call me by my first name, but telling them that 112 00:06:22.759 --> 00:06:25.879 they can, like reduces that distance a little bit, which 113 00:06:26.279 --> 00:06:27.759 tends to be the bigger challenge for me. 114 00:06:28.319 --> 00:06:30.720 And you said because of your personality, which gets us 115 00:06:30.879 --> 00:06:34.240 right into work, because you study not only personality psychology, 116 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:37.600 but also people's own awareness and knowledge of their own personality. 117 00:06:37.639 --> 00:06:39.240 So you seem to know yours pretty well. 118 00:06:39.319 --> 00:06:41.319 I know some aspects of mine. I'm sure they have 119 00:06:41.360 --> 00:06:44.199 blind spots too. Yeah. We have this expression and that 120 00:06:44.240 --> 00:06:46.240 could be called me search, which is like you study 121 00:06:46.639 --> 00:06:49.800 what you're bad at. So I think I'm probably overall 122 00:06:49.839 --> 00:06:52.120 average on self knowledge, but I know I have some 123 00:06:52.199 --> 00:06:53.319 blind spots for sure. 124 00:06:54.120 --> 00:06:57.360 What did you start to notice about your personality when 125 00:06:57.360 --> 00:06:58.279 you got into this work. 126 00:06:59.879 --> 00:07:02.439 I think I was really fascinated by the differences between 127 00:07:02.480 --> 00:07:04.879 how people see themselves and how others see them And 128 00:07:04.959 --> 00:07:06.560 I think it's really rare that we find out how 129 00:07:06.560 --> 00:07:08.639 other people see us. I remember when I was in 130 00:07:08.720 --> 00:07:10.160 high school. At the end of high school, when my 131 00:07:10.199 --> 00:07:12.800 friends wrote in my yearbook, I always admired you because 132 00:07:12.800 --> 00:07:14.879 you don't care what people think, and I was like, 133 00:07:14.959 --> 00:07:18.360 what do people think? So I had no idea that 134 00:07:18.399 --> 00:07:20.319 I came across as not caring what people thought, and 135 00:07:20.360 --> 00:07:22.560 I was like, well, maybe I care less than other people, 136 00:07:22.600 --> 00:07:24.360 Like I experienced myself as carrying a lot what other 137 00:07:24.399 --> 00:07:27.399 people think. But then I realized, well, I don't wear makeup, 138 00:07:27.480 --> 00:07:29.759 I don't like put a lot of thought into my clothing. 139 00:07:29.839 --> 00:07:31.720 So if I really cared what people think, maybe I 140 00:07:31.720 --> 00:07:34.959 would have been doing those things. So then I was like, oh, maybe, 141 00:07:35.000 --> 00:07:37.959 like relative to other people, I actually do care less 142 00:07:37.959 --> 00:07:41.360 what people think. So it's like, but like, yearbooks are 143 00:07:41.360 --> 00:07:43.879 like one of the rare places where people sometimes tell 144 00:07:43.920 --> 00:07:45.240 you a little bit about what they think of you. 145 00:07:45.480 --> 00:07:47.079 I actually found a note. My best friend and I 146 00:07:47.120 --> 00:07:48.759 in high school used to write each other notes. You know, 147 00:07:48.800 --> 00:07:50.519 we shared a locker when we leave each other notes 148 00:07:50.519 --> 00:07:52.720 in our locker, and she wrote me a note sophomore 149 00:07:52.800 --> 00:07:55.160 year of high school, and it said, you asked me 150 00:07:55.319 --> 00:07:58.240 at the party on Saturday what I thought of your personality? 151 00:07:58.279 --> 00:07:59.480 And so I want to tell you what I think 152 00:07:59.480 --> 00:08:01.040 you're a personal and she's like, you're a nine out 153 00:08:01.079 --> 00:08:03.000 of ten, but don't worry, like you wouldn't want to 154 00:08:03.000 --> 00:08:05.000 be a ten out of ten because those people are annoying. 155 00:08:05.519 --> 00:08:07.480 And it was just really funny that apparently, when I 156 00:08:07.480 --> 00:08:09.480 was fourteen or fifteen years old, I was asking my 157 00:08:09.519 --> 00:08:12.639 best friend what she thought of my personality. It was crazy, you. 158 00:08:12.600 --> 00:08:14.480 Were doing personality research in your locker. 159 00:08:14.639 --> 00:08:17.000 Yeah, yeah, it's so funny. It was so funny when 160 00:08:17.040 --> 00:08:17.399 I found that. 161 00:08:18.160 --> 00:08:20.519 Did she say what that docked point was for? 162 00:08:21.240 --> 00:08:22.800 No, I don't know. I mean, so then she went 163 00:08:22.879 --> 00:08:24.560 on to tell me more specific things, because like nine 164 00:08:24.600 --> 00:08:26.920 out of ten doesn't really mean anything. But I don't 165 00:08:26.959 --> 00:08:29.000 remember now. I actually took a picture of it and 166 00:08:29.040 --> 00:08:31.160 have a PDF so that I don't ever lose it, 167 00:08:31.199 --> 00:08:32.840 so it'd be interesting to go back and look. But 168 00:08:32.879 --> 00:08:35.240 I don't remember what the specific criticisms were. There were 169 00:08:35.279 --> 00:08:36.480 some they weren't mean or anything. 170 00:08:36.759 --> 00:08:39.039 Okay, side note, So I sent Samine a note to 171 00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:41.639 ask if she ever found that pdf, and she emailed 172 00:08:41.679 --> 00:08:46.159 me right back with the pdf itself. What a time 173 00:08:46.240 --> 00:08:49.759 capsule of vulnerability. I love her, so of course I 174 00:08:49.840 --> 00:08:51.559 read it. So here are some of the things that 175 00:08:51.559 --> 00:08:54.960 her friend Jarlyn Hand wrote on a greeting card that 176 00:08:55.080 --> 00:08:58.320 was a nineteen ninety five Dot Matrix picture of a turkey. 177 00:08:58.679 --> 00:09:01.759 So an excerpt. I think you're very good at understanding people, 178 00:09:01.759 --> 00:09:04.919 but sometimes a little too harsh in your judgment. You're spirited, 179 00:09:05.120 --> 00:09:07.799 it said. You motivate people, and you're a good sport 180 00:09:07.840 --> 00:09:11.440 about things. You're trustworthy and honest and one important quality, 181 00:09:11.600 --> 00:09:14.559 your morals are wonderful. Another great thing I like about you, 182 00:09:14.559 --> 00:09:18.240 You're always learning about yourself and growing. Your influence in 183 00:09:18.320 --> 00:09:20.440 friendship is part of what makes me me. And I 184 00:09:20.519 --> 00:09:23.240 have to thank you because I like myself and your 185 00:09:23.279 --> 00:09:25.320 friendship has meant a lot to me over the years. 186 00:09:25.720 --> 00:09:26.200 Oh. 187 00:09:26.320 --> 00:09:28.879 Not only is this an honest and sweet ass letter 188 00:09:28.960 --> 00:09:31.759 from a best friend, but how precious to see that 189 00:09:31.879 --> 00:09:36.039 personality psychology and how people see themselves is something that 190 00:09:36.159 --> 00:09:40.720 Samin has been low key researching since the dot matrix days. Also, 191 00:09:41.320 --> 00:09:43.480 this prompted me to look back at some old school 192 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:45.799 papers and I found an old yearbook of mine with 193 00:09:45.960 --> 00:09:48.759 inscriptions that were like you're weird but fun, I guess, 194 00:09:49.080 --> 00:09:52.000 and one from a guy named Eric in my science class, who, 195 00:09:52.399 --> 00:09:55.759 in the fashion of middle management, inscribed, here's a piece 196 00:09:55.799 --> 00:09:58.039 of advice. Try to calm down. You always seem to 197 00:09:58.080 --> 00:10:00.960 be going in fast forward, so nothing's changed. 198 00:10:01.320 --> 00:10:02.000 Oh my god. 199 00:10:02.279 --> 00:10:04.879 I think that that's something that so many people want 200 00:10:04.960 --> 00:10:08.320 to know. How do others see them versus how they 201 00:10:08.399 --> 00:10:12.000 see themselves? And did you grow up, you know, earlier 202 00:10:12.080 --> 00:10:13.960 than high school thinking about this or was it really 203 00:10:14.000 --> 00:10:15.840 when you started to get around peers and go through 204 00:10:15.840 --> 00:10:17.200 adolescens that you start thinking about it. 205 00:10:17.320 --> 00:10:19.639 Yeah, that's a good question, thank you. I mean I 206 00:10:19.919 --> 00:10:21.440 grew up pretty close to my brother. We were one 207 00:10:21.759 --> 00:10:23.879 one year apart in school, so I think I always 208 00:10:23.960 --> 00:10:27.000 like looked at differences between him and me, and like 209 00:10:27.039 --> 00:10:29.080 within our families we had like kind of different roles 210 00:10:29.080 --> 00:10:31.039 and personalities. Now that we're adults, I see that were 211 00:10:31.039 --> 00:10:33.759 actually really really similar compared to like the broader population. 212 00:10:34.840 --> 00:10:36.759 But yeah, it was always interesting to me, like the 213 00:10:36.799 --> 00:10:38.600 things that he was scared of and I wasn't, or 214 00:10:38.720 --> 00:10:42.919 vice versa, So I think it was on my radar 215 00:10:43.399 --> 00:10:45.480 earlier on. But I think it becomes really relevant when 216 00:10:45.519 --> 00:10:47.559 you have like friend groups and who doesn't get invited 217 00:10:47.639 --> 00:10:50.039 to the party and why, and you know, what do 218 00:10:50.080 --> 00:10:51.879 people think of you? What's your role and your friend 219 00:10:51.879 --> 00:10:52.559 group and all that. 220 00:10:53.000 --> 00:10:55.360 When did you start steering your career that way? 221 00:10:55.440 --> 00:10:57.600 I took a personality site class and had a really 222 00:10:57.600 --> 00:11:00.399 good teacher and a really good textbook, So I think 223 00:11:00.440 --> 00:11:02.799 it was that class in particular that got me into it. 224 00:11:03.600 --> 00:11:08.360 Did you ever take those personality quizzes in magazines or yeah, definitely? 225 00:11:10.000 --> 00:11:11.639 Is there any merit to those at all? 226 00:11:13.440 --> 00:11:15.799 Probably not, or if there is, it's probably by accident. 227 00:11:15.840 --> 00:11:18.320 It's actually not that hard to write a valid personality quiz, 228 00:11:18.360 --> 00:11:21.679 so the ones that don't seem completely ridiculous probably actually 229 00:11:21.720 --> 00:11:24.320 do have merit. So if it's a test of your 230 00:11:24.360 --> 00:11:25.840 extra version and it asks if you like to go 231 00:11:25.879 --> 00:11:27.519 to parties, if you like to hang out with people, 232 00:11:27.600 --> 00:11:30.159 that's probably pretty valid. But if it's a test of 233 00:11:30.200 --> 00:11:33.960 your extraversion it asked you like Bernese mountain dogs or chiuahas, 234 00:11:34.120 --> 00:11:36.440 that's probably not a valid measure of your extroversion. 235 00:11:36.799 --> 00:11:40.039 That is what we call bullshit ps. If you wanted 236 00:11:40.039 --> 00:11:43.480 to take a bullshit quiz. Oh, Oh, there's plenty waiting 237 00:11:43.519 --> 00:11:47.320 for you, such as buzzfeeds, what type of sandwich are you? 238 00:11:47.919 --> 00:11:51.480 Which nineties cartoon series are you? What piece of Ikea 239 00:11:51.600 --> 00:11:55.279 furniture are you? Or living these your choice in late 240 00:11:55.399 --> 00:11:59.440 night snacks will reveal your dominant personality type, or which 241 00:11:59.480 --> 00:12:02.679 Megan mar are you? Zimbia has A are you Robin 242 00:12:02.720 --> 00:12:07.039 Williams Genie? Or will Smith Genie? And finally buzzfeeds, which 243 00:12:07.120 --> 00:12:08.360 BuzzFeed quizz are you? 244 00:12:09.039 --> 00:12:09.200 So? 245 00:12:09.440 --> 00:12:14.320 How does some means methodology differ from these insightful surveys? 246 00:12:14.679 --> 00:12:18.440 And so when you're doing research on personalities, what is 247 00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:21.480 that involved? Are you asking people about their own personalities? 248 00:12:21.559 --> 00:12:24.039 Or are you grabbing their best friend and asking what's 249 00:12:24.080 --> 00:12:24.559 their deal? 250 00:12:24.679 --> 00:12:24.759 Like? 251 00:12:24.799 --> 00:12:26.080 How are you getting the data? 252 00:12:26.320 --> 00:12:28.120 Yeah, it's all of the above. So we try to 253 00:12:28.159 --> 00:12:30.240 get every measurement we can think of, because none of 254 00:12:30.320 --> 00:12:32.759 them is like a direct pipeline, right, There's no like 255 00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:36.240 pure measure of someone's personality. So we try to get 256 00:12:36.279 --> 00:12:37.840 We ask them what they're like, We give them a 257 00:12:37.919 --> 00:12:41.320 questionnaire with you know, dozens or sometimes hundreds of questions 258 00:12:41.360 --> 00:12:44.000 about their personality, and then we give a similar questionnaire 259 00:12:44.039 --> 00:12:46.240 to their friends or family members whoever they let us 260 00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:49.480 contact and ask those people to describe the person on 261 00:12:49.519 --> 00:12:52.480 the same kind of questionnaire. We also try to get 262 00:12:52.679 --> 00:12:55.399 something independent of both them and their friends or family 263 00:12:55.639 --> 00:12:57.320 so that we can try to gauge who's right or 264 00:12:57.360 --> 00:12:59.799 who's more accurate. And that's a challenge because those are 265 00:12:59.799 --> 00:13:01.799 the two easiest methods right Asking people to fill out 266 00:13:01.840 --> 00:13:05.279 questionnaires is easier than almost anything else. So the challenge 267 00:13:05.320 --> 00:13:07.879 with getting okay, a third measure, something other than self 268 00:13:07.879 --> 00:13:11.000 and friends. We try to get actual behavior, so we 269 00:13:11.080 --> 00:13:13.120 want to observe what people are like. But the trick 270 00:13:13.200 --> 00:13:14.919 with that is if you bring people into the lab 271 00:13:14.960 --> 00:13:16.799 and observe their behavior, that might not be what they're 272 00:13:16.840 --> 00:13:17.360 really like. 273 00:13:17.639 --> 00:13:21.080 I keep picturing myself stiffly walking in, trying to conceal 274 00:13:21.279 --> 00:13:24.399 a mustard stain on my scarf, wearing an expression of 275 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:28.120 desperation to blend in. Hello, I am healthy but normal. 276 00:13:28.440 --> 00:13:30.559 So we try to do it in a naturalistic way 277 00:13:30.679 --> 00:13:33.360 get people in their everyday lives. So we have this 278 00:13:33.480 --> 00:13:36.559 audio recorder that our participants agree to wear if they're 279 00:13:36.600 --> 00:13:39.360 willing to, and it's really just an iPod touch, but 280 00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:42.240 we program it so that the audio recording aspect of 281 00:13:42.279 --> 00:13:44.279 it comes on and off, and so they just clip 282 00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:46.000 it to the outside of their clothes or their bag 283 00:13:46.039 --> 00:13:48.279 and they wear it for, for example, a week, and 284 00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:49.639 it comes on and off and they don't know exactly 285 00:13:49.679 --> 00:13:52.360 when it's on or off. And then when they turn 286 00:13:52.360 --> 00:13:53.759 it in, we tell them we're going to give you 287 00:13:53.840 --> 00:13:55.879 a disc with all the files. You can delete any files, 288 00:13:55.919 --> 00:13:57.559 you know, tell us which files to delete, you know. 289 00:13:57.600 --> 00:14:00.000 And actually people end up being fine with leaving all 290 00:14:00.000 --> 00:14:02.240 all of them on, but we want to make sure 291 00:14:02.279 --> 00:14:03.799 that they're really okay with it. We give them a 292 00:14:03.799 --> 00:14:04.759 lot of opportunities. 293 00:14:05.120 --> 00:14:07.720 Okay, side note, I had done some research of Semine's 294 00:14:07.720 --> 00:14:10.039 work ahead of time, and I was so excited she 295 00:14:10.120 --> 00:14:14.720 brought this up right away. So these devices are called ears. EAR. 296 00:14:14.840 --> 00:14:20.320 It stands for electronically activated recorder, which is very cute. Technically, 297 00:14:20.360 --> 00:14:23.120 that's called a backronym when something that stands for something 298 00:14:23.120 --> 00:14:26.799 else is cute on purpose. So the most common capture 299 00:14:26.879 --> 00:14:31.279 pattern they do is recording for thirty seconds every twelve minutes. 300 00:14:31.559 --> 00:14:34.240 Then the volunteers fill out an hourly report of what 301 00:14:34.240 --> 00:14:38.039 they were up to. They also wear a button that says, essentially, hey, 302 00:14:38.440 --> 00:14:40.639 someone might be recording this and listening to this, so 303 00:14:40.720 --> 00:14:42.080 let me know if that freaks you the fuck out 304 00:14:42.159 --> 00:14:44.759 or whatever. Also, this made me wonder, aren't our phones 305 00:14:44.840 --> 00:14:48.039 just always eavesdropping all the time anyway, just ready to 306 00:14:48.080 --> 00:14:51.240 sell us something we casually mentioned in a conversation. Well, 307 00:14:51.519 --> 00:14:54.919 a study from Northwestern University came out last year that 308 00:14:55.080 --> 00:14:58.200 tracked over seventeen thousand apps to see if they were 309 00:14:58.240 --> 00:15:03.200 recording our conversations about out like vegan marshmallows and platform sneakers, 310 00:15:03.360 --> 00:15:06.679 and the researchers, well, they didn't say no. They just 311 00:15:06.720 --> 00:15:10.879 said that they couldn't find evidence of the activities taking place. 312 00:15:11.200 --> 00:15:15.440 So it's not not listening to you anyway. Some personality 313 00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:19.480 psychologists recording conversations to untangle the mysteries of the human 314 00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:22.519 mind pretty benign. It's not like the UC Davis research 315 00:15:22.559 --> 00:15:26.000 team includes old Zuckerberg at his laptop sending you coupons 316 00:15:26.039 --> 00:15:30.279 for off brand invisi line where geometric sloth necklaces, which 317 00:15:30.320 --> 00:15:32.159 is what my Instagram just tried to sell me, which 318 00:15:32.200 --> 00:15:34.759 was spot on. Though it's pretty good. Well, play a 319 00:15:34.759 --> 00:15:35.600 big brother, So. 320 00:15:35.559 --> 00:15:37.320 It's about five percent of the time that it's on, 321 00:15:37.759 --> 00:15:40.919 So random snippets of your life. Yes, so thirty seconds 322 00:15:40.960 --> 00:15:42.559 turns out to be long enough that we can figure 323 00:15:42.559 --> 00:15:44.879 out are you socializing or are you working? Or are 324 00:15:44.879 --> 00:15:47.720 you watching TV? And if you're socializing, is it a 325 00:15:47.720 --> 00:15:49.159 group of people or is it one on one? Is 326 00:15:49.159 --> 00:15:51.440 it a deep conversation or is it superficial. So we 327 00:15:51.480 --> 00:15:53.559 can tell a lot about what people are doing, both 328 00:15:53.600 --> 00:15:56.159 like just the behaviors and also the psychological context that 329 00:15:56.159 --> 00:15:59.039 they're in. So, yeah, it turns out of thirty second 330 00:15:59.039 --> 00:16:01.039 clips gives you quite a bit of information about what 331 00:16:01.080 --> 00:16:04.120 people are up to without like violating their privacy too much. 332 00:16:05.159 --> 00:16:07.039 And then so you take all of those files and 333 00:16:07.080 --> 00:16:09.480 you figure out, Okay, this is how often the person 334 00:16:09.600 --> 00:16:12.320 was around other people or talking to other people. This 335 00:16:12.360 --> 00:16:14.240 is how much they were alone, This is how much 336 00:16:14.480 --> 00:16:18.000 they were using maybe violent or sexual language. So you 337 00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:21.519 can kind of categorize, yeah, and interpret the data that way. 338 00:16:21.639 --> 00:16:24.120 Yeah, So for example, if from the questionnaires, if you 339 00:16:24.159 --> 00:16:26.279 said you're not very funny, but your friends said you're 340 00:16:26.279 --> 00:16:28.759 really funny, then we can listen to the sound files 341 00:16:28.759 --> 00:16:31.759 and have a group of coders who are relatively neutral 342 00:16:31.799 --> 00:16:34.200 and objective, who don't know you. They can rate how 343 00:16:34.240 --> 00:16:36.600 funny you were and your conversations, and then we can 344 00:16:36.639 --> 00:16:38.639 say who's more accurate, you or your friends? 345 00:16:39.039 --> 00:16:43.200 Wow, you're so funny, And now what are you studying 346 00:16:43.240 --> 00:16:44.559 when you're looking at this data? 347 00:16:44.600 --> 00:16:45.399 Are you do you do? 348 00:16:45.480 --> 00:16:49.120 Maybe one study on extra version and one on narcissism? 349 00:16:49.200 --> 00:16:50.600 Or what are you looking at? That's a really good question. 350 00:16:50.639 --> 00:16:52.320 So because it's so hard to collect these data, we 351 00:16:52.360 --> 00:16:53.519 measure everything we can think of. 352 00:16:53.759 --> 00:16:56.320 Okay, a bunch of people too many to name asked 353 00:16:56.559 --> 00:16:59.600 what tests they use, and boom, here it is in 354 00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:02.559 five four three two five. 355 00:17:02.919 --> 00:17:05.920 So we use a model called the Big five, which 356 00:17:05.960 --> 00:17:08.720 is a model of personality that says there's five kind 357 00:17:08.720 --> 00:17:11.599 of broad dimensions along which people differ. So, for example, 358 00:17:11.599 --> 00:17:14.359 one of them is extraversion, and in each of those 359 00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:17.559 five categories there's specific traits, Like in the extraversion category, 360 00:17:17.799 --> 00:17:20.319 there's how sociable the person is, how talkative they are, 361 00:17:20.319 --> 00:17:22.920 how assertive they are, So there's like more specific personality 362 00:17:22.920 --> 00:17:24.720 traits in each of the five categories. So it's not 363 00:17:24.759 --> 00:17:27.039 that there's only five personality traits, but there's five kind 364 00:17:27.079 --> 00:17:30.200 of clusters of personality traits. So we measure those and 365 00:17:30.240 --> 00:17:31.799 then we also throw in other things that we think 366 00:17:31.880 --> 00:17:34.279 aren't really well captured by the Big Five. So narcissism 367 00:17:34.319 --> 00:17:37.319 is one example of something that we think doesn't quite 368 00:17:37.400 --> 00:17:40.920 fall neatly into those five categories. So we measure a 369 00:17:40.960 --> 00:17:43.279 handful of other traits beyond the Big five as well. 370 00:17:43.519 --> 00:17:46.400 So real quick, what is the Big five? So it's 371 00:17:46.400 --> 00:17:49.759 a bunch of questions. It takes maybe eight minutes to complete. 372 00:17:49.799 --> 00:17:53.680 It measures essentially what your deal is. It's also called 373 00:17:53.839 --> 00:17:58.119 the very unspicy name five Factors model, or the exciting 374 00:17:58.160 --> 00:18:07.960 acronym ocean because these factors are measured openness to experience, conscientiousness, extraversion, agreeableness, 375 00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:11.119 and euroticism. So you can flip those words around and 376 00:18:11.160 --> 00:18:13.720 make it spoke canoe if you're more of an inland 377 00:18:13.759 --> 00:18:16.200 lakes rather than an open sea kind of person. 378 00:18:17.319 --> 00:18:19.839 So our research isn't really about one specific personality trait. 379 00:18:19.880 --> 00:18:21.759 What we really want to know is how accurate people 380 00:18:21.799 --> 00:18:24.519 are describing themselves in general. So we might, you know, 381 00:18:25.240 --> 00:18:27.319 look at how accurate they are about how funny they are, 382 00:18:27.319 --> 00:18:29.279 but actually we're interested in also how accurate are they 383 00:18:29.319 --> 00:18:32.200 about how extroverted they are and how narcissistic they are 384 00:18:32.240 --> 00:18:33.000 and everything else. 385 00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:37.000 What do you think is a trait that tends to 386 00:18:37.039 --> 00:18:38.640 get misreported the most. 387 00:18:39.359 --> 00:18:40.960 So I don't have a lot of evidence for this, 388 00:18:41.039 --> 00:18:44.599 but my intuition, my hunch, and we're starting to collect 389 00:18:44.640 --> 00:18:47.279 data on this and have some evidence for it. But 390 00:18:47.359 --> 00:18:49.799 I could be wrong. But my hunch is that we're 391 00:18:49.799 --> 00:18:52.119 not very good at judging our own what in personal 392 00:18:52.160 --> 00:18:55.799 psychology we call agreeableness, which is basically how like polite 393 00:18:55.880 --> 00:19:00.839 and kind and considerate you are. And that all sounds 394 00:19:00.839 --> 00:19:02.920 like a good thing, and everybody wants to be really agreeable, 395 00:19:02.920 --> 00:19:04.880 but actually it can be taken too far. So people 396 00:19:04.880 --> 00:19:07.640 who are too agreeable are kind of doormats. They won't 397 00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:10.400 stick up for people they care about or things they 398 00:19:10.440 --> 00:19:12.319 believe in. Things like that, So I don't want to 399 00:19:12.359 --> 00:19:15.559 paint it as only good things. It's like most personality traits, 400 00:19:15.680 --> 00:19:17.759 there's good and bad components to it, or it can 401 00:19:17.920 --> 00:19:21.440