Speaker 1: Well, bookend the show today with two great NBA riders,
Speaker 1: two great NBA media members Orange Crush because you know Nicks,
Speaker 1: Howard Beck, How clever is that?
Speaker 2: Huh?
Speaker 3: How impressed are you on this Friday afternoon, sir?
Speaker 2: Doing well? You managed to merge Nix, an Ram and me.
Speaker 2: That's phenomenal. We just an incredible work on your part.
Speaker 1: Thank you, sir. Let's start out with this. The lottery's rigged. Okay,
Speaker 1: we're cheated here in Salt Lake City. What's going on?
Speaker 1: Jazz fall to five?
Speaker 3: Howard?
Speaker 1: And at the risk of insulting your intelligence, but as
Speaker 1: you know, we live in a day in society where
Speaker 1: if your guy doesn't win the election, it was stolen.
Speaker 1: If your team doesn't win the championship, you got had.
Speaker 1: And so we got a lot of folks out here
Speaker 1: that believe the NBA lottery is rigged. Four teams that
Speaker 1: don't necessarily need it as bad as we do in
Speaker 1: Salt Lake.
Speaker 3: Your thoughts, sir, Oh my god.
Speaker 2: So let's start with this. Belief is not fact. I
Speaker 2: don't care how strongly you believe something. I don't care
Speaker 2: how strong you suspect something. I don't care how strongly
Speaker 2: you think something seems suspicious, it's not the same as fact.
Speaker 2: And so if anybody wants to believe, And the fact is,
Speaker 2: if any of your listeners right now are running around
Speaker 2: with this belief, I can't talk them out of it.
Speaker 2: So in some respects it's pointless for me to lay
Speaker 2: out any of this, but I will if you want
Speaker 2: me to. But the fact is people will believed what
Speaker 2: they want to believe. But let's make it very very clear.
Speaker 2: There is no proof that anybody has. There's no reason
Speaker 2: to believe this other than suspicion. Than suspicion alone, as
Speaker 2: you have just noted alluding to some other events of
Speaker 2: the recent past, including an election, you don't have to
Speaker 2: prove anything. You can just say it with stolen an
Speaker 2: election was stolen and believe it, and you don't need
Speaker 2: any proof. So if people want to say that the
Speaker 2: lottery was fixed and they have no proof, and they
Speaker 2: have nothing but their suspicion, I can't do anything about it.
Speaker 2: All I can tell you is I've been in the
Speaker 2: lottery room twice. I was not this year, but I've
Speaker 2: been in there for this exact version of the lottery,
Speaker 2: this procedure where there are all the balls that go
Speaker 2: in the machine, and there's a thousand combinations or a
Speaker 2: thousand and one combinations, and there's a guy in the
Speaker 2: back of the room with his back turned who every
Speaker 2: I think thirty seconds puts his hand up and that
Speaker 2: is the signal to the person running the machine to
Speaker 2: then hit the button that sucks up one of the balls. Like,
Speaker 2: there's no way to fix this thing, and if there were,
Speaker 2: it would be a fraudulence of epic proportions. It would
Speaker 2: involved probably multiple felonies. And everybody who works for the
Speaker 2: NBA and for Ernst and Young Global accounting and finance firm,
Speaker 2: they would be implicated in this. All these people are
Speaker 2: putting their careers and their lives on the line so
Speaker 2: that Cooper Flag can go to Dallas. Come on, people like,
Speaker 2: grow up, get a grip. This is stupid and the
Speaker 2: amount of ink and time that has been spilled and
Speaker 2: spent on it this week is and just foolish. It's wasted.
Speaker 2: And I'll just close with a couple other quick thoughts
Speaker 2: on this. When people think it is fixed, is it
Speaker 2: fixed by the NBA itself the league office, in which
Speaker 2: case it's a fraud perpetrated on the thirty owners, the
Speaker 2: same people who employ Adam Silver, who hire and could
Speaker 2: fire Adam Silver. If the owners on themselves are in
Speaker 2: on it, why would they be in on it? Why
Speaker 2: do the other owners want to reward the idiocy that
Speaker 2: happened in Dallas this year where they gave away their
Speaker 2: franchise star. Why do the Memphis Grizzlies and Indianapolis Indiana
Speaker 2: Pacers and everybody else, why do they want to participate
Speaker 2: in this? Why are they participating in a fraudulence in
Speaker 2: felonies to help the Dallas Mavericks get a player who,
Speaker 2: by the way, by all accounts, is going to be
Speaker 2: very very good. But according to scouts I've talked to,
Speaker 2: they're not absolutely certain he's going to be a superstar.
Speaker 2: So none of this makes a lick of sense, suspence.
Speaker 3: No, it does not.
Speaker 1: And I think you know me well enough to know
Speaker 1: where I've fall on the entire thing. You know, it's
Speaker 1: literally called the lottery, and I wonder, you know, I
Speaker 1: wonder though. So one of the interesting things that I've
Speaker 1: learned this week is that in twenty nineteen, when Commissioner
Speaker 1: Silver elected a flat in the odds, the vote was
Speaker 1: twenty nine to one in favor of doing so. The
Speaker 1: one dissenting vote was Sam Presty and Oklahoma City, whose
Speaker 1: point was the best way for cities like Oklahoma City
Speaker 1: to acquire talent is via the draft.
Speaker 3: Now there's a lot of irony.
Speaker 1: Six years later, we're sitting here watching potentially the most
Speaker 1: talented team in the league reside in Oklahoma City. But
Speaker 1: we do live in Salt Lake City, where the best
Speaker 1: and sometimes only way, not always only way, but sometimes
Speaker 1: only way to acquire talent is through the draft.
Speaker 3: So do you like the way the league does this?
Speaker 1: There's a lot of other ideas, like do you just
Speaker 1: give every team in the lottery the same odds? All
Speaker 1: fourteen teams have the same odds, and therefore you do
Speaker 1: away with any sort of tanking. Now you know, tanking,
Speaker 1: of course, guarantees nothing. We have six lotteries since twenty nineteen,
Speaker 1: and the worst team in the league has never received
Speaker 1: the number one overall pick. And the reality is, and
Speaker 1: I'll credit Justin Zana, Jazz, general manager the Jazz. As
Speaker 1: far as the lottery odds go, the percentages the Jazz
Speaker 1: were most likely to land four or five. Okay, so
Speaker 1: forty seven percent chants at five fourteen percent chants at
Speaker 1: one for all the hand ringing and you know, pearl clutching,
Speaker 1: the Jazz actually landed where they were most likely to land.
Speaker 1: But is this the best way to do this, Howard
Speaker 1: in your opinion?
Speaker 2: So ten years ago, when we were in the middle
Speaker 2: of the process, Era sixers and a lot of other
Speaker 2: teams were, you know, not as extreme, but we're practicing
Speaker 2: different versions of tanking, and the NBA had a problem
Speaker 2: on a tand Adam Silver hated what was going on,
Speaker 2: absolutely hated it, and a lot of the owners did too,
Speaker 2: and a lot of the public did. And it's a
Speaker 2: really interesting kind of case study in the way we
Speaker 2: as a public react to things because ten years ago,
Speaker 2: a lot of people were crying out that this system
Speaker 2: is unfair. You should not be able to game the system,
Speaker 2: even though the worst record still only got to a
Speaker 2: twenty five percent chance at the number one pick. People
Speaker 2: didn't like the idea that it incentivized losing, that it
Speaker 2: perverted the entire enterprise because if you weren't a good team,
Speaker 2: then it was too alluring to just be really really
Speaker 2: bad for the possibility of getting a great pick. And
Speaker 2: so that was the consensus opinion out they're ten years ago,
Speaker 2: and in the wake of this week's lottery, I feel
Speaker 2: like everybody has flipped around to, well, this system's unfair
Speaker 2: and the teams that needed the most help aren't getting it. Well, okay,
Speaker 2: but yeah, this is the problem when you go to
Speaker 2: a strictly reverse order draft draft. If you had no lottery,
Speaker 2: then there's ultimate incentive the tank. So you bring in
Speaker 2: a lottery, and the first lottery was you know, however,
Speaker 2: many teams in the in the hopper with an equal chance.
Speaker 2: But that wasn't the best system as far as the
Speaker 2: NBA was concerned. And if we went back to that,
Speaker 2: then you would have a different trigger point where teams
Speaker 2: would be opting out of the playoffs and the play
Speaker 2: in saying, well, if I've got as good a chance
Speaker 2: as the worst team in the league of getting the
Speaker 2: number one pick, I'm better off being the sixteenth best
Speaker 2: team in the league rather than the fourteenth best team
Speaker 2: like I or excuse me, the fourteenth best and wow,
Speaker 2: whatever it is. You see my point. I'd be better
Speaker 2: off out of the playoffs than in the playoffs. You
Speaker 2: don't want that either, So it's a quandary and I
Speaker 2: am not. I don't have any strong beliefs on what
Speaker 2: is the quote unquote right system Spence, I don't know
Speaker 2: that there is a right system. I'm not particularly upset
Speaker 2: about anything that's happened in this lottery or the last
Speaker 2: several but I have no rooting interest, so it's easy
Speaker 2: for me to say there are competing objectives here clearly,
Speaker 2: and it is a difficult thing to manage. But I
Speaker 2: would say to the extent that the league is trying
Speaker 2: to discourage tanking, and yes, tanking still happens, including in
Speaker 2: your city. The fact is, when teams keep falling out
Speaker 2: of the top three, as it's happened a lot since
Speaker 2: the lottery odds were changed, that is the distancentive the tank,
Speaker 2: or it should be. If teams don't change their behavior
Speaker 2: and still say, you know what, I don't care, let's
Speaker 2: just go for the fourteen percent chance. We'll take our chances.
Speaker 2: It's still better than only having a ten percent or
Speaker 2: eight percent chance. Maybe teams will keep doing that in perpetuity,
Speaker 2: but I think the collected results of the last several
Speaker 2: years should suggest to teams, don't do this. It's probably
Speaker 2: not going to pay off. You're better off just trying
Speaker 2: to be respectable.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I have to wonder whether or not the
Speaker 1: approach for teams like the Jazz and Washington. I'll throw
Speaker 1: Charlotte in there, and we could throw a number of
Speaker 1: other teams in there through their hat in the ring.
Speaker 1: After certain dynamics went down, like when Ben Yama getting
Speaker 1: hurt or en beating Paul Joe George being shut well
Speaker 1: and be getting hurt than Paul George being shut down,
Speaker 1: several teams were unserious about winning the Jazz in Washington
Speaker 1: probably the two front facing teams that were un serious
Speaker 1: all year long. But you know, the message that Adam
Speaker 1: Silver and the league sen in twenty nineteen is if
Speaker 1: you don't approach this with integrity to put your best
Speaker 1: foot forward and compete, we don't believe you should be rewarded.
Speaker 1: And a bunch of articles making the rounds this week
Speaker 1: that people in the league were actually glad the Jazz
Speaker 1: and the Wizards did not get the number one overall
Speaker 1: pick and therefore be rewarded for their unseerious approach about competing.
Speaker 1: So do you think we see something different from pretty
Speaker 1: much everybody, like, at the very least, don't make up
Speaker 1: injuries for lowry marketing. And when you get fined, don't
Speaker 1: then have Walker Kessler shoot eight threes a night, Like,
Speaker 1: maybe put your best foot forward and try to compete.
Speaker 1: You think we'll actually see that.
Speaker 2: I don't know, Spence. I mean the very first year
Speaker 2: of the new format, the new lottery odds, the worst
Speaker 2: three teams I think all fell out that year, including
Speaker 2: your Knicks and or excuse me, the Nicks fell to three.
Speaker 2: But they were, yeah, they I think they had were
Speaker 2: they the worst team in the league that year? They
Speaker 2: they were the worst, yeah, I think, And they ended
Speaker 2: up falling to three, So they missed out on Zion
Speaker 2: and John Morant, which looking back, maybe is not the
Speaker 2: worst thing. But still, in the very first year of
Speaker 2: the new odds, the team of the worst record did
Speaker 2: not get the top pick. They fell to three, and
Speaker 2: I think Cleveland might have been one of the bottom
Speaker 2: three and they fell back, and you know, and New
Speaker 2: Orleans jumped up from like tenth or ninth or whatever
Speaker 2: that year. So right off the bat, there was an
Speaker 2: indication that, ooh, you know what, this is a risky
Speaker 2: gambit for teams that are just trying to lose in
Speaker 2: order to gain the system. You can't game the system,
Speaker 2: and that again, that should be enough to discourage tanking.
Speaker 2: But here we are six years later. Whatever it's been,
Speaker 2: and it's it, it hasn't changed behavior. The Jazz and
Speaker 2: the Wizards are proof of that. And you know, the
Speaker 2: Sixers did a different version of this where they were
Speaker 2: supposed to be a great team. They you know, fell
Speaker 2: apart and they decided to lean into tanking because they
Speaker 2: owed a top six protected pick to Oklahoma. And so
Speaker 2: even though they weren't tanking it at the same level
Speaker 2: or for the same purpose, they were tanking to protect
Speaker 2: the draft pick because they wanted to keep it. And
Speaker 2: they succeeded, and they even moved up. And you can say,
Speaker 2: well that rewarded them. Well, okay, that's a lottery. That's
Speaker 2: the thing. Like you know, at some point the you know,
Speaker 2: the odds don't go according to the odds. That's not
Speaker 2: the way it works. It's a hopper, it's a bunch
Speaker 2: of ping pong balls. They're bouncing around. We don't know
Speaker 2: what's going to happen. There is just luck involved here,
Speaker 2: including bad luck if you're the Jazz or the Wizards.
Speaker 2: So I think it should discourage tanking. It hasn't. I
Speaker 2: don't know what will change that. I don't know where
Speaker 2: the league goes from here.
Speaker 1: All right, let's move over to teams that are playing
Speaker 1: basketball actually before we get there, man, And I'll give
Speaker 1: Kenny Atkinson a lot of credit after the game where
Speaker 1: Indiana sent the Cavs home. I mean, he acknowledged like
Speaker 1: this is a team that simply is playing the right
Speaker 1: way at the right time of the year. And he said,
Speaker 1: they're up here and we're clearly down here. And Rick
Speaker 1: Carlisle with a very salient postgame pressure himself, He's like, look,
Speaker 1: we're just we're red hot right now. We're on fire
Speaker 1: right now. And you know, I don't know what this
Speaker 1: means for Cleveland, but it's more of a compliment to
Speaker 1: Indiana for just the way they fought.
Speaker 3: And you know, I like Tyree Saliburton. I know You've
Speaker 3: always been very high on him.
Speaker 1: Where is he in the ecosystem of stars, I don't know,
Speaker 1: but they have got a deep team with a bunch
Speaker 1: of perimeter players that really get down and guard you.
Speaker 1: Your takeaways from Indiana SENDI in Cleveland home?
Speaker 2: Yeah, tough for the Calves. I mean when you're a
Speaker 2: sixty plus win team, sixty four wins in their case,
Speaker 2: and you lose in the second round. That's rough. They
Speaker 2: obviously there were some injury issues that contributed to that,
Speaker 2: but it wasn't entirely that the Pacers were just better.
Speaker 2: And yeah, all the credit in the world to to
Speaker 2: Halliburton and Siakam and Nie Smith and Turner and everybody
Speaker 2: else and Rick Carlisle. I think people thought they were
Speaker 2: a fluke when they got to the conference finals last
Speaker 2: year because they, you know, got through some some injured
Speaker 2: teams in a week east And this time, I don't
Speaker 2: think you can knock this at all, like this is
Speaker 2: an accomplishment. This is now a team that's been in
Speaker 2: back to back conference finals. Halliburton's for real, his his
Speaker 2: you know, his overall game like it's it's it's just
Speaker 2: so interesting because he's he doesn't project as the prototypical
Speaker 2: NBA superstar, right and he's never really been in the
Speaker 2: running for m VP. I think he's gonna make third
Speaker 2: team All NBA this year, that's my best guess, but
Speaker 2: we don't know yet. We'll find out, I think probably
Speaker 2: next week. But you know, he hasn't put up monster
Speaker 2: numbers every night he does lead the league an assist
Speaker 2: or is always near the lead and assists. He's just
Speaker 2: a guy who's got an incredible amount of tracker and
Speaker 2: confidence about him. I think that that helps lift up
Speaker 2: the rest of his team. And you know, his his
Speaker 2: running mate. You know, the two stars. Halibert and Siakam
Speaker 2: are two guys that I think everybody would like and go, yeah,
Speaker 2: really great players, but they don't have a honest, they
Speaker 2: don't have a Luca, they don't have a lebron orous
Speaker 2: Steph in their prime. But they they just they beat
Speaker 2: you up a little bit defensively, like they really get
Speaker 2: after it for a team that wasn't known for their defense,
Speaker 2: like Meee Smith and Nemhard really get after you. Turner's
Speaker 2: obviously a great shot blocker, and they really locked down
Speaker 2: in the playoffs. And then on offense, the pace is
Speaker 2: really high, they shoot threes at a high rate. They're
Speaker 2: they're just it's they're the classic ensemble where there is
Speaker 2: no one who leaps off the page. But collectively they're
Speaker 2: just really really good. And they have now you know,
Speaker 2: they've sent the Calves home and sent the Calves into
Speaker 2: an offseason where they've got a lot to think about.
Speaker 3: Well, stay out east before we end out this way.
Speaker 1: And you know, I very much love living here, but
Speaker 1: today's day where I miss being home and I cannot
Speaker 1: imagine what Midtown Manhattan is going to look, sound and
Speaker 1: feel like. As the New York Knicks have a chance
Speaker 1: to advance to the Eastern Conference Finals for the first
Speaker 1: time since two thousand, where ironically enough, they played the
Speaker 1: Indie Indian Pacers. As you know, you know, Howard, I've
Speaker 1: been talking about this because before Game five, I made
Speaker 1: it a point to record the coaches, Missoula and Thibodeau
Speaker 1: to see what they had to say before the game,
Speaker 1: and Missoula said something that really caught my attention. He said,
Speaker 1: we're gutted about what happened with JT Jason Tatum, obviously,
Speaker 1: but it opens up a schematic opportunity for us, and
Speaker 1: I went, oh, okay, interesting, And then watching the game,
Speaker 1: essentially what that meant is Tatum, for all of his brilliance,
Speaker 1: and I love Jason Tatum. He's a bit of a
Speaker 1: ball stopper, and he's like the only one kind of
Speaker 1: on that roster that is. And so the ball was moving,
Speaker 1: I don't know who the hell Luke Cornett thinks he is,
Speaker 1: but my goodness, poor Zingis is not ready for this.
Speaker 3: I don't know what's going on with him.
Speaker 1: So as somebody who's trying to objectively analyze this game,
Speaker 1: I do certainly believe that the Knicks have an opportunity
Speaker 1: to get it down a home. As somebody who has
Speaker 1: been cheering for this team that has let me down
Speaker 1: ever since I was ten, I am nervous and scared
Speaker 1: that the Celtics will continue to do with the Celtics
Speaker 1: are able to do. What do you think happens coming
Speaker 1: up in just a few hours in midtown Manhattan.
Speaker 2: I'm heading there as soon as we hang up. Had
Speaker 2: a guy, I think it's going to be utter mayhem
Speaker 2: in a good way, Like it's just going to be
Speaker 2: bonkers there, which reminds me I better pack my earplugs
Speaker 2: because I don't want my I'm too old to start
Speaker 2: losing my hearings for other purposes. It's been a really
Speaker 2: interesting series, to say the least, and the Celtics, you know,
Speaker 2: if they lose this thing, there's going to be an
Speaker 2: off season of just serious naval gazing, and not just
Speaker 2: because they lost Jason Tatum for the foreseeable future and
Speaker 2: probably all of next season. It's also just that they
Speaker 2: kept blowing twenty point leads, and they're clearly the team
Speaker 2: with the better array of talent and with the championship experience,
Speaker 2: and they should have never found themselves in this position.
Speaker 2: Is certainly one way of looking at this. But all
Speaker 2: credit to the Knicks for being the team that's always steadier,
Speaker 2: grittier in fourth quarters, Jalen Brunson in particular. And here
Speaker 2: we are, it's three to two, Nick's home game, second
Speaker 2: chance for them to close it out. They absolutely should
Speaker 2: given everything that we know, including the fact that Jason
Speaker 2: Tatum is not playing, including the fact that porzingis apparently
Speaker 2: still having issues with whatever the viral infection or whatever
Speaker 2: he had was. They said he didn't he wasn't breathing
Speaker 2: well the other night, like they could have used him
Speaker 2: in a emergency in the second half, but they decided
Speaker 2: not to. I don't know if you're getting another seven
Speaker 2: block Luke Cornett game, but the Celtics, I will say this,
Speaker 2: and it's the one reason why I think that this
Speaker 2: is going to be a true battle tonight. I don't
Speaker 2: know who will win. But you know, Jalen Brown was
Speaker 2: the Finals MVP and the Conference Finals MVP last year
Speaker 2: for a reason. Maybe he's not quite at Tatum's level,
Speaker 2: but he's just a slight bit below, but he's really
Speaker 2: capable of doing a lot. And sometimes it simplifies things
Speaker 2: for NBA teams when you lose your star, it's, you know, everybody,
Speaker 2: you know kind of rallies around if you've still got
Speaker 2: a star, which they do in Brown. Now it's clear
Speaker 2: we've got to ride this guy. And then if that
Speaker 2: guy in Jalen Brown's case, you know, remembers their best
Speaker 2: principles of basketball, which is like, I've got a lot
Speaker 2: to carry, but I can't do it alone. I got
Speaker 2: to make sure to leverage my teammates. I got to
Speaker 2: move the ball around. I've got to you know, draw
Speaker 2: to to the ball and pass. You know, this is
Speaker 2: the simple basic basketball principles, right, And you've got guys
Speaker 2: like Derek White and Drew Holliday who have been and
Speaker 2: Al Horford who have all been there and done that,
Speaker 2: and Peyton Pritchard who was six Man of the Year,
Speaker 2: like you have plenty of talent. Still, Like I actually
Speaker 2: think this is not a knock on the Knicks, but
Speaker 2: without Tatum. I don't think there's some massive talent gap
Speaker 2: between these two teams. Because Jalen Brown's that good, and
Speaker 2: because Karl Anthony tw is that unreliable, and because the
Speaker 2: Celtics have a bunch of guys who, if they haven't
Speaker 2: been you know, all stars are least like right there
Speaker 2: a cut below it, Like Drew Holliday could have been.
Speaker 2: He's been an All Star I think once he could
Speaker 2: have been multiple times. Derek White could have been multiple times.
Speaker 2: They have that kind of talent, but they've played roles
Speaker 2: because that's what they needed to do and that's how
Speaker 2: they're built. So I think the Celtics have a real
Speaker 2: chance to win this and send it back to Boston
Speaker 2: for a Game seven. I think what I would expect
Speaker 2: is the Knicks to close it out. But in this postseason,
Speaker 2: I'm through trying to figure out anything.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's what's made it so fun.
Speaker 1: I will give you credit though, and I gave you
Speaker 1: credit on the show the other day. With a couple
Speaker 1: of weeks left in the regular season, you know, when
Speaker 1: OKC started to establish themselves as like historically good with
Speaker 1: the net and just the simply win loss record.
Speaker 3: We would revisit this every week. I'm like, who's keeping
Speaker 3: Mark Dagnold up at night?
Speaker 1: And at what point you said we should keep an
Speaker 1: eye on Minnesota. Now, of course Stephan goes down, and
Speaker 1: you know, for as connected as Boston looks during Game
Speaker 1: five without Tatum, the Warriors are just screwed without Steph.
Speaker 3: I mean, it changes everything.
Speaker 1: I was kind of waiting to see a Jimmy Butler
Speaker 1: from a couple of years ago, playoff Jimmy that carried
Speaker 1: Miami to the finals.
Speaker 3: We never really saw that.
Speaker 1: And I don't know how much of that has to
Speaker 1: do with the injury Jimmy picked up. I don't know
Speaker 1: how much of that has to do with all the big,
Speaker 1: strong wings Minnesota has. But they dispatch of the Warriors
Speaker 1: in five.
Speaker 3: What do you make of it?
Speaker 2: You know, the Timberwolves, they they did start out the
Speaker 2: season shaky, right. Randall didn't seem to quite fit. Devincenzo
Speaker 2: who you know, both of those guys came over in
Speaker 2: the tent and the cat trade with the Knicks. Devincenzo
Speaker 2: didn't quite seem you know, the same. I don't know
Speaker 2: if that was just like, you know, the heartbreak over
Speaker 2: losing his Villanova buddies. As we've seen in the commercials,
Speaker 2: it took them a while to get going, but the
Speaker 2: talent was always there. And like Julius Randall, you know
Speaker 2: this as a Knicks fan, Like he's a very frustrating
Speaker 2: player at times like high highs and low lows, and
Speaker 2: he can be a ball stopper. By the time we
Speaker 2: got to the end of part of the season, it
Speaker 2: seemed like he had really found his place with them
Speaker 2: not forcing it, and certainly in the playoffs, Like Julius,
Speaker 2: Randall's been fantastic for them. And so you know, we
Speaker 2: already knew they had great wing defenders McDaniels and Nick Kayle,
Speaker 2: Alexander Walker and Anthony Edwards himself can be a you know,
Speaker 2: great defender on the perimeter. Like they had all the
Speaker 2: requisite stuff. I think we just weren't sure what to
Speaker 2: make of them after swapping Towns for Randall and Evincenzo,
Speaker 2: and because they had a rough start, they did beat
Speaker 2: a more than wounded Warriors team. Like you know, there
Speaker 2: are a lot of teams would have beat the Warriors
Speaker 2: without Steph. The Rockets would have beaten the Warriors without Steph.
Speaker 2: So you know, you don't place a ton on that,
Speaker 2: but Minnesota earned their way here, just as I was
Speaker 2: saying with Indiana and and again Minnesota was in the
Speaker 2: conference finals a year ago, and that they're doing it
Speaker 2: now with a different core, you know, I mean, same
Speaker 2: basic group, but you know those were significant changes. Is
Speaker 2: a real testament to them and to their coach Chris Finch.
Speaker 2: And whoever they get Oklahoma or Denver will find out
Speaker 2: after that game seven. You know, Minnesota iss gonna give
Speaker 2: him a tough time. It's like the conference finals in
Speaker 2: the West. I would be shocked if it were any
Speaker 2: fewer than six games, and it's not gonna surprise me
Speaker 2: if it goes seven, no matter who they draw.
Speaker 1: All right, Finally, before I say you lose, you know,
Speaker 1: my only like reservation about just anointing and OKC because
Speaker 1: when they're when they're playing, when they're playing peak, when
Speaker 1: they're hitting their ceiling, it looks different than I think
Speaker 1: maybe every team outside of a fully healthy Boston Celtic team.
Speaker 1: I mean, it was interesting all year long. It's like,
Speaker 1: are we over analyzing this? Is it just going to
Speaker 1: be thunder Celtics. Then, of course you never know, injuries happen,
Speaker 1: and I give Denver a lot of credit for showing
Speaker 1: some championship medal. I thought Russell Westbrook was trying to
Speaker 1: point shave last night when he came in. I mean,
Speaker 1: Denver overcomes what appeared to be just a intentional sabotaging
Speaker 1: of that game and the game seven it's in Oklahoma City.
Speaker 1: I will not right off a team with Nicola Jokicic,
Speaker 1: but I wonder what you make of what we've seen
Speaker 1: so far and your thoughts on an exciting game seven
Speaker 1: comes Sunday.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's gonna be just that that game is
Speaker 2: going to be incredibly intense here. I mean the thunder
Speaker 2: a fifty eight win team that have been the young
Speaker 2: up and comer for the last two years, and you know,
Speaker 2: this is the first season that they've really made a run,
Speaker 2: and they're they're you know, they're they're this close to
Speaker 2: the conference finals where they're supposed to be, and it's
Speaker 2: such a massive letdown if they don't get there. And
Speaker 2: the Nuggets have been written off I don't know how
Speaker 2: many times in the last couple of years since they
Speaker 2: won the championship, and they've they've lost players, they fired
Speaker 2: their coach, they fired their GM and yet here they
Speaker 2: are in the verge of the conference finals and we've
Speaker 2: got the two MVP candidate's going against each other, still
Speaker 2: waiting for that announcement from the NBA. It's gonna be awesome.
Speaker 2: The game is gonna be awesome. The th underneath Jalen Williams,
Speaker 2: you know, the the guard Jason Williams or the guard
Speaker 2: forward Jason Williams, not the taller one. They need him
Speaker 2: to come through. He's obviously had a bit of a
Speaker 2: shaky series. On the Nuggets side of it, you know,
Speaker 2: there's the roller coaster that is Russell Westbrook because you
Speaker 2: just never know he can shoot you in and shoot
Speaker 2: you out of a game. And their rotations not particularly deep.
Speaker 2: Julian Strawther a great game last night, but can he
Speaker 2: repeat it? That's that's you know, they may need it.
Speaker 2: And there's one thing to flag. There's one other thing
Speaker 2: to flag on the Nugget's side, which is that late
Speaker 2: in the game, there was a point where it looked
Speaker 2: like Aaron Gordon might have pulled his hamstring and was
Speaker 2: he was, he was rubbing it, went out, came you know,
Speaker 2: went to the bench, came back in finished the game.
Speaker 2: But I'm just putting a little flag there because I
Speaker 2: don't I don't know what that might mean. Right, we
Speaker 2: haven't heard anything. I'm not saying, you know, he he's
Speaker 2: not gonna playsund or anything. I'm just that kind of
Speaker 2: thing is concerning this deep in a playoff series, because
Speaker 2: if he's at all limited or for some reason, if
Speaker 2: it's if it if it's really a pull and he
Speaker 2: can't play, obviously, like the Nuggets have no room for error,
Speaker 2: they have no depths. But Game seven should be just
Speaker 2: be incredible.
Speaker 1: All right, my friend, Well, I know you got to
Speaker 1: battle some some midtown traffic, so I'll set you loose.
Speaker 3: Enjoy that game, and I appreciate the time.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 3: Have a good weekend.
Speaker 2: Okay you thanks man.
Speaker 1: Howard Beck from The Ringer, formerly of the New York Times,
Speaker 1: Fake News, LA Times Sports illustrated one of my favorite
Speaker 1: NBA riders for like thirty years. Appreciate his time today
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