Speaker 1: Joining us from beautiful New Hampshire. He is Derek Wilburn.
Speaker 1: Not only is he a member of the D twenty
Speaker 1: school board, now he is a longtime rabble rouser and
Speaker 1: conservative activist. And uh, he is doing something that I
Speaker 1: think deserves a plod and it would go a long
Speaker 1: way towards tamping down some of the nastiness in our
Speaker 1: political discourse. And he's he's sitting on the side of
Speaker 1: a lake right now. Derek, do you do realize that
Speaker 1: you're sitting on the lake that is home to one
Speaker 1: of my favorite movies of all time?
Speaker 2: What about Bob?
Speaker 3: My wife and I are going to watch it tonight.
Speaker 2: Have you seen it before?
Speaker 3: Oh? My goodness, so at least two dozen times?
Speaker 2: Get good good.
Speaker 1: I just although I did just look it up, they
Speaker 1: did not film.
Speaker 2: It there, So you're gonna be able to be like,
Speaker 2: what this is?
Speaker 1: It make winnipeesake? No, We're yeah, fabulous movie. But uh,
Speaker 1: let me let me ask you. You're on vacation now,
Speaker 1: but you earned a vacation. I'm gonna let you kind
Speaker 1: of lay out what's happened, you know, recently, And I
Speaker 1: did put a story that I think is from Karado
Speaker 1: from some time ago, kind of with the backstory. But
Speaker 1: I'm sure that when you decided to run for the
Speaker 1: school board you never thought you would find yourself on
Speaker 1: the plaintiffs side.
Speaker 2: Of a slander suit, and yet here you are.
Speaker 3: No, of course I didn't. And there's a longer story
Speaker 3: to answer your question about where we've been through to
Speaker 3: earn a vacation. We'll talk about that next time you
Speaker 3: and I get together. But we had a cancer diagnosis
Speaker 3: between my life and I, and then I was diagnosed
Speaker 3: with a brain tumor. We survived it all in the
Speaker 3: last two years and it was just time to get
Speaker 3: out of dodge and relax. But more to more to
Speaker 3: your point, I have been called a child sex predator,
Speaker 3: a rapist, accused of being sexually aroused by children, and
Speaker 3: on and on and on for two years ever since
Speaker 3: I won my school board election. I said, you know
Speaker 3: what you've got to do sometimes is punch a bully
Speaker 3: in the mouth, and I lawyered up and sued. That's
Speaker 3: the short of it. You can't run around calling people
Speaker 3: sex child sex predators when they've never been accused of
Speaker 3: a crime, never been arrested, never been incarcerated, never been tried.
Speaker 3: The only thing I've got on my record is a
Speaker 3: speeding ticket from nineteen ninety five. That's it. That's it.
Speaker 3: I'm a motorcycle in California. And there was a constituent
Speaker 3: of mine, a woman named Bernadette, who's been calling me
Speaker 3: a child sex predator for two years. And I said,
Speaker 3: I'm going to put an into it, and I lawyered up,
Speaker 3: and here we are.
Speaker 1: So, Derek, let's go back to the beginning, because I
Speaker 1: said earlier in the show, I'm like, this woman appears
Speaker 1: to be a school board activist of some sort. In
Speaker 1: I don't hate school board activists. I want people to
Speaker 1: go to school board meetings and hold school boards accountable. Right,
Speaker 1: I'm not using that as a majorative, But how is she?
Speaker 1: Is she at every meeting? What got her involved in
Speaker 1: the first place? What brought her to your knowledge? And
Speaker 1: I'm just asking to speculate here. Why has she becoming
Speaker 1: such a persistent thorn in your side?
Speaker 3: She's been at school board meetings as have I for
Speaker 3: years and years and years. I was going to school
Speaker 3: board meetings long before I was elected to the board,
Speaker 3: and she has been too. And frankly, we had a
Speaker 3: pretty coldual relationship up until I got elected. The genesis
Speaker 3: is during the campaign we had three candidate forums, actually
Speaker 3: two because the two leftists refused to show up to
Speaker 3: one of the forums because it was being held inside
Speaker 3: of a church. But at one of the forums, I
Speaker 3: anticipated a question about books. We all know that's a
Speaker 3: hot topic. The left wants these sexually explicit books and
Speaker 3: everything else in our schools. I don't. We don't. So
Speaker 3: I knew i'd have the microphone in my hand and
Speaker 3: there's nothing they could do to stop me. So I said, okay,
Speaker 3: here we go, and I read out loud from some
Speaker 3: of these books that are that are in our schools.
Speaker 3: And it was ugly. It was nasty, it was vulgar,
Speaker 3: it was profane, It was everything you think it is. Interestingly,
Speaker 3: left doesn't have a problem with the books being in
Speaker 3: our schools, only with me reading from them. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 3: I read it out loud. I had the mic. I
Speaker 3: knew they couldn't stop me, and I just read it
Speaker 3: out loud and said, you know what, ladies and gentlemen,
Speaker 3: if you elect me to the school board, I will
Speaker 3: not be spending your tax dollars to provide our children
Speaker 3: with this filth. That's how it all started.
Speaker 1: And since then, she says that by reading in that
Speaker 1: school board meeting, you sexually assaulted her daughter. Is that
Speaker 1: what I read in one of these news articles?
Speaker 3: That's loosely what she's saying. So sexually assaulted her daughter.
Speaker 3: And it's just been it's gotten worse and worse and worse.
Speaker 3: I can't turn around without being called these things school
Speaker 3: board when she comes to the meetings and reads from
Speaker 3: the podium, and we can't respond, right, all we can
Speaker 3: do is just sit there and calls me sept predator
Speaker 3: and unsafe to be around children. And she made up
Speaker 3: a quote from casby the Colorado Association of school Boards,
Speaker 3: posted it online, been posting in Facebook for two years,
Speaker 3: which is the most public venue imaginable false quotes, filed
Speaker 3: a police report against me, then claimed that I was
Speaker 3: being investigated by the police. Right, filed a complaint with
Speaker 3: the district Attorney's office, then claimed I was being investigated
Speaker 3: by the district attorney. That's not how it works, right,
Speaker 3: That's not how our system. Imagine if you could just
Speaker 3: go to the DA and say, right, I want Randy investigated,
Speaker 3: that's not how it works. First and arrest has to
Speaker 3: be made. Zannik has referred to the District Attorney's office
Speaker 3: for potential prosecution, so she's been over the top of
Speaker 3: this stuff. We had our first hearing in front of
Speaker 3: a judge three or four weeks April eighteen or nineteen.
Speaker 3: The judge absolutely destroyed her motion to dismiss and looked
Speaker 3: more like something I would have written and threw the
Speaker 3: case out. So she's decided to appeal, and now we're
Speaker 3: waiting for an appointment with the appellate Court in Denver.
Speaker 1: So you know, Derek, this would have been so much
Speaker 1: easier if you weren't on the school board. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm sure you're Ernie has told you that as soon
Speaker 1: as you become an elected official or you're considered a
Speaker 1: quote public entity, proving slander is really challenging. But you
Speaker 1: guys have already gotten an encouraging word from the judge.
Speaker 2: Correct.
Speaker 3: Correct. Colorado has a provision called anti slap. The long
Speaker 3: short of it is the bar is higher when you're
Speaker 3: an elected representative. You have to prove damages and much
Speaker 3: more excess than if you're just a John Q. Citizen.
Speaker 3: And the judge wrote a decision that I mean, it
Speaker 3: was so strong it just destroyed anti slap And if
Speaker 3: I were in her shoes, I would appeal too, because
Speaker 3: the next step is to put it in front of
Speaker 3: a jury, and when, if, and when it happens, not if,
Speaker 3: when it does happens, any jury it's going to say
Speaker 3: you can't run around calling someone a sex predator, a
Speaker 3: child sex predator in public. And she's going to lose.
Speaker 3: And she knows that. But you're absolutely right. It's a
Speaker 3: higher bar for elected representatives. And I have cleared it,
Speaker 3: and cleared it by a substantial amount.
Speaker 1: Somebody elked on the tech line. Is she is she
Speaker 1: against removing these books from the library? Is that is
Speaker 1: that part of the issue. She's on the other side
Speaker 1: of this politically absolutely rightful.
Speaker 3: All are against removing these books from the library. They
Speaker 3: call it book banning, which always cured me up, as
Speaker 3: if the idea that a book, if it's not available
Speaker 3: in a public school library, is therefore somehow banned. I've
Speaker 3: said from the get go, from before I was running
Speaker 3: for office, that look, if you want your child reading
Speaker 3: this sort of material, none of my business, none of
Speaker 3: my business you do. You you parent your way, I'll
Speaker 3: parent my way, but don't ask me to pay for it. Right,
Speaker 3: if you were your child to have these books, fine,
Speaker 3: none of my business. Go to Barnes and Noble, go
Speaker 3: to Amazon whatever, Go to the public library.
Speaker 2: They're in the public library.
Speaker 1: Well, lots of un Let me ask this question, Eric,
Speaker 1: because this seems to me to be a real sticking point.
Speaker 1: Okay from I'm trying to put myself in her logic position. Right,
Speaker 1: She's arguing that you are a sexual predator because.
Speaker 2: You read these books.
Speaker 1: But she wants the books to still be available to teenagers,
Speaker 1: so why so they could be violated as well.
Speaker 2: You see the logic lack here.
Speaker 1: I'm genuinely curious if that has been asked or address
Speaker 1: by her at all.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it has, so, the point being, I did not
Speaker 3: read the books for the purposes of personal gratification. Absolutely.
Speaker 3: Anybody who knows me knows that. You know, as parents,
Speaker 3: our resumes are walking around the face of the Europe
Speaker 3: right right. Anyone who knows my kids and knows their
Speaker 3: accomplishments and what kind of children I raised knows I
Speaker 3: did not do this for the purpose of self gratification
Speaker 3: or personal gratification. I did it for the purpose of
Speaker 3: identifying to the community how your money is being spent.
Speaker 3: But there were and to tell you the truth, Nandy,
Speaker 3: there there were children present at this forum. Not a lot,
Speaker 3: but there were some there. And if I could back up,
Speaker 3: if I could use a time machine and go back,
Speaker 3: I probably would have edited my own words, or at least.
Speaker 2: Because I was going to say.
Speaker 1: If it were me Eric, I would have said, I
Speaker 1: am going to read some of these books that I
Speaker 1: believe are inappropriate. If you have children, you should probably
Speaker 1: take them out of the room. That's how I would
Speaker 1: have done it.
Speaker 3: I did. I didn't say take them out of the room.
Speaker 3: I didn't go that far. I said, I apologize for
Speaker 3: what you're going to hear. I'm not a As long
Speaker 3: as you've known me MC, you've never heard me drop
Speaker 3: an F bombs either of anybody else up until that night,
Speaker 3: because they don't swear. I don't believe in it. So
Speaker 3: I said, hey, I'm sorry for what you're going to hear.
Speaker 3: But here it comes, and I read it. And if
Speaker 3: I could do it again, i've had a time machine.
Speaker 3: Instead of saying it, I would have said, mfer or
Speaker 3: something like that. I want to avoid all the suits
Speaker 3: that we're in right now. But I don't have one
Speaker 3: of these. I don't have a time machine.
Speaker 2: Correct.
Speaker 3: So the very idea that having done so makes me
Speaker 3: some sort of a child molester is clearly, in the
Speaker 3: view of the judge defamatory, slanderous, wibeless. You can't go
Speaker 3: around doing that to people. And so I lawyered up
Speaker 3: and here we go.
Speaker 1: So let me ask this question, what sort of resolution
Speaker 1: are you looking for? I'm guessing this woman is not
Speaker 1: someone with incredibly deep pockets. The phrase judgment proof is
Speaker 1: sort of rattling around in my mind in terms of
Speaker 1: monetary damages. What are you realistically looking for? What could
Speaker 1: you realistically get out of this case?
Speaker 3: Now, you know better than just about anyone. I know
Speaker 3: that I'm not going to answer that question.
Speaker 2: I just thought.
Speaker 3: I just thought I would before you asked you to,
Speaker 3: while I was gonna is not going to answer that question. Yeah,
Speaker 3: So I don't know. I mean, it's it's active litigation, right.
Speaker 3: So she strikes me as a sort of individual who's
Speaker 3: going to dig in her heels and she's in it
Speaker 3: till till the end, and sow, I my reputation has
Speaker 3: been damaged when I ran for school board and this
Speaker 3: is November. Election was November of twenty three. I had
Speaker 3: endorsements from United States congressman, not just from Colorado, our
Speaker 3: former mayor, our former sheriff. You know, I've got relatively
Speaker 3: deep political connections. And all these people were contacted saying
Speaker 3: did you know that you're endorsing a child sex predator.
Speaker 3: That's that's problematic in a number of ways. I have
Speaker 3: a reputation to protect as well. So what it looks
Speaker 3: like at the end of the line, once a jury
Speaker 3: comes back and says we find for the plaintiff. I'm
Speaker 3: not going to get into that now, and frankly I
Speaker 3: couldn't because I don't even know.
Speaker 1: Right right, well, let me ask you this, are you
Speaker 1: guys in d twenty now that you're on the board,
Speaker 1: are you working on a library policy? What has come
Speaker 1: of your promises that you gave to parents to say, look,
Speaker 1: we're not going to have this sort of graphic material
Speaker 1: in our libraries.
Speaker 3: We have crafted a much better policy in my opinion,
Speaker 3: the way it's everything is processed related. Of course, if
Speaker 3: you can't just come in and say we're changing everything,
Speaker 3: because it's administrati there's administrative policy and there's board policy, right.
Speaker 3: The administration is responsible for the day to day running
Speaker 3: of the schools. So in my view, it's it's not right, proper,
Speaker 3: or correct for a board to just come in and
Speaker 3: tell the administration this is not how you're going to
Speaker 3: do it. Now we work more behind the scenes and
Speaker 3: manage the superintendent, who in turn puts his or her
Speaker 3: thumbprint on the district. The policy we have now in
Speaker 3: place in D twenty is much stronger, is much better.
Speaker 3: I don't think it's perfect. We've got a little ways
Speaker 3: to go, but you've got to crawl before you crawl.
Speaker 3: Baby steps, right, you got to crawl. Speaking of what
Speaker 3: a bol you got to crawl before you walk. Uh.
Speaker 3: And it's better. It is going to continue to improve,
Speaker 3: and the community is behind us. I mean, by and large,
Speaker 3: mister and missus John Hugh citizen. They don't want their
Speaker 3: children sitting around uh it having access to these things,
Speaker 3: or if they do, they understand that not everybody does.
Speaker 3: And maybe we should do that personally than leaving that
Speaker 3: responsibility up to the school district. So we have community support.
Speaker 1: Well, Derek, I'm glad you're doing this, and I said
Speaker 1: it before you came on in my mind, Unfortunately, the
Speaker 1: only thing that is going to make people check themselves
Speaker 1: are lawsuits like this, right because right now, the incentive
Speaker 1: to be vitriolic and nasty is really high because everybody
Speaker 1: retweets your stuff on Twitter or you know, they they're
Speaker 1: sharing your stuff on Facebook, and you know, I think
Speaker 1: people do this. And I don't know a single thing
Speaker 1: about this woman. I know nothing about her, but I
Speaker 1: think that once you start to get traction, there's a
Speaker 1: temptation to sort of escalate your your your you know,
Speaker 1: your your verbiage and make it worse and more extreme.
Speaker 1: And perhaps she got caught up in that, or perhaps
Speaker 1: she just isn't very bright and doesn't realize that this
Speaker 1: stuff is defamatory and she's going to have to learn
Speaker 1: a hard lesson.
Speaker 2: But maybe if more people started.
Speaker 1: Saying, wait a minute, I'm not going to let you
Speaker 1: get away with this, it would force other people to
Speaker 1: sort of say, hmmm, is it really worth it to
Speaker 1: come after this person online. Unfortunately, these sorts of lawsuits
Speaker 1: are very expensive, and that's where you're finding yourself now.
Speaker 3: They costs a lot of money, and you've hit the
Speaker 3: nail right on the head. So she's said all along.
Speaker 3: All she wanted was two things, an apology and for
Speaker 3: me to stay away from her daughter's school. She's gotten
Speaker 3: both of those things. At the very next candidate forum,
Speaker 3: I offered a very heartfelt and sincere apology, cameras rolling
Speaker 3: the microphones up, turned on, and I have not been
Speaker 3: to her daughter's school one time since I've been on
Speaker 3: the board. I don't want to traumatize anybody's daughter. Why
Speaker 3: would I want to do that. So the two things
Speaker 3: she's claimed she wanted, she's gotten. The only thing I
Speaker 3: wanted was tr you to stop running around saying these
Speaker 3: things about me, and you do that by serving the
Speaker 3: season to asist. She brings the season to Asist two
Speaker 3: of the school board meeting, reads it out loud, and says,
Speaker 3: I'll spend the next ninety seconds retracting everything I've said
Speaker 3: about Derrek Wilburn and stands they're in pen drop silence
Speaker 3: for ninety seconds, which is a law.
Speaker 2: Okay, that's what.
Speaker 3: In other words, everything I've said about him, he's a child,
Speaker 3: sex better, et cetera. It's all true.
Speaker 1: So that is next level passive aggressive right there. I mean,
Speaker 1: I got to tell you as a passive aggressive master myself.
Speaker 1: That is next level passive aggressive. That that's not going
Speaker 1: to play well in front of a judge.
Speaker 3: It didn't, It didn't. This This judge has made it
Speaker 3: quite clear where he stands on the anti slat motion
Speaker 3: to dismiss. We'll find out where he stands on the
Speaker 3: awarding of damages once a jury brings back their verdict. Right,
Speaker 3: that could be a year from now.
Speaker 2: Right, right, So let me do this.
Speaker 1: Derek actually has a gifts end go account if you
Speaker 1: would like to support him in this endeavor. And like
Speaker 1: I said, I hate it that this is where we are.
Speaker 1: But I think that other than walking up and stocking
Speaker 1: people in the nose, which I do not endorse in
Speaker 1: any way perform, I'm not sure what people can do
Speaker 1: to stop the level of nastiness that we see on
Speaker 1: a daily basis in our political dialogue. And so maybe
Speaker 1: it is going to be things like this that are
Speaker 1: required to bring people back in check.
Speaker 3: I'm with you, MC, I mean, I don't want this,
Speaker 3: I don't need this. I don't have time for this.
Speaker 3: I just want to see children get the best education
Speaker 3: that they can. Right. At some point, you've got to
Speaker 3: stand up for yourself. I mean at some point you've
Speaker 3: got to say, look, we've crossed the line, and I
Speaker 3: hate this and I don't want this at all, but
Speaker 3: you've got to defend yourself at some point, and we
Speaker 3: simply reached to.
Speaker 2: That point, correct, Derek Wilburn. Go back to your vacation.
Speaker 1: I've put the link to your goat Give Give Send
Speaker 1: Goo account on the blog, along with a link to
Speaker 1: an article from the Gazette down in Colorado Springs that
Speaker 1: gives a little more of the backstory, although I think
Speaker 1: we covered it really well. Go enjoy your vacation and
Speaker 1: we will share updates as you make them available to
Speaker 1: me about where this whole thing is headed.
Speaker 3: Don't mind if I do, and if I remember correctly, MC,
Speaker 3: you ob a bowl of General Tale's hike, Dagan.
Speaker 2: I do call me when you get back in town.
Speaker 3: See ya.