WEBVTT 1 00:00:16.559 --> 00:00:20.960 All right, Hi, welcome everyone, this is another episode. Let's started, 2 00:00:21.000 --> 00:00:25.679 they'll say, and we're talking today with Madnus Mueller from Greenway. 3 00:00:26.160 --> 00:00:27.640 All right, Mad is welcome. 4 00:00:28.440 --> 00:00:29.600 Why don't we kick it off? 5 00:00:29.800 --> 00:00:31.719 Tell us a little bit about yourself. 6 00:00:35.240 --> 00:00:39.399 I thank you for having me here. Yeah, so two 7 00:00:39.439 --> 00:00:42.159 years ago I was I was hitchhiking around the world 8 00:00:42.840 --> 00:00:47.399 through Central America, through Middle East from Germany, tom lest 9 00:00:47.679 --> 00:00:51.799 through India, Southeast Asia, and half of my time was 10 00:00:51.799 --> 00:00:55.880 wasted at stupid traffic lights. So I thought back then, 11 00:00:56.039 --> 00:00:59.679 like which century we're living in, Like this cannot be true. 12 00:01:01.200 --> 00:01:04.959 So doing a hacker Ton in Germany with some colleagues 13 00:01:04.959 --> 00:01:10.400 from my undergrad and cognitive science so neuroscientists, we tackled 14 00:01:10.400 --> 00:01:14.560 this problem and we built the first PROTECT pilot project 15 00:01:14.599 --> 00:01:17.560 for that we could actually manage in a simulation to 16 00:01:17.799 --> 00:01:22.239 like release skyrocket, like all the metrics like Seal two emissions, 17 00:01:22.239 --> 00:01:25.840 lowered downfield usage, waiting times, and we thought, wow, this 18 00:01:25.840 --> 00:01:29.760 this is incredible. And yeah, since then we are on 19 00:01:29.799 --> 00:01:34.359 this journey for almost two years now to tackle this 20 00:01:34.439 --> 00:01:38.599 problem with a vision to both every single traffic light 21 00:01:38.760 --> 00:01:45.000 on this planet. And while doing this, I moved from 22 00:01:45.000 --> 00:01:48.640 my undergrad to my to my master program in cyric 23 00:01:48.840 --> 00:01:53.920 at Etah, where I'm surrounded with many motivated people, especially 24 00:01:54.040 --> 00:01:57.000 around the student project house. It's like an accelerator where 25 00:01:57.200 --> 00:02:01.719 you're forbidden to study on your project on your university courses, 26 00:02:01.760 --> 00:02:03.799 so you have to work on your court, on your project, 27 00:02:04.319 --> 00:02:09.560 and I just love to be surrounded by people push. 28 00:02:09.960 --> 00:02:13.639 That's that's how I came here today. 29 00:02:14.840 --> 00:02:17.080 So, Magnus, I mean, why did we double click on 30 00:02:17.120 --> 00:02:19.719 the problem itself for a little bit, right, for people 31 00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:25.319 to understand better? So you said you were hitchhiking. Obviously 32 00:02:26.080 --> 00:02:28.919 that is a challenge by itself, right In addition to that, 33 00:02:29.919 --> 00:02:32.599 you are stopping at two way too many traffic lights 34 00:02:32.599 --> 00:02:36.319 and spending a lot of time. So uh, for people 35 00:02:36.400 --> 00:02:40.080 who probably don't know too much about traffic lights and 36 00:02:40.120 --> 00:02:44.560 how it works today, right, I mean, is what goes 37 00:02:44.599 --> 00:02:47.319 on today in most of the world. You think, right, 38 00:02:47.479 --> 00:02:51.159 why why people stop at these lights? And maybe it's 39 00:02:51.159 --> 00:02:54.800 a primitive way of doing it, maybe it's not the 40 00:02:54.840 --> 00:02:57.639 best optimized way to do it, But I mean, what 41 00:02:57.759 --> 00:03:00.719 is the real problem itself? Can you maybe two minutes 42 00:03:00.759 --> 00:03:01.000 on that? 43 00:03:01.120 --> 00:03:04.639 Yes? So I guess everyone who lives in a city 44 00:03:04.639 --> 00:03:07.479 with traffic lights knows the situation, like fix them in 45 00:03:07.520 --> 00:03:09.800 the middle of the night where you drive and you 46 00:03:09.879 --> 00:03:12.479 face a red traffic light and they think, okay, house 47 00:03:12.439 --> 00:03:15.000 is possible, like there's no car intersection? Why do I 48 00:03:15.039 --> 00:03:18.520 have read? And of course different cultures deal different with 49 00:03:18.560 --> 00:03:23.400 that situation. Some just go over some way. But if 50 00:03:23.439 --> 00:03:26.199 you think that problem, which is now really clear to everyone, 51 00:03:26.360 --> 00:03:28.879 fix some to the rush hour okay, where you have 52 00:03:29.000 --> 00:03:32.719 thousand cars from every side and you have there a 53 00:03:32.879 --> 00:03:36.080 stupid traffic lights which in many cities just run on 54 00:03:36.360 --> 00:03:40.199 static cycles, so every side just gets the same amount 55 00:03:40.199 --> 00:03:43.680 of brief time, no matter what's the current traffic, what's 56 00:03:43.680 --> 00:03:45.960 the weather, if there was a big football game and 57 00:03:46.000 --> 00:03:49.080 there are now thousand people coming from one side. So 58 00:03:49.919 --> 00:03:53.400 in many cities they have like just still stupid traffic 59 00:03:53.439 --> 00:03:56.120 lights and some for someone in Germany they now started 60 00:03:56.159 --> 00:04:00.960 to tackle this problem by investing like millions of euros 61 00:04:01.479 --> 00:04:04.520 and too expensive sensors, so they open the street, play 62 00:04:04.520 --> 00:04:09.360 some pressure sensors or install cameras to then optimize single intersections. 63 00:04:09.919 --> 00:04:13.639 But if you think about that like nowadays, especially why hitchhicking, 64 00:04:13.719 --> 00:04:16.560 I realized every day around the world uses mobile phones 65 00:04:16.600 --> 00:04:20.279 in their car and with that with Google Maps, tom 66 00:04:20.360 --> 00:04:24.800 Tom Rixia many providers, you have globally available real time 67 00:04:24.920 --> 00:04:28.839 data for the whole planet, and based on that data, 68 00:04:28.959 --> 00:04:32.279 we build models to optimize those traffic lights, not just 69 00:04:32.319 --> 00:04:36.439 for one intersections, but for whole cities. So those interactions, 70 00:04:36.439 --> 00:04:38.480 they can talk to each other. You can say, hey, 71 00:04:38.800 --> 00:04:41.720 I send to you now ten cars coming this way. 72 00:04:42.720 --> 00:04:45.519 With this communication, they can have a much more efficient 73 00:04:45.879 --> 00:04:47.360 optimization for the whole city. 74 00:04:48.319 --> 00:04:50.519 Got it? So any have you done any sort of 75 00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:54.639 research magnets to see how big this market is? You know, 76 00:04:54.720 --> 00:04:58.519 obviously you obviously seem passionate about the problem itself, right, 77 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:01.199 But I mean for you to spend time and say, oh, 78 00:05:01.360 --> 00:05:03.680 I want to solve this. I want to solve this 79 00:05:03.720 --> 00:05:07.680 by starting a company. I mean, what sort of numbers 80 00:05:09.120 --> 00:05:14.639 market cab or market size rather any research numbers you have, yes. 81 00:05:15.000 --> 00:05:17.360 Yes, of course, so right now we'll do a lot 82 00:05:17.399 --> 00:05:20.120 of fund raising. So I'm familiar with all this numbers, 83 00:05:20.519 --> 00:05:24.199 Like the total available market is around ten billion dollars 84 00:05:24.279 --> 00:05:27.879 in that space with a forty percent growth rate. Because 85 00:05:27.959 --> 00:05:30.439 for example, in Germany there are now many smart city 86 00:05:30.560 --> 00:05:32.800 Also in India, I saw there like one hundred new 87 00:05:32.800 --> 00:05:37.240 smart cities so the government like really pushes those initiatives 88 00:05:38.600 --> 00:05:42.439 as different reason has stealed two and sustainability issues, but 89 00:05:42.519 --> 00:05:46.120 also air pollution. Also in Germany, Many, many cities are 90 00:05:46.480 --> 00:05:49.600 just don't have enough people to manage their traffic lights 91 00:05:49.639 --> 00:05:52.920 like manually, so they invest more and more in those 92 00:05:52.959 --> 00:05:54.720 automated solutions. 93 00:05:55.279 --> 00:05:59.759 Got it. So it obviously affects us, say every day everyone, 94 00:06:00.040 --> 00:06:01.720 I mean anyone who's on the road, I mean whether 95 00:06:01.759 --> 00:06:05.000 you're a pedestrian or whether you're driving a car or 96 00:06:05.240 --> 00:06:10.759 you're driving a commercial truck. So that's a very unique 97 00:06:10.759 --> 00:06:16.720 problem that you're trying to solve. So obviously sorry, good. 98 00:06:16.399 --> 00:06:19.480 Yeah, yeah, you're completely right, Like it impacts all of us. 99 00:06:19.519 --> 00:06:22.480 And if you think it impacts in so many different industries. 100 00:06:22.519 --> 00:06:25.120 If you, for example, think okay, you're sitting banganor and 101 00:06:25.160 --> 00:06:30.040 you're now ordering your food and your food delivery, it's 102 00:06:30.079 --> 00:06:33.079 like maybe for you those couple of seconds which is late, 103 00:06:33.519 --> 00:06:36.079 isn't a big difference because of stupid traffic lights. But 104 00:06:36.120 --> 00:06:38.360 if you think, like for such a global business there's 105 00:06:38.439 --> 00:06:42.199 like millions of trips every day, a couple of seconds 106 00:06:42.240 --> 00:06:44.480 per trip is like immense and you can think that 107 00:06:44.560 --> 00:06:48.680 from the logistic the truck through the bicycle industry like 108 00:06:49.360 --> 00:06:53.199 it just impacts basically everything understood. 109 00:06:53.439 --> 00:06:55.879 So we've spoken about the problem. I think we have 110 00:06:55.879 --> 00:06:59.160 a fair idea of what the problem is. So I 111 00:06:59.560 --> 00:07:03.480 see greenway has an AI in it. So what is 112 00:07:03.519 --> 00:07:07.160 your approach to solving this problem with greenway? 113 00:07:09.120 --> 00:07:14.199 Okay, so what was done until now was you look 114 00:07:14.240 --> 00:07:18.439 at the city and you calculate, Okay, this traffic light 115 00:07:18.519 --> 00:07:21.279 is five hundred meters away from this traffic light, so 116 00:07:21.600 --> 00:07:24.800 we need to switch this traffic lightlight thirty seconds later green, 117 00:07:24.879 --> 00:07:28.120 so that cars or bicycles, whatever you want to optimize, 118 00:07:28.160 --> 00:07:31.639 have kind of a seamless flat green greenway, steamless flow. 119 00:07:32.519 --> 00:07:34.879 But of course for us humans, that's hard to do 120 00:07:34.920 --> 00:07:39.079 that with twenty different lodes, twenty different intersections and their 121 00:07:39.240 --> 00:07:43.040 their complexity, the interactions between them, and that's where our 122 00:07:43.399 --> 00:07:46.240 OAI comes into. Plank we have. We can create a 123 00:07:46.279 --> 00:07:51.399 simulation of a city stack bangal or here, San Francisco, Berlin. 124 00:07:52.240 --> 00:07:55.600 Create a simulation and then in a simulation we can 125 00:07:55.639 --> 00:08:00.920 simulate everything. We can simulate cars, bicycle, trucks, buses, drives 126 00:08:00.920 --> 00:08:04.199 around like in a real world. Now we can train 127 00:08:04.279 --> 00:08:11.000 in AI, which in the beginning just completely stupid control 128 00:08:11.079 --> 00:08:13.600 the traffic light. You can imagine it's like a baby 129 00:08:13.639 --> 00:08:17.319 which comes to the world and there's just stupid actions 130 00:08:17.360 --> 00:08:20.079 like putting the hand into the fire and gets feedback 131 00:08:20.199 --> 00:08:22.839 and gets better and better and hair and like this. 132 00:08:22.920 --> 00:08:26.720 You can also imagine our AI. We can throw thousands 133 00:08:26.720 --> 00:08:31.639 of different like traffic situations on it. We can rush 134 00:08:31.720 --> 00:08:35.000 our middle of the night, big football game, and all 135 00:08:35.000 --> 00:08:39.480 those different data distributions can then get learned from our 136 00:08:39.559 --> 00:08:43.480 system to get better and better. You can just choose 137 00:08:43.600 --> 00:08:46.440 what it should optimize. Some cities they want to optimize 138 00:08:46.440 --> 00:08:49.200 for speed, some for seal tool emissions, some they want 139 00:08:49.240 --> 00:08:54.759 to improve buses or want to prioritize bicycles, and based 140 00:08:54.799 --> 00:08:57.639 on what the city wants, you can then design your 141 00:08:57.639 --> 00:09:01.919 optimization function to optimize statinism. Then, in the second step 142 00:09:02.080 --> 00:09:04.720 in the real world, you don't take the data from 143 00:09:05.000 --> 00:09:09.919 some Google maps or from sometimes feed it into your system, 144 00:09:10.080 --> 00:09:15.080 which is learned in assimilation and then outputs the best 145 00:09:15.080 --> 00:09:17.960 option to now in real time based on this data. 146 00:09:18.320 --> 00:09:19.720 Control the traffic. 147 00:09:19.919 --> 00:09:23.639 Got it, So I think I get it, But at 148 00:09:23.639 --> 00:09:26.480 the same time, I mean I'm a little I'm trying 149 00:09:26.480 --> 00:09:29.519 to understand a little better on the real time data 150 00:09:29.919 --> 00:09:30.200 of it. 151 00:09:30.279 --> 00:09:30.440 Right. 152 00:09:30.480 --> 00:09:34.879 Obviously with AI, you're training it with data that you 153 00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:39.360 already have based on different permutations and combinations, like you said. 154 00:09:40.039 --> 00:09:42.799 But at the same time, I mean, you know, traffic 155 00:09:42.879 --> 00:09:46.159 is always unpredictable, right, I mean, you know, a group 156 00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:49.600 of hundred might choose to have a party and they 157 00:09:49.759 --> 00:09:52.559 might be going in you know, fifty different cars, which 158 00:09:52.639 --> 00:09:55.360 is kind of an outlier, right, But I mean, how 159 00:09:55.399 --> 00:09:58.840 do you so you have a combination of historical plus 160 00:09:58.879 --> 00:10:03.480 real time data being fed and constantly kind of training 161 00:10:03.519 --> 00:10:06.320 your model or updating area. Is that the right way 162 00:10:06.360 --> 00:10:07.000 to think about it? 163 00:10:08.960 --> 00:10:12.320 Exactly? Yeah? So of course, like it's about making your 164 00:10:12.320 --> 00:10:15.120 models better and better and better and fitting more and 165 00:10:15.159 --> 00:10:19.240 more outlier cases into your model. And for example, if 166 00:10:19.240 --> 00:10:23.240 you take like, yeah, traffic, like you say, is such 167 00:10:23.279 --> 00:10:26.399 a huge diversity, Like you can just imagine, okay, here outside, 168 00:10:26.480 --> 00:10:29.840 is now a car from Amazon Prime? Then then maybe 169 00:10:29.840 --> 00:10:32.759 blocking the traffic light. Right, There's so many different cases. 170 00:10:33.240 --> 00:10:36.480 But by creating a model which is trained on millions 171 00:10:36.559 --> 00:10:37.440 of different. 172 00:10:37.200 --> 00:10:40.600 Data distributions and then you deploy them practice, and of 173 00:10:40.639 --> 00:10:44.000 course you will figure out in the beginning cases which 174 00:10:44.000 --> 00:10:47.840 are unexpected where which you need to handle for but 175 00:10:47.960 --> 00:10:51.759 over time, like self driving cars to get better and 176 00:10:51.799 --> 00:10:53.080 better and better from. 177 00:10:53.000 --> 00:10:59.720 Learning more and more and more regarded data distributions. Understand, yes, 178 00:11:00.159 --> 00:11:02.720 this is interesting, the cool thing here? 179 00:11:05.000 --> 00:11:06.399 Make you have messed this up? 180 00:11:06.480 --> 00:11:06.879 I think? 181 00:11:11.039 --> 00:11:11.720 Then I'll go ahead. 182 00:11:13.759 --> 00:11:16.480 Yeah, I was gonna ask, at least the solution is 183 00:11:16.519 --> 00:11:20.320 going to sit through with the state level agencies or 184 00:11:20.840 --> 00:11:25.519 the traffic agencies. How has that interaction been, right? I 185 00:11:25.559 --> 00:11:28.519 get like I would be curious to hear your reactions 186 00:11:28.519 --> 00:11:33.480 with them. 187 00:11:34.320 --> 00:11:36.240 You mean to go to market, so how we sell 188 00:11:36.279 --> 00:11:36.639 to the city. 189 00:11:36.840 --> 00:11:39.399 Yeah, like, because once you would have exposed the solution, 190 00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:42.000 I'm sure they're like, oh, why our system is not 191 00:11:42.080 --> 00:11:44.519 good enough? Like was that the reaction of people who 192 00:11:44.519 --> 00:11:47.440 were very open to oh, look that there is a 193 00:11:47.440 --> 00:11:48.440 better way of doing it. 194 00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:55.039 So for sure there are some like like you have 195 00:11:55.080 --> 00:11:58.759 to understand and all our customer interviews, we realize those 196 00:11:58.799 --> 00:12:04.320 cities especially they have nowadays a huge problem with skill shortage, 197 00:12:04.879 --> 00:12:07.440 so they don't have enough people to handle those problems. 198 00:12:08.159 --> 00:12:13.159 And for example, in normal small, medium sized cities, there 199 00:12:13.159 --> 00:12:16.919 are hundreds of construction sites every year which changed the 200 00:12:17.000 --> 00:12:23.759 road network and to handle those road blockages, those cities 201 00:12:23.799 --> 00:12:29.000 they pay expensive factional engineering offices who then create new 202 00:12:29.039 --> 00:12:34.840 traffic signals schedules by hand for those intersections. So by 203 00:12:34.879 --> 00:12:39.240 doing those customer interviews, we realized, okay, with those skill 204 00:12:39.320 --> 00:12:42.120 shortage where they really don't have enough people to look 205 00:12:42.120 --> 00:12:45.320 for anything, we can have one of the biggest value 206 00:12:45.440 --> 00:12:48.240 proposition to them. And so you really need to figure 207 00:12:48.240 --> 00:12:50.639 out I mean, in the end of course you benefit 208 00:12:50.679 --> 00:12:53.919 the whole society, but in a first step, like you say, 209 00:12:54.039 --> 00:12:56.399 you sell the cities. So first you need to figure 210 00:12:56.399 --> 00:12:59.279 out why would the city buy the solution, why would 211 00:12:59.279 --> 00:13:03.679 they waste time on you? And one is skill shortage, 212 00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:08.080 another one is still to a must reduction, and third 213 00:13:08.120 --> 00:13:12.799 one is for example, direct cost savings in the the 214 00:13:12.840 --> 00:13:16.639 public transport sector when they need less buses to keep 215 00:13:16.720 --> 00:13:19.879 up the bus frequency. Imagine the bus in the city 216 00:13:19.919 --> 00:13:22.240 wants that every thirty minutes is a bus in front 217 00:13:22.240 --> 00:13:25.320 of your house which can pick you up. And if 218 00:13:25.320 --> 00:13:29.240 now traffic is poor, they need more buses. But if 219 00:13:29.279 --> 00:13:32.960 you improve your the system, then they need less buses. 220 00:13:33.159 --> 00:13:37.080 And such a bus is super super expensive, like normally 221 00:13:37.080 --> 00:13:41.039 they keep one for like ten years, costs around one million, 222 00:13:41.320 --> 00:13:45.440 so to handle them for one year costs around one 223 00:13:45.559 --> 00:13:49.200 hundred to more than two hundred thousand euros per year, 224 00:13:49.519 --> 00:13:52.639 and that's where you can provide them like a value proposition. 225 00:13:53.759 --> 00:13:57.879 And if you have like those three arguments, then you 226 00:13:57.879 --> 00:14:00.399 can go to cities and of course, like we have 227 00:14:00.519 --> 00:14:03.879 heart problems as a young startups that they to get 228 00:14:03.919 --> 00:14:05.720 trust off those cities, and our. 229 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:10.200 Strategy is to go with with pilot projects, which we 230 00:14:10.279 --> 00:14:13.440 offer them almost for free to say, okay, let us 231 00:14:13.519 --> 00:14:16.679 try this out so you can discover how much you 232 00:14:16.759 --> 00:14:20.639 benefit from that and. 233 00:14:19.720 --> 00:14:23.000 Over time win more and more trust off those cities. 234 00:14:24.399 --> 00:14:27.919 Got it, Thanks, thanks my migness. So one of the 235 00:14:30.200 --> 00:14:31.639 I don't know if it is you call it a 236 00:14:31.679 --> 00:14:33.919 residual effect or a side effect. This actually can be 237 00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:39.039 a big selling point I'm assuming is what goes hand 238 00:14:39.080 --> 00:14:43.639 in hand is if you regulate traffic efficiently and you 239 00:14:44.039 --> 00:14:48.120 regulate traffic safely, you can avoid a lot of accidents 240 00:14:48.120 --> 00:14:51.120 as well. Right, I mean, you know why do most 241 00:14:51.120 --> 00:14:53.559 of the accidents happen because you know, people are in 242 00:14:53.559 --> 00:14:56.879 a rushia. People are frustrated because you know, the traffic 243 00:14:56.960 --> 00:15:00.159 light is in red for so long and they take 244 00:15:00.200 --> 00:15:03.039 a you know, a risk to just cut across the 245 00:15:03.080 --> 00:15:06.080 street and go or you know speed or whatnot. So 246 00:15:06.759 --> 00:15:11.240 I mean, is your solution with Green Bay trying to 247 00:15:11.279 --> 00:15:15.519 pitch you know, public safety on the roads as also 248 00:15:15.639 --> 00:15:18.000 one of these effects. I mean, is that something you've 249 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:18.879 thought about as well. 250 00:15:21.519 --> 00:15:25.200 So we are aware of studies which show that if 251 00:15:25.200 --> 00:15:29.720 you improve traffic flow so less stopping code traffic, then 252 00:15:30.120 --> 00:15:35.440 this increases road safety. And we can clearly improve traffic 253 00:15:35.480 --> 00:15:38.960 flow somewhere in simulation in rush hour we can sometimes 254 00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:41.679 reduce a number of waiting vehicles, but up to ninety percent. 255 00:15:43.000 --> 00:15:46.159 And but asn't now we have never used that fact. 256 00:15:46.679 --> 00:15:50.519 I think that's something which especially needs to figure it out, 257 00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:53.919 like what clear percentage we can say, or like how 258 00:15:53.919 --> 00:15:57.000 many accidents less are there. It's a thing which is 259 00:15:57.039 --> 00:16:00.840 really hard to measure for us right now. But long term, 260 00:16:01.039 --> 00:16:05.519 like this just goes hand in hand and with my vision. 261 00:16:05.559 --> 00:16:09.600 And the cool thing here is that if you improve 262 00:16:09.720 --> 00:16:12.720 one factor, then you improve so many other factors. You 263 00:16:12.799 --> 00:16:18.759 improves your two waiting time, fuel usage, road safety, stability. 264 00:16:19.559 --> 00:16:22.879 That's one thing which really amazed me about this problem. 265 00:16:23.559 --> 00:16:25.639 Awesome magnets. I mean, it's a it's a great idea. 266 00:16:26.559 --> 00:16:31.679 Obviously you started this based off your experience traveling the world, 267 00:16:32.120 --> 00:16:34.639 so you didn't see it in just one place. I 268 00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:38.039 mean this is applicable kind of in every city around 269 00:16:38.080 --> 00:16:41.919 the world. I mean, you know, you've you're obviously from Germany, 270 00:16:42.679 --> 00:16:46.399 You've seen the traffic in in Bangalore. So do you 271 00:16:46.440 --> 00:16:50.559 do you think, I mean greenway will work for any 272 00:16:50.799 --> 00:16:55.200 permutation and combination sort of thing, or in other words, 273 00:16:55.360 --> 00:16:57.720 it will it work for any any city you think, 274 00:16:57.799 --> 00:17:01.759 any modern city so to speak, or you think you 275 00:17:01.879 --> 00:17:05.799 have a sort of a template for an ideal city 276 00:17:05.880 --> 00:17:09.720 where greenway will work now and maybe work elsewhere later. 277 00:17:10.240 --> 00:17:11.200 What is your thought on that? 278 00:17:14.559 --> 00:17:17.680 So, of course we have our initial target customer group 279 00:17:17.799 --> 00:17:20.200 where we start with this, but our plan is to 280 00:17:20.279 --> 00:17:23.039 make this work everywhere, to solve of every single traffic 281 00:17:23.119 --> 00:17:26.240 light on this on this planet. And of course some 282 00:17:26.400 --> 00:17:29.880 cities are faster, somewhat slower, So we focus, especially in 283 00:17:29.880 --> 00:17:32.319 the beginning, just on those who love us and really 284 00:17:32.319 --> 00:17:36.400 want to develop it just together with us. And our 285 00:17:36.519 --> 00:17:39.960 vision is like long term to make the whole process 286 00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:44.680 around smart cities really easier for cities. Right now, imagine 287 00:17:44.680 --> 00:17:48.920 you're a developer and you want to develop your app 288 00:17:49.119 --> 00:17:52.200 for the App Store, so that everyone can benefit from it, right, 289 00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:54.440 so you just go to Google play Store or App 290 00:17:54.440 --> 00:17:58.400 Store and to upload your app. But in cities this 291 00:17:58.480 --> 00:18:02.039 is right now, super super hard because every city uses 292 00:18:02.039 --> 00:18:05.400 a different system and you have to do tenders. But 293 00:18:06.119 --> 00:18:11.079 like my long term vision is that long young developers 294 00:18:11.319 --> 00:18:13.559 and there'll be in India and Germany or in the 295 00:18:13.680 --> 00:18:17.119 US if the ideas can come to a city and 296 00:18:17.200 --> 00:18:21.640 an easy framework can bring in their ideas and easy 297 00:18:21.720 --> 00:18:27.480 sandbox like format to run experiments on some infrastructure from 298 00:18:27.519 --> 00:18:31.240 small they save parts of the city to test out 299 00:18:31.279 --> 00:18:32.960 new stuff. And I think with that we can have 300 00:18:33.359 --> 00:18:36.359 in so many different ways new innovation which benefits in 301 00:18:36.400 --> 00:18:40.759 the end all of us will live in those cities. Great. 302 00:18:43.599 --> 00:18:46.079 I'm still really more of the fact that it's hitchhiking 303 00:18:46.119 --> 00:18:46.680 that got. 304 00:18:46.519 --> 00:18:47.319 You to the solution. 305 00:18:47.720 --> 00:18:51.640 To be honest, I would be like, you weren't even 306 00:18:51.720 --> 00:18:53.759 driving at that point, you still got bothered with the 307 00:18:53.799 --> 00:18:59.839 traffic lights. That's just seriously amazing. But it's also it's 308 00:18:59.880 --> 00:19:03.480 the scale of the problem too, right, This is you 309 00:19:03.519 --> 00:19:06.200 said it yourself, right, You're starting with a small setups 310 00:19:06.319 --> 00:19:08.519 that's the one city in then expand globally. 311 00:19:09.039 --> 00:19:12.440 That's a massive vision, right, how is it and how 312 00:19:12.519 --> 00:19:14.839 is your day to day right when you go out 313 00:19:14.880 --> 00:19:17.000 and like, Okay, I'm gonna achieve this one at a time, 314 00:19:17.440 --> 00:19:18.640 how does that day look like. 315 00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:27.000 My day to day life. So it really depends on 316 00:19:27.039 --> 00:19:30.960 the face of the business. Like sometimes I remember two 317 00:19:30.960 --> 00:19:34.279 months ago, I was coding day and night, just thinking, 318 00:19:34.799 --> 00:19:39.559 brainstorming on like a flip shot, you know, and drawing 319 00:19:39.880 --> 00:19:44.160 architectures of our AI model. How's the whole pipeline going 320 00:19:44.759 --> 00:19:48.279 right now? It's a whole day like fund raising. Right 321 00:19:48.319 --> 00:19:53.319 now we have fund raising half a million euros and 322 00:19:53.359 --> 00:19:56.240 so I reach out to many investors right now, I'm 323 00:19:56.240 --> 00:20:01.119 here in Silicon Valley and just pitch I worked a 324 00:20:01.119 --> 00:20:04.119 lot along pitch Deck, learned a lot to improve there. 325 00:20:04.480 --> 00:20:06.920 About legal stuff, I learned a lot. So I think 326 00:20:06.920 --> 00:20:09.599 that's it's one of the most amazing things to be 327 00:20:09.839 --> 00:20:12.920 a founder, to just get insights into so many different domains, 328 00:20:13.000 --> 00:20:16.680 learn about legal, learn about hiring, learn about tech, to 329 00:20:16.680 --> 00:20:19.920 be a generalist. And I think especially for crewious people 330 00:20:20.200 --> 00:20:23.240 like us, they're one of the most amazing things to do. 331 00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:30.839 So for anyone listening Magnus, you are fundraising and you 332 00:20:30.839 --> 00:20:34.720 you're maybe again based on what I know I will 333 00:20:34.759 --> 00:20:36.759 say it and you can correct it. You're looking for 334 00:20:36.839 --> 00:20:39.440 angels for a start, right I mean you're in an 335 00:20:39.440 --> 00:20:42.599 initial seed face or you can probably talk about what 336 00:20:42.759 --> 00:20:46.119 sort of funding you would rather take in right now. 337 00:20:49.079 --> 00:20:52.400 Yes, So we got nominated for like a three million 338 00:20:52.759 --> 00:20:55.400 grant in Germany where we want to hack at them 339 00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:58.960 at the federal Ministry. And to secure this grant, we 340 00:20:59.480 --> 00:21:03.839 are our saying five hundred k and we have already 341 00:21:03.960 --> 00:21:08.000 the first angels committed. It's all around pre seed, like 342 00:21:08.200 --> 00:21:12.279 we're especially looking for people who bring smart money on 343 00:21:12.319 --> 00:21:14.200 the table, who wants to bring a network on a 344 00:21:14.279 --> 00:21:17.880 table in the mobility space. Can be a tech space 345 00:21:18.799 --> 00:21:23.240 advisor from from Google, can be also in the government 346 00:21:23.400 --> 00:21:27.119 sector like everything. Just someone who is also frustrated about 347 00:21:27.119 --> 00:21:30.400 this problem and wants to solve it. I'm happy to 348 00:21:30.440 --> 00:21:33.519 talk with. Can be pre seed be cs or or 349 00:21:33.599 --> 00:21:36.119 angels who really believe in that mission to solve that 350 00:21:36.200 --> 00:21:39.640 problem globally. And it's crazy if you do the calculation, 351 00:21:39.759 --> 00:21:42.599 like how many million tons of seal two we can 352 00:21:42.720 --> 00:21:48.200 save with that solution, Like it's insane and that's really 353 00:21:48.240 --> 00:21:49.880 what what motivates me. 354 00:21:49.880 --> 00:21:53.920 To somebody anyone with money in the bank and a checkbook. Right, 355 00:21:54.079 --> 00:21:56.240 that's that's that's that's what you're looking for. 356 00:21:57.839 --> 00:22:02.359 Yeah, basically someone who brings a new new ideas. 357 00:22:02.559 --> 00:22:06.759 I'm always so I want to do a little bit 358 00:22:06.799 --> 00:22:10.359 of a flashback maybe, right Obviously we've talked in about 359 00:22:10.559 --> 00:22:15.279 enough about your hitchhiking, so to speak. But I mean, 360 00:22:15.319 --> 00:22:17.599 did you always want to be an entrepreneur or it 361 00:22:17.720 --> 00:22:18.799 just happened by chance? 362 00:22:24.839 --> 00:22:27.359 I think in the world where I grew up right now, 363 00:22:27.920 --> 00:22:31.359 it's like a really hype it's all around ath Agent's 364 00:22:31.480 --> 00:22:35.039 Rakes project house that was an esoprick. 365 00:22:35.400 --> 00:22:39.079 Like, Okay, maybe maybe I say this also because I'm 366 00:22:39.079 --> 00:22:42.519 in this, baba, it could be also true because everyone 367 00:22:42.640 --> 00:22:46.880 around me is like an entrepreneur. But yeah, I think 368 00:22:47.440 --> 00:22:50.920 like also, when I was younger growing up and I 369 00:22:50.960 --> 00:22:54.200 had problems, I always thought, okay, like what's the chance here, 370 00:22:54.599 --> 00:22:59.160 Like I I remember I was sixteen, I'm selling like 371 00:22:59.599 --> 00:23:03.039 Tisha designs online and I need to upload those designs 372 00:23:03.240 --> 00:23:07.079 to like Ama Zone, and I just wasted my time 373 00:23:07.119 --> 00:23:09.480 with uploading. So I just started, okay, writing my own 374 00:23:09.519 --> 00:23:15.200 boughts to to upload that stuff. Just whenever if you 375 00:23:15.279 --> 00:23:18.759 face a problem, I thought, okay, okay, what chance is here, 376 00:23:18.880 --> 00:23:22.519 what solution could be here? Which also I don't better 377 00:23:22.839 --> 00:23:25.319 fits from it, and I think this is what an 378 00:23:25.440 --> 00:23:27.400 entrepreneur does in the beginning. 379 00:23:28.119 --> 00:23:32.079 Yeah, do you still think it's all hyped up being 380 00:23:32.079 --> 00:23:32.839 an entrepreneur? 381 00:23:39.000 --> 00:23:42.160 I think right now a lot here in my age, 382 00:23:42.279 --> 00:23:46.319 like many young people want to be really independent and 383 00:23:46.640 --> 00:23:50.279 want to create their own company. And I think like 384 00:23:51.079 --> 00:23:53.799 right now, especially online, like we have so many tools 385 00:23:53.799 --> 00:23:57.279 which support us with that makes it easier and easier 386 00:23:57.920 --> 00:24:01.880 to just go out and co found is went investors 387 00:24:02.759 --> 00:24:06.680 great first MVPs, like the structure to do that is 388 00:24:07.480 --> 00:24:08.160 become much. 389 00:24:08.039 --> 00:24:11.119 More Would you recommend caution or would you be more 390 00:24:11.160 --> 00:24:13.599 like you know, hey, more power at this point, like 391 00:24:13.720 --> 00:24:14.799 knowing what you know now? 392 00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:21.799 Yeah, if I would recommend to be an entrepreneur, yeah, 393 00:24:22.480 --> 00:24:25.960 so I think, yeah, of course I wouldn't. I would 394 00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:29.400 recommend it. Yeah, especially if you're like curious, like if 395 00:24:29.400 --> 00:24:31.319 you feel inside of you that you want to be 396 00:24:31.400 --> 00:24:33.680 it and there's just a little bit, you know, maybe 397 00:24:33.680 --> 00:24:35.799 a little bit of fear or just can't be anything 398 00:24:35.799 --> 00:24:38.160 which holds you back, then I would definitely recommend it 399 00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:41.599 to you. But I think we often forget also in 400 00:24:41.759 --> 00:24:46.799 big companies they are often like really entrepreneurs, you know, 401 00:24:47.000 --> 00:24:49.799