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Speaker 1: Hi Arrow, This is Anna.

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Speaker 2: Hi Anna, how are you doing today.

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Speaker 1: I'm great, nice to meet you.

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Speaker 3: I'll tell you what your book really covers. Something that's

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very touching to my heart in the way that I've

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been that guy who has had artwork out there, and

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I'm also the guy who purchases artwork. So therefore, when

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I got my hands on this book, I'm going, oh, really,

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now I can dive into something that also has to

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do with art.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I'm so glad that you loved it.

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Speaker 3: Where did this story come from inside of you? Is

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it based on an experience or is it just something

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that hits you inside your imagination, maybe while walking or

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even taking a nap.

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Speaker 1: While it's something that came to me over a period

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of years, I was working in the art world in

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auction houses and galleries in between London and New York,

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mostly because I was dating someone. I was following a

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guy who had become my husband around the world, so

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I was basically I was working in those environments and

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I was seeing crazy things go on and sort of

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recording it all in this journalistic way. At the same time,

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I was I was sort of inspired by by a

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tabloid story of an art dealer who got involved in

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a Ponzi scheme, so kind of it went that way naturally.

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Speaker 3: It seems like wherever there's art, there's always a con

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man or or a law that's about to be broken.

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How what is the connection between the.

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Speaker 1: Two, Yes, well, ero, it's it's a I feel like

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it's a really unregulated world, maybe the last very unregulated industry.

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And it's a lot like the finance world in that

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you're trusting in these people who tell you their experts

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to buy stuff for you, to handle your money. In finance,

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you're trusting them to buy socks or invest for you.

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In the art world, trusting them to tell you who's

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a good artist and buy the art for you. There

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are a lot of checks and balances in finance and

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art maybe not so much.

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Speaker 3: That's so true because when it comes to me buying art,

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someone will call me up and say, here's the situation.

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This is what's going to be offered at this particular sale.

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You can come in or I can just make sure

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that I get this one. And you've got to trust.

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Speaker 2: You've got to trust, You've got to trust, and you hope.

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Speaker 3: That the investment has a payoff. But I'm not going

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to see the payoff. It's going to be those that

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are after me because I want something, you know, to

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be long lasting. Am I being a bad buyer when

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I do that?

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Speaker 1: No, not at all. I think the good thing is

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that most people in the art world are very trustworthy

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and you know, they want the best for their clients.

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They are friends with their clients a lot of the time.

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It's just, you know, there are always a few bad

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apples in every industry.

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Speaker 3: Especially when it comes to the painters themselves, because it

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seems like every time I meet with a painter, you know,

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it's like it's all about the money.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you set.

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Speaker 3: Or a trader, a painter is it's all it's all

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about the money. I mean, it's you know, I realize

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you the starving artist kind of a thing. But the

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thing is is that it's like they you know, you'll

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even if you go to a flea market, the painters

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are sitting there going, okay, I'll sell it to you

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for seven hundred and fifty dollars. I'm going, what you're

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at a flea market?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, the middleman is always trying to make an

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extra extra book, and I think salesman salesman are tricky.

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I mean people with a real gift for selling something.

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They are special in this world and they know it

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and they take advantage of it.

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Speaker 3: Please do not move. There's more with Anna Barrington coming

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up next. The name of the book The Spectacle from

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Anna Barrington. Let's get back to that talk.

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Speaker 2: What have you.

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Speaker 3: Learned along this, this this journe because I mean you

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you being a part of it and then putting it

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in a book and now bringing it to us, you know,

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to feed our imaginations. I mean this has got to

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be exciting for you. What have you learned?

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Speaker 1: It's so exciting. I think I learned a lot about

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so My main character in the Spectacle, Rudolph, is this

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charming and manipulative art dealer who is lying to a

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lot of people. He's kind of a pathological liar and

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he double deals because his debts are spiling out of control.

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I think I learned a lot about that type of

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person who is kind of very common.

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Speaker 3: What kind of research did you do? Because I mean

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in order to make you know him so real and authentic.

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I mean it's like, do I know this person?

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Speaker 1: My research was? You know? I just I lived that life.

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You know, I went to all these parties. I knew

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those types of guys, and I also knew those the

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types of collectors. I also knew guys in finance who

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were a lot like that too, So it felt very real.

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At the same time, I felt like I was channeling

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stuff that was happening culturally and political. Those types of people.

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Speaker 3: For you, that's got to be balanced, because I mean,

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you've got to work with both both you know, the

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buyer as well as you know everything else in the

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involved with the gallery.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, of course. I mean I wasn't really, I wasn't

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a salesperson. I was I was on the writing side.

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I worked with artists.

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Speaker 3: When you say the writing side, so you're you're build

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you're building the copy and stuff like that to get

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the word out there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. I was writing press release and interviewing artists.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: That's see, that's that right, there is that connection. That's

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what pulled me into like Wentworth Gallery and things like that,

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so that I could go in there and make sure

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that these things got done.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, I mean I'm sorry, Well, what kind of

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artists do you like?

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Speaker 2: I Well, I'll say you, I I've got you.

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Speaker 3: I've got Peter Max, I've got Charles what is his

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last name, but he does a three D art and

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and and so they and I was so fascinated by that.

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I've got Matisse and and so you know, I like

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and you know, it's it's one of those things where

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it's like, I want to invest so that the the

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investment itself has value for other people beyond me.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I've even got a pause.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, he's great.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So I mean, did did you work one on one

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with a lot of these artists? Did you invite him

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into your area?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Well, they were kind enough to invite me into

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their studios. So it was it was amazing getting to

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know them and and sort of seeing inside the mind

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of artists who and be very prophetic, you know, about

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the future where they see our culture going. You know,

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they spend their lives thinking about the idea that make

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the world tick, trying to find a deeper meaning in that.

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So it was really profound for me.

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Speaker 3: Well, and to create that conversation because to walk up

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to Paul Stanley, I wasn't gonna go up there and say,

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so you're part of the group, kiss man. I went

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up there and asked him. I said, did you scrape

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your canvas when you're painting? And he goes, what do

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you mean? And I explained to him what I do

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because I'll scrape the paint so it has a lighter

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feel to it, And all of a sudden, that was

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the conversation starter. And when you get with someone like Peter,

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when you get with Peter Max, I go, Okay, you're

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peaking your paint.

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Speaker 2: What are you doing?

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Speaker 3: Are you drawing my attention from the origin of your

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original thought? And then that got the conversation going.

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Speaker 1: M yeah, I mean, artists are often so interested in

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the process of the physical process of making art.

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Speaker 3: What did you learn in being with those creative minds?

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Because when you sat down to write this book in essence,

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in my heart, I feel like you were painting a

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beautiful picture.

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Speaker 1: Oh, thank you, thank you so much. Yeah. I really

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was very influenced by artists and how they make work.

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A lot of it is they sort of a lot

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of artists they sort of give themselves over to I

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guess the muse you would say, they sort of let

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intuition guide them and they concentrate on the process of

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something very physical and sort of looking everywhere artists. They

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admire reading a lot what's going on culturally and sort

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of letting that flow through them in this kind of

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collage like way, letting all the the layers accumulate. And

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so I thought of I thought of writing this book

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very similarly, very visual person I love.

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Speaker 3: Do you see this growing into a binge watch or

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some sort of movie that stars Ed Norton.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, I really hope so, because.

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Speaker 3: It's got that drama, it's got that appeal, it's it's

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got there. There's just something about it that says it's

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got to be in moving picture.

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Speaker 1: Oh god, I'm so so glad to hear you say that.

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I hope other.

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Speaker 3: People I get to, Well, they've got to get their

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hands on us. So where can they go to get

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their hands on it?

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Speaker 1: Anywhere you get your books.

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Speaker 2: That's a good answer.

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Speaker 3: Where can we find out more about you?

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Speaker 1: You can go to my website Anna Barrington dot com

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or I'm also on Instagram, Anna Barrington Campbell.

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Speaker 2: I love it.

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Speaker 3: Please come back to this show anytime in the future.

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Ten minutes with you is just not enough.

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Speaker 1: Oh thank you so much. Er, It's been a pleasure.

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Speaker 2: Will you'd be brilliant today? Okay, you too, Thank you,