1 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:09,880 Speaker 1: What is up, fellow sickos. 2 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:12,199 Speaker 2: I am Dan Valley coming at you with my certified 3 00:00:12,279 --> 00:00:15,960 fantabulous goes. Mister Grant Hughes taking a break from sort 4 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:19,000 of day to day reactions to look at more macro stuff. 5 00:00:19,039 --> 00:00:21,039 This is something we might try and do once a week, 6 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:23,640 just these little mini things to give you a third 7 00:00:24,039 --> 00:00:27,320 full type episode of the week if we can. No promises, 8 00:00:27,359 --> 00:00:30,120 but we're always what did we call grant hashtag? We 9 00:00:30,199 --> 00:00:33,039 try shit, we try, continue to try shit. We are 10 00:00:33,079 --> 00:00:35,640 behind on this, but we're going to react to some 11 00:00:35,719 --> 00:00:38,039 of the rookie extent or all of the rookie extensions 12 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:40,240 that were given out and maybe some of their bigger 13 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:43,679 picture implications. I will say, Grant, before we throw it 14 00:00:43,719 --> 00:00:46,880 on screen, have you figured out, like what's the best 15 00:00:47,039 --> 00:00:51,280 way for you to frame how you feel about an extension? 16 00:00:51,600 --> 00:00:53,359 And it's not even just for the rookies but for 17 00:00:53,399 --> 00:00:54,880 any team. And what I kind of mean by this 18 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:56,960 is what I've kind of settled on is now I'm 19 00:00:57,039 --> 00:00:59,399 kind of looking at Okay, well, how much what percent 20 00:00:59,399 --> 00:01:00,240 of the cap is. 21 00:01:00,159 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 1: The final year worth? Now? 22 00:01:02,039 --> 00:01:04,319 Speaker 2: And that's probably the best way because you could look 23 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:05,879 at it in general. Oh, the first year is this 24 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:08,439 percentage of the salary cap? But I think even scaling 25 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:10,359 out forward and saying, well, how is this contract going 26 00:01:10,400 --> 00:01:12,400 to age? But I'm also trying to view it through 27 00:01:12,439 --> 00:01:14,959 a lens of as we're talking about this, I talk 28 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:17,599 in circles. You're just super smart. I don't want it 29 00:01:17,599 --> 00:01:20,120 to be like inaccessible wire rambling on or throwing too 30 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:23,640 much information at listeners and viewers. And I think I 31 00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:26,560 settled on that might be the best nutshell way aside 32 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:29,280 from the raw number, to say, okay, like this is 33 00:01:29,719 --> 00:01:33,359 again zooming forward, fast forward, what does this contract look 34 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:35,319 like down the line? How might at age that might 35 00:01:35,359 --> 00:01:37,599 be the number that I view is most important? 36 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:40,319 Speaker 3: Now does that mean you know it totally? Because you 37 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:43,599 got to find because the raw dollar figures still just 38 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:47,280 like don't compute sometimes because of the rising cap, and 39 00:01:47,439 --> 00:01:50,560 you're comparing it to older deals. You know? That seemed like, 40 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:53,439 how is how is Scottie Barnes getting X? And when 41 00:01:54,079 --> 00:01:55,959 I can't even think of a good example now, and 42 00:01:55,959 --> 00:01:59,439 when like so and so signed five years ago to 43 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:01,480 his rookies el Max, it was why It's like those 44 00:02:01,560 --> 00:02:03,959 numbers kind of stick in your head. So some kind 45 00:02:03,959 --> 00:02:07,040 of distant point of comparison helps for me. I just well, one, 46 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:09,759 I think we both view it and this is a 47 00:02:09,759 --> 00:02:11,639 weird thing, but this is just how it is. From 48 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:14,280 the team perspective, Don't you default to that where it's like, oh, 49 00:02:14,319 --> 00:02:16,280 is this a good value for the team, sort of 50 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:18,879 unavoidable because otherwise it's like if you go from the 51 00:02:18,879 --> 00:02:21,800 player perspective, it's like he got the most money that 52 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:23,280 he could, therefore it's a good deal. 53 00:02:23,319 --> 00:02:27,479 Speaker 2: It's like not, I think because especially when these like 54 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:30,360 rookie extensions are signed, it's the team that in all 55 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:33,319 like wood is taking the bigger risk because like, these 56 00:02:33,319 --> 00:02:36,280 players are never finished products, right, and then it gets 57 00:02:36,319 --> 00:02:38,360 to and with them it's the only time you're taking 58 00:02:38,400 --> 00:02:40,599 not a risk is if you signed for less than 59 00:02:40,599 --> 00:02:42,680 the max. And so if you're a player looking at 60 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:45,280 ahead to next season, and this is me being generous, 61 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:48,680 we're talking like the Spurs, the Hornets and the Nets 62 00:02:48,719 --> 00:02:50,879 can have cap space if they really want to, Like, 63 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:52,680 there are some other teams that can sneak in there. 64 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:56,639 And we saw zero restricted free agency offer sheets go 65 00:02:56,719 --> 00:02:58,919 out this past summer and last summer. Grand I think 66 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:01,520 Paul Reid the only player who signed on and that 67 00:03:01,599 --> 00:03:02,639 was because the Jazz did that. 68 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:03,639 Speaker 1: I love it, I favor it. 69 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:07,400 Speaker 3: Yeah that was a weird one. No, So yeah, it's 70 00:03:07,479 --> 00:03:12,599 team perspective. I I mean really, because the numbers get 71 00:03:12,599 --> 00:03:15,400 funky and like I still am not I don't. I 72 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:17,599 think that you do this way better than I do. 73 00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:19,639 Where you look at what's the percentage of the cap, Like, 74 00:03:19,719 --> 00:03:21,520 just tell me what percentage of the cap this this 75 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:23,319 is going to be on an annual basis, and that 76 00:03:23,319 --> 00:03:25,879 that at least keeps things like scaled correctly for me. 77 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:27,840 I just still kind of look at it relative, like 78 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:31,639 in relative terms, where Scotty Barnes got this, kid Cunningham 79 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:33,360 got that. Now a lot of these are gonna be identical, 80 00:03:33,439 --> 00:03:36,120 but in general, just like what's the because I'm just 81 00:03:36,159 --> 00:03:38,520 looking for what the market says a guy's worth and 82 00:03:38,599 --> 00:03:41,199 did you pay more or less than that? And that's 83 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:43,360 like kind of my starting point for evaluating these. It's 84 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,000 not sophisticated or like all that inventive, but that's just 85 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:47,599 how I try to like keep it straight. 86 00:03:47,919 --> 00:03:49,360 Speaker 1: Let's begin with the Max guys. 87 00:03:49,439 --> 00:03:51,759 Speaker 2: I think these were the four that just signed their 88 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:55,120 deals first, right, So Scottie Barnes kaid Cunningham, who I 89 00:03:55,159 --> 00:03:56,919 have up there twice for some reason, I'm tized for 90 00:03:56,919 --> 00:04:01,159 everybody watching h Franz Wagner and Mobley was the other one. 91 00:04:01,159 --> 00:04:03,240 So they all got five years, two hundred and twenty 92 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:05,639 four point two million. All of them can get up 93 00:04:05,639 --> 00:04:07,800 to two hundred and sixty nine point one million, depending 94 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:09,919 on whether they make an All NBA team or win 95 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:15,280 DPOY slash MVP. There is with Mobiley and Franz Wagner, 96 00:04:15,319 --> 00:04:19,839 specifically Grant, there's differentiation. There's like differential language that says 97 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:23,240 their contracts can also increased to two forty six point. 98 00:04:23,079 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 1: Seven depending on what happens. 99 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:28,959 Speaker 2: So I wanted to I have two just overarching questions 100 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:32,800 on this one. Was there any of these contracts that 101 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,199 you felt most done easy about? 102 00:04:35,560 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 3: I mean, you know what it is, right, Like, I 103 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:40,279 think this is the consensus. It's just it's Wagner's He's 104 00:04:40,439 --> 00:04:43,600 proved the least of these three of these four three 105 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:45,720 other guys, of the of the four that got Max's, 106 00:04:46,959 --> 00:04:50,879 his ceiling seems the lowest, and he's also not the 107 00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:54,560 best player on his team. That doesn't disqualify you like 108 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:58,480 Mobiliy's not either. I guess you'd say, because Donovan Mitchell 109 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:01,959 just has been more decorated. Uh, but but that's that's 110 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:04,040 the one where the moment it was signed, it was 111 00:05:04,079 --> 00:05:07,199 like really like that the just going all the way there, huh. 112 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:09,079 And then when you get a couple other guys after 113 00:05:09,079 --> 00:05:11,480 the fact that are signing for less than the max, 114 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:15,600 I think it looks the iffiest of the four by 115 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,040 far right that that's that has to be the answer 116 00:05:18,759 --> 00:05:19,199 for sure. 117 00:05:19,399 --> 00:05:21,439 Speaker 2: And who do you think has the best chance of 118 00:05:21,480 --> 00:05:23,839 getting to that thirty percent max, which would be two 119 00:05:23,879 --> 00:05:24,959 hundred and sixty nine million. 120 00:05:26,199 --> 00:05:29,040 Speaker 3: I mean, I think you have to go mobilely because 121 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:31,040 he could win Defensive Player of the Year like that. 122 00:05:31,199 --> 00:05:34,120 I don't I immediately went to that. Yeah, yeah, that 123 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:36,199 that's just the way you get there. Like Cunningham's not 124 00:05:36,199 --> 00:05:39,680 winningn MVP Cunningham, I mean, Cunningham could make an all 125 00:05:40,360 --> 00:05:42,959 could be all NBA. I've really I think everybody but 126 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:46,519 Franz has a shot at all NBA here. But yeah, 127 00:05:46,519 --> 00:05:48,560 that so just of those, maybe we should confine it 128 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:52,399 to just those other three. We'll take Franz out of Mobile, 129 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:56,040 Cunningham and Barnes. Do you just view those as like 130 00:05:56,439 --> 00:05:59,639 it's a three way tie for like that's sensible, or 131 00:05:59,639 --> 00:06:02,519 do you do differentiate any of those three and say, 132 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:04,839 like maybe one of them shouldn't have got the max, 133 00:06:04,920 --> 00:06:07,240 or maybe maybe one of them could have pushed for 134 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:09,399 a player option, which kind of used to happen more 135 00:06:09,399 --> 00:06:10,959 often than it does on that last year. 136 00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:12,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, no, don't worry. 137 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:18,839 Speaker 2: Patrick Williams got a player option, though I think it 138 00:06:18,879 --> 00:06:22,399 would probably be Barnes had the most leverage because he 139 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:24,480 is the most important player to his team and is 140 00:06:24,519 --> 00:06:28,160 also just shown more than Kay Cunningham to date, in 141 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:30,560 part because he's played more. If you were asking of 142 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:32,879 those three, forget about defensive player the year, who's more 143 00:06:32,879 --> 00:06:34,800 likely to make it all NB a team this year? 144 00:06:35,519 --> 00:06:40,560 I actually might it's probably Mobile because maybe I'm skewed 145 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:42,519 by the Barnes at orbital fracture where it's always even 146 00:06:42,519 --> 00:06:44,279 gonna have the games played at the end of all 147 00:06:44,319 --> 00:06:46,680 this for the Raptors. But he's playing on a good team. 148 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:48,839 He has a chance to be the second best player 149 00:06:48,879 --> 00:06:51,040 on that team this season. So whether it do you 150 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:52,839 want to frame it as overall getting to that thirty 151 00:06:52,879 --> 00:06:55,319 percent max as of right now, though for all these 152 00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:58,160 deals are currently worth projected to be worth about twenty 153 00:06:58,199 --> 00:07:00,240 two and a half percent of the coup salary cap. 154 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:01,839 In their final year, that number will take up a 155 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:05,240 bit if anyone actualizes the thirty percent language. 156 00:07:05,399 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 1: I will say I will be fairly surprised. 157 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:10,399 Speaker 2: If any of these four players wind up getting the 158 00:07:10,439 --> 00:07:11,439 thirty percent max. 159 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:12,040 Speaker 3: I just don't. 160 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:14,519 Speaker 2: I don't feel great about any of them making an 161 00:07:14,519 --> 00:07:15,720 All NBA team this year. 162 00:07:15,839 --> 00:07:17,959 Speaker 3: I think I agree with that and like, and as 163 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:21,199 we always say, if any of them does, then that's 164 00:07:21,199 --> 00:07:23,199 a great problem for their team to have, because you 165 00:07:23,279 --> 00:07:26,120 just that means, that means this deal was a good 166 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:29,319 one if the guy basically just proved that he could 167 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,279 hit the accelerators in the contract in that first year. 168 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 2: Honestly, the only team really quickly that I think probably 169 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:37,399 should have negotiated harder. Like even if you thought, well, 170 00:07:37,439 --> 00:07:40,199 why not just use restricted free agency to our advantage, 171 00:07:40,319 --> 00:07:41,879 The Cavs weren't gonna have cap space. 172 00:07:42,199 --> 00:07:43,680 Speaker 1: The Raptors, you just don't. 173 00:07:43,439 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 2: Have anyone other than Scotty Barnes, the Pistons. You don't 174 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:48,040 get to treat players like this when you're the No, 175 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:49,160 we're gonna make you wait. 176 00:07:49,079 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 1: Even though we probably not gonna have cap space. 177 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 2: Either it's Orlando because Franz is not your most important player. 178 00:07:53,839 --> 00:07:56,279 You had the ability to be flexible, but you decided 179 00:07:56,319 --> 00:07:58,319 in other areas, as we'll get to with Jalen Suggs, 180 00:07:58,399 --> 00:08:00,000 that you're not going to use that flexibility. 181 00:08:00,279 --> 00:08:02,040 Speaker 1: So next up. 182 00:08:02,079 --> 00:08:03,399 Speaker 2: As we go through this, it was really in no 183 00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:06,759 particular order. We're on to jail and Johnson five years, 184 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:10,199 one hundred and fifty million, no options. That'll be worth 185 00:08:10,199 --> 00:08:13,560 thirteen point twenty five percent of the cap in year five. 186 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:16,319 As of now, Grant, it looks like it will be 187 00:08:16,439 --> 00:08:18,720 where it's going to be at a flat rate. So 188 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,800 that's that's always you normally see an increase or decrease. 189 00:08:21,839 --> 00:08:24,120 I feel like maybe a flat Atlanta. Did they give 190 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:25,839 a flat rate thing with John Collins too? 191 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:27,079 Speaker 1: I think they might have. 192 00:08:27,639 --> 00:08:31,279 Speaker 3: That sounds right. Actually, it's a weird thing usually because 193 00:08:31,279 --> 00:08:34,360 it used to just be just standard what eight percent 194 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:36,360 raises or what. Depending on the length of the deal 195 00:08:36,360 --> 00:08:39,639 and the type of contract, it was always increasing this. 196 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:41,919 Do you feel like maybe this is a response to 197 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:43,919 some of the second apron fears of just like, okay, 198 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:45,879 we just want to lock this number in so that 199 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:47,600 we know what it's going to be going forward and 200 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:51,000 we don't have to account for rising pet salaries. 201 00:08:51,039 --> 00:08:51,279 Speaker 2: I don't know. 202 00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:53,039 Speaker 3: It just felt to me like there have been more 203 00:08:53,519 --> 00:08:55,000 Well in the Magic do this all the time with 204 00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:58,440 like flatter declining deals, but there's been more I don't know, 205 00:08:58,519 --> 00:09:01,480 inventiveness and how you're there teams are structuring these deals. 206 00:09:01,519 --> 00:09:03,080 It seems like lately I think so. 207 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:04,840 Speaker 2: In Atlanta's case, and by the way, I was wrong, 208 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:06,840 they did not do a flat salary with John Collins. 209 00:09:06,879 --> 00:09:08,799 In Atlanta's case, they didn't even have the option really 210 00:09:08,799 --> 00:09:11,000 of making it declining because they're so concerned about the 211 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:14,440 tax in these coming years. Flat is interesting is always 212 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:17,000 interesting to me though, because okay, so you know what 213 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:18,240 that number is going to be, and you know it's 214 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:20,879 always going to be less of the salary cap moving 215 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:23,879 forward than it was in year one, despite not declining, 216 00:09:24,039 --> 00:09:26,720 how did you feel about, like, Okay, this is not 217 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:29,720 this was noticeably blow what his max could have been. 218 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:33,679 He has not started. Jalen Johnson's not look good to 219 00:09:33,759 --> 00:09:36,039 start this season. I think they've given him too much 220 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:40,679 agency agency on offense. I don't know if that's an 221 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:42,679 issue of Okay, look at the personnel that's available they're 222 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:44,919 dealing with some injuries here, but I think they need 223 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:46,600 to get back to streamlining his role where it's like 224 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:49,279 get out and transition, put him the ball in situations 225 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:51,840 where he already has advantages to go downhill, rather than 226 00:09:51,879 --> 00:09:54,320 asking him to create or giving him a license to 227 00:09:54,399 --> 00:09:56,840 kind of not even operate from dead stops but to 228 00:09:57,120 --> 00:09:57,919 try and initiate. 229 00:09:58,879 --> 00:10:02,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, I this is this is one where upfront it's 230 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:04,279 like one hundred and fifty over five, Oh my god, 231 00:10:04,879 --> 00:10:07,399 but that's really just eventually going to be by the 232 00:10:07,399 --> 00:10:10,120 time this deal is done, thirty million a year is 233 00:10:10,159 --> 00:10:12,279 just like it's what fifteen used to be in terms 234 00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:15,559 of Okay, that's a solid starter more or less. So 235 00:10:15,759 --> 00:10:18,039 like that's just what it is. I'm fine with it. 236 00:10:18,039 --> 00:10:20,799 I'm not going to read too much into his struggles early. 237 00:10:21,279 --> 00:10:24,720 I just think if you just I care more about 238 00:10:24,799 --> 00:10:27,720 like the trajectory that he's on more broadly, and the 239 00:10:27,759 --> 00:10:31,360 fact that last year he showed several new facets and 240 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:33,639 I would expect him to just continue to get better 241 00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:36,639 and and like I don't know, I don't think a 242 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:39,320 Max was ever really in play, but this is a 243 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:42,519 significant deal that does bring some risk. But I think 244 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:44,480 I think odds are he's going to be worth this, 245 00:10:45,399 --> 00:10:47,039 just whether you have Trey Young there or not, which 246 00:10:47,080 --> 00:10:49,080 is kind of another factor I think in Atlanta's thinking. 247 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:51,159 Speaker 2: I think it was probably a good bet by him, 248 00:10:51,279 --> 00:10:54,960 just based on how Atlanta has on multiple occasions now 249 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:58,519 marginalized important talent around Trey Young when you kind of 250 00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:00,840 look like what happened with John Colin, we look at 251 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:01,399 what happened. 252 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:02,279 Speaker 1: With de Johonte Murray. 253 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:04,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, in many ways, so I think this was probably 254 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:06,960 I think it's team friendly still, but I do think 255 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:09,000 it was probably a smart decision for Johnson, who he 256 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:10,679 is someone though that I think teams would have given 257 00:11:10,679 --> 00:11:13,440 an offer sheet to in RFA. Next up, if you 258 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:16,000 want to take us through his footnotes, is another Jailen, 259 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:16,919 Jalen Suggs. 260 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:19,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, Jalen Suggs also gets five for one point fifty. 261 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:21,320 Looking a little different though, and you've got it up 262 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:23,799 here on the graphic, it'll be just under twelve percent. 263 00:11:23,879 --> 00:11:25,559 His salary will be just under twelve percent of the 264 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:28,679 cap in the final year. Uh So obviously it declines 265 00:11:29,159 --> 00:11:31,519 he's gonna make thirty five million the first year, which 266 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:34,720 is just inside four million of the of the max, so, like, 267 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:37,360 you know, pretty close to what the best he could 268 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:39,679 have done, at least in that initial year. But then 269 00:11:39,759 --> 00:11:42,039 by the end he's down to twenty six point seven million, 270 00:11:42,279 --> 00:11:45,840 which is just like, that's that's a low number five 271 00:11:45,919 --> 00:11:48,919 years from now so or yeah, five years so uh, 272 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:52,639 if he stays exactly as good as he's been, that's 273 00:11:52,639 --> 00:11:55,720 a that's a heist number. If he gets any better 274 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:58,159 then like, and that'll just come on offense. We've talked 275 00:11:58,159 --> 00:12:03,399 about it plenty and this is still totally fine, and like, 276 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:04,960 I don't know that he's going to be a thirty 277 00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:06,919 five million dollar player in the first year of the deal, 278 00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:08,879 but he might be, and then after that it just 279 00:12:08,879 --> 00:12:11,000 gets easier and easier for him to clear sort of 280 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:13,600 the value bar. So I guess I would ask you, like, 281 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:17,879 you're spending the same amount of money on Jalen Johnson 282 00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:20,120 and team teams and situations are different, But do you 283 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:21,559 like one of one or the other of these one 284 00:12:21,639 --> 00:12:24,960 hundred and fifty million deals one hundred and fifty million 285 00:12:25,039 --> 00:12:27,480 dollar deals more or less than the other? 286 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:31,559 Speaker 2: Wow, it's probably the Sugs one because I think he 287 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:34,240 has the higher two way ceiling. Even if Jalen Johnson 288 00:12:34,279 --> 00:12:37,519 has the overall higher offensive ceiling, and maybe I'm skewed 289 00:12:37,519 --> 00:12:39,840 a little bit too much by the start of the season, 290 00:12:39,879 --> 00:12:42,279 but when you look at it declining, and also just 291 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:44,120 what the this is magic specific So it's not a 292 00:12:44,159 --> 00:12:46,320 reason they like the deal better. But now it's okay, 293 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:48,480 maybe there's a year that you have to cause is 294 00:12:48,519 --> 00:12:49,799 this going to be a team even if it's good, 295 00:12:49,799 --> 00:12:51,600 that's paying the tax? I don't know, But now can 296 00:12:51,639 --> 00:12:53,519 you suck it up for a year? But his deal 297 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:55,360 is going to decline as you are Franz and Paala 298 00:12:55,399 --> 00:12:57,919 Banko kicking in. Does that make it easier to keep 299 00:12:57,919 --> 00:13:00,840 your core intact while not just we're gonna keep those 300 00:13:00,840 --> 00:13:03,320 three guys regardless, but now adding talent around them or 301 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:05,440 paying talent that you need around them. 302 00:13:05,720 --> 00:13:06,399 Speaker 1: So I like that. 303 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,200 Speaker 2: Aspect of it for Orlando. But I think I'm curiously 304 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:11,399 what your answer be. I think I like the Sugs deal. 305 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:14,399 Let's forget about the salary scales just in net value. 306 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:18,840 I think I'm more confident in Suggs actualizing his value 307 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:20,320 on this than I am Jalen Johnson. 308 00:13:20,799 --> 00:13:23,799 Speaker 3: I think Suggs is the safer bet because you sort 309 00:13:23,799 --> 00:13:27,799 of you know that he can be a key player 310 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,600 on a very good team because he was last year, 311 00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:34,480 and that's that's true. While he still has pretty obvious 312 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:37,159 areas for growth, some of which I think are like 313 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,960 pretty doable. I kind of can't get away from Johnson 314 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:43,279 having like the higher ceiling, Like if he hits his 315 00:13:43,759 --> 00:13:47,120 you know, ninety fifth percentile outcome, I think then Jalen 316 00:13:47,159 --> 00:13:49,879 Johnson is like a two way big wing slash forward 317 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:52,639 that can kind of do everything, and that player type 318 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:56,519 just matters more than like an essentially like a combo guard. 319 00:13:56,559 --> 00:13:59,600 I don't know that that's that's the thing. Maybe Sugs 320 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:03,120 eventually proves he is actually a point guard, which hasn't 321 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:05,879 really happened yet, so there's upside there. But I think 322 00:14:05,919 --> 00:14:08,840 Johnson has Johnson's the ceiling play. Suggs is maybe the 323 00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:12,320 floor play, And so with the declining structure, I think 324 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:15,200 I still like the Suggs one a little better. But 325 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:17,200 I do think you have to acknowledge that Johnson, because 326 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:21,519 of the athleticism, size, position, like, there's a chance that 327 00:14:21,519 --> 00:14:23,840 that's one of the there's a better chance that that's 328 00:14:23,879 --> 00:14:25,960 one of the best value deals in the league in 329 00:14:26,039 --> 00:14:27,679 like three years than there is for Suggs. 330 00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 2: I'd say that's Jalen Johnson is more of an anomaly 331 00:14:32,399 --> 00:14:34,759 offensively for sure at his peak. But I will say 332 00:14:34,759 --> 00:14:37,320 with Suggs is we see defensive playmaking even this season 333 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:40,879 from JJ. But Jalen Suggs has a way of defensive 334 00:14:40,879 --> 00:14:44,799 playmaking without it costing his team or being viewed as gambles. 335 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:46,600 And that's a very tough line to straddle that I 336 00:14:46,639 --> 00:14:50,360 don't know sure if Johnson does well just yet. Next 337 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:52,840 up and this will be my guy. We have mister 338 00:14:52,919 --> 00:14:55,799 Trey Murphy who has yet to play this season. Four years, 339 00:14:55,879 --> 00:14:58,799 one hundred and twelve million dollars projected to be fifteen 340 00:14:58,879 --> 00:15:02,600 point zero six percent of the cap in year four. 341 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:06,960 What did you make of this one grant? I was I, 342 00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:10,720 I think I'm surprised this is what help. I'm surprised 343 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:11,879 at how team friendly. 344 00:15:11,919 --> 00:15:15,679 Speaker 3: It ended up being interesting. I think my first thought 345 00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:18,399 was not so much about the deal but what it 346 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:21,080 meant for the team, because, as everybody immediately jumped to, 347 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:23,279 it's like, Okay, well Brandon Ingram is really gone now 348 00:15:23,279 --> 00:15:27,039 because you're not you're not paying Tray Murphy this to 349 00:15:27,039 --> 00:15:28,679 come off the bench. I don't think it wouldn't be 350 00:15:28,759 --> 00:15:31,559 like an insane salary for a really really good six man. 351 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,840 But it does to me suggest that like the Ingram 352 00:15:35,879 --> 00:15:37,840 trade is just more likely. 353 00:15:37,759 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 1: That or the trade I guess. 354 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:41,600 Speaker 3: Somebody, Yeah, right, you got to clear a little bit 355 00:15:41,639 --> 00:15:44,000 of room because this is now like on trade there 356 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:48,200 it is first Scoot Henderson on draft night, Right, That's 357 00:15:46,639 --> 00:15:52,840 what I think. Like the shooting is a premium skill, 358 00:15:53,159 --> 00:15:56,200 and the position Murphy play is the defensive potential of 359 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:59,200 the length like all that stuff. Just that feels like, 360 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:01,919 you know, it's worth what are we at, like twenty 361 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:05,840 twenty eight twenty nine a year? Give something with twenty 362 00:16:05,879 --> 00:16:10,159 seven ish? I think that's about right. I do feel like, 363 00:16:10,399 --> 00:16:13,360 don't don't you think that it presumes that Murphy will 364 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:17,080 continue to be as efficient and effective as he's been 365 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,360 over just larger samples of minutes against better opponents, Like 366 00:16:20,399 --> 00:16:22,879 this presumes that, right, because it's if he's just what 367 00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:25,320 he was last year, which and we love him is 368 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:27,519 I don't know, this might be a little rich, right, 369 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:29,440 it like improved his pricet. 370 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:32,399 Speaker 2: I think I think if you were to if he's 371 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:34,600 just the same player, but he's locking more minutes and 372 00:16:34,639 --> 00:16:37,120 he's in the starting lineup. I think he's done enough 373 00:16:37,159 --> 00:16:40,000 to deserve this. This does that's interesting. This kind of 374 00:16:40,039 --> 00:16:43,759 feels the number seems to reflect that the Pelicans don't. 375 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:45,840 I mean, you lock him up with this number anyway. 376 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:47,360 He is something that I think he could have went 377 00:16:47,399 --> 00:16:49,440 to restricted free agency. He might have had more suitors 378 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:52,200 than Jalen Johnson or Jalen Suggs just because of how scalable. 379 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:53,919 Speaker 3: Yeah, universal for. 380 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:55,919 Speaker 2: Sure, right, but this does when you almost look at 381 00:16:55,919 --> 00:16:57,759 the number and the fact there's no player option at 382 00:16:57,759 --> 00:16:59,519 the end of it, does it kind of say. 383 00:16:59,320 --> 00:16:59,840 Speaker 1: No, that all right? 384 00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:02,039 Speaker 2: They what he is now on offense, like that's just 385 00:17:02,039 --> 00:17:04,680 what they consider him. He's showing me more, but it 386 00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:06,960 doesn't seem like they're prepared to let him try to 387 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:07,799 branch out. 388 00:17:08,039 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 3: I would say, yeah, well, and that's just kind of 389 00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:11,880 the player he's been where he's catch and shoot, catch 390 00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:14,200 and drive. Guy, he's not, you know, handling the ball 391 00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:17,079 a ton. I think if if he had more of 392 00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:19,480 that type of stuff in his game, this just just like, 393 00:17:19,559 --> 00:17:21,559 there's no way he signs for this little right, or 394 00:17:21,759 --> 00:17:25,039 the offers are way bigger, or maybe he's more incentivized 395 00:17:25,039 --> 00:17:27,680 to go to free agency. Because then you're talking about 396 00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:31,319 like a primary scoring like playmaking big wing, which is 397 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:34,519 that's the premium asset in the league. This this does 398 00:17:34,599 --> 00:17:36,319 to me suggests like I do think he can just 399 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:39,960 play more and sustain his like permanent stuff over longer stretches. 400 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:43,079 And I think you're right. I think that does that. 401 00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:45,240 This deal does sort of make it seem like that's 402 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:48,559 the expectation and not that he's going to be like 403 00:17:49,079 --> 00:17:52,000 contrasted with Jalen Johnson's it's like that seems to prising 404 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:55,720 you're gonna do some more like on ball stuff probably 405 00:17:55,759 --> 00:17:57,240 where this this doesn't seem to do that. 406 00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:00,200 Speaker 2: And also they didn't have the flexibility to do so. 407 00:18:00,279 --> 00:18:02,079 This is a team that probably could have benefited from 408 00:18:02,519 --> 00:18:05,880 a declining scale because of just thinking about, Okay, you've 409 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:07,920 paid on if you wanted to pay Ingram, that might 410 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:10,119 be a way to fit all that in. But they 411 00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:12,759 don't have the They're toning that fine line but beneath 412 00:18:12,799 --> 00:18:17,039 the tax moving forward, so they it is escalating. We're 413 00:18:17,039 --> 00:18:20,640 onto your guy, Mike Goasic Moody. 414 00:18:20,039 --> 00:18:22,720 Speaker 3: Just the I mean three years, thirty nine million got 415 00:18:22,759 --> 00:18:26,079 done right around the mid level range that was kind 416 00:18:26,079 --> 00:18:28,599 of hinted at that that might be where things were 417 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:31,400 going thirty seven and a half million. That's guaranteed. He's 418 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:33,880 got one and a half million unlikely incentives, which, by 419 00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:35,160 the way, this is a new trend. I don't know 420 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:36,759 if you've been kind of keeping up with this, Like 421 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:40,079 incentives might be just going away because they do count 422 00:18:40,079 --> 00:18:42,240 against the apron now and they didn't before. So if 423 00:18:42,279 --> 00:18:45,799 you throw a bunch of incentive dollars into contracts, that's 424 00:18:45,839 --> 00:18:48,000 counting again. That's but you don't want that to put 425 00:18:48,039 --> 00:18:50,920 you over aprons. So even though if it's not a cap, it's. 426 00:18:50,759 --> 00:18:53,680 Speaker 2: Just like that, and I might have mislabeled it. So 427 00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:56,359 I apologize his are likely incentives, they're considered. I would 428 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:58,839 love to know exactly what those likely incentives are because 429 00:18:58,839 --> 00:19:02,200 what about Moses Moody performance is considered likely under Steve. 430 00:19:02,039 --> 00:19:07,559 Speaker 3: Karr playing more than Jonathan kaminga. So this is projected 431 00:19:07,559 --> 00:19:09,920 to be worth just a little over seven percent of 432 00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:13,200 the cap in the final year, obviously a very tradeable number. He, 433 00:19:13,519 --> 00:19:16,119 like we said about Murphy, Moody is just kind of 434 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:18,640 a scalable. You're not scaling him up, but he does 435 00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:21,079 fit everywhere. He's just a three and d wing that 436 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:23,680 has a little more off the bounce than you might think, 437 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:25,880 so fits. 438 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 1: Into the poison pill provision neatly. That's how scalable he is. 439 00:19:29,079 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, outgoing salary of eleven point two million, which fits 440 00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:34,079 into the mL E, which is now like a trade 441 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:36,000 exception teams have if they didn't use it. So it's 442 00:19:36,039 --> 00:19:39,240 pretty I wouldn't say the deal designed to be traded, 443 00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:41,119 but if you were designing a deal to be traded, 444 00:19:41,279 --> 00:19:42,200 it might look like. 445 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:44,680 Speaker 2: This, right, because my first thought was because I was 446 00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:46,119 looking at a number and I was, they're gonna trade 447 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:47,119 him this season, aren't they? 448 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:47,359 Speaker 1: Still? 449 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:49,319 Speaker 2: He locked down a pay day and he's gonna finish 450 00:19:49,319 --> 00:19:50,359 the season somewhere else. 451 00:19:50,799 --> 00:19:54,799 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he's he. Whether he plays more than 452 00:19:54,839 --> 00:19:58,000 he has or not is kind of like, I don't 453 00:19:58,039 --> 00:20:00,839 know how relevant it is, because this is a eminently 454 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:04,960 tradable contract that almost any team would be interested in having. 455 00:20:05,079 --> 00:20:08,279 If the if he just continues to be either the 456 00:20:08,319 --> 00:20:10,880 seventh guy or the thirteenth guy on the war like 457 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:13,519 that somewhere else, he would just be the eighth man, 458 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:15,720 maybe better than that, And that's this is a bargain 459 00:20:15,799 --> 00:20:17,000 for that type of player. 460 00:20:17,599 --> 00:20:20,039 Speaker 2: I mean, move on, to Corey Kisbert, who signed for 461 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:23,680 four years fifty four point one million dollars. There's a 462 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:27,000 team option on that final year, at which point if 463 00:20:27,039 --> 00:20:28,920 if they pick it up, that's like six point three 464 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:31,680 percent of the salary cap in the final year he'll 465 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:32,839 be twenty nine years. 466 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:33,720 Speaker 1: That can't be correct. 467 00:20:33,839 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 2: I have to have a tight there's no way that's 468 00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:37,799 going to be his age, maybe age twenty seven or something. 469 00:20:37,839 --> 00:20:40,319 I know that Corey Kispert's older, but he's not gonna 470 00:20:40,319 --> 00:20:41,759 be age twenty nine at the end of this, is 471 00:20:41,799 --> 00:20:42,240 he grant? 472 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:45,440 Speaker 3: I think you're right. He didn't come in as a 473 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:46,200 as a young guy. 474 00:20:46,799 --> 00:20:50,920 Speaker 2: So what do you have any strong thoughts about this deal? I, 475 00:20:51,039 --> 00:20:54,359 if I had to give one, I do think he 476 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:57,240 actually does more than space the floor, and he's had 477 00:20:57,279 --> 00:20:59,359 some prougher defensive moments than I would have expected. 478 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:00,759 Speaker 1: And by the way, I was right about his age 479 00:21:00,799 --> 00:21:04,160 twenty nine season. That's that's wild. I still thought this numbers. 480 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:06,119 Speaker 2: The number is fine, but when you look at the 481 00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:09,920 average annual value, and it's more than Moses Moody, who 482 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,559 I view as he's more scalable at both ends of 483 00:21:12,599 --> 00:21:12,920 the court. 484 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:14,880 Speaker 1: But it's it's also kind of about the same number. 485 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 2: It's like they started it, they also made it. They 486 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:19,319 didn't decline it. But his first two years will be 487 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:22,079 about fourteen and then it drops to about thirteen. So 488 00:21:22,279 --> 00:21:23,920 just the little extra flexibility there. 489 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:25,480 Speaker 1: I just I don't know. 490 00:21:25,839 --> 00:21:27,680 Speaker 2: He wasn't someone who was going to get an offer sheet, 491 00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:28,839 and I don't know that you have to worry about 492 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:31,880 him about performing this. I'm fine with the deal that 493 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:34,000 that must be. Just like I understand it from both 494 00:21:34,039 --> 00:21:36,079 the player and team perspectives. I don't know that anyone 495 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:39,319 made out more so than the other here, No, it 496 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:40,119 does it. 497 00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:42,319 Speaker 3: I mean like you have to view anything with the 498 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:44,720 Wizards at this point, it's like, well, okay, so this 499 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:48,119 is done with the intention of it being appealing as 500 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:50,359 a trade asset, like and then just this is the 501 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:53,359 cost of shooting. But you know, on the market, I 502 00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:56,359 don't know. I don't I don't love it just cause 503 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,319 I don't know. I don't know how much difference there is. 504 00:21:58,400 --> 00:22:02,039 I don't want to undersell it, but like there's is 505 00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:06,079 Kispert a better fundamentally better player than like Malik Beasley, 506 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:08,599 you know, I don't know. It's like you can imagine 507 00:22:08,599 --> 00:22:11,480 them occupying similar roles in Beasley's gone. You know, it 508 00:22:11,559 --> 00:22:13,599 was a minimum guy two years ago making six this year. 509 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:16,400 It doesn't have four years of security like Kispert does. 510 00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:18,720 It feels like a little bit of an overpay, but 511 00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:23,880 not to the point where you couldn't imagine some team deciding, yeah, 512 00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:27,359 we'll give up like a couple seconds and expiring salary 513 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,359 for this guy to just come in and give us 514 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,680 a spacer right like that. That feels like what this is? 515 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,359 Speaker 2: I saved what I believe the most interesting two for last, 516 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:38,400 and they're from the same team. So we begin with 517 00:22:38,799 --> 00:22:39,720 Alpha and Shangun. 518 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,119 Speaker 3: This this is the one you point to when you're 519 00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:46,359 criticizing the Franz Wagner deal and some of the other 520 00:22:46,519 --> 00:22:49,400 Like you know, you're not going to say, don't give 521 00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:53,039 Kate or Mobley or Scottie the max, but like Shanghun 522 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:55,759 not getting the max. Even if you want to say, oh, 523 00:22:55,759 --> 00:22:57,720 it's because he got the player option on the fifth year, 524 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:01,759 that's still I mean five for that's seventeen percent of 525 00:23:01,759 --> 00:23:04,000 the cap and the final year of the deal, you 526 00:23:04,039 --> 00:23:06,400 could make the case that he has been more productive 527 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:08,200 to this point in his career than any of those 528 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:11,359 guys that got Maxes. I mean, Mobiley's got an argument. 529 00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:15,640 I suppose Barnes maybe, but like this is just it's 530 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,200 it's a little under. It's almost five million under the 531 00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:19,759 max that he could have gotten in the first year 532 00:23:19,799 --> 00:23:22,680 of the salary. He'll be twenty seven. Uh when that 533 00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:25,400 player option hits. He just like, great deal for the 534 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,279 Rockets and also kind of a good deal for him 535 00:23:27,319 --> 00:23:29,160 because he's gonna get out a year early and be 536 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,240 able to sign another huge deal sooner. I was just 537 00:23:32,279 --> 00:23:35,559 surprised that this got done sub max just because of 538 00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:37,480 where the other max guys came in. Were you. 539 00:23:38,559 --> 00:23:41,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, When I saw Fronz getting the max, that was 540 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,160 kind of well, why isn't Shane Gun? I know, his role, 541 00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:46,920 like the Magic kind of identified Fronz as a guy 542 00:23:47,319 --> 00:23:50,920 in year one and Shane Gun took into what year three? Yeah, 543 00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:53,160 for him to get there, it's a really good deal 544 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:56,119 for them. I think it only it shocked me. It 545 00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,119 didn't shock me that the Rockets did this because you 546 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:00,880 look at this year's for you agnency class. They didn't 547 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:02,359 need to care about cap space, and you view it 548 00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:05,359 in conjunction with they're actually lowered. I think Jalen greens 549 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:08,279 like offseason cap number. By signing him, I think you 550 00:24:08,279 --> 00:24:10,119 looked at it and said, there's more of a chance 551 00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:12,839 that he's going to outperform this deal next year and 552 00:24:12,839 --> 00:24:14,400 we'll have to max him out. So let's just save 553 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:15,880 the money off the top now and if we need 554 00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:18,559 to cut salary or just do everything via trade, which 555 00:24:18,559 --> 00:24:20,839 it seems like they're going to. But in terms of 556 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,880 upgrading the roster, not moving shangun specifically with him though, 557 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:27,160 and I think this was actually a stute by him. 558 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:30,359 I don't know which team of the cap Space Squasma 559 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:31,720 went out and tried to give him MAXI money. They 560 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:33,519 would have been signing trades on the table, I'm sure. 561 00:24:33,599 --> 00:24:37,079 But did he look at this roster as the Rockets 562 00:24:37,079 --> 00:24:39,599 and there's just too many guys? And is there just 563 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:41,880 a chance that even if I'm playing a ton, my 564 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:45,200 performance slips and my market value suffers as a result 565 00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:47,960 because they can't even five minutes for read Shepard. Right now, 566 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:50,880 I'm looking at Aman Thompson. I know that the raw 567 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:53,559 shooting percentages don't necessarily show this. This dude looks like 568 00:24:53,599 --> 00:24:56,319 he's itching to make an offensive breakout well, ending everyone's 569 00:24:56,319 --> 00:24:58,279 lives on the defensive end, and it's oh yeah, like 570 00:24:58,319 --> 00:25:00,839 he's averaging fewer minutes per game than last too, So 571 00:25:01,519 --> 00:25:03,240 I almost wonder. I know they have more of it. 572 00:25:03,319 --> 00:25:05,599 There's not as many like bigs blooting up the rotation 573 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:07,400 that you have him and Jabbari and Steven Adams and 574 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:10,599 that's basically it. But with him, I think was probably 575 00:25:10,799 --> 00:25:13,039 smart to do this. More so not even because of 576 00:25:13,079 --> 00:25:14,799 what the market could have been when you look at 577 00:25:14,799 --> 00:25:18,079 the cap space teams or lack thereof. I do view 578 00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:19,759 him as a central part of what the Rockets are doing, 579 00:25:19,799 --> 00:25:23,039 but there's so many guys in Houston that anything feels 580 00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:25,119 like it's on the table, good or bad for these 581 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:25,960 individual guys. 582 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:28,839 Speaker 3: I had not thought about that because I really viewed 583 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:32,160 him as sort of apart from all the other young 584 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,200 guys they need to play. Because he was such a 585 00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:37,960 focal point last year, it's like you're really different talking 586 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,720 about the Rockets if Sengoon is off the floor, like 587 00:25:40,759 --> 00:25:43,519 he just he had such a huge role, I wouldn't 588 00:25:43,559 --> 00:25:46,720 have thought that. Like he kind of scanned the team 589 00:25:46,759 --> 00:25:48,680 and said, like, my numbers might dip and that might 590 00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:51,599 cost me. That's an interesting position to take it. I 591 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:55,079 get the explanation that I think in conjunction with that 592 00:25:55,079 --> 00:25:56,920 that makes sense is he just wanted that player option. 593 00:25:57,039 --> 00:25:59,759 But I don't know. Man, Like, if I'm him and 594 00:25:59,799 --> 00:26:02,759 I'm seeing those other guys get Max's and I'm just 595 00:26:02,799 --> 00:26:05,480 like comparing my numbers to them, and like frankly, like 596 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:09,599 he drove winning to you know, on a five team 597 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:12,319 last year those other guys, I guess mobilely to some extent, 598 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,839 But like, I don't know if I'm signing this. If 599 00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:18,160 I'm him, I would just so like who's got So 600 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:20,920 it's Charlotte, Brooklyn and San Antonio? Are you are are 601 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:21,519 like losing? 602 00:26:21,519 --> 00:26:23,279 Speaker 2: Like the teams where by the way, not even all 603 00:26:23,319 --> 00:26:25,640 those teams are actually they're just they're like if the 604 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:27,519 Spurs were, hey, we will dumb Zack. 605 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:28,839 Speaker 1: Collins, we could have gap space. 606 00:26:29,039 --> 00:26:32,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, like Brooklyn doesn't have Like, so inserting 607 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,079 Shangun on some teams might be tough because it's like, well, 608 00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:37,279 Shanguon is just a He's a focal point. He's central 609 00:26:37,279 --> 00:26:39,440 to what you do. Like on Brooklyn, that's fine because 610 00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:42,720 they don't have anybody that that occupies that role. Charlotte's 611 00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:45,240 tricky because LaMelo's there, and you want Brandon Miller to 612 00:26:45,279 --> 00:26:48,039 have the ball. San Antonio would be fascinating with him 613 00:26:48,079 --> 00:26:49,880 and Wimby there. I would two of. 614 00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,680 Speaker 2: Those teams, by the way, have Wemby's just the big 615 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,799 in San Antonio. In Brooklyn they did for they did 616 00:26:55,799 --> 00:26:58,079 pay Nick Claxton. That's maybe not somebody who stops you 617 00:26:58,079 --> 00:27:00,599 from going to get shanggun. But Brooklyn is also trying 618 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:02,200 to be bad for the next two years, So why 619 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:04,200 would you add, right Chun. 620 00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:06,759 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's tough when you start looking. I would just 621 00:27:06,799 --> 00:27:09,200 look at Santa now. I'm now I've just spoken talked 622 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:12,559 myself into wanting san Antonio to happen first Singoon. Now 623 00:27:12,599 --> 00:27:16,000 it won't probably, But yeah, I don't know if I 624 00:27:16,039 --> 00:27:18,640 would have taken it, although, like I'm sure him and 625 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:20,960 his agent they just looked around and said, like, I 626 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:22,799 don't know that there's going to be more. You might 627 00:27:22,839 --> 00:27:25,720 just want to lock this up. So still, though, Super 628 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,519 Team like my favorite of the of the five year 629 00:27:28,559 --> 00:27:30,880 deals by far, just because it's so much less than 630 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:31,759 these other guys got. 631 00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:35,640 Speaker 2: Our final like actual extension that was signed I find 632 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:37,680 to be the most interesting actually, and I think it 633 00:27:37,759 --> 00:27:39,960 says more about the Rockets's. 634 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:40,319 Speaker 1: Longer term outlook. 635 00:27:40,599 --> 00:27:43,000 Speaker 2: You signed Jalen Green for three years, one hundred and 636 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:46,200 five point three million. The first year's salary I believe 637 00:27:46,279 --> 00:27:48,200 ends up being lower than his RFA hold was going 638 00:27:48,279 --> 00:27:48,400 to be. 639 00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:49,720 Speaker 1: I don't have it in front of me and already 640 00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:50,440 forgot the number. 641 00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:53,119 Speaker 2: They have a player option, So we mentioned, like all 642 00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:55,960 these deals Shane Gun and Green, I think we're the 643 00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,440 only ones who got player options on all these extensions. 644 00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:00,759 Speaker 1: That's that's that's a little why. But he has a 645 00:28:00,759 --> 00:28:01,440 player option. 646 00:28:01,279 --> 00:28:04,279 Speaker 2: On year three, which will be his age twenty five season. 647 00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:08,119 It's projected to be worth his salary about nineteen point 648 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:11,480 two percent of the cap. Now, people have said this 649 00:28:11,519 --> 00:28:13,359 is a deal that's designed to be traded, which I 650 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:15,519 think is where I find it most Like, there's a 651 00:28:15,599 --> 00:28:18,319 chance that Jalen Green ends up being worth this money. 652 00:28:18,519 --> 00:28:20,240 But if you think it's designed to be traded, you're 653 00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:22,079 almost saying, well, then, yeah, he absolutely needs to be 654 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:24,920 worth this money. It's not happening this season, would be 655 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:25,319 my point. 656 00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 1: If he gets. 657 00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:29,319 Speaker 2: Traded this year the Rockets, he counts his twelve point 658 00:28:29,319 --> 00:28:32,400 five million dollars in outgoing salary for them, and then 659 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:36,000 twenty nine point five million in incoming salary for his 660 00:28:36,039 --> 00:28:39,000 next team, and that's just to bridge that different from 661 00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:41,039 the middle of the season. So if he's getting moved, 662 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:43,200 it's in the off season when you have his salary 663 00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,039 coming in at like thirty three million or whatever it 664 00:28:45,079 --> 00:28:49,039 winds up being. So that's where I throw it to you, Grant, 665 00:28:49,119 --> 00:28:51,559 is do you view this one that this is a 666 00:28:51,599 --> 00:28:54,160 deal that they sign so that I know people kind 667 00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:56,880 of fret. Well, actually, let's start here. Let's say they 668 00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:59,559 don't move him. Are you really fretting over the possibility 669 00:28:59,599 --> 00:29:02,160 that you can't extend him off this? I think the 670 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:04,640 number is high enough. I think what you've risked is 671 00:29:04,839 --> 00:29:07,039 does he want to leave anyway? Because you didn't show 672 00:29:07,039 --> 00:29:10,720 that longer term faith in him out out the jump. 673 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:13,960 Speaker 3: So I definitely I feel like we got hit over 674 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:16,839 the head with the take that this was signed because 675 00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:19,160 the Rockets intend to trade him like right away. But 676 00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,720 that was my first reaction was was more that, like, 677 00:29:22,599 --> 00:29:28,160 the Rockets aren't sure justifiably that Jalen Green is a 678 00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:32,200 thirty plus million dollar player and a potential cornerstone or whatever, 679 00:29:32,519 --> 00:29:34,759 because he just has sometimes looked like that and most 680 00:29:34,799 --> 00:29:37,680 of the time has not and this is the result. 681 00:29:37,759 --> 00:29:40,680 They're just and he and I think he, like we've 682 00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:42,880 talked about with several other guys sing Goun included, kind 683 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:44,960 of looked at the landscape and said, like, I don't 684 00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:47,079 know what's going to be out there, why not do 685 00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:48,880 and get back on the market at twenty five. It 686 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:51,559 just feels like this is risk mitigation by like everybody, 687 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:54,279 and that's how you get a two plus one in 688 00:29:54,319 --> 00:29:56,880 a situation where it seems like it's almost always four 689 00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:59,480 or five right for guys of like his draft pedigree 690 00:29:59,799 --> 00:30:02,880 and and production really because the counting stats are still 691 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,440 there even if the efficiency hasn't been. So this just 692 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:09,799 felt like the rockets not comfortable going for four or 693 00:30:09,839 --> 00:30:12,960 five years at whatever that dollar figure needed to be. 694 00:30:13,519 --> 00:30:16,519 And Green and his rep saying like, some of the 695 00:30:16,519 --> 00:30:18,920 things you said about Sangoon like and all the like 696 00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:21,200 you know, minutes crunch stuff applies way more to Green 697 00:30:21,279 --> 00:30:23,240 than it does to Shangoon because there's just more guards 698 00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:25,480 and wings to split the minutes up. It just feels 699 00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:28,039 like everybody mitigated risk here, don't I don't view it 700 00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:30,720 as now he could still be traded, but because so 701 00:30:30,799 --> 00:30:33,359 could everybody on the Rockets. They can't pay everybody. But 702 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,279 I view it more as just like no one was 703 00:30:36,319 --> 00:30:38,559 sure they wanted to commit, and the money's there, and 704 00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:39,960 let's just do it for a couple of years and 705 00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:40,720 see where we're at. 706 00:30:41,079 --> 00:30:42,799 Speaker 2: And by the way, a handful of games of the season, 707 00:30:42,799 --> 00:30:45,200 this deal looks better for the Rockets than it did 708 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:48,839 when he signed it. Yeah, what I will will say though, 709 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:51,000 to the evidence that it was designed to be traded, 710 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:53,799 I view that as, Okay, well, that's an off season thing, 711 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:55,920 and it's there is logic to it in the sense 712 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:58,599 of if they wanted to go after they've been linked 713 00:30:58,599 --> 00:31:01,039 to Jimmy Butler. Sure, but if you want to go 714 00:31:01,039 --> 00:31:04,279 after anyone who's on like a big salary, you want 715 00:31:04,319 --> 00:31:06,440 other big salaries because you could talk about, well, they 716 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:08,359 could have just went the cap space route. There are 717 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:12,000 a few problem problems with that one. We very rarely 718 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:14,359 see those lopsided trades where teams are using their cap 719 00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:16,759 space bringing in this big name and teams only want 720 00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:19,839 draft picks. Like there's always a larger contract, even in 721 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:22,920 the off season ones the bigger trades, there's bigger contracts involved. 722 00:31:23,279 --> 00:31:27,720 The other thing, too, is you can only lament space. 723 00:31:27,759 --> 00:31:29,720 If you thought they were just gonna let Jayalen Green 724 00:31:29,839 --> 00:31:31,440 walk for nothing, and so. 725 00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,240 Speaker 3: They're gonna reno just like they were never going. 726 00:31:35,079 --> 00:31:37,480 Speaker 2: To do that, and so they also weren't What are 727 00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,000 the odds that they would have signed and traded him 728 00:31:39,039 --> 00:31:41,039 into a team that had cap space, because if a 729 00:31:41,079 --> 00:31:42,799 team is a cap space to absorb him out right, 730 00:31:43,079 --> 00:31:46,200 why are you brokering aside and trade basically anyway, So 731 00:31:46,319 --> 00:31:48,200 you get into that and it's, yeah, there's a they 732 00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:51,160 do need bigger salaries to be traded if they want 733 00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:54,039 to bring in these bigger guys, especially if let's say 734 00:31:54,039 --> 00:31:56,519 it doesn't happen next summer, grant like they're still gonna 735 00:31:56,519 --> 00:31:58,440 want maybe maybe they want more information on this group 736 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,720 where it's reed Shepherd will finish it's just rookie year 737 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,319 and apparently might have barely played Tom and thompsonilly be 738 00:32:03,319 --> 00:32:05,880 wrapping up year two. You have extensions to figure out 739 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:08,599 for Tarry Easton Jabari Smith. If you want to make 740 00:32:08,599 --> 00:32:11,799 a move at mid season, you definitely need or want 741 00:32:11,799 --> 00:32:13,039 to be open to it. You need one of these 742 00:32:13,039 --> 00:32:15,519 bigger deals. Now, yes you have Fred van Fleet, but 743 00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:17,559 this now when you're looking at him, at forty plus, 744 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:18,640 Jail and Green is more. 745 00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:19,599 Speaker 3: He's closer. 746 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:22,160 Speaker 2: Now what would be considered like a mid end contract 747 00:32:22,599 --> 00:32:24,880 so than these higher ends, and those are just that's 748 00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:26,759 easy to fit in where it's well, we can trade 749 00:32:26,839 --> 00:32:29,000 jail and Green and other stuff and not worry about 750 00:32:29,039 --> 00:32:31,480 the math. Whereas Fred van Fleet, oh we attached him 751 00:32:31,519 --> 00:32:33,720 to another contract and now it's fifty million dollars is 752 00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:36,519 all of a sudden in play. So I think I 753 00:32:36,599 --> 00:32:39,000 understand what both sides are doing here, but I will say, 754 00:32:39,039 --> 00:32:41,160 in terms of the percentage of the cap, even the 755 00:32:41,240 --> 00:32:44,160 raw number, there's still for me for me to look 756 00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:45,799 back and say, oh, Jail and Green is worth this. 757 00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:48,920 He shoulders the burden of proof here more than the 758 00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:51,839 whatever you think the rockets are doing. I think it's 759 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:54,279 easier to understand than to say, oh, Jail and Green 760 00:32:54,359 --> 00:32:55,240 is absolutely worth this. 761 00:32:55,759 --> 00:32:58,079 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's right. You want to talk about 762 00:32:58,119 --> 00:33:00,400 some deals that did not get done. There are three 763 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:05,759 notable ones, right, yep. So we got Jonathan KAMINGA, Josh Giddy, 764 00:33:06,079 --> 00:33:08,279 and Quentin Grimes. I love that we've got Quentin Grimes 765 00:33:08,279 --> 00:33:09,759 and here among the notable as part of that's just 766 00:33:09,759 --> 00:33:11,880 because we've got a report that he did turn down 767 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:15,359 a three for twenty seven extension from the MAVs quickly. 768 00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:16,920 Speaker 1: Would you should he have taken that? 769 00:33:18,119 --> 00:33:22,160 Speaker 3: I mean, I hovering over all this is the lack 770 00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:24,559 of cap space out there. Yeah, but I don't think 771 00:33:24,599 --> 00:33:26,559 I'm taking that because if I'm him, I'm just like, 772 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:29,200 I know, my role may not be huge here. Although 773 00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:32,119 he has looked good, I'm I gotta just see if 774 00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:33,079 I can get the mid level. 775 00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,480 Speaker 2: Now, you don't need cap if you there's a mid 776 00:33:35,559 --> 00:33:37,880 level team out there with a NOD done. This has 777 00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:39,640 been beaten, so I think was smart by him. 778 00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:42,039 Speaker 3: Yeah, you want to talk about Giddy, this is a 779 00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,640 I think, Well, Giddey and Minga are both really interesting, 780 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:47,240 but let's let's start with Giddy. So reportedly he wanted 781 00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:50,599 thirty million a year. The Bulls traded Alex CRUs over him, 782 00:33:50,599 --> 00:33:52,720 did not get picks back. So the thinking was that, like, well, 783 00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:54,119 if you're not going to extend this guy, what are 784 00:33:54,119 --> 00:33:56,400 you doing? You just give up Alex Cruso for nothing. 785 00:33:56,839 --> 00:33:58,759 I would argue that extending Giddy at too big of 786 00:33:58,799 --> 00:34:02,119 a number would just compound error. So I'm actually okay 787 00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:05,240 with them saying, let's see what you got, well, we'll 788 00:34:05,279 --> 00:34:07,960 hold on to restricted rights and see what we think 789 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,039 you're worth. And what the market says is that where 790 00:34:10,039 --> 00:34:10,400 you're at. 791 00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:15,559 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just but you it's wild that you traded 792 00:34:15,559 --> 00:34:17,880 for this guy. You trade Alex Caruso to get this 793 00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:20,320 guy that you want more information on and aren't prepared 794 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,679 to pay, and no draft picks from the team in 795 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:25,039 the league that has all the draft picks. 796 00:34:25,079 --> 00:34:27,280 Speaker 1: But overall, I don't. 797 00:34:27,159 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 2: Think teams used because it exists, whether you think it 798 00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:30,880 should exists, I've said this many times. 799 00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:31,639 Speaker 1: It's a different matter. 800 00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:34,800 Speaker 2: Teams should use restricted free agency more to their advantage. 801 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:37,639 So I think the Bulls made the right call. It's 802 00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:40,000 just when you look at it through the lens of 803 00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:43,199 how they valued him in the Alex Caruso trade, it 804 00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:44,119 is a little curious. 805 00:34:44,559 --> 00:34:47,360 Speaker 3: And it's just like the thirty a year would just 806 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:49,920 be a full stop no from me, like just because 807 00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:53,119 you're not you're not Jalen Suggs, You're not Jalen Johnson, 808 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,719 Like if that's your comp Like, that's wild, You're not there. 809 00:34:58,239 --> 00:35:01,039 I agree. I think the restrict think restrict free agency 810 00:35:01,079 --> 00:35:04,599 should be used like much more aggressively by teams and 811 00:35:04,639 --> 00:35:06,920 that's just the right call here, especially if the number 812 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:08,760 was thirty, Like, what do you even encounter with if 813 00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:12,360 you're Chicago at that point, it's like twenty, I don't 814 00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:12,840 even know if. 815 00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:14,519 Speaker 2: I want to pay him twenty Do you think they 816 00:35:14,599 --> 00:35:16,760 run and every team runs this risk to an extent, 817 00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:18,639 But if you're probably going to be a bad team 818 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,119 and he just puts up numbers, do they run into 819 00:35:21,159 --> 00:35:24,000 the risk of he put up good numbers but it 820 00:35:24,039 --> 00:35:26,599 didn't necessarily drive winnings, so then or do we just 821 00:35:26,599 --> 00:35:28,920 pay him the thirty five at that point that you 822 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:30,239 might need to to bump up. 823 00:35:30,519 --> 00:35:32,360 Speaker 1: I think what helps though, which. 824 00:35:32,119 --> 00:35:33,880 Speaker 2: Is why I think Chicago made the right call, even 825 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:36,079 if I still don't support to how they valued him 826 00:35:36,079 --> 00:35:38,440 in the first place, is that he needs to have 827 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:40,679 another offer sheet out there. And you need to tell 828 00:35:40,679 --> 00:35:42,920 me the team that's coming in with even thirty million 829 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,039 dollars a year for Josh Gidty right now, I don't. 830 00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:45,800 Speaker 1: See that it exists. 831 00:35:46,039 --> 00:35:49,159 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's harsh. I definitely just say, go out 832 00:35:49,159 --> 00:35:51,000 and see what you're worth and we'll decide if we 833 00:35:51,039 --> 00:35:53,079 want to match it. Like, I'm not making the offer 834 00:35:53,119 --> 00:35:55,199 to Gidey. I don't think until he comes back with 835 00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:59,519 nobody and nobody offered me anything, you know, any anywhere 836 00:35:59,559 --> 00:36:02,360 close to I mean if Yeah, the odds of him 837 00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:05,000 actually generating that kind of interest as restricted free agents 838 00:36:05,039 --> 00:36:05,960 are pretty low to me. 839 00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:09,280 Speaker 2: Jonathan Kaminga turned down thirty million dollars a year from 840 00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:10,079 the Warriors grant. 841 00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:11,840 Speaker 1: How do you feel about that? 842 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:15,960 Speaker 3: You know, I don't really have any thoughts he I 843 00:36:16,039 --> 00:36:19,039 wouldn't have given him that if I'm the Warriors. I 844 00:36:19,079 --> 00:36:22,639 can understand why. I don't think it's rational, But I 845 00:36:22,639 --> 00:36:27,039 could understand why he wouldn't take thirty just because he 846 00:36:27,119 --> 00:36:30,039 believes I think that he's a like a singular star 847 00:36:30,199 --> 00:36:33,039 first option, like that kind of thing might have been 848 00:36:33,039 --> 00:36:35,000 a misread based on the depth of this team to 849 00:36:35,039 --> 00:36:37,280 think he'd get the opportunity to prove that this year, 850 00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:40,719 and he's been mostly terrible so far, outside of a 851 00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:43,840 couple flashes. He was good against New Orleans on the 852 00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:47,400 twenty ninth, But yeah, like this is a proven season 853 00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:49,239 now from a guy that is in year four. That's 854 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:53,320 a little late to be proving it. But I would 855 00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:57,280 put it this way, I can imagine him commanding much 856 00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:01,559 larger restricted free agent offers than someone like Giddy, just 857 00:37:01,599 --> 00:37:04,679 because of the athletic talent, the sort of the little 858 00:37:04,679 --> 00:37:07,360 bit of mystery boxiness that he still has, which someone 859 00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:12,760 like Giddy really doesn't. But that thirty a year, I 860 00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:15,199 don't I wouldn't have got there if I were the 861 00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:18,559 Warriors and COAMINGA probably should have taken it if it 862 00:37:18,599 --> 00:37:21,320 was anything close to that, But I also weirdly understand 863 00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:21,960 why he wouldn't. 864 00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:25,239 Speaker 2: And perb Jake Fisher a Bleacher report, the Nets and 865 00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:27,920 Sixers have interest in him. If the Sixers have interest 866 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:30,159 in him, he's getting traded this year because they're definitely 867 00:37:30,199 --> 00:37:32,880 not gonna have cap space and the Nets will have 868 00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:35,000 cap space and that might be an where it's oh 869 00:37:35,079 --> 00:37:37,639 who won't impact the tank but fits our timeline and 870 00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:41,239 could be good. But I think the Warriors were smart 871 00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:43,400 not to give him that money. I understand what he's doing. 872 00:37:43,719 --> 00:37:45,239 He is the one to me that took the way 873 00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:46,159 bigger risk here. 874 00:37:46,519 --> 00:37:49,920 Speaker 3: Yes, for sure, and I would say too, I don't 875 00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:53,840 think you I should say phrase it this way. I 876 00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:57,360 think you can view the Moody extension like in relationship 877 00:37:57,400 --> 00:38:01,000 with this, because the Warriors locked up someone that you 878 00:38:01,039 --> 00:38:05,760 know might be eighty percent as productive as Kaminga going forward, 879 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:08,400 and they're gonna pay him like a third of what 880 00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:11,639 Kaminga wants. So just as a value proposition and as 881 00:38:11,679 --> 00:38:14,400 like a I don't know insurance play, like just having 882 00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:17,639 Moody locked up at you know, some somewhat similar position 883 00:38:18,079 --> 00:38:20,159 is like, okay, we can we we don't need to 884 00:38:20,199 --> 00:38:23,159 extend anything past our comfort zone at all on cominga. 885 00:38:23,199 --> 00:38:25,480 Now he can just he can demonstrate he's worth a 886 00:38:25,519 --> 00:38:27,480 big contract or not, and then we'll just let the 887 00:38:27,519 --> 00:38:28,800 market decide. 888 00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:32,519 Speaker 2: Final thing over under on his contract being thirty point 889 00:38:32,599 --> 00:38:35,239 five million dollars in year one next season. 890 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:41,599 Speaker 3: I'm gonna go under because I don't think. I don't 891 00:38:41,639 --> 00:38:44,239 think he's going to get the opportunity with the team 892 00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:46,480 as deep as the Warriors, and I am less and 893 00:38:46,559 --> 00:38:49,800 less convinced that even if he did get the opportunity, 894 00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:54,000 he's like he's that type of player. It could change, 895 00:38:54,039 --> 00:38:55,719 but as of today, I don't think he's a thirty 896 00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:56,599 million dollar player. 897 00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,440 Speaker 1: I kind of view him on the same level as 898 00:38:58,440 --> 00:38:59,239 a Jalen Johnson. 899 00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:01,159 Speaker 2: Maybe his ceiling will be slightly higher, but I think 900 00:39:01,199 --> 00:39:04,119 Jim Johnson, when you look at the playmaking, he's got 901 00:39:04,119 --> 00:39:06,159 to be the more dynamic even the defense, the more 902 00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:07,320 dynamic player right now. 903 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:11,119 Speaker 3: No, oh no, totally agree like that. That's why I 904 00:39:11,159 --> 00:39:13,920 would have given Johnson in that deal. I've already said 905 00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:15,519 I wouldn't have given it to Kaminga. 906 00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:17,800 Speaker 1: Take us to what they, mister Hughes. 907 00:39:18,679 --> 00:39:21,920 Speaker 3: We will not be awarded any contract extensions for this effort, 908 00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:24,800 but I hope you all understand the NBA's contract extensions 909 00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:29,480 a little better. Thanks everybody for watching, for listening. If 910 00:39:29,599 --> 00:39:31,920 you have not done so, already a great review, subscribe, 911 00:39:32,079 --> 00:39:35,960 thumbs up, leave comments on YouTube, join our discord, check 912 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:38,800 out our merch links in the YouTube and podcast description 913 00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,719 for all that stuff. Tell your friends quordermouth super helps us, 914 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:45,119 and uh yeah, let us know in the comments what 915 00:39:45,199 --> 00:39:47,639 you think about some of these extensions. I'm sure there 916 00:39:47,679 --> 00:39:50,320 will be some different opinions on whether any of these 917 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,199 were good or not, except everyone should agree with Shingun 918 00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:57,679 was gotten first deal. Thanks again, Shouts Frank, Apologies, Jared 919 00:39:57,679 --> 00:39:57,920 Allen