WEBVTT 1 00:00:15.199 --> 00:00:17.399 Coming to you from the dining room table at East 2 00:00:17.440 --> 00:00:21.039 Barbary Lane. Welcome to a very special edition a Full 3 00:00:21.039 --> 00:00:26.000 Circle the Podcast. I'm your host Martha Madigal and I'm. 4 00:00:25.760 --> 00:00:27.440 Your host Charles Tyson Junior. 5 00:00:27.600 --> 00:00:31.039 We have a very special guest today. She is truly 6 00:00:31.120 --> 00:00:33.799 an American treasurer. Not only is she one of the 7 00:00:33.840 --> 00:00:38.840 finest musicians, a brilliant songwriter, and a seriously gifted singer. 8 00:00:39.320 --> 00:00:43.119 She explores genres of music like none other. She's one 9 00:00:43.119 --> 00:00:47.320 of the most talented and funniest live performers we have 10 00:00:47.479 --> 00:00:51.159 ever seen. And we got to spend last Saturday night 11 00:00:51.840 --> 00:00:56.119 with Susan Warner. Welcome to the Full Circle Table. 12 00:00:56.719 --> 00:00:58.880 I am really happy to be here, and thanks for 13 00:00:58.920 --> 00:01:03.359 inviting me. Absolutely, I was so excited to meet you 14 00:01:03.719 --> 00:01:08.280 Saturday because you're pals with my friend Elizabeth Williams, and 15 00:01:09.120 --> 00:01:13.719 Elizabeth attracts the best energy around her. She is just 16 00:01:14.079 --> 00:01:16.400 she is just moving the world forward in the most 17 00:01:16.439 --> 00:01:19.400 wonderful way. She always has been. And so when I 18 00:01:19.439 --> 00:01:22.000 met you and we were talking and you said a podcast, 19 00:01:22.079 --> 00:01:25.079 it was easy to say, hell yes, because I'm so 20 00:01:25.159 --> 00:01:27.560 interested in having more time with you, and so we'll 21 00:01:27.599 --> 00:01:30.959 have time together with you know, microphones and cameras. 22 00:01:30.519 --> 00:01:33.760 On microphones and cameras. And by the way, wine. 23 00:01:33.719 --> 00:01:35.920 Cheers and the little wine cheer cheers. 24 00:01:37.400 --> 00:01:41.000 This is this is coffee. No, it's not. No, it's 25 00:01:41.040 --> 00:01:41.400 not you. 26 00:01:41.519 --> 00:01:43.840 But did you see the mug? Did you see the mug? 27 00:01:44.079 --> 00:01:50.920 What does the mug say? Wait? Two, there's a lot 28 00:01:50.920 --> 00:01:52.120 of those Christmas gift. 29 00:01:52.239 --> 00:01:58.359 It was a Christmas gift. My other buddy actually introduced you. 30 00:01:58.480 --> 00:02:01.000 And it's also a long time I'm friend of yours. 31 00:02:01.159 --> 00:02:02.079 Kathy O'Connell. 32 00:02:02.840 --> 00:02:06.079 Kathy is the best, the best, the best. So Kathy, 33 00:02:06.359 --> 00:02:08.159 as some of your listeners may know, it is the 34 00:02:08.240 --> 00:02:12.719 longtime host of Kids Corner w XPN Radio, and she 35 00:02:12.840 --> 00:02:16.599 has been there so long and created such a great 36 00:02:16.599 --> 00:02:21.439 community between generations at XPN. And I said to her, 37 00:02:21.680 --> 00:02:24.800 and I said, does Roger who runs the station, does 38 00:02:24.879 --> 00:02:27.360 he know the value that you've brought to that to 39 00:02:27.400 --> 00:02:31.560 that enterprise. And she said, yes he does. And I 40 00:02:31.599 --> 00:02:34.360 was glad because kids though right to get kids listening 41 00:02:34.439 --> 00:02:38.800 to you know, independent triple A radio, to get parents 42 00:02:38.919 --> 00:02:40.680 to have parents listen, and then their kids listen, and 43 00:02:40.719 --> 00:02:43.400 then the kids go to the shows and hear about 44 00:02:43.439 --> 00:02:46.000 you know, they hear the music in the car, right, 45 00:02:46.120 --> 00:02:48.599 and then they stay with those artists and it just 46 00:02:48.800 --> 00:02:52.439 XPN introduces them to music a little out, a little 47 00:02:52.479 --> 00:02:55.039 outside the mainstream. And for those of us that do 48 00:02:55.120 --> 00:02:57.919 music outside the mainstream, it's a real blessing Station's like 49 00:02:57.919 --> 00:02:58.680 the w XPN. 50 00:02:59.000 --> 00:03:01.319 Oh absolutely, I'm sure is so great. 51 00:03:01.319 --> 00:03:03.080 I got to tell you that adults listen to her. 52 00:03:03.560 --> 00:03:05.240 Oh yeah, oh yeah. 53 00:03:05.680 --> 00:03:09.000 I have put Shazam on auto for her show so 54 00:03:09.120 --> 00:03:10.280 many times because I'm like. 55 00:03:10.360 --> 00:03:11.560 This is good? What is it? 56 00:03:11.639 --> 00:03:12.240 What is good? 57 00:03:12.319 --> 00:03:15.120 What is this her energy? It's about the energy, right, 58 00:03:15.439 --> 00:03:17.719 this positivity that something good is going to happen and 59 00:03:17.759 --> 00:03:18.800 I'm going to help make it so. 60 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:23.879 And it does. And you know she was our twentieth episode, 61 00:03:24.599 --> 00:03:25.120 is that right? 62 00:03:25.360 --> 00:03:25.639 Yes? 63 00:03:25.919 --> 00:03:29.000 Actually, because because she's my pal, like you know, she's 64 00:03:29.000 --> 00:03:32.360 my sister, and you know, I knew that I could 65 00:03:32.360 --> 00:03:34.960 always call on her, but I didn't want to do 66 00:03:35.080 --> 00:03:38.280 that until I really felt like, Okay, there's a real 67 00:03:38.360 --> 00:03:41.199 reason to bring Kathy on and talk with her. And 68 00:03:41.240 --> 00:03:46.919 it was right after uv ald Texas and I said, 69 00:03:48.520 --> 00:03:50.800 for Buffalo, I had read the names and I said, 70 00:03:50.840 --> 00:03:56.000 I cannot do that here. I can't. But I wanted 71 00:03:56.000 --> 00:04:01.280 a response and that was my response. Why is to 72 00:04:01.360 --> 00:04:04.240 talk with Kathy and talk about playing the rainbow connection 73 00:04:04.360 --> 00:04:07.759 and talking talk about how do we talk to kids 74 00:04:08.840 --> 00:04:12.520 during these times? So, you know, it was a brilliant 75 00:04:12.560 --> 00:04:16.240 hour and I'm so grateful that she did it. That 76 00:04:16.399 --> 00:04:19.680 was the first episode of ours that they played at 77 00:04:19.720 --> 00:04:22.639 Medway Pride was the Kathy episode. Yeah. 78 00:04:22.680 --> 00:04:26.040 Wow, I just love it because because you know, a 79 00:04:26.040 --> 00:04:30.720 lot of us, uh understand ourselves early in life as 80 00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:35.079 in this as in this as in this fluid place 81 00:04:35.160 --> 00:04:41.800 or this place where orientation and gender oriented, sexual orientation 82 00:04:41.879 --> 00:04:44.639 and gender identity, you know, these things are are we 83 00:04:44.680 --> 00:04:47.319 feel like we might be outside of whatever the Barbie 84 00:04:47.360 --> 00:04:51.959 and Ken deal is. And and and that she speaks 85 00:04:52.040 --> 00:04:54.360 so easily about it and so positively about it is 86 00:04:54.399 --> 00:04:58.560 like it is good medicine. What she does is good medicine. 87 00:04:59.120 --> 00:04:59.800 She delivers it. 88 00:04:59.839 --> 00:05:02.480 She yeah, yeah, And I wanted to say, you know, 89 00:05:02.600 --> 00:05:06.319 none of this is a game. This is Kathy O'Connell, like, 90 00:05:06.560 --> 00:05:10.439 you know, because half of my wardrobe came from Kathy O'Connell. 91 00:05:11.079 --> 00:05:14.879 Do you like this? Do you want this? What do 92 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:16.800 you think of this one? 93 00:05:17.240 --> 00:05:17.319 So? 94 00:05:17.759 --> 00:05:20.560 Yeah, I mean she's just she's been there, you know, 95 00:05:20.639 --> 00:05:23.600 certainly for me. We've known each other for twenty years 96 00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:26.480 and she's just one of those people who's been there. 97 00:05:26.639 --> 00:05:28.319 She's a great American and she should have win. Like 98 00:05:28.360 --> 00:05:31.000 they're given the Mark Twain Prize for Humor to I 99 00:05:31.000 --> 00:05:33.399 don't know who this week or somebody. It's like, come on, 100 00:05:33.600 --> 00:05:37.720 you know right, can we please get outside the Yeah, 101 00:05:38.120 --> 00:05:40.399 I agree with these white guys with TV shows, it's 102 00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:40.759 like come. 103 00:05:40.680 --> 00:05:46.040 On always And for years, yeah, for years, I've referred 104 00:05:46.079 --> 00:05:49.079 to her as my personal media guru because she's always 105 00:05:49.120 --> 00:05:51.120 got a song or an album or a book or 106 00:05:51.120 --> 00:05:53.279 a movie or a television show for me to watch 107 00:05:53.480 --> 00:05:56.120 or listen to, and it's always just what I need 108 00:05:56.480 --> 00:05:57.120 in that moment. 109 00:05:57.800 --> 00:06:00.000 It's delight. I think that's the thing. She finds delight 110 00:06:00.160 --> 00:06:01.759 in things, and she wants to share that delight. 111 00:06:02.240 --> 00:06:03.319 So yeah, it's true. 112 00:06:03.480 --> 00:06:05.480 It's something to aspire to be. I mean maybe she's 113 00:06:05.519 --> 00:06:07.040 just that way all the time, but it's something to 114 00:06:07.079 --> 00:06:07.639 aspire to be. 115 00:06:07.959 --> 00:06:11.079 Oh yeah, it just is like she can't help it. 116 00:06:11.759 --> 00:06:12.639 She can't help it. 117 00:06:12.879 --> 00:06:15.920 She talks in show tunes, She speaks in show tunes 118 00:06:16.079 --> 00:06:20.639 like that's and it always comes down to a show tune. 119 00:06:20.680 --> 00:06:29.560 I'm like, man, it kind of does. Yeah, especially with you. 120 00:06:26.800 --> 00:06:27.040 You know. 121 00:06:27.319 --> 00:06:30.759 I so I sent you this fangirl email because I 122 00:06:30.879 --> 00:06:33.680 really did want to thank you for an amazing show. 123 00:06:33.879 --> 00:06:36.879 I mean, we looked at each other and we it 124 00:06:36.920 --> 00:06:39.439 felt like we had sat there for fifteen minutes. 125 00:06:39.839 --> 00:06:43.319 That's wonderful. That's the best praise and entertainer can ever 126 00:06:43.519 --> 00:06:47.279 ever get, is that you know, the audience they forgot 127 00:06:47.360 --> 00:06:50.399 that they forgot themselves or forgot the outside world for 128 00:06:51.000 --> 00:06:54.040 a period of time. Yeah, and fifteen minutes out of 129 00:06:54.079 --> 00:06:56.240 an hour and a half show all that. 130 00:06:56.759 --> 00:07:01.199 No, it was like, what does she mean they're done? 131 00:07:01.680 --> 00:07:02.759 How could they be done? 132 00:07:03.279 --> 00:07:07.040 And I'll admit I was the one that was unfamiliar 133 00:07:07.079 --> 00:07:13.199 with your work, but just hearing Martha and Kathy and 134 00:07:13.240 --> 00:07:16.360 Elizabeth like go on and on about how wonderful you 135 00:07:16.399 --> 00:07:19.000 are and how wonderful your music is. I was expecting 136 00:07:19.560 --> 00:07:22.240 a good show and it was wonder I told you 137 00:07:22.279 --> 00:07:24.040 it was perfect in every way, it really was. 138 00:07:24.439 --> 00:07:26.439 I thank you both for taking a chance. I mean 139 00:07:26.480 --> 00:07:29.240 to go you've never seen before, right, And You're like, 140 00:07:29.319 --> 00:07:31.000 I need a folks singer. I need this like a 141 00:07:31.040 --> 00:07:32.959 hole in the head, right, what is this waste of 142 00:07:33.000 --> 00:07:33.560 my Saturday? 143 00:07:33.639 --> 00:07:35.279 Night. It's only when it's a white guy with a 144 00:07:35.360 --> 00:07:38.560 guitar when I go really like, unless it's John Flynn 145 00:07:38.680 --> 00:07:45.279 or trout fishing in America, I'm like, I'm busy that guys. Yeah, 146 00:07:45.399 --> 00:07:49.480 I'm like, yeah, I'm busy that by Yeah. And then 147 00:07:50.720 --> 00:07:53.680 one of the people that works high up at XPN 148 00:07:54.120 --> 00:07:58.279 mentioned a mutual friend's son was breaking into music and 149 00:07:58.319 --> 00:08:00.839 she just looked at me, deadpan with everything she says, 150 00:08:00.879 --> 00:08:04.639 it's deadpan, and she said, that's just what the world needs, 151 00:08:04.800 --> 00:08:11.279 another white guy with a guitar. I was like, yeah, well, yeah, well, 152 00:08:11.519 --> 00:08:11.720 you know. 153 00:08:11.759 --> 00:08:15.279 There's this there's this duo of of of black guys 154 00:08:15.360 --> 00:08:18.480 and their and their gig is called Their Their duo 155 00:08:18.600 --> 00:08:23.720 is called Black Violin. Yes, they're tremendous. Yes, just tremendous 156 00:08:23.800 --> 00:08:28.199 because they're busting everything you think about, all your preconceived 157 00:08:28.240 --> 00:08:32.000 notions about what black is and what a violin is. 158 00:08:32.159 --> 00:08:36.399 It's like, wow, mm hmm, fantassic. That's doing the work 159 00:08:36.399 --> 00:08:37.279 of God right there. 160 00:08:37.879 --> 00:08:41.879 I discovered them I in one of my dance classes 161 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:44.840 that I taught. One of my kids was playing one 162 00:08:44.840 --> 00:08:47.840 of their songs and I was like, what is this 163 00:08:48.399 --> 00:08:50.240 And she told me, and I was like, what is 164 00:08:50.240 --> 00:08:53.799 the name of that album? Write that down? 165 00:08:55.559 --> 00:08:59.799 So I sent you this fangirl email and I said 166 00:08:59.799 --> 00:09:02.840 to but I actually forwarded it to Elizabeth and I said, 167 00:09:03.080 --> 00:09:07.759 I sent this note to Susan. Tell me this isn't creepy. 168 00:09:10.559 --> 00:09:12.639 And she called me and she said, first of all, 169 00:09:12.720 --> 00:09:19.840 that's a letter, that's not a note. If you ask her, she'll. 170 00:09:19.679 --> 00:09:22.480 Tell you whatever you sent me was wonderful. Well, and 171 00:09:22.960 --> 00:09:25.120 I appreciated your kindness and your enthusiasm. 172 00:09:25.440 --> 00:09:27.440 I told you a little story, and I want to 173 00:09:27.480 --> 00:09:30.039 tell you why I told you the little story I did, 174 00:09:30.240 --> 00:09:33.919 so I told you about my friend Ghosha. Yes, Gosha 175 00:09:34.000 --> 00:09:38.840 Iguano was a singer songwriter about ten twelve years older 176 00:09:38.840 --> 00:09:45.320 than us. She was a prolific songwriter and just an 177 00:09:45.360 --> 00:09:49.720 incredible musician. Piano was her primary instrument. She could pick 178 00:09:49.759 --> 00:09:52.759 up a guitar, she could play the drums, she could 179 00:09:52.799 --> 00:09:56.399 do a lot and when I by the time I 180 00:09:56.480 --> 00:10:00.360 met her, she was doing sing along piano bar in 181 00:10:00.399 --> 00:10:02.759 a gay bar at tavern on Comeack and she had 182 00:10:02.799 --> 00:10:06.840 done piano playing like that all over the world. And 183 00:10:09.679 --> 00:10:13.960 when we opened our bar, she called me and she said, 184 00:10:14.759 --> 00:10:18.639 I got Thursday. You want Thursday, I said, I would 185 00:10:18.639 --> 00:10:19.360 love Thursday. 186 00:10:19.440 --> 00:10:19.639 Yeah. 187 00:10:20.120 --> 00:10:26.559 So every Thursday from the day we opened till till 188 00:10:26.600 --> 00:10:29.600 she was too sick to play, which was really quick. 189 00:10:29.639 --> 00:10:33.639 Her illness was really fast. She was there every Thursday, 190 00:10:33.799 --> 00:10:37.240 and we actually assembled a band. She called them the 191 00:10:37.279 --> 00:10:41.960 Pickups because they were just the guy who hosted our 192 00:10:42.240 --> 00:10:45.840 open mic night on Tuesday and a drummer that we 193 00:10:45.919 --> 00:10:49.960 found at open mic night, and they became her band. 194 00:10:50.360 --> 00:10:53.440 And one night she and it happened organically, just organically, 195 00:10:54.559 --> 00:11:00.480 and one night she looked at me with tears in 196 00:11:00.519 --> 00:11:04.519 her eyes and she stopped playing, and I'm looking across 197 00:11:04.519 --> 00:11:07.600 the barn and I'm like what, And she said thank 198 00:11:07.639 --> 00:11:10.679 you for this, because I never thought i'd have it again. 199 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:16.080 And I went them and she said them, and I went, 200 00:11:16.360 --> 00:11:21.279 you're welcome. I heard there was live music tonight. Every 201 00:11:21.320 --> 00:11:23.639 time they would start talking or go off on a tangent, 202 00:11:23.679 --> 00:11:25.679 I would just that was my line. I'm like, I 203 00:11:25.720 --> 00:11:27.840 heard there was live music tonight. So she started playing. 204 00:11:27.840 --> 00:11:30.240 She said how fuck you, and then she started playing. 205 00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:38.320 But Goosha so early in her career she worked for 206 00:11:39.360 --> 00:11:42.720 as cap because and it was kind of named that 207 00:11:42.840 --> 00:11:46.519 tune like if somebody sampled something in a new release, 208 00:11:46.639 --> 00:11:50.600 she could hear it. She could hear it. And so 209 00:11:50.919 --> 00:11:53.440 that was her job, was to just listen to new 210 00:11:53.480 --> 00:11:57.039 stuff and find where they had placed someone else's stuff 211 00:11:57.519 --> 00:11:59.320 and make sure they were paying for it. That was 212 00:11:59.360 --> 00:12:03.480 her job. Yes, and she had this ear. She played 213 00:12:03.480 --> 00:12:06.960 by ear. Everybody else at the piano bar walked in 214 00:12:07.120 --> 00:12:10.440 with a roly cart full of songbooks. She walked in 215 00:12:10.480 --> 00:12:12.759 with her car keys and a cup of Dunkin Donuts, 216 00:12:12.799 --> 00:12:13.480 and that was it. 217 00:12:13.759 --> 00:12:14.960 She had it, and. 218 00:12:14.919 --> 00:12:17.320 She either had it or she didn't. And she would 219 00:12:17.320 --> 00:12:20.000 put it in your key. She'd say, give me a 220 00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:24.120 little and she could change keys in the middle of 221 00:12:24.120 --> 00:12:25.960 a song, or she would tell you that's not a key. 222 00:12:26.000 --> 00:12:28.000 Go sit down and hum for a while and I'll 223 00:12:28.039 --> 00:12:28.600 get back to you. 224 00:12:28.960 --> 00:12:31.000 But I mean to say she had the gift. 225 00:12:31.240 --> 00:12:31.960 She had the gift. 226 00:12:32.039 --> 00:12:33.960 She had, she had ear. She had the ear, she 227 00:12:33.960 --> 00:12:37.039 had the childhood ear that is just instant and pattern recognition. 228 00:12:37.559 --> 00:12:40.759 And I would love to have met her, because I 229 00:12:40.840 --> 00:12:43.159 learned too as a little kid, really early, and before 230 00:12:43.200 --> 00:12:45.799 I knew notes or any such thing. It was almost 231 00:12:45.799 --> 00:12:48.799 like math or colors or something. And she just sounds 232 00:12:48.840 --> 00:12:50.840 like such an exceptional person that she could just pick 233 00:12:50.879 --> 00:12:54.440 that up and just create magic like this, like a magician. 234 00:12:55.120 --> 00:12:56.360 And I'd love to have met. 235 00:12:56.159 --> 00:13:00.559 Her, And I'm sorry that you didn't, because you remind 236 00:13:00.720 --> 00:13:06.519 me of her in that Gosha was music, and music 237 00:13:06.720 --> 00:13:07.679 was Ghosha. 238 00:13:09.240 --> 00:13:09.639 Online. 239 00:13:10.559 --> 00:13:14.879 You can, in fact, some of her work has been 240 00:13:14.919 --> 00:13:18.320 remastered and re released. Her brother is still living, Wow, 241 00:13:19.120 --> 00:13:22.279 and he he just released an EP I guess right 242 00:13:23.320 --> 00:13:25.919 of some of her stuff that was original stuff she 243 00:13:25.960 --> 00:13:31.799 did with a previous girlfriend and tell Gosha and Teal 244 00:13:32.519 --> 00:13:36.039 and it's out there and it's it's really good stuff. 245 00:13:36.039 --> 00:13:39.200 And there's there's a million, you know, YouTube clips and 246 00:13:39.240 --> 00:13:43.960 things like that. But one of the things it meant 247 00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:48.759 was she was fully present as a human. That ability 248 00:13:49.480 --> 00:13:52.039 to be a part of a song and and be 249 00:13:52.240 --> 00:13:56.159 the music is what I saw when you stepped on 250 00:13:56.240 --> 00:13:59.519 stage and played your first song. That's what you do. 251 00:14:00.679 --> 00:14:03.360 I'm and it impresses me and touches me in the 252 00:14:03.399 --> 00:14:07.759 same way. And I felt like I've Goosha said the 253 00:14:07.759 --> 00:14:10.279 first And I told you this story. The first night 254 00:14:10.320 --> 00:14:12.159 we met. She came over. She gave me a big hug. 255 00:14:12.200 --> 00:14:13.840 She said, We've known each other one hundred years. And 256 00:14:13.840 --> 00:14:15.200 we finally found each other again. 257 00:14:15.360 --> 00:14:15.759 Yeah. 258 00:14:15.919 --> 00:14:19.039 Yeah, And I just when you started to play, I 259 00:14:19.080 --> 00:14:24.879 was like, I've known this soul and and I hear that, 260 00:14:25.919 --> 00:14:31.399 and you know, I'm seeing you up here. 261 00:14:32.559 --> 00:14:35.480 I'm just honored that you know that. 262 00:14:34.759 --> 00:14:36.120 Well you you are music. 263 00:14:36.240 --> 00:14:38.879 You have someone that is really that was really deeply musical. 264 00:14:38.919 --> 00:14:41.559 And also and on the other side of that, the 265 00:14:41.639 --> 00:14:44.320 other the other part of that that really moves me, Martha, 266 00:14:44.399 --> 00:14:47.879 is that Ghosha sounds like the kind of person who, 267 00:14:49.120 --> 00:14:52.440 again we talked earlier about Kathy O Connell, like the delight, sharing, 268 00:14:52.480 --> 00:14:55.440 the delight drawing, like I have found something delightful come 269 00:14:55.480 --> 00:15:00.440 with me right that it's this generosity of spirit, and 270 00:15:02.080 --> 00:15:04.120 I just feel really lucky. Music kind of found me 271 00:15:04.240 --> 00:15:07.960 before I knew what I was even doing. When I 272 00:15:08.080 --> 00:15:10.159 was three, I had eye surgery. I still have a 273 00:15:10.200 --> 00:15:15.600 bad eye, but I wasn't very good with stereo vision. Okay, 274 00:15:15.720 --> 00:15:17.159 so I didn't you know, I didn't get to run 275 00:15:17.200 --> 00:15:19.480 around and play like all the things I wanted to play. 276 00:15:19.600 --> 00:15:22.720 I had an eye that didn't work right. But there 277 00:15:22.759 --> 00:15:24.919 was a little there was a little record player, uh 278 00:15:25.159 --> 00:15:28.440 in our house on the farm. Long story there too, 279 00:15:28.559 --> 00:15:32.440 But anyway, I played the record the record player over 280 00:15:32.480 --> 00:15:34.559 and over and over. My mother says, like, I just 281 00:15:34.840 --> 00:15:37.080 played it for hours. I would just stand there and 282 00:15:37.159 --> 00:15:40.279 almost vibrate with the intensity of it. And then my 283 00:15:40.440 --> 00:15:43.080 brother Old, one of my older brothers, brought a guitar 284 00:15:43.159 --> 00:15:47.879 home from Saint Mary's Catholic Elementary School in Manchester, Iowa. 285 00:15:48.480 --> 00:15:54.039 Why because Vatican two, right, John the twenty third, Pope 286 00:15:54.080 --> 00:15:56.639 John the twenty third said, the Catholic Church can now 287 00:15:56.720 --> 00:15:57.840 have groovy music. 288 00:15:58.279 --> 00:16:01.559 Yes, I remember this, okay, a huge. 289 00:16:01.600 --> 00:16:03.639 Right, instead of the old you know, sort of morbid 290 00:16:03.840 --> 00:16:07.039 right that chant and such, which look that it has 291 00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:10.399 its place. But what I remember is my brother came 292 00:16:10.399 --> 00:16:13.519 home with a guitar and I was like, what is that? 293 00:16:14.919 --> 00:16:17.240 And that was it? And I was five, and he 294 00:16:17.320 --> 00:16:20.720 showed me three chords and I figured out the rest. 295 00:16:21.200 --> 00:16:24.279 The guitar was bigger than I was. And I was 296 00:16:24.320 --> 00:16:28.919 already playing in first grade at Masses at St. Mary's 297 00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:33.279 Catholic School in Manchester, Iowa. I was already like work, Yeah, 298 00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:36.200 well they didn't pay me, but but you know, I 299 00:16:36.240 --> 00:16:38.519 was super motivated. I'm like, I love this, right, this 300 00:16:38.600 --> 00:16:40.360 is the only gig in town, a town of five 301 00:16:40.399 --> 00:16:43.639 thousand farming community, and he's like, oh man, this is it. 302 00:16:43.720 --> 00:16:47.799 And so learning pattern right, pattern recognition and perfect pitch. 303 00:16:48.639 --> 00:16:52.279 There's a there's a study that said, if you learn 304 00:16:52.320 --> 00:16:55.639 an instrument before age of eight, yes, there's a good 305 00:16:55.720 --> 00:16:58.840 chance that you will develop perfect pitch because what you'll 306 00:16:58.879 --> 00:17:01.919 develop is a is a an eye hand like a 307 00:17:01.960 --> 00:17:06.400 physical corollary to where, for instance, we're gonna just use 308 00:17:06.440 --> 00:17:10.279 this hair clip, Okay, as example hair clip, You're gonna 309 00:17:10.279 --> 00:17:16.119 be like thing, thing, thing, thing. You will hear thing 310 00:17:16.440 --> 00:17:20.240 and you'll see this image like a key, write a 311 00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:23.160 piano key, You'll hear it and you'll see it. And 312 00:17:23.200 --> 00:17:25.559 if you see it, same with a guitar, a note 313 00:17:25.640 --> 00:17:30.799 on a guitar fretboard, you will hear it always, you'll 314 00:17:30.960 --> 00:17:34.160 identify it with a visual And that's what perfect pitch 315 00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:37.720 comes from, is having this visual corollary to it. And 316 00:17:37.799 --> 00:17:39.400 I was so lucky. I was already playing an instrument 317 00:17:39.400 --> 00:17:40.960 at age five and then I could play piano and 318 00:17:41.039 --> 00:17:43.039 I figured that out. And so by ear you were 319 00:17:43.079 --> 00:17:45.440 talking about Ghosha. I think some of Ghosha's talent must 320 00:17:45.480 --> 00:17:48.440 have come by learning by ear, just from within instead 321 00:17:48.480 --> 00:17:51.160 of looking at a you know, a sheet music and 322 00:17:51.240 --> 00:17:52.599 executing stenography. 323 00:17:53.559 --> 00:17:57.160 I'm still not completely convinced she could ever site read. 324 00:17:57.519 --> 00:17:59.920 Well, you don't need to to be musical, It's totally 325 00:18:00.039 --> 00:18:01.960 That's why I always feel sad when someone says, oh, 326 00:18:01.960 --> 00:18:04.720 i'd love to learn, you know, piano, that I don't 327 00:18:04.759 --> 00:18:08.160 read music right right as they supposed to have anything 328 00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:09.200 to do with each other, and. 329 00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:10.440 I don't think they do. 330 00:18:10.799 --> 00:18:13.599 I didn't start playing until the seventh grade, so that 331 00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:17.480 probably has a hand in why I don't have that that. 332 00:18:17.559 --> 00:18:19.440 I was trying to be a music major at Temple 333 00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:22.759 and theory was is not my friend. 334 00:18:22.839 --> 00:18:25.759 But you don't need theory to be a musical at all. 335 00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:29.640 Well, luckily that's true. But like I can mimic, like 336 00:18:29.680 --> 00:18:31.720 if you give me the note, I can sing it 337 00:18:31.839 --> 00:18:34.960 back to you. But if you say give me an e, 338 00:18:37.920 --> 00:18:38.359 that's okay. 339 00:18:38.480 --> 00:18:41.680 You don't need that either. I mean, the most important thing. 340 00:18:41.960 --> 00:18:44.720 I had a great voice teacher at Temple, Harold Parker. 341 00:18:44.759 --> 00:18:47.680 He was just tremendous, and he made singing so much 342 00:18:47.759 --> 00:18:50.519 like speech. It was always about what are you communicating? 343 00:18:50.519 --> 00:18:52.759 What do you communicating? What are you communicating? And if 344 00:18:52.799 --> 00:18:55.400 you would start to get too enamored of your own noise, 345 00:18:55.839 --> 00:18:59.640 right too, enamored of the noise coming out your own mouth. Right, 346 00:19:00.240 --> 00:19:02.279 He would say, are you making sense or are you 347 00:19:02.400 --> 00:19:07.839 making tone? Because you can make a beautiful tone and 348 00:19:07.880 --> 00:19:11.279 it doesn't mean anything. It's made a pretty noise, which 349 00:19:11.359 --> 00:19:14.440 is lovely, But what does it mean? And even in 350 00:19:14.480 --> 00:19:16.880 singing in a foreign language, not that this is, you know, 351 00:19:17.079 --> 00:19:19.319 not that this is let me know if I'm going 352 00:19:19.319 --> 00:19:22.880 off on tangents here, but not at all. But even 353 00:19:22.920 --> 00:19:24.799 if you're singing in a foreign language, which is part 354 00:19:24.799 --> 00:19:27.279 of what a degree in vocal performance is about. And 355 00:19:27.319 --> 00:19:30.039 why I happened to actually get degrees in vocal performance. 356 00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:32.519 That's how I could get a scholarship. You know, I'm 357 00:19:32.559 --> 00:19:35.240 a farm kid. We didn't have any money, right, but 358 00:19:35.279 --> 00:19:37.759 I had a weird ear, so I could learn, you know, 359 00:19:38.079 --> 00:19:40.480 German and French and Italian really fast. I could learn 360 00:19:40.519 --> 00:19:41.759 how to sound it out, and then I could learn 361 00:19:41.759 --> 00:19:46.839 how to read it. And he would say, even if 362 00:19:46.880 --> 00:19:49.960 you're singing singing in French, do you know what you're saying? 363 00:19:50.119 --> 00:19:52.039 And do you know what this word here means? Exactly 364 00:19:52.119 --> 00:19:54.599 right here? And now say it like a sentence, and 365 00:19:54.640 --> 00:20:00.599 now sing it, and that the emotion makes itself when 366 00:20:00.640 --> 00:20:03.519 you speak. Right, If I tell you two that I 367 00:20:03.599 --> 00:20:05.559 really enjoyed meeting you, I don't have to think to 368 00:20:05.599 --> 00:20:10.119 put kindness or excitement in that. It's just really true, right. 369 00:20:10.200 --> 00:20:10.480 Yes. 370 00:20:10.720 --> 00:20:12.480 So it's almost like if I was singing you know, 371 00:20:15.000 --> 00:20:19.880 I'm so excited I met you. I didn't add something phony, right, 372 00:20:19.920 --> 00:20:22.359 I just said I'm excited to me and it sounds excited. Right. 373 00:20:22.599 --> 00:20:27.400 There's no need to hydraulically arrange feeling when singing. 374 00:20:27.759 --> 00:20:28.640 Right, right. 375 00:20:28.920 --> 00:20:31.640 Just if it's making sense to you and you're authentically 376 00:20:31.680 --> 00:20:34.279 connected to what it is you're singing and what you're saying, 377 00:20:34.359 --> 00:20:35.160 it's going to happen. 378 00:20:35.640 --> 00:20:38.480 That's the thing with authenticity. It's either there or it 379 00:20:38.519 --> 00:20:38.759 is not. 380 00:20:39.400 --> 00:20:41.119 And you can, I mean, you can find your way 381 00:20:41.160 --> 00:20:42.359 back to it, but you have to have a good 382 00:20:42.359 --> 00:20:46.400 teacher who keeps reminding you say it like a sentence. 383 00:20:47.559 --> 00:20:49.519 And often he would do this whole trick, like I 384 00:20:49.559 --> 00:20:53.039 went to the seven eleven and I bought a diet pepsi, 385 00:20:53.119 --> 00:20:58.119 and so you would be like, Okay, I went to 386 00:20:58.160 --> 00:21:04.880 the seven eleven and I bought a diet pepsi and corn. Yes, 387 00:21:06.480 --> 00:21:09.200 like you go into the sense of it instead of 388 00:21:09.200 --> 00:21:11.880 thinking about the noise you're making. It's like a sentence. 389 00:21:12.240 --> 00:21:14.720 It's just okay, that's performing. 390 00:21:14.799 --> 00:21:17.960 I'm sorry, I'm going No, it's not in the. 391 00:21:17.920 --> 00:21:21.480 Weds at all. It's not in the Weds at all. 392 00:21:21.960 --> 00:21:25.039 I never thought for a second you didn't want to 393 00:21:25.079 --> 00:21:26.960 be right there on stage. 394 00:21:27.119 --> 00:21:30.079 It's the best. Yeah, let's show people a good time. 395 00:21:30.160 --> 00:21:33.559 Let's have a good time. Life short. No, that's right, Yeah, 396 00:21:33.720 --> 00:21:35.000 let's have a good time right now. 397 00:21:36.680 --> 00:21:40.960 Yeah. I invoked you during our last podcast because Charles 398 00:21:41.039 --> 00:21:45.319 does a fifteen minute fave before our first break. Every time. 399 00:21:45.400 --> 00:21:48.240 He just whatever song is in his head that week. Yeah, whatever, 400 00:21:48.319 --> 00:21:50.279 like the two songs that were in his head that week. 401 00:21:50.440 --> 00:21:54.200