Speaker 1: We're all owned by the Syndicate Body and Soul or
should I just say bunny?
Speaker 2: Hello, filthy movie lovers, something Weirdos and anti criterion brose
to the thirty fourth episode of The Sin Syndicate, where
to Know is to Love and we never forget our
mother's Gang Bang spinal injury.
Speaker 3: My name is Gentry Austen, writer and researcher, and I'm
here with my co host, adult film historian Casey Scott,
and we're digging deep into this exploitation Ledger this week,
the Kurt Ledger, to be exact, as we look at
the darkly comedic follow up to one of the nastiest
ruffies of all time, director Kurt Ledgers epic erotic coming
of age dramedy It's Rancy's Friday.
Speaker 4: But before we welcome on this week's special guest by
unpopular demand, we thought we'd warm ourselves up with a
quick rundown of the New Beverly Cinema's recently unveiled March lineup,
which is a continuation of last month's tribute to the
old Aero Theater. But before that, I have a last
minute update from Jane Garrett, author of John Willie, a
Bizarre Life available everywhere books are sold. Who gave an
introduction to a live screening of Satan in High Heels
last Friday at the Beacon Theater in Seattle, so I
will summarize her message. She said the screening went well.
Lots of folks came out, people were laughing at all
the right campy parts. She said, a lot of people
showed up wearing their leather, which was great. She also
said that the festival director, Deanna Berger, provided some background
on the print they were watching, which was the same
one that Something Weird Video used for their VHS release
of the film in nineteen ninety three. Speaking of s WV,
boss Lady Lisa Patrucci even passed along a nice message
to the audience that's sweet. Jane also concluded by saying
it was a lot of fun and the audience seemed
really engaged and interested in her historical intro about Leonard
Bertman and the mid century fetish industry. So all in
all a huge success.
Speaker 3: All right, March Arrows Calendar, New Beverly. Let's just get
into this casey.
Speaker 5: I think we that we're going to do this again.
Speaker 3: I know, I think that we'll just we'll we'll kind
of cruise through this because that other podcast I know
is going to go much more in depth about them,
so we'll just give our quick thoughts. How does that sound?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean they're also biased, so yeah, it's not
like they aren't directly connected to the venue.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I am curious to listen to it though when it
is released, because sometimes they have little nuggets about where
the you know, the source prints are from, where they're sourcing.
Speaker 5: I do like to know, yes, I do like to
know that, right, And I feel like they also took
some cues from you because a lot of stuff this
month is over multiple days, which, right, you had said
for February there are very few one night only things, so.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're right. I did like that. Yeah, I was like, wait, actually,
there's not that much for us to cover because it is, Yeah,
it is spanning multiple days for some of these.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and for as many people as complaining about this, already,
very very few actual sex films on this release. It's
a lot of foreign foreign art films, American NC seventeen titles,
euro horror, women in prison stuff like there's Yeah, so
this is actually a safer schedule than last month, which
I'm not complaining about but people will well.
Speaker 3: They're kicking it. They're kicking it off. With the Casey
approved Alice in Wonderland, which you just screened.
Speaker 5: I did, whichever went over very well. I don't know
if it's the same print, though, with the opening promo
for Wizard of Oz, which I posted about all over
the place that that's the only photographic evidence that that's
the only thing that was ever shot for that movie
was a promo with Christine De Bell and Jason Williams,
and it was at the head of the print that
was shown at Nighthawk. I don't know if it's the same.
Speaker 3: Print, so that'll be an indicator if it is the
same print.
Speaker 5: Yeah, if that's it opens with Christine de Bell saying,
hi is Christinea Bell from Alice in Wonderland and yeah, yeah,
that would be great. And Cinderella print might be the
exhumed films print. But yeah, this is a double feature
that I actually suggested that they should do. Somebody should
do it because they're both great. The music is good
in both, and it's one's east coast, one's west coast.
I think Cinderella is better, but I love both of them.
They're both a lot of fun.
Speaker 3: Well, that's really funny. Yeah, if they are actually listening
someone somewhere, I don't know. That's March second and third,
so that's kicking off the month. There, March fourth and fifth,
we got Lolita, not the Kubrick one. This is the
Adrian Lion Lolita. Yeah, what are your thoughts on this?
I actually don't remember it that well.
Speaker 5: I remember when it came out because I think it
was just I think it was Showtime. I don't think
it played theatrically. That's why I'm kind of maybe it
must have played theatrical. They had prints, but I remember
for some reason being associated with Showtime. Maybe it did
a festival run. I don't care for it. Dominic Swain
is Lolita. There still hasn't been a good film version
of Lolita because it's kind of impossible to film because
all the film versions have made it so it looks sexier.
It makes the source material look more perverse than it
actually is the movie. The movies are are a little
too about the titillation, and they make you know, the
hero of the movie a little too sympathetic. The book
is not like that. So there's a lot of reckoning
to do with both the book and the movie. Odd choice. Yeah,
sue Lion one.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I wonder why they're not going to Kopberg.
I mean, what I remember about the Kopberg one is
that it's sometimes it did capture some of the humor
in the book better than the Adrian Line one.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but I mean, yeah, if there's any humor in
that one, is there. I feel like Lyne took it
like wats more serious?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so from what I remember of it.
But yeah, I saw Sean Baker posted like a story
of you know, a screenshot of Lolita the poster, and
he was excited about it. So I'm sure he's going
to get some hate mail from all the people online
that are like, this is child porn. Of course Quentin
Tarantino's showing it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, somebody said that, and I was like, there, no,
there's no They showed that last month. It was called
Buckingham Sexual and that already was shown. Stop is that
was already shown. We already saw underage girls, and they've
showed defiance a good that would have been not great
or by elation Claudia. But but yeah, Sean Baker, until
you follow us back, You're kind of on my shit list,
so follow us back? What's the problem. Yeah, they're sand
I feel very slight, din't hurt.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sure his mentions are just insane. So even
if I did tag him, he's not going to see it.
Speaker 5: So right, well, we need to wait until one of
our releases comes out and then he gets it and
then he's like, oh right, I'm not following these guys
because he followed not only two in the Pinky, we
followed their individual instagram. So I'm like, hum, I know
I need I need that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, come on now, Yeah, which release is he going
to pick up soon that might have us on it?
Speaker 5: Well, we can't really probably the well, the keinot one probably, well,
I don't know, both keos probably yeah, that's right, and
the other act fo one Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean we'll kind of probably get into it
a little bit as we get through this. But yeah,
some of the remarks online about this have been ridiculous,
just like, look, there there's nothing in here that is
you know, that is child porn, just.
Speaker 5: Because it's also not a sex film. It's an R
rated film. Yeah, it's not even erotic, it's not erotic,
so it's like it's it's so we're already beginning early
this month of something that is not an erotic film
or a sex film, but it's because it's programming in
the vicinity of these films, people are going to think, oh,
just more sex films, Like this is an R rated
feature with Jeremy Irons Donic Swayin, directed by Adrian Lyne.
It is not a sex film, so you'll hear that
a lot as we go through this this calendar too.
Speaker 3: Oh, I just remember, this is like going down memory lane.
I listened to the audiobook of Lolita and it had
Jeremy Irons reading it and it was amazing.
Speaker 5: So that's interesting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he has such a great voice for it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, he's good.
Speaker 3: Anyways, Faster Pussycat Kill, Kill, and Motorcycle March sixth, seventh,
and eighth, three days for russ Meyer double feature. I
like it.
Speaker 5: It's perfect, and both of those movies are great. You
get to see Motorsca was great because of Hodgy. Then
Faster Pussy Got Kill, Kill is start to finish perfection.
So that yeah, definitely, I would go all three days
if I could. I love all three there's so much Yeah. Yeah,
because I would want to see the reactions of the
different crowds. And I love both of those movies.
Speaker 3: So yeah, great, great double feature March ninth. Yeah, this
is a funny one. They're doing Italian sex comedies. This
is for Sean Baker. Apparently he's making an Italian sex
comedy inspired movie. That's what he says, So maybe he'll
show up to this. Hopefully it's funny, funny Antonelli, Gean
Carlo Janini. I like, I haven't seen it.
Speaker 5: Laura Antonelli, somebody loves her. I don't get it. We
we don't have a Glory Guida movie, but Sex with
a Smile, we at the very least have Ed Vi
and Barbara Bouchet.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: That's good casting, and Thomas Million's in that, but it's
also got Marty Feldman.
Speaker 7: He's not.
Speaker 5: Yes, that's right, Marty Feldman. Thomas Million is no Franco
Narrow or Fabio Testy. Okay, give me a.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Well in terms of attractiveness, now, Thomas Million is not attractive.
He's not sexy Tabio Testi and Franco Narrow smoking hot. Yeah,
Thomas Million wasn't cast in movies like that. It was
like romantic weeds and stuff.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but yeah, this is gonna be interesting because with
regard to these these Italian sexy comedies, even the ones
with like edwarch Finnick, everybody knows Edwidge, but they're not
being released by like boutique labels in the US because
it just the comedy just doesn't translate well.
Speaker 5: So I think No Shame put out a few ages
ago on DVD, but I don't think they've been reissued. Yeah,
which is interesting because I feel like a box set
that would only work and it would only sell if
you got her on camera, like No Shame did, which
was major when they put out you know, Strange Vice
and one of the other ones I don't remember now,
but they got her on camera and it was the
only time she's ever done an interview for for a
blue ray release or a home video release of for stuff. Yeah,
it's actually a smile is Martina, right, So yeah it's
another Martino, Yeah, because she was married to his brother
at the time.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this will go over probably like a leadweight. But
that's okay. I kind of like the idea that they're
doing it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, it's fine.
Speaker 3: Yeah, show Girls is getting a three day window here,
that'll be obviously a hit.
Speaker 5: Love that movie, but once again, not a sex movie.
It's just an it's an seventeen general release film. Great movie,
but yeah, I think it's It definitely indicates kind of
how this month is not. This is not an Arrows movie. Yeah,
this is like this is something they would show it
like the Egyptian. This is like, this is a mainstream title.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 3: Well, they're losing money on all these other days, so
they'll they'll make it back on these three days.
Speaker 5: Right now, they need to get Elizabeth Berkeley to show
up to one of those.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they got her on that was it Vinegar Syndrome
re release that on that Oh she's not.
Speaker 6: She's not on that.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 5: I think she asked MGM at one point for a
certain amount of money I think like twenty five hundred
dollars for an interview, and they said.
Speaker 3: No, oh that's what I heard.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I think I don't think they asked because
I thought she'd asked the same amount of money. And
it's like, you pay her that money because you're gonna
make it back because you get her on, you get
her on the record talking about this major movie. The
twenty five hundred dollars is worth it? Oh yeah, I
think didn't else sports nigger make like ten k for
doing a commentary for Conan, which is crazy because it's
not even on camera and he had nothing to say.
Speaker 3: Are you serious?
Speaker 5: I'm serious?
Speaker 6: It was it was.
Speaker 5: I think it was a major thing when they did
the Conan commentary with with the director of that. I
think he sat with the director. It was a long
time ago.
Speaker 3: But yeah, all right, we got March thirteenth and fourteenth.
Going back to Pasolini, his decameerotics. They're doing the Cameron.
I like it. H two days. Yeah, that's fine. Yeah,
no comment Yeah, oh you're you're giving it a pass.
Speaker 6: All right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're not really a Pasolini guy, are you.
Speaker 5: I like everything around the Cameron and Cannonbird Tales and stuff.
I don't care for those. Oh okay, I like Solo.
I like Mama Roma. Yeah, I like his early I
like his stuff in the sixties, and then I like Solo.
I don't Yeah, the peer the costume things I don't like.
Speaker 3: Okay, do you like the can the Erotic Canterbury Tales movie,
the hardcore film Pield.
Speaker 5: The Tomato movie, No, the High paid oh, ribbled Tales
of Canterbury.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Ribald, Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, I do all right.
March fifteenth, we have a wild one.
Speaker 5: Gay porn finally. I mean, Forbidden Letters is great, and
I forget the The supplier of these prints already mentioned
what the second feature is, and I forget what it is.
And I think there's a third feature that always that
also is like a mystery feature. I love Braissan. Forbidden
Letters is great. I think this is gonna go over,
like you said, like the proverbial lead balloon with this audience. Yes,
this is a very straight audience, so I think it's
a it's a bold risk. I'm glad that they're including them.
And if you're gonna do gay porn, these are good
ones to do. Forbidden Letters is much more of an
art film. But I forget what the other one is.
It's on a Sunday night.
Speaker 3: Wonderful.
Speaker 5: Yeah, oh very I like that.
Speaker 3: The day of our little bit law. I do love that, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I have nothing to say about that. I think, yeah,
it'll be very curious to see the reactions.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 3: March sixteenth, Jess Franco double one Night Only, that's what
I'm upset about give this two nights, guys. I agree,
And these are two films that haven't really I don't
think that they've gotten a nice US home video release,
So yeah, there's some I think there's some rights issues
there maybe, But these are two of Jess's YEA best
sixty nine movies. I hope they I hope they do well.
I hope people like them. I don't know. I think
this is two good ones. If you're not familiar with Franco,
these are two good ones to start with, very psychedelic, erotic,
cool music. Yeah, what do you have to say?
Speaker 5: I love them both.
Speaker 7: Go see it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And like I said, yeah, hopefully these get a
home video release because yeah, both of these would be
huge hits if Severn got them for UHD or whoever
m right. March seventeenth and eighteenth.
Speaker 6: What is this?
Speaker 3: They don't even have a title for this pairing?
Speaker 7: What is this?
Speaker 3: Like women?
Speaker 5: I don't either, I think so Women in Flames as
nineteen eighty three film belders A sixty seven. The Bunuel
film Women in Flames is so obscure that I'm not
familiar with it. And I love Belderzoor so I would
probably go see this double feature too, just because I'd
like to know what Women in Flames is. I think
it's a German film, German Swedish. Possibly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's housewives stepping out kind of thing. I guess
the same.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Fellini's Casanova March nineteenth and twentieth.
Speaker 5: Past my least one of my least favorite Fellini films.
It's eve You're going to do? Actually, you know, we've
been great for this City of Women because that is
probably one of the closest films the sex Boy that
Felini did, because it's you know, it's very focused on
this man obsessed with women and his his relationships with women.
It also has Beatrice sweats her face from a cobb
and extro in it. Oh she's a woman on the train. Yeah.
Casanova is not good. It's Donald south Olnham ended up
being annoying. Yeah, I don't care for it, so pass. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this might be another one of those cases where
it's just like, this is one of the prints that
they have access to.
Speaker 5: So that's not and I'll say it again, not a
reason to program something because you have a print. And
also it's just it's not Yeah, it's not. It's not
a sex folm as well, so it's just like if
you're skipping with the arrows. I don't know. I think
at this point they are kind of trying to be like, well,
we want other people to come out, so we have
to show stuff that isn't sex likes. It's CASA's is
not great. So tyrcon Is is better too. That would
have been good too.
Speaker 3: March twenty first and twenty second, Your Favorite Guy, Radley
Metzger double feature.
Speaker 5: The only two two films of his only two softcore
films of his that I can tolerate. Terrayson. Isabel Is
a masterpiece and I've seen both of these theatrically at
the Lincoln at Lincoln Center, Trayson. Isabelle is really incredible
to see with an audience. It's really beautiful on the
big screen. And liquorice Wartet is good. I like liquors Wartet.
It's very good. So that's a good double feature.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is.
Speaker 5: I would go to one of those two.
Speaker 3: Yep, go see Frank Wolf on the big screen.
Speaker 5: Guys y before he killed himself, Yeah, like literally before
he killed himself, didn't kill himself, like a year after
that movie came.
Speaker 3: Out yeah pretty soon after. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love
that guy anyways.
Speaker 5: And also what's her face died too? The lead actress
of that movie died tragically young too of cancer. Oh yeah,
she was Camille in two thousand. Yeah, she died very
young too. But Terrayson Isabel is also sie person who
I'm obsessed with. She is one of probably my favorite
Swedish actress ever. I love her so yeah, yep, that's
a good one thumbs two thumbs up. Christina Lindbergh double
oh boy m mmmm. Love both of these, The Depraved
and Campus Swingers. Now very different type of movies, yeah,
very different.
Speaker 3: I don't know if there's any differences in the Depraved
version than the exposed titled version.
Speaker 5: I don't believe so. I don't think Jerry because wasn't Depraved.
I think it was cinnimation. I don't think it was
at all. Yes, yeah, it was just a straight import.
But it's great. I love Depraved.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Uh you said that, you're yeah, you weren't sure
how these were gonna go over. I mean I think
the Depraved is gonna go over pretty well. I think
there's no there's no really strong sexual assault. I mean,
I'm just thinking about just.
Speaker 5: The general distastefulness of that film. Sure, it's just distasteful,
which is fine. I mean it lives up to the title.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Christina is amazing in that and that one.
Speaker 5: She's great. She's great in them. Campus Swingers is a
school girl report movie that might actually go over worse.
Speaker 3: Yeah that I was gonna say, that's gonna go over
way worse.
Speaker 5: I I enjoy it though. I And you know what's funny.
You know, I ordered all those from m v D
finally on DVD. They finally shipped and they're arriving today,
so I can actually get into my school good report mode.
I love those problematic suckers. I'm sorry. Yes, you know
there's something because I when I were up in Germany,
I would watch them my late in I TV when
my parents were asleep in Germans. So I would just
watch these terrible sermons exploitation movies in German and it
helped me learn the language, to be honest.
Speaker 3: Oh, do the m v D Blu rays have multiple
language options?
Speaker 5: They're the they're Impulse DVDs.
Speaker 3: But are they Is there English? Is there an English
dub on?
Speaker 7: There?
Speaker 6: No?
Speaker 5: Just German and English subs. I have DVD rs of
all of the like private screenings vhs, so I'll just
shove them into the dB case.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just curious. Yeah, Campus Swingers. I would love
to watch the audience for that one. I mean, yeah,
it's it's a it's a trip.
Speaker 8: I like.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I like it too. But March twenty fourth, twenty fifth,
Henry and June.
Speaker 5: Yeah, also not a sex film, mainstream something the seventeen
art film.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like late night television a pass.
Speaker 5: I'm not interested.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I have nothing.
Speaker 5: I love Philip Kaufman, but not interested.
Speaker 3: No, thank you. March twenty sixth and twenty seventh. This
is a fun one.
Speaker 5: This is what we're talking about. Yeah, there's Alban very
double feature, another absolute icon that I worshiped, and a
monk is terrific because you always go Barbara Bouschet Slaughtter Hotel.
She is kind of the best thing about that. There's
no reason why she needed to show up on set
and go as hard as she did in her performance
in that film for that piece of garbage. She really
brings it hard, and it's just like, you didn't need
to be so good in this. This is clearly garbage.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean knows it's garbage.
Speaker 5: Yeah, correct, it's phoned in, but like she shows up
looking gorgeous, really like bringing something to the portrayal of
a ninfomaniac. She's very good. She's always good though, and
she's great in a muck. I mean a muck is great.
I'm very that is one. That's another one. I might
go both nights actually, because I love Resolva that much.
I would like to see audience reactions to nights in
a road to her.
Speaker 3: Yeah, those two girls, Bouchet and Resolve are gonna have
some new fans for sure after that, I hope.
Speaker 5: So you better believe I'm hot in those comments. I'm
telling people, guys, focus focus, Let's lock in on the
Bouchet of the Narry please, let's lock in and focus. Yeah,
these are icons. Please.
Speaker 3: I'm actually kind of sick. I almost wasn't sure if
you were going to be a fan of a Muck
or not. A lot of people I love a Muk.
I don't like that movie even well, they're wrong, Yeah.
Speaker 5: No, it is so good. It is so good. That
was one when they came out on a DVD years
ago through like DVD drive in. Actually, when they did,
it was like a full frame VHS transfer, and they
interviewed both Barbara and on like a because they live
like literally down the street from each other, their next
door neighbors.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm saying that, and.
Speaker 5: I still have that DVD. But yeah, I mean, what's
not to love about that? The soundtrack is amazing. Oh yeah,
you know that song sexually? Yeah, I mean it's so good. Yeah,
actually I might watch I might watch that out to
we finished recording.
Speaker 3: You get to see Farley Granger like slutting. It actually
good Italian era.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it has not phoned it. He doesn't phone it in. Yeah,
I a muck is I love a muck. I loved
it even in the full frame version. So when it
finally came out, I got the Camera obscura release and
it was like seeing it for the first time.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I love that movie.
Speaker 3: March twenty eighth and twenty ninth, The Hot Box and
Terminal Island. It's kind of a drive in Women in
Prison very much.
Speaker 5: So I love both movies, so I would go see both.
I love I preferred Terminal Island. Actually, the better double
feature would probably be Sweet Sugar in Terminal Island because
they're both roth At least Rothman directed Terminal Island and
she wrote Sweet Sugar. I think Sweet Sugar was the script,
the original script for something. But Hotbox is good. Hopbox's
Margaret Markoff, who's terrific. And so there's a few other
people in that. Lori Rose is in Hot Box, ak
Jennifer Brooks, some adult version of jackal and Hyde. But
Terminal Island is a masterpiece, and that's that's I've always
loved that movie. That's so good. So yeah, not sex films,
but I highly recommend both of.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that'd be a fun one. That's a fun weekend
weekend screening. And last, but definitely least, March thirtieth and
thirty first, Last Tango in Paris. I mean, historically, I
think we can agree it's an important film. I think
it sucks.
Speaker 5: I have never liked it, and I was very mad
when it was reissued on the Districts label. And I
will say again Distripis wasn't happy about that either. It
wasn't their choice. But yeah, I also think it's an
interesting choice considering what we know now about the production
of that film, right, and how Marie Schnyder was mistreated
and essentially assaulted on camera without her knowledge.
Speaker 3: Yeah, these people that are haunting comments like saying it's
inappropriate to be showing Lolita. Adrian lines Lolita. This is
way more inappropriate from them, you know perspective, If that's
your perspective, that you know that we shouldn't be showing
any film that has there was inappropriate things going on
behind the scenes.
Speaker 8: You know.
Speaker 3: It's funny that Alex, when we talked to him a
few episodes ago, he talked about how that's sort of
a barrier he's he's seen that as a barrier in
his experience trying to show sixty sex films to people
that they all assume that, you know, there was nefarious
things going on behind the scenes, And I had never
considered that like that people would think that, but here's
a real time I.
Speaker 5: Don't know where they're yes, and I don't know where
they're getting that from. It's just it's just supposition that
any kind of film with sex as it's focus is
automatically taking advantage of women and they didn't sign up
for it, and there's like moral ambiguity there. But that's
not the case even in I mean even an adult
adults not squeaky clean either when it gets into hardcore.
But yeah, it's and also there were sleezy people in
softcore too, But no, this is a case of some
like a major director in a major star collaborating together
to make this This Woman's Life hell on set that
was that's a that's a that's a major motion picture.
It's not. It's not a sex film. So the fact
that it's happening on a mainstream set to tell you
where the real problems are, which is on the people
in power in Hollywood. That's the kind of shit that
they would do and get away with. That's what we're
talking about here, and.
Speaker 3: Which we've heard. We've heard people talk about that that
were in the business that you know, the low budget
exploitation films, that was the fun stuff, you know, where
there were no issues. But it's when they started going
to these mainstream Hollywood pictures where they ran into the
real sleeze bags.
Speaker 5: Right, So I say pass on that, not just for
moral reasons, but it's just it's also not it's just
not good. It's boring as hell. It's not erotic. Marlon
Brando keeps his clothes on for most of the movie
because he's fat and chicken shit, So.
Speaker 6: It really is.
Speaker 5: It really does been more exploitive when it's not equal opportunity,
nudity and sex.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's a good point. I just think he's
so annoying in that movie and it's just not great.
But I mean, if you haven't seen it before, I
think everyone should see it at least once. I'm not
someone who says you should never see a certain film
for any particular reason. Well I shouldn't say that. Maybe
that's going too far, but right, maybe there are some
films that I would completely say you should never see.
But well we won't go there. That's another dispecial.
Speaker 6: Right, So letatry.
Speaker 1: It's going to be long day to day. I mean,
his friends won't be here until eight o'clock. How the
hell am I supposed to entertained two married couples. He'll
probably look down the righteous noses it me.
Speaker 6: And thank you slut.
Speaker 3: Like episode thirty one love Land, where we looked at
Gary Kent's softcore hotel set Masterpiece, Secret Places, Secret Things
with guest Chris Poggiali, this week we gave our guests
carte blanche and his choice of film pick, and he
brought us another extremely underseen obscurity with currently less than
ten logged views on letterboxed. So I'm going to ask
him the same question I asked Chris Sean Langrick. Welcome.
Who are you and why did you pick this movie?
Speaker 7: Well? I've been described by someone who will will not
name as a let's see, I got this written down
for the actual posting a keyboard jockey doing hack research
in my spare time. So that's that's who I Yeah,
so yeah, so thanks for having me. Who am I?
That's always a good question for our purposes. Today, we'll
say I'm a film researcher, historian, writer, talker, whatever. I
like films I like, especially you know the type of
films you guys cover, I'll put it that way. I've
always had a n act for research, and I was
I'm one of those guys who can't get through a
film without pausing at about three dozen times to you know,
look at who is that person? Where's that location? Especially
the locations. I have an especial special affinity for film locations,
which I guess is kind of how you know. Joe
Rubin from Vinegar Syndrome first noticed me. I started lurking
on the Vinegar Syndrome Facebook group about gosh, it's been
about seven years ago now, back what I consider the
golden era of that group, when we had folks like
Charles Devlin, who's still around very much still around, but
Christopher Elam and Greg Javor also rest in peace. Guys
like that, and there's a few other names who I
won't mention because they're no longer part of the group.
But I finally got up enough gumption to start posting
some comments and stuff myself and got noticed by Joe,
and the rest is history, I guess I could say.
Speaker 8: There.
Speaker 7: I think he also noticed took notice whenever I did
a personal on my personal blog. I posted an article
I'd done a very deep dive on Mickey Mouse movies
and not the kinds your kids watch, hopefully, but I
discovered that it was in some places and as a
certain period of code for adult movies, especially in Hawaii.
So I did a whole article on that, which I
think caught his attention, and so he started, you know,
we started chatting, and he eventually I got to meet
him when I was in New York one of the
trips I was up for. He was always sending me
stuff to hey, what do you think of this? Can
you look into this? That? That sort of stuff. That
led to a couple of opportunities to do film commentaries.
One for Titus Modies the Last of the American Hobos
and Titus will come back up in a minute, and
also the locations commentary for Hollywood nine two eight, which,
by the way, Mark Edward Hoyke did a far better
commentary for that as he should have. That was his baby,
just dating for what fifteen years, I think to make
that that release happen. And you know, I've done a
number of other commentaries in the last few years. I
worked with Greg Javor who was doing the hardwood collection
for Severn on Edward's hard Core stuff. Although the film
I did the commentary for is not hard core. It's
the only house in town. And if this goes well,
I'd like to twist your guys's arm to come back
at some point and talk about that movie as well.
Because we did a commentary then years past before it
came out, I found out a ton more stuff, correct
some stuff, redid the commentary, and seven put the wrong
one on the on the release. So I'd love the
opportunity to talk about that film, and Casey, I mean,
I'll twist your arm a lot on that. It's got
a course Oushi and Itola, It's got Jane come home.
We got it.
Speaker 3: I think we kind of talked about it, didn't we, Casey,
when we were thinking about an Edward movie to cover.
Speaker 5: I don't recall I might have said now automatically, yeah,
I think you did. But the thing is, if Sean,
knowing Sean in his amount of research, that might be
the arm twisting I need, Because then it might it
would it would make me see it in a different
light than the whatever, whatever the hell that is now.
Speaker 7: Or less about the film, about everything around it, honestly, Yeah, yeah,
tracked down all the all the people in it. I've
tracked down the house. I've tracked down the guy that
rented in the house and interviewed him. So what more
do you need, Casey?
Speaker 6: Damn?
Speaker 5: Well?
Speaker 7: Uh yeah. So Titus Moody I mentioned earlier because of Joe.
You know, I guess I'm kind of an expert or
becoming an expert. I guess on Titus, I have a
whole archive of his personal and professional elements that I've
become the steward of and you know, I guess his
ghost has been prompting me enough. I'm, I guess now
officially writing a biography about Titus. Okay, so don't look
for that anytime soon. But I've interviewed his twin sister
quite extensively. At the end of last year, I've been
interviewing James Bryan, the director that worked with him on
Dirtiest Game, among other films, and we actually still talk
almost on a weekly basis now. So and I have
a growing amount of people I need to try to
find and also, you know, interview and other things I
want to other elements I want to try to get
a hold of as well. There, So that's kind of
who I am. Why did I want to talk about
Franci in particular and Kurt Ledger for the last twenty
eight years, I'm one of these old school guys. I've
worked at the same place for twenty eight years. It's
been bought and broken out and reacquired and all sorts
of stuff, but it's basically the same company, and it's
headquarters either it's global, it's regional, or whatever. Headquarters throughout
all that different eras has been in New Jersey, specifically
the Woodbridge, New Jersey area, So I kind of become
a second home for me. I work from home, but
you know, it used to be a lot more that
I would travel up there. But I got very familiar
and I am very familiar with that area. So when
I first got when that there had been a film
made in New Jersey and in that area, I had
to find out more about it. Now, Francis one of
those films that was in that Distribute Pick sort of
they had to yank them in casey you know more
about that than I do, right, what happened with them?
Speaker 5: Well, that one was actually that was one of the
last titles that something we'd released on DVDR. It was
in their second to last batch and they didn't even
say it was a District Picks title, So I think
they released it and they didn't even.
Speaker 7: Attach it to They didn't know.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So I don't know if they yanked it or not.
Because I after they stopped doing dvdrs, I kind of
lost and because I bought them all, so I lost,
I lost touch of what happened, what went out of print,
and what they kept making. So that wouldn't surprise me though,
what they had to, because I know Stephen had to
kind of make up with something weird after a while.
There was some stuff going on there.
Speaker 7: But yeah, I believe when I asked Lisa, that's what
she had said. It was part of that distribut pick
sort of it. She wasn't. I mean, there's nothing that
would allude to that in the film or anything that
I've seen, but it was part of that or there was.
It was questionable perhaps, so you know, out of caution
that they yanked and everything, so it wasn't available, But Lisa,
in her enabling goodness, sent me the last copy she
had on the on the shelf for Christmas one year.
So that's how I first got a hold of it
there and it did not disappoint. The very first frame
I was a meeting, like I know exactly where that
is because i'd been my god, wow, I.
Speaker 3: Mean the first frame where Franci's on the hillside.
Speaker 7: Like the funeral scene, the cemetery.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the cemetery, Okay, yeah, In.
Speaker 7: Fact, I was just there two weeks ago. I have
to drop through that to get from my office to
the hotel. So that's how uh, And it's only the
first of many relations I have with the film itself.
But yeah, so that's why I got interested in And
of course, since I again am in New Jersey, or
have been in New Jersey a lot, I took the opportunity.
I was up there for an extended time for a
project two years ago, almost three years ago now, and
I had time that I wasn't in the office, so
I did a whole location sort of field trip, if
you will. So I'm moving to this when we get
into into the locations on the film. But I've the house,
I've been there. I've been to the car wash, I've
been to the airport, I've been to the house that
she came on the bus was filmed at. So so
again we'll get we'll get into that in more detail
as we dive into the films there. But that's why
I asked for these films, because I did spend some
time finding out about it, finding about at the locations,
finding about some of the people I've actually been. And
I am in contact with Curtis Ledger's daughter. We have
not had a chance to actually speak on the phone
because I'm terrible at scheduling, evidently, at least with her,
So that will hopefully happen in the next week, and
if anything new or interesting comes out, I'll let you
guys know when you can throw it in the show
notes there. But yeah, that was a long answer, Gentry.
Hopefully I won't be a long winded because we don't
have a lot of time.
Speaker 3: So no, No, that was great. Yeah, that helped me
understand your connection with the movie for sure. Well let's
just start. You know, we talked about the home video
release a little bit. I want to see the trailer
for this. I haven't seen it yet. It's on Twisted
Sex Volume twenty. Have you guys seen the trailer?
Speaker 1: Not?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 3: How do they frame the movie?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 3: Is you know, is anything interesting in that next movie?
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's pretty It's a pretty standard S exploitation trailer.
There's not any footage in the trailer that isn't in
the film, so it doesn't have any alternate takes that
I remember. I but it's interesting to think of when
it came out and the fact that it's that it's
in black and white, which is very unusual.
Speaker 7: For that period. There was actually I found at least
one ad that claimed it was in color. Liars they had, Yeah,
and I went to Lisa and like, least, what what
is this is like that? That can't be that's only
ever been in black?
Speaker 5: Yeah, it can't be. Yeah, yeah, that's what. And that's
why I was kind of like, well, is this like
a black and white dupe nag? But I don't think
that's not It can't be the case, because yeah, I
think this was a movie lab thing and I think
it's the original camera negative for this. So yeah, even though.
Speaker 7: It's the DVD, are it looks good? At least the version?
Speaker 5: It absolutely does?
Speaker 3: Yeah, it does. Does the DVDR come with any liner notes?
Was there anything written about it?
Speaker 5: Lisa doing like it's just Lisa doing like a plot summary,
I think, saying the Kurt Ledger director, she came on bus,
and I think I think a little bit on Alicia Fontaine.
I think that's it.
Speaker 3: And I did see in some of the ad mats that, yeah,
Kurt Ledger's name is attached to Branty's. So I'm curious
why he didn't put his name on she came on
the bus? If he directed that, maybe where maybe are.
Speaker 5: You you've seen the movie? You know why he wouldn't
put his name on the movie, are you?
Speaker 8: Yeah?
Speaker 3: That's funny.
Speaker 7: I think, you know, I don't know that he directed
or wrote or I don't know what his involvement truly was,
and she came on the bus. I am one hundred
percent sure he was involved with it though, because again,
like I said, I've been to the house where it
was filmed. That was his parents and or grandparents' house.
So that's how I'm convinced he was somehow related to it.
Now where you know where it got whoever, I don't
know who it was said it was he wrote and
directed it or directed it or whatever. There it almost
feels like someone had been down the same pathway I
went down to find the house, and that they put
two and two together and maybe came up with that.
That's my best guess beyond that maybe someone maybe this
mysterious Peter Jackson, you know, or something. And by the
way that I know, we're getting ahead of ourselves, but
that Peter Jackson is not The IMDb entry for him
cannot be correct.
Speaker 5: Now, very very often isn't. Yeah, but you know what,
I kind of I'm at the point now where I
don't want to correct it because that's my form of gatekeeping.
I'm like, well, people can keep claiming that the people
who know know that that's incorrect. So that's my Jim
that's my Jim Holiday move of keeping certain things not
necessarily public. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, IMDb is so bad about people that have the
same name that are clearly different people.
Speaker 5: We just talked about that with Braham Place last week.
Speaker 7: Yeah, and we're going to run into another one of
those situations a little bit later when we talk about
another mysterious guy.
Speaker 3: Well just the Yeah, we're talking about the opening of
Francis Friday here. So who what is lp R production?
Speaker 7: Well, the Ledger, I think the P and the R.
I don't know. I don't know. I haven't found anything
else about what they were. I found out where they were, though,
at least some of their at least one of their addresses,
which wound up being the house that was filmed at.
So which again we're getting ahead of ourselves, but that
that that house has many many secrets to tell, not
all of which I have answers for.
Speaker 3: Okay, well, maybe you want to run down the Do
you want to run through Curtis chronology? Is that a
good place to start.
Speaker 7: Yeah, that's what you.
Speaker 3: Found about this mysterious Curtis Ledger.
Speaker 7: The beginning and end of it is he was born
in nineteen thirty and died in nineteen ninety, and in
between is where all the fun happened. Of course, he
from New Jersey area. He's one of these guys that
I think tried a little bit of everything that interests him.
We see a lot of these folks behind the scenes
in adult films and underground films, and he definitely fits
that mold. He actually, let me tell you what. Kenny Chandler,
who's the male star of Francy, I interviewed him a
couple of hours worth a few weeks ago, and let
me read you what his impression to Kurt was. I
think that's a good part actually, and I'm going to
quote that said, Kurt was a strange man. I don't
know how he even got into doing a movie. One
of these guys you never knew what he was thinking.
A very mysterious guy. I mean, he was nice, he
was polite, did whatever we asked, and he reiterated that
he was a strange guy like three or four times there.
So that's that's the intro to mister Ledger.
Speaker 2: There.
Speaker 7: So the stuff he was involved in that that I
was able to dig up. And this goes back to
the early fifties. Actually the early fifties, he was involved
in a couple of car dealerships in New Jersey. One
of them was called the first used car Dealership, the first.
I don't know if it was the first in the world.
I don't know why he was doing that, but he
was very markedly a promoter. We can we can tell
that he had in nineteen sixty one, he had a
company called Curtis Michael Associates. And the guy that was
the Michael was at Michael Nimitz and he's going to
show up again in a few minutes. And what that
Curtis Michael Associates did is they did shopping center sort
of Santa Clauses and you know, decorations for parades and
things like this. And one of the articles I found
from December sixty one they had a thirty four foot
Santa Claus at the Menlo Park shopping Center which is
now the Minlo part Mole and where they do have
the better Easter Bunny. By the way, my mind on
this went to, well, is this fun in balloon Land?
Is this somehow related to that? Answers, though I could
find no overlap whatsoever, even though I think they were
from Pennsylvania, where Ledger also had some footprints in, But
I found no connection there. Unfortunately, that was going to
be great if we did. But sixty two he started
Curtis G. Ledger Advertising Company, also Sports Leasing Corporation, and
in sixty four he got involved with the New York
World's Fair, the World's Fair that was held in New York.
He was I don't know if he was head of
or he was working with the Indonesia Pavilion, which had
kind of assorted history, political history there was. I think
the fair ran two years. The Indonesian Pavilion was only
open one year because of political reasons, and there was
a whole thing there.
Speaker 3: So he was designing there. What is he doing for it?
Speaker 7: I think based on you know, based on his mechanical inclination.
I think it was something to do with the decorations.
I haven't got a real picture of what they had
at the Indonesia Pavilion, other than Skarna was very clear
that he didn't want the regular beauty pageants types escorting
people around. He wanted very proper Indonesian people doing that
but beyond that, I'm not sure. So I think it was,
you know, some kind of animatronics maybe I'm guessing, or
something along those lines. But he's not the only guy
that did work there, and we'll come to those in
a little bit as well. So then he did the
used Carlot I mentioned. Then in Philadelphia he had Ledger Displays,
another advertising type firm. Then in sixty four he had
some kind of legal trouble with his sports leasing and
a guy named Philip Stone that was I think his partner,
and I don't. I mean, it's tempting to think the
P and LPR might be Philip, but that doesn't really
make sense if he's using Ledger the last name, So
I don't think that was. I don't think he was
still around at that point. Then in sixty five he
has In the sixties, you know, the slot car racing
was really popular, so he had this Golden Gear Raceway
in Plainfield, New Jersey, and also Ledger excuse me, something
called Ledger and Son, which was a hobby shop, which
is interesting on two fronts, which is he never had
a son that I know of, and he hadn't even
yet had his daughter, So I don't know. I don't
know where that name came from. His daughter wouldn't be
born for another couple of years, and then we get
into you know, she came on the bus Franci's Friday.
Around the same time of Franci's Friday. He's also running
a company called LMC, which stood for Ledger Machine Company.
And what they did is they built and I think
franchised car washes. And so there's a lot of ads
around this time for LWC or LMC for car washes
in the New Jersey area, in the Pennsylvania area, and
a lot of them. Again, the address used as the
house in Colonia where Francy was filmed, So I'm starting
to get the feeling at this point that maybe, you know,
Curtis and family were living there at the time. And again,
unfortunately I've not talked to his daughter to confirm that
one way or the other. So Fancy's Friday's filmed. Then
we get to some interesting things with Kurt. In seventy four,
he shows up in the papers as turning the guy
that turned in this I guess fairly infamous doctor that
had been caught for tax evasion and had escaped, and
I guess there was some you know, drama in the
newspaper about this guy. Well anyway, I guess he was
friends with mister Ledger turned him in, so he got
in the news for that. Also in seventy eight and
seventy well seventy eight, he was in an armed robbery attempt.
Not he wasn't the guy robbing, but he like stopped
the guy, stopped the robber that was doing it, So
he became sort of a hero for about a year.
Speaker 3: Where was that, do you know? Was it like a bank?
Was it a gas station?
Speaker 7: I think it was a store. I think positive on that.
I'll have to go back to my deep notes on
that one, but I'm not sure that. In seventy nine, though,
he was arrested for sort of running a prostitution ring
with this guy named Mitchell Wachowski. Now it looks like
mister Ledger was let off because there's only one mention
that he was arrested for it, and that's it. The
rest of the articles and the rest of the story
all focused on Wachowski, So I'm thinking there was hopefully
some confusion on that. I don't know. Wachowski, though, was
an interesting guy. He was like I said he was
arrested with Ledger in seventy nine. He was arrested again
in seventy nine for running a booking agency for go
go bars and underage girls. So this guy wasn't really great.
He'd had another arrest later fortitute running prostitutes, and he
also owned a go go bar in New Brunswick, which
is just south of where Fancy was film. So not
a very good guy.
Speaker 3: But I think it clear from your research that they
were associates.
Speaker 7: At they were associates were at least yeah. I mean,
it wasn't like he was walking down the street and
got nabbed, you know, accident. He was he was. He
was related somehow, but to what extent, I don't know.
Right in seventy nine and then also later in eighty five,
he there's a couple of articles about him developing a
Nighthawk alarm system. So this is an alarm system that
would be you know, trip tripping. I'm not sure how
technically it works, but he got he's got patents for
it and everything, and he evidently had been working on
this since the sixties when he had some of that
I think that store, that hobby shop back which was
robbed back then as well. So and there's a I
think it's in the eighty five article. There's a really
good picture of him. So we do have one picture
of him that we can go and then then we
get to ninety and that's when he passes away. So
that at a very high level, is mister Curtis Ledger?
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a lot. Yeah, I mean what is it?
I have my opinion, like based on all that information
about this kind of character, but what is yours?
Speaker 2: You know, Like, who is you know?
Speaker 3: I see a journey man here who's trying to find
something to do something to make money.
Speaker 7: Is I think that's it?
Speaker 3: Yeah, clearly he's good with his hands, probably at making things.
I see that. But yeah, I don't have a clear
picture of this guy.
Speaker 7: Uh well the only the clearest picture I got was
from mister Chandler. And he's weird. Yeah serious, but but
he you know, he reminds me you're right. I mean
this journey we just went through is is kind of deliberate,
it almost right. I mean he starts out and very
broad in cars and everything. Then he gets slot cars
even themselves that's very mechanical. And there were the Santa
clauses and stuff like that, and now patenting this alarm system.
So I think there definitely was that vision for him,
but I think it's also about making money. And I
get the impression. I mean that the sixties were a
rat tat tat of things we just went through. Right.
That just seems like someone throwing things against the wall,
seeing what's going to stick and make make him, make
him a buck.
Speaker 5: You know, and there's nothing sex films, And then sex
films just happened to be one of those things where
it's like, well, these are making money and we can
make them very cheaply, but it's so interesting because one
of them is obviously made much more cheap than the other.
Speaker 7: Absolutely, I think she came up was exactly that, though.
It was like let's try this. Now there's some you know,
maybe maybe he was at a bar and plainfield and
someone's like, hey, you know, I hear Fred just to
be invested in this Nudi film and you know, made
bank on it or whatever, and away we go. It's interesting.
It was made cheaply, but there was some budget there
had to be to get folks like Uda and Linda there, right.
Speaker 5: Yes, right, and bring them out from New York and
just like, yeah, hop on the train, let's get it.
Come out here, right, get on the bus.
Speaker 7: But they didn't come for free. I think most of
the guys probably did in that film. Sure right, yes,
and beyond that, I mean again, we're getting ahead of
ourselves on that you had. He was using his parents
or grandparents' house, so there was no money there, and
it was a charter bus that he probably cashed a
favor in for the guy down at the bar. You
know that he might have got the idea from you,
or it might have been a co investor, if you will.
Who knows, right, Yeah, maybe Peter Jackson owned the bus company.
I don't know.
Speaker 9: The conversation during the car ride moves from one thought
to another, and finally, a moving bus triggers a new
and possibly more exciting thought. Why not get ahead of
the bus, stump the bus, get on it and see
what happens from there?
Speaker 2: What the heck?
Speaker 3: It's all in the name of fun and game. Are
you ready to talk?
Speaker 7: She came on the bus quick, yeah, and let's do
it quick, because.
Speaker 5: I mean, let's spend as little time as possible.
Speaker 3: I think origin a long time ago, I was you know,
we were just batting around ideas for films to talk
about me and Casey, and you know, of course I
bring up she came on the bus and he was
not having it at all, And I mean, I understand,
I understand, but I think in this case it's it's
important to understand Curtis and where his head is that
in making.
Speaker 5: The I'm viewing it as we have to talk about
fluctuations while we talk about in Hot Blood. Yeah, basically
one of those is better than the other. I mean
very different, because Francis Friday is much better than in
Hot Blood. But it's similar. How like, Yeah, the film
maker can make two films, one is significantly worse than
the other.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, well like you yeah you said that. I mean, Uda,
Linda pretty big names at least, I mean, I don't
know how big they were on the scene at that point.
What can you say, Casey, like, is it a big.
Speaker 5: Not necessarily names? I mean yeah, like name not names
weren't really a thing in sexploitation cases like Marshall Jordan
and stuff. There weren't people who you were going to
look for their name on a poster when you went
to go. Yeah, like Marca Jordan became a brand that
wasn't really a thing in New York. They didn't have
brands even like ZC. Darlene and Darlene Bennett. Like, yeah,
they're regularly in these movies. You recognize them, but you're
not going to go try to find a movie because
they're in them. There was no star system set up.
But yeah, at this point, but by the time they
did she come on the bus, they clearly been doing
a ton of work, so you would know who they are.
And they're very easy to work with them, very popular
with producers, so yeah, and good friends too, so if
one heard about one project, they might live in the other.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. I think that was the case with especially
with Linda and Uda and then Jackie Richards. I mean,
she's a pretty big part of that movie as well,
so she came as part of the package as well.
Speaker 7: The only guy I think we know is Larry Hunter,
who was of course in a bunch of Wishman films.
Speaker 3: Okay, where is Larry in that movie?
Speaker 7: He's the guy that's wearing the striped shirt. That's the
best I can tell you. He's not the main guy.
I thought he was going to be the main guy,
kind of the guy that does the bus driver in
and so forth. Yeah, not him, that's not him. It's
one of the other dorky guys. I think he doesn't
have a really big role at all, but he's he's there.
I'd use my facial comparison told it to make sure he.
Speaker 3: Was really okay. Yeah, I watched it again recently and
I couldn't find him. He's not like part of the
main hoodlums, is he? Because there's like three main hoodlums.
I don't think he's any of the three.
Speaker 7: He's in the house for sure, because that's where I
got it.
Speaker 3: I think he might appear randomly in the house, and
then he doesn't. I don't know if he goes on
the bus with them though.
Speaker 7: That's interesting. You know, I haven't watched it close enough forever.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I could way back review where I could way
back machine my DVD driving review.
Speaker 3: I think I think we need to question this Larry
Hunter credit. I think we do. I like the main
guy in this movie. He's so funny. I wish I
could see him in more stuff. He's got like a
certain energy. He's kind of like the little hoodlum guy
of who I'm talking about.
Speaker 7: Absolutely, he's the guy that he's the one that shives
the bus.
Speaker 3: Drive and he does the dance at the end.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, that guy.
Speaker 7: He had to he had to be a local. Like
I think most of the folks in these films that
we don't know were. In fact, I've confirmed a few
of them were local talent. Jersey had an amazing local
and regional theater scene back in the sixties. It looks like,
I mean, drama clubs, drama, you know, things like you know,
And we'll get to one of the guys when we
talked about Fancy that was that was pretty big in
that Michael Nimitz was was pretty big. By the way.
The guy mentioned that was in Ledger or Curtis Michael,
that firm from the Santa Claus firm from back in
the early sixties. He was big in the local theater
scene as well. So at least that guy we're talking about,
that short guy we were talking about, he had and
you know, I was hoping he was going to pop
up in some of It's the picture somewhere that I
haven't found.
Speaker 3: So you've you've found this house and she came on
the bus I did.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I'm not going to give the address because I
just checked leading up to this and it's now on
Google Maps. It's blurred out standing, it's still standing. And
if you remember when when you see the outside, there's
this sort of some kind of industrial building next to
it that's still there. That's a well, it's still there.
I won't give the name, because again I want to
be respectful. People are still living there. And when I
you know, when I went there, I tell you I
so wanted to go around the house and see the
back and nope, this is someone's house. I'm going to
stand on the sidewalk, I'm going to take my pictures
and I'm going to go my way. But but that
neighborhood looks eerily the same. And this is what fifty five,
fifty six, seven years later, almost sixty years later, at
this point, right, Look, the trees are bigger, but that's it.
And it had been again either Ledgers parents or grandparents.
I think his grandmother was the last to live there,
so it was a family house. I don't know whether
he and his family lived there at all, but it
definitely as a Ledger family residence, which is which is
again how I can say undoubtedly he was somehow involved,
if not fully behind it. He definitely had a fair
stake in the in the making of the film.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that pretty much confirms it.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I would say beyond that, I mean, it's it's
kind of a rougher RUFFI I would say, it's not
necessarily in a good way. I don't know if that
even is a thing, but it's not a favorite of
mine other than what we've talked about the connection.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, some ruffis like there is an undercurrent
of you know, cartoonish sort of humor. This one is
just it's pretty straight black. I mean, there's not really
any humor.
Speaker 7: And there's no humor. It's just mean.
Speaker 3: I think it's just pretty mean.
Speaker 5: I think that's the thing. It's just mean, Like at
least there are certain points in certain ruffies where well,
I don't know, I've said on here before, I watched
these movies for the women, so like, typically, you know,
I like to see women get there, women will you know,
eventually come out in the end, okay, And in this one,
it's just like it's just so dark and brtle, and yeah,
it's just it's just not fun. It's not you know,
but Ruffy can be fun. It's just you know, there
are levels to Ruffi's well, so this is the bottom
of the barrel.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's kind of fun seeing Linda play
like one of.
Speaker 2: The boys, you know, one of the hoodlum girls, but.
Speaker 5: Do that and other stuff.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, and the first of her flesh. I don't
like the uddhas stuff, Like they treat her so bad
and she's not even like shot very well. Like that
scene when she's like they put like fake tears on
her face. I hope they're fake, where she's like getting
abused on the bus.
Speaker 5: It's just like, I don't enjoy it. And there's no
way in hell I rewatched it before this episode, because yeah,
why don't you do it after that?
Speaker 7: Right?
Speaker 8: No?
Speaker 5: I know I will only rewatch that under duress, and
I wasn't forced to do it for this episodes.
Speaker 3: So that tells you something. If Casey didn't.
Speaker 5: Rewatch it before, it's bottom of the barrel, it's bottom
of the barrel.
Speaker 7: It's going to be your clockwork orange film, then, is
what we're saying.
Speaker 5: Right, Yes, yes, yes, it will be. I will only
rewatch it because I have to go through the entire
catalog for a letterbox to review everything, and I'll just
I'll suffer through it at that point. But yeah, I
find this stuff about the production much more interesting. The
stuff that you're finding about where I was shot and
things like that, that's much more interesting than actually sitting
through the movie again, which I will. Yeah, I don't
want to do.
Speaker 7: And you know, if we want to get into it now,
I mean, it's it also allows us to talk a
little bit about Linda.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, can you tell us about Linda? I know
we've been dying to find out what is going on
with her.
Speaker 7: Yeah, so I didn't find out much more about Linda
than we knew. I do, by the way, have I mean,
I don't know, Ca, So do you want to Maybe
you're probably a better positioned than me to give the
twenty five cent version for folks that may not be
familiar with her. I don't know what they're doing listening
to you guys, they're not, but I would hope so.
Speaker 5: Well, yeah, because Linda Boyce's I think Linda Boyce was
on my she was on my Mount Rushmore of Exploitation.
Linda Boyce is kind of it's and it's interesting because
it's I love seeing Linda and Uda together because I
always considered them like the light and shadow of s
exploitation because you have the blonde and the brunette, and
they're always together and they really mirror each other really beautifully.
But no, yeah, Linda was I think like she was
a dancer first. I think she was a dancer on
a model before she became an actress. I'm not sure
if she was classically trained. You can't really tell that
she is. I think she just had natural talent. And yeah,
she was one of the go to girls and starting
from like sixty six, sixty seven up until like seventy one,
seventy probably seventy one actually, I think that's when she
bailed from the industry for a hardcore She was not
going to do hardcore.
Speaker 7: So smart for that. And she supposedly got married around
that time, right.
Speaker 5: And yes, yeah, apparently she married some rich guy, which
is what alex Man told me. And he was very
close to her and was able to confirm with me
some det tales about her life that were accurate, and
so I was like, Okay, well, this would make finding
her easier, and it absolutely is not.
Speaker 7: So it's very frustrating I only have one candidate for
that marriage, and it's like in seventy five, which is
too late kind of to fit that that timeline.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think you found the same person I did.
And I was like, could this be No, it's not. Yeah,
it didn't didn't work. The ages definitely didn't match for me.
Speaker 7: Yeah, And you know, and in sixty nine and into
the seventies, she started an agency, I guess, a casting agency,
which which we'd known about, right, that was I guess.
I think I'd known that it was called boys Stone,
but I guess that's not that well known, and it
was I'd always heard. She started with some guy that
didn't really last that long. And and then of course
she handed it off to two people that will show
up in a few minutes with the next film, Tally
Cochran and Patrick Wright Prick.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not that weird that they both that both
casting agents ended up working for Kurt Ledger.
Speaker 7: I'm arguing if you still had the phone number and
instead of Linda was telling at the other end.
Speaker 5: I mean, it was the same building. I think she
was the same apartment. She just had to go up
to that apartment.
Speaker 7: Yeah, she was in the apartment next door is what
I remember hearing. But yeah, yeah, yeah, but by the way,
I can tell you what apartment that was now because.
Speaker 5: He did really good research on that.
Speaker 7: Yeah, because I found actually found evidence of Boys Stone.
And again this was new to me, and may others
may have already gone down this road, but for me,
finding actual print evidence of Boys Stone productions is what
it was given. So and in October there was a
September twenty ninth article by Earl Wilson. Earl Wilson's going
to play a role in this later on as well.
Are you guys familiar with who Earl Wilson was?
Speaker 5: By the way, yeah, I think I have a book
by him. It's like a isn't he Wasn't it like
a gossip columnist?
Speaker 7: He was a gossip columnist. Yes, I have a book
by him.
Speaker 5: Where Actually the book I have of him, there's a
whole chapter about Jerry Miller. He air viewed Jerry Miller
when she was Yeah, that is not the one I have,
but I do need that one that got Yes, that's yes,
that's the one in your left is what is it?
The show business something? There's a whole Jerry Miller thing yes,
I buy that specifically one of the Jerry Miller stuff.
Speaker 7: Yeah, this book since I was probably fourteen, maybe earlier
thirteen or twelve, and he was one of the first
kind of visions of New York I had, and he
you know, if I have to go back and figure
out how I became who I am, it's probably that
book and Earl Wilson that helped in some part shape that.
So to find that he's the guy that announced the
boys Stone Agency was kind of a neat little thing
for me going back to my childhood. But it's going
to get better with Earl Wilson before we're done with
this thing. So in Svember he announces, and I mean
where my notes went. In September twenty ninth, actually sixty nine,
he announces cover girl Linda Boyce opened her own boys
Stone Model Agency, and there's a picture right next to
it of Linda and scantily clad of course. There then
October another announcement, not not as part of any column.
It looks like a paid announcement actually in a New
York paper. New Talent Agency arrives. Comic Jackie Mason will
serve as host tonight at a celebrity party to introduce
boy Stone Productions talks a little bit about that and
it mentions hal Stone. So now we've got mister Stone's
first name, Halstone, and actress model Linda Boyce. And it
gives the address and the apartment number. So and I'm
gonna it's you know, it was a camelot building where
this was, and we've known that. Uh, and now we
know that the boy Stone Agency was an apartment five
E of the agency.
Speaker 3: Okay, so is this the is this the apartment where
those photos were taken?
Speaker 6: That?
Speaker 7: It is? Yes, very apartment where you know we've we've
got In fact, I did an article on my blog
a couple articles about it. There's a zebra print wall
that's very very noticeable. So there's a picture a set
of Laura Cannon getting shot there. Linda herself had many
spreads that were shot there. Return of the Secret Society
has scenes that were shot in that apartment because you
can see that. And I'd also understand a lot of
other films used it as a location as well. So
apartment five E is a for us anyway, a very historical.
Speaker 3: Uh Mecca exploitation Mecca.
Speaker 6: Wow.
Speaker 7: And of course then That means that Tally and Patrick
were in the apartment next door. I don't know if
that was four five D or five C or whatever
the other one would be, but it was by the way.
I also found another familiar name of a guy that
lived in the building. I don't think he was on
the same floor. But when I was trying to track
some of this information down, I discovered that C. Davis
Smith lived in the building as well.
Speaker 5: Oh really, really, oh good old Chuck lived there.
Speaker 7: I had no idea. Wow, it's not up for rent
or for sale, but if you guys are interested in
the apartment has appraised at little over one million dollars
right now.
Speaker 5: So yes, yes, I've looked. Because I've looked at the rent,
I think the cheapest rent in there. I forget how
much it is. It's Marksman's than what I'm paying here,
because I was considering moving in there for fanboy reasons.
But no chance in hell, No chance in hell.
Speaker 1: We are, quite frankly, a lesbian organization dedicated to the proposition.
Speaker 6: That women are superior beings.
Speaker 3: Men have no place in our lives, not in our
sex lives.
Speaker 6: Anyway.
Speaker 3: I want to ask you about hal Stone, but first,
I want to ask you, Sean, who do you think
Peter Woodcock is.
Speaker 7: I have no idea.
Speaker 3: That's what everybody says. Nobody wants to even guess it's
not Roberta.
Speaker 5: And that's all I can say. I haven't looked into
it further because I don't like those films.
Speaker 7: So it's a great name, but I have no idea
who who it's behind.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, but the fact that Linda is somehow connected
to whoever made those films. Clearly it's shot, you know,
parts of it are shot at her apartment. I think
we can sort of like narrow the field down a
little bit.
Speaker 5: Maybe, I mean no, I mean no, I don't think
necessarily you can. As we're hearing just hearing about Kurt
Ledger and the fact that he was not in film
just kind of got into film for some random reason
and then got out a couple of years later. That
I think that Peter Wilcock is probably an example of that.
It's somebody was like, I want to make something quick,
and then Linda Boyce was a go to casting person.
She had an apartment, you know. I think that's why
I should probably open that casting agency. She was a
go to person. I think very helpful for producers in
situations like that. So naturally she wanted to get involved
with more helping with productions.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 7: Smart, make some money with it too, right, Yeah exactly, Yeah.
Speaker 5: Very smart girl.
Speaker 3: So tell us about the other half of this.
Speaker 7: Helstone is a Stone. Yeah, So now I had a name,
and that was enough to put me on a frenzied
search for who how Stone was. And it's it's unfortunately
a not uncommon name, especially for men born in that
time period. Hall is sort of short for Harold, so
Harold was more and more used back in the thirties
and forties when he would have been born, I would expect.
So there are a number of candidates. The first that
I found was and the most mind blowing if it
had been the right one, was a Holstone that was
a child actor back in the thirties and was the
first jug Head voice of Jughead on the Archie Comics
radio program back in the fifties, and he stayed in
acting and he did a bunch of stuff. He passed
away thinking two thousand and nine, but it became clear
fairly quickly that that wasn't the right house Stone. The
next guy was a lot closer. I thought he was
a guy that had been a he came out of
World War Two and became a comedian, and he'd created
this sort of sad sack Beatle Bailey, sort of pre
Gomer Pile character that he would do stand up as,
and it was very popular. He cut a few albums
comedy albums as this guy back in the late forties,
but by the mid fifties that you know, kind of
gotten old and stale, and he never didn't have new materials,
so he started doing whatever. So I'm thinking this sounds
kind of like the guy and he I found out
this guy died and I think seventy four seventy five.
By that time, he was doing stand up on cruise
ships and he died on the Queen Mary, Queen Elizabeth
Quey and the Queen Qwe two, I think in the Bahamas.
So he died while he was, you know, on a
booking in the Bahamas. And the only reason I bring
this up is the ship. I guess the captain called
his wife up in New York and said, Hey, I'm
sorry your husband has died. Where would you like us
to send the body? And she said, oh, well, you
know hal always wanted to be buried at sea, So
just take care of it.
Speaker 3: Saves there some money.
Speaker 7: As fun as that would have been, that's not our house.
So then I started circling around this character that was
that was really an LA character named Helstone. And the
more I found, well, actually, let me back up here.
I skipped a little bit here. I was looking in
the newspapers in New York for Helstone, trying to find
mentions of this guy. And I found a handful, all
of them in Earl Wilson articles or columns. And there's
one in which he's talking about this he names Helstone,
and he says he's I got it written down here.
A goateeed and big bellied man. He was an agent
of exclusively nudes, he said. And he was always bugging
Earl to, you know, interview some of his girls. And
I'm like, this has to be our guy, right, and
and he said, well, said, you know, to get him
out of my office. One day I just said, all right,
how send me over a nude receptionist. And two days later,
a blonde Scandinavian looking girl walks in, takes off her
overcoach completely nude, sits down, starts typing, and you know,
he's in shock. His real receptionist is in shock, his
assistant is in shock. Finally he walks over and says, man,
what are you? What are you? What are you doing?
She's like, oh, how send me over? He said you
wanted a nude typist. He's like, oh, okay, that's how funny, funny,
get get at it. He puts the jacket over, shoes
her away. But he looks at the paper she'd been typing.
There was just one word repeated over and over again
on the sheet of paper, and it's something Francy tells
her mother at the beginning of the film, the word
fuck she typed on on the thing. And I'm reading that,
and I'm thinking, I know this story. I've read this story.
That story was in the book that how Earl Wilson
had written that I got when I was, you know,
a kid. Basically wow. So I'm basically known about how
Stone for fifty years almost now. But the story gets
better because later on and Earl Wilson these books are
just basically rehashes of his articles, and he would rehash
his articles and his articles as well. So a couple
years later I found another mention of this story and
of how Stone. But it's the rest of the story
we find out who that blonde was. So he said,
I got a phone call from a lady that has
just you know, in the news right now as part
of this big scandal with prostitution and big names and
so forth. And she says, mister Wilson, I'd like to
you to write my story for me. He's like, well,
thank you very much. But why why did you choose me?
And she said, well, because we know each other. He's
like we do. He's like, yes, you remember a few
years ago that how Wilson sent me over to be
your receptionist. He's like, oh, okay, now I obviously remember
who you were. Well, that lady was Xavier Hollander.
Speaker 3: Oh, the Happy Hooker.
Speaker 6: Wow.
Speaker 5: Okay.
Speaker 7: So at one point how Stone was the agent for
the Happy Hooker, which.
Speaker 3: Opens, Yeah, well, then I want to think that he
made a lot of money because her story was everywhere
and her books were everywhere.
Speaker 7: Yes, I haven't had to go and look at her
books though, to see if he's actually mentioned. I haven't
had a chance to try one to do that. But
so so I'm convinced at this point. This is the
this is the right guy. I mean everything, all of
the boxes absolutely. So now I got to find where
he went and where he came from. So let's talk
a little bit about where he came from. I haven't
found an awful lot. But he did work for Joe Franklin.
He was a booker and a talent scout for Joe Franklin.
That's that is clear. And in fact, Joe mentions that
Franklin mentions him in at least one of his books
that he wrote, speaks very highly of Halstone, said he
trust him implicitly. And he turns out Stone was the
only booker. He was the main booker, it seems like,
and he's the only one that was actually paid a salary.
All the other bookers, guys, I'm sure they were were
paid in like tickets or other French benefits. So he
was the only one that actually made money working for
Joe Franklin. And the story is that one of the
people that Halstone discovered, and I say that with their
quotes is Richard Pryor. He supposed to discovered him down
in the village and booked him on Joe Franklin's show.
And that was his first you know on air thing. Now,
I've gone through several of Richard Pryor's biographies, his autobiography,
and there's no mention of Joe Franklin being on Joe
Franklin a Helstone. There's no hint of a Houstone character.
So it's a good story. It may be true. There's
not a lot of evidence that doesn't come from Hal
or Joe to back that up, though. Interesting So before
that's before the early sixties, there's really nothing I found
on Helstone except from him where he later on tells
that his father was a stunt pilot, his mother was
a wingwalker, they both died. I don't know whether it
was stunt related or not, and he grew up in
an orphanage. That's his version of his early life. I've
not found any stunt walker or stunt pilot that fits
this criteria. I have looked, but there's still a lot
more ground to cover there. So I get the feelings
Halstone might not have been his real name, but I'm
not sure. Again, Helstone was not an uncommon combination there.
So that's where he came from. You guys find out
where he went. Okay, Yeah, so in the early seventies,
he started going to LA. I don't know if he
was by coastal or if he was exclusively in LA
in the early seventies. I do know that by eighty
one he was on the West coast full time, and
that's where he stayed for the rest of his life.
And he was still an agent, he was still booking acts.
He was still now I don't know, one act that
I know from eighty one was a Russian hypnotist, just
because they got written up right. But beyond that, I'm
not sure what he was still doing nudes. I don't
know if he was doing actresses, actors, or just crazy acts,
but it was clear he was still doing something in
the entertainment, booking and promotion industry. In the eighties, though,
his story starts picking up steam. He gets involved with
Jackie Stallone, Sylvester Stallone's money and Foxy the post glow
gorgeous lady of wrestling post career when she was doing
the Foxy boxing, and he was basically her partner in
those businesses and all of those shows and videos and
tours that would do all the Foxy boxing. And there's
a commercials with him, you know, saying we got it
all the way from g Rated for the family, all
the weight or whatever you want, you know, that that
sort of stuff, and he was also involved. If you
guys remember Rocky five, there was a lawsuit against Jackie
and hal Stone from a guy that was an old
boxer and had given them, the two of them a
script based on his life to what to look at,
and his his contention was Rocky five was in large
part based on that script and he got no credit
or no money for that, so he sued him and
I think he won, actually maybe was settled out a
quarter or something there. But so hal Stone was very
you know if you will, link to Jackie stallone during
that period, which is interesting because this is where Greg
Jaber comes back in believe it or not. He Greg
was very involved with jack Descent. Jack Descent who had
actually worked with Jackie during this time on her what
is it, the uh, the Dean Warwick type stuff psychic.
Speaker 5: Stone psychics, Yes, psychic psyching, Friends Network or whatever you A.
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, So that was Jackie's other sort of thing
she was doing. So jack was behind that with Jackie
and Greg has like all of the master tapes for that.
I believe there so it's interesting how these things sort
of start. So if Greg was still alive, I can
he would have he would have had a cow whenever
I found out that Helstone and Jackie Stallone were you know,
were together there. So Halstone in the nineties was still around.
He was a regular at the Rainbow Bar and Grill
on Sunset Strip. There's a plaque with his name on
it at the bar claiming he's the Emperor of the Rainbow.
He was a self promoter. He went on a I
don't know the name of the show, but it's sort
of like a cross between Oprah and Jerry Springer. It
was kind of, I think an LA show, and it
was hot women who like fat guys. It was kind
of the title and so and the hot women were
obviously stripper types, uh, and you know, one of them
was Halstone's girlfriend. And then the twist was when another
woman out and claims she was also his girlfriend, and
you know, fight at jus and all that sort of stuff.
So he was he was still doing stuff. He was
in a penthouse in the not long before he passed away.
They and noted that he was a regular at the
Bunny Ranch in Nevada, but but he only went because
he liked the atmosphere. He didn't go for the you know,
just the atmosphere like taking out. And he passed away
in twenty nineteen, so we just missed him yet again,
maybe not just from this seven years ago.
Speaker 3: But wow, well that's a full life for Hal Stone.
I wonder if he would he ever remember Linda Boyce
after what he would do?
Speaker 5: Not How would you not remember Linda Boyce?
Speaker 3: Come on now, her hair is amazing?
Speaker 7: How do you how do you forget that he like
the type of guy that would remember every woman he
ever saw? Yes?
Speaker 5: Yes, well, actually, it's interesting that the Earl Wilson connection
also just makes me remember the fact that Harold that
how wanted him to, you know, do stuff on his women.
That whole thing on Jerry Miller is in that book,
and Jerry Miller is in one of the Peter Woodcock
movies with Linda Boyce. So I feel like Jerry Miller
then must have been when she wasn't a Warhol girl.
Must have been one of Linda and Hal's girls when
she was doing sexploitation stuff.
Speaker 7: That makes perfect sense. Yeah, By the way, I did
find one other interesting thing on Hell he did get married, supposedly,
and this was in an Earl Wilson column. He got
married in nineteen seventy to this actress model named Ingrid Roland.
Does that name ring doesn't mean Ingrid?
Speaker 6: Does?
Speaker 5: There was a blo. No, that's Ingrid Swenson. I'm thinking
of who was an.
Speaker 7: Another only one other mention of an Ingrid Roland, and
that was two months before that, yet again in an
Earl Wilson column where she and Alpha Blair were playing
miniature ping pong at some game salon in the seventies
west seventies. So Alpha Blair is kind of a non name.
I don't know if it rings any bells for you guys,
but she's still around and I reached out to her
to say, hey, do you remember someone named Ingrid Roland.
She hasn't got back to me, so I don't know
if she will, but I have got that that thread
out there to see, hey, did you remember this person?
And if so, probably not if she only played ping
pong once, you know, fifty five years ago, right, But.
Speaker 5: It sounds like that what might have been a gig
that she might have been on once again, represented by
that agency, so she might still even remember that agency.
Even if she wasn't with him that long, she might
still remember something exactly. Yeah, you definitely, yeah, you're yeah,
you're you always have that in mind, Sean, You're good
like that, Like every single thread it could potentially lead
somewhere interesting.
Speaker 7: Yeah, and that's why I never get anything done.
Speaker 8: What were you doing?
Speaker 5: Oh damn, gonna like one of the willows?
Speaker 8: What were you doing?
Speaker 6: Nothing?
Speaker 3: I was saying, well, so, what's the connection to Linda Boyce?
Did you find out anything about how they met?
Speaker 6: No?
Speaker 7: No, I mean you you you've basically got my full
story on how will he help hel Stone? Rather right
now there's still yeah again there there's still a ton
of questions. This raises h but but I think you know,
we've got we've got some traction, uh and uh, we'll
see what we can find and you know, getting this
out there to the masses, you know, the dozen are
so folks like us that are that are gonna. I
know that the guys, I know what you're doing. You're
already on your phones looking for this stuff. So uh,
you know, let us know what you find. Please.
Speaker 3: But that's the curious part to me. Yeah, it's like
how Linda got involved with this character and what their
partnership was, you know, in terms of who did what
in this in this company that they are apparently joint
owners of.
Speaker 7: I mean that's how it seems like.
Speaker 5: I mean, if our name was first too, I like
that too, boy Stone, Yeah.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean she she he could have been her agent, right,
and I mean who who knows how they got together?
If I had to guess what the breakup, you know
what the sort of who did what was? She probably
got all the talent and he probably got all the jobs, right. Yeah,
that's kind of what makes the most sin obviously, Yeah
does Yeah.
Speaker 5: Well, it sounds like a Bunny Yeger situation possibly where
she people would trust women models and strippers, and people
in the city would trust Linda because she knows the business.
She also knows what the money you could get, what
producers are looking for, what stuff you don't have to
do if you're not comfortable, like I think that's I
think she's It's good to have a woman working as
an Asian in this industry in New York, especially New York.
Speaker 7: Especially when you look and act like Helstone and there's
like I said, there's videos I'll send you guys links.
You can put him in the show notes. Someone did.
Someone from the Rainbow Grill did a memorial video of him,
and basically all it is is the he was on
a news show about his overweight eating what he loved
to do. He's not going to stop. There was the
from the h that show with the girlfriends that I
told you about. I mean, there's a few other things
from the wrestling and so they just basically they did
no editing. They just put them together. But that's great
because it's out there and it saves me from having
it up. So someone did that, and I actually it's
on vinmo So Vimeo. So I I tried to contact them,
say hey, I'd like to know more about what you know.
Did you obviously knew how I'd like to talk to you.
I haven't got anything back from them yet either, but
I'll share the video with you, guys, and you can
you can understand, Casey, why what you just said is
even so much more important with a guy like him.
Speaker 5: Yes, well, and then it makes me wonder we know this.
The general consensus is that Linda married. Is there who
married someone wealthy or someone she'd been in a relationship
with and left the business to Tally Now didn't marry Linda?
Speaker 7: Did he?
Speaker 5: Did you find any evidence that he married someone named
Linda around the time?
Speaker 7: No, I found any evidence. There is a picture of
Ingrid who again it says he did, but it's one
of you know, it's not paper dot com and it's
so just you know, you can't know, but it's just
an obvious thought, right, But I just don't feel like
I just don't. I mean I would, I would honestly
hate if that's the case, for Linda's sake.
Speaker 5: Would Linda's smart? Linda's smarter than that. I feel like, Yeah,
I feel like she's smarter than that, someone who is
able to go into this into this kind of work
while still being an actress that's not done by idiots,
Like she knew what she was doing. She's she's too
smart for that.
Speaker 7: Yeah. Oh, and maybe I should walk back a little bit.
Unless it was true love, I mean, there is that, right, But.
Speaker 5: But again, Gloria Leonard end up with Bobby Hollander for
some reason, right, and she's way smarter than that too.
I don't know why she was with him, and even
her daughter doesn't know why she was with Yeah, I
don't know love love, the heart wants, but the heart
wants and weird scenarios, you know.
Speaker 3: Well, that's a tangent around she came on the bus.
Should we talk about Francis anything else?
Speaker 7: Just you know, just sort of the release history, right,
you know, the earliest I found was April sixty nine,
and the latest I found was June seventy five in Texas. Yeah, Jesus,
And actually that Texas theater is also the last I
found for Francie when we get to that. So it's
interesting these two really was the true final screening for
both of them. But it's interesting that at least as
far as I've found those they both ended at the
same the same and it's in McCallum, Texas, wherever the
hell that is. So here's they both might have had
a similar ending.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's so weird. Black and white movies playing as
latest seventy five is wild.
Speaker 7: Well, Francie was seventy seven when when when that played.
Speaker 5: It went even later. That's even crazier.
Speaker 7: Wow, the film and the film it was it was
the bottom of the ticket. The top of the ticket
was You'll love this sweet punk.
Speaker 5: Can Oh what, Oh my god, that's crazy. That's really crazy. Wow,
I don't Yeah, it's looking at some of these bills
when we do these release histories and stuff, it really
is mind boggling what some theater people are thinking and
what the audiences must have thought.
Speaker 7: Just if there's C. J.
Speaker 5: Lang deep throating John Holmes, and then at a certain
amount of time later Alisa Fontaine coming of age with
the guy writing songs about her very different movies.
Speaker 3: And I also wonder like if audience members were really
aware of the distinction, like, Okay, this is a hardcore movie,
this is a softcore movie. I don't think they I
don't know if they really were. They're just kind of
sitting through it, like, eh, it's all sex.
Speaker 5: I mean, I think they might have felt hoodwinked by
seventy seven.
Speaker 3: By seventy seven, yeah, maybe hoodwinked.
Speaker 7: Or it could have been the film to you clear
out the theater, or or or Also we have to
remember that a lot of times no one was watching
the movies.
Speaker 3: On the screens exactly.
Speaker 5: Keep forgetting that because I'm not the target audience, because
that's correct, because I wouldn't be doing that right exactly,
I'd be watching very diligently the screen.
Speaker 3: Especially if it's a drive in then yeah, like stuff
that's going on.
Speaker 1: I was a little older then, but still too young
to see what was going to happen that night.
Speaker 3: Francis Friday.
Speaker 7: Yeah, let's get to the main thing now that we've
spent an hour talking.
Speaker 5: I know, well, actually I wanted to say I had
never seen this. I had bought the DVDR and I'd
never watched it, and so I was like, this is perfect,
I can find it. There aren't that many movies that
we've done on the podcast so far that I have
been first time watches for me. So I watched it
this morning and I was just like, first of Alisa Fonteine,
I mean, I love her anyway, really good in this,
And yeah, I really liked it. I'm so glad you
picked it because it finally gave me the intentive to
finally watch it. Yeah, I really liked it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know. I in the intro there I kind
of compared it to Secret Places. I think there is
a similar feeling there. There's sort of a melancholy there.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 3: I also mentioned like, is this a dark comedy? I
don't know, what do you think Casey or Sean I
think it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, what do you think, Sean?
Speaker 7: I think that there's an attempts at dark humor. I
haven't thought of it as a dark comedy, but I
can see I can see where you're coming from on that.
It's probably worth a rewatch to to get that, because
I haven't. I didn't rewatch it all the way through
leading up to this. I rewatched probably all of it
three or four times, but not as a sit down,
you know. I had to dissect certain scenes and so forth.
So it is time for me to go back and
give it an actual run through.
Speaker 3: Yeah, especially all the stuff with her mother at the beginning.
It's just so over the top with her injury and
her in the wheelchair falling down the stairs.
Speaker 5: That actress, though, is so well cast, because initially I
thought from from a from a distance, from the camera distance,
I thought it was Alicia Fontaine, just with her hair
up in a different style. Very well cast, who looks
like she could be her mother, which does not happen
in these films. You don't really have that kind of
close family casting. Yeah, we still knew who she was either, right, Sean,
Like that most of the cast on this is kind
of a mystery.
Speaker 7: Yeah, we don't. I have one of these sort of
I think fake memories that three four years ago I
had identified her. It's nowhere in my notes, though, I
haven't been able to find anything on it, so I
think I'm misremembering that. I hope i am, because if
I lost that information, I'm never going to forgive myself.
But yeah, she's She's one of the many unknowns that
are in this film. I did identify the father, which
we'll get to.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Great, Well give us a quick overview then, Sean, do
you want to do that of the plot of Franci's Friday.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, you know, it's it sounds like it's
all going to happen on one day, which I don't
think it does. You know, it's a clever name that
does multiple Fridays. Yeah. So Francie is a you know,
coming of age girl that's going through the whole sexual thing.
She's got an overbearing mother. When she was young, she
sort of saw her mother basically having an orgy when
her father was out of town on one of what
she had multiple times. It seems like every time he
left town she would have these same guys over and
on one of those, her mother, you know, they tripped
and she fell and she basically, you know, hurt herself
to where she was in a wheelchair the rest of
her life and eventually I and honestly it's been a
few years, so Gentry helped me out on this. Does
the mother commit suicide or or was.
Speaker 6: That an Yeah?
Speaker 3: She was reaching, really, she's reaching. She reaching down to
grab this cigarette lighter and then she fell down the stairs.
I thought in her I thought she did it.
Speaker 5: I thought she defiantly did it. That is what I recall.
I just watched it this morning. I thought she did
it deliberately. She kills the dog first. Yeah, she kills
the dog first.
Speaker 7: Yeah, maybe that's why I was thinking it was a suicide, right.
Speaker 3: That scene is awkward though, yeah, because, yeah, she finds
her mom at the bottom of the stairs. But then
she sees that there's smoke coming out of the garage
and she goes in there, but her mom's not in
the garage, Like that would have been the suicide. If
you're going to commit suicide, why don't she just you know,
huff some fumes in the garage. But no, it's the
dog that she kills. In the garage.
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's a confusing that her father had already died.
I guess I skipped over that right alcoholic. Yeah, and
so Francis left on her own. I guess she's still
like a teenager supposedly at that point that she's young anyway, right,
And well, I guess before her mother dies, she she's
also had this whole you know, gang bang with some
boys at the airport and gotten in trouble. And she
has that scene that she allude to gentry at the
beginning of the of the show, with her talking about
sex and knowing people and so forth, and.
Speaker 5: That is a really good line.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 7: Yeah. And along the way she meets and I forget
his character's name, but she meets Kenny Chandler. He's the
guy that played the main character who's kind of a musician, uh,
kind of you know, one of you know, a regular
sort of late sixties kind of guy, and he definitely
has the hots for her, pursues her, finally, you know,
gets with her. When then we find out that he's
also living with a woman another person who immediately knows
what he's done. And she has that one scene that's
Holly Conover has that one scene and she's gone scene.
Yeah it is, uh, and and I've tracked her down. Uh,
she she was, she's she is from Florida. She's still
down here. She was a beauty pageant queen type for
one of the counties in south west Florida. Her father
was a county commissioner, so one of these types. So
kind of that scene is a little bit interesting that
someone like that would, would you know, just go topless,
just so so freely young. She was in a couple
other films later in the seventies, but since since you know,
since I guess the late seventies, it looks like she's
been heavily in the real estate market in Florida and
very successful at it. So so yeah, so so she
leaves the Kenny and the rest of the film is
really about Francy and Kenny sort of having this relationship.
Francie is very sexual, very sexual. She has her alliances.
They have pool parties, they have sex parties. It seems
like by the way that one scene where the couple
go to the bedroom and basically get it on and
the people are walking by the hallway looking in on them,
and Alicia and Kenny or one of them. I get
the impression that whoever those two actors and actresses were
in that bedroom scene didn't get the memo that this
was soft core.
Speaker 5: Yes, I thought the exact same thing. I said, Okay,
this they had to edit around this, I think, yeah,
yeah it is. It is very graphic.
Speaker 7: Yes, there there's there's definitely some Yeah, there's some motions
that that are like, okay that that wasn't tucked away.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not the like humping the leg type of softcore. Yeah, no,
you can tell.
Speaker 5: It's not like the rest of the movie. The rest
of the movie isn't like that. So it's just kind
of like, oh, this dope goes into X territory. I
could see this getting an R otherwise Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 7: Yeah, uh and and uh and it kind of ends
on I guess you use the word melancholy a melancholy note.
I mean, it's like just sort of you know, it
ends basically.
Speaker 3: I mean it's a really sweet ending, you know, where
they're having that you know, just like a very frank
conversation about their relationship together, like do we want to
have an open relationship? Which they were kind of like
playing around with for a while, and you know, yeah,
it's it's a really sweet movie. I really liked it.
Speaker 5: That long shot on the fireplace, Yeah, that song is
really good. Everyone reminded me of like the end of
a war long movie where it's just like, okay, you
have to you have to kind of yeah, you have
to work through this, while what we just experienced before
you see the end.
Speaker 7: Yeah, so all of that guitar, the guitar music was Kenny.
Speaker 3: I was going to ask if that was really and
that's really him singing right? It is because because you
sent us a clip of Kenny singing right, that was
also Kenny.
Speaker 7: Right, Yeah, that's definitely Kenny. Yeah, so talk about him
a little.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's okay, absolutely, Yeah, he's great.
Speaker 7: Yeah. So so I got in contact with him and
we talked a few weeks ago for over two hours.
And he's eighty five I think now, but still very
much around, still very active. He lives in Nevada now,
still still writing recording, he's doing videos now, the two
of these guys, one of them. Maybe we can put
some of those in the notes to go. So he
has an incredible life story and I'm only going to
scratch the surface today on that. But he was born
in the thirties in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. By the time he
was thirteen, he discovered he liked singing. He had a
great voice, he was told, so he started singing that
early in school stuff. In high school he was a
basketball star, track star, and he had groups. He got
into singing groups. He had a threesome that when they
graduated high school, got a recording contract in Philadelphia. So
right out of high school he was recording with these
guys last too long, though they did record some songs
that you can find out there. They did tour, but
the other two guys, one of them got married, the
other one joined the army, I think, And so Kenny
headed to New York. And he wasn't born Kenny Chandler.
He was born Kenny Bolonaise. But when he got to
New York and he got signed there, that's where Chandler
he took the name Kenny Chandler. She still goes by today.
And all through the sixties he was writing songs, he
was recording, he was touring. In the mid sixties, he
lost his voice and Burt Bacharak, actually the famous music guy,
was the guy that gave him got him in contact
with Marlena Dietrich's Doctor of all People, and that guy
helped him and he wound up. After about a year,
he got his voice back and continued picked up where
he left off recording and so forth. There he toured
with everybody. I mean, Freddy Cannon, Bobby Vinton, Dion Warwick,
another name that he toured with. And this is my
my daughter's favorite, one of one of her favorite guys.
And he just passed away yesterday. Actually, Neil saidakh uh,
And so I said, I got. I got to ask
Kenny about Neil Neil Sadaka for my daughter, and I
told him one of my daughters. He's like, ah, Neil,
I didn't like him.
Speaker 3: I don't tell you.
Speaker 7: That's exactly what I said. I think maybe I won't
tell him. He said they did not get along. He
did not think highly of Neil Sadak at all. In fact,
I think he said he nearly came to blows with
him at well at least one time.
Speaker 5: So wow, but uh, kind of a diva?
Speaker 3: What kind of music was he playing with these on
these tours? Is he solo? Is he with a full band?
Speaker 7: It was? It was so, I mean, there's there's there's backing,
of course, but it's primarily him, and then you have
a backing band, I think, and you know it's it's
you can follow his sort of style through the early sixties,
which was really doo wop, early rock and roll, you know,
and then then it gets more it follows the trends,
I would say. Throughout the sixties he was also writing
jingles for commercials. You started that in the sixties he
got really involved with CBS. He was actually on the
soap opera called Edge of Night for a time and
he got to know one of the big wigs at
CBS through that, through the Edge of a Night, I believe, engagement,
and he was writing jingles for CBS. And in seventy four,
seventy three, seventy four I think was the first year
he actually wrote the promo jingle for the entire network. Now,
back in the seventies, especially every year, it would be
a big thing where they would announce their fall lineup
and they would you know, really promote themselves as the network. Right,
So he came up with the tagline and he came
up with the theme song for CBS for that entire season.
The next year, the same guy's like, hey, Kenny, I
want you to do it again. Give me five, give
me five options, and I'll choose one. So he gives
them five, he chooses one, and the guy's like, Okay, Kenny,
this time you're going to be in these So and
I've not And for all the other years I found stuff.
For this year, I've not really found a good video
of him. But in seventy four seventy five, for that season,
he again wrote the entire campaign, wrote the music, recorded
the music, and was in the promos as a troubadour
comes agin. It was kind of the idea they were
going for. And and he won an award, him and
him and the guy that did it with won a
major advertising award or whatever for that year. You know,
he's been in some movies, and he was in Tammy
and the t Rex, which I know you put in
the show notes there. I asked him about that. I
asked him if he remembered Buck Flowers, who was also Oh, yes,
one of our smunty favorites.
Speaker 6: Guys.
Speaker 7: I love him, and he like, I don I don't
think so. Then he's like, was he kind of a
goofy guy? I'm like, yeah, that that would have been
That would have been Buck Flowers.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I never talked to him anything, but I remember
it being kind of a goofy guy.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I don't think they had any scenes together,
so I don't think I remembered him.
Speaker 7: But yeah, but he apparently so he, like I said,
he's still around. He's done voiceover work fairly recently for
cartoons and so forth, some American versions of some anime stuff. Look,
I'm only scratching the surface. Honestly, we could do two
hours like I did with him. We could do four
hours on this guy. There's a book to be written
about this guy. I'm not even telling you the Sidney
Portier connection or anything like that.
Speaker 3: Okay, Well, so clearly music's a big part of his
life and it was. Then is that part of the
reason you think he got cast in.
Speaker 7: This it's he really wanted to be an actor. And
I guess I will go into the Sidney Poitier thing
a little because it is pertinent to that he Sydney
Portier was always one of his favorite actors, and he's
when he was living in New York, he would have
lunch at this restaurant across from Carnegie hall a lot,
and he got to know the waitresses there and they
got to talking about Sidney Poitier one day and they said, hey,
you know he comes in here sometimes, and Kenny's not.
Ten minutes later he came in there and sat down
and they got to talking and they got to be
kind of friendly and would see each other a little
bit around town after that, and Sydney gave him got
him in contact with his own is Sidney Poitier's acting coach.
So this is when Canny really wanted to try to
try his handed acting. So a year later, he's walking
down the street somewhere in New York and he sees
Poitier walking and he hadn't seen him in a while,
and he's like, hey, how you doing And he's like, hey,
you still remember me. He's like, Sydney, it's only been
a year. It's important phrase for a minute here, and
he's like, so, what have you been doing the last
Year's like, well, I'm still with your acting coach. And
Puddy said, well, if you're it's a year in and
you're still with him, you must have something. So so
that kind of was a good I mean, Sidney Poitier,
come on you telling you you must talk. Thirty years later,
he's living in la He's going to dinner one night,
goes into the restaurant and Poitier is sitting there and
their eyes neat. He points, Pitier points at him, goes over.
They hug each other and say, hey, Sydney, it's only
been thirty years, you know. After that, so he was
trying his hand at acting already before this, he had
an agent. Actually he said he had four or five agents,
kind of you know, he would take whatever would come along,
so he didn't wasn't exclusive to one agent. And this
is where it gets a little fuzzy on what happened when.
And I didn't have time to go back and get
clarity from him before we started the day. But either
his agent either he was already with Alisha before the movie,
but more likely he met Alisha through the movie, and
they might have shared the same agent. That's kind of
what it sounds like, because I'm pretty it's pretty clear
that they probably met in this agent's office. And he said,
agent is just floored whenever he saw her the first time, right,
And so the agent called him up and said, hey,
this guy from New Jersey, Kurt he said, this is
what Kenny said. He's like, this guy from New Jersey's
name's Curtis. Ledger called me up and says, can you
send me some headshots of a man and a woman
for this film I want to make? Told him what
kind of film it was, so he sent, among others,
Kenny and Alisha's over and he said, Curtis, you know,
said that when he saw Alisha, he just fell in love,
like there was no question she was not going to
be the one he chose. Kenny he liked, but he
wanted to meet him, so they went out to New Jersey,
met Leger the first time. Ledger liked what he looked
like in person, signed him up. So that's how they
got involved again. I'm the version I tend to think
is more accurate. Is they met that way? They got
to know each other on the film, and he said
she was battie. She was really kind of all over
the place, sort of you know, kind of crazy ish,
not crazy, but crazy ish, if you will. And he
kind of pushed through that when he got to know
her and kind of found the real her, and they
eventually fell in love and they after the film was over,
he said he went to her apartment in New York
and it was a one room junk apartment, is the
way he described it. He was like, how can you
live He's cluster foedick. He couldn't stay in there. So
she found up moving in with him, and they were
together for a few years, living together in his apartment
up in the eighties on Second Avenue in the eighties
for a few years. Now, take a little bit of
an aside here. That apartment that was his up all
on Second Avenue and I think eighty six. The corner
I think it's that's where it's at was used for
a film around that time while they were living there,
The Prisoner of Second Avenue.
Speaker 5: Oh my god, you're kidding. I love that movie.
Speaker 7: Oh my god.
Speaker 5: Really wow, that's a great apartment.
Speaker 7: So they lived together for a few years. But you know,
she was she was, like he said, he was just
still kind of crazy. He said, I got I got
to know her crazy brothers and her mother. She was
really crazy, I think was the quote I have from that.
But he's saying this in a good way, right, and
and sort of they were crazy, but you know, and
finally they you know, I'm not going to get it.
He gave me a lot of details. I'm not going
to get into those on air here, but they did
eventually break up and she moved out. She one story
I forgot to tell while they were together, and he
used to use this as an illustration of how giving
she was, how kind and giving she was, even though
she was crazy, she was still a very very you know,
good person, if you if you will. They were walking
down the street and she had this bracelet on and
they ran into someone that she kind of sort of knew,
and they got to talking and the lady said, hey,
I really love your bracelet, and Alicia just took it
off and give it to her like it was, you know,
a good gift there. And I got to think it
and I did reach back out to him on this.
I said, you know, there's a story about Alicia that
she had really she had gotten a diamond bracelet where
several thousand dollars from the Prince of Kuwait. This is
one of those Earl Wilson sort of type, you know place,
and is there any chance that that could have been
that bracelet, because that, you know, that could explain why
she Also she's like, well, here, you can have it.
Because you know, she didn't actually earn it, if you
I mean, she shouldn't buy it or anything. He's like,
you know, I've heard that story, but I can't tell
you whether it was that bracelet or not, So I can't.
I like to think it was, though. Yeah. Yeah, So
they broke up. He ran into her a few years
later in New York. They had a cordial conversation. Then
several years later, after he was in LA they got
put back together. I'm going to put it that way.
It did not end well that time at all, very
kind of nasty, and he hasn't talked or seen or
heard about her since then. So unfortunately that story did
not have a happy ending for the two of them.
But but he's you know, he's married to someone now
and they he does have a happy well not ending,
but he has a happy to this point, I'll put
it that way.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Oh that's so basically, so it sounds
like they were dating when she was like in Teenage
Tramp and her other stuff that she was in around
that time, because that would have been early seventies.
Speaker 7: Yeah, it would have to be. Yeah, so so it
would be at least from seventy one for Francy, and
it sounded like a few years so probably seventy four.
I'm thinking seventy five here.
Speaker 5: Okay, interesting, that's very interesting. I mean that definitely. It's
something that I think of when I watch. I'm like
learning that it will make me think about other things
about her. When I'm watching those.
Speaker 3: Films, I think you can see, yeah, you can see
a little of the craziness come through, and like French Quarter, Yeah,
she's a little off kilter in that certain scenes.
Speaker 7: It's interesting those on those on French Quarter especially it's
in the late sixties leading into Francy. You see her
showing up in these columns, you know, obvious placements by
her agent, most likely maybe Hal and Linda. I don't
know at that point, but it's the Earl's one of
the guys that's doing it. So and then she has Fancy,
she has the Gang that Couldn't Shoot straight. She has
one or two other films around that time. Then there's
kind of a lull, and then like around French Quarter time,
it's like she's reintroduced and she starts showing up big
time again. She was in Shamus at a few other
so she's almost got like two parts to her kind
of short career there, but she does have long enough
career to have really two different eras of it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's why I when I was looking at her career,
I was and watching her films, I was thinking about
Monica Gale. I feel like they're very similar.
Speaker 5: Career, very distinctive, separate halves.
Speaker 3: Yes, but plus they also are just two gorgeous, talented
women that really never got a really big break.
Speaker 5: Even with leads. Yeah, because I mean Alicia is the
lead in this ante enage tramp. Very actually similar rules,
very similar kind of roles in those. Yeah, but I've
always loved her. I've always been a huge Alicia fronteam person. Yeah.
Speaker 3: So, I mean, Sean, what happened? Like, I mean, she's
got an agent that's hustling for, but she never got anything.
I mean, French Quarter was probably her biggest role.
Speaker 7: The one she's I think most known for for sure.
I mean I don't know, and really until fairly recently,
I would say we didn't know where she'd win even right, right,
I mean it's pretty much after what's seventy seventy eight,
seventy nine, Yeah, she's done, right yep.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like she didn't do TV stuff, did she?
Speaker 7: Uh, not that I'm aware of.
Speaker 5: So, because she was always new I think she was
pretty much always New York. I don't think she went
out to California and French Quarter was shot on location?
Speaker 3: Was it not in y yep? That was in New Orleans, yep.
Speaker 7: All he was in California at least. I don't know
that she was working a working actress, and I don't
think she was, I think from that standpoint, your correct, casey.
But she definitely did move to California for yeah, several decades,
I think, But I don't know what she was doing
out there. I don't know that it was had anything
to do with films or TV at that point.
Speaker 5: Right, So, actually, you know what, You're right because I
found her attached to an address in Hollywood. Yes, so
you were right. Yes, I don't know why I forgot that. Yes,
that's right.
Speaker 7: And also that's where her and kennyed had their final meeting,
was out in LA and he said she she was
obviously living out there as well. The whole town has
a few things about your to mother. What do you
mean there's a lot of men in this town.
Speaker 9: That know you real good mon?
Speaker 8: Francy, you're talking to your mother. You know what it
means when they say in the Bible to know, it
means to fuck.
Speaker 7: I want to talk a little bit about her, a
little bit more about her now, Yeah, yeah, I think so. I,
as you guys know, I kind of I was got
so focused on on Kenny Chandler. I kind of forgot
about Alicia, believe it or not.
Speaker 5: And it's a good story. It's easy to it's easy
to forget because Kenny's story sounds amazing. I totally get it.
Speaker 6: Yea.
Speaker 7: Yeah, and I had I had a warm body to
to talk to. But so so I'm like, well, we
probably need to look a little bit into Alicia's background.
I'm glad. I'm glad I did, because we we've I
believe it's safe to say at this point we at
least determine where she came from, and we believe where
she's at, we believe she's still around. So she was
born in Virginia, she grew up, it looks like in
New Jersey, about sixty or seventy miles from where Francy
was shot, so southern New Jersey. She was what she
was in the drama club, the varsity club. She played hockey,
it seems like in high school, and not long after
high school she graduated, I think in sixty seven, So
about a year later is when she starts showing up
in these columns and promotions in New York City. So
she I'm thinking she probably got on the first train
north up the Northeast Corridor to New York City after graduation.
I don't know that, but it wasn't long after graduation
that she shows up in New York City there and again,
she sort of dropped off the planet after seventy nine ish. Actually,
I think there was a TV show that has her
credited in like ninety one or something like that. Right
really about that, I'm not verified at all whether that's
accurate or not. It doesn't feel like it, but it
could be. You never know it.
Speaker 5: Possibly, yeah, maybe she maybe she knew somebody and they
threw her favor. It's possible all those years later, so I.
Speaker 7: Went through that very quickly. But I think it's safe
to say that's a lot more than we knew about
her a week ago.
Speaker 5: So absolutely, absolutely. I Actually I will say I almost
called her earlier today. So to give you, to give
you an idea of whether since we're threaching out to
or not. But I said no, I'll wait because I
was like, I'm not good at cold calls. I have
to figure that one out.
Speaker 3: You have to yourself a little bit psych yourself up.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think so. I can't just be like, yeah,
we're doing an episode about Francis Friday. What do you
want to Yeah? Exactly, you know that Sean the best
you know? Do you know that you have to kind
of prepare and approach for people.
Speaker 7: Yeah, you got to prepare an approach and you have
to prepare your self too.
Speaker 5: Exactly yep, yep. Mentally yes, right, and yeah, I was
not in the right headspace for that. I was just
kind of like, oh, great, okay, I'm glad I didn't
pick up the phone.
Speaker 7: Yeah, potentially that that one's too good to do on
a spur of the moment.
Speaker 5: No, you can't throw that away, right exactly. You kind
of have to prepare for that.
Speaker 7: Yeah, all right, where you want to go next?
Speaker 8: Guys?
Speaker 7: You want to talk a little bit more about people
or places or things.
Speaker 3: Oh, I am looking at the cast list again. Well
I wanted to ask you about Yeah, running through those
are the two main ones that we know, but there
also is credited the girl who plays Alicia, like as
a child, a little girl. What's the story? Is there
any story there? Because I wonder if that's like the
daughter of someone.
Speaker 7: There that was get some of my notes on that.
I got so much on Kenny here. Yeah, Barbara Lynn, Yeah, yeah,
she she she was a local. She's from Woodbridge, New Jersey,
the local area, and her house, believe it or not,
was right behind the cemetery where the first scene was filmed,
so she truly was local to the film. Her father,
it seems, may have been somehow in business with Ledger himself,
because one of the one of the at least one
of the ads I think for the car wash company
was had his house their house listed as the address
to reply to, so it seems like they made there
was some connection there. Her father also had some kind
of he did some kind of showing of China, fine
chine or whatever at the World's Fair in sixty four,
So that's that's another World's Fair connection there. Whether that
was a direct link to Ledger or just a coincidence,
I don't know, but again, there was some direct link
even before Francy as far as the business goes side
of it, she is still around, and I believe she
lives in Florida now and I think she lives about
twenty miles or or my daughter goes to college. But
I haven't to her because I figured she was pretty young.
And you know, I don't know if she was ever
enough to warrant rattling that tree or not exactly.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you never know with kids.
Speaker 7: Yes, he's not a kid any longer, but yeah, right,
And I.
Speaker 3: Mean, yeah, I don't know if she Yeah, because she's
playing young Francy. I don't even know if she ever met.
I mean they probably met on the set.
Speaker 5: She probably met Alicia and Ken maybe yeah.
Speaker 7: Yeah. I don't think the call sheet was very extensive
days here. I mean, if you don't know how long
the shoot was, I can go back and ask him.
That's the question I probably should have covered. But it
probably wasn't weeks, you know, So you're probably right they
were there at the same time, most likely.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Before we talk yeah, locations and stuff, Well, let's talk
about Patrick Wright and Tally Cochran. I was like, watching
the movie, I'm like, when are they gonna show up?
Where are they? And then they show up at the
very end and they and then Patt has steal the movie.
Speaker 5: Honestly, no, Patrick is in really annoying mode. Again Patrick,
this is Patrick and sassy mode. This is not, this
is not. This is not my boyfriend Patrick Wright at
his best. I'm just like, here we go.
Speaker 3: He's doing like it's as to see voice, He's doing
like it's.
Speaker 5: Correct, and he's on every single line he says has
a voice or is dripping and has a yeah, has
an accent where is dripping in like sarcasm, And I
was like, I hate this. But Tally plays the southern
bell as she loved to do, is she often asked
to do because she wasn't sothing bell. She's from, you know, Alabama.
They met in California, then flew to Rome together and
worked her a little bit in dubbing, which I would
love to hear those voices in any of those films,
but I never have.
Speaker 3: Doing voices so clearly.
Speaker 5: But she also did too, like even going up, you know,
when they eventually back to California and got involved with
like a comedy troop. I forget the name of that troop,
but they did characters and voices and stuff. Both of them.
But yeah, the connection again to casting in New York
where they kind of fell into that casting agency after
Linda gave it up, and so they inherited all those
clients and all the actors and everybody. So they were
really involved with casting softcore and hardcore because Linda apparently
did not want to cast hardcore, so producers were coming
to her were doing it for softcore because she didn't
want to cast hardcore. But Tally had no problems with that,
and she was doing hardcore herself on the side. A
few little things, yeah, and Patrick too, and you can
there's a few films with that in there, but not
a lot. It was mostly sex show stuff they were doing.
But yeah, they ran away from New York after they
got wind at the MOB was going to close in
on them because they basically had a rolodex of people
that could potentially drop the dime on and get them
in trouble with the law for making sex films. So
they ran back to California and she did a little
casting out there, not that much though. I think they
were mostly involved with like acting and doing other production.
Patrick and she I think they got involved with like
producing in little tiny movies here and there. Yeah, I mean,
it's it's fun to see them. It's also because they're
some of the only other recognizable people in this film, right, So.
Speaker 6: I do like that.
Speaker 7: I asked Kenny if he remembered them. Oh, yeah, yeah,
and he said, he's like, I don't remember. Well she,
I said, well, she was the she's she's the one
of the one of the pool scenes that had a
very strong Southern accent and was the first to disrope.
And he's like, oh, yeah, I remember that. So he
remembered that.
Speaker 5: Very memorable miss Tally.
Speaker 3: Well, she's got a really cool outfit too. She's got
like that bowler hat and like the black outfit. Yeah,
she's got looks great.
Speaker 5: She does. I mean she she was always really adorable
and I always you know that, I'm a I'm a
diehard Tally person, not just because I knew her, but
I loved her even before then. And Patrick I typically
love too, But he is so annoying in this.
Speaker 3: He looks good.
Speaker 5: I'll give him that. I can't I can't deal with this,
his his character. I love the blonde in that in
that in those scenes. Actually, the other the blonde who
has the speech who had that dialogue with her about
talking about how actually it's kind of sad where she's
kind of like, well, I have to do what my
man wants because you know, I figure he's worth it,
and it's like a terrible message to give to give.
Francy he was kind of like, well, just settle basically,
just you know, just you know, he's worth it, right,
I'll just do whatever he wants because it's worth it
to keep him right. And it's like, no, no, it's not.
Speaker 1: So yeah.
Speaker 7: Well, the only other the only other name I got
for you guys is the father. I actually discovered who
that was, and I discovered I discovered who he was
when I was looking for Michael Nimtz, who don't remember
from some hours ago now, was one of Kurt Ledger's
early partners back in the sixties, and I was looking
for him, and right in front of me there are
two pictures down from Michael Nemitz's picture was this face,
and I'm like, well, shoot, that's Trancy's father. His name,
I believe was Bruce Karch. He was local, yet again
from the Woodbridgeman touch in Edison area was heavy into
theater in that region for at least through the sixties.
He had an unfortunate incident in the early seventies where
he was in an accident car accident and accidentally killed
a guy in the accident, and then a couple of
years later he also passed away. So he died I
think in seventy five, fairly young. I think he was
only fifty two when he passed away. But yeah, so
we've got one more name now of the of the
Francy's Mystery. The fill in.
Speaker 3: You mean to tell me, you're gonna tell me? I
mean you want to go out with?
Speaker 6: Who do you think you are?
Speaker 5: My magic?
Speaker 7: Well?
Speaker 3: Who is Henry Charles? That's behind it?
Speaker 7: Henry Charles. Yes, we skipped over him, so he is
not listed in the credits, but he is identified in
a few articles local articles around the time of filming.
Henry Charles or Henry Charles Fleischmann I think was his
full name. He. I think he's the single most important
reason Francy's Friday is not another she came on the bus. Yeah,
because he started in World War Two. He started filming
as a photographer cinematographer. After the war, back home in
New Jersey, he opened up his own company basically his
own studio. He is his old house in Woodbridger Edison
actually that he converted the old house and the property
around it into a studio, and for decades he did
primarily civic and industrial and you know, educational type films
and not small budget either. I saw one article that
identified that this was probably in the seventies, but that
the average budget was like a thousand dollars a minute,
So so that's not small potatoes, certainly not. She came
on the bus type budget there. So he knew how
to make films, and he knew how to do it quickly,
and he knew how to do it effectively and professionally.
And he was identified in one of these articles as
the cameraman. I'm pretty sure he was the guy pulling
most of the strings though as far as how this
film was shot, how it was blocked, how it was
put together, everything, and then yes Ledger was there and
yes he was giving direction. But again this is I
think you'll both will have to agree a far more
actually one of the more competent films of this type
of genre. And I think it absolutely with the Charles.
Speaker 3: I wonder, yeah, if he edited as well, because the
editing is really good too.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 7: We an editing studio in his in his studio and
editing you know. So yeah, I mean, if it wasn't him,
it was someone in his studio sort of you know,
cabal there if you will. I'm sure, I'm sure all
the post production was handled by him and his studio.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Wow, Yeah, I mean we heard Curtis is Ledger's
whole backstory, like he clearly had help in making this.
Speaker 7: Yeah. And and he Charles actually was Henry Charles. There
are films and I couldn't they were out there, I haven't.
I got to find him again on archive. But there
were films that he shot at the World's Fairs, like
professional films that he shot at the World's Fair as well.
So again we've got a third sort of thread back
to the nineteen sixty four World's Fare. I just think
there must have been a group of guys in Woodbridge
area that that just all took the same train into
the Fair.
Speaker 5: I got to know each other there, right, well, because
didn't didn't Leger? Also he mentioned that he had an
advertising company too, right, So I wonder if that was
kind of it. Well, they were the World's Fair wanted
local people involved for obvious reasons. But then that would
also like advertising agency at that time would have had
a connection to like industrial filmmakers because they would be
involved with shooting, like you know, the industrial films and
things like that. So yeah, it's just interesting that all
of that seems to have skipped to France's Friday, and
I don't it doesn't look it doesn't seem like it
was part involved with She Came on the Bus, maybe
because that was a much more quick, let's make a
buck production, whereas this seems like they're really trying to
do something here.
Speaker 7: Yeah. Yeah, for She Came on the Bus, is hey, gang,
let's throw a show on in the barn for Grandma
and Grandpa and Grancy's Friday was let's make a movie? Yes, right.
Speaker 5: It also, Connor reminds me a lot of a movie
that I bring up way too much, which is Pamela,
Pamela You Are, which is you know It's it's a
movie that has very high aspirations, and it's also it's
it's another case of a director whose first movie was
not technically great and then pulls out all the stops
for his for his next big movie. But I'm also
noticing a trend and that we've covered several films on
here where the cinematographers make the film. So we've talked
about the Tony Orlando movies where Chuck Smith is the
reason whethers are good. We talked about Satan in Hi
Heels last week. Hirshinston cinematography elevates that film because the director,
Gerald Introtur didn't know what.
Speaker 9: He was doing.
Speaker 5: So it seems like it's such an interesting recurring trend
and sexphitation, that this reliance on really good technicians to
actually put in the work to make these movies look good.
And it's just interesting because I think the genre is
typically not associated with visual style for whatever reason.
Speaker 3: But no, I think, yeah, you're right, because I think
also the case is sometimes the director is more a
producer in a lot of cases, so they're not really directing.
That's just they're just putting their name on there.
Speaker 8: Right.
Speaker 7: I got a few more hations I want to point out,
just because so the house, the Fancy's House, I won't
give the exact address, but it was on Middlesex Avenue
in Colonia, New Jersey. And for those that aren't aware,
there there's kind of this group of little communities Edison,
Mattouche and Island, Woodbridge, Colonia and Menlo Park. They're all
sort of together right there in that that part of
Central Jersey, so they're all sort of interchangeable. And that's
my area of New Jersey, like I said earlier. There
So the house, it's all over the place now, but
it's is actually right now the last decade or so,
there's a heavily Indian uh population that that's moved in
and lives there now. But but historically it's been middle class,
you know, the upper middle class. You know what what
you'd expect, uh, you know, a typical sixties you know
house to look like that would be in colonial type
of thing.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean they got a pool in the backyard, so
they're doing all right.
Speaker 7: Yeah yeah, And and the pool is still there. The
house is still there, and when I visited in twenty
twenty three, it looked a little worse for where it
also looked like they might have started on some renovations
that may or may not still have been going on.
But the house is still there, and it sold a
few years ago. For I had the number somewhere here
for free in twenty nineteen, it sold for four hundred
and seventeen thousand dollars.
Speaker 4: Oh that's not that much.
Speaker 7: That's really good. That area not at all. Yeah, yeah,
it's it's it's a listed it's not listed now, but
it's quoted at nine hundred thousand now. So whether they
would get that or not, I don't know. So this house,
I think, and if you look at it, I think
they filmed primarily on the lower section by the pool.
That whole living room area is the bottom sort of
that's you know, that's probably the public area of the house.
They used the kitchen, and you can go online and
from twenty nineteen you can still see the pictures that kitchen.
It's been upgraded and everything, but the layout is exactly
the same. And then they used one or two bedrooms upstairs.
So there's a whole center section of that house that
wasn't used in the film, I believe, And I think
and Kenny said he got the feeling that the Ledgers
probably lived there at the time.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so they were hands off this section. You know,
you guys can film in these parts, but don't go
in there.
Speaker 7: Yep. So I got to looking into the house. It's
of the address, and again it was used for the
Ledger Machine Company, the car wash company, and then things
get so that was around early seventy one an ad
Ledger posted for LPR Productions looking for a rock band
to score a film, and he used that thing. Now
that's interesting because we got Kenny. We didn't get a
rock band, but we got Kenny. But we got Kenny
through an agent, not through the ad.
Speaker 5: So anyway he was putting that interesting, yeah, because all
the rest of the music is KPM except for the
Kenny Chandler stuff. All of that is a library music,
even the vocal rock tracks or KPM. Yeah.
Speaker 7: Yeah, so maybe he was hoping to not use KPM.
But anyway, so but that does link us to that
address for sure. We also get the car wash ads
and also in the Philly papers, even this Philly we
get the address. Actually in the Philly papers in seventy
and seventy one that's where I had the note. That's
when they were using the Jenosko's address. So the car
wash company started at Thenosko's address, then moved to the
Colonia address in seventy one when the film was being shot.
Now here's where things get really interesting. In January seventy one,
there's an article about this guy named Frederick Myers that
was arrested at that address, and it made it sound
like that was his residence. Now, Frederick Myers was the
nephew of a guy named Vincent Canara, probably pronouncing that wrong.
Vincent Canara was a very well known local mafia guy.
Oh now again I don't know. Maybe he moved out
and the Ledgers moved in in early seventy one. But
then in seven two seventy two, a lady named Joyce
Johnson was listed as living there. She was stabbed and
killed in a bar down in South Amboy. Had nothing
to do with Basically, the guy was trying to hit
on her and she said get lost. He goes out,
gets a knife and she gets lost. Basically there. So
but that's two interesting sort of bookends to the window
that we know the Ledger, Curtis Ledger, was at that house.
So you got a mafia guy and you got a stabbing.
So a few more things. So I already mentioned the
car wash where Kenny first sees Francy and she meets
the guys that they then go to the airport. That
car wash was a Curtis Ledger car wash, so I
don't know that he owned it, but it definitely was
one of his installations. And that gas station is still there,
although it's been renovated heavily. Actually got gas there one day.
Speaker 3: I was going to say about car washes. I mean,
the stereotype about car washes is that there's some sort
of money laundering scheme or something shady going on there.
Speaker 5: So breaking bad situation.
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, it's a cash business absolutely. Now that airport
that that they go to where she has that whole
segment around the phone. I sent you guys the the
ad for that that remember that that shows the actual
phone that she has holding it like she held it
exactly in the film there right. Yes, it was called
the Hadley Airport. It was a kind of a private,
I think airport, and it was either already shut down
or about to be sort of offball shut down. And
now there's nothing there there, Well, there's a lot there.
There's restaurants and strip malls and a hotel. And I'd
heard that there was a plaque that commemorated so I
went out there one day and sure enough, there's a
little plaque in the sort of roundabout in front of
a holiday in Express sort of in the bushes that
commemorates the Hadley Airport. When I got there, it was
like one of those Spielberg sort of movements where I
zoom in and zoom out at the same time because
I'm looking at this plaque and it says this was
placed by the Inglehart Corporation. Well that's my company.
Speaker 5: What, Oh my god, what's really crazy.
Speaker 7: Not what it's called now, but when when I started
working there twenty eight years ago, it was the Inglehard Corporation.
Speaker 5: So yeah, that is really crazy. Wow.
Speaker 3: Now where's the plaque commemorating Francy shooting up vagicil on
this location?
Speaker 5: That is crazy? Yes, that scene accident. Is that why
you asked if it was a dark comedy because means
a lot going on? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I was.
Speaker 7: I was not expecting that for sure. I don't think
you guys were either going out.
Speaker 3: But it reminds me again, you had that Monica Gail
movie Sandra she there's like some sort of product like that. Yes,
so it was in the zeitgeist at that moment. I
think in the early seventies, this form of contraceptive it.
Speaker 7: Was almost like she was using it as a shield,
like these guys are never.
Speaker 3: Gonna put Yeah, that's what makes it funny in that scene. Yeah,
right right.
Speaker 7: The motorcycle montage I'm convinced was on us one also
in that same area, and that's because of the power
of the high power lines you see on the thing.
I'm very familiar with that road. I hate it with
all my guts. It's a terrible road to drive on
or be around. It's a terrible traffic trap in that area.
The pond that you see them running on, that was
Sealy's pond. That was a bit north. That was up
in Scotch Plains, New Jersey, which is a little bit
further north. But that's a public park in the Watchung Reservation.
And finally, the last thing I got for you guys,
and I'm losing my voice, so it's time to shut up.
Probably the little Hamburger joined that Kenny goes into where
he sees her Alicia's number on the wall or number
the wall. Yeah, that was the Chip's Hamburgers, and I
believe it was on Route twenty two up in North Plainfield.
So again up here where she came on the bus
was filmed I think the building's still there. They've built
on a whole front to it, but if you go
around the back, that definite frame is still visible, jetting
out of the the broader structure that's there. So the
interesting thing that phone number that you see on the wall,
that was Ledger's phone number.
Speaker 5: Oh my god.
Speaker 7: Of course.
Speaker 3: To his house. They're like to the car wash, who
was out? Oh my god, that is so funny. Maybe
some business opportunities will come his way that that.
Speaker 7: Yeah, always the promoter, right always.
Speaker 5: I guess I'm having his little girl answer the phone,
surprising people. Well, that is something I did want to
ask Sean, because that is something that I'm in total
awe of with you. One of many things I'm in
awe with you is the how you're able to identify locations,
because it's not just like this is a case of
some of a film that's shot in areas that you're
familiar with, but like only house in town you found
those locate. You found that location, I believe, and there
are other locations that you've been involved with on on
other DVD extras I think too. So like how does
your brain work for you? Don't say it, you don't
have to give the secrets away. But I'm just kind
of like, it's really super duper impressive to me, It's
really incredible.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I don't I don't try to explain it. I
will give you the entire story of Only House if
you have me back for that, and I promise that
won't be as well.
Speaker 5: I'm tempted. I'm actually tempted. I'll think about it.
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, but yeah, yeah, And I appreciate that, Casey.
I it means a lot, especially coming from from you,
who you know who. We won't get too wishy washy
on on ourselves here, but you're You're one of those
guys whose name was always out there and I'm like,
but to now be working with you, uh, it's it's
a it's a it's it's a pleasure. So but I
can't answer that just I've always just had a knack.
I think a lot of it comes from I'm a
very suspicious and untrusting person to begin with. So because
of that, I look at not just what's in front
of me, but what's also not in front of me,
and a lot of times the absence of things tell
us more than if we do something. And I'm also
tenacious and I have for for certain things like finding
people in locations I have. I think I can have
immense focus and patience patients as I think the biggest
ingredient for any of this stuff that we do. And
and you know I I I don't let things go either.
That's the other bit of it. I guess it's not
that I'm very any better at it than anyone else.
It is that maybe that I just stay with it
is the secret. I don't know.
Speaker 5: Yeah, well you got good results. I still remember when
and we were recording an episode and it was literally,
I think thirty minutes after you texted me all the
Doris Poro stuff that you'd Yeah, then you were sending
me more updates as we were recording. I was like, oh,
Shawn just messaged me. I found more info. And I
was like, who would have thought that that name was
a real name on the credits of this of this
trashy movie. And I was like, well, yeah, of course
Sean would find this of And that's.
Speaker 7: Another great example of IMDb being misleading, right because it
had the wrong person with her tea on it. There's
one other story, Casey, I want to tell about you.
It was one of my personal I think achievements that
I'm most proud of. I used to do these April
Fools things on Facebook, and there was one year where
I did one on the something Weird Facebook group. I
sort of took that over. I don't know if you
remember this casey or not, but I did one where
I found an article on the lady that was the
that played Dora in Bat Pussy. I'd found an article
about her, and I did. I had this whole thread
where she was arrested and she'd been identified in this
film and and and it was her whole story, and
of course it was a joke at the end and
the but I made up these fake articles that they
I thought they looked pretty real, and I posted them
and people were believing it, and then like wait a minute,
Safril first, but no, wait a minute, he's got the
article here. And and at the end I give it
away by saying, you know, she was let go the
judge letter go on all charges when a very young
Dennis Kampa you know, said that if you arrest her,
he'll never be the same man. He'll grow supposed to
grow something like that, right, So it's been there, but
I remember Your comment on that is you came in
fairly late in the day, so the whole thing was
already there, and you'd said, uh, I can't something along
the lines of I can't believe the roller coaster. I
just wrote something along those lines, and I'm thinking, all right,
I fooled him. I know I did something something there.
Speaker 5: Yet, Yes, that was brilliant. I do remember that. Yes,
I do remember that. Yeah, it's while Sean. We've been
We've talked back and forth forever, and every time you're
in town, I never get to see you.
Speaker 7: We've been coating around each other for now for some time,
and I feel like, you know, one of those I
don't know if it's like in high school, you know,
they they get a date and she just wouldn't show up.
That's how I feel like now with you.
Speaker 5: Oh, which is terrible actually, and I honestly the same
thing happened with Alex, where Alex came to town for
the Milligan thing and I was supposed to meet him.
I went down, I slept through the screening, and then
there was a thing I was supposed to meet him
and Joe Rubin after they got back from Staten Island,
and I didn't get a chance to meet them, so
trust me, it is not personal and it is not you.
It is a me thing because I'm I'm I'm cuckoo
bananas and I need to get my shit together, which
I think everyone knows.
Speaker 7: Well that you're supposed to need me that day too,
So that was strike too for you again.
Speaker 5: Right, that's right, Yes, that's right.
Speaker 7: I forgot letting off the hook, letting you off the
hook on the last, but that's a ball, it's not
a strike, so.
Speaker 5: Right, yes, well, yeah, when when Bowen, when you have
Bowen for that for like five and a half hours,
you need to rest and take it all it.
Speaker 7: And I got to tell you, guys, I you know
you you read my little thing last week, which I'll
claim claim I'm the guy that wrote that to you guys,
because I meant, yes, it wasn't hyperbole. I meant every
word of it. And I think when all is said
and done, that Bowen episode is going to be seen
as a turning point for you guys, because you took
for me anyway. It is because you've done good stuff
for the thirty whatever before that, really great stuff. That's
an important one though, not that the others aren't, but
that that one, truly, I think, is going to be
looked at and referenced and it's gonna we need to
package it and put it in the pantheon. It's it's
just that good. Again. I don't want to get too
hyperbolic on it, but but it it's it's it's important.
I'll put it that way.
Speaker 3: Well, like we said, we hope we lit a fire
under Bowing a little bit.
Speaker 5: I think we did. I think as Yeah, I think
I mentioned it was there was a case where I
think he's been kind of disconnected from it for a
while because of other projects he's working on. But I
think talking about it and getting asked questions like, oh right,
I do know the answer to that, all right, and
no I know this, Oh I have this stuff in
my collection, and just like it. Really it was like
it was talking shop, which he hadn't done in forever.
I think, So it really was kind of like a reminder,
oh right, I know a lot about this shit and
I need to put it down. Not that I'm saying
that him doing that made him realize I need to
do the books. I think it's been gestating, But no,
I appreciate you saying that that's kind of what we've
been trying to do. And that's why I'm so excited
we finally got to have you on because I know
that you. Yeah, I've said it on here before. Your
research skills are like incredibly impressive to me. So anytime
I'm like, well I can't find something, let's see if
Sean can figure this out, and nine times out of
ten you figure it out, and if it stumps us both,
then I know, like the Joel land where thing where
we're still stumped on, that's just that's just gonna take
a lot more. But you know that's kind of a
sign of like, if Sean can't figure it out, I
think we might be screwed here. Yeah, because I have
that much faith in your work and what you do
that Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 7: Let's depend the word yet on that we can't figure
it out yet. I'm not done with that. That's what
I said. If we put it to the side that
we're coming back to mister.
Speaker 5: Yes, I had to take a break, but I mean, yes, well,
actually next time in New York, we need to go
to filmmakers' co ops so that you can watch that
because that movie is wild and I think they will
just let you record the whole thing on your phone.
I just didn't because I didn't want to get in trouble.
But they didn't give a ship. By the end of
the day, I'll just record the whole thing on my phone.
Speaker 7: Oh, we'll bring some equipment.
Speaker 3: Then we're throwing a party there.
Speaker 5: Yes, exactly, in the.
Speaker 6: Corners of a man, all the stories I can.
Speaker 8: But let me see.
Speaker 6: It's not cheat, just a fragment. Ly she's afraid I'll
have in her, just a young.
Speaker 8: Girl with no answer.
Speaker 6: To a question. I lost a lord, Chad, what I
do her thing? I'll be there, wa try away, I'll
be theme.
Speaker 1: With the joy.
Speaker 6: Okay, in the corners of them.
Speaker 8: In most corners of them, you're with friends. He weren't you,
That's why you were still?
Speaker 7: Yes, I was.
Speaker 8: Did you make love Tour?
Speaker 7: Yes?
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Speaker 5: Whoa, whoa, whoa.
Speaker 10: Okay, Okay, okay, I'm ready, I'm ready. Welcome to Split
Your Head, a biweekly podcast hosted by me Bob that
covers the gamut of all things horror. Exploitation, cult, underground, experimental, transgressive, bizarre,
and indie. Have been fortunate enough to connect with some
of the most groundbreaking and upcoming filmmakers, writers, and artists.
Speaker 7: Don't expect a typical interview.
Speaker 6: I love shooting the shoot with my.
Speaker 10: Guests and stumbling on surprising topics that will literally split
our heads, from splatter comedies to nihilistic sleeves, uncomfortable art
house to genre classics. If it gets my brain buzzing
and cracking wide open like a watermelon full of blood,
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Now a part of the Someone's Favorite Productions podcast network,
Hi Mom,