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<v Speaker 1>What's up everyone, and welcome back to the program. In

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<v Speaker 1>the lead up to Brian Colberger's trial, there was an

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<v Speaker 1>expert that was hired by the defense and his name

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<v Speaker 1>is Siree. Now, Siree is a former Arizona homicide investigator,

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<v Speaker 1>but now he deals in digital forensics and geolocation. And

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<v Speaker 1>as we were marching towards the trial, he was one

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<v Speaker 1>of the experts that was relied heavily upon by the defense. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>now that Brian Colberger has attempted to withdraw his plea,

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<v Speaker 1>mister Sirae is coming out and saying that if Brian

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<v Speaker 1>Colberger gets a new trial, that he should face the

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<v Speaker 1>death penalty. And that's because, according to Siree, the prosecution

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<v Speaker 1>missed some forensic evidence during their investigation. So let's dive

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<v Speaker 1>into this article from box News and let's see what

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<v Speaker 1>they have to say. Headline, Brian Colberger's former defense expert

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<v Speaker 1>calls for death penalty, says investigators missed key evidence. This

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<v Speaker 1>article was authored by Michael Ruiz, admitted Idaho murderer Brian

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<v Speaker 1>Colberger should get a new trial and face the death penalty.

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<v Speaker 1>According to a digital forensics expert hired by the defense

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<v Speaker 1>who says investigators miss damning evidence against the thirty year

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<v Speaker 1>old former criminology PhD student. Evidence, he told Fox News

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<v Speaker 1>digital investigators never properly analyzed or incorporated into the prosecution's case. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>that's not very reassuring, not exactly what you want to hear, right,

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<v Speaker 1>And look, I know that there's a lot of evidence

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<v Speaker 1>and there's a lot of information that the prosecution has

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<v Speaker 1>to go through, but how do you miss something that's damning?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, you would think with all the people that

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<v Speaker 1>were involved FBI, etc. That they'd have everything on the

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<v Speaker 1>up and up, But according to Siree, there was some

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<v Speaker 1>stuff they missed. Siree is a former Arizona homicide investigator

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<v Speaker 1>who is now an expert on digital forensics, geolocation, and

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<v Speaker 1>similar data. Colberger's lawyers hired him as an expert witness

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<v Speaker 1>for the defense before Colberger pleaded guilty to avoid the

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<v Speaker 1>death penalty for the home invasion murder of Kailee Gonsalvez,

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<v Speaker 1>Madison Mogan, Xana Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin. Colberger, now serving

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<v Speaker 1>four consecutive sentences of life in prison without parole, petitioned

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<v Speaker 1>the court last week to withdraw his guilty plea and

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<v Speaker 1>seek post conviction relief, which could send the case to

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<v Speaker 1>trial and put the potential death penalty back in play.

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<v Speaker 1>Like this is a big gamble, right if Colberger gets

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<v Speaker 1>a new trial, which I have my doubts about, but

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<v Speaker 1>if he does, he's literally playing with fire. And I

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<v Speaker 1>think that if he does get a new trial, he's

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<v Speaker 1>going to end up with the death penalty because I

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<v Speaker 1>believe that Brian Colbert is guilty. Now, with that said,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm willing to look at whatever evidence is provided. If

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<v Speaker 1>there's some evidence saying that Coburger's not the guy, I'd

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<v Speaker 1>love to see it. But as of now, I haven't

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<v Speaker 1>seen that evidence. Bring back the death penalty. Ray told

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<v Speaker 1>journalist Brian Enton in a new podcast, I'm all for this.

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<v Speaker 1>He said he is confident that Coburger would be convicted

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<v Speaker 1>and claim that Coburger's smartphone data is much more incriminating

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<v Speaker 1>than was revealed previously when police in the courts un

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<v Speaker 1>sealed thousands of pages of evidence in the case. Yo,

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<v Speaker 1>I want to see it. I would love to see

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<v Speaker 1>the documents. Right, Let's dive into him and see what's what.

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<v Speaker 1>And remember, when we're going through a trial, we only

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<v Speaker 1>get a fraction of what the prosecution has, and then

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<v Speaker 1>later on down the road maybe we get some more,

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<v Speaker 1>but for the most part, we're not getting even a

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<v Speaker 1>fraction of what they have, right, especially when it comes

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<v Speaker 1>to video and shit like that. I one hundred percent

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<v Speaker 1>believe that the offender who is Brian Coberger. There is

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<v Speaker 1>no alternative theory in my head at this point, Ray

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<v Speaker 1>said in the eighty two minute episode, which also included

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<v Speaker 1>Gonsalva's parents, Christy and Steve, and their older sister Olivia.

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<v Speaker 1>I have one hundred percent believe he's been in the

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<v Speaker 1>house before. That's possible, but I think he would have

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<v Speaker 1>stood out like a sore thumb. I mean, Brian Colberger

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<v Speaker 1>is not exactly what you would call a popular guy,

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<v Speaker 1>not somebody that's showing up the frat parties, right, So

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<v Speaker 1>he would have been somebody that stands out, and I'm

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<v Speaker 1>pretty sure somebody would have been like, who's this dude

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<v Speaker 1>hanging out here that nobody knows? Hey, Mike, you know

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<v Speaker 1>this dude is I know when I was younger, that's

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<v Speaker 1>how our frat parties were. Oh so and so is

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<v Speaker 1>here with so and so, And if there was somebody

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<v Speaker 1>at the house. You didn't know. You find out who

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<v Speaker 1>they are. But I guess maybe things were different up

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<v Speaker 1>in Moscow. I don't know, a much more trusting environment.

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<v Speaker 1>Perhaps I want to college at UNLV, things were a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit different. Ray told Enton that the evidence he

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<v Speaker 1>reviewed shows Coburger potentially inside the victim's home or at

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<v Speaker 1>least in proximity outside, and at other places when they

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<v Speaker 1>were present prior to the murders. He also told Fox

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<v Speaker 1>News Digital that he didn't have to address this evidence

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<v Speaker 1>in his own expert report filed by the defense in

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<v Speaker 1>January of twenty twenty five, because he based it only

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<v Speaker 1>on the contents of the reports produced by prosecution experts,

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<v Speaker 1>which left out something called a Location Database of Record

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<v Speaker 1>or locdboor report that he alleges contains damning new information

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<v Speaker 1>about Coburger's movements in his semester at Washington State University. Look,

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<v Speaker 1>I've said from the jump, I think he cased the house.

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<v Speaker 1>He was somebody that was around the house quite a bit.

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<v Speaker 1>Now was he inside, I don't know. According to mister Ray,

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<v Speaker 1>he believes he was. I don't know if I buy that,

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<v Speaker 1>but maybe I'm not saying no, but I I would

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<v Speaker 1>think that somebody would remember Brian Kolberger if he was

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<v Speaker 1>at that house, you know, one of the other fraternity

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<v Speaker 1>brothers or sorority sisters or somebody. Ray acknowledged that his

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<v Speaker 1>January twenty twenty five report appears different from his current

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<v Speaker 1>public comments, but said the report evaluated only the prosecution's

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<v Speaker 1>work product, not the underlying AT and T records. He

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<v Speaker 1>says investigators never mapped Why wouldn't they do that? Were

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<v Speaker 1>they too busy? Why aren't you mapping everything, especially considering

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<v Speaker 1>you have a guy that was working for the defense

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<v Speaker 1>who's pointing out how bad that was and how damning

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<v Speaker 1>those records could have been. My summary of no evidence

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<v Speaker 1>is based on that work product and the work product

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<v Speaker 1>that the state had put together at the time. He

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<v Speaker 1>told Fox News Digital, I can't put in my defense report. Hey,

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<v Speaker 1>if you guys would just look at the loc DBOR

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<v Speaker 1>report here, you'll solve your case and have a really

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<v Speaker 1>rock solid case. But I can put here are some

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<v Speaker 1>follow up by it that I would expect you guys

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<v Speaker 1>to do. And one of the things is you'll see

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<v Speaker 1>repeated over and over, you have to map all the data.

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<v Speaker 1>Please go map the data. Speaking on the podcast. Ray

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<v Speaker 1>said the locd bo R report contains location data that

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<v Speaker 1>he believes shows coburger stalk the victims. Fox News Digital

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<v Speaker 1>has not independently reviewed the locd bo R report either,

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<v Speaker 1>as it's not among thousands of pages of unsealed core

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<v Speaker 1>documents in the case. So we have to take his

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<v Speaker 1>word for it, okay, But like usual, I'll take it

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<v Speaker 1>with a grain of salt until I see the report

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<v Speaker 1>for myself. I'm not going to say one way or

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<v Speaker 1>the other that it's guaranteed or not. We have to

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<v Speaker 1>see the paperwork, right. If you look at the precise measurements,

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<v Speaker 1>there's probably five that land directly on what would be

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<v Speaker 1>the living room of the house. Ray told Entin, like

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<v Speaker 1>the latitude longitude is the physical house itself, and if

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<v Speaker 1>you put the house back on the map and you

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<v Speaker 1>map those the hits or inside the house. So look,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe he was at the house when nobody was there,

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<v Speaker 1>that's possible. Did he break in and rifle around a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit and get familiar with the layout, that's definitely possible.

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<v Speaker 1>But I don't think he was invited there, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>as part of a party or something like that. I

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<v Speaker 1>think people would remember, so he might have broken into

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<v Speaker 1>this house when nobody was there and did god knows what.

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<v Speaker 1>But besides that, I don't know if he was in

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<v Speaker 1>the house as far as you know, invited out for

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<v Speaker 1>a party or something. I think that's a bit of

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<v Speaker 1>a stretch. But all of that said, if what mister

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<v Speaker 1>Ray is saying is true here, then the data puts

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<v Speaker 1>Brian Colberger at the house. I just want to make

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<v Speaker 1>sure I understand correctly because I haven't heard this before.

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<v Speaker 1>So you're saying, based on the data that you saw

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<v Speaker 1>the latitude longitude of Brian Colberger, Samsung was in the

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<v Speaker 1>living room, and NAST the AT and T derived latitude

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<v Speaker 1>longitude from the AT and T network that it estimates

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<v Speaker 1>a location. It lands in the house, and it's a

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<v Speaker 1>twenty five meter range, so we're talking seventy five feet,

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<v Speaker 1>so it could be anywhere in the house, on any floor.

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<v Speaker 1>Ray said, It could technically be outside the house, it

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<v Speaker 1>could be on the property, but it's showing in the

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<v Speaker 1>immediate area. My personal opinion is when I look at

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<v Speaker 1>those and I map what's happening before and after, and

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<v Speaker 1>I'm looking at all the other evidence, I think that

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<v Speaker 1>these are accurate locations. Speaking with Fox News Digital, He

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<v Speaker 1>said he couldn't be certain what Coburger was actually or

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<v Speaker 1>actually went inside, but the geolocation data is damning in

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<v Speaker 1>other ways. So my guess is if he did go

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<v Speaker 1>in the house, like I just said, he broke in

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<v Speaker 1>one way or the other. The door was left open,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, something happened. Speaking with Fox News Digital, he

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<v Speaker 1>said he couldn't be certain that Coburger actually went inside,

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<v Speaker 1>but the geolocation data is damning in other ways. What's

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<v Speaker 1>really telling is there times where he's in that area

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<v Speaker 1>and then you'll see one of the victim's phones move

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<v Speaker 1>over to this little A and W place, and then

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<v Speaker 1>his phone moves over. Ray told Fox News Digital and

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<v Speaker 1>the idea that you know, these are just total random

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<v Speaker 1>and there's no accuracy to it. We're actually seeing phones

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<v Speaker 1>tracked together. Ray said on the podcast that his theory

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<v Speaker 1>is that Mogan was Coberger's primary target due to the

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<v Speaker 1>number of times he could trace their phones to similar locations,

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<v Speaker 1>but he noted later that Mogan was often with Gonsalves

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<v Speaker 1>and their phones moved together a lot. Look, that's been

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<v Speaker 1>my assessment, and the reason I say that is because

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<v Speaker 1>that's where the evidence has led us. Now, granted we

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<v Speaker 1>don't have rock solid evidence, and that's just my theory.

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<v Speaker 1>I believe that Maddie was the target, he said, adding

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<v Speaker 1>that repeated collisions between their phones placed them in roughly

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<v Speaker 1>the same area at the same time, including out a

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<v Speaker 1>Pullman party the first week of school, and at the

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<v Speaker 1>A and W store near the King Road crime scene.

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<v Speaker 1>He also flagged what he described as Coburger's broader pattern

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<v Speaker 1>of life, pointing to evidence of stalking before the murders. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>that was Brian Kolberger. Mister, O'm innocent out here stalking people.

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<v Speaker 1>Because the state's work product didn't use the data, he said.

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<v Speaker 1>His report only pushed back on what the state's witnesses used,

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<v Speaker 1>which he said is lacking and missed the phone collisions entirely.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm unable to locate any period of time between June

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<v Speaker 1>twenty third, twenty twenty two and November thirteenth, twenty twenty

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<v Speaker 1>two where mister Colberger's mobile device is in the same

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<v Speaker 1>specific area as any of the deceased mobile devices. He

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<v Speaker 1>wrote that pattern of life was also broken on the

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<v Speaker 1>night of the murders, when Ray said he believes the

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<v Speaker 1>plant to target Mogan went awry and resulted in him

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<v Speaker 1>fleeing south, where he'd never driven before. Sure sounds a

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<v Speaker 1>lot like my theory, huh, And listen, the only reason

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<v Speaker 1>I think that is because it's the most logical theory

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<v Speaker 1>when we use the evidence we have. But I'm open

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<v Speaker 1>to the evidence wherever it leads us. While prosecutors alleged

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<v Speaker 1>that Colberger had visited the crime scene a dozen times

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<v Speaker 1>before the murders and at least once the morning after,

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<v Speaker 1>they have not pointed to collisions with any of the

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<v Speaker 1>victims the way Ray described in the podcast. In a

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<v Speaker 1>news briefing after Coburger's guilty plead, the case lead investigators

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<v Speaker 1>said they didn't know who the target was. The evidence

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<v Speaker 1>suggested that there was a reason that this particular house

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<v Speaker 1>was chosen. Said then Moscow Police Corporal Brett Payne, what

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<v Speaker 1>the reason is? We don't know. We don't know who

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<v Speaker 1>the target was, and we're not going to speculate on

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<v Speaker 1>that up here today, but we can tell you that

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<v Speaker 1>for whatever reason, mister Coburger chose that residence. Perhaps it's

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<v Speaker 1>the location layout, we don't know. And when they were

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<v Speaker 1>asked by Fox News Digital if they had a motive,

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<v Speaker 1>lead investigators replied, we don't. Ray has maintained that investigators

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<v Speaker 1>missed the evidence and should go back into take another

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<v Speaker 1>look in case Coberger's attempt to withdraw his plea and

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<v Speaker 1>appeal his conviction succeeds. They need to get experts who

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<v Speaker 1>actually know what the hell they're looking at, and they

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<v Speaker 1>need to rebuild the case now, he said. Morgan Wright,

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<v Speaker 1>another expert on digital forensics who's not connected to the case,

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<v Speaker 1>said he's skeptical without seeing the locd BOR data firsthand.

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<v Speaker 1>Show me the report, show me the map, said right,

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<v Speaker 1>the host of Crime Reconstructed and the CEO and founder

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<v Speaker 1>of the National Center for Open and Unsolved Cases, don't

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<v Speaker 1>tell me, show me. Look. I'm with them on that.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's see it. The days of me just trusting people

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<v Speaker 1>are long over. Wright, who's been following the case, that

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<v Speaker 1>he hasn't seen LOCDBOR references in connection with the investigation

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<v Speaker 1>prior to the podcast interview. Ray argues that the records

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<v Speaker 1>speak for themselves if investigators are willing to revisit them.

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<v Speaker 1>After Coburger's guilty plea, Ray said he offered to do

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<v Speaker 1>a debrief with the FBI to show the evidence. He

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<v Speaker 1>said he found and they missed. He said he got

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<v Speaker 1>no response, but added that he has presented before hundreds

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<v Speaker 1>of law enforcement agencies around the country going back to November.

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<v Speaker 1>He said, last week, Coburger filed a petition for a

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<v Speaker 1>post conviction relief, claiming he had ineffective counsel from his

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<v Speaker 1>defense team. So ridiculous, I mean, come on, absolutely ridiculous.

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<v Speaker 1>Ray also speculated that Coberger's post conviction petition was part

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<v Speaker 1>of a broader legal strategy by his lead defense attorney,

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<v Speaker 1>Anne Taylor. Despite the plea agreements waiver of most appeal rights.

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<v Speaker 1>That's possible because Ann Taylor knows her shit. Coburger pleaded

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<v Speaker 1>guilty to avoid the death penalty. This can never be

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<v Speaker 1>the standard investigation that we see in cases. Ray said,

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<v Speaker 1>this can never be acceptable. However, he said he's confident

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<v Speaker 1>Colburger would be convicted any way at trial if investigators

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<v Speaker 1>introduced the evidence he found while working with Taylor. The

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<v Speaker 1>time is now to start this investigation over. Ray said

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<v Speaker 1>Colberger had followed other people in Moscow, Pullmon area. He said,

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<v Speaker 1>a pair of college towns on the border of Washington

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<v Speaker 1>and Idaho. I think he had multiple targets throughout the

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<v Speaker 1>entire Moscow Pullmon area. Ray said, location information and pattern

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<v Speaker 1>of life is by far the most telling. Ray said

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<v Speaker 1>he had no doubt that Coburger committed the murders. If

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<v Speaker 1>he ever does walk, he will kill again. He said, Yo,

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<v Speaker 1>I agree with that, But as far as the other stuff,

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<v Speaker 1>we'll have to wait and see, because I think that

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<v Speaker 1>it's pretty important that we see the documentation, right, So

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<v Speaker 1>will we? I guess that's the question. And like usual,

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<v Speaker 1>we'll continue to follow along and when we have some

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<v Speaker 1>more information, we'll get it added to the catalog. All

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<v Speaker 1>the information that goes with this episode can be found

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<v Speaker 1>in the description box.