1
00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:04,799
Speaker 1: While she was remote viewing. All of a sudden, down

2
00:00:04,839 --> 00:00:10,560
this corridor, this being the shadow person, whatever you want

3
00:00:10,640 --> 00:00:13,839
to call it, came racing towards her. It was giant

4
00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:19,199
size and rushed her and literally booted her completely out

5
00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:22,920
of the complex. While on as we're traveler remote viewing.

6
00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:26,280
Speaker 2: We came up to around about on the left hand side,

7
00:00:26,839 --> 00:00:29,160
we overtook a car that was going because it was

8
00:00:29,199 --> 00:00:31,280
going really slowly. This car in front of us was

9
00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:33,840
going really slowly and we wanted to get to our film,

10
00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:37,000
so we overtook it and we looked to the left

11
00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:41,039
as we were overhiking it and there was nobody in

12
00:00:41,079 --> 00:00:42,799
the car at all.

13
00:00:43,119 --> 00:00:48,320
Speaker 1: I felt this presence literally walk up on me along

14
00:00:48,359 --> 00:00:50,439
the side of the bed and was standing right next

15
00:00:50,439 --> 00:00:50,640
to me.

16
00:00:51,039 --> 00:00:53,320
Speaker 3: The people on the other side were talking about a

17
00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:57,479
level of reality between the earth and the spirit well

18
00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:01,200
that they were contacting which no one was aware of,

19
00:01:01,359 --> 00:01:06,439
and it's it's like another level where there is another

20
00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:10,159
civilization there that exists. They were saved, and they said,

21
00:01:10,159 --> 00:01:13,079
it's not bad, it's not necessarily good. It's just runs

22
00:01:13,079 --> 00:01:17,640
alongside your own civilization, and it's between your world and

23
00:01:17,719 --> 00:01:23,120
our world. You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio Network

24
00:01:23,319 --> 00:02:17,240
and now it's time for the Paranormal peep Show. Now, Hi,

25
00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:19,759
welcome to the Paranormal peep Show on the Paranormal UK

26
00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:23,919
Radio Network, and I'm joined by Andrew Chaplin and special

27
00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:27,680
guest tonight is Mark Johnson calling in from the US

28
00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:32,120
of A. And Mark Johnson runs the Paranormal UK Radio

29
00:02:32,199 --> 00:02:37,280
Network along with Irene Allen Block. So welcome Andy and

30
00:02:37,439 --> 00:02:42,840
welcome Mark. And are you how are you both well?

31
00:02:42,879 --> 00:02:45,159
One out of times I can with one for it?

32
00:02:45,479 --> 00:02:46,520
Speaker 4: Hey deferred, Andy?

33
00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:51,840
Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, how you doing, Neil? So we're for our viewers.

34
00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:55,479
We're we've had huge technical issues in actually trying to

35
00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:58,759
connect to make this happen because since they've deleted Skype,

36
00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:02,120
we've been running around with teams and zoom and goodness

37
00:03:02,159 --> 00:03:04,159
knows what else, and there's so many technical things like

38
00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:07,400
audio and video and connection problems. Isn't it weird? Apparently

39
00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:10,319
we went to the Moon in the nineteen sixties and seventies,

40
00:03:11,159 --> 00:03:13,919
and in all of that time we can't actually get

41
00:03:14,240 --> 00:03:17,800
a proper kind of internet meeting together like in twenty

42
00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:19,840
twenty five. Never mind that nineteen.

43
00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:21,759
Speaker 3: Sec I'm going to revert to a tincam with a

44
00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:24,879
piece of string. I think I think that was fairly reliable.

45
00:03:24,479 --> 00:03:26,400
Speaker 2: Which is pretty much like the moon landings. Anyway.

46
00:03:27,599 --> 00:03:30,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll just put it and we'll have Musk launch

47
00:03:30,159 --> 00:03:32,240
a rocket and to get the string over here.

48
00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:33,919
Speaker 2: Those dude don't rock.

49
00:03:34,159 --> 00:03:36,120
Speaker 3: Do you think with all these satellites in the sky,

50
00:03:36,199 --> 00:03:38,800
all these streams of satellites connecting, we'll at least been

51
00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:41,439
against something that. I mean, we obviously have finally connected,

52
00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:44,639
but it took a long dime. And I'd just like

53
00:03:44,719 --> 00:03:47,360
to voice my public opinion. I think everyone's in agreement

54
00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:51,280
that Skype was working fairly well. Yes, and they've discuided

55
00:03:51,319 --> 00:03:55,599
to cancel it and Microsoft Teams, well, sod that for

56
00:03:55,639 --> 00:03:57,280
a game of soldiers.

57
00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:00,199
Speaker 2: I mean, if it works, why try and fix it.

58
00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:02,319
If it ain't broken, don't fix.

59
00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:03,520
Speaker 4: It, because that's their brand.

60
00:04:03,599 --> 00:04:07,599
Speaker 5: That's why they bond Skype to get rid of it. Yeah,

61
00:04:07,639 --> 00:04:10,919
today I am about to push their own product, Microsoft Teams,

62
00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:14,080
which I don't know what I can say here.

63
00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:18,160
Speaker 2: But well, let's just say it's performing as well as

64
00:04:18,279 --> 00:04:21,360
their windows and as well as their vaccines.

65
00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:26,680
Speaker 3: There you go, He'll fly me and so Mark, how

66
00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,399
are you, first of all, well.

67
00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:32,680
Speaker 1: It's been an interesting last several months, that's for sure.

68
00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:34,920
I've been dealing with some health issues and whatnot, but

69
00:04:35,759 --> 00:04:41,120
helping Irene get her not one, but two books published

70
00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:44,040
within the last couple of months, which we'll talk about

71
00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:47,519
here in a moment, and she and I are currently

72
00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:51,399
working on one together, which is going to be a

73
00:04:51,519 --> 00:04:56,079
very all encompassing book on the paranormal, going into detail

74
00:04:56,199 --> 00:05:02,519
on different experiences we've had, both together separately, and just

75
00:05:02,879 --> 00:05:08,000
trying to go into some familiar experiences that people have

76
00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:12,079
to go into more detailed explanations, some that a lot

77
00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:14,720
of people may not have thought of. Every night from

78
00:05:14,759 --> 00:05:19,759
dealing with demons especially, that's her, that's her specialty. Mine

79
00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:23,360
is dealing with the more wonky aspects of time and

80
00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:25,519
multiple dimensions and things like that.

81
00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:32,319
Speaker 3: So you've got Irene's book there, which Irene has kind

82
00:05:32,319 --> 00:05:36,040
of selected you as a spokesperson for it. So, yes,

83
00:05:36,439 --> 00:05:38,959
you've worked on it. So you know the book fairly well.

84
00:05:39,120 --> 00:05:42,759
Speaker 1: Yes, so the one the one of the two books

85
00:05:42,759 --> 00:05:44,800
we have. Well, unfortunately I don't have the book in

86
00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:46,920
front of me. I went into a friend and having

87
00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:51,079
on a back yet walking with the Dead, which is

88
00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:58,399
her autobiography of growing up as a psychic medium and dealing.

89
00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:01,639
Speaker 4: With all the.

90
00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:05,519
Speaker 1: Really crazy things that she has experienced in her life

91
00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,959
that so many people don't know about. She talks about

92
00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,439
a few on our own radio show, The Paranormal UK

93
00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:16,040
Radio Show, but this goes into so much more detail.

94
00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:19,199
In fact, after reading the book, I was surprised because

95
00:06:19,199 --> 00:06:22,560
she and I've been friends for over a decade now,

96
00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:25,279
and there's things that I didn't even know that I

97
00:06:25,399 --> 00:06:30,160
found to be fascinating, totally fascinating. And then she also

98
00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:34,839
wrote this fictional book called Mysterious Tales of the Unseen,

99
00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:40,279
which is a collection of paranormal themes, short stories kind

100
00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:43,439
of in the vein of the old like nineteen forties

101
00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:47,399
or serial like that would pear in newspaper magazines. That

102
00:06:47,759 --> 00:06:50,639
it has that vibe to it, and there's some really

103
00:06:50,759 --> 00:06:53,639
creepy stuff in here, a lot of it based on

104
00:06:54,439 --> 00:06:58,000
some based on personal experiences, but it is a fictionalized

105
00:06:58,120 --> 00:07:03,360
version short stories. They are really well done and that

106
00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:04,319
is now available.

107
00:07:05,319 --> 00:07:10,360
Speaker 2: Did you say Mark that Ireen specialties dealing with demons?

108
00:07:11,040 --> 00:07:16,000
Speaker 1: Yes, well it was, It wasn't the she's kind of

109
00:07:16,199 --> 00:07:19,759
retired right now, but we still look into some cases.

110
00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:24,199
Speaker 2: Occasionally I want she differentiate between a demon and say

111
00:07:24,439 --> 00:07:27,720
a pistol for angry negative human spirit.

112
00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:33,319
Speaker 1: She doesn't usually like me talking like this, but you know,

113
00:07:33,439 --> 00:07:36,439
because she doesn't like labels and terms. But just so

114
00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:41,959
people understand that she is, without a doubt, probably the

115
00:07:41,959 --> 00:07:47,600
most incredibly talented psychic medium I've ever met. And she

116
00:07:47,759 --> 00:07:49,839
has done most of her work. I mean, she did

117
00:07:49,879 --> 00:07:52,439
a lot of work on in person there in the UK,

118
00:07:53,360 --> 00:08:00,000
but her organization Spirit Rescue International helped people literally all

119
00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:03,360
all over the world. Because one of Irene's other specialties

120
00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:08,680
is being a remote viewer, and so using remote viewing

121
00:08:08,879 --> 00:08:12,920
she is able. She's helped people with cases as far

122
00:08:12,959 --> 00:08:16,680
away as New Zealand, well cases here in the States.

123
00:08:17,519 --> 00:08:23,120
She can tune in to a location and see what's there, right,

124
00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:27,360
and as far as telling a demon from a irate

125
00:08:27,519 --> 00:08:32,200
human spirit, which they can be pretty nasty sometimes there

126
00:08:33,279 --> 00:08:35,240
if there are a holes in life, there a holes

127
00:08:35,279 --> 00:08:35,679
in death.

128
00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,200
Speaker 4: So but it's their energy.

129
00:08:38,879 --> 00:08:43,039
Speaker 1: It's the energy that these entities or these spirits give off,

130
00:08:43,159 --> 00:08:47,919
and the what we would refer to as demonic gives

131
00:08:47,919 --> 00:08:51,080
off a much more intense negative energy.

132
00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:57,039
Speaker 2: M I found that when I went back to kind

133
00:08:57,039 --> 00:09:02,360
of like uh progression into the into spiritualism and kind

134
00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:06,879
of like mediumistic things. Myself. I was getting problems with

135
00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:11,559
negative entities when I was practicing remote viewing myself. Do

136
00:09:11,639 --> 00:09:14,759
you think that remote viewing somehow opens the door not

137
00:09:14,799 --> 00:09:17,360
only to the good things and kind of like the

138
00:09:18,039 --> 00:09:21,840
interesting things in life, but also opens the possibility of

139
00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:23,480
a door of other things coming in that are not

140
00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:24,240
quite so nice.

141
00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:30,279
Speaker 1: Well, in dealing with anything involving remote viewing or astral traveling,

142
00:09:30,879 --> 00:09:34,440
there is a part of the person, their consciousness or

143
00:09:34,639 --> 00:09:39,440
their spirit so to speak, is like astral traveling in

144
00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:44,159
that you're projecting yourself into another location to view it

145
00:09:44,879 --> 00:09:49,840
or remote work work through it. And you know, it's

146
00:09:49,879 --> 00:09:53,600
like the moth to a flame. You know, they can

147
00:09:53,840 --> 00:09:59,080
these entities can sense your presence, your energy, your light,

148
00:10:00,080 --> 00:10:03,240
and you have to make sure you are properly.

149
00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:08,720
Speaker 3: Protected most prestigures would Irene typically do.

150
00:10:08,879 --> 00:10:18,960
Speaker 1: For protection, she has help from. I don't think we

151
00:10:19,039 --> 00:10:22,480
ever clarified what to call them, but there are angelic

152
00:10:23,039 --> 00:10:27,000
type beings or spirits that she has worked with, other

153
00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:31,480
types of entities that have come through and worked to

154
00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:34,720
protect her and help her during these cases, especially when

155
00:10:34,759 --> 00:10:40,639
doing a clearing of a location, because you know, with

156
00:10:40,799 --> 00:10:45,039
getting rid of a demonic force human spirits, you just

157
00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:46,279
need to coax them to.

158
00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:48,399
Speaker 4: Move on to the other side.

159
00:10:49,159 --> 00:10:54,679
Speaker 1: But demonics need to be pretty much forced out. And

160
00:10:56,960 --> 00:11:02,480
you know, energy cannot be destroyed, and so it's basically

161
00:11:02,519 --> 00:11:05,879
pushing the energy out somewhere else. The demons aren't destroyed.

162
00:11:05,919 --> 00:11:08,440
They can think, go somewhere else or do whatever, but

163
00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:13,200
it's pushing them out of the location, and then you know,

164
00:11:13,519 --> 00:11:14,759
not letting them back in.

165
00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:18,720
Speaker 2: Where do you think they get shoved to. Would it be,

166
00:11:18,879 --> 00:11:22,360
for instance, another realm and another reality, or would it

167
00:11:22,399 --> 00:11:26,000
simply be another location on Earth than bugging someone else's house.

168
00:11:27,840 --> 00:11:30,000
Speaker 1: That's a good question, to be honest, I don't know

169
00:11:30,039 --> 00:11:33,480
if anybody really has that answer. And I've believed that

170
00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:37,759
these demonic and again I use the term loosely because

171
00:11:37,799 --> 00:11:40,360
I'm not using it from a religious perspective, just so

172
00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:43,960
people understand they have a better idea of the type

173
00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:47,600
of negative energies we're talking about. I believe that they

174
00:11:47,639 --> 00:11:50,080
can wander around the earth, they could try to find

175
00:11:50,240 --> 00:11:54,320
someone else. Usually in these cases, sometimes people in a

176
00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:58,279
location have invited it in somehow, either they're playing around

177
00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:02,879
with the occult, or even if somebody is really troubled

178
00:12:03,039 --> 00:12:06,879
they're going through some hard times mental illness maybe or whatnot.

179
00:12:07,240 --> 00:12:10,720
They have that low vibrational energy which attracts these things

180
00:12:11,159 --> 00:12:14,639
because there's a lot of them. I call them paranormal parasites.

181
00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:19,320
They feed on negative energy, like a mosquito. And if

182
00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:21,879
you're putting off the energy that they can feed on

183
00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:23,919
and grow stronger, they will.

184
00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:25,840
Speaker 4: Attach to you or a location.

185
00:12:28,639 --> 00:12:30,919
Speaker 1: But I think they also fliterate and out of our

186
00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:38,240
dimension or our realm, because you know, our physical reality

187
00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:41,720
is just one of many, many, many different realities and planes.

188
00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:45,039
So and I believe they're perfectly capable of going in,

189
00:12:45,159 --> 00:12:49,960
going out whatever wherever their vibrational frequency will allow them

190
00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:52,600
to go. Obviously, they're going to have trouble going to

191
00:12:52,639 --> 00:12:57,159
any place with a higher vibrational frequency because theirs is

192
00:12:57,200 --> 00:12:58,000
so low.

193
00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:02,679
Speaker 2: I mean this that this is a theory of Sorry,

194
00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:04,279
I was just gonna say, there's this theory of lush,

195
00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:08,159
isn't it isn't there these these negative beings feeding off loosh.

196
00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:10,639
Have you heard that's spelled l H.

197
00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:12,960
Speaker 4: No, I haven't heard of lush before.

198
00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:15,639
Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, So it's it's you could you could look

199
00:13:15,639 --> 00:13:17,240
it up and people listening to this can look it

200
00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:19,320
up as well. I think it's spelled l U c

201
00:13:19,639 --> 00:13:23,240
h E. And the idea is exactly what you said, Mark,

202
00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:26,759
that these negative beings they feed off fear, they feed

203
00:13:26,799 --> 00:13:29,240
off hatred, they feed off I mean, it's something like

204
00:13:29,279 --> 00:13:32,759
a concentration camp historically would be like an absolute feeding

205
00:13:32,919 --> 00:13:37,960
frenzy for negative beings. But yeah, the lush apparently is

206
00:13:39,519 --> 00:13:42,080
what they're feeding off. Neil, you're going to say something.

207
00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, Now, I was just thinking back to, you know, like,

208
00:13:44,639 --> 00:13:47,159
where do these entities go when they've been cast down?

209
00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:49,519
And I just remember back to I mean, I'm not

210
00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:52,000
religious in the slightest, but I kind of always have

211
00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:58,159
debates with religion religionists or apologetics on on on the

212
00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:01,360
Christian side of things. But it's interesting. I think in

213
00:14:01,399 --> 00:14:05,000
the Bible where Jesus cast out a demon or demons

214
00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:08,360
from might be a man or a girl, I can't

215
00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:10,600
remember who it was now. I think in the Late

216
00:14:10,799 --> 00:14:14,039
Editions Bible they actually said, oh, this person suffered from epilepsy.

217
00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:15,440
So it's a bit of a strange thing to have

218
00:14:15,639 --> 00:14:17,519
mentioned in the Bible that someone had epilepsy.

219
00:14:17,559 --> 00:14:20,360
Speaker 1: But then someone's trying to do revision this history there,

220
00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:21,360
because that.

221
00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:23,480
Speaker 4: Is not what the Bible. They didn't know, that's right.

222
00:14:23,759 --> 00:14:28,960
Speaker 3: It someddenly became very medical. Yeah, but apparently Jesus cast

223
00:14:29,039 --> 00:14:32,200
these these demons out and they went into pigs, a

224
00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:34,879
lot of swine, and that then ran and jumped off

225
00:14:34,919 --> 00:14:35,919
a cliff or something.

226
00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:38,120
Speaker 2: And this is why they don't eat pork.

227
00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:41,720
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I mean, pigs are considered in that kind

228
00:14:41,759 --> 00:14:44,840
of region around that time and probably still to this

229
00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:48,759
time as dirty animals, and so they consider he put.

230
00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:52,679
Speaker 1: The big route mud and the filth and yeah, and yeah,

231
00:14:52,759 --> 00:14:58,440
that they're purity laws. Back then especially it was considered unclean.

232
00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:01,639
That's why they couldn't eat pork. Hmm, Not so much

233
00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:05,320
because of demons as just because they rooted around in

234
00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,360
the mud. So they figured they were certainly.

235
00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:09,360
Speaker 3: You can get you can get bare black bacon, you

236
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:12,480
can get smoky bacon, you can get demon flavored bacon.

237
00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:16,080
Well that'd be interesting to put under the grill.

238
00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:19,679
Speaker 1: What if I have a little bit does that have

239
00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:21,399
like a little ghost pepper kick to it?

240
00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:28,720
Speaker 3: So once, I mean, when when Irene's doing her like

241
00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:32,320
remote viewing and she can do it like as far

242
00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:36,519
places as for instance, New Zealand you mentioned, how would

243
00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:39,559
she what she do look at a map and focus

244
00:15:39,559 --> 00:15:42,200
on a target area or coordinates given to her or something.

245
00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:44,159
Speaker 1: Of course, a lot of this goes back a lot

246
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:47,759
of years, so, but she had ways of tuning into

247
00:15:47,799 --> 00:15:50,720
a location of me if they sent her a picture

248
00:15:50,759 --> 00:15:53,120
of the front of the house or something, and she

249
00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:55,720
could go there and look at it from above. I

250
00:15:55,759 --> 00:15:58,159
even worked on a couple of cases more recently with

251
00:15:58,279 --> 00:16:01,600
her where she's able to see above and then get

252
00:16:01,639 --> 00:16:05,879
whatever feelings she's getting there, then project herself into.

253
00:16:05,559 --> 00:16:07,240
Speaker 3: The house and.

254
00:16:08,919 --> 00:16:14,159
Speaker 1: See what's there, pick up whatever energy's there. And sometimes

255
00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:18,559
it's trying to disguise itself, sometimes it's hiding. There's so

256
00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:24,600
many cases of demonic activity where like a perfect example

257
00:16:24,639 --> 00:16:28,279
would be the Sally House hauntings in Kansas that were

258
00:16:28,279 --> 00:16:32,519
really made famous on TV back in the nineties with

259
00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:37,000
the show's sightings and the family there started seeing this

260
00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:41,360
little girl spirit and this is a very common type

261
00:16:41,559 --> 00:16:44,840
of beginning to this type of haunting. They see a

262
00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:48,279
little girl or child spirit and then of course the

263
00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:53,559
homeowners or the family starts feeling empathy towards the spirit

264
00:16:53,679 --> 00:16:57,600
and not knowing it's a trick, not knowing that these

265
00:16:57,759 --> 00:17:00,399
entities can project themselves as anything they want. But once

266
00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:05,079
you start giving it energy, start sympathizing with it, talking

267
00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:08,759
to it, whatever, you're basically inviting it in to attach

268
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:12,240
to you your energy, which it starts feeding on. And

269
00:17:12,279 --> 00:17:15,799
this is why if you read most demonic cases, they

270
00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:18,559
start off small and then they slowly start getting bigger

271
00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:21,359
and bigger and bigger, because it's the more they feed,

272
00:17:22,279 --> 00:17:23,680
the more powerful they get.

273
00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:25,319
Speaker 4: Here in our physical.

274
00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:29,839
Speaker 2: Realm, there's there's an analogy with that. Apparently, if you

275
00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:32,920
get two tuning forks and you ding one, the other

276
00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:36,240
one will start resonating to that tuning fork. So in

277
00:17:36,799 --> 00:17:40,240
a similar way, if you kind of imagine a person

278
00:17:40,279 --> 00:17:43,720
as a tuning fork, if they give off a resonance

279
00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:46,359
and they give that resonance to this other being and

280
00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:49,000
they start resonating at the same vibration, they're going to

281
00:17:49,319 --> 00:17:52,799
create a connection that works both positive and negative. So

282
00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:55,279
it can work in a positive way in terms of

283
00:17:55,319 --> 00:17:58,640
working with angelic realms and with God or high consciousness

284
00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:01,640
or guide, but unfortunate they also can work on lower

285
00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:02,440
levels as well.

286
00:18:04,079 --> 00:18:07,599
Speaker 1: The one thing I found fascinating going through all of

287
00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:14,119
Irene's accounts and with dealing with demonic type hauntings is

288
00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:17,799
how different every single one is. You know, there are

289
00:18:17,839 --> 00:18:21,319
people who come in. Actually, what would usually happen in

290
00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:23,799
a lot of these cases the people would call on

291
00:18:23,839 --> 00:18:26,519
a local medium and psychic who didn't know what the

292
00:18:26,519 --> 00:18:29,759
heck they were doing, and they'd stir things up and

293
00:18:29,799 --> 00:18:33,359
make things even worse, and then she be called finally

294
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:35,039
be the one called, and she'd have to go in

295
00:18:35,079 --> 00:18:38,000
and clean up their mess. And usually by that time

296
00:18:38,079 --> 00:18:42,119
it's much more dangerous because these people did not know

297
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:47,400
what they were doing and stirred it up. So but

298
00:18:47,559 --> 00:18:55,640
they she would always meditate and tune in to you know,

299
00:18:55,880 --> 00:19:00,920
whoever or whatever works with her and comes up with

300
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:04,519
what she needs to do for each case. And again

301
00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:10,119
it's in the book. It's fascinating because they're so wildly different.

302
00:19:10,839 --> 00:19:13,720
In one case, she had to work with colors. She

303
00:19:13,839 --> 00:19:18,119
was told work with the colored green for this specific case.

304
00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:22,119
Another case was she was told to come in from

305
00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:28,720
a very Christian oriented perspective, even though she's not religious,

306
00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:32,079
but that's what she had to do in order to

307
00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:36,160
get this spirit, this negative entity out of the house.

308
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,599
So every case is unique and different, and you need

309
00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:44,599
a different approach. So these people who come in doing

310
00:19:44,599 --> 00:19:48,279
their own little stick every time waving sage around. One

311
00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:52,640
of her favorite favorite sayings is, you know what happens

312
00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:54,359
when you burn sage in your house?

313
00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:59,119
Speaker 4: We stink it up. That's all it does.

314
00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:04,920
Speaker 1: But in some cases, though, and this is another thing

315
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,880
people don't understand. A lot of people don't understand burning

316
00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:14,440
stage doesn't do a darn thing. However, your intention is

317
00:20:14,519 --> 00:20:19,359
what gives the energy to it. If you believe in

318
00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:22,680
that stage that it's going to absolutely do the job,

319
00:20:23,599 --> 00:20:25,240
then that's what gives it power.

320
00:20:25,799 --> 00:20:29,440
Speaker 2: A mission't slip as but Shaw would say it was.

321
00:20:30,319 --> 00:20:34,440
Speaker 1: It's it's still you know, inanimate object. Yeah, there's no

322
00:20:34,519 --> 00:20:37,759
spiritual qualities to it. All people have crystals, people have

323
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:41,200
put salt around the house. You know, if I was

324
00:20:42,160 --> 00:20:44,799
you know, salting a bland meal, maybe, but you know,

325
00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:48,559
doesn't do anything. But again, it's all about intent. What

326
00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:51,839
you put into it is what will make it work.

327
00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:55,000
And again depends on the level of an intent that

328
00:20:55,039 --> 00:20:57,200
you're able to put into it. And in a lot

329
00:20:57,200 --> 00:20:59,359
of cases it needs a lot more power than most

330
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:00,519
people can get.

331
00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:03,359
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that's the same thing could be said

332
00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:05,759
for kind of like Holy Water and the Bible. It's

333
00:21:05,799 --> 00:21:08,960
not so much the objects themselves, it's the belief and

334
00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:12,960
the intent. Yeah. Now this is a really interesting one.

335
00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:13,680
Speaker 1: Mark.

336
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,559
Speaker 2: There is a theory, and I came across this a

337
00:21:16,599 --> 00:21:20,400
while back. There was a theory that before humans were

338
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:23,359
on this Earth, there was another species that was a

339
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:29,680
demonic race or a race of beings that weren't particularly negative,

340
00:21:29,759 --> 00:21:32,400
but they were just kind of their own beings. And

341
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:36,720
then humans came along, invaded Earth so to speak, or

342
00:21:36,759 --> 00:21:39,400
took over booted them out, and that's why they've got

343
00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:43,200
such negative feelings and caused chaos amongst humans because they

344
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:45,759
want to kind of get revenge or get their planet back.

345
00:21:45,799 --> 00:21:47,880
Have you heard across this as.

346
00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:51,160
Speaker 1: I've heard similar stories and in fact, if you want

347
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:56,400
to look at it from let's say some apocryphal writings

348
00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,559
Book of Enoch or whatnot, which talks about the Watchers,

349
00:21:59,599 --> 00:22:02,839
but there's also the stories of the war in Heaven

350
00:22:03,079 --> 00:22:09,799
and Satan basically being jealous of humanity. God creates humans.

351
00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:14,559
Satan was top dog there for a long time, and

352
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:18,480
when God created humans, they got jealous and they refused

353
00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:22,039
to bow down to humans, which caused the war in

354
00:22:22,079 --> 00:22:26,680
heaven and Lucifer Satan got kicked out, and he took

355
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:30,440
all of everyone who sided with him with him. Now,

356
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:34,839
I sometimes have problems with that, because you know, angels

357
00:22:34,839 --> 00:22:38,519
in Heaven's bostaly, good, high vibration. Why they suddenly turned

358
00:22:38,519 --> 00:22:42,599
into demons possessing people and doing all sorts of evil.

359
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:43,720
Speaker 4: I just, I don't know.

360
00:22:44,559 --> 00:22:46,799
Speaker 1: I think it's just allegories. I think it's just ways

361
00:22:46,839 --> 00:22:49,240
of trying to explain some of the activity we have.

362
00:22:50,319 --> 00:22:54,359
But to your point, Andrew, what you said makes a

363
00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:56,799
lot of sense in terms of what I look at

364
00:22:56,880 --> 00:23:02,759
as elemental spirits, the ones that have never been incarnated

365
00:23:02,799 --> 00:23:07,880
as human that can be really nasty. But I also

366
00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:11,799
don't think that they're necessarily evil per se. But they

367
00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:16,200
can more like human beings. Some can be good, some

368
00:23:16,279 --> 00:23:20,039
can be bad. They're all still human beings. Even the

369
00:23:20,079 --> 00:23:24,440
old folklore, the fairy stories, the fay, you know, some

370
00:23:24,519 --> 00:23:27,559
could be good, some would could be really nasty to you.

371
00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:28,799
Speaker 4: Even the Middle.

372
00:23:28,559 --> 00:23:31,480
Speaker 1: East, the Gin the exact same way they tried to

373
00:23:31,519 --> 00:23:35,440
separate them by colors, red gins being nasty, blue gins

374
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:39,240
being I don't know, I forget the color steep, but yeah,

375
00:23:39,279 --> 00:23:46,759
it's every race or every type you know, has varying

376
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,720
levels of how they're going to Behave you.

377
00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:52,119
Speaker 2: Went to the fairy thing on't you?

378
00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:55,640
Speaker 3: Now? Yeah? I was just thinking, Actually, something I read

379
00:23:55,720 --> 00:24:00,119
recently where someone was talking about how they protect them

380
00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:03,839
cells against fairies and the confusion that they can throw out.

381
00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:09,519
And this person, supposedly, if I recall the story correctly,

382
00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:12,200
was with a load of scientists out in the field.

383
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:13,680
I think this is from a conference I went to

384
00:24:13,759 --> 00:24:16,079
that it was mentioned. I went to this cryptid conference

385
00:24:16,559 --> 00:24:20,000
at the at the weekend, and someone there was talking

386
00:24:20,039 --> 00:24:22,799
about fairies and stuff, and this this person was saying

387
00:24:22,799 --> 00:24:28,400
about how they were getting confused by the fay out

388
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:31,640
in this location somewhere. So the person who was like

389
00:24:31,839 --> 00:24:36,960
leading this little expedition was leading with some scientific types.

390
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,880
I don't know if they weren't necessarily scientists, but I

391
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:43,960
kind of got the impression they were more more academic

392
00:24:44,039 --> 00:24:47,839
types or something, you know. And this person said, Okay,

393
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:50,400
to stop this confusion at what we're getting confused about.

394
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:52,759
What you've got to do is take your coat, turn

395
00:24:52,799 --> 00:24:55,440
it inside out and then put it on inside out

396
00:24:55,759 --> 00:24:58,640
and all these academics just said, yeah, okay, we'll do that,

397
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:01,680
and they even though it went against their logic, they

398
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,680
took their coats off turn them inside out to protect

399
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,960
themselves against any confusion of the faith. I don't know.

400
00:25:08,279 --> 00:25:10,079
I mean, someone else could probably write in and tell

401
00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:11,680
me what that means. I'm going to have to look

402
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:13,759
into that because I have heard it before, but I

403
00:25:13,759 --> 00:25:17,119
can't remember the whole reason. But it kind of turns

404
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,839
the world on its head and you'll fight in the

405
00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:23,480
confusion with confusion or something. Maybe maybe it's something like that.

406
00:25:23,799 --> 00:25:25,359
I don't know how it turned out of the end

407
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:27,359
for the academics and this person out in the field,

408
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:29,119
but hopefully it was okay for.

409
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:32,880
Speaker 1: Maybe they're still out there winding around confused.

410
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:39,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, with real bad fashion. So with the thing about

411
00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,960
the demons is that a lot of these kind of

412
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:47,039
exorcisms are being performed by members of the Catholic Church,

413
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:50,079
and I wonder, you know all this stuff, like you

414
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:51,960
used to talk about the sage that they're coming at

415
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:54,680
it with the Bible and holy water and stuff like that.

416
00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:59,079
And then Irene had to come and do one particular

417
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,799
kind of scicism for one of them with a very

418
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,559
Christian approach. So I wonder that it's the family that

419
00:26:06,599 --> 00:26:09,920
she was dealing with very Christian orientate for them to

420
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:11,079
kind of accept.

421
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:15,440
Speaker 1: Her or the entity, And I believe this was the case.

422
00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:19,359
In this particular case. The entity turned out to be

423
00:26:19,519 --> 00:26:23,119
not so much demonic as what we talked about earlier,

424
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:27,640
a very ira pissed off human spirit that could still

425
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:33,720
simulate demonic type activity because they're so negative, But maybe

426
00:26:33,759 --> 00:26:37,960
they were also very religious in life or they believe that,

427
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,839
you know, even if they're bad, they're still afraid of

428
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:43,319
going to Hell. That's why they're don't cross over and

429
00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:47,079
they continue their bad behavior. And so she used the

430
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:51,480
religion as a way to get to them the religious practices,

431
00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:53,440
because that's what that entity believed in.

432
00:26:54,079 --> 00:26:58,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a psychological approach, isn't it, bars He It's the.

433
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:03,279
Speaker 4: Same way of over here, you know, or in the UK.

434
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:07,440
Speaker 1: What you know, you have a predominantly Christian type nation,

435
00:27:08,519 --> 00:27:14,160
but yet you would not send a Buddhist monk over

436
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:17,200
here to do an exoricism in a house that the

437
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,720
family practices Christianity.

438
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:21,440
Speaker 4: And because it's.

439
00:27:21,279 --> 00:27:25,400
Speaker 1: Not probably not going to work, you have to fine

440
00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:31,720
tune your approach based on what you're able, what you're

441
00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:34,279
dealing with, and of course Irene is able to figure

442
00:27:34,319 --> 00:27:37,880
that out not only through the vibration of the entity,

443
00:27:38,039 --> 00:27:44,079
but also tapping in meditating, getting instructions from her guides

444
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:49,240
or her tag team as I sometimes call them, to

445
00:27:49,279 --> 00:27:52,240
tell her and give her information on how to handle

446
00:27:52,319 --> 00:27:54,240
those those types of entities.

447
00:27:54,839 --> 00:27:57,359
Speaker 2: Where do you think that the color comes in? Like,

448
00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:00,920
because I know somebody that works with colors, and the

449
00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:05,119
colors are green, and yellow and blue are very important,

450
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:09,279
and they she goes into it quite in depth. But

451
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:12,160
each each color has a different resonance. So when I

452
00:28:12,279 --> 00:28:14,279
mean's working with the color with a case, what do

453
00:28:14,319 --> 00:28:15,319
you think is going on there?

454
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,880
Speaker 1: I know that in her case she just used whatever

455
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:24,640
color she was told to use. She didn't fully understand it.

456
00:28:26,079 --> 00:28:32,119
I have done some training as a shamanic practitioner a

457
00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:36,720
few years ago, and one of the healing classes that

458
00:28:36,759 --> 00:28:40,759
we took was all about healing with color and different colors,

459
00:28:40,799 --> 00:28:44,839
having that different vibration and depending on Again, it's the

460
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:50,559
same thing. It's meditating or in shamanism, it's journeying and

461
00:28:50,599 --> 00:28:53,200
picking up on the information on what is best going

462
00:28:53,279 --> 00:28:57,279
to work towards whatever the illness is, what color will work?

463
00:28:57,319 --> 00:29:00,559
The vibration, because colors are as we see them, are

464
00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:05,880
light energy vibrating at certain frequencies, and that frequency comes

465
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:10,480
into our retinas, our eyes, and that's the color we see.

466
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:15,599
Colors themselves really don't exist. It's our brain interpreting frequencies.

467
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:16,799
Speaker 2: That's interesting.

468
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,279
Speaker 3: It's interesting because they recently announced that they discovered a

469
00:29:21,319 --> 00:29:25,000
new color. I heard, okay, yeah, it's something like a

470
00:29:25,039 --> 00:29:28,920
special type of green. I think it was, but not so.

471
00:29:29,799 --> 00:29:32,960
I don't know, you know, how they suddenly discover a

472
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,200
new color, because I mean they're looking at your prism

473
00:29:35,279 --> 00:29:37,400
with a piece of paper. Oh what's that little one there?

474
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:40,359
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure, Neil. And if they flashed it up,

475
00:29:40,359 --> 00:29:41,240
we just go green.

476
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, just a very in tone of green, you know,

477
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:46,880
like dark green, light green or.

478
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:50,640
Speaker 1: Or I work in photoshop a lot, and when you

479
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:54,720
come in for selecting a text color or whatever, the

480
00:29:54,759 --> 00:29:57,799
big collar bar things comes up and you can select

481
00:29:57,799 --> 00:30:00,200
the major color you want to work with, whether it's

482
00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,839
blue or green or gold yellowish, and then when the

483
00:30:03,839 --> 00:30:07,160
box pops up, there's everything from the white all the

484
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:09,920
way down to black, and then all the variations of

485
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:14,400
that color in between, and each one is really a

486
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:20,839
different color. It's but they're lighter, darker shades. It's so

487
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:24,640
there's there's unlimited colors. Yeah, that it could be and

488
00:30:24,799 --> 00:30:27,920
putting names to it. Yeah, we're all kind of proteges

489
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,200
a photo sheolp, and we know exactly what you're doing about.

490
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:33,039
It's when you want to try and pick the same

491
00:30:33,119 --> 00:30:34,240
color again the next day.

492
00:30:34,519 --> 00:30:36,160
Speaker 3: Now, what color was that? Because there's all these little

493
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:43,079
hashtags of the hashtags. Yeah, yeah, So as I really

494
00:30:43,079 --> 00:30:45,480
ever come off badly as a result of any of

495
00:30:45,519 --> 00:30:48,400
these encounters, or she always got a lot of protection

496
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,079
and being okay.

497
00:30:50,279 --> 00:30:54,519
Speaker 1: Well she I've been talking in the middle of talking

498
00:30:54,559 --> 00:30:57,839
to her. It wasn't really on a case, but there

499
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,160
have been times she's come under psychic attack, something was

500
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:06,559
attacking her and all of a sudden, Usually at that time,

501
00:31:06,599 --> 00:31:11,319
we were just texting back and forth through Skyte, Microsoft,

502
00:31:11,519 --> 00:31:15,440
and all of a sudden, her everything is starts coming

503
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:19,160
through jumbled, and I was just able to make out

504
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:21,400
a couple of things that she was in the middle

505
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,759
of a psychic attack. It's almost like in the middle

506
00:31:23,759 --> 00:31:27,759
of having a seizure. And it took a few minutes

507
00:31:28,599 --> 00:31:31,920
before she started coming back to normal because something was

508
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:36,720
attacking her at that time. In most of these cases,

509
00:31:38,079 --> 00:31:43,319
she hasn't been personally attacked or she's had protection, but

510
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:45,839
she sets up that protection for she even goes in,

511
00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:49,599
and she knows she's done the work beforehand. She knows

512
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:52,680
exactly what kind of protection she's going to need. But

513
00:31:52,759 --> 00:31:56,039
getting hit out of the blue or suddenly, I mean

514
00:31:56,079 --> 00:31:59,680
even at her house, her house which is actually featured

515
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:04,039
in the because she's talked about the ghosts in her house,

516
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:07,559
which there's three of them from the turn of the century,

517
00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:13,759
last century that once lived there. But the land where

518
00:32:13,799 --> 00:32:17,519
it sits on some lay lines. There's some portals around,

519
00:32:17,599 --> 00:32:20,119
and she gets a lot of transient stuff coming through,

520
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,200
and every now and then there's this one that comes through.

521
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:29,279
She calls the stinker because it literally gives off bad odors.

522
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:34,200
And when I was over there visiting back in twenty

523
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:36,079
twenty three, when you and I got to meet Neil,

524
00:32:38,519 --> 00:32:41,200
I experienced that myself one day because I walked into

525
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:45,039
this hallway and there was this kind of sharp ranscest.

526
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:46,920
The only way I can describe it is it smelled

527
00:32:47,039 --> 00:32:52,400
like marijuana, and that sharp, pungent type smell. It smelled

528
00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:54,200
like it, and yet it didn't. It had its own

529
00:32:55,039 --> 00:32:57,000
odor to it. And I asked her, I go, what

530
00:32:57,119 --> 00:32:59,920
is this smell? And within a few minutes it disappeared.

531
00:33:00,079 --> 00:33:01,960
Speaker 3: It was gone.

532
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,400
Speaker 4: So it.

533
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:09,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, these things, you know, can come and go, and

534
00:33:10,079 --> 00:33:13,960
different things come in and she just uses whatever protection

535
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:18,079
is necessary if something. In fact, when I was there,

536
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:21,039
she had an experience which she really won't tell me

537
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:26,559
much about where One night, I was in the guest

538
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:31,359
room and I was lying there and I wear blind

539
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,480
blindfolds because I just don't want to see any light

540
00:33:34,559 --> 00:33:39,680
at all, keeps me awake. And I felt this presence

541
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:43,240
literally walk up on me along the side of the

542
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,640
bed and was standing right next to me. And I

543
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:49,680
feel it because my heart starts palpitating. I can just

544
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,839
feel the presence around me. And yet for whatever reason,

545
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:56,640
I didn't take the blind off, I didn't try to look,

546
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:00,759
and after a minute or two it went away. Well,

547
00:34:00,759 --> 00:34:03,119
I found out later that night that something had came

548
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:06,240
into her room and she saw this big shadow in

549
00:34:06,319 --> 00:34:10,360
the corner and she said it felt pretty negative and

550
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,320
she was like keeping her protection up and pretty much

551
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:19,039
telling it to naf Off. And again she's vague on

552
00:34:19,039 --> 00:34:19,599
the details.

553
00:34:19,639 --> 00:34:20,960
Speaker 4: Sometimes she won't tell me things.

554
00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:22,119
Speaker 2: Why do you think that is?

555
00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:25,679
Speaker 1: Well, she's very private in a lot of ways, but

556
00:34:26,039 --> 00:34:30,320
there's some things in her work she keeps to herself.

557
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:34,440
I mean, with the book Walking with the Dead, she

558
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:36,239
goes into a lot of detail about a lot of

559
00:34:36,239 --> 00:34:40,360
different cases and her processes, but they really only scratch

560
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:42,760
the surface because there's a lot of things that have

561
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:46,079
happened to her that she keeps to herself, won't talk about,

562
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:47,440
which I respect that.

563
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:52,960
Speaker 2: And when she's getting a psychic attack, mark does she

564
00:34:53,039 --> 00:34:55,480
get as well as the spiritual things? Does she get

565
00:34:55,559 --> 00:34:59,719
physical human things such as the black helicopters being followed,

566
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:03,920
headlights flashing, weird find calls, that kind of stuff physical stuff.

567
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:05,320
Speaker 4: During a psychic attack.

568
00:35:07,079 --> 00:35:11,039
Speaker 1: I mean, I've only known the one that happened when

569
00:35:11,079 --> 00:35:12,840
I was in the middle of a conversation with her,

570
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:15,519
So all I can tell you is that's the only

571
00:35:15,519 --> 00:35:17,800
one that I experienced and she's ever told me about.

572
00:35:18,559 --> 00:35:23,159
And it basically it freezes her up. She's unable to talk,

573
00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:26,400
she's unable to move. It's almost like a state of paralysis,

574
00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:30,679
which is I think it's very similar to a form

575
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:34,119
of sleep. Paralysis, which I have experienced living in this

576
00:35:34,159 --> 00:35:37,159
one house that when I first moved here to New Jersey.

577
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:43,039
They you can't move, you can't speak, you can't do anything,

578
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:46,719
and it feels like there's this weight pressing down on

579
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,360
your chest. And I think she was experienced is very

580
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:52,840
similar to that, but probably in her case much more intense.

581
00:35:53,639 --> 00:35:57,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, the reason I asked that is because this was

582
00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:00,400
more in the earlier days of my kind of spiritual

583
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:03,159
development is that I had exactly those kind of things.

584
00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:06,400
So I was so I'd be doing the love and

585
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:08,480
light stuff, which would be kind of like the spiritualist

586
00:36:08,519 --> 00:36:11,920
church and the readings and the mediumship and stuff, but

587
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,320
then kind of like aside from that, I'd get kind

588
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:17,039
of like feelings of presences exactly like you said about

589
00:36:17,039 --> 00:36:19,280
someone coming and standing next to you. But as well

590
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:22,039
as that, I was getting people flashing their headlights at

591
00:36:22,039 --> 00:36:25,599
me constantly. The black helicopters are real, they do exist,

592
00:36:25,679 --> 00:36:27,639
and they were circling around my house quite a lot,

593
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,159
and I was getting weird phone calls as well. And

594
00:36:30,199 --> 00:36:32,440
this was all kind of like within a cluster of

595
00:36:32,559 --> 00:36:38,159
kind of like a target they called it tis targeted individuals,

596
00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:40,679
a cluster of it is. I don't have it so

597
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:43,000
much now, thank goodness. But then I don't really do

598
00:36:43,119 --> 00:36:45,719
much remote viewing or kind of deep mediumship now. But

599
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:47,840
certainly at the beginning I was getting all of this

600
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:48,639
shit happening.

601
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:52,199
Speaker 1: Now was the was this type of activity all happening

602
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:55,599
at once, or you would experience one, then you'd experience another,

603
00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,519
like the headlights, then the helicopters, so.

604
00:36:58,679 --> 00:37:01,360
Speaker 2: It would it would have been it was a cluster. So,

605
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,239
for instance, the headlights thing, I would notice that whenever

606
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:06,960
I'd go out in a car and I'm driving along

607
00:37:07,159 --> 00:37:10,239
people coming towards me, there'd always be, you know, somebody

608
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:12,719
flashing the headlights at me, or would be driving along

609
00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:15,400
and somebody behind me would flashing their headlights at me,

610
00:37:16,119 --> 00:37:17,920
you know, the kind of like the way you flick

611
00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:20,119
your headlights if you're letting somebody out of a junction

612
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:21,920
or something like that. It was that kind of thing.

613
00:37:22,039 --> 00:37:23,480
And it was to the point where I was kind

614
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:25,639
of pulling my car over and thinking like, oh, my

615
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:28,480
brake lights out? Have I got a headlight that's out?

616
00:37:29,119 --> 00:37:31,880
And then the helicopter things I'd noticed. I'd just be

617
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:34,559
watching TV. I wasn't even in tune. I wasn't doing readings.

618
00:37:34,599 --> 00:37:37,039
I'd just be watching TV and I'd noticed around about

619
00:37:37,039 --> 00:37:40,079
two o'clock, three o'clock in the morning, these bloody helicopter

620
00:37:40,119 --> 00:37:42,599
buzzing around. And then it got to the point where

621
00:37:42,639 --> 00:37:44,480
sometimes they'd come in the daylight as well as you

622
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:46,360
can actually see what they look like. And there's a

623
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:50,599
very distinct difference. I don't know how police helicopters differentiate

624
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,440
between military helicopters in the States, but there's a very

625
00:37:53,719 --> 00:37:57,880
there's a very distinct vibration and noise level between UK

626
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:01,679
police helicopters and a pat key black helicopters. And I've

627
00:38:01,679 --> 00:38:04,079
seen the black cap actually helicopters. I've seen them and

628
00:38:04,119 --> 00:38:07,719
they do sometimes circle around. This hasn't happened for quite

629
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,400
a while, but it has happened, and it's just it's bizarre.

630
00:38:11,559 --> 00:38:13,360
And then the phone calls as well. The phone calls

631
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:16,039
were kind of like it was kind of like again

632
00:38:16,079 --> 00:38:18,199
two three o'clock in the morning, and there'd be a

633
00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:20,400
phone call and I'd pick it up. If this is

634
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:23,360
landline not mobile, would pick it up and there's nobody there,

635
00:38:23,599 --> 00:38:25,039
or they'd just be kind of like a noise that

636
00:38:25,119 --> 00:38:30,360
goes it's just bizarre, bizarre stuff.

637
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:32,719
Speaker 4: Yeah.

638
00:38:33,119 --> 00:38:36,280
Speaker 1: I saw an interview recently and I forget, I don't

639
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,159
know who this lady is who's talking about remote viewing

640
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:44,800
and remote viewing like like bases in an Arctica or

641
00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:48,320
something like that. Something very really hush hush no no.

642
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:49,480
Speaker 4: Yeah.

643
00:38:49,519 --> 00:38:54,280
Speaker 1: And while she was remote viewing, all of a sudden,

644
00:38:54,360 --> 00:39:00,199
down this quarter, this this being shadow person, whatever you

645
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:03,039
want to call it, came racing towards her. It was

646
00:39:03,159 --> 00:39:08,599
giant size and rushed her and literally booted her completely

647
00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:12,400
out of the complex while in astra travel remote viewing.

648
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:18,159
And she was able to sneak in by just masking

649
00:39:18,199 --> 00:39:22,719
her energy like a cloak, and stuck back in around

650
00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:24,760
this thing and went all the way back into this room,

651
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:28,960
and there was two men in uniform military men, sitting

652
00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:31,199
in chairs with their eyes closed, and they were obviously

653
00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:34,679
remote viewing, and they were acting like sentries. So that

654
00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:38,440
energy that attacked her was them. So it makes me think,

655
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:41,960
when you're talking about what happened to you, is when

656
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:44,880
you're remote viewing, you're tapping into this part of the

657
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:49,519
astral or these other dimensions, or I mean, however you

658
00:39:49,599 --> 00:39:54,840
want to explain it, that these governments of these entities

659
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:59,679
are policing, and if they detect your presence, then they

660
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:00,840
start the harassment.

661
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:04,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's exactly the market. That's exactly it. And this

662
00:40:04,559 --> 00:40:06,800
is why I was asking whether i Ween had this

663
00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:09,119
because everything that you just said is exactly what I

664
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:09,679
was thinking.

665
00:40:10,599 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 1: I don't know, because she doesn't talk too much about

666
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:15,760
her own remote viewing, and there was only a couple

667
00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:19,159
of cases where working with me, she really worked on it,

668
00:40:21,679 --> 00:40:27,039
and she's scary accurate at times, but I've never heard

669
00:40:27,039 --> 00:40:31,920
from her talking about ever encountering somebody else trying to

670
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,840
like stop her or push her out or attack her

671
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:36,599
while she's trying to remote.

672
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:40,800
Speaker 2: You had she delved into what we'd call hush hush locations,

673
00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:43,519
and if so, is there anything she could share what

674
00:40:43,679 --> 00:40:44,239
she found?

675
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:46,760
Speaker 4: Not that I'm aware.

676
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:50,880
Speaker 1: We talked about it a few times, and I really

677
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:54,119
wanted to look at Dulce, New Mexico myself, but for

678
00:40:54,199 --> 00:40:56,719
whatever reason, we never got around to it. And I

679
00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:01,400
have a sneaking suspicion that she knew not to go

680
00:41:01,440 --> 00:41:04,960
into these places, to not expose herself, and I think

681
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:09,840
she just kind of covered it up basically, But sometimes

682
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,039
she also has a really short attention span too, so

683
00:41:12,079 --> 00:41:14,800
if she loses interest in something, that's it she walks

684
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:15,400
away from it.

685
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:20,760
Speaker 3: With regard to the helicopters, my wife's daughter is quite

686
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:25,440
interested in helicopters, and so she's downloaded an app which

687
00:41:25,519 --> 00:41:31,559
is something like Helicopter Tracker or something. So we get

688
00:41:31,639 --> 00:41:34,280
quite a few of these last Chinnuch helicopters flying from

689
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:37,440
Portland over our house and she looks it up on

690
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:39,679
her phone and says, oh, that's the whatever it is.

691
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:43,199
So I'm just thinking, if you've got a black helicopter

692
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:46,280
and he's going to fly outside your house, if you've

693
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:48,719
got the app, it'd be interesting to sort of see it.

694
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:51,719
If it sort of shows you one outside your house,

695
00:41:52,039 --> 00:41:54,039
or in fact it's not coming up on the app,

696
00:41:54,079 --> 00:41:55,440
that would be interesting.

697
00:41:56,199 --> 00:41:59,079
Speaker 1: There are there are a lot of different apps that

698
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:04,119
track traffic, and you know, all air traffic is supposed

699
00:42:04,159 --> 00:42:08,840
to have transponder signals identifying the aircraft and you're able

700
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:12,679
to track it. The best example I've seen of that

701
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:15,440
type of activity. I don't know if you've ever watched

702
00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:19,559
the American program A Secret of Skinwalker Ranch where the

703
00:42:19,599 --> 00:42:23,159
scientists and I love the show because again they take

704
00:42:23,199 --> 00:42:26,280
a purely scientific point of view, although they've done some

705
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:28,920
things a little fringe, but mostly they're trying to collect

706
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:34,079
data in the science. But in the show, there have

707
00:42:34,159 --> 00:42:38,000
been a few times when they've been buzzed by black

708
00:42:38,039 --> 00:42:44,719
helicopters and they're either Blackhawks or Chinooks or apaches like

709
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:48,280
you said. And while they're going on, they're out and

710
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,800
standing in these fields watching this, they are radioing back

711
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:56,000
to their command center where they're one research or the

712
00:42:56,039 --> 00:42:58,519
main tech guy. He has all these big screens up

713
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:02,239
with the air traffic on there, and they don't appear

714
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:08,719
they're not transponding, so they don't show up on the apps.

715
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:13,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, the thing is that they're there. If

716
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:15,920
they're Black ops and they're kind of part of Black projects,

717
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:18,000
why would they show up. Of course they're show up.

718
00:43:18,159 --> 00:43:20,039
Speaker 4: Yeah, yep, exactly.

719
00:43:21,599 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 1: Right there filming them too, So it's obviously they're real.

720
00:43:25,079 --> 00:43:28,039
Speaker 3: Yeah, followed by a mysterious car. They're probably not likely

721
00:43:28,079 --> 00:43:30,880
to have a genuine car license plate or something like

722
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:32,000
that on the car as well.

723
00:43:32,559 --> 00:43:35,519
Speaker 1: No, No, I've I've talked with I've interviewed a lot

724
00:43:35,559 --> 00:43:39,320
of people who've had encounters with these types of things.

725
00:43:39,519 --> 00:43:46,159
Men in black or uh, just shadowy government figures and yeah,

726
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:50,079
there's no nothing identifying that you could track and find

727
00:43:50,079 --> 00:43:52,119
out who these people are that are harassing you.

728
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:56,320
Speaker 2: Well, I think one of the most bizarre incidents. Mark,

729
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:58,920
you know who Indigo is, and Neil you know who

730
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:03,159
Indigo is, don't you? On the show? So Indigo used

731
00:44:03,199 --> 00:44:05,000
to live about And she won't mind me saying this

732
00:44:05,039 --> 00:44:08,360
because she goes public on this and we've spoken about this,

733
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:11,119
and I've asked her, am I okay kind of talking

734
00:44:11,119 --> 00:44:14,559
about this kind of thing. She says, Yeah, so I

735
00:44:14,599 --> 00:44:16,960
know what an Apache helicopter looks like. They're long and

736
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:20,920
they're black. They have gun twerets underneath, and they have

737
00:44:21,039 --> 00:44:23,719
like a big radar disc circular kind of thing on

738
00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:26,079
top of the rotor blades. So you've got where the

739
00:44:26,159 --> 00:44:28,039
rotor blades are, you've got kind of like a if

740
00:44:28,039 --> 00:44:31,320
you imagine, kind of like a revels like the Sweet

741
00:44:31,480 --> 00:44:35,000
Revels shape above that, and then right underneath it, you've

742
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:38,159
got like a gun toe. It's kind of like facing forwards,

743
00:44:38,480 --> 00:44:40,960
and they're long and they're black. There's absolutely no way

744
00:44:41,239 --> 00:44:43,000
you could not know what an Apache is once you

745
00:44:43,079 --> 00:44:48,159
see an Apache. So myself and Indigo have had very

746
00:44:48,199 --> 00:44:51,559
odd things happen. Won't go into everything, but one of

747
00:44:51,559 --> 00:44:55,119
the oddest ones was I had an Apache fly near me,

748
00:44:55,199 --> 00:44:57,400
and funnily enough, I think I just came back from

749
00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:00,719
playing airsoft. So in the UK, similar to the US,

750
00:45:00,719 --> 00:45:02,639
we have airsoft, which is a bit like paintball, but

751
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:05,599
kind of little plastic pellets. And I'd come back from

752
00:45:05,639 --> 00:45:07,639
that and I was kind of getting all my kits

753
00:45:07,639 --> 00:45:10,360
off and kind of like getting everything kind of sorted

754
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:13,159
and packed away again, and I noticed out of the window,

755
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:16,559
I noticed an Apache helicopter and just thought, that's really weird,

756
00:45:17,119 --> 00:45:19,880
because why is there an Apache? And I wasn't doing

757
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:22,440
anything in terms of like psychic or mediumship or tuning

758
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:24,039
in a remote being, nothing like that. There was just

759
00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:28,679
a remote, a patched helicopter flying around, and weirdly, I

760
00:45:28,719 --> 00:45:31,400
could see it, having buzzed my house a few times.

761
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:35,159
I could see it go over into the town next door,

762
00:45:35,159 --> 00:45:38,039
which is where Indigo lives, and I could see it

763
00:45:38,360 --> 00:45:41,760
and again it was just hovering, and I thought to myself,

764
00:45:42,199 --> 00:45:47,320
I bet this is hovering right outside Indigo's place. So

765
00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:50,079
I message her and I say, as I, Indigo, you

766
00:45:50,119 --> 00:45:52,559
haven't got a helicopter above your by any chances. He goes, Yes,

767
00:45:52,599 --> 00:45:55,159
it's been buzzing right right above my house. It's there,

768
00:45:55,199 --> 00:45:57,880
I can see it. So why is this? Why is

769
00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:02,039
this helicopter buzzing my house, flying a couple of miles

770
00:46:02,079 --> 00:46:03,719
away and I could still see it because I could

771
00:46:04,119 --> 00:46:06,880
see a couple of miles away over and then buzzing

772
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,599
over her house as well. What is the deal with that?

773
00:46:10,639 --> 00:46:10,920
Speaker 4: And this.

774
00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:15,119
Speaker 1: Is well, it's way different from the demonic stuff we

775
00:46:15,119 --> 00:46:19,119
were talking about earlier, but it's it's always fascinated me,

776
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:21,400
like how they how they know things are going on,

777
00:46:22,119 --> 00:46:26,679
how they're able to react so quickly and coordinate like

778
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:31,400
they do. And I think it's similar to that story

779
00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:35,119
I repeated with the remote viewing. I think that they

780
00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:41,000
have to be doing dedicating resources to basically.

781
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:41,440
Speaker 3: Spy on people.

782
00:46:42,039 --> 00:46:47,599
Speaker 1: But it's not just through electronics. You know the microphones

783
00:46:47,639 --> 00:46:50,039
that can that can go into a house and you

784
00:46:50,079 --> 00:46:53,920
can listen to a conversation. I think they're using techniques

785
00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:57,599
similar to remote viewing. Yeah, that they target somebody and

786
00:46:57,639 --> 00:47:00,360
they're able to see what's going on and to pat

787
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:05,119
what's happening, show up at different times, and sometimes they're

788
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:08,320
very when they're very blatant about it, it means they're

789
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:09,239
sending a message.

790
00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:11,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is it. There's there's absolutely no way these

791
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:16,239
guys wanted to be hidden. This was the message. Yes, Yeah,

792
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:18,000
I think I think you're right. I think there's a

793
00:47:18,039 --> 00:47:21,400
marrying of what we would call the spiritual and the

794
00:47:21,440 --> 00:47:26,199
etheric dare I say interdimensional possibly alien, possibly demonic, and

795
00:47:26,239 --> 00:47:29,920
the physical reality that we have here. It's not separate.

796
00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:32,679
It's not aliens and ghosts over here, and like the

797
00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:36,039
military industrial complex over here, it's like that. That's what

798
00:47:36,119 --> 00:47:36,440
I think is.

799
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:42,360
Speaker 1: It's these black ops programs that are these teams. They're

800
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:43,599
all very interconnected.

801
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:48,119
Speaker 3: It costs a hell a lot of money to launch chelicopters.

802
00:47:47,639 --> 00:47:50,760
Speaker 2: You know. I n sixteen hundred pounds half an hour.

803
00:47:51,440 --> 00:47:54,639
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I've other varying things like ten pounds

804
00:47:54,679 --> 00:47:57,199
in laun chelliculter. It depends maybe on what's what helicopter

805
00:47:57,239 --> 00:47:58,239
it is and where it's got to come to.

806
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:00,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, probably would. Actually you kind of.

807
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:06,280
Speaker 3: Think, well, what kind of kind of budget of launching

808
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:08,280
a helicopter to come and floating outside your house?

809
00:48:08,320 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 5: Thing?

810
00:48:08,639 --> 00:48:10,920
Speaker 3: Just go on to the next town for for what

811
00:48:11,119 --> 00:48:14,199
you know, like you're not like a major government Asian

812
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:15,320
or something.

813
00:48:15,079 --> 00:48:17,840
Speaker 2: You know exactly that that That's exactly what myself and

814
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:22,719
Indigo were saying. What's the bloody point? It's pathetic. What's

815
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:24,400
the point, because it's not going to change us. We're

816
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:26,440
still going to be doing what we're doing. We're still

817
00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:28,239
going to be doing psychic medium ship, We're still going

818
00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:30,199
to be tuning in, We're still going to be talking

819
00:48:30,199 --> 00:48:32,599
about woo woo subjects. It's not going to change us.

820
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:34,679
So what's the bloody point? We don't get it?

821
00:48:35,239 --> 00:48:38,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, and we're talking about it, Yeah, publicly.

822
00:48:37,719 --> 00:48:39,880
Speaker 2: As well, exactly, And I'll keep talking about it and

823
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:41,199
I ain't going to shot up about it.

824
00:48:41,559 --> 00:48:45,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, I'm just intrigued about shadowy government figures that

825
00:48:45,960 --> 00:48:48,400
work for the shadowy government agencies and how do they

826
00:48:48,400 --> 00:48:49,159
get recruited?

827
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:52,119
Speaker 2: Now this, now, this could now, this could get us

828
00:48:52,159 --> 00:48:55,239
onto the hat Man. Why is the hat Man that

829
00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:58,719
people see this this infamous kind of like black shadowy figure.

830
00:48:59,239 --> 00:49:02,559
Why why is he not some kind of like spooky

831
00:49:02,639 --> 00:49:05,000
tutor goes. Why is he kind of like a nineteen

832
00:49:05,039 --> 00:49:10,079
fifties B movie kind of FBI type kind of suited,

833
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:14,480
you know, film noir type men in black. Yeah, exactly

834
00:49:14,519 --> 00:49:19,000
what but why but why vintage? Why why the Theadora hat?

835
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:21,880
Why why is he looking like something at the fifties.

836
00:49:22,760 --> 00:49:23,880
Speaker 4: No, it's a great question.

837
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:27,440
Speaker 1: I mean, and they they never change either. Yeah, you know,

838
00:49:27,599 --> 00:49:30,039
for like thirty something year. I mean, go back as

839
00:49:30,079 --> 00:49:35,039
far as the MAFMN Mafman incidents. We're back in the

840
00:49:35,119 --> 00:49:38,719
sixties when the men in Black were first showing up

841
00:49:38,800 --> 00:49:40,239
and they were exactly like that.

842
00:49:40,599 --> 00:49:44,039
Speaker 3: Maybe let's stuck like that. They can't change this, stuck

843
00:49:44,079 --> 00:49:47,039
as that sort of pre programmed image. And it's a

844
00:49:47,039 --> 00:49:50,559
bit like Doctor Who's Tardis Although it was a nineteen

845
00:49:50,599 --> 00:49:53,920
sixties kind of invention police boxes around the UK to

846
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:57,400
call up the police, and Doctor Who's Tardis was masquerading

847
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:00,679
as one and something got stuck the comene device or

848
00:50:00,719 --> 00:50:04,880
whatever it's called in the story, and even today appears

849
00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:07,679
this old fashioned police box, you know. So maybe these

850
00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:10,079
men in Black have a kind of similar thing that

851
00:50:10,239 --> 00:50:11,760
comelean device is called stock.

852
00:50:12,679 --> 00:50:16,199
Speaker 1: There's a lot of evidence just in the stories where

853
00:50:16,280 --> 00:50:21,119
eyewitness reports of men in black where they they actually

854
00:50:21,639 --> 00:50:25,800
don't act human. It's like it's like like what you said,

855
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:31,440
kind of a mask it's a hologram or excuse me,

856
00:50:31,519 --> 00:50:35,199
they're presenting an image. That's what you perceive them as.

857
00:50:35,519 --> 00:50:37,559
And even if they're picked up on video or whatever,

858
00:50:37,719 --> 00:50:40,599
that's what they're surrounded with. That's what they pick up on.

859
00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:44,559
And but yeah, it could be that's it. They're just

860
00:50:44,639 --> 00:50:48,280
stuck with this one program. They don't even think about

861
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:51,320
updating it because you know, maybe with us and our

862
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:53,519
culture and everything, they just don't understand it.

863
00:50:54,159 --> 00:50:56,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, hells, if you saw this worthy thing appear in

864
00:50:56,840 --> 00:51:02,239
your room, it says, please stand by men in black updating.

865
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:05,920
Speaker 2: But do not switch off your vision from their perspective.

866
00:51:06,119 --> 00:51:08,920
I don't. I just don't understand why they wouldn't update

867
00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:12,920
because somebody in a nineteen fifties outfit would look so

868
00:51:13,199 --> 00:51:16,440
out of place. You'd think if you were an intelligent

869
00:51:16,519 --> 00:51:19,039
being and you were kind of trying to infiltate another race,

870
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:21,840
you would be up to date with what that race

871
00:51:21,920 --> 00:51:25,559
looks like, what it's I mean, it does seem like

872
00:51:25,599 --> 00:51:28,239
it's stuck, but I understand why it's stuck. Why would

873
00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:29,079
they not update it?

874
00:51:29,239 --> 00:51:29,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know.

875
00:51:30,039 --> 00:51:33,719
Speaker 1: This is one of those things, these mysteries that I

876
00:51:33,760 --> 00:51:36,800
think are just a little bit beyond our understanding comprehension.

877
00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:43,639
It's obviously somebody's doing it, but they're reasoning and the

878
00:51:43,679 --> 00:51:46,440
why maybe it's something that we won't be able to understand.

879
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:48,880
I mean, we won't be able to understand their reasoning.

880
00:51:49,039 --> 00:51:52,320
Speaker 3: Maybe when they come into our reality. They can't pick

881
00:51:52,360 --> 00:51:54,639
a precise time, but they just throw a dart and

882
00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:57,960
they land somewhere in the twentieth century or the twenty

883
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:00,480
first century, so they've got a kind of close It

884
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:03,280
generally might fit in with the general theme of that

885
00:52:03,400 --> 00:52:06,199
kind of time realm, but they can't be specific.

886
00:52:06,559 --> 00:52:09,960
Speaker 1: But why did they then show up immediately after let's

887
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:14,760
say a UFO sighting or even ENCRYPTID sighting, and they

888
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:18,480
immediately show up knowing all the details of it, even

889
00:52:18,519 --> 00:52:22,599
when that witness has only experienced it all by themselves,

890
00:52:22,639 --> 00:52:24,880
no other witnesses. They never even got a chance to

891
00:52:24,920 --> 00:52:27,639
tell anybody yet, and then all of a sudden, men

892
00:52:27,679 --> 00:52:31,000
in black are knocking on their door or a military

893
00:52:31,519 --> 00:52:35,880
you know, uniform dressed people coming in and threatening them.

894
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:38,199
Speaker 3: Yeah, we had a guy that we interviewed a couple

895
00:52:38,199 --> 00:52:40,119
of years ago. I actually met him in Birmingham. That's

896
00:52:40,159 --> 00:52:41,639
why I got him on the show because he's soundly

897
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:43,679
very interesting. And he said that he had seen a

898
00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:46,480
UFO like he was seventeen, walking the dog or something.

899
00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:51,719
And about ten years later, the men in black showed

900
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:54,960
of his housing and it was a man and a

901
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:58,559
woman and you might remember this, only I can't remember.

902
00:52:58,599 --> 00:53:00,679
The guy's name. Is a very nice chat and he

903
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:04,360
said they actually had photographs of this UFO that he

904
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:06,559
had seen. But the thing is when they showed in

905
00:53:06,599 --> 00:53:09,920
the photograph, he said, the actual photo looked like it

906
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:12,800
was taken from his own point of viewers. If it's

907
00:53:12,800 --> 00:53:16,440
through his eyes, you know, that's the weird thing that

908
00:53:16,559 --> 00:53:19,400
was spooky. Huh Yeah.

909
00:53:19,719 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 2: Do you kind of suggest that they go into people's minds,

910
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:24,760
that they could take snapshops from what we see?

911
00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:25,119
Speaker 3: Yeah?

912
00:53:25,519 --> 00:53:26,679
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah.

913
00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:32,119
Speaker 1: It's again, it's high strangeness. It's beyond our ability to explain,

914
00:53:32,719 --> 00:53:35,920
at least for now. And that's the really, this is

915
00:53:35,920 --> 00:53:40,000
something that I'm personally very interested in, is high strangeness.

916
00:53:40,079 --> 00:53:43,559
And our reality, or what we think of his reality, isn't.

917
00:53:44,639 --> 00:53:51,440
Reality is so much more twisted and weird, and it's

918
00:53:51,920 --> 00:53:55,039
our brains can only process things in a certain way,

919
00:53:55,079 --> 00:53:58,440
and that's how or people, you know, never underestimate the

920
00:53:58,480 --> 00:54:02,199
power of denial. They're so focused on what they think

921
00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:04,920
they know, they won't open their eyes up to see

922
00:54:04,960 --> 00:54:08,320
what's going on around them, or at least entertain the

923
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:14,000
idea that, hey, maybe our version of reality isn't that right.

924
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:17,360
Speaker 2: Did I tell you about the craziest thing I've ever

925
00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:19,039
experienced in my entire life?

926
00:54:19,280 --> 00:54:20,519
Speaker 4: Nope, but I'm going to hear it.

927
00:54:22,039 --> 00:54:24,480
Speaker 2: This is mental. And if I'm not a Christian, but

928
00:54:24,480 --> 00:54:26,400
if I was a Christian, I'd place my hand on

929
00:54:26,440 --> 00:54:28,559
the Bible and swear this to be true. This is

930
00:54:28,599 --> 00:54:31,519
absolutely mental. One of my favorite subjects is glitches in

931
00:54:31,599 --> 00:54:33,599
reality and the fact that we live in a weird

932
00:54:33,639 --> 00:54:36,480
matrix and some things make sense. This is absolutely true.

933
00:54:36,519 --> 00:54:39,960
So used to go with a group of friends to

934
00:54:40,039 --> 00:54:44,119
the cinema from around about the late nineties to around

935
00:54:44,159 --> 00:54:47,000
about twenty ten ish. There's like a regular group of

936
00:54:47,039 --> 00:54:50,679
us that used to go to the cinema Fridays and Saturdays,

937
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:53,480
and it usually it was the I could say which

938
00:54:53,559 --> 00:54:57,039
cinema is because it doesn't really matter, Stevenage Cinema in Hertfordshire.

939
00:54:57,480 --> 00:55:01,760
So we would be driving towards Stephen Cinema in a

940
00:55:01,800 --> 00:55:06,000
group of lads. One particular time mark. This was an

941
00:55:06,039 --> 00:55:09,800
evening time. It was summertime, and it was twilight. It

942
00:55:09,800 --> 00:55:13,000
was kind of I suppose still light looking outside now,

943
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:15,639
it's not quite dark. It's not quite light. It's around

944
00:55:15,679 --> 00:55:20,440
about how it is now. We came up to a

945
00:55:20,519 --> 00:55:24,320
round about on the left hand side. We overtook a

946
00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:26,599
car that was going because it was going really slowly.

947
00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:28,719
This car in front of us was going really slowly

948
00:55:28,920 --> 00:55:30,599
and we wanted to get to our film, so we

949
00:55:30,679 --> 00:55:34,000
overtook it. And we looked to the left as we

950
00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:37,679
were overly taking it, and there was nobody in the

951
00:55:37,719 --> 00:55:41,239
car at all. Now we're not talking about we're not

952
00:55:41,320 --> 00:55:44,599
talking about a midget or a dwarf, or a small

953
00:55:44,679 --> 00:55:47,719
person or a little old lady with their hands like that,

954
00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:51,800
because we were looking into this car. I was looking

955
00:55:51,840 --> 00:55:55,800
into it, and I was thinking, what the hell is

956
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:58,360
going on? I know it wasn't a left hand drive,

957
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:01,320
it wasn't a foreign car. There was no passengers. There's

958
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:04,800
nobody in the front seats. I forget the color of it.

959
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:06,840
I do forget the color of it, but I do

960
00:56:06,880 --> 00:56:09,880
remember it being like a compact, like a smallish type car.

961
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:15,800
To this day, I have absolutely zero logical explanation as

962
00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:18,280
to what were what the hell was going on there.

963
00:56:18,679 --> 00:56:21,760
Now we talk about kind of like driverless cars now

964
00:56:22,199 --> 00:56:25,519
kind of likes and this has been since what would

965
00:56:25,559 --> 00:56:29,440
you say, guys twenty fifteen onwards, I don't know when,

966
00:56:29,519 --> 00:56:32,320
kind of Tesla and Musk and everyone, and now they're

967
00:56:32,360 --> 00:56:34,079
kind of like they're kind of like their normal aren't

968
00:56:34,079 --> 00:56:37,639
they driverless cars? They're talking about driverless lorries kind of

969
00:56:37,639 --> 00:56:41,880
like little driverless buggies that deliver things to people. But

970
00:56:42,079 --> 00:56:45,960
this when this happened was around about mid two thousand,

971
00:56:46,159 --> 00:56:48,360
kind of like two thousand and four, two thousand and five,

972
00:56:48,679 --> 00:56:51,280
So this, I would say, this is pre technology that

973
00:56:51,360 --> 00:56:55,199
we're aware of. And even if they were testing something

974
00:56:55,320 --> 00:56:58,039
like a driverless car, why on earth are you taking

975
00:56:58,079 --> 00:57:00,719
out out on the public roads. You know, surely this

976
00:57:00,719 --> 00:57:03,639
should be kind of like a in a scientific laboratory

977
00:57:03,639 --> 00:57:07,119
type situation, not in a roundabout in stevenage, I have

978
00:57:07,280 --> 00:57:11,440
zero explanation, and to this day, first of all, I'll

979
00:57:11,519 --> 00:57:15,559
swear hand on heart that that actually happened exactly how

980
00:57:15,559 --> 00:57:20,119
I described it with witnesses, and I have no explanation

981
00:57:20,199 --> 00:57:21,880
whatsoever as to what the hell was going on with that.

982
00:57:22,679 --> 00:57:23,840
Speaker 4: I've heard stories like that.

983
00:57:25,440 --> 00:57:28,039
Speaker 1: I've seen some videos, but in this day of day

984
00:57:28,079 --> 00:57:30,719
and age of AI and certain special effects, I don't

985
00:57:30,800 --> 00:57:33,480
trust it. But a lot of the videos but I've

986
00:57:33,519 --> 00:57:38,559
heard and counts very similar to that. Really, it's not

987
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:43,880
exactly like the Irene has an account in her book. Ah,

988
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:47,079
it's a story that happened just a couple of years

989
00:57:47,079 --> 00:57:50,000
ago and Walking with the Dead, where he and she

990
00:57:50,159 --> 00:57:54,719
had a relative die up in Scotland. So they had

991
00:57:54,800 --> 00:57:58,000
to drive to the airport in Bristol. Because of where

992
00:57:58,039 --> 00:58:02,079
she lives. It's close at the airport, but they had

993
00:58:02,079 --> 00:58:04,440
to leave it like three in the morning or whatever

994
00:58:04,480 --> 00:58:08,519
to get there. So it's very very early dark out,

995
00:58:08,719 --> 00:58:11,639
nobody's on the road, and they get lost and they're

996
00:58:11,679 --> 00:58:16,039
trying to find their way or try to find someplace

997
00:58:16,079 --> 00:58:19,159
they can get directions, but it's like so late that

998
00:58:19,199 --> 00:58:23,480
there's nothing open. And then as they're driving, they see

999
00:58:23,519 --> 00:58:29,280
this man, this old man, walking on the street, and

1000
00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:33,119
so Irene just responded instinctively, and she even now thinks

1001
00:58:33,119 --> 00:58:36,440
it was kind of strange, but she said to her husband,

1002
00:58:36,840 --> 00:58:38,920
you know, maybe we should why don't we ask him?

1003
00:58:39,559 --> 00:58:42,559
And so they stopped and they asked him directions. He goes,

1004
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:46,960
I'll show you. Now, this is where reality kind of

1005
00:58:47,000 --> 00:58:50,639
takes a wonky turn, and it's funny.

1006
00:58:50,320 --> 00:58:53,880
Speaker 4: How people react to it. Without another word.

1007
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:56,360
Speaker 1: The gentleman climbs in the back seat of the car,

1008
00:58:57,679 --> 00:59:02,559
not invited. He goes, it's easier if I show you. Yeah,

1009
00:59:03,079 --> 00:59:06,760
So he's telling driving. They're like driving for ten minutes,

1010
00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:11,199
so go turn here, turn there, and they just get it.

1011
00:59:12,280 --> 00:59:13,239
Speaker 4: And when they.

1012
00:59:13,159 --> 00:59:16,079
Speaker 1: Get to right before where the airport is, they could see.

1013
00:59:16,159 --> 00:59:18,920
He goes, you can let me out here. So he

1014
00:59:18,920 --> 00:59:21,239
gets out of the car, doesn't say a word. He

1015
00:59:21,360 --> 00:59:25,079
starts walking off. They look at each other like what happened?

1016
00:59:25,119 --> 00:59:27,119
Speaker 4: They look, he's gone.

1017
00:59:27,719 --> 00:59:35,159
Speaker 1: He's gone, And that was part of it. But later

1018
00:59:35,239 --> 00:59:37,480
on they went to the funeral, they got there in time,

1019
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:40,840
they came back home, and then like a week later,

1020
00:59:40,960 --> 00:59:45,719
they start thinking about it and they realize how strange

1021
00:59:45,760 --> 00:59:51,599
the whole incident was. So they start describing what he

1022
00:59:51,679 --> 00:59:55,000
looked like. They both described.

1023
00:59:54,599 --> 00:59:55,679
Speaker 4: Him completely different.

1024
00:59:56,320 --> 01:00:02,079
Speaker 1: Wow, different clothes, different hairstyle, racial hair. On one he

1025
01:00:02,119 --> 01:00:04,159
had a hat and glasses and the one he didn't.

1026
01:00:04,719 --> 01:00:07,440
Manchels saw him in one way, she saw he saw

1027
01:00:07,559 --> 01:00:12,199
him in another and it's it's wild and then you

1028
01:00:12,199 --> 01:00:14,519
stop to think, well, what was it. Was he some

1029
01:00:14,639 --> 01:00:17,840
type of angelic being, you know, who showed up at

1030
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:19,920
the last minute to help them get to the airport

1031
01:00:20,000 --> 01:00:24,960
and go, you know, a helpful person or who knows,

1032
01:00:25,679 --> 01:00:28,400
But he appeared out of thin air, basically that he

1033
01:00:28,519 --> 01:00:30,920
was where he was walking at four in the morning,

1034
01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:35,840
you know, our for a stroll right when they needed him,

1035
01:00:36,320 --> 01:00:38,599
gets in the car and he acts as not acting

1036
01:00:38,679 --> 01:00:41,960
normal anyway, and then he just vanishes and they both

1037
01:00:42,000 --> 01:00:46,119
see him completely different, different hair color and style, everything

1038
01:00:46,199 --> 01:00:46,639
was different.

1039
01:00:47,559 --> 01:00:50,320
Speaker 2: So, I mean, one one possibility, and I don't know

1040
01:00:50,360 --> 01:00:52,440
if this is the case. If it was some kind

1041
01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:56,880
of being that wanted to interact, maybe maybe this being

1042
01:00:57,320 --> 01:01:00,519
wasn't really fust too fast how it looked. Maybe it

1043
01:01:00,599 --> 01:01:03,239
kind of delved into both of their minds to pluck

1044
01:01:03,320 --> 01:01:05,599
a random person I might have seen in the past

1045
01:01:05,639 --> 01:01:08,039
on the street and then projected that as a hologram

1046
01:01:08,119 --> 01:01:10,880
onto them, because it really wasn't about how he looked

1047
01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:12,679
or how they're being looked. It was more about getting

1048
01:01:12,679 --> 01:01:13,960
them to the airport kind of thing.

1049
01:01:15,280 --> 01:01:17,719
Speaker 1: And this goes off kind of on another subject. But

1050
01:01:18,639 --> 01:01:22,119
when you're I found many stories and one of my

1051
01:01:22,239 --> 01:01:27,880
theories is these types of spiritual entities. And I'm not

1052
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:33,280
talking about just regular ghosts. Some could be demons or

1053
01:01:33,360 --> 01:01:37,000
but even when you're dealing with higher level vibration, angelic

1054
01:01:37,119 --> 01:01:41,280
type beings or whatnot. A great example is when people

1055
01:01:41,320 --> 01:01:45,599
have a near death experience, okay, and they go to

1056
01:01:45,639 --> 01:01:46,360
the other side.

1057
01:01:46,400 --> 01:01:47,639
Speaker 4: Of course they're.

1058
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:52,159
Speaker 1: Sent back eventually at some point, but they all describe

1059
01:01:52,360 --> 01:01:53,880
everything slightly different.

1060
01:01:54,039 --> 01:01:55,639
Speaker 4: It's kind of the same, it's kind of not.

1061
01:01:56,880 --> 01:02:01,280
Speaker 1: But then the people they meet, the Christians or people

1062
01:02:01,320 --> 01:02:09,280
more influenced by Christianity see Jesus a lot others see

1063
01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:14,760
you know, is there Muslim they see Muhammad or their

1064
01:02:14,840 --> 01:02:19,679
version of Allah or the people. It's like these things

1065
01:02:20,760 --> 01:02:25,039
can tap into your mind and then they present themselves.

1066
01:02:25,079 --> 01:02:28,199
The image of themselves is what they want and a

1067
01:02:28,239 --> 01:02:32,000
lot of cases it's what you need to see in

1068
01:02:32,159 --> 01:02:36,039
order to better communicate their message and for you to

1069
01:02:36,119 --> 01:02:39,760
accept it. And I think in the case of what

1070
01:02:39,960 --> 01:02:45,239
happened with Irene and her husband, and again this is

1071
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:49,400
only guesswork on my part, but I felt it was

1072
01:02:49,440 --> 01:02:53,400
some type of higher level entity. And again because it's

1073
01:02:53,440 --> 01:02:57,079
putting up like a mask, they in their minds see

1074
01:02:57,119 --> 01:03:00,639
this person, but they're both seeing the person different because

1075
01:03:00,639 --> 01:03:03,360
it's how their minds is interpreting the data that's being

1076
01:03:03,360 --> 01:03:04,559
broadcast to them.

1077
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:08,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. It's almost going back to

1078
01:03:08,320 --> 01:03:12,159
this theory that the universe acts as a mirror, and

1079
01:03:13,440 --> 01:03:15,840
you're right in terms of different people from different kind

1080
01:03:15,840 --> 01:03:18,800
of like cultures and customs, they will see what they're

1081
01:03:18,840 --> 01:03:21,280
expecting to see on the other side of life. It's

1082
01:03:21,400 --> 01:03:25,480
it's it's like the universe is custom tailoring reality to

1083
01:03:25,559 --> 01:03:28,159
your consciousness as it crosses over. So yeah, if you're

1084
01:03:28,159 --> 01:03:30,719
a Jew, you see Moses. If you're Christian, you see Jesus.

1085
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:34,199
If you're Islamic, you see Mohammed, et cetera, et cetera.

1086
01:03:34,360 --> 01:03:37,840
If your Buddhist, you see Buddha. So it's it's tailoring

1087
01:03:38,599 --> 01:03:43,840
your perception of consciousness to you, to you to your perception.

1088
01:03:44,280 --> 01:03:45,119
It's weird, in't they.

1089
01:03:45,119 --> 01:03:48,840
Speaker 1: Well, especially if in those near death experiences the people

1090
01:03:48,840 --> 01:03:53,119
are coming back into their physical bodies with their monkey

1091
01:03:53,159 --> 01:03:57,000
brains and it's the only way that they can interpret

1092
01:03:57,039 --> 01:04:00,559
the imagery that they saw over there, because what they

1093
01:04:00,559 --> 01:04:03,639
could really see or somebody who really crosses over I

1094
01:04:03,679 --> 01:04:09,320
think it's absolutely completely different, and it's beyond description, beyond

1095
01:04:09,719 --> 01:04:15,440
our human language, and so they're given a more afterlife

1096
01:04:15,480 --> 01:04:19,599
for dummies version of what they're seeing in order for

1097
01:04:19,679 --> 01:04:23,280
them to interpret or understand better what they're actually seeing.

1098
01:04:23,519 --> 01:04:26,719
Do I think they're actually seeing Jesus, No, but they're

1099
01:04:26,760 --> 01:04:30,719
seeing some type of being interacting with them. But if

1100
01:04:30,760 --> 01:04:33,199
you see Jesus and he starts telling you things, you're

1101
01:04:33,199 --> 01:04:36,679
going to listen. If you're a Christian, Yeah, I'm fuzzy

1102
01:04:36,719 --> 01:04:44,840
feet Jesus, yeah, buddy, Jesus. Yeah, yeah, it's it's there's

1103
01:04:44,880 --> 01:04:49,199
so much happening on these other levels of consciousness, and

1104
01:04:49,920 --> 01:04:53,599
with our brains we can only interpret so much, which

1105
01:04:53,639 --> 01:04:58,480
is for those people who do do astral traveling, I'm

1106
01:04:58,559 --> 01:05:02,760
curious sometimes that what they may see. If they see

1107
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:05,119
stuff that they literally, and I've heard people say this,

1108
01:05:05,199 --> 01:05:08,559
they literally can't put it into words. English language just

1109
01:05:08,639 --> 01:05:11,920
won't cut it. Colors, especially, they talk about colors that

1110
01:05:12,000 --> 01:05:14,599
we've never seen before, and they had no way of

1111
01:05:14,599 --> 01:05:15,719
describing what they were.

1112
01:05:18,360 --> 01:05:22,199
Speaker 3: I was reading something recently and it was all to

1113
01:05:22,239 --> 01:05:26,559
do with ITC communication and that kind of stuff, and

1114
01:05:27,079 --> 01:05:31,280
messages from the other side were coming through ITC or

1115
01:05:31,320 --> 01:05:36,639
computers or recorders or something to these researchers and the

1116
01:05:36,679 --> 01:05:39,320
people on the other side were talking about a level

1117
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:43,280
of reality between the earth and the spirit world that

1118
01:05:43,320 --> 01:05:47,079
they were contacting, which no one was aware of. And

1119
01:05:47,119 --> 01:05:53,159
it's like another level where there is another civilization there

1120
01:05:53,199 --> 01:05:56,440
that exist, they were saying. And they said, it's not bad,

1121
01:05:56,559 --> 01:05:59,559
it's not necessarily good. It's just runs alongside your own

1122
01:05:59,559 --> 01:06:04,320
civilized and it's between your world and our world. And

1123
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:09,599
sometimes you will get communications come through it, you know,

1124
01:06:09,639 --> 01:06:12,639
sometimes it might cut shop through itc or something, or

1125
01:06:12,679 --> 01:06:15,519
it might shop in media, mystical psychic reens or whatever

1126
01:06:15,519 --> 01:06:18,039
it may be. I was just wondering, as we're discussing

1127
01:06:18,119 --> 01:06:21,960
shadow men and demons and things, maybe that's where these

1128
01:06:22,000 --> 01:06:26,000
other things might reside. I don't know, it's a possibility.

1129
01:06:26,320 --> 01:06:31,039
Speaker 1: I mean, even science with string theory, and as for

1130
01:06:31,159 --> 01:06:34,639
physicists like doctor Mitchi Kakku will talk about the fact

1131
01:06:34,679 --> 01:06:37,639
that so far they're able to.

1132
01:06:39,599 --> 01:06:41,400
Speaker 4: With their theory, they able.

1133
01:06:41,159 --> 01:06:45,119
Speaker 1: To say that there's at least eleven different dimensions. Personally,

1134
01:06:45,119 --> 01:06:47,840
I think it's way more than that. It's just we

1135
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:52,400
have only gotten so far. But these dimensions are all

1136
01:06:52,480 --> 01:06:56,519
happening at once, right alongside art, and they're right here.

1137
01:06:56,599 --> 01:06:59,239
See where I'm sticking my hand out, and this is

1138
01:06:59,239 --> 01:07:01,719
where the other dimension and it's just right there. Now

1139
01:07:01,760 --> 01:07:04,280
we can't perceive it. We're vibrating at a certain level,

1140
01:07:05,199 --> 01:07:07,880
and it's vibrating at a different frequency. It's like tuning

1141
01:07:07,880 --> 01:07:10,000
into a radio station or the old time where you

1142
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:13,360
could dial the knob and go through one station to another.

1143
01:07:13,400 --> 01:07:17,559
They're all broadcasting simultaneously, but you can only listen to

1144
01:07:17,599 --> 01:07:21,719
the station that you tune into. Yea. So, but these

1145
01:07:21,760 --> 01:07:26,559
things are all happening at once. The one theory that

1146
01:07:26,639 --> 01:07:30,440
really hurts my brain sometimes is the concept of time,

1147
01:07:31,280 --> 01:07:35,239
that time doesn't exist, that all time is happening at once.

1148
01:07:36,199 --> 01:07:40,360
There is only now. But yet instead of looking at

1149
01:07:40,400 --> 01:07:46,559
having past lives or even maybe future lives, they're all

1150
01:07:46,639 --> 01:07:49,039
they're not happening in the past, They're happening right now.

1151
01:07:49,639 --> 01:07:52,920
Everything is happening right now, which if I think about

1152
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:59,400
it too much, I sometimes I want to cry. It's

1153
01:07:59,440 --> 01:08:03,199
so mind bending, the concepts, and it really it's I

1154
01:08:03,239 --> 01:08:05,280
think a lot for a lot of people's just too

1155
01:08:05,360 --> 01:08:08,599
much for them to think about, and they.

1156
01:08:08,360 --> 01:08:13,679
Speaker 2: Would it makes sense in terms of how psychics and

1157
01:08:13,719 --> 01:08:16,880
mediums are able to predict the future because in effect,

1158
01:08:16,920 --> 01:08:19,960
there is no future. They're tipping, they're tapping into the

1159
01:08:19,960 --> 01:08:23,119
information that's already out there of things are happening now.

1160
01:08:23,199 --> 01:08:26,880
Speaker 1: But at the same time, there are psychics who maybe

1161
01:08:26,960 --> 01:08:30,279
are writing only fifty percent of the time. And it's

1162
01:08:30,319 --> 01:08:34,680
not because they're a bad psychic, but it's because while

1163
01:08:35,119 --> 01:08:38,880
the past is set in stone for our timeline, okay,

1164
01:08:39,800 --> 01:08:45,479
from what I understand, we're constantly shifting timelines. It doesn't

1165
01:08:45,520 --> 01:08:47,479
look like it, we don't notice it, but that would

1166
01:08:47,520 --> 01:08:51,760
actually explain Mendel effects. We remember certain events differently is

1167
01:08:51,800 --> 01:08:55,960
because unknownally we've jumped into another timeline where things are

1168
01:08:55,960 --> 01:08:59,279
slightly different and we're just not aware of it.

1169
01:08:59,319 --> 01:08:59,520
Speaker 3: Now.

1170
01:08:59,560 --> 01:09:00,199
Speaker 4: As far as the.

1171
01:09:00,239 --> 01:09:08,000
Speaker 1: Future goes, the possibilities are endless because for every action

1172
01:09:08,279 --> 01:09:11,960
there's an opposite reaction, and if any of the variables

1173
01:09:12,079 --> 01:09:16,199
changed just a little bit, that may not take place.

1174
01:09:17,359 --> 01:09:20,520
Maybe something else will happen. Somebody who predicts a disaster

1175
01:09:20,640 --> 01:09:25,680
the world's going to end on June twenty fifth, and

1176
01:09:25,720 --> 01:09:28,399
then it doesn't happen, people go, haha, See they were wrong.

1177
01:09:28,800 --> 01:09:32,159
Not necessarily, maybe it did end in one of these

1178
01:09:32,159 --> 01:09:34,920
other timelines because that's what they're able to see at

1179
01:09:34,960 --> 01:09:39,119
the moment. You let's say you remote viewed, okay, and

1180
01:09:39,159 --> 01:09:41,960
you're trying to see a future event from right this moment,

1181
01:09:42,039 --> 01:09:44,720
right now. You're looking into the future, and you see

1182
01:09:44,720 --> 01:09:48,720
a future event between the time that you've remote viewed

1183
01:09:48,760 --> 01:09:52,000
it to the time period when the event happens, so

1184
01:09:52,079 --> 01:09:56,560
many different things could have happened to alter the direction

1185
01:09:56,960 --> 01:10:02,760
of the timeline and miss it, or things happened maybe

1186
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:07,479
weeks later or a year later, and they don't happen

1187
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:10,520
exactly as they were described, but a version of it happened.

1188
01:10:10,960 --> 01:10:14,840
And again it's not necessarily that the person just didn't

1189
01:10:15,000 --> 01:10:18,800
see it right. It's just that when looking at the future,

1190
01:10:18,680 --> 01:10:22,600
there's too many variables that can change. So when you're

1191
01:10:22,640 --> 01:10:26,439
looking into the far future, especially, there's no way in

1192
01:10:26,520 --> 01:10:29,920
predicting if that's going to really happen or not. In

1193
01:10:30,000 --> 01:10:36,520
the short term future, there's less less probability that other

1194
01:10:36,600 --> 01:10:39,920
factors will come into play to change the outcome of

1195
01:10:39,960 --> 01:10:41,000
those events.

1196
01:10:42,039 --> 01:10:43,479
Speaker 3: I don't know if that makes any sense or not.

1197
01:10:46,119 --> 01:10:50,039
The weekend those this conference, although it was called a

1198
01:10:50,640 --> 01:10:53,920
kryptoid conference, there was a lady there talking about ghosts

1199
01:10:53,960 --> 01:10:57,640
and spirits and hauntings and things, and she was saying

1200
01:10:57,680 --> 01:11:04,479
that she outrightly rejected the stone tape theory. For those

1201
01:11:04,520 --> 01:11:06,239
that want to know what the stone tape theory is,

1202
01:11:06,279 --> 01:11:11,720
that's where their ghosts are alleged to be recordings associated

1203
01:11:11,840 --> 01:11:16,600
with castles or old buildings and things that somehow.

1204
01:11:16,279 --> 01:11:22,039
Speaker 1: That buried underneath water running water, granite, yeah, crystals.

1205
01:11:21,479 --> 01:11:24,479
Speaker 3: And somehow it records those events. But she says, I

1206
01:11:24,520 --> 01:11:27,359
don't agree with it. And I went up and asked

1207
01:11:27,439 --> 01:11:29,760
a question later on or pointed something out her which

1208
01:11:29,760 --> 01:11:31,560
I'll tell you about a minute. But she says, the

1209
01:11:31,600 --> 01:11:33,840
reason I don't agree with it is because there was

1210
01:11:33,880 --> 01:11:37,359
someone in Essex, so I thought, that's near Humany, so

1211
01:11:37,479 --> 01:11:39,800
you may know people that might know this story or

1212
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:42,640
not where they saw like a load of cave men

1213
01:11:42,800 --> 01:11:46,359
come out somewhere. I'm at some place she never kind

1214
01:11:46,359 --> 01:11:48,159
of went into details about. It was a load of caves,

1215
01:11:48,960 --> 01:11:53,000
like ghost cave men, which there weren't near any castles

1216
01:11:53,079 --> 01:11:54,960
or any stones or anything like that, and they were

1217
01:11:55,000 --> 01:11:59,680
cited by people, which is interesting. So she said, that's

1218
01:11:59,680 --> 01:12:02,319
why the stone tape theory doesn't work, because there's no

1219
01:12:02,479 --> 01:12:05,479
stones around him. I don't know the details of its

1220
01:12:05,479 --> 01:12:08,960
psycholic comment too much. But then when it was time

1221
01:12:09,119 --> 01:12:11,279
to ask her questions, I went up and sort of

1222
01:12:11,319 --> 01:12:14,840
mentioned the fact that the stone tape theory was actually

1223
01:12:14,880 --> 01:12:18,279
just a point in a play for Today that was

1224
01:12:18,279 --> 01:12:22,640
broadcast on BBC in the nineteen seventies, where the play

1225
01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:25,840
in question was about a paranormal research team who were

1226
01:12:25,840 --> 01:12:29,039
investigating hauntings, and part of the plot of the play

1227
01:12:29,439 --> 01:12:32,960
was talking about theories of ghosts, and this scriptwriter or

1228
01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:35,039
something it came up the idea of this stone tape

1229
01:12:35,079 --> 01:12:39,239
theory about how ghosts of recoins on the atmosphere or something,

1230
01:12:39,560 --> 01:12:41,840
and he wrote the stone tape theory. It is part

1231
01:12:41,880 --> 01:12:44,479
of a plot of a play, and then people rolled

1232
01:12:44,479 --> 01:12:46,760
with that idea and it became a theory in its

1233
01:12:46,800 --> 01:12:48,279
own right, you see, which I think.

1234
01:12:49,079 --> 01:12:51,960
Speaker 1: I remember when I first started investigating the paranormal back

1235
01:12:51,960 --> 01:12:55,720
in the early two thousands, they didn't call its stone

1236
01:12:55,760 --> 01:13:00,560
tape yet, but they were calling it I'm going to

1237
01:13:00,560 --> 01:13:04,600
have a brain freeze right now. They were saying pretty

1238
01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:07,399
much the same thing. It was like a tape recording

1239
01:13:07,439 --> 01:13:09,600
playing over and over it. And I don't buy that either,

1240
01:13:10,279 --> 01:13:14,399
because and this is Irene has a couple of experiences

1241
01:13:14,439 --> 01:13:18,199
in her book, and we've had many discussions about it.

1242
01:13:18,279 --> 01:13:22,520
I think in most cases where people are seeing let's

1243
01:13:22,520 --> 01:13:28,159
say someone dressed in period clothes and maybe they're repeating

1244
01:13:28,159 --> 01:13:30,720
a pattern or whatnot, and people go, oh, well, it's

1245
01:13:30,760 --> 01:13:31,039
just a.

1246
01:13:32,960 --> 01:13:33,479
Speaker 4: Recording.

1247
01:13:34,359 --> 01:13:41,079
Speaker 1: I can't remember the popular term, but we think it's

1248
01:13:41,359 --> 01:13:46,039
actually a time slip, and what's happening is is you're

1249
01:13:46,119 --> 01:13:51,079
seeing an actual event, but the conditions are right that

1250
01:13:51,079 --> 01:13:55,199
that time period is coming through and bleeding over into

1251
01:13:55,279 --> 01:13:55,720
our time.

1252
01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:55,960
Speaker 4: Now.

1253
01:13:56,000 --> 01:14:01,359
Speaker 1: Sometimes it happens and you can interact directly with people

1254
01:14:01,439 --> 01:14:04,439
and they will interact with you. Other times it does

1255
01:14:04,479 --> 01:14:06,840
seem like a recording because no one is aware of it.

1256
01:14:06,920 --> 01:14:10,239
On our side, we could see this event taking place.

1257
01:14:10,319 --> 01:14:12,680
Even if it's as simple as somebody walking down a corridor.

1258
01:14:13,640 --> 01:14:17,640
People think, oh, it's a ghost or it's you know,

1259
01:14:17,720 --> 01:14:21,800
one of these memory type ghost events, but it's really

1260
01:14:21,960 --> 01:14:24,560
just that time period leading through and you're just actually

1261
01:14:24,640 --> 01:14:26,560
watching it. Now you can watch it again and again

1262
01:14:26,640 --> 01:14:30,039
because there's no time that event is there and the

1263
01:14:30,079 --> 01:14:33,399
conditions are such that it bleeds through. Now. Irene has

1264
01:14:33,720 --> 01:14:36,399
again in her book there's this couple of stories, two

1265
01:14:36,479 --> 01:14:37,640
stories where.

1266
01:14:38,479 --> 01:14:39,720
Speaker 4: One she was at.

1267
01:14:39,760 --> 01:14:45,000
Speaker 1: Her son was looking at this one flat he was

1268
01:14:45,039 --> 01:14:49,000
gonna buy, and Irene and her husband went over to

1269
01:14:49,039 --> 01:14:53,520
see it. And at one point Irene walked upstairs and

1270
01:14:53,560 --> 01:14:56,960
by herself, and she walked into this one room and

1271
01:14:57,000 --> 01:15:02,960
there's this woman dressed in like nineteen twenties Edwardian's style

1272
01:15:03,319 --> 01:15:07,800
made clothing. And when she walked in, the woman turned

1273
01:15:07,840 --> 01:15:10,079
and looked at her and both of their jaws dropped

1274
01:15:10,119 --> 01:15:12,880
and hit the floor. It's the same time they.

1275
01:15:13,000 --> 01:15:16,159
Speaker 4: Saw each other. So the geist and then it.

1276
01:15:16,199 --> 01:15:21,199
Speaker 1: Faded, and you know, people go, oh, well, that's just somebody.

1277
01:15:21,239 --> 01:15:24,079
If they an old servant, they died, and now they're

1278
01:15:24,119 --> 01:15:26,960
going back about their business. They think they're still at work,

1279
01:15:27,119 --> 01:15:30,800
and they come up with all these elaborate things which

1280
01:15:30,880 --> 01:15:34,880
I just think are a bunch of bull, And in truth,

1281
01:15:35,039 --> 01:15:39,800
what it is is too very living, breathing, human beings

1282
01:15:39,920 --> 01:15:43,399
living in different time periods actually saw each other through

1283
01:15:43,439 --> 01:15:47,159
whatever the conditions are that the time or our idea

1284
01:15:47,199 --> 01:15:52,720
of time blended, the veil pulled back, or however you

1285
01:15:52,760 --> 01:15:55,079
want to describe it, and they were able to see

1286
01:15:55,079 --> 01:15:58,039
each other for a brief few seconds, and they were

1287
01:15:58,039 --> 01:15:58,960
added to each other.

1288
01:15:59,319 --> 01:16:01,920
Speaker 2: What's interesting there is, Okay, so you've got somebody who's

1289
01:16:01,960 --> 01:16:05,680
modern looking at somebody whose vintage. Presumably, if this was

1290
01:16:05,680 --> 01:16:08,840
a thing, presumably there'd be some reports of people from

1291
01:16:08,880 --> 01:16:12,840
our period seeing somebody from the future in a similar

1292
01:16:12,920 --> 01:16:13,760
kind of interaction.

1293
01:16:14,760 --> 01:16:18,479
Speaker 1: Well, see, back then, they would look at maybe how

1294
01:16:18,520 --> 01:16:21,479
she's dressed, or what she's wearing or whatnot, and not

1295
01:16:21,560 --> 01:16:24,479
being able to describe it because it's beyond that person's

1296
01:16:24,479 --> 01:16:29,840
comprehension what our society looks like. We now, in the

1297
01:16:29,880 --> 01:16:36,600
era of very overly done time travel movies and different periods,

1298
01:16:36,640 --> 01:16:39,680
we are able to understand if we're looking at somebody

1299
01:16:39,680 --> 01:16:44,800
from a different time period. But another great story in

1300
01:16:44,840 --> 01:16:48,960
Irene's book is a case that she and this other

1301
01:16:49,039 --> 01:16:54,479
team member with her organization did on site where they

1302
01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:58,880
were walking around. They were taking pictures and Irene just

1303
01:16:58,920 --> 01:17:05,439
had this pull to go to the loop, opened the door,

1304
01:17:06,000 --> 01:17:08,760
and in front of her is a sink in a

1305
01:17:08,800 --> 01:17:12,760
big wall mirror. She took a picture directly into the mirror,

1306
01:17:12,760 --> 01:17:16,439
and now her other researcher was standing right behind her

1307
01:17:16,560 --> 01:17:20,479
trying to look over her shoulder when the picture. When

1308
01:17:20,520 --> 01:17:24,840
she went and looked back at the picture, later, and

1309
01:17:24,880 --> 01:17:28,159
I'm serious, there's copies in the book and the heck,

1310
01:17:28,199 --> 01:17:30,520
if you want to send you copies of what she saw.

1311
01:17:31,800 --> 01:17:37,039
There's another person there in between her and her other

1312
01:17:37,079 --> 01:17:39,600
research who was literally standing behind her on the like

1313
01:17:39,640 --> 01:17:45,279
looking over her shoulder. There is this man who is

1314
01:17:45,439 --> 01:17:51,439
dressed in tight fitting black almost like swat here, with

1315
01:17:51,520 --> 01:17:56,079
a helmet and a chin strap, and he's holding some

1316
01:17:56,199 --> 01:17:58,239
device that we can't figure out what it is in

1317
01:17:58,279 --> 01:18:01,640
his right hand, and he's moving. They're looking straight ahead,

1318
01:18:02,000 --> 01:18:07,840
and he's moving from left to right between them, and

1319
01:18:07,880 --> 01:18:10,039
he looks like he's in the middle of a fast walk,

1320
01:18:11,399 --> 01:18:15,000
like he they just caught him in that still frame

1321
01:18:15,439 --> 01:18:18,920
as he was going through them. She always used to

1322
01:18:18,960 --> 01:18:22,640
call him her time traveler. I'm not sure if it

1323
01:18:22,680 --> 01:18:27,039
was a time traveler, maybe from the future, although the

1324
01:18:27,159 --> 01:18:31,680
gear he was wearing could kind of fit in our

1325
01:18:31,720 --> 01:18:36,439
time period for tactical gear. But the helmet and with

1326
01:18:36,520 --> 01:18:39,760
the chin strap very interesting. You can clearly see his face.

1327
01:18:40,119 --> 01:18:43,720
He looks as solid as them, and yet he shouldn't

1328
01:18:43,720 --> 01:18:44,079
be there.

1329
01:18:44,560 --> 01:18:44,840
Speaker 2: He was.

1330
01:18:45,079 --> 01:18:47,159
Speaker 1: It's a tiny bathroom, and he looked that he was

1331
01:18:47,199 --> 01:18:48,680
walking like fifty feet.

1332
01:18:48,960 --> 01:18:49,600
Speaker 2: That's crazy.

1333
01:18:51,239 --> 01:18:51,800
Speaker 4: It is.

1334
01:18:52,000 --> 01:18:54,880
Speaker 1: It's the strangest picture I've ever seen in my life,

1335
01:18:54,880 --> 01:18:57,359
and I've put it through photoshop, I've tried, and you

1336
01:18:57,399 --> 01:18:58,359
said it's nail.

1337
01:18:58,640 --> 01:18:59,880
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, I'll say that to you.

1338
01:19:00,039 --> 01:19:01,840
Speaker 3: I can say that, yeah, it's.

1339
01:19:03,600 --> 01:19:08,319
Speaker 1: It's incredible. And yet we can only try to theorize

1340
01:19:08,359 --> 01:19:10,920
what we what she caught, what she saw. But it's

1341
01:19:10,960 --> 01:19:15,079
a solid human, just like anybody else, doing something that

1342
01:19:15,159 --> 01:19:18,600
had purpose, holding something that we can't really make out,

1343
01:19:19,640 --> 01:19:23,079
and impossible for him to fit not only in that

1344
01:19:23,159 --> 01:19:25,279
bathroom but between her and her research.

1345
01:19:26,279 --> 01:19:28,199
Speaker 3: And there's a guy in a lady's bathroom.

1346
01:19:29,000 --> 01:19:32,079
Speaker 1: No, it's a it's a home bathroom. Oh, so expect

1347
01:19:32,119 --> 01:19:36,439
something very very tiny, very tiny space. And the way

1348
01:19:36,479 --> 01:19:39,560
he's moving, it's looked like he's walking across, you know,

1349
01:19:39,600 --> 01:19:40,520
a very large room.

1350
01:19:41,279 --> 01:19:41,720
Speaker 4: Wow.

1351
01:19:43,279 --> 01:19:46,159
Speaker 3: But this is how people used to communicate with black

1352
01:19:46,239 --> 01:19:49,880
mirrors and things like that in Egyptian times. Scrying and

1353
01:19:49,920 --> 01:19:53,239
that kind of thing has always done reflective surfaces, mirrors

1354
01:19:53,319 --> 01:19:56,279
or bowls or anything that had a shiny surface. So

1355
01:19:56,880 --> 01:19:59,039
it kind of comes as no surprise, even though it

1356
01:19:59,159 --> 01:20:03,000
is a surprise. But it seems like one kind of

1357
01:20:03,119 --> 01:20:07,640
possible method of communication is getting an image cast in

1358
01:20:07,680 --> 01:20:10,439
a mirror or a reflection of something, which is very interesting.

1359
01:20:10,760 --> 01:20:12,800
Speaker 4: Yeah, and that happens a lot.

1360
01:20:12,880 --> 01:20:17,319
Speaker 1: And again you have to wonder, like, well, the mirror

1361
01:20:17,399 --> 01:20:23,800
is just reflecting the light from behind you and maybe

1362
01:20:23,840 --> 01:20:30,199
not or maybe not just behind you. There are videos

1363
01:20:30,239 --> 01:20:32,560
that people have taken like they're looking in a mirror

1364
01:20:32,600 --> 01:20:35,600
and then when they turn away, their image in the

1365
01:20:35,600 --> 01:20:40,720
mirror doesn't turn he is staring. Or people who go

1366
01:20:40,880 --> 01:20:43,439
up on the side of a mirror, press against the

1367
01:20:43,479 --> 01:20:49,079
wall outside of the mirror's range, but another camera focusing

1368
01:20:49,159 --> 01:20:52,560
on them. They're nowhere near the mirror that they could

1369
01:20:52,600 --> 01:20:54,760
pick up their image. Yet when you look in the mirror,

1370
01:20:55,399 --> 01:20:59,239
there they are a couple of feet away, pressed up

1371
01:20:59,239 --> 01:21:01,640
against the wall, completely out of the mirror's view, but

1372
01:21:01,680 --> 01:21:02,840
the mirror still picks it up.

1373
01:21:03,560 --> 01:21:04,680
Speaker 3: How is that possible?

1374
01:21:05,439 --> 01:21:09,640
Speaker 1: And you know it could be the mirrors are kind

1375
01:21:09,640 --> 01:21:12,760
of windows into some of these other dimensions and realms.

1376
01:21:13,119 --> 01:21:18,199
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, spooky. So Irene's book, As We Draw to

1377
01:21:18,239 --> 01:21:21,840
a Close is called Walking with the Days.

1378
01:21:21,920 --> 01:21:27,000
Speaker 1: Walking with the Dead is available in softcover, hardcover and

1379
01:21:27,159 --> 01:21:35,399
kindle on Amazon dot com dot co UK. Okay, everybody

1380
01:21:35,399 --> 01:21:38,720
can pick that up, but I highly recommend it not

1381
01:21:38,760 --> 01:21:42,600
only just because I helped her publish it, but again

1382
01:21:42,800 --> 01:21:46,880
reading it and reading the stories and it's just it's

1383
01:21:46,960 --> 01:21:49,399
amazing the kind of life that she lived.

1384
01:21:49,960 --> 01:21:50,359
Speaker 3: Wow.

1385
01:21:50,800 --> 01:21:51,159
Speaker 4: Wow.

1386
01:21:51,800 --> 01:21:54,319
Speaker 3: But we wish her luck with it and yourself for

1387
01:21:54,399 --> 01:21:57,279
publishing it. I mean it's been out a month or two.

1388
01:21:57,119 --> 01:21:59,119
Speaker 1: Now, so it's been out about a little over a

1389
01:21:59,159 --> 01:21:59,720
month now.

1390
01:22:00,239 --> 01:22:03,479
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, good time to release it, I think. Well,

1391
01:22:03,479 --> 01:22:07,359
thank you very much, Mark Johnson, head of the Paranormal

1392
01:22:07,479 --> 01:22:11,800
UK radio network, along with I'm not.

1393
01:22:11,840 --> 01:22:17,600
Speaker 1: The hair, I mean, Irene owns it and Andy Mercer

1394
01:22:17,760 --> 01:22:20,399
is our station manager and he does a lot of

1395
01:22:20,399 --> 01:22:22,520
work on it, and I do a little bit, but

1396
01:22:22,680 --> 01:22:24,560
I'm I don't I don't run it.

1397
01:22:24,640 --> 01:22:26,039
Speaker 4: I just want to clarify.

1398
01:22:25,720 --> 01:22:29,199
Speaker 3: That, Okay, cool, all right, So thank you very much

1399
01:22:29,239 --> 01:22:32,039
anyway from Mark for joining us. Any final words Andy

1400
01:22:32,119 --> 01:22:33,000
before we depart.

1401
01:22:33,479 --> 01:22:36,399
Speaker 2: That is a really fascinating talk. I hope people find

1402
01:22:36,399 --> 01:22:38,399
it as interesting as we do. And it'd be nice

1403
01:22:38,439 --> 01:22:40,479
to do around two at some point with Mark.

1404
01:22:40,840 --> 01:22:44,520
Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, Maybe there'll be a sequel, a sequel book.

1405
01:22:44,760 --> 01:22:46,119
Speaker 4: I'd be happy to come back.

1406
01:22:46,640 --> 01:22:50,960
Speaker 3: Walking with more Dad or something or running from the Dead.

1407
01:22:51,000 --> 01:22:54,319
I think in my case, there you go all right,

1408
01:22:54,479 --> 01:22:57,119
thank you very much. Mark. You have been listening and

1409
01:22:57,199 --> 01:23:00,840
watching the Paranormal Peep Show on the Paranormal UK Radio network,

1410
01:23:01,279 --> 01:23:04,000
and stay tuned for more programs on the network coming

1411
01:23:04,079 --> 01:23:06,680
up shortly and we'll see you next month.

1412
01:23:07,000 --> 01:23:08,359
Speaker 4: Good night, good night,