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That's Chumbu Casino dot com and lived Chumba. 20 00:00:57.479 --> 00:01:00.560 Landeburgs necessary dwod wherever if I lost terms of It's eighty. 21 00:01:00.399 --> 00:01:10.920 Plus You are now listening to True Murder, The most 22 00:01:10.959 --> 00:01:14.280 shocking killers in true crime history and the authors that 23 00:01:14.400 --> 00:01:20.640 have written about them. Gaesy, Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker BTK. 24 00:01:21.519 --> 00:01:25.319 Every week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking 25 00:01:25.480 --> 00:01:29.519 and infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with 26 00:01:29.680 --> 00:01:33.640 your host journalist and author Dan Zupanski. 27 00:01:41.719 --> 00:01:46.280 Good Evening, a shocking expose of the deadliest killing spree 28 00:01:46.359 --> 00:01:50.359 in Canadian history and how police tragically failed its victims 29 00:01:50.560 --> 00:01:54.519 and survivors. As news broke of a killer rampaging across 30 00:01:54.599 --> 00:01:57.480 the tiny community of Porta Peak, Nova Scotia late on 31 00:01:57.560 --> 00:02:01.760 April eighteenth, twenty twenty, details were oddly hard to come by. 32 00:02:02.120 --> 00:02:05.439 Who was the killer, why was he not apprehended, what 33 00:02:05.560 --> 00:02:08.479 were police doing? How many were dead? And why was 34 00:02:08.520 --> 00:02:10.840 the gunman still on the loose the next morning and 35 00:02:10.960 --> 00:02:15.319 killing again. The RCMP was largely silent then and continued 36 00:02:15.319 --> 00:02:18.520 to obscure the actions of Denturis Gabriel Wartman after an 37 00:02:18.560 --> 00:02:20.879 officer's shot and killed them at a gas station during 38 00:02:20.919 --> 00:02:24.680 a chance encounter. Though retired as an investigative journalist and author, 39 00:02:25.039 --> 00:02:28.319 Paul Plango spent much of his career reporting on Canada's 40 00:02:28.319 --> 00:02:32.039 troubled National Police Force. Watching the RCMP stumble through the 41 00:02:32.080 --> 00:02:34.840 Porta Peak massacre only a few hours from his Nova 42 00:02:34.879 --> 00:02:37.879 Scotia home, Plango knew the story behind the headlines was 43 00:02:37.919 --> 00:02:41.319 more complicated and damning than anyone was willing to admit. 44 00:02:42.199 --> 00:02:46.000 With the COVID nineteen lockdown sealing off the Maritimes, no 45 00:02:46.199 --> 00:02:49.919 journalists in the province knew the RCMP better than Polango did. 46 00:02:50.560 --> 00:02:52.919 Within a month, he was back in print and on 47 00:02:53.120 --> 00:02:56.000 the radio, peeling away the layers of this murderous episode 48 00:02:56.120 --> 00:02:59.960 as only he could, and unearthing the collision of failure 49 00:03:00.400 --> 00:03:04.879 and malfeasance that cost a quiet community twenty two innocent lives. 50 00:03:05.960 --> 00:03:09.039 The book that we're featuring this evening is twenty two Murders, 51 00:03:09.159 --> 00:03:12.520 Investigating the Massacres, cover Up and Obstacles to Justice and 52 00:03:12.599 --> 00:03:16.599 Nova Scotia Part two with my special guest, investigative author 53 00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:20.280 and journalist Paul Polango. Welcome back to the program and 54 00:03:20.360 --> 00:03:22.960 thank you for this interview. Paul Polango, Thank you, Dan, 55 00:03:23.039 --> 00:03:26.520 good to be back. Thank you so much. People are 56 00:03:27.000 --> 00:03:30.240 highly anticipating this part two of this incredible I know 57 00:03:30.360 --> 00:03:34.680 I over use that word, but incredible story and remarkable book. 58 00:03:35.159 --> 00:03:38.280 Let's get to where we were last time. We were 59 00:03:38.360 --> 00:03:43.080 talking about your ongoing investigation and your use of media 60 00:03:43.439 --> 00:03:48.319 anywhere you could, podcasts and radio. Talked about Rick how 61 00:03:48.719 --> 00:03:53.960 radio show and your ability and your willingness to resort 62 00:03:54.120 --> 00:03:58.520 to controversy and ask some hard questions to get some 63 00:03:58.639 --> 00:04:02.039 people to come forward. Now, we hadn't mentioned somebody that's 64 00:04:02.159 --> 00:04:05.319 instrumental in helping you in this investigation, and that was 65 00:04:05.439 --> 00:04:08.240 Chad Jones. Tell us a little bit about Chad Jones 66 00:04:08.400 --> 00:04:12.039 and what some of the investigation that he does leads 67 00:04:12.120 --> 00:04:16.279 to in terms of a person named Leon Jodre Chad Jones. 68 00:04:16.399 --> 00:04:20.560 Okay, I came across Chad Jones in an unusual way. 69 00:04:20.680 --> 00:04:24.240 I was approached by a podcaster called Little Gray Cells, 70 00:04:24.240 --> 00:04:27.279 who do a YouTube channel. And this is all unfamiliar 71 00:04:27.480 --> 00:04:29.759 territory to me. You know, I'm an old guy who 72 00:04:29.839 --> 00:04:34.240 does radio, TV and the computer and I didn't know 73 00:04:34.399 --> 00:04:38.279 much about podcasts. And Little Gray Cells and their host 74 00:04:38.720 --> 00:04:41.360 who went by the name Seamus Gorman but whose actual 75 00:04:41.600 --> 00:04:45.759 name was Paul Ragona had me on and I think 76 00:04:46.040 --> 00:04:48.040 I was on a couple of times, and there was 77 00:04:48.079 --> 00:04:50.800 a panel of three on his end. There was him 78 00:04:51.319 --> 00:04:54.040 a guy named Steve and this other guy called NES 79 00:04:54.240 --> 00:04:57.639 guy who had sort of a ponytail or his hair 80 00:04:57.720 --> 00:05:01.879 tied back and a ponytail and added and as we 81 00:05:02.079 --> 00:05:04.360 chatted in the you know, the one or two times 82 00:05:04.399 --> 00:05:06.079 that I was there, I think it was two, I 83 00:05:06.240 --> 00:05:10.079 was really impressed by the questions that NS guy asked 84 00:05:11.079 --> 00:05:16.720 and his apparent intellect. And at some point we arranged 85 00:05:16.800 --> 00:05:19.279 to have a private conversation. I told him to call me. 86 00:05:19.399 --> 00:05:23.160 I had something, and we got talking and I realized 87 00:05:23.199 --> 00:05:26.079 that now he was the unusual guy. He you know, 88 00:05:26.160 --> 00:05:29.160 I needed help and I couldn't you know. I started 89 00:05:29.199 --> 00:05:31.959 out trying to help other journalists with what I could 90 00:05:32.399 --> 00:05:34.560 I knew and what I could sense about the story, 91 00:05:34.959 --> 00:05:38.000 and you know, help them with accessing good sources that 92 00:05:38.120 --> 00:05:41.000 I had inside the r scamp and outside the r scamp, 93 00:05:41.560 --> 00:05:43.720 and I couldn't get them. So I got Chad and 94 00:05:43.759 --> 00:05:46.199 I sort of had a meeting of minds, you know, 95 00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:49.600 we went up to pour a pic together and started 96 00:05:49.639 --> 00:05:54.319 scouting out the various locations and trying to do timing 97 00:05:54.560 --> 00:05:57.199 on what the RCMP said they did and what they 98 00:05:57.319 --> 00:06:00.399 actually did, what the possibilities were, and really we started 99 00:06:00.439 --> 00:06:04.199 mapping out the story together, and eventually I became to 100 00:06:04.319 --> 00:06:08.639 call Chad. I had a nickname from artificial intelligence, because 101 00:06:08.680 --> 00:06:11.439 anytime I had a question, I would just add, you know, 102 00:06:12.079 --> 00:06:16.000 call Chad up and instantaneously, this thirty three year old 103 00:06:16.040 --> 00:06:20.519 guy who worked as a distribution manager in Halifax knew 104 00:06:20.560 --> 00:06:24.720 the answer to everything very quickly. And plus he was 105 00:06:24.920 --> 00:06:27.759 monitoring what else was what was going on in the 106 00:06:27.839 --> 00:06:30.279 wider community, in the and in cyberspace. 107 00:06:30.480 --> 00:06:33.199 Now, tell us about the circumstances in which you get 108 00:06:33.519 --> 00:06:40.000 to interview this Leon Jodre and what exactly is his 109 00:06:40.120 --> 00:06:41.839 account and what does he have to say? 110 00:06:42.040 --> 00:06:45.240 Well, the difficulty in telling this story as I you know, 111 00:06:45.319 --> 00:06:47.959 as I pointed out in the previous episode, the Prime 112 00:06:48.040 --> 00:06:51.519 Minister had said, you know, we don't want to glorify 113 00:06:52.160 --> 00:06:55.439 Gabriel Wortman's infamy, we should not name him. And then 114 00:06:55.480 --> 00:06:59.040 the Canadian media dutifully went along with that, right across 115 00:06:59.199 --> 00:07:03.040 the board, a media, mainstream media. So now we had 116 00:07:03.120 --> 00:07:07.120 the perpetrator, and then we had his common law wife 117 00:07:07.160 --> 00:07:09.959 of nineteen years, who was never named in print, Like 118 00:07:10.040 --> 00:07:12.879 getting her name was almost impossible, trying to figure out 119 00:07:12.920 --> 00:07:17.480 who she was until Frank Magazine, the satire magazine in 120 00:07:17.639 --> 00:07:21.480 Halifax wrote a piece about her and cleverly described her 121 00:07:21.560 --> 00:07:24.600 as a hero, just so nobody would come back at 122 00:07:24.720 --> 00:07:26.879 them and you know, sort of pick up their office 123 00:07:27.399 --> 00:07:30.199 for outing Lisa Banfield and her name. So they sort 124 00:07:30.199 --> 00:07:32.120 of did it in a tongue in cheek way, right, 125 00:07:32.199 --> 00:07:35.000 And I wanted to know more about Lisa Banfield, and 126 00:07:35.800 --> 00:07:37.839 you know, and as you see in the story, the 127 00:07:37.920 --> 00:07:40.319 other thing that was going on, my health wasn't so 128 00:07:40.439 --> 00:07:42.759 good at the time. My wife's health wasn't so good 129 00:07:42.800 --> 00:07:46.040 at the time, and we had COVID lockdown, so we 130 00:07:46.800 --> 00:07:49.160 never really left home. You know, at one point in 131 00:07:49.279 --> 00:07:51.959 Nova Scotia, you weren't even allowed to leave your county. 132 00:07:52.319 --> 00:07:56.759 And eventually a sunny day came and Chad and I said, okay, 133 00:07:57.639 --> 00:08:00.519 let's go. He says, you got im meet Leon Jodry 134 00:08:01.439 --> 00:08:04.959 and he arranged there because on his own, as a 135 00:08:05.000 --> 00:08:09.199 citizen investigator, he was identifying other people because there's so 136 00:08:09.360 --> 00:08:12.600 many people in this story partition. There's twenty two victims, 137 00:08:12.879 --> 00:08:15.279 and there's the police, and there's the politicians. There's so 138 00:08:15.319 --> 00:08:17.279 many angles to go that, you know, you can tie 139 00:08:17.360 --> 00:08:19.160 up a lot of a newser of just following all 140 00:08:19.199 --> 00:08:20.800 the angles. So there was just the two of us 141 00:08:20.879 --> 00:08:23.240 at this point, and we said, okay, well let's drive 142 00:08:23.319 --> 00:08:25.199 up to portapec And it was like a two hour 143 00:08:25.360 --> 00:08:28.519 drive and we got there and we met Leon at 144 00:08:28.560 --> 00:08:30.839 a restaurant I think it called the C and C. 145 00:08:31.079 --> 00:08:33.679 And as I joke about it, Chad used to call 146 00:08:33.759 --> 00:08:37.720 it the Chewin' choke as a joke. R you know, 147 00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:40.799 like a typical thing they do in rural communities, you know, 148 00:08:40.840 --> 00:08:43.279 which wasn't fair with the food was pretty good. And 149 00:08:43.879 --> 00:08:46.039 we met Leon and then he took us on his 150 00:08:46.399 --> 00:08:49.480 version of the story, which was very compelling. 151 00:08:49.639 --> 00:08:53.320 Well, you're right, that's what with the narrative from police, 152 00:08:53.360 --> 00:08:55.960 from the rs MP was that they hadn't been in 153 00:08:56.080 --> 00:08:58.480 contact with her at all till six thirty in the 154 00:08:58.559 --> 00:09:01.440 morning when she came out of the woods. Leon was 155 00:09:01.480 --> 00:09:03.879 telling you that she came to his cabin. 156 00:09:04.080 --> 00:09:06.039 It's not a cabin, it's a house. 157 00:09:06.320 --> 00:09:10.840 Okay, it's a house. But the narrative was totally contradictory 158 00:09:10.919 --> 00:09:13.639 to what she had said and what the RCMP had 159 00:09:13.679 --> 00:09:17.080 said and what the media had reported. So tell us 160 00:09:17.120 --> 00:09:18.399 the difference, the vast difference. 161 00:09:18.440 --> 00:09:22.159 Well, the RCMP narrative is this woman was beaten, drag 162 00:09:22.399 --> 00:09:25.200 kick shot at you know, forced to watch her. The 163 00:09:25.320 --> 00:09:30.240 cottage burned down, the warehouse burned down. She tied up 164 00:09:30.759 --> 00:09:33.960 handcuffed in the back of a decommissioned police car, crawled 165 00:09:34.039 --> 00:09:37.600 through the silent patrolman that separates the front and back seat, 166 00:09:38.000 --> 00:09:40.480 escaped into the bush and hit out for eight and 167 00:09:40.519 --> 00:09:43.919 a half hours, dressed in yoga pants and a spandex top. 168 00:09:44.399 --> 00:09:48.320 She had no jacket, no gloves, no boots, And they 169 00:09:48.360 --> 00:09:51.039 said she arrived at you know for six thirty, came 170 00:09:51.080 --> 00:09:54.399 out of the woods just as the RCMP was going home. 171 00:09:54.480 --> 00:09:57.720 The old RCMP officers went home at six thirty because 172 00:09:57.759 --> 00:10:01.279 they presumed so. They said that we're been committed suicide. 173 00:10:01.480 --> 00:10:03.679 And right around this time she comes out of the 174 00:10:03.759 --> 00:10:07.240 woods and goes to Leon Jodrey's house. The RCMP goes 175 00:10:07.320 --> 00:10:11.159 rescue her, take her to the hospital, and then everything 176 00:10:11.279 --> 00:10:15.039 really goes silent. You don't know anything really about Lisa Banfield. 177 00:10:15.360 --> 00:10:19.919 And so we went and saw Wortman, and that where 178 00:10:19.960 --> 00:10:22.759 we went and saw Leon Jodriy, and his version of 179 00:10:22.799 --> 00:10:25.720 the story was somewhat different. Leon is one of the 180 00:10:25.759 --> 00:10:30.519 few people who survive this onslaught Porto Park remember thirteen 181 00:10:30.639 --> 00:10:33.000 people are killed. At the time, there might have been 182 00:10:33.559 --> 00:10:37.759 probably eighteen to twenty people residing in houses at that 183 00:10:37.919 --> 00:10:40.840 time of the year as far as seasonal community. So 184 00:10:41.080 --> 00:10:43.279 most of the people that were wiped out by warpman. 185 00:10:43.519 --> 00:10:47.200 And the night before, Leon who was you know, he 186 00:10:47.279 --> 00:10:50.039 worked in the forest. He worked for the provincial Department 187 00:10:50.039 --> 00:10:53.240 of Natural Resources. He did a lot of forestry work. 188 00:10:53.559 --> 00:10:57.639 Strong guy. His neighbors Jamie and Greg Blair, were cleaning 189 00:10:57.720 --> 00:11:00.440 up their property for you know, the spring clean up 190 00:11:00.600 --> 00:11:04.639 and cutting out some bush and him and Leon and 191 00:11:04.679 --> 00:11:07.679 another guy helped them that day taking bush down to 192 00:11:07.759 --> 00:11:09.799 the beach because once a year, a couple of times 193 00:11:09.840 --> 00:11:12.000 a year, they'd have a giant bonfire down there, a 194 00:11:12.080 --> 00:11:14.720 big party in the neighborhood with his giant fire on 195 00:11:14.840 --> 00:11:16.960 the waters of the Bay of Fundy, right, And then 196 00:11:17.120 --> 00:11:19.759 they went back to Jamie and Greg's house, had dinner 197 00:11:20.120 --> 00:11:22.840 at around nine o'clock. He went home because he's a 198 00:11:23.559 --> 00:11:25.679 early to bed, early to rise kind of guy. In 199 00:11:25.759 --> 00:11:28.200 the middle of the night, he said, he remembers exactly 200 00:11:28.240 --> 00:11:31.879 at three point thirty three am, he remember smelling smoke 201 00:11:32.039 --> 00:11:35.360 and he said the smoke was not wood burning, it 202 00:11:35.559 --> 00:11:38.399 was something else, and so he was quite alarmed by it. 203 00:11:38.639 --> 00:11:40.159 And after he thought about it, he got in his 204 00:11:40.279 --> 00:11:43.519 truck and he roared around the neighborhood in the dark, 205 00:11:43.639 --> 00:11:46.240 and there were no police there. And eventually he goes 206 00:11:46.279 --> 00:11:49.360 about a kilometer and a half almost a mile from 207 00:11:49.440 --> 00:11:52.919 his place to Gabriel Wortman's cottage at two hundred quart 208 00:11:53.000 --> 00:11:57.679 Pit Beach Road, and there's a police armored vehicle sitting 209 00:11:57.759 --> 00:12:01.480 there and the properties and cinder and the police just 210 00:12:01.559 --> 00:12:03.600 tell him to turn around and go back and get 211 00:12:03.639 --> 00:12:05.399 out of there, which is kind of odd because they 212 00:12:05.440 --> 00:12:08.320 still hadn't found workman. They how do they know it 213 00:12:08.440 --> 00:12:11.000 wasn't work How do they just set him away? So 214 00:12:11.159 --> 00:12:13.519 he roared around the other way up to the intersection 215 00:12:13.720 --> 00:12:16.759 down Orchard Beach Drive, went past Greg Blair's house. He 216 00:12:16.840 --> 00:12:18.919 saw it wasn't on fire. It was only four o'clock 217 00:12:18.960 --> 00:12:20.440 in the morning. He wasn't going to go in there, 218 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:22.919 drove down a little farther, turned around, came up. Didn't 219 00:12:23.039 --> 00:12:25.519 notice that he had driven past two bodies lying by 220 00:12:25.559 --> 00:12:27.960 the side of the road, you know, Corey Ellison on 221 00:12:28.039 --> 00:12:31.879 one side, Leon's old girlfriend Lisa McCully on the other side. 222 00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:35.440 Behind the fence, drives back to his place, starts texting 223 00:12:35.600 --> 00:12:38.679 and trying to find out what's going on in his neighborhood, 224 00:12:39.440 --> 00:12:42.039 makes himself a coffee. At six point thirty, you know, 225 00:12:42.159 --> 00:12:45.200 the sun's coming up. There's a knock at the door 226 00:12:45.360 --> 00:12:48.600 and it's Lisa Banfield and he says, uh, you know, 227 00:12:48.720 --> 00:12:52.720 what are you doing here? You know, Gabriel doesn't like me. 228 00:12:53.840 --> 00:12:57.799 And Li says, oh, I'll leave, and she turned around 229 00:12:57.840 --> 00:13:00.600 to leave, and Wortman said, no, no, no, you can't go. 230 00:13:01.240 --> 00:13:03.799 You know. She said, Gabriel's gone crazy. And he brought 231 00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:07.000 her into the house and right away he said he 232 00:13:07.159 --> 00:13:11.679 noticed her makeup was perfect, and she said she had 233 00:13:11.720 --> 00:13:14.320 these skippy clothes on. And she said she'd been out 234 00:13:14.399 --> 00:13:17.879 all night in the woods and it was zero degrees celsius, 235 00:13:17.919 --> 00:13:21.000 which is thirty two degrees fahrenheit that night, and cold 236 00:13:21.039 --> 00:13:23.399 because it's a windy, windy place there. You know, the 237 00:13:23.480 --> 00:13:25.519 Bay of Fundi has the highest tides of the world. 238 00:13:25.720 --> 00:13:28.120 You imagine, you can imagine the wind right beside their 239 00:13:28.200 --> 00:13:32.600 all constant. So he called nine one one and got 240 00:13:32.720 --> 00:13:35.360 the operator, told him what was going on. I have 241 00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:39.320 Gabriel Wortman's girlfriend here, Da Da da DA and within 242 00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:43.120 three minutes swat team members where there are er team 243 00:13:43.159 --> 00:13:45.960 members for the RCMP. They you know, Leon gave her 244 00:13:46.039 --> 00:13:49.080 some shoes to wear, something to cover up a blanket. 245 00:13:49.360 --> 00:13:52.240 The police took her away, and they basically didn't search 246 00:13:52.320 --> 00:13:55.440 his house, didn't search his property. He said their behavior 247 00:13:55.639 --> 00:13:59.360 was really really strange in his opinion, and from the outside, 248 00:13:59.399 --> 00:14:03.399 he said, I don't believe her story, you know. He said, 249 00:14:03.679 --> 00:14:07.320 she didn't smell of gasoline, she didn't look like she'd 250 00:14:07.360 --> 00:14:08.960 been in the woods. This is a guy who knows 251 00:14:09.000 --> 00:14:10.960 the woods there and if you look at the woods, 252 00:14:11.120 --> 00:14:15.279 they're almost impossible to travel. The roads are gravel. Walking 253 00:14:15.360 --> 00:14:17.440 barefoot around the woods for eight and a half hours, 254 00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:19.960 I mean, Lisa said at one point she hid in 255 00:14:20.039 --> 00:14:22.039 a tree stump, and I thought, what is this like 256 00:14:22.200 --> 00:14:24.480 Lord of the Rings and lead you all without the 257 00:14:24.559 --> 00:14:26.559 same thing. So he wanted to tell his story, and 258 00:14:26.639 --> 00:14:29.480 he would tell everyone history, and it was very convincing. 259 00:14:29.679 --> 00:14:31.120 He's the kind of guy who looks you in the 260 00:14:31.159 --> 00:14:33.919 eye and tells you the story. But nobody wanted to 261 00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:37.919 hear his story, so the media would never report Leon's 262 00:14:38.039 --> 00:14:41.320 version of events. They'll talk about Lisa Banfield going to 263 00:14:41.440 --> 00:14:45.080 his house, but never that Leon thought didn't believe her story. 264 00:14:45.480 --> 00:14:49.159 And as I started to examine this story and eventually 265 00:14:49.200 --> 00:14:51.759 started reporting on it, others would be reporting on the 266 00:14:51.799 --> 00:14:54.919 story like Global News for example, did a podcast thirteen 267 00:14:54.960 --> 00:14:57.960 and a half hours, CBC did stories on it, other 268 00:14:58.039 --> 00:15:00.799 reporters did story and all they would do is report 269 00:15:00.960 --> 00:15:04.600 the version of the story that Lisa Banfield told to 270 00:15:04.679 --> 00:15:07.200 the police. And the RCMP would tell this story and 271 00:15:07.279 --> 00:15:09.879 when they were confronted by why did they use Leon 272 00:15:10.039 --> 00:15:14.279 Jogeres's story, Global News for example, on two occasions said well, 273 00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:17.639 his version of events doesn't fit the police version of events. 274 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:21.679 And that's the kind of reporter were we're getting. There 275 00:15:21.799 --> 00:15:26.960 was no skepticism, no suspension of disbelief about the RCMP story, 276 00:15:27.279 --> 00:15:29.519 even though there were obvious holes in it, and when 277 00:15:29.600 --> 00:15:32.000 you could prove that there was something wrong with the story, 278 00:15:32.200 --> 00:15:34.200 other reporters were just ignore it. Where they're going to 279 00:15:34.240 --> 00:15:36.360 stick to the narrative that the police had given them. 280 00:15:36.480 --> 00:15:39.559 And that sort of forced me forward into telling digging 281 00:15:39.679 --> 00:15:42.720 deeper and starting to come up with the idea I 282 00:15:43.360 --> 00:15:45.080 was going to have to write a book there, because 283 00:15:45.279 --> 00:15:47.720 no one is going to listen to the to the 284 00:15:47.799 --> 00:15:48.360 real story. 285 00:15:48.480 --> 00:15:50.279 What we didn't mention too, is that part of her 286 00:15:50.440 --> 00:15:53.320 story was that she had been handcuffed in the back 287 00:15:53.399 --> 00:15:56.519 of one of these police cars and then she had escaped. 288 00:15:56.919 --> 00:15:57.679 What was his. 289 00:15:58.519 --> 00:16:01.639 Observance and regarded the handcuff, Well. 290 00:16:01.519 --> 00:16:04.799 He saw no handcuffs. There were no handcuffs, you know. 291 00:16:05.879 --> 00:16:07.720 I think she may have said, oh, I slipped out 292 00:16:07.720 --> 00:16:09.919 of the handcuffs. But in later as I did the 293 00:16:10.000 --> 00:16:13.000 investigation and met other people who were in the community, 294 00:16:13.559 --> 00:16:17.080 including one woman, Cindy Sterrett, who is sort of one 295 00:16:17.120 --> 00:16:20.600 of Wortman's regular girlfriends up there, and she had worked 296 00:16:20.639 --> 00:16:24.200 at an adult shop and had gifted some S and 297 00:16:24.320 --> 00:16:28.080 M type handcuffs, bondage handcuffs to workmen and along with 298 00:16:28.240 --> 00:16:33.399 other toys, and those handcuffs had a safety button on 299 00:16:33.480 --> 00:16:35.720 a release button that you could take off. So the 300 00:16:35.840 --> 00:16:38.720 question became, was she really handcuffed or what were these 301 00:16:38.960 --> 00:16:41.399 S and M handcuffs part of the show. But we 302 00:16:41.519 --> 00:16:43.399 still don't have an answer to that. Two years down 303 00:16:43.440 --> 00:16:43.879 the road. 304 00:16:43.960 --> 00:16:46.840 When you talk about the narrative that the police had 305 00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:51.240 tell us about this, you know, prelude to kidnap to 306 00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:55.279 the killings itself, and this was supposed to be their anniversary, 307 00:16:55.360 --> 00:16:59.679 their nineteenth anniversary this night, so they drove around a 308 00:16:59.799 --> 00:17:02.480 course to her, what did they do on this drive? 309 00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:05.839 According to her, on that day they had a criminal 310 00:17:05.920 --> 00:17:07.519 who we may or may not get to here, Peter 311 00:17:07.640 --> 00:17:11.880 Griffin working you know, who has spent time in jail 312 00:17:11.960 --> 00:17:16.720 for drug trafficking. Had associations with the laugh Familia cartel 313 00:17:16.920 --> 00:17:20.799 in Mexico and MS thirteen and the Hells Angels. He 314 00:17:21.000 --> 00:17:25.000 was their yard boy and he was recently off He 315 00:17:25.119 --> 00:17:27.960 was on parole or just off parole for a previous conviction. 316 00:17:28.480 --> 00:17:32.839 They went for a ride around sort of northern Nova Scotia. 317 00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:37.480 According to Banfield that they visited a few places that 318 00:17:37.680 --> 00:17:42.880 subsequently Workman would return to the next day and kill 319 00:17:43.000 --> 00:17:45.880 some people. But they also went to spring Hill where 320 00:17:45.880 --> 00:17:49.960 there's a prison, a federal prison, and he gifted some 321 00:17:50.160 --> 00:17:54.519 of his dentist equipment to another dentriss there, saying he 322 00:17:54.680 --> 00:17:58.279 was getting out of the business. They drove by another 323 00:17:58.400 --> 00:18:02.079 dentrous cottage. Her name was Gina Golay, who turned out 324 00:18:02.119 --> 00:18:05.039 to be his last victim, and Lisa Banfield told the 325 00:18:05.039 --> 00:18:09.880 police she didn't know how Workman knew where Gulay's place was. 326 00:18:10.359 --> 00:18:12.759 It's interesting to note that when the police first told 327 00:18:12.839 --> 00:18:16.119 this story, they didn't have the cottage in the story. 328 00:18:16.279 --> 00:18:18.680 They led people to believe that he had driven by 329 00:18:18.799 --> 00:18:23.000 Gina Galay's house, which was about almost an hour's drive 330 00:18:23.119 --> 00:18:27.400 in the other direction for its Halifax, and so it 331 00:18:27.519 --> 00:18:32.039 was all sort of vague, and the story was portrayed 332 00:18:32.119 --> 00:18:36.839 as he was driving around, was driving around, staking out places. 333 00:18:36.920 --> 00:18:39.200 But along the way he went to the prison and 334 00:18:39.559 --> 00:18:42.680 they looked at the prison and he told Lisa, I'm 335 00:18:42.759 --> 00:18:45.640 never going in there, which suggests there was something going 336 00:18:45.720 --> 00:18:48.559 in in his mind that either he was under investigation 337 00:18:49.119 --> 00:18:52.039 or something was going on to make him fear going 338 00:18:52.119 --> 00:18:54.480 into the prison. His uncle had been in prison, and 339 00:18:54.599 --> 00:18:58.519 meanwhile he had three other relatives who were our CFP police. 340 00:18:58.599 --> 00:19:01.799 So he was in this lotus of this in between world, 341 00:19:02.079 --> 00:19:05.319 and there was obviously things on his mind. You know, 342 00:19:05.400 --> 00:19:08.559 he was depressed. Friends said he was drinking a lot 343 00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:12.160 again and he was concerned about going to jail. They 344 00:19:12.240 --> 00:19:15.359 returned home around five o'clock that night, and then they 345 00:19:15.440 --> 00:19:19.160 went and apparently went over to the warehouse, which is 346 00:19:19.200 --> 00:19:22.000 about four hundred meters walk through the woods. And we're 347 00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:25.000 having a virtual party. This is the police story with 348 00:19:25.079 --> 00:19:27.759 a couple in Maine and someone said about a recommit 349 00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:31.160 you know, said they should have a recommitment ceremony the 350 00:19:31.279 --> 00:19:34.519 next year. And apparently this led to a fight between 351 00:19:34.559 --> 00:19:38.680 Workmen and Lisa Banfield, and then the events happened, the 352 00:19:38.799 --> 00:19:42.079 murders began to happen. That's the official story to me. 353 00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:43.920 It didn't pass the smell test. 354 00:19:44.200 --> 00:19:49.079 Before we talk about your further investigation, Let's people are 355 00:19:49.119 --> 00:19:52.599 familiar with Peter Griffin, but only in this limited way, 356 00:19:52.680 --> 00:19:56.400 and that he was responsible supposedly for the decal on 357 00:19:56.559 --> 00:19:59.640 the police car, on the replica car, the manufacturing of that. 358 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:01.359 Can you tell us about that. 359 00:20:01.640 --> 00:20:06.279 Well, Peter Griffin, he is asidd this character who I 360 00:20:06.359 --> 00:20:10.200 sort of I identified in the summer of twenty twenty. 361 00:20:10.480 --> 00:20:12.880 His name had not been in the press and the 362 00:20:13.039 --> 00:20:16.920 RCMP hadn't released it. They said that the person who 363 00:20:17.160 --> 00:20:20.839 put the the decals on the police car they dressed 364 00:20:20.920 --> 00:20:24.440 up a fully functional looking police car, wasn't going to 365 00:20:24.519 --> 00:20:28.079 be charged and they were innocent victims. And I started 366 00:20:28.119 --> 00:20:30.799 to look. I heard rumors from various sources about this 367 00:20:31.119 --> 00:20:34.599 drinking group that Workman had of the Friday night Friday 368 00:20:34.640 --> 00:20:37.559 Afternoon club and they said there were some heavy dudes 369 00:20:37.599 --> 00:20:40.640 there that what I was told in other people, and 370 00:20:41.640 --> 00:20:44.119 I eventually figured out that one of the people was 371 00:20:44.200 --> 00:20:47.440 Peter Allen Griffin, and he had been arrested in Edmonton 372 00:20:48.359 --> 00:20:53.599 back in twenty and fourteen or so with heavy duty 373 00:20:54.480 --> 00:20:58.680 drug smuggling weapons and with links, as I said to 374 00:20:58.880 --> 00:21:02.920 left Familia MS thirteen and his own grandmother was in 375 00:21:03.160 --> 00:21:07.079 you know, associates with the Hell's Angels, and there were 376 00:21:07.119 --> 00:21:10.680 family friends, the two brothers named the Mercero Brothers, especially 377 00:21:10.799 --> 00:21:13.920 Randy Mercero. So this is a sort of this you 378 00:21:14.000 --> 00:21:17.359 start getting into the biker world that exists in an 379 00:21:17.480 --> 00:21:20.759 organized crime world in Colchester, with all these relationships that 380 00:21:20.839 --> 00:21:24.440 are very close to Workman and the activities he was 381 00:21:24.519 --> 00:21:25.000 involved in. 382 00:21:25.279 --> 00:21:28.920 Another breakthrough you talk about that was very important in 383 00:21:29.000 --> 00:21:33.480 this as your further investigation was a person named Laura Graham. 384 00:21:34.720 --> 00:21:37.359 What do you learn as a result of what she 385 00:21:37.559 --> 00:21:39.119 tells you? Laura Graham, you have to. 386 00:21:39.200 --> 00:21:43.799 Understand that, Okay, we're now like nine months down the road. 387 00:21:44.160 --> 00:21:49.160 The RCMP is refusing to release any real documents about 388 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:51.960 what happened. They're making the media fight to get at 389 00:21:52.039 --> 00:21:55.319 what are called informations to obtain search warrants, and they're 390 00:21:55.359 --> 00:21:58.279 heavily redacted, so it's almost impossible to figure out what 391 00:21:58.640 --> 00:22:01.599 is going on what they did. They're not identifying any 392 00:22:01.680 --> 00:22:05.160 officers who were at the scene. They contended that they 393 00:22:05.200 --> 00:22:09.200 were working on a major investigation, which I knew was 394 00:22:09.240 --> 00:22:11.480 a cover because that's usually what they do. They shut 395 00:22:11.559 --> 00:22:14.319 all kind of discussion down saying they're working on an investigation, 396 00:22:14.599 --> 00:22:18.079 and no investigation ever happens. Because the RCMPS, as I 397 00:22:18.160 --> 00:22:21.039 showed in my previous books, was really good at building 398 00:22:21.119 --> 00:22:24.960 files but not building cases, so I'm suspicious to them 399 00:22:25.119 --> 00:22:28.720 doing that. And I eventually did a story that begins 400 00:22:28.759 --> 00:22:32.880 this sort of sequence, this tumbling sequence, into the deeper story. 401 00:22:33.200 --> 00:22:37.160