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<v Speaker 1>Have you ever been in a situation where the hair

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<v Speaker 1>on the back of your neck stands up for no

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<v Speaker 1>apparent reason. You should be safe, but something doesn't feel

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<v Speaker 1>quite right. Ignoring your gut feeling, you shake it off,

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<v Speaker 1>only to regret it later because before you know it,

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<v Speaker 1>it's too late and you're gone without a trace.

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<v Speaker 2>Good morning the following podcast and grab content manial audience listener,

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<v Speaker 2>just ustion? Is that us? Welcome back. I'm Nicole and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Ben, and you're listening to Wicked and Graham.

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<v Speaker 1>A true crime podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>And I have whiskey today, so you don't get a chick.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm drinking water.

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<v Speaker 2>I clinkle, clinkle, clank.

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<v Speaker 1>We're not making any noise.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm trying to drink clink. I'd clink the ice there.

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<v Speaker 2>I can't think of a word. Wow, i'd clink the ice.

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<v Speaker 2>But I have stones in there and they're just like

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<v Speaker 2>and they don't move well, not unless I like make

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of motion. I'm gonna spill my whiskey. You know.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh well, we wouldn't want that, no.

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<v Speaker 2>Because ice floats and it clinks easier where stones are

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<v Speaker 2>just sitting on the bottom.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah you know, yeah, I know. I know, I know,

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<v Speaker 1>I know.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to the show, guys. How's it going, what's new,

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<v Speaker 2>what's shaking? What's happening? Yeah, the whole shebang.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we have a lot going on here.

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<v Speaker 2>We do like what, I have no idea, you have

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<v Speaker 2>no ideas. We didn't discuss what we're going to discuss

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<v Speaker 2>intro today.

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<v Speaker 1>My day has literally been full of podcast research, sorry,

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<v Speaker 1>and killing mosquitoes and many of them had blood in them.

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<v Speaker 1>So our tiny home probably looks like a slight crime

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<v Speaker 1>scene right now. Probably I cleaned up the blood, but

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<v Speaker 1>you know it's still there and never actually goes away.

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<v Speaker 2>Did you bleach it and everything? I didn't?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, shit, and it's either my blood, Ripley's blood, Meeka's blood,

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<v Speaker 1>or Kiwi's blood.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, if you mysteriously go like disappear tomorrow and

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<v Speaker 2>CSI comes into our little tiny home, I am fucked

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<v Speaker 2>you are, because.

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<v Speaker 1>Like there's probably at least three three to four splatters

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<v Speaker 1>wow around Wow. Yeah, so we have a mosquito problem here.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know if other people have to deal with

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<v Speaker 1>that shit, but it seriously sucks because it's like winter's gone,

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<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh, Like you can go outside, you can

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<v Speaker 1>get fresh air and then like boom.

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<v Speaker 2>Just swarms of mosquitoes.

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<v Speaker 1>Likes really bad this year.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so so yeah, that's that's totally fun. That's what

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<v Speaker 2>we're dealing with. But it doesn't usually ask the whole No,

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<v Speaker 2>it doesn't, which is good.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but I wouldn't mind living somewhere that doesn't have mosquitoes,

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<v Speaker 1>to be honest.

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<v Speaker 2>That's true. Maybe one day we'll see one day we

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<v Speaker 2>were talking about but doing some moving the other day.

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<v Speaker 2>Though It'll be a while before that occurs because me,

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<v Speaker 2>we got jobs, we got life, the whole thing, so

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<v Speaker 2>it'll be down the road.

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<v Speaker 1>But I do think one day we'll probably move, though, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>one day.

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<v Speaker 2>One day, I was going to say something. Oh right,

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<v Speaker 2>we gave out something. Just the other day on our

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<v Speaker 2>Patreon someone else got some suf.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, we've done it two weeks in a row now.

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<v Speaker 2>The winner of this one was Sabrina, who guess what

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<v Speaker 2>was who guessed this case?

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<v Speaker 1>Right?

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<v Speaker 2>Because you gave him a hint for this case.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I thought the kate. Literally every week I'm like,

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<v Speaker 1>oh my gosh, this guest is gonna be so hard,

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<v Speaker 1>and it's just not everyone.

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<v Speaker 2>You guys are way too smart for us because you

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<v Speaker 2>get these hints like instantaneously. It's ridiculous.

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<v Speaker 1>And it was on our Patreon, so I can like

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<v Speaker 1>if you're not on Patreon. It was literally just a

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<v Speaker 1>picture of a deco on the back of a truck

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<v Speaker 1>like rear window of a lake scene with a fish

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<v Speaker 1>jumping out of it.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's like one of those super low qualities.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I made it real, like pick the lowest quality

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<v Speaker 1>pick ever and yeah, and Sabrina Randall got it like

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<v Speaker 1>within minutes again.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so she got some Jacko socks heading her way.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's so cool. We're out of socks now, so

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<v Speaker 1>we're gonna have to order someone.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, we were discussing before that we should actually do

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<v Speaker 2>up a specific design for patron or like giveaway.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, so it's a big deal.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so you only can get this this is our

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<v Speaker 2>merch design by winning one of our giveaways.

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<v Speaker 1>I love doing giveaways, so yeah, I think we should.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, if you guys have a design request that we

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<v Speaker 2>should do up for this giveaway specific merch, hit us

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<v Speaker 2>up on Instagram or Facebook or Patreon wherever. Just get

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<v Speaker 2>ahold of us somehow and we'll take take it into

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<v Speaker 2>our account of art and figure it all out and

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<v Speaker 2>see what we come up with.

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<v Speaker 1>H So yeah, so who do we have for new patrons?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, speaking of Patreon, let's see. Let me head over here.

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<v Speaker 2>So we have a few people who signed up this

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<v Speaker 2>week for Patreon. We have, and I'm gonna again preface this.

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<v Speaker 2>I am absolutely so sorry if I pronounce your name wrong,

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<v Speaker 2>although I did have someone, Lindsay Valentine, who made sure

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<v Speaker 2>she messaged us with proper pronunciation of her name. So

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<v Speaker 2>thank you Lindsay on that one. She signed up for

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<v Speaker 2>Patreon this week, along with Kristen Elise, Abby Fields, Sydney Rivas, Rivis.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know, that's one of those ones. That's just

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<v Speaker 2>there's always one that gets me. H and Buck Broadhead,

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<v Speaker 2>thank you very much for signing up for Patreon. You

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<v Speaker 2>guys are incredible.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's awesome.

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<v Speaker 2>The show honestly, it keeps going because of our patrons,

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<v Speaker 2>So thank you so much for your support.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh, it definitely does. Yeah, it so does. I actually

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<v Speaker 1>should Okay, I wasn't going to do this. I'm winging something.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh but this could take a really long time.

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<v Speaker 2>What's that?

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<v Speaker 1>I was going to read our newest review?

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<v Speaker 2>What's that? Newest review. Read it up, read it, read it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but I have it first, so ah, well smooth,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't have it open.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, well we'll cut this little piece out.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh, I have it. Okay, I'm pretty fast. It doesn't

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<v Speaker 1>take me that long.

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<v Speaker 2>Ye, fair enough job.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay. So it's from Josie. I think it would be

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<v Speaker 1>what her first name is, Kristen Christine.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know you're looking at it. Don't look at me,

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<v Speaker 2>you tell me.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, I'm going Josie Christine. And it's via Apple Podcasts. Obviously.

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<v Speaker 1>I think that's obvious. So it says top tier, five stars.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm very, very picky when it comes to true crime podcasts.

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<v Speaker 1>Many times the hosts are less focus on the victim

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<v Speaker 1>and more focus on the person that committed the crime.

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<v Speaker 1>But not Ben and Nicole. I love that they focus

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<v Speaker 1>and try to make it more about the victim. Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>there is background on the criminal, but they make it

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<v Speaker 1>more about the victim and their story. I absolutely love

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<v Speaker 1>listening to this podcast. I never miss an episode. Also,

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<v Speaker 1>if you haven't already joined the Patreon.

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<v Speaker 2>Damn, thank you so much that incredible review that like

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<v Speaker 2>shit like that makes our day on.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh. Yeah, I do check the reviews periodically

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<v Speaker 1>and stuff, and yeah, when there's one like that, it

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<v Speaker 1>just like warms my heart.

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<v Speaker 2>So thank you so much. Seriously, anytime anytime we get

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<v Speaker 2>messages or comments or anything like it, it means the world.

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<v Speaker 2>So thank you so much. And yeah, we definitely do

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<v Speaker 2>try and tell the victim side as much as we can.

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<v Speaker 2>We do. Yeah, sometimes it's it's very hard. And sometimes

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<v Speaker 2>there's cases that we choose where it is the story

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<v Speaker 2>of the killer.

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<v Speaker 1>Well yeah, the killer just like shit, they do overshadows

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<v Speaker 1>the victim completely and it's just like, oh, but when we.

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<v Speaker 2>Can, we definitely try and talk about the victims as

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<v Speaker 2>much as we can.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, Okay, are we ready?

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<v Speaker 2>I think we're ready.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, And so if you didn't, I dropped the hint.

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<v Speaker 1>But if you don't know, today we're talking about the

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<v Speaker 1>disappearance of Angelotte Marie Hammond, and I'm gonna be referring

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<v Speaker 1>to her as Angie because that is what she went by.

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<v Speaker 2>Awesome. I know this case slightly. It's one of those

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<v Speaker 2>ones that's been on my radar to research, and I'm like,

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<v Speaker 2>this is going to be a good case.

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<v Speaker 1>It is.

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<v Speaker 2>You got to it before me.

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<v Speaker 1>Though, So, oh was it on your list?

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<v Speaker 2>Sorry? Oh oh yeah, well it's in our big book

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<v Speaker 2>of cases.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, yeah, well yes, snoozealer.

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<v Speaker 2>I was going to apologize on't. No.

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<v Speaker 1>It is interesting because a lot of your cases you do,

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<v Speaker 1>like they're not solved or whatever. At the end you

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<v Speaker 1>have like theories and stuff. Yep, And now I get

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<v Speaker 1>to do one kind.

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<v Speaker 2>Of like that awesome possum.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's kind of interesting going through the theories in

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<v Speaker 1>your head, but it also sucks because then it's like

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<v Speaker 1>there's just like not the closure there for the families

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<v Speaker 1>and stuff, which breaks my freaking heart.

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<v Speaker 2>I am sorry, go ahead.

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<v Speaker 1>I was just going to say, this case honestly absolutely

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<v Speaker 1>destroys me, like it just destroys me for so many reasons.

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<v Speaker 2>Fair enough, But I am curious to see what your

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<v Speaker 2>theory is. But I'm sure we'll get to that.

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<v Speaker 1>We will get to that.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, Let's buckle down and get into it. Let's

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<v Speaker 2>hear it.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay. So now, the particular incident of Angie's disappearance took

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<v Speaker 1>place in Clinton Zuri on April fourth, nineteen ninety one.

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<v Speaker 1>So we're going back a little ways, but not too

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<v Speaker 1>far Clinton is a relatively small town with a population

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<v Speaker 1>at the time and now so it hasn't really changed

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<v Speaker 1>much of around nine thousand people. It's the type of

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<v Speaker 1>place where everyone knows each other, and it has like

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<v Speaker 1>the feeling of being isolated from the big city and

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<v Speaker 1>the crime of a big city.

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<v Speaker 2>Fair enough, Okay, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>I kind of like small town feels. We also have

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<v Speaker 1>a very small Clinton, NBC.

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<v Speaker 2>We do. Yeah, it's a bigger population than that.

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<v Speaker 1>Way. Oh, I think it's probably smaller, is it, I

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<v Speaker 1>would think? I don't know. Okay, so some details here.

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<v Speaker 1>Angie was twenty at the time of her disappearance, and

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<v Speaker 1>she was known to be a very outgoing and popular

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<v Speaker 1>young woman. She worked as a bank clerk and was

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<v Speaker 1>taking classes at the Central Missouri State University. Did you

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<v Speaker 1>just look it up?

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<v Speaker 2>I did. It's way smaller than I thought.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's teeny what's.

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<v Speaker 2>The six hundred and forty one? Yeah, I'm clearly thinking

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<v Speaker 2>of the wrong city.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it must be.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's a lot of little towns like that in

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<v Speaker 2>BC either. There are tons.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So earlier that year, in January, she became engaged

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<v Speaker 1>to her boyfriend Rob Shaefer, who was a high school

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<v Speaker 1>star athlete who planned to have a career in the military,

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<v Speaker 1>and a few details about Angie because spoiler alert, this

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<v Speaker 1>is still an active case, meaning that Angie has yet

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<v Speaker 1>to be found. So she was born on February ninth,

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy one. She is four foot eleven.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, she's short.

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<v Speaker 1>So she's very petite. Petite woman, that's a nicer way

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<v Speaker 1>of putting it.

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<v Speaker 2>Ben, Sorry, under the bus. No shit, now I feel

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<v Speaker 2>like a dick. No.

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<v Speaker 1>No, she's like not very she's not very tall. She's petite.

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<v Speaker 1>She's about like one hundred and twenty pounds or so. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>So she's a Caucasian female with brown hair and brown eyes.

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<v Speaker 1>Had a scar on her upper lip, and she wore contacts.

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<v Speaker 1>The real kicker, though, is Angie was four months pregnant

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<v Speaker 1>at the time of her disappearance.

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<v Speaker 2>Of course she was.

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<v Speaker 1>Did you know that?

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<v Speaker 2>I did not know that part? No, Like that's real.

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<v Speaker 1>That just adds like a whole new level that does.

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<v Speaker 1>So to go through her evening the night of April fourth,

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<v Speaker 1>her and Rob spent the evening attending a family barbecue.

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<v Speaker 1>The family barbecue was at Angie's mother's house. Once they

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<v Speaker 1>left there, Angie was to drop Rob off. It was

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<v Speaker 1>around ten pm, so he could watch his little brother

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<v Speaker 1>until his mother arrived home. They however, did plan to

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<v Speaker 1>meet up afterwards to enjoy spending some more time together.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's like, geez, like to be young. Hey, yeah, no, kid, Like,

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<v Speaker 1>if I dropped you off at ten, I'd be like

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<v Speaker 1>piece of one home to bed.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah by ten o'clock. It's like I need to be

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<v Speaker 2>sleeping by then. I got to work in the morning.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And here they were thinking about getting back like

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<v Speaker 1>after eleven Like.

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<v Speaker 2>That's wow, no, thanks no.

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<v Speaker 1>So in the meantime, Angie would meet up with her

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<v Speaker 1>friend Kyla to catch up and they would hang out

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<v Speaker 1>and tell about eleven fifteen, at which time Angie stopped

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<v Speaker 1>at a payphone to phone Rob and tell him she

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<v Speaker 1>was feeling a little bit tired and was just going

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<v Speaker 1>to go home for the rest of the night, so

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<v Speaker 1>she wasn't not forgetting together, okay. The payphone she called

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<v Speaker 1>Rob from was at the intersection of Jefferson in Second Street.

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<v Speaker 1>It was located in the parking lot of a grocery store,

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<v Speaker 1>and it was only seven blocks away from where Rob

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<v Speaker 1>was at the time. They chatted for a while when

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<v Speaker 1>Angie would notice an older model Ford or sorry, older

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<v Speaker 1>model green Ford pickup truck driving by slowly and circling

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<v Speaker 1>the block around the payphone a few times. It was late,

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<v Speaker 1>so there weren't a lot of people on the road

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<v Speaker 1>at the time, and as I mentioned, they lived in

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<v Speaker 1>a relatiatively small town, so it wasn't a truck or

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<v Speaker 1>driver that she recognized. It had a few very noticeable

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<v Speaker 1>characteristics about it, including a decal which we kind of already.

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<v Speaker 2>Talk about mm hm, the one in the back window.

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<v Speaker 1>Yep, And it was truck or asaria a lake scene

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<v Speaker 1>with a fish jumping out of the water. And I

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<v Speaker 1>don't fault Rob for this even in the least because

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<v Speaker 1>I do think you probably would would maybe do the

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00:13:26.600 --> 00:13:30.279
<v Speaker 1>same thing. But he went about easing Angie's mind saying

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<v Speaker 1>he probably wasn't from the area and was just like lost, right, Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, odds are it's not going to be a

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<v Speaker 2>serial killer, you know.

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<v Speaker 1>The odds are there. Yeah, And I mean, just like

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<v Speaker 1>human nature, I don't think that you generally go around

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<v Speaker 1>thinking that people are like, oh to get.

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<v Speaker 2>You, because generally they're not.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, generally, unless you unless you listen to a lot of.

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<v Speaker 2>True crime exactly. Yeah, because we had that conversation the

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<v Speaker 2>other day about how you're just concerned about everyone at

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<v Speaker 2>all times.

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<v Speaker 1>Now, I know, I like went this park thing that

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00:14:01.480 --> 00:14:05.519
<v Speaker 1>no one was at, but I had turned taken a

293
00:14:05.519 --> 00:14:07.759
<v Speaker 1>wrong turn at one point and like up the road

294
00:14:07.799 --> 00:14:11.759
<v Speaker 1>where like some people just like randomly camping, And so

295
00:14:11.840 --> 00:14:13.639
<v Speaker 1>I was looking at this place for like a location,

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00:14:13.799 --> 00:14:15.360
<v Speaker 1>and it was very small, and I pretty much just

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00:14:15.399 --> 00:14:17.639
<v Speaker 1>like ran the whole time because I was like, if

298
00:14:17.679 --> 00:14:20.200
<v Speaker 1>I run, no one will get me. Like that's so weird.

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00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:21.360
<v Speaker 1>I should have just enjoy.

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00:14:21.960 --> 00:14:25.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's that's odd. But honestly, like the life of

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00:14:25.720 --> 00:14:28.600
<v Speaker 2>being doing true crime and researching all this, even growing

302
00:14:28.679 --> 00:14:30.879
<v Speaker 2>up on it, like Unsolved Mysteries, like that shit, like

303
00:14:30.919 --> 00:14:33.240
<v Speaker 2>it affects you for a long time. Oh yeah, you

304
00:14:33.279 --> 00:14:36.279
<v Speaker 2>even you played a clip of the dude from Unsolved Mysteries,

305
00:14:36.320 --> 00:14:38.360
<v Speaker 2>just his voice. You're like, hey, do you recognize his voice?

306
00:14:38.440 --> 00:14:41.159
<v Speaker 2>I know instantly, Yeah, I know that.

307
00:14:40.840 --> 00:14:41.679
<v Speaker 1>That guy's epic.

308
00:14:41.960 --> 00:14:42.279
<v Speaker 2>He is.

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00:14:44.240 --> 00:14:47.799
<v Speaker 1>Okay, So next time, the truck would end up pulling

310
00:14:47.960 --> 00:14:51.720
<v Speaker 1>in beside where Angie was parked and proceeded to go

311
00:14:51.759 --> 00:14:54.200
<v Speaker 1>about using the payphone next to the stall she was

312
00:14:54.240 --> 00:14:57.200
<v Speaker 1>in there was like two next to each other, after

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00:14:57.279 --> 00:15:00.559
<v Speaker 1>which he headed back to his truck, took out to flashlight,

314
00:15:00.840 --> 00:15:03.120
<v Speaker 1>and would go about acting as though he was looking

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00:15:03.159 --> 00:15:07.559
<v Speaker 1>for something within his truck. If Angie wasn't on edge before,

316
00:15:07.679 --> 00:15:11.200
<v Speaker 1>at this point, she very much so was. And she

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00:15:11.279 --> 00:15:14.639
<v Speaker 1>goes about describing the truck and the man's appearance to Rob,

318
00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:17.360
<v Speaker 1>which is like good for her, Like that's actually like

319
00:15:17.440 --> 00:15:19.320
<v Speaker 1>kind of smart, No kidding. I don't know if she

320
00:15:19.399 --> 00:15:21.759
<v Speaker 1>was doing that for like a reason or just like

321
00:15:22.600 --> 00:15:26.000
<v Speaker 1>Rob was curious, or I don't know. So she described

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00:15:26.000 --> 00:15:28.240
<v Speaker 1>the man as kind of a dirty look as kind

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00:15:28.240 --> 00:15:32.519
<v Speaker 1>of dirty looking with a mustache, beard, glasses, and was

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00:15:32.559 --> 00:15:36.480
<v Speaker 1>wearing overalls. I think, like I honestly think at this

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00:15:36.519 --> 00:15:38.919
<v Speaker 1>point though, I would be like probably running for the

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00:15:38.919 --> 00:15:41.080
<v Speaker 1>fucking hills. Yeah, I would be terrified.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, this is why I tell you that you need

328
00:15:42.919 --> 00:15:44.919
<v Speaker 2>to be carrying a knife in your person stuff. Right,

329
00:15:45.480 --> 00:15:47.639
<v Speaker 2>this is why I always have a knife on my hip.

330
00:15:48.399 --> 00:15:50.720
<v Speaker 1>I know I should. It would it would probably do

331
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<v Speaker 1>me well, it would just even just make you feel

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00:15:53.080 --> 00:15:56.840
<v Speaker 1>a little bit better made. Yeah, but like honestly too,

333
00:15:56.879 --> 00:16:00.440
<v Speaker 1>in all reality, at this point, she probably was getting

334
00:16:00.440 --> 00:16:00.960
<v Speaker 1>away either.

335
00:16:02.080 --> 00:16:06.320
<v Speaker 2>Well, that's hard to say. If she can defend herself.

336
00:16:06.240 --> 00:16:10.240
<v Speaker 1>I guess yeah. If she was in control and she

337
00:16:10.399 --> 00:16:13.039
<v Speaker 1>decided when she was running, maybe maybe she would have

338
00:16:13.120 --> 00:16:16.879
<v Speaker 1>got to her vehicle. So Rob gets Angie to ask

339
00:16:16.919 --> 00:16:19.600
<v Speaker 1>the man if he needed to use the phone, thinking

340
00:16:19.799 --> 00:16:21.919
<v Speaker 1>that maybe the other phone in the stall beside her

341
00:16:22.039 --> 00:16:25.639
<v Speaker 1>was like broken or something. Right, yeah, But when Angie asks,

342
00:16:25.799 --> 00:16:29.360
<v Speaker 1>the man responds no, that he'll just try again in

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00:16:29.399 --> 00:16:29.799
<v Speaker 1>a minute.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>Angie and Rob proceed to have their conversation, but just

346
00:16:36.639 --> 00:16:40.320
<v Speaker 1>a few minutes later, Rob would hear Angie scream on

347
00:16:40.399 --> 00:16:43.440
<v Speaker 1>the phone, and he'd hear the voice of the mysterious

348
00:16:43.440 --> 00:16:46.960
<v Speaker 1>man saying I didn't need to use the phone anyway.

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<v Speaker 2>Shit, oh my god.

350
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<v Speaker 1>Rob, only being about a two minute drive away, immediately

351
00:16:56.159 --> 00:16:59.600
<v Speaker 1>drops his phone and runs outside to drive over to

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00:16:59.639 --> 00:17:04.759
<v Speaker 1>where was And this is where the story gets absolutely

353
00:17:05.519 --> 00:17:06.200
<v Speaker 1>got wrenched.

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00:17:06.359 --> 00:17:09.000
<v Speaker 2>This is fucking heartbreaking, this part, this part, I know,

355
00:17:09.200 --> 00:17:12.079
<v Speaker 2>this is what made me want to research this case, because.

356
00:17:11.799 --> 00:17:14.680
<v Speaker 1>This is this is just like bullshit.

357
00:17:14.880 --> 00:17:17.960
<v Speaker 2>This is probably out of all the fucking true crime

358
00:17:18.000 --> 00:17:21.799
<v Speaker 2>cases that I have ever heard, researched or anything. This

359
00:17:21.839 --> 00:17:24.559
<v Speaker 2>is one moment that that gets me.

360
00:17:24.839 --> 00:17:28.720
<v Speaker 1>It does like it's really fucked. So, as he's driving

361
00:17:28.720 --> 00:17:33.880
<v Speaker 1>towards the payphone, he actually passes and Angie's abductor going

362
00:17:33.960 --> 00:17:37.839
<v Speaker 1>the opposite direction. Angie had given him a fairly good

363
00:17:37.880 --> 00:17:40.799
<v Speaker 1>description of the truck, and as they pass each other,

364
00:17:41.480 --> 00:17:45.839
<v Speaker 1>Rob actually hears Angie scream out Robbie from inside the

365
00:17:45.880 --> 00:17:47.079
<v Speaker 1>abductor's truck.

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<v Speaker 2>Fuck.

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00:17:48.640 --> 00:17:52.720
<v Speaker 1>So Rob throws his carn reverse, makes a very sharp turn,

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00:17:53.319 --> 00:17:58.119
<v Speaker 1>and speeds after Angie and the truck. He followed the

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00:17:58.160 --> 00:18:04.400
<v Speaker 1>truck for approximately to mylls before his car would give out, No,

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00:18:04.480 --> 00:18:08.680
<v Speaker 1>it would give out. Oh really, and so it apparently

371
00:18:08.920 --> 00:18:11.960
<v Speaker 1>when Rob threw his car and reverse so abruptly to

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00:18:12.039 --> 00:18:14.119
<v Speaker 1>go after them, or the sharp turn one or the

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00:18:14.119 --> 00:18:22.039
<v Speaker 1>other unknowingly damaged his transmission, making his car basically undrivable.

374
00:18:22.200 --> 00:18:25.599
<v Speaker 2>He blew his transmission and oh my god, that is brutal.

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00:18:25.640 --> 00:18:29.680
<v Speaker 1>Like in his panic like, oh, I don't know, that's

376
00:18:29.799 --> 00:18:35.440
<v Speaker 1>just where like I don't even know. I mean, you

377
00:18:35.480 --> 00:18:37.799
<v Speaker 1>hear people like talking the phone sometimes and like the

378
00:18:37.799 --> 00:18:40.839
<v Speaker 1>person gets on in an accident like just these incidents

379
00:18:40.880 --> 00:18:42.880
<v Speaker 1>that I just couldn't deal.

380
00:18:42.720 --> 00:18:45.400
<v Speaker 2>With something like this, no kidding, did he get a

381
00:18:45.400 --> 00:18:46.240
<v Speaker 2>license plate number.

382
00:18:46.279 --> 00:18:51.240
<v Speaker 1>Do you know he only had gotten like two letters

383
00:18:51.279 --> 00:18:53.440
<v Speaker 1>I think on there because it was like really rusted.

384
00:18:55.400 --> 00:19:00.400
<v Speaker 1>So he watched the truck carrying his fiance and future

385
00:19:00.440 --> 00:19:04.279
<v Speaker 1>baby drive away to never be seen again.

386
00:19:05.880 --> 00:19:09.720
<v Speaker 2>Wow, oh my goodness, that hurts like on so many

387
00:19:09.799 --> 00:19:10.640
<v Speaker 2>levels right there.

388
00:19:10.960 --> 00:19:12.960
<v Speaker 1>I know I can barely deal with that, to be honest,

389
00:19:13.119 --> 00:19:15.680
<v Speaker 1>And yeah.

390
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:17.200
<v Speaker 2>The worst part of it is is like, you know,

391
00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:20.559
<v Speaker 2>there's no way it's his fault in any way, shape

392
00:19:20.640 --> 00:19:23.920
<v Speaker 2>or form. But you know he's probably blaming himself for

393
00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:25.640
<v Speaker 2>fucking up the car, right.

394
00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:27.960
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, we'll talk about that, the poor guy.

395
00:19:29.039 --> 00:19:31.079
<v Speaker 2>But like I say, there's no way, it's oh no.

396
00:19:31.240 --> 00:19:34.079
<v Speaker 1>Nothing, No, he was there, Yeah, like he was there.

397
00:19:34.160 --> 00:19:37.200
<v Speaker 1>That is just, oh gosh, a moment in life where

398
00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:41.440
<v Speaker 1>you just have to feel like, I don't know, the

399
00:19:41.480 --> 00:19:46.640
<v Speaker 1>powers at be just hate you or something I don't know, yeah,

400
00:19:46.759 --> 00:19:50.279
<v Speaker 1>or I don't even know. So Rob was able to

401
00:19:50.319 --> 00:19:53.839
<v Speaker 1>flag down a vehicle passing by to drive him to

402
00:19:53.880 --> 00:19:57.119
<v Speaker 1>the police station to get help and relay his story

403
00:19:57.160 --> 00:19:59.960
<v Speaker 1>to the police, but he put a lot of blame

404
00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:03.519
<v Speaker 1>on himself. He always told Angie he'd be there to

405
00:20:03.559 --> 00:20:07.319
<v Speaker 1>take care of her. So unsolved mysteries. Like we mentioned,

406
00:20:07.359 --> 00:20:10.119
<v Speaker 1>covered the case way back in February of nineteen ninety

407
00:20:10.119 --> 00:20:13.400
<v Speaker 1>two with Rob and Angie's mother appearing on the show,

408
00:20:14.160 --> 00:20:18.079
<v Speaker 1>and the mother said Rob tried and did everything he could.

409
00:20:18.559 --> 00:20:22.240
<v Speaker 1>No one blamed him, but that Rob thought people did.

410
00:20:23.160 --> 00:20:26.079
<v Speaker 1>This is a quote from Rob. He said, the beginning's

411
00:20:26.119 --> 00:20:29.880
<v Speaker 1>the hardest because you know you were close enough to

412
00:20:29.920 --> 00:20:33.279
<v Speaker 1>get him, but you just didn't get the job done.

413
00:20:34.119 --> 00:20:37.279
<v Speaker 1>And you still wake at nights wondering where she's at,

414
00:20:38.279 --> 00:20:43.160
<v Speaker 1>wondering what happened, wondering if anyone's still looking. You just

415
00:20:43.359 --> 00:20:48.640
<v Speaker 1>wonder all the time. So, like you can tell there

416
00:20:48.680 --> 00:20:52.640
<v Speaker 1>that he just like it feels terrible, like he'd just blame.

417
00:20:52.519 --> 00:20:55.359
<v Speaker 2>Himself and enemy. I understand. I could. I could see

418
00:20:55.400 --> 00:20:58.480
<v Speaker 2>where he's coming from. However, he wasn't close enough to

419
00:20:58.480 --> 00:21:00.200
<v Speaker 2>get him. If he was close enough to get him,

420
00:21:00.240 --> 00:21:00.960
<v Speaker 2>he would have got him.

421
00:21:01.359 --> 00:21:03.240
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I mean, even if that didn't happen, the

422
00:21:03.279 --> 00:21:05.200
<v Speaker 1>guy could still very much so have gotten away.

423
00:21:05.440 --> 00:21:08.720
<v Speaker 2>Exactly totally right. It's definitely not his fault, not in

424
00:21:08.759 --> 00:21:11.559
<v Speaker 2>any way, shape or form. No, Like I say, if

425
00:21:11.559 --> 00:21:13.519
<v Speaker 2>he was close enough he would have got him, he

426
00:21:13.519 --> 00:21:14.400
<v Speaker 2>would have made sure of that.

427
00:21:14.599 --> 00:21:17.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So a side note, did you know that Unsolved

428
00:21:17.240 --> 00:21:18.599
<v Speaker 1>Mysteries is actually on Prime?

429
00:21:19.279 --> 00:21:19.759
<v Speaker 2>Is it really?

430
00:21:20.039 --> 00:21:22.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? There's like numerous seasons on there.

431
00:21:22.079 --> 00:21:24.839
<v Speaker 2>So cool. I'm pretty sure I've seen all of them

432
00:21:24.880 --> 00:21:25.359
<v Speaker 2>as a kid.

433
00:21:25.400 --> 00:21:28.039
<v Speaker 1>Anyways, Well, there was new ones come out or something,

434
00:21:28.079 --> 00:21:30.720
<v Speaker 1>and a new season came out in like, oh gosh,

435
00:21:30.759 --> 00:21:32.079
<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna get this wrong. I can't remember. It's like

436
00:21:32.119 --> 00:21:35.160
<v Speaker 1>twenty fifteen or twenty twenty. Really, yes, you haven't, dude,

437
00:21:35.160 --> 00:21:36.079
<v Speaker 1>there's a new season.

438
00:21:36.119 --> 00:21:38.720
<v Speaker 2>I am. Actually I did see a couple of the

439
00:21:38.720 --> 00:21:41.480
<v Speaker 2>new ones because there was a few cases that I

440
00:21:41.559 --> 00:21:43.720
<v Speaker 2>either did research or wanted to research that I saw

441
00:21:43.759 --> 00:21:44.799
<v Speaker 2>the episodes.

442
00:21:44.359 --> 00:21:47.359
<v Speaker 1>On Oh okay, I wonder if it's the same host,

443
00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:50.119
<v Speaker 1>and I meant to look that up. But that show

444
00:21:50.240 --> 00:21:53.920
<v Speaker 1>is just dope. Like that's literally why all millennials are

445
00:21:53.960 --> 00:21:54.960
<v Speaker 1>obsessed with true crime.

446
00:21:55.000 --> 00:21:59.759
<v Speaker 2>It's that it's Goosebumps, It's Ghostbusters and are you afraid

447
00:21:59.759 --> 00:22:01.960
<v Speaker 2>of the which I don't know if that's a Canadian thing.

448
00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:02.839
<v Speaker 2>I think it might be.

449
00:22:03.079 --> 00:22:08.000
<v Speaker 1>Oh maybe, yeah, all of those things. Yeah, okay, So,

450
00:22:08.079 --> 00:22:11.440
<v Speaker 1>the news of Angie's disappearance shocked the town of Clinton.

451
00:22:12.319 --> 00:22:15.480
<v Speaker 1>An extensive air and land search involving the police and

452
00:22:15.640 --> 00:22:20.599
<v Speaker 1>hundreds of citizens was launched in hopes of finding at Angie,

453
00:22:20.839 --> 00:22:25.839
<v Speaker 1>the abductor or the truck, but there was no sign damn.

454
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:27.720
<v Speaker 1>And one thing I was like, I feel I didn't

455
00:22:27.759 --> 00:22:31.119
<v Speaker 1>put this in here, but I felt like they kind

456
00:22:31.119 --> 00:22:33.279
<v Speaker 1>of thought it might not be super hard because the

457
00:22:33.319 --> 00:22:37.680
<v Speaker 1>truck was so with the deco and stuff was so distinguished, right,

458
00:22:37.720 --> 00:22:38.400
<v Speaker 1>like you think.

459
00:22:38.200 --> 00:22:39.440
<v Speaker 2>They could be to behind that.

460
00:22:41.240 --> 00:22:45.119
<v Speaker 1>So the Missouri State Highway Patrol assisted doing a computer

461
00:22:45.279 --> 00:22:49.480
<v Speaker 1>search on all registered vehicles matching the truck description, and

462
00:22:49.519 --> 00:22:53.680
<v Speaker 1>they ended up with sixteen hundred possibilities, but again there

463
00:22:53.720 --> 00:22:58.480
<v Speaker 1>was no success. The police based their investigation on Rob's testimony,

464
00:22:59.079 --> 00:23:02.119
<v Speaker 1>but when no witness this is refound to validate his statement,

465
00:23:02.920 --> 00:23:07.799
<v Speaker 1>Rob would become a suspect himself, understandable, which brings us

466
00:23:07.839 --> 00:23:11.000
<v Speaker 1>to the suspects and possible theories into the case.

467
00:23:11.559 --> 00:23:13.240
<v Speaker 2>Can I throw my theory out there before we get

468
00:23:13.240 --> 00:23:14.119
<v Speaker 2>into him? Really?

469
00:23:14.559 --> 00:23:15.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, let's do it.

470
00:23:15.720 --> 00:23:20.680
<v Speaker 2>My theory is it some fucked up farmer because people

471
00:23:20.680 --> 00:23:24.680
<v Speaker 2>with acreage often have unregistered vehicles that they run around

472
00:23:24.720 --> 00:23:28.400
<v Speaker 2>on their own property. With this being arrested, out license

473
00:23:28.440 --> 00:23:30.960
<v Speaker 2>plate probably would have gotten pulled over by authorities at

474
00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:34.039
<v Speaker 2>some point, so that license plate is probably old, not

475
00:23:34.119 --> 00:23:37.720
<v Speaker 2>even registered anymore, long since gone. That is only running

476
00:23:37.720 --> 00:23:41.480
<v Speaker 2>around on his personal property. For whatever reason, he decided

477
00:23:41.519 --> 00:23:43.640
<v Speaker 2>he's going to go out one night grab someone. Maybe

478
00:23:43.680 --> 00:23:45.680
<v Speaker 2>he was even just drinking in the moment. He just

479
00:23:45.720 --> 00:23:47.599
<v Speaker 2>saw her and was like, fuck, yeah, I'm gonna do this.

480
00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:51.039
<v Speaker 2>But for whatever reason, he's out with his personal truck

481
00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:54.079
<v Speaker 2>where he shouldn't be, and he gets her, goes back

482
00:23:54.119 --> 00:23:57.440
<v Speaker 2>to his property, doesn't leave the farm again with that truck.

483
00:23:57.480 --> 00:23:59.680
<v Speaker 2>That truck is sitting somewhere in his property, either buried

484
00:23:59.839 --> 00:24:04.559
<v Speaker 2>or in a barn or something. And unfortunately she never

485
00:24:04.640 --> 00:24:07.799
<v Speaker 2>left his property either. Whether she's live or buried as

486
00:24:07.839 --> 00:24:09.440
<v Speaker 2>well is another thing.

487
00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:12.079
<v Speaker 1>Oh man, I at first wanted to be like you

488
00:24:12.279 --> 00:24:15.400
<v Speaker 1>probably almost hope that she wasn't alive, But I don't know.

489
00:24:16.400 --> 00:24:19.200
<v Speaker 2>It depends if she's alive. I can't imagine the horror

490
00:24:19.200 --> 00:24:20.640
<v Speaker 2>she's it's probably.

491
00:24:20.400 --> 00:24:25.440
<v Speaker 1>A terrible life. Yeah, okay, So Rob, that's interesting. So like,

492
00:24:25.559 --> 00:24:27.559
<v Speaker 1>after I go through these, I'm curious to know if,

493
00:24:27.640 --> 00:24:28.480
<v Speaker 1>like you still.

494
00:24:28.279 --> 00:24:30.519
<v Speaker 2>Think that you know, Okay, well let's hear it.

495
00:24:31.079 --> 00:24:35.400
<v Speaker 1>So Rob Schaefer, the fiance suspect number one, I mean

496
00:24:35.880 --> 00:24:39.400
<v Speaker 1>it's always suspect number one, right, Yeah, I'm not going

497
00:24:39.480 --> 00:24:41.519
<v Speaker 1>to go into a ton of detail because it's not

498
00:24:41.599 --> 00:24:45.279
<v Speaker 1>always the significant other people. It's just not okay. So

499
00:24:45.319 --> 00:24:49.319
<v Speaker 1>a quote from Angie's mother, Unsold Mysteries said, I think

500
00:24:49.319 --> 00:24:53.000
<v Speaker 1>it was natural that people wondered did the boyfriend do it?

501
00:24:53.279 --> 00:24:56.119
<v Speaker 1>But my feeling, I've known the kid all his life

502
00:24:56.440 --> 00:24:58.759
<v Speaker 1>and I never doubted for a minute that he had

503
00:24:58.880 --> 00:25:02.359
<v Speaker 1>anything to do with it. So right there, I just

504
00:25:02.359 --> 00:25:04.400
<v Speaker 1>felt like that quote was super strong, and within a

505
00:25:04.440 --> 00:25:08.000
<v Speaker 1>week Rob was cleared of any involvement in Angie's disappearance.

506
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:13.240
<v Speaker 1>Angie's ex boyfriend at one time was also a potential suspect.

507
00:25:13.279 --> 00:25:16.400
<v Speaker 1>His name was Bill Barker. Apparently a rumor was going

508
00:25:16.440 --> 00:25:19.880
<v Speaker 1>around that the baby was actually Bill's and not Rob's.

509
00:25:20.640 --> 00:25:24.240
<v Speaker 1>This was denied by both Bill and Rob. There was

510
00:25:24.880 --> 00:25:27.759
<v Speaker 1>there wasn't what was that? I think it was kiwi okay,

511
00:25:27.920 --> 00:25:32.480
<v Speaker 1>just a super earliird noise. There wasn't any evidence to

512
00:25:32.599 --> 00:25:37.200
<v Speaker 1>point to Bill, and he also passed a polygraph test,

513
00:25:37.559 --> 00:25:40.079
<v Speaker 1>so he was cleared as a suspect. But there was

514
00:25:40.119 --> 00:25:43.160
<v Speaker 1>also another suspicion that the two of them, Rob and

515
00:25:43.200 --> 00:25:48.000
<v Speaker 1>Bill were in on the abduction together. Wow, Okay, I

516
00:25:48.000 --> 00:25:49.960
<v Speaker 1>don't know, but like I said, they were both cleared

517
00:25:49.960 --> 00:25:50.759
<v Speaker 1>to suspects.

518
00:25:51.160 --> 00:25:53.480
<v Speaker 2>But a polygraph isn't one hundred percent though it's not.

519
00:25:54.160 --> 00:25:56.480
<v Speaker 1>No, I don't think it is. But I think even then,

520
00:25:56.599 --> 00:25:58.519
<v Speaker 1>like in the nineties, I think they kind of relied

521
00:25:58.559 --> 00:25:59.920
<v Speaker 1>on it a bit more than they do now.

522
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:02.279
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, they definitely would have. Yeah.

523
00:26:03.200 --> 00:26:06.880
<v Speaker 1>So now, as the investigation continued, the police would connect

524
00:26:06.880 --> 00:26:10.519
<v Speaker 1>Angie's abduction to two other unsolved cases. At the time,

525
00:26:11.359 --> 00:26:14.599
<v Speaker 1>these cases were within a one hundred mile radius of Clinton.

526
00:26:15.519 --> 00:26:20.359
<v Speaker 1>The first occurred near max Creek, Missouri, on January nineteenth,

527
00:26:20.759 --> 00:26:23.319
<v Speaker 1>nineteen ninety one, so not even three months prior to

528
00:26:23.319 --> 00:26:29.200
<v Speaker 1>Agie's abduction. Forty two year old Trudy Darby was working

529
00:26:29.279 --> 00:26:32.559
<v Speaker 1>alone in a convenience store when she called her son

530
00:26:32.599 --> 00:26:37.000
<v Speaker 1>around ten pm, saying there was a suspicious man lurking outside.

531
00:26:38.000 --> 00:26:40.400
<v Speaker 1>She didn't want to travel through the parking lot alone

532
00:26:40.480 --> 00:26:42.799
<v Speaker 1>to her vehicle, so she asked if he could come

533
00:26:42.839 --> 00:26:46.839
<v Speaker 1>down and escort her. The Sun traveled the less than

534
00:26:46.880 --> 00:26:49.720
<v Speaker 1>ten minutes to his mum, but when he arrived to

535
00:26:49.759 --> 00:26:53.640
<v Speaker 1>the store, the store was empty and Trudy was nowhere

536
00:26:53.680 --> 00:26:54.279
<v Speaker 1>to be found.

537
00:26:54.440 --> 00:26:54.680
<v Speaker 2>Shit.

538
00:26:56.160 --> 00:26:59.480
<v Speaker 1>Two days later, on January twenty first, the body of

539
00:26:59.519 --> 00:27:03.640
<v Speaker 1>Trudy would be found only ten miles from the store

540
00:27:03.680 --> 00:27:07.279
<v Speaker 1>on a riverbank. She had been raped and shot in

541
00:27:07.319 --> 00:27:12.759
<v Speaker 1>the head twice. The store had been robbed two hundred

542
00:27:12.799 --> 00:27:18.680
<v Speaker 1>and twenty dollars. Wow, okay, which I'm like, that's disgusting,

543
00:27:18.839 --> 00:27:22.799
<v Speaker 1>no kidding, I'm sorry, but that's I mean, no money

544
00:27:22.839 --> 00:27:24.519
<v Speaker 1>is worth like the death of a person.

545
00:27:24.559 --> 00:27:28.720
<v Speaker 2>But like, that's no kidding. Well, I'm going to play

546
00:27:28.759 --> 00:27:33.519
<v Speaker 2>the whole devil's advocacy here, though. The argument I'm arguing

547
00:27:33.519 --> 00:27:35.279
<v Speaker 2>for kind of disgusts me that this is going to

548
00:27:35.279 --> 00:27:38.880
<v Speaker 2>come out of my mouth. It wasn't just the money

549
00:27:39.480 --> 00:27:42.880
<v Speaker 2>that was paid in penance. There was also the sexual assault.

550
00:27:43.000 --> 00:27:46.039
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, so it was it was the sexual assault

551
00:27:46.079 --> 00:27:49.759
<v Speaker 2>and the money that was valued at her life. Not

552
00:27:49.880 --> 00:27:52.480
<v Speaker 2>that it's still equal value, not even fucking close. It's

553
00:27:52.559 --> 00:27:54.839
<v Speaker 2>absolutely disgusting. But it's not just the money, you know

554
00:27:54.880 --> 00:27:55.240
<v Speaker 2>what I mean?

555
00:27:55.440 --> 00:27:58.640
<v Speaker 1>And who knows, like the sexual assault might have been

556
00:27:58.680 --> 00:28:02.079
<v Speaker 1>a higher value to that then the money, right, Yeah.

557
00:28:01.920 --> 00:28:05.400
<v Speaker 2>The money was probably just they grabbed it like in

558
00:28:05.440 --> 00:28:06.880
<v Speaker 2>a quick whim sort of thing.

559
00:28:07.000 --> 00:28:08.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, because I don't as far as I know, they

560
00:28:08.680 --> 00:28:10.759
<v Speaker 1>didn't like steal anything else and stuff. They could have

561
00:28:10.759 --> 00:28:12.279
<v Speaker 1>stole probably other things from there.

562
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:14.519
<v Speaker 2>They were there for her.

563
00:28:14.640 --> 00:28:19.119
<v Speaker 1>Oh disgusting. The other case they believed may have been

564
00:28:19.200 --> 00:28:22.680
<v Speaker 1>connected was that of thirty year old Cheryl Kenny. She

565
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:26.319
<v Speaker 1>was another Convenience Star worker seventy miles from Max Creek

566
00:28:27.000 --> 00:28:31.160
<v Speaker 1>in Nevada, Missouri. It was the evening of November twenty seventh,

567
00:28:31.440 --> 00:28:35.400
<v Speaker 1>again nineteen ninety one, and Cheryl's time card shows that

568
00:28:35.440 --> 00:28:38.240
<v Speaker 1>she clocked out for the night at ten pm and

569
00:28:38.279 --> 00:28:42.880
<v Speaker 1>the store was locked, but she never arrived home. Her

570
00:28:42.920 --> 00:28:45.599
<v Speaker 1>car was found in the store parking lot. So from

571
00:28:45.640 --> 00:28:48.680
<v Speaker 1>the time of locking up the convenience store to getting

572
00:28:48.680 --> 00:28:53.240
<v Speaker 1>in her car, she seemed to simply vanish. She was

573
00:28:53.279 --> 00:28:56.200
<v Speaker 1>a wife and mother to two and has not been

574
00:28:56.240 --> 00:28:56.960
<v Speaker 1>seen since.

575
00:28:58.319 --> 00:29:03.319
<v Speaker 2>Damn. Yeah, and there's no witness to that. Just gone, hey, yeah.

576
00:29:03.119 --> 00:29:04.960
<v Speaker 1>Well with that one. Apparently I didn't put it in here,

577
00:29:05.039 --> 00:29:07.319
<v Speaker 1>but apparently there was like she was working with a

578
00:29:07.440 --> 00:29:11.119
<v Speaker 1>janitor and they decided to close the store early just

579
00:29:11.119 --> 00:29:13.799
<v Speaker 1>because it wasn't super busy and stuff, and so she

580
00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:18.319
<v Speaker 1>sent the janitor home, and there was one customer in

581
00:29:18.359 --> 00:29:21.720
<v Speaker 1>the store at the time, and so when the janner left.

582
00:29:21.720 --> 00:29:25.200
<v Speaker 1>There was just this one person. But then they said

583
00:29:25.759 --> 00:29:28.720
<v Speaker 1>for Angie to or sorry, not Angie, what was her name, sorry,

584
00:29:28.799 --> 00:29:31.960
<v Speaker 1>Cheryl to actually have locked up the store and everything

585
00:29:32.000 --> 00:29:34.559
<v Speaker 1>like that person would have had to have left, but

586
00:29:34.680 --> 00:29:36.920
<v Speaker 1>who knows if they had waited for her in the

587
00:29:36.960 --> 00:29:39.960
<v Speaker 1>parking lot or something. But then the janitor also said

588
00:29:39.960 --> 00:29:42.480
<v Speaker 1>that it was just his car in Cheryl's car in

589
00:29:42.519 --> 00:29:44.720
<v Speaker 1>the parking lot, so someone could have.

590
00:29:44.720 --> 00:29:49.720
<v Speaker 2>Come yeap or likely, but it very much could have

591
00:29:49.759 --> 00:29:54.480
<v Speaker 2>been someone who knowingly knew she was there alone.

592
00:29:54.680 --> 00:29:57.759
<v Speaker 1>Those two incidents seem very similar to me, Yeah, they do.

593
00:29:58.079 --> 00:30:02.160
<v Speaker 1>So Angie was a duckted just one month later, so

594
00:30:02.440 --> 00:30:05.039
<v Speaker 1>it's not far fetched to think that these cases may

595
00:30:05.079 --> 00:30:08.720
<v Speaker 1>be connected. It was feared a serial killer maybe on

596
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:12.079
<v Speaker 1>the loose, and we have a few serial killers on

597
00:30:12.119 --> 00:30:16.799
<v Speaker 1>the list of potential suspects. But first, while Angie and

598
00:30:16.880 --> 00:30:22.599
<v Speaker 1>Cheryl Kenny's case remains unsolved, Trudy Darby's killers did eventually

599
00:30:22.640 --> 00:30:25.599
<v Speaker 1>get caught a few years later and her case did

600
00:30:25.640 --> 00:30:30.599
<v Speaker 1>get solved. So they were two men, Jesse Rush and

601
00:30:30.640 --> 00:30:35.079
<v Speaker 1>Marvin Chaney, who were half brothers. They were caught because

602
00:30:35.200 --> 00:30:38.240
<v Speaker 1>Jesse ended up confiding in a few people I think

603
00:30:38.279 --> 00:30:41.119
<v Speaker 1>he was like probably bragging that he and Marvin were

604
00:30:41.319 --> 00:30:43.000
<v Speaker 1>responsible for Trudy's murder.

605
00:30:43.200 --> 00:30:47.440
<v Speaker 2>Most likely, these fucking skis bags end up getting confidence

606
00:30:47.440 --> 00:30:48.960
<v Speaker 2>and wanting to showboat.

607
00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:53.359
<v Speaker 1>Right, which is so disgusting, Like just oh, just don't

608
00:30:53.400 --> 00:30:54.759
<v Speaker 1>even like, just go.

609
00:30:54.720 --> 00:30:59.000
<v Speaker 2>Away, just don't even just don't even don't even.

610
00:31:00.119 --> 00:31:03.680
<v Speaker 1>Of these friends and ended up contacting police, even though

611
00:31:03.799 --> 00:31:06.920
<v Speaker 1>Jesse had threatened to kill her if she did so.

612
00:31:07.039 --> 00:31:09.440
<v Speaker 1>Good on her, No kidding. You were friends with an

613
00:31:09.440 --> 00:31:12.799
<v Speaker 1>absolute piece of shit, but you slightly redeem yourself.

614
00:31:12.920 --> 00:31:14.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you have a moral compass.

615
00:31:16.000 --> 00:31:19.200
<v Speaker 1>The police ended up putting recording devices in the friend's

616
00:31:19.319 --> 00:31:22.960
<v Speaker 1>room and were able to get a recorded confession from

617
00:31:23.079 --> 00:31:26.799
<v Speaker 1>Jesse on the tape. After he was arrested, he confessed

618
00:31:26.839 --> 00:31:29.720
<v Speaker 1>to detectives and continued to brag about.

619
00:31:29.480 --> 00:31:32.160
<v Speaker 2>It to inmates. Fuck off.

620
00:31:32.200 --> 00:31:35.480
<v Speaker 1>But then these inmates apparently went on to testify and

621
00:31:35.519 --> 00:31:38.880
<v Speaker 1>stuff because they probably out of tior motives are like, shit,

622
00:31:38.920 --> 00:31:41.200
<v Speaker 1>if I testify then about this guy being a piece

623
00:31:41.240 --> 00:31:43.359
<v Speaker 1>of shit, then I can maybe get less on myself.

624
00:31:43.680 --> 00:31:44.839
<v Speaker 2>Time shaved off. Yep.

625
00:31:45.599 --> 00:31:49.079
<v Speaker 1>So his confession entailed that he and Marvin went into

626
00:31:49.160 --> 00:31:52.559
<v Speaker 1>the store with the intention of robbing and abducting Trudy.

627
00:31:53.400 --> 00:31:56.319
<v Speaker 1>After taking the money, they dragged to Trudy out of

628
00:31:56.359 --> 00:31:59.200
<v Speaker 1>the store, forced her into the trunk of the car,

629
00:31:59.720 --> 00:32:02.680
<v Speaker 1>drove to a nearby barn, where they raped and shot

630
00:32:02.680 --> 00:32:05.720
<v Speaker 1>her in the head. They then went to dispose of

631
00:32:05.720 --> 00:32:08.160
<v Speaker 1>her body in the river when they noticed she was

632
00:32:08.200 --> 00:32:12.359
<v Speaker 1>still alive and shot her again. Wow.

633
00:32:13.359 --> 00:32:16.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but I want to point out something. They went

634
00:32:16.440 --> 00:32:22.079
<v Speaker 2>where to a barn, to barnes saying.

635
00:32:21.799 --> 00:32:23.599
<v Speaker 1>You did actually say that. I was like, what's with

636
00:32:23.640 --> 00:32:27.799
<v Speaker 1>the barn? Just saying yeah, I don't know if they

637
00:32:27.839 --> 00:32:31.000
<v Speaker 1>lived there though, I don't know no, but but there

638
00:32:31.079 --> 00:32:35.680
<v Speaker 1>you go. So Marvin claimed to never be involved, saying

639
00:32:35.720 --> 00:32:38.519
<v Speaker 1>he was at home with his wife, who initially supported

640
00:32:38.519 --> 00:32:42.160
<v Speaker 1>his alibi, but she later changed her story, stating she

641
00:32:42.279 --> 00:32:45.160
<v Speaker 1>lied because she was afraid of Marvin. They were both

642
00:32:45.200 --> 00:32:49.559
<v Speaker 1>sentenced to life in prison. The police believed that Marvin

643
00:32:49.559 --> 00:32:55.519
<v Speaker 1>and Jesse were also responsible for Angie and Cheryl's disappearances.

644
00:32:56.000 --> 00:32:59.319
<v Speaker 1>In a letter Jesse wrote to another inmate, it mentioned

645
00:32:59.359 --> 00:33:02.839
<v Speaker 1>dumping the barodies of two other women in remote locations

646
00:33:03.400 --> 00:33:06.319
<v Speaker 1>and said, I'm glad they don't know everything else we did,

647
00:33:06.599 --> 00:33:07.880
<v Speaker 1>or I'd be on death row.

648
00:33:09.240 --> 00:33:11.960
<v Speaker 2>Well that's clearly he's responsible for other people.

649
00:33:12.799 --> 00:33:16.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah so, but as you know, the bodies of the

650
00:33:16.400 --> 00:33:18.960
<v Speaker 1>two others have never been found, right.

651
00:33:19.279 --> 00:33:21.920
<v Speaker 2>And if they did dump in river, it's you're not

652
00:33:21.960 --> 00:33:24.960
<v Speaker 2>going to find it, right. Rivers are notorious for getting

653
00:33:25.039 --> 00:33:25.680
<v Speaker 2>rid of bodies.

654
00:33:25.960 --> 00:33:30.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Yeah, so I personally believe that Jesse Mervin also

655
00:33:30.640 --> 00:33:33.240
<v Speaker 1>committed the crime against Cheryld. I just feel like they're

656
00:33:33.240 --> 00:33:35.440
<v Speaker 1>just too similar, that that was almost like their m O.

657
00:33:35.599 --> 00:33:39.440
<v Speaker 1>Maybe going to like a convenience store where like a

658
00:33:39.480 --> 00:33:43.240
<v Speaker 1>singular person was working like that. But for some reason,

659
00:33:43.279 --> 00:33:46.200
<v Speaker 1>I don't feel convinced they are also connected to Angie's case.

660
00:33:47.319 --> 00:33:49.960
<v Speaker 1>I do wonder, though, why Jesse wouldn't blab about the

661
00:33:50.000 --> 00:33:51.960
<v Speaker 1>others like he did with Trudy.

662
00:33:53.160 --> 00:33:55.440
<v Speaker 2>Because it's sentencing.

663
00:33:56.279 --> 00:33:58.720
<v Speaker 1>Well, why would he blab about one though to friends

664
00:33:58.720 --> 00:33:59.880
<v Speaker 1>and stuff, but not the other.

665
00:34:02.039 --> 00:34:03.839
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. Maybe you just hadn't got that far yet.

666
00:34:03.880 --> 00:34:05.519
<v Speaker 2>Give him enough time, and he probably would.

667
00:34:05.359 --> 00:34:07.359
<v Speaker 1>Have, I guess if he gets away with it.

668
00:34:07.319 --> 00:34:10.360
<v Speaker 2>Long enough, because clearly in that letter he was starting

669
00:34:10.360 --> 00:34:13.679
<v Speaker 2>to already. Yeah, if he wasn't in prison at that time,

670
00:34:13.719 --> 00:34:16.639
<v Speaker 2>he probably would have started. Probably give him another year,

671
00:34:16.679 --> 00:34:18.719
<v Speaker 2>he probably would have been confessing to both of them

672
00:34:18.719 --> 00:34:21.000
<v Speaker 2>to his friends, and who knows what he would have said.

673
00:34:21.760 --> 00:34:25.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So, now before I move on in regards to

674
00:34:25.239 --> 00:34:28.320
<v Speaker 1>serial killer's theory, there's one thing that I should note,

675
00:34:28.360 --> 00:34:32.440
<v Speaker 1>which is the apparent sightings of Angie being reported to

676
00:34:32.480 --> 00:34:37.679
<v Speaker 1>the police, one particular sighting being in Manitoba, Canada in

677
00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:41.599
<v Speaker 1>October of nineteen ninety one. The individual who reported the

678
00:34:41.639 --> 00:34:44.920
<v Speaker 1>sighting his name was Russell Smith. He was from Manitoba,

679
00:34:45.320 --> 00:34:48.079
<v Speaker 1>but he was visiting family Mirsouri when he saw a

680
00:34:48.119 --> 00:34:52.480
<v Speaker 1>missing person's poster for Angie. It striked a memory for him,

681
00:34:52.519 --> 00:34:56.719
<v Speaker 1>and he claimed he saw a woman matching Angie's description

682
00:34:56.920 --> 00:35:00.239
<v Speaker 1>get inside a green pickup truck with a decal on

683
00:35:00.320 --> 00:35:05.000
<v Speaker 1>the rear window in Manitoba, leaving a drug store. A

684
00:35:05.079 --> 00:35:09.760
<v Speaker 1>thorough search was done by the RCMP, including researching bursts

685
00:35:10.199 --> 00:35:12.559
<v Speaker 1>because at that time and you would have had her

686
00:35:12.599 --> 00:35:19.559
<v Speaker 1>baby and abandoned babies. But nothing was found. So I

687
00:35:19.599 --> 00:35:22.280
<v Speaker 1>don't know. You hear that sometimes where people are seen,

688
00:35:22.360 --> 00:35:25.639
<v Speaker 1>but I feel like everyone has someone that looks like them.

689
00:35:26.119 --> 00:35:28.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, in the world, right, And there's a lot of green,

690
00:35:29.079 --> 00:35:32.599
<v Speaker 2>old green pickup trucks out there. Yeah, I've seen a

691
00:35:32.639 --> 00:35:35.559
<v Speaker 2>lot of decos with scenery on the back window of

692
00:35:35.639 --> 00:35:37.559
<v Speaker 2>trucks around here in town where we live. We live

693
00:35:37.599 --> 00:35:40.079
<v Speaker 2>in a small city. Yeah, so I'm sure there's other

694
00:35:40.199 --> 00:35:42.920
<v Speaker 2>green pickup trucks with a similar type deco out there

695
00:35:42.920 --> 00:35:43.360
<v Speaker 2>in the world.

696
00:35:43.800 --> 00:35:46.440
<v Speaker 1>And it's also interesting because I just feel like a month,

697
00:35:46.480 --> 00:35:49.039
<v Speaker 1>I think it was about a month had passed. So

698
00:35:49.079 --> 00:35:53.000
<v Speaker 1>it's just like, can he actually remember like what exactly

699
00:35:53.039 --> 00:35:55.559
<v Speaker 1>he saw, Like I don't know, like in that kind

700
00:35:55.679 --> 00:35:56.440
<v Speaker 1>in detail.

701
00:35:56.519 --> 00:35:59.480
<v Speaker 2>You know. The mine plays some crazy tricks on individuals

702
00:35:59.519 --> 00:36:01.679
<v Speaker 2>when you're trying to think back a lot of the time, Yeah,

703
00:36:01.719 --> 00:36:04.800
<v Speaker 2>it's your memory making it up again. You can't remember

704
00:36:04.800 --> 00:36:08.119
<v Speaker 2>things exactly. Yeah, like all your memories you have of

705
00:36:08.159 --> 00:36:11.840
<v Speaker 2>your childhood, it's your memory making it up for you

706
00:36:11.960 --> 00:36:13.119
<v Speaker 2>to revisit it.

707
00:36:13.679 --> 00:36:14.239
<v Speaker 1>That's true.

708
00:36:14.480 --> 00:36:14.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

709
00:36:14.679 --> 00:36:17.039
<v Speaker 1>And sometimes and I mean I even have had that

710
00:36:17.079 --> 00:36:19.199
<v Speaker 1>sometimes you don't remember even like if it's something's a

711
00:36:19.280 --> 00:36:23.519
<v Speaker 1>dream versus like reality or something like, the mind plays

712
00:36:23.559 --> 00:36:24.719
<v Speaker 1>weird shit games on you.

713
00:36:24.840 --> 00:36:26.480
<v Speaker 2>Oh, it does weird shit games.

714
00:36:26.519 --> 00:36:29.920
<v Speaker 1>Indeed, that's a good English, isn't it.

715
00:36:30.199 --> 00:36:33.599
<v Speaker 2>That's very good English. That is a very good English.

716
00:36:33.679 --> 00:36:37.000
<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh. Okay, So for the serial killers on

717
00:36:37.039 --> 00:36:42.880
<v Speaker 1>the list, we have Kenneth McDuff, Tommy Sells, and Larry

718
00:36:43.000 --> 00:36:46.280
<v Speaker 1>d Wayne Hall. They were all active in the state

719
00:36:46.280 --> 00:36:49.280
<v Speaker 1>of Missouri at the time of Angie's disappearance, and they

720
00:36:49.320 --> 00:36:52.320
<v Speaker 1>were all like not serving time at that particular moment.

721
00:36:53.440 --> 00:36:57.519
<v Speaker 1>Though direct evidence isn't necessary leading to these three individuals,

722
00:36:57.920 --> 00:37:01.440
<v Speaker 1>they all had a resemblance to Angie He's abductor. So

723
00:37:01.519 --> 00:37:05.159
<v Speaker 1>what Angie had told Rob that they look like their

724
00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:09.039
<v Speaker 1>victims were often young women, and they had more victims

725
00:37:09.320 --> 00:37:14.639
<v Speaker 1>still undetermined by police. So Kenneth McDuff, his span of

726
00:37:14.679 --> 00:37:18.760
<v Speaker 1>crimes was from October sixth, nineteen sixty six to March first,

727
00:37:19.159 --> 00:37:22.519
<v Speaker 1>nineteen ninety two, and his victim count was it said

728
00:37:22.559 --> 00:37:28.239
<v Speaker 1>any of her nine to fourteen plus. Kenneth has has

729
00:37:28.360 --> 00:37:31.199
<v Speaker 1>actually been on my list. I don't know if we

730
00:37:31.239 --> 00:37:32.840
<v Speaker 1>ever written our book, but a list to do a

731
00:37:32.840 --> 00:37:34.960
<v Speaker 1>podcast on because he's the one also known as the

732
00:37:34.960 --> 00:37:35.800
<v Speaker 1>broomstick killer.

733
00:37:35.960 --> 00:37:38.039
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, yeah yeah.

734
00:37:38.119 --> 00:37:41.239
<v Speaker 1>But with Kenneth, a lot of people believe it isn't

735
00:37:41.320 --> 00:37:45.119
<v Speaker 1>him because he when he was on death row about

736
00:37:45.360 --> 00:37:50.440
<v Speaker 1>to get executed, they figured he would have brought up

737
00:37:50.880 --> 00:37:53.039
<v Speaker 1>because he'd brought up things like he was trying to

738
00:37:53.079 --> 00:37:55.639
<v Speaker 1>not get executed, so they think that he would have

739
00:37:55.679 --> 00:37:56.960
<v Speaker 1>brought up Angie.

740
00:37:57.000 --> 00:37:57.440
<v Speaker 2>That's fair.

741
00:37:58.199 --> 00:37:59.760
<v Speaker 1>I think it totally makes sense.

742
00:37:59.800 --> 00:38:02.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, if you're gonna if you're gonna be playing

743
00:38:02.559 --> 00:38:04.800
<v Speaker 2>your cards, you're gonna play the ace up your sleep, right.

744
00:38:04.679 --> 00:38:06.920
<v Speaker 1>Absolutely, and that would definitely come up because I think

745
00:38:06.960 --> 00:38:08.400
<v Speaker 1>that would buy you a lot of time.

746
00:38:08.559 --> 00:38:08.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeap.

747
00:38:09.400 --> 00:38:13.119
<v Speaker 1>So Tommy sells his span of crimes was from nineteen

748
00:38:13.199 --> 00:38:17.880
<v Speaker 1>eighty to December nineteen ninety nine. He was only convicted

749
00:38:17.920 --> 00:38:22.280
<v Speaker 1>of one crime, but he had like twenty two plus suspected.

750
00:38:22.400 --> 00:38:24.639
<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, Yeah.

751
00:38:24.119 --> 00:38:25.880
<v Speaker 1>Like all these people just getting away with shit.

752
00:38:26.079 --> 00:38:26.840
<v Speaker 2>Just disgusting.

753
00:38:27.920 --> 00:38:29.719
<v Speaker 1>I keep saying disgusting, but it's just.

754
00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:32.400
<v Speaker 2>Like it's just that's what it is, though, it really is.

755
00:38:32.880 --> 00:38:35.280
<v Speaker 1>It so is because even that I'm not going to

756
00:38:35.320 --> 00:38:37.039
<v Speaker 1>go in a lot of detail about that Kenneth due

757
00:38:37.039 --> 00:38:39.480
<v Speaker 1>because we might do a podcast on him, but the

758
00:38:39.599 --> 00:38:42.599
<v Speaker 1>brief shit I read about that, like he should have

759
00:38:42.760 --> 00:38:46.519
<v Speaker 1>been in jail and he's not, and he was doing

760
00:38:46.639 --> 00:38:48.039
<v Speaker 1>bad things.

761
00:38:48.280 --> 00:38:49.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

762
00:38:49.599 --> 00:38:54.559
<v Speaker 1>Okay, So Kenneth McDuff and Tommy Sell have both since

763
00:38:54.599 --> 00:38:57.599
<v Speaker 1>been executed, so it's unlikely we'll know if Angie's fate

764
00:38:57.719 --> 00:39:01.440
<v Speaker 1>was due to one of these men As for Larry

765
00:39:02.039 --> 00:39:04.960
<v Speaker 1>d Wayne hall Well, he mentioned in an interview he

766
00:39:05.079 --> 00:39:09.559
<v Speaker 1>had five girls buried in the Mark Twain Forest. When

767
00:39:09.599 --> 00:39:13.119
<v Speaker 1>asked which cities they were from, he replied with three

768
00:39:13.360 --> 00:39:17.400
<v Speaker 1>from Springfield and two from small towns that he couldn't

769
00:39:17.440 --> 00:39:21.320
<v Speaker 1>remember the names of. So it suspected three of his

770
00:39:21.400 --> 00:39:25.400
<v Speaker 1>victims were the Springfield three, which is an unsolved missing

771
00:39:25.400 --> 00:39:29.199
<v Speaker 1>person's case from June of ninety two in Missouri, and

772
00:39:29.239 --> 00:39:33.480
<v Speaker 1>the other two being Sheryl Kenny and Angie. So that's

773
00:39:33.519 --> 00:39:36.920
<v Speaker 1>a speculation. So the newest theory out there. And I

774
00:39:36.920 --> 00:39:40.039
<v Speaker 1>think this theory was just like released in twenty twenty

775
00:39:40.079 --> 00:39:44.400
<v Speaker 1>one or something like very recent. And this is the

776
00:39:44.440 --> 00:39:49.599
<v Speaker 1>potential of a mistaken identity. So this one, this one's.

777
00:39:49.519 --> 00:39:52.880
<v Speaker 2>Wild mistaken identity. Okay, you got my interest.

778
00:39:53.400 --> 00:39:57.880
<v Speaker 1>Investigators are working on a theory that at Gie was

779
00:39:58.039 --> 00:40:02.760
<v Speaker 1>actually mistaken for another woman who was being targeted in

780
00:40:02.840 --> 00:40:06.000
<v Speaker 1>the aftermath of her father's legal affairs.

781
00:40:06.320 --> 00:40:07.199
<v Speaker 2>Oh shit.

782
00:40:07.880 --> 00:40:11.239
<v Speaker 1>So this man had had acted as an informant in

783
00:40:11.239 --> 00:40:16.280
<v Speaker 1>an narcotics case and received a note threatening the life

784
00:40:16.360 --> 00:40:20.800
<v Speaker 1>of his daughter, who was also named Angela. So the

785
00:40:20.880 --> 00:40:23.679
<v Speaker 1>note was sent out on April fourth, nineteen ninety one.

786
00:40:24.159 --> 00:40:29.199
<v Speaker 1>The same evening Angie was abducted. Authorities believe that due

787
00:40:29.199 --> 00:40:33.199
<v Speaker 1>to the similar names and appearances, the two women were

788
00:40:33.199 --> 00:40:36.880
<v Speaker 1>mixed up and Angie was mistakenly abducted.

789
00:40:38.400 --> 00:40:42.639
<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, Yeah, that seems extremely plausible.

790
00:40:43.119 --> 00:40:46.719
<v Speaker 1>So this theory, I think is still being like investigated.

791
00:40:47.119 --> 00:40:50.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that that seems very plausible. It does. I do

792
00:40:50.239 --> 00:40:52.039
<v Speaker 2>still stand by my part of the theory that that

793
00:40:52.079 --> 00:40:56.719
<v Speaker 2>truck came from an old farm. And sorry, the reason

794
00:40:56.760 --> 00:40:58.800
<v Speaker 2>I say that is that rusted out license plate.

795
00:40:59.400 --> 00:41:01.679
<v Speaker 1>Well, Kate, do you remember my license plate at one

796
00:41:01.719 --> 00:41:02.119
<v Speaker 1>point on.

797
00:41:02.119 --> 00:41:04.559
<v Speaker 2>My civic that's not rusted. It was just that was

798
00:41:04.639 --> 00:41:07.320
<v Speaker 2>falling off, that was sun bleached and the label was peeling.

799
00:41:08.039 --> 00:41:11.519
<v Speaker 2>Rusted means it's been sitting there for a long time,

800
00:41:11.920 --> 00:41:15.519
<v Speaker 2>not being replaced. And where does that happen? On private property?

801
00:41:15.679 --> 00:41:18.800
<v Speaker 1>I never even thought about that. You know, I didn't

802
00:41:18.840 --> 00:41:20.920
<v Speaker 1>even have the rusted thing written in there. Just came

803
00:41:20.960 --> 00:41:22.079
<v Speaker 1>off out of my head.

804
00:41:22.280 --> 00:41:23.800
<v Speaker 2>Well it was rusted though, right, it was.

805
00:41:24.760 --> 00:41:26.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but I didn't even have it written in here

806
00:41:26.239 --> 00:41:29.239
<v Speaker 1>because you know, as you're reading, lots of shit just flows.

807
00:41:28.920 --> 00:41:31.920
<v Speaker 2>Back to you. Yeah. No, but that, like that rusted

808
00:41:32.000 --> 00:41:35.360
<v Speaker 2>license plate, that to me is a very big key. Yeah,

809
00:41:35.440 --> 00:41:37.599
<v Speaker 2>that tells me where that truck has been and where

810
00:41:37.639 --> 00:41:41.039
<v Speaker 2>it comes from. That says it's private property where no

811
00:41:41.079 --> 00:41:43.320
<v Speaker 2>one sees it's been sitting for a long time.

812
00:41:43.360 --> 00:41:46.280
<v Speaker 1>Because I do believe that it would be that truck

813
00:41:46.320 --> 00:41:48.599
<v Speaker 1>would be very easy to spot at a later time.

814
00:41:48.800 --> 00:41:53.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so it's probably sitting on someone's back forty right now. Yeah,

815
00:41:53.800 --> 00:41:54.440
<v Speaker 2>just covered up.

816
00:41:55.280 --> 00:42:00.679
<v Speaker 1>So now, also with just that last theory, it had

817
00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:03.199
<v Speaker 1>been that note and stuff I think had been like

818
00:42:04.360 --> 00:42:08.480
<v Speaker 1>in their documents or whatever. But as the case, the

819
00:42:08.519 --> 00:42:11.119
<v Speaker 1>case does get relooked at this like came up.

820
00:42:11.239 --> 00:42:13.000
<v Speaker 2>So she I was like, that's wild.

821
00:42:13.079 --> 00:42:16.639
<v Speaker 1>So to briefly recap the theories I went over because

822
00:42:17.480 --> 00:42:19.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm giving a lot of information here. It's a it's

823
00:42:19.800 --> 00:42:23.960
<v Speaker 1>gonna be a bit overwhelming. So we have Angie's fiance,

824
00:42:24.159 --> 00:42:27.480
<v Speaker 1>Angie's ex boyfriend or the two of them as a team.

825
00:42:28.119 --> 00:42:32.760
<v Speaker 1>We have Jesse Russ and Marvin Chaney who murdered Trudy Darby.

826
00:42:33.920 --> 00:42:38.559
<v Speaker 1>We have serial killers Kenneth McDuff, Tommy Sells or Larry

827
00:42:38.639 --> 00:42:43.679
<v Speaker 1>d Wayne Hall. We have the mistaken identity or we

828
00:42:43.760 --> 00:42:45.920
<v Speaker 1>have that it could have honestly just been a completely

829
00:42:46.079 --> 00:42:50.639
<v Speaker 1>random attack, which you kind of had said, And I'm

830
00:42:50.639 --> 00:42:53.119
<v Speaker 1>throwing this one in here because I mean, there were

831
00:42:53.199 --> 00:42:55.519
<v Speaker 1>some sightings at some point. It could be that she's

832
00:42:55.559 --> 00:42:56.800
<v Speaker 1>still like alive somewhere.

833
00:42:56.960 --> 00:43:02.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so I'm going to adapt my theory. Okay, let's

834
00:43:02.760 --> 00:43:05.840
<v Speaker 2>hear my theory is, Yeah, of course those brothers were

835
00:43:05.920 --> 00:43:11.440
<v Speaker 2>responsible for more. They're not responsible for Angie, is it, sorry, Angie? Yeah, Angie.

836
00:43:11.440 --> 00:43:16.679
<v Speaker 2>They're not responsible for Angie specifically, though, I think yes,

837
00:43:16.760 --> 00:43:21.199
<v Speaker 2>this note leads to a mistaken identity. They talk to

838
00:43:21.320 --> 00:43:25.920
<v Speaker 2>someone available, they know someone who knows, someone who's somebody

839
00:43:26.000 --> 00:43:28.880
<v Speaker 2>out on a farm somewhere who's like, yeah, I can

840
00:43:28.920 --> 00:43:32.639
<v Speaker 2>get it done for you for ten grand whatever. Hopson

841
00:43:32.719 --> 00:43:36.840
<v Speaker 2>his truck he knows isn't going to get identified through

842
00:43:36.880 --> 00:43:39.519
<v Speaker 2>the grapevine. He knows where said Angie is going to be,

843
00:43:40.079 --> 00:43:43.400
<v Speaker 2>and through the grapevine, said Angie is the wrong Angie.

844
00:43:44.679 --> 00:43:47.320
<v Speaker 2>He goes, picks her up, heads back to his farm,

845
00:43:48.039 --> 00:43:50.960
<v Speaker 2>where the truck is now disposed of, and Angie is

846
00:43:51.039 --> 00:43:52.679
<v Speaker 2>unfortunately disposed of as well.

847
00:43:54.000 --> 00:43:57.719
<v Speaker 1>Isn't that just devastating? Though, Hey, that is the person that.

848
00:43:57.760 --> 00:43:59.800
<v Speaker 2>Is that's I mean wrong or right?

849
00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:01.800
<v Speaker 1>I mean even if yeah, even if that was the

850
00:44:01.880 --> 00:44:05.719
<v Speaker 1>right Angie, like terrible because I mean, but oh, like

851
00:44:05.800 --> 00:44:09.679
<v Speaker 1>she really did nothing. I mean, the other Angie. I

852
00:44:09.719 --> 00:44:12.880
<v Speaker 1>guess her father did something, which doesn't help.

853
00:44:12.679 --> 00:44:15.679
<v Speaker 2>Her at all. But so what's your theory?

854
00:44:15.960 --> 00:44:22.559
<v Speaker 1>Oh man, Okay, I actually, yeah, I don't think that

855
00:44:22.639 --> 00:44:26.639
<v Speaker 1>the brothers did Angies. I do think this theory of

856
00:44:26.679 --> 00:44:30.280
<v Speaker 1>this mistaken identity identity makes a lot of sense. But

857
00:44:30.320 --> 00:44:32.960
<v Speaker 1>then I also really think the Larry de Wayne Hall

858
00:44:33.679 --> 00:44:36.960
<v Speaker 1>serial killer thing makes a lot of sense too.

859
00:44:37.239 --> 00:44:38.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it does to me.

860
00:44:39.320 --> 00:44:41.559
<v Speaker 1>Just how he said there was like five victims. They're

861
00:44:41.599 --> 00:44:45.840
<v Speaker 1>all from Missouri, the three of them, or that the

862
00:44:45.920 --> 00:44:48.440
<v Speaker 1>Springfield three, and then the other two or these other

863
00:44:48.440 --> 00:44:50.679
<v Speaker 1>two that didn't I don't know. It just makes sense

864
00:44:50.719 --> 00:44:50.920
<v Speaker 1>to me.

865
00:44:51.719 --> 00:44:54.920
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, you'd never know who those other two are, right.

866
00:44:55.039 --> 00:44:56.480
<v Speaker 1>Well, Angie and Cheryl.

867
00:44:56.440 --> 00:44:59.239
<v Speaker 2>I know it could be yeah, but it also could

868
00:44:59.239 --> 00:44:59.679
<v Speaker 2>be others.

869
00:45:00.320 --> 00:45:04.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it totally could be others. So okay, So there

870
00:45:04.960 --> 00:45:08.440
<v Speaker 1>you have it. Angie has been missing for thirty years now,

871
00:45:08.800 --> 00:45:12.000
<v Speaker 1>and know there may be possibilities, there sure aren't any

872
00:45:12.039 --> 00:45:16.559
<v Speaker 1>confirmed answers into her deduction. And I'll close the podcast

873
00:45:16.559 --> 00:45:19.840
<v Speaker 1>with once again the description of Angie being that this

874
00:45:19.960 --> 00:45:23.119
<v Speaker 1>is still an ongoing thing, a drawing was done in

875
00:45:23.199 --> 00:45:26.000
<v Speaker 1>twenty thirteen of what Angie may look like at the

876
00:45:26.000 --> 00:45:28.599
<v Speaker 1>age of forty three, So I'll post that on our

877
00:45:28.639 --> 00:45:32.920
<v Speaker 1>Instagram and Facebook. Angela Hamlin is described as a betite

878
00:45:33.000 --> 00:45:36.280
<v Speaker 1>Caucasian female. She's four or eleven, and at the time

879
00:45:36.280 --> 00:45:39.039
<v Speaker 1>of her aduction weighed one hundred and twenty pounds. She

880
00:45:39.079 --> 00:45:41.639
<v Speaker 1>has brown, curly hair and brown eyes and a scar

881
00:45:41.800 --> 00:45:45.039
<v Speaker 1>on her upper lip. If you have any information about Angie,

882
00:45:45.079 --> 00:45:48.599
<v Speaker 1>you're asked to contact the police.

883
00:45:48.960 --> 00:45:51.599
<v Speaker 2>Well, I really hope that she is still out there,

884
00:45:51.639 --> 00:45:54.199
<v Speaker 2>and I really do hope that she's found. Yeah, and

885
00:45:54.320 --> 00:45:57.639
<v Speaker 2>even I hate to say it, but I do hope

886
00:45:57.679 --> 00:45:59.519
<v Speaker 2>at the very least her remains are found.

887
00:45:59.719 --> 00:46:03.079
<v Speaker 1>I mean, it would give the family closure. There is

888
00:46:03.159 --> 00:46:08.119
<v Speaker 1>a Facebook page actually that I was on. It's called

889
00:46:08.519 --> 00:46:13.480
<v Speaker 1>Angele Marie Hammond or maybe it's just hers, I don't know,

890
00:46:13.559 --> 00:46:16.519
<v Speaker 1>but anyway, there's like updates on there.

891
00:46:16.679 --> 00:46:18.480
<v Speaker 2>It wouldn't be hers if it's from ninety one.

892
00:46:18.400 --> 00:46:21.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it wouldn't be so okay, So it's just someone

893
00:46:21.880 --> 00:46:24.079
<v Speaker 1>has made it. And yeah, they put updates on there,

894
00:46:24.239 --> 00:46:27.079
<v Speaker 1>like they've put this newest one and it's still active,

895
00:46:27.159 --> 00:46:30.960
<v Speaker 1>like the last post was April. Oh, that's not super active,

896
00:46:30.960 --> 00:46:35.519
<v Speaker 1>I guess April twenty nine, twenty twenty one. But yeah,

897
00:46:35.880 --> 00:46:37.760
<v Speaker 1>so I mean the family, because that's the thing, Like

898
00:46:37.800 --> 00:46:41.360
<v Speaker 1>they're not losing hope and stuff. It's just yeah, I

899
00:46:41.360 --> 00:46:45.880
<v Speaker 1>mean if she was alive or found, or if she

900
00:46:45.960 --> 00:46:47.960
<v Speaker 1>had died and they knew about it, she'd still always

901
00:46:48.000 --> 00:46:50.000
<v Speaker 1>be on their mind, but in a little bit of

902
00:46:50.039 --> 00:46:51.960
<v Speaker 1>a different way, there'd be some closure, I suppose.

903
00:46:52.159 --> 00:46:55.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, one way or another. This is an absolutely heartbreaking case.

904
00:46:55.639 --> 00:47:02.320
<v Speaker 2>I can't imagine the idea of passing. Oh that's the

905
00:47:02.400 --> 00:47:04.519
<v Speaker 2>thing that gets me that that's got to be one

906
00:47:04.519 --> 00:47:07.320
<v Speaker 2>of the most heartbreaking things I've ever heard in true crime.

907
00:47:07.480 --> 00:47:09.639
<v Speaker 1>On that is it's just it would just haunt you.

908
00:47:09.679 --> 00:47:12.840
<v Speaker 2>Like we've heard disgusting things. Don't get me wrong, but

909
00:47:12.880 --> 00:47:14.440
<v Speaker 2>that is like, that's.

910
00:47:14.239 --> 00:47:16.079
<v Speaker 1>That is just like it would just wake you up

911
00:47:16.079 --> 00:47:18.880
<v Speaker 1>in the middle of the night, nightmare, Like you'd hear

912
00:47:19.159 --> 00:47:21.760
<v Speaker 1>the scream that she was said of your voice.

913
00:47:21.840 --> 00:47:24.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well your name sorry, And like you said at

914
00:47:24.199 --> 00:47:27.480
<v Speaker 2>the very u intro of this, that's hair standing on

915
00:47:27.519 --> 00:47:28.599
<v Speaker 2>the back of your neck. Yeah.

916
00:47:29.239 --> 00:47:33.039
<v Speaker 1>So anyway, let us know what you think. We always

917
00:47:33.039 --> 00:47:35.880
<v Speaker 1>loved to hear what your guys' theories and what you

918
00:47:35.920 --> 00:47:36.519
<v Speaker 1>think happened.

919
00:47:36.599 --> 00:47:38.320
<v Speaker 2>So, yeah, let us know. We'd love to hear it.

920
00:47:38.360 --> 00:47:40.960
<v Speaker 2>You can shoot us a message or a comment or whatever,

921
00:47:41.400 --> 00:47:45.800
<v Speaker 2>whether it's email or website or Instagram or Facebook or Patreon,

922
00:47:46.039 --> 00:47:50.239
<v Speaker 2>or we have Twitter, which I still need to learn

923
00:47:50.280 --> 00:47:50.719
<v Speaker 2>how to use.

924
00:47:50.840 --> 00:47:52.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, have we been updating on Twitter? I've actually been

925
00:47:52.760 --> 00:47:54.360
<v Speaker 1>meaning to ask you that, and I'm just asking you

926
00:47:54.360 --> 00:47:55.280
<v Speaker 1>that on our podcast.

927
00:47:56.320 --> 00:47:58.039
<v Speaker 2>No, I haven't really been updating. I haven't been on

928
00:47:58.039 --> 00:47:58.639
<v Speaker 2>there for like a week.

929
00:47:58.920 --> 00:48:00.960
<v Speaker 1>I know I haven't. I haven't got on there at all.

930
00:48:01.440 --> 00:48:04.960
<v Speaker 2>And also, as of today, we officially have a Reddit account.

931
00:48:05.400 --> 00:48:07.239
<v Speaker 2>I mean, we're on Reddit looking at cases once in

932
00:48:07.280 --> 00:48:08.559
<v Speaker 2>a while, so I figured, you know what, might as

933
00:48:08.559 --> 00:48:11.039
<v Speaker 2>well get an account. There you go.

934
00:48:11.880 --> 00:48:14.800
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Well, thank you for listening, thank you for being here,

935
00:48:14.840 --> 00:48:16.960
<v Speaker 1>and as always, stay wicked.