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Speaker 1: H give me your this, kill me that kill my enemy,

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Kill my enemy, my enemy, give me give they kill

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my enemy, Give me the kid.

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Speaker 2: Anyone that's the one.

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Speaker 1: Minisoxa die die die dictive to kill the game.

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Speaker 2: They give me tex, give me.

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Speaker 1: Dumb, give the kilm my enemy, give me, give me

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predicted to give the game.

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Speaker 2: They give me, give me, give me wife, give me

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your fifty.

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Speaker 1: Kill me that kill my enemy, Kill my enemy, my

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enemy kills they give they kill my enemy, Give me

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the kid. Anyone that's the one mitisox die die die

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pardicted give me give they give me a trix, give

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me down, give the kil aneth give me, give me

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predicted to give the game. They give me a tixkill me,

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die by the give me wife, give me your fifty.

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Kill me that kill my enemy, Kill my enemy, my enemy,

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kill me, give the kill my enemy, give me the

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kive me only one that does. Who want medisoms die

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by fife die die die.

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Speaker 2: Give to kill me game.

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Speaker 1: They give me a text any do give the kick

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enemy game give me people predictive to give me games.

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They give me a text plenty died by t give

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me wife, give me your.

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Speaker 2: Six this fill me that in my enemy, kill my enemy.

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Speaker 1: My enemy kim me give the kill my enemy, give

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me the give me Only one does who want medisos

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t life, Die Die diet to kill me game. They

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give me a trix any do give the kill my enemy,

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give me give me time people protective to give me game.

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They give me a text.

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Speaker 2: Plenty died by Ted.

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Speaker 1: I give you the cat gives me where the facts?

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Speaker 3: Right now?

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Speaker 2: I'm not said the bomb up the awesome. I'm such.

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Speaker 1: I thought he's the.

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Speaker 4: Selling singing and I hear a.

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Speaker 3: Sash of victory. I hear a sound of the order

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of the peasant victory for Nachel.

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Speaker 4: Will Big release right now for being the sash right now, I'm.

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Speaker 2: Not said the bomped up the awesome.

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Speaker 5: I'm not.

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Speaker 4: I thought he's the gis of sing sing and.

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Speaker 3: I'll hear a flash of victory. I'm here a sound

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of the order of the heaven victory for Nachel. Will

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Big release right now for being a sac right now,

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I'm said the bomb up the awesome.

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Speaker 2: I'm the atcha.

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Speaker 1: I thought he's the.

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Speaker 3: Selling singing and I hear a tush of victory.

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Speaker 2: Nika, give me wife, give me your fifty this kill.

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Speaker 1: Me that in my enemy kill my enemy, my enemy kill.

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They give the kill my enemy, give me the kive

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me only one.

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Speaker 5: That's one.

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Speaker 2: Miniso te di.

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Speaker 1: Di id predicted to kill me give they give me

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a trix, give me down, give the kill any give me.

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Speaker 2: Give me time you predicted to give me give me,

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Give me a tex till me die die die.

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Speaker 5: I give you the cap.

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Speaker 2: Nika give me wife, give me child this kill me

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that in my enemy kill my enemy, my enemy kill.

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They give the kill my enemy. Give me the kive

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me only one. That's one. Miniso die die die die

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give to kill the game.

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Speaker 1: They give me tax, give me down, give to kill

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my enemy give give me time you predicted to give

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me give They give me tax died died, give me

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the cave.

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Speaker 2: Me give me wife, give.

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Speaker 5: Me you give me that my enemy all day long,

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all day long.

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Speaker 6: They give me all day long, all day long.

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Speaker 4: That's spice.

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Speaker 1: Keeps you bill, give you, give me, gives, give me, give.

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Speaker 2: Me, give me teast di.

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Speaker 5: Diar by fire who wife.

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Speaker 2: Give me, give me that my enemy enemy give they

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give thee give me my life, give me, give give,

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give give gi gi give give, give, give, give.

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Speaker 6: Give gip on Crystal's a nasty.

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Speaker 5: What's up?

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Speaker 6: Welcome everybody? You all ready to die by fire today?

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How can you do a stream on Easterday?

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Speaker 5: How can you do it to me?

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Speaker 2: How can you do a streams voluntary? It's offending me.

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Speaker 6: It's a microaggression, even though I don't have to call in.

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Speaker 4: Or even interact with you. How do you do a stream?

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Speaker 5: My fee wegel we we we we we.

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Speaker 6: We also celebrate the victory over the gates of Hell,

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who the church fathers say are the gates of Hell? Oh,

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the mouth of the heretics. So included in the notion

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of the resurrection victory in the heroing of Hades and

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the destruction of the bars and gates and doors of Hades,

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and the obtaining of the keys of Hades by the

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Son of God. We also have the notion that all

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heretics are silenced and destroyed via the events of the

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past couple days, So the descent into Hades and the

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glorious Third day resurrection. By the way, did you hear

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at the beginning of yesterday's service the mention of the

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divine energies in the liturgy?

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Speaker 5: I did so.

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Speaker 6: The apostle liturgy even includes the reference to divine divine

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energies in regard to the glorious Third day resurrection, but

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not just that, also his descent into Hades. Anyway, So today, though, well,

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we're going to focus on the topic of charismaticism, not

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that we haven't already addressed megachurches, but specifically the topic

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of charismatic pentecostalism in the churches and why this is ridiculous, goofy.

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It's an atheism factory. It's destructive to all things known

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as Christianity. It makes everyone look look like clowns, and

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it is clown church. And so we're going to talk

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about the basics of why this is wrong today, and

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hopefully you'll understand that the stream that we did a

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few days ago, or actually a couple of weeks ago,

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where I talked about how there's no new divine revelations

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by extension audio issues. Okay, let me see maybe uh.

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Speaker 5: I was on.

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Speaker 6: Stream yard. Every time I go on stream yard, it

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turns my microphone down. Is that better? Can you hear me?

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There shouldn't be audio issues? Hello, Hello, laha gives me?

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This gives me debt. Anyway, First of all, signs and

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wonders cannot and do not quote prove a thing. This

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is a very low tier, low low information votage who

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believe that a mirror sign or wonder necessarily proves the

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entire Paradigmers system. In Luke sixteen, we have the statement wicked,

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adulterous generation seeks signs, and yet no sign is given

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to it except the sign of the prophet. Jonah knows

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Jesus refers back to already written divine revelation, the Book

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of Jonah, to show that you're asking me to do

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signs and wonders to quote prove my ministry, even though

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he already did do signs and wonders as an attestation

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and in a limited sense, a quote proof of his ministry.

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It's not a proof in the strict sense of paradigm

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level justification. Because if we think about atheists, for example,

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you'll notice a lot of very low tier normy apologetics

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tries to prove the possibility of a resurrection to an atheist,

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look at all the witnesses, look at the change in

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their lives. Well, that may be the case, but it's

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conceivable that people can change their lives and die for

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something false, even Christians across the board so called in

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various groups and sects, will admit that people can die

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for a false belief or a heresy. For example, we

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have the statement in Cantate Domino the Council of Florence

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that the Roman caldert Church formed only dogmatize the position

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that even if a person dies for the name of

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Christ outside of communion with the papacy, they're still lost.

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So even if you're a Roman Catholic, you would have

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to admit that just because a person is martyred or

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does some heroic action like dying for the name of Christ,

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it still doesn't prove that the religion is true, especially

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given every religion claims signs and wonders. And as I

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pointed out many times, there were thousands and thousands of

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people who supposedly witnessed Mary appear at a Coptic church

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in Ziton, Egypt. Does that mean that Coptic theology is

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true because supposedly Mary appeared to many people, And so

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we begin to see that very quickly, thinking that a

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miracle claim proves the entire paradigm is easily demonstrably false

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because the same criteria is not used when other religions

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and paradigms claim the same. For example, you heard probably

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a few weeks ago, we had a Roman Catholic that

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maybe a couple months ago called in and made me

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twice on this topic for about an hour each time,

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and every time I would bring up the counter objections,

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he would move the goalpost to say, well, the Roman

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Catholic miracles have been scientifically proven. Okay, Well, what happens

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when a Coptic person claims that the coptic apparition is

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scientifically proven. It's a never ending chain of regression of

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miracle claims. For example, we had some years back, Muslims

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for many years claiming the miracles of the Qoran prove

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the Qoran. Now I don't believe that there were real

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miracles of the Koran, but my point is that you're

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never going to solve a paradigm level challenge by elements

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or particular things within the worldview itself, because just like

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an atheist is not going to accept the claims that

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Jesus rose from the dead on the basis of so

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called e witnesses or this or that person or this

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or that theologian, they're going to reinterpret it according to

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the lens that they have their paradigm, their rose colored glasses.

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They're gonna say, perhaps it appeared to them that Jesus

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walked out of the tomb, and perhaps this and that,

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Perhaps it was a yet unexplained natural event, Perhaps it

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was another person, Perhaps it.

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Speaker 5: Was this that.

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Speaker 6: So in other words, again, as we've pointed out many years,

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many hundred times, there's nothing about the issues that we're

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talking about that are strictly evidential in nature. They're not

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evidential problems like if you just stack up enough quote evidences,

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suddenly it becomes true or the entire paradigm is true.

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Even if Jesus was raised from the dead or came

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back from the dead, how do we know that that

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proves anything outside of the assumptions of the rest of

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the paradigm of Christianity. We have in the Old Testament

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many holy men, some of whom came back and appeared

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and did resurrections and so forth. The bones of Elisha right.

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But in other words, the resurrection of Christ only has

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the meaning that it has within the entire Christian redemptive story.

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So just rising from the dead itself even doesn't necessarily

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mean that the totality of Christianity is true, even if

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you were to somehow convince a person that it was

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very likely that Jesus rose from the dead. So these

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are all logical refutations and objections to the claim that

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supposedly this event means the entire paradigm is true. Now,

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I do believe that the paradigm is true, but I'm

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trying to make a different philosophical point that seems to

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go over so many people's heads who can't think in

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terms of systems. They can only think in terms of

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particular piecemeal bits and pieces. Same problem that we see,

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for example, with papists when they try to argue for

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the papacy. They don't understand that all I need is

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one dogmatic contradiction between various popes. It might be in

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your car, it might have been slid back in there.

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It's not a big deal. I didn't leave it at church.

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Speaker 5: It's there.

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Speaker 6: Well, maybe I didn't live at church. I don't know anyway.

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Miracles will accompany the true faith, but miracles themselves and

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signs and wonders cannot of themselves prove it. And just

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like in Luke sixteen, Jesus isn't interested in giving the

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pharisees a sign or a wonder. He just simply says,

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go read Jonah. Remember the story of the rich man,

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the parable the rich man and Lazarus. And the rich

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guy is in Hades, and he says, let me go

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back from the dead, and the miracle will prove to

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my brothers that you know you're the Messiah, and I'll

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convince them. And Jesus says, what, Yes, you're right. If

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we just stack up the evidence is we'll convince everybody.

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Is that what Jesus says? No, he says, even if

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one rises from the dead, they still will not believe

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because they have Moses and the prophets. They already have

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the story of Jonah and the prophetic typology in Jonah

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or the prophetic typology throughout the writings of Moses. If

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they're not going to believe those prophecies, they will not believe.

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Though one rise from the dead. Hello, is that right?

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Sound familiar? Butts literally argue like the guy and charismatics

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like the guy in uh Hades. No, but if you

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just if they just see a miracle, they'll believe. And

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the point is that people's disbelief isn't ultimately a lack

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of evidence. It's actually ultimately an issue of the heart

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and pride and heart heeartedness. Now intellect is involved because

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a hard heart will misuse the intellect and the reasoning

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faculty to go against divine revelation, go against God, go

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against what's true, and they will selectively pick and choose

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the evidences that they accept. That's why evidentialism doesn't work.

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In fact, if you read C. S. Lewisi's Space trilogy,

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that's the entire point of the character of Mark in

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the third installment. Mark knew deep down from the beginning

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of joining nice in Ice, which is basically the nWo

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in the Tavistok Institute. He knew that they were evil

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from the get go, but he selectively chose the pieces

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of evidence that fit what he wanted to be the case.

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This is the whole point of that character in the novel.

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And when he eventually converts and comes to his senses

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and realizes that he was part of an evil institution,

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he admits to himself, you know what, it wasn't because

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a lack of evidence that it was an evil institution.

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It was because I didn't want it to be, and

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I selectively chose the evidence to fit the narrative that

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I wanted to be the case. He read the evidences

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with rose colored glasses, and every atheist, every debunker, will

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do that same thing, because it's a issue of paradigms.

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It's not an issue of a lack of facts or

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lack of evidences, because if you were to go into

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looking into the facts and evidences, you would begin to see, oh,

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actually there's tons and tons of evidences, right, And being

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against evidentialism does not mean I'm against evidences. You have

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to use evidences. Evidences are absolutely necessary when it comes

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to you know, historic Christianity, when it comes to you know,

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claims of you know, Tacitus and claims of Josiphus. Right,

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all of these ancient historical texts are very useful as evidences.

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But that's not the same thing as evidentialism, which presupposes

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a very naive enlightenment ish epistemology that you just present

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the facts. Humans are neutral observers. The facts are just

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brute facts. They don't require any interpretation. They're not theory laden,

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and if you just look at the facts and stack

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them up, then there it is all right. It's the

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same naive way that Protestants pres reading the scriptures. Well,

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the scriptures are just perspicuous, they have perspicacity, they're just clear,

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and you just go to the clear passages, and the

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clear passages enlightened the other passages because the Bible is

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self attesting and it's clear. Well, maybe some passages are,

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but that doesn't tell you what the meaning of the

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non clear passages are. And how do you know which

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ones are the clear which ones are In other words,

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you cannot avoid theory laden interpretations of the data and

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the facts and the world and history and ancient testimonies. Likewise,

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you can't avoid theory laden interpretation of language and words

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and books. Now getting back to charismaticism. Charismaticism, as probably

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everyone is aware, I'm not going to spend a whole

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lot of time on the history of it. You know,

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it's late eighteen hundreds, a nineteen hundreds four square gospel.

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You know, this comes out of Azuza Street, Revival comes

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out of California. All kinds of weird, crazy heresies and

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nonsense and colts totally come out of California. California is

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like a giant cult factory. Basically, it's very good at

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that California. It gelds say a grade on its ability

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to create crazy cults. They're very good at it. I

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believe some of those are fostered and aided by the system,

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and some of those are organic, just straight up cults.

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And so I don't necessarily have a thesis that there

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was some conspiracy involved in the rise of charismaticism. There

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could be, I'm just not aware of it. Rather, I

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would assume that much like a lot of cults and movements,

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you get uneducated people who mistake their enthusiasm. It used

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to be called that in the time of the Enlightenment

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Scientific Revolution, people who were these sort of crazy religious

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wackos were called enthusiasts. If you read I think it's

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either Lock or Kant, I think it's Locke talks about enthusiasts,

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this sort of just you know, prelst inspired individuals who

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believe that they have some you know, divine direct mandate

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from God, God speaking to them in audible voices or

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in feelings or in patterns of events, et cetera. And

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this takes off in California at this Azuza Street revival,

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and this becomes not the origin of all Pentecostalism or charismaticism. Certainly,

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as I will mention in a moment, there are predecessors,

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and shocker, where does the precedent come for this? Why

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Roman Catholicism and it's histrionic women saints that we've covered

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many many times. I'm not going to rehearse all that,

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but I do want to make a point to say that,

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for example, if we look back at the Azusa Street revival,

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we will notice very clear parallels between the way that

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these people act and operate and the histrionic women's saint

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claims in the Roman Catholic world. And I'm not just

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singling out the Roman Calicus either, because there were Protestant

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predecessors as well. For example, the Great Awakening, the Old

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Light New Light dispute Jonathan Edwards is preaching, which led

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to people having these bizarre manifestations of yapping and barking

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and rolling and frothing and giggling and losing their mind,

330
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all this nonsense. But let's start with a Zuza Street

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for a little bit here, and then we'll get the

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background briefly, and then we'll move into some of the

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other historical examples, and then we'll go to some of

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the texts that are used by this Goofball religion sect

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that are easily refuted.

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Speaker 7: Nineteen o six, the location two hundred and fourteen Bonnie

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Bray Street. On the third day of a ten day fast,

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William Seymour began to preach to the prayer group from

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Acts chapter two, verse four, and they were all filled

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with the Holy Ghost and began to speak with other

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tongues as the spirit gave them utterance. Afterwards, mister Edward

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Lee asked Seymour to lay hands on him as they

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did in the scriptures, and pray that he would receive

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the Holy Ghost. When they finished, Lee lifted his hands

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and began speaking in tongues.

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Speaker 6: Now, notice first of all that there's no context for

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Acts two here, And it's the exact same mistake that

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I made when I was eighteen or nineteen and I

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just started reading the Bible as a Protestant, and I thought, oh, look,

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here's Acts too. They're laying on hands and they're quotes

351
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speaking in tongues. That must be what the Pentecostal Church

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is doing down the road. I thought this when I

353
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first started reading the Bible. In just total biblical exegetical

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hermeneutical and historical ignorance. I thought this right, and so

355
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you know, I'm going to try to be as patient

356
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as I can and as nice as I can because

357
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I'm so mean. But we have to understand that, first

358
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of all, that's not what's happening in Acts two. Acts

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two is a fulfillment of the Old Testament prophecies and predictions.

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For example, in Isaiah. You can go back and watch

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my video on why there's no New Revelations that I

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just posted a couple of weeks ago in my clips

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not my clips channel, on my main channel under videos clips,

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there's a video called this one argument refutes all new

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revelation cults, whether Mormons, Muslims, or Charismatic and Pentecostals. So

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that I'm not going to rehearse all this stuff about

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new divine revelations because that's dealt within that very quick, precise,

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fifteen to twenty minute video. But suffice to say that

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Isaiah predicts a specific event where the Jews will see

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a miraculous event, as well as Joel predicting the pouring

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out of the Holy Spirit upon all flesh. Those are

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signs that are specific fulfillments of Old Testament prophecies or

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Isaiah about the Jews being taught by another people in

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a strange tongue and then falling over backwards when they

375
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don't believe. That's a reference to the actions and events

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pentecost Next too, the languages that are spoken, and it's

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very key here are people hearing the message in the

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Gospel miraculously in their native tongue. That's the miracle. There

379
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is nothing at all about gibberish or an angel language

380
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in any of this. Okay, so glosa, as we'll see

381
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in a moment. Or languages or tongues is literally defined

382
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in the most basic Greek lexicon as a language, a tongue,

383
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a native people group's speech. Nothing to do with gibbering, babbling, frothing,

384
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falling on the floor, rolling, barking in all the nonsense

385
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that charismatics and Pentecostals do. Literally nothing, And the angel

386
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tongue that Paul talks about. Paul is not saying that

387
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there's an actual angel language that's like gibberish. No, No,

388
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he's saying it's a rhetorical point that even if I

389
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knew the tongues of the language of the Angels, if

390
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I had all the linguistic knowledge in the world, even

391
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if I knew the language of the angels. Okay, it's

392
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an exaggeration, it's rhetoric. It's a rhetorical statement, he says.

393
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But if I don't have love, it's useless. And I'm

394
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a clanging gong, a banging symbol. It doesn't mean that

395
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Paul is also telling you about the secret Gibberish angel language.

396
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And I think that you would only come to this

397
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if you were completely ignorant. And I don't mean that

398
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in a mean way, just in a factual way. Uneducated

399
00:27:35,839 --> 00:27:40,480
people pick up religious texts and they think that it's

400
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:44,799
whatever the first thing that pops in their mind. Right, Oh,

401
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,000
that must be what the pentecostald. And I know because

402
00:27:47,039 --> 00:27:49,359
I was uneducated, and when I first started reading the Bible,

403
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I thought that I thought, I guess this is what

404
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:54,559
the Pentecostals do, Right. I didn't know that I could

405
00:27:54,559 --> 00:28:01,319
go look in the strongs and I even had a strongs.

406
00:28:05,039 --> 00:28:10,960
What is glosa in scripture a tongue, a language, specifically

407
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:18,640
one naturally unacquired language. That's the miracle aspect. But as

408
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:25,519
you can see in the Gift of Foreign languages and acts, Two.

409
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:33,799
There's nothing about gibberish in any of this. What is

410
00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:38,240
tongues in the Bible a language or dialect used by

411
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particular people distinct from another nation. It's that simple. So

412
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:47,599
what is the miracle in the church the ability to

413
00:28:47,759 --> 00:28:53,559
translate the texts into other languages? It's that simple. Not

414
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:57,400
many people have the gift of languages. Some people are

415
00:28:57,519 --> 00:29:00,119
very gifted in that. Did you know that the go

416
00:29:00,279 --> 00:29:07,000
Mortensen speaks like seven languages. That's a gift. Now, that

417
00:29:07,079 --> 00:29:10,559
doesn't mean he has like the gift of pentecost. I'm

418
00:29:10,599 --> 00:29:12,759
not saying that. I'm just saying that some people have

419
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a natural affinity for that. And I think in the

420
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Biblical context, in the period of Acts, there was this

421
00:29:20,119 --> 00:29:23,599
ongoing divine revelation. So we're not at the point when

422
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:27,960
divine revelation ends. Yet public divine revelation ends. When John

423
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the Apostle dies, there's no more new public divine revelations.

424
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It's complete. And go see the other video I made

425
00:29:36,119 --> 00:29:39,519
on why the Bible itself tells you when divine revelation

426
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:44,079
that's public is complete. I'm not saying there's no miracles.

427
00:29:44,079 --> 00:29:49,920
I'm saying that divine revelation is done. Public divine revelation

428
00:29:50,039 --> 00:29:52,759
ceases when John passes away. So let's go back to

429
00:29:52,799 --> 00:29:58,440
the Zuzus Street Revival and we'll get the history this experience.

430
00:29:58,519 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 7: Since Shock wage the room and at the same time,

431
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a young lady named Ginny Moore feil from her stool

432
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where she was sitting.

433
00:30:06,839 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 3: The power of God fail, and I was baptized in

434
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the Holy Ghost and Fire with the evidence of speaking

435
00:30:14,039 --> 00:30:14,559
in tons.

436
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 6: Now, notice that this is immediately a woman affiliated, woman

437
00:30:22,559 --> 00:30:26,240
based thing. It began with this dude preaching. But the

438
00:30:26,319 --> 00:30:31,559
first baptized in the spirit person is this obviously emotional

439
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:37,200
woman who falls over in her chair and starts. I

440
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:40,119
don't know what she's doing here. She says talking in tongues,

441
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:44,720
but that probably means just gibberish. Right now, let's keep

442
00:30:44,759 --> 00:30:47,880
in mind what does Paul say about the role of

443
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,519
women in church. Generally, I do not permit a woman

444
00:30:51,599 --> 00:30:55,960
to teach in the church, but to be in silence. Okay,

445
00:30:56,799 --> 00:31:01,160
And what's the beginning of the Azusa Street Revival. A

446
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:06,359
woman flopping around on the ground in gibberish? Does that

447
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:09,440
sound like a Pauline type of spirit?

448
00:31:09,559 --> 00:31:12,960
Speaker 3: Here as I looked at God, it seemed as if

449
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a vessel broke within me and water surged up through

450
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:19,559
my being, which when it had reached my mouth, it

451
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,920
poured out in a torrent of languages God had given me.

452
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:27,039
I sang under the power of the spirit in many languages,

453
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and in the home where the meeting was helped. The

454
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spirit led me to the piano, where I played and

455
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:37,039
sang under the inspiration, although I had not learned how

456
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to play.

457
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Speaker 6: Now, this is what this woman claims. I mean, who

458
00:31:41,799 --> 00:31:43,839
knows if she actually didn't know how to play the

459
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piano and just miraculously played the piano. I mean, this

460
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is her claim. Who knows if this is actually the case.

461
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:53,839
But secondly, even if this did occur in some out

462
00:31:53,839 --> 00:31:56,079
of the norm way, that she didn't actually know how

463
00:31:56,119 --> 00:31:58,279
to play the piano and then suddenly did, how do

464
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:00,640
we know that it's actually a good spirit and not

465
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:05,480
an evil spirit? I mean, an evil spirit could conceivably

466
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:10,079
play the piano or possess a person to do this.

467
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:15,200
So these actions themselves do not prove or disprove anything

468
00:32:15,839 --> 00:32:21,079
without the context of discerning the spirits. Remember John talks

469
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about be sure to discern the spirits, And how do

470
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we discern the spirits according to divine revelation? Is it

471
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:35,039
just feelings? And everybody knows that almost all of this

472
00:32:35,279 --> 00:32:40,000
kind of stuff is feelings based, right, all this Pentecostal

473
00:32:40,039 --> 00:32:44,000
stuff right now, I'm not saying feelings have no place.

474
00:32:44,319 --> 00:32:44,480
Speaker 5: Right.

475
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:48,440
Speaker 6: For example, if we go to confession, we have sorrow

476
00:32:48,519 --> 00:32:52,400
over our sins, we repent, there's feelings involved in that.

477
00:32:52,559 --> 00:32:56,519
But your emotions and your feelings are not God. They're you.

478
00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:01,839
And most of these sects and groups mistake their emotions

479
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:05,400
and their feelings for the dictates of the spirit or

480
00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:09,960
of God. Now, in Deuteronomi thirteen, we have the principle

481
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:13,680
that anytime there's signs and wonders or claims of miracles,

482
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:19,079
what you test them by is the theology they that

483
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:23,400
they possess, and by extension also the fruits. Right, so

484
00:33:23,519 --> 00:33:26,000
Jesus says you'll know them by their fruits. But the

485
00:33:26,799 --> 00:33:31,039
specific way to know about a prophet. In many charismatic

486
00:33:31,119 --> 00:33:34,240
Pentecostal people believe that their prophets or that they have

487
00:33:34,359 --> 00:33:40,200
divine prophetic revelations. In fact, we just saw sam Dalon

488
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:45,200
Shamoun claiming to also apparently be able to in a

489
00:33:45,319 --> 00:33:47,599
prophetic way even though he says, I'm not calling myself

490
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:50,119
a prophet, but I'm gonna prophesy, which is a lie

491
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:55,680
out of his own mouth, contradicting himself. The test of

492
00:33:55,759 --> 00:33:58,599
a prophet or the gift of prophecy quote unquote, is,

493
00:33:59,079 --> 00:34:03,000
first of all, do you keep in line with prior

494
00:34:03,119 --> 00:34:06,359
revelation and the theological principles laid out.

495
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:06,559
Speaker 5: Now.

496
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 6: I'm not even granting that there are quote prophets today,

497
00:34:09,559 --> 00:34:11,840
there are not prophets, And in fact Luke sixteen sixteen

498
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:15,199
says there's no prophets in an Old Testament sense today.

499
00:34:16,519 --> 00:34:18,360
But if you also look over at Nermy eighteen, you'll

500
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:24,920
notice that the second principle laid out is that there

501
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:31,440
will be a prophet that speaks like Moses. That's the prophet,

502
00:34:31,599 --> 00:34:35,119
as the Book of Acts says, was Jesus. Jesus is

503
00:34:35,199 --> 00:34:38,360
the new Moses. I just read it in the liturgy

504
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:42,239
last night, the chapter in Acts where it specifically identifies

505
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:47,840
this as fulfilled in Christ, and it says, how do

506
00:34:47,920 --> 00:34:51,239
we know the prophet is a true prophet or false prophet?

507
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:53,960
And again you have to dictate that he has to

508
00:34:54,119 --> 00:35:01,360
speak according to what was previously divine revelation right now.

509
00:35:01,639 --> 00:35:05,119
When Paul in Galatians won lays down his principles for

510
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:08,519
a false and a true gospel, or a false and

511
00:35:08,599 --> 00:35:13,159
a true teacher, it is the same principle as Deuome

512
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:17,320
thirteen and eighteen. You may only follow the person who

513
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:21,920
has the same preaching and teaching that Paul laid down.

514
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:25,679
That means there's a finality. If there was no finality

515
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:28,760
to Paul's letters in the New Testament, you could have

516
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:33,159
no fixed measure to judge so called prophets and so

517
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:38,239
called teachers. That's another reason why it can't be an ongoing,

518
00:35:38,559 --> 00:35:44,599
evolving public revelation with new prophets and new gospels and

519
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:49,920
new teachers and whatever else Muslims and Mormons and Charismatics

520
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:55,239
think is going on and again, just like Joseph Smith

521
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:58,719
had to change this verse in his translation, Luke sixteen

522
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:03,239
sixteen says, the law and prophets were until John, and

523
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,719
since that time, since the law and the prophets since John,

524
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:10,360
as the last of the Old Testament prophets, the Kingdom

525
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,000
of God is preached. Okay, so the Church is the

526
00:36:13,079 --> 00:36:17,480
Kingdom of God. The Church are the vine dressers that

527
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:22,280
Zechariah thirteen predicted would be the church age. Right again,

528
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:25,639
I'm hammering home this point in the other video about

529
00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:32,320
why there's not new divine prophetic revelations after the death

530
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:37,599
of the Apostles. In Zacharia thirteen, we have the prediction

531
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:39,280
that in the Messianic era, and if you read the

532
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:41,440
entire chapter is very clear that it is the Messianic

533
00:36:41,519 --> 00:36:43,920
era because it talks about the Son of God being pierced.

534
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:49,440
It says that if anyone still claims to prophesy it

535
00:36:49,599 --> 00:36:53,840
or be a prophet, his mother and his father that

536
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:56,880
be God him will say you shall not live. We

537
00:36:57,039 --> 00:37:01,679
already know that you are a deceiver. Anyone who claims

538
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:08,079
to be a prophet in those days, we will say

539
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:11,719
you are cut off. There are no more prophets, because

540
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:16,519
this is the time in which the Shepherd Savior was

541
00:37:16,599 --> 00:37:20,760
cut off. So all of these texts attest to a

542
00:37:21,199 --> 00:37:26,039
finality to public divine relation, not can a saint be

543
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,079
a clairvoyant, or can this miracle happen at this or

544
00:37:29,119 --> 00:37:32,000
that church or around this or that icon. Of course,

545
00:37:32,079 --> 00:37:35,719
we believe that that is not the same thing as

546
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:41,119
Prophetess So and so spoke. Therefore, we have a new

547
00:37:41,159 --> 00:37:45,000
book from Ellen White that will supplant and help the Bible.

548
00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:50,519
Joseph Smith has spoken, and Moron I told him what

549
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,159
to say from the Golden tablets, and this book will

550
00:37:53,199 --> 00:37:56,880
help fix the problems in the Bible. Mohammed has spoken

551
00:37:56,960 --> 00:37:59,960
as a prophet like Moses and Jesus, and Mohammed will

552
00:38:00,039 --> 00:38:01,599
fix the problems in the Bible. Do you see the

553
00:38:01,639 --> 00:38:10,320
difference here? And even though a charismatic Pentecostal person might

554
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:15,880
not necessarily say that my prophecies supplement the Bible or

555
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:21,039
correct the Bible, he's already violated this principle that you

556
00:38:21,199 --> 00:38:24,840
were already rejected and condemned in the second and third

557
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:30,480
century when we rejected Montanism. Okay, the Church rejected Montanous

558
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:34,800
the charismatic of the second century, and the Church rejected

559
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:41,639
that interpretation of Glossalelia as gibberish and extemporaneously speaking from

560
00:38:41,679 --> 00:38:49,000
the Holy Spirit because it's languages. Thus, the Orthodox Catholic

561
00:38:49,159 --> 00:38:57,480
Church never ever accepted the Pentecostal charismatic understanding of what

562
00:38:58,519 --> 00:39:03,960
is going on in two or with the charismatic gifts

563
00:39:04,079 --> 00:39:10,119
of First Corinthians twelve. And in fact, let's look at

564
00:39:10,119 --> 00:39:14,360
First Corinthians twelve. When Paul writes that there is a

565
00:39:14,639 --> 00:39:20,199
diversity of gifts. To one is giving the working of miracles,

566
00:39:20,679 --> 00:39:23,920
to one the gift of prophecy. This is in the

567
00:39:24,159 --> 00:39:28,400
intertestamental transitional period. You understand that from the time of

568
00:39:28,519 --> 00:39:32,800
Christ's death, resurrection, ascension, and the Book of Acts to

569
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:35,320
the death of John and the destruction of the Temple

570
00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:39,239
in seventy eight D. This is entirely the transition period

571
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:41,880
from the Old to the New Covenant. The New Covenant

572
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:47,239
is not totally fully one hundred percent in until the

573
00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:51,760
seventy eight D destruction of the Temple. That's the removal

574
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:57,239
of the old system that Hebrews talks about, thus fulfilling

575
00:39:57,519 --> 00:40:01,239
Luke twenty one in Matthew twenty four. So not everything

576
00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:05,840
in the Acts Book of Acts period will even be

577
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:09,679
normative for the entire history of the Church. For example,

578
00:40:10,079 --> 00:40:13,000
there is no new We don't have a new Pentecost.

579
00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:17,639
There will not be another Acts too, because Pentecost in

580
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:25,719
Acts two was the fulfillment of Pentecost. You see, there

581
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:30,000
will never be another Jerusalem Council to solve how to

582
00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:35,159
receive gentiles into the church. It's already been settled. So

583
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:40,880
you see that just because something occurs between the ascension

584
00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:44,199
of Christ and Acts one and the death of John

585
00:40:44,639 --> 00:40:46,199
or the destruction of the Temple in seventy eight D.

586
00:40:47,519 --> 00:40:49,639
That doesn't mean that that's normative for the entire history

587
00:40:49,639 --> 00:40:54,119
of the Church. But because Pentecostals and Charismatics are almost

588
00:40:55,079 --> 00:41:00,280
usually uneducated people, self appointed lay people with no real

589
00:41:00,440 --> 00:41:03,440
education in these topics or no knowledge of church history,

590
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:07,000
formation of the Biblical canon, et cetera, et cetera, they

591
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:13,320
import their personal subjectivist interpretations into all these passages. But

592
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,599
what's the word that's use here? In one Corinthians twelve

593
00:41:15,679 --> 00:41:20,199
ten A diversity of languages and to another the ability

594
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:24,079
to interpret the languages. Now, this could be referring to

595
00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:27,400
a miraculous gift like you see in Acts to a

596
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:32,639
pentecost right, or it could be referring to a miraculous

597
00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:37,280
fluency and ability to understand and translate. It could be

598
00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:45,280
either one. Yeah, please, thank you. But you'll notice that

599
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:46,840
the word, by and by the way, did you know

600
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:51,960
that the word here working here is energeia, the energies

601
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:58,239
of the spirit. Right to one is given the gift

602
00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:09,199
of prophecy, and all kinds of what glosa languages? Glosa?

603
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:14,000
What is glosa the language or dialect of a particular

604
00:42:14,079 --> 00:42:19,320
people distinct from another nation. Where's the gibberish, where's the

605
00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:23,559
speaking the tongues of angels that these goobers think that

606
00:42:23,599 --> 00:42:35,639
they're doing. Welcome everybody. We got twelve hundred over here

607
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:39,639
almost on YouTube what it like, and you can support

608
00:42:39,679 --> 00:42:41,880
the stream also by super chat. Super chats are done

609
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:46,039
through stream labs or through YouTube natively, you can support

610
00:42:46,079 --> 00:42:49,480
the stream stream there. So hopefully we can begin to

611
00:42:49,519 --> 00:42:52,960
see that, you know, there's not anything really in First

612
00:42:53,039 --> 00:42:58,199
Corinthians twelve that would in any way speak to some

613
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:02,320
sort of gibberish, some sort of flopping around and acting

614
00:43:02,519 --> 00:43:10,239
insane and foolish. And keep in mind too that when

615
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:16,599
we when we see in the next chapter, let's go

616
00:43:16,639 --> 00:43:24,239
to the next chapter, O man that went on the

617
00:43:24,239 --> 00:43:30,519
way to the Second Corinthians. In the Orthodox Church, we

618
00:43:31,079 --> 00:43:35,840
believe that Paul's discussions of the experience that he has

619
00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:42,639
about the third heavens, right though I speak with the

620
00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:46,559
tongues of men and angels. Now, this passage here is

621
00:43:46,599 --> 00:43:50,239
what most of them sort of just assume. Well, then

622
00:43:50,679 --> 00:43:53,199
Paul must be saying that he got an angel language

623
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:56,199
and that we can learn language when the preacher lays

624
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:59,400
his hands on me and I start babbling. Once stop Bible.

625
00:43:59,519 --> 00:44:02,320
That was the I ain't I could talk to Gabriel

626
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:10,000
and Michael directly, right. No, it literally says tongues of men,

627
00:44:10,719 --> 00:44:14,199
which are known languages, as we just saw in the

628
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:20,320
definition here, right, a tongue is a known dialect of

629
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:25,480
a nation, a glossa. And it does not follow from

630
00:44:25,519 --> 00:44:31,480
that that because Paul uses a rhetorical statement. Look, if

631
00:44:31,519 --> 00:44:33,719
I know all the languages and I can even talk

632
00:44:33,800 --> 00:44:36,760
angel language, it doesn't follow that there is an angel

633
00:44:36,840 --> 00:44:42,559
language that you that you can speak. That's silly. And

634
00:44:42,639 --> 00:44:46,440
then he goes into discussing love, and he discusses charity, right,

635
00:44:48,039 --> 00:45:00,440
and then he talks about his mystical experience. So this

636
00:45:00,719 --> 00:45:04,679
unknown tongue in the Orthodox interpretation, this is the next

637
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:11,000
passage that the charismatics go to. That is the speaking

638
00:45:11,079 --> 00:45:16,920
of mysteries, right, that edifies the individual. This is the

639
00:45:17,119 --> 00:45:20,519
inner prayer of the heart. And there was a really

640
00:45:20,559 --> 00:45:23,320
good exegesis of this some years back. I can't remember

641
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:25,639
who did it, and I'm not a huge fan of

642
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:28,440
the Romanides, but it might have actually been Romanites had

643
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:33,719
a really good exegesis of this passage. But regardless whoever

644
00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:37,400
it was, there is an Orthodox priest or bishop of

645
00:45:38,239 --> 00:45:43,079
recent note. It might have been maybe Herothios Lacos that

646
00:45:43,199 --> 00:45:51,719
had a really good exegesis of this chapter. Because Paul

647
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:56,679
is talking about this the language of prayer, which is

648
00:45:56,760 --> 00:46:00,800
this deep inner hessekia, the prayer of violence, that the

649
00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:07,079
inner man is praying without ceasing. Right. And it's because

650
00:46:07,239 --> 00:46:09,880
Paul says elsewhere right, the Spirit knows me better than

651
00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:14,360
I know myself, that inner prayer of his spirit, the

652
00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:19,360
news the heart directly praying in the Holy Spirit. That's

653
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:24,400
what we think this is. It doesn't equate to gibberish

654
00:46:24,519 --> 00:46:28,320
flopping around on the ground, and gives me that prosperity

655
00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:32,000
gospel nonsense. In fact, Paul in the very same letter says,

656
00:46:32,960 --> 00:46:37,880
do nothing out of order, but do all things with

657
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:43,599
sobriety order. And he says God is not the author

658
00:46:43,679 --> 00:46:47,440
of confusion. If God is not the author of confusion,

659
00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:53,079
then why would we think that He ordained worship services

660
00:46:53,880 --> 00:47:04,679
to be nothing but insane confusion like charismatic church services screaming, yapping, flopping, foaming, giggling.

661
00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:14,639
Literally right, think of it. For thousands of years, God

662
00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:23,119
ordains specific ordered, patterned liturgical worship. That liturgical worship is

663
00:47:23,199 --> 00:47:27,480
even based on the worship in heaven. Right, Moses received

664
00:47:27,599 --> 00:47:32,159
the pattern of worship. Paul says, that was the tupos,

665
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:35,960
the type of the heavenly worship in Hebrews. So what

666
00:47:36,199 --> 00:47:40,400
Moses puts into the tabernacle is the pattern of the

667
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:43,719
heavenly worship. When John sees into heaven in the Revelation

668
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:47,679
five to nine, it's ordered liturgical worship in heaven. That's

669
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,320
what the Orthodox Church has on earth. Do you see

670
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:53,519
any yipping and yapping and rolling when John looks into heaven?

671
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:56,639
You see incense, you see vestiments, you see an altar.

672
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:59,719
Do you see any of that in these clown churches?

673
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:06,960
Of course not, because God doesn't ordain liturgical worship for

674
00:48:07,079 --> 00:48:09,639
thousands of years and then suddenly tell everybody to go

675
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:13,840
act like it's a rock concert. It's idiotic, it's stupid,

676
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:23,760
it's ignorant. How did Jesus himself worship? I always like

677
00:48:23,840 --> 00:48:29,440
to ask Protestants and Charismatics this, when Jesus was a

678
00:48:29,559 --> 00:48:32,960
young man and he was growing up, and how did

679
00:48:33,039 --> 00:48:36,159
his normal pattern of worship go?

680
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:38,320
Speaker 5: And what was it like?

681
00:48:39,159 --> 00:48:40,960
Speaker 6: Was he flopping around the ground. Did he give any

682
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,920
examples of doing this or did he go to his

683
00:48:44,039 --> 00:48:49,199
local synagogue and temple and worship the way that had

684
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:56,119
been ordained by him? Because he gave the law through liturgy. Oh,

685
00:48:56,440 --> 00:49:02,360
I never thought about that. Why would Jesus ordain liturgical

686
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:06,920
worship for thousands of years establish his church? That church

687
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:12,400
immediately fails. I'm talking about the Apostolic Patristic church. Then

688
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:16,440
we get who Montanous, who, by the way, is a

689
00:49:17,039 --> 00:49:20,719
I think he's a weird heterodox trinitarian. Like his trinitarian

690
00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:24,320
theologizing sound trinitarian. He thinks he's the voice of the

691
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:28,960
Holy Spirit. So Montanous was the true church? And then

692
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:31,599
what it dies out? And then we don't get more

693
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:41,199
charismatic stuff until Gertrude. I'm trying to think of the

694
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:50,239
first medieval histrionic. No Francis the first charismatic Roman Catholic

695
00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:53,599
I can think of as Francis of ASSISI and you

696
00:49:53,679 --> 00:50:00,119
guys recall we saw this in the History of the

697
00:50:00,159 --> 00:50:05,400
Cambridge Companion to Western Hermeticism had a chapter on medieval

698
00:50:05,519 --> 00:50:08,880
women mystics. It's one of the best chapters I've read

699
00:50:09,199 --> 00:50:11,679
in a long time. On all this stuff because you realize,

700
00:50:11,719 --> 00:50:15,639
wait a minute, these chicks are the actual predecessors to

701
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:22,679
feminism and to charismaticism, and two women preachers all wrapped

702
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:30,719
up in one medieval convent of insanity. So I'm talking

703
00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:37,079
about Julian Norwich, Gertrude the Great, there's some other ones

704
00:50:37,119 --> 00:50:39,840
that I don't remember. And then more recently you move

705
00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:48,559
up into Faustina Kowalska, Margaret Mary Alacoque, so called Saint Gemma.

706
00:50:49,360 --> 00:50:53,519
These are all Roman Catholic histrionic women, so called saints,

707
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:59,960
who are literally proto charismatics in the sense of charismaticism. Now,

708
00:51:01,159 --> 00:51:05,760
I've already addressed this in this video over here, so

709
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:10,440
I'm not going to readdress this same point. I'm going

710
00:51:10,519 --> 00:51:11,880
to give you the link if you want to go

711
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:19,760
watch what I think is another pretty pretty damning critique

712
00:51:20,719 --> 00:51:23,480
of the Roman Catholic system here, because we're going to

713
00:51:23,519 --> 00:51:26,440
see in a moment that when I refute this and

714
00:51:26,599 --> 00:51:31,039
prove this to be heterodox, this also means Roman Catholicism

715
00:51:31,199 --> 00:51:36,320
is false because Roman Catholicism from the papacy down has

716
00:51:36,400 --> 00:51:43,280
approved and accepted the so called charismatic renewal. Thus, if

717
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:51,480
Charismaticism and Pentecostalism are heresies and heterodox. Then logically it

718
00:51:51,559 --> 00:51:57,800
follows that the papacy is also heterodox and heretical, because

719
00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:01,679
it approves and promotes quote the charismatic renewal from the

720
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:04,760
papacy down and has at least as far back as

721
00:52:05,679 --> 00:52:09,079
John Paul the Second, maybe even earlier, maybe even John

722
00:52:09,199 --> 00:52:12,159
twenty third to Paul the sixth, but at least for

723
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:15,440
sure John Paul the Second approved of the charismatic renewal,

724
00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:20,760
even to the point of giving charismatics Catholic communion like

725
00:52:21,599 --> 00:52:29,039
Brother Roger Shoots. As we've covered many, many times. If

726
00:52:29,119 --> 00:52:33,840
you want that video, you scroll down to right here,

727
00:52:35,679 --> 00:52:38,760
and I show you that you don't get the liberty

728
00:52:38,800 --> 00:52:41,079
and Roman Catholicism of saying, oh, well, I don't accept

729
00:52:41,119 --> 00:52:43,159
Margaret Mary alo cocoit no, no, it doesn't work that way.

730
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:48,360
She's already approved by two popes and her veneration and

731
00:52:48,599 --> 00:52:51,480
the Sacred Heart is all approved by two popes and

732
00:52:51,519 --> 00:52:55,599
two bulls. Sainthood and Roman Catholicism is part of the

733
00:52:55,719 --> 00:53:00,719
ordinary magisterium. I can evolve, and that means you don't

734
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:02,440
get the freedom and the right. So oh, I just

735
00:53:02,480 --> 00:53:04,480
don't accept that. I can't tell you how many Roman

736
00:53:04,519 --> 00:53:06,000
Catholics I bring this up that said, well, I just

737
00:53:06,079 --> 00:53:07,639
don't have to accept all that. No, yes, you do.

738
00:53:09,079 --> 00:53:12,639
You think you get the right to reject two papal

739
00:53:12,719 --> 00:53:17,079
bulls affirming her mystical experiences and sainthood. You think that

740
00:53:17,159 --> 00:53:20,840
you get to reject the second most popular Roman Catholic

741
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:31,519
devotion in the world. That's ludicrous. So you've got Fatima

742
00:53:32,199 --> 00:53:35,599
number one, our lady of Fatima. What's the number two

743
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:39,320
devotion in the Roman Catholic world? I would argue the

744
00:53:39,400 --> 00:53:46,760
Sacred Heart. That's Margaret Mary ala Coque. Yes, absolutely, Sam

745
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:52,920
Schmoun is a Roman Catholic charismatic. Thus he is immediately disqualified.

746
00:53:53,360 --> 00:53:56,320
That's all you need to know. Anybody claiming that orbs

747
00:53:56,440 --> 00:54:00,400
are manifesting through their spit particles and their cat dust

748
00:54:01,599 --> 00:54:09,559
is an insane Sam Shalom automatic disqualifier. And he literally

749
00:54:09,599 --> 00:54:12,880
said he was going to prophesy even as he says

750
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:16,280
he's not prophesying, which is like straight up contradiction. So

751
00:54:17,599 --> 00:54:20,039
so if you're a Roman Catholic, you got to defend

752
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:23,679
and accept that Jesus was telling Margaret Mary alo coquit

753
00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:27,119
to carve his name in her chest, cut herself up,

754
00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:31,159
and that Jesus was her boyfriend and all this other nonsense.

755
00:54:31,239 --> 00:54:34,239
As well as Faustina Koualska, she has just as ridiculous

756
00:54:34,239 --> 00:54:39,760
a claim. Falstina Kowalska's claims are just as insane and

757
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:43,920
ridiculous as Margaret maryly Al okay, except that Fostina Koualska's

758
00:54:44,000 --> 00:54:47,440
claims didn't involve her like cutting herself up and then

759
00:54:47,559 --> 00:54:51,800
re cutting the wounds again later after she her superiors

760
00:54:51,840 --> 00:54:54,880
thought she was crazy because she was, and then she

761
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:57,880
went and tried to recut the wounds again, carving Jesus

762
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:13,679
name into her chest. Next, Kowalska claims that the host

763
00:55:13,800 --> 00:55:17,960
floats around, right, and Jesus talks to her through the

764
00:55:18,039 --> 00:55:20,559
host as is floating around and says, you're the greatest

765
00:55:20,639 --> 00:55:24,519
nun in the convent. We're basically boyfriend girlfriend. I'm not kidding.

766
00:55:26,079 --> 00:55:31,159
You don't get to reject that if you're Roman Catholic.

767
00:55:31,159 --> 00:55:34,159
Oh that I said on accept Falseina Kowalska. She's a

768
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:38,800
papally declared, universally accepted saint in the Roman Catholic Church.

769
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:42,000
You don't get to reject that. What are you talking

770
00:55:42,039 --> 00:55:46,360
about you really think the host was flying around telling

771
00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:48,599
her that she was the greatest nun in the world. Now,

772
00:55:49,679 --> 00:55:53,559
what's one of the key signs in our perspective Orthodox

773
00:55:53,599 --> 00:55:59,280
perspective on false miracle? Saint Vision claims, what's the number

774
00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:04,000
one sign of pre okay, prelast is spiritual delusion. The

775
00:56:04,159 --> 00:56:09,360
number one sign of prelast is that it produces pride

776
00:56:10,719 --> 00:56:17,119
and not humility. So if Falstina Kuska claims that, yeah,

777
00:56:17,480 --> 00:56:20,079
Jehalsa has a funny quote there, he says, Falstina Kuaska

778
00:56:20,119 --> 00:56:23,199
claim that Jesus gave her authority over all creation. I mean,

779
00:56:23,239 --> 00:56:27,840
this is like obviously delusion. It's like you see Sam

780
00:56:27,960 --> 00:56:30,360
Chumunn with the exact same delusion as these history onic

781
00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:42,960
women's saints. Right, So here we come with the people.

782
00:56:43,360 --> 00:56:46,679
It's Easter, and Jujus wants to debate. Did you realize

783
00:56:46,719 --> 00:56:50,039
that a part of Easter is the victory over all

784
00:56:50,159 --> 00:56:52,440
the mouths of the heretics. Who does the Cerch Church

785
00:56:52,559 --> 00:56:55,320
rather say the mouths of heretics are the gates of hell,

786
00:56:56,519 --> 00:57:02,559
and we proclaim in the liturgy victory over the gates

787
00:57:02,599 --> 00:57:04,719
of Hell. Well, if the gates of Hell are the

788
00:57:04,800 --> 00:57:08,880
mouths of the heretics. Then what better day to refute

789
00:57:10,079 --> 00:57:13,960
gibberish nonsense than the days celebrating the victory over the

790
00:57:14,039 --> 00:57:24,599
gates of hell the mouths of heretics. Now, in the

791
00:57:24,679 --> 00:57:28,960
case of Fasena Kowalska, the first things that she starts

792
00:57:28,960 --> 00:57:31,880
saying after the supposed host is floating around and talking

793
00:57:31,920 --> 00:57:37,519
to her, is how she is the special girlfriend of

794
00:57:37,639 --> 00:57:39,719
Jesus above all the other nuns.

795
00:57:39,519 --> 00:57:39,880
Speaker 5: In the world.

796
00:57:40,679 --> 00:57:45,239
Speaker 6: You can't make this up. Does that sound like humility

797
00:57:45,320 --> 00:57:47,360
or does that sound like prelist? Imagine if I came

798
00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:48,840
on here and I said, God, I had a dream

799
00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:51,119
last night, Jesus came to a dream. Jesus told me

800
00:57:51,159 --> 00:57:54,119
I'm the greatest apologist in the world, and then I'm

801
00:57:54,199 --> 00:57:57,760
the best Jesus defender in the entire world. Would you

802
00:57:57,880 --> 00:58:01,480
think that I was humble if I said that, or

803
00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:04,079
would you all just immediately think that, Okay, he's lost it.

804
00:58:04,199 --> 00:58:08,800
He's looney tunes, he's gone the road of sham shamoo,

805
00:58:09,639 --> 00:58:16,840
scam shamoo, he's looney tunes. He's lost it. Obviously you

806
00:58:16,880 --> 00:58:21,840
would think that accurately I have gone crazy, because that's

807
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:26,360
a crazy, it's a it's not producing humility. So the

808
00:58:26,639 --> 00:58:33,599
first sign of delusion is extreme arrogance and delusional pride

809
00:58:33,639 --> 00:58:36,559
and not the production of humility. And in many of

810
00:58:36,639 --> 00:58:41,360
these history onic Roman Catholic women saints, especially you see

811
00:58:42,639 --> 00:58:45,360
pre Lest p R E l e s T. Pre

812
00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:52,519
Lest is spiritual delusion. There's no better example of this

813
00:58:53,360 --> 00:58:57,679
than these history on women's saints who are cutting themselves.

814
00:58:58,360 --> 00:59:00,079
I mean, is it it?

815
00:59:00,559 --> 00:59:00,679
Speaker 5: Uh?

816
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:11,239
Speaker 6: Jesus is sending Catherine. Uh, what's that one? Spiritual orgasms?

817
00:59:11,239 --> 00:59:13,960
I'm not kidding. I'm not trying to be gross or blosphemous.

818
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:18,960
That's what she says. The one that has the you

819
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:20,559
know when you walk into the Vatican and you see

820
00:59:20,559 --> 00:59:23,280
it's like the second one you see. I forget which

821
00:59:23,320 --> 00:59:29,800
one it is. But if you read the Cambridge Companion,

822
00:59:30,199 --> 00:59:33,360
you can actually see that, Okay, these women are actually

823
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:39,519
having some sexual issues in the convent because they actually

824
00:59:39,639 --> 00:59:42,159
talk about I'm not kidding and I'm not being people

825
00:59:42,199 --> 00:59:46,800
rumcaics saying no, no, they speak in sexual language. Catherine

826
00:59:46,800 --> 00:59:47,119
is seeing it.

827
00:59:47,119 --> 00:59:47,440
Speaker 5: I thank you.

828
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:55,920
Speaker 6: They speak in the weird sexual language, not me, and

829
00:59:56,079 --> 00:59:59,519
it just that's just Roman Catholics like being ignorant of

830
00:59:59,559 --> 01:00:04,559
their own addition, right, when it comes to the the

831
01:00:04,679 --> 01:00:08,119
spiritual orgasms that they talk about. I'm not kidding. That's

832
01:00:08,159 --> 01:00:14,119
what she says, not me. So something was going on

833
01:00:14,360 --> 01:00:20,039
in the Roman Calthoc domain when immediately after the Schism,

834
01:00:20,159 --> 01:00:23,480
not too long after that, you have Francis of Assiz

835
01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:30,679
claiming that he saw a Sarah Fim crucified on the cross.

836
01:00:31,039 --> 01:00:37,960
What that's one of his famous visions. There's no angel

837
01:00:38,039 --> 01:00:41,960
that was crucified. That's a delusion. That's weird. It doesn't

838
01:00:41,960 --> 01:00:47,480
make any sense. And by the way, this weird stuff

839
01:00:48,239 --> 01:00:52,440
is not just Roman caltholc oddities. Okay. Again, the point

840
01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:55,559
I'm making here is that you have to believe what's

841
01:00:55,679 --> 01:01:03,360
papally approved about the saints, and the pattern of what

842
01:01:03,920 --> 01:01:07,320
orthodox saints talk about and experience is quite literally, as

843
01:01:07,320 --> 01:01:10,440
people have pointed out in the Chat, the opposite. Any

844
01:01:10,599 --> 01:01:14,800
mystical experiences, any visions, these kinds of things, they immediately

845
01:01:14,880 --> 01:01:19,960
produce tremendous humility, not outrageous claims of Jesus, my boyfriend

846
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:22,599
and I control all the creation of the world. That's crazy.

847
01:01:23,280 --> 01:01:25,679
It's weird to me that they can't see this. It

848
01:01:25,719 --> 01:01:28,639
doesn't make any But again, if you don't have discernment,

849
01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:34,800
you will fall for these delusions. So let's look at

850
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:39,679
another example. This is supposed to be true Christian Now, No,

851
01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:44,679
the Roman Calviolc world, because of so many scandals and corruptions,

852
01:01:45,039 --> 01:01:48,880
has famously had to sell off many of its dioceses

853
01:01:48,960 --> 01:01:52,360
and many of its cathedrals. Here's a Roman Calvy cathedral

854
01:01:52,480 --> 01:02:29,039
in Duscheldorf, Germany that is now a Pentecostal church. Do

855
01:02:29,119 --> 01:02:34,320
you think that whatever this nonsense patty cake is, do

856
01:02:34,400 --> 01:02:37,360
you think that's going to be able to stave off Islam?

857
01:02:38,480 --> 01:02:42,199
Do you think these goofballs stand any chance against an

858
01:02:42,239 --> 01:02:50,639
onslaught of Arab lunatics that are coming with simpters and

859
01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:58,800
five hundred offspring right, I mean the the just the

860
01:02:59,719 --> 01:03:02,840
in sane level of delusion, as I pointed out on

861
01:03:02,920 --> 01:03:08,920
Twitter today, with people who want to whine and bitch

862
01:03:08,960 --> 01:03:13,800
about me debating people, you're gonna learn the hard way.

863
01:03:14,079 --> 01:03:16,519
You're gonna wish in ten to fifteen years that you

864
01:03:16,639 --> 01:03:19,159
had supported me out here on the front lines, debating

865
01:03:19,199 --> 01:03:22,719
all the top Muslims when your whole lands are coated

866
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:27,519
with minarets and his jobs. And do you think your

867
01:03:28,320 --> 01:03:31,679
skittles Evangelicalism is going to stand a chance against a

868
01:03:31,840 --> 01:03:35,719
giant horde of Islamic invasion that's presently happening right now.

869
01:03:35,800 --> 01:03:38,119
I just drove coast to coast a few months ago.

870
01:03:38,920 --> 01:03:50,159
I saw mosques on Indian reservations, and you pathetic weak people, disgusting,

871
01:03:50,559 --> 01:03:56,840
cowardly weak people who want to virtue signal piety, signal

872
01:03:56,920 --> 01:04:00,239
about how you're above debating and how pious you are.

873
01:04:01,840 --> 01:04:05,480
And your children are going to wake up to the

874
01:04:05,800 --> 01:04:13,480
yapping minaret playing the yapping sounds, and your sons and daughters,

875
01:04:13,519 --> 01:04:17,480
which you probably don't even have because you're sterile. The

876
01:04:17,599 --> 01:04:20,159
ones that you do have are going to be married

877
01:04:20,199 --> 01:04:24,800
off to Muslims, and you're going to be wondering how

878
01:04:24,840 --> 01:04:27,920
did this happen. I can't figure out how it happened.

879
01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:32,719
How did our skittles Christianity not stand up against a

880
01:04:32,880 --> 01:04:38,400
giant Islamic invasion. I just can't figure it out. I

881
01:04:38,480 --> 01:04:42,519
guess it was the fault of those evil debaters on YouTube.

882
01:04:43,960 --> 01:04:46,679
It was the evil debate people that caused all of it.

883
01:04:52,679 --> 01:04:56,360
When Islam invades the West as it is and it

884
01:04:56,440 --> 01:04:59,920
takes over, it will actually be justified. I don't want

885
01:05:00,119 --> 01:05:02,400
that to happen. But I'm saying, when I see the

886
01:05:02,480 --> 01:05:06,360
attitude of people in the West, you are so ripe

887
01:05:07,320 --> 01:05:18,559
for conquer you are so weak, you're so pathetic, You're disgusting.

888
01:05:18,719 --> 01:05:25,679
Most of you are disgusting. Meanwhile, your papacy praise towards

889
01:05:25,760 --> 01:05:29,960
Mecca in the mosques, and you larp online as a

890
01:05:30,000 --> 01:05:34,760
trad cat when your infallible, indefectible head is light years

891
01:05:34,760 --> 01:05:44,519
ahead of you into Chris lom and I open up Twitter,

892
01:05:44,639 --> 01:05:49,360
I open up TikTok, I see giant profiles of idiot

893
01:05:49,480 --> 01:05:54,199
blonde models with hundreds of thousands of followers talking about

894
01:05:54,280 --> 01:05:59,960
the lowest tier DAWA talking points. You understand it's already happening, dummies,

895
01:06:00,639 --> 01:06:05,960
You're already getting invaded. Oh it's Pasco's celebrate we cat

896
01:06:06,039 --> 01:06:09,880
well good, Celebrate, Celebrate the death of the West. Celebrate

897
01:06:10,039 --> 01:06:12,760
the end of your genetic lineage. Celebrate the end of

898
01:06:12,800 --> 01:06:18,239
your culture, and laugh and giggle all you want. Pretend

899
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:21,000
like it's not real. Pretend like there's not mosques going up.

900
01:06:21,119 --> 01:06:27,199
They just built a giant Islamic center in Florida. And

901
01:06:27,239 --> 01:06:29,079
then here's people. Oh, you could't even dead lift one

902
01:06:29,159 --> 01:06:32,880
hundred pounds, right, so I can't deadlift is your answer

903
01:06:33,000 --> 01:06:39,079
to how you're gonna stop this insane death cult sect

904
01:06:39,199 --> 01:06:43,119
of Islam invading the West. See this is why people

905
01:06:43,280 --> 01:06:48,320
like you are the reason why it's a problem. Are

906
01:06:48,400 --> 01:06:52,800
you gonna deadlift all the Muslims as they invade your

907
01:06:53,519 --> 01:06:59,800
your country, your village, your your gated community? BC is

908
01:07:00,000 --> 01:07:02,719
you're gonna be gonna deadlift to stop the Muslims? You idiot.

909
01:07:07,559 --> 01:07:10,679
They just tried to build an entire compound, a city

910
01:07:10,880 --> 01:07:12,280
village compound in Texas.

911
01:07:13,679 --> 01:07:17,679
Speaker 8: There ain't no, there aren't no Muslims in burden. What

912
01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:32,760
an idiot he wants to debate everybody? Just wait, just wait, no, no,

913
01:07:33,320 --> 01:07:36,079
I'm not talking about I know about Texas. They just

914
01:07:36,159 --> 01:07:40,239
built a separate center in Florida. They built a giant

915
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:42,280
separate Islamic center in Florida.

916
01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:46,480
Speaker 6: Who the Muslims are gonna clip this? Why is he

917
01:07:46,599 --> 01:07:48,719
talking like this? Because you need a reality check?

918
01:07:48,800 --> 01:07:48,920
Speaker 5: Man?

919
01:07:55,719 --> 01:07:58,079
Speaker 6: Who are the top people out here debating the Muslims?

920
01:07:58,440 --> 01:07:58,480
Speaker 5: Me?

921
01:07:59,760 --> 01:08:16,439
Speaker 6: I'm un fortunately Sam Shaloon, David would ap Bob Orthodox,

922
01:08:16,479 --> 01:08:28,720
Shahada Lewis, and Kai almost nobody like it's weird too

923
01:08:28,800 --> 01:08:31,319
because so many of like the like I would say

924
01:08:31,319 --> 01:08:36,039
half the Orthodox clergy and world. They tolerate what I

925
01:08:36,159 --> 01:08:39,520
do even though they hate it because they don't control

926
01:08:39,600 --> 01:08:42,399
what I say. They don't control you know, what I

927
01:08:42,840 --> 01:08:48,600
think or whatever. Oh yeah, God logic, and Christian Prince

928
01:08:48,680 --> 01:08:51,079
is I mean, Christian Prince is worthless. He might as

929
01:08:51,079 --> 01:08:52,760
well just not even because all he does is lead

930
01:08:52,800 --> 01:08:57,279
people into something just as stupid as as long his

931
01:08:57,399 --> 01:09:00,680
ad Iq cult is just as just as dumb. So

932
01:09:00,880 --> 01:09:14,159
let's be honest here and look at uh, look at England.

933
01:09:15,239 --> 01:09:18,520
Basically England is already Muslim. So you want to see

934
01:09:18,520 --> 01:09:23,319
your future, look at England. That's your future, bro, I

935
01:09:23,439 --> 01:09:33,119
said Ap, I said David Wood, ap Bob Avery. So

936
01:09:33,399 --> 01:09:38,520
like hardly there's herd. There's not that many people. Yes,

937
01:09:38,680 --> 01:09:42,159
Andrew did a debate as well, so I'm not intentionally

938
01:09:42,239 --> 01:09:46,479
leaving people out. I'm just thinking about the standard, you know,

939
01:09:46,600 --> 01:09:52,279
Muslim debater people out there, and half of the so

940
01:09:52,439 --> 01:09:56,479
called Orthodox world thinks that debating is mean and evil.

941
01:09:57,399 --> 01:09:59,960
And I'm just sitting here saying, I mean, enjoy your

942
01:10:00,520 --> 01:10:02,880
Muslim overlords. I mean, that's what you want. You want

943
01:10:02,960 --> 01:10:07,520
to be under a bunch of weirdo, insane death gould people.

944
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:12,000
You're gonna get it. You're gonna get it. You will

945
01:10:12,039 --> 01:10:17,119
get what you want. And you want to act like

946
01:10:17,279 --> 01:10:19,840
this is Christianity. You want to be like this is

947
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:23,520
something authentic. All this acting like a bunch of idiots

948
01:10:23,560 --> 01:10:29,319
and kidner gardeners flopping around yapping, acting like teenagers and

949
01:10:29,479 --> 01:10:34,680
twelve year olds at a sleepover. You're ripe for conquering.

950
01:10:35,680 --> 01:10:38,119
By the way, I said this exact same thing six

951
01:10:38,239 --> 01:10:40,359
years ago when I debated my first Muslim. The first

952
01:10:40,439 --> 01:10:43,199
Muslim I debated was Paul Williams. Now, there was a

953
01:10:43,800 --> 01:10:48,000
previous conversation with the Zomba for one of the Dobbel guys,

954
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:51,000
but it wasn't a formal debate. The first formal debate

955
01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:55,640
was Paul Williams. And I said, right before I did

956
01:10:55,640 --> 01:11:00,359
the Paul Williams debate, that Western so called Christiana Kuckianity

957
01:11:00,600 --> 01:11:03,239
is ripe for conquer and they're going to be conquered.

958
01:11:04,439 --> 01:11:07,319
And the Muslims clipped me about that because they thought

959
01:11:07,319 --> 01:11:08,880
it was some kind of own when I'm just trying

960
01:11:08,920 --> 01:11:11,840
to warn people about what's happening here. We are what

961
01:11:12,399 --> 01:11:17,039
from twenty eighteen, seventeen eighteen to twenty twenty five, seven

962
01:11:17,119 --> 01:11:23,039
years later, we have mosques going up in Indian reservations.

963
01:11:23,199 --> 01:11:27,039
In America, we have giant Islamic center being built in Florida.

964
01:11:28,399 --> 01:11:31,199
They had tried to build a giant Islamic city in Texas.

965
01:11:35,039 --> 01:11:39,840
And people are still acting like Jesus doesn't want you debating.

966
01:11:39,920 --> 01:11:43,600
I mean, it's like, do you understand you get what

967
01:11:43,800 --> 01:11:47,560
you deserve when you're that dumb and you're that naive.

968
01:11:49,239 --> 01:11:52,840
And even I was naive ten years ago about the

969
01:11:52,960 --> 01:11:55,279
real nature of Islam. I never thought it made any sense,

970
01:11:55,399 --> 01:11:57,680
never believed it. I didn't realize it was as dumb

971
01:11:57,680 --> 01:11:59,920
and crazy as it actually is. That's when I still

972
01:12:00,119 --> 01:12:02,600
he is long right. I started looking into it twenty

973
01:12:02,640 --> 01:12:06,319
seventeen eighteen, and here we are now. I have a

974
01:12:06,359 --> 01:12:08,359
good grasp on it. I don't know everything about it.

975
01:12:08,399 --> 01:12:12,079
I don't have to. It's an insane death goult. But

976
01:12:13,239 --> 01:12:19,239
you weak evangelicals and Southodox and Normy docs and Amerdox

977
01:12:19,960 --> 01:12:25,760
and all the rest of you charismatic skittles wisses who

978
01:12:25,840 --> 01:12:29,680
can't even handle a debate, How are you going to

979
01:12:29,760 --> 01:12:42,880
handle sharia law? Oh you're going to cower immediately, and

980
01:12:43,000 --> 01:12:47,399
you can celebrate the resurrection because we know Christ has

981
01:12:47,479 --> 01:12:53,760
already won, but that hasn't in time manifested entirely yet,

982
01:12:53,840 --> 01:12:57,640
has it. There's still a warfare, there's still battle going

983
01:12:57,680 --> 01:13:01,520
on until the second I'd been and that might be

984
01:13:01,560 --> 01:13:03,239
one hundred years, that might be two hundred years, that

985
01:13:03,239 --> 01:13:09,880
maybe five hundred years. And it's only going to take

986
01:13:09,960 --> 01:13:15,199
ten to fifteen years if this continues for your children

987
01:13:15,279 --> 01:13:18,720
to be under the Islamic yoke. And that's what you deserve,

988
01:13:19,600 --> 01:13:23,520
all of you cowards and you scumbacks. And many of

989
01:13:23,560 --> 01:13:25,600
you are cowards and scumbacks. I'm talking about other people

990
01:13:25,600 --> 01:13:29,319
who whine and bitch about debating being bad and who

991
01:13:29,960 --> 01:13:34,920
act like they're so morally superior. You will be under

992
01:13:35,079 --> 01:13:38,960
a yoke that you chose because you are weak, empathetic

993
01:13:39,039 --> 01:13:45,319
and a coward. And this is what you think is

994
01:13:45,399 --> 01:14:05,239
going to stand up against that? All right, you're getting

995
01:14:05,239 --> 01:14:09,439
on my nerves because you use that stupid hoss emoji

996
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:20,399
for the last hour. What's your point? Go ahead, I'm mute, hey,

997
01:14:20,520 --> 01:14:21,119
j what's up?

998
01:14:21,199 --> 01:14:21,359
Speaker 5: Man?

999
01:14:22,840 --> 01:14:23,279
Speaker 6: You tell me?

1000
01:14:24,920 --> 01:14:29,840
Speaker 9: Well, first of all, I'm evangelical, nondy nam and everything

1001
01:14:29,920 --> 01:14:31,159
he said is completely right.

1002
01:14:33,159 --> 01:14:37,079
Speaker 6: Okay, Well, if everything I says right, then why are

1003
01:14:37,079 --> 01:14:38,680
you Evangelical. No, then I'm a nation once.

1004
01:14:40,039 --> 01:14:41,479
Speaker 5: No, regarding Islam's tough.

1005
01:14:41,520 --> 01:14:45,600
Speaker 6: It's mostly orthodogs online who like hate Jews and they

1006
01:14:45,720 --> 01:14:46,720
like love Muslims.

1007
01:14:47,199 --> 01:14:48,640
Speaker 2: They're like ally with Muslims.

1008
01:14:48,640 --> 01:14:52,159
Speaker 6: I notice I've never seen an Orthodox person online ally

1009
01:14:52,239 --> 01:14:55,520
with a Muslim. I've never seen that.

1010
01:14:57,439 --> 01:14:59,439
Speaker 5: They're always like defending muslim No.

1011
01:14:59,479 --> 01:15:02,640
Speaker 6: They're not. Now you're lying of where ever where there

1012
01:15:02,920 --> 01:15:06,359
are you talking about? Hold On? Defending Palestine is not

1013
01:15:06,560 --> 01:15:14,159
necessarily equivalent of defending Muslims. It is, No, it isn't.

1014
01:15:14,520 --> 01:15:16,560
Do you know that there's Orthodox Christians in Telson?

1015
01:15:17,399 --> 01:15:17,439
Speaker 5: Like?

1016
01:15:21,880 --> 01:15:22,560
Speaker 6: Is that funny to you?

1017
01:15:22,720 --> 01:15:22,760
Speaker 5: That?

1018
01:15:22,840 --> 01:15:25,000
Speaker 6: So it's funny to you when Orthodox Christians get their

1019
01:15:25,079 --> 01:15:26,680
churches bombed, that's funny.

1020
01:15:27,439 --> 01:15:29,079
Speaker 5: So you blame Israels.

1021
01:15:29,800 --> 01:15:32,319
Speaker 6: Yeah, I blame Israel for bombing Orthodox churches like they

1022
01:15:32,439 --> 01:15:32,720
just did.

1023
01:15:34,159 --> 01:15:37,239
Speaker 9: Are you saying because Hajumusk literally uses a nearby building

1024
01:15:37,520 --> 01:15:38,840
as a freaking terrorist thing?

1025
01:15:38,920 --> 01:15:46,359
Speaker 6: No, no, no, no, a separate event the church was bombed. No, no, no,

1026
01:15:46,520 --> 01:15:49,319
You're just a scumbag man. You're trash bro. Get out

1027
01:15:49,319 --> 01:15:54,760
of here. You're a I'm a joke, right, Yeah, Evangelicals

1028
01:15:54,760 --> 01:16:01,880
are just the worst man. Daniel on you this, he

1029
01:16:02,079 --> 01:16:04,359
just comes in line. There's I've never seen an Orthodox

1030
01:16:04,399 --> 01:16:09,039
person defending Muslims. That's ridiculous. If he's talking about the

1031
01:16:09,119 --> 01:16:13,159
people groups getting that's not defending Islam. Idiot, what's up?

1032
01:16:14,600 --> 01:16:17,600
Speaker 9: Yeah, so I come from a Calvinist kind of background,

1033
01:16:17,640 --> 01:16:18,840
and you know, I got.

1034
01:16:20,600 --> 01:16:22,840
Speaker 10: You know, caught up in the whole dialectic thing and

1035
01:16:23,000 --> 01:16:24,239
you know, faith and works and things like that.

1036
01:16:24,279 --> 01:16:26,279
Speaker 5: I had a couple of questions, if you don't mind, okay,

1037
01:16:28,119 --> 01:16:29,079
So do you think like this.

1038
01:16:29,199 --> 01:16:32,439
Speaker 10: Kind of paradigm was like trying to separate you from

1039
01:16:32,800 --> 01:16:35,680
like what you do can like triple down to other things.

1040
01:16:35,760 --> 01:16:38,279
Speaker 5: Like you know, some people say like I want to

1041
01:16:38,399 --> 01:16:40,479
like you for you and not like what you do

1042
01:16:40,640 --> 01:16:43,520
for me. But I'm starting to think, like, then what

1043
01:16:43,720 --> 01:16:45,720
you do for me like the same thing as who

1044
01:16:45,800 --> 01:16:47,520
you are, you know, that type of thing.

1045
01:16:47,960 --> 01:16:53,199
Speaker 6: I mean, you're not identical to your works right right, right,

1046
01:16:53,359 --> 01:16:55,840
but the works reflect what's in you.

1047
01:16:56,119 --> 01:17:00,319
Speaker 10: So right, Yeah, So it just doesn't even make sense

1048
01:17:00,479 --> 01:17:02,239
to even separate the two, is what I'm trying to

1049
01:17:02,239 --> 01:17:06,079
get that, right, And that's pretty much the orthodosic you Well.

1050
01:17:06,079 --> 01:17:07,800
Speaker 6: You said, if you love me, you'll keep my commandments.

1051
01:17:08,000 --> 01:17:14,920
So yeah, Berg, by the way, it's open for him

1052
01:17:14,920 --> 01:17:16,479
if you want to call in. Now is the time

1053
01:17:16,560 --> 01:17:18,840
to call in. I'll give you, guys the link here

1054
01:17:19,039 --> 01:17:20,560
for the X space in the chat.

1055
01:17:24,920 --> 01:17:29,640
Speaker 5: And that's pretty much the So what hello, can.

1056
01:17:31,520 --> 01:17:37,920
Speaker 9: I'm calling thembout Christ has risen orthodox truly, Mike, I'm

1057
01:17:37,960 --> 01:17:39,239
calling on behalf of my Like.

1058
01:17:40,079 --> 01:17:43,359
Speaker 5: What's it called? Like Pentecostal friends? I think the biggest

1059
01:17:43,439 --> 01:17:45,800
is show is like conveying ecclesiology to them, because I

1060
01:17:46,000 --> 01:17:49,199
just take the parts and the crazylogy. What would you

1061
01:17:49,359 --> 01:17:54,199
suggest to convey that to them? Uh?

1062
01:17:54,399 --> 01:17:57,079
Speaker 6: Well, I mean Paul in the New Testament says that

1063
01:17:57,239 --> 01:18:01,399
there's a historic laying on his hands that is Apostolic succession.

1064
01:18:02,359 --> 01:18:08,039
It's not Pentecostal preachers laying on hands. It's from Paul

1065
01:18:08,239 --> 01:18:13,840
to Timothy to Timothy's descendants. Okay, So the very thing

1066
01:18:13,920 --> 01:18:20,279
that they think is like charismatic gifts being given by

1067
01:18:20,319 --> 01:18:23,880
the laying on of hands is Apostolic succession. It's the

1068
01:18:24,000 --> 01:18:27,319
very thing like that refutes them, right, because in the

1069
01:18:27,359 --> 01:18:30,399
Book of Numbers numbers eleven, when when Moses does that,

1070
01:18:31,039 --> 01:18:37,000
it's establishing an authority, and Paul is mirroring that in

1071
01:18:37,119 --> 01:18:41,119
what he does. Ye oh yeah, So I.

1072
01:18:41,079 --> 01:18:44,960
Speaker 11: Had a question about evangelical say that divine commentd theory

1073
01:18:45,159 --> 01:18:48,439
solves the Islk distinction or the problem is would that

1074
01:18:48,560 --> 01:18:51,039
be accurate or is there another way.

1075
01:18:50,960 --> 01:18:51,399
Speaker 5: To solve it?

1076
01:18:53,840 --> 01:18:58,000
Speaker 6: The is ought problem is a problem for UH empiricists,

1077
01:18:58,359 --> 01:19:01,039
So it doesn't really have something to do with Theism

1078
01:19:01,439 --> 01:19:05,439
or Christianity or whatever. It's only a problem if you

1079
01:19:05,520 --> 01:19:10,279
believe in everything being madder or if you're a strict materialist.

1080
01:19:11,680 --> 01:19:12,439
Speaker 5: All right, thanks.

1081
01:19:19,199 --> 01:19:30,520
Speaker 6: Lajakonda. So people in the chat, we got a pretty lively,

1082
01:19:31,920 --> 01:19:36,039
feisty chat over here on YouTube. It's not for you

1083
01:19:36,159 --> 01:19:39,880
to yap and spam and preach. You either call in

1084
01:19:40,279 --> 01:19:42,960
or we're not interested. So there's the link to call

1085
01:19:43,039 --> 01:19:46,920
in and you can call in there. Otherwise we're not

1086
01:19:47,039 --> 01:19:49,760
interested in your preaching in the chat. What's up, man,

1087
01:19:50,319 --> 01:20:06,159
I'm mute, Lajiaconda, unmute. Okay, don't let me Let's move on.

1088
01:20:06,840 --> 01:20:10,399
Are you there? Hello?

1089
01:20:11,439 --> 01:20:11,680
Speaker 4: Hello?

1090
01:20:13,159 --> 01:20:13,680
Speaker 5: Are you there?

1091
01:20:14,680 --> 01:20:15,199
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm here.

1092
01:20:15,760 --> 01:20:17,239
Speaker 6: I can barely hear you. What's on your mind?

1093
01:20:18,119 --> 01:20:19,239
Speaker 4: Oh you.

1094
01:20:22,079 --> 01:20:22,359
Speaker 5: Don't know?

1095
01:20:22,479 --> 01:20:24,920
Speaker 4: I can you hear me? My microphone should be working,

1096
01:20:25,039 --> 01:20:27,199
but I just I just calling in. I went through

1097
01:20:27,239 --> 01:20:30,399
your page. I was looking for any maybe videos that

1098
01:20:30,479 --> 01:20:33,279
you have on Easter. I just want to know what

1099
01:20:33,720 --> 01:20:34,560
what is it Easter?

1100
01:20:35,640 --> 01:20:40,279
Speaker 6: What is an Easters is Pasca and the Orthodox Church

1101
01:20:40,399 --> 01:20:45,119
is called Pasca, which is passover. Christ is our passover, Pasca.

1102
01:20:45,359 --> 01:20:48,680
That's the Greek word for Passover. The Jewish Passover we

1103
01:20:48,840 --> 01:20:51,319
believe is fulfilled in our Pasco.

1104
01:20:54,159 --> 01:20:57,079
Speaker 4: Right, But where is this word Easter coming from where?

1105
01:20:58,079 --> 01:21:01,239
Speaker 6: That's a Germanic term that's used in the six or

1106
01:21:01,279 --> 01:21:06,079
seven hundreds for that time of the year in amongst

1107
01:21:06,119 --> 01:21:09,640
Germanic tribes. So it has nothing to do with Ishtar,

1108
01:21:09,920 --> 01:21:13,319
has nothing to do with goddess worship. In the Orthodox Church.

1109
01:21:13,399 --> 01:21:15,960
And then the Church Fathers is called Pasca, which is

1110
01:21:16,039 --> 01:21:17,800
the Greek word for Passover.

1111
01:21:18,479 --> 01:21:21,479
Speaker 4: Okay, So you're saying Orthodox they sell it. They don't

1112
01:21:22,039 --> 01:21:24,199
recognize Easter, they recognize past.

1113
01:21:24,359 --> 01:21:28,199
Speaker 6: It's the same thing what people in the West call Easter,

1114
01:21:28,840 --> 01:21:32,159
which is the Germanic term for that time of the year,

1115
01:21:32,439 --> 01:21:35,720
has nothing to do with Ishtar. It's Ostara, which is

1116
01:21:35,760 --> 01:21:40,239
that period in the in the season they call Easter,

1117
01:21:40,960 --> 01:21:44,520
is the same thing that we call Passover or Pasca.

1118
01:21:46,279 --> 01:21:51,359
Speaker 4: Okay, I would disagree that it doesn't have anything to

1119
01:21:51,479 --> 01:21:54,039
do with estorte or well, you.

1120
01:21:54,079 --> 01:21:56,600
Speaker 6: Can look up the meaning of the word and its

1121
01:21:56,640 --> 01:21:58,439
origin and it will show you that has nothing to

1122
01:21:58,560 --> 01:22:00,760
do with ishtar or astart.

1123
01:22:01,680 --> 01:22:03,880
Speaker 4: I mean, I did look it up, and it does

1124
01:22:04,399 --> 01:22:08,960
have a correlation to a starte or a goddess of fortunity.

1125
01:22:09,159 --> 01:22:11,039
Speaker 6: Do you know what the word concept fallacy is?

1126
01:22:13,039 --> 01:22:13,520
Speaker 5: I don't know.

1127
01:22:13,640 --> 01:22:15,800
Speaker 4: I just went by the definition of the word and

1128
01:22:16,000 --> 01:22:17,800
it says that it has that meaning.

1129
01:22:19,199 --> 01:22:24,319
Speaker 6: So if I use the word January, okay, and if

1130
01:22:24,399 --> 01:22:27,319
I recall this refers to a time period in the

1131
01:22:27,439 --> 01:22:30,439
Roman back in the Roman pagan world, they believed in

1132
01:22:30,520 --> 01:22:34,520
the goddess of the god Janus. Okay. If I use

1133
01:22:34,600 --> 01:22:38,439
the term January to delineate a time of the year,

1134
01:22:38,960 --> 01:22:41,159
does that mean that I'm worshiping Janus?

1135
01:22:45,239 --> 01:22:45,279
Speaker 5: No?

1136
01:22:45,600 --> 01:22:49,640
Speaker 4: But if we have if we're we have like a

1137
01:22:49,840 --> 01:22:53,880
separate like if Christians have their own kind of like

1138
01:22:54,039 --> 01:23:00,520
separate thing and they can put names on things that

1139
01:23:00,640 --> 01:23:04,000
they want to call it, then why would they choose

1140
01:23:04,760 --> 01:23:06,479
a name associated with So.

1141
01:23:06,680 --> 01:23:11,560
Speaker 6: When Germanic tribes I'm explaining it to you, just like

1142
01:23:11,720 --> 01:23:15,600
we still use the term January, it doesn't necessitate worshiping

1143
01:23:15,720 --> 01:23:19,479
the god Janus. It's just a name for a time period.

1144
01:23:19,520 --> 01:23:23,119
It no longer has the connotation of a deity, and

1145
01:23:23,199 --> 01:23:27,319
we still use the term January. So likewise, because a

1146
01:23:27,439 --> 01:23:33,000
Germanic tribe called this time period astare and they linked

1147
01:23:33,039 --> 01:23:36,880
it not to ishtar ishtar is a Mesopotamian goddess, has

1148
01:23:36,880 --> 01:23:40,359
nothing to do with Germanic tribes, because they did have

1149
01:23:40,520 --> 01:23:45,239
a pagan idea of you know, the spring relating to

1150
01:23:45,840 --> 01:23:47,279
regenerative rebirth.

1151
01:23:47,760 --> 01:23:50,359
Speaker 4: Well, we're not talking I'm sorry sinterrupt, but we're not

1152
01:23:50,520 --> 01:23:54,239
talking about the German time period. We're talking about a Christians.

1153
01:23:54,319 --> 01:23:57,159
Speaker 6: But we are talking about it because that's the origin

1154
01:23:57,319 --> 01:24:00,560
of the word. And so when the Germanic tribe, when

1155
01:24:00,600 --> 01:24:04,239
you stop, I mean, look, man, this is so hard

1156
01:24:04,319 --> 01:24:09,960
to talk to people who can't understand a basic grammatical distinction. Again,

1157
01:24:10,920 --> 01:24:15,960
because a German tribe calls a time period a stare

1158
01:24:17,159 --> 01:24:21,920
and it marks out a season spring. Okay, when they

1159
01:24:22,000 --> 01:24:26,800
get Christianized, if they keep using the word even though

1160
01:24:26,840 --> 01:24:31,680
it's referring to Easter, the word no longer signifies or

1161
01:24:31,800 --> 01:24:36,840
means the pagan deity, just like the word January no

1162
01:24:37,039 --> 01:24:40,399
longer means the god Janus. It's very simple.

1163
01:24:42,760 --> 01:24:46,199
Speaker 4: I just I don't agree with saying that the Germanic

1164
01:24:46,359 --> 01:24:49,600
people because we're not talking about the Germanic people. We're

1165
01:24:49,640 --> 01:24:50,600
talking about the church.

1166
01:24:50,920 --> 01:24:53,399
Speaker 6: Okay, so I'm sorry, but I don't think that you

1167
01:24:53,560 --> 01:24:57,199
have the mental capabilities to understand that the term or star.

1168
01:24:57,680 --> 01:24:59,800
Where do you think the term ostari comes from?

1169
01:25:02,479 --> 01:25:05,640
Speaker 4: I mean, I understand that it has some Germanic origin.

1170
01:25:05,800 --> 01:25:08,720
It says perhaps it's related to the word astarte, name

1171
01:25:08,800 --> 01:25:09,319
of the goddess.

1172
01:25:09,840 --> 01:25:13,680
Speaker 6: It is not Astarte. It is the Germanic tribe's word

1173
01:25:13,960 --> 01:25:17,960
for the time period. It has nothing to do with Astarte,

1174
01:25:18,520 --> 01:25:20,239
nor does have anything to do with Ishtar. Those are

1175
01:25:20,279 --> 01:25:22,960
ancient Mesopotamian goddesses.

1176
01:25:24,239 --> 01:25:27,159
Speaker 4: Chill, I get what you're saying.

1177
01:25:27,239 --> 01:25:30,039
Speaker 6: No, you don't. You you fundamentally are not understanding what

1178
01:25:30,159 --> 01:25:30,520
I'm saying.

1179
01:25:31,319 --> 01:25:35,680
Speaker 4: Okay, I guess we don't. Don't. I don't agree, but

1180
01:25:35,800 --> 01:25:37,000
I don't I understand it.

1181
01:25:37,359 --> 01:25:41,000
Speaker 6: You don't understand I do. I understand it's a Germanic word,

1182
01:25:41,159 --> 01:25:44,119
So what does it have to do with what does

1183
01:25:44,239 --> 01:25:46,960
Oh my gosh, do you remember the first thing I

1184
01:25:47,039 --> 01:25:47,479
said to you?

1185
01:25:48,119 --> 01:25:49,319
Speaker 4: Resurrection Sunday?

1186
01:25:49,479 --> 01:25:52,159
Speaker 6: I don't gosh, it's like the stupidity is just I

1187
01:25:52,239 --> 01:25:56,359
can't even like that. The word is not the same

1188
01:25:56,399 --> 01:25:59,760
thing as the concept. That's what a word concept fallacy is.

1189
01:26:01,079 --> 01:26:04,840
Are you worshiping Janice? And when you write, when you

1190
01:26:04,920 --> 01:26:07,159
write the word January out on a check, are you

1191
01:26:07,239 --> 01:26:08,640
worshiping Janis?

1192
01:26:11,199 --> 01:26:14,439
Speaker 4: No, I'm not. No, I'm not. But if I have

1193
01:26:14,640 --> 01:26:17,640
my own special group, right and I and I want

1194
01:26:17,760 --> 01:26:22,279
to honor my beliefs, why would I use a word

1195
01:26:22,920 --> 01:26:26,279
that I know has connections to paganism?

1196
01:26:27,520 --> 01:26:30,520
Speaker 6: I mean, this is just I can't even the word

1197
01:26:30,960 --> 01:26:33,399
no longer has the connection? And language is that.

1198
01:26:33,479 --> 01:26:40,840
Speaker 4: Way I language? Are you trolling me right now?

1199
01:26:41,359 --> 01:26:45,239
Speaker 6: I mean you're just too fundamentally on a You just

1200
01:26:45,279 --> 01:26:46,520
cannot understand the point.

1201
01:26:47,960 --> 01:26:51,600
Speaker 4: You can't understand the point. No, j are kidding. Okay,

1202
01:26:52,119 --> 01:26:53,239
I'm just gonna go there.

1203
01:26:53,479 --> 01:26:55,680
Speaker 6: Let me ask you this. Maybe this will help. Can

1204
01:26:55,720 --> 01:26:59,279
you can you restate let's talk about this again, so

1205
01:26:59,560 --> 01:27:02,039
you're not you're just not able to understand a word

1206
01:27:02,119 --> 01:27:04,960
concept fallacy? Can you restate what I'm arguing for me,

1207
01:27:05,199 --> 01:27:06,600
even though you don't agree with it? Can you just

1208
01:27:06,680 --> 01:27:08,239
restate what you think my argument is?

1209
01:27:08,720 --> 01:27:11,520
Speaker 4: I think I already restated. You said that the word

1210
01:27:12,000 --> 01:27:16,000
even though it has Germanic origin, it has a definition.

1211
01:27:17,239 --> 01:27:18,119
It doesn't mean that.

1212
01:27:20,800 --> 01:27:23,039
Speaker 6: Do you think a word can Let's stop. Let's about

1213
01:27:23,039 --> 01:27:27,359
the word kid. Okay, the word kid is that a

1214
01:27:27,560 --> 01:27:28,720
child or a goat?

1215
01:27:31,560 --> 01:27:34,319
Speaker 4: I mean it's depending on the context.

1216
01:27:34,000 --> 01:27:37,439
Speaker 6: Exactly, So a word can have different reference. That's the

1217
01:27:37,960 --> 01:27:42,520
word concept fallacy problem. So the word itself doesn't necessitate

1218
01:27:42,560 --> 01:27:46,199
there's no necessary connection between that word and a goddess

1219
01:27:46,319 --> 01:27:51,199
or a demon. Do you understand because the word January

1220
01:27:51,479 --> 01:27:55,039
no longer means genus, it's.

1221
01:27:54,840 --> 01:27:57,600
Speaker 4: Still it still means, it still means genus.

1222
01:27:59,720 --> 01:28:03,239
Speaker 6: It does not mean that for us nowadays, nobody, nobody

1223
01:28:03,359 --> 01:28:06,680
believes that the god Janice is honored when we write

1224
01:28:06,720 --> 01:28:09,960
out our checks in January. My birthday is in January.

1225
01:28:11,319 --> 01:28:14,039
Still be Oh my gosh, this is just too stupid.

1226
01:28:14,159 --> 01:28:19,079
I can't you just literally cannot grasp something that's about

1227
01:28:19,720 --> 01:28:21,760
I think you need about a one hundred IQ at

1228
01:28:21,840 --> 01:28:33,960
least to understand this. Dell, Hello, yep, hey.

1229
01:28:34,039 --> 01:28:34,760
Speaker 5: Thanks for having me.

1230
01:28:36,039 --> 01:28:40,439
Speaker 12: I just wanted to the evangelical that came on made

1231
01:28:40,479 --> 01:28:44,239
me want to speak because I've been currently delving into

1232
01:28:44,520 --> 01:28:47,399
some things and trying to come to understand, and I

1233
01:28:47,520 --> 01:28:50,239
still have to do a lot of searching and researching,

1234
01:28:50,760 --> 01:28:54,600
but I've been learning a lot about Protestantism and you know,

1235
01:28:54,720 --> 01:28:57,680
what I was taught growing up, and the more I

1236
01:28:57,760 --> 01:29:00,319
look into it, the more I look into you know,

1237
01:29:00,560 --> 01:29:04,359
Martin Luther and what he used for his sources, and

1238
01:29:04,479 --> 01:29:07,720
then the removal of the apocrypha from the sixteen to

1239
01:29:07,720 --> 01:29:12,880
eleven King James version, just time after time within the

1240
01:29:12,960 --> 01:29:18,680
Protestant Reformation, including all these denominations and where their belue

1241
01:29:18,760 --> 01:29:19,640
systems come from.

1242
01:29:20,079 --> 01:29:23,000
Speaker 5: A lot of it keeps going back to Judaism.

1243
01:29:23,640 --> 01:29:27,760
Speaker 12: And you know, I don't have all the answers on this,

1244
01:29:27,840 --> 01:29:29,840
and I'm still trying to learn, but I know.

1245
01:29:29,920 --> 01:29:34,119
Speaker 6: All the all the classical reformers are under some sort

1246
01:29:34,159 --> 01:29:35,680
of Judaizing influence tos on degree.

1247
01:29:35,760 --> 01:29:36,279
Speaker 5: Yes, so.

1248
01:29:38,880 --> 01:29:41,960
Speaker 6: Yeah, so you know I'm not, for example, we're supposed

1249
01:29:41,960 --> 01:29:44,039
to just go with We're just supposed to just go

1250
01:29:44,119 --> 01:29:50,720
with masoretic text that rabbinic authorities that reject Jesus said,

1251
01:29:51,079 --> 01:29:54,119
like why says who? It's all premise and they're not

1252
01:29:54,159 --> 01:29:56,079
actually being a church with authority. Oh you just do

1253
01:29:56,199 --> 01:29:59,039
what the Jews said. Do you have a question let's

1254
01:29:59,079 --> 01:30:01,920
get let's get through this way. What's your topic or

1255
01:30:02,000 --> 01:30:02,520
question or what.

1256
01:30:04,239 --> 01:30:06,399
Speaker 12: Well, what's a good way that I can debate with

1257
01:30:06,560 --> 01:30:11,000
these people, especially since you know, they believe in soul

1258
01:30:11,079 --> 01:30:14,600
scriptura and they believe that it's really more of a

1259
01:30:14,720 --> 01:30:18,279
feeling than like, you know, man's tradition or the ways

1260
01:30:18,319 --> 01:30:20,439
of man, you know, to refute this stuff and to

1261
01:30:20,600 --> 01:30:23,800
argue this stuff, I just don't really have enough good sources.

1262
01:30:24,199 --> 01:30:26,239
Speaker 6: Well, I would say, go watch my talks on the

1263
01:30:26,319 --> 01:30:28,720
formation of the Biblical canon, and that will help arm

1264
01:30:28,800 --> 01:30:35,760
you with that information. Tristan. Unfortunately, no, not that, Tristan.

1265
01:30:37,000 --> 01:30:42,359
Notice here pretty common knowledge. January is the month named

1266
01:30:42,359 --> 01:30:45,960
after Janus, the god of beginnings and transitions, the two

1267
01:30:46,039 --> 01:30:49,439
face god. So I guess every time that we I

1268
01:30:49,479 --> 01:30:52,039
don't know, my birthday is in January. So I guess

1269
01:30:52,720 --> 01:30:58,119
because my birthday is in January, I am in inextricably

1270
01:30:58,239 --> 01:31:02,840
bound up with worship of the god Jenus. So everybody

1271
01:31:03,000 --> 01:31:08,720
riding out January, you're a two faced a Janice worshiper.

1272
01:31:08,800 --> 01:31:11,199
This is how silly this is. This is so I mean,

1273
01:31:11,880 --> 01:31:17,039
I'm trying really hard to be patient with explaining grammar.

1274
01:31:17,640 --> 01:31:21,079
This is how grammar works, guys. It's not that difficult

1275
01:31:21,279 --> 01:31:24,079
if you stop and think about it. Okay, the word

1276
01:31:24,239 --> 01:31:32,760
kid doesn't have one reference. The word January. Back in

1277
01:31:33,000 --> 01:31:39,159
the Roman time, the Roman calendar right was in honor

1278
01:31:39,319 --> 01:31:52,439
of a deity Janus. Nobody in the world today believes, conceives, cares,

1279
01:31:53,159 --> 01:31:57,479
or thinks that the month January is in any way

1280
01:31:57,520 --> 01:32:00,560
connected to the god iss Jenus. It does doesn't matter

1281
01:32:00,760 --> 01:32:04,840
anymore that it was Janus at one time. So likewise,

1282
01:32:05,079 --> 01:32:09,000
if a Germanic tribe considers a time period in the

1283
01:32:09,119 --> 01:32:17,159
year Ostare or springtime when they're Christianized and they become

1284
01:32:17,279 --> 01:32:24,560
Christians and they celebrate Easter or Passover, the word Easter

1285
01:32:25,479 --> 01:32:29,439
no longer has the deity connotation anymore. It has changed

1286
01:32:29,560 --> 01:32:32,840
in its meaning because words evolve and change. There's flexibility

1287
01:32:32,880 --> 01:32:37,479
in language. All very low iq stupid people, and this

1288
01:32:37,640 --> 01:32:41,239
is not me, this is Saint Basil. Basil says, dumb

1289
01:32:41,359 --> 01:32:45,680
people believe that words only have a single reference, and

1290
01:32:45,800 --> 01:32:52,880
they can't understand flexibility and nuance and polyvalence multiple meanings.

1291
01:32:54,199 --> 01:32:57,319
And she even understood that the context can change the

1292
01:32:57,399 --> 01:33:02,399
meaning exactly. The context of today is not first century Rome,

1293
01:33:03,760 --> 01:33:06,600
where it would have necessarily been connected to the worship

1294
01:33:06,680 --> 01:33:12,680
of the god Janus. Nowadays, nobody believes that the context

1295
01:33:12,760 --> 01:33:17,640
has changed the meaning of the word January, which nobody

1296
01:33:17,720 --> 01:33:21,159
thinks about jenis It is irrelevant. The meaning has changed

1297
01:33:23,439 --> 01:33:26,880
and for some reason, I don't exactly.

1298
01:33:26,560 --> 01:33:27,239
Speaker 5: Know what it is.

1299
01:33:27,399 --> 01:33:29,479
Speaker 6: And I'm not meaning to be mean or pick on people.

1300
01:33:29,960 --> 01:33:35,600
There's something about words and language that not intelligent people

1301
01:33:36,520 --> 01:33:38,960
cannot figure out. It's like it mystifies them. They can't

1302
01:33:38,960 --> 01:33:42,560
figure it out. It's like whoa what They cannot conceive

1303
01:33:43,680 --> 01:33:47,520
of flexibility in language or that a word refers to

1304
01:33:47,680 --> 01:33:52,079
different things in different systems or contexts. It's bizarre. I

1305
01:33:52,119 --> 01:33:54,840
don't know what it is or why people have a

1306
01:33:54,880 --> 01:33:58,600
hard time with this. I think that some people just

1307
01:33:58,800 --> 01:34:07,079
cannot think at multiple levels or at multiple tears. And

1308
01:34:07,279 --> 01:34:11,680
it's not even that difficult of a question. It's not

1309
01:34:11,760 --> 01:34:16,119
even metaphysics. People say, oh, it's this is hard metaphysics. No, No,

1310
01:34:16,239 --> 01:34:21,960
this is grammar, dude. Basic grammar tells you that one

1311
01:34:22,119 --> 01:34:25,880
word can mean different things at different times and even

1312
01:34:26,039 --> 01:34:31,600
over time. Twenty one percent of America reads at a

1313
01:34:31,680 --> 01:34:33,680
sixth grade level or below. In fact, I think we

1314
01:34:33,880 --> 01:34:36,560
just saw this It's in one of Basil's letters where

1315
01:34:36,600 --> 01:34:40,399
he says, not everybody should do theology. It's not for everybody.

1316
01:34:41,439 --> 01:34:43,840
And he says something defective. I'm going for memory, something

1317
01:34:43,840 --> 01:34:45,880
that I read fifteen years ago. He says something like

1318
01:34:47,439 --> 01:34:51,119
many heretics just simply mess up grammar, like they make

1319
01:34:51,159 --> 01:34:53,439
a grammar mistake. In fact, if you listen to doctor

1320
01:34:53,479 --> 01:34:56,840
Branson's talks, he talks about the Eunomians. According to Basil,

1321
01:34:58,199 --> 01:35:02,520
it's like they couldn't even make basic grammar distinctions, the

1322
01:35:02,600 --> 01:35:06,039
way that words work, how we predicate things, subject, predicate

1323
01:35:06,680 --> 01:35:10,720
one many in language. It's in one of Besil's letters.

1324
01:35:12,479 --> 01:35:14,199
I assure you it's there. I'm not making it up.

1325
01:35:15,039 --> 01:35:16,079
Go ahead, Tristan, what's up?

1326
01:35:21,359 --> 01:35:23,319
Speaker 5: Heyboddy, can you hear me? Uh huh?

1327
01:35:27,359 --> 01:35:31,319
Speaker 9: So, I guess they should start with the background for

1328
01:35:31,560 --> 01:35:32,560
my personal background.

1329
01:35:32,600 --> 01:35:34,439
Speaker 6: Okay, we don't need a whole I'm not trying to

1330
01:35:34,479 --> 01:35:36,600
be rude, but can you get to the point to

1331
01:35:36,720 --> 01:35:37,079
the question.

1332
01:35:37,159 --> 01:35:39,479
Speaker 5: We don't need a story about Pentecostalism.

1333
01:35:39,680 --> 01:35:44,600
Speaker 9: Okay, it seems to be growing at quite a fast

1334
01:35:44,720 --> 01:35:52,039
rate compared to these other charismatic like non denominational or yeah, anyway,

1335
01:35:54,239 --> 01:35:56,960
and I was just wondering, there's there's a group of

1336
01:35:57,199 --> 01:35:59,399
Oneness Pentecostals.

1337
01:36:01,159 --> 01:36:07,439
Speaker 5: That are essentially modalists, and.

1338
01:36:09,319 --> 01:36:12,479
Speaker 9: I've been born and raised in this one as Pentecostal church.

1339
01:36:13,119 --> 01:36:14,319
Speaker 5: I still attend there, but.

1340
01:36:16,520 --> 01:36:19,039
Speaker 9: I'm just trying to figure it out of is there

1341
01:36:19,119 --> 01:36:25,359
a logical fallacy with what you would consider the heresy

1342
01:36:25,399 --> 01:36:31,600
of modalism or is it just a heresy because well.

1343
01:36:32,000 --> 01:36:35,840
Speaker 6: It would depend it would depend on which person that

1344
01:36:35,960 --> 01:36:38,960
you're talking to in order to specify, like, is it

1345
01:36:39,039 --> 01:36:42,560
actually just a linguistic problem, because it could be or

1346
01:36:42,680 --> 01:36:47,439
it could actually be a specific like straight up, it

1347
01:36:47,479 --> 01:36:49,680
could be either one, and it just depends on who

1348
01:36:49,720 --> 01:36:52,600
I'm talking to. But it's pretty I mean, it should

1349
01:36:52,600 --> 01:36:55,000
be pretty clear. We've had multiple modalists call in. Like

1350
01:36:55,119 --> 01:36:58,840
if you read John fourteen, for example, Jesus says that

1351
01:37:01,399 --> 01:37:03,760
if you love me keep my commandments, I will pray

1352
01:37:03,880 --> 01:37:06,319
to the Father, and the Father will send you a

1353
01:37:06,479 --> 01:37:11,000
helper that he may abide with you forever. Okay, that's

1354
01:37:11,079 --> 01:37:18,479
clearly three persons. So a modalist would read this and say, well,

1355
01:37:18,520 --> 01:37:21,239
it may appear that way, but it's actually just Jesus

1356
01:37:21,359 --> 01:37:24,079
talking to himself about what he will do. Okay, So

1357
01:37:24,720 --> 01:37:29,479
now God's schizophrenic because all of these passages that show

1358
01:37:29,600 --> 01:37:36,439
distinction have to be reinterpreted or retooled or ignored because

1359
01:37:36,479 --> 01:37:40,479
the assumption is that, well, there's only one hypostasis. Okay.

1360
01:37:40,920 --> 01:37:43,800
So what most heresies do first and foremost is that

1361
01:37:44,039 --> 01:37:48,199
they take one verse or one assumption and they squeeze

1362
01:37:48,239 --> 01:37:50,920
everything into that. So everything must be cut off and

1363
01:37:51,039 --> 01:37:54,119
retooled and reinterpreted to fit the one verse or the

1364
01:37:54,199 --> 01:37:58,319
one presupposition that God is just one person. Where do

1365
01:37:58,439 --> 01:38:01,279
you get the idea that God is just one hypostasis?

1366
01:38:01,359 --> 01:38:04,399
So I would say, first pre subpositional critique would be,

1367
01:38:05,880 --> 01:38:08,560
there is no verse that teaches that. In fact, there

1368
01:38:08,600 --> 01:38:12,399
are dozens and dozens of verses in the Old Testament

1369
01:38:12,520 --> 01:38:16,760
that teach the triad, that teach multiplicity in God. I've

1370
01:38:16,800 --> 01:38:20,039
done lectures on the dozens of passages in the Torah

1371
01:38:20,119 --> 01:38:26,159
alone that teach the triad. So where are we getting

1372
01:38:26,239 --> 01:38:30,159
the assumption that God is only one hypostasis? Who said

1373
01:38:30,199 --> 01:38:30,560
where is this?

1374
01:38:31,439 --> 01:38:32,159
Speaker 5: Yeah? I feel like.

1375
01:38:34,039 --> 01:38:37,279
Speaker 9: I feel like there's a couple of verses.

1376
01:38:37,359 --> 01:38:39,640
Speaker 5: And you probably heard all the arguments.

1377
01:38:40,840 --> 01:38:42,800
Speaker 9: Hero Israel, the Lord of God is one is a

1378
01:38:42,920 --> 01:38:43,880
very famous one.

1379
01:38:44,479 --> 01:38:47,399
Speaker 6: Yeah, but the Old Testament. The Old Testament also explains

1380
01:38:47,479 --> 01:38:52,640
that oneness to be the shared divine nature that yahweigh,

1381
01:38:52,680 --> 01:38:56,239
his Angel and his spirit have. So again, that's just

1382
01:38:56,359 --> 01:38:59,640
picking the verse that talks about God's unity. And by

1383
01:38:59,680 --> 01:39:02,319
the way, mentioned it mentions God. It mentions three the

1384
01:39:02,840 --> 01:39:04,399
heroes or the Lord of other the Lord is one.

1385
01:39:04,479 --> 01:39:06,560
That's three, right, three and one.

1386
01:39:06,640 --> 01:39:08,199
Speaker 5: But when you see the Angel of the Lord in

1387
01:39:08,239 --> 01:39:10,800
the Old Testament, is that supposed to.

1388
01:39:10,800 --> 01:39:15,079
Speaker 6: Be Jesus or Yeah, of course Jesus himself identifies that

1389
01:39:15,159 --> 01:39:17,640
he's that he's the Angel Lord. Who do you think

1390
01:39:17,760 --> 01:39:23,000
Abraham worshiped? And he face to face with Abraham majoys

1391
01:39:23,000 --> 01:39:24,399
to see my day and saw it was glad.

1392
01:39:25,039 --> 01:39:28,800
Speaker 5: So the question is why couldn't that be? Yeah?

1393
01:39:28,880 --> 01:39:32,560
Speaker 6: Way, or no one has seen the Father at any time,

1394
01:39:32,880 --> 01:39:36,359
Jesus says in John, So how is that God the Father?

1395
01:39:36,520 --> 01:39:39,680
When God the Father has no form and no one

1396
01:39:39,760 --> 01:39:41,000
has seen the Father at any time.

1397
01:39:42,960 --> 01:39:45,960
Speaker 9: So when God picks up Moses, Sorry if I'm not

1398
01:39:46,079 --> 01:39:48,239
trying to be super argumentative, I'm just trying.

1399
01:39:48,039 --> 01:39:50,600
Speaker 5: To think, and you're helping me.

1400
01:39:50,840 --> 01:39:51,279
Speaker 6: It's fine.

1401
01:39:51,920 --> 01:39:54,239
Speaker 9: When when God picks up Moses and puts him in

1402
01:39:54,279 --> 01:39:58,600
the cleft of the rock and hides him, and you know,

1403
01:39:58,760 --> 01:39:59,800
starts walking away.

1404
01:40:00,119 --> 01:40:03,319
Speaker 5: Who who is that supposed to be? Well?

1405
01:40:03,760 --> 01:40:06,800
Speaker 6: If no one sees the Father at any time? And

1406
01:40:07,079 --> 01:40:11,840
Jesus says Jesus, Jesus says, Moses wrote about me. If

1407
01:40:11,880 --> 01:40:14,479
you believe Moses, you would believe in me. For Moses

1408
01:40:14,560 --> 01:40:17,640
wrote about me. And if Moses and the elders go

1409
01:40:17,800 --> 01:40:21,760
up on the mountain and have a meal with God,

1410
01:40:22,000 --> 01:40:25,239
and if Abram had a meal with God and no

1411
01:40:25,319 --> 01:40:28,560
one sees the Father, who could it be? Who does

1412
01:40:28,600 --> 01:40:31,920
Paul say in se Corinthians three, Moses saw face to face?

1413
01:40:39,520 --> 01:40:39,960
Speaker 5: Are you there?

1414
01:40:42,079 --> 01:40:42,319
Speaker 6: Hello?

1415
01:40:43,920 --> 01:40:44,159
Speaker 5: Hello?

1416
01:40:44,239 --> 01:40:44,720
Speaker 7: Can you hear me?

1417
01:40:45,239 --> 01:40:45,439
Speaker 5: Yeah?

1418
01:40:45,479 --> 01:40:48,800
Speaker 6: And seon Corinthians three, Paul says that Moses went up

1419
01:40:48,920 --> 01:40:52,319
and saw someone face to face, and that that person

1420
01:40:52,399 --> 01:40:54,840
that he saw, that glory is reflected onto Moses. Whose

1421
01:40:54,880 --> 01:40:55,439
glory was it?

1422
01:40:58,119 --> 01:40:58,279
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1423
01:40:58,319 --> 01:41:01,640
Speaker 6: Exactly, so many, many, many times. The New Testament explains

1424
01:41:01,680 --> 01:41:04,399
that it was Jesus at Mount Sina, it was Jesus

1425
01:41:04,720 --> 01:41:07,199
in the desert, it was Jesus with Abraham.

1426
01:41:12,399 --> 01:41:12,640
Speaker 5: Wow.

1427
01:41:13,079 --> 01:41:16,760
Speaker 9: Uh and then uh so when it says that God

1428
01:41:17,000 --> 01:41:22,640
was manifest in the flesh, obviously, I could see how

1429
01:41:22,720 --> 01:41:23,399
you would.

1430
01:41:23,880 --> 01:41:27,199
Speaker 6: Yeah, God the son. The second hyposides, but.

1431
01:41:27,319 --> 01:41:30,640
Speaker 5: It doesn't it doesn't clear. It doesn't make that distinction.

1432
01:41:30,760 --> 01:41:32,520
Speaker 6: I don't think have you read John one.

1433
01:41:34,439 --> 01:41:36,239
Speaker 5: In the beginning was the word? The word was with God?

1434
01:41:36,319 --> 01:41:38,399
Speaker 6: The word well the rest of the passage, because the

1435
01:41:38,520 --> 01:41:42,439
word the same word, the same word in verse one

1436
01:41:43,560 --> 01:41:46,359
is the one who became flesh and dwelt among us

1437
01:41:46,439 --> 01:41:53,800
verse fourteen, Right, yeah, not the Father. The word of

1438
01:41:53,840 --> 01:41:54,880
the Father became flesh.

1439
01:41:57,479 --> 01:41:58,680
Speaker 5: Does it say the word of the Father?

1440
01:42:00,119 --> 01:42:04,239
Speaker 6: Verse fourteen? And do you have your Bible? Are you

1441
01:42:04,479 --> 01:42:04,960
looking at it?

1442
01:42:08,359 --> 01:42:08,399
Speaker 5: Is?

1443
01:42:08,560 --> 01:42:17,960
Speaker 6: What does verse fourteen say? Are you there? Are you

1444
01:42:18,039 --> 01:42:19,640
cutting out? I think maybe you're cutting out?

1445
01:42:21,920 --> 01:42:25,079
Speaker 9: Sorry, Whenever I turn away from whenever I open a

1446
01:42:25,119 --> 01:42:26,720
different app it cuts out.

1447
01:42:27,920 --> 01:42:33,640
Speaker 6: Can you can you see one fourteen? Yes, okay, go ahead,

1448
01:42:33,640 --> 01:42:34,199
go ahead and read that.

1449
01:42:34,960 --> 01:42:37,279
Speaker 5: And the word became flesh and dwelt among us.

1450
01:42:38,279 --> 01:42:41,439
Speaker 9: And we have seen his glory, glory as of the

1451
01:42:41,640 --> 01:42:45,760
only son from the Father, full of grace and truth.

1452
01:42:46,039 --> 01:42:48,079
Speaker 6: Now and we're not going to go to Ezekiel. But

1453
01:42:48,119 --> 01:42:51,000
if you look at Ezekiel one to eleven, there's a

1454
01:42:51,079 --> 01:42:54,359
specific statement that this one riding the chariot like a

1455
01:42:54,479 --> 01:42:58,119
son of man is called the glory of Yahweh. So

1456
01:42:58,199 --> 01:43:00,039
who is the glory right here? In John one four.

1457
01:43:02,960 --> 01:43:03,279
Speaker 5: The son?

1458
01:43:03,439 --> 01:43:04,760
Speaker 6: Okay, now read verse eighteen.

1459
01:43:06,760 --> 01:43:12,159
Speaker 9: Okay, no one has ever seen God, the only God.

1460
01:43:12,560 --> 01:43:16,000
Speaker 5: Who is at the Father's side. He has made him known.

1461
01:43:17,520 --> 01:43:19,039
Speaker 6: What what do you reading to read again?

1462
01:43:21,479 --> 01:43:22,239
Speaker 5: This is the ESV.

1463
01:43:22,479 --> 01:43:24,600
Speaker 9: No one has ever seen God, the only.

1464
01:43:24,520 --> 01:43:27,800
Speaker 5: God who is at the Father's side. He has made

1465
01:43:27,880 --> 01:43:28,800
him known. A right.

1466
01:43:28,920 --> 01:43:32,920
Speaker 6: So in other words, the New King James reads, no

1467
01:43:33,039 --> 01:43:36,359
one is seeing God at any time. The only begotten

1468
01:43:36,520 --> 01:43:39,399
Son in the bosom of the Father has declared him.

1469
01:43:40,279 --> 01:43:43,960
So that second quote God mentioned there is God, the

1470
01:43:44,079 --> 01:43:44,920
Son the word.

1471
01:43:48,279 --> 01:43:48,600
Speaker 5: Okay.

1472
01:43:49,199 --> 01:43:57,720
Speaker 9: So it's not that there's a logical fallacy, but the

1473
01:43:58,119 --> 01:44:02,359
scripture builds it so that it can't be modalism.

1474
01:44:04,840 --> 01:44:08,960
Speaker 6: Yeah. I mean there's just like countless passages in the

1475
01:44:09,079 --> 01:44:12,399
Old and the New Testament. I mean, let's let's go

1476
01:44:12,439 --> 01:44:14,640
to Isaiah. Let's go to Isaiah eleven.

1477
01:44:15,720 --> 01:44:17,840
Speaker 5: Okay, because I feel like there's some.

1478
01:44:19,560 --> 01:44:22,920
Speaker 9: Let me get my Bible because it's, like I said,

1479
01:44:22,960 --> 01:44:26,239
the app is being weird. I feel like there's a

1480
01:44:26,319 --> 01:44:31,000
lot of Trinitarians that, whether they know it or not,

1481
01:44:31,880 --> 01:44:33,479
fall into modalism.

1482
01:44:34,920 --> 01:44:38,439
Speaker 6: I mean, we could be, but I don't know how

1483
01:44:38,479 --> 01:44:41,239
that would That would by definition not be trinitarian if

1484
01:44:41,279 --> 01:44:44,079
it was modalism. I mean, the only trinitarian theology that

1485
01:44:44,159 --> 01:44:50,039
we recognize or affirm or think even exists is Orthodox

1486
01:44:50,279 --> 01:44:54,439
monarchical trinitarianism. That's it. The Father is the one God,

1487
01:44:55,119 --> 01:44:59,000
and he shares that deity with the Son that he

1488
01:44:59,079 --> 01:45:01,239
generates in the spirit that he spir rates, and they

1489
01:45:01,920 --> 01:45:05,560
endwell one another in a perfect union, a perfect parachuresis

1490
01:45:05,680 --> 01:45:08,399
that is the one God. That is the only trinitarian

1491
01:45:08,439 --> 01:45:11,600
theology that we think exists. We don't think Protestants and

1492
01:45:11,720 --> 01:45:17,079
Roman Catholics have a coherent Orthodox trinitarian theology. And the

1493
01:45:17,159 --> 01:45:20,520
one exception might be that technically Uniates do confess the

1494
01:45:20,600 --> 01:45:26,840
same trinity as Us. But I have a talk after

1495
01:45:27,039 --> 01:45:28,720
you and I have this talk, I want them, for

1496
01:45:28,760 --> 01:45:32,640
the sake of the audience, points out that I've got

1497
01:45:33,560 --> 01:45:36,960
various talks actually on the subject. You can come down

1498
01:45:37,000 --> 01:45:44,840
here too. Is Jesus God and is God a Trinity?

1499
01:45:45,199 --> 01:45:49,039
Is a talk I did many years ago that is

1500
01:45:49,079 --> 01:45:53,239
still relevant. And then I also have a talk called

1501
01:45:54,520 --> 01:45:58,560
the Jewish Trinity refuting the Unitarian presuppositions of the Old Testament,

1502
01:45:59,600 --> 01:46:04,439
and have a talk about the Trinity in the Torah specifically,

1503
01:46:05,239 --> 01:46:07,199
So that talk is right there. So there's three talks

1504
01:46:07,239 --> 01:46:09,239
that I would recommend for people who want to deeper

1505
01:46:09,319 --> 01:46:11,000
dive on the subject matter. But go ahead.

1506
01:46:12,880 --> 01:46:14,319
Speaker 5: You were directing me to Isaiah.

1507
01:46:15,079 --> 01:46:33,760
Speaker 6: Yeah, so we look at Isaiah eleven. Okay, So just

1508
01:46:33,840 --> 01:46:34,960
read one and two there.

1509
01:46:36,800 --> 01:46:38,600
Speaker 9: And there shall come forth a rod out of the

1510
01:46:39,199 --> 01:46:41,520
stem of Jesse, and a branch shall grow out of

1511
01:46:41,560 --> 01:46:44,199
his roots, and the spirit of the Lord shall rest

1512
01:46:44,279 --> 01:46:47,760
upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit

1513
01:46:47,840 --> 01:46:52,159
of counsel, and my spirit of knowledge, and of the fear.

1514
01:46:52,000 --> 01:46:52,399
Speaker 5: Of the Lord.

1515
01:46:53,079 --> 01:46:56,720
Speaker 6: So in verse two you have all three persons of

1516
01:46:56,800 --> 01:46:59,680
the trinity you mentioned right there, the spirit of Yahweh

1517
01:46:59,760 --> 01:47:02,640
well rest upon him. Do you agree that this is

1518
01:47:02,760 --> 01:47:08,279
a famous Messianic prophecy. I agree, Yeah, So there's three

1519
01:47:08,359 --> 01:47:09,560
persons right there.

1520
01:47:13,439 --> 01:47:16,840
Speaker 9: Yeah, because because when when I I guess, when I

1521
01:47:17,039 --> 01:47:22,000
read it with my with my understanding, when I see

1522
01:47:22,000 --> 01:47:25,319
the spirit of the Lord, I just think, you know, God,

1523
01:47:26,600 --> 01:47:31,880
I don't I don't necessarily see because because God is

1524
01:47:31,960 --> 01:47:32,439
a spirit.

1525
01:47:32,600 --> 01:47:37,279
Speaker 6: Okay. In John one that we just read one of

1526
01:47:37,359 --> 01:47:41,720
those reference does not become incarnate one of them does.

1527
01:47:43,800 --> 01:47:47,479
Do you remember that that we just read? Yes, no

1528
01:47:47,560 --> 01:47:50,159
one has seen God or God the Father at anytime.

1529
01:47:50,279 --> 01:47:52,840
Jesus later in the Gospel of John specifies that no

1530
01:47:52,920 --> 01:47:56,479
one has seen the Father at any time, and then

1531
01:47:56,600 --> 01:48:00,119
John one fourteen and John one eighteen specified that the

1532
01:48:00,239 --> 01:48:06,680
Word and Son of God did become manifest. So that's

1533
01:48:06,720 --> 01:48:21,760
a queer distinction. Look at Isaiah forty two, okay, and

1534
01:48:21,920 --> 01:48:22,680
read one and two.

1535
01:48:24,159 --> 01:48:28,279
Speaker 9: Behold my servant, whom I uphold my intellect, and whom

1536
01:48:28,319 --> 01:48:32,199
my soul delighted. I have put my spirit upon him.

1537
01:48:32,960 --> 01:48:35,720
He shall bring fourth judgment to the gentiles. He shall

1538
01:48:35,800 --> 01:48:38,880
not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to

1539
01:48:38,960 --> 01:48:40,000
be heard in the street.

1540
01:48:40,720 --> 01:48:43,399
Speaker 6: Okay, So who's speaking in verse one? Do you think.

1541
01:48:45,399 --> 01:48:48,319
Speaker 5: I believe that would be the Lord as in Jehovah?

1542
01:48:49,439 --> 01:48:53,439
Speaker 6: About who about his servant? Who's the servant here?

1543
01:48:54,479 --> 01:48:54,840
Speaker 5: Jesus?

1544
01:48:55,319 --> 01:48:56,760
Speaker 6: Okay? How many is that?

1545
01:48:59,079 --> 01:48:59,479
Speaker 5: That's too?

1546
01:49:00,119 --> 01:49:01,399
Speaker 6: And then what's the spirit there?

1547
01:49:05,760 --> 01:49:07,960
Speaker 5: I have put my spirit upon him? Right?

1548
01:49:08,239 --> 01:49:08,680
Speaker 6: That's three?

1549
01:49:09,800 --> 01:49:10,079
Speaker 5: Okay?

1550
01:49:10,399 --> 01:49:12,560
Speaker 9: So when so when God moves upon the face of

1551
01:49:12,600 --> 01:49:17,640
the deep, sorry to jump around, that he is in

1552
01:49:17,760 --> 01:49:19,560
the form you would say the Father is in the

1553
01:49:19,640 --> 01:49:20,439
form of a spirit.

1554
01:49:20,720 --> 01:49:24,680
Speaker 6: Right, the Father is in a form of a spirit. No,

1555
01:49:24,920 --> 01:49:28,359
the Father is distinct from the spirit.

1556
01:49:30,399 --> 01:49:32,119
Speaker 5: So what form would you say the Father.

1557
01:49:33,640 --> 01:49:35,319
Speaker 6: I don't know what you mean by forms. I mean

1558
01:49:35,359 --> 01:49:38,159
if you come over here to go ahead, I guess.

1559
01:49:38,279 --> 01:49:42,920
Speaker 5: It says that God. It says that God is a spirit.

1560
01:49:44,760 --> 01:49:47,319
Speaker 6: Yeah, God is spirit. That doesn't mean that God is

1561
01:49:47,680 --> 01:49:50,399
the Father is identical to the Holy Spirit, right, Because

1562
01:49:50,479 --> 01:49:52,800
Jesus says that we must worship him in spirit and

1563
01:49:52,880 --> 01:49:56,560
in truth. So God in terms of his nature is spiritual.

1564
01:49:56,680 --> 01:49:59,600
He's not physical. He doesn't have location, he doesn't have

1565
01:50:00,279 --> 01:50:05,119
like you can't encapsulate or you know, define him or

1566
01:50:05,359 --> 01:50:08,880
say that, you know, God is that idol over there, right.

1567
01:50:09,199 --> 01:50:12,560
And then Jesus says that he must be worshiped in spirit,

1568
01:50:12,640 --> 01:50:15,119
that is, in the Holy Spirit. Because that passage says

1569
01:50:15,199 --> 01:50:17,680
that he that believes in me out of his heart

1570
01:50:17,680 --> 01:50:21,000
will flow a river of life giving water, right, which

1571
01:50:21,079 --> 01:50:27,399
is a reference to the Holy Spirit. So that doesn't

1572
01:50:27,479 --> 01:50:29,800
mean that that doesn't mean that God the Father is

1573
01:50:29,840 --> 01:50:34,800
identical to the Holy Spirit. Right.

1574
01:50:35,840 --> 01:50:37,680
Speaker 5: I'm trying to wrap my head around that because I

1575
01:50:37,760 --> 01:50:38,720
get so, let's.

1576
01:50:38,960 --> 01:50:50,439
Speaker 6: Let's spirit Okay, let's wrap up. Let's go to John sixteen. Yeah, sixteen,

1577
01:50:50,479 --> 01:50:56,720
he said, Now read verse seven to ten.

1578
01:51:00,159 --> 01:51:03,199
Speaker 5: Okay, nevertheless, I tell you the truth.

1579
01:51:04,000 --> 01:51:07,199
Speaker 9: It is expedient for you that I go away, broth,

1580
01:51:07,479 --> 01:51:10,800
I go not away. The comforter will not come unto you.

1581
01:51:11,039 --> 01:51:12,840
Speaker 6: Okay. So who's going and who's coming?

1582
01:51:12,880 --> 01:51:19,640
Speaker 5: Here? Jesus is going and the comforter, which is.

1583
01:51:21,720 --> 01:51:26,760
Speaker 6: God, it's the Holy Spirit. How can they be identical

1584
01:51:26,880 --> 01:51:28,319
if one is going and one is coming.

1585
01:51:30,319 --> 01:51:35,119
Speaker 9: Well, I feel like the traditional thing here would be.

1586
01:51:36,520 --> 01:51:39,199
And again, I'm I'm trying to balance.

1587
01:51:39,039 --> 01:51:43,800
Speaker 6: What tradition really what tradition, because the church is tradition,

1588
01:51:43,960 --> 01:51:44,640
is what I'm saying.

1589
01:51:47,079 --> 01:51:50,159
Speaker 5: Everyone seems to have their own tradition. But I get

1590
01:51:50,239 --> 01:51:51,439
I get where you're coming from.

1591
01:51:51,359 --> 01:51:55,880
Speaker 6: The sorry, so okay, well from the first okay, in

1592
01:51:55,920 --> 01:51:58,279
the first, second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth century,

1593
01:51:58,399 --> 01:52:00,520
what did that church confess tradition or.

1594
01:52:00,560 --> 01:52:07,439
Speaker 5: Mine most of your tradition? Definitely?

1595
01:52:08,399 --> 01:52:12,239
Speaker 6: Oh, I mean except for the modalists, except for Sabellius.

1596
01:52:11,800 --> 01:52:18,479
Speaker 5: Right right, Okay, there was early church fathers. Yeah, we're modalists.

1597
01:52:19,720 --> 01:52:22,119
Speaker 6: They weren't church fathers. They were herod sics like Sabellius

1598
01:52:22,199 --> 01:52:24,399
that were modalists, but not church fathers. Church fathers are

1599
01:52:24,600 --> 01:52:30,399
people who teach what we teach. So again, where in

1600
01:52:30,479 --> 01:52:34,680
this passage do you see an identification of the two,

1601
01:52:35,039 --> 01:52:37,199
Because it sounds like you keep when you when I

1602
01:52:37,399 --> 01:52:40,760
bring it up, you keep saying, well, it's God. Do

1603
01:52:40,880 --> 01:52:43,319
you believe that the word God has a single reference

1604
01:52:43,439 --> 01:52:46,920
because that might actually be the source of the grammatical

1605
01:52:47,000 --> 01:52:48,880
mistake here. What do you think God, Do you think

1606
01:52:48,880 --> 01:52:56,000
it only refers to a single Unitarian essence When you

1607
01:52:56,079 --> 01:52:59,680
say yes, okay, that's the error right here. Because the

1608
01:52:59,720 --> 01:53:03,960
word God, even in the scriptures, can refer to multiple things.

1609
01:53:04,119 --> 01:53:07,600
It's not a single reference term. God can pick out

1610
01:53:08,520 --> 01:53:11,079
the hypostasis of the Father, the Son, the Spirit, the

1611
01:53:11,159 --> 01:53:14,760
divine essence, divine energies and operations, and it can pick

1612
01:53:14,800 --> 01:53:18,640
out angels, demons, and humans. I have said, ye are God's.

1613
01:53:19,199 --> 01:53:21,439
So this is a Muslim mistake. Muslims make the same

1614
01:53:21,439 --> 01:53:24,239
mistake where they think that the word God only refers

1615
01:53:24,319 --> 01:53:28,560
to a single Unitarian being or essence, and it is

1616
01:53:28,720 --> 01:53:30,880
not the case in scripture. In fact, it refers to

1617
01:53:31,000 --> 01:53:33,720
all the things that I listed. So your mistake is

1618
01:53:33,800 --> 01:53:35,760
first and foremost thinking that the word God has a

1619
01:53:35,880 --> 01:53:40,600
single reference. It doesn't. It refers to Jesus as for example,

1620
01:53:40,640 --> 01:53:44,640
there's none good but God talking about God the Father.

1621
01:53:45,399 --> 01:53:47,399
Even in John one that we just read, you saw

1622
01:53:47,520 --> 01:53:51,199
that the word God has multiple reference. In one passage

1623
01:53:51,239 --> 01:53:54,439
is referring to the Father, in another passage referring to

1624
01:53:54,760 --> 01:54:05,720
the Son. So let's look at verse fourteen here in

1625
01:54:07,039 --> 01:54:08,560
let's read twelve to what.

1626
01:54:08,640 --> 01:54:10,840
Speaker 5: Do all modalists be? Unitarian and nature?

1627
01:54:12,279 --> 01:54:16,840
Speaker 6: Yeah, but my point is that my point is that

1628
01:54:17,119 --> 01:54:19,800
you cannot prove or demonstrate that the word God has

1629
01:54:19,840 --> 01:54:22,239
a single reference or meaning. In fact, it doesn't.

1630
01:54:23,760 --> 01:54:28,920
Speaker 5: No, I guess, I guess. So what they would say

1631
01:54:29,239 --> 01:54:31,640
would be that those are titles.

1632
01:54:34,039 --> 01:54:36,439
Speaker 6: Okay, I understand that's what they would say. But I

1633
01:54:36,520 --> 01:54:40,600
want you to read twelve to fifteen of what of

1634
01:54:40,720 --> 01:54:41,880
what the same chapter that we're in.

1635
01:54:42,520 --> 01:54:47,199
Speaker 9: Okay, Sorry, I have yet many things to say unto you,

1636
01:54:47,359 --> 01:54:50,840
but you cannot bear them now. Helbeit when he the

1637
01:54:50,920 --> 01:54:53,800
spirit of truth has come, he will guide you into

1638
01:54:53,880 --> 01:54:57,159
all truth. For he shall not speak of himself, but

1639
01:54:57,439 --> 01:55:01,359
whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak.

1640
01:55:01,720 --> 01:55:05,880
Speaker 6: Okay. And if he's not speaking on his own authority,

1641
01:55:06,520 --> 01:55:07,840
whose authority is he's speaking on.

1642
01:55:10,239 --> 01:55:12,720
Speaker 5: And this is still about the comforter right, who is

1643
01:55:12,800 --> 01:55:29,520
the spirit right? Huh? Would you say Jesus or God

1644
01:55:29,600 --> 01:55:29,920
the Father.

1645
01:55:30,920 --> 01:55:33,119
Speaker 6: God the Father is the source and origin of all

1646
01:55:33,199 --> 01:55:35,600
things in the trinity, So it would be God the Father,

1647
01:55:35,720 --> 01:55:39,720
who is the fount, the source, the one God. For example,

1648
01:55:39,760 --> 01:55:42,359
a Nicien Creed says, I believe in one God, the Father.

1649
01:55:42,600 --> 01:55:46,000
The Father is the source, fountain archade. So he will

1650
01:55:46,079 --> 01:55:49,279
only speak what he hears, just like Jesus says. He

1651
01:55:49,479 --> 01:55:52,640
only speaks and obeys and does what the Father says.

1652
01:55:55,479 --> 01:55:55,640
Speaker 5: Right.

1653
01:55:57,680 --> 01:56:00,239
Speaker 6: And then now reverse fourteen.

1654
01:56:01,800 --> 01:56:05,439
Speaker 9: He shall glorify me, for he shall receive of mine

1655
01:56:06,239 --> 01:56:07,319
and shall show.

1656
01:56:07,399 --> 01:56:08,039
Speaker 5: It unto you.

1657
01:56:09,800 --> 01:56:10,880
Speaker 6: And then reverse fifteen.

1658
01:56:11,880 --> 01:56:14,760
Speaker 9: All things that the Father has, all things that the

1659
01:56:14,880 --> 01:56:20,000
Father hath are mine. Therefore said I that he shall

1660
01:56:20,079 --> 01:56:23,399
take of mine and shall show it unto you.

1661
01:56:23,960 --> 01:56:29,159
Speaker 6: So there's a trinitarian exchange here going on in these

1662
01:56:29,359 --> 01:56:33,840
roles in salvation. And there's nothing in this passage that

1663
01:56:34,079 --> 01:56:35,399
makes them all the same he.

1664
01:56:38,960 --> 01:56:41,680
Speaker 5: Other than we would both agree that they're all God.

1665
01:56:42,960 --> 01:56:47,000
Speaker 6: If these the word God referring to the divine nature, yes,

1666
01:56:47,159 --> 01:56:50,319
they all have the same essence or nature. But they

1667
01:56:50,359 --> 01:56:52,520
are not all the same person or hypostasis.

1668
01:57:00,119 --> 01:57:00,560
Speaker 5: That's tough.

1669
01:57:01,760 --> 01:57:04,720
Speaker 6: Well, it's because it's just renitarian Theald.

1670
01:57:05,920 --> 01:57:11,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I totally see I see it, and in

1671
01:57:11,880 --> 01:57:16,279
a lot of ways, I think I think we're pretty close.

1672
01:57:17,439 --> 01:57:19,000
You would disagree, but hold on.

1673
01:57:19,039 --> 01:57:26,079
Speaker 6: I want you to go down to verse twenty eight.

1674
01:57:28,880 --> 01:57:29,399
Speaker 5: Twenty eight.

1675
01:57:31,600 --> 01:57:35,199
Speaker 9: I came fourth from the father, and I'm come into

1676
01:57:35,319 --> 01:57:36,439
the world again.

1677
01:57:36,640 --> 01:57:39,079
Speaker 5: I leave the world and go to the father.

1678
01:57:40,000 --> 01:57:41,199
Speaker 6: So how many is that?

1679
01:57:44,439 --> 01:57:45,159
Speaker 5: That's two there?

1680
01:57:45,319 --> 01:57:48,479
Speaker 6: Yeah, Now is he going to himself or is he

1681
01:57:48,560 --> 01:57:49,560
really going to the father?

1682
01:57:55,319 --> 01:57:59,600
Speaker 5: I guess he's rejoining with himself and his ends.

1683
01:58:01,279 --> 01:58:03,560
Speaker 6: How would he rejoin with himself? That doesn't even make

1684
01:58:03,560 --> 01:58:06,239
any sense. I mean again, let's go back to John one.

1685
01:58:09,319 --> 01:58:10,680
Did the father become flush?

1686
01:58:16,439 --> 01:58:17,760
Speaker 5: The father sends himself?

1687
01:58:18,600 --> 01:58:20,720
Speaker 6: Where are you getting that? It never says that in

1688
01:58:20,800 --> 01:58:25,119
John one. We just read John one a few minutes ago,

1689
01:58:25,159 --> 01:58:26,039
you remember us.

1690
01:58:26,239 --> 01:58:32,199
Speaker 5: Then it uses the son the father sent the son language.

1691
01:58:33,319 --> 01:58:35,760
Speaker 6: Oh so now now it's just language, even though it

1692
01:58:35,880 --> 01:58:38,760
literally says no one has seen the father, but the

1693
01:58:38,960 --> 01:58:41,439
word that is the son became flush.

1694
01:58:47,840 --> 01:58:48,920
Speaker 5: Couldn't that hold on?

1695
01:58:49,560 --> 01:58:53,039
Speaker 9: I'm not trying to be again super couldn't that still

1696
01:58:53,079 --> 01:58:58,439
be a true statement, because Jesus is man and God

1697
01:58:58,560 --> 01:59:01,199
is a spirit there where we must worship him.

1698
01:59:01,279 --> 01:59:06,520
Speaker 6: And you're confusing these terms. The fact that God is

1699
01:59:06,720 --> 01:59:14,079
spirit means that his nature is not material, physical, composed, changeable, right.

1700
01:59:14,239 --> 01:59:18,000
It does not mean that God's nature is the Holy Spirit.

1701
01:59:18,239 --> 01:59:22,920
They're distinct things. So you keep falling back into the

1702
01:59:23,000 --> 01:59:26,880
word concept fallacy that the word God just refers to

1703
01:59:27,119 --> 01:59:30,520
a unitarian simple essence. And I'm telling you that the

1704
01:59:30,640 --> 01:59:34,960
word God in even in verse eighteen, no one has

1705
01:59:35,000 --> 01:59:38,680
seen God at any time. The only begotten son in

1706
01:59:38,760 --> 01:59:42,359
the bosom of the Father has declared him, and in

1707
01:59:42,479 --> 01:59:47,880
the Greek it is exegeted him explained him. The son

1708
01:59:48,399 --> 01:59:52,960
exegetes or explains the Father. That's two, that's not one.

1709
01:59:54,800 --> 01:59:58,560
It's actually very simple. It's just that you have to

1710
01:59:58,680 --> 02:00:02,560
accept that the Bible t each is both, not either or.

1711
02:00:03,359 --> 02:00:04,720
And the thing about the Bible is that you have

1712
02:00:04,800 --> 02:00:07,359
to do you have to do justice to all the passages.

1713
02:00:07,880 --> 02:00:11,399
You don't take one passage that you think, well, there's

1714
02:00:11,479 --> 02:00:15,720
just one unitarian entity in every passage that has distinct language.

1715
02:00:16,000 --> 02:00:19,199
I just reinterpret that to mean that they're identical. So

1716
02:00:19,319 --> 02:00:21,520
now you have a schizophrenic deity.

1717
02:00:28,920 --> 02:00:31,479
Speaker 5: You mean where he's talking to himself and such.

1718
02:00:33,239 --> 02:00:37,760
Speaker 6: The spirit does not speak on his own authority. Who

1719
02:00:37,920 --> 02:00:40,079
is the authority if they're all the same.

1720
02:00:45,239 --> 02:00:52,039
Speaker 5: Oh, I see what you're saying. Sorry, I see it now, man, Okay.

1721
02:00:53,920 --> 02:00:56,119
Speaker 6: So look, just go to my just go to my

1722
02:00:56,239 --> 02:00:58,760
videos where I go in through all the passages. You're

1723
02:00:58,800 --> 02:01:00,720
gonna need to go through all the passages. And I

1724
02:01:00,760 --> 02:01:03,000
appreciate your calls. A great conversation, and I'm not at

1725
02:01:03,039 --> 02:01:05,560
all trying to fuss with you or or be rude

1726
02:01:05,600 --> 02:01:20,000
to you or whatever. Aurn Bazanian watch this be that

1727
02:01:20,119 --> 02:01:26,399
black dude. I was my white boy, white boy. What's up?

1728
02:01:26,439 --> 02:01:26,600
Speaker 5: Man?

1729
02:01:32,000 --> 02:01:46,800
Speaker 6: All right? He won't he can't connect Reyes Moonacchi Monachi minachi.

1730
02:01:50,840 --> 02:01:53,199
So a lot of people having a hard time connecting munachi.

1731
02:01:53,239 --> 02:01:53,880
You want to I mute?

1732
02:01:54,800 --> 02:02:00,600
Speaker 5: Oh all right, ta can you hear me?

1733
02:02:01,199 --> 02:02:01,760
Speaker 6: Yeah? What's up?

1734
02:02:01,800 --> 02:02:04,880
Speaker 5: Man? Thank God, bless you, and a happy resurrection day.

1735
02:02:07,239 --> 02:02:09,399
I have just a quick question, maybe or two or

1736
02:02:09,399 --> 02:02:12,319
three of after we have time. I do believe that

1737
02:02:12,880 --> 02:02:16,039
we should follow the teachings of Jesus Christ. But if

1738
02:02:16,079 --> 02:02:16,399
I had to.

1739
02:02:16,399 --> 02:02:18,640
Speaker 11: Align myself with any religion, I would probably say I

1740
02:02:18,680 --> 02:02:22,479
will be closer to Pentecostalism, But in the last few

1741
02:02:22,560 --> 02:02:25,119
years I've realized that there's like different kinds of Pentecostals.

1742
02:02:25,600 --> 02:02:27,920
The one that I follow is more of that we

1743
02:02:28,039 --> 02:02:31,239
believe in the Trinity, which would be that we believe

1744
02:02:31,239 --> 02:02:33,479
in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. We

1745
02:02:33,640 --> 02:02:37,720
believe that Jesus Christ that are across and he was resurrected.

1746
02:02:37,239 --> 02:02:39,880
Speaker 5: In three days. We also believe that.

1747
02:02:41,600 --> 02:02:44,239
Speaker 11: We don't pray to marry or the statue or any

1748
02:02:44,239 --> 02:02:47,560
statutes or sayts or icons. So my question is, are

1749
02:02:47,600 --> 02:02:49,000
you against all Pentecostals?

1750
02:02:49,079 --> 02:02:49,279
Speaker 5: Is there?

1751
02:02:49,439 --> 02:02:55,439
Speaker 6: Yes, it's all completely fraudulent and a sham. Correct And

1752
02:02:55,520 --> 02:02:58,119
why is that for all the reasons that I laid

1753
02:02:58,159 --> 02:02:59,119
out in the first hour.

1754
02:03:01,760 --> 02:03:06,319
Speaker 11: Oh okay, I actually you saw your your YouTube video

1755
02:03:06,439 --> 02:03:08,199
online like just a few minutes ago, so much.

1756
02:03:08,239 --> 02:03:11,199
Speaker 6: Okay, that's fine, No, that's fine. I mean, I just

1757
02:03:11,359 --> 02:03:14,800
I can just I can just read state in brief

1758
02:03:15,600 --> 02:03:20,720
that God always gave a liturgical pattern of worship, and

1759
02:03:20,920 --> 02:03:24,840
so from the outset that would disqualify all Pentecostal charismatic groups.

1760
02:03:24,920 --> 02:03:27,800
Number two, there is no new divine revelation after the

1761
02:03:27,880 --> 02:03:30,359
death of John the Apostle, the Bible itself, and the

1762
02:03:30,439 --> 02:03:33,199
Early Church condemned Montanism, and so it rejects the idea

1763
02:03:33,239 --> 02:03:37,720
of any new, ongoing public divine revelations. And three, the

1764
02:03:37,800 --> 02:03:42,399
word tongues in the First Corinthians is known languages. There's

1765
02:03:42,479 --> 02:03:47,800
nothing at all about gibberish. Paul's talking about noetic heart

1766
02:03:47,920 --> 02:03:52,000
prayer in First Corinthians fourteen nothing to do with gibberish.

1767
02:03:52,560 --> 02:03:58,239
So those three simple points, I think immediately disqualify all

1768
02:03:58,359 --> 02:04:00,840
forms of Pentecostal and charismaticism.

1769
02:04:01,680 --> 02:04:03,720
Speaker 5: Yeah, I agree with you with the Jewish party, I

1770
02:04:03,920 --> 02:04:05,079
fully agree with what that part.

1771
02:04:06,159 --> 02:04:07,479
Speaker 6: What was that you agree with?

1772
02:04:07,560 --> 02:04:07,600
Speaker 5: What?

1773
02:04:08,760 --> 02:04:11,640
Speaker 11: I'm sorry, I do agree with the jibberish part that

1774
02:04:11,720 --> 02:04:15,199
there are certain individuals that they pretend to speak in tongues.

1775
02:04:15,239 --> 02:04:18,319
But I would say that that the gift of tongues

1776
02:04:18,479 --> 02:04:21,520
still exists, though is they so not?

1777
02:04:21,680 --> 02:04:24,319
Speaker 6: Everyone may and the gift of different kinds of the

1778
02:04:24,399 --> 02:04:27,479
gift of tongues. According hold On, the gift of tongues

1779
02:04:27,880 --> 02:04:30,720
is stated in terms of the definition of the Greek

1780
02:04:30,760 --> 02:04:35,560
word to be a known language distinct from other nations

1781
02:04:35,680 --> 02:04:36,199
or languages.

1782
02:04:37,880 --> 02:04:40,079
Speaker 11: Okay, But I also want to address like the First

1783
02:04:40,119 --> 02:04:43,680
point you mentioned, we'regard to the highcle of what was

1784
02:04:43,720 --> 02:04:44,479
the terms that you use?

1785
02:04:44,880 --> 02:04:46,760
Speaker 5: The normal one point that you mentioned.

1786
02:04:46,520 --> 02:04:48,880
Speaker 6: That God has always told his people to worship liturgically

1787
02:04:48,960 --> 02:04:52,880
and not in gibberish and flopping around and whatever.

1788
02:04:53,800 --> 02:04:56,600
Speaker 5: Okay, So are you saying that, let's say we need

1789
02:04:56,680 --> 02:04:58,600
to because I do apologize, I'm not.

1790
02:04:58,640 --> 02:05:01,239
Speaker 11: I'm not too familiar with the Orthodox views. I'm a

1791
02:05:01,279 --> 02:05:03,960
little bit more culture. I understand Catholics a bit more.

1792
02:05:04,399 --> 02:05:06,159
But are you saying that if let's say we need

1793
02:05:06,199 --> 02:05:08,239
to reach out to God, we would have to go

1794
02:05:08,359 --> 02:05:10,640
through a hierarchy of individuals.

1795
02:05:11,279 --> 02:05:13,159
Speaker 6: I didn't. I'd never said anything like that. I said

1796
02:05:13,199 --> 02:05:17,600
that liturgical worship, ordered patterned worship that the temple and

1797
02:05:17,680 --> 02:05:21,239
the synagogue had, that the early church set up. It's

1798
02:05:21,640 --> 02:05:26,199
apostolic liturgical worship based on those things. Okay, So like

1799
02:05:26,239 --> 02:05:32,199
a pastor and the no no liturgical worship it meaning

1800
02:05:32,319 --> 02:05:34,720
all the things that, for example, you see in an

1801
02:05:34,840 --> 02:05:38,279
Orthodox church or a Catholic church, what you think is Catholic,

1802
02:05:38,800 --> 02:05:45,319
those elements of vestiments, priests, imagery, icons, all of that

1803
02:05:45,560 --> 02:05:48,960
that existed in the temple and the synagogue. That is

1804
02:05:49,159 --> 02:05:52,079
the liturgical pattern of worship David psalms are meant to

1805
02:05:52,159 --> 02:05:55,960
be sung in a liturgical ordered worship service. There is

1806
02:05:56,119 --> 02:05:58,720
no chaos, there's no gibberish, there's no none of that,

1807
02:05:58,840 --> 02:05:59,960
No rock bands, none of the.

1808
02:06:00,079 --> 02:06:05,079
Speaker 11: Uh So, when the disciples were being persecuted, did they

1809
02:06:05,119 --> 02:06:07,000
have any of those wargicalup.

1810
02:06:06,600 --> 02:06:09,840
Speaker 6: Absolutely they did, yep.

1811
02:06:09,920 --> 02:06:12,560
Speaker 11: And and so what if what about the like Christians

1812
02:06:12,600 --> 02:06:14,479
in Africa now we are being tortured and they're hiding

1813
02:06:14,560 --> 02:06:18,760
in worshiping God. But in hiding are they required to

1814
02:06:18,840 --> 02:06:21,000
have Like my point is, do you need to have

1815
02:06:21,199 --> 02:06:25,319
that for you to praise God? If let's say, let's

1816
02:06:25,359 --> 02:06:27,640
say we go with worst case scenario. If let's say

1817
02:06:27,640 --> 02:06:28,840
you have individuals are being tortured.

1818
02:06:28,880 --> 02:06:32,399
Speaker 6: So you're talking about out of the norm instances which

1819
02:06:32,640 --> 02:06:35,840
don't make the norm. I'm talking about the norm of

1820
02:06:35,960 --> 02:06:38,920
what God established. Do you believe that God established in

1821
02:06:38,960 --> 02:06:40,520
the Old Testament liturgical worship.

1822
02:06:42,800 --> 02:06:45,279
Speaker 5: I believe that. I believe that.

1823
02:06:45,760 --> 02:06:48,199
Speaker 6: It's a simple question, man, So you're not gonna answer

1824
02:06:48,239 --> 02:06:50,560
my question. You're not gonna answer my question. But once

1825
02:06:51,399 --> 02:06:54,600
you're not gonna answer my question, I asked you answer,

1826
02:06:54,680 --> 02:06:57,079
But that's not an answer. You said after Jesus came,

1827
02:06:57,119 --> 02:07:00,640
I said in the Old Testament? Did God establish liturgical worship.

1828
02:07:01,319 --> 02:07:07,079
Speaker 5: In the Old Testament? I guess, based on your definition,

1829
02:07:07,119 --> 02:07:07,640
I would say.

1830
02:07:07,600 --> 02:07:09,640
Speaker 6: Yes, okay, how did Jesus worship?

1831
02:07:11,279 --> 02:07:14,359
Speaker 5: Well, the way Jesus worship was pringing directly to God.

1832
02:07:15,840 --> 02:07:17,720
Speaker 6: Did he attend the face and go to the synagogue

1833
02:07:17,720 --> 02:07:18,159
in the temple?

1834
02:07:19,000 --> 02:07:19,199
Speaker 5: Yes?

1835
02:07:19,560 --> 02:07:20,920
Speaker 6: Okay, so he worship liturgical?

1836
02:07:21,760 --> 02:07:22,920
Speaker 5: Oh? Is that? Is that what you mean by that?

1837
02:07:23,039 --> 02:07:24,239
Speaker 6: Okay? You don't even know what the words. So you

1838
02:07:24,279 --> 02:07:26,680
want to debate something and you're not familiar with these terms, man,

1839
02:07:26,720 --> 02:07:27,920
you know, I mean, I'm not trying to be rude

1840
02:07:27,960 --> 02:07:30,039
with you, mean to you, man, but you don't know

1841
02:07:30,159 --> 02:07:32,439
anything about this topic. So you're not in a position

1842
02:07:32,600 --> 02:07:35,319
to debate it. And let's move on to the topic

1843
02:07:35,399 --> 02:07:38,239
about languages. Where do you get that it's Gibberish?

1844
02:07:40,600 --> 02:07:41,800
Speaker 5: No, no, I'm not saying that it is true. I

1845
02:07:41,840 --> 02:07:42,439
thought that's wird.

1846
02:07:42,680 --> 02:07:43,760
Speaker 6: That was okay.

1847
02:07:43,840 --> 02:07:45,600
Speaker 11: So, but the thing is that I do believe that

1848
02:07:45,640 --> 02:07:48,520
certain individuals do use speaking in tongues as jib British,

1849
02:07:49,000 --> 02:07:52,680
but I do not believe that all individuals are speaking Gibberish.

1850
02:07:52,720 --> 02:07:54,800
Speaker 5: I do believe that you can have to give those

1851
02:07:54,800 --> 02:07:55,439
speaking in tongues.

1852
02:07:55,479 --> 02:07:59,920
Speaker 6: Okay, where in the usage in the New Testament when

1853
02:08:00,119 --> 02:08:03,000
the word means a known dialect do you get that

1854
02:08:03,239 --> 02:08:04,479
it's not a known dialect.

1855
02:08:07,000 --> 02:08:08,159
Speaker 5: I'm sorry, I'm not falling.

1856
02:08:08,199 --> 02:08:11,439
Speaker 6: I'm not follow with a with your question, because when

1857
02:08:11,479 --> 02:08:15,279
people in charismatic Pentecostal, when people in charismatic and Pentecostal

1858
02:08:15,399 --> 02:08:18,960
churches are doing their glossal alia, where do you get

1859
02:08:19,039 --> 02:08:21,359
any of that in the New Testament when the word

1860
02:08:21,439 --> 02:08:24,319
itself means a known dialect or language.

1861
02:08:25,960 --> 02:08:28,000
Speaker 5: I think it's yeah, it's in the New Testament. Let

1862
02:08:28,000 --> 02:08:29,680
me see. I actually don't have the worse in front

1863
02:08:29,680 --> 02:08:29,840
of me.

1864
02:08:29,920 --> 02:08:32,039
Speaker 6: Now, okay, well, I've got the Greek term right pull

1865
02:08:32,159 --> 02:08:34,960
writer pulled up and it means a known language.

1866
02:08:37,479 --> 02:08:38,279
Speaker 5: Oh, let's see.

1867
02:08:39,079 --> 02:08:46,000
Speaker 11: Oh my gosh, patients, my friend, patients.

1868
02:08:46,359 --> 02:08:48,520
Speaker 5: Okay, but I I know you have other individuals who

1869
02:08:48,600 --> 02:08:50,199
want to speak as well.

1870
02:08:50,560 --> 02:08:52,000
Speaker 11: Maybe my last question that I have for you is

1871
02:08:52,000 --> 02:08:53,439
that I'll look into this, But I know there's some

1872
02:08:53,479 --> 02:08:56,279
vible version in the New Testament that states at the

1873
02:08:56,319 --> 02:08:59,560
gift of tongue, individuals will have the church kinds of gifts.

1874
02:08:59,600 --> 02:09:02,239
Speaker 5: One of them is the speaking of tongues. But maybe

1875
02:09:02,359 --> 02:09:03,039
my other question I.

1876
02:09:03,039 --> 02:09:05,039
Speaker 6: Have is what do you think that means? Man? When

1877
02:09:05,079 --> 02:09:08,720
I'm I can look at the Greek definition right here,

1878
02:09:09,800 --> 02:09:10,600
what do you think it means?

1879
02:09:10,640 --> 02:09:12,199
Speaker 5: Do you have the version in front of you can?

1880
02:09:13,000 --> 02:09:16,119
Speaker 6: Well, it's first Grianthian, it's thirteen twelve, thirteen fourteen, And

1881
02:09:16,399 --> 02:09:20,479
I'm telling you that the word glosa means a language

1882
02:09:20,560 --> 02:09:25,960
or dialect used by a particular people distinct from other nations.

1883
02:09:26,079 --> 02:09:27,680
So that means it's a known language.

1884
02:09:28,119 --> 02:09:30,079
Speaker 11: Thank you for a pointing me to corinthis. Yes, I

1885
02:09:30,159 --> 02:09:33,840
do have more quarentius often so another miraculous powers to another,

1886
02:09:34,119 --> 02:09:37,640
prophecy to still another, distinguishing between parents, still another, different

1887
02:09:37,720 --> 02:09:40,960
kinds of tongues, and get to another interpreting tongue.

1888
02:09:41,119 --> 02:09:43,079
Speaker 5: So what do you understand when you when you hear that?

1889
02:09:43,279 --> 02:09:46,079
Speaker 6: Okay, what did I just say? Like I'm not, Oh

1890
02:09:46,159 --> 02:09:48,640
my god, this is so difficult. Like five times I

1891
02:09:48,760 --> 02:09:50,359
just told you what the word means tongues?

1892
02:09:50,399 --> 02:09:53,760
Speaker 5: What does it mean? I think you meant.

1893
02:09:55,079 --> 02:09:57,319
Speaker 11: Dialect, the interpreting dialect, And there is like a lady

1894
02:09:57,560 --> 02:09:58,399
putting a lot of smiles.

1895
02:09:58,520 --> 02:10:00,760
Speaker 6: A known dialect means a own language.

1896
02:10:00,800 --> 02:10:06,279
Speaker 5: Man, Yeah, but what songues?

1897
02:10:08,439 --> 02:10:11,840
Speaker 6: It literally just means the languages that nations speak like,

1898
02:10:11,960 --> 02:10:15,600
that's literally what it means speaking a language like Russian

1899
02:10:15,880 --> 02:10:18,159
or speaking uh, you know, Greek.

1900
02:10:19,199 --> 02:10:21,520
Speaker 5: Is there is there a language that is that mankind?

1901
02:10:22,239 --> 02:10:26,199
What is there? Is there any language that that that

1902
02:10:26,359 --> 02:10:29,439
is not within this realm of within our human world?

1903
02:10:30,279 --> 02:10:31,239
Spiritual language?

1904
02:10:31,840 --> 02:10:35,119
Speaker 6: Uh that if you talk about First Corinthians where Paul's

1905
02:10:35,119 --> 02:10:38,840
talking about the language that is not known, that's not

1906
02:10:39,079 --> 02:10:42,760
an actual verbal thing. That's him praying in his spirit.

1907
02:10:43,640 --> 02:10:45,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, but that's the form of communication.

1908
02:10:45,840 --> 02:10:50,159
Speaker 6: Yeah, but it's not the word glosa. It's a different

1909
02:10:50,199 --> 02:10:52,800
I mean, it's the it's the word there meaning inner

1910
02:10:52,920 --> 02:10:55,800
prayer in his spirit. It's not gibberish and yapping.

1911
02:10:56,760 --> 02:10:59,079
Speaker 11: No, no, I definitely agree with it with the gibberish

1912
02:10:59,079 --> 02:11:01,319
and japping, for there's people or pretending to be speaking tongues.

1913
02:11:01,359 --> 02:11:03,399
But what I believe in what I understand is that

1914
02:11:04,279 --> 02:11:06,319
because let me put it that, we don't understand it.

1915
02:11:06,439 --> 02:11:08,439
Speaker 6: No, no, no, And I'm disagreeing with that. And I'm saying,

1916
02:11:08,520 --> 02:11:11,760
I'm saying that nothing that occurs in the charismatic sphere

1917
02:11:12,000 --> 02:11:15,159
at all is anything in the New Testament, none of

1918
02:11:15,199 --> 02:11:19,520
it nowhere, whether it's the gibberish, people pretending to speak

1919
02:11:19,560 --> 02:11:21,960
in tongues or people claiming that they are speaking in

1920
02:11:22,000 --> 02:11:24,039
the language that no one knows. None of that is

1921
02:11:24,079 --> 02:11:26,479
in the New Testament or at all, what's going on

1922
02:11:26,640 --> 02:11:28,439
in Paul's writings. That's what I'm claiming.

1923
02:11:29,640 --> 02:11:31,520
Speaker 11: And then what about it in the towns of Pentecost

1924
02:11:31,600 --> 02:11:35,800
when they spoke over one hundred they've spoken with the

1925
02:11:36,000 --> 02:11:37,640
languages in languages that.

1926
02:11:37,680 --> 02:11:41,239
Speaker 6: Are the miracle. Is everybody hearing the message in their

1927
02:11:41,319 --> 02:11:45,359
tongue that means known language, known dialect.

1928
02:11:46,079 --> 02:11:47,920
Speaker 5: But it doesn't limit it to non languages.

1929
02:11:48,680 --> 02:11:54,560
Speaker 6: Oh my god, how would it if you hold on, man,

1930
02:11:54,640 --> 02:11:57,159
hold on, how would a bunch of people from different

1931
02:11:57,279 --> 02:12:02,079
nations who are gathered there hearing it in their dialect?

1932
02:12:02,520 --> 02:12:05,279
What would be the point of unknown dialects in that?

1933
02:12:05,600 --> 02:12:09,039
Speaker 5: That's It's like, okay, so do they all understand? In

1934
02:12:09,119 --> 02:12:14,159
other words, do they owners in each and every dialect? Oh?

1935
02:12:14,239 --> 02:12:18,239
Speaker 6: Man, It says that they heard. It says that they

1936
02:12:18,399 --> 02:12:23,199
heard the message in their language. So when a Greek

1937
02:12:23,319 --> 02:12:26,960
guy goes there and Paul Peter's preaching, he here's the

1938
02:12:27,000 --> 02:12:28,880
message in Greek Greek.

1939
02:12:28,920 --> 02:12:29,720
Speaker 5: And that's my point.

1940
02:12:29,880 --> 02:12:32,640
Speaker 6: So none of this has any So none of this

1941
02:12:32,840 --> 02:12:36,359
is charismatic stuff. Dude, None of this is the charismatic nonsense.

1942
02:12:36,439 --> 02:12:39,199
Speaker 5: Okay, this is my question. If he understudy in Greek,

1943
02:12:39,319 --> 02:12:40,800
does that mean he understoody in Hebrew?

1944
02:12:41,880 --> 02:12:43,279
Speaker 6: No, the Hebrews.

1945
02:12:44,079 --> 02:12:46,680
Speaker 11: The languages that they understood place on what they knew,

1946
02:12:47,800 --> 02:12:51,079
So there's no limitation of what possible languages came.

1947
02:12:52,039 --> 02:12:55,079
Speaker 6: It's known languages. There is no unknown language. It would

1948
02:12:55,079 --> 02:12:57,119
even make it if it wouldn't, It wouldn't even make

1949
02:12:57,199 --> 02:12:59,279
sense for an stop interrupting me, man, Why are you

1950
02:12:59,359 --> 02:13:01,520
doing this? Why are you trying to yap over me?

1951
02:13:02,039 --> 02:13:05,319
It's a simple point. A Hebrew, here's the message in

1952
02:13:05,439 --> 02:13:08,199
his native tongue. Hey, Greek, here's the message in his

1953
02:13:08,319 --> 02:13:10,479
native tongue. You're telling me that because they're hearing it

1954
02:13:10,640 --> 02:13:14,119
native tongues. There are infinite unknown languages that are also

1955
02:13:14,239 --> 02:13:17,479
being heard. That is that is insane, not that.

1956
02:13:17,520 --> 02:13:22,520
Speaker 5: They're hearing, just that the possibility exists that you know,

1957
02:13:22,840 --> 02:13:25,439
where are you getting that? Languages that we hear within

1958
02:13:25,520 --> 02:13:29,039
the world. There there's also languages there are unknown, which.

1959
02:13:28,880 --> 02:13:30,439
Speaker 6: Are what I where are you getting that?

1960
02:13:30,840 --> 02:13:31,039
Speaker 5: Cool?

1961
02:13:31,199 --> 02:13:33,600
Speaker 6: Where are you getting that? When literally the word means

1962
02:13:33,840 --> 02:13:35,079
a known language or dialect.

1963
02:13:37,319 --> 02:13:39,880
Speaker 5: Well, I would say that's your definition of this word.

1964
02:13:39,760 --> 02:13:41,880
Speaker 6: But my definition. Do you understand that? I am at

1965
02:13:42,199 --> 02:13:43,680
where do you think of getting? Did I have it

1966
02:13:43,760 --> 02:13:49,159
pulled up on screen? The Greek definition from strongs my definition?

1967
02:13:49,680 --> 02:13:51,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, I can't see you. I'm sorry, I'm actually on

1968
02:13:52,479 --> 02:13:54,279
I can't see your screen. But I'll take.

1969
02:13:54,119 --> 02:13:58,079
Speaker 6: Your word for it. It's strong, is the word?

1970
02:13:58,600 --> 02:13:58,760
Speaker 13: Yeah?

1971
02:13:58,960 --> 02:14:00,880
Speaker 11: I guess so like you asking me where do I

1972
02:14:00,920 --> 02:14:02,920
get it from? But how do you know that it's

1973
02:14:02,960 --> 02:14:03,880
being limited to.

1974
02:14:03,960 --> 02:14:04,600
Speaker 5: Only the word?

1975
02:14:05,039 --> 02:14:07,520
Speaker 6: So now you're making an argument from silence when there's

1976
02:14:07,560 --> 02:14:10,439
absolutely no reason to believe a passages it says that

1977
02:14:11,039 --> 02:14:14,960
the hearers we're hearing it in their native dialect, that

1978
02:14:15,119 --> 02:14:19,600
there's unknown What would be the point? Do you understand

1979
02:14:19,600 --> 02:14:20,239
how dumbness is?

1980
02:14:20,439 --> 02:14:20,479
Speaker 5: Like?

1981
02:14:20,720 --> 02:14:23,880
Speaker 6: So God is transit It is stupid. It's really stupid.

1982
02:14:23,920 --> 02:14:24,039
Speaker 5: Man.

1983
02:14:24,079 --> 02:14:26,159
Speaker 6: I'm not trying to be mean to you, but let's

1984
02:14:26,199 --> 02:14:28,439
stop and think about it for a minute. God is

1985
02:14:28,560 --> 02:14:31,840
transmitting a message to an unknown dialect at the same

1986
02:14:31,960 --> 02:14:35,439
time that no one else hears or knows. That's insane.

1987
02:14:35,640 --> 02:14:36,239
Speaker 5: I understand it.

1988
02:14:36,479 --> 02:14:38,840
Speaker 11: The way I understand it is there's a language that's

1989
02:14:38,880 --> 02:14:42,119
being funded through to us as you know, humans that

1990
02:14:42,199 --> 02:14:43,119
we all could understand.

1991
02:14:43,159 --> 02:14:45,600
Speaker 5: But the original source of that language coming in through us,

1992
02:14:45,960 --> 02:14:46,800
it's a language.

1993
02:14:47,079 --> 02:14:50,119
Speaker 6: That's what are you even talking about now? You're talking

1994
02:14:50,119 --> 02:14:52,279
about just total I don't even know what that means.

1995
02:14:53,319 --> 02:14:56,000
A language coming into us as totally spiritual where an

1996
02:14:56,039 --> 02:14:56,399
act too?

1997
02:14:56,479 --> 02:14:57,640
Speaker 5: Is that what I'm trying to say?

1998
02:14:58,560 --> 02:15:00,600
Speaker 6: Where are you getting this from? You keep saying that

1999
02:15:00,680 --> 02:15:02,560
this is the case, But where is that from?

2000
02:15:03,159 --> 02:15:05,439
Speaker 5: Saying that we're limited to certain kinds of languages.

2001
02:15:05,640 --> 02:15:11,039
Speaker 6: I'm not saying that, I'm saying what the text, dude,

2002
02:15:11,119 --> 02:15:16,520
Stop yap yapping. The text itself tells us what is

2003
02:15:16,640 --> 02:15:20,920
going on. It says that the hearers heard in their

2004
02:15:21,039 --> 02:15:24,079
native tongues what Peter was preaching. That's the miracle, that's

2005
02:15:24,159 --> 02:15:28,399
the reversal of babble. That's what's predicted in Isaiah. You're saying, well,

2006
02:15:28,439 --> 02:15:31,079
but but it's an argument from silence, because there could

2007
02:15:31,079 --> 02:15:33,920
have been the transmission of unknown languages. Where are you

2008
02:15:33,960 --> 02:15:38,000
getting it? But that's an argument from silence that is

2009
02:15:38,119 --> 02:15:42,439
nowhere there. What would be the point of transmitting unknown

2010
02:15:42,560 --> 02:15:44,000
languages to people that can't hear it?

2011
02:15:45,079 --> 02:15:46,760
Speaker 5: Only us here in this world?

2012
02:15:46,840 --> 02:15:51,279
Speaker 6: Would hear is this, dude, you're not even making any

2013
02:15:51,520 --> 02:15:53,720
This is so stupid. I can't I mean, that is

2014
02:15:53,760 --> 02:15:58,359
the dumbest ever. So God is transmitting unknown languages to

2015
02:15:58,479 --> 02:16:01,560
people who can't hear or understand it, who aren't there

2016
02:16:01,680 --> 02:16:05,359
for an unknown language, and the basis for this is

2017
02:16:05,359 --> 02:16:09,159
an argument from silence. I mean, I don't even know

2018
02:16:09,239 --> 02:16:13,079
what to say. That is so stupid. It's like people

2019
02:16:13,159 --> 02:16:18,720
can't just look at literally what the word means, known dialects, languages.

2020
02:16:25,199 --> 02:16:32,600
Go ahead, I'm mute, James, you want to call in

2021
02:16:32,799 --> 02:16:38,440
because that's total nonsense. You can't literally believe this, just

2022
02:16:38,559 --> 02:16:42,239
absolute stupidity that this guy was saying. You can't honestly

2023
02:16:42,319 --> 02:16:45,159
believe that he was correct about that. That makes absolutely

2024
02:16:45,360 --> 02:16:48,159
no sense. I can't believe that we have people this stupid.

2025
02:16:48,239 --> 02:16:52,879
I mean, it's unreal. Really, I'm mute, man, professor, what's up?

2026
02:16:56,159 --> 02:16:58,639
Speaker 5: How you doing? Good? Good?

2027
02:16:58,799 --> 02:16:59,239
Speaker 6: What's up?

2028
02:17:00,520 --> 02:17:05,879
Speaker 5: Brilliant? No? I frankly, I actually I have fifty percent.

2029
02:17:05,760 --> 02:17:08,799
Speaker 13: Agree with you in the notion that the day of

2030
02:17:08,879 --> 02:17:11,440
the Pentacles, they actually had their own languages.

2031
02:17:12,040 --> 02:17:15,120
Speaker 5: I speak Shona from southern Africa.

2032
02:17:15,600 --> 02:17:18,680
Speaker 13: I could probably if I hear one of the opposed

2033
02:17:18,719 --> 02:17:21,559
to speaking shorona and speaking the word of God to

2034
02:17:21,639 --> 02:17:26,719
me that I agree. However, I'm going to give you

2035
02:17:27,399 --> 02:17:29,559
if you would allow me to demonstrate something.

2036
02:17:29,879 --> 02:17:33,159
Speaker 5: Let me just use those single words, a single wit.

2037
02:17:34,079 --> 02:17:39,079
Speaker 6: All right, Okay, hold on, stop, yeah, let's read this passage.

2038
02:17:39,440 --> 02:17:42,639
I mean, this is so similar. This is I'm having

2039
02:17:42,639 --> 02:17:46,639
an art tib not cracking up. They were dwelling in Jerusalem, Jews,

2040
02:17:46,840 --> 02:17:50,760
development from every nation under heaven, and when the sound occurred,

2041
02:17:51,000 --> 02:17:54,000
this is Pentecost. The multitude came together and they were

2042
02:17:54,079 --> 02:17:59,159
confused because everyone heard them speak in their own language.

2043
02:17:59,680 --> 02:18:05,000
They were amazed and marveled. Look, aren't these men Galileans.

2044
02:18:05,600 --> 02:18:09,200
How can we hear in our language what they speak?

2045
02:18:09,600 --> 02:18:09,760
Speaker 5: Now?

2046
02:18:10,479 --> 02:18:14,840
Speaker 6: It lists some of the ethnicities and languages and people

2047
02:18:14,920 --> 02:18:23,639
groups that are there. Parthians, Meds, Elamites, those dwelling and Mesopotamia, Judea, Cappadocia, Pontus, Asia, Phrygia, Pamphilia, Egypt, Libya,

2048
02:18:23,799 --> 02:18:28,879
syreene Rome, Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabs. We hear

2049
02:18:29,079 --> 02:18:35,040
the apostles speaking in our tongues Nate languages. Again for

2050
02:18:35,719 --> 02:18:39,239
slow boys, you can go look up on blue letter Bible.

2051
02:18:39,360 --> 02:18:43,520
What the word glosso means languages. There is nothing in

2052
02:18:43,600 --> 02:18:50,120
this passage at all about unknown mystical translation transmissions from

2053
02:18:50,159 --> 02:18:54,399
God of unknown languages. That is insane, given what this

2054
02:18:54,559 --> 02:18:56,360
passage just says clear as.

2055
02:18:58,760 --> 02:19:01,200
Speaker 5: With you, the notion that I want to bring.

2056
02:19:01,360 --> 02:19:04,000
Speaker 13: It's what I want to ask you, because I actually

2057
02:19:04,079 --> 02:19:06,920
want to ask more like than to actually.

2058
02:19:06,639 --> 02:19:09,280
Speaker 5: Take a position as if I know. Here's the thing.

2059
02:19:10,120 --> 02:19:13,280
Speaker 13: I'm gonna give you a word, and I'm gonna it's

2060
02:19:13,319 --> 02:19:14,840
a sound probably.

2061
02:19:14,680 --> 02:19:17,399
Speaker 5: And we're gonna say put right.

2062
02:19:18,120 --> 02:19:20,680
Speaker 13: It means nothing, not even in my language, but between

2063
02:19:20,760 --> 02:19:23,959
me and you, we want to agree that it says.

2064
02:19:25,879 --> 02:19:26,600
Speaker 5: Jam right.

2065
02:19:27,239 --> 02:19:30,840
Speaker 13: So no matter whatever way that I'm gonna say right now,

2066
02:19:31,040 --> 02:19:31,760
every time when I.

2067
02:19:31,799 --> 02:19:35,280
Speaker 5: Say putua to you, you already know exactly what I mean.

2068
02:19:35,479 --> 02:19:37,280
It means jump. Here's the thing.

2069
02:19:37,879 --> 02:19:41,719
Speaker 13: If I'm gonna give you a series of words to say, oh,

2070
02:19:41,799 --> 02:19:44,319
this word means this one to three, then one day

2071
02:19:44,399 --> 02:19:47,799
you hear me speaking those words, won't you be able

2072
02:19:47,920 --> 02:19:51,639
to determine what I'm actually let's say I'm praying. Won't

2073
02:19:51,719 --> 02:19:54,799
you be able to actually determine what I'm praying? Because

2074
02:19:54,840 --> 02:19:57,920
I gave you the codes of what I said the

2075
02:19:58,440 --> 02:20:01,719
sound every time when I make when I'm saying, I

2076
02:20:01,840 --> 02:20:04,680
mean Jim. If you see me say by that time,

2077
02:20:04,760 --> 02:20:06,520
you know the guy is saying jump jump.

2078
02:20:06,879 --> 02:20:08,280
Speaker 5: Maybe no idea?

2079
02:20:08,360 --> 02:20:10,200
Speaker 6: What what is going on here? I don't know what

2080
02:20:10,280 --> 02:20:12,360
you're talking about? Man swash?

2081
02:20:12,399 --> 02:20:12,719
Speaker 5: What's up?

2082
02:20:22,239 --> 02:20:25,159
Speaker 6: Charshi? Five dollars? My brain has been alchemically reduced to

2083
02:20:25,280 --> 02:20:30,239
reptilian mush by algorithmcdopamine warfare. I tried to read Hollywood,

2084
02:20:30,239 --> 02:20:36,559
but no, we already read that. Excuse me, we read

2085
02:20:36,680 --> 02:20:40,959
that two hours ago. Culper cat cast two dollars. My

2086
02:20:41,040 --> 02:20:44,319
first posca was last night. I Love every second Philly

2087
02:20:44,399 --> 02:20:47,879
and the Wolf. Two pounds, Crystal sinnasty Trilli has Risen

2088
02:20:48,360 --> 02:20:53,079
alitoty glut goo two pounds. You got a debunk Orthodox Muslim.

2089
02:20:53,120 --> 02:20:56,879
I'm tired of him. Can we get him on here?

2090
02:20:58,040 --> 02:20:59,559
Maybe we can send him a link to come to

2091
02:20:59,600 --> 02:21:02,280
be a five dollars crisis? Risen? What do you tell

2092
02:21:02,319 --> 02:21:06,239
people that are serious about Orthodoxy to do? I did

2093
02:21:06,319 --> 02:21:09,559
what you told them, find a good parish and a

2094
02:21:09,639 --> 02:21:12,040
good priest. I gave it everything, and I kept my

2095
02:21:12,120 --> 02:21:15,639
mouth shut. I was received by Chris Mason. Thank you,

2096
02:21:15,760 --> 02:21:20,520
Jay good Man let's get here, h five bucks. In

2097
02:21:20,680 --> 02:21:24,239
high school, my girlfriend's family went to church in Irvine

2098
02:21:24,280 --> 02:21:29,079
with a dude calling himself the prophet Rucus McKinley. He

2099
02:21:29,200 --> 02:21:34,000
played funk music and he would wrap the Bible. I

2100
02:21:34,159 --> 02:21:42,079
just don't. I mean, people get emotional and they mistake

2101
02:21:42,120 --> 02:21:45,719
their emotions for God, and you you can't reason with them.

2102
02:21:50,319 --> 02:21:56,000
Here is a Roman Catholic tweeting a bunch of gibbers

2103
02:21:56,079 --> 02:21:57,399
that I'm not going to read, so thank you for

2104
02:21:57,479 --> 02:22:01,719
sending me money and cussing at me, which I'm not

2105
02:22:01,760 --> 02:22:04,719
gonna read. Storm the cat ten dollars. Why are evangelical

2106
02:22:04,799 --> 02:22:09,680
churches always simps. They preach this thing that's catered to

2107
02:22:09,760 --> 02:22:13,879
women as though it's a man preaching. Well, I mean,

2108
02:22:14,200 --> 02:22:20,399
evangelical megachurches have pretty early on had women pastors, women prophetesses,

2109
02:22:21,000 --> 02:22:23,719
And this is what we just saw with this Zuzu street, right,

2110
02:22:23,760 --> 02:22:25,319
So let's play a little bit more. That I forgot

2111
02:22:25,319 --> 02:22:28,559
about this. Several other believers in the room