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<v Speaker 1>Hello, and welcome to Mythic Mind or Pursue Wisdom in

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<v Speaker 1>the Past between primary secondary worlds. I'm your host, Andrew Snyder,

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<v Speaker 1>and I am always grateful for your company. First of all,

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<v Speaker 1>as a reminder, this is available both as video through

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<v Speaker 1>YouTube as well as through your favorite podcasting platform, and

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<v Speaker 1>so regardless of how you're looking at this, know that

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<v Speaker 1>the other option is available. And so if you're listening

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<v Speaker 1>to the podcast, then I will include the link to

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<v Speaker 1>the YouTube video in the show notes, and so go

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<v Speaker 1>and click on that, make sure you subscribe to the channel.

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<v Speaker 1>And if you're watching this on YouTube, they know that

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<v Speaker 1>the Mythic Mind podcast is also available on your preferred

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<v Speaker 1>podcasting platform. Well, today we are continuing our conversations on

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<v Speaker 1>the Poetic Eda, or the Elder Ed, as is sometimes called.

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<v Speaker 1>This is one of the oldest, one of the most

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<v Speaker 1>significant collections of text for our understanding of the Northern

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<v Speaker 1>mythos of Norse mythology, in particular Norse mythology, Norse legends,

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<v Speaker 1>Norse epics, and so this is something that none of

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<v Speaker 1>us who are involved, none of are are patrons myself

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<v Speaker 1>are at all experts in this material. In fact, I

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<v Speaker 1>believe that we're all reading this for the first time. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>obviously we all have a general interest in this kind

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<v Speaker 1>of material. Most of us are pretty well acquainted with Tolkien,

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<v Speaker 1>with Lewis, both of whom drew pretty heavily on the

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<v Speaker 1>Northern Mythos as well as you know, a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>us have some knowledge of broader mythology mythological themes, but

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<v Speaker 1>none of us are experts on this material. None of

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<v Speaker 1>us have ever studied or read this in particular before.

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<v Speaker 1>And this is not an easy text just to pick up.

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<v Speaker 1>At least a lot of these readings from the poetic

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<v Speaker 1>are not easy you just to pick up. And that's

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<v Speaker 1>because I mean these are these are older sources. A

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<v Speaker 1>lot of what we're dealing with has been redactive, it

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<v Speaker 1>has been edited over time. Sometimes what we have is

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<v Speaker 1>not entirely coherent. We have some some competing traditions at

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<v Speaker 1>play sometimes, and so it's just not easy always to

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<v Speaker 1>piece together, as opposed to something like the pro Zata,

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<v Speaker 1>which came a little bit later, which provides a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of this material in more of a linear, more of

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<v Speaker 1>a uniform, coherent manner, as well as a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>the the other standalone texts that have come out things

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<v Speaker 1>like the Volsung Saga, which also is very old, but

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<v Speaker 1>it's more recent than the poetic at a narrative, and

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<v Speaker 1>so in fact, we're going to reference the Volsung Saga

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<v Speaker 1>a few times. That's something I would definitely recommend that.

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<v Speaker 2>You pick up and read.

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<v Speaker 1>But when you just read the poetic Eda, even setting

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<v Speaker 1>aside the fact that, okay, sometimes we seem to have

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<v Speaker 1>some maybe incomplete or not fully edited text. As I

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<v Speaker 1>was talking with Chase that reading the Poetica for the

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<v Speaker 1>first time, it's a lot like reading the Silmarillion for

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<v Speaker 1>the first time, where you have a broad host of characters,

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of whom have very similar names, and so

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<v Speaker 1>the first time through it can be kind of difficult

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<v Speaker 1>to keep track of who's who, what's happening, what are

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<v Speaker 1>all the particular backstories. They kind of blend together the

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<v Speaker 1>first time through, and it really takes a second full

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<v Speaker 1>read to get down like what's happening. At least that

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<v Speaker 1>was my experience with the Silmarillion, I think that's pretty common.

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<v Speaker 1>Definitely getting the same vibe with the poetic Eda. I

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<v Speaker 1>think that a second full read would help to solidify

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<v Speaker 1>some of this in our minds. But I think that

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<v Speaker 1>Chase and I were able to hobble together a productive conversation.

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<v Speaker 1>I definitely appreciate.

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<v Speaker 2>His role in that.

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<v Speaker 1>But before we get to that, I do want to

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<v Speaker 1>give a special thank you to my patrons who helped

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<v Speaker 1>to keep me producing, who have to keep me leading

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<v Speaker 1>communities and leading these studies and having these kinds of conversations,

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<v Speaker 1>because I literally could not do it without that financial support.

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<v Speaker 1>I literally could not afford the time. And this is

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<v Speaker 1>the kind of thing that I really want to be

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<v Speaker 1>doing full time. So I really appreciate those of you

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<v Speaker 1>who helped me do what I'm doing right now, and

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<v Speaker 1>those of you who are setting me up to do

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<v Speaker 1>more of this in the future. And if you would

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<v Speaker 1>like to help me do that, if you appreciate what

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<v Speaker 1>I do and you want to see me do more

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<v Speaker 1>of it, you want to come along on the road

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<v Speaker 1>with me, you want to participate in, or at least

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<v Speaker 1>enjoy a broader and more frequent range of things like

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<v Speaker 1>this of project studies conversations, then I welcome your support

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<v Speaker 1>over on patreon dot com slash Mythic Mind. But I

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<v Speaker 1>do want to think by name all of my Tier

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<v Speaker 1>two patrons and higher as I've been doing, and we've

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<v Speaker 1>had some new patrons come in recently, a number who

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<v Speaker 1>have come in for the current Lord of the Ring

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<v Speaker 1>study which just started. This is study that I just

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<v Speaker 1>started leading is called the Wisdom of Talking the Lord

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<v Speaker 1>of the Rings, and this is a twelve week study

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<v Speaker 1>through the entirety of the Lord of the Rings, a

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<v Speaker 1>way to well learn from the wisdom that Tolkien has

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<v Speaker 1>given us implicitly in these stories. And so each week

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<v Speaker 1>includes two videos, one of which is a shorter wild

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<v Speaker 1>card video that covers some element of lore or philosophy

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<v Speaker 1>or talking to life or a secondary source, basically just

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<v Speaker 1>something to provide a new fresh angle or some kind

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<v Speaker 1>of context to what we're reading. And then there's a second,

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<v Speaker 1>longer video which runs more or less an hour or so,

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<v Speaker 1>probably a little bit more, but that covers that week's reading.

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<v Speaker 1>And so I hope that this is an enriching study

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<v Speaker 1>that's going to be in enriching study. It already has

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<v Speaker 1>been for me in preparation and in getting out the

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<v Speaker 1>first week of material, which is now available, and in fact,

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<v Speaker 1>our first live meeting is going to be this Thursday,

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<v Speaker 1>the ninth at nine pm Eastern, and so it's not

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<v Speaker 1>too late to hop on board. You just need to

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<v Speaker 1>go to patreon dot com slash Mythic Mind and sign

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<v Speaker 1>on at Tier three or hire in order to participate.

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<v Speaker 1>But I do want to read out, probably for the

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<v Speaker 1>last time, all of my Tier two patrons and higher.

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<v Speaker 1>I say for the last time simply because this is

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<v Speaker 1>a big group now at Tier two or higher, and

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<v Speaker 1>so I think that after today I'm going to move

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<v Speaker 1>to just mentioned by name Tier three patrons, not because

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<v Speaker 1>I don't appreciate my Tier twos, but just because there

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<v Speaker 1>are just so many at this point. But and again

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<v Speaker 1>I do truly appreciate you, and so thank you to

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<v Speaker 1>all Tier two patrons and higher. And that is Mark, Aaron, Evy, Jamie, Mariah,

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<v Speaker 1>Paul Tyler, William Aaron, Andrew g Andrew, m are Turro, Brandon, Christopher, Emmy, Ian, Jeremiah, Joscelyn,

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<v Speaker 1>Josh b Josh t Landon, Matthew, Sarah and Steele. And

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<v Speaker 1>of course thank you to all Tier one patrons as well.

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<v Speaker 1>And again, if you want to join to either just

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<v Speaker 1>support my work or to gain access to the ad

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<v Speaker 1>free podcast feed, or to enroll in the Lord of

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<v Speaker 1>the Ring study, go to patreon dot com slash mythmind.

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<v Speaker 1>But now let's go ahead and get to my conversation

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<v Speaker 1>with Chase regarding the next set of readings from the

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<v Speaker 1>Poetic Edda. Right, and so welcome back as we continue

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<v Speaker 1>our chats on the Poetic Edda today, I'm joined by

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<v Speaker 1>Chase and it's just the two of us, and so

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<v Speaker 1>I just say, and I hope he's ready to carry

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<v Speaker 1>that load, because there's a lot going on here that

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<v Speaker 1>you know, I just it's kind of like reading the

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<v Speaker 1>silmar Allion for me, which I mean knowing talking that

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<v Speaker 1>is kind of by design. It makes sense, there's a

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<v Speaker 1>connection there. You know, You've got so many different names

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<v Speaker 1>that many of which sound very familiar, so many different

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<v Speaker 1>things happening, interweaving plots, and you know, with the Silmarillion,

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<v Speaker 1>it took me a couple of reads to really just

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<v Speaker 1>get down like what's happening. And I feel like I

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<v Speaker 1>need another full rate of the Edda to really nail

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<v Speaker 1>this down. But I don't know what's been your just

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<v Speaker 1>general experience so far trying to read the edit for

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<v Speaker 1>the first time.

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<v Speaker 3>So what I read through the Prosta that one helped

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<v Speaker 3>a lot because it just kind of like gave a

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<v Speaker 3>basis for everything, and I started seeing how, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>all of modern entertainment that's anything Norse related, really falls

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<v Speaker 3>from that, even in the smallest ways. And it also

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<v Speaker 3>kind of helps knowing what some of the characters in

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<v Speaker 3>terms of like thor like how he typically acts or

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<v Speaker 3>how Oden typically acts. Overall, I've I mean, I've liked it.

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<v Speaker 3>I think so I finished the prose Eta before this

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<v Speaker 3>month one, but the previous ones I hadn't, and those

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<v Speaker 3>were still kind of abusing to me. So I may

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<v Speaker 3>need to reread those just to see awful.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think it's a good idea, you know, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>just saying that I've started the prose Ata, definitely need

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<v Speaker 1>to finish it. I think that would shed a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of light here the Prozeta, which came a little bit

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<v Speaker 1>after the poetic Ata, but it's arranged a much more

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<v Speaker 1>linear kind of way, a lot more straightforward as far

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<v Speaker 1>as opposed to the poetic Eda, where we're dealing with

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<v Speaker 1>older source material. A lot of it isn't totally coherent

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<v Speaker 1>as we have it because we've got fragments of different

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<v Speaker 1>poems that you know, they've changed. Sometimes there are gaps

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<v Speaker 1>even our you know Larrington, who translated and gives some

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<v Speaker 1>commentary in this edition. You know, she notes a number

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<v Speaker 1>of times that sometimes what we have just is not

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<v Speaker 1>fully coherent, and so it's difficult to work it out

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<v Speaker 1>with that alone. Now, for some of the ones that

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<v Speaker 1>we're going to get into today, we're starting to approach

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<v Speaker 1>the Volse Songs, and so definitely recommend anyone who listening

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<v Speaker 1>to this to read that the Saga of the Volse Songs,

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<v Speaker 1>which Chasa you've read that right, yep, yeah, yeah, which

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<v Speaker 1>you know again lays out a lot of material, but

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<v Speaker 1>in more of a coherent, straightforward manner. I wish I

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<v Speaker 1>had the time to do a reread I read a

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<v Speaker 1>few months ago, but at least having that somewhere in

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<v Speaker 1>my head has definitely helped to piece some list together

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<v Speaker 1>as far as who's doing and what's happening. Yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>so I get we'll get to some of that, but

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<v Speaker 1>before we get to the vul song stuff. The first poem,

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<v Speaker 1>the first reading in this set that we're doing this week,

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<v Speaker 1>is called all Wisest Sayings, So we've got a little

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<v Speaker 1>bit about Thor again before we shift gears to the

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<v Speaker 1>Vull songs, and as I've been doing. I'll just read

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<v Speaker 1>the introduction provided by Larrington. Here, Thor intercepts a dwarf who, apparently,

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<v Speaker 1>and unbeknown to Thor, is intending to marry the latter's daughter.

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<v Speaker 1>Thorp proposes a wisdom contest in which he tests the

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<v Speaker 1>dwarf's knowledge of the terminology used by the different races

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<v Speaker 1>of being for natural phenomenon. The dwarf knows the striking

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<v Speaker 1>range of kennings and perhaps taboo words, but Thor's secret

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<v Speaker 1>aim is to delay him until the sun comes up

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<v Speaker 1>and turns.

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<v Speaker 2>Him to stone. Gets the kind enough of that.

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<v Speaker 1>So out of the readings for this time, this is definitely,

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<v Speaker 1>I think the easiest read. But at the same time,

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<v Speaker 1>at least on my d I probably have the least

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<v Speaker 1>to say about it. Did anything stand out to you

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<v Speaker 1>about this reading or anywhere you want to go with this?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so, I think a couple of things I kind

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<v Speaker 3>of got, and I'd listened to some discussion about it.

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<v Speaker 3>It kind of even an interview with with Larrington, and

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<v Speaker 3>she was talking about how she had to kind of

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<v Speaker 3>like look at other texts and find stuff. But this

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<v Speaker 3>one the main thing I pulled from it was it

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<v Speaker 3>really just seems like, you know, this is a time

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<v Speaker 3>when Thor comes back, the Dwarf is asking, not asking,

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<v Speaker 3>He's telling, like, I would like your permission, but I'm

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<v Speaker 3>going to take it anyway to take your daughter. And

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<v Speaker 3>you know, Thor typically comes in like with the hammer swinging,

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<v Speaker 3>ready to like knock everybody out. But I think here

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<v Speaker 3>is the like the rules of like hospitality. Since he's

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<v Speaker 3>in his home, he can't just immediate I mean, I

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<v Speaker 3>guess he's done that sometimes, but here he's respecting that

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<v Speaker 3>and not immediately murdering that the dwarf. And so yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>it's kind of kind of a different one with that,

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<v Speaker 3>and so I think, uh yeah, just basically Thor kind

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<v Speaker 3>of have a more straint.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and you know, maybe there is some cultural element here,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe something about hospitality. Maybe it's just the fact that

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<v Speaker 1>you know, we do have a number of different traditions

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<v Speaker 1>of Thor coming together where you know, this does seem

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit out of character.

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<v Speaker 2>Tip him Purdue.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, he's not exactly a pleasant long run, but

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<v Speaker 1>he's more cunning than just you know, hammer of Blazon.

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<v Speaker 1>Because you know, we've got this lore contest that they

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<v Speaker 1>get into, which teams to happen fairly regularly within the EDA,

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<v Speaker 1>where the back and forth arguing not even so much

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<v Speaker 1>just about lare, but it's about like what do different

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<v Speaker 1>people call different things? It's more like a terminology debate.

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<v Speaker 1>And all these Lord debates, because you know, I'm coming

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<v Speaker 1>to this material from first, starting with Tolkien and Lewis,

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<v Speaker 1>these Lord debates always make me think of Ransom's fight

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<v Speaker 1>with Merdlin when he first shows up, like fighting for dominance,

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<v Speaker 1>talking about you know, all these different elements of the

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<v Speaker 1>cosmos and mythology and whatnot. Yeah, I always makes to

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<v Speaker 1>think of that, which I'm sure that's the tradition that

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<v Speaker 1>Lewis is pulling from for that.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, for sure, I think you're right. I do think

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<v Speaker 3>it's funny when he says, you know, he says, maybe

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<v Speaker 3>I'm reading into this, but when he says, like, tell

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<v Speaker 3>me this all Wise, I reckon Dwarf, and it kind

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<v Speaker 3>of almost seems like he's kind of just like, I know,

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<v Speaker 3>your name's all Wise, but I'm still like, you're just

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<v Speaker 3>a dwarf to me, like you're nothing. But I don't know,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm probably reading that into it, but he just he

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<v Speaker 3>says it every single time. You know, I reckon, dwarf,

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<v Speaker 3>you have wisdom about all things. So I don't know

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<v Speaker 3>if that's like the meaning way of talking, or he's

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<v Speaker 3>just that's the way he wrote.

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<v Speaker 2>It very well.

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<v Speaker 1>Maybe I know that Thor has killed his number of

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<v Speaker 1>dwarves and usually doesn't hold them in very high esteem.

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<v Speaker 1>That's definitely very possible that he's demonstrating the irony of

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<v Speaker 1>you know, referring to this dwarf as all wise. That's

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<v Speaker 1>definitely possible. And of course his whole strategy here, where

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<v Speaker 1>you know, the the lore or the actual fight isn't

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<v Speaker 1>actually what this story is about. The story is about

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<v Speaker 1>Thor's cunning, and he's just keeping the debate going until

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<v Speaker 1>daybreak when the dwarf turns the stone, which then reminds me,

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<v Speaker 1>of course, of the Hobbit, where you know, Gandalff gets

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<v Speaker 1>the trolls arguing until daybreak where they turn a stone.

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<v Speaker 2>There's definitely connection there, Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>Definitely, let's see. Yeah, from some discussions on it, I

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<v Speaker 3>did see that people had the thought that it could

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<v Speaker 3>have been like this could have been almost a way

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<v Speaker 3>of teaching children the different words for things, or something

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<v Speaker 3>kind of like a oh, what do you call this.

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<v Speaker 3>This is what each person, each of the mythical beings

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<v Speaker 3>called it.

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<v Speaker 1>You know that that makes a lot of sense. I

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<v Speaker 1>actually kind of like that teaching strategy. Yeah, you need

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<v Speaker 1>to find some way to make use of that.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, we learned a little bit about the dwarfs, like

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<v Speaker 3>appearance when he calls him, was it like pale face? Uh?

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<v Speaker 3>Is it? Where was the so the.

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<v Speaker 2>It does something?

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<v Speaker 3>Eli, Maybe that was a different translation. Oh no, why

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<v Speaker 3>why so pale? About the nostrils? You just spend the

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<v Speaker 3>night with a corpse. I think it just like he

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<v Speaker 3>spends so much time underground that he's just a very

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<v Speaker 3>pale creature.

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<v Speaker 1>And then we get the kind of insults we tend

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<v Speaker 1>to get from Thorn's fellows.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's funny.

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<v Speaker 3>I do wonder what they use the word liquid fundament,

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<v Speaker 3>which Larrington doesn't really no, I mean she's just like,

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<v Speaker 3>we don't know what this word is. And so it

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<v Speaker 3>is kind of cool seeing all the different ways that

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<v Speaker 3>they're they're describing something in terms of like like with

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<v Speaker 3>rain in or something it being like roof tripping or

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<v Speaker 3>something like that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's it's a very descriptive language. That's one of

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<v Speaker 1>reasons why even you know, I can't read the original,

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<v Speaker 1>but in translation and reading this or reading like Beowulf

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<v Speaker 1>or anything from this general time and region, the language

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<v Speaker 1>is so so so cool, like so visual, so descriptive.

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<v Speaker 1>They have so many different ways of referring to you know,

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<v Speaker 1>what we tend to think of as like objects. They

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<v Speaker 1>turn into actions almost that they're turned into process, which

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<v Speaker 1>I think that that kind of adds an extra energy

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<v Speaker 1>to the language.

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<v Speaker 2>What's going on?

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<v Speaker 3>Uh? They talked about the the whalen's plaything when they're

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<v Speaker 3>talking about the sun mm hm, which I think is

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<v Speaker 3>just kind of playing with that the sun turns them

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<v Speaker 3>to the stone. So because the whale then, as a

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<v Speaker 3>dwarf so obviously wouldn't be playing with the song, I guess.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, which also is probably where we get Tolkien's Dwarf dwelling,

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<v Speaker 1>I assume. Yeah, And I don't know that I have

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<v Speaker 1>much else to say about this one anything else.

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<v Speaker 3>Now it's pretty just straightforward.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, that's the shorter one. It's more straightforward one.

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<v Speaker 2>Now.

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<v Speaker 1>Now we get into the poems that I keep mixing

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<v Speaker 1>up in my head, the three poems with Helgi, well,

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<v Speaker 1>two different Helgi's who also might be the same person,

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<v Speaker 1>so that's okay, yeah, and then of course the yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>the way that this is you know a range where Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>first we were we were dealing with the first poem

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<v Speaker 1>of Helgi hundings Bank who hunis Bonnie, and well, I

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<v Speaker 1>guess we'll just take this one at time. Okay, we'll

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<v Speaker 1>start there. So in this poem, Helgi is this son

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<v Speaker 1>of Zigmund, who is one of the major figures in

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<v Speaker 1>the Volsung Sogam, which again and when listening to this,

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<v Speaker 1>I recommend reading the Volsung Sanga, or I did after

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<v Speaker 1>I read it, put together a short summary video. I'll

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<v Speaker 1>link that in the show notes. I anyone wants to

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<v Speaker 1>look at that, and may even, just for convenience sake,

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<v Speaker 1>drop the audio into the end of this episode. And

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<v Speaker 1>so if anyone wants to just kind of get that

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<v Speaker 1>the basic story down as we get in the more

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00:19:39.279 --> 00:19:41.319
<v Speaker 1>worked out saga, then you can just listen to that

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<v Speaker 1>and then jump back here. Now, So Helgi is the

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<v Speaker 1>son of Zigmund as well as Sinfiotli, which they're they're

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<v Speaker 1>half brothers, different different moms in that since sin Fioli

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<v Speaker 1>is actually the son of of Zigmund as and his sister,

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<v Speaker 1>which gives us some children off here in vibes for

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<v Speaker 1>sure if anyone's read that.

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<v Speaker 2>But again, just listen to that story. We want want

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<v Speaker 2>to rehash that here.

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<v Speaker 1>So again sin Fioti who kind of who joined with

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<v Speaker 1>Zigmund on various raids when Zigmund is kind of like

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<v Speaker 1>an outlaw type figure, and so they rate it off together.

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<v Speaker 1>Helgi was born of Zigmund in Borghild and so they're

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<v Speaker 1>half siblings. But after Zigmund dies at the hands of

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<v Speaker 1>the Saxon king hunting, Helgi sets off to avenge his father,

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<v Speaker 1>which is a regular current in the the the saga

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<v Speaker 1>of you know, aventuring your kinsman when they're killed by somebody,

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<v Speaker 1>so and so, so Helgi goes off. He kills hunting

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<v Speaker 1>with Sinfiotli kill Hunding's children and in the process meets

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<v Speaker 1>up with.

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<v Speaker 2>The valkyrie. Who is it who's in this one? What's

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<v Speaker 2>her name?

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<v Speaker 3>Is it Sigurine in this one?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes?

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, yes, so so Segruin and so. But she is

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<v Speaker 1>already promised to this guy, Hobrod, this prince I believe

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<v Speaker 1>at this point Hoobroad. But she doesn't like him very much,

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<v Speaker 1>and so she basically commissions, how you to go off

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<v Speaker 1>and kill them so that way they can be together,

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<v Speaker 1>And that's what takes place. And that's basically the gist

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<v Speaker 1>of this poem. All right, that's probably succinctly as I

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<v Speaker 1>can put that together. So what you have to say

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<v Speaker 1>about this?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I was trying to remember all the foulsen sega

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<v Speaker 3>as I was reading through this. It's interesting with these

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<v Speaker 3>poems just it's they're so like similar, but it's like

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<v Speaker 3>different chunks and different kind of like interpretations. Yeah, no, exactly, sure,

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<v Speaker 3>I noticed the since Fiote and Goubmand Goodmand later on,

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<v Speaker 3>they're kind of exchanging, you know, insults again, as one

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<v Speaker 3>does in any kind of Norse.

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<v Speaker 1>Right right before that last kind of major battle. They Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>they get into this insult fight whether they can get

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<v Speaker 1>into each other's backstories. I mean, Guruan says that since

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<v Speaker 1>Fiote killed his brothers, which he did because Zigmund's sister,

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<v Speaker 1>who was Zigmund's sister, is that Signey?

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<v Speaker 2>Is that right?

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<v Speaker 1>Uh?

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<v Speaker 2>Do you remember all songs?

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<v Speaker 3>Yes?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, And so.

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<v Speaker 1>Signey is basically taking against her will as this foreign

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<v Speaker 1>king's wife, and you know she I mean out of

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00:22:59.720 --> 00:23:03.039
<v Speaker 1>spy for this king that she's married to basically gets

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00:23:03.079 --> 00:23:06.480
<v Speaker 1>sin Fioti to kill her children that she had with him,

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00:23:07.079 --> 00:23:09.240
<v Speaker 1>and so he does, you know, indeed, kill his brothers

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<v Speaker 1>since that's brought up against him as well as there's

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<v Speaker 1>a reference to when Sigmund and Sinfiolti wore these enchanted

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00:23:17.359 --> 00:23:19.359
<v Speaker 1>wolf skins that basically turned them to wear wolves, and

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<v Speaker 1>so you know, these rampages that he used to engage

396
00:23:22.920 --> 00:23:25.960
<v Speaker 1>with those are brought up here. And then as there

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00:23:26.079 --> 00:23:31.359
<v Speaker 1>usually is, there there's some you know, some sexual insults

398
00:23:31.400 --> 00:23:35.200
<v Speaker 1>thrown at each other. I can't remember off hand even

399
00:23:35.200 --> 00:23:38.359
<v Speaker 1>where there's or but I remember coming across them.

400
00:23:37.720 --> 00:23:41.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, basically saying, you know, you were dressed as like

401
00:23:42.240 --> 00:23:44.839
<v Speaker 3>one of their daughters or something, and you know it's

402
00:23:45.000 --> 00:23:50.319
<v Speaker 3>just that was this and filt and and later on too.

403
00:23:51.799 --> 00:23:53.599
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's some reference I can't even remember if this

404
00:23:53.680 --> 00:23:56.079
<v Speaker 1>is in this one or the other poem, which kind

405
00:23:56.079 --> 00:23:58.000
<v Speaker 1>of repeats a lot of this, but in a different way.

406
00:23:58.720 --> 00:24:03.480
<v Speaker 1>There's a mention about him into some guy's armor, like, yeah,

407
00:24:03.599 --> 00:24:05.720
<v Speaker 1>so all sorts of things like that, like we've seen

408
00:24:06.000 --> 00:24:10.799
<v Speaker 1>from this point now. One thing I thought it was

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00:24:10.799 --> 00:24:14.640
<v Speaker 1>interesting about this poem begins by talking about the norns

410
00:24:15.240 --> 00:24:17.720
<v Speaker 1>who are the Norse fates essentially right, They're the ones

411
00:24:17.720 --> 00:24:20.400
<v Speaker 1>who weave together the fates of the God's end of men.

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00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:24.400
<v Speaker 1>And so it starts off in the second stanza saying

413
00:24:25.240 --> 00:24:28.799
<v Speaker 1>night fell on the estate, then came norns, those who

414
00:24:28.799 --> 00:24:31.400
<v Speaker 1>shaped fate for the prince. And so it's a sense

415
00:24:31.440 --> 00:24:34.000
<v Speaker 1>that everything that we're about to read is happening according

416
00:24:34.039 --> 00:24:37.000
<v Speaker 1>to fate, which is not uncommon for these Northern tales

417
00:24:37.039 --> 00:24:39.440
<v Speaker 1>to be very clear that things are happening according to fate,

418
00:24:39.720 --> 00:24:44.680
<v Speaker 1>which gets to this idea that the kind of the

419
00:24:44.759 --> 00:24:47.519
<v Speaker 1>what happens in the story is not the point of

420
00:24:47.519 --> 00:24:50.599
<v Speaker 1>the story. The point of the story is the hero's

421
00:24:50.599 --> 00:24:55.279
<v Speaker 1>relationship to fate and really how he received that. And

422
00:24:55.359 --> 00:24:58.200
<v Speaker 1>so he said that things are going to happen as

423
00:24:58.200 --> 00:25:00.160
<v Speaker 1>they're going to happen. But I guess the question are

424
00:25:00.400 --> 00:25:05.200
<v Speaker 1>you going to fulfill your destiny by receiving it, you know,

425
00:25:05.440 --> 00:25:07.480
<v Speaker 1>or are you going to fight against it? And we

426
00:25:07.519 --> 00:25:10.720
<v Speaker 1>see that the path of honor that Helgy carries out

427
00:25:11.160 --> 00:25:12.799
<v Speaker 1>is the one that just kind of accepts his fate,

428
00:25:13.200 --> 00:25:17.839
<v Speaker 1>like you know, he's well, I guess this connects to

429
00:25:17.960 --> 00:25:21.680
<v Speaker 1>the next poem about Helge. So if I'll say my

430
00:25:21.720 --> 00:25:25.359
<v Speaker 1>hand on that it's it's it's hard to talk about

431
00:25:25.359 --> 00:25:26.359
<v Speaker 1>this in a straightforward way.

432
00:25:28.799 --> 00:25:32.000
<v Speaker 3>I don't know this one. This one's kind of like

433
00:25:32.640 --> 00:25:36.799
<v Speaker 3>I felt like this one was the not as in

434
00:25:36.920 --> 00:25:39.440
<v Speaker 3>depth of what's happening. I think it took like till

435
00:25:39.440 --> 00:25:43.079
<v Speaker 3>the last three that kind of get what's going on.

436
00:25:44.680 --> 00:25:49.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I guess we can jump around some and

437
00:25:49.559 --> 00:25:53.240
<v Speaker 1>should we go ahead and talk about the poem of Well, actually,

438
00:25:53.279 --> 00:25:54.480
<v Speaker 1>one thing I do just want to mention it kind

439
00:25:54.480 --> 00:25:59.559
<v Speaker 1>of in passing even the name of Helgi he referred

440
00:25:59.599 --> 00:26:04.680
<v Speaker 1>to as hell Hounding's body, which you know that you

441
00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:06.359
<v Speaker 1>know what we think of his last name, but as

442
00:26:06.400 --> 00:26:08.319
<v Speaker 1>really more of a title, you know, speaks to the

443
00:26:08.319 --> 00:26:12.599
<v Speaker 1>fact that he is the bane of hunting. He's Hunting's bane, right, hunting,

444
00:26:12.640 --> 00:26:15.119
<v Speaker 1>being this killer of his father that then he goes

445
00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:17.480
<v Speaker 1>off and kills, and so he is the bane of hunting,

446
00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:21.799
<v Speaker 1>which again gives us some of precedents for for Tolkien's language,

447
00:26:21.799 --> 00:26:25.000
<v Speaker 1>like when he refers to, you know, Isildur's bane or

448
00:26:25.559 --> 00:26:28.559
<v Speaker 1>Durham's bane as these things that did them in He's

449
00:26:28.640 --> 00:26:31.680
<v Speaker 1>very much just using this northern kind of language, which I.

450
00:26:31.799 --> 00:26:32.880
<v Speaker 2>Think is an interesting connection.

451
00:26:34.559 --> 00:26:37.079
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, I guess we can go in and talk

452
00:26:37.079 --> 00:26:42.519
<v Speaker 1>a little bit about the poem of Helge Yorwertsen, which

453
00:26:43.039 --> 00:26:49.079
<v Speaker 1>really jumps back to a different Helgi, maybe at least

454
00:26:49.279 --> 00:26:55.160
<v Speaker 1>a different version of Helgi. And so in this poem

455
00:26:55.200 --> 00:26:57.200
<v Speaker 1>which I don't even know if I can summarize all

456
00:26:57.240 --> 00:27:06.039
<v Speaker 1>this with, so we've got this king, well, maybe i'll

457
00:27:06.079 --> 00:27:09.279
<v Speaker 1>read the introduction. Helgiy Hilbert's Son is a kind of

458
00:27:09.359 --> 00:27:13.720
<v Speaker 1>doublet of Helgi Hondingsbahni, whose two poems surround his in

459
00:27:13.759 --> 00:27:18.119
<v Speaker 1>the manuscript. The poem of Helgi Heilbertson follows the basic

460
00:27:18.119 --> 00:27:20.480
<v Speaker 1>plot of the other Helgi poems with an added prelude

461
00:27:20.559 --> 00:27:24.119
<v Speaker 1>telling of the winning of Helgi's mother. This sets up

462
00:27:24.160 --> 00:27:28.599
<v Speaker 1>Helgi's first adventure killing his mother's disgruntled former wooer. Then

463
00:27:28.680 --> 00:27:32.440
<v Speaker 1>comes a flighting between the heroes Lieutenant Atli and a

464
00:27:32.480 --> 00:27:36.000
<v Speaker 1>troll woman Rumgerd, the marriage with the valkyrie, and the

465
00:27:36.039 --> 00:27:38.039
<v Speaker 1>death of the hands of the son of his former enemy.

466
00:27:38.440 --> 00:27:40.720
<v Speaker 1>Compared with the other two Helgi poems, the plot in

467
00:27:40.720 --> 00:27:44.359
<v Speaker 1>this poem is less coherent. The fighting between Atlee and

468
00:27:44.480 --> 00:27:47.920
<v Speaker 1>Shromguard parallels that in the previous poem, and Hayden's vow

469
00:27:47.960 --> 00:27:51.359
<v Speaker 1>has no clear tragic consequences. He simply acquires his brother's

470
00:27:51.359 --> 00:27:54.400
<v Speaker 1>bride after his death. The poem ends before we know

471
00:27:54.440 --> 00:27:57.720
<v Speaker 1>whether Hayden dies avenging Helgi or whether he and Svava

472
00:27:57.920 --> 00:28:01.480
<v Speaker 1>find love together. There's some parallels between this poem and

473
00:28:01.559 --> 00:28:04.880
<v Speaker 1>the other poems. We're dealing again with a guy named Helgi,

474
00:28:06.039 --> 00:28:11.480
<v Speaker 1>and some kind of similar things take place here. He

475
00:28:11.720 --> 00:28:17.240
<v Speaker 1>falls in love with the valkyrie Sapa, who seems who

476
00:28:17.400 --> 00:28:20.720
<v Speaker 1>is or who will kind of reincarnate into the Valkyrie

477
00:28:20.759 --> 00:28:24.480
<v Speaker 1>of the other poems. And it's at least heavily implied

478
00:28:24.480 --> 00:28:26.359
<v Speaker 1>that the Helgi of the other poems is not merely

479
00:28:26.400 --> 00:28:29.039
<v Speaker 1>named after this Algie, but he has the reincarnated Hugi,

480
00:28:29.119 --> 00:28:30.680
<v Speaker 1>the one and the same. And so we get these

481
00:28:31.359 --> 00:28:35.240
<v Speaker 1>these lovers, this Helgi and the Valkyrie, who die and

482
00:28:35.240 --> 00:28:37.319
<v Speaker 1>then they get reincarnated again and sort of play out

483
00:28:37.359 --> 00:28:43.440
<v Speaker 1>similar roles in another lifetime. Yeah, I guess that's enough background.

484
00:28:44.319 --> 00:28:45.759
<v Speaker 1>What what do you have to say about this?

485
00:28:46.680 --> 00:28:49.039
<v Speaker 3>I do think it's funny that she she shows like, hey,

486
00:28:49.039 --> 00:28:51.960
<v Speaker 3>this is the least coherent compared to the other two,

487
00:28:52.000 --> 00:28:54.400
<v Speaker 3>which are not super cot.

488
00:28:54.200 --> 00:28:56.759
<v Speaker 1>Correct, So it's definitely comforting to read that.

489
00:28:57.519 --> 00:29:05.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, I think throughout these poems, I think just

490
00:29:05.039 --> 00:29:09.200
<v Speaker 3>to remember that, like it's the family of like Sigmund,

491
00:29:09.279 --> 00:29:14.599
<v Speaker 3>and then the Huntings are enemies just hostled towards each other.

492
00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:17.640
<v Speaker 3>So it's just a consistent like trade off of like, oh,

493
00:29:17.680 --> 00:29:20.240
<v Speaker 3>you killed my kinsman, I'm going to come kill you

494
00:29:20.519 --> 00:29:23.240
<v Speaker 3>or you know, and then you bring in the third portion,

495
00:29:23.400 --> 00:29:25.480
<v Speaker 3>which is just like, hey, this is somebody that like

496
00:29:25.599 --> 00:29:28.319
<v Speaker 3>loved that woman, but she didn't return the feelings, so

497
00:29:29.240 --> 00:29:31.039
<v Speaker 3>now we got to kill him. But then his sons

498
00:29:31.039 --> 00:29:32.680
<v Speaker 3>are going to try and come kill us. So it's

499
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:35.880
<v Speaker 3>just a cycle of like revenge.

500
00:29:36.720 --> 00:29:42.000
<v Speaker 1>Right right, Which I think is a major point of

501
00:29:42.000 --> 00:29:46.440
<v Speaker 1>a lot of these poems is that well, actually I

502
00:29:46.680 --> 00:29:50.240
<v Speaker 1>don't know what the point is because you know, one hand,

503
00:29:51.359 --> 00:29:54.000
<v Speaker 1>it would be easy to read this and get out

504
00:29:54.000 --> 00:29:56.759
<v Speaker 1>of like the futility of the cycle of revenge. But

505
00:29:56.799 --> 00:29:59.640
<v Speaker 1>at the same time, like the revenge is built into

506
00:29:59.680 --> 00:30:01.519
<v Speaker 1>the honor system of these people, and so it's like

507
00:30:01.559 --> 00:30:03.720
<v Speaker 1>it's even really criticism or the way of saying like

508
00:30:03.960 --> 00:30:04.880
<v Speaker 1>this is how things are.

509
00:30:05.720 --> 00:30:08.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I mean, I don't think it would be like

510
00:30:09.160 --> 00:30:12.720
<v Speaker 3>very much different than what was happening there. You know,

511
00:30:12.839 --> 00:30:16.400
<v Speaker 3>like they these are obviously built off of what's happening

512
00:30:17.400 --> 00:30:23.839
<v Speaker 3>in you know, in history. You know, so that's around

513
00:30:23.839 --> 00:30:26.440
<v Speaker 3>that time. I'm sure people were killing each other affinching

514
00:30:26.519 --> 00:30:32.400
<v Speaker 3>and you're talking about it, but I didn't notice it,

515
00:30:32.440 --> 00:30:36.240
<v Speaker 3>said Otti, But I don't know if that's supposed to be,

516
00:30:36.480 --> 00:30:39.640
<v Speaker 3>Like I know when other poems Atli was like Attila

517
00:30:39.720 --> 00:30:41.640
<v Speaker 3>the Hunt, but I don't know if that isn't this one.

518
00:30:42.799 --> 00:30:43.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

519
00:30:43.680 --> 00:30:47.599
<v Speaker 1>I had that confusion at first too, But it seems

520
00:30:47.640 --> 00:30:50.599
<v Speaker 1>to be two different people in my reading in that

521
00:30:50.839 --> 00:30:55.279
<v Speaker 1>Atle seems to be basically the commander of Helgi or

522
00:30:55.279 --> 00:30:58.119
<v Speaker 1>like one of his lieutenants, and based on context, it

523
00:30:58.119 --> 00:31:00.000
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't make sense for that to be until the Hunt,

524
00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:02.160
<v Speaker 1>and so I can only assume these are two different people.

525
00:31:02.400 --> 00:31:04.359
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, I thought about that as well.

526
00:31:05.799 --> 00:31:09.519
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and I think that one comes later anyway, because

527
00:31:09.559 --> 00:31:13.960
<v Speaker 3>that would have been with that's with like Brent Hill

528
00:31:14.039 --> 00:31:25.640
<v Speaker 3>and everything. Right, Let's see, this does bring back him

529
00:31:25.680 --> 00:31:30.279
<v Speaker 3>listening to the birds makes me think of when is

530
00:31:30.319 --> 00:31:38.160
<v Speaker 3>it faff near slave by? Uh? Figured figured, yeah, and uh,

531
00:31:38.279 --> 00:31:43.680
<v Speaker 3>he's able to hear the hear the birds speaking, which

532
00:31:43.759 --> 00:31:48.599
<v Speaker 3>ends up being negative for him. But here I was

533
00:31:48.599 --> 00:31:50.000
<v Speaker 3>starting to read it and I was like oh no,

534
00:31:50.240 --> 00:31:53.759
<v Speaker 3>birds are talking. It's it's trouble now because they must

535
00:31:53.839 --> 00:31:55.759
<v Speaker 3>lie or.

536
00:31:55.839 --> 00:32:03.160
<v Speaker 1>Just yeh, yeah, I assume understanding birds is some sign

537
00:32:03.200 --> 00:32:07.920
<v Speaker 1>of wisdom, probably connected to like Odin and his ravens

538
00:32:09.079 --> 00:32:12.400
<v Speaker 1>Odin being associated with wisdom, which you know, in this context,

539
00:32:12.400 --> 00:32:15.240
<v Speaker 1>wisdom is not always necessarily a good thing. It's more

540
00:32:15.279 --> 00:32:18.440
<v Speaker 1>like just knowledge more than anything else, which could be

541
00:32:18.519 --> 00:32:20.000
<v Speaker 1>a good thing or it could not.

542
00:32:19.960 --> 00:32:20.559
<v Speaker 2>Be a good thing.

543
00:32:20.640 --> 00:32:22.960
<v Speaker 1>And I guess we don't get a sign it's necessarily

544
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:26.319
<v Speaker 1>a bad thing here, although Helgy does seem to get

545
00:32:26.319 --> 00:32:30.119
<v Speaker 1>the sense that he is marked by fate, especially towards

546
00:32:30.119 --> 00:32:33.319
<v Speaker 1>the end of the story, so I don't know. Maybe

547
00:32:33.359 --> 00:32:36.839
<v Speaker 1>this He's always been kind of a doomed type of figure,

548
00:32:36.880 --> 00:32:39.519
<v Speaker 1>which is again definitely a theme that Tolkien like to

549
00:32:39.720 --> 00:32:41.160
<v Speaker 1>pick up, especially in the Silmarlion.

550
00:32:41.920 --> 00:32:48.799
<v Speaker 3>M Yeah, Nattie is at least clever enough to not

551
00:32:49.079 --> 00:32:53.519
<v Speaker 3>just make an open ended yeah, I'll sacrifice anything to

552
00:32:53.599 --> 00:32:58.240
<v Speaker 3>you from the you know, anything he wishes from the

553
00:32:58.279 --> 00:33:01.720
<v Speaker 3>King's sport. He like lays out like not gonna kill

554
00:33:01.720 --> 00:33:07.359
<v Speaker 3>like the bride's of the king, the king or any

555
00:33:07.400 --> 00:33:10.000
<v Speaker 3>of his sons. So good on at.

556
00:33:11.359 --> 00:33:16.119
<v Speaker 1>Right, Yeah, And then again we get a fighting or

557
00:33:16.200 --> 00:33:23.880
<v Speaker 1>the insult competition match, this time between this between Atli

558
00:33:24.480 --> 00:33:30.000
<v Speaker 1>and the troll woman room guard, which again ends in

559
00:33:30.039 --> 00:33:31.640
<v Speaker 1>her turning it a stone because they keep up the

560
00:33:31.720 --> 00:33:36.359
<v Speaker 1>argument until sunrise. And so I just kind of repeated

561
00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:38.759
<v Speaker 1>the same idea there, and.

562
00:33:38.759 --> 00:33:42.519
<v Speaker 3>I even feel like it's yeah, he's he's speaking to him,

563
00:33:42.559 --> 00:33:45.960
<v Speaker 3>and doesn't it Hell he got in there. Maybe it

564
00:33:46.039 --> 00:33:50.960
<v Speaker 3>was once, Oh that's what it was. They're doing kind

565
00:33:50.960 --> 00:33:51.640
<v Speaker 3>of an insult.

566
00:33:51.759 --> 00:33:55.319
<v Speaker 2>And then right and then how he gets pulled in.

567
00:33:56.279 --> 00:33:58.359
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, hell, he gets pulled in and he's like, all right,

568
00:33:58.400 --> 00:34:01.359
<v Speaker 3>at are you gonna, you know, sleep with this ogre?

569
00:34:01.720 --> 00:34:07.599
<v Speaker 3>And he's like, right right, the worst of the love

570
00:34:07.599 --> 00:34:10.559
<v Speaker 3>of dwelling ogres. He's a fitting that made for you.

571
00:34:10.639 --> 00:34:11.960
<v Speaker 3>That's that's a good insult.

572
00:34:12.039 --> 00:34:21.199
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, you know, save that one for Twitter. Yeah,

573
00:34:21.199 --> 00:34:24.559
<v Speaker 1>and then jumping toward the end, and we.

574
00:34:24.519 --> 00:34:25.800
<v Speaker 2>Can always go back if if need be.

575
00:34:25.960 --> 00:34:29.000
<v Speaker 1>But toward the end we find that he's, you know,

576
00:34:29.000 --> 00:34:32.400
<v Speaker 1>after Helgi's won all these great conquests and you know,

577
00:34:32.400 --> 00:34:38.960
<v Speaker 1>great glories. Then his brother Hayden back home, has somebody

578
00:34:38.960 --> 00:34:42.159
<v Speaker 1>approached him. Who is it that's like a some kind

579
00:34:42.159 --> 00:34:43.679
<v Speaker 1>of like witch or something.

580
00:34:43.679 --> 00:34:44.480
<v Speaker 2>I don't control.

581
00:34:46.440 --> 00:34:49.519
<v Speaker 1>I can't remember some something of that sort of nature

582
00:34:50.119 --> 00:34:53.199
<v Speaker 1>approaches him and wants him to to get together with her,

583
00:34:53.320 --> 00:34:55.880
<v Speaker 1>to sleep with her or something, and he says no.

584
00:34:56.199 --> 00:34:59.360
<v Speaker 1>So then she dooms him essentially, and so that he

585
00:34:59.400 --> 00:35:01.920
<v Speaker 1>gets into when he gets into the Ale where he

586
00:35:01.920 --> 00:35:06.039
<v Speaker 1>starts drinking and then pledges that he's going to have Vava,

587
00:35:06.440 --> 00:35:13.360
<v Speaker 1>his brother's valkyrie wife. And then he comes to and

588
00:35:13.440 --> 00:35:16.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, he's recognizes in his sobriety that he made

589
00:35:16.000 --> 00:35:22.480
<v Speaker 1>a big mistake. But even Helgey recognizes that a there's

590
00:35:22.519 --> 00:35:24.960
<v Speaker 1>like something sacred about what's said over ale, and so

591
00:35:25.320 --> 00:35:27.599
<v Speaker 1>he says, all right, well now we have to duel

592
00:35:27.639 --> 00:35:30.400
<v Speaker 1>over this and there's no way out of it. And

593
00:35:30.440 --> 00:35:32.119
<v Speaker 1>that's how healthy dies.

594
00:35:33.519 --> 00:35:35.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's it's interesting.

595
00:35:36.119 --> 00:35:38.480
<v Speaker 3>You know, even back then, they're realizing, you know, when

596
00:35:38.480 --> 00:35:43.440
<v Speaker 3>you're when you're drunk or making a pledge over drinks,

597
00:35:43.480 --> 00:35:47.239
<v Speaker 3>you're typically gonna say, what's fully on your mind? Takes

598
00:35:47.239 --> 00:35:52.559
<v Speaker 3>all the inhibitions out. Yeah, this troll woman riding a

599
00:35:52.599 --> 00:35:58.039
<v Speaker 3>wolf with serpents's reins. I'm surprised, he said, no. I mean,

600
00:35:58.199 --> 00:36:05.880
<v Speaker 3>it just seems like such a very feeling. But yeah, yeah, good,

601
00:36:06.719 --> 00:36:09.760
<v Speaker 3>just it's a it's a weird reaction from healthy where

602
00:36:09.760 --> 00:36:12.480
<v Speaker 3>he's just like not immediately like taking it back, like

603
00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:14.199
<v Speaker 3>this is the woman that I love if you're about

604
00:36:14.239 --> 00:36:17.239
<v Speaker 3>to you're trying to sleep, where he's like, I'm probably

605
00:36:17.239 --> 00:36:19.920
<v Speaker 3>gonna die. So he just this may turn out good

606
00:36:19.960 --> 00:36:20.800
<v Speaker 3>for you, just wait.

607
00:36:22.360 --> 00:36:22.519
<v Speaker 2>Right.

608
00:36:22.559 --> 00:36:25.079
<v Speaker 1>It's like he's not really concerned with the outcome or

609
00:36:25.239 --> 00:36:28.440
<v Speaker 1>the dishonor that he's been dealt with. He just recognized

610
00:36:28.480 --> 00:36:30.800
<v Speaker 1>his brother and he stuff whole his honor and you know,

611
00:36:30.920 --> 00:36:34.159
<v Speaker 1>do what he set out to do. And so he's

612
00:36:34.199 --> 00:36:38.360
<v Speaker 1>just totally okay with his duel. But yeah, it's interesting

613
00:36:38.400 --> 00:36:41.159
<v Speaker 1>that we think today that you know, if if somebody

614
00:36:41.519 --> 00:36:44.760
<v Speaker 1>clearly inebriated that, okay, you're not gonna put too much

615
00:36:44.760 --> 00:36:47.360
<v Speaker 1>stock in what they're saying. But yeah, as you said,

616
00:36:48.119 --> 00:36:51.039
<v Speaker 1>they really understand that no alcohol tends to actually bring

617
00:36:51.079 --> 00:36:55.400
<v Speaker 1>out what's really in your heart and so it's actually

618
00:36:55.440 --> 00:37:00.440
<v Speaker 1>more binding, not less binding, and and so yeah, just

619
00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:03.280
<v Speaker 1>it's interesting that Helgi is totally kind of okay with

620
00:37:03.320 --> 00:37:08.480
<v Speaker 1>this on an emotional level. I definitely think that it's

621
00:37:09.360 --> 00:37:11.719
<v Speaker 1>not a bad idea to read like you know, the

622
00:37:11.760 --> 00:37:16.599
<v Speaker 1>stoics like Marcus Raeli's or something alongside this Northern literature,

623
00:37:16.679 --> 00:37:20.800
<v Speaker 1>because it's so much like against the emotional. It's just

624
00:37:21.480 --> 00:37:23.599
<v Speaker 1>this is the path of honor, this is what I need.

625
00:37:23.519 --> 00:37:24.079
<v Speaker 2>To go out and do.

626
00:37:26.719 --> 00:37:31.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And so that is indeed how Helgi dies, and

627
00:37:31.199 --> 00:37:34.840
<v Speaker 1>then it says here we get a prose conclusion right

628
00:37:34.880 --> 00:37:37.960
<v Speaker 1>at the end after he dies that Helgi and Slava

629
00:37:38.079 --> 00:37:41.719
<v Speaker 1>are said to have been reincarnated. And then that's how

630
00:37:41.760 --> 00:37:45.519
<v Speaker 1>it ends, which sets us up for the other Helgi

631
00:37:45.639 --> 00:37:50.840
<v Speaker 1>in his Valkyrie Bride of Vrocyrariy Lover that seems to

632
00:37:50.840 --> 00:37:54.039
<v Speaker 1>be them reincarnated. Although it's interesting that the end of

633
00:37:54.079 --> 00:38:01.440
<v Speaker 1>the second poem of Helgi hundingsbani Are narrator pops in

634
00:38:01.519 --> 00:38:06.239
<v Speaker 1>and says that reincarnation is like a old wives tale

635
00:38:06.239 --> 00:38:08.559
<v Speaker 1>of the Pagans, and so I kind of assume this

636
00:38:08.599 --> 00:38:11.199
<v Speaker 1>is some kind of Christian narrator saying that, okay, this

637
00:38:11.239 --> 00:38:12.880
<v Speaker 1>is all bunkish, just the story.

638
00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:17.519
<v Speaker 3>There was a belief in pagan times that is crazy

639
00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:21.440
<v Speaker 3>that I like that. Like with the pros that I know,

640
00:38:21.679 --> 00:38:28.360
<v Speaker 3>Snory had left out some things that were more pagan

641
00:38:28.400 --> 00:38:31.119
<v Speaker 3>and more kind of out there and kind of inserted

642
00:38:31.239 --> 00:38:34.760
<v Speaker 3>more of what he thought with Christian stuff and kind

643
00:38:34.760 --> 00:38:35.360
<v Speaker 3>of made it clear.

644
00:38:38.519 --> 00:38:41.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean, you know, even in his introduction to

645
00:38:41.480 --> 00:38:44.519
<v Speaker 1>the pros that Snory he tries to kind of humanize

646
00:38:44.559 --> 00:38:47.480
<v Speaker 1>the gods even and say that, you know, they came

647
00:38:47.519 --> 00:38:52.880
<v Speaker 1>from Troy, like he's trying to, you know, well, giving

648
00:38:52.960 --> 00:38:56.280
<v Speaker 1>us the pagan mythos, he's kind of demathologizing it somewhat,

649
00:38:56.320 --> 00:38:57.960
<v Speaker 1>he's trying to sanitize some of it, make it a

650
00:38:57.960 --> 00:39:01.039
<v Speaker 1>little bit more palatable to a Christian audio. But I

651
00:39:01.079 --> 00:39:03.880
<v Speaker 1>was surprised that even in the prose ata to get

652
00:39:03.880 --> 00:39:06.559
<v Speaker 1>this epilogue where it just you know, makes this reference

653
00:39:06.599 --> 00:39:17.840
<v Speaker 1>to pagan times, you know, very very straightforward. Well, we've

654
00:39:17.920 --> 00:39:21.760
<v Speaker 1>kind of jumped around a bit. So whether we're dealing

655
00:39:21.800 --> 00:39:27.119
<v Speaker 1>with this second poems Bani or whatever, I don't know,

656
00:39:27.159 --> 00:39:28.559
<v Speaker 1>what's something else on your mind?

657
00:39:29.000 --> 00:39:33.519
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, this, so it definitely doesn't tell us whatever happens.

658
00:39:33.559 --> 00:39:39.559
<v Speaker 3>I know, heading rides out to Avenge we are told

659
00:39:39.559 --> 00:39:43.800
<v Speaker 3>of he ends up being with Spava before she dies.

660
00:39:44.280 --> 00:39:44.679
<v Speaker 2>Mm hmm.

661
00:39:46.239 --> 00:39:48.480
<v Speaker 3>But yeah, in both of these it's it's talking about

662
00:39:48.519 --> 00:39:52.519
<v Speaker 3>how he has this, he meets the same fate right

663
00:39:53.039 --> 00:40:01.480
<v Speaker 3>he fights? Is it original part or the poem was

664
00:40:01.599 --> 00:40:04.920
<v Speaker 3>alf son of Rob Moore, So it was a it

665
00:40:05.039 --> 00:40:10.199
<v Speaker 3>was avenging his father killing. And then I can't remember

666
00:40:10.239 --> 00:40:14.159
<v Speaker 3>if the second one was the same thing. No, it

667
00:40:14.239 --> 00:40:18.679
<v Speaker 3>said Dag, So it was a little different than it was.

668
00:40:20.719 --> 00:40:25.880
<v Speaker 1>Because the second one has some seemed echoing a repetition

669
00:40:25.920 --> 00:40:27.000
<v Speaker 1>of what happens in the first poem.

670
00:40:27.000 --> 00:40:28.239
<v Speaker 2>But then it takes it further.

671
00:40:29.639 --> 00:40:34.159
<v Speaker 1>In that we still have the the Valkyrie wants Helgi

672
00:40:34.400 --> 00:40:39.679
<v Speaker 1>to go and kill the hole Road, you know. After

673
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:42.239
<v Speaker 1>so he kills Hunting and then he goes off to

674
00:40:42.360 --> 00:40:45.400
<v Speaker 1>kill holb Road. But then the story kind of goes

675
00:40:45.440 --> 00:40:48.559
<v Speaker 1>on from there, which is going to lead to this

676
00:40:48.639 --> 00:40:52.639
<v Speaker 1>Halgy's death from what was it dog.

677
00:40:52.480 --> 00:40:56.000
<v Speaker 3>Or so dog is Dog is Hogney son, So that

678
00:40:56.000 --> 00:41:00.159
<v Speaker 3>would have been Sigurn's father. I guess signs brother be

679
00:41:00.199 --> 00:41:02.800
<v Speaker 3>a half brother, maybe a full brother, but instead of

680
00:41:02.800 --> 00:41:06.280
<v Speaker 3>being Rod Moore's son, it's Hogny's son that fights him.

681
00:41:07.599 --> 00:41:13.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so there's some similarity there. And I do think

682
00:41:13.920 --> 00:41:21.440
<v Speaker 1>it's interesting that Dog, you know when he so that's

683
00:41:23.519 --> 00:41:26.880
<v Speaker 1>so Dog is Segrew and the Valkyrie's sister, right, and

684
00:41:26.960 --> 00:41:31.320
<v Speaker 1>so he's the one who's going to kill Helgi in

685
00:41:31.360 --> 00:41:34.960
<v Speaker 1>the in this in this rendition, and it says that Okay,

686
00:41:34.960 --> 00:41:41.400
<v Speaker 1>he sets off to to kill him, and he basically

687
00:41:41.440 --> 00:41:44.679
<v Speaker 1>he makes a sacrifice to Odin, and so Odin kind

688
00:41:44.679 --> 00:41:47.199
<v Speaker 1>of gives him the ability to kill Helgi. And Odin

689
00:41:47.320 --> 00:41:48.679
<v Speaker 1>is just such an interesting character.

690
00:41:48.920 --> 00:41:49.079
<v Speaker 2>You know.

691
00:41:49.079 --> 00:41:51.119
<v Speaker 1>He shows up a few times in the the voll

692
00:41:51.159 --> 00:41:54.079
<v Speaker 1>Song saga where sometimes he's helping the vol Songs and

693
00:41:54.079 --> 00:41:56.480
<v Speaker 1>then helps randomly show up and bring about their death,

694
00:41:57.719 --> 00:42:00.199
<v Speaker 1>which is what happens to to Sigmund I believe, who

695
00:42:00.239 --> 00:42:03.559
<v Speaker 1>was in the Father of Hugi where Sigmund was in

696
00:42:03.599 --> 00:42:07.400
<v Speaker 1>this battle, and then Odin shows up and basically shatters

697
00:42:07.400 --> 00:42:11.519
<v Speaker 1>his sword, and then that leads him to be defenseless.

698
00:42:11.559 --> 00:42:15.679
<v Speaker 1>Then he dies the sword, which would then be re

699
00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:19.320
<v Speaker 1>forged by Ziggurd giving a strong Narsal vibes.

700
00:42:19.920 --> 00:42:21.079
<v Speaker 2>But that's beside the point.

701
00:42:22.679 --> 00:42:25.119
<v Speaker 1>And so yeah, Odin just kind of shows up and

702
00:42:25.119 --> 00:42:26.360
<v Speaker 1>then shows up again at the end of the Wollsong

703
00:42:26.400 --> 00:42:30.800
<v Speaker 1>saga to kill off the last Wolsong essentially, and so Odin,

704
00:42:32.280 --> 00:42:37.239
<v Speaker 1>you know, he's always stirring up these conflicts between these people,

705
00:42:37.400 --> 00:42:41.079
<v Speaker 1>these dynasties' families, and he's always like raising up a

706
00:42:41.119 --> 00:42:44.440
<v Speaker 1>powerful warrior and then conspiring to bring about his death

707
00:42:44.960 --> 00:42:48.519
<v Speaker 1>because he's trying to fill Valhalla with you know, these

708
00:42:48.679 --> 00:42:51.880
<v Speaker 1>great warriors for you know, for Ragnarok, and so he's

709
00:42:51.920 --> 00:42:53.679
<v Speaker 1>got his own ends at a play here.

710
00:42:54.400 --> 00:42:56.719
<v Speaker 3>Yeah that makes I mean, that makes sense because if

711
00:42:56.760 --> 00:42:59.719
<v Speaker 3>these are men that would not have fallen in battle,

712
00:43:01.239 --> 00:43:03.360
<v Speaker 3>probably they probably would have died of all day because

713
00:43:03.360 --> 00:43:07.280
<v Speaker 3>they were stronger than everybody else. Obviously, Oden's gonna need

714
00:43:07.280 --> 00:43:10.719
<v Speaker 3>to find a way to find the loophole so that

715
00:43:10.760 --> 00:43:14.000
<v Speaker 3>they don't go to to uh underworld with hell.

716
00:43:14.679 --> 00:43:17.119
<v Speaker 1>Right right until you build them up and then make

717
00:43:17.119 --> 00:43:18.199
<v Speaker 1>sure that they die in battle.

718
00:43:20.000 --> 00:43:22.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, to.

719
00:43:22.159 --> 00:43:24.320
<v Speaker 1>Be fair, how Gey is uh, you know, made to

720
00:43:24.360 --> 00:43:26.559
<v Speaker 1>be like his right hand man in Dahala.

721
00:43:27.199 --> 00:43:31.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, not a bad way to go, yeah, I guess

722
00:43:31.360 --> 00:43:39.400
<v Speaker 3>until the end. But the what was it? Yeah, and

723
00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:42.920
<v Speaker 3>this one we see Cigaurine actually or Cigareine actually go

724
00:43:44.039 --> 00:43:47.360
<v Speaker 3>and find hot Rock on like the point of death,

725
00:43:47.440 --> 00:43:50.400
<v Speaker 3>laying in the field and just being like, yeah, I'm

726
00:43:50.400 --> 00:43:55.519
<v Speaker 3>not gonna sink into your arms, bro, uh, you're actually

727
00:43:55.599 --> 00:43:58.199
<v Speaker 3>gonna have your you know, y'all are all going to

728
00:43:58.239 --> 00:44:03.559
<v Speaker 3>be eaten by wolves our show. It's like, all right,

729
00:44:06.519 --> 00:44:10.480
<v Speaker 3>Helgi just likes really metal women, I guess.

730
00:44:10.440 --> 00:44:15.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I mean at one point, she is even

731
00:44:15.159 --> 00:44:17.800
<v Speaker 1>referred to as their their battle goddess.

732
00:44:18.000 --> 00:44:20.599
<v Speaker 2>It's yeah, definitely very very metal.

733
00:44:21.880 --> 00:44:28.599
<v Speaker 3>Valkyrie, very really yeah, just fine. This one brings in

734
00:44:28.679 --> 00:44:31.440
<v Speaker 3>something that the other one doesn't in terms of meeting

735
00:44:32.360 --> 00:44:38.119
<v Speaker 3>Helgi at the burial now, uh yeah, once they I

736
00:44:38.159 --> 00:44:42.800
<v Speaker 3>don't know if he's like a in ghost form or

737
00:44:43.840 --> 00:44:47.440
<v Speaker 3>just has not like fully laid down yet. What did

738
00:44:47.440 --> 00:44:49.079
<v Speaker 3>you get from that? Were you seeing If it was like,

739
00:44:49.840 --> 00:44:52.119
<v Speaker 3>I mean, this is just like not fully dead or.

740
00:44:52.960 --> 00:44:56.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it seems to be that he has kind of

741
00:44:56.320 --> 00:44:59.119
<v Speaker 1>some ability to, you know, even though he lives with Odin,

742
00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:03.440
<v Speaker 1>you know, sometimes at night he's able to sort of

743
00:45:03.440 --> 00:45:06.480
<v Speaker 1>cross the veil and you.

744
00:45:06.440 --> 00:45:08.079
<v Speaker 2>Know, appear in his burial ground.

745
00:45:08.159 --> 00:45:10.920
<v Speaker 1>I think it's interesting that I think, and I could

746
00:45:10.960 --> 00:45:12.920
<v Speaker 1>be mixing up the poems, but I think it was

747
00:45:13.000 --> 00:45:18.000
<v Speaker 1>in the poem of helge Orbitson where it says that

748
00:45:18.440 --> 00:45:21.800
<v Speaker 1>he was toward the beginning of the poem, where it

749
00:45:21.800 --> 00:45:24.719
<v Speaker 1>says that he was sitting on basically a burial mound

750
00:45:25.039 --> 00:45:27.719
<v Speaker 1>and he saw valkyries passing by, And so there's some

751
00:45:27.840 --> 00:45:30.800
<v Speaker 1>kind of connection here. I don't know exactly what that is,

752
00:45:30.840 --> 00:45:33.239
<v Speaker 1>but that there's some connection here with the Helgi's with

753
00:45:33.320 --> 00:45:36.440
<v Speaker 1>burial mounds, the da sort of like living on the

754
00:45:36.559 --> 00:45:40.519
<v Speaker 1>edge of things, having some connection to the beyond the other.

755
00:45:41.800 --> 00:45:44.039
<v Speaker 1>And so Helgi seems to have this sort of special

756
00:45:45.360 --> 00:45:49.719
<v Speaker 1>liminal sort of existence at this point where by day

757
00:45:49.760 --> 00:45:52.320
<v Speaker 1>he's with Odin and by night he's able to visit

758
00:45:52.360 --> 00:45:58.239
<v Speaker 1>with or with Sigrun at the burial mound.

759
00:45:59.559 --> 00:46:02.519
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Even I mean, maybe it's something to do with

760
00:46:02.559 --> 00:46:08.199
<v Speaker 3>like he's destined for Valhalla, va Hall or whatever, you know,

761
00:46:09.400 --> 00:46:12.559
<v Speaker 3>where he's down the Barymone seeing the Valkyries and then

762
00:46:12.639 --> 00:46:16.800
<v Speaker 3>later coming out and with Odin with like you're saying,

763
00:46:22.199 --> 00:46:30.440
<v Speaker 3>mm hm, they just they just spent one night together

764
00:46:30.519 --> 00:46:37.000
<v Speaker 3>and he was occupied. I uh. Before we get to

765
00:46:37.039 --> 00:46:42.039
<v Speaker 3>that part, it talks about Odin just thrower ice. Helgy

766
00:46:42.920 --> 00:46:47.559
<v Speaker 3>throws in that hunting is it's basically like a servant

767
00:46:47.960 --> 00:46:53.199
<v Speaker 3>in Uh right.

768
00:46:53.320 --> 00:46:55.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we're told that he has made you know, basically,

769
00:46:56.920 --> 00:46:59.880
<v Speaker 1>so he's asked to roll over everything in Valhalla alongside

770
00:47:00.199 --> 00:47:03.159
<v Speaker 1>and the first thing he says is hunting, you shall

771
00:47:03.159 --> 00:47:05.880
<v Speaker 1>fetch the footpath put me in his place.

772
00:47:08.360 --> 00:47:12.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you know, scores were apparently not settled when he

773
00:47:13.039 --> 00:47:14.639
<v Speaker 3>killed him.

774
00:47:15.039 --> 00:47:19.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it would be awful get killed even about how

775
00:47:19.480 --> 00:47:24.360
<v Speaker 1>that's that's your fate. So Seagrun has this encounter with Hell,

776
00:47:24.400 --> 00:47:26.320
<v Speaker 1>gets the burial mound. Next day, she seems to not

777
00:47:26.360 --> 00:47:28.639
<v Speaker 1>be there, and then we're told that she didn't live

778
00:47:28.679 --> 00:47:33.079
<v Speaker 1>long for sorrow and for grief, and so that's really

779
00:47:33.079 --> 00:47:40.000
<v Speaker 1>how the story ends. And I don't know, I mean,

780
00:47:40.039 --> 00:47:41.960
<v Speaker 1>do you have anything else to say?

781
00:47:42.679 --> 00:47:45.920
<v Speaker 3>Not A whole lot kind of went over the stuff

782
00:47:47.159 --> 00:47:51.360
<v Speaker 3>and this one. I know that it's said that this

783
00:47:51.599 --> 00:47:55.679
<v Speaker 3>was told and you basically in a source that was

784
00:47:56.239 --> 00:48:05.719
<v Speaker 3>lost at the time, so song of Kara care. But yeah,

785
00:48:05.880 --> 00:48:08.679
<v Speaker 3>I do feel that Volson Sega kind of does a

786
00:48:08.719 --> 00:48:11.599
<v Speaker 3>little clear a little more straight line than this is.

787
00:48:12.719 --> 00:48:15.119
<v Speaker 3>But it's cool kind of seeing different maybe how it

788
00:48:15.159 --> 00:48:17.119
<v Speaker 3>was told in different places.

789
00:48:17.599 --> 00:48:22.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and from what I remember in the Volson saga,

790
00:48:22.599 --> 00:48:27.639
<v Speaker 1>does it even go into I know that Helgee going

791
00:48:27.679 --> 00:48:30.079
<v Speaker 1>off to to kill hunting, and I know that's mentioned

792
00:48:30.079 --> 00:48:32.079
<v Speaker 1>this saga, but I feel like we get more detail

793
00:48:32.079 --> 00:48:33.199
<v Speaker 1>about Helge in this version.

794
00:48:33.880 --> 00:48:35.480
<v Speaker 3>I think I think you're right. I think it just

795
00:48:35.559 --> 00:48:38.320
<v Speaker 3>kind of like briefly summarizes that, oh, these are like

796
00:48:39.360 --> 00:48:46.159
<v Speaker 3>the ancestors and then kind of moves on. So his

797
00:48:46.159 --> 00:48:47.920
<v Speaker 3>family's just destined for Valkyries.

798
00:48:47.960 --> 00:48:52.000
<v Speaker 1>I guess, I guess, so, which I mean is connected

799
00:48:52.000 --> 00:48:55.599
<v Speaker 1>to the fact that they're especially marked by Odin, who

800
00:48:55.800 --> 00:49:00.920
<v Speaker 1>you know, doctor is obviously associated with Odin. Yeah, and

801
00:49:00.960 --> 00:49:05.000
<v Speaker 1>so that is the story of the Helgies. There we go,

802
00:49:07.480 --> 00:49:11.280
<v Speaker 1>all right, Well, don't know that I have a great

803
00:49:11.280 --> 00:49:11.960
<v Speaker 1>conclusion here.

804
00:49:12.199 --> 00:49:12.360
<v Speaker 3>Do you?

805
00:49:12.400 --> 00:49:14.719
<v Speaker 1>Do you have anything to recommend anything you've been reading

806
00:49:14.719 --> 00:49:15.679
<v Speaker 1>recently outside of this?

807
00:49:16.960 --> 00:49:19.880
<v Speaker 3>So I actually joined another book club and we're working

808
00:49:20.199 --> 00:49:23.119
<v Speaker 3>our way through. It's a it's nothing to do with this.

809
00:49:23.239 --> 00:49:29.360
<v Speaker 3>It's actually a Japanese book Shipwrecks, which it's kind of

810
00:49:29.599 --> 00:49:32.960
<v Speaker 3>interesting to see, like what it's like a fishing village

811
00:49:32.960 --> 00:49:36.840
<v Speaker 3>and kind of life there, and like the eighteen hundreds,

812
00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:40.559
<v Speaker 3>I think late eighteen hundreds, really nice hundreds, and so

813
00:49:41.440 --> 00:49:43.960
<v Speaker 3>kind of does give a feeling of what life would

814
00:49:43.960 --> 00:49:48.840
<v Speaker 3>have been like on a fishing type village in anyone

815
00:49:48.880 --> 00:49:51.559
<v Speaker 3>in the world. I guess that's cool.

816
00:49:52.400 --> 00:49:54.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's definitely different. That's cool.

817
00:49:56.639 --> 00:49:59.199
<v Speaker 1>My I mean, basically everything I've been reading recently is

818
00:49:59.239 --> 00:50:02.880
<v Speaker 1>related to Tolkien for this Tolkien class that I'm leading now.

819
00:50:03.400 --> 00:50:06.559
<v Speaker 2>But I've I've really enjoyed. I don't have it around

820
00:50:06.599 --> 00:50:07.079
<v Speaker 2>me right now.

821
00:50:08.519 --> 00:50:12.760
<v Speaker 1>But the the let me see if I can look

822
00:50:12.760 --> 00:50:16.679
<v Speaker 1>at up profest and I'll probably cut out here where

823
00:50:16.719 --> 00:50:22.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm just looking at that out. Yeah, I've really liked

824
00:50:22.199 --> 00:50:26.039
<v Speaker 1>the Reader's Companion to Lord of the Rings by Hamilton's Skull,

825
00:50:26.599 --> 00:50:32.079
<v Speaker 1>which it's just it's such a detailed commentary on Lord

826
00:50:32.119 --> 00:50:35.840
<v Speaker 1>of the Rings. It provides all kinds of backstory connections

827
00:50:35.880 --> 00:50:38.840
<v Speaker 1>to biographical connections.

828
00:50:38.320 --> 00:50:39.199
<v Speaker 2>In Tolkien's life.

829
00:50:39.559 --> 00:50:42.239
<v Speaker 1>It points you to letters, points you to, you know,

830
00:50:42.280 --> 00:50:44.159
<v Speaker 1>where to look in History of Middle Earth, looks like

831
00:50:44.440 --> 00:50:47.199
<v Speaker 1>other drafts of that section, that of the Reading. It's

832
00:50:47.239 --> 00:50:50.320
<v Speaker 1>like a super detailed commentary that runs all throughout Lord

833
00:50:50.320 --> 00:50:54.599
<v Speaker 1>of the Rings, which is just great for just compiling

834
00:50:54.679 --> 00:50:58.840
<v Speaker 1>all this stuff secondary information, but also pointing you to,

835
00:50:59.280 --> 00:51:01.159
<v Speaker 1>you know, when you want to look more about the

836
00:51:01.480 --> 00:51:05.119
<v Speaker 1>backstory of this character or like what this looks like

837
00:51:05.119 --> 00:51:08.039
<v Speaker 1>in different drafts and whatnot. It's just a great kind

838
00:51:08.039 --> 00:51:10.000
<v Speaker 1>of hub to get to all these different areas. And

839
00:51:10.039 --> 00:51:12.199
<v Speaker 1>so I can't believe I haven't come across this before,

840
00:51:14.039 --> 00:51:15.920
<v Speaker 1>but yeah, so that's definitely something I would recommend for

841
00:51:16.239 --> 00:51:17.000
<v Speaker 1>studying Tolkien.

842
00:51:17.960 --> 00:51:21.599
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Yeah, that's that's good. I sometimes I see those

843
00:51:21.639 --> 00:51:24.840
<v Speaker 3>and I'm always like, Okay, who's writing kind of a gimmick,

844
00:51:25.000 --> 00:51:26.960
<v Speaker 3>you know, just to like if it's a reading compaining,

845
00:51:26.960 --> 00:51:29.199
<v Speaker 3>You're like, I really need that, But that sounds like

846
00:51:29.239 --> 00:51:30.760
<v Speaker 3>it's actually very forminative.

847
00:51:30.920 --> 00:51:31.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

848
00:51:31.800 --> 00:51:36.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, basically anything with the Hammin and Skull authors or

849
00:51:36.239 --> 00:51:39.559
<v Speaker 1>editors on there. It seems to be pretty reliable. And

850
00:51:39.599 --> 00:51:44.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, I'm still, all things considered, relatively new to Tolkien.

851
00:51:44.039 --> 00:51:45.599
<v Speaker 1>I mean able spent like the whole.

852
00:51:45.440 --> 00:51:46.079
<v Speaker 2>Life reading him.

853
00:51:46.440 --> 00:51:50.199
<v Speaker 1>You know, I first started in twenty twenty one. I

854
00:51:50.199 --> 00:51:54.960
<v Speaker 1>think I've just been going NonStop since then. But yeah,

855
00:51:55.039 --> 00:51:58.159
<v Speaker 1>so I'm still discovering all kinds of new stuff. So yeah,

856
00:51:58.199 --> 00:52:03.039
<v Speaker 1>that's definitely something I would recommend. Awesome, Well cool, So yeah,

857
00:52:03.119 --> 00:52:05.320
<v Speaker 1>next time we'll cover the next probably four readings or so,

858
00:52:05.519 --> 00:52:08.559
<v Speaker 1>but I'll post that in the discord. But otherwise I

859
00:52:08.559 --> 00:52:10.800
<v Speaker 1>guess that's where we'll go ahead and end it off.

860
00:52:10.920 --> 00:52:13.920
<v Speaker 1>So thanks again for joining us and for carry in

861
00:52:13.920 --> 00:52:17.079
<v Speaker 1>probably more than half of the conversation appreciated.

862
00:52:17.119 --> 00:52:41.440
<v Speaker 3>Man, it was good, I got it. M hm.

863
00:52:52.679 --> 00:52:55.000
<v Speaker 1>The saga begins with Sigi, who was introduced as a

864
00:52:55.039 --> 00:52:57.880
<v Speaker 1>son of Odin, giving him legendary status from the beginning,

865
00:52:58.039 --> 00:52:59.880
<v Speaker 1>and letting us know that Odin will be taking a

866
00:53:00.079 --> 00:53:03.639
<v Speaker 1>special interests In this line, Seggy was in fellowship with Scotty,

867
00:53:03.880 --> 00:53:06.280
<v Speaker 1>a man of greater stock and power than he, who

868
00:53:06.320 --> 00:53:10.719
<v Speaker 1>owned a thrall named Breddy, who excelled in skill and accomplishments.

869
00:53:10.960 --> 00:53:13.679
<v Speaker 1>One day, Siggi took Bretty hunting for the entire day

870
00:53:13.719 --> 00:53:16.000
<v Speaker 1>and into the evening, and Bretty proved himself to be

871
00:53:16.039 --> 00:53:20.000
<v Speaker 1>the superior hunter, much to Siggi's disappointment. Unable to accept

872
00:53:20.000 --> 00:53:22.199
<v Speaker 1>the wound to his pride wrought by being bested by

873
00:53:22.199 --> 00:53:25.360
<v Speaker 1>a mere thrall, Seggi attacked and killed Bretty and buried

874
00:53:25.360 --> 00:53:28.400
<v Speaker 1>his corpse in a snowdrift. When Scotty asked about the venture,

875
00:53:28.519 --> 00:53:31.000
<v Speaker 1>Siggi attempted to lie, but the truth became known and

876
00:53:31.079 --> 00:53:35.440
<v Speaker 1>Siggy was driven away as an outlaw. With guidance from Odin, Sigge,

877
00:53:35.519 --> 00:53:38.360
<v Speaker 1>in a company provided by his father, became fearsome raiders,

878
00:53:38.639 --> 00:53:41.840
<v Speaker 1>and Siggi eventually became a great and powerful king of Hunland,

879
00:53:41.960 --> 00:53:44.239
<v Speaker 1>the exact location of which is difficult to pin down,

880
00:53:44.320 --> 00:53:47.719
<v Speaker 1>but according to Snorri Stirlson, the thirteenth century compiler of

881
00:53:47.719 --> 00:53:51.039
<v Speaker 1>the Prosetta, this is likely somewhere in France. As Siggy

882
00:53:51.119 --> 00:53:54.880
<v Speaker 1>grew in years and prestige. His wife's brothers, who held

883
00:53:54.920 --> 00:53:58.960
<v Speaker 1>his trust, conspired against him, reminding us of Siggy's previous

884
00:53:58.960 --> 00:54:02.679
<v Speaker 1>betrayal of his trust. Hunting companion Siggi's in laws assaulted

885
00:54:02.719 --> 00:54:06.360
<v Speaker 1>his land and killed the aged king, who was caught unprepared.

886
00:54:07.119 --> 00:54:10.639
<v Speaker 1>Siggi's son, Rarier, was not present during the attack. He

887
00:54:10.719 --> 00:54:13.840
<v Speaker 1>gathered together a company of trusted companions and local chieftains,

888
00:54:13.880 --> 00:54:16.159
<v Speaker 1>and he took back his father's land and claimed his

889
00:54:16.199 --> 00:54:19.679
<v Speaker 1>inheritance as king. Once he was well established, Rarier was

890
00:54:19.719 --> 00:54:22.519
<v Speaker 1>faced with competing obligations to his kin and to his

891
00:54:22.519 --> 00:54:25.599
<v Speaker 1>father's honor, a tense ethical position that is often found

892
00:54:25.599 --> 00:54:28.800
<v Speaker 1>in the Great Germanic legends. However, because of his uncle's

893
00:54:28.800 --> 00:54:31.719
<v Speaker 1>great sins, Rarier no longer counted their ties of kinship

894
00:54:31.760 --> 00:54:34.400
<v Speaker 1>to be binding, and he honored his father with vengeance,

895
00:54:34.679 --> 00:54:37.840
<v Speaker 1>striking down his killers and claiming more land, wealth, and

896
00:54:37.920 --> 00:54:41.199
<v Speaker 1>power than his father ever had. During these exploits, he

897
00:54:41.239 --> 00:54:43.639
<v Speaker 1>also took a wife, but they were unable to produce

898
00:54:43.639 --> 00:54:45.960
<v Speaker 1>an air, and so they implored the gods until Friga

899
00:54:46.000 --> 00:54:49.000
<v Speaker 1>heard their prayers and asked Odin to intervene. Odin sent

900
00:54:49.039 --> 00:54:51.480
<v Speaker 1>one of his balkyries lude the daughter of the giant

901
00:54:51.559 --> 00:54:54.480
<v Speaker 1>Krumnir to bring an apple of fertility to King Rarier,

902
00:54:54.639 --> 00:54:57.559
<v Speaker 1>and she did so, dropping the apple on the King's lap.

903
00:54:58.039 --> 00:54:59.599
<v Speaker 1>He ate of the apple, and the queen was soon

904
00:54:59.639 --> 00:55:02.639
<v Speaker 1>found to be with child. The pregnancy lasted long, and

905
00:55:02.679 --> 00:55:05.360
<v Speaker 1>when King Rairier was away on a campaign, he took

906
00:55:05.400 --> 00:55:08.519
<v Speaker 1>sick and died in distress. The queen could not give

907
00:55:08.599 --> 00:55:11.320
<v Speaker 1>birth for six years, at which point the child was

908
00:55:11.360 --> 00:55:14.119
<v Speaker 1>finally cut out of her. The child kissed his mother,

909
00:55:14.280 --> 00:55:16.760
<v Speaker 1>and then she breathed her last, as her life by

910
00:55:16.760 --> 00:55:19.800
<v Speaker 1>this point was utterly spent. The boy was given the

911
00:55:19.880 --> 00:55:22.559
<v Speaker 1>name Volsung, and he was a king and a warrior

912
00:55:22.599 --> 00:55:26.440
<v Speaker 1>who surpassed his fathers before him. Volsung eventually married Siuld,

913
00:55:26.599 --> 00:55:29.079
<v Speaker 1>the valkyrie who brought the apple to his father, thereby

914
00:55:29.159 --> 00:55:33.519
<v Speaker 1>introducing a semi incestuous melody, if not exactly then at

915
00:55:33.599 --> 00:55:35.960
<v Speaker 1>least in a manner that rhymes with events that are

916
00:55:36.039 --> 00:55:39.679
<v Speaker 1>yet to come. Volsung Atiuld bore ten sons and one daughter.

917
00:55:39.960 --> 00:55:43.280
<v Speaker 1>The eldest were the twins Zigmund and his sister Zigny.

918
00:55:43.760 --> 00:55:47.559
<v Speaker 1>Zigny's hand in marriage was requested by Zigir, king of Goutland.

919
00:55:47.880 --> 00:55:50.920
<v Speaker 1>And although Zigny was reluctant, she honored her father's direction

920
00:55:51.039 --> 00:55:54.199
<v Speaker 1>to accept the proposal. During a feast held to celebrate

921
00:55:54.239 --> 00:55:57.239
<v Speaker 1>this union, a stranger enter the hall. He wore a

922
00:55:57.280 --> 00:55:59.960
<v Speaker 1>modeled cape and hood. He was barefoot, and he had

923
00:56:00.280 --> 00:56:02.920
<v Speaker 1>only one eye, which reveals to us that this was

924
00:56:03.039 --> 00:56:06.000
<v Speaker 1>in fact none other than the All Father Odin. This

925
00:56:06.039 --> 00:56:09.519
<v Speaker 1>stranger brandished a magnificent sword and thrust it into the

926
00:56:09.519 --> 00:56:11.599
<v Speaker 1>great tree that grew through the middle of the hall,

927
00:56:11.719 --> 00:56:14.119
<v Speaker 1>and he made the declaration that whoever could draw the

928
00:56:14.159 --> 00:56:16.239
<v Speaker 1>sword from the trunk shall receive it as a gift,

929
00:56:16.280 --> 00:56:18.199
<v Speaker 1>and this would be a sword better than any of

930
00:56:18.239 --> 00:56:20.960
<v Speaker 1>them had ever borne. Each the noblest of men made

931
00:56:20.960 --> 00:56:24.400
<v Speaker 1>their attempts, but to no avail. Finally, Zigmund, son of

932
00:56:24.480 --> 00:56:27.400
<v Speaker 1>King Volsung, grasped his hand around the hilt and pulled

933
00:56:27.400 --> 00:56:30.320
<v Speaker 1>it out with no effort whatsoever. It was he who

934
00:56:30.360 --> 00:56:33.400
<v Speaker 1>would bear this great sword of the All Father. King

935
00:56:33.519 --> 00:56:35.559
<v Speaker 1>Zigger offered to buy the sword for triple its weight

936
00:56:35.599 --> 00:56:38.239
<v Speaker 1>in gold, to which Zigmund answered, you could have taken

937
00:56:38.239 --> 00:56:40.559
<v Speaker 1>the sword from where it stood no less than I did,

938
00:56:40.960 --> 00:56:43.159
<v Speaker 1>if it were meant for you to carry it. But

939
00:56:43.199 --> 00:56:45.360
<v Speaker 1>now that it has come first into my hands, you

940
00:56:45.400 --> 00:56:47.599
<v Speaker 1>will never obtain it, even if you should offer me

941
00:56:47.800 --> 00:56:51.039
<v Speaker 1>all the gold you own. Ziger was deeply offended at this,

942
00:56:51.320 --> 00:56:54.280
<v Speaker 1>but being an underhanded and deceitful man, he plotted his

943
00:56:54.360 --> 00:56:58.679
<v Speaker 1>revenge in silence rather than demonstrating open scorn. Zigger decided

944
00:56:58.719 --> 00:57:01.000
<v Speaker 1>to leave for home the next day, but Zigni employed

945
00:57:01.000 --> 00:57:03.400
<v Speaker 1>her father to annul the marriage, for she was informed

946
00:57:03.400 --> 00:57:06.320
<v Speaker 1>by her gift of foresight that misery would otherwise follow.

947
00:57:06.800 --> 00:57:09.840
<v Speaker 1>King Volsung did not see sufficient reason to commit this dishonor,

948
00:57:09.960 --> 00:57:12.159
<v Speaker 1>and so he told his daughter to continue with her

949
00:57:12.199 --> 00:57:16.239
<v Speaker 1>new life as so agreed. Before leaving, Zigur invited Volsung

950
00:57:16.360 --> 00:57:18.400
<v Speaker 1>and his sons to visit him in Goutland in three

951
00:57:18.400 --> 00:57:22.039
<v Speaker 1>months time, and Volsung agreed to the offer. When the

952
00:57:22.039 --> 00:57:25.280
<v Speaker 1>appointed time came, Zigny called her father and brothers together

953
00:57:25.360 --> 00:57:28.360
<v Speaker 1>for a private conversation. She informed them that Ziggur had

954
00:57:28.360 --> 00:57:30.960
<v Speaker 1>gathered an unbeatable army and that he had intended to

955
00:57:30.960 --> 00:57:34.199
<v Speaker 1>betray the Volsung clan, and she implored them to flee.

956
00:57:34.719 --> 00:57:37.480
<v Speaker 1>King Volsung declared that he would not betray his pride

957
00:57:37.559 --> 00:57:39.639
<v Speaker 1>in his honor, but that he and his men would

958
00:57:39.679 --> 00:57:43.880
<v Speaker 1>instead stand and fight with fierce and valiant combat, Volsung

959
00:57:44.039 --> 00:57:47.519
<v Speaker 1>charged the hostile forces of Ziggur, but Volsung's forces were

960
00:57:47.639 --> 00:57:51.639
<v Speaker 1>no match for the overwhelming power of Zigger's. King Volsung

961
00:57:51.760 --> 00:57:54.559
<v Speaker 1>fell in battle and his ten sons were taken captive.

962
00:57:55.000 --> 00:57:57.280
<v Speaker 1>Zigny pleaded with her husband on behalf of her brothers,

963
00:57:57.360 --> 00:57:59.719
<v Speaker 1>but he agreed only that they should not be immediately

964
00:57:59.760 --> 00:58:02.079
<v Speaker 1>huge down, but that they would instead be subject to

965
00:58:02.079 --> 00:58:05.559
<v Speaker 1>torture and lingering deaths. The sons of Volsom were pinned

966
00:58:05.599 --> 00:58:08.119
<v Speaker 1>down under a great trunk in the woods, and every

967
00:58:08.199 --> 00:58:10.519
<v Speaker 1>night a she wolf who may have actually been King

968
00:58:10.599 --> 00:58:14.199
<v Speaker 1>Zigger's mother transformed by sorcery, would arrive to feast on

969
00:58:14.199 --> 00:58:17.360
<v Speaker 1>one of the brothers. This continued every night until only

970
00:58:17.440 --> 00:58:20.559
<v Speaker 1>Zigmund was left. Before the final knight that would have

971
00:58:20.559 --> 00:58:23.159
<v Speaker 1>claimed his life as well, Zigny instructed one of her

972
00:58:23.159 --> 00:58:26.199
<v Speaker 1>trusted servants to smear honey on Zigmund's face and into

973
00:58:26.239 --> 00:58:28.840
<v Speaker 1>his mouth. When the she wolf arrived that evening, she

974
00:58:28.920 --> 00:58:31.519
<v Speaker 1>did not instantly devour him, but first licked the sweet

975
00:58:31.519 --> 00:58:34.519
<v Speaker 1>honey off his face and reached her tongue into his mouth,

976
00:58:34.760 --> 00:58:37.719
<v Speaker 1>allowing Zigmund to bite the wolf's tongue, causing the great

977
00:58:37.760 --> 00:58:40.480
<v Speaker 1>wolf to recoil back and split the trunk that held

978
00:58:40.480 --> 00:58:43.320
<v Speaker 1>his feet. As she recoiled, Zigmund did not release her

979
00:58:43.360 --> 00:58:45.639
<v Speaker 1>tongue from his teeth, causing it to be sundered from

980
00:58:45.639 --> 00:58:48.719
<v Speaker 1>her mouth. With this great wound, the she wolf bled

981
00:58:48.760 --> 00:58:51.840
<v Speaker 1>out and died, and Sigmund was free to take his leave.

982
00:58:52.360 --> 00:58:55.000
<v Speaker 1>Sigmund then took up residence in the woods as an outlaw,

983
00:58:55.119 --> 00:58:57.000
<v Speaker 1>while Zigger believed that he had killed the last of

984
00:58:57.039 --> 00:59:00.519
<v Speaker 1>the Volsungs save for his wife. Signy had two sons

985
00:59:00.519 --> 00:59:02.519
<v Speaker 1>of Zigger, whom she sent one at a time to

986
00:59:02.599 --> 00:59:05.599
<v Speaker 1>aid Zigmund and to potentially serve as companions of revenge

987
00:59:05.679 --> 00:59:09.559
<v Speaker 1>against Zigger her husband. However, both proved to be cowards,

988
00:59:09.679 --> 00:59:13.159
<v Speaker 1>so Zigny, bearing no love for her husband or his offspring,

989
00:59:13.360 --> 00:59:16.400
<v Speaker 1>asked Sigmund to kill them, which he did without remorse.

990
00:59:16.880 --> 00:59:19.440
<v Speaker 1>One day, when Zigny was sitting in her chamber, a

991
00:59:19.599 --> 00:59:23.400
<v Speaker 1>sorceress appeared to her. Zigny requested the sorceress change appearances

992
00:59:23.400 --> 00:59:26.639
<v Speaker 1>with her, and with this magic in effect, Zigny went

993
00:59:26.679 --> 00:59:29.719
<v Speaker 1>to Zigmun's home in the forest, seduced him, and laid

994
00:59:29.760 --> 00:59:32.519
<v Speaker 1>with him for three nights. Sometime later, she gave birth

995
00:59:32.559 --> 00:59:36.079
<v Speaker 1>to a son, Sinfiotli, who grew to be large and strong.

996
00:59:36.480 --> 00:59:40.159
<v Speaker 1>Zigmund and Sinfiote rated together, sometimes as men and sometimes

997
00:59:40.199 --> 00:59:43.760
<v Speaker 1>with the guise of enchanted wolf skins. Once Sinfiotle was

998
00:59:43.760 --> 00:59:46.840
<v Speaker 1>fully grown, Zigmund was ready to avenge his father by

999
00:59:46.840 --> 00:59:49.800
<v Speaker 1>striking at King Zigger. Late in the evening, Zigmund and

1000
00:59:49.800 --> 00:59:53.559
<v Speaker 1>Sinfiotli hid themselves among ale caskets outside Zigger's main hall.

1001
00:59:54.000 --> 00:59:56.840
<v Speaker 1>By this point, Zygney and Ziger had two more young

1002
00:59:56.920 --> 00:59:59.880
<v Speaker 1>sons who were playing with golden toys, and as a

1003
01:00:00.000 --> 01:00:02.559
<v Speaker 1>the golden ring rolled down the hall. The boys chased

1004
01:00:02.599 --> 01:00:06.639
<v Speaker 1>after it. Zigmund and Sinfioti presented themselves with terrifying appearance

1005
01:00:06.639 --> 01:00:09.320
<v Speaker 1>to these children, and Signy told Zigmund to kill them,

1006
01:00:09.360 --> 01:00:12.719
<v Speaker 1>but Zigmund stays his hand this time. Symfioti, however, has

1007
01:00:12.800 --> 01:00:15.920
<v Speaker 1>no qualms with dispatching his half brothers, and he swiftly

1008
01:00:15.960 --> 01:00:18.480
<v Speaker 1>does so. Their bodies were then cast into the hall

1009
01:00:18.599 --> 01:00:21.000
<v Speaker 1>of King Zigger, who called the guards to his defense.

1010
01:00:21.440 --> 01:00:25.199
<v Speaker 1>Zigmund and Simfiotle fought valiantly, but they were eventually overpowered,

1011
01:00:25.440 --> 01:00:29.239
<v Speaker 1>bound and fettered, and sealed alive in a stone cairn. However,

1012
01:00:29.440 --> 01:00:33.360
<v Speaker 1>Zigny had subtly provided them with provisions, including Zigmund's great

1013
01:00:33.400 --> 01:00:36.400
<v Speaker 1>sword given to him by Odin. With this noble blade,

1014
01:00:36.519 --> 01:00:39.119
<v Speaker 1>Zigmund cut through the rock and the two left freely

1015
01:00:39.360 --> 01:00:41.679
<v Speaker 1>and promptly returned to the hall of the King, which

1016
01:00:41.679 --> 01:00:44.480
<v Speaker 1>they set ablaze. Zigmund asked Zigny to leave with him,

1017
01:00:44.719 --> 01:00:47.400
<v Speaker 1>at which point she revealed that Simfioti is his son,

1018
01:00:47.559 --> 01:00:49.840
<v Speaker 1>and that she had plotted all of these years for

1019
01:00:49.960 --> 01:00:53.400
<v Speaker 1>vengeance against her husband. She finds contentment in knowing that

1020
01:00:53.400 --> 01:00:55.719
<v Speaker 1>the deed had been done, but she believes that her

1021
01:00:55.719 --> 01:00:58.519
<v Speaker 1>life was spent in the process and she now must

1022
01:00:58.559 --> 01:01:01.760
<v Speaker 1>die in the flames along side her husband. Zigmund takes

1023
01:01:01.760 --> 01:01:04.440
<v Speaker 1>the throne and marries Borghild, who gives birth to his

1024
01:01:04.480 --> 01:01:07.559
<v Speaker 1>son Helgi. When Helgi is of age, he desired to

1025
01:01:07.599 --> 01:01:11.760
<v Speaker 1>marry Segrun, daughter of King Hogny. However, Zigrun was betrothed

1026
01:01:11.800 --> 01:01:16.400
<v Speaker 1>to King Hothbrod, so naturally, Helgi and Simptioli invade Hothbrod's realm.

1027
01:01:16.559 --> 01:01:19.920
<v Speaker 1>Helgi usurps his kingship and then marries Zigrun. Zinfield Lee

1028
01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:22.079
<v Speaker 1>also finds a woman that he desires to marry, but

1029
01:01:22.159 --> 01:01:24.880
<v Speaker 1>he must kill a competing suitor in order to secure

1030
01:01:24.920 --> 01:01:27.519
<v Speaker 1>her hand. It turns out that the suitor was actually

1031
01:01:27.599 --> 01:01:32.039
<v Speaker 1>Borkild's brother. In vengeance, she poisons and kills Sinfiotli, leading

1032
01:01:32.119 --> 01:01:35.599
<v Speaker 1>Zigmund to cast her out. In his old age, Zigmund

1033
01:01:35.599 --> 01:01:39.320
<v Speaker 1>married another named Geordis, much of the anger of King LINGVI,

1034
01:01:39.719 --> 01:01:43.000
<v Speaker 1>who also sought her hand. Lingviy attacks Sigmund, and in

1035
01:01:43.039 --> 01:01:45.679
<v Speaker 1>the midst of the battle, Odin appeared, armed with his

1036
01:01:45.760 --> 01:01:50.000
<v Speaker 1>spear to make divine intervention. Sigmund struck Odin's spearshaft with

1037
01:01:50.039 --> 01:01:52.719
<v Speaker 1>his sword, but the blade shattered on impact As this

1038
01:01:52.880 --> 01:01:57.320
<v Speaker 1>mysterious spearman vanished. That evening, Geordis found the languishing Zigmund

1039
01:01:57.320 --> 01:02:00.559
<v Speaker 1>on the battlefield among the slain. Zigmund of four sortis

1040
01:02:00.599 --> 01:02:02.719
<v Speaker 1>that she is carrying a son in her womb and

1041
01:02:02.800 --> 01:02:05.000
<v Speaker 1>tells her to guard the charge of the sword that

1042
01:02:05.119 --> 01:02:08.920
<v Speaker 1>was broken. Shortly thereafter, Prince Alph of Denmark arrives and

1043
01:02:08.960 --> 01:02:12.079
<v Speaker 1>clucts Spoils from the battlefield aunt Ordis for his wife.

1044
01:02:12.480 --> 01:02:15.039
<v Speaker 1>She gives birth to Ziggard, son of Zigmund, who is

1045
01:02:15.159 --> 01:02:18.320
<v Speaker 1>raised in the Danish court. Ziggurd grows to be strong

1046
01:02:18.440 --> 01:02:21.280
<v Speaker 1>and valiant in the tradition of his father's, and eventually

1047
01:02:21.400 --> 01:02:24.000
<v Speaker 1>his tutor Reagon reveals to him the story of fof

1048
01:02:24.079 --> 01:02:26.320
<v Speaker 1>Near the Dragon, who we come to find is in

1049
01:02:26.400 --> 01:02:29.079
<v Speaker 1>fact Reagan's brother, who killed their father to secure a

1050
01:02:29.079 --> 01:02:31.679
<v Speaker 1>great treasure for himself. Assus Lewis said of us to

1051
01:02:31.719 --> 01:02:35.519
<v Speaker 1>scrubs dragoning sleeping on a dragon's hoard with greedy, dragonish

1052
01:02:35.599 --> 01:02:38.760
<v Speaker 1>thoughts in his heart, he had become a dragon himself.

1053
01:02:39.039 --> 01:02:42.000
<v Speaker 1>Thus we have fofth Near the Dragon, who would find

1054
01:02:42.039 --> 01:02:42.679
<v Speaker 1>no Aslan.

1055
01:02:42.760 --> 01:02:43.320
<v Speaker 2>To remove his.

1056
01:02:43.360 --> 01:02:46.679
<v Speaker 1>Scales, Reragon re forges the sword of Odin that was broken,

1057
01:02:46.760 --> 01:02:50.519
<v Speaker 1>thereby providing Sigurd with a legendary sword known as gram

1058
01:02:50.679 --> 01:02:53.719
<v Speaker 1>before facing off with the dragon. Zigard uses his sword

1059
01:02:53.760 --> 01:02:57.880
<v Speaker 1>for vengeance, slaying his father's killers. With this duty fulfilled,

1060
01:02:58.159 --> 01:03:01.119
<v Speaker 1>he faces off with the dragon, which he readily despatches

1061
01:03:01.239 --> 01:03:05.400
<v Speaker 1>before liberating its great wealth, including the dreaded Helm of Fear.

1062
01:03:06.039 --> 01:03:09.280
<v Speaker 1>He roach the dragon's heart, and when its enchanting blood

1063
01:03:09.360 --> 01:03:12.719
<v Speaker 1>touches his mouth, he gains wisdom, which now allows him

1064
01:03:12.719 --> 01:03:16.159
<v Speaker 1>to understand the speech of birds. Zigmund hears the birds

1065
01:03:16.159 --> 01:03:19.800
<v Speaker 1>discussing how Regan intends to betray Zigmund, so Zigmund acts

1066
01:03:19.800 --> 01:03:23.519
<v Speaker 1>preemptively and strikes Regan down with great wealth and power.

1067
01:03:23.840 --> 01:03:26.480
<v Speaker 1>Ziggurd goes to Frankish lands and vows to marry the

1068
01:03:26.559 --> 01:03:31.159
<v Speaker 1>valkyrie Brinhild. However, the sorceress Grimhild bewitches Ziggurd into forgetting

1069
01:03:31.159 --> 01:03:34.079
<v Speaker 1>about Brinhild so she would marry her daughter Gudrun, and

1070
01:03:34.119 --> 01:03:37.280
<v Speaker 1>she also tells her son Gunnar to marry Brinhild. Sigurd

1071
01:03:37.320 --> 01:03:39.679
<v Speaker 1>and the three sons of Grimhild go to King Boodli,

1072
01:03:39.840 --> 01:03:42.400
<v Speaker 1>father of Brinhild, so that Gunnar may ask for her

1073
01:03:42.400 --> 01:03:45.239
<v Speaker 1>hand in marriage. Brinhild is in a hall surrounded by

1074
01:03:45.280 --> 01:03:47.920
<v Speaker 1>fire and will only marry one who is brave enough

1075
01:03:47.920 --> 01:03:50.280
<v Speaker 1>to ride through the flames, as she believes that only

1076
01:03:50.360 --> 01:03:54.239
<v Speaker 1>her Ziggurd would perform such a feat. She is correct, Butziggard,

1077
01:03:54.440 --> 01:03:57.880
<v Speaker 1>still bewitched, knows nothing of his connection to Brinhild, so

1078
01:03:58.159 --> 01:04:01.199
<v Speaker 1>in service to Gunnar, they switch upon spearances and Zigmund

1079
01:04:01.239 --> 01:04:04.320
<v Speaker 1>appearing as Gunnar passes through the flames and secures her

1080
01:04:04.320 --> 01:04:08.480
<v Speaker 1>hand in marriage for Gunnar. Bridenhild eventually discovers what happened

1081
01:04:08.519 --> 01:04:11.880
<v Speaker 1>and she falls into deep despair, only desiring to wed

1082
01:04:12.039 --> 01:04:15.639
<v Speaker 1>the great and courageous Ziggurd. Attempting to deal with this problem,

1083
01:04:15.880 --> 01:04:19.000
<v Speaker 1>Gunnar gives his brother wolf and snake meat, which sends

1084
01:04:19.039 --> 01:04:21.400
<v Speaker 1>him into a violent rage, with which he stabbed the

1085
01:04:21.400 --> 01:04:25.480
<v Speaker 1>sleeping Ziggard before dying. Ziggrid throws Grom and cleaves his

1086
01:04:25.519 --> 01:04:28.519
<v Speaker 1>assailant in two Bridenhild tells Gunnar that what he did

1087
01:04:28.599 --> 01:04:31.760
<v Speaker 1>was wrong, and she stabs herself in despair and dies.

1088
01:04:32.360 --> 01:04:36.840
<v Speaker 1>Grimhild orders Gudrun, Sigurd's widow, to marry King Attlee, also

1089
01:04:36.920 --> 01:04:39.480
<v Speaker 1>known as Attila the Hun, who proves himself to be

1090
01:04:39.519 --> 01:04:43.519
<v Speaker 1>treacherous under false pretenses. Gunnar and his brother Hogny are

1091
01:04:43.559 --> 01:04:46.079
<v Speaker 1>summoned to the court of King Attlee, who desires the

1092
01:04:46.119 --> 01:04:49.440
<v Speaker 1>treasure of Ziggurd. Hogney's heart is cut out and Gunnar

1093
01:04:49.559 --> 01:04:52.400
<v Speaker 1>is bound and cast into a pit of snakes. Gudrun

1094
01:04:52.480 --> 01:04:54.960
<v Speaker 1>is able to give Gunnar a harp, which he plays

1095
01:04:55.000 --> 01:04:58.159
<v Speaker 1>his toes, sending all the serpents into a slumber, except

1096
01:04:58.159 --> 01:05:00.920
<v Speaker 1>for one, which bites his heart and p ruse his doom.

1097
01:05:01.480 --> 01:05:05.079
<v Speaker 1>In retaliation, Gudurun kills Atli's sons and feeds their blood,

1098
01:05:05.119 --> 01:05:08.639
<v Speaker 1>and hearts to their father. Gudrun and Hogni's son Niflun

1099
01:05:08.920 --> 01:05:12.480
<v Speaker 1>then stobs Atli while he's sleeping and sets his court ablaze.

1100
01:05:13.079 --> 01:05:15.960
<v Speaker 1>Feeling her life spent by this point, Guduruan attempts to

1101
01:05:16.000 --> 01:05:18.280
<v Speaker 1>cast herself to the sea, but she was carried by

1102
01:05:18.280 --> 01:05:21.280
<v Speaker 1>the waves to the fortress of King Yunaker, whom she

1103
01:05:21.360 --> 01:05:25.199
<v Speaker 1>married and bore three sons, who are raised alongside Zwanhild,

1104
01:05:25.400 --> 01:05:28.679
<v Speaker 1>her daughter by means of Ziggard. Vanhild was exceedingly beautiful

1105
01:05:28.800 --> 01:05:31.360
<v Speaker 1>and her hand was desired of King Yormanrek, but she

1106
01:05:31.400 --> 01:05:35.119
<v Speaker 1>instead marries his son Ronb. In response, Goorman Rect has

1107
01:05:35.119 --> 01:05:39.039
<v Speaker 1>his son hanged and Zvanhild trampled by horses. In revenge,

1108
01:05:39.239 --> 01:05:42.559
<v Speaker 1>Gudrun's sons cut off Yormanrec's hands and feet, but he

1109
01:05:42.639 --> 01:05:46.519
<v Speaker 1>calls for his Housecarls, who, with Odin's guidance, kills gunrun

1110
01:05:46.639 --> 01:05:51.079
<v Speaker 1>sons and so ends the Saga of the Volsungs. In

1111
01:05:51.199 --> 01:05:53.920
<v Speaker 1>this presentation of the Saga of the Volsongs, which originally

1112
01:05:53.960 --> 01:05:56.679
<v Speaker 1>part of my course called Life, Death and Meaning with

1113
01:05:56.760 --> 01:06:00.159
<v Speaker 1>Beowulf and Boethius at the time of this recording, you

1114
01:06:00.199 --> 01:06:03.280
<v Speaker 1>can purchase the course in full at Andrew Snyder dot

1115
01:06:03.320 --> 01:06:06.119
<v Speaker 1>Patia dot com, although it will soon be moving to

1116
01:06:06.239 --> 01:06:09.519
<v Speaker 1>Patreon For the latest updates, Follow Mythic Mind on Patreon

1117
01:06:09.599 --> 01:06:12.599
<v Speaker 1>at patreon dot com, slash mythic Mind, or feel free

1118
01:06:12.639 --> 01:06:15.360
<v Speaker 1>to reach out to me at Mythicmind podcast at gmail

1119
01:06:15.400 --> 01:06:18.800
<v Speaker 1>dot com or on x at Andrew inn Snyder