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<v Speaker 1>Sety five KRC, the talk station six oh five on

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<v Speaker 1>this Wednesday morning. I'm Dan Carroll. Brian Thomas taking the

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<v Speaker 1>week off, so it's my pleasure to be here for him.

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<v Speaker 1>I get to do it one more day tomorrow, so

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<v Speaker 1>I'm looking forward to that and also looking forward to

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<v Speaker 1>speaking with our next guest, and our first guest in

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<v Speaker 1>the morning is Charlton Allen. Charlton Allen is an attorney.

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<v Speaker 1>He is the former chief executive officer of the North

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<v Speaker 1>Carolina Industrial Commission, the founder of the Madison Center for

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<v Speaker 1>Law and Liberty, and the host of the Modern Federalist podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>And he also is a regular contributor to American Thinker,

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<v Speaker 1>which is a great website where that I look at

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<v Speaker 1>just about every single day. And it is because of

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<v Speaker 1>a piece that he wrote there that I reached out

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<v Speaker 1>to him and asked him to be on the show

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<v Speaker 1>this morning. And here he is, and Charlton Allen, thank

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<v Speaker 1>you so much for being here, and good morning. It's

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<v Speaker 1>great to have you on fifty five KRC. How are

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<v Speaker 1>you today.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm doing well, Dan, thanks for having me well.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you for being here. This piece that you wrote

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<v Speaker 1>that really got my attention A few days ago. The

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<v Speaker 1>headline is we didn't start the trade war, We've just

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<v Speaker 1>finally joined it, and you make the case. First of all,

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<v Speaker 1>the first thing you talk about is how the media

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<v Speaker 1>really fails to deliver any context as it relates to tariffs.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you believe that this is because they're pursuing an

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<v Speaker 1>agenda that they don't want to provide real context. I

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<v Speaker 1>think they have the ability to provide context, but they

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<v Speaker 1>simply choose not to provide context and really wind up

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<v Speaker 1>just parroting the talking points that come from the DNC

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<v Speaker 1>and other organizations who were opposed to this administration.

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<v Speaker 2>I think this is a heavy part of it.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't necessarily believe that's all of it, And let

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<v Speaker 3>me explain long. I think we have reached a point

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<v Speaker 3>in our nation, and particularly in terms of the legacy media.

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<v Speaker 3>They are very much coastal enclosed, and they have for

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<v Speaker 3>generations ignored the flight of states like your state, Ohio,

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<v Speaker 3>my state North Carolina, and all the states in between

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<v Speaker 3>the two coasts. And as a consequence, Yeah, I have

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<v Speaker 3>come to conclude unfortunately a lot of the legacy media

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<v Speaker 3>sees there themselves as having more in common with Europe,

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<v Speaker 3>for example, than the rest of America. And I think

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<v Speaker 3>there is a deep philosophical and cultural divide that you know,

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<v Speaker 3>is a chism between those media elites and the rest

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<v Speaker 3>of us in this country.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think as a major factor as well.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think I think most Americans have an idea

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<v Speaker 1>that that we have a very large trade imbalance when

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<v Speaker 1>it comes to dealing with China. I think a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of Americans might have been surprised though, to recognize the

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<v Speaker 1>amount of tariffs that and and really how unlevel the

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<v Speaker 1>playing field is when it when you talk about the

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<v Speaker 1>rest of the world, when you when you look at

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<v Speaker 1>all the other tariffs that all these countries impose on

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<v Speaker 1>the United States, and the United States for so long

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<v Speaker 1>essentially had had little or no tariffs on many of

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<v Speaker 1>these other countries. And I think when you when you

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<v Speaker 1>look at a guy like Trump, it is that sort

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<v Speaker 1>of imbalance that that really bothers him more than anything else.

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<v Speaker 1>That you know, we have all this access for all

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<v Speaker 1>these other countries into our markets, but yet we don't

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<v Speaker 1>have the same access to theirs.

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<v Speaker 3>That's exactly the point. And you know, in terms of

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<v Speaker 3>approaching it, I think you have to one hand, take

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<v Speaker 3>China in China is a unique and over arching problem

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<v Speaker 3>that's separate and apart from the rest of the world.

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<v Speaker 3>And the reason why I say that is because China is,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, buy and large, one of our largest trading partners,

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<v Speaker 3>and they manipulate the markets, They manipulate trade.

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<v Speaker 2>They have barriers upon barriers to trade in China.

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<v Speaker 3>They have things such as Golden chairs, which give the

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<v Speaker 3>Chinese Communist Party control over entities in China into corporations

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<v Speaker 3>that you know, frankly did the fact that that is

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<v Speaker 3>the case and those companies are dealing in securities in

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<v Speaker 3>the United States is long overdue for the sec to

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<v Speaker 3>be involved.

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<v Speaker 2>But China is a problem in and of itself.

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<v Speaker 3>Europe is another problem, and you know, I would take

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<v Speaker 3>it a step further, not just Europe, but also Canada.

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<v Speaker 3>We have significant trade imbalances Europe in particular in Canada

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<v Speaker 3>as well, rely on the United States for national security.

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<v Speaker 3>There is no way in the world that the Canadian

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<v Speaker 3>Armed Forces can protect the one hundred and fifty one

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<v Speaker 3>thousand miles of coastline in Canada or the four million

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<v Speaker 3>square miles of aerospace in Canada. There's no way they

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<v Speaker 3>rely on us to provide security. Same with Europe, and

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<v Speaker 3>yet there are barriers to our penetration of both of

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<v Speaker 3>those markets, in particular Europe, where if a United States

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<v Speaker 3>company wants to sell a car, they're slapped with a

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<v Speaker 3>ten percent tariffon on our cars, and then Europe cries

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<v Speaker 3>foul when we demand reciprocity. For decades since World War Two,

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<v Speaker 3>we have subsidized European comfort with American sacrifice. And that

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<v Speaker 3>era is over.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you wrote a piece that appeared to an American

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<v Speaker 1>thinker yesterday talking about Canada's free ride is finally over.

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<v Speaker 1>I want to ask you a couple more questions about that.

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<v Speaker 1>But just getting back to China for a moment, I

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<v Speaker 1>guess the latest move was by China talking about how

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<v Speaker 1>they're going to put a pause or a hold on

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<v Speaker 1>China shipping out these rare earth minerals. And I was

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<v Speaker 1>I was reading about this that the United States actually

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<v Speaker 1>is a major producer of rare earth minerals. It's just

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<v Speaker 1>that the refining process is shipped overseas, shipped over to

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<v Speaker 1>China where those minerals are refined, and then they are

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<v Speaker 1>sent back to the United States and to other parts

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<v Speaker 1>of the world as well. And I think I think

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<v Speaker 1>Trump has a pretty good handle on this. And so

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<v Speaker 1>when you look at, or at least when I look

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<v Speaker 1>at what I perceive to be the bargaining position that

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<v Speaker 1>Trump wants to put this country into when it comes

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<v Speaker 1>to tariffs, it's not only to level the playing field,

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<v Speaker 1>but to reinvigorate these manufacturing processes, and so we are

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<v Speaker 1>able to self sustain ourselves here in the United States

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<v Speaker 1>and no longer be reliant on places like China for pharmaceuticals,

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<v Speaker 1>for rare earth, for things like this that American consumers

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<v Speaker 1>need on a daily basis.

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<v Speaker 2>Exactly.

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<v Speaker 3>The twentieth century was one by tanks and oil. The

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<v Speaker 3>twenty first century will be one by chips, energy and

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<v Speaker 3>who controls the tech stack. China knows this, and they

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<v Speaker 3>have tried to corner the market not just on rare

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<v Speaker 3>earth production, but rare earth refinery refineries such as what

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<v Speaker 3>you discussed. And we need to cut through the barriers

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<v Speaker 3>here in our own country so that we cannot only

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<v Speaker 3>mine rare earth minerals that we need in just about

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<v Speaker 3>every facet and modern electric and electronic compute and AI.

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<v Speaker 3>We need to cut those barriers down so that we

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<v Speaker 3>are not only competitive that we are surpassing China in

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<v Speaker 3>those key factors because if we do not have control

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<v Speaker 3>of pharmaceuticals, we do not control our own energy future,

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<v Speaker 3>we do not control our access to rare earth minerals.

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<v Speaker 3>We will not be an independent nation much longer. You know,

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<v Speaker 3>China is, you know, And this is something I think

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<v Speaker 3>is one of the greatest failures of American policy makers

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<v Speaker 3>over the past fifty years. Despite its deep market penetration

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<v Speaker 3>in the United States, China has remained a one party state,

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<v Speaker 3>and that party is the Chinese Communist Party. And one

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<v Speaker 3>of those great failures of our policymakers and politicians was

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<v Speaker 3>they misread China's economic opening in the nineteen seventies as

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<v Speaker 3>a repudiation or rejection of Marxism.

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<v Speaker 2>It wasn't.

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<v Speaker 3>It was a rebranding. At its core, Marxism is about

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<v Speaker 3>wealth redistribution from the economically successful to the unsuccessful, from

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<v Speaker 3>the havels to the have nots, and for the last

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<v Speaker 3>several generations, accelerating dramatically. After China's admission to the WTO

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<v Speaker 3>and the granting of Most Favored Nation status, we've watched

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<v Speaker 3>that redistribution play out in a global scale. What China

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<v Speaker 3>has executed is a wholesale transfer of wealth from the

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<v Speaker 3>United States to the People's Republic. It's been wrapped into

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<v Speaker 3>seductive packaging of cheap consumer goods, but the core transaction

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<v Speaker 3>is unmistakable. We sent them our industries or supply chains

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<v Speaker 3>and our leverage, and in return we've got plastic trinkets

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<v Speaker 3>and mounting death.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>And I think if China sees that the United States

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<v Speaker 1>is serious about taking up this manufacturing process that we

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<v Speaker 1>have the we have seeded to them, then I think

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<v Speaker 1>I think that'll be even more leverage that'll get that'll

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<v Speaker 1>get the Chinese to the bargaining table and and be

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<v Speaker 1>something that will work in the favor of the United States.

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<v Speaker 1>Charlton Allen, we get we have to get to a

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<v Speaker 1>quick break here, so let me ask you to hold

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<v Speaker 1>on right there. We'll do a quick little traffic in

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<v Speaker 1>weather and then we'll continue on with Charlton Allen from

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<v Speaker 1>the great state of North Carolina. So we appreciate him

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<v Speaker 1>being here on fifty five KRC the Talk station.

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<v Speaker 3>This is fifty five KRC and iHeartRadio station or your

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<v Speaker 3>money steels total.

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<v Speaker 1>Fifty five KRC the Talk station six nineteen. On this Wednesday, morning,

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<v Speaker 1>Dan Carroll for Brian Thomas, continuing our conversation with Attorney

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<v Speaker 1>Charlton Allen, and mister Allen, let me ask you this

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<v Speaker 1>when it comes to when it comes to the criticism

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<v Speaker 1>that has been brought against President Trump and the and

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<v Speaker 1>the way he's going about I don't think that. I

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<v Speaker 1>don't think that this whole uh, this whole trade war

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<v Speaker 1>if you want to call it that, or the tariffs

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<v Speaker 1>that Trump has been using for leverage, is as haphazard

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<v Speaker 1>as the media would have you believe. But I think

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<v Speaker 1>there's I think there's some legitimate criticism and especially when

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<v Speaker 1>people look at their savings, when they look at their

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<v Speaker 1>four oh one k's, when they look at their retirement accounts,

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<v Speaker 1>their stock market investment portfolios, things like that, that that

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<v Speaker 1>there has been a lot of volatility there. There's been

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<v Speaker 1>you know, so at least some some temporary damage done

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<v Speaker 1>to these to these things, and I think people have

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<v Speaker 1>genuine concerns about that. When when you get asked or

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<v Speaker 1>people want to talk about that, what is your response

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<v Speaker 1>to them about the game, the pain that is associated

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<v Speaker 1>with the with the policies and and what what Trump

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<v Speaker 1>is trying to accomplish.

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<v Speaker 3>Here approssire from several angles. First of all, we cannot

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<v Speaker 3>be dissuaded from what I believe is the right course

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<v Speaker 3>of action based upon short term results and pain.

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<v Speaker 2>There was always.

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<v Speaker 3>Going to be no matter how the President tried to

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<v Speaker 3>implement tariffs, whether he did it in the manner he

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<v Speaker 3>has done, or if he took a more longer term

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<v Speaker 3>approach and phased it in more gradually, there was going

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<v Speaker 3>to be uncertainty. And the market reacts to uncertainty, and

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<v Speaker 3>the market's job is to react. The President's job is

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<v Speaker 3>to act. And I think President Trump's doctrine may rattle

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<v Speaker 3>some of the hitgebunge managers, but it reassures the factory floors,

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<v Speaker 3>and that's where the real strength of this country's always been.

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<v Speaker 3>And I will also say that a lot of the

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<v Speaker 3>companies that are traded on the public exchanges, the equities,

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<v Speaker 3>they are very much leveraged into trade with China. And

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<v Speaker 3>I will also point I've discussed this in an article

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<v Speaker 3>last week. Uh you know, our Treasury Secretary has made

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<v Speaker 3>a very strong point of this, just how much of

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<v Speaker 3>a schism there is within the United States the people

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<v Speaker 3>who actually.

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<v Speaker 2>Participate in Wall Street.

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<v Speaker 3>I believe it is something along the lines of twelve

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<v Speaker 3>percent of Americans own eighty percent of stock. That is

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<v Speaker 3>a you know that gives you an idea of just how.

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<v Speaker 2>Much you know.

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<v Speaker 3>There is a dichotomy between those who are participating in

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<v Speaker 3>the market and those are not. The long term play

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<v Speaker 3>I think is going to be following the approach the

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<v Speaker 3>approach to precedent is going to follow. China is going

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<v Speaker 3>to require some suiction eificant sacrifice to decouple from the

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<v Speaker 3>Chinese Communist Party because it is more than just a

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<v Speaker 3>trade issue.

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<v Speaker 2>They have They have.

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<v Speaker 3>Infiltrated our economy in a very parasitic manner. One of

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<v Speaker 3>the largest employers in North Carolina is Smith Pille Foods,

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<v Speaker 3>which is owned by China. Uh They have purchased a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of agribusiness. They are heavily leveraged in the pharmaceutical industry,

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<v Speaker 3>which is another big employer in the state of North Carolina.

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<v Speaker 3>Uh So, decoupling from China is going to be a

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<v Speaker 3>very long term process, but it is going to be

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<v Speaker 3>necessary for our sovereignty because if China controls through Rare

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<v Speaker 3>Earth and other technology or National Security Center, if they

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<v Speaker 3>control our pharmaceutical center, if they control consumer and you know,

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<v Speaker 3>listen to electronics and then they're making a strong play

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<v Speaker 3>in AI. Where is our future not just in terms

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<v Speaker 3>of our economy, but our national security. It's very much

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<v Speaker 3>in doubt when you have a geopolitical adversary controlling all

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<v Speaker 3>the key sectors of the economy and they want to

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<v Speaker 3>subdue the United States.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Uh. And then and then getting back to Canada

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<v Speaker 1>here as we as we wrap this up, you talked,

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<v Speaker 1>you talk about Canada and the United States and Canada

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<v Speaker 1>are are the our big trading partners, but China is

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<v Speaker 1>is intertwined quite deeply into Canada as well. Is that

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<v Speaker 1>is that a hindrance moving forward with Canada? Does Does

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<v Speaker 1>Canada have to be concerned about, you know, any repercussions

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<v Speaker 1>from China as it seeks to uh, you know, mend

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<v Speaker 1>fences with the United States, Yes.

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<v Speaker 2>They do.

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<v Speaker 3>They have to be a very significant erms considered in

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<v Speaker 3>my view, not just with China but also with Russia

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<v Speaker 3>and incursions within Canada's shipping lanes and access to the

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<v Speaker 3>Arctic Ocean and the Northern Pacific and the Northern Atlantic oceans.

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<v Speaker 3>They're going to have very significant concerns in Canada really

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<v Speaker 3>needs to step up to the plate and get involved

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<v Speaker 3>in the Indo Pacific in a way that they have

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<v Speaker 3>not been, get invested in their national security, which they

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<v Speaker 3>have not been.

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<v Speaker 2>They are won the.

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<v Speaker 3>Worst performing nations in NATO and have been for generations,

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<v Speaker 3>and they have not taken their obligations under NATO seriously.

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<v Speaker 3>They are stuck at about one point three percent of

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<v Speaker 3>their GDP contributing to their own national security when NATO

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<v Speaker 3>has set a goal, and it's not an unreasonable goal

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<v Speaker 3>two percent. But it's not just Canada that we have

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<v Speaker 3>to watch. In terms of China, Mexico is a very

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<v Speaker 3>big deal as well. Mexico has been used as a

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<v Speaker 3>basically a trojan horse for China to get their goods

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<v Speaker 3>assembled in Mexico and then entered the United States care free,

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<v Speaker 3>and that has caused a spike in the Mexican trade

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<v Speaker 3>surplus with the United States. Last year tween twenty four

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<v Speaker 3>it soord to nearly one hundred and seventy two billion dollars,

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<v Speaker 3>and a big reason for that was Chinese goods assembled

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<v Speaker 3>in Mexico and then shipped to the United States.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, Charlton Allen, I'll tell you what. You make some

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<v Speaker 1>great points in the commentaries that I find on American Thinker.

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<v Speaker 1>And you know, when I look at this, I look

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<v Speaker 1>at a situation that, you know, so many of these

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<v Speaker 1>situations have gone unaddressed for so long in any sort

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<v Speaker 1>of meaningful way, that when it does come time to

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<v Speaker 1>deal with it, which I think we're just you know,

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<v Speaker 1>dipping our toe into the water here on this, that

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<v Speaker 1>there's going to be some there. You know, Ripping that

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<v Speaker 1>band aid office doesn't come without any consequences. So I

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<v Speaker 1>think it's something that needs to be done, and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>long term, I think it's going to be wind up

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<v Speaker 1>being a good thing for the United States. But Charleston Allen,

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<v Speaker 1>we have to run. I want to thank you for

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<v Speaker 1>the time today and the Madison Center for Law and

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<v Speaker 1>Liberty and the Modern Federalist podcast. Where can people find

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<v Speaker 1>that podcast? The Modern Federalist?

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<v Speaker 3>You could find it on all the major podcast providers,

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<v Speaker 3>Apple Podcasts for example, your Podbeans, Spotify, so forth. So on,

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<v Speaker 3>We're out there and seasons two stop the launch.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, well, Charlton Allen, great having you on the

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<v Speaker 1>show today. I look forward to future conversations and with

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<v Speaker 1>your permission, we'll be calling on you again before too long.

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<v Speaker 2>That'd be great, Thank you.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, there you go Charlton Allen and look up

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<v Speaker 1>his writings on American Thinker.

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<v Speaker 2>You will be glad that you did.

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<v Speaker 1>It is six twenty eight, little late for a break

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<v Speaker 1>on fifty five krc V talk station fifty five krc

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<v Speaker 1>dot com