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Speaker 5: Oh Hi, welcome to smologies. What are smologies. Okay, So
Speaker 5: these are shorter, kid friendly versions of classic episodes. So
Speaker 5: we took them, and we took all the swears out,
Speaker 5: nothing too racy. You can listen around kids, you can
Speaker 5: listen around your grandparents, perhaps, work colleagues, whatever. If you
Speaker 5: want the full length version of this episode, though, of course,
Speaker 5: it's going to be linked in the show notes. We
Speaker 5: also have more smologies up at aliwar dot com slash smologies. Okay, enjoy, Hey,
Speaker 5: it's your stepbrother's girlfriend, the one with the pet rat?
Speaker 5: What's up at sali ward? Welcome back another episode of ologies?
Speaker 6: Are you ready?
Speaker 5: Okay? Mars so that that orange orb in the night sky.
Speaker 5: It's fodder for science fiction and it's a place where
Speaker 5: billionaires ask themselves, can we go there when we ruin
Speaker 5: the planet?
Speaker 6: Or on?
Speaker 5: So, maybe you love Mars. Maybe you don't know why
Speaker 5: people love Mars. Maybe you're like me, and until a
Speaker 5: few years ago, I would think, wait, is Mars a
Speaker 5: really hot hot like fiery one? Because it's red and stuff?
Speaker 5: I had no idea. Okay, areology. Let's get into it.
Speaker 5: So first off, Mars has a lot of iron in
Speaker 5: the oil, which makes it red, which makes it look
Speaker 5: like the Solar System's big bloody eyeball. So hence we
Speaker 5: named it after the god of war, Mars. So it's
Speaker 5: Aris in Greek mythology, and if you want to know
Speaker 5: more about Roman's ripping off Greeks, listen to the mythology episode.
Speaker 5: So the word areology means study of Mars. So this
Speaker 5: ologist was introduced to me via email by my NASA
Speaker 5: friend Casey. Hi, Casey Hi. Christine. Casey's email between us
Speaker 5: simply said, do you need introductions? No, you do not.
Speaker 5: Then I received a message back from her saying that
Speaker 5: she listens to the podcast. So this interview was on.
Speaker 5: It was happening. So I got off a plane from
Speaker 5: a work trip. I had it straight from the airport
Speaker 5: to a little conference room with squeaky chairs at Caltech
Speaker 5: in Pasadena to talk about like what Mars deal is?
Speaker 5: Why is it cold? Why was it named after the
Speaker 5: deity of battle? What's up with its two moons, one
Speaker 5: named after the fear and the other of the dread
Speaker 5: that a company wore, some super recent discoveries about life,
Speaker 5: insane dust storms. The rovers are building, so please prepare
Speaker 5: for a journey into space, and you're rocky subconscious with
Speaker 5: areologist Jennifer Booze alogy knowlogy knowli So you study Mars,
Speaker 5: Yes you're an areologist?
Speaker 6: Yes? Is that correct?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 6: Well I think I'm a planetary geologist who studies Mars.
Speaker 6: But I study Mars.
Speaker 5: I'm an areologist as a planetary geologist. Can you run
Speaker 5: me through, Like, what's Mars? What's it steal? Why is
Speaker 5: it so dry? How cold is it? How big is it?
Speaker 5: Just tell me what we're working with here, Give me
Speaker 5: some specs, Like if you were if you were a dog,
Speaker 5: and you're like, I don't know what Mars is, like,
Speaker 5: how would you start?
Speaker 6: Okay, So Mars, you know, it's the next planet from
Speaker 6: our sun, so it's going to be like older. It's
Speaker 6: also a lot smaller.
Speaker 5: At its closest, Mars is around thirty four million miles
Speaker 5: that's fifty five million kilometers, So scale wise, Mars is
Speaker 5: about half the size of Earth and has roughly one
Speaker 5: third the gravity one third. So I looked up a
Speaker 5: few simulators of Mars gravity and in one there's this
Speaker 5: human in an orange onesie supported by slings, taking these
Speaker 5: graceful leaps around an indoor track, kind of like a
Speaker 5: giant Marionette. In another video, I saw what appeared to
Speaker 5: be a gaggle of French cosmonautical tourists taking a ride
Speaker 5: in a Vomit Comet, which is a seatless commercial jet
Speaker 5: that makes these roller coaster dips in flights and simulates
Speaker 5: lower gravity. I don't know from what I can tell,
Speaker 5: less gravity looks fun with these middle aged Parisians resorting
Speaker 5: to whoops, they're hooting like tiny happy donkeys, our kids
Speaker 5: in a ball pit. Ah, So, Mars gravity, take your weight,
Speaker 5: divide it by three. That is your bounding happy space
Speaker 5: pony weight.
Speaker 6: It's like, atmosphere is super thin right now, but in
Speaker 6: the past it had a thicker atmosphere and there was
Speaker 6: water on it for sure, like we have evidence for
Speaker 6: like streams and lakes and all sorts of like things
Speaker 6: like that. And it was a lot warmer because it
Speaker 6: had an atmosphere, and it used to have a magnetic
Speaker 6: field like we had on Earth, but it doesn't have
Speaker 6: one anymore. How do magnetic fields die Mars? Because it's smaller,
Speaker 6: it kind of like cooled down a lot quicker. On Earth,
Speaker 6: it's like hot down in our core and we have
Speaker 6: got iron spinning around and it's also like a big
Speaker 6: plan but Mars doesn't have like all those things, and
Speaker 6: so it's core is like just not putting out that
Speaker 6: kind of motion anymore. So we're not getting a magnet
Speaker 6: field anymore.
Speaker 5: I had no idea that was even a thing. I
Speaker 5: didn't know that was an option. Yeah, does Mars have moons?
Speaker 5: It has two moons, Phobos and Demos. Okay, there's like
Speaker 5: some debate about.
Speaker 6: How the Moon's formed, but I think most people think
Speaker 6: they're like captured asteroids. So they're really small moons and
Speaker 6: not like ours, and I think from the surface they
Speaker 6: look more like a planet's.
Speaker 5: So if you're on Mars, yeah, do you see two
Speaker 5: moons in the sky at the same time.
Speaker 6: I think you can, but they're so small, I think
Speaker 6: that they look more like planets.
Speaker 5: Okay, they just are like little Dimi dots.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I don't think they don't look like Arman for sure.
Speaker 5: Okay, Yeah, I thought maybe have you ever cracked an
Speaker 5: egg and you got a double yoak an e? As
Speaker 5: for Mars's double moons, some hot goss Jennifer emailed me
Speaker 5: that Phobos, which she described as a twenty six kilometer wide,
Speaker 5: lumpy cocoa puff may not have been a captured asteroid,
Speaker 5: but possibly it was formed out of a cloud of
Speaker 5: dust that was left over from a giant impact, kind
Speaker 5: of like our own beloved moon, and that possibly possibly
Speaker 5: Phobos has formed many times over Mars history, and it
Speaker 5: just periodically crashes into the surface, forms a dust cloud
Speaker 5: around Mars again, and then recreates itself into a moon,
Speaker 5: and then crashes again, forms itself anew again, but smaller,
Speaker 5: over and over and over. So what do they think
Speaker 5: happened to make Mars such a dust bowl?
Speaker 6: So it got dry. Basically it used to have water,
Speaker 6: but because it's so much smaller, its atmosphere like got
Speaker 6: lost basically doesn't have as much gravity like pulling it in.
Speaker 6: And it also like didn't have a magnetic field anymore,
Speaker 6: and like we say, our magnet field protects us, and
Speaker 6: so like the atmosphere just got like stripped away over
Speaker 6: time by like the solar wind and other atmosphere loss processes,
Speaker 6: and so it just lost its atmosphere got drier and drier,
Speaker 6: and then now it has a thin atmosphere and everything's
Speaker 6: just dusty.
Speaker 5: Does the water evaporate into the solar system?
Speaker 6: Yeah, it just gets like lost and yeah, basically I
Speaker 6: wonder where it goes. Yeah, I don't know, just like
Speaker 6: out there.
Speaker 5: Can ition just oceans just kind of missing around.
Speaker 6: Maybe I think it's like probably really scattered apart. Okay,
Speaker 6: probably just a gas.
Speaker 5: So we have a super dusty planet.
Speaker 6: Yeah, why is it red? It has a lot of iron.
Speaker 6: It's like rusty.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, and same as like Utah.
Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, kind of a lot of ways.
Speaker 5: So what parts of this chili desert are we really
Speaker 5: poking around? Now? The Curiosity rover landed in a crater,
Speaker 5: Gale Crater named for Walter Frederick Gael, who was an
Speaker 5: Australian banker by name, but he was a real space
Speaker 5: do we bind? So? Gale Crater is this huge dent
Speaker 5: in Mars, and it's filled with a mountain of perhaps
Speaker 5: wind whipped debrize that's taller than Mount Rainier. It looks
Speaker 5: like if you piled a bunch of brown sugar into
Speaker 5: a shallow bowl, or like a little tiny tuft of
Speaker 5: lint in a belly button. Now, why do we care
Speaker 5: about this crater? Because maybe it was a lake?
Speaker 6: Why did we.
Speaker 5: Put Curiosity in the crater that's where the lake was? Okay,
Speaker 5: And that's where the cool stuff was got it. So
Speaker 5: if there were gonna be like signs that people had
Speaker 5: a party there, we would find it in the bottom
Speaker 5: of what used to be lake, or we'd be like,
Speaker 5: there were maybe some old.
Speaker 6: Fish in here. Yeah, okay, yeah, it's like a basin,
Speaker 6: so stuff's gonna collect there. And we had seen from
Speaker 6: orbit that there were like layers that looked like they
Speaker 6: could have been from a lake or something wet or
Speaker 6: people actually really debated what the layers were and so
Speaker 6: it's just people were curious from many different perspectives, and
Speaker 6: so that's why we went there. But picking like the
Speaker 6: landing site is like a multi year thing with like
Speaker 6: hundreds of people involved and stuff.
Speaker 5: So what's the twenty twenty get a peep? What's it
Speaker 5: looking at? Where's it gonna land? So we don't know
Speaker 5: yet where it's gonna land. It's like down to three sites. Okay, now,
Speaker 5: according to a page up at marsnext dot JPL dot
Speaker 5: NASA dot gov. I'll put a link in the show
Speaker 5: notes all possible sites where life could have existed and
Speaker 5: or there's a lot of evidence for rocks and fluids
Speaker 5: having interacted.
Speaker 6: And so one of the big ideas behind like past
Speaker 6: Mars life is that that it was like microbes maybe
Speaker 6: living in like cracks and rocks and stuff, and so
Speaker 6: there's also in that area there's also like volcanism and
Speaker 6: a wide variety of rocks there and a wide variety
Speaker 6: of ages, which is crucial because Mars was like probably
Speaker 6: habitable in its like early history.
Speaker 5: How long ago do you think Mars was probably habitable? Right?
Speaker 5: Are we talking like five billion years ago or like
Speaker 5: thirty thousand billion years?
Speaker 6: No long time ago? Okay, billions of years, Okay, just
Speaker 6: billion years or something like. I mean maybe there's like
Speaker 6: still some fluid activity more recently, but it's like such
Speaker 6: small amounts that these would be like really lonely bugs.
Speaker 6: There's a big group of people that want to send
Speaker 6: a rover back to the same spot where Spirit is,
Speaker 6: which is kind of a cute thought in some way.
Speaker 6: A lot of people are like, no, we want to
Speaker 6: go somewhere new, but that spot there's like hydrothermal activity,
Speaker 6: so which is like on Earth where a lot of
Speaker 6: people think life might have started here. So that's why
Speaker 6: there's big arguments to go back there.
Speaker 5: To make primordial Martian soup. Yeah, kind of how much
Speaker 5: water is on Mars and when did we find it?
Speaker 5: I say we as though I had anything to do
Speaker 5: with it.
Speaker 6: Currently on Mars there's not a lot of water. There's
Speaker 6: like some water, like liquid water, just like in pores
Speaker 6: of rocks and like buried basically not really exposed on
Speaker 6: the surface. But there's like water ice in the caps.
Speaker 6: And when did we find it? I think think probably
Speaker 6: the best, Like when we started getting these early images
Speaker 6: that showed like channels, there was no solid evidence that
Speaker 6: it was formed by water, but people were like, the
Speaker 6: looks like it was formed by water, and then you know,
Speaker 6: get more and more info on it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So what happened with the recent announcement, Like everyone,
Speaker 5: watch out, we have an announcement to make about Mars,
Speaker 5: and everyone's like, I'm setting my alarm clock, I'm staying
Speaker 5: up late. Yeah, what happened with that announcement?
Speaker 6: So there were what people call like the building blocks
Speaker 6: of life that were found with the Curiosity rover. These
Speaker 6: like molecules that are actually really hard to preserve. They
Speaker 6: were found by the rover pretty like fresh looking, and
Speaker 6: so they're I don't know, it's just like the building
Speaker 6: blocks of life that were found and we didn't think
Speaker 6: that we would find them because they can get destroyed
Speaker 6: really easily. So that means that they were like resurfaced
Speaker 6: like pretty recently, which is really exciting, and that they
Speaker 6: were there at all was exciting that they could have formed.
Speaker 5: And so this was a heads up. We have the
Speaker 5: ingredients to make life. We didn't find it yet, but
Speaker 5: we found the ingredients. Ye, and that's a big deal. Yeah,
Speaker 5: I have one million questions for you. Okay, is it
Speaker 5: okay if I ask you one million?
Speaker 6: Yeah? Okay.
Speaker 5: But before we take questions from you, our beloved listeners,
Speaker 5: we're going to take a quick break for sponsors of
Speaker 5: the show. Sponsors. Why sponsors? You know what they do?
Speaker 5: They help us give money to different charities every week.
Speaker 5: So if you want to know where Ologies gives our money,
Speaker 5: you can go to aliword dot com and look for
Speaker 5: the tab Ologies gives back. There's like one hundred and
Speaker 5: fifty different charities that we've given to already, with more
Speaker 5: every single week. So if you need a place to
Speaker 5: go donate a little bit of money but you're not
Speaker 5: sure where to go, those are all picked biologists who
Speaker 5: work in those fields. And this ad break allows us
Speaker 5: to give a ton.
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Speaker 5: So thanks for listening and thank sponsors.
Speaker 7: When it comes to a great deal.
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Speaker 3: a welcome bonus switch today at board Goosh Energy dot
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Speaker 5: Okay, your questions, Greg ariel Belk, Craig Curry, and Jorge
Speaker 5: Barnett all ask the same basic question. So this is
Speaker 5: a super question, Okay, in light of the giant ust
Speaker 5: storm that seems to have knocked out the curiosity, what
Speaker 5: is the most useful to humanity right now information that
Speaker 5: it has collected since its arrival to the red planet?
Speaker 5: So what's the best stuff that the rovers have gotten?
Speaker 6: Okay? So, like I was thinking about this a lot,
Speaker 6: and I think the seeing that Mars was habitable in
Speaker 6: the past was probably the most interesting and maybe useful
Speaker 6: to humanity kind of thing because we see how Mars
Speaker 6: has changed with time, and like how Earth might change
Speaker 6: with time to and also like what the different extremes
Speaker 6: like that we can have on different planets are. So
Speaker 6: that's like super interesting.
Speaker 5: Mariner Cosplay, Al Martinez, Irakasha, Stephen Titus, and Justin M.
Speaker 5: Gifford all wanted to know what are the biggest hurdles
Speaker 5: for terraforming and is there an initiative within NASA or
Speaker 5: another agency to do so? Also follow up question from
Speaker 5: Ali Ward, what is terror?
Speaker 6: I think terraforming. I don't know the definition, but I
Speaker 6: feel like it's when you make the surface like have
Speaker 6: grass on it. Really no, no, definitely not. That's just
Speaker 6: what I imagine is Like what.
Speaker 5: Terraforming is landscaping, it's partial landscaping. Yeah, uh, you'll have
Speaker 5: to look that up. But so quick definition here. Terraforming
Speaker 5: is mostly at present a sci fi term, and it
Speaker 5: means to transform a planet to be more like Earth,
Speaker 5: presumably so that we can go live there. So I imagine
Speaker 5: in the future HGTV will have a whole flip or
Speaker 5: Flop esque series dedicated to making over dry, barren planets
Speaker 5: into like lush, boho habitats of our dreams. All we
Speaker 5: have to do is just painstakingly alter but already naturally exists.
Speaker 6: Can you review the question?
Speaker 5: Yeah, essentially, what are the biggest hurdles for terraforming?
Speaker 6: Okay, so, yeah, that we don't have a lot of
Speaker 6: water or oxygen in the atmosphere, or that the amr
Speaker 6: so thin in general, So it's either going to have
Speaker 6: to be like you make the atmosphere thicker somehow by
Speaker 6: like melting the caps or like taking an atmosphere. But
Speaker 6: then you need a shield for the atmosphere.
Speaker 5: So, like I think if they.
Speaker 6: Existed in bubbles, like if we had like a big dome,
Speaker 6: maybe you could kind of start doing that that way,
Speaker 6: where you can like contain your atmosphere and your water
Speaker 6: and stuff like that. Yeah, so those are the big hurdles.
Speaker 6: In Radiation is another hurdle.
Speaker 5: Because there's not a lot of atmosphere to shieldy from
Speaker 5: it exactly. Even though the sun is farther away, you're
Speaker 5: still like sizzling. So even if you landscape Mars, you're
Speaker 5: still going to get a pretty high dose of radiation
Speaker 5: because of a really thin atmosphere. And also the place
Speaker 5: is pretty dry, it's pretty sandy. Now there is water
Speaker 5: trapped in minerals, but getting it out would be, in
Speaker 5: technical terms, a ton of work. Christopher Barley had a
Speaker 5: great question that I didn't even I hadn't considered. He says,
Speaker 5: I seem to remember that the northern half of is
Speaker 5: completely smooth, while the southern half is full of craters. Yeah,
Speaker 5: what's up? Do we understand what caused this and why
Speaker 5: the inconsistency?
Speaker 6: Yeah, So, like, uh, I think that maybe the major
Speaker 6: idea for this is that there was a big impact
Speaker 6: that came in like at an oblique angle and just
Speaker 6: like shaved off the top of Mars, and then it
Speaker 6: was like low And there's also a lot of debate
Speaker 6: about the they're called the Northern Lowlands the Southern Highlands,
Speaker 6: and so like the Southern Highlands are like way older,
Speaker 6: and there's like what we think were like catastrophic floods
Speaker 6: going up there. So is there some idea that there
Speaker 6: was an ocean up there too, which may explain that,
Speaker 6: and then like volcanism related to that like impact, so
Speaker 6: all things that could have smoothed it out.
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh. Katherine Woodrow and Michelle Sullivan both asked
Speaker 5: about microbia life on Mars. Which type of bacteria do
Speaker 5: you think would be the most likely to be found?
Speaker 5: Michelle Sullivan was like, cinobacteria, Yeah, so like extremophiles.
Speaker 6: I think for sure, I couldn't like tell you a
Speaker 6: specific bacteria, but like extremo files are things that live
Speaker 6: in extreme places, and so I think that's what we
Speaker 6: could find there. And I think there are some ciano
Speaker 6: bacteria that fit that category. And then like these microfossils
Speaker 6: that they thought were in this meteorite, those were magnetotactic bacteria.
Speaker 6: So if it were true that that were that they
Speaker 6: were fossils and maybe we could find that there. And
Speaker 6: since Mars did have a magnetic feel, it's not totally
Speaker 6: out of the question that they could have used it. Interesting. Yeah,
Speaker 6: and there's a lot of iron theres that's another possibility.
Speaker 5: Jude kidding wants to know what color is the sky
Speaker 5: on Mars. Are there long sunsets or does it switch
Speaker 5: to dark quickly? And can you see Earth from Mars?
Speaker 6: Okay, so the color of Mars, the color of the
Speaker 6: sky on Mars is like a butter scotch color, yeah,
Speaker 6: which we know, like from taking pictures and stuff of Mars.
Speaker 6: So there's a lot of like dust in the atmosphere,
Speaker 6: so it's dimmer. It's like way further from the sun
Speaker 6: than Earth is, so it's dimmer. But there it's still sunlight,
Speaker 6: but it's just darker. And so you think, and the
Speaker 6: days are about the same length, so I guess in
Speaker 6: a way it gets darker quicker, but only because there's
Speaker 6: less of light to begin with. Maybe, Yeah, But then
Speaker 6: the dust interacts with the atmosphere in the sunlight differently
Speaker 6: than it does on Earth because it's just like super
Speaker 6: iron rich dust, and so I think that's why it's
Speaker 6: like a more butter Scotch color than here we have
Speaker 6: like this blue color.
Speaker 5: What is one thing about Mars that people don't know
Speaker 5: that would really flabbergas them.
Speaker 6: Just how wet it used to be? People often ask
Speaker 6: me like, is it true that we found water on Mars?
Speaker 6: And then like, yeah, we found that like a million
Speaker 6: times already. Like, but that's the thing that they're often
Speaker 6: blown away by, right, But I think it's just still,
Speaker 6: for some reason not common knowledge yet that Mars used
Speaker 6: to be this like awesome place that was like not
Speaker 6: as cold and dry as it is now it's like wet.
Speaker 5: Just lush pools and spaws.
Speaker 6: Yeah maybe maybe slimy maybe Well I was just thinking,
Speaker 6: like you said, the lush, and I thought of like plants,
Speaker 6: but like in actually, if there's any life there would
Speaker 6: probably be like micro says like slimy.
Speaker 5: Yeah that's okay too. What's your favorite thing about Mars
Speaker 5: or your job surrounding Mars?
Speaker 6: I love that I can be paid to think about
Speaker 6: another planet and what it used to be like and
Speaker 6: what we could have been like and just these like
Speaker 6: crazy questions that are you know, really removed from the
Speaker 6: day to day, but that like that's my job, like
Speaker 6: because I could have a really practical job, but I
Speaker 6: instead get to do this really out out of this
Speaker 6: world thing.
Speaker 5: Literally.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and it's like a really cool to be part
Speaker 6: of these teams.
Speaker 5: And any advice to anyone who's like I want to
Speaker 5: work on Marsh.
Speaker 6: Yeah, there's so many ways to get involved with Mars stuff.
Speaker 6: And like one great thing about NASA is that all
Speaker 6: of our data that we get is publicly available. You
Speaker 6: can anybody with the internet can go on the Internet
Speaker 6: and look at like dope pictures of Mars for free
Speaker 6: download data the rover guts, Like anybody can have the
Speaker 6: same data that the scientists who work at NASA have.
Speaker 6: So you can literally just become you can just do
Speaker 6: that on your own, and you can go to like
Speaker 6: seminars and stuff and meet people and read books. Like
Speaker 6: there's tons of podcasts and stuff like that. There's like
Speaker 6: a million ways to get involved with NASA stuff, and
Speaker 6: there's lots of NASA outreach that is like pretty accessible,
Speaker 6: I think to most people. Thank you so much for
Speaker 6: being on Thank you, I'm so excited. Thanks for caring
Speaker 6: about Mars.
Speaker 5: Dude, I do care about Mars. I love Mars even
Speaker 5: more now great it works, So there you have it.
Speaker 5: I am so much more about Mars than I was
Speaker 5: before meeting the amazing doctor Jennifer Booze and her website
Speaker 5: What a destination on this world wide web. It features
Speaker 5: self portraits of her as a turtle with octopus hair.
Speaker 5: It's gorgeously perfect. It's j nnfr dot bz so it's
Speaker 5: her name novals Now. You can find ologies at Ologies
Speaker 5: on Instagram or Twitter. I'm on both at Ali Ward
Speaker 5: with one L and if you want more smologies you
Speaker 5: can find them at aliward dot com slash smologies. There
Speaker 5: are tons of episodes. They're all kids, safe, classrooms, safe
Speaker 5: with experts. We are at ologies on Instagram and Twitter.
Speaker 5: I'm at Aliward with one L on both. Thank you Zeegredrigez,
Speaker 5: Thomas Jarrett Sleeper of mind Jam Media, and Mercedes Maitland
Speaker 5: of Maitland Audio for working on these. We like to
Speaker 5: keep these small and short, so you'll find a whole
Speaker 5: list of credits in the show notes. Thank you for
Speaker 5: listening and pass them on. Okay, Bryebye Ologies, Spology, algy.
Speaker 7: Ologyologies when it comes to a great deal.
Speaker 1: Virgin Mobile doesn't play around introducing our news simplan price
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Speaker 2: Mobile customer twelvemonth contract includes unlimited data, standard calls and
Speaker 2: texts to all Irish networks. Offer ends Februar eighteenth, twenty
Speaker 2: twenty six. See Virgin Media dot Ie