WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.000 --> 00:00:05.280 Sean O'Connell ESPN seven hundred. As someone correctly stated, it 2 00:00:05.320 --> 00:00:08.119 seems like a team in a rebuild and some things 3 00:00:08.160 --> 00:00:12.080 were done this past season to potentially manipulate where the 4 00:00:12.119 --> 00:00:14.000 team would end up in the draft. Lot ofy odds, 5 00:00:14.039 --> 00:00:16.879 and unfortunately some of that is dependent on luck, and 6 00:00:17.239 --> 00:00:19.600 the team got a little bit unlucky. So do you 7 00:00:19.640 --> 00:00:22.719 have a philosophy, what is your philosophy on, for lack 8 00:00:22.760 --> 00:00:25.960 of a better term, to be in delicate tanking or 9 00:00:27.280 --> 00:00:32.799 manipulating minutes and player performance in order to achieve better 10 00:00:32.840 --> 00:00:33.479 lot of yodds? 11 00:00:34.159 --> 00:00:35.200 Won't see that this year. 12 00:00:35.439 --> 00:00:39.439 Yesterday, during Austin Ange's media availability, our very own Sean 13 00:00:39.479 --> 00:00:41.880 O'Connell the question that has made the rounds. 14 00:00:42.039 --> 00:00:44.640 A lot of people have reacted to it. 15 00:00:44.719 --> 00:00:47.799 Our next guest was also present, and certainly we'll have 16 00:00:47.840 --> 00:00:50.759 some thoughts on that and all things related to the 17 00:00:50.920 --> 00:00:51.759 Utah Jazz. 18 00:00:51.920 --> 00:00:55.079 Two time Utah Sports rid of the Year. Sarah Todd 19 00:00:55.159 --> 00:00:57.079 des Red News, Sarah, Happy Tuesday. How are you? 20 00:00:58.240 --> 00:01:01.479 I'm doing great? I actually was present, so I should 21 00:01:01.520 --> 00:01:04.400 I should say that I'm actually in San. 22 00:01:04.319 --> 00:01:08.079 Diego, So, sir, literally nobody knew that you could have 23 00:01:08.159 --> 00:01:09.519 just faked it, I. 24 00:01:09.480 --> 00:01:12.400 Know, honor system. I started to feel bad before I 25 00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:13.000 even talked. 26 00:01:13.120 --> 00:01:14.200 That says a lot about you. 27 00:01:14.519 --> 00:01:16.799 Let's I'm jealous you're in San Diego, but let's get 28 00:01:16.799 --> 00:01:20.799 your reaction, h And also whether or not you believe 29 00:01:21.200 --> 00:01:25.359 what Austin had to say that this idea of making 30 00:01:25.359 --> 00:01:29.280 sure certain players are encouraged to not show up for 31 00:01:29.359 --> 00:01:31.760 work in order to have the best lottery odds is 32 00:01:31.799 --> 00:01:33.920 something we will not see from the Jazz next year. 33 00:01:35.480 --> 00:01:40.640 Yeah, I mean I was just as shocked as everyone else. 34 00:01:40.680 --> 00:01:43.560 I mean not just from that comment, but through the 35 00:01:43.760 --> 00:01:46.239 whole press conference. I mean the way that it started 36 00:01:46.879 --> 00:01:49.560 right off the that like Ryan Smith had some comments, 37 00:01:49.640 --> 00:01:52.159 Austin said some comments, and then they opened up for questions. 38 00:01:52.200 --> 00:01:55.400 But literally, like the first thing that Ryan said to 39 00:01:55.519 --> 00:01:58.439 recorders was, I know everyone's going to probably have some 40 00:01:58.560 --> 00:02:02.760 questions about like organizations, structure and hierarchy, and I'm gonna 41 00:02:02.760 --> 00:02:05.159 clear that up right now. Like Austin is in charge, 42 00:02:05.280 --> 00:02:08.159 he has final say, he'll be giving the recommendations to me. 43 00:02:08.879 --> 00:02:12.000 And so what I thought was going to end up 44 00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:14.840 being another confusing press conference like it was when Danny 45 00:02:14.879 --> 00:02:17.080 Ainge was hired, was not like that at all it 46 00:02:17.199 --> 00:02:24.680 was very clear that they are making Austin Ange the 47 00:02:24.719 --> 00:02:27.879 most powerful decision maker in the front office, and so 48 00:02:28.639 --> 00:02:33.840 that was surprising. The second thing was that was surprising 49 00:02:34.360 --> 00:02:40.599 was that Danny Ainge, by all accounts, did not know 50 00:02:40.680 --> 00:02:44.000 that this was happening, That they weren't like interviewing president 51 00:02:44.039 --> 00:02:48.840 of basketball Operations candidates, and that it all happened what 52 00:02:49.159 --> 00:02:53.080 seemed very impulsively. So that was a second surprising thing. 53 00:02:53.120 --> 00:02:57.120 And then the final surprising thing was a very clear 54 00:02:57.159 --> 00:03:01.240 and concise you just play the audio. You won't see 55 00:03:01.280 --> 00:03:05.599 that next year as it pertains to tanking. And I 56 00:03:05.680 --> 00:03:09.520 reached out to different people within the organization and kind 57 00:03:09.520 --> 00:03:12.479 of pretty frankly like asked people like is this real 58 00:03:12.599 --> 00:03:14.680 or we be just being told what needs to be told. 59 00:03:15.360 --> 00:03:17.960 And I was told pretty plainly, like, no, this is real. 60 00:03:18.800 --> 00:03:21.000 Now There's two ways that could go right, Like the 61 00:03:21.159 --> 00:03:25.759 Jazz could trade away enough players to wear tanking by 62 00:03:25.919 --> 00:03:29.879 manipulating injury reports and minutes and games played is not 63 00:03:29.960 --> 00:03:34.840 necessary in order for them to be bad enough, or 64 00:03:34.879 --> 00:03:37.400 they will just play the roster they have and live 65 00:03:37.439 --> 00:03:41.000 with the results. But I have but I've been told 66 00:03:41.000 --> 00:03:44.400 by a number of people that they do not plan 67 00:03:44.479 --> 00:03:44.840 to tank. 68 00:03:46.919 --> 00:03:51.599 All right, Well I don't believe Okay, like I don't 69 00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:55.919 believe them. I don't believe what Austin said to be 70 00:03:56.199 --> 00:03:58.639 a truthful statement. I thought it was a great SoundBite. 71 00:03:59.120 --> 00:04:02.919 And respectfully, Sarah, if anybody out there is buying that 72 00:04:03.039 --> 00:04:05.360 Danny didn't know Ryan was talking to his son about 73 00:04:05.360 --> 00:04:07.479 this job, I've got a great piece of property we 74 00:04:07.479 --> 00:04:09.719 can talk about like, there's no way that happened behind 75 00:04:09.759 --> 00:04:13.000 closed doors either. But let's operate because your sources are 76 00:04:13.000 --> 00:04:14.759 good as good as any beat writer we have in 77 00:04:14.800 --> 00:04:17.839 the market. You're connected. So if we operate off the 78 00:04:17.879 --> 00:04:22.399 assumption and take Austin at as word that next year 79 00:04:22.439 --> 00:04:24.920 they are going to put their best foot forward and 80 00:04:24.959 --> 00:04:28.800 not be unserious about competition, you tell me what that 81 00:04:28.839 --> 00:04:31.920 looks like in your opinion, Because as we've talked about, 82 00:04:31.920 --> 00:04:34.480 and as you know, they have a top eight protected 83 00:04:34.560 --> 00:04:37.079 pick next year that if they don't finish in the 84 00:04:37.079 --> 00:04:39.079 top eight, that pick goes to the team that's about 85 00:04:39.079 --> 00:04:41.639 to win the world championship. But if they hold onto 86 00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:44.360 that pick next year, the first round convey turns into 87 00:04:44.519 --> 00:04:47.959 second rounders the year after. So it really makes zero 88 00:04:48.120 --> 00:04:51.160 sense to go all in on trying to win. If 89 00:04:51.199 --> 00:04:53.519 there's a chance that you win thirty two games and 90 00:04:53.639 --> 00:04:57.519 draft ninth and send that to Okase. In my opinion, 91 00:04:58.199 --> 00:05:00.800 the smart approach is doing everything you can to hold 92 00:05:00.839 --> 00:05:04.040 on to that asset, especially based off of where this 93 00:05:04.120 --> 00:05:05.879 team is in the process of trying to get back 94 00:05:05.879 --> 00:05:08.720 to relevance. So if he's telling the truth and they 95 00:05:08.759 --> 00:05:10.920 go all in and they try to win next year, 96 00:05:11.000 --> 00:05:11.399 what does. 97 00:05:11.240 --> 00:05:11.720 That look like. 98 00:05:13.079 --> 00:05:15.120 Well, I think that's the difference is I don't believe 99 00:05:15.160 --> 00:05:16.839 that they're going to go all in and try to win. 100 00:05:17.040 --> 00:05:19.199 I think that that there is a difference between not 101 00:05:19.279 --> 00:05:21.959 tanking and trying to win, like there is a middle 102 00:05:21.959 --> 00:05:26.000 ground there, which is why I believe that if they're 103 00:05:26.000 --> 00:05:30.560 talking about, like if they're being serious about not manipulating 104 00:05:30.600 --> 00:05:34.439 the injury report in minutes, I think that you have 105 00:05:34.560 --> 00:05:37.600 to offload players from the roster in order to make 106 00:05:37.639 --> 00:05:39.480 it so that you can put your best foot forward 107 00:05:39.519 --> 00:05:42.040 and still keep that top eight pick. And so that's 108 00:05:42.040 --> 00:05:43.879 what I think it looks like. I think that it 109 00:05:43.920 --> 00:05:47.720 looks like you can't just hang on to these contracts. 110 00:05:47.759 --> 00:05:49.560 I think that the fact that you have quite a 111 00:05:49.560 --> 00:05:52.279 few expiring deals now means it's probably going to be 112 00:05:52.319 --> 00:05:55.959 easier to get rid of guys like John Collins Jordan Clarkson. 113 00:05:56.519 --> 00:05:59.480 I think that it makes it interesting when you think 114 00:05:59.519 --> 00:06:02.920 about what kind of suitors may come calling for Walker 115 00:06:03.000 --> 00:06:06.600 Kessler or Lowry Markinen. I think that those are kind 116 00:06:06.600 --> 00:06:10.759 of more likely than they ever have been to be moved. 117 00:06:11.040 --> 00:06:13.959 I don't mean that super likely, but more likely than 118 00:06:14.000 --> 00:06:17.759 they were previously. And so if you are going to 119 00:06:17.839 --> 00:06:20.920 make it to where the roster is bad enough that 120 00:06:21.000 --> 00:06:24.079 you don't have to manipulate it in order to keep 121 00:06:24.079 --> 00:06:27.279 that top eight pick, that feels like what is probably 122 00:06:27.360 --> 00:06:30.720 going to happen. And I agree with you, and I'm 123 00:06:30.759 --> 00:06:33.160 pretty sure at this point it doesn't even turn into 124 00:06:33.199 --> 00:06:37.399 seconds like after this year, if the Jazz don't convey 125 00:06:37.399 --> 00:06:40.279 the pick to Okay, see, the obligation extinguishes. And so 126 00:06:40.800 --> 00:06:43.240 that's even more of a reason, like don't give this 127 00:06:43.360 --> 00:06:48.000 finals team a lottery pick, because that would just make 128 00:06:48.040 --> 00:06:50.920 the Western Conference even more difficult, Like don't reward them 129 00:06:50.959 --> 00:06:53.800 when you could just keep the pick. And so, I mean, 130 00:06:53.959 --> 00:06:57.480 it just feels insane if they were to not go 131 00:06:57.519 --> 00:06:59.839 after that pick. And so if they're going to stand 132 00:06:59.839 --> 00:07:02.560 by the word that they're not going to manipulate things 133 00:07:02.600 --> 00:07:05.480 in order to get better lottery odds. As it pertains 134 00:07:05.480 --> 00:07:08.399 to like performances in minutes, then I would expect a 135 00:07:08.439 --> 00:07:09.879 lot of trading to start happening. 136 00:07:10.279 --> 00:07:13.079 Yeah, well said, I do think there's a world because 137 00:07:13.680 --> 00:07:17.879 in my opinion, it's it's Lowry and it's Walker are 138 00:07:17.920 --> 00:07:20.879 the two players where you've got a little something there. Okay, 139 00:07:20.959 --> 00:07:23.920 I have questions about literally every other player on the roster. 140 00:07:24.759 --> 00:07:29.319 So if you wanted to tank and also meet the 141 00:07:29.360 --> 00:07:33.120 minimum salary floor requirements because you do have to pay players, 142 00:07:33.959 --> 00:07:37.399 then moving on from Marketing and Kessler and holding on 143 00:07:37.439 --> 00:07:40.399 to Collins, Clarkson and Sexton is something that you could 144 00:07:40.399 --> 00:07:43.079 probably look at because do respect. 145 00:07:42.720 --> 00:07:44.600 To those three that are all good guys. 146 00:07:45.879 --> 00:07:48.120 That's the kind of situation like John Collins might be 147 00:07:48.120 --> 00:07:50.399 a perfect vet for a team that's not trying to win, 148 00:07:51.120 --> 00:07:53.680 even though you know they're claiming they're not going to 149 00:07:53.879 --> 00:07:57.079 manipulate minutes because he's making twenty six point five and 150 00:07:57.160 --> 00:08:00.519 while he's been good in spurts, he's i'd have on 151 00:08:00.519 --> 00:08:02.240 the roster because John Collins is not going to win 152 00:08:02.279 --> 00:08:05.279 a bunch of games. Marketing and Kessler are good enough 153 00:08:05.319 --> 00:08:07.360 that if you play them. I don't know, if they 154 00:08:07.360 --> 00:08:09.600 play sixty five to seventy games, they're good enough that. 155 00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:10.639 You are going to win games. 156 00:08:10.680 --> 00:08:12.959 We've seen Lowry be able to do that, and Walker 157 00:08:13.040 --> 00:08:15.639 is an emerging player in this league. So what do 158 00:08:15.680 --> 00:08:17.839 you think of the potential of maybe moving on from 159 00:08:17.839 --> 00:08:21.439 market and Kessler, holding on to the other veterans and 160 00:08:21.480 --> 00:08:23.920 then playing the young players a grip of minutes that 161 00:08:24.000 --> 00:08:26.160 could include four new rookies on the roster. 162 00:08:27.319 --> 00:08:29.879 Yeah, I mean, and it kind of depends on what 163 00:08:30.000 --> 00:08:32.600 kind of timeline that you're going to be looking at right, Like, 164 00:08:32.639 --> 00:08:34.919 these are all discussions that are going to be happening 165 00:08:36.360 --> 00:08:40.720 in the very coming days and weeks with Austin Ainge 166 00:08:40.720 --> 00:08:43.559 and the rest of the front office. Like the idea 167 00:08:43.679 --> 00:08:46.879 of if you're moving on from Kessler, who is going 168 00:08:46.919 --> 00:08:51.320 into his fourth year, and market In who is now 169 00:08:51.440 --> 00:08:55.399 kind of really entering the prime of his career in age, 170 00:08:56.360 --> 00:08:59.080 and you're thinking, Okay, we're just going to have like 171 00:08:59.120 --> 00:09:02.080 the contracts that talking about John Collins concepts and on 172 00:09:02.159 --> 00:09:04.960 the roster in order to take up money space, but 173 00:09:05.159 --> 00:09:08.360 banking on young players that we can get this year 174 00:09:08.399 --> 00:09:10.799 with the fifth pick and maybe next year with a 175 00:09:10.879 --> 00:09:14.159 top eight pick, then you're talking about an even longer timeline. 176 00:09:14.879 --> 00:09:17.080 Obviously you'd be getting more picks if you were to 177 00:09:17.159 --> 00:09:20.120 unload Kessler and market In, and so what are you 178 00:09:20.159 --> 00:09:22.399 going to do with those What do the trade and 179 00:09:22.440 --> 00:09:25.840 free agent markets look like down the road two, three, four, 180 00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:30.279 five years from now? And so if you were to 181 00:09:30.279 --> 00:09:33.639 move those guys, it feels like an even more elongated timeline. 182 00:09:33.679 --> 00:09:35.320 If that's what they want to do, and if that's 183 00:09:35.600 --> 00:09:37.200 what they feel comfortable with it, and we'll be more 184 00:09:37.240 --> 00:09:39.080 successful with the team. Like I'm not going to say 185 00:09:39.080 --> 00:09:42.000 that it's not, but just you know, it would be 186 00:09:42.039 --> 00:09:46.559 another reason to temper the expectations of fans who think, like, oh, 187 00:09:46.600 --> 00:09:48.480 he came in, he said that there's not going to 188 00:09:48.519 --> 00:09:51.159 be any tanking. This is it, We're going to go win. 189 00:09:51.279 --> 00:09:54.120 It's like, no, this actually could be a situation where 190 00:09:54.120 --> 00:09:56.440 things could take longer than expected. 191 00:09:58.639 --> 00:10:00.039 On the other side. 192 00:10:00.200 --> 00:10:03.759 Okay, on the other side, and we'll just kind of 193 00:10:03.799 --> 00:10:06.360 talk about possibilities, Sarah, because there's no way of knowing 194 00:10:06.480 --> 00:10:10.000 how this will go. But you know, even Ryan yesterday, 195 00:10:10.320 --> 00:10:13.159 when Austin alluded to the success that he and his 196 00:10:13.279 --> 00:10:16.120 dad had in Boston, Ryan said I'd take some of 197 00:10:16.120 --> 00:10:20.559 that success right now. And Ryan oftentimes in the past 198 00:10:20.879 --> 00:10:24.440 has you know I heard Ryan talk about a potential 199 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:27.279 Christaps Porzingis deal that he thought they had done. 200 00:10:27.679 --> 00:10:29.879 Bobby Mark's on My show said he was. 201 00:10:29.799 --> 00:10:32.320 Told that the Jazz had a really nice offer for 202 00:10:32.440 --> 00:10:35.480 Drew Holliday. Andrew wanted to go play in Boston because 203 00:10:35.480 --> 00:10:36.720 he thought they could win, and they did. 204 00:10:36.759 --> 00:10:39.799 He's an NBA champion now. So we know that Ryan. 205 00:10:39.759 --> 00:10:43.360 Has expressed in the past the desire to bring in 206 00:10:43.440 --> 00:10:46.440 really good players. I still don't know who the guy 207 00:10:46.519 --> 00:10:48.600 down there was that uttered the phrase, we are going 208 00:10:48.639 --> 00:10:51.440 to sign Paul George and trade for mckel bridges, but 209 00:10:52.320 --> 00:10:54.639 good luck. I mean, that would have been awesome. Obviously 210 00:10:55.159 --> 00:10:58.159 that was not steeped in reality. But those are the 211 00:10:58.600 --> 00:11:01.600 desires that certain people down there have. And we are 212 00:11:01.759 --> 00:11:06.159 entering sarah offseason where Kevin Durant and maybe Jannis and 213 00:11:06.240 --> 00:11:09.360 maybe Kat and I could keep going. I mean, I 214 00:11:09.360 --> 00:11:12.080 don't know what Phoenix does, but they've got a they've 215 00:11:12.080 --> 00:11:13.960 got a problem where they've got to try to find 216 00:11:13.960 --> 00:11:14.480 some answers. 217 00:11:14.519 --> 00:11:16.200 Boston has a really expensive roster. 218 00:11:16.279 --> 00:11:19.759 They'll probably jet in some players the Jazz do not 219 00:11:19.840 --> 00:11:23.519 have cap space. John Collins is probably gonna pick up 220 00:11:23.559 --> 00:11:25.200 his player option. I'll go out of a limb there. 221 00:11:25.200 --> 00:11:28.360 If he doesn't, then we have a different conversation. Next 222 00:11:28.440 --> 00:11:30.720 year is the off season where the Jazz have very 223 00:11:30.720 --> 00:11:33.919 clean books. So next year is the year that I 224 00:11:33.919 --> 00:11:37.120 think it's more realistic to talk about adding more viable 225 00:11:37.159 --> 00:11:40.519 pieces and talent to give them a better chance of competing. 226 00:11:41.440 --> 00:11:46.320 But is there are there avenues for the Jazz to 227 00:11:46.320 --> 00:11:51.240 add talent this offseason to make next year much more competitive? 228 00:11:51.799 --> 00:11:53.519 And if you're able to add a couple of really 229 00:11:53.559 --> 00:11:57.679 good veteran players, add them to these young pieces and 230 00:11:57.759 --> 00:11:59.720 maybe put a couple of players next to Larry and 231 00:11:59.759 --> 00:12:04.200 Walker her Is there is that a real scenario for 232 00:12:04.279 --> 00:12:07.039 the Jazz this offseason to add some really good veteran 233 00:12:07.080 --> 00:12:10.159 players and actually take a couple of tangible steps forward 234 00:12:10.320 --> 00:12:10.879 next year. 235 00:12:14.279 --> 00:12:18.840 It doesn't. It doesn't feel real. I agree, because even 236 00:12:18.879 --> 00:12:21.159 if we're talking about, like, you know, some of the 237 00:12:21.200 --> 00:12:23.399 guys that are on the table right now, like Yannis 238 00:12:23.440 --> 00:12:27.879 right like why in any world or any scenario would 239 00:12:28.039 --> 00:12:33.679 Milwaukee talk to Utah about the fifth pick and some 240 00:12:33.840 --> 00:12:37.039 of the young players that the Jazz have when clearly 241 00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:40.480 they could have the second pick from San Antonio and 242 00:12:40.720 --> 00:12:44.360 better young players. I just think that there are better 243 00:12:44.440 --> 00:12:49.799 deals and better situations that the Bucks would want to 244 00:12:49.840 --> 00:12:52.320 deal with, Like they're they're not looking to get rid 245 00:12:52.320 --> 00:12:57.240 of Yanis and be completely in the lurch with someone 246 00:12:57.279 --> 00:13:00.360 like Isaiah Collier who's not proven and probably going to 247 00:13:00.440 --> 00:13:02.639 end up being like a backup point guard at best 248 00:13:02.799 --> 00:13:05.480 at this point with what we know about him. Why 249 00:13:05.480 --> 00:13:08.000 would they do that if they could just get Dylan 250 00:13:08.039 --> 00:13:11.759 Harper and you know, Devin Befel or something like that. 251 00:13:11.919 --> 00:13:15.440 So it just doesn't feel like the Jazz have the 252 00:13:15.480 --> 00:13:18.799 players and picks that a lot of other teams could 253 00:13:18.840 --> 00:13:24.799 offer the Bucks right now. But I just can't get 254 00:13:24.840 --> 00:13:29.200 past the fact that the Jazz are just not in 255 00:13:29.240 --> 00:13:32.080 a position to be okay with giving up that top 256 00:13:32.120 --> 00:13:36.799 eight pick next year. It just feels irresponsible to do that, 257 00:13:37.120 --> 00:13:39.559 and so I don't see that happening. I don't see 258 00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:42.919 them wanting or willing to just give it up outright 259 00:13:43.080 --> 00:13:45.159 just to get a few more wins. But I think 260 00:13:45.679 --> 00:13:51.240 the biggest question is who is ultimately making that decision 261 00:13:51.279 --> 00:13:53.120 at the end. Right, Like we know that the front 262 00:13:53.120 --> 00:13:56.120 office hierarchy, what we've been told is that often change 263 00:13:56.240 --> 00:14:01.039 is in charge, but like every other professor sports team, 264 00:14:01.799 --> 00:14:05.159 he will make a decision and take that decision to ownership. 265 00:14:05.720 --> 00:14:08.200 And that is where the true final say happened. That is, 266 00:14:08.240 --> 00:14:13.039 with every professional sports organization, ownership signs off on decisions, 267 00:14:13.519 --> 00:14:18.360 and in this case it's Ryan Smith and he is 268 00:14:19.960 --> 00:14:24.440 He literally tweeted out that he was screaming outside the 269 00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:27.759 day after the lottery, Like he is emotional and he 270 00:14:27.840 --> 00:14:30.480 reacts to things as a fan. He is a fan 271 00:14:30.559 --> 00:14:35.080 of this team that he owns, and so if Ryan 272 00:14:35.200 --> 00:14:38.600 Smith wants to win, I think that that is what 273 00:14:38.759 --> 00:14:41.720 is going to push decisions. 274 00:14:42.039 --> 00:14:46.120 When it comes to the front office hierarchy. I guess 275 00:14:46.159 --> 00:14:48.559 we can only go off of what we've been told. 276 00:14:49.120 --> 00:14:53.080 Does it feel like Justin Zanik and Danny Ainge report 277 00:14:53.159 --> 00:14:56.320 to Austin Ange? Is that is that the gut the 278 00:14:56.320 --> 00:14:57.919 gut feel, is that kind of how this thing is 279 00:14:57.960 --> 00:14:58.559 going to play out? 280 00:14:59.440 --> 00:15:01.159 That's what i' I mean, that's what we're led to 281 00:15:01.200 --> 00:15:06.200 believe right now. Right And like if they if the 282 00:15:06.240 --> 00:15:09.720 president of basketball operations job has been open for three 283 00:15:09.799 --> 00:15:14.240 years and they haven't made any indication that they were 284 00:15:14.320 --> 00:15:19.919 going to promote justin Zanik, and he has stayed and 285 00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:24.120 for by all accounts, happily been in the position of 286 00:15:24.200 --> 00:15:27.399 general manager. And if you're there for three years while 287 00:15:27.440 --> 00:15:30.440 that job is open, I don't think that Zanik ever 288 00:15:30.559 --> 00:15:35.559 expected to have that job, you know, but it is 289 00:15:35.759 --> 00:15:38.440 it is a strange dynamic to have the new person 290 00:15:38.480 --> 00:15:41.960 come in and have everybody be reporting to them, including 291 00:15:42.039 --> 00:15:42.600 his father. 292 00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:46.720 Were you surprised that Danny was not quoted in any 293 00:15:46.759 --> 00:15:49.919 press releases nor was made available during the media stuff. 294 00:15:50.919 --> 00:15:56.039 I'm not surprised by that at all. I mean, number one, like, 295 00:15:56.440 --> 00:15:59.559 it's not shocking that they didn't make him available because 296 00:16:02.360 --> 00:16:05.279 probably posing some weird questions to him would be uncomfortable, 297 00:16:05.320 --> 00:16:07.480 So like why would they make him available for that? Right, 298 00:16:07.559 --> 00:16:13.879 But then also a little unfaired often, right, like if 299 00:16:13.919 --> 00:16:16.159 he just got hired as president of back of Operation, 300 00:16:16.360 --> 00:16:18.320 that's like the biggest job in the NBA that he's 301 00:16:18.360 --> 00:16:22.320 ever had, Like it would feel a little infantilizing to 302 00:16:22.360 --> 00:16:24.080 be like, Okay, now let's talk to your daddy. 303 00:16:26.720 --> 00:16:28.320 Okay, the way, if you put it like that, I 304 00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:30.600 guess I'm on board. 305 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:33.679 What do you Okay, let's see how to pose this question. 306 00:16:34.600 --> 00:16:37.759 If you got Zanik in an honest moment about this 307 00:16:38.039 --> 00:16:38.440 entire thing. 308 00:16:38.480 --> 00:16:39.720 And let me start with this. 309 00:16:40.120 --> 00:16:43.240 We all want to keep our jobs, and there are 310 00:16:43.279 --> 00:16:46.320 not a lot of NBA general manager jobs out there now. 311 00:16:46.519 --> 00:16:48.360 Zanik at one point was thought to be the new 312 00:16:48.399 --> 00:16:52.279 GM in Milwaukee before that went to Horst, and then 313 00:16:52.320 --> 00:16:55.960 he was elevated after Dennis Lindsay decided he was not 314 00:16:56.080 --> 00:17:01.159 interested in working for this ownership group anymore. Soultimately, I'm 315 00:17:01.200 --> 00:17:04.160 sure the bottom line for jay Z is I'm an 316 00:17:04.240 --> 00:17:06.720 NBA general manager and this is awesome and I love 317 00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:12.359 my job. But I wonder ultimately how he feels about 318 00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:15.200 this entire thing where it's clear that you know, he's 319 00:17:15.279 --> 00:17:18.160 part of the group but not running the show, maybe 320 00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:20.640 in a way that he thought maybe at some point 321 00:17:20.680 --> 00:17:21.960 he would be, if that makes sense. 322 00:17:22.799 --> 00:17:27.759 Yeah, I mean, like I said, he's known the score 323 00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:30.599 because he hasn't been given that promotion for three years, right, 324 00:17:30.680 --> 00:17:33.759 Like if he thought that he was getting it then 325 00:17:33.920 --> 00:17:36.079 one year or two years ago, then it would have 326 00:17:36.160 --> 00:17:41.839 become clear, right and so, And I also think a 327 00:17:41.880 --> 00:17:46.000 lot about Justin's personal life when I think about his position. 328 00:17:46.400 --> 00:17:49.440 He's been in Utah for a long time, recently had 329 00:17:49.480 --> 00:17:54.000 a kidney transplant, learned that all of his children have 330 00:17:54.119 --> 00:17:58.720 the same genetic variant that he has that leads to 331 00:17:58.759 --> 00:18:02.359 the kidney disease that he has. So like all of 332 00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:06.319 his doctors are in Utah, you know, his children in 333 00:18:06.400 --> 00:18:09.400 high school. Like, there's not a lot of personal reason 334 00:18:09.519 --> 00:18:12.039 for him to want to leave. And if he's in 335 00:18:12.079 --> 00:18:16.599 a position where staying general manager and continuing to have 336 00:18:17.119 --> 00:18:20.359 a very lucrative and successful job keeps him in a 337 00:18:20.400 --> 00:18:23.200 place where him his family are not only happy, but healthy, 338 00:18:23.839 --> 00:18:26.640 I think that that plays a lot more into Justin's 339 00:18:26.759 --> 00:18:31.359 decisions and perception on his life then maybe it did 340 00:18:31.440 --> 00:18:34.640 even two or three years ago. And then in addition 341 00:18:34.720 --> 00:18:39.920 to that, there are a lot of owners in the 342 00:18:40.039 --> 00:18:47.119 NBA who are less willing to spend money and less 343 00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:51.480 willing to keep things to keep continuent. I mean, look 344 00:18:51.519 --> 00:18:53.319 at what is happening in New York right now, Like 345 00:18:53.759 --> 00:18:55.960 you know, James Dolan is as sickle as they come, 346 00:18:56.200 --> 00:18:59.079 and is as horrible as they come, and they're firing 347 00:18:59.160 --> 00:19:01.240 TIBs after he just the next to the furthest points 348 00:19:01.240 --> 00:19:04.000 they've been in over twenty years, and so like things 349 00:19:04.039 --> 00:19:05.799 could be worse, And I think that you know, if 350 00:19:05.799 --> 00:19:08.519 you're if you're a front office person in the NBA 351 00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:10.880 and you're serving the landscape, there are a lot worse 352 00:19:10.880 --> 00:19:13.039 places to be than where justin' zanik is right now. 353 00:19:13.359 --> 00:19:15.319 Yeah, and you're good to bring up the personal side. 354 00:19:15.359 --> 00:19:18.240 That's something that we fail to do in this space often. 355 00:19:18.319 --> 00:19:19.880 So I appreciate that perspective. 356 00:19:19.920 --> 00:19:21.160 I like Justin. 357 00:19:21.279 --> 00:19:23.400 I'm a Xana guy, and so you know, I just 358 00:19:23.480 --> 00:19:25.160 kind of wonder how this is all landing with him. 359 00:19:25.160 --> 00:19:27.359 But yes, we all want to keep our jobs, and 360 00:19:27.400 --> 00:19:30.319 I'm sure Justin is in that that space as well. 361 00:19:30.400 --> 00:19:32.160 So you brought up where I wanted to go next, 362 00:19:32.279 --> 00:19:35.960 which is and I'll start here just to reduct, you know, 363 00:19:36.119 --> 00:19:38.599 to be reductive and reduce it to really what the 364 00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:41.240 bottom line is of pro basketball, and that is, if 365 00:19:41.240 --> 00:19:44.480 you don't have players, it doesn't matter who your coach is. 366 00:19:44.599 --> 00:19:46.599 If you don't have players, it doesn't matter who your 367 00:19:46.599 --> 00:19:48.839 front office is, it doesn't matter who your owner is 368 00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:49.799 if you don't have players. 369 00:19:50.240 --> 00:19:53.480 And the Jazz don't have players, they don't the Knicks do. 370 00:19:54.480 --> 00:19:58.079 But what happened today is another example of why New 371 00:19:58.160 --> 00:20:00.880 York has been treading water for twenty five years. They 372 00:20:00.920 --> 00:20:04.680 have a petulant owner who's impatient and makes ration, you know, 373 00:20:04.759 --> 00:20:07.079 irrational decisions without thinking them through. 374 00:20:08.160 --> 00:20:10.960 And so where I will give the Jazz credit. 375 00:20:11.039 --> 00:20:13.599 And only time will tell if this is the right approach, 376 00:20:13.640 --> 00:20:16.799 because again, if you don't have players, it doesn't matter 377 00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:19.000 who your coach is or who your front office is. 378 00:20:19.039 --> 00:20:23.079 But what Ryan is elected to do will hardy received. 379 00:20:23.160 --> 00:20:24.960 He's going to receive a nine year runway and he's 380 00:20:24.960 --> 00:20:27.480 won thirty percent of his basketball games. Tom Thibeau was 381 00:20:27.519 --> 00:20:29.640 just fired after going to the Eastern Conference Finals and 382 00:20:29.680 --> 00:20:31.640 winning fifty games in back to back years for the 383 00:20:31.640 --> 00:20:34.799 first time in twenty five thirty years. So what Ryan 384 00:20:34.880 --> 00:20:37.319 has elected to do is like the anti Dolean approach, 385 00:20:37.359 --> 00:20:39.920 and that is lock in a front office, lock in 386 00:20:39.960 --> 00:20:42.960 a coach, and let's go again. Bottom line, you have 387 00:20:43.039 --> 00:20:45.400 to have players and the Jazz don't. But what do 388 00:20:45.440 --> 00:20:48.440 you make of that dichotomy where I perceive to be, 389 00:20:49.559 --> 00:20:52.119 you know, the wrong approach from James Dolan for years 390 00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:55.480 to bring in aged, you know, aging overpriced players and 391 00:20:55.480 --> 00:20:58.240 aren't ready to win, to fire coaches left and right, 392 00:20:58.279 --> 00:21:00.640 and it clearly has not worked, Can says in New York. 393 00:21:00.640 --> 00:21:02.960 And Ryan is taking the opposite approach. What are your thoughts. 394 00:21:04.720 --> 00:21:09.079 I'm long been a believer that like consistency and continuity 395 00:21:09.119 --> 00:21:12.279 when it comes to coaching is really important. Like it 396 00:21:12.319 --> 00:21:15.240 is really hard to look at some of the teams 397 00:21:15.279 --> 00:21:18.359 in the NBA and think, like, wow, that's not part 398 00:21:18.359 --> 00:21:21.160 of it, right, Like you look at the turnover and 399 00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:24.519 coaching in Phoenix, the turnover and coaching in Milwaukee, the 400 00:21:24.559 --> 00:21:27.720 turnover and coaching in Philadelphia, and like now New York 401 00:21:27.759 --> 00:21:29.319