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Speaker 1: Hi. This is Christina and Carmen and this is another

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episode of a Spooky Tells, a podcast for all things spooky,

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true crime hunter places not American related, and that's what

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we're doing today. We have some cryptids and then a

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true crime case that somehow doctor Phil has evolved. I

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don't like that already. Yeah, yeah, that man no for real?

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Because did you see that he was at Ice Raids?

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I did. I did see that, and I'm like, who

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the fuck do you think you are? Yeah? I was like, wow,

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how weird that he came up when I was researching

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and then he comes up today and I'm like, can

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you just please go away? One of the only things

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I want in life is for him to go away.

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Nothing else matters, no, because same, well besides some other

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people that I want to go away. But you know,

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all right, before we get into our topic, we do

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have a listener story and if you want to submit

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a story to us for us to read, email at

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spookitos at gmail dot com. You can submit it on Discord,

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you can set it to me on Instagram. All those

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things are linked in the show notes. You can also

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call these spooky hotline. It's been a hot midut since

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we've had a phone call, feel free to do that.

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It has Yeah and all right, this story is from Discord.

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You want to read it? Yes, it comes from use

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your named Geeka. Hi everyone, I have a kind of

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creepy story from my childhood. I remember small parts of it,

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but most of it is my family's version since I

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was four years old. Apologies and advanced for end years

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as English is not my first language and I don't

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practice writing in English as much as I should. First

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of all, English doesn't matter. Don't ever apologize for that. Never,

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not here in this house, in this podcast. No, So

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here we go. When I was very little, I had

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an imaginary friend who I called Uncle Leo. At first,

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my mother didn't think much about it, since imagining friends

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are a normal thing, but normally children don't have an

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imaginary uncle. But okay, true, true, okay, mom? Why did

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that not always any red flags? Like, you're just kidding.

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We don't blame him anyway, And I would talk and

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play with Uncle Leo all the time, terrorizing the cleaning lady. Anyway,

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One day my mother caught me talking to Uncle Leo

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in a way that made me seem very upset and

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she asked what was happening. I replied that Uncle Leo

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said he needed to leave, but I didn't want him

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to go, and then I added that he looked beautiful, shining,

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full of light. Oh my god, he was saying mine. Oh.

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My Mom was like okay, and didn't pressure me too

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much about it, just comforted me. A long time passed

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without me mentioning Uncle Leo again, until one day my

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mother was organizing the photo albums and I was playing

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around her. When she opened an album from her teenage years.

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She showed me what everyone was like at the time,

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and I didn't pay much attention until I suddenly pointed

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to one of the photographs and said, look at Uncle Leo.

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Oh my god. I just got chills. I know. I know.

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My mother says her blood around cold, because I was

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pointing out one of our teenage friends who had died

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in a motorcycle accident long before. Cry don't cry yet,

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the tears are Kobe hold it in dark, Okay. So

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long before I was born. His name was Leonardo to

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his friends, Leo. Oh my god, he came back to visit.

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He just wanted to meet his nibbling. Oh my god,

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that's the most beautiful thing I've ever heard is it's

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so beautiful, like he came from beyond the grate that

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al I have escalofrios right now. I literally got chills

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when I was reading it. Oh my god, And you're

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trying to stop your tears, I am. I don't you

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know while you're doing that. I just want to let

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these spookies know that Carmen got me a new brush

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for Christmas. Oh my god, my hair looks amazing. I

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got a new hair dryer, and I have to say

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the combo hair immaculus. Never Yeah, I've never been this

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happy with my curls. The curls Sky Kravin, for give

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to me the gift of my curls. Welcome, You're welcome.

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Plus the hairdryer is also my recommendation, so so really

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was also welcome for that of course. In fact, I

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implore everyone to go to our YouTube to look at

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my hair. Yeah yeah, yeah, you'll notice how much better

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it looks from other episodes. You really will, you really will. Yeah, Okay,

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I'm done. What a tear drinker. That was razing story.

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I really loved it. I love a fell ghost story,

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you know what I mean? Like those aren't the best.

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Remind me of the one we've already mentioned so many

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times in the podcast about our great grandpa visiting us. Yes, yeah,

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and it was the same, like we didn't know it

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was him on to where our mama was showing us

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pictures and we're like, he visited us and she's like

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what what? Yeah? What? Yeah? And those are the best

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and only ghost stories that you want to experience. Yeah, yeah, personally,

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I agree. And it has to be when you're little

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so you're not scared, you know, Yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay.

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Should we get onto some cryptid stories. Let's do it,

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all right. Our first cryptid is El chon Choon. First

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love the name me too. I really had a ring

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to it. So. El Tronchon is a myth that first

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began among them Mapucha people, who are native to the

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region of south central Chile and southwestern Argentina. El Tronchon

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is said to be a powerful sorcerer who undergoes a transformation.

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The creature is highly feared, and only the most powerful

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sorcerers can transform into El Tronchon. It's giving Yes, oh

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my god, what are they called? I know what you're

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going to say. I also forgot what it's called, but

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I know you're talking about as possible. I'm you know

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what my MEAs are wearing now? But you know the

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shape shifting creature, not the white Chivo, but the other one. Christina,

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we have the same brain because I was like, not

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the wit TiVo and I was literally just gonna say

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that are we twins or what we must be? Wow?

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No way, it wouldn't be funny, Like a new listener

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and they're like, they don't know that we're twins. Okay,

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shout out Fred. I love him on Patreon. He's always commenting,

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but he was like, wait, you guys are twins. And

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our episode with Mommy, what my gosh. She's like He's like,

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I suspected, but I didn't want to be dumb and ask,

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and I was like, you should always be dumb. Yeah

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that's our motto. Yeah, there are no dumb questions here.

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Spooky telles no, no, no. I still can't remember the

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shape shous creature in Mexico that I am talking about,

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but you all know what I'm talking about. Man, Why

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can't we remember? We have had them in many stories? Wow?

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This is sad. Yeah, yeah, it's not going to not

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coming to me either. No, okay, so where was I

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before beginning its transformation. It's said, either it be a

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male or fear locks themselves in their rooms and make

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sure no one will stop while they're not in their bodies.

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So they they want their privacy, and they need their privacy,

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and we respect that. Yeah, this reminds me of this

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other story also that we read. I think it was

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one of the myths or legends from Yes if it's

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somewhere else, something about a cave, Yes, like that would

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turn into a snake and they were like terrorizing. Yes, yeah, yeah, yes, yes,

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so they need their privacy. Then they apply a magical

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cream to their throat. Oh my god, yes, wow, we

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should have known that. Yeah, so the throat. I won't

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know if you heard that because you were you know,

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no no startovers. Okay, so a sentence well before that,

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since you know you were preoccupied with the naway. It's

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fine because we all wanted to know the answer, as

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it means we did. Yeah, but anyway, I was saying

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that the tranzone needs this privacy while transforming. Right, So

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then they locked themselves in the room and make sure

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no one goes into the room while they're not in

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their bodies, and then they apply a magical cream to

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their throat, and the cream then initiates the transformation by

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allowing the head to smoothly remove itself from the body

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without a drop of blood being spilled, and it's said

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to resemble a bat. Okay interesting. In nineteen twenty nine,

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a Chilen historian named Tomas Gevarra set the ears and

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then stretch out and turn into very large wings that

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allow the head to fly around. The head is then

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adorned with feathers and talons. I'm picturing it, I am,

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I can see it, and she's a cutie. I'm pretty

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sing like an owl, even though they say it remembers

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it resembles a bat. Yeah. The powerful creature then flies

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at night and uses its news shape to engage in

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malevolent activities, such as flying to caves where other sorcerers

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and Satan gets together at night to perform rituals. And

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are they joining or internality. I'm not sure yet. I wonder.

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I don't know if they're just a casual observer or

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they're participant in these satanic rituals. I don't know, I

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don't know, I don't know. In addition to performing rituals,

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Elronchon is also able to drink the blood of the

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sick or sleeping. Don't expect to see Elronjon anytime soon,

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as legend says that only other sorcerers or powerful people

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can see them. Oh, but normal individuals can still hear

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their cries in the dark, which sound like a loud

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And how do you think this is pronounced? It's t

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u e Oh, that's a little too close to tua,

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not toua tua in Spanish. This is the o g

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hawk tua. Yeah and better better Yeah. Yeah, if you

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hear a outside your house, it's best you, says Camino respectfully.

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I love it. Yeah. I love when there's like a

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phrase you can say to avoid, you know, like the trouble. Yeah,

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if you don't say it, it said an old lady

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or handsome man will appear at your door asking for salt. Well,

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those are very different. I don't know if it's like

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gender base or how it decides to present itself. Yeah,

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so either an old lady or a handsome man will

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appear at your door asking for salt, and if you

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don't give it to them, they'll take it as an

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insult and will avenge themselves doing what. I don't know

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what the avenge in tels Son. Please clarify. Hopefully it's

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not like murder. Maybe just like like a little beating,

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like the other lady who beat up the You remember

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that la. I don't remember anything, okay first all, but

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remember the like I remember the concepts of things, but

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I don't remember the name of anything. Yeah, and do

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you remember the legend of the lady. She was like

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an eventual spirit and you think she was the one

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that's turned No, she's not the one that turned into

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a firewall. That's a different one. Anyway, this lady was

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like an old lady and then like old lady spirit

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and then you would light candles for her, but you

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had to light it on. It might be ye. At

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first I thought it wasn't, but then I was like,

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maybe it is. And then the lady didn't she like

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forgot one night and then she needs to beat her ass. Yeah, yeah,

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I'm pretty sure I think it was. I think yeah,

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I think yeah. Others say that hearing in the woods

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is a bad omen I imagine it would be. Yeah,

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because someone will avenge themselves to you to give them

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salts and what if you don't realize it, you know

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what I mean? Yeah? Okay, so that was It's sill

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a cute name but kind of scary. Yeah, okay, So

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next up we have the vampire vine. This sounds cool. Yeah,

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this is a botanical cryptid. A what botanical cryptid? What

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does that mean?

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Speaker 2: Like?

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Speaker 1: Oh my god? Like a like a natural? Yeah, she's

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just a natural, girly Yes, I understand now I was

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I don't know what I was thinking. I don't know

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where my brain was. In other words, the vampire vine

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is a plant rumored to be a katawan that survives

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by draining the blood of living creatures. So it's okay,

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like a plant vampire hybrid. This will probably be people

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to think of plants like venus fly traps and picture plants,

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but these plants only eat insects or lizards, not humans

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or large animals. The story was first discussed by the

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famous mystic Helena Blovotsky, who in nineteen not nineteen eighty one,

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who in eighteen ninety one published a story in Lucifer

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magazine where she discussed and experience a young explorer named

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Leroy Dunstan. Sorry, so we're starting in eighteen ninety one

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explorer I think Evan colonizer and in Central America. Yeah yeah, yeah,

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so Leroy Dunstan some experience he had a while he

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was researching botanical specimens in Central America. According to Blovotsky,

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Dunstan was exploring a swamp in i Karawa with the

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help of natives when he heard his dog crying out loud.

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Dunstan a rushed to his dog's aid, only to find

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him wrapped in roots and vines. Oh. Dunctan tried to

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save his dog from this plant that was oozing a

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sticky black substance from its pores, but as he tried

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to cut the vines with a knife, the plant also

234
00:13:12,399 --> 00:13:17,159
tried to trap Dunstan. Oh. Dunstan was then shocked to

235
00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:19,440
see that the part of his skin that was touched

236
00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:23,000
by the plant was turning red and blistering, and the

237
00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:26,639
dog's skin was covered in puncher marks and blood. Oh no,

238
00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:31,840
what a gory scene. Yeah. Miraculously the dogs survived, but

239
00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:35,279
natives then warned Dunstan of the plant they called the

240
00:13:35,279 --> 00:13:38,919
Devil's snare. Oh does this not remind you Harry Potter?

241
00:13:39,559 --> 00:13:42,399
Yeah it does, and so did the other story because

242
00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:44,399
for some reason, even though I know it's on an owl,

243
00:13:44,399 --> 00:13:47,000
I kept thinking of the owl. Okay, even though I

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00:13:47,039 --> 00:13:50,559
know it's not an owl. That's too far, too far, okay, sorry, sorry,

245
00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:54,480
I'm pulling the plug. I just kept picturing an owl. Yeah,

246
00:13:54,799 --> 00:13:57,000
isn't that what the plants call in the first movie?

247
00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,679
Isn't it? I think? I think so. I can only

248
00:13:59,720 --> 00:14:04,559
think of fucking TikTok. They took this chess scene, yeah,

249
00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:07,799
admitted into like a dancing and then they're like voky

250
00:14:07,879 --> 00:14:14,759
Harry No. I loved those. To sacrifice myself my favorite.

251
00:14:14,799 --> 00:14:17,200
I'm still freaking dumb. I had to sacrifice myself and

252
00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:18,440
then he's like on the floor. I don't know what

253
00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:19,879
that move is called, but you know the way i'men.

254
00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:24,000
They're like down and then up like yeah, yeah, I

255
00:14:24,039 --> 00:14:26,840
haven't come across one in a while. I gotta find either. Yeah.

256
00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:30,840
I love those. So, according to the local several others

257
00:14:30,879 --> 00:14:34,120
were not lucky enough to escape the vampire vine. Dunstan

258
00:14:34,320 --> 00:14:36,519
brought a route back with him to Europe to study,

259
00:14:36,720 --> 00:14:38,600
but it died on the way and had to be

260
00:14:38,679 --> 00:14:42,600
thrown out after it began to smell. The British journalist

261
00:14:42,759 --> 00:14:46,399
William Thomas Stead also published a story in his magazine

262
00:14:46,679 --> 00:14:50,720
Review of Reviews. Okay, wow, you know what. Okay, but

263
00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:52,639
this is what I would name a magazine that was

264
00:14:52,679 --> 00:14:59,000
reviewing things, review of reviews. Yeah. So he published a

265
00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:04,399
story review of Reviews of Dunstan Discovery and Instead said

266
00:15:05,559 --> 00:15:08,120
he was able to discover very little about the nature

267
00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,879
of the plant owing to the difficulty of handling it,

268
00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:13,600
for its grasp can only be torn away with the

269
00:15:13,639 --> 00:15:18,000
loss of skin and even of flesh. Yeah no thanks, yeah,

270
00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:21,679
Instead said. Dunstan describes how the plant drew blood from

271
00:15:21,679 --> 00:15:27,320
people or animals by using a number of infinite, infinite, infinite,

272
00:15:27,679 --> 00:15:34,320
infinitesimal infinite. Okay, I think it's like infinitimal. I'm not sure. Okay, infinity,

273
00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:39,240
amount of mosane, amount of mouths, yes, numerous, extra numerous,

274
00:15:40,039 --> 00:15:46,600
too many, too many mouths count which ordinarily closed open

275
00:15:46,679 --> 00:15:49,720
for the reception of food. If the substance is animal,

276
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:57,399
that's the mouth and sorry it was a substance is animal.

277
00:15:57,480 --> 00:16:00,639
The blood is drawn off and the carcass or refuse

278
00:16:00,799 --> 00:16:03,559
then dropped. I wouldn't want to mess or come across

279
00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:12,879
this plant. Nope, nope. So then next we have the Abagucci. Okay,

280
00:16:13,080 --> 00:16:16,039
fun name. We're just getting fun names today. Yeah. So

281
00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,000
L Labauci, believe it or not, is a crypto that

282
00:16:19,039 --> 00:16:21,639
not only has a connection to Costatica, but also to

283
00:16:21,759 --> 00:16:27,320
West Virginia. Well, I'm surprised, and shock color be shocked. No,

284
00:16:27,399 --> 00:16:31,559
I am surprised. Labagucci was first spotted in Costatica, where

285
00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:37,120
many locals referred to it as dry land Banya. Well,

286
00:16:37,159 --> 00:16:41,440
that's terrifying. Yeah, that is surviving, Like paranas are like

287
00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:43,200
one of the scariest things about the ocean, and then

288
00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:45,720
they're gonna be on dry land like they actually don't

289
00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:48,240
like attack people like that. Oh, it's just like very

290
00:16:48,399 --> 00:16:51,799
very rare. Oh oh, I'm just picturing like all the movies,

291
00:16:51,879 --> 00:16:53,960
you know. Yeah, it's just the thing in the movies,

292
00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:55,759
like if you're in Amazon you fall in, They're not

293
00:16:55,799 --> 00:16:59,039
gonna Yeah, maybe something else will, but that's terrifying. I

294
00:16:59,039 --> 00:17:01,480
can't even think about that. No, you will never catch

295
00:17:01,519 --> 00:17:05,039
me there, no, no, no, no no. The strange creature

296
00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:07,400
is said to eat anything, no matter how big the

297
00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:11,680
animal might be, including animals as big as horses and cows. Wow,

298
00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:14,559
and good like catching one because it's said the creature

299
00:17:14,599 --> 00:17:18,279
will do anything to escape capture. But in nineteen ny nine,

300
00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:22,519
the West Virginia State Division of Natural Resources imported thirteen

301
00:17:22,599 --> 00:17:27,319
Abagucis to help the state combat growing predator populations. Jim

302
00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:30,640
Wilson said in an article he wrote for the Webster

303
00:17:30,839 --> 00:17:34,319
Echo in two thousand and one, the plan backfired when

304
00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:38,720
Abaguci population When the Abagucci population exploded and got out

305
00:17:38,759 --> 00:17:42,799
of control and began to attack livestock. Wow. In the article,

306
00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,400
Wilson described the creature as a carnivore that would be

307
00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:47,960
anything big or small, which freaked out the residents of

308
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:51,200
West Virginia, who became terrified to go outside. Soon. Many

309
00:17:51,279 --> 00:17:54,599
residents also reported their own Abagucci sidings, which it led

310
00:17:54,640 --> 00:17:58,559
to reports of residents carrying around shotguns and others walking

311
00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:01,400
their kids to schools. Resident even claimed to have run

312
00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:04,599
over in ab Gucci. Wow, but it was all a hoax.

313
00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:07,240
The writer of the article later convinced, what the fuck

314
00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:12,880
I was eating this ship up? But yeah, yeah, okay, okay.

315
00:18:13,039 --> 00:18:16,240
The signings did not stop, and many continue to report

316
00:18:16,279 --> 00:18:19,799
Abgucci till this day. Okay, Well, let us know if

317
00:18:19,799 --> 00:18:23,359
you've seen Wow what else? Wild ride? Yeah, fir us

318
00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:26,559
I was like wait no, oh yes, no, oh yes, okay,

319
00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:32,000
hold on wait a minute, hold on true okay, and

320
00:18:32,039 --> 00:18:34,680
I think that's yourn of your Yeah, that's right, that

321
00:18:34,799 --> 00:18:37,599
was it. Okay, wow, well you know what. That was

322
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:41,039
fun three fun little cryptids, and you know we needed

323
00:18:41,039 --> 00:18:46,519
it after this week that just finished this week. Oh yes, yeah.

324
00:18:46,799 --> 00:18:49,400
So with that, we'll take a little ad break and

325
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:52,160
then we'll come back with my portion again, a true

326
00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:56,119
crime case, a tragic loss of a mother, but also

327
00:18:56,319 --> 00:19:06,880
like somehow doctor Phil is involved. I don't like that. No, no, okay,

328
00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:11,960
and we're back all right. So there is an episode

329
00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:16,240
of Killer Relationship. It's season two, Killer Relationships. Oh I

330
00:19:16,279 --> 00:19:19,519
can't remember that, militihow. It's either relationship or relationship show

331
00:19:19,599 --> 00:19:23,279
or podcast. Yeah, it's a show Killer Relationships. That sounds

332
00:19:23,279 --> 00:19:26,440
more normal. Okay, So it's a show called Killer Relationships.

333
00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:28,960
This is from season two, episode five. So that in

334
00:19:29,039 --> 00:19:32,880
combination with one really detailed article or my sources. So

335
00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:36,119
let's just start in the beginning. Twenty one year old

336
00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:39,440
Julie and Gonzalez loved her daughter. She would do anything

337
00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:41,400
for her. One day, her family could not get a

338
00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:43,720
hold of her, and her ex husband had told them

339
00:19:43,839 --> 00:19:46,160
while she was acting weird, and she told me she

340
00:19:46,319 --> 00:19:51,160
was taken off to Colorado, something they refused to believe. Gratefully, yes,

341
00:19:51,279 --> 00:19:53,200
of course they dug deep. This is the case of

342
00:19:53,279 --> 00:19:56,720
Julie and Gonzales. Julie Anne was born in nineteen eighty

343
00:19:56,759 --> 00:20:00,160
eight in Dripping Springs, Texas. Her mom was young when

344
00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:02,960
she had her, just nineteen years old, but she loved

345
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:05,759
her daughter more than anything. She was part of a

346
00:20:05,839 --> 00:20:10,079
very tight knit family. Her sisters and brothers all lived

347
00:20:10,079 --> 00:20:12,359
in the same house, her grandparents. They all supported her

348
00:20:12,559 --> 00:20:15,400
as a young mom at nineteen, so her fifteen year

349
00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:19,000
old Tia, Julie's fifteen year old da was now her babysitter,

350
00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:23,079
so that Julie's mom could go continue her education. Her

351
00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:25,960
grandparents were always around. Everyone was around. And then her

352
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,240
parents opened a general store in Dripping Springs, and I

353
00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:31,240
think that's just what it was called, the general store,

354
00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:35,359
and everyone knew the family. Everyone in town saw Julie

355
00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:40,319
growing up, and everyone describes her as so smart, so wise,

356
00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:46,079
kind beautiful, stubborn, and someone who just wanted to live

357
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:49,240
life to the fullest, but also kind of like too fast,

358
00:20:49,319 --> 00:20:51,759
like she just wanted to be an adult. And you

359
00:20:51,759 --> 00:20:54,799
know when that's to me a red flag when someone

360
00:20:54,799 --> 00:20:59,160
says that about it. Not always, but yeah, so they

361
00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:01,519
did say that about her, that she she wanted to

362
00:21:01,559 --> 00:21:06,480
be an adult. So at sixteen, one of the employees

363
00:21:06,559 --> 00:21:09,759
of the grandparents' store started to get very close to Julie,

364
00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:14,880
and Julie's mom noticed that these two were passing notes

365
00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:18,319
back and forth. So Julie's mom confronted her and asked

366
00:21:18,319 --> 00:21:20,960
her straight up, are you in a relationship with Aaron?

367
00:21:21,079 --> 00:21:24,200
This is the employee. Julie then admitted, yes, we're together.

368
00:21:24,519 --> 00:21:27,799
But Aaron was twenty three years old and Julie was sixteen,

369
00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:31,000
so her mom was like, this is not okay. You're

370
00:21:31,039 --> 00:21:34,240
not allowed to see him anymore. When Julie went and listened,

371
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,720
the grandparents fired Aarin from the store. They chased him

372
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:39,640
off and he came around, so they were just like, no,

373
00:21:39,759 --> 00:21:42,160
they put an end to it. It was forbidden, not allowed,

374
00:21:42,279 --> 00:21:45,359
and you know, as you showed as a parent, yeah, yeah,

375
00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:49,519
try and protect the daughter, your kids, right, But again,

376
00:21:49,759 --> 00:21:52,359
very normal reaction that a sixteen year old would do.

377
00:21:52,519 --> 00:21:54,559
But Julie was so mad at her family for this,

378
00:21:55,319 --> 00:21:57,920
she resented them. She started to hate her mom for this.

379
00:21:58,279 --> 00:22:00,960
So a year went by where Julie was just not

380
00:22:01,079 --> 00:22:04,000
forgiving of her mom again. One of the things people

381
00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:08,279
described her as was like again kind, stubborn. Okay, So

382
00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:11,759
that's and she was. And so she was still mad

383
00:22:11,759 --> 00:22:14,319
at her mamma your whole year later. So at seventeen,

384
00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:18,279
Julie told not she didn't ask, She told her mom

385
00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:20,640
she was moving out to live with her Tia Laura

386
00:22:20,799 --> 00:22:24,960
in Austin, Texas, and trying to establage the relationship, trying

387
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:27,200
to not make her more mad. And also because she

388
00:22:27,279 --> 00:22:29,400
was very close with her sister, she knew Julie would

389
00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:32,119
be in good hands. She agreed. She was like, okay, fine,

390
00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:35,640
you can move there. So Julie moved with her Dora

391
00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:40,079
to Austin, Texas. She enrolled into Crockett High School and

392
00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:42,119
this is her senior year now, and this is where

393
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,799
she met George Dela Cruz, her boyfriend or the guy

394
00:22:45,799 --> 00:22:48,440
who would become her boyfriend the family, you know, met

395
00:22:48,519 --> 00:22:51,920
him right away because she was also very responsible, so

396
00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,440
she you know, she was doing her school work, she

397
00:22:54,559 --> 00:22:56,839
was involved in I don't know if things at school

398
00:22:56,839 --> 00:22:59,559
too light clubs, and she brought him home right away

399
00:22:59,599 --> 00:23:01,839
to meet the FI and the family noticed right away

400
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:04,400
he's very quiet, he's very shy. They'd be like, are

401
00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:06,319
you sure you like him? Like he doesn't seem to

402
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:09,920
be doing anything saying anything, like he's just there, what

403
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,160
are you seeing him? And Julie would defend him, and

404
00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:15,559
of course it's her boyfriend. She would defend him and say,

405
00:23:15,599 --> 00:23:17,240
you know, you guys just need to know one better.

406
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:20,079
He's very intelligent, he's so kind. And by the end

407
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,279
of their senior year in two thousand and seven, things

408
00:23:22,319 --> 00:23:25,559
were very serious between the two. You know, they went

409
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:30,839
to Prompt together. Then it was graduation and Julie received

410
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:34,839
a scholarship from Saint Edward's University. So the two moved

411
00:23:34,839 --> 00:23:38,079
out together to be closer to the university so she

412
00:23:38,079 --> 00:23:41,480
could attend and it was a full riote scholarship. You know,

413
00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:44,079
they were young, but they were serious about their future.

414
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:45,880
They did this so she could, you know, go to

415
00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:50,240
the school easier. And before her first year of school

416
00:23:50,279 --> 00:23:53,960
was even over, Julie was pregnant and when she told

417
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,920
her mom, her mom remembers crying, but she wasn't mad.

418
00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:59,720
She was happy for her daughter that like, okay, you're

419
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:02,240
gonna get to experience this too. Now, we know you're

420
00:24:02,279 --> 00:24:04,640
going to be a good mom because she's so responsible.

421
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:07,400
And yeah, she can put her education on pause. Now

422
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:11,319
that doesn't mean us forever. So everyone was accepting be

423
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,359
for her, accepting, Yes, thank you, you're always here with

424
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:18,240
the better words. So on September twenty seven, two thousand

425
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:22,400
and seven, Julie's daughter, Layla was born, and Julie knew

426
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,200
she couldn't attend university anymore, you know, she had a

427
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:27,960
baby defeat. Now, she enrolled herself in a very you know,

428
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:32,440
short career type thing and became a pharmacy technician at Walgreens.

429
00:24:32,759 --> 00:24:35,160
And I mean, honestly, when you're looking for a quick

430
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:38,400
career that pays okay, where you can live, like, that's

431
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,680
a good one to choose, Like, yeah, that's not a

432
00:24:40,759 --> 00:24:42,880
bad move at all. And that's what she did. But

433
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:47,200
their living situation, her George and little Layla, it was

434
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:50,440
not as easy. They relocated a few times. They were

435
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:54,200
barely making the ends meet. George lost his most recent job,

436
00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:59,119
and unlike Julie, George just didn't have it together. He

437
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,599
was not motivated. He wasn't like stepping up to the plate.

438
00:25:02,759 --> 00:25:06,440
Like Julie did, where Julie's like, I can't finish my degree,

439
00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:09,119
but I am going to get a career, something dependable,

440
00:25:09,279 --> 00:25:11,440
something I can do every day. He wasn't like that.

441
00:25:11,599 --> 00:25:14,440
Sometimes he worked, sometimes he didn't. He was in and

442
00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:18,880
out of jobs in construction in what was the other

443
00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:21,960
one I saw? Construction was one of them, random jobs,

444
00:25:22,039 --> 00:25:24,400
random jobs, and he didn't ever stay at one for

445
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:28,359
too long. Eventually they moved in with George's mom, Victoria,

446
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:30,880
and his three younger sisters to save money, because they

447
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:33,839
just couldn't afford it if he wasn't also working. And

448
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:37,880
so since Julie was the one going to work every day,

449
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:41,440
they decided he would stay and take care of Laila.

450
00:25:41,519 --> 00:25:44,920
But then when Julie was coming back from work, their

451
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:49,640
room in this house a complete mess. Wow, Laila was.

452
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:53,200
She would find their daughter in dirty diapers that had

453
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,799
been dirty for hours. Oh wow, And you can tell

454
00:25:55,839 --> 00:25:59,480
because of that gets heavy, of course, yeah, And it

455
00:25:59,519 --> 00:26:04,000
looks it's just gross. It's so bad. Like the rashes

456
00:26:04,039 --> 00:26:08,000
can get like first it's like a normal small rash. Okay, fine,

457
00:26:08,039 --> 00:26:10,559
that's not a big deal, but they can get bad.

458
00:26:10,759 --> 00:26:15,319
I have seen horrible rashes of course you have. Yes, Yes,

459
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:18,279
of course you have that. They get it like basically

460
00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:22,960
equated to like like second degree burns. Yes, yes, And

461
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:27,240
with him doing this every day, that's a problem. That's

462
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:31,279
a straight up problem. So George was doing nothing all day.

463
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:36,759
He just sat playing his Xbox for eighteen hours a day. Yeah, like,

464
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:38,640
get it together. You have a child. Now, that's not

465
00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:41,000
to say you can't play games. I love one game

466
00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:45,000
Started Valleys, because you know, some people will be like, oh,

467
00:26:45,039 --> 00:26:47,720
you have a kidnap, you can't game anymore? You can,

468
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,799
I mean everything in moderation, honestly, Yeah, even if he

469
00:26:50,839 --> 00:26:53,119
didn't have a kid, like you have other stuff to do.

470
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:55,880
I'm sure everyone does. But I love to sit around

471
00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:59,759
and do nothing all day. Yes, did I do that? Sometimes?

472
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:02,240
Not when I have other stuff to do, you know. Now,

473
00:27:02,279 --> 00:27:05,480
when I have a job to go to, yeah, or

474
00:27:05,559 --> 00:27:07,880
a child to take care of. I can't ignore them

475
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:11,079
and play Started Value all day. It's not possible. Yeah,

476
00:27:11,319 --> 00:27:16,119
I'm picturing that meme with the sims the person throwing

477
00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:19,160
the character that. But there's like one where she's sitting

478
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:24,279
on the computer and then all fired. Yes, Okay, that's George.

479
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,680
That's George. But what does Xbox not a computer? Yes?

480
00:27:28,319 --> 00:27:32,240
Which is worse to me? Yeah? Yeah, well, I mean

481
00:27:32,279 --> 00:27:37,680
they're both there, both bad. But when is a SIMS mean? Yeah,

482
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:43,960
one is not real, right, one is pretend? Yes, And

483
00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:48,400
this went on. They did not get better, but Julie

484
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,720
thought he could change, and she really wanted to make

485
00:27:51,759 --> 00:27:56,319
it work. She didn't want to grow up. She didn't

486
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:57,839
want Leyla to grow up like she did with a

487
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:00,920
single mom. You know, you know, this is the problem.

488
00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:03,839
What I tell people all the time, all the time.

489
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:08,400
There's nothing wrong. No, there's nothing wrong with going up

490
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:13,279
with divorced parents in a single parent household, especially of

491
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,440
the other parent is neglectful and harmful, you know what

492
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,319
I mean? Like, yes, And I was gonna say this

493
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:24,240
is the problem with society, yeah, not like emphasizing only

494
00:28:24,319 --> 00:28:30,000
caring about the what is it like the typical two

495
00:28:30,039 --> 00:28:35,359
parent women, two parent household? Yeah, because like regardless of

496
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:38,359
Julie having grown up with a single mom, all her

497
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,240
family was around taking care of her like everyone everyone,

498
00:28:42,359 --> 00:28:44,880
She had the support, even if a father was not present,

499
00:28:45,359 --> 00:28:49,160
Her grandparents were there her all her family like everyone.

500
00:28:49,279 --> 00:28:52,640
So I think when you don't do like self work

501
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,319
or an insane amount of therapy, like almost too much.

502
00:28:55,839 --> 00:28:58,079
You don't realize, like you don't need to be comparing

503
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,799
where you are in life to where other people were.

504
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:02,839
You don't need to be like, oh the greener, the

505
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:04,960
grass is greener on this side, where oh I need

506
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,640
to stay in this marriage because two parents is always

507
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:09,960
better and blah blah blah blah. There's all this like

508
00:29:10,079 --> 00:29:14,680
societal messaging about that, and yes, stigmug and single moms

509
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:17,319
and yeah, and when you have the resources you can

510
00:29:17,359 --> 00:29:20,559
break away from those sticks. You have the power to

511
00:29:20,599 --> 00:29:24,359
do that. And not everyone is there, Yeah, and that's unfortunately.

512
00:29:24,559 --> 00:29:28,759
I wish people were there because yeah, like oftentimes, like

513
00:29:28,839 --> 00:29:32,359
it's more harmful to the children to be like in

514
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,680
this case, and yeah, sometimes to the other parent, you know, honestly,

515
00:29:35,799 --> 00:29:39,880
Like it's always usually worse to stay in a bad

516
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,200
one hundred relationship marriage, you know, yeah, unless it really

517
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:47,279
does get better, I don't then okay, fine, but no, Yeah,

518
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:50,880
George didn't change at all. But she wanted this to

519
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,359
She wanted this two parent households so bad for Layla.

520
00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:57,559
So they got married in secret because her family was

521
00:29:57,599 --> 00:30:00,200
not going to approve. She knew they weren't gonna proof.

522
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:01,799
They would tell her he's not a good dad, he's

523
00:30:01,799 --> 00:30:03,720
not a good partner, he needs to step up. He's

524
00:30:03,759 --> 00:30:05,880
not doing he's not doing what a man is supposed

525
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,640
to do. But you know that part, to me, it's

526
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:10,720
like if he had been taken care of Laila, this

527
00:30:10,839 --> 00:30:13,960
want to be a problem. Yeah. And also like sometimes

528
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:17,720
when you tell people again and again and again that

529
00:30:17,759 --> 00:30:21,240
their partner is trash, they fucking suck Like it just

530
00:30:21,279 --> 00:30:24,799
pushes the other person away, causes them to be creative, secretive,

531
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:26,759
and to no longer go to you for some part,

532
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:29,359
which seems that like was the case here. That's true

533
00:30:29,359 --> 00:30:32,359
because yeah, when Layla was almost two, they got married

534
00:30:32,359 --> 00:30:35,519
in secret because Julie didn't want to tell her family, Yeah,

535
00:30:35,559 --> 00:30:37,559
because of all the things that had been saying about her,

536
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,599
and she wanted that about him, yes, and then and

537
00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:43,319
she really wanted that to parent household for Laila. But

538
00:30:43,839 --> 00:30:47,200
seven months after the marriage, Julie confided to her mom

539
00:30:47,319 --> 00:30:51,200
that she wanted to leave George. Wow. She realized that

540
00:30:51,319 --> 00:30:54,160
he was never going to change, So she took Leayla

541
00:30:54,279 --> 00:30:58,559
and moved in with her grandparents back to Springs Something

542
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:02,400
Springs depressed and Springs Now that wasn't the name straying up,

543
00:31:02,599 --> 00:31:08,559
Dripping Spring, Dripping Oh, my goodness, it's suppressing. My bad.

544
00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:12,200
I don't it's probably a fine town. I don't know.

545
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:18,359
That just came out accidentally. Anyway. She moved back to

546
00:31:18,759 --> 00:31:22,160
Dripping Springs with her grandparents and took Layla with her.

547
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,319
She was over it, she was ready to leave him.

548
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:27,720
But for the next six months, George was dragging his feet,

549
00:31:27,839 --> 00:31:30,079
refusing to sign the vorce papers. Of course he was

550
00:31:30,119 --> 00:31:32,920
they always do this shit. No, of course, she called

551
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:35,400
the lawyer, she drafted up the papers, she sent them

552
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:37,640
to him. The last thing he just needed to sign.

553
00:31:37,759 --> 00:31:41,440
That's it. Wow. And during these six months of her

554
00:31:41,519 --> 00:31:44,319
trying to co parent, trying to be keep the peace,

555
00:31:44,559 --> 00:31:47,440
to try and get him to sign those papers, they

556
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:50,079
were still going to split custody fifty fifty. Like she

557
00:31:50,279 --> 00:31:55,759
was trying to just not be with him anymore, but amicably. Yeah.

558
00:31:55,839 --> 00:31:58,720
So during these six months, she was, you know, back

559
00:31:58,759 --> 00:32:02,240
in her hometown now, and she was at the store

560
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:05,279
one day and she ran into her long lost love

561
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:08,519
from her teenage years, which was inappropriate back then but

562
00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:12,640
not so much today. Their adults now erin And so

563
00:32:12,799 --> 00:32:14,799
she was grocery shopping when they ran into each other

564
00:32:14,839 --> 00:32:18,119
at the store, and apparently they she didn't even buy

565
00:32:18,119 --> 00:32:20,119
whatever she was going grocery shopping for. She just got

566
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,319
so distracted running into Erin that we spent two hours

567
00:32:23,319 --> 00:32:27,240
talking that day at the grocery store d and she

568
00:32:27,799 --> 00:32:29,839
was so excited. She went home. She called her mom

569
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:31,279
and she's like, oh my god, you won't believe what

570
00:32:31,359 --> 00:32:34,839
I ran into. And they started seeing each other after that.

571
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,200
They called their relationship official in November two thousand and nine,

572
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:43,519
and they were both very similar, hard working, driven. Julianne

573
00:32:43,519 --> 00:32:47,200
could see right away. Erin was responsible, reliable, He had

574
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:50,240
his own apartment, he had steady work as an electrician.

575
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:54,039
Basically everything in George was not. And they were adults now.

576
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,519
She was twenty one, he was twenty eight, so it

577
00:32:56,559 --> 00:32:59,599
wasn't like the first time where it was illegal and wrong.

578
00:32:59,799 --> 00:33:02,519
So you know, they're like, okay, we can, we can

579
00:33:02,599 --> 00:33:05,480
do this now. Like they were happy, but there was

580
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,200
still one obstacle. Julie was still married to George because

581
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,680
his aus was refusing to sign the force papers like

582
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:15,000
a little bitch. Yeah, So Julie made sure to keep

583
00:33:15,039 --> 00:33:18,200
her relationship with Aaron tight. She didn't want to upset

584
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:21,720
George because he still was reason to sign the papers.

585
00:33:21,759 --> 00:33:24,640
They still had to Copare and Leila together. She wanted

586
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:27,799
to make sure everything was still good, that he was like,

587
00:33:28,039 --> 00:33:32,480
not upset George so near Lailah. When Layla was around,

588
00:33:32,599 --> 00:33:35,480
she never used Aaron's name so that she couldn't say,

589
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:39,079
Mommy met Aaron, Yeah, Mommy Brian Aaron over. Yeah. She

590
00:33:39,119 --> 00:33:41,759
also made her my Space page private so not only

591
00:33:41,799 --> 00:33:44,039
friends could see it. That way, George couldn't see it

592
00:33:44,039 --> 00:33:46,480
because she deleted his ass as soon as she moved out.

593
00:33:46,799 --> 00:33:49,519
No longer in my top eight. You know, I can't

594
00:33:49,519 --> 00:33:51,400
picture being married if you didn't put your spouse on

595
00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:55,480
the top eight like you know back then. So she

596
00:33:55,559 --> 00:33:57,759
deleted him right away when she moved out. But she

597
00:33:57,799 --> 00:34:01,200
didn't think to remove George's cousin Addie from her friends.

598
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:05,880
She man, there's always one nitch cousin or simply for real,

599
00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:11,480
for real, and I see everything. So he showed George

600
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:15,119
a picture Julie uploaded with Aarin that they were at

601
00:34:15,119 --> 00:34:17,880
the Austin Zoo together on a day she had Leilah.

602
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:20,039
They were there together. The picture was just them too,

603
00:34:20,039 --> 00:34:22,760
though it wasn't them too when Leila looking like a family,

604
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:26,760
which probably would have upset him more. But that was

605
00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:29,559
still upsetting to him because he again was refusing to

606
00:34:29,599 --> 00:34:32,599
sign the papers right. So after he saw this picture,

607
00:34:32,639 --> 00:34:36,880
George started acting erratic and desperate. He faked amnesia on

608
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:41,920
a weekend to get Julie and back amnesia. Amnesia, yes,

609
00:34:42,039 --> 00:34:44,320
And then he admitted to faking the amnesia. And she's like,

610
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:48,880
I already knew, bitch. Wow. He also tried to kill himself.

611
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:53,880
She had picked up Leila from her George, and George

612
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:56,840
told her after she was already gone, like, hey, there's

613
00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:59,000
a note in Nail's diaper bag. Like he told her

614
00:34:59,039 --> 00:35:01,360
this later and and when she finally read it and

615
00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:04,599
she was in her car to read the note, it

616
00:35:04,639 --> 00:35:08,400
was a suicide letter. Wow. So she rushed back to

617
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:11,599
his house called nine one one, and he had taken

618
00:35:11,599 --> 00:35:15,679
some pills at the emergency services did arrive and saved him.

619
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:18,519
But again, if he was really going to do way,

620
00:35:18,519 --> 00:35:19,880
he would have just done it. There was no need.

621
00:35:19,920 --> 00:35:23,400
This was manipulative, This wasn't well, it's a control tactic.

622
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,000
But people like him, you know, the yes, taking forever

623
00:35:27,119 --> 00:35:29,679
to sign the divorce papers, trying to reel her back

624
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:33,360
in with faking the illnesses. Yeah, and now this like

625
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:37,119
it's too real, her back in and to maintain control. Yeah,

626
00:35:37,159 --> 00:35:41,000
and threatening suicide when someone's trying to leave you is abuse.

627
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:44,440
It's to control. Yeah, yeah, it is abuse. So he

628
00:35:44,559 --> 00:35:46,840
was doing these things, but he was also showing up

629
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:52,239
her work at the Walgreens pharmacy unannounced of course, stalking her. Yes, yeah,

630
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:55,280
this is very I don't want to sound like I'm minimizing,

631
00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:57,039
making it sound like an everyday thing, but this is

632
00:35:57,079 --> 00:36:00,199
like textbook like abusive behavior. Yeah, yeah, I know. These

633
00:36:00,199 --> 00:36:04,239
are the clear signs, the controlling, the stocking. Well, those

634
00:36:04,239 --> 00:36:08,000
aren't even signs. Those are like abusive control. My bad. Yeah,

635
00:36:08,119 --> 00:36:10,280
that's what I mean by signs. They are the things

636
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:13,599
that abusive people are doing that you can say, you

637
00:36:13,639 --> 00:36:17,800
can clearly say this is abuse. Yes, yeah, okay. So

638
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:21,400
he would call the pharmacy frequently and just hang up,

639
00:36:21,679 --> 00:36:26,079
like again, controlling. Julie's boss had to kick him out

640
00:36:26,199 --> 00:36:29,320
of the store multiple times. There was another night where

641
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:32,280
Julie freaked out called her boss after work, telling her

642
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:35,920
that George was following her in his car, and during

643
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:39,480
that call Julianne told her boss, if something ever happens

644
00:36:39,519 --> 00:36:41,840
to me it was him, Oh my god. But she

645
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:43,840
didn't want to cause any trouble by reporting him to

646
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:47,039
the police because again, she just wanted the divorce to

647
00:36:47,079 --> 00:36:50,199
be peaceful. She's just trying to keep the peace. Yeah,

648
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:54,639
that makes sense, and sometimes things don't improve by going

649
00:36:54,639 --> 00:36:57,320
to the police or by filing or straining order. I

650
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:01,599
saw a while ago on TikTok a video and it

651
00:37:01,639 --> 00:37:04,000
was there was like sources and stuff, so it was

652
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:08,360
like legitimate, but I don't remember the mau like the percentage.

653
00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:13,079
But the video talked about how when women or victims

654
00:37:13,079 --> 00:37:17,000
of like talking or violence garistraating order, their chance of

655
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:23,599
being like physically harmed by their abuse or like spikes significantly.

656
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:28,119
I'm not surprised how many stories, like not stories, like

657
00:37:28,199 --> 00:37:32,239
real accounts of pieces have we seen that this exact

658
00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:35,239
thing is happening. So, yeah, that's the statistic is not

659
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:38,800
surprising at all. On days that they had to exchange

660
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:41,719
Leyla George would have blocked the front door to preventually

661
00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:45,639
from leaving again abuse. Yeah, and it's it's scary too.

662
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:48,480
This is the kind of situation where I know I

663
00:37:48,519 --> 00:37:50,480
know that she wanted to do the piece, and it

664
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:52,239
makes sense that she wanted to keep the peace, but

665
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:55,000
he was not cooperating regardless of her trying to keep

666
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,400
the peace, and it would have been a situation where

667
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:01,280
she maybe could have like qualify from like soul custody

668
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:06,159
or having some kind of supervised person like a lot

669
00:38:06,199 --> 00:38:08,400
of times, like some people when they're in a situation

670
00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:11,920
like this with an abusive co parent, then you can

671
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:15,519
get somebody else to like coordinate others to do the

672
00:38:15,559 --> 00:38:19,800
pick up and drop off. But like those things take

673
00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:22,039
time and effort to look up money. Sometimes you have

674
00:38:22,079 --> 00:38:24,719
to pay for others to supervise a visit and all

675
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:27,679
of that. So, yeah, it's a lot. It's hard. It's hard.

676
00:38:28,039 --> 00:38:30,480
Julie Dish start having family members come with her for

677
00:38:30,599 --> 00:38:33,760
drop offs and pickups, and eventually the exchange was done

678
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:37,199
between Julie and George's mother because she could do it

679
00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,159
with Georgia Brown and luckily her family was more than

680
00:38:40,199 --> 00:38:43,639
one yeah with her every time, and George's mother was

681
00:38:43,679 --> 00:38:47,639
willing to do it too, because sometimes the parents enable

682
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:50,000
this kind of behavior and don't like offer to help

683
00:38:50,039 --> 00:38:53,239
out and stuff. Yeah, so this is how things were

684
00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:57,440
for a while, and then on March twenty fifth, twenty ten,

685
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:00,000
Julie was talking to her mom. She was on the phone.

686
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:03,960
She had just spent the night with Aaron. This was

687
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:06,119
a Friday now, and it was her turn to go

688
00:39:06,159 --> 00:39:09,320
pick up Leila. For some reason that day, she I

689
00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:12,199
mean maybe because she was already nearby because she was

690
00:39:12,199 --> 00:39:14,599
at Aaron's. She just said, I don't need a family

691
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:18,079
member to come with me. I'm already right here. She

692
00:39:18,199 --> 00:39:20,800
did ask Arin that day for him to not go

693
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:23,199
to work so they could stay together and watch movies like,

694
00:39:24,519 --> 00:39:26,199
but he was like, no, I gotta work. I gotta go.

695
00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:28,000
Like I can't. I don't have like I have bills

696
00:39:28,039 --> 00:39:29,880
coming up, I don't have sick days. I have to go.

697
00:39:30,280 --> 00:39:32,639
They said bye to each other, and she was like

698
00:39:32,639 --> 00:39:35,199
all right. She called her mom and she was like, oh, no,

699
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,239
you don't need to come with me. It's okay. I'm

700
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:40,840
like right here. So she went and did the pickup,

701
00:39:41,079 --> 00:39:45,519
and then like later she Julie's mom was expecting her

702
00:39:45,519 --> 00:39:47,239
a phone call again, because she was always calling her

703
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:49,599
on her days off, like repeatedly. It was very normal

704
00:39:49,639 --> 00:39:52,079
for them. The phone call never came. The next day,

705
00:39:52,559 --> 00:39:56,320
Julie's mom was calling again and again and Julie was

706
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,360
not picking up. So right away, Julie's mom and her tias,

707
00:39:59,599 --> 00:40:02,480
everyone was worried. They reached out to Erin and he

708
00:40:02,639 --> 00:40:05,360
told them she broke up with him. He had received

709
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:07,760
a text message saying she had to get away, and

710
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,119
he was confused because he was like, things were perfectly fine.

711
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:12,480
That doesn't make any sense. Yeah it doesn't, Yeah, it

712
00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:15,519
doesn't make any sense. Julie's younger sister also started getting

713
00:40:15,519 --> 00:40:17,360
texts from Julie's phone, but it was in a way

714
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:19,880
that she never texted it. It was like things were misspelled.

715
00:40:20,079 --> 00:40:22,400
It was slaying that Julie just didn't use even in

716
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:24,920
her text messages. She was very proper the show. I

717
00:40:25,039 --> 00:40:27,760
was watching the episode on this. Her grandpa was like,

718
00:40:28,039 --> 00:40:30,239
she has sent a text that had the effort in it.

719
00:40:30,519 --> 00:40:33,000
She doesn't use this kind of language. Never, She's never

720
00:40:33,239 --> 00:40:35,039
like that. And he's like, and I know I'm a

721
00:40:35,039 --> 00:40:37,960
grandpa saying this, but no, I promise you she never

722
00:40:38,079 --> 00:40:39,719
used this language. She would never send it in a

723
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:42,599
text message. But these texts all had all that kind

724
00:40:42,639 --> 00:40:44,800
of stuff, things she would never say. Then they all

725
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:47,960
looked at Julie's MySpace page together and it had this

726
00:40:48,119 --> 00:40:51,000
post going away hate all this ps want to run

727
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:54,440
away again in a way. She would never write things,

728
00:40:54,519 --> 00:40:57,840
just a one run on sentence, no spaces, no proper

729
00:40:58,639 --> 00:41:02,000
She was very proper. So the educators and she showed it. Yeah,

730
00:41:02,039 --> 00:41:04,039
they were like, this isn't her. There's no way. Then

731
00:41:04,079 --> 00:41:06,519
there was another post it said, I met a software

732
00:41:06,559 --> 00:41:09,880
engineer named James and I'm leaving with him for Colorado.

733
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,239
I hope he's going to show me a good time again.

734
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:14,960
They're like, no way, There's no way she would ever

735
00:41:15,039 --> 00:41:17,639
leave Layla. Layla, her daughter was a world to her.

736
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:20,119
She wouldn't just up and leave her for some guy

737
00:41:20,199 --> 00:41:22,679
named James when she was also that she had never

738
00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:25,360
even mentioned to anybody else, and she was in a loving,

739
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:29,440
happy relationship with Aaron. Like, that's ridiculous, exactly. It sounds

740
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:33,119
like something someone dumb would make up, some dumb motherfucker.

741
00:41:35,159 --> 00:41:38,559
But playing spots and Lisa's kid in dirty diapers all

742
00:41:38,639 --> 00:41:42,760
day long, that's what that sounds like. No, because I

743
00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:46,159
thought the same thing right away. So Aaron then met

744
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:49,119
up with Julie's mom and her tia, and he showed

745
00:41:49,519 --> 00:41:52,039
them a letter that Julie had left, and the letter

746
00:41:52,159 --> 00:41:54,079
just talks about how she was so happy she was

747
00:41:54,119 --> 00:41:56,599
looking forward to them having a little boy together. Honestly,

748
00:41:56,679 --> 00:41:58,880
the letter was the cute. It reminded me of something

749
00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:02,559
you write in middle school or in high school to

750
00:42:02,639 --> 00:42:05,519
a boyfriend where you're playing your features together, which honestly

751
00:42:05,559 --> 00:42:07,920
makes sense if they were together for a little bit

752
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:10,320
when she was in high school. Yeah, like maybe she

753
00:42:11,039 --> 00:42:13,119
was still hot, like she was remembering those and she

754
00:42:13,199 --> 00:42:15,079
just wrote down. It was like written on you know,

755
00:42:15,119 --> 00:42:17,239
binder paper, and it had like, you know how you

756
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:19,960
used to write bubbly letters like yeah, yeah, okay, So

757
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,239
it had Aaron and Julie in bubble letters that were

758
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:26,119
like shaded, and then she wrote, you know, the whole thing.

759
00:42:26,159 --> 00:42:27,880
And I'm like, first of all, was damn, who writes

760
00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:29,920
like that this much? Things these days? But this was

761
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:32,920
in twenty ten, oh yeah yeah, and she wrote like

762
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:34,960
she was She wrote, I can't wait for us to

763
00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:37,599
live our lives together. We're gonna have a little boy,

764
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:41,639
We're gonna get married, live as a family with Leila here,

765
00:42:42,159 --> 00:42:44,320
and I'll like, you know, live together. It's gonna be

766
00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:47,480
so beautiful. It's everything we ever wanted, Like it was

767
00:42:48,519 --> 00:42:51,119
a beautiful letter. So the breakup text he received just

768
00:42:51,119 --> 00:42:54,000
didn't make any sense, yeah, because like how would she

769
00:42:54,039 --> 00:42:58,280
write this heartfelt letter and then hours later break up

770
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,480
with him via text with no explome nation, right, Yeah,

771
00:43:01,559 --> 00:43:04,199
that doesn't make any sense. No, and the family agreed

772
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:06,079
with him, so they all went out looking for her,

773
00:43:06,119 --> 00:43:08,639
also the normal response where they knew she would hang out,

774
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:11,679
but no one had seen her. So then they filed

775
00:43:11,679 --> 00:43:16,000
the missing persons report and police did arrive at Julie's

776
00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:19,199
mom's house forty eight hours later after you know, she

777
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:22,239
was picking up the calls or anything. They took statements,

778
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:24,280
but then another officer was like, wait a minute, this

779
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:27,920
sounds familiar. This name you're telling me Julie Ane Gonzalez.

780
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:29,519
He's like, I'm pretty sure I took a statement about

781
00:43:29,519 --> 00:43:33,239
this earlier. And then the family mentioned like, well, the

782
00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:35,519
last one to see in her if it was an

783
00:43:35,599 --> 00:43:38,719
errand it had to be George de la Cruz, her ex,

784
00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:41,960
And then he was like, wait a minute, George la Cruz. Yeah,

785
00:43:42,039 --> 00:43:44,920
he called and gave a report, and he looked through

786
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:47,559
his files and he's like, yeah, George de la Cruz

787
00:43:47,679 --> 00:43:50,679
called in a report or called into report that his

788
00:43:50,719 --> 00:43:54,559
wife abandoned their child. What the hell? Yes, And so

789
00:43:54,679 --> 00:43:57,000
now the family was freaking out because one, she would

790
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:01,119
never abandon Leila, and then Austin PD were like, well,

791
00:44:01,159 --> 00:44:03,639
she's an adult, like and she's allowed to leave if

792
00:44:03,679 --> 00:44:06,559
that's what she's doing, Like, there's nothing to do here that.

793
00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:09,079
I hate when that like that. I say that because

794
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:11,400
sure it's true, but also like, why can't you take

795
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:14,599
into account like literally everyone that knows this person saying

796
00:44:14,639 --> 00:44:18,000
they would never do anything like that. Yeah, No, seriously,

797
00:44:18,199 --> 00:44:21,519
I wonder the same thing. Her family was to drop.

798
00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:24,199
They had no choice but to wait. The next morning,

799
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:28,119
Julie'stia was on her way to work when she decided

800
00:44:28,159 --> 00:44:31,719
she would drive the route Julie took too from her

801
00:44:31,719 --> 00:44:35,159
house to her work. She passed by a Walgreens, not

802
00:44:35,199 --> 00:44:38,519
the Walgreens Julie worked at a different one, but she

803
00:44:38,639 --> 00:44:42,199
passed by and saw Julie's car parked in the parking lot.

804
00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:44,280
It was the only car in the parking lot that morning.

805
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:47,039
She pulled in. She rushed in, ran to the car,

806
00:44:47,159 --> 00:44:51,480
and nothing was inside. She called Julie's mom and Aaron.

807
00:44:51,599 --> 00:44:54,239
She called both to them and they arrived a little

808
00:44:54,239 --> 00:44:56,440
bit earlier, but while she was waiting for them to arrive,

809
00:44:56,519 --> 00:44:58,599
she ran inside, thinking, oh my god, maybe she's just

810
00:44:58,599 --> 00:45:02,480
inside this store. But she wasn't there. She talked to

811
00:45:02,519 --> 00:45:04,760
the front desk person, not from desk. This is a Walgreens,

812
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:07,840
it's not a clinic. She talked to the cashier, the

813
00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:10,800
cash person at the cash register, and they hadn't seen her.

814
00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:16,760
So by now Aaron and Julie's mom arrived and yeah,

815
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:18,880
they were like, no, this is weird. She would never

816
00:45:18,920 --> 00:45:22,679
leave her car either, like, so they called the police,

817
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:24,599
who did go to check it out because they could

818
00:45:24,599 --> 00:45:27,000
have easily ignored it. And while the police were checking

819
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,079
the car out, Julie's mom begged them like look into George,

820
00:45:30,159 --> 00:45:32,039
like this might have been the last person to see her.

821
00:45:32,119 --> 00:45:35,079
Plus he lives around the corner from this Walgreens. Yeah,

822
00:45:35,079 --> 00:45:37,559
and her car is right here, Like this is two

823
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:41,920
they can't be a coincidence exactly, And so yeah, police

824
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:46,480
went over to George's house and when police arrived, George

825
00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:50,719
told them, well, Julianne was acting weird. She asked me

826
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:53,239
to keep Lailah with me this weekend instead of taking

827
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,159
her because she has something to do, and she just left,

828
00:45:56,559 --> 00:45:59,519
and she looked like she was under the influence of

829
00:45:59,519 --> 00:46:01,639
some drugs, even though she had no history of taking

830
00:46:01,679 --> 00:46:05,800
drugs at all. So he let police inspect the house.

831
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:07,400
They they were like, all right, we're going to make

832
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:09,360
sure she's not here. So they looked around. They made

833
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:11,760
their way to the backyard, which had a playhouse and

834
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:13,840
a storage shed in it. And the shed had a

835
00:46:13,920 --> 00:46:18,199
large square cut into the piewood floor and there was

836
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:22,159
fresh sawdust around it. The officer noticed that the cut

837
00:46:22,159 --> 00:46:25,199
portion was loose. When he stepped on it, it almost fell in.

838
00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:27,119
It almost caved in when he stepped on it. So

839
00:46:27,159 --> 00:46:30,679
he lifted the piewood and there was a weird empty

840
00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:35,559
trench that was about five feet long, two feet wide,

841
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:39,880
and one and a half feet deep. That's the size

842
00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:44,159
of a person. Wow. Yeah. George claimed that someone had

843
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:48,159
dug the hole for plumbing purposes. Later way later, his

844
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:51,760
mom would testify that when she asked about the hole,

845
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:54,280
he acted as surprise and told her he had no

846
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:56,679
idea how the hole got there. Oh my god, a

847
00:46:56,760 --> 00:47:00,920
human signed a hole for plumbing, and not even like

848
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:07,320
a big human, right fight queen. Yes. And so even

849
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:11,239
though this trench was very out of place. The police

850
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:15,599
didn't consider anything to be suspicious. Come on, man, yeah

851
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:17,880
they didn't. Yeah, so whatever. They were just like, all right, well,

852
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:21,880
there's nothing here. She seemed to have disappeared voluntarily, and

853
00:47:22,079 --> 00:47:24,760
you know, as far as they could tell, Julianne was alive,

854
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:28,239
not in any imminent danger. Wow. That's a hard word

855
00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:32,480
to say. Yeah, and she had voluntarily withdrawn from family

856
00:47:32,519 --> 00:47:35,480
and friends, so there was no crime. I just don't understand.

857
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:38,559
I don't understand why they can't. Don't also, or didn't

858
00:47:38,559 --> 00:47:42,079
take into consideration that she was texting differently than she

859
00:47:42,199 --> 00:47:45,239
normally does. Wouldn't that be like a sign that that

860
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:47,960
wasn't her? It should be Yeah, you would think, you

861
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:51,199
would think, but no. Her family just was like, all right,

862
00:47:51,440 --> 00:47:54,519
it's up to us now. So they went back to

863
00:47:54,559 --> 00:47:57,519
where Julie's car was, and her mom and her Dyeah

864
00:47:57,760 --> 00:47:59,679
slept there like two days in a row, seeing if

865
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:02,800
she would come back. She didn't come back, and again

866
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:04,800
police were like, we're not going to do anything. Our

867
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,159
hands are tied. So the family started putting up missing

868
00:48:07,159 --> 00:48:10,599
posters everywhere, no missing flyers everywhere. They paid for a

869
00:48:10,639 --> 00:48:13,760
missing poster billboard on the side of the freeway just

870
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:16,440
have you seen me? And then it had her info

871
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:20,159
and her information. They sent out hundreds and hundreds of emails.

872
00:48:20,360 --> 00:48:23,440
They were able to get local the local Fox seventh

873
00:48:23,599 --> 00:48:26,599
channel to cover her story, how she hadn't been seeing,

874
00:48:26,639 --> 00:48:29,480
how the police wasn't doing anything. They talked to anyone

875
00:48:29,519 --> 00:48:32,599
and everyone, and the community really came together searching for her.

876
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:35,800
Even Aaron, who the family, was like, oh my god,

877
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:37,119
what did he do it? He was one of the

878
00:48:37,159 --> 00:48:39,559
last ones to see her, even he was out there

879
00:48:39,639 --> 00:48:42,880
looking helping every day, and we're real George, yes, I was,

880
00:48:43,159 --> 00:48:47,519
you know who didn't do shit? Who? Even her Julianne's

881
00:48:47,519 --> 00:48:49,400
youngest sister was like, where is that motherfucker?

882
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:50,039
Speaker 2: No?

883
00:48:50,079 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 1: Where do we seen?

884
00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 2: No?

885
00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:57,000
Speaker 1: Where do we seen? Finally, on April sixth, Austin p

886
00:48:57,119 --> 00:49:00,360
d brought Georgian for questioning, and in his interview, George

887
00:49:00,519 --> 00:49:03,519
told the detective that he was worried someone took her

888
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:05,639
or made her belief she had to run away. The

889
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:08,159
detective was like, well, I had to ask did you

890
00:49:08,239 --> 00:49:10,519
kill her? And George was like, I would never. My

891
00:49:10,639 --> 00:49:13,119
daughter was with me, like I could never, And the

892
00:49:13,519 --> 00:49:16,519
detective noted George soundered nervous, but he was like, I mean,

893
00:49:16,519 --> 00:49:21,000
who wouldn't sound nervous, It's true, asked if you killed someone,

894
00:49:21,199 --> 00:49:23,639
So he was like, there's nothing suspicious about his behavior.

895
00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:26,440
And there that's where it ended, and the family was

896
00:49:26,519 --> 00:49:30,440
left wondering and desperate. The days turned into weeks. One

897
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:34,039
month later, May twenty ten, the family got a call

898
00:49:34,119 --> 00:49:36,599
from the Doctor Phil Show. They let the family know

899
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:39,199
that George had agreed to come onto the show and

900
00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:41,920
take a light detective test on camera. Was the family

901
00:49:42,039 --> 00:49:44,079
trying to get on the show and get George on

902
00:49:44,119 --> 00:49:47,519
the show or did George take it upon himself. Doctor

903
00:49:47,559 --> 00:49:52,599
Phil contacted George, Oh okay on the stories Yeah, oh

904
00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:56,400
my god. First of all, this is stupid to agree to. Yeah,

905
00:49:56,440 --> 00:50:00,079
George is stupid. You should never agree to take a

906
00:50:00,159 --> 00:50:03,239
polygraph test, even if they're not admissible to court. This

907
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:07,840
is just dumb ass behavior. Yeah. Again, he's not very smart. Yeah.

908
00:50:08,199 --> 00:50:10,719
And the and the Doctor Phil Show wanted to let

909
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:12,639
the family know and also give them a chance to

910
00:50:12,639 --> 00:50:14,239
see if they wanted to be on the show too,

911
00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:18,519
which they agree to. They were like, name out, yeah, wow,

912
00:50:20,159 --> 00:50:24,480
so let me send I'm shocked a video. Yeah, this

913
00:50:24,679 --> 00:50:29,599
is the family getting the results of the test. Okay, so,

914
00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:32,119
but they did show the whole thing him taking it

915
00:50:32,239 --> 00:50:35,960
as well. Oh wow, are you ready? Yeah? One two three,

916
00:50:36,039 --> 00:50:37,719
then play so one two three.

917
00:50:38,639 --> 00:50:42,719
Speaker 2: He was asked, are you responsible for Julie's disappearance? He

918
00:50:42,840 --> 00:50:48,079
answered no. He was asked, did you cause Julie's disappearance

919
00:50:48,159 --> 00:50:55,719
during the month of March? He answered no. Those were

920
00:50:55,760 --> 00:51:00,400
not truthful answers. He failed the PolyGram.

921
00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:05,039
Speaker 1: Test, and we we knew it.

922
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:07,079
Speaker 2: This was not a close call.

923
00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:08,719
Speaker 1: This was not a close call at all.

924
00:51:09,599 --> 00:51:14,000
Speaker 2: If if he scored a minus two or three, that

925
00:51:14,039 --> 00:51:18,039
would be conclusive. Minus three to either of those questions

926
00:51:18,159 --> 00:51:22,800
or minus four in concert is deceptive on this particular format,

927
00:51:23,079 --> 00:51:28,800
and his score was minus fourteen. Let's talk about this.

928
00:51:29,719 --> 00:51:35,199
Speaker 1: Wow, So like again, fuck doctor Phil. Yeah, but he

929
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:37,480
was doing more than the police at this point, not

930
00:51:38,159 --> 00:51:42,719
because he's a good person, because he's an opportunistic little bitch. Yeah. Yeah,

931
00:51:43,159 --> 00:51:47,079
it feels almost wrong watching this because polygraphs are not

932
00:51:48,199 --> 00:51:52,400
I don't want to be as Yeah, there's a reason

933
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:54,719
they're in admissible in court. And yeah, this is just

934
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:59,320
playing off, you know, exploiting their emotions, and I don't

935
00:51:59,519 --> 00:52:02,320
I don't know, but I understand that of course it

936
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:05,159
would feel like they knew it all along. Yeah, and

937
00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:11,960
validating to them, Yeah, that will leave it there understandable. Yeah.

938
00:52:13,199 --> 00:52:17,519
So it was hard though seeing her react like that, like, yeah,

939
00:52:17,599 --> 00:52:19,519
she was like trying to hold it in and she

940
00:52:19,599 --> 00:52:22,000
couldn't anymore. I'm like, oh my god. Yeah. Again very

941
00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:25,320
parasitic of doctor philm but no, yeah, like the normal

942
00:52:26,039 --> 00:52:30,480
yeah yeah. Yeah. So another part that I couldn't find

943
00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:32,599
the clip of, but it is in an episode of

944
00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:36,480
Killer Relationships. They showed footage of George and his mom

945
00:52:36,840 --> 00:52:39,679
after the polygraph test and the mom is like what

946
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:41,719
did you do? What did you do? Crying and like

947
00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:45,719
asking him and he's like nada, na his mommy, you

948
00:52:45,800 --> 00:52:49,079
know me, you know me? And she's like no, damn.

949
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:57,159
Actually that's that's the right one that was on air

950
00:52:57,440 --> 00:53:03,079
on the episode, and Austin PD was watching. Wow, And

951
00:53:03,119 --> 00:53:06,239
so this kicked off the real investigation for Austin PD.

952
00:53:06,679 --> 00:53:09,199
Not only did they know this kid's stupid. Yes, of

953
00:53:09,239 --> 00:53:12,800
course they started getting bombarded with calls because they're like

954
00:53:12,880 --> 00:53:15,119
we saw this on Doctor Phil. They're like, hey, what

955
00:53:15,119 --> 00:53:17,119
are you doing about this? Why are you not looking

956
00:53:17,119 --> 00:53:18,760
into this, Why are you not investigating? Why is that

957
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:22,960
your film investigating? Did your fucking job? So finally they

958
00:53:22,960 --> 00:53:24,840
were like, okay, let's open this up. This is no

959
00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:28,000
longer a missing case. This is a homicide case. Detectives

960
00:53:28,039 --> 00:53:30,639
wanted to bring him in now for proper questioning, but

961
00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:32,960
George lawyered up, and they gave him. They gave him

962
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:36,599
a lot of times lawyer up. So but it's your

963
00:53:36,639 --> 00:53:39,079
right to have a lawyer. No, of course, it is

964
00:53:39,119 --> 00:53:42,280
your right. Yeah, it's always funny funny in shows when

965
00:53:42,599 --> 00:53:44,920
the person doesn't lawyer up and just like confesses, and

966
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:46,519
it's like, this is not the way it works in

967
00:53:46,559 --> 00:53:50,360
real life, Like, yeah, Bones, that happened so much on Bones,

968
00:53:51,519 --> 00:53:55,119
detectives try searching for this supposer James. They had to

969
00:53:55,159 --> 00:53:57,679
follow up every lead, especially now that they couldn't get George.

970
00:53:57,840 --> 00:53:59,519
It just pissed me off that they could have been

971
00:53:59,559 --> 00:54:02,039
doing this all along. But okay, oh yeah, but they

972
00:54:02,079 --> 00:54:04,360
refused them to until it was on Doctor Phil. So

973
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:08,239
in a way, the publicity that that garnered exactly not

974
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:10,920
Doctor Phil is not to think for, but the publicity

975
00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:13,000
that came with it that finally got them to be like,

976
00:54:13,239 --> 00:54:18,239
that's funny looking they really kind of family checked this beforehand. Yeah, yeah,

977
00:54:18,280 --> 00:54:21,440
of course. So detectives tried to search for the supposed

978
00:54:21,559 --> 00:54:24,360
James to see if you existed. They looked into phone records,

979
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:28,039
into social media. They also looked into Aaron because they

980
00:54:28,079 --> 00:54:30,280
had to search every avenue investigation now that they were

981
00:54:30,280 --> 00:54:34,440
finally investigating, So they brought Aaron back in questioning him.

982
00:54:34,760 --> 00:54:38,320
He was shocked about the text messages, confused, he didn't understand,

983
00:54:38,480 --> 00:54:41,320
he didn't believe it was her. But then he also

984
00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:43,800
told them he deleted the messages, he didn't have them anymore,

985
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:46,800
and detectives were like, that's a red flag. Okay, now

986
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:48,760
they're talking about red flags. Okay, I don't know if

987
00:54:48,800 --> 00:54:50,920
I would want to see the person I was with.

988
00:54:51,119 --> 00:54:53,360
I wouldn't want a reminder of these messages if I

989
00:54:53,360 --> 00:54:56,000
didn't even know where they were. Like, I understand the deletion,

990
00:54:56,360 --> 00:54:59,719
and I guess I understand them looking that looking suspicions.

991
00:55:00,039 --> 00:55:03,079
Understand both ways. Both yeah both. So then they were like,

992
00:55:03,159 --> 00:55:05,559
let's go over that Friday that you were together. So

993
00:55:05,639 --> 00:55:10,360
Aaron told him told the police that Julianne had asked

994
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:12,159
him to skip work that day because she had the

995
00:55:12,239 --> 00:55:14,719
day off too, and they could like hang out watch movies,

996
00:55:15,679 --> 00:55:17,239
and he was like, no, I need to go to work,

997
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:20,239
and so he left for work and that was the

998
00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:22,480
last time he saw her. Later, he came home and

999
00:55:22,519 --> 00:55:25,400
he found the letter that she had written for him,

1000
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:27,960
the one I mentioned earlier that was it was very cute.

1001
00:55:28,639 --> 00:55:31,880
And they took that letter to compare it to other

1002
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:34,960
handwriting that the family had of things she had written

1003
00:55:35,119 --> 00:55:39,719
out planning the planners, things like that, and the handwriting

1004
00:55:39,800 --> 00:55:41,719
was a match. This was a genuine letter. This was

1005
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:47,000
really Julianne. They were really in a good, committed relationship. Finally,

1006
00:55:47,199 --> 00:55:51,119
Aaron was ruled out, so this search for the alleged

1007
00:55:51,199 --> 00:55:54,159
James went nowhere. Then finally they decided to focus on

1008
00:55:54,199 --> 00:55:56,760
George again because he was the only other lead they had.

1009
00:55:57,199 --> 00:56:00,840
They were looking at the evidence and it took them

1010
00:56:00,880 --> 00:56:05,440
to George. Yes, the path went to George, back to George. Yeah,

1011
00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:09,480
I went sin circle back to George. So they found

1012
00:56:09,719 --> 00:56:13,360
out George had used Julie's debit card right before she

1013
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:15,519
went missing or right after, sorry, right after she went

1014
00:56:15,559 --> 00:56:20,400
miss key uster. Yeah, after there was debit card. Like

1015
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:22,519
they looked at the bank records and they saw that

1016
00:56:22,559 --> 00:56:27,360
it had been used at a store after her family

1017
00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:30,599
said she was missing. So with this they were able

1018
00:56:30,679 --> 00:56:33,719
to get a warrant to search his house. Yes, at

1019
00:56:33,719 --> 00:56:36,559
the house they found various steps of ammunition, lake text

1020
00:56:36,599 --> 00:56:39,719
gloves and knife, pieces of burn clothes from a pit

1021
00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:43,840
in the backyard, a lot of cleaning products, digging tools

1022
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:47,440
near that trench that was there, and a big dirt

1023
00:56:47,480 --> 00:56:51,280
pile behind the storage shed there was also it had

1024
00:56:51,360 --> 00:56:54,360
been that big dirt pile had been covered with the

1025
00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:59,000
mattress and other household items. Interesting. So weird things, but

1026
00:56:59,119 --> 00:57:02,239
not like in need it on their own right. When

1027
00:57:02,280 --> 00:57:05,320
they asked about the debit card usage, he said, oh, well,

1028
00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:07,480
when she had left, she came back to put it

1029
00:57:07,519 --> 00:57:09,360
in the mailbox for me so I could use it

1030
00:57:09,360 --> 00:57:12,519
for our daughter. That makes zero sense. Why would she

1031
00:57:12,679 --> 00:57:15,800
leave it in the mailbox when if she was still

1032
00:57:16,039 --> 00:57:18,679
there she would be like, here's my debit card. Also,

1033
00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:20,840
does he not have his own money? But whatever? Probably not.

1034
00:57:20,880 --> 00:57:23,880
It doesn't work. It doesn't work. He just plays Xbox alting. Yes,

1035
00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:28,159
so this was an immediate red flag. Yeah, still not

1036
00:57:28,280 --> 00:57:30,000
enough to get an arrest warrant, but they had a

1037
00:57:30,039 --> 00:57:32,480
warrant to search the house, So they took the Xbox

1038
00:57:32,679 --> 00:57:36,000
to analyze, and they also took his phone and they

1039
00:57:36,039 --> 00:57:39,119
already had Julie's phone and the phone records, but like,

1040
00:57:39,360 --> 00:57:42,760
technology isn't where it was today, I don't know, So

1041
00:57:42,800 --> 00:57:46,000
it took them a long ass time to get that information.

1042
00:57:46,360 --> 00:57:49,280
Years went by. Her family kept putting up posters. When

1043
00:57:49,280 --> 00:57:51,639
the ones that they had put up before started wiring out,

1044
00:57:51,679 --> 00:57:55,360
they would put up new ones. They unfortunately had lost

1045
00:57:55,400 --> 00:58:00,199
contact with their granddaughter Layla because George and his mom

1046
00:58:00,679 --> 00:58:03,559
didn't let them see her. Well that just piss me off, Wow,

1047
00:58:03,880 --> 00:58:08,119
it really does. Yeah, because like he Okay, at this

1048
00:58:08,159 --> 00:58:10,920
point in time and the where we're at, he wasn't

1049
00:58:10,920 --> 00:58:13,440
proven to be him yet, but like he took their

1050
00:58:13,519 --> 00:58:16,639
daughter from them, and now he's taking their granddaughter right

1051
00:58:16,800 --> 00:58:19,840
because he's not letting them see her. Yeah. Then in

1052
00:58:19,840 --> 00:58:24,599
twenty thirteen, the data from George's Xbox was finally available

1053
00:58:24,639 --> 00:58:29,119
to Austin PD. So George typically gamed eighteen fucking hours

1054
00:58:29,119 --> 00:58:31,719
a day, every day, without a beat, without missing that

1055
00:58:32,719 --> 00:58:36,679
the day Julie went missing, the Xbox had not been

1056
00:58:36,719 --> 00:58:40,440
used for twenty hours. Okay, so they were like, okay,

1057
00:58:40,599 --> 00:58:44,440
this is suspicious. Yeah, when the Xbox was back on

1058
00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:47,440
and reconnected to the internet. It was at a friend's

1059
00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:51,239
house in North Austin, Julie's phone also being there after

1060
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:53,559
she was already missing. It was from the same IP

1061
00:58:53,679 --> 00:58:56,679
address as the xbox. So he was like taking his

1062
00:58:56,800 --> 00:59:00,320
xbox around to places. Yeah, he took his xbox his

1063
00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:02,360
house over to his friend's house. Okay, I see, I

1064
00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:05,800
see yeah, and after it was not usually for twenty hours.

1065
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:08,960
Presumably George's Xbox and Julie's phone were in the same

1066
00:59:08,960 --> 00:59:11,360
place after she was missing. Right, Julie was not there.

1067
00:59:11,639 --> 00:59:14,719
She was missing before that. The Xbox hadn't been used

1068
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:18,159
for twenty hours. Twenty hours not for him exactly, like

1069
00:59:18,239 --> 00:59:20,199
he was busy or something like he was doing something

1070
00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:23,559
out of the ordinary that day. Yes, because again this

1071
00:59:23,679 --> 00:59:26,000
without a beat was on eighteen hours a day. So

1072
00:59:26,079 --> 00:59:29,519
then police were able to find video surveillance from a

1073
00:59:29,599 --> 00:59:34,880
Walmart that caught George on camera texting. Those texts matched

1074
00:59:34,880 --> 00:59:37,519
with time stabs on Julie's phone. He was the one

1075
00:59:37,559 --> 00:59:41,239
who sent the breakup message to Aaron, of course, and

1076
00:59:41,320 --> 00:59:44,679
he was the one texting the family nonsense and things

1077
00:59:44,719 --> 00:59:47,079
that were grammarly incorrect and think she would never say.

1078
00:59:47,159 --> 00:59:49,280
He also was the one who updated the MySpace page.

1079
00:59:49,360 --> 00:59:52,239
Three years after she went missing, police finally had enough

1080
00:59:52,239 --> 00:59:54,880
for an the rest warrant. They brought George Dela Cruz in.

1081
00:59:55,400 --> 00:59:59,400
When Austin PD arrested George, they contacted Julie's family so

1082
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:03,280
they would know George has been arrested, he's admitted to

1083
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:07,480
killing her, but there was nobody still. Oh my god.

1084
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:10,280
They were devastated because they were still hoping she would

1085
01:00:10,280 --> 01:00:13,559
return because all this time she was missing. Yeah, but

1086
01:00:13,599 --> 01:00:19,880
now he's been arrested and he's admitted to killing her.

1087
01:00:21,039 --> 01:00:23,840
So the trial began in the fall of twenty thirteen,

1088
01:00:24,239 --> 01:00:26,960
but the DA was very concerned about the outcome because

1089
01:00:27,000 --> 01:00:30,800
they did not have a body. These cases are the hardest, yeah,

1090
01:00:30,880 --> 01:00:33,320
hardest to prove, so it took them two years to

1091
01:00:33,360 --> 01:00:37,719
prepare the case. Finally, in twenty fifteen, they found a

1092
01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:40,559
clear motive that just couldn't to them. It was like,

1093
01:00:40,599 --> 01:00:43,320
this is solid. George had found out about her and

1094
01:00:43,519 --> 01:00:46,559
erin because again his fucking cousin at Yette. I hope

1095
01:00:46,559 --> 01:00:50,960
Marienne feels horrible about this. I really probably doesn't if

1096
01:00:50,960 --> 01:00:55,079
he's related to George to yeah, I hope means white hope.

1097
01:00:55,119 --> 01:00:58,159
But I don't know. It turns out George saved that picture.

1098
01:00:58,239 --> 01:00:59,760
They found it out his phone, the one that I

1099
01:01:00,280 --> 01:01:02,400
showed him. He had it on his phone. Dumb ass

1100
01:01:02,639 --> 01:01:06,280
move my god. If he really not more than dumbass allegations,

1101
01:01:06,519 --> 01:01:10,880
No he's not so. At the trial, in May testified

1102
01:01:11,079 --> 01:01:15,320
that while in jail, because from twenty thirteen to twenty fifteen,

1103
01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:18,599
George had been in jail waiting trial. So what sellmate

1104
01:01:18,760 --> 01:01:22,000
testified that George had been venting that he and his

1105
01:01:22,119 --> 01:01:25,880
estranged wife Julie got into an argument because another man, Aaron,

1106
01:01:26,360 --> 01:01:30,800
was in her life and they were together. George told

1107
01:01:30,800 --> 01:01:34,760
the inmate that the argument turned physical and that Julie

1108
01:01:34,760 --> 01:01:38,480
Anne fell and hit her head and was rendered unconscious.

1109
01:01:38,599 --> 01:01:41,719
And when George told this to the cellmate, he minimized

1110
01:01:41,760 --> 01:01:44,320
the fight that they had, that it was an accident,

1111
01:01:44,320 --> 01:01:47,079
of course, of course, but there was a fact that

1112
01:01:47,159 --> 01:01:50,199
he dug that trench in his backyard before Julianne even

1113
01:01:50,280 --> 01:01:54,079
arrived to pick up Leilam so premeditated. This was planned

1114
01:01:54,199 --> 01:01:58,440
because he had also presented to be her on the

1115
01:01:58,440 --> 01:02:02,480
phone when he was texting, and so there was it

1116
01:02:02,559 --> 01:02:06,920
was clear that this fight and her missing. All this

1117
01:02:06,960 --> 01:02:11,119
is in the same day, and the witnesses testimony like

1118
01:02:11,519 --> 01:02:15,719
further corroborated all of this. Yeah, because now they had

1119
01:02:15,719 --> 01:02:19,039
a definitive like there was a fight. Yeah, so they

1120
01:02:19,079 --> 01:02:22,159
had all the information already about the trench being there

1121
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:26,400
or a doug he was impersonating her on the cell phone.

1122
01:02:26,480 --> 01:02:29,360
And then they found out about the argument from that inmate.

1123
01:02:30,039 --> 01:02:33,519
Mm hmmm. And then also so they well, do I

1124
01:02:33,519 --> 01:02:35,519
have this in my news? Let me just double check.

1125
01:02:36,960 --> 01:02:41,440
I don't, okay. So another thing that the state really

1126
01:02:41,440 --> 01:02:44,119
tried to emphasize in their argument is that this was

1127
01:02:44,320 --> 01:02:47,480
actually pre planned. It wasn't like even what George told

1128
01:02:47,519 --> 01:02:51,719
that inmate, because he had asked to keep Layla an

1129
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:55,360
extra day and he had that. The day he kept

1130
01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:58,800
Layla is when he dug the trench. The next day,

1131
01:02:59,639 --> 01:03:04,639
she without a family friend to pick up. So that's

1132
01:03:04,679 --> 01:03:07,639
another thing I think. So it was like an out

1133
01:03:07,679 --> 01:03:11,679
of ordinary routine pickup. So then she was like others

1134
01:03:11,719 --> 01:03:14,559
heids name, She's already has it arranged and scheduled with, Yeah,

1135
01:03:14,599 --> 01:03:17,519
like her family to come with her to pick Leela. Yes,

1136
01:03:17,559 --> 01:03:19,559
but then now we have a pickup date. That's on

1137
01:03:19,599 --> 01:03:21,519
a different day, and she's like, oh, it's fine. Maybe

1138
01:03:21,519 --> 01:03:23,840
it's not inconvenience anybody, maybe because she thought, you know,

1139
01:03:23,920 --> 01:03:26,239
of course, nothing of it, because who would think like

1140
01:03:26,480 --> 01:03:29,719
something like that would aim to them? Yes, exactly, So

1141
01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:32,960
they were arguing this was planned, and I agree with them.

1142
01:03:33,039 --> 01:03:36,360
He took an extra day exactly, like there's no way

1143
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:40,239
around it to me. Yeah. So the defense, you know,

1144
01:03:40,679 --> 01:03:45,559
emphasized that George didn't have a criminal history, but the

1145
01:03:45,599 --> 01:03:50,199
state called up Julianne's mom, her aunt. They all talked

1146
01:03:50,199 --> 01:03:54,480
about how much they missed Julianne. You know. Victim impact

1147
01:03:54,519 --> 01:03:57,320
statements I think is what they're called, where they come

1148
01:03:57,360 --> 01:04:00,960
and you know, testify like what how this has affected them,

1149
01:04:01,079 --> 01:04:04,320
and also that they're keeping Leila from them too. So

1150
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:08,119
and then the defense called Victoria, George's mother, to cecify

1151
01:04:08,199 --> 01:04:10,239
that George had never been convicted of a felony, that

1152
01:04:10,280 --> 01:04:12,840
he was a good son, good brother, he was raised

1153
01:04:12,880 --> 01:04:15,480
by both his parents, like that means anything, that he

1154
01:04:15,519 --> 01:04:19,320
was never physically or sexually abused. Again, people putting emphasis

1155
01:04:19,360 --> 01:04:23,360
on this arbitrary structure or not structured what's the word,

1156
01:04:23,719 --> 01:04:28,800
I know what you mean, socially constructed? Yes, expectation. Yes, yeah,

1157
01:04:29,079 --> 01:04:32,519
so they emphasized or they She shared that he had

1158
01:04:32,519 --> 01:04:35,199
ever been physically or sexually abused. Again, what is that?

1159
01:04:35,400 --> 01:04:37,960
Don't I don't know what that would implicate on his character.

1160
01:04:38,199 --> 01:04:41,320
I'm not sure. She said he graduated from high school,

1161
01:04:42,599 --> 01:04:45,679
that when he was employeed, he contributed to household expenses.

1162
01:04:45,679 --> 01:04:47,840
But she can't even say he's responsible because he wasn't

1163
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:51,000
always employed in contributing to household expenses. So yeah, and

1164
01:04:51,000 --> 01:04:54,360
then she called them an angel. At first I thought

1165
01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:57,440
I was like, oh, she she when you talked about

1166
01:04:57,440 --> 01:05:00,639
the field doctor philla interview or whatever, not interview, what's

1167
01:05:00,639 --> 01:05:03,199
it called? But then the state played that clip of

1168
01:05:03,239 --> 01:05:07,280
doctor film. What do you think here? Huh? But on

1169
01:05:07,320 --> 01:05:13,760
this date what he said this explain that I wish

1170
01:05:13,840 --> 01:05:14,599
I don't think they did.

1171
01:05:14,719 --> 01:05:14,800
Speaker 2: No.

1172
01:05:14,880 --> 01:05:18,239
Speaker 1: I mean, that would be points that would sound like

1173
01:05:18,280 --> 01:05:22,920
a sound argument. It's not, but it would be funny.

1174
01:05:23,000 --> 01:05:26,639
It was right. So the trial lasted one week and

1175
01:05:26,760 --> 01:05:31,719
after six hours, the jury found him guilty. George guilty

1176
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:35,440
of murder at the first degree. He was sentenced to

1177
01:05:35,440 --> 01:05:40,159
life in prison. Once he was in trial or doing

1178
01:05:40,199 --> 01:05:44,280
this trial, the family of Julie Anne also brought forth

1179
01:05:44,360 --> 01:05:48,239
a civil suit over the custody of Layla. Oh wow,

1180
01:05:48,599 --> 01:05:51,599
and they forced George's family into a fifty fifty split

1181
01:05:51,599 --> 01:05:55,400
custody for her good, which, honestly, I love for them

1182
01:05:55,400 --> 01:05:58,880
because it's so stupid that, like, first of all, not

1183
01:05:58,920 --> 01:06:03,119
even stupid. It's wrong to keep her from her a family. Yeah,

1184
01:06:03,159 --> 01:06:05,760
and that's what they were doing. Yeah, And I'm like you,

1185
01:06:06,199 --> 01:06:08,960
obviously it's not always the parents fallow how children turn out.

1186
01:06:09,000 --> 01:06:13,599
But you raise a murder you raised George. Yeah, so

1187
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:16,599
like you raised George de la Cruz. So what does

1188
01:06:16,679 --> 01:06:20,079
that mean? Yeah, it has doing something right? I think so,

1189
01:06:20,360 --> 01:06:25,559
I think so. I don't know, I feel like, Yeah,

1190
01:06:25,679 --> 01:06:28,960
George remains in prison to this day. He maintains that

1191
01:06:29,000 --> 01:06:32,920
he's innocent, and you can find clips of him his

1192
01:06:33,039 --> 01:06:36,280
Doctor Phil appearance. He's on the show trying to blame

1193
01:06:36,320 --> 01:06:39,199
another family member on Julie's side of the family for

1194
01:06:39,239 --> 01:06:42,320
her disappearance. How does that make any sense? None of

1195
01:06:42,360 --> 01:06:45,800
what he says makes sense when before it was oh yeah,

1196
01:06:46,000 --> 01:06:48,159
James like a bunch of dumb lies that he can't

1197
01:06:48,159 --> 01:06:50,760
even keep track of because he's dumb again, Yeah, dumb.

1198
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:53,960
But you know, at the end of the day, her family. One.

1199
01:06:54,280 --> 01:06:56,480
The person who lost in all of this is Laila

1200
01:06:56,639 --> 01:06:59,800
because now her stupid ass father is in prison because

1201
01:06:59,800 --> 01:07:02,199
of the stupid thing he did, because he's a controlling

1202
01:07:02,320 --> 01:07:06,519
piece of shit. Yeah right, and then he took Leayla's

1203
01:07:06,519 --> 01:07:09,360
mom's life. She doesn't have her parents now, you know,

1204
01:07:09,480 --> 01:07:13,239
her parents or her mom. Juliana's mom lost her daughter forever,

1205
01:07:13,360 --> 01:07:16,159
her aunts, they all are missing her in her remains

1206
01:07:16,280 --> 01:07:19,079
are still they don't know where they are. Fucking George

1207
01:07:19,079 --> 01:07:22,480
won't say because he maintains he's innocent. They're holding out

1208
01:07:22,519 --> 01:07:25,719
hope that he one day changes his mind and says, actually,

1209
01:07:25,920 --> 01:07:27,880
this is so fucking sad, but this is what they're

1210
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:30,840
waiting for. This is what Julie and Mom said in

1211
01:07:30,880 --> 01:07:33,960
the episode. She said, we're holding out hope that when

1212
01:07:34,039 --> 01:07:36,599
Lena is old enough, she might ask her dad. We're

1213
01:07:36,639 --> 01:07:40,760
not gonna make her because that's wrong, that's terrible. Yeah,

1214
01:07:40,800 --> 01:07:43,360
but we're wondering if she will be old enough one

1215
01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:45,480
day and she'll wonder and she'll ask him, and then

1216
01:07:45,559 --> 01:07:50,880
finally he'll admit it. That's their hope. Now that's terrible, right, yeah,

1217
01:07:51,000 --> 01:07:53,360
so that they can finally give her a proper funeral

1218
01:07:53,400 --> 01:07:55,559
and put her to rest. Yeah, because they still don't

1219
01:07:55,559 --> 01:07:59,840
know where she is. She's still missing. That's yeah, horrible,

1220
01:08:00,159 --> 01:08:03,199
like there's no one else. No, there really isn't. And

1221
01:08:03,320 --> 01:08:06,920
that was the case of Julianne Gonzalez. George, may you

1222
01:08:07,000 --> 01:08:10,480
raw and hell and also your cousin Adiel for sharing that.

1223
01:08:11,400 --> 01:08:13,159
And I guess. Yeah, that brings us to the end

1224
01:08:13,199 --> 01:08:16,399
of the episode. Yeah, before we go, we'll take a

1225
01:08:16,439 --> 01:08:25,359
little outbreak here and we're back for speaking recommendations. Do

1226
01:08:25,439 --> 01:08:28,520
you have any actually, I do do. It's more like

1227
01:08:28,520 --> 01:08:34,359
a crime thriller novel. I guess, okay, but I listened

1228
01:08:34,880 --> 01:08:38,920
to start pulling it up. I finished quite a few

1229
01:08:38,920 --> 01:08:42,119
books since the last time you recorded, because I wasn't

1230
01:08:42,159 --> 01:08:47,399
here last time. That's right. Yeah, let's see, I talked

1231
01:08:47,439 --> 01:08:50,399
about The Last Housewife in our book club. We're a

1232
01:08:50,399 --> 01:08:54,279
book club with MJ. Reading with MJ. And that's right. Yeah,

1233
01:08:54,439 --> 01:08:57,000
so yeah, let me know if anyone wants to join

1234
01:08:57,159 --> 01:08:59,439
MJ's book club. She just runs it on discord. It's

1235
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:02,319
very in for but you can chat with her and

1236
01:09:02,560 --> 01:09:05,079
all of us on the book that she has chosen,

1237
01:09:05,119 --> 01:09:08,720
which is parable of well, you can say it parable

1238
01:09:08,800 --> 01:09:12,199
of the Sower and I finished it already because I

1239
01:09:12,239 --> 01:09:14,079
was listening to the audiobook, and I go through audibooks

1240
01:09:14,079 --> 01:09:16,439
healthfast because I listen to it when I'm walking and driving,

1241
01:09:16,600 --> 01:09:19,920
you know, and it was really good. I think most

1242
01:09:19,960 --> 01:09:23,520
people probably know what it's about. Parable of the Sower

1243
01:09:23,840 --> 01:09:27,439
is is a series. There's one other book, the earth

1244
01:09:27,520 --> 01:09:31,720
Seed series. It's by Octavia Butler, and the description is

1245
01:09:31,760 --> 01:09:35,079
when global climate change and economic crisis leads to social

1246
01:09:35,159 --> 01:09:40,960
chaos in the early twenty twenties now now California, it

1247
01:09:40,960 --> 01:09:44,640
becomes full of dangers, from pervasive water shortage to masses

1248
01:09:44,720 --> 01:09:46,960
of vagabonds who will do anything to live to see

1249
01:09:47,000 --> 01:09:50,800
another day. Fifteen year old Lauren Olamina lives inside a

1250
01:09:50,840 --> 01:09:54,600
gated community with their preacher father, family and neighbors, sheltered

1251
01:09:54,640 --> 01:09:58,359
from the surrounding anarchy in society where any vulnerability is

1252
01:09:58,399 --> 01:10:02,319
a risk. She suffers from hyper empathy, a debilitating sensitivity

1253
01:10:02,359 --> 01:10:05,720
to others' emotions. Precocious and clear eid, Lauren must make

1254
01:10:05,720 --> 01:10:08,079
her voice heard in order to protect her loved ones

1255
01:10:08,079 --> 01:10:11,600
from the imminent disasters of her small community. Severally ignores,

1256
01:10:11,720 --> 01:10:14,560
but what begins as a fight for survival soon leads

1257
01:10:14,600 --> 01:10:16,760
to something much more the birth of a new faith

1258
01:10:16,920 --> 01:10:19,840
and a startling vision of human destiny. It was really good.

1259
01:10:20,359 --> 01:10:23,439
I won't say it's much because you're still reading. Yeah,

1260
01:10:23,560 --> 01:10:26,479
I'm on chapter two. This was blown up on TikTok

1261
01:10:26,520 --> 01:10:28,680
because people were like, oh my gosh, she was predicting

1262
01:10:28,720 --> 01:10:31,039
the future. But I just want to say she was

1263
01:10:31,039 --> 01:10:33,960
looking at the world around her, using what is literally

1264
01:10:34,039 --> 01:10:37,680
going on at the time, and like seeing where it's going.

1265
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:43,159
But it's not like not only that she was describing

1266
01:10:43,199 --> 01:10:46,800
the past. Oh sorry, that too, the president in the past.

1267
01:10:46,800 --> 01:10:52,079
For her, everything she mentioned has happened, right, but also

1268
01:10:52,159 --> 01:10:56,119
people in the book. People keep pointing to Trump as

1269
01:10:56,159 --> 01:10:58,199
being the figure in her book, but it was based

1270
01:10:58,239 --> 01:11:01,640
on Reagan, right, because all of this has happened before.

1271
01:11:01,960 --> 01:11:04,760
This is what I'm saying, Like, this is the same,

1272
01:11:05,319 --> 01:11:07,520
This moment in time is nothing new, you know what

1273
01:11:07,520 --> 01:11:12,840
I mean? Yeah, And sadly this is why people say like, oh,

1274
01:11:12,960 --> 01:11:15,399
unpercenteded times and I'm like, no, they're very president. Everything

1275
01:11:15,479 --> 01:11:18,920
has been precedented. COVID was precedented. That's not the first,

1276
01:11:19,319 --> 01:11:25,119
you know, widespread worldwide infectious disease. It's like not even

1277
01:11:25,159 --> 01:11:29,840
the second or the fifth. Right, Like, all of this

1278
01:11:29,880 --> 01:11:33,079
has happened before. And yeah, a lot of people like

1279
01:11:33,079 --> 01:11:36,560
when they're talking about this book, they they're like, oh,

1280
01:11:36,760 --> 01:11:39,119
this is this is our president. These are horrible events.

1281
01:11:39,159 --> 01:11:41,800
Blah blah blah blah. I read a I don't know

1282
01:11:41,880 --> 01:11:44,359
if I saved it, but I read a post on

1283
01:11:44,399 --> 01:11:46,079
read it about it, and they're like, I think what

1284
01:11:46,199 --> 01:11:49,800
she wanted to take, what Octavia wanted readers to get

1285
01:11:49,800 --> 01:11:54,279
out of it, is to like the way that Lauren

1286
01:11:54,560 --> 01:11:57,039
and the people she comes across, their vibe is by

1287
01:11:57,159 --> 01:12:02,680
trusting each other, by building community. Yes, yes, also a

1288
01:12:02,720 --> 01:12:05,880
lot of people don't read the rest and the s Yeah,

1289
01:12:05,880 --> 01:12:09,239
I'm gonna read. I'm yeah, listen to the second one soon.

1290
01:12:09,560 --> 01:12:12,600
But also like also by not being in denial, you know.

1291
01:12:13,439 --> 01:12:17,399
And because so you're in chapter two, I think you

1292
01:12:17,640 --> 01:12:19,479
I don't think this is spoiler, because I think you

1293
01:12:19,600 --> 01:12:22,319
probably already read about it, but everyone in her community

1294
01:12:22,680 --> 01:12:24,560
it's like, oh, no, that's not going to happen to us,

1295
01:12:24,640 --> 01:12:28,119
like about every little thing. And then you got to

1296
01:12:28,159 --> 01:12:29,640
the part where she's trying to talk to her friend

1297
01:12:29,800 --> 01:12:33,239
like about prepping. Yeah, and her friend goes and stitches

1298
01:12:33,279 --> 01:12:35,560
and then she gets in trouble and it's like nothing

1299
01:12:35,800 --> 01:12:38,680
she was saying was out outrageous, Like she was just

1300
01:12:38,720 --> 01:12:42,159
like we should all have gobacks. Yeah, we all should

1301
01:12:42,199 --> 01:12:44,159
have go backs. So I have one, No, I should

1302
01:12:44,159 --> 01:12:48,680
probably get one ready soon. But like these are little

1303
01:12:48,680 --> 01:12:50,560
things that we can all do, like every day to

1304
01:12:50,600 --> 01:12:55,840
prepare ourselves for emergencies, whether whatever kind of emergency they are,

1305
01:12:55,920 --> 01:12:57,720
you know what I mean. And so yeah, I think

1306
01:12:57,760 --> 01:13:00,319
that was one thing that that Reddit post. It's like

1307
01:13:00,399 --> 01:13:02,520
really like it stood out to me, like it's not

1308
01:13:02,560 --> 01:13:04,600
about the horrible things that are happening in this book

1309
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:07,640
and yeah, they're horrible, it's about the people coming together,

1310
01:13:07,800 --> 01:13:10,600
learning to trust each other in this high stress environment

1311
01:13:11,119 --> 01:13:14,560
and learning how to prepare for Yeah, it's like the

1312
01:13:14,600 --> 01:13:17,840
Walking Dead and actually yeah, I was financed can have

1313
01:13:17,920 --> 01:13:19,800
reviews of it. And then people are like, this is

1314
01:13:19,920 --> 01:13:24,079
very like giving me Walking Dead vibes. Yeah, where it's like, yeah,

1315
01:13:24,119 --> 01:13:27,119
it's horrible, but you have to build a community, trust

1316
01:13:27,159 --> 01:13:30,079
the people in that community, and survive together. And that's

1317
01:13:30,119 --> 01:13:33,439
how you get You cannot get through the pandemic, the

1318
01:13:33,520 --> 01:13:37,920
zombie apocalypse or right now by yourself. You need community. Also,

1319
01:13:37,920 --> 01:13:40,760
why I wanted to announce that we and I've been

1320
01:13:40,800 --> 01:13:43,600
forgetting to do this, but starting now, we are gonna

1321
01:13:43,680 --> 01:13:46,680
do twenty percent of our patron funds are going to

1322
01:13:46,720 --> 01:13:49,119
go to some charity. It's probably always going to be

1323
01:13:49,560 --> 01:13:52,920
immigration or at least Latin or Latina related. Right now,

1324
01:13:52,920 --> 01:13:55,680
it's all going to be immigration related. So I mean,

1325
01:13:55,680 --> 01:13:58,000
if you have charity suggestions, let us know and we'll

1326
01:13:58,000 --> 01:14:01,520
look into those. I already have several too, So yeah,

1327
01:14:01,520 --> 01:14:03,760
because that's important, Like it's on your neighbors, even though

1328
01:14:03,760 --> 01:14:07,119
I don't want to. I am gonna work on that.

1329
01:14:08,359 --> 01:14:14,359
But but my neighborhood I don't know. No, yeah, you's

1330
01:14:14,800 --> 01:14:17,399
you know, acting it anyway, all that to say that

1331
01:14:18,479 --> 01:14:21,119
I highly recommend this book, but I think again, I

1332
01:14:21,159 --> 01:14:23,399
think people are focusing too much on oh, she's predicting

1333
01:14:23,439 --> 01:14:25,880
the future, blah blah blah, Like that's not what it's about.

1334
01:14:26,119 --> 01:14:28,159
That's not what this book is about. Like, oh, she's

1335
01:14:28,199 --> 01:14:31,000
a magician or a or a not a magician, what

1336
01:14:31,039 --> 01:14:34,279
does that thing claroyan? Yeah, yeah, it's like, no, she's

1337
01:14:34,279 --> 01:14:36,359
a black woman who knew how things were going, who

1338
01:14:36,479 --> 01:14:41,720
knew how how things had gone. Yes, yes, so anyway,

1339
01:14:42,000 --> 01:14:44,479
the only thing I didn't like, honestly, it's the orty stuff.

1340
01:14:45,600 --> 01:14:49,079
Oh my god, it makes it the trilogy. Yes, yeah,

1341
01:14:49,199 --> 01:14:51,239
it makes sense. It does make sense the way she's

1342
01:14:51,279 --> 01:14:53,920
like working things out. But honestly, was too preachy for me.

1343
01:14:54,319 --> 01:14:56,720
It's just not I'm just not a spiritual kind of person.

1344
01:14:56,760 --> 01:14:59,319
It didn't it didn't fit my vibe, although it was

1345
01:14:59,359 --> 01:15:01,399
funny though parts of it are funny, like when she's

1346
01:15:01,399 --> 01:15:03,079
talking to the other people about it and they're like,

1347
01:15:03,119 --> 01:15:06,600
oh my god, I guess that's all I'll say about it.

1348
01:15:06,640 --> 01:15:09,600
But yeah, everyone should read it and listen to it,

1349
01:15:09,840 --> 01:15:12,800
whatever content, and if you want to chat about it again,

1350
01:15:13,000 --> 01:15:16,640
MJ has a discord yeah, where she we're doing like

1351
01:15:17,640 --> 01:15:22,239
very informal discussions about it. Yeah. And then I listened

1352
01:15:22,239 --> 01:15:26,439
to and read a few other thrillers and when was

1353
01:15:26,439 --> 01:15:28,560
The Housemaid? Which I don't want to talk about Freedom

1354
01:15:28,600 --> 01:15:34,840
mcfannon because I'm just kidding, because because I saw a

1355
01:15:34,880 --> 01:15:38,960
TikTok that Ashley was reading, well, not reading, she just

1356
01:15:39,000 --> 01:15:40,680
had the book. I'm sure she didn't read it. She

1357
01:15:40,800 --> 01:15:43,600
was just holding it upside down. Yeah, yeah, I'm pretty

1358
01:15:43,600 --> 01:15:45,920
sure it was upside down. It was a Freedom mcfaannon book.

1359
01:15:45,960 --> 01:15:47,600
She's like, oh, I'm gonna read Freedom mcfann and I

1360
01:15:47,600 --> 01:15:49,239
heard she was good, and I saw my a book

1361
01:15:49,239 --> 01:15:50,720
club about it. I'm like, you, guys, I'm sorry, I

1362
01:15:50,760 --> 01:15:54,159
can't read. I can't read Free to her again. But

1363
01:15:54,199 --> 01:15:57,119
they're just like, what do they call them? Popcorn thrillers.

1364
01:15:57,479 --> 01:16:01,520
It's just entertaining. Its substance to it. It just catchy,

1365
01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:04,560
entertains in a while, that's what you want, you know, honestly,

1366
01:16:04,600 --> 01:16:06,079
most of the time, that's what I want to read.

1367
01:16:06,520 --> 01:16:10,359
And I finished it in a weekend because it was

1368
01:16:10,760 --> 01:16:15,640
very I couldn't put it down. Yeah, ridiculous, honestly, but

1369
01:16:16,439 --> 01:16:21,039
nonetheless very entertaining. And you know, if you're into that

1370
01:16:21,479 --> 01:16:23,720
kind of like entertaining thriller that you can't put down.

1371
01:16:23,840 --> 01:16:27,720
Of course, I'm sure everyone has read it by now. Yeah.

1372
01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:30,359
And then I listened to another one called The Last Housewife,

1373
01:16:31,039 --> 01:16:36,000
and it reminded me of a true crime story I

1374
01:16:36,039 --> 01:16:39,039
had heard and I cannot remember. I feel like they

1375
01:16:39,079 --> 01:16:41,920
probably the author took inspiration from that true crime case,

1376
01:16:41,960 --> 01:16:45,439
because the true crime case was a group of college

1377
01:16:45,479 --> 01:16:49,800
girls who and there's like podcasts and documentaries about this,

1378
01:16:50,000 --> 01:16:53,039
but I of course don't remember the case or anything

1379
01:16:53,079 --> 01:16:56,760
about like the names of anything, but it was four.

1380
01:16:57,560 --> 01:16:59,520
I don't know it was four. It was college girls

1381
01:16:59,760 --> 01:17:04,520
who who became friends with one of their roommate's dad.

1382
01:17:04,880 --> 01:17:07,199
But the dad turned out to be like control and abusive,

1383
01:17:07,600 --> 01:17:10,880
and you know what I'm talking about. So I don't

1384
01:17:10,880 --> 01:17:12,039
know the name of the case. Well, you know what

1385
01:17:12,079 --> 01:17:15,760
I'm talking about. Yeah, And he basically ends up having

1386
01:17:15,920 --> 01:17:19,399
like a cult. He becomes the cult leader of these

1387
01:17:19,560 --> 01:17:23,279
of those girls, college girls. Yeah, And that's kind of

1388
01:17:23,279 --> 01:17:27,680
what the book is about. Let me see the and

1389
01:17:27,720 --> 01:17:33,560
It's the Last Housewife by Ashley Winstead. Description. While in

1390
01:17:33,640 --> 01:17:36,640
college in upstate New York, Shay Evans and her best

1391
01:17:36,640 --> 01:17:39,319
friends and met a captivating man who said to stem

1392
01:17:39,640 --> 01:17:41,800
but the web of lies about the way the world works,

1393
01:17:41,880 --> 01:17:45,079
bringing them under his thrall. By senior year, Shay and

1394
01:17:45,119 --> 01:17:47,880
her friend Laurel were the only ones who managed to escape.

1395
01:17:48,399 --> 01:17:50,800
Now eight years later, she's built a new life in

1396
01:17:51,680 --> 01:17:54,520
a Tony, Texas suburb, But when she hears the horrifying

1397
01:17:54,560 --> 01:17:58,039
news of Laurel's death, delivered always by her favorite to

1398
01:17:58,119 --> 01:18:02,520
crime podcast Crusade Her, she begins to suspect that the

1399
01:18:02,600 --> 01:18:05,159
past she thought she buried is still very much alive

1400
01:18:05,359 --> 01:18:08,439
and the prayer is more dangerous than error. Recruiting the

1401
01:18:08,439 --> 01:18:10,720
help of the podcast host, who actually is like her

1402
01:18:10,760 --> 01:18:12,800
childhood friends, so it's not just like a random podcast

1403
01:18:12,840 --> 01:18:14,119
host that she was just at to because I feel

1404
01:18:14,119 --> 01:18:15,640
like that would have been like far fetched, but it's

1405
01:18:15,640 --> 01:18:18,000
her childhood friend who happens to have a podcast anyway.

1406
01:18:18,239 --> 01:18:20,560
Recruiting the help of the podcast host, Shay goes back

1407
01:18:20,600 --> 01:18:23,119
to the place she vowed never to return in search

1408
01:18:23,159 --> 01:18:25,880
of answers. As she follows the threads of her friend's life,

1409
01:18:25,920 --> 01:18:28,840
she's pulled into the dark, seductive world where wealth and

1410
01:18:28,920 --> 01:18:33,319
privileged shield brutal philosophies that feel all too familiar. When

1411
01:18:33,520 --> 01:18:37,199
Shaye's obsession with uncovering the truth becomes so consuming, she

1412
01:18:37,239 --> 01:18:39,920
can no longer separate her desire for justice from dark,

1413
01:18:40,439 --> 01:18:44,239
darker desires. Nearly reawakened, she must confront the depths of

1414
01:18:44,239 --> 01:18:47,920
her own complicity and conditioning. But the world built for

1415
01:18:48,000 --> 01:18:50,439
men to rule it, both inside the cult and outside

1416
01:18:50,479 --> 01:18:52,439
of it, is just as even I possible, and is

1417
01:18:52,439 --> 01:18:54,680
so how far will Shaye go to get it? It

1418
01:18:54,760 --> 01:18:57,560
was good, Yeah, it was okay. It was kind of

1419
01:18:57,600 --> 01:19:00,520
hard to listen to because there's like pretty glick graphic

1420
01:19:00,600 --> 01:19:05,760
descriptions of like sexual abuse control well not like they're

1421
01:19:05,800 --> 01:19:08,279
not describing the abuse, but what is going on is

1422
01:19:08,279 --> 01:19:11,159
controlling an abusive like if that makes sense, that's what

1423
01:19:11,239 --> 01:19:15,399
I meant, yeah, okay, And but they also describe like

1424
01:19:15,439 --> 01:19:21,239
physical abuse like hitting okay, okay, like lashes like things

1425
01:19:21,279 --> 01:19:25,000
like that. So I just hate descriptions of sexual abuse

1426
01:19:25,000 --> 01:19:28,880
the most. They as you want to throw up. It's

1427
01:19:28,920 --> 01:19:33,199
not like really describing that. But there is like coersion okay,

1428
01:19:33,279 --> 01:19:35,800
and like manipulation involved this, so like I mean it

1429
01:19:35,880 --> 01:19:40,199
kind of still is, but it's very of the time now,

1430
01:19:40,439 --> 01:19:42,199
well even it's from twenty twenty two. I was like,

1431
01:19:42,199 --> 01:19:43,479
when does this come out? What do you mean of

1432
01:19:43,520 --> 01:19:47,159
the time, because it's like the cold is like a

1433
01:19:47,399 --> 01:19:50,760
like a trad uh, like a group of men who

1434
01:19:50,760 --> 01:19:54,119
wants to bring back like traditional values and you know

1435
01:19:54,159 --> 01:19:56,079
what I mean, that kind of shit. So that's what

1436
01:19:56,119 --> 01:19:59,239
I meant. Okay, But it was good. I recommend it.

1437
01:19:59,279 --> 01:20:02,439
I read it for on five stars. Okay, And let's

1438
01:20:02,479 --> 01:20:05,720
see what else. The one I recently finished and I

1439
01:20:05,760 --> 01:20:09,159
really liked it was Where They Last Saw Her, And

1440
01:20:09,199 --> 01:20:13,079
this one is about missing and murdered Indigenous women. Oh

1441
01:20:13,159 --> 01:20:17,319
where they last saw her. Yeah by Marcy R. Randon.

1442
01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:20,800
So here's that description. Quill has lived on the Red

1443
01:20:20,840 --> 01:20:23,920
Pine Reservation in Minnesota her whole life. She knows what

1444
01:20:23,960 --> 01:20:26,319
happens to women who look like her, just a girl.

1445
01:20:26,399 --> 01:20:29,039
When Jimmy Sky jumped off the railway bridge and she

1446
01:20:29,159 --> 01:20:32,680
ran for help, Quill realizes now that she's never stopped running.

1447
01:20:33,000 --> 01:20:35,560
As she trains for the Boston Marathon. Early one morning,

1448
01:20:35,640 --> 01:20:37,840
out in the woods, she hears a scream. When she

1449
01:20:37,920 --> 01:20:40,680
returns to search the area, all she finds are tire

1450
01:20:40,720 --> 01:20:43,680
tracks and a single beaded et ring. Things are different

1451
01:20:43,720 --> 01:20:45,760
now for Quill than when she was a lonely girl.

1452
01:20:46,119 --> 01:20:48,159
Her friend's Punk. The only thing that bothered me was

1453
01:20:48,159 --> 01:20:50,319
a friend's name, Punk. I'm like, that's a dumbass nickname.

1454
01:20:50,319 --> 01:20:52,239
But what I don't like a dumb name? I know,

1455
01:20:52,359 --> 01:20:54,720
I don't I hate that. Yeah, you're right. Her friends

1456
01:20:54,800 --> 01:20:56,960
Punk and Galen are two women who don't know what

1457
01:20:57,039 --> 01:20:59,359
it means to quit her loving husband Crow, and they're

1458
01:20:59,359 --> 01:21:02,640
beautiful and challenge her to be better every day. So

1459
01:21:02,680 --> 01:21:04,960
when she hears the second woman has been stolen, she's

1460
01:21:05,000 --> 01:21:08,159
determined to do something about it, starting with investigating the

1461
01:21:08,199 --> 01:21:10,920
group of men working in the pipeline construction just north

1462
01:21:10,920 --> 01:21:13,560
of their homes. As Quill closes in on the truth

1463
01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:17,000
about the missing woman, someone else disappears in request to

1464
01:21:17,000 --> 01:21:19,520
find justice for all of the women of the reservation,

1465
01:21:19,840 --> 01:21:22,840
Oh my God, reservation. She's confronted with the hard truths

1466
01:21:22,840 --> 01:21:25,520
of their home and the people who purport to serve them.

1467
01:21:25,960 --> 01:21:29,119
When will she stop losing neighbors, friends, family, As Quill

1468
01:21:29,159 --> 01:21:31,359
puts everything on the line to make a difference, The

1469
01:21:31,439 --> 01:21:35,760
novel asks searing questions about Bisundric culture, the averbations of

1470
01:21:35,840 --> 01:21:38,680
even one act of crime, and the long lasting trauma

1471
01:21:39,039 --> 01:21:42,760
of being considered invisible. So I really liked it, But

1472
01:21:42,840 --> 01:21:45,279
some reviews I saw, I said it was a little

1473
01:21:46,119 --> 01:21:49,039
like have you heard what people say authors should show

1474
01:21:49,159 --> 01:21:51,840
not tell? Yeah, And people were like, she was telling

1475
01:21:51,920 --> 01:21:54,199
not showing. But I didn't mind it. I don't know

1476
01:21:54,239 --> 01:21:56,000
if it's different reading it than listen to it, but

1477
01:21:56,039 --> 01:21:57,960
I didn't mind it. And then people were complaining about

1478
01:21:57,960 --> 01:21:59,960
the main character and making dumb ass choices. But she's

1479
01:22:00,279 --> 01:22:02,319
stressed out, she's trying to figure out what's going on,

1480
01:22:02,479 --> 01:22:05,319
Like she's not thinking straight, she's just thinking like she

1481
01:22:05,319 --> 01:22:07,199
has justice on her mind, that's on her mind, So

1482
01:22:07,239 --> 01:22:09,319
to me, it makes sense the way that she acted,

1483
01:22:09,399 --> 01:22:11,319
you know what I mean? But people hate us main

1484
01:22:11,399 --> 01:22:14,640
characters like make dumb choices that I'm like, people make

1485
01:22:14,720 --> 01:22:16,560
dumb choices all the time, Like, have you never made

1486
01:22:16,560 --> 01:22:18,279
a dumb choice? Do you think your perfect way?

1487
01:22:18,399 --> 01:22:18,560
Speaker 2: What?

1488
01:22:18,800 --> 01:22:21,720
Speaker 1: I will be the one making the dumb choice? Yeah? Yeah,

1489
01:22:21,800 --> 01:22:24,600
ten out of ten times, it'll So it was really good.

1490
01:22:26,079 --> 01:22:29,199
And I finished Hurricane Season. But you've already talked about that, right,

1491
01:22:29,199 --> 01:22:32,119
I think it was recommendation, yeah, that she will leave

1492
01:22:32,159 --> 01:22:36,239
you emptiest. I felt more dead inside than I've ever felt.

1493
01:22:36,640 --> 01:22:38,960
I was not kidding when I said that, you weren't

1494
01:22:39,479 --> 01:22:41,039
if you want to be, that's just going to fucking

1495
01:22:41,079 --> 01:22:45,079
destroy you and leave you like a fucking hole and

1496
01:22:45,560 --> 01:22:48,199
like you're just you've been consumed by a dark hole

1497
01:22:48,399 --> 01:22:52,199
and there's just no hole. Bless for humanity and everyone's terrible,

1498
01:22:52,520 --> 01:22:55,800
No one will ever be a good person ever again.

1499
01:22:56,359 --> 01:22:59,720
Read that book? Yeah, Hurricane Season and then listen to

1500
01:22:59,720 --> 01:23:02,640
it and finished, and apparently there's a movie too. I'm like, Okay,

1501
01:23:02,640 --> 01:23:04,359
should I listen to the audiobook or should I watch

1502
01:23:04,359 --> 01:23:05,479
a movie? But I don't know if I can watch

1503
01:23:05,520 --> 01:23:08,079
a movie. I can't. I don't. I haven't checked it out.

1504
01:23:08,239 --> 01:23:10,520
I might, I don't know. You know what's insane to

1505
01:23:10,520 --> 01:23:13,760
me when people are like, wow, Heurocane Sea thing was

1506
01:23:13,800 --> 01:23:17,039
mid When someone recommends it as like a really intense

1507
01:23:17,159 --> 01:23:19,199
book and I'm like, you guys are just psychos. I'm like,

1508
01:23:19,279 --> 01:23:21,359
what are they reading? What is going on in their

1509
01:23:21,439 --> 01:23:27,439
mind that they think this was mid psychos? Yes? Yeah,

1510
01:23:27,560 --> 01:23:30,720
the writing style is very different, like it's I'm getting

1511
01:23:30,800 --> 01:23:32,520
used to It kind of annoyed me a little bit,

1512
01:23:32,520 --> 01:23:34,600
but then the end, like I couldn't stop reading it

1513
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:38,119
and I waited it first, yeah, before reading it, and

1514
01:23:38,159 --> 01:23:40,560
I didn't experienced that at all. I was just like whatever,

1515
01:23:42,199 --> 01:23:44,680
five out of five. But it's hard to say. It's

1516
01:23:44,680 --> 01:23:47,199
hard to say I enjoyed reading it. Did I enjoy it?

1517
01:23:47,680 --> 01:23:52,319
It was a visceral type of fields. It was the

1518
01:23:52,399 --> 01:23:54,439
reason I feel like I read it five at five

1519
01:23:54,640 --> 01:24:02,800
is because it wasn't all consuming yeah feeling, That's exactly

1520
01:24:02,840 --> 01:24:08,319
what I was say. Yeah, it's enjoyable. I feeled a

1521
01:24:08,359 --> 01:24:15,319
lot of things, yes, yeah. Yeah. So I wouldn't recommend

1522
01:24:15,319 --> 01:24:18,880
it to just anyone. I think if you're wanting to

1523
01:24:19,520 --> 01:24:21,640
everything yeah, if you want to if you want to

1524
01:24:21,640 --> 01:24:27,439
feel despair, yeah exactly. Yeah, if you just want to

1525
01:24:27,439 --> 01:24:31,279
feel something, if you've been feeling dead insided, you want

1526
01:24:31,279 --> 01:24:33,720
to feel worse, yeah, this is the book to read,

1527
01:24:33,840 --> 01:24:35,600
but worse in a good way where you're like, wow,

1528
01:24:36,640 --> 01:24:41,960
I feel nothing but despair. No, no, but we talked

1529
01:24:42,239 --> 01:24:46,000
about that book. Yeah, yeah, yeah, done. Oh wait, well

1530
01:24:46,079 --> 01:24:48,600
might I have I'm so sorry, God, but I'm sorry, sorry,

1531
01:24:48,680 --> 01:24:54,560
I have one more recogntion. I thought stump anyway. So

1532
01:24:54,880 --> 01:24:57,239
it was in the Patron episode I mentioned that I

1533
01:24:57,319 --> 01:25:02,720
found out that Grady Hendrix has a podcast about vampires,

1534
01:25:02,840 --> 01:25:06,960
and so I listened to the first episode and it

1535
01:25:07,039 --> 01:25:11,439
was very campy but very entertaining. Okay, that's what we love.

1536
01:25:12,119 --> 01:25:14,840
It was like reading one of his books. Honestly, that's awesome.

1537
01:25:16,359 --> 01:25:20,520
In case anyone's interested, it's super scary haunted homeschool. Okay,

1538
01:25:20,800 --> 01:25:22,800
well I need to still listen to it, and that's it.

1539
01:25:22,840 --> 01:25:25,800
I'm done. Okay, finally my turn. All right, this isn't

1540
01:25:25,800 --> 01:25:29,199
a long episode. I'm sorry, no, no, no, it's like I

1541
01:25:29,319 --> 01:25:37,279
meant it in a good way. I read the I

1542
01:25:37,319 --> 01:25:39,079
listened to it. That's how I read. That's what I

1543
01:25:39,119 --> 01:25:41,039
mean when I say I read, I listened to it.

1544
01:25:41,600 --> 01:25:45,960
I read The Indifferent Stars above, the harrowing saga of

1545
01:25:46,000 --> 01:25:52,239
a dinner party bride, because let me tell you, yeah,

1546
01:25:52,399 --> 01:25:57,600
a woman in the door party. I didn't know a

1547
01:25:57,680 --> 01:26:00,520
bride in the Donner Party, of course. Okay, I get

1548
01:26:00,560 --> 01:26:03,119
it now, okay, okay. Well, I was reading a horror

1549
01:26:03,159 --> 01:26:11,119
book that's like, uh, historical fiction horror on this Donnor Party.

1550
01:26:11,239 --> 01:26:12,880
But the book I was like halfway through it, and

1551
01:26:12,920 --> 01:26:14,760
I was like, and you know, I am not one

1552
01:26:14,840 --> 01:26:17,000
to just not finish a book. I usually finish them

1553
01:26:17,079 --> 01:26:20,600
mm hmm. But man, nothing was happening. I don't remember

1554
01:26:20,640 --> 01:26:23,279
telling the book nothing was happening. It was fucking boring.

1555
01:26:23,439 --> 01:26:25,880
I was like, does this go anywhere? Like what is happening?

1556
01:26:26,159 --> 01:26:28,159
And I looked up reviews and everyone's like, this book

1557
01:26:28,199 --> 01:26:30,840
is so boring. If you really want to feel like horrified,

1558
01:26:31,000 --> 01:26:34,600
just read a true account, a nonfiction book about the

1559
01:26:34,640 --> 01:26:37,000
Donner Party. And this is the best one, The Indifferent

1560
01:26:37,039 --> 01:26:40,079
Stars above, And yeah, it's because the stars looking a

1561
01:26:40,079 --> 01:26:43,439
buck about what's happening to you, Like, this book does

1562
01:26:43,520 --> 01:26:47,960
not shy away from describing what the Donner Party went through,

1563
01:26:48,079 --> 01:26:51,159
and that was fucking insane. Just listening to it. I

1564
01:26:51,199 --> 01:26:55,119
was like, I was like, I'm gonna throw up. Let

1565
01:26:55,119 --> 01:26:58,359
me read the synopsis. The different stars above traces the

1566
01:26:58,560 --> 01:27:01,239
step of Sarah Graves, a young bride who left her

1567
01:27:01,239 --> 01:27:03,920
home in Illinois in the spring of eighteen forty six

1568
01:27:03,960 --> 01:27:06,399
banked for California. Along the way, she and her husband

1569
01:27:06,439 --> 01:27:09,319
become members of the notorious and ill fated Donner Party

1570
01:27:09,760 --> 01:27:12,039
and ran into a world of trouble. And a world

1571
01:27:12,039 --> 01:27:15,159
of trouble isn't even like a proper description. They ran

1572
01:27:15,159 --> 01:27:18,359
into like hell, like literally like oh hell. And the

1573
01:27:18,399 --> 01:27:21,640
book literally is like then they all started dying one

1574
01:27:21,640 --> 01:27:23,920
by one. They all had to started bantering each other.

1575
01:27:24,199 --> 01:27:26,239
I mean, and I think we all know by now

1576
01:27:26,399 --> 01:27:28,800
about the Donner Party, but they had to start eating

1577
01:27:28,800 --> 01:27:32,000
each other to survive. Yeah, and the book is like

1578
01:27:32,880 --> 01:27:35,199
they had to cook so and so was Infantelia. I

1579
01:27:35,239 --> 01:27:38,840
was just like, oh my god, wow. And it's like

1580
01:27:39,000 --> 01:27:41,760
it doesn't it just it tells. It tells you what happened.

1581
01:27:41,760 --> 01:27:44,079
It tells you what happened, And that's more horrifying than

1582
01:27:44,119 --> 01:27:48,079
any horror fiction on the Donner Party. The literal truth story.

1583
01:27:48,159 --> 01:27:51,199
I think I know the book that you mentioned, because

1584
01:27:51,199 --> 01:27:54,119
when I was looking through like what it's liking through,

1585
01:27:54,199 --> 01:27:56,399
I think I was on one of the subreddits from

1586
01:27:56,479 --> 01:27:58,920
one of the book subreddits, and then somebody was complaining

1587
01:27:58,920 --> 01:28:00,680
about the book you were talking about, and then they

1588
01:28:00,720 --> 01:28:04,439
recommended the one you listen to. Okay, And honestly, if

1589
01:28:04,439 --> 01:28:06,479
you like, I think everyone has that experience with that

1590
01:28:06,479 --> 01:28:09,920
book that you're talking about. Honestly, I think so, So

1591
01:28:10,000 --> 01:28:12,239
don't read whatever. The first one I'm talking about is

1592
01:28:12,279 --> 01:28:13,600
I don't know the name of it, but don't get

1593
01:28:13,640 --> 01:28:15,119
ready forgot So that's why I'm saying the one you

1594
01:28:15,119 --> 01:28:20,159
were talking about go straight to the indifferent stars above. Insane,

1595
01:28:20,520 --> 01:28:25,960
horrifying but true but true. It really happened. And it's

1596
01:28:26,000 --> 01:28:28,840
also just like written really well, because you know, some

1597
01:28:28,880 --> 01:28:32,000
nonfiction books are like dry and you're like, I want

1598
01:28:32,000 --> 01:28:34,039
to know this, but do I really want to know this?

1599
01:28:34,600 --> 01:28:38,800
And this was written beautifully and it's such a horrifying story,

1600
01:28:38,840 --> 01:28:40,880
but like there's so much I didn't know, Like there

1601
01:28:40,960 --> 01:28:45,399
was two Indigenous people that were paid to leave the

1602
01:28:45,479 --> 01:28:47,560
Darner Party and I learned that on the year Wrong

1603
01:28:47,600 --> 01:28:50,880
About episode Yes, uh huh, and I actually wanted to

1604
01:28:50,880 --> 01:28:52,520
look into it. And I'm just like, I feel like

1605
01:28:52,520 --> 01:28:55,520
I can never do this justice if I wanted to

1606
01:28:55,560 --> 01:28:58,079
cover it, and so I haven't. Yeah, but I wanted

1607
01:28:58,119 --> 01:29:01,039
to look into these men because I think one of

1608
01:29:01,039 --> 01:29:03,199
them was last night, like they were there Spanish. One

1609
01:29:03,239 --> 01:29:06,159
of them had a Spanish name, but he's an indigenous person, right,

1610
01:29:07,359 --> 01:29:10,079
And yeah, it's just there. It's a story and it

1611
01:29:10,159 --> 01:29:12,439
follows Sarah Graves, which is one of the members. But

1612
01:29:12,840 --> 01:29:16,199
man like harrowing heroin, I don't know how you pronounced

1613
01:29:16,199 --> 01:29:21,359
that shit horrifying truly, So yeah, that was my speaking recommendation.

1614
01:29:21,960 --> 01:29:25,319
We've reached the end of the episode finally. Sorry a

1615
01:29:25,359 --> 01:29:28,640
long one. She was a long one. And again, just

1616
01:29:28,640 --> 01:29:32,640
a reminder if you want to help us one helped

1617
01:29:32,640 --> 01:29:35,399
me keep the lights on by helping me pay myself

1618
01:29:35,439 --> 01:29:39,399
to do this job, but also help us gift to charity,

1619
01:29:39,479 --> 01:29:42,560
then check out the Patreon we post bonus episodes. We

1620
01:29:42,640 --> 01:29:45,359
just did as long as when talking about Vampire Media

1621
01:29:45,560 --> 01:29:48,520
and Fred on Patreon was like, you guys didn't even

1622
01:29:48,640 --> 01:29:56,119
mentioned Little Vampire God. I forgot about that. Yeah I did,

1623
01:29:56,199 --> 01:29:59,319
Fred was right, I did. Yeah, that's probably what kicked

1624
01:29:59,319 --> 01:30:02,600
off my love of vampires. I loved that movie and

1625
01:30:03,319 --> 01:30:05,279
I loved that little Kid when we were the same

1626
01:30:05,319 --> 01:30:09,560
age with me. I love watching I just some people,

1627
01:30:09,920 --> 01:30:11,359
some people to get too far and they're like, oh

1628
01:30:11,439 --> 01:30:13,399
my god, like when I'm watching the g or when

1629
01:30:13,439 --> 01:30:15,640
I'm I'm on the digresses have Reddit and you're like,

1630
01:30:15,680 --> 01:30:18,119
do you guys realized you're adults talking about children? And

1631
01:30:18,159 --> 01:30:20,560
they're like, no, we're adults who were that age and

1632
01:30:20,600 --> 01:30:23,039
these people are the same age, Like stop being weird.

1633
01:30:23,279 --> 01:30:23,520
Speaker 2: God.

1634
01:30:23,640 --> 01:30:26,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, anyway, yeah, little a Little Vmpire was great, and

1635
01:30:26,439 --> 01:30:29,680
so yeah, we spent almost two hours talking about vampire media,

1636
01:30:29,840 --> 01:30:34,079
all vampire media, books, shows, movies. We yapped for a

1637
01:30:34,119 --> 01:30:37,760
long time about that. Yeah, and then we also sometimes

1638
01:30:37,840 --> 01:30:42,079
read re read it stories to and react to them,

1639
01:30:42,399 --> 01:30:46,520
and when we're together, vlogs. Our last one was a

1640
01:30:46,600 --> 01:30:51,640
number of blog that was a while ago. And what else?

1641
01:30:51,720 --> 01:30:54,079
What else? If you joined the Highest here you get

1642
01:30:54,079 --> 01:30:56,119
a one time keychain and I love those key chains.

1643
01:30:56,159 --> 01:31:00,760
They're huge and like soft, so those are cool. And

1644
01:31:00,800 --> 01:31:03,960
then our current book club book we finished it, The

1645
01:31:04,000 --> 01:31:07,159
Witches of Apasso. We sent out the discussion questions answer

1646
01:31:07,239 --> 01:31:10,560
the answer you want. I like reading them, but you

1647
01:31:10,600 --> 01:31:12,920
don't have to answer that it's fine, but again we

1648
01:31:13,000 --> 01:31:16,640
like reading them and we will record that probably next week, honestly. Yeah,

1649
01:31:19,800 --> 01:31:22,640
now this brings us to the end of the episode. Okay,

1650
01:31:23,000 --> 01:31:25,359
I don't think we have any more new announcements. No,

1651
01:31:25,920 --> 01:31:29,159
all right, stay at Spookie. We'll catch everyone next time.

1652
01:31:29,479 --> 01:31:32,720
Buy My Book Tells is hosted by Christina and Carmen,

1653
01:31:32,840 --> 01:31:36,680
produced and edited by Christina, researched by Christina Carmen, and

1654
01:31:36,720 --> 01:31:39,079
with the help of Don shout out with Don. If

1655
01:31:39,079 --> 01:31:41,199
you aren't joying the podcast considerably, going to say five

1656
01:31:41,199 --> 01:31:43,399
star review, we would really appreciate it. If you don't

1657
01:31:43,399 --> 01:31:45,560
want to the five star review, just don't leave a review.

1658
01:31:45,600 --> 01:31:48,000
But don't leave anything lower than that, please, I'm just kidding.

1659
01:31:48,159 --> 01:31:50,640
You can reach out to the podcast at a spooktees

1660
01:31:50,640 --> 01:31:52,479
at gmail dot com. You can go to our website

1661
01:31:52,520 --> 01:31:55,600
at bookitos dot com and fill out the contact form.

1662
01:31:55,720 --> 01:31:57,680
If you want to support the podcast, you can join

1663
01:31:57,760 --> 01:32:02,000
our Patreon, where we send exclusive stickers, have bonus episodes.

1664
01:32:02,039 --> 01:32:05,359
Eight dollar members get an exclusive key chain. It's super cool.

1665
01:32:05,399 --> 01:32:07,800
I got new ones and these ones are huge. And

1666
01:32:08,039 --> 01:32:10,279
if you want to support but you can or don't

1667
01:32:10,279 --> 01:32:12,399
want to join the patreon that's fine too. You can

1668
01:32:12,439 --> 01:32:15,880
also get some merch. You can find shurets to say

1669
01:32:15,920 --> 01:32:18,840
a spooky and old English letters. There's a beanie. I

1670
01:32:18,920 --> 01:32:22,479
love the beanie. There's also a hat. There's a no

1671
01:32:22,640 --> 01:32:26,279
Mamus shirt, which is a fan favorite. There's a lot

1672
01:32:26,319 --> 01:32:29,399
of options, crap tops, sweaters. It's almost swetter weather. We're

1673
01:32:29,479 --> 01:32:32,520
nearing a spookie season, so yeah, get your hoodies. You're

1674
01:32:32,560 --> 01:32:34,439
gonna need them. If you don't want to do all that,

1675
01:32:34,439 --> 01:32:37,439
that's fine too. You can just listen like you're listening now,

1676
01:32:37,479 --> 01:32:39,199
and that's the best support that you can give us.

1677
01:32:39,239 --> 01:32:41,840
Like I always say in our ad break and yeah,

1678
01:32:41,880 --> 01:32:45,439
if you like history, you can follow Estodia's Unknown Mining,

1679
01:32:45,520 --> 01:32:49,319
Carmen's other podcasts, and you can find as Spooky tails

1680
01:32:49,319 --> 01:32:52,359
on all of our socials at Spooky Tells All. This

1681
01:32:52,399 --> 01:32:56,119
is in the show notes and we appreciate every single listen.

1682
01:32:56,199 --> 01:32:58,199
Thank you so much. Stay as Spooky