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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it can use across crypto assets. We think stable

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<v Speaker 1>coins are probably the more obvious ones where it's going

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<v Speaker 1>to start, just because that's closest to the FIAT that

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<v Speaker 1>people may be used to today. But we absolutely think

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<v Speaker 1>it's going to expand from there. And what I'll add

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<v Speaker 1>is that, like we grew up in a world where

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<v Speaker 1>the Internet was built for humans, but more and more

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<v Speaker 1>AI out there, we have to reconfigure these systems so

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<v Speaker 1>that they work for AI agents so they can do

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<v Speaker 1>what we're asking of them.

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<v Speaker 2>This content is brought to you by bitco, which is

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<v Speaker 2>one of the top crypto custodians in the crypto industry.

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<v Speaker 2>Bitco works with many big companies and brands such as

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<v Speaker 2>Pantera Capital, Bitstamp, and bitcoin Ira. Nike also selected Bitgo

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<v Speaker 2>to power its wallets for its NFTs, and bitco has

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<v Speaker 2>many great services such as hot wallets, custodial wallets, self

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<v Speaker 2>managed cold wallets, and NFT wallets. Many institutions trust bitgo

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<v Speaker 2>with its top level security and incredible services such as

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<v Speaker 2>being able to deploy your capital while it's in custody,

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<v Speaker 2>which includes lending, borrowing, trading, staking, DeFi access and more.

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<v Speaker 2>If you'd like to learn more about bitco, please visit

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<v Speaker 2>bitgo dot com link in a description. Welcome into the

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<v Speaker 2>Thinking Crypto podcast. I'm your host, Tony Edward, and my

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<v Speaker 2>guests today are Nimil de Laul, who's the head of

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<v Speaker 2>the coin based Developer Platform, and Dan Kim, who's head

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<v Speaker 2>of business development the coinbased Developer Platform. Gentlemen, great to

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<v Speaker 2>have you both on.

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<v Speaker 1>It's great to see you Tony, really, sait it beyond

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<v Speaker 1>good to see you again.

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<v Speaker 3>Tony.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Dan, you and I have spoken before, so great

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<v Speaker 2>to have you on. And Guys, I am very excited

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<v Speaker 2>to speak to you both. And that's not the cliche

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<v Speaker 2>statement I'm sure you probably here on podcasts. I'm actually

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<v Speaker 2>speaking to one of your other colleagues to figure out

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<v Speaker 2>how I can use these AI agents and have them

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<v Speaker 2>work for me and collect payment in USDCE or other crypto.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'm really fascinated by this technology and I want

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<v Speaker 2>to use it. But before we get to all the

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<v Speaker 2>details around that, let's start off with quick introductions. Nimil

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<v Speaker 2>kick us off. Tell us about yourself and what you

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<v Speaker 2>do at coinbase.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, my name is to Meil Eli our coinbased Developer

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<v Speaker 1>platform team. Think about it if you're a developer, you

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<v Speaker 1>need to be able to build a crypto app. We

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<v Speaker 1>have all the tools to be able to let you

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<v Speaker 1>do that from nodes, indexer, secure wallets, free USDC sends

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<v Speaker 1>on base and much more. And my journey into crypto

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<v Speaker 1>was I was in y combinator with Brian and Fred

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<v Speaker 1>when they started the company. It was doing another startup

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<v Speaker 1>and they gave me my first bitcoin. I got started

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<v Speaker 1>digging into this, got super excited about it, and eventually

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<v Speaker 1>I joined Coinbase. At Coinbase, I led USDC. So this

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<v Speaker 1>is a venture that they're believing, you know, in a

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<v Speaker 1>stable coin thought this could be really huge thing for

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<v Speaker 1>the world and industry. So work very closely with the

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<v Speaker 1>biology stream of US and at the time it was

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<v Speaker 1>our CTO to be able to help grow that. And

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<v Speaker 1>now I'm leading our developer tools business.

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<v Speaker 4>Awesome and Dan.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I've been with Claimbers for about three and a

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<v Speaker 5>half years now and oversee business development and partnerships mostly

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<v Speaker 5>with developers and builders doing cool stuff in crypto and

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<v Speaker 5>on blockchain. Started a journey here on a listing's team

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<v Speaker 5>uh and got to meet a bunch of asset issuers

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<v Speaker 5>who are doing cool things and as a result of

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<v Speaker 5>just learning more about what they're doing and all the

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<v Speaker 5>exciting things that they you know, have have in mind

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<v Speaker 5>expanded to really do bead and partnerships in the space,

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<v Speaker 5>working closely with the Meal, and uh, you know, we're

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<v Speaker 5>really excited today in particular to talk about I think

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<v Speaker 5>what's going to be the convergence at AI and crypto,

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<v Speaker 5>and it's something that we're just you know, seeing as

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<v Speaker 5>being a big catalyst for keeping me and the Meal

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<v Speaker 5>busy with a lot of the things that we're doing here.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, thank you, Dan, And I'm so fascinated, like I

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<v Speaker 2>said before, about uh, this use case, the convergence and

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<v Speaker 2>how these two technologies are going to work together. And

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<v Speaker 2>there seems to be a symbiotic relationship where blockchain can

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<v Speaker 2>be used to police AI in different ways de fakes

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<v Speaker 2>and so forth, but AI can be used to enhance

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<v Speaker 2>blockchain attributes. Tell us about I guess your thesis behind

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<v Speaker 2>using AI agents and crypto and how did the idea

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<v Speaker 2>come about?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so first of all, let's say that these are

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<v Speaker 1>two independent technologies that all have value of their own.

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<v Speaker 3>So AI you can.

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<v Speaker 1>See just the transformation that's done in terms of what

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<v Speaker 1>can be done quickly, easily, at scale, across vast amounts

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<v Speaker 1>of data. And with crypto, we basically what have what

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<v Speaker 1>I cause like an internet of ownership that open, transparent

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<v Speaker 1>leisure that anyone can look at and understand, where someone

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<v Speaker 1>who owns what in that world. The powerful thing is.

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<v Speaker 1>I think there are two angles where they come together.

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<v Speaker 1>One angle is that they're builders out there in the world,

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<v Speaker 1>and AI makes building easier. And so let's say they're

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<v Speaker 1>twenty five million software developers in the world, but a

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<v Speaker 1>small fraction of that work in crypto, maybe thirty to

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<v Speaker 1>fifty thousand developers. Today with AI, we're seeing people who've

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<v Speaker 1>never codd before. We're seeing people who've coded a lot,

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<v Speaker 1>but we're actually just run an engineers who want to

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<v Speaker 1>write a full application deploy it, and they're able to

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<v Speaker 1>do it in a matter of minutes. And think about this,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, compared to a world of five ten years ago,

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<v Speaker 1>might you might need a computer science degree to be

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<v Speaker 1>able to launch an application. You might need to at

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<v Speaker 1>least go through a boot camp to learn all the details.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a transformational thing. And so I think what we're

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<v Speaker 1>seeing is that they're more and more builders that are

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<v Speaker 1>able to interact on chain than ever before as a

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<v Speaker 1>result of AI. So that's one angle that we've been

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<v Speaker 1>seeing in a really big way. The other angle is

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<v Speaker 1>that AI itself cannot get a bank account, but AI

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<v Speaker 1>agents need wallets to be able to do stuff the

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<v Speaker 1>same way you know, us as humans need a credit

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<v Speaker 1>card to be able to go buy something to build

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<v Speaker 1>a few by if you're building blocks together, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>at a hardware store and put those together, and the

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<v Speaker 1>same way AI can interact in that world. And that's

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<v Speaker 1>why the blockchain is so powerful for that use case.

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<v Speaker 1>So that AI can basically take some crypto, It can

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<v Speaker 1>go ahead and either human to give it some information

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<v Speaker 1>that it critically needs to answer a query that it's getting.

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<v Speaker 1>It can go to a data API and pay for

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<v Speaker 1>that because hey, it can't swipe a credit card, you

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<v Speaker 1>can't sign up for an API, keep it can directly

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<v Speaker 1>hit that data, pay for it in crypto on chain

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<v Speaker 1>and then use that. And so there's the two like

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<v Speaker 1>really big things that we're seeing thematically excited to go

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<v Speaker 1>through more examples of that, but those are the two

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<v Speaker 1>ways that we really see it coming together.

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<v Speaker 3>Tony.

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<v Speaker 5>There, I'm dating myself here, but there was a many

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<v Speaker 5>many years ago.

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<v Speaker 3>When I was.

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<v Speaker 5>At cal College. One of the courses I took was

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<v Speaker 5>an HTML course. You can imagine how useless that is

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<v Speaker 5>now with solutions like word price and scores spaces that

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<v Speaker 5>are out there. I think this is exactly what's happening

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<v Speaker 5>in crypto today because of AI. You know, both technologies

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<v Speaker 5>and particularly crypto is becoming a lot more accessible and

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<v Speaker 5>people can really leverage its full strength, but just how

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<v Speaker 5>a vision and an idea of what they want to do.

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<v Speaker 5>And even last year this wasn't possible. So that's one

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<v Speaker 5>of the reasons why we're so excited about this space

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<v Speaker 5>is because it just opens up the space to anybody

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<v Speaker 5>who wants to build and really enhance the things that

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<v Speaker 5>they're building because of what CRYPTO could do.

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<v Speaker 2>M you know, as you guys are saying those things

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<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking about, I could be sleeping and I can

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<v Speaker 2>have an AI agent doing things on my behalf, whether

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<v Speaker 2>it's selling or buying or helping somebody providing a service

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<v Speaker 2>and collecting payment, and I can wake up and have

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<v Speaker 2>a wallet with funds in it, or I could have

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<v Speaker 2>a product delivered to me that the AI agent went

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<v Speaker 2>out and paid for.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like, I think one of the most obvious use

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<v Speaker 1>cases is that it's there. It's trading on crypto out

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<v Speaker 1>on chain, so for example, it's hitting uniswat, it's hitting

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<v Speaker 1>different forms of DEXes and exchanges that are out there

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<v Speaker 1>in the world. It's making some money that's showing up

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<v Speaker 1>in your wallet, and then when you wake up, the

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<v Speaker 1>AI has done that throughout the hours, and unlike you

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<v Speaker 1>know traditional financial markets, crypto it is twenty four to seven.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's a really good example where when you're sleeping

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<v Speaker 1>you need someone to think about, let's say, you know

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<v Speaker 1>other parts of the world, who's trading in those parts

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<v Speaker 1>of the world, and what can AI do during that time.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, you guys recently successfully conducted an AI to AI

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<v Speaker 2>agent crypto transaction.

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<v Speaker 4>Tuls about that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Dan, do you want to take that?

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 5>I mean, look, we've been experimenting with a lot of

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<v Speaker 5>like what's possible here, and I think there's like two

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<v Speaker 5>things that we've been leaning into. One is AI to

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<v Speaker 5>AI and another is what we'll call it AD a human,

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<v Speaker 5>which is also very interesting. The thing that we love

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<v Speaker 5>about AI agents is their ability to scale in a

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<v Speaker 5>very intelligent way and by conversing with other AI agents.

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<v Speaker 5>Imagine all the cool things that you can do that

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<v Speaker 5>would take humans.

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<v Speaker 3>A long time to do or may not do it

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<v Speaker 3>in a very accurate way.

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<v Speaker 5>So we're really excited about that in the application of crypto.

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<v Speaker 5>And one example that come to mind as to why

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<v Speaker 5>AIDS agent agent is interesting is imagine going cross chain. Right, So,

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<v Speaker 5>unless you're you know, I guess if you're a crypto expert,

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<v Speaker 5>it's probably easy, but imagine just being able to tell

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<v Speaker 5>somebody or at the AI agent what you want, and

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<v Speaker 5>based on that natural language instet of instructions, the agent

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<v Speaker 5>kind of goespigure it out on its own and finds

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<v Speaker 5>other agents, maybe you representing other chains to do cool

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<v Speaker 5>stuff that completely abstracts away the complexities of, you know what,

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<v Speaker 5>what the human needs to know in order to convert

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<v Speaker 5>for example, USDC on base from u SEC on Salona

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<v Speaker 5>for example. Right, So that's what we're really leaning into,

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<v Speaker 5>and that whole AI to AI it's really more of

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<v Speaker 5>a metaphor for all the cool things that can happen faster,

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<v Speaker 5>more accurately, in a more compelling way just because of

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<v Speaker 5>what AI AI agents can do, which is becomes smarter

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<v Speaker 5>bots right, and then therefore abstract away a lot of

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<v Speaker 5>the complexities that humans shouldn't really have to worry about

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<v Speaker 5>and execute that just based trip on the vision of

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<v Speaker 5>what the human wants to do.

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<v Speaker 2>And the transaction was done with USDC right. And can

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<v Speaker 2>it go to other crypto assets as well?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it can use across crypto assets. We think stable

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<v Speaker 1>coins are probably the more obvious one where it's going

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<v Speaker 1>to start, just because that's closest to the FIAT that

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<v Speaker 1>people may be used to today, but we absolutely think

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<v Speaker 1>it's going to expand from there. And what I'll add

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<v Speaker 1>is that, like we grew up in a world with

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<v Speaker 1>the Internet was built for humans, but with more and

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<v Speaker 1>more AI out there, we have to reconfigure these systems

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<v Speaker 1>so that they work for AI agents so they can

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<v Speaker 1>do what we're asking of them. And this is exactly

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<v Speaker 1>why I think this AI to AI example is so interesting,

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<v Speaker 1>is that, like in this one example, it was a

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<v Speaker 1>generalized AI conversational interface that needed a very specific, specialized

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<v Speaker 1>AI interface. So it's no different than one human, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>who might be a journalist who wants a very specific

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<v Speaker 1>skill set. They may want to reach out to a

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<v Speaker 1>programmer who's super deep to know some details and they

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<v Speaker 1>want it. They need to be able to transact to

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<v Speaker 1>be able to do that, and in this case the

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<v Speaker 1>transaction was USDC. It was moved on base and one

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<v Speaker 1>agent is able to talk to the other agent to

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<v Speaker 1>be able to ask for that. And in this case,

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<v Speaker 1>there's a WebCrawler that is an AI agent that can

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<v Speaker 1>look like on the Internet, figure out exactly what the

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<v Speaker 1>Internet is saying and put that into specific tokens that

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<v Speaker 1>can be consumed by an AI and that's what the

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<v Speaker 1>second AI agent needed.

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<v Speaker 3>ME agent today, for example, can't go to the New

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<v Speaker 3>York Times.

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<v Speaker 5>And pay for an article right or get the latest

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<v Speaker 5>weather forecast. Humans can do that because they're marketing things

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<v Speaker 5>out there to kind of incentivize.

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<v Speaker 3>So I still twenty subscribe.

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<v Speaker 5>But imagine a world where an AI agent can actually

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<v Speaker 5>go to a New York Times or a weather service

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<v Speaker 5>right and be able to buy pieces of data or

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<v Speaker 5>an article just strictly based on what it needs, and

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<v Speaker 5>not to do anything other than pay the other AI

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<v Speaker 5>agent in this case the New York Times a lot

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<v Speaker 5>for example, for that transaction, right, instead of a human

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<v Speaker 5>kind of going out there and entering your credit card

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<v Speaker 5>in and that very complex, and that's what we're really

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<v Speaker 5>excited about is just the scaling possibilities from you know,

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<v Speaker 5>what can happen is that they're fractionalized access to data

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<v Speaker 5>in a very meaningful way.

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<v Speaker 2>Walk us through this setup of that. How does the

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<v Speaker 2>AI agent connect to the respective wallet and when you

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<v Speaker 2>expand to other currencies is the wallet is it going

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<v Speaker 2>to be like a web three naming a wallet address

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<v Speaker 2>where it behind the scenes, it can support Salon, it

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<v Speaker 2>can support eth, it can support bitcoin.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, how does all that work?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So what we do with coin based developer platform

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<v Speaker 1>it would we offer something called an NPC want, which

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<v Speaker 1>is an API based wallet. So think about like really

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<v Speaker 1>simple calls. You can say create wallet. I can say

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<v Speaker 1>mint n FT or mint or create erc twenty token

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<v Speaker 1>or trade it and behind the scenes it goes to

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<v Speaker 1>a decks and trades it. Those are all examples of

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<v Speaker 1>what this API wallet or NPC walt can do. And

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<v Speaker 1>so what an AI can do is directly because it

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<v Speaker 1>can make API calls, it can directly hit this API

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<v Speaker 1>and do whatever that API allows it to do. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>the magic part of this is that because it's on

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<v Speaker 1>the blockchain, it can do all the things that the

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<v Speaker 1>blockchain allows, which is a ton of stuff today, and

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<v Speaker 1>so today, like where we're starting is we're starting with Ethereum,

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<v Speaker 1>We're starting with base, but we're slowly expanding out the

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<v Speaker 1>number of networks that we support, and we're slowly expanding

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<v Speaker 1>that into EVM to get started first over time, absolutely

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<v Speaker 1>we want to support all the different blockchain networks that

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<v Speaker 1>are out there, and then you're able to do the

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<v Speaker 1>AI is able to interact with those networks in full,

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<v Speaker 1>so whatever smart contracts are there, it can directly interact

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<v Speaker 1>with that. And so the simplest example to start maybe literally,

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<v Speaker 1>it just wants to launch an RC twenty token and

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<v Speaker 1>tell the world about it. You know, it's hooked up

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<v Speaker 1>to Twitter, similar the truth Terminal or other examples out there.

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<v Speaker 1>It wants to tell the world a little bit about

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<v Speaker 1>this token, why it launched it, and anyone can then

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<v Speaker 1>be able to access it. But you can imagine a

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<v Speaker 1>world where it gets much more sophisticated than that. It's

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<v Speaker 1>the one that you know, goes to UNISWAP or other

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<v Speaker 1>texts and is able or aerodrome and is able to

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<v Speaker 1>actually decide when to trade, how much to trade, maybe

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<v Speaker 1>to market make to provide liquidity into those markets. So

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<v Speaker 1>we're just scratching the surface of what is possible with

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<v Speaker 1>just launching ARC twenties. But I think there's a lot

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<v Speaker 1>more coming Tony.

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<v Speaker 5>The fact that you asked that question is exactly the

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<v Speaker 5>problem we're trying to solve here, right. You just can't

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<v Speaker 5>have people worrying about what network you're on, what you know, what,

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<v Speaker 5>what what token you have, what wallet you have, whether

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<v Speaker 5>or not your wallet support it self. To imagine, if

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<v Speaker 5>you know, we're the cell phones we have today, where

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<v Speaker 5>I'd ask you are you using Verizon or using AT

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<v Speaker 5>and t oh should I can't do that?

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<v Speaker 3>Well? You know so so so right now it doesn't

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<v Speaker 3>really matter.

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<v Speaker 2>Right.

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<v Speaker 5>That is the vision that we have for crypto and

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<v Speaker 5>especially for developers and users, and AI is just the

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<v Speaker 5>way to get us there. It understands code, it's this

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<v Speaker 5>natural language is software code, as is cryptos, and you

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<v Speaker 5>just have to train it and train it is probably

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<v Speaker 5>where the difficulty is. But and that's one of the reasons,

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<v Speaker 5>you know, we we built CDP coomans developer platform to

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<v Speaker 5>make a lot of that a lot easier.

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<v Speaker 3>To use with training models and AI agents so you.

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<v Speaker 5>Know, we want to take away all the We don't

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<v Speaker 5>want you asking that question, right, We want to be like,

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<v Speaker 5>oh yeah, I get it.

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<v Speaker 3>And that's one of the reasons.

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<v Speaker 5>Why we're we're investing so much in CDP is to

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<v Speaker 5>make crypto not complex and to make crypt as easy

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<v Speaker 5>as possible to use for anybody who has a vision.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, and I know interoperability is like a big thing

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<v Speaker 2>that many folks are working on, so that's going to

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<v Speaker 2>be key for global adoption. I apologize if you address this,

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<v Speaker 2>but I want to make sure I'm clear on my end.

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<v Speaker 2>The AI agents that are being created, they're on chain

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<v Speaker 2>right or they outside outside and they just connected a wallet.

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<v Speaker 1>The agents are off chain in that like they have

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<v Speaker 1>to work in traditional infrastructure, but they access the wallet

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<v Speaker 1>epis that allow it to transact anything on chain as well.

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<v Speaker 1>With based agent, you can go to CDP, dot coin

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<v Speaker 1>based dot com today and in three minutes spin up

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<v Speaker 1>an AI agent using open AI swarm, and then you

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<v Speaker 1>connect that to our NPC wallets and you can deploy

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<v Speaker 1>that in zero to three minutes total, and then suddenly

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<v Speaker 1>you have an AI agent that has a wallet that

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<v Speaker 1>can do any transaction on chain.

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<v Speaker 5>With those wallets, and interoperability isn't just between chains, right,

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<v Speaker 5>it's between on chain and off chain as well. That's

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<v Speaker 5>one of the things that we're super excited about. You know,

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<v Speaker 5>if you wanted to use based agent, the Agent kit

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<v Speaker 5>that we recently announced, it can do anything as long

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<v Speaker 5>as there's a Plython API available, right, So imagine the

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<v Speaker 5>possibilities there. Whether it's a Web two or Web three

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<v Speaker 5>tech stack, that agent can go in between.

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<v Speaker 3>Worlds and do cool things.

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<v Speaker 5>Now we're going to start talking about how AI can

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<v Speaker 5>benefit from one chain. I think there's really good discussions

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<v Speaker 5>around training data and having that being mutable and putting

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<v Speaker 5>that on chain. But as far as like the agents themselves,

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<v Speaker 5>we kind of want them to go in between and

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<v Speaker 5>you know, in and out of being unchained, right.

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<v Speaker 3>In order to be really effective.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, that makes sense.

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<v Speaker 2>So when I, let's say I generate that AI agent,

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<v Speaker 2>I got the wallet and so forth, do I need

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<v Speaker 2>to have or am I given the twenty four seed phrase?

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<v Speaker 3>Is it?

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<v Speaker 4>Is it a self hosted wallet? How does that all work? Yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>So we have different options. The traditional one that people

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<v Speaker 1>that are using is we have a two of two

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<v Speaker 1>wallet where you have two shards, and both of those

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<v Speaker 1>shards are needed to be able to sign, and in

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<v Speaker 1>that example, the user or the AI agent is holding

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<v Speaker 1>onto one, so it could be the user that's instantiating

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<v Speaker 1>the AI agent is holding onto that one of those

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<v Speaker 1>shards and then giving into the AI agent to be

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<v Speaker 1>able to call, and then we're holding and supporting the

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<v Speaker 1>other side. And that way, like you can't just go

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<v Speaker 1>hack one thing or attack one thing to be able

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<v Speaker 1>to take the funds as part of that. But kinnily,

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<v Speaker 1>like I would just say, we're just getting started, and

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<v Speaker 1>that like in the last month is really when I

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<v Speaker 1>think crypto and AI that connectivity is really taken off

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<v Speaker 1>truth terminal. There's so many really powerful experiments on Forecaster

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<v Speaker 1>and on Twitter today that I wouldn't be surprised that

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<v Speaker 1>there are new Walt and Key models and we're working

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<v Speaker 1>on those ourselves, and there's some fun announcements coming at

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<v Speaker 1>deb Com from our side. But wouldn't be surprised is that,

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<v Speaker 1>like slowly, the WAT models are going to change so

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<v Speaker 1>that the AI agent is the only one that knows

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<v Speaker 1>it's key and can then hold full and absolute custody

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<v Speaker 1>of those funds and decide exactly what it wants to do,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think we're just getting started because the tools

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<v Speaker 1>are like this is a brand new use case that

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<v Speaker 1>never existed before. And that's maybe one plug I want

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<v Speaker 1>to give to your to your viewers is that if

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<v Speaker 1>you're building today, this is one of the most exciting

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<v Speaker 1>times to build because these things have never been brought

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<v Speaker 1>together in this way. And every day, like when I

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<v Speaker 1>look on Twitter, I see like brand new experiments that

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<v Speaker 1>people have never done before. Like literally just a month

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<v Speaker 1>ago was the first time someone send funds to an

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<v Speaker 1>AI agent and gave its own crypto wallet and did it.

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<v Speaker 1>And that was like thirty sixty days ago. What's going

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<v Speaker 1>to happen the next ninety days. That's gonna happen in the

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<v Speaker 1>next hundred and eighty days. So I would just say,

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<v Speaker 1>if you're a builder today, this is one of the

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<v Speaker 1>most exciting times to start experimenting, working with open ai,

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<v Speaker 1>working with other AI agents that are out there, and

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<v Speaker 1>hooking them up into coin based developer platform.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and to be in full disclosure, like I've spoken

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<v Speaker 2>to Lincoln on your team and we started going through

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<v Speaker 2>his guide that he put together because I want to

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<v Speaker 2>leverage this technology. I want to stay ahead of the curve.

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<v Speaker 2>So it's fascinating, you know, I know, once again still

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<v Speaker 2>early and you guys are still you know, figuring it out.

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<v Speaker 2>We're going to be further iterations and so forth. Aside

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<v Speaker 2>from let's say developers, are you also looking at how

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<v Speaker 2>creators like myself can leverage this technology and automate certain

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<v Speaker 2>things or provide certain services maybe on social media like

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<v Speaker 2>answering questions and people tipping me and things like that.

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<v Speaker 5>Absolutely, I think there's a lot of discussion over the

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<v Speaker 5>past couple of years on how crypto and blockchain in

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<v Speaker 5>particular could perhaps help equilibrate the creator economy or the

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<v Speaker 5>imbalance there is where I think a lot of the

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<v Speaker 5>way the world works today in the creator economy is

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<v Speaker 5>based on views, and that you know, incentivices or at

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<v Speaker 5>least creates the wrong incentives I think for kind of

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<v Speaker 5>up and coming artists and creators to be immediately relevant.

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<v Speaker 5>We like crypto in a creator space because of the

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<v Speaker 5>payments angle, But how do you scale that?

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<v Speaker 3>Right?

426
00:20:27.160 --> 00:20:28.799
<v Speaker 5>And one of the things that you do need to

427
00:20:28.799 --> 00:20:31.160
<v Speaker 5>do is is scale very quickly in order to kind

428
00:20:31.160 --> 00:20:34.359
<v Speaker 5>of compete with these traditional platforms that have massive viewers.

429
00:20:34.359 --> 00:20:36.799
<v Speaker 5>That have really advanced algorithms to kind of direct a

430
00:20:36.839 --> 00:20:40.079
<v Speaker 5>traffic to the right places. Right, So really excited about

431
00:20:40.119 --> 00:20:43.839
<v Speaker 5>the impact of AI and crypto in particular in the

432
00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:46.759
<v Speaker 5>creator space because it's going to be able to do

433
00:20:46.880 --> 00:20:50.160
<v Speaker 5>a lot more to enable scale for creators who want

434
00:20:50.160 --> 00:20:53.920
<v Speaker 5>to reach much larger audiences identify and reach much larger

435
00:20:53.920 --> 00:20:56.599
<v Speaker 5>audiences in an authentic and engaging way.

436
00:20:56.920 --> 00:20:57.039
<v Speaker 3>Right.

437
00:20:57.039 --> 00:20:59.599
<v Speaker 5>A lot of the automations and bots that you see

438
00:20:59.759 --> 00:21:00.920
<v Speaker 5>there are exactly that.

439
00:21:00.799 --> 00:21:02.119
<v Speaker 3>They're very not smart.

440
00:21:02.880 --> 00:21:04.880
<v Speaker 5>You basically pay a bunch of money actually to these

441
00:21:04.880 --> 00:21:08.720
<v Speaker 5>other platforms they find you followers for you or viewers

442
00:21:08.759 --> 00:21:11.480
<v Speaker 5>for you in a very binary and old school kind

443
00:21:11.480 --> 00:21:14.880
<v Speaker 5>of way. With AI agents because they're getting a lot

444
00:21:14.920 --> 00:21:17.960
<v Speaker 5>more lot smarter or meaningful, more engaging, and they understand

445
00:21:17.960 --> 00:21:20.799
<v Speaker 5>people's psyche to a point where you don't might not

446
00:21:20.839 --> 00:21:23.279
<v Speaker 5>even know you're talking to an agent. Imagine imposing up

447
00:21:23.359 --> 00:21:26.160
<v Speaker 5>or or putting in printing a personality of a creator

448
00:21:27.200 --> 00:21:29.319
<v Speaker 5>or an influencer in the form of an AI agent

449
00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:32.119
<v Speaker 5>too ay out there and start to identify. Oh wait

450
00:21:32.160 --> 00:21:34.559
<v Speaker 5>a minute, I see this discussion happening in this forum

451
00:21:34.599 --> 00:21:35.920
<v Speaker 5>and never heard before. Let me let me get in

452
00:21:35.960 --> 00:21:40.319
<v Speaker 5>there and start having these conversations and beyond that, making

453
00:21:40.359 --> 00:21:44.920
<v Speaker 5>those engagements meaningful by everything crypto can do, whether it's monetizing,

454
00:21:44.920 --> 00:21:46.880
<v Speaker 5>Hey let me give you some USCC for doing cool

455
00:21:46.920 --> 00:21:49.920
<v Speaker 5>stuff for me, or hey, oh here's an NFT that

456
00:21:49.960 --> 00:21:52.640
<v Speaker 5>I just created for you. Right, So, if you believe

457
00:21:52.640 --> 00:21:54.200
<v Speaker 5>in a world where crypto is going to start to

458
00:21:54.200 --> 00:21:57.519
<v Speaker 5>advance you know, financial systems, and if you believe in

459
00:21:57.559 --> 00:22:00.480
<v Speaker 5>a world where AA agents can start to scale meaningful,

460
00:22:00.519 --> 00:22:05.079
<v Speaker 5>authentic engagements conversations combined two together and your starting, your

461
00:22:05.079 --> 00:22:06.920
<v Speaker 5>head starts to explode a little bit, right in terms

462
00:22:06.920 --> 00:22:08.359
<v Speaker 5>of what's possible. And that's one of the reasons why

463
00:22:08.359 --> 00:22:11.640
<v Speaker 5>I hide, one of the you know, the largest k

464
00:22:11.759 --> 00:22:15.400
<v Speaker 5>pop rep companies in the world, recently announced a partnership

465
00:22:15.440 --> 00:22:18.920
<v Speaker 5>of coin based to exactly that for what it sees

466
00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:21.799
<v Speaker 5>as the future in creator economy right is to really

467
00:22:21.880 --> 00:22:24.759
<v Speaker 5>leverage AI agents and crypto and blockchain to be able

468
00:22:24.759 --> 00:22:26.279
<v Speaker 5>to create and reinvent the.

469
00:22:26.279 --> 00:22:28.920
<v Speaker 3>Creator economy in a much more meaningful way that.

470
00:22:28.960 --> 00:22:31.519
<v Speaker 5>Allows you know, up and coming creators and creators that

471
00:22:31.559 --> 00:22:34.160
<v Speaker 5>don't have millions of viewers to be able to do

472
00:22:34.400 --> 00:22:37.960
<v Speaker 5>very effective things using both AI and crypto as on.

473
00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:38.680
<v Speaker 3>Your tech stack.

474
00:22:40.039 --> 00:22:42.839
<v Speaker 2>Wow, that's amazing. I love that you guys have formed

475
00:22:42.880 --> 00:22:45.880
<v Speaker 2>that partnership. And I know the create economy is growing,

476
00:22:45.960 --> 00:22:51.759
<v Speaker 2>its media is becoming decentualized. You know, obviously money and

477
00:22:51.799 --> 00:22:54.079
<v Speaker 2>movement of value and so forth to become more decentralized.

478
00:22:54.079 --> 00:22:57.039
<v Speaker 2>So it's fascinating. It's a brave new world we're headed to.

479
00:22:57.759 --> 00:22:58.480
<v Speaker 3>We should do an.

480
00:22:58.400 --> 00:23:02.359
<v Speaker 5>AI version of you and multiple of these interviews at

481
00:23:02.400 --> 00:23:05.200
<v Speaker 5>the same time in a meaningful way with these same reactions.

482
00:23:05.200 --> 00:23:10.160
<v Speaker 5>And I'm joking, but that's exactly the vision that companies

483
00:23:10.200 --> 00:23:14.000
<v Speaker 5>like High have, right is, is how do we take

484
00:23:14.200 --> 00:23:16.960
<v Speaker 5>what we know about the artists and creators that represent

485
00:23:17.480 --> 00:23:19.880
<v Speaker 5>and start to let them engage with their audiences in

486
00:23:19.920 --> 00:23:24.119
<v Speaker 5>a much more meaningful and prolific way whilst not having

487
00:23:24.160 --> 00:23:25.759
<v Speaker 5>to stay up, you know, one hundred hours a week or

488
00:23:25.799 --> 00:23:28.240
<v Speaker 5>twenty every single tweet out there and not being classified

489
00:23:28.240 --> 00:23:31.079
<v Speaker 5>as just a bought right so and then making those

490
00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:34.039
<v Speaker 5>real with crypto transactions and its teasers and see what

491
00:23:34.079 --> 00:23:35.880
<v Speaker 5>have you. That's what we're really excited about.

492
00:23:36.279 --> 00:23:36.720
<v Speaker 3>Hmm.

493
00:23:37.359 --> 00:23:39.680
<v Speaker 2>Something I was thinking about before, you know, we had

494
00:23:39.720 --> 00:23:43.039
<v Speaker 2>this conversation and this.

495
00:23:44.319 --> 00:23:45.079
<v Speaker 4>New idea.

496
00:23:45.799 --> 00:23:49.039
<v Speaker 2>Uh, it seems like it could help bring back balance

497
00:23:49.240 --> 00:23:51.960
<v Speaker 2>in a sense of there's people concerned about AI taking

498
00:23:51.960 --> 00:23:55.880
<v Speaker 2>their jobs. And look, automation has happened throughout history, renew technology, right.

499
00:23:56.079 --> 00:23:57.920
<v Speaker 4>And yes it does create new jobs.

500
00:23:58.240 --> 00:24:02.599
<v Speaker 2>But AI this this technology doesn't sleep, It continues to learn,

501
00:24:02.640 --> 00:24:04.799
<v Speaker 2>and so far some people are concerned some jobs are

502
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:08.319
<v Speaker 2>going to become obsolete. However, as an individual, if I

503
00:24:08.319 --> 00:24:12.160
<v Speaker 2>can take my knowledge and skill set and create an

504
00:24:12.200 --> 00:24:16.279
<v Speaker 2>AI agent that can help me earn, so do you

505
00:24:16.319 --> 00:24:18.599
<v Speaker 2>see the potential of this bringing a bit of balance

506
00:24:18.920 --> 00:24:20.319
<v Speaker 2>back to the scale here?

507
00:24:21.359 --> 00:24:22.720
<v Speaker 3>I think the answer is yes.

508
00:24:23.640 --> 00:24:27.640
<v Speaker 5>You know, I think for every menial or routine or

509
00:24:27.960 --> 00:24:32.440
<v Speaker 5>you know, dangerous task that humans have to do, you know,

510
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:34.559
<v Speaker 5>being able to have an AI agent do that, I

511
00:24:34.559 --> 00:24:36.799
<v Speaker 5>think will start to create new problems that humans are

512
00:24:36.839 --> 00:24:40.839
<v Speaker 5>probably better stared to solve. So it's still early, and

513
00:24:41.000 --> 00:24:42.839
<v Speaker 5>you know, I think there's a lot to still learn

514
00:24:42.880 --> 00:24:45.559
<v Speaker 5>and still experience. But you know what we're seeing here

515
00:24:45.680 --> 00:24:47.960
<v Speaker 5>is for every job that gets displaced, I think there's

516
00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:50.160
<v Speaker 5>going to be even more jobs that get created as

517
00:24:50.160 --> 00:24:52.839
<v Speaker 5>a result of this reinvention and how things get done.

518
00:24:53.000 --> 00:24:56.279
<v Speaker 5>There's also the element of AI is creating jobs just

519
00:24:56.319 --> 00:24:59.000
<v Speaker 5>by being more efficient PAYMN, which is a company that

520
00:24:59.039 --> 00:25:03.039
<v Speaker 5>we work with is an AI human platform that allows

521
00:25:03.119 --> 00:25:06.519
<v Speaker 5>AI agents to pay humans for doing stuff work right, whatever,

522
00:25:06.599 --> 00:25:09.400
<v Speaker 5>whatever that may be. Say you have a park that

523
00:25:09.480 --> 00:25:12.160
<v Speaker 5>needs cleaning after a concert and you're trying to organize

524
00:25:12.359 --> 00:25:14.039
<v Speaker 5>a bunch of people to kind of go and get there.

525
00:25:14.039 --> 00:25:15.559
<v Speaker 5>You can either have a human do that, or maybe

526
00:25:15.559 --> 00:25:18.240
<v Speaker 5>there's an AI agent that excels at doing exactly that

527
00:25:18.759 --> 00:25:21.400
<v Speaker 5>and goes out and basically says, hey, like, I'm an

528
00:25:21.400 --> 00:25:24.440
<v Speaker 5>AI agent, and if you pay me ten thousand dollars,

529
00:25:24.440 --> 00:25:26.599
<v Speaker 5>I'll go find a lot of people on my own

530
00:25:26.920 --> 00:25:29.799
<v Speaker 5>and pay them to go do this task right. So

531
00:25:29.960 --> 00:25:32.759
<v Speaker 5>I think in worlds like you know, where where there's

532
00:25:32.799 --> 00:25:34.640
<v Speaker 5>where there's still needs to be humans to gets have done,

533
00:25:34.680 --> 00:25:37.480
<v Speaker 5>I think there absolutely will be agents will be much

534
00:25:37.480 --> 00:25:40.079
<v Speaker 5>more efficient at creating or at least organizing and presenting

535
00:25:40.160 --> 00:25:42.759
<v Speaker 5>jobs that are right people in a much more fluid

536
00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:45.440
<v Speaker 5>and immediate way that I think it's going to be

537
00:25:45.440 --> 00:25:46.799
<v Speaker 5>actually a really good catalyst.

538
00:25:46.799 --> 00:25:48.680
<v Speaker 3>And we've had discussions.

539
00:25:48.039 --> 00:25:51.000
<v Speaker 5>With job boards and you know, kind of these labor

540
00:25:51.000 --> 00:25:54.039
<v Speaker 5>pools that are out there that you know, are very

541
00:25:54.079 --> 00:25:58.480
<v Speaker 5>interested in AI bringing more jobs to these workers, whether

542
00:25:58.480 --> 00:26:01.759
<v Speaker 5>they're gig workers or not. Because AI has a lot

543
00:26:01.799 --> 00:26:05.079
<v Speaker 5>more intelligence and access to where these jobs are and

544
00:26:05.319 --> 00:26:07.960
<v Speaker 5>has a lot more ability to kind of identify where

545
00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:09.559
<v Speaker 5>we pay people for this job just because they have

546
00:26:09.559 --> 00:26:13.240
<v Speaker 5>more information at their disposal, and as.

547
00:26:13.079 --> 00:26:15.720
<v Speaker 2>You're saying that, I'm thinking of it also opens up

548
00:26:15.720 --> 00:26:18.880
<v Speaker 2>our broader reach because let's say I'm in New Jersey

549
00:26:19.200 --> 00:26:22.319
<v Speaker 2>and my job is local, right, it's central to where

550
00:26:22.359 --> 00:26:25.359
<v Speaker 2>I live. But if I have certain knowledge and skills

551
00:26:25.400 --> 00:26:28.680
<v Speaker 2>gets skill sets, it opens me up nationwide even globally

552
00:26:29.240 --> 00:26:31.880
<v Speaker 2>to people who have a need based on what I

553
00:26:31.920 --> 00:26:32.400
<v Speaker 2>can offer.

554
00:26:33.200 --> 00:26:36.240
<v Speaker 3>We built a demo app at.

555
00:26:37.720 --> 00:26:43.759
<v Speaker 5>CDP, SDK, dot x y Z that shows what an

556
00:26:43.799 --> 00:26:47.240
<v Speaker 5>AI agent can do for training an mL model.

557
00:26:47.720 --> 00:26:47.920
<v Speaker 3>Right.

558
00:26:48.039 --> 00:26:51.160
<v Speaker 5>So basically an agent can present hey, like, which of

559
00:26:51.200 --> 00:26:54.920
<v Speaker 5>these is a dog? Right, and then you can basically

560
00:26:54.960 --> 00:26:57.559
<v Speaker 5>find people on Twitter, have them present it, and then

561
00:26:57.759 --> 00:26:59.960
<v Speaker 5>we're answering us series of questions just immediately payment.

562
00:26:59.759 --> 00:27:00.319
<v Speaker 1>For the work.

563
00:27:00.400 --> 00:27:00.599
<v Speaker 2>Right.

564
00:27:00.839 --> 00:27:03.240
<v Speaker 5>So to your point earlier, Yeah, I mean this is

565
00:27:03.440 --> 00:27:04.839
<v Speaker 5>I think aagents are going to create a lot of

566
00:27:04.839 --> 00:27:07.039
<v Speaker 5>opportunities or humans they're going to step in, or at

567
00:27:07.079 --> 00:27:08.960
<v Speaker 5>least they're going to ask humans to get stuff done,

568
00:27:09.319 --> 00:27:11.160
<v Speaker 5>and it's going to create a whole new demand for

569
00:27:11.200 --> 00:27:13.400
<v Speaker 5>services that I don't think we've seen before at this

570
00:27:13.480 --> 00:27:14.880
<v Speaker 5>scale and at this efficiency.

571
00:27:15.680 --> 00:27:16.960
<v Speaker 1>And I think a big part of this is that

572
00:27:17.200 --> 00:27:20.119
<v Speaker 1>crypto is just making the world smaller. Yeah, so I

573
00:27:20.119 --> 00:27:22.880
<v Speaker 1>think there's a world where, like it feels quaint now,

574
00:27:22.920 --> 00:27:25.640
<v Speaker 1>but fifteen years ago, the financial market was only open

575
00:27:25.680 --> 00:27:28.839
<v Speaker 1>from X time to why time, and it was set

576
00:27:28.880 --> 00:27:32.960
<v Speaker 1>based on certain national jurisdictions. There's a version where like

577
00:27:33.000 --> 00:27:36.200
<v Speaker 1>crypto is global, anyone can access to the blockchain is global,

578
00:27:36.440 --> 00:27:39.000
<v Speaker 1>and they can interact with anyone in the world. I

579
00:27:39.000 --> 00:27:41.599
<v Speaker 1>think that is absolutely making the world a smaller place

580
00:27:41.640 --> 00:27:44.319
<v Speaker 1>than what existed before. And again, the Internet was already

581
00:27:44.359 --> 00:27:46.759
<v Speaker 1>doing that, and you add crypto into that element, you

582
00:27:46.799 --> 00:27:48.680
<v Speaker 1>add AI in to that element, and that's making this

583
00:27:48.759 --> 00:27:51.079
<v Speaker 1>even smaller. I said, this is someone from New Jersey,

584
00:27:51.440 --> 00:27:53.160
<v Speaker 1>you know, who is like you get to interact with

585
00:27:53.200 --> 00:27:56.839
<v Speaker 1>anyone in the world. That's just a pretty powerful thing today.

586
00:27:57.720 --> 00:28:01.599
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, it's so fascinating and it opens up these secondary

587
00:28:01.680 --> 00:28:06.839
<v Speaker 2>tertiary markets and so many opportunities to earn and crypto

588
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:08.799
<v Speaker 2>is a big part of it because you can at

589
00:28:08.880 --> 00:28:11.240
<v Speaker 2>least trust right, you know, and there's no delays, is

590
00:28:11.319 --> 00:28:16.039
<v Speaker 2>instant settlement, all these things so it's fascinating now speaking

591
00:28:16.200 --> 00:28:20.240
<v Speaker 2>of earning it maybe early the answer this question, but

592
00:28:20.759 --> 00:28:24.000
<v Speaker 2>my AI agent or my multiple AI agents earned five

593
00:28:24.079 --> 00:28:29.119
<v Speaker 2>thousand dollars in the month of November. Tax implications, I'm

594
00:28:29.160 --> 00:28:30.440
<v Speaker 2>sure the IRS has not come.

595
00:28:30.279 --> 00:28:32.640
<v Speaker 4>Out anything as yet. What are you guys thinking about that?

596
00:28:33.960 --> 00:28:36.240
<v Speaker 1>I think that we're very early in the stage for this,

597
00:28:36.440 --> 00:28:39.079
<v Speaker 1>so can I can't speak to tax advice for this.

598
00:28:39.200 --> 00:28:41.920
<v Speaker 1>I think I think it reminds me a lot of Crypto,

599
00:28:41.960 --> 00:28:45.079
<v Speaker 1>where like there's no rules early on for like how

600
00:28:45.720 --> 00:28:48.640
<v Speaker 1>tax obligations and defied pools and other things would work,

601
00:28:49.039 --> 00:28:50.599
<v Speaker 1>and that's something that we have to go figure out

602
00:28:50.599 --> 00:28:53.680
<v Speaker 1>together as a society. Some of the existing rules actually

603
00:28:53.720 --> 00:28:57.240
<v Speaker 1>already worked for it, you know, maybe you're holding that agent,

604
00:28:57.279 --> 00:28:59.400
<v Speaker 1>maybe you're directing that agent, and so maybe the existing

605
00:28:59.480 --> 00:29:02.000
<v Speaker 1>rules are And in other cases we're probably gonna have

606
00:29:02.039 --> 00:29:05.160
<v Speaker 1>to create brand new roles to think about these different cases.

607
00:29:05.160 --> 00:29:08.279
<v Speaker 1>And I think that like I always, like in the

608
00:29:08.319 --> 00:29:10.880
<v Speaker 1>early years of crypto, when like DeFi was first starting,

609
00:29:10.920 --> 00:29:12.960
<v Speaker 1>I always thought about, like, hey, like will we be

610
00:29:13.000 --> 00:29:15.200
<v Speaker 1>able to catch up quick enough to this? And I've

611
00:29:15.240 --> 00:29:18.480
<v Speaker 1>actually been pretty excited about like how how many people

612
00:29:18.519 --> 00:29:20.400
<v Speaker 1>in the world are starting to interact with this, to

613
00:29:20.599 --> 00:29:24.640
<v Speaker 1>use this, and how even governments across the world are

614
00:29:24.640 --> 00:29:27.240
<v Speaker 1>starting to catch up to it thinking about exactly how

615
00:29:27.279 --> 00:29:29.079
<v Speaker 1>to thoughtfully put it into their systems.

616
00:29:29.759 --> 00:29:34.480
<v Speaker 2>M Yeah, it's fascinating. It's like exciting, what's scary at

617
00:29:34.480 --> 00:29:37.799
<v Speaker 2>the same time. Now, in regards to the AI agents, right,

618
00:29:37.920 --> 00:29:41.559
<v Speaker 2>let's say I create something really great and it's doing well.

619
00:29:42.079 --> 00:29:47.319
<v Speaker 2>Can I sell that AI agent in a white label

620
00:29:47.440 --> 00:29:50.119
<v Speaker 2>or something along those lines if that makes sense to

621
00:29:50.240 --> 00:29:51.119
<v Speaker 2>the open market.

622
00:29:52.480 --> 00:29:55.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So I think absolutely there's something to be said

623
00:29:55.440 --> 00:29:58.680
<v Speaker 1>for your training the agent. You're getting it hooked up

624
00:29:58.720 --> 00:30:01.160
<v Speaker 1>with a Twitter account with a following, maybe you're connecting

625
00:30:01.160 --> 00:30:04.039
<v Speaker 1>it to an RC twenty token or some or NFT

626
00:30:04.279 --> 00:30:06.960
<v Speaker 1>or anything else that's on chain, and you're able to

627
00:30:07.000 --> 00:30:09.359
<v Speaker 1>then consider that like one unit and sell it. I

628
00:30:09.359 --> 00:30:11.319
<v Speaker 1>think where it gets a little difficult is, first of all,

629
00:30:11.359 --> 00:30:14.559
<v Speaker 1>we at coinbase and in the crypto industry, like we're

630
00:30:14.599 --> 00:30:17.240
<v Speaker 1>focused on the crypto side of this equation, the on

631
00:30:17.319 --> 00:30:19.559
<v Speaker 1>chain side of this equation. So in the case that

632
00:30:19.640 --> 00:30:23.000
<v Speaker 1>like you're just simply training agent, giving it some prompts

633
00:30:23.640 --> 00:30:26.880
<v Speaker 1>and then educating it, that may be less defensible. But

634
00:30:26.920 --> 00:30:29.480
<v Speaker 1>then when you turn it into a social personality. When

635
00:30:29.480 --> 00:30:33.400
<v Speaker 1>you add on chain assets that it owns, suddenly that's

636
00:30:33.440 --> 00:30:37.400
<v Speaker 1>an entire package that actually cannot be as easily replicated.

637
00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:40.720
<v Speaker 1>So my sense is like there's even more defensibility in

638
00:30:40.839 --> 00:30:43.480
<v Speaker 1>terms of what the creator is creating. They have the

639
00:30:43.519 --> 00:30:45.519
<v Speaker 1>ability to have all those tools together, and the AI

640
00:30:45.599 --> 00:30:49.559
<v Speaker 1>agent only works because it's the AI personality that's tied

641
00:30:49.599 --> 00:30:51.680
<v Speaker 1>to a Twitter handle, it's tied to an nft on

642
00:30:51.759 --> 00:30:55.000
<v Speaker 1>chain or multiple NFTs on chain, and maybe it's a

643
00:30:55.039 --> 00:30:57.680
<v Speaker 1>brand that's tied to it as well. So absolutely that

644
00:30:57.720 --> 00:30:59.240
<v Speaker 1>can be sold and in a lot of ways, that

645
00:30:59.319 --> 00:31:02.400
<v Speaker 1>is a busy business with his own set of assets.

646
00:31:02.839 --> 00:31:04.759
<v Speaker 1>I think that I'd be more skeptical about just the

647
00:31:04.839 --> 00:31:08.160
<v Speaker 1>AI agent with just some learning prompt that maybe that's

648
00:31:08.200 --> 00:31:10.319
<v Speaker 1>the thing at least that's as defensible.

649
00:31:10.480 --> 00:31:12.480
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I mean it could be easily replicated, but I

650
00:31:13.160 --> 00:31:18.759
<v Speaker 5>think the idea of an AI agent marketplace is definitely feasible,

651
00:31:18.799 --> 00:31:21.200
<v Speaker 5>and we're seeing early signs of that. Provided that these

652
00:31:21.240 --> 00:31:24.799
<v Speaker 5>agents either it took a very long time to create

653
00:31:24.839 --> 00:31:28.160
<v Speaker 5>and it's really hard to replicate, or has the ability

654
00:31:28.200 --> 00:31:30.880
<v Speaker 5>to do things or access data that nobody else has, right,

655
00:31:31.400 --> 00:31:32.440
<v Speaker 5>I think we'll see it first.

656
00:31:32.440 --> 00:31:33.359
<v Speaker 3>In generative art.

657
00:31:33.319 --> 00:31:36.000
<v Speaker 5>I'm seeing a lot of models I think they call

658
00:31:36.039 --> 00:31:40.039
<v Speaker 5>the checkpoint models or law models, where they've been trained

659
00:31:40.079 --> 00:31:41.680
<v Speaker 5>to do something very very well.

660
00:31:41.759 --> 00:31:41.960
<v Speaker 3>Right.

661
00:31:42.240 --> 00:31:45.039
<v Speaker 5>I can generate food really really well. I can generate

662
00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:49.039
<v Speaker 5>you know the inside of you know, Tajmohal road very well, right,

663
00:31:49.359 --> 00:31:51.279
<v Speaker 5>whatever that may be, I think I think that's going

664
00:31:51.319 --> 00:31:54.079
<v Speaker 5>to represent the amount of effort that wanted to creating

665
00:31:54.079 --> 00:31:55.000
<v Speaker 5>the agent, and.

666
00:31:54.880 --> 00:31:56.880
<v Speaker 3>I think there's value that can be monetized.

667
00:31:57.160 --> 00:31:59.400
<v Speaker 5>But to Nemil's point, yeah, I mean if they're an

668
00:31:59.440 --> 00:32:02.279
<v Speaker 5>easy or agents that just kind of do things that

669
00:32:02.359 --> 00:32:04.480
<v Speaker 5>chat ept you can do without any other kind of

670
00:32:04.519 --> 00:32:07.240
<v Speaker 5>special sauce to it, I don't think that's going to

671
00:32:07.240 --> 00:32:09.279
<v Speaker 5>be as exciting, and that'll apply be more of like

672
00:32:09.319 --> 00:32:11.480
<v Speaker 5>hey look at me, look at me, and apply be

673
00:32:11.559 --> 00:32:13.160
<v Speaker 5>something to have the kind of bear or buyer whoever

674
00:32:13.200 --> 00:32:16.240
<v Speaker 5>does the marketplace, right. But imagine one that's just trained

675
00:32:16.279 --> 00:32:19.240
<v Speaker 5>on a skill set that's like really really cool. I

676
00:32:19.240 --> 00:32:21.720
<v Speaker 5>think you know there's an opportunity for to monetize that

677
00:32:21.799 --> 00:32:22.200
<v Speaker 5>as well.

678
00:32:23.400 --> 00:32:24.440
<v Speaker 4>Let's talk security.

679
00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:27.640
<v Speaker 2>So you create the AI agent, you got the API

680
00:32:27.799 --> 00:32:33.640
<v Speaker 2>into the NPC NPC wallet, what securities layers there aside

681
00:32:33.640 --> 00:32:36.559
<v Speaker 2>from the seed phrases and so forth, because I don't

682
00:32:36.599 --> 00:32:37.720
<v Speaker 2>know if hackers.

683
00:32:37.359 --> 00:32:38.960
<v Speaker 4>Are going to use AI to hack AI.

684
00:32:39.160 --> 00:32:41.799
<v Speaker 2>Right, this is like there's a whole new world, whole

685
00:32:42.039 --> 00:32:43.920
<v Speaker 2>can of worms that is opening up here. What are

686
00:32:43.920 --> 00:32:45.839
<v Speaker 2>you guys doing from a security standpoint?

687
00:32:46.039 --> 00:32:48.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I think you've chucked in the past to

688
00:32:48.160 --> 00:32:51.880
<v Speaker 1>Philip Pardon are like head of security, and so we're

689
00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:55.839
<v Speaker 1>based on the same finacial security promises, a coinbases like

690
00:32:55.960 --> 00:32:59.480
<v Speaker 1>security infrastructure. And when I think the key thing I

691
00:32:59.559 --> 00:33:01.359
<v Speaker 1>call out is is that we have two versions of

692
00:33:01.400 --> 00:33:04.160
<v Speaker 1>our mpaz wots today. One version is where you have

693
00:33:04.160 --> 00:33:06.400
<v Speaker 1>a single one on one key and that's very similar

694
00:33:06.400 --> 00:33:08.799
<v Speaker 1>to the seed phrase that you mentioned. It's a seed phrase.

695
00:33:09.240 --> 00:33:11.960
<v Speaker 1>If it's lost, anyone can access that wallet and they

696
00:33:12.000 --> 00:33:14.640
<v Speaker 1>can take the funds. But there's also the two of

697
00:33:14.720 --> 00:33:17.680
<v Speaker 1>two model, which is not one single seed phrase. There

698
00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:19.720
<v Speaker 1>are two parties that both have to be able to

699
00:33:19.759 --> 00:33:22.599
<v Speaker 1>agree together at the same moment in time, and if

700
00:33:22.640 --> 00:33:25.319
<v Speaker 1>they do that, then those funds can be transferred, you

701
00:33:25.359 --> 00:33:28.279
<v Speaker 1>can do an on chain action, et cetera. So we

702
00:33:28.559 --> 00:33:30.680
<v Speaker 1>two of two model is what we recommend, especially if

703
00:33:30.680 --> 00:33:33.640
<v Speaker 1>they're real funds on your assets and it still means

704
00:33:33.640 --> 00:33:37.319
<v Speaker 1>you do have to critically secure your part of the shard.

705
00:33:38.279 --> 00:33:40.319
<v Speaker 1>If you lose that, you lose the key that you

706
00:33:40.400 --> 00:33:44.119
<v Speaker 1>use access coinbasapis. That absolutely means the funds can be

707
00:33:44.119 --> 00:33:46.359
<v Speaker 1>at risk, But the idea is that it's not the

708
00:33:46.359 --> 00:33:48.599
<v Speaker 1>same as having a single seed phrase that anyone can

709
00:33:48.640 --> 00:33:52.119
<v Speaker 1>go attack and simply be able to move funds around.

710
00:33:52.200 --> 00:33:53.799
<v Speaker 1>So what I would say is that we're in the

711
00:33:53.839 --> 00:33:57.119
<v Speaker 1>early months or weeks of these trend of AI really

712
00:33:57.119 --> 00:34:00.000
<v Speaker 1>connecting deeply into crypto, that I think that the secure

713
00:34:00.079 --> 00:34:01.480
<v Speaker 1>he's going to get better and better, and that's one

714
00:34:01.480 --> 00:34:03.359
<v Speaker 1>thing that we're working on is to have more and

715
00:34:03.440 --> 00:34:06.519
<v Speaker 1>more complex forms of security so that if you have

716
00:34:06.640 --> 00:34:09.440
<v Speaker 1>large amounts of funds here, you can get higher and

717
00:34:09.519 --> 00:34:12.760
<v Speaker 1>higher guarantees in terms of what the security options that

718
00:34:12.840 --> 00:34:14.000
<v Speaker 1>you have available to you are.

719
00:34:14.280 --> 00:34:16.360
<v Speaker 5>You know, Tony and I recently had a conversation with

720
00:34:16.440 --> 00:34:21.599
<v Speaker 5>a AI chat bot on exactly this topic. And one

721
00:34:21.639 --> 00:34:23.960
<v Speaker 5>of the things that a lot of developers that we

722
00:34:24.000 --> 00:34:27.840
<v Speaker 5>work with are scared of is, you know, these wallets

723
00:34:27.880 --> 00:34:32.159
<v Speaker 5>just can't be traditional EOA wallets because AI can potentially

724
00:34:32.159 --> 00:34:33.119
<v Speaker 5>outscore human beings.

725
00:34:34.000 --> 00:34:34.719
<v Speaker 3>That's what we call them.

726
00:34:34.760 --> 00:34:37.760
<v Speaker 5>NPC wallets, at least the ones that we're using. These

727
00:34:37.800 --> 00:34:40.679
<v Speaker 5>wallets can't be a traditional EOA wallets that you know

728
00:34:41.119 --> 00:34:43.239
<v Speaker 5>you've seen in the past, and they have to have

729
00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:46.719
<v Speaker 5>a higher degree of sophistication. And if you in fact

730
00:34:46.880 --> 00:34:49.920
<v Speaker 5>ask any kind of GPT bought or chat chat bot,

731
00:34:50.480 --> 00:34:53.599
<v Speaker 5>it'll actually say, you know, it recommends multi party competition

732
00:34:54.119 --> 00:34:58.519
<v Speaker 5>as a way to enhance security for AAI agents to

733
00:34:58.559 --> 00:35:02.239
<v Speaker 5>have wallets that they can control. So look really early here,

734
00:35:02.280 --> 00:35:04.159
<v Speaker 5>but I think the signals are according to the fact

735
00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:06.320
<v Speaker 5>that security in fact has to be a lot more advanced.

736
00:35:06.760 --> 00:35:08.199
<v Speaker 5>I mean, that's one of the reasons why we're leaning

737
00:35:08.199 --> 00:35:09.480
<v Speaker 5>in so much into NBC.

738
00:35:10.119 --> 00:35:10.800
<v Speaker 3>We're good at it.

739
00:35:11.480 --> 00:35:14.199
<v Speaker 5>We believe that it represents one of the high stoves

740
00:35:14.199 --> 00:35:17.320
<v Speaker 5>of security, especially for AI agents, and it really does

741
00:35:17.880 --> 00:35:20.760
<v Speaker 5>give developers who are serious about the space the confidence

742
00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:23.960
<v Speaker 5>leaning heavily without worrying about a single point of failure

743
00:35:24.119 --> 00:35:26.519
<v Speaker 5>when it comes to traditional walls that you typically.

744
00:35:26.239 --> 00:35:31.400
<v Speaker 2>Seem excuse my ignorance on this, these are new questions

745
00:35:31.400 --> 00:35:35.639
<v Speaker 2>I'm asking you guys because I'm really curious about it. So, so,

746
00:35:35.760 --> 00:35:38.920
<v Speaker 2>the wallet all good, but can the AI agent be

747
00:35:39.000 --> 00:35:42.239
<v Speaker 2>attacked itself? And once again, may be too early, and

748
00:35:42.280 --> 00:35:44.480
<v Speaker 2>I may be thinking too much Star Wars or I

749
00:35:44.639 --> 00:35:48.239
<v Speaker 2>Robot or something, right, But I'm just curious that can

750
00:35:48.280 --> 00:35:51.880
<v Speaker 2>someone use the AI to attack the agent itself and

751
00:35:51.920 --> 00:35:52.480
<v Speaker 2>shut it down.

752
00:35:53.639 --> 00:35:56.519
<v Speaker 1>So we use open AI in terms of the base

753
00:35:56.559 --> 00:35:58.760
<v Speaker 1>agent that I talked about, we use open high behind

754
00:35:58.760 --> 00:36:02.000
<v Speaker 1>the scenes, and so that's directly what you're interacting with.

755
00:36:03.000 --> 00:36:05.480
<v Speaker 1>I think now I'm starting to speculate, and I think

756
00:36:05.480 --> 00:36:07.840
<v Speaker 1>there are examples where you can talk to the agent,

757
00:36:09.079 --> 00:36:12.360
<v Speaker 1>like convince them of something and have them, you know,

758
00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:15.039
<v Speaker 1>react in a different way than maybe the creator was

759
00:36:15.440 --> 00:36:18.880
<v Speaker 1>intending to. And absolutely that is a possibility of how

760
00:36:18.920 --> 00:36:21.440
<v Speaker 1>you can do it. I'm not an expert in terms

761
00:36:21.440 --> 00:36:23.840
<v Speaker 1>of like how the AI systems are built themselves, and

762
00:36:23.880 --> 00:36:25.559
<v Speaker 1>so I can't speak to directly like you know, what

763
00:36:25.679 --> 00:36:27.599
<v Speaker 1>types of things you can do beyond that, But it

764
00:36:27.639 --> 00:36:30.000
<v Speaker 1>feels very obvious that you could tweet at them, like

765
00:36:30.039 --> 00:36:31.800
<v Speaker 1>you've already seen this on Twitter, where there are examples

766
00:36:31.840 --> 00:36:35.480
<v Speaker 1>of people saying, hey, like send funds to this address, right,

767
00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:38.639
<v Speaker 1>and if the AI respects that, even though the creator

768
00:36:38.679 --> 00:36:41.519
<v Speaker 1>may not have wanted them to, but they didn't program

769
00:36:41.559 --> 00:36:43.519
<v Speaker 1>it in that way, I could absolutely see that happening,

770
00:36:43.880 --> 00:36:46.400
<v Speaker 1>And I would just say is that like this is

771
00:36:46.480 --> 00:36:50.360
<v Speaker 1>like we're seeing an industry and its infancy, like literally

772
00:36:50.400 --> 00:36:52.920
<v Speaker 1>in the first walks that are happening. And so my

773
00:36:53.039 --> 00:36:55.519
<v Speaker 1>sense is we're gonna see some pretty big hacks in

774
00:36:55.559 --> 00:36:58.760
<v Speaker 1>the early months and weeks, and then slowly people are

775
00:36:58.760 --> 00:37:00.960
<v Speaker 1>gonna learn and they're gonna hard in these They're going

776
00:37:01.039 --> 00:37:02.639
<v Speaker 1>to make them more powerful, and we're going to figure

777
00:37:02.639 --> 00:37:05.280
<v Speaker 1>out what are the really big and killer use cases

778
00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:07.480
<v Speaker 1>of this at this stage. And then as the AI

779
00:37:07.559 --> 00:37:10.280
<v Speaker 1>gets even better and better, and as the blockchain gets

780
00:37:10.440 --> 00:37:14.000
<v Speaker 1>at lower costs, more performance, more people in the world

781
00:37:14.039 --> 00:37:16.400
<v Speaker 1>have wallets, You're just going to see the amount of

782
00:37:16.480 --> 00:37:19.880
<v Speaker 1>like types of use cases here just change and probably

783
00:37:19.880 --> 00:37:21.199
<v Speaker 1>get more and more sophisticated.

784
00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:24.320
<v Speaker 4>Yeah. Absolutely, And I definitely agree with you there in the.

785
00:37:24.320 --> 00:37:28.559
<v Speaker 2>Baby face crawling not not walking yet right, we let

786
00:37:28.559 --> 00:37:33.920
<v Speaker 2>alone running. Now, you guys mentioned the creator economy and

787
00:37:34.400 --> 00:37:38.800
<v Speaker 2>developers as well. Are there any other industries you're noodling about,

788
00:37:39.199 --> 00:37:41.239
<v Speaker 2>you know, in regards that you might start approaching them

789
00:37:41.280 --> 00:37:43.719
<v Speaker 2>and saying, hey, check this out, this can help automate

790
00:37:43.800 --> 00:37:46.599
<v Speaker 2>some things, open up revenue sources for you and so forth.

791
00:37:48.000 --> 00:37:49.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Dan, do you want.

792
00:37:49.440 --> 00:37:49.599
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

793
00:37:49.599 --> 00:37:56.639
<v Speaker 5>I mean, look, we're we're good at training our core business.

794
00:37:57.079 --> 00:38:00.679
<v Speaker 5>So we're seeing a lot in terms of advanced streaming strategies,

795
00:38:00.960 --> 00:38:05.559
<v Speaker 5>cross chaine straining strategy, trading strategies, liquidation warnings, you know,

796
00:38:05.599 --> 00:38:08.920
<v Speaker 5>all the things that humans typically mess up or don't

797
00:38:08.960 --> 00:38:09.679
<v Speaker 5>want to encounter.

798
00:38:10.159 --> 00:38:11.320
<v Speaker 3>I think we're seeing a lot.

799
00:38:11.639 --> 00:38:13.599
<v Speaker 5>You might call them DeFi but you know, I think

800
00:38:13.639 --> 00:38:15.440
<v Speaker 5>it goes beyond defile when you start to build on

801
00:38:15.519 --> 00:38:18.320
<v Speaker 5>channel ops chain. So I think trading is another really

802
00:38:18.320 --> 00:38:21.480
<v Speaker 5>good example. Obviously the creator example that we mentioned earlier,

803
00:38:21.639 --> 00:38:23.880
<v Speaker 5>which is great, but you know, I think we should

804
00:38:23.960 --> 00:38:26.360
<v Speaker 5>understondate kind of the current places where a lot of

805
00:38:26.400 --> 00:38:29.920
<v Speaker 5>AI agents are going to use. Example, customer service, you know,

806
00:38:30.039 --> 00:38:32.000
<v Speaker 5>something that we've been talking about for a while, but

807
00:38:32.519 --> 00:38:36.039
<v Speaker 5>imagine customer service and crypto together, right where it's more

808
00:38:36.079 --> 00:38:38.800
<v Speaker 5>than just being able to understand your problem, but maybe

809
00:38:38.800 --> 00:38:41.840
<v Speaker 5>it's also going to be good at solving them because

810
00:38:41.840 --> 00:38:44.519
<v Speaker 5>of its ability to interconnect very complex systems a very

811
00:38:44.519 --> 00:38:47.480
<v Speaker 5>different complex data sets. And I started to reason right,

812
00:38:47.519 --> 00:38:49.440
<v Speaker 5>which is which is a recent development in.

813
00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:52.960
<v Speaker 3>The AI world. Right, So you know, I'm not.

814
00:38:52.960 --> 00:38:54.760
<v Speaker 5>Going to sit here and try to speculate all the

815
00:38:54.840 --> 00:38:57.239
<v Speaker 5>like amazing things that because it kind of gets scary

816
00:38:57.280 --> 00:38:58.960
<v Speaker 5>at some point, and I think we're getting close to

817
00:38:58.960 --> 00:39:02.960
<v Speaker 5>the skynet terminators kind of. But I think the fact

818
00:39:03.000 --> 00:39:06.840
<v Speaker 5>that there are immediate use cases in trading in you know,

819
00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:11.280
<v Speaker 5>creator economy, uh and you know, even even service and support.

820
00:39:11.719 --> 00:39:14.119
<v Speaker 5>I mean those are probably one of the biggest drivers

821
00:39:14.119 --> 00:39:18.480
<v Speaker 5>of costs that companies incurred today. And that's another benefit

822
00:39:18.519 --> 00:39:20.599
<v Speaker 5>I think AAI agents will bring to the table is

823
00:39:20.639 --> 00:39:21.880
<v Speaker 5>being able to do a lot more.

824
00:39:21.719 --> 00:39:22.440
<v Speaker 3>For a lot less.

825
00:39:23.000 --> 00:39:23.280
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

826
00:39:23.320 --> 00:39:27.280
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, Yeah, And I know, once again some of these

827
00:39:27.360 --> 00:39:31.199
<v Speaker 2>questions were so early, and but I'm just fascinated to

828
00:39:31.239 --> 00:39:31.800
<v Speaker 2>throw it out there.

829
00:39:31.840 --> 00:39:33.079
<v Speaker 4>See what I can get from you guys.

830
00:39:35.119 --> 00:39:39.320
<v Speaker 2>Are their plans as things progress to open up to

831
00:39:39.360 --> 00:39:45.159
<v Speaker 2>other AI companies, So let's say Google's grock on Twitter,

832
00:39:45.199 --> 00:39:45.800
<v Speaker 2>whatever it may be.

833
00:39:46.880 --> 00:39:48.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So there's a ton of different things that we're doing.

834
00:39:48.760 --> 00:39:50.199
<v Speaker 1>So maybe I'll take you through a few of those.

835
00:39:50.199 --> 00:39:52.559
<v Speaker 1>One is absolutely we want to work with all farms

836
00:39:52.559 --> 00:39:55.840
<v Speaker 1>of air that are out there, not just this open

837
00:39:55.880 --> 00:39:58.280
<v Speaker 1>AI alone, and so we're really excited about that. So

838
00:39:58.559 --> 00:40:01.800
<v Speaker 1>stay tuned. We have done con coming up in Bangkok

839
00:40:01.840 --> 00:40:03.159
<v Speaker 1>next week, and so we have a bunch of different

840
00:40:03.159 --> 00:40:05.440
<v Speaker 1>announcements coming in there. There are other sets of things

841
00:40:05.480 --> 00:40:06.920
<v Speaker 1>that we want to do is do more and more

842
00:40:06.960 --> 00:40:10.960
<v Speaker 1>on chain interactions for these AI agents. So today you

843
00:40:10.960 --> 00:40:14.159
<v Speaker 1>can use our APIs and you can call all on

844
00:40:14.280 --> 00:40:17.159
<v Speaker 1>chain calls, but you have to know what you're asking for.

845
00:40:17.559 --> 00:40:20.559
<v Speaker 1>In a future world, for example, instead of having to

846
00:40:20.599 --> 00:40:22.760
<v Speaker 1>know that you have to call the dot transfer call

847
00:40:23.360 --> 00:40:27.239
<v Speaker 1>on an r C twenty contract, the ideal thing in

848
00:40:27.239 --> 00:40:28.639
<v Speaker 1>our API is is to just have that as a

849
00:40:28.639 --> 00:40:30.920
<v Speaker 1>first class function. I want to do a transfer, I

850
00:40:30.920 --> 00:40:33.280
<v Speaker 1>want to do a trade, I want to do a borrow,

851
00:40:33.400 --> 00:40:34.960
<v Speaker 1>I want to do a lend. All of these are

852
00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:37.360
<v Speaker 1>just first class functions in our API, and so that

853
00:40:37.360 --> 00:40:39.440
<v Speaker 1>way the AI looks at that, it can read through

854
00:40:39.519 --> 00:40:41.639
<v Speaker 1>all the different menu options that it has and it

855
00:40:41.679 --> 00:40:44.480
<v Speaker 1>goes to town in terms of deciding how that comes together.

856
00:40:44.840 --> 00:40:46.719
<v Speaker 1>So that's another thing that we're working on is we're

857
00:40:46.800 --> 00:40:49.960
<v Speaker 1>unlocking basically more and more forms of these on chain actions.

858
00:40:50.159 --> 00:40:52.280
<v Speaker 1>We have a fuel already, right, we have NFT minting,

859
00:40:52.559 --> 00:40:55.920
<v Speaker 1>we have EC minting, we have transfers, but we want

860
00:40:55.920 --> 00:40:58.559
<v Speaker 1>to add more and more into that set of actions

861
00:40:58.599 --> 00:41:01.039
<v Speaker 1>that they can do that. The other big thing is

862
00:41:01.039 --> 00:41:03.800
<v Speaker 1>just security, is that we have this two of two model.

863
00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:06.239
<v Speaker 1>We want to make more and more complex multi SIGs

864
00:41:06.760 --> 00:41:08.440
<v Speaker 1>so you can do that. We want to do an

865
00:41:08.480 --> 00:41:11.079
<v Speaker 1>option like different options where the AI can have a

866
00:41:11.159 --> 00:41:14.400
<v Speaker 1>human involved and improve everything, but also have examples where

867
00:41:14.400 --> 00:41:16.559
<v Speaker 1>the AI doesn't need to do that. Maybe there's certain

868
00:41:16.599 --> 00:41:19.400
<v Speaker 1>dollar values at which you do want a human involved

869
00:41:19.440 --> 00:41:21.679
<v Speaker 1>to be able to say before it's allowed to transfer.

870
00:41:21.840 --> 00:41:25.559
<v Speaker 1>So it's a world where like the customer is not

871
00:41:25.599 --> 00:41:28.960
<v Speaker 1>an AI agent six months ago or a year ago

872
00:41:29.119 --> 00:41:31.480
<v Speaker 1>for crypto, and now it is. And what are the

873
00:41:31.559 --> 00:41:33.760
<v Speaker 1>use cases and needs that that AI agent has and

874
00:41:33.800 --> 00:41:36.840
<v Speaker 1>how's that distinct from what existed before. That's really what

875
00:41:36.880 --> 00:41:38.199
<v Speaker 1>we're spending our time thinking through.

876
00:41:39.400 --> 00:41:40.000
<v Speaker 4>Absolutely.

877
00:41:40.599 --> 00:41:42.360
<v Speaker 2>You know earlier and I forgot to ask a fall

878
00:41:42.480 --> 00:41:46.719
<v Speaker 2>up question today, you mentioned that the AI agent can

879
00:41:46.760 --> 00:41:48.719
<v Speaker 2>have its own NFTs and tokens.

880
00:41:50.159 --> 00:41:51.039
<v Speaker 4>That fascinates me.

881
00:41:52.280 --> 00:41:54.800
<v Speaker 2>So can it be just simply doing work and getting

882
00:41:54.800 --> 00:41:56.519
<v Speaker 2>paid and it doesn't have to have a token, but

883
00:41:56.639 --> 00:42:00.679
<v Speaker 2>if the person behind it can create those tokens and

884
00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:02.239
<v Speaker 2>do some sort of ecosystem with that.

885
00:42:03.159 --> 00:42:05.599
<v Speaker 1>So there are two things. Is that the agent can

886
00:42:05.639 --> 00:42:08.480
<v Speaker 1>create a token of its own. So if I decided

887
00:42:08.599 --> 00:42:11.519
<v Speaker 1>here's the name I want to name it. Here's the

888
00:42:11.559 --> 00:42:14.039
<v Speaker 1>amount of the supply of the RC twenty token is

889
00:42:14.079 --> 00:42:16.639
<v Speaker 1>an example that I want to launch. It can go

890
00:42:16.679 --> 00:42:19.880
<v Speaker 1>ahead and ask for that token is created on chain

891
00:42:19.960 --> 00:42:21.840
<v Speaker 1>and it has the ability to transfer like then it

892
00:42:21.880 --> 00:42:24.639
<v Speaker 1>has its treasury, has the ability to transfer that, move

893
00:42:24.679 --> 00:42:27.079
<v Speaker 1>that around wherever it wants. And again, the same thing

894
00:42:27.079 --> 00:42:28.920
<v Speaker 1>you can do for an NFT. Let's say you wanted

895
00:42:28.960 --> 00:42:33.639
<v Speaker 1>to create a fandom around something. You create five hundred

896
00:42:33.719 --> 00:42:37.840
<v Speaker 1>variations of a certain token. Again with Jenai and all that,

897
00:42:37.920 --> 00:42:40.239
<v Speaker 1>you can connect that up. You can create five hundred

898
00:42:40.400 --> 00:42:42.639
<v Speaker 1>different images. You can you know, basically say like, hey,

899
00:42:42.679 --> 00:42:45.280
<v Speaker 1>I want a version of CryptoPunks, but I want this theme.

900
00:42:45.599 --> 00:42:46.800
<v Speaker 1>I want you to generate that.

901
00:42:47.039 --> 00:42:47.159
<v Speaker 3>Now.

902
00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:49.280
<v Speaker 1>I want you to turn those into NFTs and have

903
00:42:49.400 --> 00:42:51.519
<v Speaker 1>them and whoever reaches out to you and has the

904
00:42:51.559 --> 00:42:54.760
<v Speaker 1>most you know, wittiest responses in this twenty four hour period,

905
00:42:55.079 --> 00:42:57.239
<v Speaker 1>I want you to give those NFTs out to them

906
00:42:57.559 --> 00:42:58.880
<v Speaker 1>as long as they give you, if they give you

907
00:42:58.920 --> 00:43:01.480
<v Speaker 1>their you know, their on change. All of that is

908
00:43:01.519 --> 00:43:04.639
<v Speaker 1>something now possible. And you know, those are just two

909
00:43:04.719 --> 00:43:07.079
<v Speaker 1>things we do today. But if I compare that to

910
00:43:07.119 --> 00:43:09.760
<v Speaker 1>the menu of things you can do on chain, there

911
00:43:09.800 --> 00:43:13.320
<v Speaker 1>is so much more that's going to be possible, especially

912
00:43:13.360 --> 00:43:16.599
<v Speaker 1>when you bring all those interaction effects among I launched

913
00:43:16.599 --> 00:43:19.320
<v Speaker 1>the UFC twenty or launched the NFT. Now you can

914
00:43:19.360 --> 00:43:21.840
<v Speaker 1>go use it in a game somewhere. You can use

915
00:43:21.880 --> 00:43:23.719
<v Speaker 1>it with a different AI agent where if you have

916
00:43:23.840 --> 00:43:27.400
<v Speaker 1>this NFT you can get access to certain content or

917
00:43:27.480 --> 00:43:29.800
<v Speaker 1>unlock a different personality or any of these things. Again,

918
00:43:29.880 --> 00:43:32.960
<v Speaker 1>I'm speculating on a lot of this, but it's like,

919
00:43:33.280 --> 00:43:35.159
<v Speaker 1>I think we're just scratching the surface of what we

920
00:43:35.199 --> 00:43:38.639
<v Speaker 1>see today. And so I think for builders, this is

921
00:43:38.679 --> 00:43:41.800
<v Speaker 1>why it's so exciting, is that the lego blocks our

922
00:43:41.880 --> 00:43:44.599
<v Speaker 1>start are there, but people are trying to figure out,

923
00:43:44.639 --> 00:43:46.880
<v Speaker 1>like what are the end state of things that people

924
00:43:46.880 --> 00:43:49.079
<v Speaker 1>are going to build with it, And that's why it's exciting.

925
00:43:49.079 --> 00:43:50.920
<v Speaker 1>I think for all of us, it's like we have

926
00:43:51.000 --> 00:43:53.559
<v Speaker 1>some popcorn. It's so exciting to have this front row

927
00:43:53.639 --> 00:43:55.440
<v Speaker 1>seat to what people are doing with it.

928
00:43:55.960 --> 00:43:59.559
<v Speaker 5>An AI agent with an NPC wallet, we'll be able

929
00:43:59.599 --> 00:44:04.719
<v Speaker 5>to do anything a human can do with a wallet, better, faster,

930
00:44:05.440 --> 00:44:06.719
<v Speaker 5>and more complex.

931
00:44:06.960 --> 00:44:07.119
<v Speaker 3>Right.

932
00:44:07.199 --> 00:44:09.599
<v Speaker 5>So that's the kind of analog that I keep in mind,

933
00:44:09.679 --> 00:44:12.360
<v Speaker 5>is a agent should be able to do exactly what I do.

934
00:44:12.400 --> 00:44:13.880
<v Speaker 3>Is I want them into Natah, you can do that.

935
00:44:13.920 --> 00:44:16.320
<v Speaker 5>I want to distribute into the tokens distributionment AAGE, you

936
00:44:16.360 --> 00:44:19.079
<v Speaker 5>can do that, right, So, but do that at scale

937
00:44:19.519 --> 00:44:20.920
<v Speaker 5>and do that instantaneously.

938
00:44:21.039 --> 00:44:21.159
<v Speaker 3>Right.

939
00:44:21.199 --> 00:44:24.239
<v Speaker 5>Imagine Tony, if you know someone's listening to your podcasts

940
00:44:24.239 --> 00:44:26.639
<v Speaker 5>and AIG determines is someone that you kind of want

941
00:44:26.639 --> 00:44:29.559
<v Speaker 5>to retain or like engage with. You know, wouldn't be

942
00:44:29.639 --> 00:44:30.960
<v Speaker 5>cool for the AGE to say, hey, like, thanks for

943
00:44:31.039 --> 00:44:34.480
<v Speaker 5>listening in and here's an NFT for you, and you know,

944
00:44:34.559 --> 00:44:36.679
<v Speaker 5>and this will give you some benefit in the future,

945
00:44:36.760 --> 00:44:38.880
<v Speaker 5>right without you having to like respond to that a

946
00:44:38.920 --> 00:44:41.000
<v Speaker 5>week later after someone comes to you with it, which

947
00:44:41.039 --> 00:44:43.760
<v Speaker 5>is far too late than that in the moment, right that,

948
00:44:44.159 --> 00:44:46.800
<v Speaker 5>I guess the new zero moment of truth, which is

949
00:44:46.840 --> 00:44:49.840
<v Speaker 5>happening like now, right, and then rewarding somebody for that,

950
00:44:50.039 --> 00:44:52.199
<v Speaker 5>at least recognizing someone that for that in a meaningful

951
00:44:52.239 --> 00:44:55.039
<v Speaker 5>way that has value, right, So that just points it's

952
00:44:55.079 --> 00:44:59.039
<v Speaker 5>actually like real like value, you know, digital assets of value, right,

953
00:44:59.039 --> 00:44:59.920
<v Speaker 5>and that's what makes us all.

954
00:44:59.800 --> 00:45:03.239
<v Speaker 2>Exp So Dan, I guess the next step will be

955
00:45:03.400 --> 00:45:04.960
<v Speaker 2>you and I set up a call so we can

956
00:45:05.000 --> 00:45:08.440
<v Speaker 2>create this thing for my wove viewers of listeners so.

957
00:45:08.639 --> 00:45:10.119
<v Speaker 5>I think you got to give me all your raw

958
00:45:10.119 --> 00:45:13.760
<v Speaker 5>footage for for your podcast and your transcripts, and we'll

959
00:45:13.960 --> 00:45:17.480
<v Speaker 5>feed it through and and we'll have Lincoln put something

960
00:45:17.480 --> 00:45:19.599
<v Speaker 5>together and then we'll call it to Tony Edwards bought

961
00:45:19.719 --> 00:45:20.920
<v Speaker 5>or thet.

962
00:45:22.760 --> 00:45:26.199
<v Speaker 2>To that point though, and I think I remember Lincoln

963
00:45:26.199 --> 00:45:29.920
<v Speaker 2>mentioning this. You can plug into the YouTube API or

964
00:45:29.960 --> 00:45:32.239
<v Speaker 2>maybe Facebook API and do this right.

965
00:45:32.480 --> 00:45:33.679
<v Speaker 3>Anywhere there's an a p I.

966
00:45:34.199 --> 00:45:37.239
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Toty, just like, I think it'd be really fun

967
00:45:37.320 --> 00:45:39.760
<v Speaker 1>as part of this podcast even to include a three

968
00:45:39.760 --> 00:45:43.920
<v Speaker 1>minute section of you deploying something, and we're absolutely excited

969
00:45:43.960 --> 00:45:45.880
<v Speaker 1>to help you do that. But it could be all

970
00:45:45.880 --> 00:45:48.760
<v Speaker 1>the transcripts of all your interviews, right and we can

971
00:45:48.840 --> 00:45:51.519
<v Speaker 1>tie that to an on chain n f T which

972
00:45:51.599 --> 00:45:53.440
<v Speaker 1>had to you know, see twenty anything else. But I

973
00:45:53.480 --> 00:45:55.719
<v Speaker 1>think there could be something really powerful there, and that

974
00:45:55.760 --> 00:45:58.000
<v Speaker 1>would be a really fun demo for your for you know,

975
00:45:58.039 --> 00:45:58.920
<v Speaker 1>for the viewers.

976
00:45:59.480 --> 00:46:02.639
<v Speaker 5>Our partner or Hive is investing a lot in using

977
00:46:02.679 --> 00:46:06.440
<v Speaker 5>AI to create voices and images of likeness, right digital twins.

978
00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:09.079
<v Speaker 5>So you know, again, like I think we're already seeing

979
00:46:09.119 --> 00:46:10.599
<v Speaker 5>a generated podcasts.

980
00:46:10.199 --> 00:46:12.519
<v Speaker 3>With like really authentic voices, right O.

981
00:46:12.639 --> 00:46:14.239
<v Speaker 5>You need this kind of video on top of that,

982
00:46:14.360 --> 00:46:16.079
<v Speaker 5>and I mean, who knows there might be a Tony

983
00:46:16.199 --> 00:46:21.199
<v Speaker 5>Edwards AI agent doing multiple interviews a day on specific topics.

984
00:46:21.199 --> 00:46:23.719
<v Speaker 5>And that's something that we see a lot of potential

985
00:46:23.800 --> 00:46:25.760
<v Speaker 5>in it, right, because it's more than just kind of

986
00:46:25.760 --> 00:46:27.960
<v Speaker 5>going out there and pushing out content. It's very engaging

987
00:46:28.440 --> 00:46:31.400
<v Speaker 5>and it's educating and there's so many ways you can

988
00:46:31.440 --> 00:46:33.559
<v Speaker 5>go with this and you can't do that today because

989
00:46:33.639 --> 00:46:36.760
<v Speaker 5>time is the resource that it's very limited for you, right.

990
00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:40.320
<v Speaker 5>This unlocks that right and allows you to do a

991
00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:43.719
<v Speaker 5>lot more with a lot less investment.

992
00:46:43.400 --> 00:46:44.320
<v Speaker 3>Of your time and energy.

993
00:46:44.920 --> 00:46:47.800
<v Speaker 2>Oh, for sure, A question I'm gonna ask. I don't

994
00:46:47.800 --> 00:46:49.800
<v Speaker 2>know if you guys can touch on this because it's

995
00:46:49.840 --> 00:46:52.719
<v Speaker 2>a whole other can of worms and maybe we need

996
00:46:52.719 --> 00:46:55.800
<v Speaker 2>like Paul Growall to come in. But an AI agent

997
00:46:55.840 --> 00:46:59.039
<v Speaker 2>creating a token. We don't have full crypto legislation here

998
00:46:59.039 --> 00:47:01.559
<v Speaker 2>in the United States. The s S you could say, hey,

999
00:47:01.599 --> 00:47:03.679
<v Speaker 2>that's a security. I don't know if they will or

1000
00:47:04.079 --> 00:47:07.199
<v Speaker 2>you know, it's too early, but is that a concern?

1001
00:47:09.599 --> 00:47:14.800
<v Speaker 5>Election is only a few days away, right? But look,

1002
00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:17.880
<v Speaker 5>I mean, what do you think I don't think we

1003
00:47:18.000 --> 00:47:18.840
<v Speaker 5>know that details?

1004
00:47:18.840 --> 00:47:21.400
<v Speaker 1>What I would say, is that like in general, there's

1005
00:47:21.440 --> 00:47:24.400
<v Speaker 1>been uh, there's been a lot of like mean coins,

1006
00:47:24.480 --> 00:47:26.519
<v Speaker 1>and that's an example where like, I think that feels

1007
00:47:26.719 --> 00:47:28.639
<v Speaker 1>qualitially is different than other things. But I am not

1008
00:47:28.719 --> 00:47:31.679
<v Speaker 1>a lawyer, and we definitely want to know have those

1009
00:47:31.719 --> 00:47:33.719
<v Speaker 1>folks in the room to be able to uppine. I

1010
00:47:33.719 --> 00:47:35.559
<v Speaker 1>think what I just say about this election is like,

1011
00:47:35.559 --> 00:47:38.039
<v Speaker 1>we're excited that there there're folks on both sides of

1012
00:47:38.039 --> 00:47:41.199
<v Speaker 1>the aisle that care about crypto, and we think that

1013
00:47:41.239 --> 00:47:44.199
<v Speaker 1>we have to balance obviously, you know, consumer rights, and

1014
00:47:44.239 --> 00:47:46.480
<v Speaker 1>we have to balance the innovation that comes from crypto

1015
00:47:46.559 --> 00:47:49.199
<v Speaker 1>and the huge opportunities that ac crew in the US

1016
00:47:49.480 --> 00:47:52.599
<v Speaker 1>for being that that you know, the place where crypto

1017
00:47:53.079 --> 00:47:56.199
<v Speaker 1>where AI a lot of the investments and that are starting,

1018
00:47:56.280 --> 00:47:58.800
<v Speaker 1>and so we're really excited excited for that. But I

1019
00:47:58.800 --> 00:48:01.679
<v Speaker 1>think Paul Grahall would be absolutely great follow up episode

1020
00:48:01.719 --> 00:48:01.920
<v Speaker 1>on this.

1021
00:48:02.199 --> 00:48:04.280
<v Speaker 5>And I think Tony, you your question and I think

1022
00:48:04.280 --> 00:48:05.880
<v Speaker 5>a couple of questions before it kind of speaks to

1023
00:48:06.000 --> 00:48:09.679
<v Speaker 5>what I think is emerging truth in this space, which

1024
00:48:09.760 --> 00:48:11.320
<v Speaker 5>is humans probably still need to be.

1025
00:48:11.280 --> 00:48:12.360
<v Speaker 3>Involved at some point.

1026
00:48:13.480 --> 00:48:15.760
<v Speaker 5>A lot of advocates out there saying, ohthough 're like,

1027
00:48:16.000 --> 00:48:19.079
<v Speaker 5>you know, as will fully be autonomous. But you know,

1028
00:48:19.400 --> 00:48:24.599
<v Speaker 5>I think the more realistic reality is that humans will

1029
00:48:24.679 --> 00:48:26.599
<v Speaker 5>need to be present, not just in the beginning when

1030
00:48:26.599 --> 00:48:27.239
<v Speaker 5>you're creating the.

1031
00:48:27.199 --> 00:48:29.679
<v Speaker 3>Eye, but to manage and moderate and improve.

1032
00:48:30.639 --> 00:48:32.360
<v Speaker 5>So I think that's one of the things that will

1033
00:48:32.400 --> 00:48:34.880
<v Speaker 5>probably continue to see, is the importance of humans in

1034
00:48:34.880 --> 00:48:35.239
<v Speaker 5>the moop.

1035
00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:36.719
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

1036
00:48:36.760 --> 00:48:39.960
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, And I once again, I know some of these

1037
00:48:40.039 --> 00:48:44.280
<v Speaker 2>questions they're too early. We're still too early to determine

1038
00:48:44.280 --> 00:48:46.920
<v Speaker 2>some of these things. But I'm fascinated by this, and

1039
00:48:47.599 --> 00:48:49.800
<v Speaker 2>like I said, I'm trying to build something and I'll

1040
00:48:49.800 --> 00:48:52.559
<v Speaker 2>probably have to have some onfline conversations with you guys,

1041
00:48:52.960 --> 00:48:57.320
<v Speaker 2>but this is amazing and any any thing else you

1042
00:48:57.320 --> 00:48:59.760
<v Speaker 2>guys want to highlight or you think you caught everything

1043
00:48:59.800 --> 00:49:01.039
<v Speaker 2>into conversation so far.

1044
00:49:01.760 --> 00:49:04.679
<v Speaker 5>I think for those going to deaf Con next week,

1045
00:49:04.960 --> 00:49:06.719
<v Speaker 5>we're hosting a series of events and we can send

1046
00:49:06.719 --> 00:49:08.920
<v Speaker 5>you to links that people want to join us. We're

1047
00:49:08.920 --> 00:49:12.760
<v Speaker 5>going to be showcasing I think five agents that are

1048
00:49:12.760 --> 00:49:16.480
<v Speaker 5>going to be doing things on crypto. It'd be fun

1049
00:49:16.519 --> 00:49:18.679
<v Speaker 5>stuff and they'll be kind of more serious stuff, but

1050
00:49:18.840 --> 00:49:21.960
<v Speaker 5>it's going to be a really cool moment for for

1051
00:49:22.039 --> 00:49:24.519
<v Speaker 5>AI and crypto. And you know, if if anyone's going

1052
00:49:24.599 --> 00:49:27.039
<v Speaker 5>to Bangkok this year for the conference, we'd love to

1053
00:49:27.280 --> 00:49:29.519
<v Speaker 5>invite them to, or at least your viewers to one

1054
00:49:29.519 --> 00:49:30.159
<v Speaker 5>of these events.

1055
00:49:30.719 --> 00:49:33.719
<v Speaker 2>Awesome, I'll put those links in the descriptions. Everyone check

1056
00:49:33.760 --> 00:49:37.880
<v Speaker 2>that out. No, mil Dan, thank you so much. This

1057
00:49:37.960 --> 00:49:41.599
<v Speaker 2>is exciting stuff and I'll have to have you either

1058
00:49:42.079 --> 00:49:45.159
<v Speaker 2>individually or both again, maybe in the next three to

1059
00:49:45.320 --> 00:49:47.719
<v Speaker 2>four months as we get further iterations.

1060
00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:49.119
<v Speaker 4>But thank you so much for joining me.

1061
00:49:49.760 --> 00:49:50.239
<v Speaker 3>No, thank you.

1062
00:49:50.239 --> 00:49:53.239
<v Speaker 5>It was fun and I can sense your enthusiasm and

1063
00:49:53.320 --> 00:49:55.480
<v Speaker 5>you know, if you can, sends ours and it's just

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<v Speaker 5>great tend to be alive and and be in this

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<v Speaker 5>space right There's so much happening out there and we

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<v Speaker 5>just want we just want this to you have the

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<v Speaker 5>world to know about it.