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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to this special series of The Federalist

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History Hour. I'm Hayden Daniel, editor at The Federalist. As always,

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you can email the show at radio at Federalist dot com,

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follow us on Twitter at Federalist, make sure to subscribe

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wherever you download your podcasts, and of course the premium

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version of our website as well. I'm joined today by

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Breonna Lyman, correspondent at the Federalists. Welcome to the show.

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much for having me.

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Speaker 1: America's got a pretty big birthday coming up, the Big

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fifty this July fourth, and the White House is pretty

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busy working on a very special little celebration. I also

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understand that you are busy onest a little special project

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celebrating this nation's founding called count Down to Freedom, in

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which you chronicle the events of the revolution from January

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the first, seventeen seventy six to July fourth, seventeen seventy six,

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when the founders signed the Declaration of Independence and leapt

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out into the unknown and embarked America on this great

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political experiment that we have been on for the last

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two hundred and fifty years. Is that correct?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just it's been almost a month now, we're

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coming up on that one month mark, and it's a

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lot of fun. If you haven't already had a chance

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to check it out, I encourage it. It's under two

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minutes because I don't want to bog people down. I

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know everyone has a busy life, but I think it's

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really important as we head to July fourth to understand

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just kind of reality. Not only were the founders facing,

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but average colonists. Right, the entire movement would have been

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unsuccessful and impossible if not for the average farmers and

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tavern keepers and so forth and so forth who took

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up arms and were willing to fight and give their

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lives for the cause. And in order to give their

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lives for the cause, they needed to be convinced. And Hayden,

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I know you know this as well, but it wasn't

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easy to convince all the colonists to pick up arms

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against a country of which you know, they have family

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living overseas. Maybe they were born overseas in Knye. Maybe

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their parents were. There were a lot of ties and

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similarities between the two people, so it was very difficult

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to convince them to raise arms against one another.

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Speaker 1: Yes, up to a third of the colonists remained loyal

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to Britain, and many of them left after the Revolution,

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mostly to hand it, but also to England as well.

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And I think that's one of the really impressive things

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about your series is that you not only take a

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big macro look at the Revolution, as in big events

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like Thomas Paine's common Sense you did that episode a

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few days ago, or Benjamin Franklin's birthday, but you also

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look at very small but still very important events that

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happened to normal colonists that either pushed them towards loyalism

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or pushed them towards the Patriot cause.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that's like a and I really

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enjoyed doing that. I love doing the research and digging

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into it. For example, you know, I think it was

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probably a week and a half ago there was an incident.

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It might have actually been January eighth, there was an

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incident in which colonists had wanted to go and basically

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take back the remaining houses that had been left after

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the British kind of you know, burned down the area

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because they didn't want the British using the remaining wood

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for firewood, and so they launched this like overnight little

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expedition and managed to take captive a few British people

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and burn the remaining wood down. And it's a funny

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story because one no one hears of it, and two,

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at the same time that the colonists were doing this,

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the British were actually enjoying a play in Boston mocking

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the Continental Army as being a bunch of, you know,

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country bumpkins. Meanwhile, those country bumpkins were out there burning

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down the firewood that they were dependent on. So it's

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little stories like that that really helps out the the

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big picture of what the colonists the militia were really

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willing to do, into what lengths to secure their freedom.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the British, definitely, especially the officers, definitely underestimated these

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sort of rustic provincials that they thought the colonists were

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and they sort of got rude awakening in instances like that.

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What inspired you to start this series? I mean it's

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a pretty big undertaking. Even if all the videos are

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under two minutes, I mean, it's quite quite the project.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I can definitely to that. I'm currently working on

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doing a new studio setup, so we're having some technical

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difficulties folks. But honestly, there were there were two big things.

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First and foremost, America's worth it. She's worth so much more,

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you know. I think of all the brave men and

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women who have sacrificed their lives and or they're just

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their time to serve this country. And I'll be honest,

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I think I'm too much of a whiss to to

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put myself in that position. And I just wanted to

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figure out a way that I could also honor America

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in a way that you know, maybe some other people

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also can't or would be interested in. So this was

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hopefully my way of kind of giving back one to

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cover what makes America so great and too, I just

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have a lot of family history. I am a Mayflower descendant,

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I have Revolutionary War Patriots direct ancestors. I'm related to

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John Adams distantly. So this is my way of also

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trying to remember the story that my ancestors live too.

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I mean, they lived in Massachusetts, they experienced this firsthand.

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Speaker 1: They were you know, Paul.

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Speaker 2: Rever yours Midnight Ride, they were there kind of deal.

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So it's just trying to give the right amount of

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coverage to ordinary again colonists who are doing the extraordinary things.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a bit of a running gag amongst the

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Federals about how many revolutionary figures that you're related to.

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So how do you do the research for these episodes,

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especially the ones that aren't that are stories that aren't

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as well known.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great question. So obviously I'm fortunate enough

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that there are a few big you know, the Burning

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of Norfolk. I know a lot of people who watch

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that episode were mad that I mispronounced it as Norfolk.

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But I am from New York, and it's difficult for

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my rs and l's like that. For example, the episode

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that I'm hoping to get out today, if it does

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not run into technical issues, is actually not even a

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story that's really happened today, because some days there was

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nothing like actually happening, right. There were no no proclamations,

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no decrees, no big meetings. So it's about finding something

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about what was happening for the colonists, And for the

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colonists on a day like this, they were struggling. Those

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who were remaining neutral, they were going to have to

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pick aside. Right, there was no such thing as being

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neutral pastal life. For it's seventeen seventy six, you were

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a loyalist or you were a patriot, and so there

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was a lot of stuff building up. So over the past.

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You know, yesterday and tomorrow in seventeen seventy six, you're

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going to start seeing reports popping up in local newspapers

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in Pennsylvania and Virginia basically saying we cannot sit back.

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Everybody like this is the time to fight for freedom.

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You know, you're not fighting against your brothers in England.

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You're fighting against the Parliament and the crown. You can

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separate those two things. Your freedom is at state. And

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it was a really tough decision for like you said,

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you know about a third of the colonists living in America.

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So for stories or days like this when it feels

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a little slow, it's about putting yourself in an average

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colonist's shoe.

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Speaker 1: Yes, And it was not as how Miss Pain might say,

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it was not time for fair weather soldiers at the time.

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It would only get worse after seventeen seventy six. I mean,

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the colonists went through all sorts of privations. I mean,

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most people know about Washington's Army and Valley Forge, how

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terribly they suffered during the winter there, but even just

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normal colonists suffered quite a bit with the semi British blockade,

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especially once they captured New York and Charleston, the two

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major ports in the colonies, and Boston. But yeah, it

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was lean times for the Revolution, but the Patriots stuck

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it out and persevered. So has working on this series

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giving you a greater appreciation for the Revolution?

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Speaker 2: Oh, of course, I mean there's so many different things.

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You know, for example, you just mentioned the blockade, and

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blockades were very difficult, more I would argue for the

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British than they were for the colonists at certain points

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of the war. So in seventeen seventy six it was

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actually more difficult I'd say for the British in Boston,

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for example, right, because the Patriots had pretty much taken

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control of most of everything except for Boston, but they

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were doing blockades. When British ships were trying to bring

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supplies up to Boston. They were actually running into trouble

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around the you know, New Jersey and New York ports

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by Patriots who were taking over these ships and saying

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you're not going there, right, And you just think of

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the sacrifice that so many of these men had made.

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You know, it's freezing in New York right now, right,

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but I have a really big warmth sweater and I'll

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put a scarf on and gloves. A lot of these

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men they didn't have those things right. Supplies were low.

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Their shoes, you know, if they're marching miles and miles

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and miles. Sometimes some shoes got warned and they didn't

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even wear them. And they did this again. They did

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it all, not even for themselves. A lot of them

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understood they were signing up to possibly die, and yet

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they still did it. But they were doing it for

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their children and their grandchildren and people like you and

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I today who enjoy, you know, the privileges that they

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got for us so.

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Speaker 1: Far, or even if you can give us a little

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glimpse into the future, what are some of your favorite

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stories and episodes that you looked into.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this one was like a little a little different.

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So Benedict Arnold's birthday was last week, and of course

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he's a trader. I'm not giving him props. But there

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is one story from the revolution that I probably won't

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be able to tell otherwise unless I tell it for

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Benedict Arnold's birthday. Because it occurred a few years into

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the war, but it took place in Tarrytown, New York.

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And Benedict Arnold, by I think it was like seventeen

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eighty one, he had been really slighted, okay, he had

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been passed over for promotions. He also had a really

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reckless spending habit, so he was accumulating a ton of

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debt and he decided, you know what, I'm not sticking

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it out with the Patriots. I Am going to side

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and become a turncoat and go with the British. And

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what was really dangerous is that Benedict Arnold controlled West Point, which,

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for those of you who may not know, West Point

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is the or was the colonial military fort. Now it's

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obviously a military academy, and it's right on the Hudson

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River in New York, which was a crucial waterway for

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the Patriots, okay, and they had control of it right now,

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or part of it at least, And Benedette Arnold was

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planning on giving in a way to the British. So

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one night in September he meets with Major John Andre

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a British general, and he gives him plans about how

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he's going to basically give the British control of West Point.

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And he tells Major John Andre, cape, with these in

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your boots and you know, go down to New York

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City and bring these to your superiors. And Major John

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Andre heads down to New York City and two or

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three days later, he's about twenty miles from New York City,

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so safety, and he accidentally ends up on a dirt

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road in Terrytown where three militiamen are sitting under what

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has been described as a tulip tree and they notice

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the sky coming down and the Major John Andre had

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seen one of the militiamen wearing a Hassian coat and

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the guy was just cold. The Major John Andre thought, oh,

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these must be, you know, people on my side. So

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he goes, oh, I'm actually a British general, and the

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Patriots go, well, we're not, and so they make him

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step off his horse, they search him and they're like

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all right, and they're just about to let him go

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and suddenly one of the Patriots says, take your shoe off,

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and Major John Andre takes a shoe off, and there

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are those papers that he is going to bring to

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the British, who basically say that Benedict Darnod was going

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to hand over control of West Point, and those three patriots, right,

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three average men who just signed up to be part

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of the local militia, saved the revolution because had British

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gained control of the Hudson River and West Point, that

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would have been catastrophic. George Washington even said that these

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three men have basically tried or have basically saved the

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revolutionary cause. So it's stories like that where you don't

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hear it enough, but you think of just one small mistake.

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If they would have let John Andre go without checking

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his boots, we may be talking about something different today.

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Speaker 1: And it really underscores sort of the coincidences that play

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a far larger role in American history and history in

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general that we often really don't think about. What if

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that patriot had not been wearing a Hessian coat and

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Andre had lied and said, oh I'm with the Patriots,

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and where they have just let him pass, or if

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they had not been there at all, what would have happened.

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It's just those little coincidences play a lot bigger part

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in history in general than a lot of people really

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give it credit for. And I also want to stress

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just how strategically important West Point was in North America.

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In general, the British had recognized that control of the

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Hudson River was basically the key to winning the war.

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I mean, if they could take control the entire Hudson,

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they basically cut the colonies in half and then be

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able to deal with each half independently. And that was

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actually the aim of the British campaign Battle of Saratoga,

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which many people believe is the real turning point of

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the war. Coincidentally, Benedict Arnold was a commanding general of

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the Patriot forces during that Patriot victory, and he was

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winded in action and was a war hero. But he

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then later blamed the commanding General Horatio Gates of like

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stealing his glory. That's one of the reasons he eventually turncoat.

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Speaker 2: Right right, and exactly you think of again, you just

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you know, made a great point. Ben As Jarnal is

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someone who very well would have been remembered as an

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American hero after the war ended, but he just let

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his Eco get in the way, and he basically died

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a man. You know, I think he died actually over

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in England. But you know, his legacy is that of

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a Trader. It doesn't matter that he helped win at Saratoga.

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It doesn't matter of all the good things he did.

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What matters is he did one bad thing, and that

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was defining.

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Speaker 3: What it means to be a conservative. Used to be clear,

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tax cuts, free markets, Christian family values, and supporting democracies

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around the world. That's not true anymore, as anyone find

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00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:04,600
following politics sees every day. That's where the new podcast,

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00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:09,240
Conservative Crossroads with Henry Olsen, Senior Fellow at the Ethics

273
00:14:09,279 --> 00:14:13,000
and Public Policy Center comes in. It doesn't shy away

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00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:15,960
from these disputes, it leans into them by putting two

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00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:20,799
conservatives who disagree about an important issue together to hash

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00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:25,200
it out on the air. Every other week, Conservative Crossroads

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00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:30,960
does what no other program does, explore conservatisms disagreements without

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00:14:31,039 --> 00:14:35,960
name calling. Conservative Crossroads is the podcast for conservatives who

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00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:40,879
want to understand what's happening to their movement. Join Henry

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00:14:40,919 --> 00:14:44,919
Olsen and his guest at Conservative Crossroads every other Monday

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00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:48,480
as they hash out the ideas and principles that will

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decide the future of the right. Download Conservative Crossroads from

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00:14:52,399 --> 00:14:56,399
our partner Ricochet or any platform where you get your podcast.

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Conservatism is at a crossroads was why all conservatives need

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conservative crossroads.

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Speaker 1: Listen today, So what are some maybe some individual facts

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that you maybe didn't know going in that you that

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you've learned now and really sort of given you more

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insight into the into the revolution.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this was the subject of my Friday episode. I

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believe and I love Ben Franklin. I've read a lot

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and I thought I knew him pretty well. But the

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one thing I didn't realize is that his son William

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actually had a big falling out with Benjamin Franklin over

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the war. And I think that just goes to show

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you the personal toll that it took on one again, families, neighbors,

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but two even our greatest founders were willing to lose

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their children over the cause. So William was the royal

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governor of New Jersey, obviously you know who Ben Franklin is,

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and William refused to become a Patriot, and Ben Franklin

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and him were, you know, fighting about it. Then seventeen

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seventy six comes around and William still doesn't want to budge,

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and he gets arrested by Patriot forces and is thrown

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in a jail, and Ben Franklin does nothing to get

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his son out of jail. He actually lets his son

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linger in jail for a long time. When William's wife

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was on her deathbed, he had begged, you know, the

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you know, Continental Congress to let him have an exception

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to go see his wife. George Washington, I believe, even

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wrote a letter kind of attesting like, all right, queen,

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let this guy a least go see his wife. And

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Ben Franklin did nothing, as his father to even say

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I second this yor like yeah, is there anything I

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can do? Can I speak to someone? Nothing, And when

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they finally reconciled after the war, Ben Franklin said, you know,

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this cousted me so much great pain losing you for

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all those years, But I'm always your affectionate father. And

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then they met in person a short while later and

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Ben Franklin said to William, apologize, you were a trader

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not only against you know, the colonies, but against your

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own father. And William refused and they never spoke again.

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Speaker 1: That really just shows again just how fractious war was,

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which we don't hear about that much. I think we

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usually think of the Civil War as the sort of

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war between brothers and the war in which the families

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are fractured and loyalty that are really tested. But as

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your series is kind of revealed that that's also true

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in the Revolution.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean is it is literally neighbor versus neighbor.

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And you know, one way to think about the Revolutionary

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War is it was our revolution, but it was England's

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civil war. That was a civil war for them, because

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if things had gone their way, we would have eventually

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reconciled to some degree. And you know, the King at

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other points had said, you know, if we, if we

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his October speech of seventeen seventy five, he said like,

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if you put your arms down, now you know we're

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gonna we're going to welcome you back into it, and

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that would have been the end of a civil war.

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It just so happened that we were able to win

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and it turned into our revolution. But when you think

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of it in the context of a civil war, it

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really makes that, you know, brother brother, and neighbor vers

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neighbor all the more real.

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Speaker 1: And it's funny you refer to as the civil war

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because during the English Civil War in the sixteen forties,

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you basically see every single grievance the colonists bring up

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in seventeen seventy five seventeen seventy six were also grievances

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of Parliament to the king in the sixteen forties before

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the English Civil War. I mean everything from taxation no

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taxation without representation, to quartering of troops in normal citizens' homes.

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Those were all grievances that Parliament had with the king

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in the sixteen forties. And it's just a little both

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tragic and a little humorous that they seemed to forget

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all those rights that they fought and had this very

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bloody civil war in the sixteen forties. For they seem

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to forget all of those also apply to their fellow

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Englishmen there in the colonies who which then leads to

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the American Revolution. And during the English Civil or different

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colonies took different sides too, so even then it was

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a little bit of a battle between countrymen, like Maryland

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was a royalist stronghold on New England was a parliamentarian stronghold.

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So you see this kind of pattern throughout the English

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colonial history of the Thirteen Colonies.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And then you'd think that the Crown would

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have learned from their mistakes in the sixteen hundreds, but

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they obviously didn't. And in a newspaper that came out

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on January twenty second, seventeen seventy six, that I've been

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reading in the past few days, it was a speech

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they had reprinted, a speech that was given in London

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in September of seventeen seventy five from you know, Britons

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who were basically sympathetic to a degree to the Patriot

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cause by saying, look, they have tried everything, They've had

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their grievances accumulate, they haven't been heard. No freeman can

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live under such type of duress. And so you even

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have again Britain understanding the cause of the patriots. And

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it's also why the Patriots were making appeals to the

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people of Britain, not just parliament right, but to the

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average citizens in Britain saying like, hey, look like we

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don't want to fight you guys, We're just upset about,

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you know, our rights being trampled and taken away. Because

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they also were trying to hope for some kind of

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reconciliation with the Crown. And again not everybody, you know,

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there were certain founders, you know Sam Adams, he absolutely

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was not someone who was like, yeah, we can reconcile

386
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this one. But you know, people like Ben Franklin, up

387
00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:32,200
to a certain point, I think he believed reconciliation was possible.

388
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I think some of the others definitely did, but you know,

389
00:20:36,559 --> 00:20:37,960
the Crown made it unfeasible.

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Speaker 1: Yes, you have radicals like Sam Adams who are sort

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of gung ho from the beginning for just complete separation.

392
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But I think if you look at most of the

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founders and most of the people who lived in the

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colonies in seventeen seventy four seventeen seventy five, before some

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kind of the threshold of no return had been reached,

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most of them would say that they may even prefer

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to stay with England, and that they're just trying to

398
00:21:06,079 --> 00:21:10,119
re establish their rights as Englishmen. Now that's a somewhat

399
00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:13,160
healthy debate in the historical community when that kind of

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00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:18,759
transition happened from trying to re establish their what they

401
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:22,079
saw is their English natural English rights to we're just

402
00:21:22,079 --> 00:21:26,279
going to be our own country and secure our own rights.

403
00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:29,920
And of course it happened sometime before July fourth, seventeen

404
00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:35,680
seventy six, obviously, but that was a very lively and

405
00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:39,279
very very contentious debate in the Thirteen Colonies in the

406
00:21:39,359 --> 00:21:46,480
in the lead up to ultimately independence, and it's still

407
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a subject of debate exactly when that happened and when

408
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public opinion kind of shifted towards independence rather than reconciliation.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, there there obviously several events that

410
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:04,359
pushed people further, obviously Lexington and Concord. You know, the

411
00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:07,119
shot heard around the world, the burning of Norfolk. That

412
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was actually one of the grievances that the founders listed

413
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in the declaration. There were what twenty five grievances, I

414
00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:16,960
believe there were, but there were little, not little things,

415
00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:18,799
but there were some big things, and then there were

416
00:22:18,839 --> 00:22:22,000
some smaller things. However, that accumulated to the point where

417
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:24,240
colinists could not ignore the fact that the king was

418
00:22:24,279 --> 00:22:27,480
willing to do whatever. And I think something interesting that

419
00:22:27,559 --> 00:22:31,200
happened in January seventeen seventy six was the king hired

420
00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:34,559
Hessian soldiers. And this had been done in previous wars,

421
00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:38,960
but it hadn't been done to slaughter, you know, the

422
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:42,839
colonist right, it was always fighting another empire, and the

423
00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:46,279
colonists saw that as really just an egregious display of

424
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authority by the Crown because here he was hiring these

425
00:22:49,599 --> 00:22:53,119
you know, foreign mercenaries to quite literally slaughter them because

426
00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,880
these were trained killers. So you know, the colonists thought

427
00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:58,519
they knew their enemy. They thought they knew it was

428
00:22:58,519 --> 00:23:01,039
the British. But you know, twelve that and Hessian soldiers

429
00:23:01,079 --> 00:23:04,799
were headed their way. Thomas Jefferson references in the Declaration

430
00:23:04,839 --> 00:23:08,559
of Independence as well in the grievances. So there were

431
00:23:08,599 --> 00:23:11,039
there were just a lot of things that pushed colonists further.

432
00:23:11,079 --> 00:23:13,400
But again, like you said, a third of them still

433
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,160
never made that complete switch, and they did flee up

434
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:19,799
to you know, Nova Scotia and Canada. I unfortunately have

435
00:23:19,839 --> 00:23:23,559
one loyalist in my family tree that I try to ignore,

436
00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:25,880
but he fled to Nova Scotia as well.

437
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:28,799
Speaker 1: You might have to blame him more for being Canadian

438
00:23:28,839 --> 00:23:31,440
than a loyalist, you know.

439
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:35,200
Speaker 2: And it's funny you say Canada think about Canadians today.

440
00:23:35,319 --> 00:23:37,200
I mean, my god, did they miss out on the

441
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,720
opportunity of a lifetime Because the colonists had tried to

442
00:23:40,759 --> 00:23:43,240
actually get Canada to join them in their fight against

443
00:23:43,839 --> 00:23:45,319
England and they said no.

444
00:23:46,839 --> 00:23:50,559
Speaker 1: There was a very small unit of Canadian volunteers who

445
00:23:50,559 --> 00:23:55,440
did fight with the patriots. But yes, in general, Canadians

446
00:23:55,480 --> 00:24:00,519
did not join the revolution, partly because Canada was one

447
00:24:00,519 --> 00:24:03,559
of the reasons the revolution started. I mean, a large

448
00:24:03,599 --> 00:24:07,519
portion of the land that the colonists wanted after the

449
00:24:07,599 --> 00:24:09,519
end of the French and Indian War went to Canada,

450
00:24:09,559 --> 00:24:13,759
like modern day Ohio, Indiana, Michigan. That was all allotted

451
00:24:13,759 --> 00:24:16,200
to Canada and they were allowed to settle there, But

452
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,119
the thirteen colonies supposedly on the winning side of that

453
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:24,680
war were not allowed to settle there. Also because roughly

454
00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:27,920
half of Canada's population in seventeen seventy five was French

455
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and the French and the colonists did not get along

456
00:24:32,079 --> 00:24:38,359
very well, so the French colonists in Canada decided they

457
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:41,519
would rather stick with the crown than with the angry

458
00:24:41,519 --> 00:24:46,279
colonists who didn't like them very much. That is like the.

459
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Speaker 2: Biggest fumble of the century. I don't know.

460
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Speaker 1: We might be lucky that we don't have the Quebec

461
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Qua in our country. Bad for Canada and maybe not

462
00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:00,079
so bad for us.

463
00:25:01,559 --> 00:25:03,359
Speaker 2: No, I agree, I agree it's good for us. I

464
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:07,079
wouldn't want the Canadians today. I don't think they understood.

465
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And here's the thing. I don't think like they understand

466
00:25:09,599 --> 00:25:11,559
freedom the way we do. I don't think any country

467
00:25:11,839 --> 00:25:14,039
understands freedom the wey do, because you know, we are

468
00:25:14,079 --> 00:25:16,359
a republic and at the end of the day, there's

469
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:19,240
no other successful republic anywhere in the world. They may

470
00:25:19,279 --> 00:25:21,880
have adopted, you know, certain democratic values, but we're not

471
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a democracy, right, And they may have adopted, you know,

472
00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:28,119
the idea that all men are created equal as well,

473
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:34,519
but what underpins our understanding of equality is Christianity. You

474
00:25:34,599 --> 00:25:37,920
don't see that in other countries where they say all

475
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,240
men are created equal. Right, What's underpinning it is simply

476
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:42,640
that you have you know, a mob majority saying yeah,

477
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:44,960
of course all men are created equal, but there's no

478
00:25:45,079 --> 00:25:47,880
foundation to that truth for them. Right. So we are

479
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:51,720
the only country that could do what we've done because

480
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:54,440
of our Christian foundations.

481
00:25:54,519 --> 00:25:57,839
Speaker 1: Very true, our Christian foundation, and I think importantly our

482
00:25:57,839 --> 00:26:02,680
written constitution is I mean it's not so much today,

483
00:26:02,759 --> 00:26:05,920
but that once upon a time Britain did have a

484
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:12,359
moral Christian foundation and they were largely on the same

485
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,359
track that we were, but they didn't have a written constitution.

486
00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:17,920
So that opens up a lot of wiggle room and

487
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:22,880
a lot of room for maneuver that unsavory characters can

488
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:27,519
use to their political advantage, as we've seen in Britain,

489
00:26:28,519 --> 00:26:31,400
to their absolute detriment in that country is just such

490
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:34,200
a mess right now, and it's largely because of their

491
00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:38,559
lawed governmental system. I think we can say that.

492
00:26:39,079 --> 00:26:41,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's funny too because you think about, you know,

493
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:46,440
at the time of the founding British England's lack a

494
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:50,279
written constitution, and when the founders were, you know, going

495
00:26:50,279 --> 00:26:53,279
through the process of actually creating our system of government

496
00:26:53,279 --> 00:26:55,400
after the war ended, you had a lot of people

497
00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:59,599
including Richard Henry Lee, who on June seventh, seventeen seventy six,

498
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:02,200
would put forward a proclamation saying to the colonies, now

499
00:27:02,319 --> 00:27:04,240
is the time to declare our independence, like it's now

500
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:09,279
or never. He voted against the Constitution because he worried

501
00:27:09,319 --> 00:27:12,680
that it was a flawed document and that the states

502
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:15,640
would lose their power, they would lose rights they had,

503
00:27:16,319 --> 00:27:18,519
It could be you know, effectively taken out of context,

504
00:27:18,519 --> 00:27:22,279
so to speak. And so you had that infighting between

505
00:27:22,599 --> 00:27:27,079
the founders for several years, and thank god they did

506
00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:29,599
come up with the constitution. Thank god they put in

507
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:32,759
what they put in, because we see today how willing

508
00:27:33,319 --> 00:27:36,920
Republicans and Democrats would be to strip us of certain

509
00:27:37,079 --> 00:27:43,160
fundamental rights or at least, you know, severely restrict them.

510
00:27:43,599 --> 00:27:46,400
Speaker 1: It doesn't stop the Democrats from trying, as we've seen

511
00:27:46,839 --> 00:27:51,200
in that current Scotus case in Hawaii, about just trying

512
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:55,759
to like wholesale strip Americans of their Second Amendment rights.

513
00:27:56,519 --> 00:27:59,799
But yes, that battle between the federalists and anti federalists

514
00:27:59,799 --> 00:28:06,279
and anti constitutionalists, very fierce debate after the Revolution and

515
00:28:06,319 --> 00:28:10,519
then really I mean, strains of that argument continue until

516
00:28:10,559 --> 00:28:13,880
the Civil War. You know, whether state power is sovereign

517
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:18,720
over federal power or vice versa. And that's pretty decisively

518
00:28:18,759 --> 00:28:20,079
settled by the Civil War.

519
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 2: Right right, And I mean now we're kind of having

520
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:28,240
that same debate to a degree. You know, Minnesota's open

521
00:28:28,279 --> 00:28:31,960
rebellion against the federal government. They're trying to pull I guess,

522
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:34,759
I guess like a nullification crisis of their own. But

523
00:28:34,799 --> 00:28:38,160
that was settled, right, calcul literally lost in all crisis,

524
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:40,400
which I hate in you this is this is your

525
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,200
forte here. But you know, we're still having these debates, right,

526
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:46,240
There's still so many things that I wouldn't say necessarily

527
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:49,400
are unclear. I think they're clear. But you know, democrats

528
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,039
try to find workarounds. When you have an activist judiciary,

529
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:56,200
it's very easy to then affect those workarounds. But you know,

530
00:28:56,279 --> 00:28:58,759
there's still a lot of people who are fighting the

531
00:28:58,799 --> 00:29:00,759
constitution very much.

532
00:29:00,799 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 1: So all those stories we hear from the revolution, and

533
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:08,200
all those stories of hardship and sacrifice really underscores why

534
00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:10,519
we need to protect the constitution and the vision that

535
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:15,000
the founders had for nothing else to honor their legacy

536
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:19,759
and their sacrifice during the revolution. Speaking of sort of

537
00:29:19,759 --> 00:29:25,559
the foundation of the country, especially the moral underpinning. Last year,

538
00:29:25,599 --> 00:29:29,599
you participated in the very prestigious, provilious fellowship with the

539
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:34,200
Claremont Institute, and you let me see some of your

540
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,640
reading lists, and there's very interesting readings on there. Would

541
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,839
you like to describe sort of your time at the

542
00:29:40,839 --> 00:29:43,119
fellowship and what kind of things that you read while

543
00:29:43,119 --> 00:29:43,599
you were there.

544
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, First of all, for anybody who is you know,

545
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:50,920
in college or recent college grad or even you know,

546
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,759
mid to late twenties, if you have the opportunity to

547
00:29:54,839 --> 00:29:58,240
become a fellow at Claremont, do it. I wish I

548
00:29:58,279 --> 00:29:58,720
had done it.

549
00:29:58,759 --> 00:29:59,160
Speaker 3: Earlier.

550
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:01,400
Speaker 2: I wish I could do every single year, but you

551
00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:03,039
can only take the fellowship ones. But they have a

552
00:30:03,039 --> 00:30:05,839
few fellowships. So I did the publiest fellowship that is

553
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,359
about a two and a half week program, and it

554
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:13,680
really grounds young thinkers in natural rights. And I think

555
00:30:13,799 --> 00:30:17,680
so often, you know a lot of conservatives, even we're

556
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,720
taught conservative policies, and we read these things and we

557
00:30:20,759 --> 00:30:22,640
hear the word rights or natural rights and we think, yeah,

558
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:25,640
that's that's very self evident. But there's so many people

559
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,200
I know who don't actually know what a natural right

560
00:30:28,279 --> 00:30:31,279
is right, they don't understand where rights come from. And

561
00:30:31,319 --> 00:30:33,680
so what Clairemont is really able to do is, first

562
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,759
of all, it starts you with some you know, Greek philosophy, right,

563
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,599
you learn about the philosophers, and then you see how

564
00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:42,960
the founders rely on those philosophers and then also relying

565
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:47,400
on Christianity to come up with, you know, one, the

566
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:53,119
idea for independence, the justification for independence. We do the uh,

567
00:30:53,319 --> 00:30:55,319
we go through the federalist papers, then we kind of

568
00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:58,920
jump to probably the eighteen thirties, we start talking about

569
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:02,000
Calhoun and and then we obviously go over the Civil War,

570
00:31:02,359 --> 00:31:04,119
and then we use everything that we learned, all these

571
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:06,519
new foundations, and we talk about the modern day, right,

572
00:31:06,559 --> 00:31:08,759
we talk about what went wrong in our country, because

573
00:31:08,799 --> 00:31:11,680
something has gone wrong, terribly wrong. But it's not that

574
00:31:11,759 --> 00:31:14,839
it's a fault of the constitution. So Claremont's entire thing

575
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,519
is the founding was perfect, right, everything about the founding.

576
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:20,160
It may have been difficult at the time, but looking

577
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:23,400
back now, it was perfect. Any problem we have today

578
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:27,440
in America is not a result of the constitution being wrong,

579
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,759
or the founding generation getting wrong, or the system of

580
00:31:29,799 --> 00:31:32,799
government being wrong. No, it's something else. So we're trying

581
00:31:32,839 --> 00:31:34,839
to find that something else, and they're trying to teach

582
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,119
us to think about, you know, identifying what that's. Something

583
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:38,640
else is.

584
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 4: How many people's health insurances cost more than their mortgage.

585
00:31:47,119 --> 00:31:49,920
The watched Out on Wall Street podcast with Chris Markowski.

586
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:52,839
Every day Chris helps unpack the connection between politics and

587
00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:55,480
the economy and how it affects your wallet. Some Americans

588
00:31:55,519 --> 00:31:58,039
are paying more for the health insurance than their mortgage.

589
00:31:58,079 --> 00:32:00,680
And what happened? What if we all just paying for

590
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:04,000
health insurance? Will that force doctors to lower costs? Whether

591
00:32:04,039 --> 00:32:06,000
it's happening in DC or down on Wall Street, it's

592
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:08,640
affecting you financially. Be informed. Check out the Watchdot on

593
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,519
Wall Street podcast with Chris Markowski on Apple, Spotify, or

594
00:32:11,559 --> 00:32:12,839
wherever you get your podcasts.

595
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:18,839
Speaker 1: And I think it's very interesting you brought up Christianity

596
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:23,160
as a more underpinning of the founding because I don't

597
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:25,440
know if you've noticed this during your readings as well,

598
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,920
but whenever I read something from basically before nineteen hundred,

599
00:32:29,599 --> 00:32:35,079
like biblical references are everywhere. They talk constantly about the

600
00:32:35,079 --> 00:32:42,359
Bible and use Biblical justifications for their positions. Is astounding

601
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:47,799
to see it, given how religion has just basically just

602
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:52,319
been erased from our public discourse today over the last

603
00:32:52,319 --> 00:32:52,920
few decades.

604
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:58,799
Speaker 2: Right, Right, and think about like Thomas Aquinas, Right, he

605
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:01,799
speaks a lot about something like eternal law, and he

606
00:33:01,839 --> 00:33:05,000
says or he believes that God represents eternal law. Right,

607
00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:08,240
because that's a combination of reason and revelation. Right, reason

608
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:11,079
leads to natural law. So all humans are endowed with

609
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:14,839
reason because God endows them with it, and they use

610
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,160
that and they use revelations in the Bible. Right, we

611
00:33:17,559 --> 00:33:20,039
see common sense things in the Bible. Right, we see

612
00:33:20,039 --> 00:33:22,480
a good moral foundation, and you combine those two things

613
00:33:22,839 --> 00:33:25,240
and you're able to kind of get a really solid

614
00:33:25,319 --> 00:33:29,200
framework for a functioning and healthy society. And what the

615
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:34,599
Founders saw is that Christianity or God, I should say,

616
00:33:34,759 --> 00:33:39,599
God gives humans human rights or natural rights and reason

617
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,680
because God creates man in his image right, that comes

618
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,480
from Genesis. And so the reason that Christianity is so

619
00:33:45,519 --> 00:33:49,119
important is because the Founders use that self evident truth

620
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,599
that all men are created equal because they are made

621
00:33:51,599 --> 00:33:54,640
in God's image, and applied that to a structure of government,

622
00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:57,039
which no one at that time had tried to do

623
00:33:57,119 --> 00:33:57,480
at all.

624
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 1: Yes, that's very interesting that it really is the only

625
00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:12,480
original application of that of that idea. Like, as you said,

626
00:34:12,559 --> 00:34:16,679
other republics have sort of poppied our system, but the

627
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:19,199
Founders are basically the only ones to establish it out

628
00:34:19,199 --> 00:34:26,079
of whole cloth. Really, And during your fellowship, did you

629
00:34:26,079 --> 00:34:27,840
you read all these things from the maws of the

630
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,559
Founders themselves? You read their writings, You read the writings

631
00:34:30,559 --> 00:34:32,880
of the people in the eighteen thirties and forties during

632
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:37,679
the slavery debates, So you're reading primary source stuff.

633
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:40,960
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And again like that is that is the

634
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:42,920
best way to do it because you know, first of all,

635
00:34:43,199 --> 00:34:45,679
everything of course is you know, slightly open to interpretation,

636
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:48,760
and if you read just one founding document, you can

637
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:51,639
easily take that out of context. And so Claremont does

638
00:34:51,639 --> 00:34:54,679
a really good job of accumulating the right resources that

639
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,039
you're reading everything within the context of one another. Right,

640
00:34:57,039 --> 00:34:59,360
You're not just getting random papers here or there. You're

641
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:02,800
they're building up to something bigger. And to go back

642
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:07,800
to how so many of our great statesmen constantly used religion,

643
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:14,199
or we're signaling to Christianity, you know, think of think

644
00:35:14,199 --> 00:35:17,800
of Abraham Lincoln, right, think of the Gettysburg Address. Every

645
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:20,840
single line and that was not only deliberate, I know

646
00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:23,159
it is what two hundred and seventy three words, but

647
00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:25,320
every line and every word choice was deliberate. And there

648
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:29,320
were so many references to Christianity, right, you know, the

649
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:32,400
idea of you know, for score and you know that

650
00:35:32,599 --> 00:35:35,199
is obviously a reference to seventeen seventy six. But also

651
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:38,360
like the Bible, you know, describes a human lifespan at

652
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:41,400
a certain point, and Lincoln is acknowledging that, like we

653
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:44,239
are reaching that lifespan is set in the Bible of

654
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:46,159
the country, Like are we going to you know, basically

655
00:35:46,159 --> 00:35:49,360
like outlift this. And Mary Lincoln later said that her

656
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:54,440
husband was extremely religious heading to Gettysburg when he gave

657
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:56,960
the Gettysburg Address, And we see that in their documents,

658
00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:00,519
and if you notice, that's what guided Lincoln through the

659
00:36:00,559 --> 00:36:03,119
Civil War. That's what was the basis for all of

660
00:36:03,159 --> 00:36:05,760
his decisions and for his position in the Civil War.

661
00:36:06,119 --> 00:36:08,280
And so many of our politicians today they lack that

662
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:11,199
moral compass. And I think that's why we're partially in

663
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:13,320
the position we are in today because people don't have

664
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:14,840
that foundation to ground them.

665
00:36:16,519 --> 00:36:19,320
Speaker 1: Not just our politician, a lot of our citizeny don't either,

666
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:24,719
I think, largely because they don't read those primary source documents.

667
00:36:25,199 --> 00:36:28,920
They don't read the Bible either. Like public schooling does

668
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:32,760
a terrible job of exposing kids to primary source documents,

669
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:36,079
especially especially over the last decade and a half or

670
00:36:36,079 --> 00:36:39,000
so with sort of the advent of Dei and things

671
00:36:39,039 --> 00:36:42,679
that just totally throw anything made by a dead white

672
00:36:42,679 --> 00:36:49,320
male out the window. But it's vital to read those

673
00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:53,480
kind of things to even have a chance of understanding

674
00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:56,480
the American founding and the American Revolution and American history

675
00:36:56,559 --> 00:36:59,639
just as a whole. The struggle I think we have

676
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:03,000
with America two fifty overall, just kind of bring it

677
00:37:03,039 --> 00:37:06,119
back to the subject of the interviewer.

678
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:08,159
Speaker 2: I was going to say with you know, with America

679
00:37:08,159 --> 00:37:13,159
two fifty, this is a body of people who are

680
00:37:13,199 --> 00:37:16,559
supposed to be celebrating America, and it is being run

681
00:37:16,639 --> 00:37:21,159
by far left wing activists. For example, the woman who's

682
00:37:21,199 --> 00:37:23,599
running in I'm drawing a name on a drawing a

683
00:37:23,599 --> 00:37:26,320
blank on her name of course right now. But when

684
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:29,159
asked who her favorite founding father was, she said she

685
00:37:29,199 --> 00:37:32,519
doesn't have one, right, she actually has favorite founding mothers.

686
00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:36,159
There was no such thing as a founding. Abigail Adam

687
00:37:36,559 --> 00:37:38,079
had been the closest thing we got to it. And

688
00:37:38,079 --> 00:37:42,079
don't get me wrong, she was extremely inspirational for her husband,

689
00:37:42,159 --> 00:37:44,079
let alone for other women. Right, this was this was

690
00:37:44,079 --> 00:37:45,960
a powerhouse of a female. But at the end of

691
00:37:46,039 --> 00:37:49,519
the day, she is not a founder in any sense

692
00:37:49,639 --> 00:37:50,360
of the word.

693
00:37:50,559 --> 00:37:50,840
Speaker 4: Right.

694
00:37:51,199 --> 00:37:53,679
Speaker 2: And it's insulting that you have people running America to

695
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:57,280
fifty who can't even recognize that because they're so deluded

696
00:37:57,320 --> 00:38:00,000
by this, you know, warp gender ideology that you know,

697
00:38:00,119 --> 00:38:02,360
masculinity is toxic. And think about all the great work

698
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,119
feminists did, women have done a lot of great things, right,

699
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:07,679
but so have men, right, and men have done different

700
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:09,800
things than women, like founding a country. And don't get

701
00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:12,800
me wrong again, women were instrumental, you know, being the

702
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,320
backbone for their husbands, keeping care of the house and

703
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:18,079
the children, you know, tending to farms when their husbands

704
00:38:18,079 --> 00:38:21,199
were off at war. No one's you know, die degrading

705
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:24,000
those important actions of them. But we should also be

706
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:26,760
able to acknowledge the founding fathers did something that nobody else,

707
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:29,360
male or female in other places, could do.

708
00:38:29,559 --> 00:38:29,719
Speaker 3: Right.

709
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:32,880
Speaker 2: But it's important for people to remember that President Trump

710
00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:36,119
has come up with a different organization called Freedom two

711
00:38:36,199 --> 00:38:39,199
fifty and they are doing a much better job honoring

712
00:38:39,559 --> 00:38:42,119
America's founding than America two fifties. So if you have

713
00:38:42,159 --> 00:38:44,679
to choose between the two, remember Freedom two fifty is

714
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:46,840
the one to go to and to to subscribe to.

715
00:38:47,599 --> 00:38:51,280
Speaker 1: Yes, and the Trump administration has a few big events planned.

716
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I think the Garden of National Heroes is supposed to

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be unveiled, I think close to or on July fourth,

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twenty twenty six. And there's supposed to be a sort

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of a national state fair. And it's kind of an

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oxymoron there's supposed to be a big giant state fair.

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I think they're thinking about it in Iowa that represents

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every single state. And those are great ideas, And yes,

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the Trump administration set up organization is at least ideologically

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leagues better than the other option. But maybe my one

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problem with it is that you kind of have to

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look for it. Yeah, this might just be my personal experience,

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but I don't think they've done particularly good job advertising

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any of these things.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree, I agree. I actually wasn't aware of

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it until I was talking to a colleage of ours

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and he was like, well, freedom to fifties a think,

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And I think it's you know, it's obviously hard. President

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Trump is a lot on his plate, so his administration,

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so you know, freedom two fifty may not be top

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of mine when you pressing issues happening here and now.

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But that being said, you know, celebrating Americus two fifty

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to me is probably the most important thing for the

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entire year, because we should be celebrating American greatness and

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reminding people of what does it actually mean to one

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be American? Where do our rights actually come from? And

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what are our freedoms?

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Speaker 1: Right?

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Speaker 2: And I think Freedom to fifty is doing a bus tour.

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Secretary Duffy I think kicked it off. But they're going

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to be visiting some cities and towns with like this

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giant tractor trailer, I think, and they'll have exhibits in

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that trailer that people can come see, and they'll stop

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at school. So I think that's a really great way

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to get people involved and kind of bring our important

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Founding documents or images to people that may not be

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able to travel to the museums in Washington.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and this is such a great opportunity to sort

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of expose people who again may not have ever been

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exposed to any of the Founding documents or anything from

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the Founding era. And it's a really great opportunity for

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Trump to really sort of hound the message home about

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who we are, where we come from, where we're going,

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of course, and to really kind of cement his make

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America Great Again initiative. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and this is a I'm happy that the Trump

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administration has the opportunity to claim the narrative on America

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to fifty because if this was the Biden administration, we'd

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see how it would play out. Because he appointed the

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woman who's leading America to fifty. And she's a radical

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left winger who said that she can't even say, you know,

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she said she's a Mexican American. She has dual allegiances

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00:41:31,679 --> 00:41:34,639
to two entirely separate countries and cultures, you know. So

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we want someone who's unequivocally and unapologetically one hundred percent

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pro America and pro America only. So I hope the

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Trump administration ramps up these two fifty efforts. I hope

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other Americans take a bigger interest in their history right

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because this is their history. And if you need an

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easy way to do it, countdown to Freedom Monday through

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00:41:51,599 --> 00:41:53,800
Friday on my social media. That is the best place,

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in my opinion, to get that daily dose of history.

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Speaker 1: Neat it is. Thank you, Brianna so much for joining me.

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You've been listening to this special series Federalist History Hour.

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I'm hating Daniel editor at the Federalist. We'll be back

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soon with more. Until then, the lovers of freedom and

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anxious for the Frame