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<v Speaker 1>The latical fundamental principles of freedom, rational self interest, and

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<v Speaker 1>individual rights. This is the ran Brook Show. Oh right, everybody,

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<v Speaker 1>welcome to your own book show on this Sunday, March sixteenth.

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<v Speaker 1>I hope everybody's having a fantastic weekend. I am and

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of shows this week.

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<v Speaker 2>God yeah, a lot of shows. But we're heading towards

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<v Speaker 2>the period ware they're gonna be all.

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<v Speaker 1>A fewer shows, so you know, this is makeup time. Today.

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<v Speaker 1>We're going to talk about the Constitution, or at least my.

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<v Speaker 2>Wishes in terms of how I would I don't know,

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<v Speaker 2>improve it, but we'll get to that. I think that's

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<v Speaker 2>a little too ambitious or a little arrogant, but anyway,

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<v Speaker 2>we'll get to that.

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<v Speaker 1>We'll talk about that Tomorrow.

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<v Speaker 2>I'll be travelings and no shows tomorrow. Tuesday, I'll be

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<v Speaker 2>travelings and no shows. On Tuesday, I'll be in North

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<v Speaker 2>Carolina giving a talk at the Business School at the

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<v Speaker 2>University of North Carolina in Wilmington. Wilmington on the morality

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<v Speaker 2>of finance. So I'm looking forward to that. If you're

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<v Speaker 2>in the area, I hope you come. Definitely come up

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<v Speaker 2>and say hello if you if you are there, and

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<v Speaker 2>you're a listener to your on book show.

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<v Speaker 1>It's always fun.

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<v Speaker 2>For me to meet people who are who are listeners

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<v Speaker 2>to the show, who I don't know, and who I

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<v Speaker 2>do know both. Then I'll be back for a few days.

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<v Speaker 2>When is it Thursday Friday on a Saturday flight to London,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'll be there for a week, and then I

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<v Speaker 2>go to Scotland for a day, and then I go

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<v Speaker 2>to Israel for almost a week.

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<v Speaker 1>So I'll be going two and a half weeks on

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<v Speaker 1>that trip. And so yeah, we'll be.

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<v Speaker 2>Constrained in terms of shows during that period of time.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll do as many shows as we can. So I

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<v Speaker 2>figured at a show today just to kind of make

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<v Speaker 2>that up to you guys, let's see anything else we

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<v Speaker 2>need to cover. Yes, those of you still have not

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<v Speaker 2>heard yet about this. I do have a seminar that

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<v Speaker 2>I'm doing in London on the twenty ninth of March,

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<v Speaker 2>so two weeks from today. It'll be on how to

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<v Speaker 2>apply the objectivist I think, so really how to apply egoism,

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<v Speaker 2>how to be an egoist, and how how to apply

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<v Speaker 2>it to your life in your relationships, your love life,

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<v Speaker 2>sex life, and and in your career and in just

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<v Speaker 2>the time you spend and how you spend it, the

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<v Speaker 2>in life, just life, how you do life. Uh so, uh,

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<v Speaker 2>I encourage you to sign up for that if you're interested,

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<v Speaker 2>if you're in the UK, still got some space. Quite

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<v Speaker 2>a few people are ready. Uh you know, quite a

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<v Speaker 2>few people already signed up. Fort so we've got we're

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<v Speaker 2>definitely doing it.

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<v Speaker 1>And uh, you know this will be.

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<v Speaker 2>Along the lines of Yourn's Rules for Life or my

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<v Speaker 2>series on on being being an egoist, uh and the

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<v Speaker 2>application of philosophy. So but if you're if you're interested,

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<v Speaker 2>you live in the UK, you want to fly the

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<v Speaker 2>UK for this, then come and do it.

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<v Speaker 1>It'll be fun. Now.

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<v Speaker 2>Colleen, Yesterday, day before yesterday, day before you stayed, I

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<v Speaker 2>think on Friday suggested, Hey, why don't you do one

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<v Speaker 2>in the US.

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<v Speaker 1>So here's the thing.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm seriously considering doing one in Denver, Colorado. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>know how many of you in Denver, Colorado, but if

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<v Speaker 2>you're in Colorado near Colorado, willing to travel to Colorado,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking of doing it in May.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it turns out to be May eighth. May eighth, which.

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<v Speaker 2>Is a Thursday, so it is a workday. It's not

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<v Speaker 2>a weekend, but it's kind of the day that I

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<v Speaker 2>can do it, and whoop what I do there? So

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<v Speaker 2>May eighth, something from one to five, twelve to four,

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<v Speaker 2>one to five, maybe in the morning.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm open to suggestions.

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<v Speaker 2>But if you are interested and you would come to Denver,

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<v Speaker 2>or you are in Denver and would like to do

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<v Speaker 2>it in Denver, then.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, then sign up.

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<v Speaker 2>And that is not sign up because there is no

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<v Speaker 2>place to sign up. Let me know you're on at

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<v Speaker 2>your on bookshow dot com. You're on at your on

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<v Speaker 2>book show. I need to get a sense of whether

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<v Speaker 2>there's enough people to do it. You're on at ran

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<v Speaker 2>brookshow dot com. That would be That would be May eighth,

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<v Speaker 2>May eighth in.

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<v Speaker 1>In Denver, Colorado.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, those of you asking about the Midwest, there

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<v Speaker 2>will be Midland, Michigan doing a talk there on on Tuesday,

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<v Speaker 2>April twenty ninth, so which I think which is open

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<v Speaker 2>to the public. So if you want to come up,

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<v Speaker 2>there's Northwood University, and then I think I'm doing one

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<v Speaker 2>at the at the God Jennifer.

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<v Speaker 1>Knows what the name of the institute is. I can't

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<v Speaker 1>sharer the name.

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<v Speaker 2>The Mecanows Center the Macinaw Center in in Midland, Michigan,

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<v Speaker 2>so Northwood and then and then Middle and then Macanoe.

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<v Speaker 2>I think both are open to the public, so you

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<v Speaker 2>certainly well, I'm not sure which one is open to

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<v Speaker 2>the public. I think Macinari is open to public. I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know about Noewood because I think I'm teaching classes

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<v Speaker 2>there rather than giving a talk, So I'm not exactly sure.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, let's see what else did I want to say?

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<v Speaker 1>Were all good here?

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<v Speaker 2>Don't forget to sign up for the event in London.

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<v Speaker 2>You can do that on my website. You're on bookshow

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<v Speaker 2>dot com. Scroll down March twenty ninth, click on the

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<v Speaker 2>link to register and you can register and pay and

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<v Speaker 2>do all that stuff. Patrick says, come to Canada, you're on.

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<v Speaker 2>Winter is almost over. I'm happy to come to Canada.

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<v Speaker 2>Somebody has to invite me. Like it's not enough to

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<v Speaker 2>say come to Canada, you're on. You have to say,

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<v Speaker 2>I've got this group at the University of Toronto will

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<v Speaker 2>host you. I've got a businessman luncheon that will host you,

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<v Speaker 2>and all of that. So any of those, yeah, I

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<v Speaker 2>would I would I come where I'm invited and where

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<v Speaker 2>somebody provides a venue and people for me to speak to.

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<v Speaker 2>People do me to speak So so Patrick, we could

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<v Speaker 2>do in the fall, happy to come to to Canada.

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<v Speaker 2>Just get a university group or some business group or

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<v Speaker 2>somebody to host an event.

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<v Speaker 1>And I will come and I will come. All enough

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<v Speaker 1>of all this logistical stuff about traveling around the world

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<v Speaker 1>and going all over the place.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's talk about the Constitution. And and let me let

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<v Speaker 2>me say a few things as a preamble. The Constitution

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<v Speaker 2>as a preamble, so does the show. The American Constitution

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<v Speaker 2>is an extraordinary document. It is I think the second

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<v Speaker 2>most important document in political human in human political history.

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<v Speaker 1>Uh. It is uh.

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<v Speaker 2>It is the test of time over two hundred and

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<v Speaker 2>fifty years, less than two hund and fifty years, but

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<v Speaker 2>almost two undred fifty years, and it has, I think,

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<v Speaker 2>keept this country relatively free during that period of time.

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<v Speaker 1>It is a document written by.

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<v Speaker 2>Some of the most brilliant men in all of human history,

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<v Speaker 2>people who thought deeply about politics, people who thought deeply

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<v Speaker 2>about political philosophy.

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<v Speaker 1>They thought deeply about.

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<v Speaker 2>What they wanted to create in what kind of country

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<v Speaker 2>they wanted to establish.

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<v Speaker 1>And in that sense, it is a novel of a document.

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<v Speaker 2>It is a You know, all the thinkers that worked

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<v Speaker 2>hard to put this document together, from Madison to the

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<v Speaker 2>rest of the people in the Constitution Convention, Madison, I think,

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<v Speaker 2>being the most important there had a deep understanding of

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<v Speaker 2>history of different political systems and how they be tried,

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<v Speaker 2>of what kind of worked and what didn't, and so

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<v Speaker 2>everything they put in this document is really is thoughtful

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<v Speaker 2>and intentional, and they knew what they were doing. And

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<v Speaker 2>if you're going to revise any of it, you have

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<v Speaker 2>to be as thoughtful and as knowledgeable and as much

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<v Speaker 2>of a deep thinker as they were. And one of

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<v Speaker 2>the things that's clear to me is that very few

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<v Speaker 2>people today who could do that.

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<v Speaker 1>And I wouldn't want anybody to touch the Constitution.

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<v Speaker 2>Today because they'll mess it up. In terms of the

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<v Speaker 2>kind of thinking that is necessary to put this together. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sure there are people that be within I think

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<v Speaker 2>the objectives world.

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<v Speaker 1>That could do it. But what do you need in

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<v Speaker 1>order to really if.

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<v Speaker 2>You're really going to reform the Constitution, you need not

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<v Speaker 2>only a deep understanding of what the Constitution as it is,

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<v Speaker 2>what it says, what it stands for, whatever represents how

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<v Speaker 2>it's been applied, how it's being distorted, deformed, where it's

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<v Speaker 2>been misinterpreted. You have to have a deep understanding of

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<v Speaker 2>the law and constitutional law, and you have to have

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<v Speaker 2>a deep understanding of kind of what what kind of

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<v Speaker 2>law would it be better if you're can improve, what

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<v Speaker 2>would you do better?

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<v Speaker 1>How would you do better?

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<v Speaker 2>And for that again, you need to really and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>when I've asked kind of the the the lawyers within

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<v Speaker 2>the Objectives movement.

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<v Speaker 1>The people who who deal with.

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<v Speaker 2>Constitutional law and other aspects, you know, yeah, why don't

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<v Speaker 2>you write a new constitution?

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<v Speaker 1>They're like they laugh at me. It's like, that's a life.

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<v Speaker 2>Project that is huge, that would really require, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>a fundamental some deep thinking, and it's a big project.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's not clearly what the purpose would be right

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<v Speaker 1>now to do such a thing, but it is a

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<v Speaker 1>big project.

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<v Speaker 2>And the reality is the Constitution of the United States

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<v Speaker 2>as is written is pretty damn good, pretty damn good. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>I am not a legal scholar. I'm not a constitutional

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<v Speaker 2>scholar certainly, and I am.

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<v Speaker 1>Not a.

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<v Speaker 2>Philosophy of philosophy of the law.

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<v Speaker 1>So whatever I have to say about improving the Constitution

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<v Speaker 1>is going to be in broad breast strokes, in terms

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<v Speaker 1>of what I would like to see in a constitution

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<v Speaker 1>that I think would make it better, that.

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<v Speaker 2>I think would make it more internally consistent and more

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<v Speaker 2>consistent with what I think was the intent at lest

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<v Speaker 2>I think of most of the founders or some of

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<v Speaker 2>the founders, or the intent of the idea of the Constitution.

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<v Speaker 1>As I understand it.

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<v Speaker 2>And a lot of this just comes from two hundred

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<v Speaker 2>and fifty years of seeing it in action and seeing

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<v Speaker 2>what the weaknesses are and where it's been attacked and

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<v Speaker 2>where it falls apart, and.

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<v Speaker 1>Where it is not it is not actually.

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<v Speaker 2>Worked, where it does not actually done what it is

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<v Speaker 2>supposed to do. So that's kind of the content next

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<v Speaker 2>of this. There's no question in my mind that after

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<v Speaker 2>two hundred and fifty years anything can be improved. You

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<v Speaker 2>just have more information, more knowledge, more concrete, more knowledge

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<v Speaker 2>about ways in which things could be messed up.

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<v Speaker 1>The founders knew a lot because they studied history, but they.

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<v Speaker 2>Had not lived through capitalism, They had not lived through

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<v Speaker 2>the era of anything like the one hundred and fifty

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<v Speaker 2>to two hundred years that followed, and a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>things happened that are very, very different from what happened

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<v Speaker 2>in history. One cannot learn everything from history. One has

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<v Speaker 2>to be alert to learning from the present and learning

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<v Speaker 2>from the more current history, the things that have happened

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<v Speaker 2>more recently. So what do I think is the biggest

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<v Speaker 2>with the Constitution? Again, as I see.

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<v Speaker 1>It, it's that it's not explicitly anchored to the Declaration

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<v Speaker 1>of Independence. It's not explicitly anchored to the idea that

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<v Speaker 1>the purpose of government, the role of government is to

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<v Speaker 1>protect individual rights and that's it. Now.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know if the founders fully understood that that

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<v Speaker 2>was the sole purpose of government. They came very close

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<v Speaker 2>to that, but whether they fully understood it, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe that can only happen after Ironband. But if you

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<v Speaker 2>would to reconceive of the Constitution, or redo it or

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<v Speaker 2>tinkle with it, that would be my main concern. How

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<v Speaker 2>do I make it clear in the document? And I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not going to tell you how, because I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>This is what you would need legal thinkers, legal philosophers

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<v Speaker 2>to do.

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<v Speaker 1>How do you make it clear in the document.

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<v Speaker 2>That the purpose of government, the purpose of all the structure,

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<v Speaker 2>everything that is done here is for the purpose of

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<v Speaker 2>protecting individual rights. And then indeed, the protection of individual

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<v Speaker 2>rights is the sole purpose, the sole.

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<v Speaker 1>Function of government.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, some of this I think the founder's thought was

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<v Speaker 2>implicit because it was in the Declaration Independence.

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<v Speaker 1>It's quite clear in the Declaration that that is how

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<v Speaker 1>they view the world of government. It is.

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<v Speaker 2>Man has rights, unalienable rights, life, liberty, in the pursuit

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<v Speaker 2>of happiness.

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<v Speaker 1>And to secure that, to secure.

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<v Speaker 2>These rights, governments are established, instituted among men, deriving their

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<v Speaker 2>power from the consent of the government.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's that.

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<v Speaker 2>To secure these rights, governments instituted among men that.

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<v Speaker 1>I think should be in.

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<v Speaker 2>The Constitution, should frame the Constitution, should be in the

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<v Speaker 2>preamble to the Constitution. And then and I know this

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<v Speaker 2>is kind of weird, but then what it really needs

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<v Speaker 2>is a definition of rights, a definition of rights. But

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<v Speaker 2>it's unequivocal what exactly the authors of the document mean

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<v Speaker 2>when they say to secure these rights, what that means,

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<v Speaker 2>what that implies, and not.

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<v Speaker 1>Defining rights as.

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<v Speaker 2>A list of rights, Like it's somewhat attempted, attempted in

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<v Speaker 2>the Bill of Rights.

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<v Speaker 1>But even though they know that's wrong.

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<v Speaker 2>So they have a Knight amendment that says, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>it's it's it's not just these rights. You know, here's

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<v Speaker 2>the ninth the enumeration in the Constitution of certain rights

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<v Speaker 2>shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained

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<v Speaker 2>by the people. Right, so they know, But what do

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<v Speaker 2>we mean by rights? This is a politically contentious issue.

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<v Speaker 2>Now it might be very very Maybe it was very

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<v Speaker 2>well understood by the people at the time. Maybe it

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<v Speaker 2>was very well understood by the intellectuals at the time.

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<v Speaker 2>They knew what they meant by rights. The people knew

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<v Speaker 2>what they meant by rights. Everybody understood rights at the

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<v Speaker 2>time in a similar way, and it's quite reasonable that

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<v Speaker 2>they couldn't predict, you know, the contient progressive revolution that

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<v Speaker 2>happened that basically steals the concept of rights, steals it

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<v Speaker 2>completely and completely distorts it and perverts it, and ultimately

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<v Speaker 2>you have a concept and a philosophy that nobody really understands.

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<v Speaker 2>Nobody knows what they're really talking about. So I'd say

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<v Speaker 2>the most important thing to me in a new constitution

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<v Speaker 2>would be to define the role of government.

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<v Speaker 1>As the protection of individual rights.

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<v Speaker 2>And to be clear and what that meant, to be

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<v Speaker 2>clear and what that meant to articulate what rights mean

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<v Speaker 2>and then maybe have something like a Bill of rights,

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<v Speaker 2>which then in a sense concretizes, concreatizes what is meant

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<v Speaker 2>by rights, What rights the people individuals have, and in

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<v Speaker 2>what ways can they be abridged, and what ways and

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<v Speaker 2>how explicitly we want to prevent the government from doing that.

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<v Speaker 1>So you know that I think.

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<v Speaker 2>Would be the number you know, the number one thing

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<v Speaker 2>that I would argue for. And look, he has another

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<v Speaker 2>I think important point, kind of as a preamble to

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<v Speaker 2>all this.

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<v Speaker 1>No constitution, No constitution can survive.

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<v Speaker 2>A culture whose ideas reject its foundation. Again, no constitution

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<v Speaker 2>can survive the philosophical ideas.

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<v Speaker 1>That reject its foundation.

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<v Speaker 2>So no matter how well they would have written a constitution,

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<v Speaker 2>it would have been undermined when justices of the Supreme Court,

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<v Speaker 2>who are responsible for interpretting and understanding the Constitution, lose

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<v Speaker 2>that understand standing because they fundamental philosophy is counter to it.

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<v Speaker 2>They're not going to interpret it right, They're not going

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<v Speaker 2>to do it well. Or what will happen is the

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<v Speaker 2>Constitution we've scrapped and some other document will replace it.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, imagine if.

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<v Speaker 2>FDR had faced a situation where everything that he wanted

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<v Speaker 2>was deemed, you know, for the right reasons and deep

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<v Speaker 2>down unconstitutional, not just the things that this has been

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<v Speaker 2>quote at the time.

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<v Speaker 1>Actually did rules unconstitutional, but really everything.

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<v Speaker 2>What would have happened in America? Right, I mean, most

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<v Speaker 2>of the people would have said, why is the Supreme

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<v Speaker 2>quote stopping the president from trying to stop this horrific.

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<v Speaker 1>Depression?

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<v Speaker 2>How does the swim Court have the power to prevent

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<v Speaker 2>the President of Congress from doing and relieving the pain

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<v Speaker 2>that we're experiencing. Now, maybe if we stuck the constitution,

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<v Speaker 2>that pain would have never happened, because maybe they would

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<v Speaker 2>have never been a federal reserve, and because that would

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<v Speaker 2>have been ruled on constitutional. And maybe if there was

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<v Speaker 2>a federal reserve, there wouldn't have been a great depression,

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<v Speaker 2>and maybe none of this, all of this would be void.

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<v Speaker 2>But the point is, if people really want something, they'll

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<v Speaker 2>find a way to get it. They'll approve the existing

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<v Speaker 2>constitution of replace it was something different. And some Latin

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<v Speaker 2>Americans countries have had multiple constitutions, multiple constitutions, they keep

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<v Speaker 2>changing them, they keep replacing them.

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<v Speaker 1>And so again I don't think that.

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<v Speaker 2>The bad stuff that's happened in this country, the move

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<v Speaker 2>away from liberty and freedom and individual rights in this

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<v Speaker 2>country is primarily the fault of the Constitution. Wasn't written

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<v Speaker 2>tightly enough, accurately enough. No, not at all, not at all.

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<v Speaker 2>The blame is in the fact that the intellectuals in America,

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<v Speaker 2>the philosophers and intellectuals of America post founding had did

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<v Speaker 2>not have the capacity, did not have the ideas to

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<v Speaker 2>defend the existing Constitution and the existing Declaration of Independence

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<v Speaker 2>and see the connections between the two, and as a consequence,

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<v Speaker 2>the people lost all understanding of the meaning of the Constitution.

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<v Speaker 1>The people lost.

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<v Speaker 2>A sense of what the declaration meant. And then it's

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<v Speaker 2>no surprise that the judges who get who go to

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<v Speaker 2>the same universities with intellectuals teach who are undermining the Constitution,

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<v Speaker 2>that the judges lose all connection to the real meaning

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<v Speaker 2>of these ideas and what the founders actually meant. So

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<v Speaker 2>no matter what would have been written, we'd still be

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<v Speaker 2>in bad shape.

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<v Speaker 1>Now.

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<v Speaker 3>It's also true, though, that are certain issues we are

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<v Speaker 3>much much, much, much much better off for having a

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<v Speaker 3>constitution and than not, and maybe if the Constitution being

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<v Speaker 3>tighter in certain places.

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<v Speaker 1>We would be a little better off.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I think that the best example of this

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<v Speaker 2>is is feedom of speech. We have a first Amendment,

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<v Speaker 2>it's clear that the government cannot censor. Courts have mostly

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<v Speaker 2>understood this, not always, not consistently, but they mostly understood this.

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<v Speaker 1>I'd say in more recent time they've understood this better

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<v Speaker 1>than in the past.

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<v Speaker 2>And as a consequence of the United States has more

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<v Speaker 2>free speech, more free speech then other countries in the

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<v Speaker 2>West that don't have a First Amendment, where it's just dependent,

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<v Speaker 2>where it's just dependent on, you know, a majority on.

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<v Speaker 1>Democracy.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think that's true of a lot of the

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<v Speaker 2>freedoms we still have today. We have those freedoms not

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<v Speaker 2>because the people in America appreciate those freedoms, not because

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<v Speaker 2>people in America understand those freedoms, not because our politicians

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<v Speaker 2>get it and want to preserve those freedoms. Big part

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<v Speaker 2>of why we have the freedoms that we have today

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<v Speaker 2>in the United States is because we have a constitution

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<v Speaker 2>that is still respected, not because it's understood necessarily, but

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<v Speaker 2>in respect that.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so the founding Document, this is what America is,

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<v Speaker 1>and we'll do it.

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<v Speaker 2>And of course we're seeing that president after president after president,

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<v Speaker 2>Congress after Congress after Congress challenge that tweak it, push it,

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<v Speaker 2>try to stretch it to the limit, and the court

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<v Speaker 2>is overwhelmed. We're trying to rein it into the best

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<v Speaker 2>of their understanding. A constitution that was clear on what

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<v Speaker 2>individual rights mean, I think would make it easier to

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<v Speaker 2>preserve the true meaning of the Constitution. A constitution that

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<v Speaker 2>was explicit about individual rights would also allow I think,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, who knows what would happen in the crazy

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<v Speaker 2>world of today. You know, one of the amazing things

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<v Speaker 2>that I find in.

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<v Speaker 1>When we.

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<v Speaker 2>When you watch the proceedings of confirmation hearings for judges,

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<v Speaker 2>Supreme Court judges, it's how anti intellectual most of the

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<v Speaker 2>discussion is. It doesn't really go to what do you

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<v Speaker 2>think the Constitution means? Almost never never a discussion of

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<v Speaker 2>rights and what they mean. It's a lot of concrete

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<v Speaker 2>pro abortion against abortion.

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<v Speaker 1>How would you will on this? How would you will

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<v Speaker 1>un that?

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<v Speaker 2>Very concrete bound, very anti intellectual, very disappointing. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>if I were a senator, I would want to know,

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<v Speaker 2>how do you understand the Constitution? What do you understand

398
00:27:55.839 --> 00:27:57.839
<v Speaker 2>the Constitution to mean when it says X, y Z,

399
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<v Speaker 2>What is the the president. What is the power of Congress?

400
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<v Speaker 2>And what does the Bill of Rights mean? What is

401
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<v Speaker 2>the Second Amendment or the First Amendment, fourth Amendment, and

402
00:28:08.920 --> 00:28:11.799
<v Speaker 2>what is the Ninth Amendment most importantly mean, What does

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00:28:11.839 --> 00:28:15.200
<v Speaker 2>it mean that there's still unenumerated rights that are held

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<v Speaker 2>by the people. What are those rights? How would you

405
00:28:17.759 --> 00:28:24.000
<v Speaker 2>define those rights? How would you find those rights? I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>that would be an unbelievable conversation that would be exciting

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<v Speaker 2>to listen to, and I think, in modern times very

408
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<v Speaker 2>very very depressing, But it would tell us.

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<v Speaker 1>It would give us the information we need in order

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<v Speaker 1>to make an evaluation of the people who are going

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<v Speaker 1>to be Supreme Court judges. So I think that if

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<v Speaker 1>we had more of that, more legal philosophy, definition of rights,

413
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<v Speaker 1>examples of rights, what they mean, how they're applied, I

414
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<v Speaker 1>think that would force the conversation. It would surface it

415
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<v Speaker 1>to the bring it to the surface, or.

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<v Speaker 2>If the constitutions somehow refer back to the declaration, is

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<v Speaker 2>this is the context?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, some presidents understood this.

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<v Speaker 2>I know Lincoln, for example, definitely understood the relationship between

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<v Speaker 2>the Declaration of the and the and the and the Constitution.

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<v Speaker 2>The declaration says the purpose of government. The Constitution is

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<v Speaker 2>an articulation of okay, of the structure based on that,

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<v Speaker 2>given the purpose of protection rights, this is, to the

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<v Speaker 2>best of our knowledge, is the best way to structure government.

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<v Speaker 2>And by the way, in terms of the structure of government,

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<v Speaker 2>I really have no.

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<v Speaker 1>Qualms with the Constitution, so.

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<v Speaker 2>Rights, finding them, being clear on what they mean, and

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<v Speaker 2>then as part of that, and being clear about the

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<v Speaker 2>world of governing protecting rights.

431
00:30:12.480 --> 00:30:13.079
<v Speaker 1>As part of.

432
00:30:13.039 --> 00:30:19.079
<v Speaker 2>That, I think it would be good to articulate in

433
00:30:19.079 --> 00:30:26.359
<v Speaker 2>a sense to conquitize what we mean by the government

434
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:30.079
<v Speaker 2>protect the individual rights and not and not involving itself

435
00:30:30.119 --> 00:30:32.079
<v Speaker 2>in other things.

436
00:30:34.319 --> 00:30:38.799
<v Speaker 1>It would be good in a sense to articulate some

437
00:30:38.839 --> 00:30:40.680
<v Speaker 1>issues that have.

438
00:30:42.680 --> 00:30:51.039
<v Speaker 2>Become you know, obviously problematic over the last two hundred years,

439
00:30:51.039 --> 00:30:56.519
<v Speaker 2>areas where the government is infringing on our rights and

440
00:30:56.640 --> 00:31:00.200
<v Speaker 2>has infringed in our rights and ever, you know, an

441
00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:04.200
<v Speaker 2>ever increasing manner. So I mean, you could start with,

442
00:31:06.680 --> 00:31:12.920
<v Speaker 2>you know, something like education or you know, or actually,

443
00:31:13.039 --> 00:31:15.960
<v Speaker 2>let's start with something else. Let's start with education is related,

444
00:31:16.119 --> 00:31:21.559
<v Speaker 2>but let's start with religion. The one area that the

445
00:31:21.599 --> 00:31:26.920
<v Speaker 2>Founders understood that there was a real danger of an

446
00:31:26.920 --> 00:31:34.119
<v Speaker 2>erosion and where the state could and would intervene and

447
00:31:35.279 --> 00:31:37.720
<v Speaker 2>in a way that was destructive to how they viewed

448
00:31:37.839 --> 00:31:45.920
<v Speaker 2>individual rights. Was in the area of religion. You have

449
00:31:45.920 --> 00:31:51.240
<v Speaker 2>to understand that the Enlightenment arises out of a period

450
00:31:51.279 --> 00:31:55.759
<v Speaker 2>of religious wars. The Enlightenment is an error in which

451
00:31:58.039 --> 00:32:00.519
<v Speaker 2>part of what's driving all the thinkers that to think

452
00:32:00.559 --> 00:32:05.519
<v Speaker 2>about political philosophy is how do we prevent the app

453
00:32:06.160 --> 00:32:07.599
<v Speaker 2>solute slaughter.

454
00:32:08.880 --> 00:32:10.640
<v Speaker 1>That happened during.

455
00:32:10.440 --> 00:32:12.720
<v Speaker 2>The Thirty Year War and during many of the other

456
00:32:12.799 --> 00:32:17.240
<v Speaker 2>wars that inflicted Europe in the pre Enlightenment era.

457
00:32:19.400 --> 00:32:22.000
<v Speaker 1>And they recognized and.

458
00:32:21.920 --> 00:32:25.200
<v Speaker 2>It was clear to them that much of the motivation

459
00:32:25.480 --> 00:32:31.160
<v Speaker 2>for the slaughter was religion, and they wanted to make

460
00:32:31.200 --> 00:32:35.720
<v Speaker 2>sure that this is one thing that they protected us against.

461
00:32:37.920 --> 00:32:39.880
<v Speaker 1>And that is why you know.

462
00:32:39.880 --> 00:32:42.920
<v Speaker 2>Amendment number one in the Bill of Rights is Congress

463
00:32:42.920 --> 00:32:48.680
<v Speaker 2>shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or

464
00:32:48.720 --> 00:32:57.559
<v Speaker 2>prohibiting the free exercise thereof I mean, that is powerful

465
00:32:57.680 --> 00:33:01.079
<v Speaker 2>stuff for the seventeenth century, for the eighteenth century.

466
00:33:01.720 --> 00:33:04.119
<v Speaker 1>I mean today we can take it for granted, but

467
00:33:04.759 --> 00:33:07.359
<v Speaker 1>that was an era in which most people were religious.

468
00:33:07.519 --> 00:33:13.359
<v Speaker 1>Overwhelming majority of people were religious, and not just in America,

469
00:33:13.440 --> 00:33:16.079
<v Speaker 1>but Europe was even more religious. Than America was.

470
00:33:16.839 --> 00:33:21.759
<v Speaker 2>Every country in Europe had a state religion. While there

471
00:33:21.759 --> 00:33:26.279
<v Speaker 2>were no religious wars, there was still religious antagonism between

472
00:33:26.279 --> 00:33:33.960
<v Speaker 2>Catholics and Protestants and various parts of Europe. So the

473
00:33:34.039 --> 00:33:37.920
<v Speaker 2>Founders wanted to make clear that with they got a

474
00:33:38.000 --> 00:33:44.400
<v Speaker 2>one set of ideas, you cannot restrict it, you cannot

475
00:33:44.400 --> 00:33:44.960
<v Speaker 2>prohibit it.

476
00:33:48.200 --> 00:33:50.279
<v Speaker 1>I think if they'd lived through the twentieth.

477
00:33:49.920 --> 00:33:57.079
<v Speaker 2>Century, they would have said, huh, it seems like people

478
00:33:57.160 --> 00:34:03.640
<v Speaker 2>kill each other, not just over religion, but over ideas

479
00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:06.880
<v Speaker 2>more broadly. Now they already recognize this, and this is

480
00:34:06.880 --> 00:34:08.840
<v Speaker 2>why the rest of the paragraph, the rest of the

481
00:34:08.880 --> 00:34:13.000
<v Speaker 2>First Amendment is or abridging the freedom of speech or

482
00:34:13.039 --> 00:34:16.639
<v Speaker 2>the press, of the press, or the right of the

483
00:34:16.679 --> 00:34:21.280
<v Speaker 2>people peacefully to assemble and to petition the government for

484
00:34:21.400 --> 00:34:22.480
<v Speaker 2>redress of grievances.

485
00:34:23.679 --> 00:34:27.079
<v Speaker 1>So they say, you can't.

486
00:34:27.360 --> 00:34:32.159
<v Speaker 2>You can't restrict a freedom when it comes to ideas

487
00:34:32.199 --> 00:34:37.159
<v Speaker 2>and the expression of those ideas. So what Congress here

488
00:34:37.360 --> 00:34:41.840
<v Speaker 2>creates is a separation of state and religion, which is

489
00:34:41.880 --> 00:34:44.039
<v Speaker 2>even more explicit than Virginia Constitution.

490
00:34:44.199 --> 00:34:46.920
<v Speaker 1>But it is pretty explicit here.

491
00:34:48.559 --> 00:34:52.800
<v Speaker 2>Religion has no role in government, but does a sense

492
00:34:52.840 --> 00:34:56.599
<v Speaker 2>in which ideas have no role in government all ideas.

493
00:34:57.920 --> 00:34:58.599
<v Speaker 1>Governor is not.

494
00:35:00.119 --> 00:35:03.599
<v Speaker 2>An advocate for capitalism or an advocate for socialism, or

495
00:35:03.599 --> 00:35:04.880
<v Speaker 2>an advocate for anything.

496
00:35:06.559 --> 00:35:08.320
<v Speaker 1>It's an advocate for individual rights.

497
00:35:10.400 --> 00:35:13.280
<v Speaker 2>People can hold whatever ideas they want as long as

498
00:35:13.320 --> 00:35:14.719
<v Speaker 2>they don't violate other people's rights.

499
00:35:14.719 --> 00:35:22.559
<v Speaker 1>They can apply those ideas in their lives. So I

500
00:35:22.559 --> 00:35:23.280
<v Speaker 1>would have liked to.

501
00:35:23.199 --> 00:35:27.719
<v Speaker 2>See a more explicit recognition of Congress shall make no

502
00:35:27.840 --> 00:35:34.079
<v Speaker 2>law respecting the establishment of any kind of ideas, including religion.

503
00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:43.559
<v Speaker 2>Guman should separate itself in the realm of ideas, and

504
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:47.559
<v Speaker 2>maybe that would make it easier then to see the need.

505
00:35:48.360 --> 00:35:54.239
<v Speaker 1>For another separation, a separation of the state from education.

506
00:35:55.679 --> 00:36:00.000
<v Speaker 2>Now, the funny thing is that you know the Thomas Jefferson,

507
00:36:00.280 --> 00:36:06.760
<v Speaker 2>one of the founding fathers, was really the first to

508
00:36:06.960 --> 00:36:10.119
<v Speaker 2>on the one hand, articulate these rights and agree with

509
00:36:10.159 --> 00:36:14.280
<v Speaker 2>these in a sense separations tape of religion, but then

510
00:36:14.760 --> 00:36:25.199
<v Speaker 2>founds a state university run by the state state of Virginia,

511
00:36:26.559 --> 00:36:28.280
<v Speaker 2>now now by the federal government. But I don't think

512
00:36:28.320 --> 00:36:37.920
<v Speaker 2>that is. The principle is when should not mix government

513
00:36:37.960 --> 00:36:42.679
<v Speaker 2>worth education? And yet the first mix we see in

514
00:36:42.719 --> 00:36:47.360
<v Speaker 2>American is a mixture of government with education. That's in

515
00:36:47.400 --> 00:36:54.400
<v Speaker 2>the founding of the University of Virginia. So some I'd

516
00:36:54.400 --> 00:36:57.199
<v Speaker 2>like to see in a revised constitution, if you will,

517
00:36:58.679 --> 00:36:59.360
<v Speaker 2>some kind of.

518
00:36:59.400 --> 00:37:01.360
<v Speaker 1>Language that makes it clear.

519
00:37:02.599 --> 00:37:05.599
<v Speaker 2>Even though if you define individual rights properly and you

520
00:37:05.639 --> 00:37:08.239
<v Speaker 2>define the role of government has only protecting individual.

521
00:37:07.880 --> 00:37:12.719
<v Speaker 1>Rights, this should be obvious, but it's good to articulate

522
00:37:12.760 --> 00:37:19.880
<v Speaker 1>it explicitly that there should be a complete separation of

523
00:37:20.039 --> 00:37:27.400
<v Speaker 1>state from education. The state has no role in education,

524
00:37:27.679 --> 00:37:31.000
<v Speaker 1>has no role in ideas and in religion, and has

525
00:37:31.039 --> 00:37:36.239
<v Speaker 1>no role in education. It doesn't have a perspective on it.

526
00:37:35.559 --> 00:37:38.639
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't have a role in It doesn't think it's

527
00:37:38.639 --> 00:37:42.239
<v Speaker 2>good or bad any particular education is good or bad.

528
00:37:42.880 --> 00:37:46.519
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't have a position, and it doesn't as a consequence,

529
00:37:46.599 --> 00:37:53.320
<v Speaker 2>fund it regulated control, it limited restricted, And that, by

530
00:37:53.360 --> 00:37:55.440
<v Speaker 2>the way, not just should apply to the federal government,

531
00:37:55.480 --> 00:37:59.880
<v Speaker 2>but to state governments as well.

532
00:38:00.119 --> 00:38:01.119
<v Speaker 1>And that would be interesting.

533
00:38:01.639 --> 00:38:08.519
<v Speaker 2>Should a federal constitutions state explicitly these particular things state

534
00:38:08.559 --> 00:38:09.840
<v Speaker 2>governments cannot abridge either.

535
00:38:10.760 --> 00:38:11.880
<v Speaker 1>So for example, if we have.

536
00:38:13.400 --> 00:38:16.559
<v Speaker 2>A Congress would make no law respecting establishment of religion,

537
00:38:16.639 --> 00:38:21.559
<v Speaker 2>does that apply to the states. What about if you

538
00:38:21.599 --> 00:38:24.360
<v Speaker 2>separate state from education, can not apply to the states.

539
00:38:24.400 --> 00:38:30.320
<v Speaker 2>It should what else should we separate, So we separated ideas,

540
00:38:31.239 --> 00:38:36.400
<v Speaker 2>we separate education. Here's a big one, and a big

541
00:38:36.480 --> 00:38:43.039
<v Speaker 2>one primarily because this is where we've seen more violations

542
00:38:43.079 --> 00:38:47.960
<v Speaker 2>of rights, more violations of I think original intent than

543
00:38:48.000 --> 00:38:53.639
<v Speaker 2>anywhere else, and that is when it comes to economic activity.

544
00:38:54.480 --> 00:38:58.280
<v Speaker 2>I'd love to see some kind of statement in the

545
00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:08.119
<v Speaker 2>Constitution says the Congress shall make no laws respecting the production, trade,

546
00:39:08.559 --> 00:39:16.599
<v Speaker 2>and consumption of goods. Something like that, some amendment, some

547
00:39:16.639 --> 00:39:19.800
<v Speaker 2>provision that separates.

548
00:39:20.119 --> 00:39:25.760
<v Speaker 1>Here's another separation government from economics.

549
00:39:28.360 --> 00:39:31.280
<v Speaker 2>And I think you would do more than just Congress

550
00:39:31.320 --> 00:39:37.079
<v Speaker 2>shall make no law respecting the restrictions on production, trade,

551
00:39:37.400 --> 00:39:42.480
<v Speaker 2>and consumption. But then it should have something about government

552
00:39:42.480 --> 00:39:46.039
<v Speaker 2>should not establish a central bank. Government should not engage

553
00:39:46.079 --> 00:39:52.400
<v Speaker 2>in any restrictions on money, on the establishment of money,

554
00:39:53.440 --> 00:39:59.079
<v Speaker 2>government should set a denomination for currency which taxes are paid.

555
00:39:59.199 --> 00:40:05.320
<v Speaker 2>Other than that, it has no role in money. So

556
00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:12.280
<v Speaker 2>you know, regulation, what are regulations they're establishing restrictions on production,

557
00:40:13.519 --> 00:40:18.000
<v Speaker 2>establishing with restrictions are trade, the establishing with restrictions on.

558
00:40:20.199 --> 00:40:26.000
<v Speaker 1>Consumption. By the way, what a provision like that prohibit tariffs? Yes,

559
00:40:27.119 --> 00:40:30.599
<v Speaker 1>I have said explicitly a restriction on trade and consumption.

560
00:40:32.280 --> 00:40:38.960
<v Speaker 2>The constitution should make tariffs impossible by limiting the government's

561
00:40:39.000 --> 00:40:40.000
<v Speaker 2>ability to.

562
00:40:39.760 --> 00:40:43.960
<v Speaker 1>Restrict those things. To regulate those things.

563
00:40:44.800 --> 00:40:49.039
<v Speaker 2>And regulate, of course, is another one of those woods

564
00:40:49.039 --> 00:40:50.920
<v Speaker 2>that have changed its meaning.

565
00:40:53.239 --> 00:40:58.679
<v Speaker 1>Over the over the uh uh, over the decades, centuries.

566
00:40:59.360 --> 00:41:03.239
<v Speaker 2>Uh it, you know, what does regulate actually mean? Does

567
00:41:03.280 --> 00:41:09.480
<v Speaker 2>regulate being control? That's how we interpret it today?

568
00:41:11.039 --> 00:41:16.480
<v Speaker 1>Is that? How right? Is that?

569
00:41:16.519 --> 00:41:19.960
<v Speaker 2>How they meant it when they say to regulate comments

570
00:41:19.960 --> 00:41:23.639
<v Speaker 2>with foreign nations and among the several states? Is it

571
00:41:23.679 --> 00:41:27.320
<v Speaker 2>to make it regular or to control it? And then

572
00:41:27.360 --> 00:41:30.079
<v Speaker 2>they also say to coin money, which they should never

573
00:41:30.239 --> 00:41:33.519
<v Speaker 2>live allowed. This is already an intervention in the economy, right,

574
00:41:33.519 --> 00:41:35.760
<v Speaker 2>there should never have been allowed that the government coined

575
00:41:35.800 --> 00:41:41.119
<v Speaker 2>money to regulate the value thereof again shouldn't have been allowed.

576
00:41:42.519 --> 00:41:49.880
<v Speaker 2>Regulates control, So all these regulates should not have been

577
00:41:49.880 --> 00:41:59.480
<v Speaker 2>in there. Right, and then the whole issue of collecting taxes, duties, imposts,

578
00:41:59.559 --> 00:42:07.440
<v Speaker 2>an x is is problematic. It's again violation of rights,

579
00:42:12.679 --> 00:42:16.199
<v Speaker 2>so separation state from the economics. But with a lot

580
00:42:16.239 --> 00:42:21.800
<v Speaker 2>of thought given to how does that apply to trade

581
00:42:23.000 --> 00:42:26.119
<v Speaker 2>among people in the state, how does that apply to

582
00:42:26.199 --> 00:42:33.679
<v Speaker 2>trade with others? Maybe some something about national security, state

583
00:42:33.679 --> 00:42:34.039
<v Speaker 2>of war.

584
00:42:34.159 --> 00:42:34.960
<v Speaker 1>Something like that.

585
00:42:35.119 --> 00:42:42.239
<v Speaker 2>Congress can in extraordinary measures at a you know, at

586
00:42:42.239 --> 00:42:46.559
<v Speaker 2>a time of war, restrict the trade with the enemy

587
00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:51.400
<v Speaker 2>as the only exception because it is an exception, because

588
00:42:51.440 --> 00:42:55.440
<v Speaker 2>it's there. Because the purpose is still to protect individual rights.

589
00:43:00.039 --> 00:43:03.239
<v Speaker 2>There should be a provision in terms of how to

590
00:43:03.360 --> 00:43:09.840
<v Speaker 2>raise revenue without violating rights. That would be part of

591
00:43:10.679 --> 00:43:14.119
<v Speaker 2>a new amendment to the Constitution, right to the Bill

592
00:43:14.159 --> 00:43:15.559
<v Speaker 2>of Rights.

593
00:43:24.400 --> 00:43:36.800
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, so separation state fan economics very essential, very needed.

594
00:43:38.639 --> 00:43:41.079
<v Speaker 1>The realm in which rights are violated the.

595
00:43:41.079 --> 00:43:47.559
<v Speaker 2>Most these days, right, is in the realm of economic activity,

596
00:43:47.559 --> 00:43:49.519
<v Speaker 2>in the realm of production and the realm of trade.

597
00:43:50.280 --> 00:43:53.719
<v Speaker 2>And you need to have it clear in the Constitution.

598
00:43:53.840 --> 00:43:54.760
<v Speaker 1>That has not allowed.

599
00:43:57.480 --> 00:44:02.480
<v Speaker 2>And I would say a fourth separate that really comes

600
00:44:02.519 --> 00:44:08.320
<v Speaker 2>out of our experiences in modern times and suddenly what's

601
00:44:08.360 --> 00:44:13.480
<v Speaker 2>going on right now, but really that's been going off

602
00:44:13.519 --> 00:44:14.239
<v Speaker 2>for the last.

603
00:44:14.119 --> 00:44:18.239
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, eighty ninety years, and that is a

604
00:44:18.280 --> 00:44:24.159
<v Speaker 1>separation of state from science. A separation of state from science.

605
00:44:25.559 --> 00:44:28.400
<v Speaker 2>A clear articulation of the fact that the state doesn't

606
00:44:28.400 --> 00:44:32.039
<v Speaker 2>have a position on science, an opinion on scientific truth.

607
00:44:33.400 --> 00:44:38.400
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't have a view about what science is correct

608
00:44:38.400 --> 00:44:45.440
<v Speaker 2>and what is not. It doesn't have it doesn't fund science.

609
00:44:48.159 --> 00:44:52.760
<v Speaker 2>And again here you would have to have one coveyat

610
00:44:53.159 --> 00:44:58.639
<v Speaker 2>one exemption, and you'd have to be very clear on

611
00:44:58.719 --> 00:45:01.119
<v Speaker 2>it because this is an time you have an exemption.

612
00:45:01.840 --> 00:45:03.199
<v Speaker 1>This is where you could have abuse.

613
00:45:03.760 --> 00:45:14.880
<v Speaker 2>Right that is, an exemption should be for national security.

614
00:45:14.880 --> 00:45:21.079
<v Speaker 1>For defense said still be possible under this constitution, this

615
00:45:21.159 --> 00:45:27.559
<v Speaker 1>new constitution, to have a Manhattan Project and to have

616
00:45:27.719 --> 00:45:29.559
<v Speaker 1>ongoing a.

617
00:45:29.559 --> 00:45:36.519
<v Speaker 2>Defense Department funding, particularly lines of research that explicitly and

618
00:45:36.679 --> 00:45:44.400
<v Speaker 2>unambiguously a serving national security needs. I know, whether it's

619
00:45:44.599 --> 00:45:51.480
<v Speaker 2>research into missiles, or whether it's research into today even

620
00:45:51.519 --> 00:45:57.400
<v Speaker 2>into hacking and cybersecurity and things like that. But I

621
00:45:57.480 --> 00:46:01.199
<v Speaker 2>don't know how you do this, but somehow the burden

622
00:46:01.599 --> 00:46:07.360
<v Speaker 2>has to be very high to convince that this is

623
00:46:07.400 --> 00:46:13.599
<v Speaker 2>indeed a national security issue. The government doesn't have to

624
00:46:13.639 --> 00:46:17.840
<v Speaker 2>buy doesn't have to do research into police equipment, It

625
00:46:17.880 --> 00:46:22.880
<v Speaker 2>just has to buy it. But when it comes to

626
00:46:23.239 --> 00:46:27.639
<v Speaker 2>national defense, there are big projects that would not happen

627
00:46:27.679 --> 00:46:30.679
<v Speaker 2>because there's no use for them unless the Defense Department

628
00:46:30.760 --> 00:46:42.199
<v Speaker 2>is buying them. So for me, the most important of

629
00:46:42.280 --> 00:46:46.119
<v Speaker 2>these is again defining rights, making clear what it is,

630
00:46:46.239 --> 00:46:50.400
<v Speaker 2>making clear what the purpose of government is. I would

631
00:46:50.480 --> 00:46:53.960
<v Speaker 2>get rid of ambiguous language like in the preamble to

632
00:46:54.000 --> 00:46:56.920
<v Speaker 2>the Constitution, which says promote the general welfare.

633
00:46:57.719 --> 00:47:01.320
<v Speaker 1>That has led to again, what do they mean by

634
00:47:01.320 --> 00:47:02.199
<v Speaker 1>the general welfare?

635
00:47:02.440 --> 00:47:05.679
<v Speaker 2>And what they meant which might have been securing rights

636
00:47:05.679 --> 00:47:06.519
<v Speaker 2>for individuals.

637
00:47:06.599 --> 00:47:08.960
<v Speaker 1>Look at the Declaration independence. That's what we meant.

638
00:47:09.599 --> 00:47:11.599
<v Speaker 2>Is not what people today or what people in the

639
00:47:11.719 --> 00:47:15.079
<v Speaker 2>interim were meant. So I'd love to get rid of

640
00:47:15.159 --> 00:47:18.320
<v Speaker 2>empiguis languages like that and make it more explicit about

641
00:47:18.400 --> 00:47:21.480
<v Speaker 2>rights with a definition and articulation of what it is.

642
00:47:21.519 --> 00:47:27.159
<v Speaker 2>And then for separations from ideas i e. Religion is

643
00:47:27.199 --> 00:47:34.760
<v Speaker 2>one idea or e g. Religion separation from education, which

644
00:47:34.800 --> 00:47:40.199
<v Speaker 2>is related to ideas. No public schools, no public education,

645
00:47:40.440 --> 00:47:45.039
<v Speaker 2>no government funded education, no government loans for education, no

646
00:47:45.119 --> 00:47:51.360
<v Speaker 2>government grants for educational institutions, no government involvement in education,

647
00:47:52.559 --> 00:48:00.000
<v Speaker 2>no national standards, no tests, NODI requirements, no title none,

648
00:48:01.000 --> 00:48:07.400
<v Speaker 2>no affirmative action, no involvement of the government in the

649
00:48:07.519 --> 00:48:13.400
<v Speaker 2>educational process. As long as there's no violation of individual rights.

650
00:48:13.440 --> 00:48:15.480
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's fine to say you can't beat your

651
00:48:15.519 --> 00:48:18.679
<v Speaker 2>students because that's a violation of their rights.

652
00:48:20.800 --> 00:48:22.440
<v Speaker 1>You can't torture them.

653
00:48:22.519 --> 00:48:24.679
<v Speaker 2>I mean, there's a bunch of things you can say about,

654
00:48:25.079 --> 00:48:30.440
<v Speaker 2>but mostly education should be private and left to parents

655
00:48:30.440 --> 00:48:37.840
<v Speaker 2>and teachers and administrators and entrepreneurs to determine. Complete separations

656
00:48:37.840 --> 00:48:42.639
<v Speaker 2>stay from economics other than protection against fraud.

657
00:48:43.280 --> 00:48:46.199
<v Speaker 1>And the articulation.

658
00:48:47.199 --> 00:48:52.400
<v Speaker 2>Of the essence of property rights and the boundaries thereof,

659
00:48:52.480 --> 00:48:56.360
<v Speaker 2>and that again should be part of the role of government.

660
00:48:56.400 --> 00:48:58.840
<v Speaker 2>Part of the role of government is to help define

661
00:48:59.000 --> 00:49:07.800
<v Speaker 2>property rights in different realms, and I think Section eight

662
00:49:07.960 --> 00:49:12.119
<v Speaker 2>of the Constitution articulates some of that. It also articulates

663
00:49:12.159 --> 00:49:15.039
<v Speaker 2>things that are not shouldn't do it, like, for example,

664
00:49:15.360 --> 00:49:19.320
<v Speaker 2>established post offices and post roads. No, I mean that

665
00:49:19.320 --> 00:49:34.000
<v Speaker 2>should all be private sector. And then finally, and nobody

666
00:49:34.039 --> 00:49:36.159
<v Speaker 2>could have foreseen that this would be an issue, that

667
00:49:36.199 --> 00:49:36.639
<v Speaker 2>this would be.

668
00:49:36.639 --> 00:49:39.320
<v Speaker 1>A problem until more recent times.

669
00:49:39.360 --> 00:49:42.760
<v Speaker 2>I'd say climate change, and then everything going on today

670
00:49:42.840 --> 00:49:46.639
<v Speaker 2>about with MAHA, you know, make America healthy again, and

671
00:49:46.679 --> 00:49:50.800
<v Speaker 2>all of that, complete separation of state from science.

672
00:49:51.880 --> 00:49:58.239
<v Speaker 1>The government has no role in science. Those would be

673
00:49:58.239 --> 00:50:01.199
<v Speaker 1>the major changes I would make. I would make.

674
00:50:01.920 --> 00:50:07.639
<v Speaker 2>I would highlight the Ninth Amendment again, this idea that

675
00:50:08.760 --> 00:50:12.599
<v Speaker 2>whatever rights are being articulated, whatever separations are being explicitly

676
00:50:12.679 --> 00:50:16.119
<v Speaker 2>said this is not the limit this, and I would

677
00:50:16.159 --> 00:50:18.679
<v Speaker 2>I would I would spend a little bit more time

678
00:50:18.719 --> 00:50:25.639
<v Speaker 2>saying the standard is individual rights and our understanding of

679
00:50:25.639 --> 00:50:30.280
<v Speaker 2>individual rights, and that you know, over time we could say, oh,

680
00:50:30.360 --> 00:50:32.480
<v Speaker 2>we need another separation, we need we need to make

681
00:50:32.480 --> 00:50:33.239
<v Speaker 2>sure the government.

682
00:50:32.960 --> 00:50:34.000
<v Speaker 1>Doesn't intervene in this.

683
00:50:34.599 --> 00:50:37.320
<v Speaker 2>There wasn't explicitly said, just like we probably wouldn't have

684
00:50:37.400 --> 00:50:40.400
<v Speaker 2>imagined science as being one of the separations needed, or

685
00:50:40.440 --> 00:50:45.599
<v Speaker 2>even economy back in seventeen seventy six, although right off

686
00:50:45.599 --> 00:50:48.400
<v Speaker 2>the bad, right right off the bad, after the constitution

687
00:50:48.480 --> 00:50:50.159
<v Speaker 2>has passed, they start regulating banks.

688
00:50:50.440 --> 00:50:53.360
<v Speaker 1>Even before the Constitution's passed, they start regulating banks.

689
00:50:53.400 --> 00:50:55.960
<v Speaker 2>Is certainly at the state level, they were regulating the

690
00:50:55.960 --> 00:50:59.880
<v Speaker 2>economy and banks and things like that, even even you know,

691
00:51:01.480 --> 00:51:06.639
<v Speaker 2>right at the beginning. So maybe you could have already

692
00:51:06.679 --> 00:51:09.400
<v Speaker 2>seen that that was going to happen. But the extent

693
00:51:09.440 --> 00:51:12.480
<v Speaker 2>of it, I don't think anybody foresaw. But certainly science,

694
00:51:12.519 --> 00:51:15.519
<v Speaker 2>I don't think they would have foreseen that could have

695
00:51:15.519 --> 00:51:17.360
<v Speaker 2>been added, and there could be things in the future

696
00:51:17.400 --> 00:51:20.320
<v Speaker 2>that should be added. But again, if the focus is positive,

697
00:51:20.440 --> 00:51:26.159
<v Speaker 2>protect individual rights, and here's what rights are freedoms, freedom

698
00:51:26.199 --> 00:51:31.760
<v Speaker 2>in the individuals that they've lived their lives pursuing their values,

699
00:51:31.920 --> 00:51:42.599
<v Speaker 2>using their mind free of coercion, force, and authority. That's

700
00:51:42.639 --> 00:51:46.159
<v Speaker 2>really you know, once you have that, and once you

701
00:51:46.440 --> 00:51:50.519
<v Speaker 2>articulate the understanding of that. I mean, if I were

702
00:51:50.519 --> 00:51:56.920
<v Speaker 2>writing in constitutions today, I would footnote constantly Rand's Article

703
00:51:57.000 --> 00:52:01.639
<v Speaker 2>and Rand's Rights, because that's what you want them to get.

704
00:52:02.239 --> 00:52:04.880
<v Speaker 2>You want them to get the two articles from my

705
00:52:05.119 --> 00:52:08.159
<v Speaker 2>man that are crucial here Man's rights and the nature

706
00:52:08.199 --> 00:52:11.199
<v Speaker 2>of government. And you want them to get in the

707
00:52:11.239 --> 00:52:14.599
<v Speaker 2>future when they're interpreting the Constitution one hundred years from now.

708
00:52:16.199 --> 00:52:18.639
<v Speaker 2>You want them to get that these are the foundations,

709
00:52:18.800 --> 00:52:20.079
<v Speaker 2>this is what it's based on.

710
00:52:20.159 --> 00:52:22.440
<v Speaker 1>These are the ideas that are being.

711
00:52:25.760 --> 00:52:30.679
<v Speaker 2>Rearticulated into a legal document called the Constitution.

712
00:52:32.920 --> 00:52:39.360
<v Speaker 1>That's all large extent is missing, all right.

713
00:52:40.079 --> 00:52:42.079
<v Speaker 2>I think those are the main things I would do.

714
00:52:45.119 --> 00:52:48.639
<v Speaker 2>You know, something explicitly saying and I think it's in there,

715
00:52:48.679 --> 00:52:54.440
<v Speaker 2>but nobody takes it seriously. It's in the Tenth amend

716
00:52:54.679 --> 00:52:57.360
<v Speaker 2>It's in the tenth Amendment. The power is not delegated

717
00:52:57.400 --> 00:53:02.480
<v Speaker 2>to the United States by Constitution. No prohibited by it

718
00:53:02.599 --> 00:53:05.840
<v Speaker 2>to the States are reserved for the states, respectively, or

719
00:53:05.840 --> 00:53:10.760
<v Speaker 2>to the people I think, I mean, I think the

720
00:53:10.840 --> 00:53:15.000
<v Speaker 2>two things here. I don't think that is highlighted enough.

721
00:53:16.639 --> 00:53:19.239
<v Speaker 2>And I think too much power is left to the states.

722
00:53:20.559 --> 00:53:25.800
<v Speaker 2>I think the states need to be these separations need

723
00:53:25.880 --> 00:53:29.039
<v Speaker 2>to be it needs to be explicit. Then see separations

724
00:53:29.039 --> 00:53:35.440
<v Speaker 2>apply to the states. Now let me I mean there's one,

725
00:53:35.679 --> 00:53:38.840
<v Speaker 2>of course, an elephant in the room if you will,

726
00:53:39.280 --> 00:53:41.840
<v Speaker 2>that haven't even touched on, and that is, of course,

727
00:53:41.880 --> 00:53:46.400
<v Speaker 2>the Constitution up amidst slavery. Slavery is exactly a violation

728
00:53:46.480 --> 00:53:49.840
<v Speaker 2>of rights. It's exactly what neither the federal government should

729
00:53:49.880 --> 00:53:52.320
<v Speaker 2>be allowed to do or state government should be allowed

730
00:53:52.360 --> 00:53:55.840
<v Speaker 2>to do. That is, this idea that no rights should

731
00:53:55.880 --> 00:54:00.960
<v Speaker 2>be violated should apply to the federal government and through

732
00:54:01.000 --> 00:54:05.199
<v Speaker 2>the federal government to the states. So once you define rights,

733
00:54:05.920 --> 00:54:08.119
<v Speaker 2>that is the definition that holds not only for the

734
00:54:08.119 --> 00:54:10.719
<v Speaker 2>federal government, but also it's the state governments. And that

735
00:54:10.760 --> 00:54:14.360
<v Speaker 2>is what should have made slavery impossible.

736
00:54:13.880 --> 00:54:16.280
<v Speaker 1>Once the Constitution was passed.

737
00:54:26.480 --> 00:54:30.679
<v Speaker 2>So Malcolm says, I don't know if complete separation of

738
00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:34.039
<v Speaker 2>state and education will ever exist. Many free market people

739
00:54:34.239 --> 00:54:35.679
<v Speaker 2>still think it's a state's business.

740
00:54:35.679 --> 00:54:37.880
<v Speaker 1>If a child is doing is being educated wrong?

741
00:54:38.079 --> 00:54:42.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but this is exactly why many free market people

742
00:54:42.199 --> 00:54:49.280
<v Speaker 2>are in the end unprincipled and useless. Sorry, but you

743
00:54:49.360 --> 00:54:52.599
<v Speaker 2>can be I mean, put aside free market. You can

744
00:54:52.719 --> 00:54:54.440
<v Speaker 2>be an advocate for individual rights. You can't be an

745
00:54:54.440 --> 00:54:59.679
<v Speaker 2>advocate of individualism and think that the state should be

746
00:55:00.639 --> 00:55:09.199
<v Speaker 2>for defining what wrong education is. So it's because free

747
00:55:09.280 --> 00:55:20.199
<v Speaker 2>market intellectuals are so utilitarian, so unprincipled, so compromising, that

748
00:55:20.320 --> 00:55:23.320
<v Speaker 2>it's very hard to fight side by side with them

749
00:55:23.360 --> 00:55:26.960
<v Speaker 2>and actually make progress towards real freedom.

750
00:55:27.199 --> 00:55:31.760
<v Speaker 1>But real freedom, real freedom.

751
00:55:31.719 --> 00:55:36.039
<v Speaker 2>Requires the separation of state from education complete.

752
00:55:36.519 --> 00:55:40.639
<v Speaker 1>And if that can't happen, then nothing else will happen.

753
00:55:41.760 --> 00:55:44.920
<v Speaker 2>That is, if you don't understand why the state should

754
00:55:44.960 --> 00:55:48.440
<v Speaker 2>have no role in education, then I don't think you

755
00:55:48.519 --> 00:55:50.800
<v Speaker 2>understand why the state should have no role in economics.

756
00:55:51.880 --> 00:55:53.639
<v Speaker 2>Because the reason the state should have no role in

757
00:55:53.679 --> 00:55:57.320
<v Speaker 2>economics is not some utilitarian economic argument. It's not that

758
00:55:57.360 --> 00:56:01.760
<v Speaker 2>it's more efficient if the state stays out of it.

759
00:56:01.760 --> 00:56:06.599
<v Speaker 2>It's again an argument from the perspective of individual rights,

760
00:56:06.599 --> 00:56:16.960
<v Speaker 2>from the perspective of freedom. Principled argument for individual rights

761
00:56:16.960 --> 00:56:21.119
<v Speaker 2>and freedom leads to the other states should not be

762
00:56:21.159 --> 00:56:24.920
<v Speaker 2>intervening in the economy, and that leads to the best

763
00:56:24.960 --> 00:56:26.199
<v Speaker 2>economic outcome possible.

764
00:56:26.639 --> 00:56:33.440
<v Speaker 1>But you don't start with the best economic outcome. You

765
00:56:33.519 --> 00:56:40.119
<v Speaker 1>start with the issue of of how individuals should live

766
00:56:41.280 --> 00:56:44.639
<v Speaker 1>in order to have the opportunity to be the best

767
00:56:44.719 --> 00:56:59.480
<v Speaker 1>human beings, the best people possible, and to be the

768
00:56:59.519 --> 00:57:02.320
<v Speaker 1>best that we can be as human beings. The one

769
00:57:02.360 --> 00:57:05.360
<v Speaker 1>thing we need is freedom. The one thing we need.

770
00:57:06.199 --> 00:57:10.280
<v Speaker 2>From government at least, is the extraction of force, the

771
00:57:10.320 --> 00:57:14.760
<v Speaker 2>extraction of violence, the extraction of cosion from human society.

772
00:57:15.360 --> 00:57:18.719
<v Speaker 2>And then it's our responsibility to embrace the things that

773
00:57:18.880 --> 00:57:25.880
<v Speaker 2>lead to happiness. That is reason and a morality of egoism.

774
00:57:26.039 --> 00:57:27.360
<v Speaker 2>But that can be imposed from.

775
00:57:27.199 --> 00:57:32.039
<v Speaker 1>The top, and it should not be in the state

776
00:57:32.159 --> 00:57:39.159
<v Speaker 1>run curriculum. The curriculum should be determined by teaches, entrepreneurs

777
00:57:39.159 --> 00:57:43.480
<v Speaker 1>and teachers and parents. Sorry, teaches, entrepreneurs and parents.

778
00:57:44.079 --> 00:57:48.559
<v Speaker 2>In the marketplace, schools are no different from a marketplace

779
00:57:48.599 --> 00:57:53.440
<v Speaker 2>perspective than they need good needs, healthcare, any of the

780
00:57:53.440 --> 00:57:56.199
<v Speaker 2>things that today the market that the goverman intervenes in

781
00:57:56.239 --> 00:58:12.320
<v Speaker 2>and regulation controls and owns to a loge extent. All right,

782
00:58:13.719 --> 00:58:17.039
<v Speaker 2>that is my I want to thank Troy for funding

783
00:58:17.079 --> 00:58:17.480
<v Speaker 2>the show.

784
00:58:17.639 --> 00:58:21.480
<v Speaker 1>Troy sponsored the show, so thank you Troy. Who's Australian.

785
00:58:21.559 --> 00:58:23.880
<v Speaker 1>It's not even American with American Constitution.

786
00:58:24.000 --> 00:58:30.280
<v Speaker 2>But thanks Troy for sponsoring this, and I'm curious to

787
00:58:30.320 --> 00:58:34.199
<v Speaker 2>see if in the questions you guys bring up other

788
00:58:34.280 --> 00:58:37.039
<v Speaker 2>issues relating to the Constitution and maybe your ideas on

789
00:58:37.119 --> 00:58:39.880
<v Speaker 2>how it should be reframed or restated. That would be

790
00:58:39.880 --> 00:58:43.079
<v Speaker 2>a great use of a super chat is to present

791
00:58:43.119 --> 00:58:46.239
<v Speaker 2>your own views about this topic and maybe and I

792
00:58:46.280 --> 00:58:47.119
<v Speaker 2>can comment on them.

793
00:58:48.519 --> 00:58:50.599
<v Speaker 1>But but yeah, you.

794
00:58:50.519 --> 00:58:54.960
<v Speaker 2>Know again, this is something that one day, when relevant

795
00:58:55.639 --> 00:58:59.760
<v Speaker 2>or in getting close to being relevant, philosophers of law

796
00:59:00.079 --> 00:59:06.480
<v Speaker 2>have to sit down and actually writes a constitution, actually

797
00:59:06.559 --> 00:59:07.679
<v Speaker 2>do it from scratch.

798
00:59:07.920 --> 00:59:08.639
<v Speaker 1>I mean on the.

799
00:59:08.559 --> 00:59:12.159
<v Speaker 2>Basis I think of the existing Constitution, but updating the

800
00:59:12.280 --> 00:59:20.119
<v Speaker 2>language and updating the references and updating the issues and

801
00:59:20.719 --> 00:59:24.239
<v Speaker 2>integrating I think the ideas that I've articulated here into

802
00:59:24.360 --> 00:59:26.800
<v Speaker 2>a proper legal document.

803
00:59:26.400 --> 00:59:31.119
<v Speaker 1>Which is not easy, not straightforward at all, will be

804
00:59:31.159 --> 00:59:39.440
<v Speaker 1>a great you know, great, great, great, huge achievement. But

805
00:59:40.039 --> 00:59:42.840
<v Speaker 1>too early, it's too early today, It's just too early.

806
00:59:44.079 --> 00:59:48.440
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it doesn't have any practical uses and somebody

807
00:59:48.480 --> 00:59:51.880
<v Speaker 2>really doing it. We need some real giants of legal

808
00:59:51.920 --> 00:59:54.880
<v Speaker 2>philosophy to do it. Constitution two point zero.

809
00:59:54.920 --> 00:59:55.360
<v Speaker 1>I like that.

810
00:59:57.159 --> 01:00:00.239
<v Speaker 2>All right, Thanks everybody again, thanks to Troy making the

811
01:00:00.280 --> 01:00:02.920
<v Speaker 2>show possible and getting me thinking about this, and I've

812
01:00:02.960 --> 01:00:05.119
<v Speaker 2>thought about it for a long time, but getting me

813
01:00:05.639 --> 01:00:06.719
<v Speaker 2>to articulate it.

814
01:00:06.599 --> 01:00:09.960
<v Speaker 1>To you in one session that was great. I enjoyed it.

815
01:00:09.960 --> 01:00:10.719
<v Speaker 1>I hope you did too.

816
01:00:13.119 --> 01:00:18.360
<v Speaker 2>Let's see what else do we want to Yes? No,

817
01:00:18.440 --> 01:00:20.239
<v Speaker 2>I mean Cato Institute cannot do this.

818
01:00:21.760 --> 01:00:22.119
<v Speaker 1>Sorry.

819
01:00:22.159 --> 01:00:25.519
<v Speaker 2>As much as I respect certain things about the CATO

820
01:00:25.599 --> 01:00:30.119
<v Speaker 2>in this institute, the Cato Institute does not have a

821
01:00:30.199 --> 01:00:38.559
<v Speaker 2>philosophical grounding to do this. They understand some extent existing constitution,

822
01:00:39.079 --> 01:00:42.320
<v Speaker 2>they have a constitutional center there, but they don't have

823
01:00:42.400 --> 01:00:47.599
<v Speaker 2>a proper understanding of political philosophy and a proper understanding

824
01:00:47.679 --> 01:00:51.400
<v Speaker 2>of the mall foundations of that political philosophy to actually

825
01:00:52.000 --> 01:00:55.800
<v Speaker 2>write a good constitution. Their constitution would be better than

826
01:00:55.800 --> 01:00:57.559
<v Speaker 2>this one, but it wouldn't be the right one.

827
01:01:00.159 --> 01:01:05.800
<v Speaker 1>Wouldn't be the right one. And because most again most

828
01:01:06.440 --> 01:01:07.480
<v Speaker 1>people a CATO.

829
01:01:07.440 --> 01:01:19.559
<v Speaker 2>And are utilitarians, and this is not a smear, this

830
01:01:19.679 --> 01:01:27.039
<v Speaker 2>is what they would think. You need an objectivist philosopher

831
01:01:27.599 --> 01:01:29.599
<v Speaker 2>who understands individual rights.

832
01:01:30.840 --> 01:01:32.920
<v Speaker 1>I think most people, I think a lot of people

833
01:01:32.920 --> 01:01:36.079
<v Speaker 1>at CATO, I don't know how many individual rights. They're kind

834
01:01:36.119 --> 01:01:39.800
<v Speaker 1>of a useful concept, but it's not that important, you Telici,

835
01:01:39.800 --> 01:01:44.639
<v Speaker 1>your instn't think individual rights are that important. You need

836
01:01:44.679 --> 01:01:46.239
<v Speaker 1>a rights perspective.

837
01:01:46.239 --> 01:01:48.199
<v Speaker 2>And to have a rights perspective, you really need to

838
01:01:48.199 --> 01:01:51.440
<v Speaker 2>have a morality of individualism. You need to understand that

839
01:01:51.559 --> 01:01:59.119
<v Speaker 2>individual rights a moral concept, come from morality, and then

840
01:01:59.159 --> 01:02:01.280
<v Speaker 2>you have to have the right morey to underpin them,

841
01:02:01.599 --> 01:02:04.639
<v Speaker 2>and that morality is egoism.

842
01:02:04.760 --> 01:02:11.719
<v Speaker 1>It has to be an individualistic morality. And so you

843
01:02:11.760 --> 01:02:16.440
<v Speaker 1>cannot be religious and do this right.

844
01:02:18.320 --> 01:02:23.159
<v Speaker 2>You cannot be a contient, you cannot be an altruist

845
01:02:23.360 --> 01:02:28.880
<v Speaker 2>and do this right. There are absolutely such things as rights.

846
01:02:29.679 --> 01:02:33.039
<v Speaker 2>Just look, there's such thing as justice, and just like

847
01:02:33.119 --> 01:02:37.559
<v Speaker 2>there's such thing as love. These are abstract concepts, but

848
01:02:37.599 --> 01:02:47.079
<v Speaker 2>they are absolutely rights. And if you don't have a

849
01:02:47.159 --> 01:02:49.480
<v Speaker 2>concept of rights, and if you don't understand the concept

850
01:02:49.519 --> 01:02:51.679
<v Speaker 2>of rights, and you can't articulate the concept of rights

851
01:02:51.880 --> 01:02:53.519
<v Speaker 2>and you don't understand where it comes from and what

852
01:02:53.559 --> 01:02:59.039
<v Speaker 2>it's established on, you cannot You cannot touch the Constitution,

853
01:02:59.199 --> 01:03:01.320
<v Speaker 2>leave it as it is better than anything else that

854
01:03:01.360 --> 01:03:06.639
<v Speaker 2>will come about. I mean, outside of objectivism, the concept

855
01:03:06.639 --> 01:03:10.519
<v Speaker 2>of rights is completely messed up heinmand is the real

856
01:03:10.840 --> 01:03:15.800
<v Speaker 2>error and completa of the Enlightenment project in political philosophy

857
01:03:15.840 --> 01:03:18.199
<v Speaker 2>and moral philosophy. But you have to have the right

858
01:03:18.280 --> 01:03:25.239
<v Speaker 2>maral philosophy to be able to have the right political philosophy.

859
01:03:25.800 --> 01:03:29.039
<v Speaker 2>I mean the argument the idea that there are no

860
01:03:29.159 --> 01:03:36.360
<v Speaker 2>rights on your agreements. That idea is the destroyer of freedom.

861
01:03:36.679 --> 01:03:41.320
<v Speaker 2>That idea is the destroyer of rights and of liberty

862
01:03:41.559 --> 01:03:51.960
<v Speaker 2>and of freedom. All right, Okay, if you want to

863
01:03:52.000 --> 01:03:57.960
<v Speaker 2>ask questions, make a comment, suggest something. The superchat is open,

864
01:03:58.719 --> 01:04:00.800
<v Speaker 2>so I f you're fee up, jump onto the super

865
01:04:00.880 --> 01:04:01.320
<v Speaker 2>chat and.

866
01:04:03.440 --> 01:04:03.920
<v Speaker 1>Do that.

867
01:04:04.039 --> 01:04:08.159
<v Speaker 2>We are way behind on our goals for today. Today's

868
01:04:08.239 --> 01:04:09.000
<v Speaker 2>just like any other show.

869
01:04:09.039 --> 01:04:09.639
<v Speaker 1>We have goals.

870
01:04:10.320 --> 01:04:12.320
<v Speaker 2>One hour goal was still about one hundred dollars short

871
01:04:12.320 --> 01:04:14.119
<v Speaker 2>of our first hour goal, and we're already on the

872
01:04:14.119 --> 01:04:14.639
<v Speaker 2>second hour.

873
01:04:15.119 --> 01:04:16.679
<v Speaker 1>So it would be great if we can at least

874
01:04:16.760 --> 01:04:20.440
<v Speaker 1>achieve our first hour goal. That would be amazing. Daniel

875
01:04:20.639 --> 01:04:23.079
<v Speaker 1>here has really set the tone. It's his first super

876
01:04:23.119 --> 01:04:28.599
<v Speaker 1>chat ever, I think that's what YouTube tells me, and

877
01:04:28.639 --> 01:04:29.000
<v Speaker 1>he has.

878
01:04:28.920 --> 01:04:33.119
<v Speaker 2>Already done fifty dollars. That's amazing, So thank you. Let

879
01:04:33.119 --> 01:04:37.000
<v Speaker 2>me just thank some stickers before we get to Daniel Brady,

880
01:04:37.119 --> 01:04:39.760
<v Speaker 2>thank you for the sticker. I think I saw a

881
01:04:39.800 --> 01:04:44.360
<v Speaker 2>few others. You two can just support the show with

882
01:04:44.519 --> 01:04:46.880
<v Speaker 2>a sticker. You don't even have to ask a question.

883
01:04:47.239 --> 01:04:49.880
<v Speaker 2>You can come in and just drop a few bucks,

884
01:04:50.280 --> 01:04:51.920
<v Speaker 2>and if enough of you drop a few bucks, we

885
01:04:51.960 --> 01:04:52.679
<v Speaker 2>can make our goal.

886
01:04:53.320 --> 01:04:54.719
<v Speaker 1>So please consider doing that.

887
01:04:55.079 --> 01:04:58.920
<v Speaker 2>Remember, value for value, the show is made possible from

888
01:04:59.320 --> 01:05:03.400
<v Speaker 2>by viewers like you. Couldn't do this without the financial

889
01:05:03.440 --> 01:05:07.880
<v Speaker 2>support you guys provide. Don't get any grants from anybody.

890
01:05:08.800 --> 01:05:10.559
<v Speaker 2>We have a couple of sponsors, but that's not a

891
01:05:10.599 --> 01:05:13.599
<v Speaker 2>lot of money. The main money, overwhelming amount of money,

892
01:05:14.119 --> 01:05:16.000
<v Speaker 2>ninety five percent of the money comes from you guys.

893
01:05:16.599 --> 01:05:18.400
<v Speaker 1>Without you, this could not happen.

894
01:05:18.480 --> 01:05:21.400
<v Speaker 2>So please consider supporting the show right now with a

895
01:05:21.440 --> 01:05:24.920
<v Speaker 2>sticker or super chat. And for those of you who

896
01:05:25.000 --> 01:05:28.199
<v Speaker 2>would like and can do it, please become a monthly

897
01:05:28.239 --> 01:05:31.840
<v Speaker 2>supporter of the show and Patreon. You can go there

898
01:05:32.039 --> 01:05:34.880
<v Speaker 2>any amount on a monthly basis. You don't have to

899
01:05:34.880 --> 01:05:37.039
<v Speaker 2>think about it. And I love it because I don't

900
01:05:37.079 --> 01:05:39.159
<v Speaker 2>have to think about it. It's regular income and it's

901
01:05:39.239 --> 01:05:41.840
<v Speaker 2>very predictable, and it's what sustains the show.

902
01:05:41.880 --> 01:05:45.239
<v Speaker 1>So I appreciate that. But for now, those are a

903
01:05:45.360 --> 01:05:46.440
<v Speaker 1>here on YouTube.

904
01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:49.239
<v Speaker 2>Those of you are on Twitter, come on over to

905
01:05:49.280 --> 01:05:52.360
<v Speaker 2>YouTube and you can ask questions and you can support

906
01:05:52.400 --> 01:05:57.760
<v Speaker 2>the show. Please please consider doing that value for value,

907
01:05:57.800 --> 01:05:59.960
<v Speaker 2>and two other things I'd ask you to do.

908
01:06:00.960 --> 01:06:03.199
<v Speaker 1>One is like the show before you leave.

909
01:06:04.280 --> 01:06:08.800
<v Speaker 2>And second is, if you're not a subscriber yet, please

910
01:06:08.840 --> 01:06:11.880
<v Speaker 2>consider subscribing. Just subscribe that way you Tube will let

911
01:06:11.920 --> 01:06:13.639
<v Speaker 2>you know when shows are coming on.

912
01:06:14.679 --> 01:06:18.679
<v Speaker 1>All right, let's start with Daniel who I get again? First?

913
01:06:18.920 --> 01:06:22.280
<v Speaker 1>Super said question, so this is great. Fifty dollars that's amazing.

914
01:06:23.519 --> 01:06:26.920
<v Speaker 2>Abundance by Eza Klein and Derek Thompson gives a progressive

915
01:06:27.000 --> 01:06:30.639
<v Speaker 2>vision of abundance with a communist view of technology and

916
01:06:30.679 --> 01:06:37.760
<v Speaker 2>social progress, a ploy to capture the term for central planning.

917
01:06:41.960 --> 01:06:44.840
<v Speaker 2>Suddenly it's a way for them to capture the term

918
01:06:44.960 --> 01:06:51.280
<v Speaker 2>for the left. And I think though that there are

919
01:06:51.320 --> 01:06:54.320
<v Speaker 2>people on the left as a client, and Derek Thompson

920
01:06:54.519 --> 01:06:58.920
<v Speaker 2>among them, And Derrek Thompson often writes very good stuff

921
01:06:58.960 --> 01:07:02.880
<v Speaker 2>I think in Atlantic about progress and about the need

922
01:07:02.920 --> 01:07:04.880
<v Speaker 2>for progress and the need for economic growth.

923
01:07:06.039 --> 01:07:11.440
<v Speaker 1>But people like no Smith and others who really do

924
01:07:11.559 --> 01:07:15.239
<v Speaker 1>believe that we need economic growth and economic growth is

925
01:07:15.280 --> 01:07:17.400
<v Speaker 1>good and abundance is good, and we want to have

926
01:07:17.519 --> 01:07:18.280
<v Speaker 1>more abundance.

927
01:07:18.320 --> 01:07:20.039
<v Speaker 2>I think they really believe that. I think, as a

928
01:07:20.079 --> 01:07:22.639
<v Speaker 2>client believes that. I think Dearrack Thompson believes.

929
01:07:22.320 --> 01:07:27.000
<v Speaker 1>That, but they are gravely mistaken. Whether those mistakes are

930
01:07:27.000 --> 01:07:30.599
<v Speaker 1>consequence of just errors of knowledge, or whether those mistakes

931
01:07:30.639 --> 01:07:34.039
<v Speaker 1>are consequence of evasion and not being wanting to be

932
01:07:34.079 --> 01:07:36.559
<v Speaker 1>too radical or of.

933
01:07:36.559 --> 01:07:42.800
<v Speaker 2>Altruism, could very well be evasions resulting from altruism. They

934
01:07:43.280 --> 01:07:47.480
<v Speaker 2>really do believe that central planning, or at least some

935
01:07:47.599 --> 01:07:51.960
<v Speaker 2>central planning elence of clentral planning, are needed in order

936
01:07:52.000 --> 01:07:55.760
<v Speaker 2>to reach amundance. So, for example, I think a lot

937
01:07:55.800 --> 01:07:59.239
<v Speaker 2>of these people, Klin and Thompson, no Smith, and others

938
01:08:00.360 --> 01:08:03.119
<v Speaker 2>really believe and I think that they honestly hold this,

939
01:08:03.440 --> 01:08:09.440
<v Speaker 2>although again within the scope of what they're willing to

940
01:08:09.480 --> 01:08:15.280
<v Speaker 2>look at. They believe that government is necessary for scientific

941
01:08:15.320 --> 01:08:20.840
<v Speaker 2>progress and therefore for technological progress. So I don't think

942
01:08:20.920 --> 01:08:24.760
<v Speaker 2>as a client Dery Thompson would say we should nationalize

943
01:08:24.760 --> 01:08:29.800
<v Speaker 2>Silicon Valley. But what they do say is we should

944
01:08:29.880 --> 01:08:36.720
<v Speaker 2>be investing a lot more government money into scientific research

945
01:08:38.439 --> 01:08:43.279
<v Speaker 2>that then can be spun off into you know, projects

946
01:08:43.319 --> 01:08:47.359
<v Speaker 2>of silicon value. I mean they would argue, and there

947
01:08:47.439 --> 01:08:52.920
<v Speaker 2>is some maybe not much, but some reason to do this,

948
01:08:53.119 --> 01:08:56.039
<v Speaker 2>that you know, something like the Internet is a product

949
01:08:56.199 --> 01:08:59.720
<v Speaker 2>ultimately of the government. The governments set up the first

950
01:09:00.680 --> 01:09:08.720
<v Speaker 2>communication between computers and set up the first Web. And

951
01:09:08.760 --> 01:09:12.039
<v Speaker 2>they would argue nothing would happen without the government, that

952
01:09:12.119 --> 01:09:16.000
<v Speaker 2>this was a necessary thing, and indeed more of that

953
01:09:16.039 --> 01:09:18.520
<v Speaker 2>should happen, and the way to achieve more of that

954
01:09:18.720 --> 01:09:20.800
<v Speaker 2>is for the government to spend more money on science

955
01:09:21.800 --> 01:09:26.960
<v Speaker 2>without them rejecting markets for certain things. So they again

956
01:09:27.039 --> 01:09:33.119
<v Speaker 2>utilitarian thinking. They think governance necessarily for certain things. I eat,

957
01:09:33.560 --> 01:09:38.640
<v Speaker 2>big projects like NASA and the you know what they

958
01:09:38.840 --> 01:09:40.800
<v Speaker 2>view as the Internet, So that was never the intent

959
01:09:40.880 --> 01:09:45.640
<v Speaker 2>of the people who started nuclear research other things, and

960
01:09:46.560 --> 01:09:49.920
<v Speaker 2>that's what you need government for. And the private sector

961
01:09:49.920 --> 01:09:52.600
<v Speaker 2>they can commercialize it and make it more efficient, more productive.

962
01:09:52.760 --> 01:09:57.079
<v Speaker 2>Markets are good for that. They also, to their credit,

963
01:09:57.119 --> 01:10:02.640
<v Speaker 2>I'd say, I think that local government should be massively

964
01:10:02.720 --> 01:10:06.720
<v Speaker 2>deregulating so that we can build more, but they don't

965
01:10:06.720 --> 01:10:11.279
<v Speaker 2>extrapolate that to other ways in which we should deregulate.

966
01:10:12.159 --> 01:10:13.840
<v Speaker 2>And I think the key here is they come in

967
01:10:13.960 --> 01:10:21.920
<v Speaker 2>everything from a welfas state utilitarian perspective, and what they

968
01:10:21.960 --> 01:10:25.159
<v Speaker 2>ignore and what they don't talk about it at all.

969
01:10:25.239 --> 01:10:28.079
<v Speaker 1>What they don't relate to it all is rights.

970
01:10:28.880 --> 01:10:30.920
<v Speaker 2>Is the idea that there are such things as individual

971
01:10:31.000 --> 01:10:35.319
<v Speaker 2>rights and that the government violates them when they regulate, that,

972
01:10:36.359 --> 01:10:39.199
<v Speaker 2>it violates them when it taxes money and spends them

973
01:10:39.199 --> 01:10:43.000
<v Speaker 2>on research. They don't see that, they don't care about that,

974
01:10:43.119 --> 01:10:45.920
<v Speaker 2>they don't philosophically, don't relate to.

975
01:10:45.920 --> 01:10:50.920
<v Speaker 1>That at all. So I think they want aboundon. So remember,

976
01:10:52.079 --> 01:11:00.199
<v Speaker 1>and this is in a sense, they are a a

977
01:11:00.640 --> 01:11:05.000
<v Speaker 1>what do you call it, you know, kind of a.

978
01:11:03.760 --> 01:11:08.880
<v Speaker 2>Backward look at old the old left, the left of

979
01:11:08.920 --> 01:11:14.920
<v Speaker 2>the forties, fifties, sixties, early sixties before the new left

980
01:11:14.920 --> 01:11:18.680
<v Speaker 2>replaced him. The old left, the Marxist left, the real

981
01:11:18.760 --> 01:11:23.840
<v Speaker 2>Marxist left, not that modern nihilistic left, the old Marxist left.

982
01:11:25.079 --> 01:11:30.039
<v Speaker 2>Marx isn't believed in progress. Marx's utopia is a utopia

983
01:11:30.079 --> 01:11:34.239
<v Speaker 2>of abundance. It's we have everything we need and we

984
01:11:34.239 --> 01:11:37.880
<v Speaker 2>could do whatever we want because our material stuff is

985
01:11:37.880 --> 01:11:40.600
<v Speaker 2>taking care of how exactly he never tells us.

986
01:11:40.439 --> 01:11:47.840
<v Speaker 1>But Marx is pro abundance. Marxism is pro abundance.

987
01:11:49.960 --> 01:11:53.479
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't have an idea how to get there, So

988
01:11:53.680 --> 01:11:57.720
<v Speaker 2>what Client and Thompson are doing is resurrecting an old left,

989
01:11:58.039 --> 01:12:03.399
<v Speaker 2>a left that believed in industrialization, believed in abundance before

990
01:12:03.640 --> 01:12:07.439
<v Speaker 2>it was taken over by nihilists and environmentalists and haters

991
01:12:07.680 --> 01:12:14.880
<v Speaker 2>who focus on hate. They believe that abundance needs the state,

992
01:12:15.159 --> 01:12:18.720
<v Speaker 2>i e. State investment, state regulations, state control, states, intral

993
01:12:18.800 --> 01:12:22.880
<v Speaker 2>planning to be achieved. And they're wrong in that, But

994
01:12:23.279 --> 01:12:28.039
<v Speaker 2>they are hearkening back to the age of the Left

995
01:12:28.119 --> 01:12:34.640
<v Speaker 2>being Marxist versus the modern left, which is anti progress,

996
01:12:35.600 --> 01:12:44.279
<v Speaker 2>anti achievement, anti wealth, anti industrialization. I'll take them over

997
01:12:44.319 --> 01:12:48.079
<v Speaker 2>the new Left any day, right. So I don't think

998
01:12:48.119 --> 01:12:50.840
<v Speaker 2>it's quite that they're trying to capture the term. It's

999
01:12:50.920 --> 01:12:54.359
<v Speaker 2>more that there's a way in which they believe that

1000
01:12:54.359 --> 01:12:57.520
<v Speaker 2>that is what they want, even though a lot of

1001
01:12:57.520 --> 01:13:03.960
<v Speaker 2>their prescriptions for it a destructive to abundance. Central planning

1002
01:13:04.079 --> 01:13:08.399
<v Speaker 2>is clearly destructive to abundance. Thank you, Daniel, thanks to

1003
01:13:08.439 --> 01:13:13.720
<v Speaker 2>the first super chat, hopefully the first of many. Andrew,

1004
01:13:14.199 --> 01:13:16.479
<v Speaker 2>what are the false premises behind the claim that if

1005
01:13:16.520 --> 01:13:20.880
<v Speaker 2>government didn't provide X service education then there would be

1006
01:13:21.079 --> 01:13:22.119
<v Speaker 2>no X.

1007
01:13:23.439 --> 01:13:24.479
<v Speaker 1>Or inferior X.

1008
01:13:24.960 --> 01:13:27.399
<v Speaker 2>There seems to be a very low opinion of humanity

1009
01:13:27.439 --> 01:13:31.760
<v Speaker 2>implicity in that. Yeah, there's a low opinion of humanity.

1010
01:13:31.800 --> 01:13:34.560
<v Speaker 2>There's a low opinion of markets and how they work.

1011
01:13:34.560 --> 01:13:37.319
<v Speaker 2>There's a lack of understanding of markets and how they work.

1012
01:13:37.880 --> 01:13:42.439
<v Speaker 2>But there's also, you know, an implicity galitarianism there. That is,

1013
01:13:42.479 --> 01:13:44.479
<v Speaker 2>government is the only one that can make sure everybody

1014
01:13:44.560 --> 01:13:48.319
<v Speaker 2>gets it and everybody gets the same, and the rich

1015
01:13:48.399 --> 01:13:50.920
<v Speaker 2>don't get a better product than the poor because the

1016
01:13:50.960 --> 01:13:53.840
<v Speaker 2>reality isn't a free market. It's quite likely rich will

1017
01:13:53.840 --> 01:13:58.239
<v Speaker 2>get a better education, at least in some dimensions than

1018
01:13:58.279 --> 01:14:01.119
<v Speaker 2>the poor world. The rich school will have swimming pools

1019
01:14:01.119 --> 01:14:05.399
<v Speaker 2>and football courts and football fields and baseball fields, and

1020
01:14:05.479 --> 01:14:08.800
<v Speaker 2>they'll have a better experience than their you know, the

1021
01:14:08.880 --> 01:14:13.600
<v Speaker 2>poor schools. And that is offensive to anybody who believes

1022
01:14:13.600 --> 01:14:18.399
<v Speaker 2>in egalitarianism. So I think it's a lack of understanding

1023
01:14:18.439 --> 01:14:20.359
<v Speaker 2>of how that works and also.

1024
01:14:22.399 --> 01:14:26.920
<v Speaker 1>A certain reality that and this is unfortunate because of

1025
01:14:27.039 --> 01:14:32.159
<v Speaker 1>how it evolved. Well, the first schools in America were

1026
01:14:32.199 --> 01:14:36.720
<v Speaker 1>not government schools, most of them because they weren't govern

1027
01:14:36.800 --> 01:14:42.760
<v Speaker 1>schools were schools run by churches. Religious schools or schools.

1028
01:14:43.640 --> 01:14:46.079
<v Speaker 2>Maybe they didn't focus on religion, but they were managed

1029
01:14:46.119 --> 01:14:52.239
<v Speaker 2>by religious orders, So if you wanted a secular education,

1030
01:14:53.000 --> 01:14:57.560
<v Speaker 2>it seemed like the only one available was from the government.

1031
01:14:57.600 --> 01:15:00.800
<v Speaker 2>And then the government steps in and it happened very

1032
01:15:00.880 --> 01:15:02.960
<v Speaker 2>quickly in the late nineteenth century and then into the

1033
01:15:02.960 --> 01:15:07.880
<v Speaker 2>twentieth century. Is the government monopolizes education and it crowds

1034
01:15:07.920 --> 01:15:09.039
<v Speaker 2>out private capital.

1035
01:15:09.680 --> 01:15:13.680
<v Speaker 1>And just at the point where private education probably would

1036
01:15:13.680 --> 01:15:18.079
<v Speaker 1>have taken off, where private education became feasible.

1037
01:15:17.600 --> 01:15:19.600
<v Speaker 2>Because the middle class there was a middle class. Now

1038
01:15:19.640 --> 01:15:22.079
<v Speaker 2>people had money they could pay for their kids' education.

1039
01:15:23.479 --> 01:15:25.880
<v Speaker 2>You could even have you had enough money in the

1040
01:15:25.920 --> 01:15:27.920
<v Speaker 2>hands of some people so that you could create scholarship

1041
01:15:28.000 --> 01:15:31.279
<v Speaker 2>funds for poor kids to attend a private edged schools.

1042
01:15:32.479 --> 01:15:35.239
<v Speaker 2>Just when that could have bubbled to the surface, where

1043
01:15:35.319 --> 01:15:39.800
<v Speaker 2>entrepreneurs could have started schools and charged money and kids

1044
01:15:39.800 --> 01:15:43.760
<v Speaker 2>would have come, it's about the same time the state

1045
01:15:43.800 --> 01:15:47.960
<v Speaker 2>decided to get involved and basically crowded out that private education.

1046
01:15:48.000 --> 01:15:50.760
<v Speaker 1>Said no, don't do that, we'll do it. We got it,

1047
01:15:50.800 --> 01:15:51.520
<v Speaker 1>we got to cover it.

1048
01:15:51.600 --> 01:15:58.399
<v Speaker 2>Don't worry about it, you know, And there are other

1049
01:15:58.479 --> 01:16:01.560
<v Speaker 2>things like you know, there's a lot of places around

1050
01:16:01.560 --> 01:16:05.279
<v Speaker 2>the world where healthcare is the same thing. And again,

1051
01:16:05.520 --> 01:16:10.960
<v Speaker 2>underlying the healthcare argument is if you had private rich

1052
01:16:11.000 --> 01:16:12.479
<v Speaker 2>people would get better healthcare.

1053
01:16:12.199 --> 01:16:18.199
<v Speaker 1>Than poor people. That's true. People don't see the mind.

1054
01:16:18.279 --> 01:16:19.600
<v Speaker 1>Or rich people eat better food.

1055
01:16:20.359 --> 01:16:24.079
<v Speaker 2>Rich people drive nicer cars, rich people live in better homes,

1056
01:16:24.560 --> 01:16:28.399
<v Speaker 2>bigger homes, nicer homes. But when it comes to healthcare

1057
01:16:28.399 --> 01:16:32.880
<v Speaker 2>and it comes to education, egalitarianism kicks in and we

1058
01:16:33.000 --> 01:16:38.159
<v Speaker 2>demand that everybody get the same. So it's a galitarianism

1059
01:16:38.199 --> 01:16:43.039
<v Speaker 2>really driving it. And education, as I said, markets never

1060
01:16:43.119 --> 01:16:46.079
<v Speaker 2>really developed, so what you got from the beginning was

1061
01:16:46.119 --> 01:16:49.119
<v Speaker 2>public education. And you think people think therefore that it's

1062
01:16:49.239 --> 01:16:57.479
<v Speaker 2>just like just that. And with health care, there were

1063
01:16:57.600 --> 01:17:01.800
<v Speaker 2>enough challenges with the private because the private ticket was

1064
01:17:01.840 --> 01:17:05.640
<v Speaker 2>never truly private. There were distortions and perversions, starting certainly

1065
01:17:05.680 --> 01:17:08.960
<v Speaker 2>with World War two in America, so that a healthy

1066
01:17:09.079 --> 01:17:16.079
<v Speaker 2>private market never developed in healthcare, and the government stepped

1067
01:17:16.119 --> 01:17:18.319
<v Speaker 2>in and started taking over big chunks of it, or

1068
01:17:18.880 --> 01:17:23.640
<v Speaker 2>or by giving taxt baks the businesses created they center

1069
01:17:23.720 --> 01:17:26.199
<v Speaker 2>for them to buy insurance and providing the market very

1070
01:17:26.279 --> 01:17:27.800
<v Speaker 2>very quickly and very very easily.

1071
01:17:30.680 --> 01:17:32.960
<v Speaker 1>So those are the kind of reasons.

1072
01:17:32.960 --> 01:17:36.359
<v Speaker 2>But I think the basic premises egalitarianism and the idea

1073
01:17:36.479 --> 01:17:38.479
<v Speaker 2>that markets can't provide these services.

1074
01:17:39.680 --> 01:17:45.439
<v Speaker 1>The economic idea all right, I'll ask again stickers, stickers,

1075
01:17:45.439 --> 01:17:48.039
<v Speaker 1>so we can make our goal. We are now what

1076
01:17:48.159 --> 01:17:52.279
<v Speaker 1>are we? You know, another.

1077
01:17:53.319 --> 01:17:55.960
<v Speaker 2>Sixty dollars short of our one hour goal, which would

1078
01:17:55.960 --> 01:17:58.520
<v Speaker 2>be nice to reach sixty, or somebody should come in

1079
01:17:58.560 --> 01:17:59.239
<v Speaker 2>with a.

1080
01:17:59.000 --> 01:18:02.880
<v Speaker 1>Sticker for fifty bucks. That'd be great, Richard. Thank you.

1081
01:18:03.920 --> 01:18:07.760
<v Speaker 2>In defining rights, it bears repeating that a right applies

1082
01:18:07.800 --> 01:18:11.960
<v Speaker 2>only to individual action or speech. It's not an entirement

1083
01:18:12.039 --> 01:18:14.479
<v Speaker 2>from the government, such as a right to health care housing.

1084
01:18:15.039 --> 01:18:16.000
<v Speaker 1>Yes, exactly.

1085
01:18:16.199 --> 01:18:19.319
<v Speaker 2>So that's the kind of thing that needs to be

1086
01:18:19.359 --> 01:18:24.439
<v Speaker 2>explained in a definition of rights and an explanation of

1087
01:18:24.479 --> 01:18:27.960
<v Speaker 2>what we mean by rights. Now, of course there's a

1088
01:18:28.039 --> 01:18:29.880
<v Speaker 2>sension which you do have a right to health care.

1089
01:18:31.359 --> 01:18:34.279
<v Speaker 2>You have a right to receive whatever healthcare.

1090
01:18:34.319 --> 01:18:37.920
<v Speaker 1>You can negotiate with those who provided and you get

1091
01:18:37.960 --> 01:18:39.960
<v Speaker 1>to choose who do negotiate with and who not to

1092
01:18:40.000 --> 01:18:43.439
<v Speaker 1>negotiate with, who to engage in their service, and who

1093
01:18:43.520 --> 01:18:44.800
<v Speaker 1>not engage in their service.

1094
01:18:46.119 --> 01:18:49.560
<v Speaker 2>That's what it means to have a right to healthcare

1095
01:18:49.920 --> 01:18:52.119
<v Speaker 2>or right to housing. You have a right to go

1096
01:18:52.159 --> 01:18:57.399
<v Speaker 2>out there, buy and engage in trade with whoever is

1097
01:18:57.439 --> 01:19:01.760
<v Speaker 2>willing to trade with you. And that's the sense in

1098
01:19:01.800 --> 01:19:06.039
<v Speaker 2>which the right is only a right to action, not

1099
01:19:06.239 --> 01:19:11.840
<v Speaker 2>to stuff, not to an outcome, just to the act

1100
01:19:11.880 --> 01:19:21.439
<v Speaker 2>of pursuing No, William, the government should not deal with

1101
01:19:21.479 --> 01:19:27.960
<v Speaker 2>water or electricity or any other thing, or roads or

1102
01:19:28.119 --> 01:19:31.560
<v Speaker 2>canals or anything that you might have difficulty wrapping your

1103
01:19:31.560 --> 01:19:35.239
<v Speaker 2>head around. This is what it means to think in principle,

1104
01:19:37.199 --> 01:19:40.720
<v Speaker 2>the government is not protecting individual rights by dealing with water.

1105
01:19:41.560 --> 01:19:45.279
<v Speaker 2>It is not protecting individual rights by dealing with electricity,

1106
01:19:45.960 --> 01:19:49.199
<v Speaker 2>So it has no business there other than if somebody

1107
01:19:49.239 --> 01:19:53.039
<v Speaker 2>is violating property rights, or somebody is committing fraud, or

1108
01:19:53.039 --> 01:19:55.840
<v Speaker 2>somebody is polluting the water in a way that makes

1109
01:19:55.840 --> 01:20:01.880
<v Speaker 2>people's sake, or you know, killing people with their electricity.

1110
01:20:03.039 --> 01:20:07.319
<v Speaker 2>Government has no role other than protect individual rights.

1111
01:20:09.760 --> 01:20:10.479
<v Speaker 1>Well, that's tough.

1112
01:20:10.479 --> 01:20:13.079
<v Speaker 2>If you don't have a choice, it's not the government's

1113
01:20:13.359 --> 01:20:16.159
<v Speaker 2>job to provide you with choices. First of all, you

1114
01:20:16.159 --> 01:20:19.000
<v Speaker 2>have a choice to move, you have a choice to

1115
01:20:19.079 --> 01:20:22.640
<v Speaker 2>live without, you have a choice to dig your own well,

1116
01:20:23.239 --> 01:20:25.560
<v Speaker 2>you have lots of choices, And the fact that you

1117
01:20:25.680 --> 01:20:30.479
<v Speaker 2>can't conceive today of having choices around those things is.

1118
01:20:30.640 --> 01:20:33.319
<v Speaker 1>Just a lack of imagination.

1119
01:20:35.000 --> 01:20:39.840
<v Speaker 2>Markets provide for choices in ways that are hard for

1120
01:20:40.039 --> 01:20:41.560
<v Speaker 2>us to imagine.

1121
01:20:41.760 --> 01:20:44.079
<v Speaker 1>When we allow markets to actually function.

1122
01:20:45.279 --> 01:20:49.479
<v Speaker 2>But markets don't function with regard of water, not in

1123
01:20:49.560 --> 01:20:52.000
<v Speaker 2>terms of the private ownership of water with the source

1124
01:20:52.680 --> 01:20:56.319
<v Speaker 2>or the private ownership of the pipes and the ability

1125
01:20:56.359 --> 01:20:57.079
<v Speaker 2>to provide you.

1126
01:20:57.000 --> 01:20:59.920
<v Speaker 1>With multiple sources.

1127
01:21:01.119 --> 01:21:03.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because you have a choice to go well on

1128
01:21:03.239 --> 01:21:08.520
<v Speaker 2>your property, you don't have a right to somebody providing

1129
01:21:08.560 --> 01:21:09.079
<v Speaker 2>you with water.

1130
01:21:11.279 --> 01:21:15.279
<v Speaker 1>Figure out how to get water to your property. No,

1131
01:21:15.560 --> 01:21:19.279
<v Speaker 1>I'm absolutely one hundred percent serious you.

1132
01:21:19.439 --> 01:21:21.239
<v Speaker 2>If you can't figure out how to get water to

1133
01:21:21.239 --> 01:21:23.720
<v Speaker 2>your property or how to buy water for somebody who

1134
01:21:23.760 --> 01:21:26.239
<v Speaker 2>provides the water, then you won't have water.

1135
01:21:29.520 --> 01:21:31.680
<v Speaker 1>This is what it means to thinking principle.

1136
01:21:32.000 --> 01:21:36.039
<v Speaker 2>And your lack of ability to imagine the two providers

1137
01:21:36.039 --> 01:21:41.359
<v Speaker 2>of water would build pipes into your neighborhood and to

1138
01:21:41.479 --> 01:21:44.000
<v Speaker 2>your home is your lack of imagination.

1139
01:21:47.520 --> 01:21:48.840
<v Speaker 1>But that's the point.

1140
01:21:48.920 --> 01:21:52.640
<v Speaker 2>I don't know exactly how you solve problems in the marketplace.

1141
01:21:53.399 --> 01:21:54.960
<v Speaker 1>I leave it to the market.

1142
01:21:55.159 --> 01:21:59.880
<v Speaker 2>And electricity in the original When originally electricity was put

1143
01:21:59.880 --> 01:22:04.000
<v Speaker 2>in place, there were competitors of electricity. It's only when

1144
01:22:04.000 --> 01:22:08.319
<v Speaker 2>the state came in and in a sense, forced monopolies

1145
01:22:10.359 --> 01:22:15.960
<v Speaker 2>onto these things did was electricity then restricted to one provider?

1146
01:22:17.399 --> 01:22:19.960
<v Speaker 2>You can call it silly all you like, but it

1147
01:22:20.039 --> 01:22:22.600
<v Speaker 2>is reality. There's no such thing as a natural monopoly,

1148
01:22:23.079 --> 01:22:25.680
<v Speaker 2>and there's no such thing as the government should provide

1149
01:22:25.720 --> 01:22:27.479
<v Speaker 2>you with fill in the blank.

1150
01:22:29.039 --> 01:22:29.800
<v Speaker 1>Just isn't.

1151
01:22:34.520 --> 01:22:37.239
<v Speaker 2>Mary Mary say she owns a property where water is delivered,

1152
01:22:37.920 --> 01:22:40.600
<v Speaker 2>But you have a right to have a pipe delivering

1153
01:22:40.680 --> 01:22:47.279
<v Speaker 2>water to your property. And indeed, development would have happened

1154
01:22:47.279 --> 01:22:52.920
<v Speaker 2>in a different way. Developers would have thought about how

1155
01:22:52.960 --> 01:22:56.800
<v Speaker 2>to provide people with alternatives to electricity and for water

1156
01:22:57.319 --> 01:23:01.159
<v Speaker 2>as they developed neighborhoods if they wasn't a state monopoly

1157
01:23:01.199 --> 01:23:07.000
<v Speaker 2>over these things. Imagine one big tunnel that is dug

1158
01:23:07.159 --> 01:23:12.319
<v Speaker 2>under neighborhoods, that which they do today with cable and

1159
01:23:12.359 --> 01:23:14.720
<v Speaker 2>other things, where you can put whatever kind of pipelines

1160
01:23:14.800 --> 01:23:17.039
<v Speaker 2>or whatever kind of cables that you want.

1161
01:23:18.239 --> 01:23:20.920
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I remember the days, during the days where

1162
01:23:22.800 --> 01:23:26.880
<v Speaker 1>nobody could conceive of how you could ad Internet unless

1163
01:23:26.880 --> 01:23:37.520
<v Speaker 1>the government guaranteed the internet. Right. William C.

1164
01:23:37.680 --> 01:23:40.319
<v Speaker 2>Says, I have two or three water providers, Well the ego,

1165
01:23:40.600 --> 01:23:43.800
<v Speaker 2>So what's so silly? You have already two or three

1166
01:23:43.800 --> 01:23:46.479
<v Speaker 2>water providers. So what does the government have to be

1167
01:23:46.560 --> 01:23:53.520
<v Speaker 2>involved here? Choose you should have two or three electricity providers.

1168
01:23:53.800 --> 01:24:01.479
<v Speaker 2>You have multiple providers of internet service. Even though I

1169
01:24:01.560 --> 01:24:04.600
<v Speaker 2>remember in the nineties everybody thought it was a monopoly

1170
01:24:05.399 --> 01:24:06.279
<v Speaker 2>it could only be one.

1171
01:24:06.359 --> 01:24:08.199
<v Speaker 1>It could it was the telephone.

1172
01:24:08.239 --> 01:24:12.680
<v Speaker 2>It all came on the telephone line, and whoever owned

1173
01:24:12.680 --> 01:24:17.359
<v Speaker 2>the telephone line had a monopoly. Having two or three water.

1174
01:24:17.199 --> 01:24:21.600
<v Speaker 1>Providers is certainly a free is relatively free market.

1175
01:24:22.359 --> 01:24:25.119
<v Speaker 2>A lot of people don't have two or three because

1176
01:24:25.319 --> 01:24:33.960
<v Speaker 2>it hasn't been allowed. So, going back to Richard, yes,

1177
01:24:34.520 --> 01:24:46.520
<v Speaker 2>you're not entitled to anything. You're entitled to be left free.

1178
01:24:47.439 --> 01:24:51.720
<v Speaker 2>But even if you only have one, it doesn't mean

1179
01:24:51.920 --> 01:24:56.000
<v Speaker 2>you're entitled to it. You don't pay your bill, they'll

1180
01:24:56.039 --> 01:25:00.840
<v Speaker 2>cut your water off, and if they jack up the prices,

1181
01:25:01.199 --> 01:25:06.000
<v Speaker 2>they jack up the prices, and then people will start

1182
01:25:06.039 --> 01:25:11.560
<v Speaker 2>thinking about how to create alternatives. But no, a free

1183
01:25:11.600 --> 01:25:12.279
<v Speaker 2>market is.

1184
01:25:14.399 --> 01:25:19.800
<v Speaker 1>Gunman. Doesn't guarantee you any economic product.

1185
01:25:20.079 --> 01:25:28.119
<v Speaker 2>Any economic product doesn't guarantee your water, doesn't guarantee you electricity.

1186
01:25:28.880 --> 01:25:29.840
<v Speaker 2>You know, I'll tie to anything.

1187
01:25:29.840 --> 01:25:32.359
<v Speaker 1>You have to pay for it. You don't pay, you

1188
01:25:32.359 --> 01:25:34.720
<v Speaker 1>don't get it, and you have to pay what the

1189
01:25:34.760 --> 01:25:36.159
<v Speaker 1>market bears.

1190
01:25:38.439 --> 01:25:46.520
<v Speaker 4>All right, tom uh I recommend restoring the Lost Constitution

1191
01:25:47.319 --> 01:25:50.039
<v Speaker 4>by Professor Randy Barnett.

1192
01:25:50.439 --> 01:25:51.920
<v Speaker 1>He'd make a good interview. Guess yeah.

1193
01:25:51.960 --> 01:25:54.640
<v Speaker 2>Randy's really good on the Constitution and he's really good

1194
01:25:54.640 --> 01:26:01.119
<v Speaker 2>on interpreting the Constitution. He's a bit of a I

1195
01:26:01.119 --> 01:26:03.000
<v Speaker 2>mean it's a bit of an originalist, and he is

1196
01:26:03.039 --> 01:26:03.720
<v Speaker 2>an anarchist.

1197
01:26:04.279 --> 01:26:08.840
<v Speaker 1>I think the best book about constitution is about about

1198
01:26:08.840 --> 01:26:13.119
<v Speaker 1>thinking about the Constitution is Tarah Smith's book. I forget

1199
01:26:13.119 --> 01:26:15.479
<v Speaker 1>its name now, but Tara has a really good book.

1200
01:26:16.239 --> 01:26:19.920
<v Speaker 2>Uh, kind of a legal philosophy that would go into

1201
01:26:21.199 --> 01:26:22.039
<v Speaker 2>a constitution.

1202
01:26:24.239 --> 01:26:34.000
<v Speaker 1>I'm just looking up the name of the book. Where

1203
01:26:34.119 --> 01:26:39.520
<v Speaker 1>is the actual book? A book?

1204
01:26:44.640 --> 01:26:48.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's a judicial review in an Objective Legal System.

1205
01:26:49.880 --> 01:26:52.760
<v Speaker 2>So a lot of that kind of thinking about the Constitution,

1206
01:26:53.239 --> 01:26:55.600
<v Speaker 2>about how to think about the Constitution, how to think

1207
01:26:55.640 --> 01:26:58.680
<v Speaker 2>about in a sense of tipening in the Constitution.

1208
01:26:58.720 --> 01:26:59.920
<v Speaker 1>That's what judicial review is.

1209
01:27:02.079 --> 01:27:05.359
<v Speaker 2>You know, is there highly recommend it. It's you can

1210
01:27:05.359 --> 01:27:09.600
<v Speaker 2>find it in an Amazon. God it's expensive on hardcover,

1211
01:27:09.720 --> 01:27:13.399
<v Speaker 2>but you can get it on kindle for a pretty

1212
01:27:13.800 --> 01:27:17.439
<v Speaker 2>good price. So Judicial Review in an Objective Legal System

1213
01:27:17.479 --> 01:27:20.520
<v Speaker 2>by Tara Smith. If you're interested about these topics, Tom,

1214
01:27:20.560 --> 01:27:25.039
<v Speaker 2>if you've read a Barnett, you should definitely read Tara Smith.

1215
01:27:25.760 --> 01:27:30.000
<v Speaker 2>She's critical of certain aspects of Randy's content, but also

1216
01:27:30.920 --> 01:27:35.760
<v Speaker 2>positive on a lot of other things that Randy's done.

1217
01:27:37.000 --> 01:27:41.520
<v Speaker 2>Michael Trump still went through with a few hundred deportations

1218
01:27:41.520 --> 01:27:45.079
<v Speaker 2>despite a judge pause. His lunacy is getting dangerous. But

1219
01:27:45.119 --> 01:27:48.039
<v Speaker 2>I don't see anyone in Congress having the balls to impeach. No,

1220
01:27:48.039 --> 01:27:50.760
<v Speaker 2>nobody's gonna impeach you in Congress. Forget about that. That's

1221
01:27:50.800 --> 01:27:54.720
<v Speaker 2>not going to happen. Let's see if he continues, and

1222
01:27:54.840 --> 01:27:59.800
<v Speaker 2>let's see what the quote does and and and how

1223
01:28:00.199 --> 01:28:01.279
<v Speaker 2>people respond to it.

1224
01:28:01.319 --> 01:28:03.960
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, you.

1225
01:28:03.920 --> 01:28:07.920
<v Speaker 2>Know, he's got people like Elon Musk standing next to

1226
01:28:07.960 --> 01:28:13.960
<v Speaker 2>him saying we should just impeach the judges that reverse

1227
01:28:14.000 --> 01:28:21.159
<v Speaker 2>your decisions. You should be able to do whatever you want. Andrew,

1228
01:28:21.760 --> 01:28:24.960
<v Speaker 2>how do you ground in reality? The proper meaning of

1229
01:28:25.119 --> 01:28:28.439
<v Speaker 2>rights to life is against the right to be given

1230
01:28:28.840 --> 01:28:29.840
<v Speaker 2>the things one.

1231
01:28:29.800 --> 01:28:34.960
<v Speaker 1>Needs to live well. The proper grounding in reality is to.

1232
01:28:37.960 --> 01:28:41.119
<v Speaker 2>Really think about why we need rights, What is the

1233
01:28:41.239 --> 01:28:43.359
<v Speaker 2>concept of rights, what.

1234
01:28:43.319 --> 01:28:51.239
<v Speaker 1>Purpose does it serve, what purpose does it serve? And

1235
01:28:51.600 --> 01:28:55.000
<v Speaker 1>to understand that, we have to understand the nature of

1236
01:28:55.079 --> 01:29:03.039
<v Speaker 1>human beings, and really before even what human beings require,

1237
01:29:03.079 --> 01:29:04.319
<v Speaker 1>what humans being need?

1238
01:29:04.840 --> 01:29:12.279
<v Speaker 2>When they come into society when they are in a

1239
01:29:12.319 --> 01:29:19.000
<v Speaker 2>group in a social context. So we should start with

1240
01:29:19.000 --> 01:29:22.119
<v Speaker 2>the nature of human beings, and one has to understand

1241
01:29:22.119 --> 01:29:24.039
<v Speaker 2>that the nature of human beings is to be rational.

1242
01:29:25.039 --> 01:29:28.399
<v Speaker 2>Rationality is what makes us human, what makes the pursuit

1243
01:29:28.399 --> 01:29:34.119
<v Speaker 2>of values possible, what makes human success at living possible.

1244
01:29:35.960 --> 01:29:41.319
<v Speaker 2>So human success at living requires rationality, requires reason. Now

1245
01:29:41.319 --> 01:29:49.000
<v Speaker 2>what does reason require? Reason requires the absence of force.

1246
01:29:50.640 --> 01:29:53.479
<v Speaker 2>That is, when we come into interaction with other people,

1247
01:29:54.840 --> 01:29:59.399
<v Speaker 2>the thing that can obstruct our ability to think and

1248
01:29:59.439 --> 01:30:02.279
<v Speaker 2>to act on those thoughts to pursue our values, to

1249
01:30:02.319 --> 01:30:05.000
<v Speaker 2>achieve our values in there for to achieve our happiness.

1250
01:30:05.319 --> 01:30:06.600
<v Speaker 1>Is force incursion.

1251
01:30:08.159 --> 01:30:12.359
<v Speaker 2>That is, the enemy of the individual, the enemy of

1252
01:30:12.399 --> 01:30:15.159
<v Speaker 2>an individual list, the enemy of an egoist, the enemy

1253
01:30:15.239 --> 01:30:23.760
<v Speaker 2>of a rational animal, because it is the enemy of reason.

1254
01:30:24.800 --> 01:30:31.800
<v Speaker 2>It obstructs ability to reason. So writs a way to

1255
01:30:31.920 --> 01:30:37.000
<v Speaker 2>formalize that, the way to formalize the idea that a

1256
01:30:37.520 --> 01:30:41.159
<v Speaker 2>rational being needs to be free of coasion and force

1257
01:30:41.720 --> 01:30:44.439
<v Speaker 2>in order to be able to pursue his happiness, in

1258
01:30:44.520 --> 01:30:46.520
<v Speaker 2>order to be able to use his mind in pursuit

1259
01:30:46.560 --> 01:30:47.159
<v Speaker 2>of his happiness.

1260
01:30:47.880 --> 01:30:56.800
<v Speaker 1>That's it, and the whole idea of getting things you

1261
01:30:56.880 --> 01:31:01.600
<v Speaker 1>need to live well. That mdically should be suspicious because

1262
01:31:01.600 --> 01:31:04.399
<v Speaker 1>the only way you could get them is if they're

1263
01:31:04.439 --> 01:31:05.840
<v Speaker 1>taken from those who produce them.

1264
01:31:07.399 --> 01:31:10.840
<v Speaker 2>And that means those people don't have a right to

1265
01:31:10.960 --> 01:31:17.680
<v Speaker 2>live free or force incosion. They are now just tools

1266
01:31:18.439 --> 01:31:21.880
<v Speaker 2>for me to live well. That means rights are not universal.

1267
01:31:22.279 --> 01:31:26.079
<v Speaker 2>But rights are universal, just as human nature is universal.

1268
01:31:27.840 --> 01:31:35.199
<v Speaker 2>So uh, rights can't. It's a contradiction, the idea that

1269
01:31:35.239 --> 01:31:38.239
<v Speaker 2>you have a right to other people's stuff, that's an

1270
01:31:38.239 --> 01:31:39.279
<v Speaker 2>immediate contradiction.

1271
01:31:39.680 --> 01:31:52.520
<v Speaker 1>The only right you have is to be left alone.

1272
01:31:53.239 --> 01:32:02.199
<v Speaker 2>So the engagement with other people requires an understanding the

1273
01:32:02.279 --> 01:32:07.720
<v Speaker 2>coosion is banned, that there is no cosion, and that

1274
01:32:07.840 --> 01:32:12.319
<v Speaker 2>is what the concept of rights captures. And if somebody

1275
01:32:12.439 --> 01:32:15.319
<v Speaker 2>violates that, if somebody doesn't want.

1276
01:32:15.199 --> 01:32:18.359
<v Speaker 1>To agree, oh I think qusion is great, I'm going

1277
01:32:18.439 --> 01:32:21.880
<v Speaker 1>to go rape and pillage. Okay, Well, we have a.

1278
01:32:21.800 --> 01:32:25.560
<v Speaker 2>Mechanism a police that captures you and throws you in

1279
01:32:25.640 --> 01:32:31.680
<v Speaker 2>jail forever, because we don't need your agreement to do that.

1280
01:32:32.680 --> 01:32:34.720
<v Speaker 1>We don't need your agreement to put you in jail.

1281
01:32:35.359 --> 01:32:48.039
<v Speaker 1>You have violated right, the fundamental necessity for human coexistence, Richard,

1282
01:32:48.880 --> 01:32:52.560
<v Speaker 1>how could you tighten the Constitution to completely prevent buying

1283
01:32:52.600 --> 01:32:56.720
<v Speaker 1>and selling government influence. Well, I don't think you really can.

1284
01:32:57.560 --> 01:32:59.159
<v Speaker 1>What you can do is.

1285
01:33:01.960 --> 01:33:08.439
<v Speaker 2>Restrict the influence government has so that there's nothing to buy.

1286
01:33:08.960 --> 01:33:17.720
<v Speaker 2>There's nothing to buy. If I, you know, can't give

1287
01:33:17.760 --> 01:33:20.600
<v Speaker 2>subsidies because that's a violation of the principal separation state

1288
01:33:20.600 --> 01:33:24.560
<v Speaker 2>from economics, why would you lobby me.

1289
01:33:26.079 --> 01:33:30.680
<v Speaker 1>If I can't give out favors, why would you lobby me?

1290
01:33:30.760 --> 01:33:34.239
<v Speaker 2>So the only thing is government contracts, and government contracts

1291
01:33:34.239 --> 01:33:36.760
<v Speaker 2>even there would be limited, government would be relatively small,

1292
01:33:37.399 --> 01:33:41.720
<v Speaker 2>and the main contracts would be defense contracts, and you

1293
01:33:41.760 --> 01:33:48.319
<v Speaker 2>could have something in there about, you know, the illegality

1294
01:33:48.359 --> 01:33:50.920
<v Speaker 2>and the wrongness of bribery, but that could be in

1295
01:33:51.039 --> 01:33:55.479
<v Speaker 2>legislation afterwards in terms of exactly how to procure defense

1296
01:33:55.800 --> 01:34:00.199
<v Speaker 2>contracts without corruption. But and you can't have a will

1297
01:34:00.239 --> 01:34:04.359
<v Speaker 2>it prove anything, right, So corruption is always possible. But

1298
01:34:04.560 --> 01:34:06.319
<v Speaker 2>if we reduce the influence.

1299
01:34:05.960 --> 01:34:10.560
<v Speaker 1>Of politicians, you reduce the need to lobby them, the

1300
01:34:10.600 --> 01:34:13.880
<v Speaker 1>ability to lobby them, the purpose of lobbying them, it's gone.

1301
01:34:14.319 --> 01:34:15.199
<v Speaker 1>They have no power.

1302
01:34:16.840 --> 01:34:21.359
<v Speaker 2>Make politicians impotent, and then you don't have to worry

1303
01:34:21.359 --> 01:34:24.640
<v Speaker 2>about the influence of lobbying.

1304
01:34:27.560 --> 01:34:28.600
<v Speaker 1>All right, Merrivins.

1305
01:34:28.840 --> 01:34:35.680
<v Speaker 2>The federalist papers resemble experimentation, isolate variables aspects of the Constitution,

1306
01:34:35.920 --> 01:34:40.880
<v Speaker 2>and test them against the objections of the public forum. Yeah,

1307
01:34:41.560 --> 01:34:45.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean they were partially to do that. They were

1308
01:34:45.039 --> 01:34:48.560
<v Speaker 2>partially to educate the public. They were partially to test

1309
01:34:48.600 --> 01:34:52.039
<v Speaker 2>them against each other. That is, the federalist papers are

1310
01:34:52.520 --> 01:34:58.920
<v Speaker 2>debates between some of the people engaged in writing the Constitution,

1311
01:35:00.439 --> 01:35:03.359
<v Speaker 2>and they were testing out their theories against one another.

1312
01:35:03.399 --> 01:35:06.399
<v Speaker 1>But yes, and against the public. So I think that's right.

1313
01:35:06.840 --> 01:35:10.359
<v Speaker 2>And you think about how beautifully written they are, how intellectual, how.

1314
01:35:10.319 --> 01:35:11.560
<v Speaker 1>They are, how deep they are.

1315
01:35:16.720 --> 01:35:21.359
<v Speaker 2>That that is right. Williams says. Defense is another good

1316
01:35:21.399 --> 01:35:23.239
<v Speaker 2>example of an industry. We don't have a choice it.

1317
01:35:23.239 --> 01:35:31.039
<v Speaker 2>It's the only industry. Government is a monopoly over the

1318
01:35:31.119 --> 01:35:35.000
<v Speaker 2>use of force. Goverment is a monopoly over the use

1319
01:35:35.039 --> 01:35:39.600
<v Speaker 2>of force. The only thing should be monopolized in our

1320
01:35:39.640 --> 01:35:45.279
<v Speaker 2>world is force. That means policing and military.

1321
01:35:45.399 --> 01:35:48.159
<v Speaker 1>That's it. That's it.

1322
01:35:48.479 --> 01:35:52.840
<v Speaker 2>Now the government chooses between different arms of manufacturers. So

1323
01:35:52.880 --> 01:35:55.359
<v Speaker 2>the arms of manufacturers still can be in a private market,

1324
01:35:55.439 --> 01:35:56.399
<v Speaker 2>in a free market.

1325
01:35:57.359 --> 01:36:01.319
<v Speaker 1>But you, as a citizen, the only choice you have

1326
01:36:01.439 --> 01:36:01.960
<v Speaker 1>is the state.

1327
01:36:02.039 --> 01:36:05.079
<v Speaker 2>In this country, you'll leave. But in this country, the

1328
01:36:05.119 --> 01:36:07.640
<v Speaker 2>government has a monopoly over the use of force. You

1329
01:36:07.720 --> 01:36:10.119
<v Speaker 2>cannot take a gun and go and enforce the laws.

1330
01:36:11.279 --> 01:36:14.520
<v Speaker 2>You can't hire a private security firm to go and

1331
01:36:14.600 --> 01:36:17.439
<v Speaker 2>enforce the laws. Only the government can enforce the laws.

1332
01:36:17.439 --> 01:36:21.079
<v Speaker 1>That is the only, the one and only.

1333
01:36:23.000 --> 01:36:27.239
<v Speaker 2>Monopoly that exists, and it's a state granded monopoly. And

1334
01:36:27.279 --> 01:36:29.640
<v Speaker 2>it's the whole purpose of a state. There's no purpose

1335
01:36:29.640 --> 01:36:31.439
<v Speaker 2>of a state other than to be the monopoly over

1336
01:36:31.439 --> 01:36:34.159
<v Speaker 2>the use of force. And that's what it really means

1337
01:36:34.600 --> 01:36:36.920
<v Speaker 2>to have individual rights. It means they have an entity

1338
01:36:37.199 --> 01:36:39.359
<v Speaker 2>that protects your rights. In order to protect those rights,

1339
01:36:39.359 --> 01:36:41.600
<v Speaker 2>it has to have a monopoly over the use of force.

1340
01:36:42.479 --> 01:36:45.760
<v Speaker 2>And they are held accountable through voting. That's what you

1341
01:36:45.840 --> 01:36:49.840
<v Speaker 2>have a constitution for. That's why constitution has a separation

1342
01:36:49.880 --> 01:36:53.319
<v Speaker 2>of powers. That's why it limits the power of each

1343
01:36:53.439 --> 01:36:56.359
<v Speaker 2>branch of the government. That's why each branch of the

1344
01:36:56.359 --> 01:36:59.119
<v Speaker 2>government is supposed to correct the other branches of the government,

1345
01:36:59.399 --> 01:37:02.760
<v Speaker 2>look over and check on the other branches of government.

1346
01:37:02.840 --> 01:37:06.760
<v Speaker 2>And then ultimately, since all those branches are government, ultimately

1347
01:37:07.159 --> 01:37:09.680
<v Speaker 2>re bound to a vote by the population.

1348
01:37:10.279 --> 01:37:15.079
<v Speaker 1>That is what holds them accountable. A Constitution and voting

1349
01:37:16.720 --> 01:37:17.840
<v Speaker 1>hector on.

1350
01:37:17.960 --> 01:37:20.479
<v Speaker 2>Most of the US didn't have a high school diploma

1351
01:37:20.560 --> 01:37:23.119
<v Speaker 2>for a long time, that's right, And for a long

1352
01:37:23.159 --> 01:37:24.119
<v Speaker 2>time that wasn't needed.

1353
01:37:25.239 --> 01:37:27.520
<v Speaker 1>Today, more and more it is needed.

1354
01:37:27.560 --> 01:37:29.840
<v Speaker 2>Maybe not the high school diplomas that are being granted

1355
01:37:29.840 --> 01:37:33.640
<v Speaker 2>out there, that is garbage, but a proper high school diploma,

1356
01:37:34.000 --> 01:37:37.039
<v Speaker 2>a high school diploma that actually represents a teaching of

1357
01:37:37.119 --> 01:37:41.680
<v Speaker 2>skills of knowledge, knowledge that is necessary in order to

1358
01:37:41.720 --> 01:37:42.640
<v Speaker 2>function in.

1359
01:37:42.520 --> 01:37:45.920
<v Speaker 1>The modern world. That I think is required.

1360
01:37:45.920 --> 01:37:50.800
<v Speaker 2>We live in information to chnological age, a computer age,

1361
01:37:50.880 --> 01:37:57.279
<v Speaker 2>where certain basic knowledge needs needs to be there. Jacob,

1362
01:37:57.840 --> 01:38:01.720
<v Speaker 2>how much of the Constitution was feel in by case

1363
01:38:01.800 --> 01:38:04.439
<v Speaker 2>law within the first five decades of the country. Would

1364
01:38:04.439 --> 01:38:08.000
<v Speaker 2>you change or altered this structure? Well, I mean the

1365
01:38:08.000 --> 01:38:08.960
<v Speaker 2>more explicit the.

1366
01:38:08.920 --> 01:38:12.880
<v Speaker 1>Constitution had been about rights and what they meant, the

1367
01:38:13.039 --> 01:38:14.560
<v Speaker 1>less you would have needed that.

1368
01:38:14.439 --> 01:38:16.720
<v Speaker 2>Filling in, so part of that would be taken care

1369
01:38:16.760 --> 01:38:21.039
<v Speaker 2>of that. But yeah, I mean, I think the Constitution

1370
01:38:21.159 --> 01:38:23.279
<v Speaker 2>needed to be more explicit about certain things so that

1371
01:38:23.760 --> 01:38:25.560
<v Speaker 2>it relied less on that case law.

1372
01:38:25.720 --> 01:38:28.279
<v Speaker 1>And I don't know how much of it. I'm not

1373
01:38:28.319 --> 01:38:30.159
<v Speaker 1>a scholar of the history of.

1374
01:38:30.159 --> 01:38:34.319
<v Speaker 2>The Constitution, and so I don't know how much of

1375
01:38:34.359 --> 01:38:37.560
<v Speaker 2>that I would revise today. I'd have to know a

1376
01:38:37.560 --> 01:38:39.760
<v Speaker 2>lot more about what was decided in those first five

1377
01:38:39.800 --> 01:38:43.800
<v Speaker 2>decades and.

1378
01:38:42.039 --> 01:38:43.399
<v Speaker 1>How much of it was good and how much of

1379
01:38:43.439 --> 01:38:43.920
<v Speaker 1>it was bad.

1380
01:38:46.479 --> 01:38:50.119
<v Speaker 2>Ian you focused on the things that documents should forbid,

1381
01:38:50.560 --> 01:38:52.960
<v Speaker 2>but I think it would be more important to be

1382
01:38:53.159 --> 01:38:56.199
<v Speaker 2>very explicit that the government is not allowed to do

1383
01:38:56.239 --> 01:38:58.319
<v Speaker 2>anything that isn't explicitly listed as.

1384
01:38:58.239 --> 01:39:03.319
<v Speaker 1>Okay, well, I don't know if that's true, though.

1385
01:39:04.119 --> 01:39:08.119
<v Speaker 2>The government is that to protect individual rights, and it

1386
01:39:08.239 --> 01:39:12.640
<v Speaker 2>might be that because of technology advanced, so because of

1387
01:39:12.680 --> 01:39:15.159
<v Speaker 2>something else. There are certain things that the government in

1388
01:39:15.159 --> 01:39:18.439
<v Speaker 2>the future will have to do to protect rights that

1389
01:39:18.560 --> 01:39:20.039
<v Speaker 2>we didn't think of that it is not listed.

1390
01:39:22.079 --> 01:39:27.520
<v Speaker 1>So I think the real crucial part is.

1391
01:39:27.479 --> 01:39:29.319
<v Speaker 2>To gain an understanding of rights and to gain an

1392
01:39:29.399 --> 01:39:31.720
<v Speaker 2>understanding of what it means to the government to protect rights,

1393
01:39:32.479 --> 01:39:34.720
<v Speaker 2>and then it needs to do whatever it needs to

1394
01:39:34.720 --> 01:39:36.960
<v Speaker 2>do in order to protect those rights. And he has

1395
01:39:36.960 --> 01:39:40.680
<v Speaker 2>some examples of things that it can do.

1396
01:39:42.960 --> 01:39:44.960
<v Speaker 1>I don't know that you need to go through a

1397
01:39:44.960 --> 01:39:47.560
<v Speaker 1>whole constitutional amendment in order to do that.

1398
01:39:47.680 --> 01:39:51.800
<v Speaker 2>I'm not sure that's right. I don't think that's a

1399
01:39:51.840 --> 01:39:55.000
<v Speaker 2>particularly efficient way of doing it. So here's a bunch

1400
01:39:55.000 --> 01:39:56.920
<v Speaker 2>of things that the government needs to do.

1401
01:39:57.880 --> 01:39:59.439
<v Speaker 1>But for example, there's.

1402
01:39:59.199 --> 01:40:04.000
<v Speaker 2>No way the founders could have imagined a Manhattan Project.

1403
01:40:05.600 --> 01:40:07.279
<v Speaker 1>There's just no way they could have imagined that.

1404
01:40:08.079 --> 01:40:10.680
<v Speaker 2>And if you'd had a separation of state from economics

1405
01:40:10.680 --> 01:40:15.359
<v Speaker 2>and state from educational, state from science, then how do

1406
01:40:15.439 --> 01:40:17.560
<v Speaker 2>you get the Manhad Project. Then they wouldn't have put

1407
01:40:17.600 --> 01:40:20.840
<v Speaker 2>in there. I don't think national defense and da da da,

1408
01:40:20.920 --> 01:40:22.359
<v Speaker 2>da da, because they couldn't have thought of it.

1409
01:40:23.159 --> 01:40:26.560
<v Speaker 1>And now it was essential that in a state of

1410
01:40:26.600 --> 01:40:30.600
<v Speaker 1>war that they've come to do this, and not as

1411
01:40:30.640 --> 01:40:36.439
<v Speaker 1>a violation of the Constitution, like let's say Lincoln. Certain

1412
01:40:36.479 --> 01:40:37.439
<v Speaker 1>things that Lincoln.

1413
01:40:37.119 --> 01:40:39.119
<v Speaker 2>Did during the Civil War a journey the Civil War,

1414
01:40:39.159 --> 01:40:42.039
<v Speaker 2>which he understood as violation as a constitution but were

1415
01:40:42.119 --> 01:40:46.159
<v Speaker 2>necessary but not and they were wrong what Lincoln did,

1416
01:40:46.760 --> 01:40:49.560
<v Speaker 2>but not as violation of constitution, but yes, consistent with

1417
01:40:49.600 --> 01:40:53.640
<v Speaker 2>the Constitution. But things that couldn't have been predicted Manhattan

1418
01:40:53.680 --> 01:41:03.760
<v Speaker 2>Project being an example, Tom to play Devil's advocate, Do

1419
01:41:03.800 --> 01:41:06.920
<v Speaker 2>we need the state to support science as a facet

1420
01:41:07.000 --> 01:41:12.199
<v Speaker 2>as its role in defense. No, outside of very narrow

1421
01:41:13.039 --> 01:41:21.520
<v Speaker 2>fields which can explicitly and equivocally be linked to defense.

1422
01:41:22.199 --> 01:41:26.760
<v Speaker 2>Otherwise there's no limit to it. I mean, biotech can secures.

1423
01:41:26.840 --> 01:41:36.800
<v Speaker 2>I mean, so it has to be clearly linked to munitions, missiles, satellites,

1424
01:41:36.840 --> 01:41:38.600
<v Speaker 2>even things like that.

1425
01:41:39.680 --> 01:41:43.680
<v Speaker 1>But it has to be it's very, very slippery slope.

1426
01:41:43.960 --> 01:41:47.640
<v Speaker 2>And look how defense is being used today to do tariffs,

1427
01:41:47.680 --> 01:41:50.159
<v Speaker 2>to do a million things that the government intervenes in.

1428
01:42:00.880 --> 01:42:04.880
<v Speaker 2>Would egoism be an explicit part of just implicit basis

1429
01:42:04.880 --> 01:42:07.479
<v Speaker 2>for a proper constitution. A right to pursue one's own

1430
01:42:07.520 --> 01:42:10.319
<v Speaker 2>happiness is a very abstract statement, though powerful.

1431
01:42:10.359 --> 01:42:14.199
<v Speaker 1>I think I think it would be implicit.

1432
01:42:14.279 --> 01:42:16.680
<v Speaker 2>I mean, even a right to pursue your own happiness

1433
01:42:16.960 --> 01:42:21.680
<v Speaker 2>does not necessarily imply morality of egoism. I mean it does,

1434
01:42:21.720 --> 01:42:25.359
<v Speaker 2>it's the only place it could come from, but it doesn't.

1435
01:42:25.399 --> 01:42:29.239
<v Speaker 2>You know, people can still be ultruists and still call

1436
01:42:29.319 --> 01:42:33.399
<v Speaker 2>for that in some bizarre way. So I would say,

1437
01:42:35.920 --> 01:42:42.039
<v Speaker 2>I would say that it's implicit. The better understood egoism

1438
01:42:42.159 --> 01:42:45.439
<v Speaker 2>is in the culture, the more likely the constitution is

1439
01:42:45.439 --> 01:42:50.560
<v Speaker 2>to be adopted, accepted, and preserved. And that is where

1440
01:42:50.560 --> 01:42:52.960
<v Speaker 2>the focus of the teachings need to be. Because once

1441
01:42:53.840 --> 01:42:57.920
<v Speaker 2>once you get egoism, the rest is relatively easy. Freedom

1442
01:42:58.000 --> 01:43:02.119
<v Speaker 2>is easy for an egoist to freedom. The reason we

1443
01:43:02.199 --> 01:43:06.399
<v Speaker 2>struggle so much for freedom is because altruism does not

1444
01:43:06.560 --> 01:43:07.960
<v Speaker 2>lead to freedom.

1445
01:43:08.399 --> 01:43:11.239
<v Speaker 1>So we are constantly having to figure out how to

1446
01:43:13.199 --> 01:43:18.199
<v Speaker 1>advocate for freedom from all perspective that is not consistent

1447
01:43:18.239 --> 01:43:21.159
<v Speaker 1>with it. And that's why the culture struggles so much

1448
01:43:21.199 --> 01:43:26.119
<v Speaker 1>with the concept of freedom. Stevens says, should punitive damage

1449
01:43:26.159 --> 01:43:27.960
<v Speaker 1>be allowed in contract cases?

1450
01:43:30.680 --> 01:43:36.119
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, probably not or yes, but they should

1451
01:43:36.119 --> 01:43:41.600
<v Speaker 2>be pretty obviously capped. That is, if somebody is violating

1452
01:43:41.600 --> 01:43:46.039
<v Speaker 2>a contract on purpose, there should be a penalty above

1453
01:43:46.079 --> 01:43:49.960
<v Speaker 2>and beyond what is lost, the economic value that's lost.

1454
01:43:50.279 --> 01:43:52.439
<v Speaker 1>But that penalty can be a million acts.

1455
01:43:52.479 --> 01:43:56.680
<v Speaker 2>So you know, these juries that find gazillions of dollars

1456
01:43:56.760 --> 01:43:59.840
<v Speaker 2>punitive damages, there has to be some limits, so they

1457
01:43:59.840 --> 01:44:04.079
<v Speaker 2>have to be some constraints on that. I'm not against

1458
01:44:04.159 --> 01:44:07.640
<v Speaker 2>punitive I e. You did this on purpose, you should

1459
01:44:07.840 --> 01:44:12.039
<v Speaker 2>you should you should pay for that more than just

1460
01:44:12.439 --> 01:44:16.800
<v Speaker 2>you know, you should pay damages. But it can be

1461
01:44:17.920 --> 01:44:21.399
<v Speaker 2>it can be you know, uh, just a way to

1462
01:44:21.520 --> 01:44:24.199
<v Speaker 2>penalize whole businesses and penalize.

1463
01:44:24.239 --> 01:44:25.760
<v Speaker 1>You take from the rich and give to the poor.

1464
01:44:26.199 --> 01:44:30.039
<v Speaker 2>The whole legal structure and legal liability and laws of

1465
01:44:30.079 --> 01:44:32.600
<v Speaker 2>liability and laws of lawsuits need to be changed and

1466
01:44:32.720 --> 01:44:33.520
<v Speaker 2>need to be rethought.

1467
01:44:35.319 --> 01:44:39.279
<v Speaker 1>What's your view of a DPA. I don't know what

1468
01:44:39.279 --> 01:44:39.640
<v Speaker 1>that is.

1469
01:44:40.119 --> 01:44:43.600
<v Speaker 2>If you're protecting rights at the state level. Shouldn't be

1470
01:44:43.600 --> 01:44:54.479
<v Speaker 2>easier to appeal death penalty sentences? Yeah, I mean I

1471
01:44:54.479 --> 01:44:57.359
<v Speaker 2>think it should be easy to appeal death penalty sentences.

1472
01:44:57.880 --> 01:44:59.880
<v Speaker 2>I think you should be easy and fast and quick.

1473
01:45:00.399 --> 01:45:05.319
<v Speaker 2>I'm not particularly in favor of the death penalty, so

1474
01:45:05.800 --> 01:45:09.159
<v Speaker 2>I'm fine with doing away with the death penalty. But yeah,

1475
01:45:09.199 --> 01:45:13.079
<v Speaker 2>I think it should be much easier, much faster to

1476
01:45:13.159 --> 01:45:15.840
<v Speaker 2>appeal and to get a final answer about death penalty.

1477
01:45:15.960 --> 01:45:17.640
<v Speaker 2>I think the fact that they drag on for years

1478
01:45:17.680 --> 01:45:24.600
<v Speaker 2>and years and years is ridiculous, really really ridiculous. Objectives

1479
01:45:24.680 --> 01:45:29.640
<v Speaker 2>claim that psychologizing is wrong. I can't see how it

1480
01:45:29.720 --> 01:45:35.399
<v Speaker 2>is desirable or even possible to avoid inferring one another

1481
01:45:35.560 --> 01:45:40.439
<v Speaker 2>person's mentality is based on their actions what objectives do,

1482
01:45:42.199 --> 01:45:43.680
<v Speaker 2>and objectives do it all the time.

1483
01:45:45.960 --> 01:45:47.000
<v Speaker 1>I think the point.

1484
01:45:46.800 --> 01:45:51.199
<v Speaker 2>Is that one should judge people based on their actions.

1485
01:45:52.479 --> 01:45:54.680
<v Speaker 1>And sure, you can infer somebody's.

1486
01:45:54.279 --> 01:46:01.439
<v Speaker 2>Mentality, but I don't think one should give them a

1487
01:46:01.560 --> 01:46:07.439
<v Speaker 2>pass on judging their actions based on their mentality or

1488
01:46:08.199 --> 01:46:12.039
<v Speaker 2>penalize them more given their actions based on their mentality,

1489
01:46:13.079 --> 01:46:15.960
<v Speaker 2>based on their psychology versus what they explicity.

1490
01:46:16.039 --> 01:46:16.239
<v Speaker 1>Say.

1491
01:46:17.039 --> 01:46:23.800
<v Speaker 2>So again, I encourage everybody to listen to Gatte's talk

1492
01:46:24.560 --> 01:46:26.239
<v Speaker 2>from a year and a half ago at OCONN or

1493
01:46:26.239 --> 01:46:29.439
<v Speaker 2>two years ago from OCONN on psychologizing.

1494
01:46:29.520 --> 01:46:36.520
<v Speaker 1>I thought it was very good. There's a Turk.

1495
01:46:36.399 --> 01:46:39.800
<v Speaker 2>Dichotomy here you're on yesterday you mentioned a vision of

1496
01:46:39.880 --> 01:46:43.720
<v Speaker 2>a cybernetic future where human integrates technology and we enhance

1497
01:46:43.800 --> 01:46:44.399
<v Speaker 2>and modify.

1498
01:46:45.000 --> 01:46:47.039
<v Speaker 1>Super inspiring. Thank you.

1499
01:46:48.279 --> 01:46:50.920
<v Speaker 2>I think that's the way we're going to evolve. I

1500
01:46:51.640 --> 01:46:54.159
<v Speaker 2>think it is a mistake to see humans and robots

1501
01:46:54.159 --> 01:47:00.279
<v Speaker 2>as two separate entities that I think ultimately be a

1502
01:47:00.279 --> 01:47:03.199
<v Speaker 2>good division of labor between the two, and there'll be

1503
01:47:03.199 --> 01:47:08.159
<v Speaker 2>an integration and division of labor between the two. All right, everybody,

1504
01:47:08.279 --> 01:47:10.000
<v Speaker 2>thank you, Thanks all the super chatters.

1505
01:47:10.159 --> 01:47:13.800
<v Speaker 1>I appreciate the support. Uh and.

1506
01:47:15.960 --> 01:47:18.560
<v Speaker 2>Thank you thank you again for Troy from making the

1507
01:47:18.600 --> 01:47:22.880
<v Speaker 2>show possible and for sponsoring it. And I will see

1508
01:47:22.920 --> 01:47:28.159
<v Speaker 2>you guys on Wednesday. Remember no show Monday, no show

1509
01:47:28.199 --> 01:47:32.079
<v Speaker 2>Tuesday Wednesday. In the meantime, those of you would like

1510
01:47:32.119 --> 01:47:35.000
<v Speaker 2>to support the show on a regular basis Patreon, Patreon

1511
01:47:35.039 --> 01:47:37.960
<v Speaker 2>dot com, put in your on book show and you

1512
01:47:38.000 --> 01:47:40.199
<v Speaker 2>can do it. I get almost every day I get

1513
01:47:40.720 --> 01:47:44.359
<v Speaker 2>one new supporter on Patreon. That is a great pace

1514
01:47:44.960 --> 01:47:45.960
<v Speaker 2>that I hope we can.

1515
01:47:46.520 --> 01:47:48.439
<v Speaker 1>I hope we can. We can keep to.

1516
01:47:51.239 --> 01:47:54.279
<v Speaker 2>Uh you know, one to day it would be amazing.

1517
01:47:54.399 --> 01:47:58.199
<v Speaker 2>So you you be the one for today. You I

1518
01:47:58.239 --> 01:47:59.439
<v Speaker 2>can see you right there.

1519
01:48:00.359 --> 01:48:06.720
<v Speaker 1>All right. Thanks everybody. I will talk to you on Wednesday. Bye, everybody.