WEBVTT

1
00:00:31.079 --> 00:00:33.079
<v Speaker 1>Welcome back to calling on things.

2
00:00:33.759 --> 00:00:37.600
<v Speaker 2>I'm your host DJ, along with the one and only

3
00:00:37.840 --> 00:00:42.759
<v Speaker 2>Massachusetts one of Troy, my homie Boston BA.

4
00:00:42.920 --> 00:00:43.439
<v Speaker 1>What's up?

5
00:00:43.840 --> 00:00:45.759
<v Speaker 3>What's up? Happy Saturday night.

6
00:00:46.479 --> 00:00:49.679
<v Speaker 1>Happy Saturday night to you. What we got going on tonight?

7
00:00:49.759 --> 00:00:54.200
<v Speaker 3>Via, Well, we have two amazing ladies coming on to

8
00:00:54.359 --> 00:00:55.119
<v Speaker 3>talk to us.

9
00:00:55.520 --> 00:00:57.960
<v Speaker 1>That's right, that's right, that's right, all right.

10
00:00:58.600 --> 00:01:01.640
<v Speaker 2>You guys know her because she has appeared on shows,

11
00:01:01.679 --> 00:01:08.040
<v Speaker 2>and essentially, this young lady, this successful business owner, entrepreneur,

12
00:01:09.120 --> 00:01:11.359
<v Speaker 2>owner of two law firms, and she sits on more

13
00:01:11.439 --> 00:01:19.680
<v Speaker 2>boards than a lot of surfers do, has come here

14
00:01:19.920 --> 00:01:27.439
<v Speaker 2>to shed light on what is almost unbelievable what's happening

15
00:01:27.439 --> 00:01:32.560
<v Speaker 2>in Massachusetts with regard to bias. Bev and her cast

16
00:01:32.640 --> 00:01:36.239
<v Speaker 2>of characters from the Norfolk DA, the MSP, and the

17
00:01:36.359 --> 00:01:37.319
<v Speaker 2>Kenton Police Office.

18
00:01:37.400 --> 00:01:43.000
<v Speaker 1>Hi Helena Rafferty xoxo. So, and she's actually.

19
00:01:42.760 --> 00:01:47.159
<v Speaker 2>I heard her today on Young Jerks, a great show

20
00:01:47.239 --> 00:01:51.120
<v Speaker 2>with Mike, and she was encouraging other She used the

21
00:01:51.159 --> 00:01:56.280
<v Speaker 2>word barristers, which really struck my English, my UK soul

22
00:01:57.000 --> 00:02:01.400
<v Speaker 2>to come and join her in this fight. So, without

23
00:02:01.760 --> 00:02:08.159
<v Speaker 2>further delay, let us please welcome in cab Homie. Awesome attorney,

24
00:02:08.599 --> 00:02:11.960
<v Speaker 2>cool badass lady ned Gallop.

25
00:02:15.240 --> 00:02:23.759
<v Speaker 1>Did somebody get in amen? Then gall you miss Joy? Yes?

26
00:02:24.080 --> 00:02:26.680
<v Speaker 4>And can I add she's also very down to earth

27
00:02:26.960 --> 00:02:30.479
<v Speaker 4>and very yes, very down to earth, very approachable.

28
00:02:30.879 --> 00:02:34.199
<v Speaker 5>Thank you. I appreciate that. Guys. It's always the warmest

29
00:02:34.240 --> 00:02:37.800
<v Speaker 5>welcome when I come see you. How are you today?

30
00:02:38.439 --> 00:02:40.800
<v Speaker 2>We're doing great, man, We got We've got a great

31
00:02:40.840 --> 00:02:41.960
<v Speaker 2>bunch of people in the chat.

32
00:02:42.439 --> 00:02:45.120
<v Speaker 1>Got some working out done this morning so we could

33
00:02:45.120 --> 00:02:45.919
<v Speaker 1>try to look like you.

34
00:02:46.599 --> 00:02:52.520
<v Speaker 5>Oh there ain't no, there ain't no muscle here. BIA's

35
00:02:52.599 --> 00:02:55.520
<v Speaker 5>met me in person. It's just it's kind of just

36
00:02:56.000 --> 00:02:56.680
<v Speaker 5>not much there.

37
00:02:57.080 --> 00:02:59.360
<v Speaker 1>Sinewy your sinewy? Is that the right way? I don't

38
00:02:59.360 --> 00:03:01.599
<v Speaker 1>know if that's.

39
00:03:00.599 --> 00:03:01.840
<v Speaker 5>That's a good word for me.

40
00:03:03.360 --> 00:03:07.120
<v Speaker 2>I like them, And you know what, it's funny. I

41
00:03:07.120 --> 00:03:12.639
<v Speaker 2>had to write down a question uh today that is

42
00:03:12.680 --> 00:03:15.319
<v Speaker 2>a take off from your conversation with Mike.

43
00:03:15.800 --> 00:03:21.159
<v Speaker 1>And you you spoke about and so we're gonna do

44
00:03:21.199 --> 00:03:23.639
<v Speaker 1>this and then what's gonna happen. First of all, Hello,

45
00:03:23.680 --> 00:03:24.360
<v Speaker 1>everybody in chat.

46
00:03:24.400 --> 00:03:28.919
<v Speaker 2>Hello, Kimberley macguiere, Welcome in, Debbie Blair and everybody else, Hillary,

47
00:03:29.319 --> 00:03:30.280
<v Speaker 2>everybody that's here.

48
00:03:30.879 --> 00:03:33.919
<v Speaker 1>I just saw somebody, uh and and Webb a.

49
00:03:35.439 --> 00:03:38.280
<v Speaker 2>Timely manner. I love some of your names. Valhall Law,

50
00:03:38.360 --> 00:03:40.240
<v Speaker 2>the Massachusetts attorneys here.

51
00:03:40.159 --> 00:03:46.199
<v Speaker 1>Your colleague, uh hey, And so I'm sitting there listening

52
00:03:46.360 --> 00:03:48.319
<v Speaker 1>to you, and you said that there's going to be

53
00:03:48.360 --> 00:03:52.639
<v Speaker 1>a reckoning for Hank Brennan, and I was curious what

54
00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:54.120
<v Speaker 1>type of reckoning could be.

55
00:03:54.240 --> 00:03:57.879
<v Speaker 2>So, in other words, what form could that take? Uh,

56
00:03:57.960 --> 00:04:03.000
<v Speaker 2>some sort of reckoning after this trial unfolds and comes

57
00:04:03.000 --> 00:04:03.840
<v Speaker 2>to a conclusion.

58
00:04:04.199 --> 00:04:07.199
<v Speaker 5>That's a great question. And I have used that word

59
00:04:07.479 --> 00:04:10.000
<v Speaker 5>just a handful of times, and one of which was today,

60
00:04:10.120 --> 00:04:14.639
<v Speaker 5>And for anyone who's interested, I kind of stole that

61
00:04:14.840 --> 00:04:18.800
<v Speaker 5>line from the end of There's a movie that came

62
00:04:18.839 --> 00:04:20.920
<v Speaker 5>out I think it was in two thousand and two

63
00:04:21.720 --> 00:04:27.040
<v Speaker 5>called Cold Mountain with Nicole Kidman and Jude Law and

64
00:04:27.279 --> 00:04:31.120
<v Speaker 5>it was Civil War based love story and war story.

65
00:04:31.639 --> 00:04:34.839
<v Speaker 5>And towards the end of the movie, after all of

66
00:04:34.879 --> 00:04:40.800
<v Speaker 5>this kind of corruption in how the Civil War deserters

67
00:04:40.920 --> 00:04:43.360
<v Speaker 5>were treated, those who just walked away from the war,

68
00:04:43.959 --> 00:04:46.800
<v Speaker 5>Nicole Kidman had a line where she looked one of

69
00:04:46.839 --> 00:04:52.079
<v Speaker 5>the corrupt law enforcement individuals in the face and she said,

70
00:04:52.079 --> 00:04:54.600
<v Speaker 5>there will be a reckoning. And that always kind of

71
00:04:54.759 --> 00:04:59.120
<v Speaker 5>stuck with me, and I'm sure, and I really just

72
00:04:59.199 --> 00:05:02.560
<v Speaker 5>don't know, but I'm sure there is some biblical background

73
00:05:02.560 --> 00:05:05.600
<v Speaker 5>to it, but it's I took it from the cinema.

74
00:05:06.240 --> 00:05:09.279
<v Speaker 5>But in terms of a reckoning, I really do believe

75
00:05:09.319 --> 00:05:12.519
<v Speaker 5>in that, in that in this case, the Karen Reid case,

76
00:05:12.560 --> 00:05:17.079
<v Speaker 5>and frankly the Aiden Carney case, which is tied to

77
00:05:17.120 --> 00:05:20.920
<v Speaker 5>it but certainly separate from it, I'm of the opinion,

78
00:05:21.000 --> 00:05:24.920
<v Speaker 5>with my legal background, to say that I look at

79
00:05:25.199 --> 00:05:30.959
<v Speaker 5>once she is acquitted and he is acquitted, although perhaps

80
00:05:31.360 --> 00:05:35.120
<v Speaker 5>his charges will be dismissed outright, and there's some pending

81
00:05:35.319 --> 00:05:39.879
<v Speaker 5>applications to do that, that there will be some type

82
00:05:39.920 --> 00:05:44.800
<v Speaker 5>of look back, whatever it is, in terms of what

83
00:05:45.000 --> 00:05:49.519
<v Speaker 5>went wrong, what officers were really at fault, who covered

84
00:05:49.560 --> 00:05:53.279
<v Speaker 5>things up, what individuals who have been named as third

85
00:05:53.319 --> 00:05:58.279
<v Speaker 5>party culprits and or co conspirators in any potential cover

86
00:05:58.399 --> 00:06:01.199
<v Speaker 5>up of you know what. I I don't believe was

87
00:06:01.199 --> 00:06:06.519
<v Speaker 5>ever an intentional murder of John O'Keeffe. I just feel

88
00:06:06.560 --> 00:06:11.240
<v Speaker 5>that there was probably something that went awry, and then

89
00:06:12.319 --> 00:06:15.839
<v Speaker 5>I wish cooler heads had prevailed and that law enforcement

90
00:06:15.879 --> 00:06:19.639
<v Speaker 5>had been called and people had been held accountable. But

91
00:06:19.720 --> 00:06:21.720
<v Speaker 5>that does not seem to have been the case as

92
00:06:21.720 --> 00:06:24.600
<v Speaker 5>it tracks with the facts that have come out, and

93
00:06:24.839 --> 00:06:30.680
<v Speaker 5>once there is this quote look back. There will be consequences,

94
00:06:30.839 --> 00:06:34.720
<v Speaker 5>consequences that range from those who were really at ground

95
00:06:34.839 --> 00:06:38.360
<v Speaker 5>zero from the tragic events of January twenty ninth, twenty

96
00:06:38.399 --> 00:06:42.920
<v Speaker 5>twenty two, stemming all the way through the investigation. And

97
00:06:42.959 --> 00:06:46.160
<v Speaker 5>you've already seen one of those reckonings with the former

98
00:06:46.560 --> 00:06:54.160
<v Speaker 5>trooper Proctor, mister Michael Proctor now, and I always, I

99
00:06:54.199 --> 00:06:57.120
<v Speaker 5>always try to make sure I emphasize that, and I

100
00:06:57.160 --> 00:07:00.399
<v Speaker 5>hope you all do too. But that's one little depth.

101
00:07:00.879 --> 00:07:06.839
<v Speaker 5>Then there will be some looking at the prosecutor, the

102
00:07:06.879 --> 00:07:11.240
<v Speaker 5>district attorney in that in that county, and whether or

103
00:07:11.319 --> 00:07:15.319
<v Speaker 5>not he had a hand in orchestrating and or not

104
00:07:16.120 --> 00:07:22.199
<v Speaker 5>properly investigating and prosecuting ms Read and possibly Aiden Carney

105
00:07:22.279 --> 00:07:25.560
<v Speaker 5>as well. Also, I think that in terms of reckoning,

106
00:07:25.759 --> 00:07:29.600
<v Speaker 5>there will likely be a complete overhaul for not only

107
00:07:29.680 --> 00:07:36.319
<v Speaker 5>how just ground level investigations are performed, but also ranging

108
00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:39.600
<v Speaker 5>all the way up through how cases are brought, when,

109
00:07:39.720 --> 00:07:43.639
<v Speaker 5>how the decision making is done, how that sausage is made.

110
00:07:43.879 --> 00:07:46.399
<v Speaker 5>Do we bring charges against this person, do we bring

111
00:07:46.480 --> 00:07:50.000
<v Speaker 5>this level of charges against this person, and by this person,

112
00:07:50.040 --> 00:07:52.560
<v Speaker 5>I mean any of you, any of your loved ones

113
00:07:52.879 --> 00:07:58.240
<v Speaker 5>that in that community up there, and hopefully perhaps a

114
00:07:58.319 --> 00:08:03.319
<v Speaker 5>judicial overhaul if if there has been a determination that

115
00:08:03.480 --> 00:08:06.279
<v Speaker 5>some of the decisions were biased, there needs to be

116
00:08:06.399 --> 00:08:11.639
<v Speaker 5>some accountability there. And the accountability is all to the taxpayers.

117
00:08:11.839 --> 00:08:14.879
<v Speaker 5>I'm not a taxpayer there, but if I were any

118
00:08:14.920 --> 00:08:18.240
<v Speaker 5>of your viewers listening and watching, saying I pay taxes

119
00:08:18.279 --> 00:08:22.160
<v Speaker 5>to this county or this this town, I would want

120
00:08:22.199 --> 00:08:25.160
<v Speaker 5>to make sure that only the best law enforcement were

121
00:08:25.160 --> 00:08:28.879
<v Speaker 5>policing the streets and that there wasn't a thin blue line.

122
00:08:29.240 --> 00:08:31.600
<v Speaker 5>So there there's going to be a look back or

123
00:08:31.600 --> 00:08:35.279
<v Speaker 5>a reckoning, and one day, I really do hope it

124
00:08:35.360 --> 00:08:38.480
<v Speaker 5>comes to fruition, because this has been not only a

125
00:08:38.519 --> 00:08:44.360
<v Speaker 5>financial strain, but it's been an emotional one, a psychological one. Yeah,

126
00:08:44.519 --> 00:08:44.919
<v Speaker 5>look at this.

127
00:08:45.039 --> 00:08:49.960
<v Speaker 1>Somebody is checking you out right from here from Bartha Colona. Right,

128
00:08:50.000 --> 00:09:00.519
<v Speaker 1>go ahead, that's right, look at that. What's up?

129
00:09:00.559 --> 00:09:03.720
<v Speaker 2>There's my homie from Franklin, mass where my college is Deborah.

130
00:09:03.759 --> 00:09:05.600
<v Speaker 1>What's up? Homes? How are you?

131
00:09:07.000 --> 00:09:10.720
<v Speaker 2>And so there before there is quite we already have

132
00:09:10.879 --> 00:09:13.600
<v Speaker 2>interesting questions for you, But I want to say thank

133
00:09:13.600 --> 00:09:16.639
<v Speaker 2>you very much for AJK for gifting ten calling all

134
00:09:16.759 --> 00:09:20.399
<v Speaker 2>beings memberships, and I mustay I really appreciate you when

135
00:09:20.440 --> 00:09:22.639
<v Speaker 2>you see me raise my hands up that but my

136
00:09:22.679 --> 00:09:23.519
<v Speaker 2>guest is speaking.

137
00:09:24.360 --> 00:09:26.360
<v Speaker 1>That's what I'm saying is thank you, even though it's

138
00:09:26.399 --> 00:09:28.080
<v Speaker 1>just visual in nature.

139
00:09:28.600 --> 00:09:31.320
<v Speaker 5>I love I love you guys so much. You are

140
00:09:31.600 --> 00:09:35.840
<v Speaker 5>the most like the sweetest hosts and also not only

141
00:09:35.840 --> 00:09:38.440
<v Speaker 5>to your guests but to your chat. It's wonderful.

142
00:09:39.399 --> 00:09:39.720
<v Speaker 1>Thank you.

143
00:09:39.799 --> 00:09:43.320
<v Speaker 2>We feel honored that they have chosen to take time.

144
00:09:43.399 --> 00:09:45.879
<v Speaker 2>They could be doing anything right now, but they have

145
00:09:46.039 --> 00:09:48.200
<v Speaker 2>chosen to come and spend it with us, and that's

146
00:09:48.240 --> 00:09:48.879
<v Speaker 2>that's an honor.

147
00:09:49.320 --> 00:09:50.000
<v Speaker 5>So great.

148
00:09:50.000 --> 00:09:53.799
<v Speaker 1>You very happy. This lady right here we expect here

149
00:09:53.879 --> 00:09:54.799
<v Speaker 1>on here shortly.

150
00:09:54.919 --> 00:09:58.879
<v Speaker 2>This is Kate Casey, the host of Reality Life, and

151
00:09:58.960 --> 00:10:02.759
<v Speaker 2>she is the one who interviewed the documentarian I think

152
00:10:02.759 --> 00:10:05.200
<v Speaker 2>that did the Karen Reid Netflix show.

153
00:10:05.840 --> 00:10:08.120
<v Speaker 1>So I I.

154
00:10:07.679 --> 00:10:09.799
<v Speaker 2>When she comes, I'm basically going to turn it over

155
00:10:09.799 --> 00:10:12.879
<v Speaker 2>to her because I don't feel like they have a

156
00:10:12.919 --> 00:10:16.000
<v Speaker 2>great understanding of what's so egregious in the case in

157
00:10:16.039 --> 00:10:18.360
<v Speaker 2>this case, and who better to explain that to her

158
00:10:18.519 --> 00:10:19.360
<v Speaker 2>than Nan Gallagher.

159
00:10:20.759 --> 00:10:23.279
<v Speaker 5>I'm gonna explain it to her. DJ I'm explain it

160
00:10:23.320 --> 00:10:23.600
<v Speaker 5>to her.

161
00:10:23.679 --> 00:10:24.879
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean, I don't.

162
00:10:24.919 --> 00:10:28.320
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if she has a sense of how

163
00:10:28.360 --> 00:10:32.080
<v Speaker 2>bizarre this is and how out of character and out

164
00:10:32.120 --> 00:10:35.480
<v Speaker 2>of any legal norm that any of you have ever seen,

165
00:10:35.559 --> 00:10:41.279
<v Speaker 2>anyone from Mark to Melanie and probably out if you

166
00:10:41.320 --> 00:10:45.759
<v Speaker 2>were having private conversations, probably Alan David and Eliza and

167
00:10:47.120 --> 00:10:50.720
<v Speaker 2>Robert Alisi or Lessie, depending upon where you're from, would

168
00:10:50.759 --> 00:10:53.200
<v Speaker 2>say this, that they're saying, this is completely out of

169
00:10:53.240 --> 00:10:53.600
<v Speaker 2>the norm.

170
00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:56.759
<v Speaker 5>Well, and I think that it being so out of

171
00:10:56.759 --> 00:11:00.519
<v Speaker 5>the norm is I know, it's what caused me. It

172
00:11:00.559 --> 00:11:03.279
<v Speaker 5>was one of two contributing factors to what caused me

173
00:11:03.360 --> 00:11:06.559
<v Speaker 5>to start speaking up. The other factor was the fact

174
00:11:06.559 --> 00:11:10.720
<v Speaker 5>that one attorney in the Dallas area had donated one

175
00:11:10.759 --> 00:11:14.559
<v Speaker 5>billable hour of her time in the form of a donation.

176
00:11:14.840 --> 00:11:17.080
<v Speaker 5>And I don't recall if she donated it to the

177
00:11:17.159 --> 00:11:20.720
<v Speaker 5>Karen Reid Defense Fund or to Turtle Boy, but you know,

178
00:11:20.759 --> 00:11:22.840
<v Speaker 5>I was like, oh, I guess I could do that,

179
00:11:23.039 --> 00:11:26.519
<v Speaker 5>and then it kind of evolved in terms of donations

180
00:11:26.559 --> 00:11:33.440
<v Speaker 5>after that. But then also the abnormalities are so striking,

181
00:11:33.559 --> 00:11:39.039
<v Speaker 5>the contrariness to the way jurisprudence is supposed to be done,

182
00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:42.519
<v Speaker 5>that is so notable to me and I know to

183
00:11:42.600 --> 00:11:47.200
<v Speaker 5>others and even to the newest juror, former juror who

184
00:11:47.240 --> 00:11:52.759
<v Speaker 5>was an alternate Victoria George. She in a really badass move,

185
00:11:53.080 --> 00:11:56.759
<v Speaker 5>just decided to move from a former juror on this

186
00:11:56.919 --> 00:12:01.240
<v Speaker 5>case to a defense council on behalf of the defendant

187
00:12:01.759 --> 00:12:06.919
<v Speaker 5>for whom she sat as an alternate juror. So it's

188
00:12:07.320 --> 00:12:12.879
<v Speaker 5>it runs against our very mental and experiential constitution, and

189
00:12:12.919 --> 00:12:17.120
<v Speaker 5>I'm I got to do something that's that's my mindset,

190
00:12:17.120 --> 00:12:20.200
<v Speaker 5>and I know all of you feel the same way totally.

191
00:12:20.759 --> 00:12:25.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's so there's two questions for you already that

192
00:12:25.559 --> 00:12:27.399
<v Speaker 2>I want to get to. But I want to thank

193
00:12:27.480 --> 00:12:32.240
<v Speaker 2>AJK for donating another cab ten cab memberships. Thank you

194
00:12:32.399 --> 00:12:34.840
<v Speaker 2>very much. We don't have a whole lot of members

195
00:12:34.879 --> 00:12:37.000
<v Speaker 2>I think we're like under one hundred or something, so

196
00:12:37.320 --> 00:12:38.080
<v Speaker 2>thank you very much.

197
00:12:38.120 --> 00:12:39.639
<v Speaker 1>I was very very kind of you. Thank you.

198
00:12:40.759 --> 00:12:44.039
<v Speaker 2>And now I must say the other one is okay,

199
00:12:44.159 --> 00:12:46.279
<v Speaker 2>CoP's daughter wants to know.

200
00:12:46.960 --> 00:12:49.200
<v Speaker 1>I want to know what Nan and Mike Croft had

201
00:12:49.320 --> 00:12:50.000
<v Speaker 1>said that they know.

202
00:12:51.480 --> 00:12:54.600
<v Speaker 5>Well. And it's funny. I know we both said earlier

203
00:12:54.799 --> 00:12:57.320
<v Speaker 5>on The Young Jerks that we know some things, and

204
00:12:57.360 --> 00:13:02.799
<v Speaker 5>I can't remember in what context CoP's daughter. I said

205
00:13:02.799 --> 00:13:06.120
<v Speaker 5>that because I happen, I happen to know a few

206
00:13:06.200 --> 00:13:12.519
<v Speaker 5>things which I'm not at liberty to say. But I

207
00:13:12.519 --> 00:13:15.080
<v Speaker 5>don't know. Oh what, Oh how.

208
00:13:14.840 --> 00:13:18.000
<v Speaker 1>Adorable buddy Julia the polar Bear.

209
00:13:18.919 --> 00:13:22.679
<v Speaker 5>Oh my gosh, if that puppy is going to be

210
00:13:22.720 --> 00:13:29.159
<v Speaker 5>on this stream, I'm not going to pay attention at all. Well,

211
00:13:29.200 --> 00:13:31.080
<v Speaker 5>I wish I could pick my dog up like that.

212
00:13:31.159 --> 00:13:34.679
<v Speaker 5>My dog is eighty pounds, and I mean, at this

213
00:13:34.759 --> 00:13:38.200
<v Speaker 5>point she could probably pick me up. But anyway, there's

214
00:13:38.440 --> 00:13:41.399
<v Speaker 5>just a few things that I have heard, which I

215
00:13:41.440 --> 00:13:44.639
<v Speaker 5>always discount. When I hear things, I'm like, Okay, maybe

216
00:13:44.639 --> 00:13:47.879
<v Speaker 5>that's a rumor mill. And then I've had an opportunity

217
00:13:48.480 --> 00:13:52.840
<v Speaker 5>CoP's daughter to have some conversations. I don't know if

218
00:13:52.879 --> 00:13:55.600
<v Speaker 5>what I know is what Mike Crawford knows, So I

219
00:13:55.639 --> 00:13:59.600
<v Speaker 5>can't even I can't even validate that we both know

220
00:13:59.679 --> 00:14:02.799
<v Speaker 5>the same things. So I'm sorry if that was in

221
00:14:02.840 --> 00:14:07.240
<v Speaker 5>any way a dissatisfying answer. But what I have heard

222
00:14:07.360 --> 00:14:10.519
<v Speaker 5>and have on good information is that this is going

223
00:14:10.559 --> 00:14:16.120
<v Speaker 5>to be a completely different trial, a very completely different trial.

224
00:14:16.440 --> 00:14:17.399
<v Speaker 1>Lord here a prayer.

225
00:14:18.759 --> 00:14:24.240
<v Speaker 2>I retired North Carolina State Highway Police, so basically state trooper.

226
00:14:25.039 --> 00:14:27.879
<v Speaker 2>He says, Nan, have you ever seen a case where

227
00:14:27.919 --> 00:14:29.799
<v Speaker 2>the lead investigator was.

228
00:14:29.799 --> 00:14:33.759
<v Speaker 1>Fired and the case proceeded. I haven't. In one hundred

229
00:14:33.840 --> 00:14:38.639
<v Speaker 1>percent of those penning cases are always dismissed. Always, So

230
00:14:39.039 --> 00:14:40.240
<v Speaker 1>what's your reaction to that.

231
00:14:40.720 --> 00:14:43.799
<v Speaker 5>Well, first, I want to say hey to you, because

232
00:14:43.879 --> 00:14:46.399
<v Speaker 5>I know I've seen you put in chats on some

233
00:14:46.480 --> 00:14:48.720
<v Speaker 5>of the shows I've been on, so it's great to

234
00:14:48.720 --> 00:14:52.679
<v Speaker 5>see you. And I've heard you call in to the

235
00:14:52.720 --> 00:14:56.000
<v Speaker 5>young jerks. I've heard you call into seeking justice. I believe,

236
00:14:56.080 --> 00:14:59.679
<v Speaker 5>and you know your stuff. I have never had a

237
00:14:59.720 --> 00:15:03.440
<v Speaker 5>case or seen a case where the lead investigator had

238
00:15:03.480 --> 00:15:07.960
<v Speaker 5>been fired, at least during the pendency of the trial proceedings,

239
00:15:08.000 --> 00:15:10.480
<v Speaker 5>which we are in. Even though two point zero didn't

240
00:15:10.519 --> 00:15:14.240
<v Speaker 5>start yet, we're in the pendency of the trial. I

241
00:15:14.399 --> 00:15:17.720
<v Speaker 5>have to believe that in the cases where the lead

242
00:15:17.799 --> 00:15:21.600
<v Speaker 5>investigator has been fired, and I imagine that's not many,

243
00:15:21.639 --> 00:15:25.600
<v Speaker 5>that the prosecutor would always decide to dismiss I mean,

244
00:15:25.840 --> 00:15:29.279
<v Speaker 5>it's your lead investigator. It would be the same if

245
00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:38.399
<v Speaker 5>the medical examiner just absolutely would not agree with the

246
00:15:38.440 --> 00:15:42.159
<v Speaker 5>prosecution's position. So right now we're in a position where

247
00:15:42.720 --> 00:15:46.399
<v Speaker 5>the medical examiner doctor Scordy Bellow. It's not that she

248
00:15:46.440 --> 00:15:50.960
<v Speaker 5>doesn't agree with the prosecution's theory in terms of cause

249
00:15:51.000 --> 00:15:54.840
<v Speaker 5>and manner of death. She's just not able to cross

250
00:15:54.879 --> 00:15:59.519
<v Speaker 5>that threshold of saying, yes, I can definitively say that

251
00:15:59.639 --> 00:16:02.840
<v Speaker 5>this is the cause and this is the manner of death.

252
00:16:02.919 --> 00:16:05.840
<v Speaker 5>She will She's kind of hedging on the manner of death,

253
00:16:06.440 --> 00:16:11.759
<v Speaker 5>so they don't need to sever ties with her completely,

254
00:16:12.159 --> 00:16:14.919
<v Speaker 5>although it seems to me that they're pretty much severing

255
00:16:14.960 --> 00:16:17.960
<v Speaker 5>ties with her because she did not give them the

256
00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:21.879
<v Speaker 5>manner of death that they wanted. She's only saying it's undetermined,

257
00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:25.840
<v Speaker 5>and she's willing, as was seen in Trial one point zero,

258
00:16:26.240 --> 00:16:30.039
<v Speaker 5>to make concessions to the defense in terms of what

259
00:16:30.240 --> 00:16:35.279
<v Speaker 5>could have been other potential causes or manners of death

260
00:16:35.440 --> 00:16:39.840
<v Speaker 5>for John O'Keefe. So in this case, I would simply

261
00:16:39.879 --> 00:16:45.039
<v Speaker 5>say that the fact that former Trooper Proctor or Michael

262
00:16:45.080 --> 00:16:49.480
<v Speaker 5>Proctor was fired and they're still not willing to dismiss

263
00:16:49.919 --> 00:16:53.679
<v Speaker 5>the charges or to downgrade them or make this some

264
00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:57.759
<v Speaker 5>type of more attractive plea deal for Karen, which I

265
00:16:58.039 --> 00:17:01.320
<v Speaker 5>still would not suggest, But the fact that they won't

266
00:17:01.360 --> 00:17:04.119
<v Speaker 5>do that just tells me that they're so locked in

267
00:17:04.640 --> 00:17:08.240
<v Speaker 5>to their current position and they've come too far and

268
00:17:08.279 --> 00:17:11.640
<v Speaker 5>there's too much at risk for law enforcement and the

269
00:17:11.680 --> 00:17:15.559
<v Speaker 5>prosecution to do it, that they're pot committed, as I say,

270
00:17:15.599 --> 00:17:19.079
<v Speaker 5>and they're just going to move forward. But I will say,

271
00:17:19.680 --> 00:17:26.119
<v Speaker 5>whichever side calls Trooper Proctor former Trooper Proctor, it's going

272
00:17:26.200 --> 00:17:31.640
<v Speaker 5>to be a very spicy testimony. Whether the questions come

273
00:17:31.839 --> 00:17:35.599
<v Speaker 5>from the prosecution to the former officer, or they come

274
00:17:35.680 --> 00:17:39.000
<v Speaker 5>from Alan Jackson or David Yannetti or any one of

275
00:17:39.039 --> 00:17:41.720
<v Speaker 5>the team. I am here for it, and I'm really

276
00:17:41.720 --> 00:17:44.440
<v Speaker 5>looking forward to it because he's going to be absolutely

277
00:17:45.480 --> 00:17:46.799
<v Speaker 5>mauled on the stand.

278
00:17:48.920 --> 00:17:51.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, the thing is, I don't think there's

279
00:17:51.960 --> 00:17:54.880
<v Speaker 2>a I'm going to use the word realistic here. I

280
00:17:54.920 --> 00:17:59.079
<v Speaker 2>don't think there's a realistic circumstance where they would dismiss

281
00:17:59.160 --> 00:18:01.759
<v Speaker 2>the case and with.

282
00:18:01.680 --> 00:18:03.799
<v Speaker 1>That that qualifier.

283
00:18:04.200 --> 00:18:06.680
<v Speaker 2>In other words, yes, if there was a video of

284
00:18:06.759 --> 00:18:10.440
<v Speaker 2>Karen's car where it was indisputable, clear photo of the

285
00:18:10.480 --> 00:18:15.039
<v Speaker 2>red tail light after the supposed, uh you know, faked

286
00:18:15.440 --> 00:18:17.599
<v Speaker 2>thing happened, that they say that that she hit him

287
00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:22.640
<v Speaker 2>with the vehicle, I don't think. I don't think of

288
00:18:23.759 --> 00:18:26.319
<v Speaker 2>outside of that, I don't think there's any circumstance where

289
00:18:26.359 --> 00:18:29.039
<v Speaker 2>they would dismiss the case. But tell me if if

290
00:18:29.079 --> 00:18:31.720
<v Speaker 2>I'm wrong, is there I don't think there's a realistic circumstance.

291
00:18:32.319 --> 00:18:35.880
<v Speaker 5>No, I mean unless it suddenly becomes clear as day

292
00:18:36.119 --> 00:18:41.920
<v Speaker 5>that you know the the evidence that has been discovered

293
00:18:41.960 --> 00:18:45.920
<v Speaker 5>thus far as to the third party culprits who are

294
00:18:45.920 --> 00:18:50.960
<v Speaker 5>Brian Albert, Brian Higgins and Colin Albert, or those who

295
00:18:51.039 --> 00:18:56.640
<v Speaker 5>are in my opinion, accessories or co conspirators, those in

296
00:18:56.720 --> 00:19:03.319
<v Speaker 5>the realm of Jen McCabe, Matt McCabe, Chris Albert, those

297
00:19:03.359 --> 00:19:08.079
<v Speaker 5>who Julie Nagel, people who clearly have shown that they

298
00:19:08.119 --> 00:19:13.079
<v Speaker 5>were somehow possibly involved or know something. That's what evidence

299
00:19:13.160 --> 00:19:15.559
<v Speaker 5>is showing to me. It might not show that way

300
00:19:15.599 --> 00:19:18.880
<v Speaker 5>to a jury or to any of you. But unless

301
00:19:18.920 --> 00:19:24.319
<v Speaker 5>that stuff gets so credibly revealed and not subject to question,

302
00:19:24.880 --> 00:19:27.759
<v Speaker 5>this isn't going to go away until a jury finds

303
00:19:27.799 --> 00:19:32.519
<v Speaker 5>her not guilty. And it's really unfortunate because this is

304
00:19:32.640 --> 00:19:35.920
<v Speaker 5>not the way, in my opinion, that our system of

305
00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:39.799
<v Speaker 5>jurisprudence in any jurisdiction should work. We should be in

306
00:19:39.839 --> 00:19:46.240
<v Speaker 5>a position where prosecutors bring charges based on credible facts

307
00:19:46.319 --> 00:19:50.680
<v Speaker 5>and not stretches, and not junk science and not ill equipped,

308
00:19:51.160 --> 00:19:57.759
<v Speaker 5>poorly educated accident reconstructionists. I'm referring to trial one point

309
00:19:57.839 --> 00:20:01.079
<v Speaker 5>zero when I say that it's it's just not the

310
00:20:01.240 --> 00:20:06.799
<v Speaker 5>type of financial investment that any government and its judiciary

311
00:20:07.319 --> 00:20:11.039
<v Speaker 5>and its prosecutors should be wasting their time on. I

312
00:20:11.119 --> 00:20:15.839
<v Speaker 5>find that really insulting to the legal profession. And that's

313
00:20:15.880 --> 00:20:17.440
<v Speaker 5>why I take it so personally.

314
00:20:18.759 --> 00:20:21.559
<v Speaker 4>And do you really believe that the Feds on January

315
00:20:21.640 --> 00:20:24.200
<v Speaker 4>eighteenth wrote a letter to both the defense and the

316
00:20:24.240 --> 00:20:28.880
<v Speaker 4>prosecution regarding their investigation that was ongoing, and by February

317
00:20:28.920 --> 00:20:31.359
<v Speaker 4>they just called up Hank on the phone and say, hey,

318
00:20:31.559 --> 00:20:34.880
<v Speaker 4>it's over, do you There's no way, right.

319
00:20:35.480 --> 00:20:39.160
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, there is no way anybody's going to convince me

320
00:20:39.240 --> 00:20:42.799
<v Speaker 5>of that. So just and I can't remember if I

321
00:20:42.920 --> 00:20:45.359
<v Speaker 5>explained this to you guys the last time I was

322
00:20:45.400 --> 00:20:47.640
<v Speaker 5>on I might have said it on some other streams.

323
00:20:47.720 --> 00:20:52.119
<v Speaker 5>But in my practice, so I do civil, administrative and

324
00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:56.559
<v Speaker 5>criminal law, and I've done it now for many, many years,

325
00:20:57.200 --> 00:21:00.839
<v Speaker 5>almost a quarter of a century. And in that quarter

326
00:21:00.880 --> 00:21:05.039
<v Speaker 5>of a century, throughout I have dealt with federal criminal

327
00:21:05.200 --> 00:21:10.039
<v Speaker 5>investigative agencies as well as state criminal investigative agencies, and

328
00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:13.240
<v Speaker 5>many times they work hand in hand. Sometimes they don't,

329
00:21:13.240 --> 00:21:17.880
<v Speaker 5>but many times they do. In every single one of

330
00:21:17.920 --> 00:21:24.519
<v Speaker 5>those investigations by a federal investigating body, not once, never,

331
00:21:24.759 --> 00:21:30.799
<v Speaker 5>once have they ever quote closed their investigation with some

332
00:21:31.000 --> 00:21:35.920
<v Speaker 5>type of confirmatory call, email, or letter. It has never

333
00:21:36.039 --> 00:21:39.440
<v Speaker 5>happened in my practice. And I do that type of

334
00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:42.160
<v Speaker 5>work a lot, So it's not like I'm saying, ah,

335
00:21:42.240 --> 00:21:45.400
<v Speaker 5>you know, I've done a handful no in my field,

336
00:21:45.440 --> 00:21:48.160
<v Speaker 5>which is healthcare law, which is a fancy way of

337
00:21:48.200 --> 00:21:52.599
<v Speaker 5>saying I do everything for doctors, and there are a

338
00:21:52.599 --> 00:21:56.279
<v Speaker 5>lot of criminal things that can happen to doctors in

339
00:21:56.359 --> 00:22:01.799
<v Speaker 5>my field. The federal investigating body are really hands on

340
00:22:01.960 --> 00:22:05.559
<v Speaker 5>because there's usually types of insurance fraud moneies that are

341
00:22:05.559 --> 00:22:09.000
<v Speaker 5>being taken in by payers and Medicare medicaid at the

342
00:22:09.039 --> 00:22:13.480
<v Speaker 5>state level. Of these investigative arms, they never tell you

343
00:22:13.960 --> 00:22:16.680
<v Speaker 5>that they're closing out, so you know it to send

344
00:22:16.680 --> 00:22:20.079
<v Speaker 5>some letter in January only to confirm that they're closing

345
00:22:20.119 --> 00:22:24.559
<v Speaker 5>things out or completing things in February. It doesn't track

346
00:22:24.680 --> 00:22:28.880
<v Speaker 5>for me. Also, I do make my clients who want

347
00:22:28.960 --> 00:22:32.240
<v Speaker 5>closure on pending investigations, I make them put to me

348
00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:35.440
<v Speaker 5>in writing every time I say, put it in writing

349
00:22:35.519 --> 00:22:38.680
<v Speaker 5>to me if you're insisting that I follow up with

350
00:22:38.759 --> 00:22:41.640
<v Speaker 5>the Department of Justice, or you're insisting that I follow

351
00:22:41.720 --> 00:22:44.240
<v Speaker 5>up with the Office of the Inspector General, which is

352
00:22:44.279 --> 00:22:49.960
<v Speaker 5>another criminal federal investigating body, because many times, from my experience,

353
00:22:50.000 --> 00:22:52.160
<v Speaker 5>when I do that, when I have to follow up

354
00:22:52.160 --> 00:22:55.799
<v Speaker 5>with these bodies to say what's the status here these agencies,

355
00:22:56.640 --> 00:23:00.920
<v Speaker 5>they get so vindictive that I'm following up with them,

356
00:23:01.000 --> 00:23:04.240
<v Speaker 5>and many times my inquiry is just prompting them to

357
00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:07.200
<v Speaker 5>dust something off on their desk. So when I do

358
00:23:07.400 --> 00:23:13.160
<v Speaker 5>follow up, invariably a week or two or a month later,

359
00:23:13.279 --> 00:23:18.160
<v Speaker 5>I'm getting yet another request from them or getting called

360
00:23:18.200 --> 00:23:21.640
<v Speaker 5>in for a hearing for my client. So I don't

361
00:23:21.680 --> 00:23:24.960
<v Speaker 5>believe it. I do not believe that it is closed

362
00:23:25.000 --> 00:23:27.440
<v Speaker 5>at this point, and someone's going to have to put

363
00:23:27.640 --> 00:23:31.440
<v Speaker 5>a piece of paper from the FEDS under my nose

364
00:23:31.480 --> 00:23:32.720
<v Speaker 5>for me to believe otherwise.

365
00:23:33.640 --> 00:23:35.720
<v Speaker 1>Well, that letter was published by.

366
00:23:37.440 --> 00:23:41.920
<v Speaker 2>Helena Rafferty, dated March fourth that said it's dismissed. And

367
00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:44.480
<v Speaker 2>I don't know about you, but it's so hard for

368
00:23:44.519 --> 00:23:45.559
<v Speaker 2>me to believe.

369
00:23:45.240 --> 00:23:48.960
<v Speaker 1>That Chief Rafferty would say anything that wasn't true.

370
00:23:49.279 --> 00:23:51.559
<v Speaker 3>But that was her own letter on her letter head.

371
00:23:52.039 --> 00:23:54.759
<v Speaker 1>Tissues. No tissues here, I'm sorry to go.

372
00:23:55.039 --> 00:23:58.559
<v Speaker 5>Let me get you some tissues. Djay. Yeah, you make

373
00:23:58.599 --> 00:24:01.920
<v Speaker 5>a great point, because that letter, which I happened unless

374
00:24:01.960 --> 00:24:03.799
<v Speaker 5>I'm unless there was a letter that I missed, And

375
00:24:03.839 --> 00:24:07.000
<v Speaker 5>I tell everybody I don't see everything. I was looking

376
00:24:07.039 --> 00:24:10.599
<v Speaker 5>at that letter earlier. Someone had it on X and

377
00:24:10.759 --> 00:24:13.559
<v Speaker 5>I was looking at it, going, wait, okay, I know

378
00:24:13.640 --> 00:24:15.680
<v Speaker 5>I saw this a few weeks back, but this is

379
00:24:15.720 --> 00:24:19.640
<v Speaker 5>on Canton p D Letters. You know I could I

380
00:24:19.680 --> 00:24:22.160
<v Speaker 5>could put it, whip up something on my letter head

381
00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:25.400
<v Speaker 5>that says, you know, I'm the best thing since slice bread.

382
00:24:25.880 --> 00:24:28.559
<v Speaker 5>Give it to you, and you should not be drawing

383
00:24:28.640 --> 00:24:31.519
<v Speaker 5>the conclusion that I'm the best thing since sliced bread.

384
00:24:31.680 --> 00:24:31.759
<v Speaker 4>Like.

385
00:24:32.000 --> 00:24:36.960
<v Speaker 5>I think it was done not only for the pr

386
00:24:37.200 --> 00:24:41.880
<v Speaker 5>of it. I forget exactly what part of the timeline

387
00:24:42.640 --> 00:24:47.039
<v Speaker 5>this was released. It was right before I believe the

388
00:24:47.079 --> 00:24:50.680
<v Speaker 5>motion to dismiss was argued by the defense, and I

389
00:24:50.720 --> 00:24:53.839
<v Speaker 5>think it was a bit of a pr stunt. I

390
00:24:53.880 --> 00:24:59.519
<v Speaker 5>am not in any way saying that you know it's

391
00:24:59.559 --> 00:25:04.400
<v Speaker 5>perhaps it's I mean, it is possible that Chief Rafferty

392
00:25:04.519 --> 00:25:09.000
<v Speaker 5>spoke to someone at the federal level or Brennan spoke

393
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:12.960
<v Speaker 5>to someone at the federal level and was given some information,

394
00:25:13.400 --> 00:25:17.559
<v Speaker 5>but I know from experience the information they did not get,

395
00:25:17.599 --> 00:25:22.440
<v Speaker 5>which is we closed our investigation or it's completed. And

396
00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:28.200
<v Speaker 5>often there are times when agencies will complete their investigation,

397
00:25:29.160 --> 00:25:31.799
<v Speaker 5>but that doesn't mean it's over. That means the fact

398
00:25:31.880 --> 00:25:37.400
<v Speaker 5>finding is over. So once an investigation arguably is quote completed,

399
00:25:38.039 --> 00:25:42.160
<v Speaker 5>there are times and not few and far between, when

400
00:25:42.279 --> 00:25:47.440
<v Speaker 5>the investigation kind of completes I guess for a poetic

401
00:25:47.519 --> 00:25:52.960
<v Speaker 5>licensure state. But when you take it beyond that, many

402
00:25:53.000 --> 00:25:55.880
<v Speaker 5>times I've seen indictments follow after that.

403
00:25:56.039 --> 00:25:58.680
<v Speaker 1>Well, there's a legal review of what they found. I mean,

404
00:25:58.680 --> 00:26:00.200
<v Speaker 1>that could take months.

405
00:26:00.160 --> 00:26:02.799
<v Speaker 2>To figure out what can we charge and who can

406
00:26:02.839 --> 00:26:03.640
<v Speaker 2>we tie to up.

407
00:26:04.119 --> 00:26:06.920
<v Speaker 5>That's right, So you know, it's one of those things.

408
00:26:06.960 --> 00:26:10.640
<v Speaker 5>I don't believe it until you know with certainty. And

409
00:26:12.519 --> 00:26:15.319
<v Speaker 5>there's a reason why the FEDS have such a high

410
00:26:15.319 --> 00:26:19.920
<v Speaker 5>conviction rate. There is, and there is also a significant

411
00:26:20.200 --> 00:26:25.000
<v Speaker 5>reason why the Feds took great lengths to investigate kind

412
00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:29.480
<v Speaker 5>of all of the different tentacles of this matter, ranging

413
00:26:29.599 --> 00:26:35.720
<v Speaker 5>from I'm surmising the Karen Reid case, the accident. Then

414
00:26:35.799 --> 00:26:39.599
<v Speaker 5>they had hired ARCA. They looked at phone records, they

415
00:26:39.640 --> 00:26:45.319
<v Speaker 5>looked at cell data, they looked at computer records. From

416
00:26:45.400 --> 00:26:49.200
<v Speaker 5>everything I recall seeing was handed over to them. Then

417
00:26:49.680 --> 00:26:54.519
<v Speaker 5>they probably I'm not sure, but they probably also looked

418
00:26:54.559 --> 00:27:02.640
<v Speaker 5>into any perceivable connection with Birchmore Central Birchmore case, possibly

419
00:27:02.720 --> 00:27:05.200
<v Speaker 5>the just on Root case. I don't know any of

420
00:27:05.240 --> 00:27:07.640
<v Speaker 5>the last two things to be true, but I have

421
00:27:07.720 --> 00:27:13.279
<v Speaker 5>to believe because of some overlap, they're probably looking at trends.

422
00:27:13.519 --> 00:27:18.359
<v Speaker 5>And when there are trends, that's where federal agencies and

423
00:27:18.400 --> 00:27:23.640
<v Speaker 5>investigative criminal bodies do focus interest because they want to

424
00:27:23.680 --> 00:27:27.839
<v Speaker 5>see if there is this level of corruption that would

425
00:27:27.920 --> 00:27:32.200
<v Speaker 5>peak their interest. Because normally a state is sovereign, it

426
00:27:32.240 --> 00:27:35.240
<v Speaker 5>can do what it wants, how it operates is normally

427
00:27:35.400 --> 00:27:38.759
<v Speaker 5>not of the business of the federal government. But when

428
00:27:38.799 --> 00:27:47.480
<v Speaker 5>there's patterns and there's prosecutorial overreach and clear in my opinion,

429
00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:52.920
<v Speaker 5>or at least questionable in the fed's opinion, evidence of corruption,

430
00:27:53.240 --> 00:27:55.920
<v Speaker 5>they're all over it. So I just don't believe it.

431
00:27:56.559 --> 00:27:58.839
<v Speaker 5>I don't I agree.

432
00:27:58.519 --> 00:28:01.400
<v Speaker 2>In Let me, first of all, let me think the

433
00:28:01.519 --> 00:28:04.079
<v Speaker 2>travel off of fives.

434
00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:06.759
<v Speaker 1>But I'll read this in the accent that I was

435
00:28:06.759 --> 00:28:07.640
<v Speaker 1>working on last night.

436
00:28:07.640 --> 00:28:11.359
<v Speaker 2>Would be funny to hear it it was Winston Churchill.

437
00:28:12.240 --> 00:28:19.079
<v Speaker 1>Did we see the lightest drole that just dropped? So?

438
00:28:19.359 --> 00:28:19.640
<v Speaker 1>Did you?

439
00:28:20.839 --> 00:28:25.240
<v Speaker 5>Was there another wait? Is there another Bedroll letter that dropped?

440
00:28:25.440 --> 00:28:28.200
<v Speaker 5>Like today? I have not seen it.

441
00:28:28.759 --> 00:28:33.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So if anybody has the details of that or

442
00:28:33.400 --> 00:28:36.559
<v Speaker 2>wants to let us know during the show, I.

443
00:28:36.440 --> 00:28:40.119
<v Speaker 1>Can put up the cab call in number.

444
00:28:40.960 --> 00:28:43.160
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

445
00:28:42.440 --> 00:28:50.359
<v Speaker 4>I aiden just released it forty minutes ago. Okay, now, yeah,

446
00:28:50.440 --> 00:28:52.359
<v Speaker 4>I can send it to you DJ on Twitter.

447
00:28:52.680 --> 00:28:57.279
<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much you. I'm on It's lord it.

448
00:28:58.039 --> 00:29:02.440
<v Speaker 5>I had the opportunity to meet Mark Bettero in person

449
00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:05.519
<v Speaker 5>when I went up to visit. He's fantastic.

450
00:29:06.920 --> 00:29:07.440
<v Speaker 3>I did too.

451
00:29:08.039 --> 00:29:09.279
<v Speaker 1>It's about Okay.

452
00:29:09.440 --> 00:29:11.119
<v Speaker 2>This is one of the things I wanted to ask

453
00:29:11.200 --> 00:29:13.720
<v Speaker 2>you when we when we said, hey, we're gonna book

454
00:29:13.799 --> 00:29:15.640
<v Speaker 2>you know, he was like, you got to book Nan again.

455
00:29:15.640 --> 00:29:17.359
<v Speaker 1>I'm like, yeah, we got it. We got a book her.

456
00:29:17.279 --> 00:29:20.119
<v Speaker 5>On here and we put a ways back like I

457
00:29:20.160 --> 00:29:23.279
<v Speaker 5>think I might have even been writer in Boston when

458
00:29:23.319 --> 00:29:25.039
<v Speaker 5>we booked it in the Boston area.

459
00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:28.960
<v Speaker 1>Yes, what was it like? What were the conversations like?

460
00:29:29.000 --> 00:29:31.799
<v Speaker 2>And we're not asking for details that have to do

461
00:29:31.880 --> 00:29:33.519
<v Speaker 2>with legalities and things.

462
00:29:33.759 --> 00:29:36.839
<v Speaker 4>You want to say they went to dinner together too.

463
00:29:37.559 --> 00:29:41.559
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, well, I always want to preface when I mentioned

464
00:29:41.799 --> 00:29:44.960
<v Speaker 5>meeting him in my conversation with him, and Will the

465
00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:47.799
<v Speaker 5>Glarer was there as well, so I want to thank

466
00:29:47.839 --> 00:29:54.759
<v Speaker 5>Will for presenting me with that wonderful opportunity to meet him.

467
00:29:55.960 --> 00:29:59.319
<v Speaker 5>But I always want to preface by saying, Mark Betteroh,

468
00:29:59.599 --> 00:30:04.119
<v Speaker 5>did not discuss anything involving Aiden Carney with me, or

469
00:30:04.160 --> 00:30:10.960
<v Speaker 5>anything involving, you know, any particularities that might have been

470
00:30:11.079 --> 00:30:14.759
<v Speaker 5>within his knowledge base concerning Karen Reid as he was

471
00:30:14.880 --> 00:30:19.160
<v Speaker 5>poised to be hopefully at that point appointed as in

472
00:30:19.480 --> 00:30:22.319
<v Speaker 5>pro hac vice, which ended up getting denied a few

473
00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:24.920
<v Speaker 5>days after I met him, which is a ridiculous ruling,

474
00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:27.799
<v Speaker 5>and I think the judge was wrong. But we did

475
00:30:27.839 --> 00:30:31.119
<v Speaker 5>have a great dinner. We went to Smith and Lensky

476
00:30:31.440 --> 00:30:36.799
<v Speaker 5>in Boston, and I mean the steaks there, God, Like,

477
00:30:37.240 --> 00:30:41.079
<v Speaker 5>they're just unbelievable. I should probably eat there more often,

478
00:30:41.200 --> 00:30:44.920
<v Speaker 5>just to build more muscle from all the protein. And

479
00:30:45.440 --> 00:30:49.680
<v Speaker 5>I know the Glarer thought like his steak was perfectly cooked.

480
00:30:49.920 --> 00:30:57.079
<v Speaker 5>But Mark was so so much fun. He's very very funny,

481
00:30:57.319 --> 00:31:03.319
<v Speaker 5>very snarky, makes great eye contact. He also had a

482
00:31:03.359 --> 00:31:06.559
<v Speaker 5>few drinks, as did Will. Like I was drinking, like,

483
00:31:06.799 --> 00:31:09.160
<v Speaker 5>I think, one cocktail and a bunch of ginger ales.

484
00:31:09.240 --> 00:31:16.640
<v Speaker 5>But the conversation between two lawyers who do criminal defense

485
00:31:16.720 --> 00:31:19.880
<v Speaker 5>work who are from the cold, dark streets of Manhattan

486
00:31:20.039 --> 00:31:25.640
<v Speaker 5>him more than me. Yeah, Like we were like head

487
00:31:25.640 --> 00:31:28.000
<v Speaker 5>to head at that table kind of talk in this

488
00:31:28.119 --> 00:31:31.920
<v Speaker 5>case and all of the issues we see with it.

489
00:31:32.000 --> 00:31:34.359
<v Speaker 5>Because as I started out at the top of your hour,

490
00:31:34.440 --> 00:31:39.359
<v Speaker 5>I'm like, this stuff is so like crazy to lawyers

491
00:31:39.400 --> 00:31:42.640
<v Speaker 5>who know how it's supposed to work. So at some point,

492
00:31:42.680 --> 00:31:45.240
<v Speaker 5>you know, I think Will was sitting there kind of going,

493
00:31:45.279 --> 00:31:47.319
<v Speaker 5>I'm just gonna let I'm gonna let you guys talk,

494
00:31:48.960 --> 00:31:51.960
<v Speaker 5>and probably some of what we were saying was flying

495
00:31:52.000 --> 00:31:57.279
<v Speaker 5>over his head. But Mark was really a pleasure. I

496
00:31:57.319 --> 00:31:58.759
<v Speaker 5>told him, I said, we got to go out for

497
00:31:58.839 --> 00:32:01.519
<v Speaker 5>some dirty water dog switch are hot dogs from a

498
00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:02.920
<v Speaker 5>street cart in Manhattan?

499
00:32:03.200 --> 00:32:07.839
<v Speaker 1>Yes, yes, yes, yeah yeah.

500
00:32:07.880 --> 00:32:11.039
<v Speaker 5>And then also I was a little surprised because Beto

501
00:32:12.240 --> 00:32:15.880
<v Speaker 5>was like, let's like they were shutting down the restaurant.

502
00:32:16.680 --> 00:32:19.279
<v Speaker 5>I forget what time it was, but he was like, yeah,

503
00:32:19.359 --> 00:32:23.039
<v Speaker 5>let's let's go get another cocktail. I don't know how

504
00:32:23.160 --> 00:32:26.759
<v Speaker 5>people can stay up as late as they stay up.

505
00:32:27.680 --> 00:32:31.440
<v Speaker 5>When I went to visit there, it's unbelievable. And normally

506
00:32:31.480 --> 00:32:33.359
<v Speaker 5>I would say, but yeah, he's a New Yorker, but

507
00:32:33.440 --> 00:32:37.400
<v Speaker 5>he's originally from there. So I am convinced there is

508
00:32:37.480 --> 00:32:43.920
<v Speaker 5>something baked into the DNA up in Massachusetts that keeps

509
00:32:44.039 --> 00:32:49.400
<v Speaker 5>people awake late at night. I just I had fun.

510
00:32:49.599 --> 00:32:52.079
<v Speaker 3>You awesome visitors. That's what keeps us awake.

511
00:32:52.759 --> 00:32:55.200
<v Speaker 2>When the company's good, you don't want it to end, man,

512
00:32:55.240 --> 00:32:57.079
<v Speaker 2>I mean, that's the bottom line here.

513
00:32:57.480 --> 00:33:00.119
<v Speaker 5>Thank you. By the time I got home, though, it

514
00:33:00.640 --> 00:33:06.039
<v Speaker 5>literally took me four days to recover. Yeah, easily, easily

515
00:33:06.160 --> 00:33:08.079
<v Speaker 5>four days late.

516
00:33:08.000 --> 00:33:09.200
<v Speaker 1>Nights, you know what I mean.

517
00:33:09.799 --> 00:33:13.559
<v Speaker 2>But so it was compelling conversation and you guys could

518
00:33:13.599 --> 00:33:16.920
<v Speaker 2>bounce ideas off each other, and you might have had

519
00:33:16.960 --> 00:33:19.160
<v Speaker 2>some ideas for him about that he hadn't thought of,

520
00:33:19.200 --> 00:33:20.240
<v Speaker 2>and vice versa.

521
00:33:19.960 --> 00:33:20.400
<v Speaker 1>Et cetera.

522
00:33:20.920 --> 00:33:25.000
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, it was very collaborative. And also we gave our

523
00:33:25.319 --> 00:33:27.279
<v Speaker 5>which I won't share, but we kind of gave our

524
00:33:27.359 --> 00:33:30.519
<v Speaker 5>opinions on who we feel are some of the most

525
00:33:30.680 --> 00:33:36.160
<v Speaker 5>useful tools to just the free Karen read movement on

526
00:33:37.559 --> 00:33:41.599
<v Speaker 5>x and on these streams and chats, and you know,

527
00:33:41.640 --> 00:33:45.200
<v Speaker 5>I'm not referring to content creators when I say that,

528
00:33:45.240 --> 00:33:48.160
<v Speaker 5>but people we see in the chats, because I'm normally

529
00:33:48.200 --> 00:33:52.079
<v Speaker 5>a chat surfer, and we had a lot of similar

530
00:33:52.079 --> 00:33:54.119
<v Speaker 5>opinions about that. He's a great guy.

531
00:33:55.519 --> 00:33:58.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's our opinion too. We've got him coming back.

532
00:34:00.160 --> 00:34:00.599
<v Speaker 1>Shortly.

533
00:34:00.839 --> 00:34:04.000
<v Speaker 2>He and a brother counsel that they didn't get to

534
00:34:04.000 --> 00:34:05.440
<v Speaker 2>talk last time, So we're going to get in a

535
00:34:05.480 --> 00:34:06.799
<v Speaker 2>talk this time.

536
00:34:06.839 --> 00:34:09.440
<v Speaker 1>Because we didn't know that Mark was joining the defense team.

537
00:34:10.599 --> 00:34:13.599
<v Speaker 5>Oh yeah, that's right. He was supposed to join us,

538
00:34:13.639 --> 00:34:17.119
<v Speaker 5>and I think we've got Olivia join Olivia, Nile or

539
00:34:17.199 --> 00:34:22.519
<v Speaker 5>Lambeau join instead. God, that seems like forever ago.

540
00:34:22.840 --> 00:34:25.480
<v Speaker 1>It does. In cam Reidland, it was like six months ago.

541
00:34:26.519 --> 00:34:28.920
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, because I did my first I was looking back.

542
00:34:29.400 --> 00:34:32.719
<v Speaker 5>I think I did my first stream with the Young

543
00:34:32.840 --> 00:34:36.480
<v Speaker 5>Jerks in like the last week of January, and you know,

544
00:34:36.599 --> 00:34:40.880
<v Speaker 5>it's the almost the end of March. Now. It feels

545
00:34:40.920 --> 00:34:44.760
<v Speaker 5>like a million years. And I will be scaling back

546
00:34:44.880 --> 00:34:48.920
<v Speaker 5>my streaming in the coming weeks just because I think

547
00:34:49.639 --> 00:34:52.159
<v Speaker 5>I've hit all the creators and I think people have

548
00:34:52.280 --> 00:34:54.800
<v Speaker 5>heard enough from Nan Gallagher. I'm probably going to be

549
00:34:54.840 --> 00:35:00.000
<v Speaker 5>doing more tweeting and posting on Facebook social media occasion

550
00:35:00.320 --> 00:35:04.599
<v Speaker 5>popping into Seeking Justice with Tom Cpu and Boston Mike.

551
00:35:05.480 --> 00:35:08.079
<v Speaker 4>Well, I have to say, as the trial starts, we're

552
00:35:08.119 --> 00:35:10.519
<v Speaker 4>all going to need this a breakdown and we're gonna

553
00:35:10.519 --> 00:35:12.559
<v Speaker 4>we want to hear what you have to say, so

554
00:35:12.599 --> 00:35:14.920
<v Speaker 4>hopefully you'll come back and visit, because.

555
00:35:14.840 --> 00:35:16.280
<v Speaker 3>That's when it gets real.

556
00:35:16.400 --> 00:35:19.239
<v Speaker 4>Now we're kind of rehashing things from one point zero.

557
00:35:19.760 --> 00:35:22.239
<v Speaker 4>When two point oh starts, we're going to need that

558
00:35:22.480 --> 00:35:25.960
<v Speaker 4>law tuber type of tell us what we just watched

559
00:35:26.000 --> 00:35:27.880
<v Speaker 4>all day and tell us that it's nonsense.

560
00:35:29.599 --> 00:35:32.880
<v Speaker 5>So I well, I tell I'm gonna tell everybody always

561
00:35:32.920 --> 00:35:35.440
<v Speaker 5>feel free to ask, like if I if it, if

562
00:35:35.440 --> 00:35:38.320
<v Speaker 5>it feels right and works, I'm happy to And I

563
00:35:38.360 --> 00:35:40.880
<v Speaker 5>love DJ, like DJ and you both like reached out

564
00:35:40.920 --> 00:35:43.840
<v Speaker 5>to me a few weeks ago, and I'm like, this

565
00:35:44.000 --> 00:35:46.480
<v Speaker 5>date would work, and thank you so much for holding

566
00:35:46.519 --> 00:35:50.599
<v Speaker 5>it for me. And I do feel I feel I

567
00:35:50.599 --> 00:35:53.760
<v Speaker 5>don't want to say badly. I feel a lot of

568
00:35:53.840 --> 00:35:59.239
<v Speaker 5>sensitivity to the the Free Care and read supporters who

569
00:35:59.280 --> 00:36:02.599
<v Speaker 5>have a lot of questions about what just happened, or

570
00:36:03.159 --> 00:36:05.880
<v Speaker 5>I'm worried about this, this just just got filed, what

571
00:36:05.920 --> 00:36:09.719
<v Speaker 5>does this mean? And so many times it's nothing to

572
00:36:09.760 --> 00:36:13.440
<v Speaker 5>worry about. So I'm a mummy, you know, I want

573
00:36:13.440 --> 00:36:15.719
<v Speaker 5>to com My job is to calm people. And I

574
00:36:15.800 --> 00:36:18.719
<v Speaker 5>feel like, hey, if I can tell you this is

575
00:36:18.800 --> 00:36:21.480
<v Speaker 5>nothing and you feel a little better about it, great,

576
00:36:22.199 --> 00:36:26.719
<v Speaker 5>you know. And then there's times where I say everyone

577
00:36:26.760 --> 00:36:30.599
<v Speaker 5>should be worried about that, or you know, even yesterday,

578
00:36:31.480 --> 00:36:35.760
<v Speaker 5>Aiden Carney had had a hearing before a different judge

579
00:36:36.480 --> 00:36:41.239
<v Speaker 5>on the Karen Reid case with regard to the phone

580
00:36:41.280 --> 00:36:45.760
<v Speaker 5>extractions that the Commonwealth, not Brennan of the Commonwealth, but

581
00:36:45.880 --> 00:36:50.000
<v Speaker 5>the other kind of arm of the Commonwealth, special Appointed

582
00:36:50.039 --> 00:36:55.760
<v Speaker 5>Prosecutor Cosgrove has and you know, in that hearing, a

583
00:36:55.760 --> 00:36:57.719
<v Speaker 5>lot of people were worried about it because they thought,

584
00:36:57.719 --> 00:37:00.199
<v Speaker 5>oh my god, there's an emergency hearing. And I'm like, no, no, no,

585
00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:03.079
<v Speaker 5>I don't know. It's really a status hearing. Don't worry

586
00:37:03.119 --> 00:37:05.559
<v Speaker 5>about it is not I don't know what's going to

587
00:37:05.559 --> 00:37:08.000
<v Speaker 5>be discussed, but I can tell you it's it's not

588
00:37:08.199 --> 00:37:11.480
<v Speaker 5>as bad as you think. And some people felt better

589
00:37:11.559 --> 00:37:15.440
<v Speaker 5>when they heard that. And then during the hearing, the

590
00:37:15.559 --> 00:37:21.679
<v Speaker 5>judge essentially spanked Cosgrove and Brennan, which I was very

591
00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:27.639
<v Speaker 5>happy to hear and watch as I'm sure. Yeah, I'm

592
00:37:27.679 --> 00:37:33.039
<v Speaker 5>sure that other people were as well. Actually, that's the

593
00:37:33.119 --> 00:37:38.119
<v Speaker 5>way judges are supposed to work. That's that's this kind

594
00:37:38.159 --> 00:37:42.079
<v Speaker 5>of unbiased. Both sides are accountable no matter which side

595
00:37:42.119 --> 00:37:44.320
<v Speaker 5>it is. Well, that's what we're used to seeing.

596
00:37:44.480 --> 00:37:44.639
<v Speaker 1>Nan.

597
00:37:44.760 --> 00:37:46.920
<v Speaker 2>Are you saying that you're not supposed to just like

598
00:37:47.400 --> 00:37:50.199
<v Speaker 2>pick aside that you don't like and treat them poorly

599
00:37:50.639 --> 00:37:52.280
<v Speaker 2>and then the other side you're really nice to.

600
00:37:52.360 --> 00:37:54.639
<v Speaker 1>Is that? What is that how it's supposed to go.

601
00:37:55.480 --> 00:37:58.599
<v Speaker 5>Yes, that that is the way it's works to go.

602
00:37:59.039 --> 00:38:02.840
<v Speaker 1>So the judges supposed to like justice is blind and

603
00:38:03.400 --> 00:38:04.639
<v Speaker 1>really like what.

604
00:38:05.159 --> 00:38:09.599
<v Speaker 5>Def thumb and blind or whatever. Yeah, it's it's definitely

605
00:38:09.800 --> 00:38:10.559
<v Speaker 5>something to.

606
00:38:12.400 --> 00:38:12.880
<v Speaker 3>Expect.

607
00:38:13.239 --> 00:38:15.880
<v Speaker 5>I expect it when I'm before judges, and I've been

608
00:38:16.119 --> 00:38:19.800
<v Speaker 5>in the hot seat, you know, I was happy to

609
00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:22.960
<v Speaker 5>see it. And in that regard, like I think a

610
00:38:22.960 --> 00:38:26.840
<v Speaker 5>lot of people in the Free Karen Reid and the

611
00:38:26.880 --> 00:38:30.840
<v Speaker 5>Free Turtle Boy movements, they felt comforted not only by

612
00:38:30.880 --> 00:38:34.840
<v Speaker 5>the fact that Brennan and Cosgrove were dished it by

613
00:38:34.920 --> 00:38:38.599
<v Speaker 5>Judge Adam Sisiski, but also that, oh, okay, this is

614
00:38:38.639 --> 00:38:44.360
<v Speaker 5>a refreshing breeze of or breath of fresh air because look,

615
00:38:45.280 --> 00:38:48.559
<v Speaker 5>a judge actually called balls and strikes here, and it

616
00:38:48.639 --> 00:38:51.199
<v Speaker 5>wasn't just oh my god, he's going to deny this,

617
00:38:51.320 --> 00:38:53.760
<v Speaker 5>or he's going to award all of these you know,

618
00:38:54.639 --> 00:39:00.760
<v Speaker 5>expand his ruling to include communications between Aiden and Karen attorneys.

619
00:39:00.800 --> 00:39:05.440
<v Speaker 5>So it's it's it's the way it's supposed to work.

620
00:39:06.360 --> 00:39:09.199
<v Speaker 5>It's supposed to be fair, and when it's not fair,

621
00:39:09.480 --> 00:39:12.239
<v Speaker 5>I think everybody, whether you're a lawyer or not, or

622
00:39:12.320 --> 00:39:16.360
<v Speaker 5>a content creator or not, we get frustrated. So I'm

623
00:39:16.440 --> 00:39:20.800
<v Speaker 5>hopeful that, I mean, I do believe that Judge BEV

624
00:39:21.159 --> 00:39:26.000
<v Speaker 5>follows the kind of social media aspects of this case,

625
00:39:26.079 --> 00:39:30.320
<v Speaker 5>maybe not as assiduously as others do, but I'm hoping

626
00:39:30.760 --> 00:39:36.920
<v Speaker 5>that she starts to curb some apparent bias that is

627
00:39:37.039 --> 00:39:42.599
<v Speaker 5>just so it's just so present. I hope that changes.

628
00:39:43.039 --> 00:39:44.320
<v Speaker 5>We'll see I don't.

629
00:39:44.400 --> 00:39:44.719
<v Speaker 1>I don't.

630
00:39:44.840 --> 00:39:47.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry that I don't see that happening. I think

631
00:39:48.239 --> 00:39:50.960
<v Speaker 2>when she grants emotion in their favor. What were we

632
00:39:51.000 --> 00:39:53.599
<v Speaker 2>talking about the other night, bea, he granted one in

633
00:39:53.639 --> 00:39:54.880
<v Speaker 2>their favor, and it's.

634
00:39:54.639 --> 00:39:58.800
<v Speaker 1>Like she'll go, okay, duck, duck, goose, and like.

635
00:39:58.800 --> 00:40:02.000
<v Speaker 2>So she'll give them some thing that's kind of not

636
00:40:02.800 --> 00:40:08.159
<v Speaker 2>very impactful or groundbreaking, just to say that she ruled

637
00:40:08.199 --> 00:40:10.960
<v Speaker 2>one motion in their favor and then she'll go back

638
00:40:10.960 --> 00:40:15.360
<v Speaker 2>to approving other inappropriate motions or ruling against them. And

639
00:40:15.400 --> 00:40:18.199
<v Speaker 2>I think Microdots once did he did a breakdown of

640
00:40:18.239 --> 00:40:20.280
<v Speaker 2>this one second real quick. I just want to say

641
00:40:20.440 --> 00:40:22.280
<v Speaker 2>thank you the cat Lady. The cat Lady is one

642
00:40:22.360 --> 00:40:26.599
<v Speaker 2>of our new mods. She's awesome, and she has gifted

643
00:40:26.639 --> 00:40:29.199
<v Speaker 2>thirty memberships, so now must day cat Lady.

644
00:40:29.559 --> 00:40:32.280
<v Speaker 1>We appreciate you, and then we will get If you.

645
00:40:32.280 --> 00:40:36.119
<v Speaker 2>Have a question for Nan Gallagher, please put like some

646
00:40:36.159 --> 00:40:39.000
<v Speaker 2>sort of a question mark so we know it. If

647
00:40:39.039 --> 00:40:40.840
<v Speaker 2>you don't like to type in all caps, put like

648
00:40:40.880 --> 00:40:43.840
<v Speaker 2>a question mark at the beginning something like that, because

649
00:40:43.840 --> 00:40:46.599
<v Speaker 2>we want to get her to answer your questions before

650
00:40:46.599 --> 00:40:47.559
<v Speaker 2>we get out of here tonight.

651
00:40:47.880 --> 00:40:50.199
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, yes, ma'am, you were going to say, answer your

652
00:40:50.280 --> 00:40:54.199
<v Speaker 5>questions or just try to make them stand out as

653
00:40:54.199 --> 00:40:58.840
<v Speaker 5>best as possible. And so many people have questions and

654
00:40:58.880 --> 00:41:04.079
<v Speaker 5>then questions stemming from answers that they hear. So yeah,

655
00:41:04.159 --> 00:41:07.519
<v Speaker 5>it's a really great job you guys do trying to

656
00:41:07.519 --> 00:41:10.159
<v Speaker 5>bring people together to try to make them more aware

657
00:41:10.159 --> 00:41:12.440
<v Speaker 5>of this stuff. Yeah.

658
00:41:12.519 --> 00:41:15.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's basically you know, what we're trying to do

659
00:41:15.519 --> 00:41:19.280
<v Speaker 2>is we are not going to leave Karen alone because

660
00:41:19.280 --> 00:41:22.599
<v Speaker 2>people in other communities. I've covered other genres obviously, and

661
00:41:22.679 --> 00:41:24.519
<v Speaker 2>people have asked me, and I said, you know, we're

662
00:41:24.519 --> 00:41:26.679
<v Speaker 2>going to stay on this case. I'm going to go

663
00:41:26.719 --> 00:41:31.159
<v Speaker 2>to Massachusetts again, just like you did. Just I just

664
00:41:31.199 --> 00:41:32.960
<v Speaker 2>want to make sure Elon's not going to fire me.

665
00:41:33.440 --> 00:41:36.719
<v Speaker 2>And I'm going to book another trip to Massachusetts and

666
00:41:39.000 --> 00:41:41.679
<v Speaker 2>support the movement and I'll stand out and I'll do

667
00:41:41.760 --> 00:41:44.039
<v Speaker 2>another meal of food and all that stuff.

668
00:41:44.079 --> 00:41:45.800
<v Speaker 1>So I wish we had known you when we did

669
00:41:45.840 --> 00:41:48.599
<v Speaker 1>that that meal of food And was.

670
00:41:48.559 --> 00:41:53.000
<v Speaker 5>That twelve, yeah, January twelfth.

671
00:41:53.119 --> 00:41:54.880
<v Speaker 1>Yes, we have like one hundred people.

672
00:41:55.559 --> 00:41:59.119
<v Speaker 5>And it's so interesting because I was clearly writing Chats,

673
00:41:59.559 --> 00:42:03.320
<v Speaker 5>you know, throughout but when you write, what I wasn't

674
00:42:03.400 --> 00:42:08.039
<v Speaker 5>doing from twenty twenty three to twenty twenty five was

675
00:42:09.559 --> 00:42:13.239
<v Speaker 5>making sure I never missed a show of anybody. Now

676
00:42:13.280 --> 00:42:18.280
<v Speaker 5>I try to never miss a show of anybody in Chats,

677
00:42:18.519 --> 00:42:22.599
<v Speaker 5>and I've tried to, you know, when asked to come

678
00:42:22.639 --> 00:42:25.960
<v Speaker 5>on the different creators, just to help them understand or

679
00:42:26.039 --> 00:42:31.079
<v Speaker 5>frame their mindsets. But yeah, so I'm sure there was

680
00:42:31.159 --> 00:42:33.920
<v Speaker 5>plenty of things like that DJ or b O, Like

681
00:42:33.960 --> 00:42:37.480
<v Speaker 5>when you guys that did the meal of food, I

682
00:42:37.559 --> 00:42:41.239
<v Speaker 5>didn't happen to pick that up whatsoever just from writing chats,

683
00:42:41.280 --> 00:42:43.199
<v Speaker 5>but I will moving forward.

684
00:42:43.519 --> 00:42:45.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well we're going to make sure now that we

685
00:42:45.360 --> 00:42:46.800
<v Speaker 2>know you we can invite you.

686
00:42:46.840 --> 00:42:48.320
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, it was it was really good.

687
00:42:48.719 --> 00:42:52.559
<v Speaker 2>We wanted there were people that felt left out because basically,

688
00:42:52.639 --> 00:42:56.599
<v Speaker 2>Karen did a fundraiser to ear and you know, she

689
00:42:56.599 --> 00:42:59.480
<v Speaker 2>couldn't invite everybody for the room that she had, but

690
00:42:59.559 --> 00:43:01.920
<v Speaker 2>she was trying to make money for her defense fund obviously,

691
00:43:02.119 --> 00:43:04.800
<v Speaker 2>which is very understandable. And by the way, the Karen

692
00:43:04.840 --> 00:43:07.800
<v Speaker 2>Reied Defense Fund is pinned to the top of the chat,

693
00:43:07.880 --> 00:43:13.519
<v Speaker 2>so if you're so inclined, please donate. And so therefore,

694
00:43:13.559 --> 00:43:16.719
<v Speaker 2>when people were aggrieved, we had already planned our meal

695
00:43:16.719 --> 00:43:19.880
<v Speaker 2>of food for about twenty so after we found out

696
00:43:19.920 --> 00:43:22.679
<v Speaker 2>people were kind of bummed out, we said, okay, well

697
00:43:23.079 --> 00:43:26.480
<v Speaker 2>instead of just twenty, I mean everyone was always invited anyway.

698
00:43:26.800 --> 00:43:29.400
<v Speaker 2>We didn't have a you know, we didn't say, oh,

699
00:43:29.559 --> 00:43:32.360
<v Speaker 2>only these people can come, but we just started off

700
00:43:32.400 --> 00:43:35.519
<v Speaker 2>with a tacit list. So then we just said, okay,

701
00:43:35.599 --> 00:43:38.760
<v Speaker 2>everyone in the community, you are invited. This is where

702
00:43:38.800 --> 00:43:40.320
<v Speaker 2>we're going to be this is the time, this is

703
00:43:40.320 --> 00:43:42.960
<v Speaker 2>the place, So just come there and book a table

704
00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:45.480
<v Speaker 2>and we're going to hang out. And we had Aiden

705
00:43:45.559 --> 00:43:49.639
<v Speaker 2>and Meredith, we had Jason, we had Brian LTL.

706
00:43:49.760 --> 00:43:50.159
<v Speaker 1>Maza.

707
00:43:50.760 --> 00:43:54.199
<v Speaker 2>Uh it came so and and then myself and Bia

708
00:43:54.320 --> 00:43:56.960
<v Speaker 2>so and then just tons of people showed up.

709
00:43:56.960 --> 00:43:59.199
<v Speaker 1>It was I got to streaming.

710
00:43:59.280 --> 00:44:02.039
<v Speaker 3>It was just the station and you know it was nice.

711
00:44:02.199 --> 00:44:05.519
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, oh that's that's great. It must have been cold.

712
00:44:05.559 --> 00:44:09.360
<v Speaker 5>Then you said January. It was, Yes, it was cold

713
00:44:09.440 --> 00:44:11.880
<v Speaker 5>when I went up there. So when I when I

714
00:44:12.000 --> 00:44:16.760
<v Speaker 5>was up there, I guess it was March, maybe March

715
00:44:17.000 --> 00:44:20.360
<v Speaker 5>third or so through six, something like that. It was cold.

716
00:44:20.880 --> 00:44:21.800
<v Speaker 1>So I have a number.

717
00:44:22.159 --> 00:44:26.639
<v Speaker 5>I'm planning planning to go up in some time in April,

718
00:44:26.760 --> 00:44:28.400
<v Speaker 5>and hopefully it's a little milder.

719
00:44:29.559 --> 00:44:31.960
<v Speaker 1>It should be on air. Somebody's on air or not.

720
00:44:33.239 --> 00:44:35.880
<v Speaker 1>It says unknown. That could be bad. All right, let

721
00:44:35.880 --> 00:44:38.440
<v Speaker 1>me hang up on it. I don't know who that was.

722
00:44:39.639 --> 00:44:42.320
<v Speaker 2>We do have questions for you, though, Alica. Let's see

723
00:44:42.320 --> 00:44:45.159
<v Speaker 2>if we can get to our police. Uh So, here's

724
00:44:45.199 --> 00:44:47.639
<v Speaker 2>one we got to tag. We're going to tag this

725
00:44:47.679 --> 00:44:49.280
<v Speaker 2>one from Christina Maria.

726
00:44:50.559 --> 00:44:51.400
<v Speaker 1>Help me out.

727
00:44:51.280 --> 00:44:56.880
<v Speaker 2>Here, oh, joba, yeah, if you got one.

728
00:44:56.880 --> 00:44:58.079
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, go ahead, you can go ahead.

729
00:44:58.119 --> 00:44:59.280
<v Speaker 3>Oh are you asking me to read it?

730
00:44:59.280 --> 00:45:01.360
<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry, absolutely, go ahead, yes, please.

731
00:45:01.800 --> 00:45:05.079
<v Speaker 4>If the judge misquotes facts are evidence, i e. The

732
00:45:05.159 --> 00:45:11.079
<v Speaker 4>conclusion the confusion between polycarbonate and glass, Is there any recourse.

733
00:45:11.840 --> 00:45:17.280
<v Speaker 5>If the judge misquotes it? So you know, the recourse

734
00:45:17.360 --> 00:45:20.800
<v Speaker 5>would be for the attorneys at the time that it happens,

735
00:45:20.880 --> 00:45:26.159
<v Speaker 5>the misquoting happens. To correct respectfully correct the judge depends

736
00:45:26.239 --> 00:45:29.440
<v Speaker 5>on what's being misquoted. This is an important thing to

737
00:45:29.519 --> 00:45:33.519
<v Speaker 5>quote properly because there is a big difference, especially in

738
00:45:33.559 --> 00:45:36.960
<v Speaker 5>this case between polycarbonate and glass, when you have a

739
00:45:37.079 --> 00:45:42.679
<v Speaker 5>broken alleged broken tail light and at least one, possibly

740
00:45:42.800 --> 00:45:47.000
<v Speaker 5>two tumbler or cocktail glasses that may or may not

741
00:45:47.079 --> 00:45:51.599
<v Speaker 5>have left the bar establishments. So it's really to just

742
00:45:51.840 --> 00:45:55.440
<v Speaker 5>respectfully correct the judge. I'd have to know a little

743
00:45:55.440 --> 00:45:59.119
<v Speaker 5>bit more as to the context there in Lemonade pickets

744
00:45:59.280 --> 00:46:04.400
<v Speaker 5>where where the judge would have misquoted it. But I

745
00:46:05.159 --> 00:46:11.400
<v Speaker 5>believe I heard witnesses interchanging glass and tail light or

746
00:46:11.440 --> 00:46:15.000
<v Speaker 5>tail light pieces in glass in questions, and I think

747
00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:17.559
<v Speaker 5>I heard that on both sides I think I heard

748
00:46:18.239 --> 00:46:21.679
<v Speaker 5>the defense doing it and the prosecution doing it, which

749
00:46:21.760 --> 00:46:25.800
<v Speaker 5>makes for a little bit of a confusing factual scenario

750
00:46:26.559 --> 00:46:29.599
<v Speaker 5>for a jury. So if I can give any advice

751
00:46:29.840 --> 00:46:34.960
<v Speaker 5>to the attorneys for the defense, I don't like to

752
00:46:34.960 --> 00:46:38.280
<v Speaker 5>give advice to the Commonwealth other than dismiss this case

753
00:46:38.599 --> 00:46:43.760
<v Speaker 5>and dismiss the case against Aiden cases against Aiden. If

754
00:46:43.760 --> 00:46:46.400
<v Speaker 5>I can give any advice to the Karen Reid defense team,

755
00:46:46.440 --> 00:46:48.960
<v Speaker 5>it would just be to make sure that you're very

756
00:46:49.079 --> 00:46:53.400
<v Speaker 5>nicely and in a likable way, being very consistent with

757
00:46:53.519 --> 00:46:58.039
<v Speaker 5>the terminology of polycarbonate versus glass or tail light versus

758
00:46:58.039 --> 00:47:02.519
<v Speaker 5>glass in what context correct anyone or object to any

759
00:47:02.599 --> 00:47:05.400
<v Speaker 5>question where that is used incorrectly.

760
00:47:06.159 --> 00:47:09.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And I think with a fair degree of confidence

761
00:47:10.199 --> 00:47:14.239
<v Speaker 2>that that polycarbonate that the tail light lens is made

762
00:47:14.239 --> 00:47:17.400
<v Speaker 2>out of would not have shattered in that manner hitting

763
00:47:17.719 --> 00:47:22.840
<v Speaker 2>John's arm, probably not hitting him center mass It would

764
00:47:22.880 --> 00:47:26.000
<v Speaker 2>not have broken in that manner. So that they're going

765
00:47:26.000 --> 00:47:29.960
<v Speaker 2>to need someone who's an automotive expert and expert in plastics.

766
00:47:30.280 --> 00:47:32.880
<v Speaker 1>Someone actually reached out to me that had.

767
00:47:32.719 --> 00:47:36.239
<v Speaker 2>A degree from Massachusetts, that had a degree and that

768
00:47:36.360 --> 00:47:41.239
<v Speaker 2>type of science that produces plastics, and he never answered

769
00:47:41.280 --> 00:47:43.039
<v Speaker 2>me back though he never came on the show, but

770
00:47:43.079 --> 00:47:44.320
<v Speaker 2>I would have loved to have had them.

771
00:47:44.960 --> 00:47:48.760
<v Speaker 1>This one is from Mary Milachey. I truly enjoy Attorney

772
00:47:48.840 --> 00:47:52.559
<v Speaker 1>Non Gallagher's condor and humor, as we learn so much

773
00:47:52.920 --> 00:47:56.559
<v Speaker 1>from her live stream visits. He's a treasure, Thank you

774
00:47:56.679 --> 00:47:58.519
<v Speaker 1>very much, Not Gallagher.

775
00:47:58.679 --> 00:48:02.000
<v Speaker 5>Thank you Mary. And I love it because DJ gets

776
00:48:02.039 --> 00:48:05.079
<v Speaker 5>to do the accents. This is always so much fun.

777
00:48:06.000 --> 00:48:09.679
<v Speaker 5>I think though it's important to be funny, Like even

778
00:48:09.719 --> 00:48:13.199
<v Speaker 5>though none of this is funny, it's like, can we

779
00:48:13.280 --> 00:48:17.639
<v Speaker 5>find some level of humor or entertainment as you guys

780
00:48:17.800 --> 00:48:21.760
<v Speaker 5>all who are boots on the ground, And I mean

781
00:48:21.800 --> 00:48:24.960
<v Speaker 5>that in not just the standing outside of the courthouse way,

782
00:48:25.000 --> 00:48:28.079
<v Speaker 5>but the people who are dedicated to the chats and

783
00:48:28.159 --> 00:48:31.199
<v Speaker 5>the people who don't stand out at the courthouse every

784
00:48:31.280 --> 00:48:34.239
<v Speaker 5>day but are from the community. You have to, in

785
00:48:34.280 --> 00:48:38.480
<v Speaker 5>my opinion, find some ways to make light of this.

786
00:48:38.599 --> 00:48:41.840
<v Speaker 5>And I'm sure in some ways I don't know this,

787
00:48:42.000 --> 00:48:45.280
<v Speaker 5>but I really have to believe even Karen and her

788
00:48:45.360 --> 00:48:50.800
<v Speaker 5>family hopefully do, that they find joy amongst these horrible

789
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:56.079
<v Speaker 5>set of really prolonged, just horrible facts. Their life has

790
00:48:56.199 --> 00:48:59.079
<v Speaker 5>just been ruined. It's been ruined, and I don't think

791
00:48:59.119 --> 00:49:04.159
<v Speaker 5>it's comorable for them. So I did say that just

792
00:49:04.239 --> 00:49:06.559
<v Speaker 5>so you know. I did have a chance to speak

793
00:49:06.599 --> 00:49:10.679
<v Speaker 5>to Karen and her family. They were the ones that

794
00:49:10.800 --> 00:49:14.079
<v Speaker 5>had invited me to come to Massachusetts when I did,

795
00:49:14.840 --> 00:49:19.679
<v Speaker 5>and to go to court with them, which that was

796
00:49:19.880 --> 00:49:21.880
<v Speaker 5>very sweet of them to do, and I was like,

797
00:49:21.920 --> 00:49:24.639
<v Speaker 5>are you guys sure you know I didn't. I still

798
00:49:24.679 --> 00:49:30.079
<v Speaker 5>don't understand, but when they asked me. I remember during

799
00:49:30.119 --> 00:49:33.239
<v Speaker 5>that call. I think it was that particular night, or

800
00:49:33.360 --> 00:49:35.679
<v Speaker 5>maybe a couple nights later, I was supposed to be

801
00:49:35.760 --> 00:49:39.599
<v Speaker 5>on the Glarer's program and I like apologized to them.

802
00:49:39.639 --> 00:49:42.159
<v Speaker 5>I said, you know, I'm I'm going to be on

803
00:49:42.239 --> 00:49:44.960
<v Speaker 5>his program, and I know, we laugh a little bit

804
00:49:45.000 --> 00:49:48.920
<v Speaker 5>about some of these stupid things that are going on

805
00:49:49.000 --> 00:49:52.519
<v Speaker 5>and I mean, no disrespect to you, and they they

806
00:49:52.599 --> 00:49:55.519
<v Speaker 5>kind of laughed. They're like, we understand. So they're like

807
00:49:55.599 --> 00:49:58.360
<v Speaker 5>really down to earth. You know. I can't say I

808
00:49:58.400 --> 00:50:00.800
<v Speaker 5>know them very well, but I I knew enough to

809
00:50:00.880 --> 00:50:06.320
<v Speaker 5>apologize for making light of some things, and they were

810
00:50:06.440 --> 00:50:09.400
<v Speaker 5>really friendly and receptive when I said that, and thought

811
00:50:09.440 --> 00:50:11.320
<v Speaker 5>that my apology was ridiculous.

812
00:50:12.320 --> 00:50:14.519
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I've never met them, but they just seem like

813
00:50:14.679 --> 00:50:17.199
<v Speaker 2>very very as you said, down to Earth is about

814
00:50:17.239 --> 00:50:20.199
<v Speaker 2>as well as you very genuine people that there's no

815
00:50:20.239 --> 00:50:21.519
<v Speaker 2>pretense about them.

816
00:50:22.039 --> 00:50:25.360
<v Speaker 5>Yeah. Oh, and I see this question here. This is

817
00:50:25.400 --> 00:50:29.039
<v Speaker 5>like all caps, so yes, I have to say I

818
00:50:29.039 --> 00:50:32.800
<v Speaker 5>can read this without my glasses, which is like completely

819
00:50:33.079 --> 00:50:37.360
<v Speaker 5>unbelievable to me. But the question that Ken Hathaway has

820
00:50:37.440 --> 00:50:40.320
<v Speaker 5>in terms of, you know, if the prosecutor's going to

821
00:50:40.440 --> 00:50:43.280
<v Speaker 5>really push it with the ARCA experts, can they bring

822
00:50:43.320 --> 00:50:47.199
<v Speaker 5>their own lawyers in he's called them liars, Yes they can.

823
00:50:47.480 --> 00:50:50.519
<v Speaker 5>In fact, I don't know how much Judge Bev would

824
00:50:50.559 --> 00:50:55.840
<v Speaker 5>allow lawyers for witnesses to have a role in proceedings,

825
00:50:55.880 --> 00:51:00.800
<v Speaker 5>but I will say, drawing upon prior experience, she did

826
00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:04.599
<v Speaker 5>allow the lawyer for Brian Higgins to kind of step

827
00:51:04.639 --> 00:51:07.199
<v Speaker 5>in and with outside of the presence of the jury

828
00:51:07.320 --> 00:51:09.480
<v Speaker 5>and to kind of say, no, you know, everything's fine,

829
00:51:09.559 --> 00:51:11.960
<v Speaker 5>or I'm going to I've talked to my client. So

830
00:51:12.119 --> 00:51:16.480
<v Speaker 5>I think she was very respectful and deferential to the

831
00:51:16.559 --> 00:51:21.719
<v Speaker 5>fact that a lawyer for a witness was present. But yeah,

832
00:51:21.800 --> 00:51:25.360
<v Speaker 5>I have served in that capacity where my client has

833
00:51:25.440 --> 00:51:29.199
<v Speaker 5>been a fact witness or an expert witness, and in

834
00:51:29.239 --> 00:51:32.199
<v Speaker 5>fact he was an expert witness on a particular case,

835
00:51:32.519 --> 00:51:37.280
<v Speaker 5>he was getting bullied by the plaintiff's attorney, the litigant's attorney,

836
00:51:38.079 --> 00:51:42.199
<v Speaker 5>for opinions he had, and this litigant was going after

837
00:51:42.320 --> 00:51:47.159
<v Speaker 5>my client's license because he disagreed with his opinions. He

838
00:51:47.280 --> 00:51:51.639
<v Speaker 5>went after my client's board certification as a medical doctor

839
00:51:51.679 --> 00:51:54.760
<v Speaker 5>because he didn't like the opinions. And that's why my

840
00:51:54.840 --> 00:51:57.480
<v Speaker 5>client retained me. He's like, I feel like I'm serving

841
00:51:57.519 --> 00:51:59.840
<v Speaker 5>as an expert, but I'm on the defensive here what's

842
00:51:59.880 --> 00:52:03.440
<v Speaker 5>going on? And I had to come to trial with him.

843
00:52:04.239 --> 00:52:06.760
<v Speaker 5>It was only one day, he was testifying one day,

844
00:52:07.199 --> 00:52:12.039
<v Speaker 5>and that that judge allowed me to protect his rights,

845
00:52:12.079 --> 00:52:15.360
<v Speaker 5>like I was going to protect my client who was

846
00:52:15.519 --> 00:52:19.440
<v Speaker 5>answering questions that were being asked by someone else, to

847
00:52:19.519 --> 00:52:24.599
<v Speaker 5>make sure that my client wasn't being trampled upon. So yes, Ken,

848
00:52:24.719 --> 00:52:28.440
<v Speaker 5>I definitely think if Hanky wants to push it with ARCA,

849
00:52:28.480 --> 00:52:31.400
<v Speaker 5>they should come in with their own attorneys. And that

850
00:52:31.599 --> 00:52:36.000
<v Speaker 5>is really risky if Hank wants to do that, if

851
00:52:36.039 --> 00:52:39.360
<v Speaker 5>he wants to push it and try to smear or

852
00:52:39.400 --> 00:52:44.039
<v Speaker 5>besmirch these experts so much who were sound enough to

853
00:52:44.119 --> 00:52:47.199
<v Speaker 5>be engaged by the federal government and who from what

854
00:52:47.280 --> 00:52:53.480
<v Speaker 5>I understand, render expert opinions for the military. And I

855
00:52:53.559 --> 00:52:57.840
<v Speaker 5>believe I heard NASA, although Hockey too, and Hockey and

856
00:52:57.840 --> 00:53:00.840
<v Speaker 5>maybe not NASA, I'm not But yeah, if they're if

857
00:53:00.840 --> 00:53:04.039
<v Speaker 5>they're nationally regarded experts, and he wants to try to

858
00:53:04.079 --> 00:53:08.039
<v Speaker 5>smear them, that can backfire in front of a jury,

859
00:53:08.239 --> 00:53:10.679
<v Speaker 5>whether there's an attorney who comes in for them or not.

860
00:53:11.880 --> 00:53:15.480
<v Speaker 5>If you try to make someone who's been accepted in

861
00:53:15.559 --> 00:53:18.880
<v Speaker 5>courts look like an idiot, you make yourself look like

862
00:53:18.920 --> 00:53:21.400
<v Speaker 5>an idiot if you don't do it properly.

863
00:53:22.039 --> 00:53:26.920
<v Speaker 1>So Russell essentially, yeah.

864
00:53:26.280 --> 00:53:30.159
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, that was completely Oh and look, Kimberly. Every once

865
00:53:30.199 --> 00:53:32.880
<v Speaker 5>in a while, I look at the chat, Kimberly is saying, yes, NASA,

866
00:53:33.039 --> 00:53:37.000
<v Speaker 5>see I must have heard it right, you got ye.

867
00:53:38.719 --> 00:53:43.920
<v Speaker 5>The only reason, the only reason I noticed it is

868
00:53:43.920 --> 00:53:48.960
<v Speaker 5>because NASA was all capps. So but yeah, I definitely

869
00:53:49.079 --> 00:53:52.199
<v Speaker 5>think he should think twice before he does that, because

870
00:53:52.719 --> 00:53:57.119
<v Speaker 5>someone like doctor Marie Russell, who is, as I've said

871
00:53:57.159 --> 00:54:00.679
<v Speaker 5>before and others have too, the most uniquely qualify expert

872
00:54:00.719 --> 00:54:05.159
<v Speaker 5>on a case I've ever encountered. She dished it back

873
00:54:05.199 --> 00:54:09.559
<v Speaker 5>to him and you never you never want an expert

874
00:54:09.679 --> 00:54:11.880
<v Speaker 5>to stay back to you in front of a jury.

875
00:54:12.199 --> 00:54:15.079
<v Speaker 5>I'm a little offended by what you're asking me right now. Yes,

876
00:54:15.159 --> 00:54:20.079
<v Speaker 5>And in her scenario, she is a more seasoned expert.

877
00:54:20.280 --> 00:54:25.639
<v Speaker 5>She's been practicing and working in her fields for many decades.

878
00:54:26.280 --> 00:54:30.760
<v Speaker 5>You can come off as like bullying bully. Yeah, doesn't

879
00:54:30.800 --> 00:54:34.440
<v Speaker 5>always track well with a jury, and one little thing

880
00:54:34.599 --> 00:54:40.519
<v Speaker 5>like that is enough to really set jurors mindsets. So

881
00:54:40.559 --> 00:54:43.039
<v Speaker 5>you have to kind of choose your battles if you're

882
00:54:43.079 --> 00:54:45.079
<v Speaker 5>going to go that route.

883
00:54:45.320 --> 00:54:48.519
<v Speaker 2>And thank you for the five dollars, Mata Milachey, I

884
00:54:48.639 --> 00:54:50.239
<v Speaker 2>greatly appreciated.

885
00:54:50.679 --> 00:54:52.599
<v Speaker 1>Oh that one didn't come off so well. All right,

886
00:54:52.679 --> 00:54:54.639
<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna work on my Scottish all right.

887
00:54:54.719 --> 00:54:59.960
<v Speaker 2>So now, with as much as the calemand seems dead

888
00:55:00.320 --> 00:55:03.280
<v Speaker 2>to get a guilty verdict, we are the chances the

889
00:55:03.360 --> 00:55:05.800
<v Speaker 2>judge would overrule a jury verdict.

890
00:55:06.079 --> 00:55:08.920
<v Speaker 1>You're awesome none exclamation point.

891
00:55:11.079 --> 00:55:14.760
<v Speaker 5>So the chances a judge would overrule a jury verdict.

892
00:55:14.840 --> 00:55:18.320
<v Speaker 5>Thank you so much, by the way, Shilah, Shilah Janelle,

893
00:55:18.320 --> 00:55:23.719
<v Speaker 5>what a pretty handle. So it doesn't it doesn't work

894
00:55:23.760 --> 00:55:30.199
<v Speaker 5>that way. If a verdict comes in, this judge wouldn't

895
00:55:30.280 --> 00:55:34.199
<v Speaker 5>overrule it so you know, there is an opportunity at

896
00:55:34.239 --> 00:55:37.920
<v Speaker 5>the close of the Commonwealth's case. The Commonwealth goes first,

897
00:55:37.960 --> 00:55:40.719
<v Speaker 5>and when they rest at the end of the presentation

898
00:55:40.840 --> 00:55:45.719
<v Speaker 5>of their case, an application can and should be made

899
00:55:45.760 --> 00:55:50.079
<v Speaker 5>by the defense to move for dismissal for failure to

900
00:55:50.280 --> 00:55:54.199
<v Speaker 5>establish all of the elements of the crimes and enough

901
00:55:54.239 --> 00:55:58.119
<v Speaker 5>reasonable doubt, et cetera. And it is that decision before

902
00:55:58.159 --> 00:56:01.079
<v Speaker 5>the defense has a chance to go give their turn,

903
00:56:01.719 --> 00:56:05.760
<v Speaker 5>where a judge could decide on a motion to dismiss

904
00:56:06.159 --> 00:56:09.159
<v Speaker 5>at the close of the Commonwealth case, to dismiss all

905
00:56:09.199 --> 00:56:14.000
<v Speaker 5>of the charges. I think that the judge, this judge,

906
00:56:14.079 --> 00:56:19.199
<v Speaker 5>will not do that. Another judge might have so. But

907
00:56:19.480 --> 00:56:23.079
<v Speaker 5>if a jury verdict comes in, this judge, meaning Judge

908
00:56:23.119 --> 00:56:26.039
<v Speaker 5>Beverly Cononi, would not do that. She can't do that.

909
00:56:26.159 --> 00:56:31.239
<v Speaker 5>The only remedy available to the defendant Karen at that

910
00:56:31.440 --> 00:56:36.519
<v Speaker 5>time would be to file a motion for an appeal

911
00:56:36.559 --> 00:56:38.559
<v Speaker 5>like she'd have to file for an appeal, a post

912
00:56:38.559 --> 00:56:42.639
<v Speaker 5>conviction appeal. And I hope that answers your question. You're

913
00:56:42.679 --> 00:56:43.239
<v Speaker 5>awesome too.

914
00:56:44.800 --> 00:56:46.800
<v Speaker 2>We've got a lot of questions here to get to

915
00:56:47.519 --> 00:56:50.599
<v Speaker 2>why is there nothing that can be done with their

916
00:56:50.760 --> 00:56:53.559
<v Speaker 2>obvious judge biased, and basically, I think you guys have

917
00:56:53.639 --> 00:56:57.679
<v Speaker 2>said on multiple shows there is not a remedy at

918
00:56:57.679 --> 00:56:59.960
<v Speaker 2>this level, below the appellate level for this.

919
00:57:00.519 --> 00:57:03.679
<v Speaker 5>That's right. And you know some people have been taking

920
00:57:03.760 --> 00:57:10.480
<v Speaker 5>to well, pardon my dog. My dog wants to file

921
00:57:10.519 --> 00:57:17.440
<v Speaker 5>a complaint against Yes, yes, but but anyway, there's been

922
00:57:17.719 --> 00:57:21.440
<v Speaker 5>a push I've seen on social media to file complaints

923
00:57:21.440 --> 00:57:25.719
<v Speaker 5>and register bad reviews for this judge. I don't condone that.

924
00:57:27.360 --> 00:57:30.360
<v Speaker 5>I don't think that's advisable for anyone to do. At

925
00:57:30.360 --> 00:57:34.039
<v Speaker 5>the appellate level. If it's found that Judge Canoni has

926
00:57:34.079 --> 00:57:39.440
<v Speaker 5>made biased rulings or rulings that are beyond her discretionary authority,

927
00:57:39.599 --> 00:57:43.719
<v Speaker 5>then they can that appellate court or a higher appellate

928
00:57:43.760 --> 00:57:48.360
<v Speaker 5>court can overrule her decisions. They could give Karen a

929
00:57:48.400 --> 00:57:51.679
<v Speaker 5>new trial, they could dismiss the charges outright, they could

930
00:57:51.800 --> 00:57:55.719
<v Speaker 5>reverse the conviction. It's that's the place to do it.

931
00:57:56.400 --> 00:57:59.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, And unfortunately she would already will have been

932
00:57:59.800 --> 00:58:02.360
<v Speaker 2>if and I don't I don't, even, like I said,

933
00:58:02.400 --> 00:58:05.800
<v Speaker 2>I've said before, I don't even think there's a chance

934
00:58:05.840 --> 00:58:08.159
<v Speaker 2>they have enough evidence to convict her. So I don't

935
00:58:08.159 --> 00:58:10.800
<v Speaker 2>think that's happening I think Hank was hired for the

936
00:58:10.840 --> 00:58:13.079
<v Speaker 2>hung jury. That was the reason why they brought him

937
00:58:13.119 --> 00:58:14.880
<v Speaker 2>in because they know they don't have any evidence to

938
00:58:14.920 --> 00:58:18.039
<v Speaker 2>convict her, but they can just try to bankrupt her more,

939
00:58:18.159 --> 00:58:20.840
<v Speaker 2>which is even in a way, it's even more evil

940
00:58:21.280 --> 00:58:26.880
<v Speaker 2>because they're just trying to injure her financially and emotionally

941
00:58:27.360 --> 00:58:32.599
<v Speaker 2>and reputationally, knowing that they can't actually earn a conviction.

942
00:58:33.440 --> 00:58:36.639
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I think there's something to that that makes sense.

943
00:58:36.679 --> 00:58:42.400
<v Speaker 5>You guys really provide a lot of thoughtful analysis to

944
00:58:42.519 --> 00:58:46.519
<v Speaker 5>this case. You know, I very much like that when

945
00:58:46.519 --> 00:58:49.000
<v Speaker 5>I listen to your streams, and you know, it's very

946
00:58:49.000 --> 00:58:54.280
<v Speaker 5>interesting to hear all of the different perspectives on it.

947
00:58:54.360 --> 00:58:59.119
<v Speaker 5>So not everyone of the free Karen Reid supporters all

948
00:58:59.159 --> 00:59:02.320
<v Speaker 5>have the same views on everything that you know, not

949
00:59:02.400 --> 00:59:05.800
<v Speaker 5>everything is kind of cookie cutter. But I really do

950
00:59:05.920 --> 00:59:07.400
<v Speaker 5>think you've made a good point there.

951
00:59:08.039 --> 00:59:11.199
<v Speaker 1>This is good because most people are throwing items of

952
00:59:11.239 --> 00:59:13.480
<v Speaker 1>food at their screen when I'm on air, so this

953
00:59:13.559 --> 00:59:19.280
<v Speaker 1>is really a very pleasant change. Yeah, so Java time

954
00:59:19.280 --> 00:59:22.760
<v Speaker 1>you want to read this one. DEALW sure if.

955
00:59:22.639 --> 00:59:26.519
<v Speaker 4>You were cross examining Brian Albert, Brian Higgins and Colin

956
00:59:26.719 --> 00:59:30.400
<v Speaker 4>or Colon, what is one question you didn't ask each

957
00:59:30.440 --> 00:59:33.079
<v Speaker 4>of them as part of the third party culprit defense.

958
00:59:33.400 --> 00:59:35.920
<v Speaker 5>Oh my god, Java.

959
00:59:35.280 --> 00:59:37.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, let's get it, man, let's get that.

960
00:59:37.199 --> 00:59:41.559
<v Speaker 5>That's a good one.

961
00:59:41.840 --> 00:59:44.239
<v Speaker 1>Awesome, that's sorry.

962
00:59:44.280 --> 00:59:47.519
<v Speaker 5>There goes and my questions probably like no one get

963
00:59:47.519 --> 00:59:50.039
<v Speaker 5>their hopes up. I would be asking questions that you

964
00:59:50.079 --> 00:59:53.880
<v Speaker 5>guys all might ask yourselves too. But in terms of

965
00:59:53.920 --> 00:59:56.599
<v Speaker 5>Brian Albert, the one question I would ask him in

966
00:59:56.719 --> 01:00:00.480
<v Speaker 5>terms of the third party culprit defense, it's it's two

967
01:00:00.599 --> 01:00:03.559
<v Speaker 5>can I'm going to say two for him. The first

968
01:00:03.599 --> 01:00:09.400
<v Speaker 5>one would be why why didn't you come out of

969
01:00:09.440 --> 01:00:12.159
<v Speaker 5>the house that night? Why did you you know? And

970
01:00:12.199 --> 01:00:15.400
<v Speaker 5>I I have my theories, I think we all do,

971
01:00:15.599 --> 01:00:17.559
<v Speaker 5>but why didn't you come out of the house once

972
01:00:17.639 --> 01:00:20.519
<v Speaker 5>you you? He had to have heard, he had to

973
01:00:20.559 --> 01:00:23.480
<v Speaker 5>have known. I don't believe that he didn't know what

974
01:00:23.679 --> 01:00:26.320
<v Speaker 5>was going on, But once he knew, once you knew

975
01:00:26.360 --> 01:00:28.719
<v Speaker 5>what was going on, once your sister in law came

976
01:00:28.760 --> 01:00:32.760
<v Speaker 5>into that house, why didn't you come out? And I

977
01:00:32.800 --> 01:00:35.719
<v Speaker 5>think it's very telling that he did not. I would

978
01:00:35.719 --> 01:00:39.239
<v Speaker 5>also want to ask Brian Albert, if I understand the

979
01:00:39.320 --> 01:00:46.559
<v Speaker 5>waterfall video properly, he was the one who stopped Higgins, right,

980
01:00:46.719 --> 01:00:48.679
<v Speaker 5>isn't he the one that He's not the one that

981
01:00:48.719 --> 01:00:54.639
<v Speaker 5>stopped all of these bald Irish guys.

982
01:00:54.920 --> 01:00:56.400
<v Speaker 3>He's the one on the select board.

983
01:00:57.079 --> 01:01:01.000
<v Speaker 5>Yes, well, who else was on that again? Vision impaired?

984
01:01:01.239 --> 01:01:03.760
<v Speaker 5>That was Higgins in the middle. Chris is the one

985
01:01:03.800 --> 01:01:04.760
<v Speaker 5>who grabbed his arm.

986
01:01:05.000 --> 01:01:07.079
<v Speaker 1>Ryan was like behind him, I believe.

987
01:01:06.880 --> 01:01:08.119
<v Speaker 3>Kind of to the left of him.

988
01:01:08.159 --> 01:01:12.480
<v Speaker 5>Ok, that would but by the way that the grabbing

989
01:01:12.519 --> 01:01:15.639
<v Speaker 5>of the arm with the peacocking that was going on,

990
01:01:15.719 --> 01:01:17.800
<v Speaker 5>I would I would want to ask Chris Albert that

991
01:01:17.960 --> 01:01:20.320
<v Speaker 5>so I know that's not part of this question. That's

992
01:01:20.360 --> 01:01:24.760
<v Speaker 5>good as far as Higgins is concerned. I really would

993
01:01:24.760 --> 01:01:29.239
<v Speaker 5>need to drill down more on the getting rid of

994
01:01:29.280 --> 01:01:34.320
<v Speaker 5>his phone, the self curation of text messages. You know,

995
01:01:34.480 --> 01:01:37.960
<v Speaker 5>some he's making himself. He made himself out to sound

996
01:01:38.039 --> 01:01:41.800
<v Speaker 5>like he was being charitable and helpful by picking and

997
01:01:41.880 --> 01:01:46.760
<v Speaker 5>choosing a small subset of text messages with Karen to

998
01:01:47.039 --> 01:01:51.280
<v Speaker 5>help the investigation. Meanwhile, what should have been done was

999
01:01:51.360 --> 01:01:54.639
<v Speaker 5>to hand over your phone and then the discarding of

1000
01:01:54.719 --> 01:01:58.159
<v Speaker 5>the phone on the wake of news breaking that there

1001
01:01:58.239 --> 01:02:01.800
<v Speaker 5>was going to be an order entered to procure his phone,

1002
01:02:01.920 --> 01:02:05.320
<v Speaker 5>and how he discarded his phone. It just nobody does that,

1003
01:02:06.239 --> 01:02:10.079
<v Speaker 5>So I would want to pursue that, and I would

1004
01:02:10.159 --> 01:02:13.760
<v Speaker 5>probably also want to if I were a female asking

1005
01:02:13.840 --> 01:02:16.599
<v Speaker 5>him questions, I would I would want to probe a

1006
01:02:16.639 --> 01:02:19.719
<v Speaker 5>little bit in terms of like how he thought he

1007
01:02:19.760 --> 01:02:22.280
<v Speaker 5>had a snowball's chance in hell with that woman? Like,

1008
01:02:22.760 --> 01:02:24.719
<v Speaker 5>you know, I would want to ras him a little bit,

1009
01:02:24.840 --> 01:02:27.360
<v Speaker 5>like you thought she was into you? Tell me why,

1010
01:02:27.639 --> 01:02:31.880
<v Speaker 5>and start embarrassing him as a female, because you know,

1011
01:02:31.920 --> 01:02:35.000
<v Speaker 5>we all have our tools as lawyers. As a female,

1012
01:02:35.119 --> 01:02:37.480
<v Speaker 5>if I were in that courtroom, I'd want to shame

1013
01:02:37.599 --> 01:02:40.320
<v Speaker 5>him a little bit on the whole what were you

1014
01:02:40.400 --> 01:02:43.320
<v Speaker 5>doing with her? Or what were you communicating with her about?

1015
01:02:43.440 --> 01:02:47.880
<v Speaker 5>But like he's you know, John O'Keefe there in the house,

1016
01:02:47.920 --> 01:02:50.559
<v Speaker 5>and like what's going on here? And then as far

1017
01:02:50.639 --> 01:02:56.400
<v Speaker 5>as Colin Albert, I think that the whole issue of

1018
01:02:57.239 --> 01:03:00.280
<v Speaker 5>when he was in the house, when he left that

1019
01:03:00.320 --> 01:03:05.639
<v Speaker 5>little window, when Ali allegedly picked him up, and the

1020
01:03:05.719 --> 01:03:10.159
<v Speaker 5>text communications which I think were fudged between the two

1021
01:03:10.440 --> 01:03:15.639
<v Speaker 5>self curated and suspicious to me, then also leading to

1022
01:03:15.719 --> 01:03:18.519
<v Speaker 5>where did you go after that? And why did you

1023
01:03:18.559 --> 01:03:23.679
<v Speaker 5>not communicate with her via text? For weeks and weeks

1024
01:03:23.679 --> 01:03:27.079
<v Speaker 5>and weeks later. Now I understand there's other text modalities,

1025
01:03:27.280 --> 01:03:30.480
<v Speaker 5>you know, platforms, et cetera, but i'd want to drill

1026
01:03:30.559 --> 01:03:31.400
<v Speaker 5>down more on that.

1027
01:03:32.800 --> 01:03:33.360
<v Speaker 1>And can I.

1028
01:03:33.320 --> 01:03:37.480
<v Speaker 4>Add one thing to that too In regards to Hagen's phone,

1029
01:03:37.840 --> 01:03:40.199
<v Speaker 4>The thing is is that not everybody in the house

1030
01:03:40.360 --> 01:03:42.599
<v Speaker 4>had to turn over their phone, so he just went

1031
01:03:42.639 --> 01:03:44.719
<v Speaker 4>to voluntarily do.

1032
01:03:44.679 --> 01:03:47.519
<v Speaker 3>This so that he see the fix was in.

1033
01:03:47.960 --> 01:03:50.519
<v Speaker 4>And then on top of that, he choose you know,

1034
01:03:50.840 --> 01:03:53.159
<v Speaker 4>so he was just being nice because they didn't get

1035
01:03:53.199 --> 01:03:56.199
<v Speaker 4>everybody's phone who was in that house, so why was

1036
01:03:56.440 --> 01:03:57.960
<v Speaker 4>out of all of them, he was going to be

1037
01:03:57.960 --> 01:04:00.159
<v Speaker 4>the one that whose phone they were going to, So

1038
01:04:00.199 --> 01:04:02.000
<v Speaker 4>he had to do it backwards and say this is

1039
01:04:02.000 --> 01:04:03.760
<v Speaker 4>what I want to give you. And he had the

1040
01:04:03.800 --> 01:04:06.599
<v Speaker 4>perfect chance to be her hero that day when she

1041
01:04:06.760 --> 01:04:10.400
<v Speaker 4>sent him a mess at tax saying John died and

1042
01:04:10.480 --> 01:04:13.000
<v Speaker 4>he didn't. So that goes to show you right then

1043
01:04:13.039 --> 01:04:17.039
<v Speaker 4>and there that he was just in with the fix.

1044
01:04:17.760 --> 01:04:23.519
<v Speaker 5>I agree that's very important too, Like I that enough

1045
01:04:24.159 --> 01:04:28.679
<v Speaker 5>just that as to Higgins is enough for reasonable doubt,

1046
01:04:29.159 --> 01:04:32.400
<v Speaker 5>and that is why it's very important in my opinion,

1047
01:04:32.599 --> 01:04:36.039
<v Speaker 5>for there to be allowed a third party culprit defense,

1048
01:04:36.079 --> 01:04:39.599
<v Speaker 5>which that decision is still pending by Judge Canoni. But

1049
01:04:40.199 --> 01:04:41.880
<v Speaker 5>out of all I think we can all agree, out

1050
01:04:41.880 --> 01:04:45.360
<v Speaker 5>of all of the third party culprits and out of

1051
01:04:45.400 --> 01:04:50.320
<v Speaker 5>all of those additional kind of accessories or co conspirators

1052
01:04:50.360 --> 01:04:54.880
<v Speaker 5>that I was mentioning before, Higgins had all of the

1053
01:04:54.920 --> 01:04:57.840
<v Speaker 5>reasons in the world. He had the motive, which doesn't

1054
01:04:57.880 --> 01:05:01.760
<v Speaker 5>need to be proven for these charges to stick. But

1055
01:05:01.880 --> 01:05:05.199
<v Speaker 5>he had the motive, he had the communications with her.

1056
01:05:05.559 --> 01:05:11.880
<v Speaker 5>He had not only motive, but just the receipts with her.

1057
01:05:12.079 --> 01:05:16.480
<v Speaker 5>He's the one who had some type of I'm gonna

1058
01:05:16.480 --> 01:05:19.679
<v Speaker 5>call it romantic, although I don't believe it was in

1059
01:05:19.719 --> 01:05:23.599
<v Speaker 5>any way romantic for Karen, but he had the romantic

1060
01:05:24.440 --> 01:05:30.360
<v Speaker 5>dalliance with her, which goes beyond motive. It's more of

1061
01:05:30.400 --> 01:05:35.199
<v Speaker 5>a what was he hiding? Like? What kind of guy

1062
01:05:35.519 --> 01:05:38.639
<v Speaker 5>is he? So beyond motive if you're going to do that,

1063
01:05:38.800 --> 01:05:42.480
<v Speaker 5>you know she's got a boyfriend, like and the boyfriend

1064
01:05:42.519 --> 01:05:48.400
<v Speaker 5>is the custodian and caregiver of children of family members

1065
01:05:48.400 --> 01:05:51.599
<v Speaker 5>who have passed. What kind of guy are you? And

1066
01:05:51.639 --> 01:05:55.840
<v Speaker 5>the jury should be able to draw inferences from that.

1067
01:05:57.000 --> 01:05:58.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I have some thank yous.

1068
01:05:58.719 --> 01:06:01.920
<v Speaker 2>I've got to hit because these people have have donated.

1069
01:06:02.039 --> 01:06:08.400
<v Speaker 2>Thank you Ken Hathaway from Nottingham, England, and thank you the.

1070
01:06:08.440 --> 01:06:09.480
<v Speaker 1>Cat Lady again.

1071
01:06:09.599 --> 01:06:12.000
<v Speaker 2>You're so awesome, ma'am, and we're so lucky to have

1072
01:06:12.079 --> 01:06:13.400
<v Speaker 2>you as part of our team here and.

1073
01:06:13.440 --> 01:06:18.639
<v Speaker 1>Calling all beings and this is this a cat cat something? Randall?

1074
01:06:19.000 --> 01:06:21.960
<v Speaker 1>Is that what that says? I might need me glasses

1075
01:06:22.119 --> 01:06:23.280
<v Speaker 1>not a count se.

1076
01:06:24.840 --> 01:06:29.119
<v Speaker 3>R b al cat Randall.

1077
01:06:29.559 --> 01:06:32.440
<v Speaker 1>I think you're right, Randall. Thank you seeing me and

1078
01:06:32.480 --> 01:06:32.920
<v Speaker 1>be a brother.

1079
01:06:33.280 --> 01:06:34.119
<v Speaker 5>I can't read that.

1080
01:06:34.880 --> 01:06:39.199
<v Speaker 1>Yep, thank you so much for five memberships. Thank you.

1081
01:06:39.360 --> 01:06:41.760
<v Speaker 2>Sherry Dizzel made it in. I knew she was going

1082
01:06:41.800 --> 01:06:43.239
<v Speaker 2>to be a little late. She messaged me.

1083
01:06:43.239 --> 01:06:47.159
<v Speaker 1>Right before we started. Thank you Sherry Dizzel for twenty memberships.

1084
01:06:47.199 --> 01:06:47.960
<v Speaker 1>Love the mistake.

1085
01:06:49.199 --> 01:06:52.920
<v Speaker 2>We thank Mary Milackey goodness six and we've got to

1086
01:06:53.000 --> 01:06:54.960
<v Speaker 2>thank Tommy mack mack.

1087
01:06:55.559 --> 01:06:59.280
<v Speaker 1>She's like a boss. I'm Scottish and irons for got six.

1088
01:07:00.039 --> 01:07:03.639
<v Speaker 2>Thank you very much for five memberships and then AJK

1089
01:07:04.000 --> 01:07:04.800
<v Speaker 2>another ten.

1090
01:07:05.400 --> 01:07:08.239
<v Speaker 1>You are our hero of calling all beings. I don't

1091
01:07:08.239 --> 01:07:10.039
<v Speaker 1>know how many of that is tonight, but it must

1092
01:07:10.039 --> 01:07:12.400
<v Speaker 1>be like thirty or forty. Thank you very much, No

1093
01:07:12.559 --> 01:07:15.159
<v Speaker 1>must stay. You guys are so cool.

1094
01:07:15.639 --> 01:07:17.760
<v Speaker 5>A lot of memberships. That's good for you guys.

1095
01:07:17.920 --> 01:07:18.280
<v Speaker 1>It is.

1096
01:07:18.360 --> 01:07:21.000
<v Speaker 2>It's pretty cool. We don't I think last week I

1097
01:07:21.039 --> 01:07:22.880
<v Speaker 2>was like, b I think we have like forty eight members.

1098
01:07:22.960 --> 01:07:25.920
<v Speaker 2>We didn't have very many, So that's pretty awesome. Uh,

1099
01:07:25.960 --> 01:07:29.880
<v Speaker 2>this one right here none. How can the Commonwealth have

1100
01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:34.880
<v Speaker 2>won theater with true papoul in one point zero and

1101
01:07:34.079 --> 01:07:37.360
<v Speaker 2>another and another expa in two point zero?

1102
01:07:37.360 --> 01:07:39.599
<v Speaker 1>How is that legal to change staff theory?

1103
01:07:40.039 --> 01:07:43.320
<v Speaker 5>That's a great that's a really good question because I

1104
01:07:44.199 --> 01:07:47.639
<v Speaker 5>often thought that myself when I was new at practicing

1105
01:07:47.679 --> 01:07:53.920
<v Speaker 5>criminal defense work. The Commonwealth is allowed to change its theory.

1106
01:07:54.400 --> 01:08:00.360
<v Speaker 5>It shouldn't, and I think it it doesn't track well

1107
01:08:00.800 --> 01:08:04.920
<v Speaker 5>because if you're going to commit people in one you

1108
01:08:04.960 --> 01:08:06.960
<v Speaker 5>hope you only have one trial, But if you're going

1109
01:08:07.000 --> 01:08:11.239
<v Speaker 5>to commit people to testimony in the trial which ends

1110
01:08:11.320 --> 01:08:15.480
<v Speaker 5>up being the first trial of hopefully only two trials,

1111
01:08:16.600 --> 01:08:20.239
<v Speaker 5>you can mess things up and make it very confusing

1112
01:08:20.399 --> 01:08:23.079
<v Speaker 5>for the second trial that you hope never happens. But

1113
01:08:23.199 --> 01:08:27.640
<v Speaker 5>they are allowed to change their theory. What that does, though,

1114
01:08:27.840 --> 01:08:31.720
<v Speaker 5>is signal to all of you and all of those watching,

1115
01:08:31.920 --> 01:08:37.920
<v Speaker 5>and all of the defense team that they don't have credibility.

1116
01:08:38.039 --> 01:08:41.479
<v Speaker 5>They meaning the Commonwealth if they first think it was

1117
01:08:41.680 --> 01:08:44.000
<v Speaker 5>you know, John standing a certain way and then gets

1118
01:08:44.079 --> 01:08:46.000
<v Speaker 5>hit and does a pure wet and falls back on

1119
01:08:46.000 --> 01:08:50.000
<v Speaker 5>Smacks's head. Then if and I don't know what their

1120
01:08:50.039 --> 01:08:54.800
<v Speaker 5>new theory is, if that came out, I completely missed

1121
01:08:54.840 --> 01:08:58.439
<v Speaker 5>that because we don't see the expert reports. But if

1122
01:08:58.439 --> 01:09:01.479
<v Speaker 5>they're going to come out with something different in terms

1123
01:09:01.479 --> 01:09:05.479
<v Speaker 5>of how that accident transpired, or okay, really the car

1124
01:09:05.600 --> 01:09:08.840
<v Speaker 5>didn't back up at this many miles per hour for

1125
01:09:08.920 --> 01:09:11.680
<v Speaker 5>this many feet and it didn't hit him this way,

1126
01:09:11.720 --> 01:09:15.039
<v Speaker 5>it hit him that way, then the defense knows that

1127
01:09:15.119 --> 01:09:18.239
<v Speaker 5>they're fully you know, they're full of you know what

1128
01:09:18.479 --> 01:09:22.720
<v Speaker 5>they're they're grasping, and it really means that their opinions

1129
01:09:22.720 --> 01:09:26.439
<v Speaker 5>are hollow and that two of their own two of

1130
01:09:26.479 --> 01:09:30.319
<v Speaker 5>the Commonwealth's own experts are are in disagreement, which is,

1131
01:09:31.159 --> 01:09:34.199
<v Speaker 5>you know, grounds for cross examination. They can say to

1132
01:09:34.279 --> 01:09:39.520
<v Speaker 5>the new is it Welcher jud whoever the new reconstructionist is,

1133
01:09:40.239 --> 01:09:42.560
<v Speaker 5>They can say to him, well, are you aware that

1134
01:09:42.760 --> 01:09:46.840
<v Speaker 5>Trooper Paul reached these different conclusions if there's a difference,

1135
01:09:47.000 --> 01:09:50.720
<v Speaker 5>you know in it previously, Yes, I'm aware, Well why

1136
01:09:50.720 --> 01:09:54.159
<v Speaker 5>would you disagree with him? He was there at some

1137
01:09:54.359 --> 01:10:00.079
<v Speaker 5>point being spoken to by an inanimate crime scene. But

1138
01:10:00.119 --> 01:10:02.840
<v Speaker 5>you know they have the ability to cross examine the

1139
01:10:02.880 --> 01:10:10.119
<v Speaker 5>new accident reconstructionist on the differences between the two different opinions.

1140
01:10:10.119 --> 01:10:12.960
<v Speaker 5>But they can do it. They're allowed to change their theory.

1141
01:10:13.119 --> 01:10:16.600
<v Speaker 5>It just doesn't look good for them.

1142
01:10:17.079 --> 01:10:17.279
<v Speaker 1>Man.

1143
01:10:17.399 --> 01:10:21.840
<v Speaker 2>Can we also say that if reasonable doubt were a pie,

1144
01:10:22.319 --> 01:10:26.840
<v Speaker 2>this would be inclosing a huge slice of that pie.

1145
01:10:26.960 --> 01:10:29.600
<v Speaker 2>You know that guy Thanksgiving that goes and you're like wow,

1146
01:10:29.680 --> 01:10:32.159
<v Speaker 2>he makes that first slice and then the second one

1147
01:10:32.359 --> 01:10:34.960
<v Speaker 2>is like way over there and it's almost like a third.

1148
01:10:34.760 --> 01:10:35.239
<v Speaker 1>Of the pie.

1149
01:10:35.640 --> 01:10:39.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that is huge reasonable doubt on the prosecution's theory,

1150
01:10:39.960 --> 01:10:40.840
<v Speaker 2>which is what they had.

1151
01:10:40.880 --> 01:10:43.159
<v Speaker 1>They're going to argue this time they have.

1152
01:10:43.119 --> 01:10:45.640
<v Speaker 3>To, and now they're bringing in somebody to say the

1153
01:10:45.680 --> 01:10:46.960
<v Speaker 3>ground was hard as a rock.

1154
01:10:47.840 --> 01:10:51.960
<v Speaker 1>I mean, let me see, I think the ground was

1155
01:10:51.960 --> 01:10:54.159
<v Speaker 1>hard that night, based like, how do you know that?

1156
01:10:54.920 --> 01:10:58.680
<v Speaker 5>I just I don't see how that is a credible

1157
01:10:59.239 --> 01:11:02.279
<v Speaker 5>conclusion that mister Gilman or doctor. I don't know if

1158
01:11:02.319 --> 01:11:05.760
<v Speaker 5>he's a doctor. I'm a doctor of meteorology. I don't

1159
01:11:05.800 --> 01:11:07.439
<v Speaker 5>know if he's a doctor. But I don't know how

1160
01:11:07.520 --> 01:11:11.359
<v Speaker 5>mister Gilman can reach that type of conclusion. I think

1161
01:11:11.439 --> 01:11:14.239
<v Speaker 5>that's a reach. If they're going to try to say

1162
01:11:14.239 --> 01:11:19.039
<v Speaker 5>that a contracou type of injury was caused by that,

1163
01:11:19.039 --> 01:11:22.760
<v Speaker 5>that's a reach. And I would expect the defense to

1164
01:11:23.479 --> 01:11:31.239
<v Speaker 5>fully explore that with the neurosurgeon who has been permitted

1165
01:11:31.399 --> 01:11:34.800
<v Speaker 5>now been permitted to testify, kind of in place of

1166
01:11:35.279 --> 01:11:40.760
<v Speaker 5>the medical examiner, you know, asking him because he's a neurosurgeon,

1167
01:11:40.800 --> 01:11:44.119
<v Speaker 5>he's probably treated those types of injuries. So they should

1168
01:11:44.199 --> 01:11:45.239
<v Speaker 5>fully explore that.

1169
01:11:46.279 --> 01:11:48.600
<v Speaker 3>And I have two words, just do it?

1170
01:11:52.000 --> 01:11:52.439
<v Speaker 5>Do it?

1171
01:11:53.279 --> 01:11:56.800
<v Speaker 4>Oh yeah, yeah, it says do it a j Yeah,

1172
01:11:56.880 --> 01:11:57.359
<v Speaker 4>go ahead.

1173
01:11:57.720 --> 01:12:01.279
<v Speaker 5>I keep showing up shirts. Someone sent me this. It's

1174
01:12:01.319 --> 01:12:05.000
<v Speaker 5>my favorite color. I was lucky. It's so everyone's so sweet.

1175
01:12:05.039 --> 01:12:08.039
<v Speaker 5>They've sent me things, but they keep it really simple.

1176
01:12:08.079 --> 01:12:11.800
<v Speaker 5>They either send me funny shirts or like some light

1177
01:12:11.920 --> 01:12:15.479
<v Speaker 5>little trinkets, or I get boxes of O's cereal, which

1178
01:12:15.520 --> 01:12:17.840
<v Speaker 5>I told Auntie deb a few weeks ago that I

1179
01:12:17.920 --> 01:12:20.640
<v Speaker 5>really love and they don't sell it down here in

1180
01:12:20.720 --> 01:12:23.600
<v Speaker 5>the stores. So I have boxes and boxes of O's

1181
01:12:24.039 --> 01:12:25.239
<v Speaker 5>and I love them.

1182
01:12:26.159 --> 01:12:29.399
<v Speaker 2>Nan during any since we got a heart from Swiss

1183
01:12:29.399 --> 01:12:32.279
<v Speaker 2>miss during any of your trips over seas, had you

1184
01:12:32.359 --> 01:12:33.239
<v Speaker 2>learned how to yodel?

1185
01:12:33.600 --> 01:12:35.399
<v Speaker 1>At all. Have you been to Switzerland?

1186
01:12:35.920 --> 01:12:40.319
<v Speaker 5>Me, No, I've only I've only been to Uh. I'm sorry.

1187
01:12:40.439 --> 01:12:42.359
<v Speaker 5>I don't even think I would be good at yodeling.

1188
01:12:43.119 --> 01:12:45.800
<v Speaker 5>I've been to only to South America is the only

1189
01:12:45.840 --> 01:12:49.520
<v Speaker 5>place I would think is remotely considered overseas, and it's

1190
01:12:49.520 --> 01:12:55.159
<v Speaker 5>probably not because we consider that to be Europe. Yeah, right, Well,

1191
01:12:55.199 --> 01:12:58.319
<v Speaker 5>I mean I guess, yeah, no, I've not. I guess

1192
01:12:58.479 --> 01:13:03.880
<v Speaker 5>I eat yodles yodel's of the chocolatey treat, but no,

1193
01:13:04.039 --> 01:13:05.039
<v Speaker 5>I don't know how to yodel.

1194
01:13:05.239 --> 01:13:08.920
<v Speaker 1>Okay, so even I think that's that.

1195
01:13:11.680 --> 01:13:14.640
<v Speaker 5>I like Swiss Miss Hot Chocolate. I like that brand

1196
01:13:14.640 --> 01:13:16.520
<v Speaker 5>hot Chocolate definitely.

1197
01:13:16.479 --> 01:13:17.359
<v Speaker 1>As as do I.

1198
01:13:17.439 --> 01:13:19.800
<v Speaker 2>Let's see what we have here, please tell Everyone was

1199
01:13:19.840 --> 01:13:25.000
<v Speaker 2>sure to mention Nicole Albert's obsession with cleaning very suspicious.

1200
01:13:25.239 --> 01:13:28.439
<v Speaker 2>I think they expected the house to be searched. Yeah,

1201
01:13:28.560 --> 01:13:30.159
<v Speaker 2>I mean, who the hell is cleaning in the middle

1202
01:13:30.159 --> 01:13:32.439
<v Speaker 2>of the night like that? So yeah, that's I don't

1203
01:13:32.479 --> 01:13:34.199
<v Speaker 2>even think bea cleans in the middle.

1204
01:13:34.039 --> 01:13:36.239
<v Speaker 3>Of I know, I was gonna say I love to clean,

1205
01:13:36.279 --> 01:13:37.359
<v Speaker 3>but not in the middle of the night.

1206
01:13:37.560 --> 01:13:37.920
<v Speaker 1>No.

1207
01:13:38.119 --> 01:13:41.680
<v Speaker 5>For me, it's the fact that they mentioned it. I

1208
01:13:41.720 --> 01:13:46.399
<v Speaker 5>think there were three witnesses if I recall who mentioned cleaning,

1209
01:13:47.079 --> 01:13:50.760
<v Speaker 5>and it was like Nicole Albert, Brian Albert Junior, and

1210
01:13:50.800 --> 01:13:52.680
<v Speaker 5>I want to say it was one other who I

1211
01:13:52.720 --> 01:13:56.239
<v Speaker 5>can't recall. The fact that they felt in a murder

1212
01:13:56.399 --> 01:14:01.159
<v Speaker 5>trial that the reference to cleaning was in any way

1213
01:14:01.199 --> 01:14:06.800
<v Speaker 5>important makes me think, hmm mm hmm, okay, in case,

1214
01:14:06.920 --> 01:14:10.039
<v Speaker 5>for example, the house had they were cleaning up, or

1215
01:14:10.039 --> 01:14:13.720
<v Speaker 5>the house was searched, or interviews were being taken place

1216
01:14:13.760 --> 01:14:17.560
<v Speaker 5>there in the coming hours, if the house smelled like bleach,

1217
01:14:17.840 --> 01:14:24.520
<v Speaker 5>anything like that. I'm not an investigator, but I think

1218
01:14:25.279 --> 01:14:29.600
<v Speaker 5>the fact that they mentioned her obsessive cleaning is enough

1219
01:14:29.600 --> 01:14:32.079
<v Speaker 5>for me to ask more questions about it. And that's

1220
01:14:32.119 --> 01:14:37.039
<v Speaker 5>something I would be probing those witnesses on Nicole Albert,

1221
01:14:37.039 --> 01:14:40.199
<v Speaker 5>Brian Albert Junior, and if there was a third on

1222
01:14:40.239 --> 01:14:42.880
<v Speaker 5>that very issue, because I find it interesting.

1223
01:14:43.479 --> 01:14:45.520
<v Speaker 3>I think the third person was Jem McKay when she

1224
01:14:45.600 --> 01:14:47.199
<v Speaker 3>was ascribing her sister.

1225
01:14:46.960 --> 01:14:50.680
<v Speaker 5>As yeah, yeah, it was. I think it was Gen.

1226
01:14:50.680 --> 01:14:52.760
<v Speaker 5>You have a better memory of this bea than I do.

1227
01:14:53.920 --> 01:14:56.840
<v Speaker 5>I also think there's something there about the whole It's

1228
01:14:56.920 --> 01:15:00.239
<v Speaker 5>raining men song that Jen that seems to have and

1229
01:15:01.079 --> 01:15:03.720
<v Speaker 5>like whoo, who would have thought it's raining men would

1230
01:15:03.800 --> 01:15:08.520
<v Speaker 5>become like an important little side road on a murder trial.

1231
01:15:08.600 --> 01:15:13.159
<v Speaker 5>But I think there's something off about that as well.

1232
01:15:13.199 --> 01:15:16.640
<v Speaker 5>It just doesn't flow. It's kind of like the old games.

1233
01:15:17.039 --> 01:15:19.920
<v Speaker 5>You ever play that game, like which of these things

1234
01:15:20.000 --> 01:15:22.399
<v Speaker 5>is not like the other? Or find the thing that

1235
01:15:22.439 --> 01:15:25.199
<v Speaker 5>doesn't match the rest of the picture that to me

1236
01:15:25.359 --> 01:15:28.680
<v Speaker 5>is not matching. And I have to believe, although I

1237
01:15:28.720 --> 01:15:33.359
<v Speaker 5>don't have any knowledge on this subject, that people who

1238
01:15:33.560 --> 01:15:38.039
<v Speaker 5>read body language and assess people's words and mannerisms, they

1239
01:15:38.119 --> 01:15:44.079
<v Speaker 5>might say these little irrelevant facts are telling I bet

1240
01:15:44.199 --> 01:15:45.520
<v Speaker 5>you they would say that.

1241
01:15:46.479 --> 01:15:50.720
<v Speaker 2>The number three comes into my mind as well, and

1242
01:15:50.760 --> 01:15:54.600
<v Speaker 2>that is there is three leaders of blood that are

1243
01:15:54.800 --> 01:15:57.600
<v Speaker 2>unaccounted for in the lawn, which means they're inside the house.

1244
01:15:58.199 --> 01:16:01.800
<v Speaker 2>And every CSI guy especially are we haven't heard from

1245
01:16:01.880 --> 01:16:04.319
<v Speaker 2>our New York Cops guys in a while, because I

1246
01:16:04.439 --> 01:16:08.399
<v Speaker 2>believe not Ed, but the other gentleman duty Ron, I

1247
01:16:08.560 --> 01:16:10.239
<v Speaker 2>believe is battling cancer.

1248
01:16:10.720 --> 01:16:15.000
<v Speaker 1>Bless him, bless him. But Ed would have said, oh,

1249
01:16:15.119 --> 01:16:18.359
<v Speaker 1>I would have had a field day of Kate Casey's

1250
01:16:18.359 --> 01:16:21.840
<v Speaker 1>asking him still launch She's just pulling back and I'll.

1251
01:16:21.600 --> 01:16:27.600
<v Speaker 2>Just tell her so yep, we're here, Kate Casey, Yeah, okay,

1252
01:16:28.399 --> 01:16:30.640
<v Speaker 2>And so they would have found that blood, they would

1253
01:16:30.640 --> 01:16:31.479
<v Speaker 2>have they could have.

1254
01:16:31.520 --> 01:16:35.359
<v Speaker 1>Bleached from now. And I think Ed said that as much.

1255
01:16:35.720 --> 01:16:36.479
<v Speaker 1>He said that on.

1256
01:16:36.479 --> 01:16:38.800
<v Speaker 2>Their show, you can bleach, you can try to clean

1257
01:16:38.800 --> 01:16:40.560
<v Speaker 2>it up. You're not going to get it all, and

1258
01:16:40.600 --> 01:16:40.920
<v Speaker 2>we're going.

1259
01:16:40.880 --> 01:16:41.640
<v Speaker 1>To find it.

1260
01:16:41.840 --> 01:16:45.199
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and I and I also believe that like no

1261
01:16:45.199 --> 01:16:51.199
<v Speaker 5>normal average household would be prepared for the exanguination of

1262
01:16:51.279 --> 01:16:54.600
<v Speaker 5>three leaders of blood. Like if if I went out

1263
01:16:54.640 --> 01:16:56.800
<v Speaker 5>in my home right now and I there was a

1264
01:16:56.840 --> 01:17:00.319
<v Speaker 5>horrible accident, I love to clean, I've got a lot

1265
01:17:00.319 --> 01:17:03.600
<v Speaker 5>of cleaning supplies. I think I'd be challenged cleaning up

1266
01:17:03.600 --> 01:17:06.760
<v Speaker 5>that much blood. So if this was, as I think

1267
01:17:06.800 --> 01:17:10.279
<v Speaker 5>it was, an accident, that should have you know, they

1268
01:17:10.319 --> 01:17:13.079
<v Speaker 5>should have done the right thing and taken honorable steps

1269
01:17:13.119 --> 01:17:17.439
<v Speaker 5>to report it and accept any consequences that came. Then

1270
01:17:18.159 --> 01:17:22.279
<v Speaker 5>if it really was unplanned, then they likely wouldn't have

1271
01:17:22.359 --> 01:17:26.640
<v Speaker 5>had proper cleaning supplies, in my opinion.

1272
01:17:26.560 --> 01:17:28.319
<v Speaker 3>Or enough bounty paper towels.

1273
01:17:28.800 --> 01:17:31.600
<v Speaker 2>Right right, Ah, there's are you not going to like

1274
01:17:31.680 --> 01:17:35.439
<v Speaker 2>from what Ed says that the splatter and things like that,

1275
01:17:35.520 --> 01:17:37.520
<v Speaker 2>you're just not going to get it all. You're not

1276
01:17:37.560 --> 01:17:39.119
<v Speaker 2>going to get it all out of the carpet. If

1277
01:17:39.159 --> 01:17:42.319
<v Speaker 2>they had carpet down in the basement, which they did.

1278
01:17:42.479 --> 01:17:44.880
<v Speaker 2>They did have cart because they had so, so that

1279
01:17:44.880 --> 01:17:46.880
<v Speaker 2>would be the other thing. Hey, Brian, what what does

1280
01:17:46.920 --> 01:17:47.479
<v Speaker 2>it major ed?

1281
01:17:48.720 --> 01:17:52.239
<v Speaker 1>Remove that carpet? And so I would have asked them

1282
01:17:52.239 --> 01:17:52.960
<v Speaker 1>like a three and one.

1283
01:17:52.960 --> 01:17:56.520
<v Speaker 2>You removed the carpet, and then you you sold the

1284
01:17:56.520 --> 01:18:00.600
<v Speaker 2>house that was your childhood home. I'm wondering, really wondering

1285
01:18:00.600 --> 01:18:06.079
<v Speaker 2>if who going into retirement sells a paid off house

1286
01:18:06.640 --> 01:18:11.039
<v Speaker 2>sixty thousand dollars under market value and then has to

1287
01:18:11.079 --> 01:18:14.119
<v Speaker 2>go buy a house. Nobody does that when that's the

1288
01:18:14.159 --> 01:18:15.199
<v Speaker 2>house Brian grew up in.

1289
01:18:15.239 --> 01:18:15.920
<v Speaker 1>You already know that.

1290
01:18:16.159 --> 01:18:19.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so surely it had to have been paid off

1291
01:18:19.199 --> 01:18:21.560
<v Speaker 2>by then. Why would you want to get rid of

1292
01:18:21.560 --> 01:18:23.520
<v Speaker 2>that house? Like nobody does that?

1293
01:18:23.880 --> 01:18:26.960
<v Speaker 5>I agree. And I don't know the ages of all

1294
01:18:27.000 --> 01:18:30.600
<v Speaker 5>of his children. I don't even know the number of

1295
01:18:30.640 --> 01:18:33.960
<v Speaker 5>all of his children. Doesn't he have like five kids

1296
01:18:34.399 --> 01:18:35.840
<v Speaker 5>in some sud I don't know.

1297
01:18:35.960 --> 01:18:40.920
<v Speaker 2>Maybe Scotty or or actually Dennis Sweeney or Scotti in

1298
01:18:40.960 --> 01:18:42.560
<v Speaker 2>the chat can let us know?

1299
01:18:42.600 --> 01:18:44.600
<v Speaker 5>And then if you see it pop up, Well, here's

1300
01:18:44.800 --> 01:18:48.039
<v Speaker 5>here's something that I had just popped into my mind

1301
01:18:48.159 --> 01:18:51.640
<v Speaker 5>a few months back when I had you know, little

1302
01:18:51.640 --> 01:18:54.960
<v Speaker 5>things pop in from time to time, and I was like, oh,

1303
01:18:55.000 --> 01:18:59.239
<v Speaker 5>five kids, BA has five. Okay, so I don't know

1304
01:18:59.279 --> 01:19:03.079
<v Speaker 5>all of their ages. But when when these little facts

1305
01:19:03.119 --> 01:19:08.079
<v Speaker 5>pop into my head, I say to myself like, Okay,

1306
01:19:08.199 --> 01:19:10.359
<v Speaker 5>some of these kids are grown, or maybe all of

1307
01:19:10.359 --> 01:19:16.600
<v Speaker 5>them are. But if you're post pandemic, okay, So now

1308
01:19:16.600 --> 01:19:20.560
<v Speaker 5>we're twenty twenty two. The market was thriving, the real

1309
01:19:20.680 --> 01:19:23.479
<v Speaker 5>estate market, at least in my area, and I have

1310
01:19:23.520 --> 01:19:26.880
<v Speaker 5>to believe nationally was thriving, but probably up in that

1311
01:19:27.039 --> 01:19:30.439
<v Speaker 5>area as well. And if you have children who are

1312
01:19:30.479 --> 01:19:34.000
<v Speaker 5>grown and some or all of them are in relationships,

1313
01:19:34.199 --> 01:19:37.199
<v Speaker 5>and now, as you said, DJ, like he sells this

1314
01:19:37.359 --> 01:19:40.479
<v Speaker 5>house only to buy another house, which is what I

1315
01:19:40.560 --> 01:19:41.560
<v Speaker 5>had heard as well.

1316
01:19:41.800 --> 01:19:42.760
<v Speaker 1>Yes, you earn do that.

1317
01:19:43.159 --> 01:19:46.079
<v Speaker 5>You know, I could understand if they said, okay, we're downsizing,

1318
01:19:46.199 --> 01:19:49.239
<v Speaker 5>let's get a little townhouse or a condo. But if

1319
01:19:49.279 --> 01:19:53.279
<v Speaker 5>you buy another house, that doesn't track to me. If

1320
01:19:53.319 --> 01:20:00.359
<v Speaker 5>you have grown kids, many times you sell your home

1321
01:20:00.399 --> 01:20:03.600
<v Speaker 5>to your child. So it's like, if they're going to

1322
01:20:03.640 --> 01:20:06.720
<v Speaker 5>be starting out into marriages and relationships, maybe you sell

1323
01:20:06.760 --> 01:20:09.680
<v Speaker 5>your house to your child. I recognize what I'm telling

1324
01:20:09.760 --> 01:20:12.800
<v Speaker 5>you right now is just complete speculation on my part.

1325
01:20:13.159 --> 01:20:17.399
<v Speaker 5>It just it's like a little fact that shows me

1326
01:20:17.680 --> 01:20:19.760
<v Speaker 5>there was a cover up here down to you.

1327
01:20:19.920 --> 01:20:23.560
<v Speaker 4>They're disassociating themselves with the dog, with.

1328
01:20:23.640 --> 01:20:25.199
<v Speaker 1>The house, house, the phone.

1329
01:20:25.279 --> 01:20:25.439
<v Speaker 6>You know.

1330
01:20:25.640 --> 01:20:29.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So let's let's bring in Kate Casey because she's

1331
01:20:29.279 --> 01:20:32.960
<v Speaker 2>backstage right here. So, folks, this young lady right here

1332
01:20:33.479 --> 01:20:36.159
<v Speaker 2>is the host of Reality Life with Kate Casey.

1333
01:20:37.359 --> 01:20:39.239
<v Speaker 1>She is a phenomenal individual.

1334
01:20:39.760 --> 01:20:43.239
<v Speaker 2>Her her own life story Blew Me Away as one

1335
01:20:43.399 --> 01:20:48.199
<v Speaker 2>as another compelling story. On her channel, she interviews reality

1336
01:20:48.239 --> 01:20:55.640
<v Speaker 2>TV stars, showrunners, directors, documentarians. She recently interviewed a documentarian

1337
01:20:55.640 --> 01:20:56.159
<v Speaker 2>that covered the.

1338
01:20:56.199 --> 01:20:57.079
<v Speaker 1>Karen Reid case.

1339
01:20:57.600 --> 01:20:59.880
<v Speaker 2>And she's been my friend for several years and an

1340
01:21:00.039 --> 01:21:03.680
<v Speaker 2>interviewer who is phenomenal who I admire in this business,

1341
01:21:03.680 --> 01:21:05.720
<v Speaker 2>one of the people that I look at to try

1342
01:21:05.720 --> 01:21:06.960
<v Speaker 2>to model myself after.

1343
01:21:07.039 --> 01:21:11.000
<v Speaker 1>So party people put your hands together for my home girl,

1344
01:21:11.920 --> 01:21:12.720
<v Speaker 1>pay say.

1345
01:21:14.720 --> 01:21:15.720
<v Speaker 6>It's way too nice.

1346
01:21:15.960 --> 01:21:22.960
<v Speaker 1>I'm hi, Kate, Hi.

1347
01:21:23.359 --> 01:21:26.199
<v Speaker 6>I feel like a dingling compared to your guests, who like,

1348
01:21:26.279 --> 01:21:28.079
<v Speaker 6>are so up to date on this case. I mean,

1349
01:21:28.119 --> 01:21:30.840
<v Speaker 6>I'm I'm familiar with it because I covered it the

1350
01:21:30.840 --> 01:21:34.079
<v Speaker 6>first trial. But I'm you know, I by no means

1351
01:21:34.359 --> 01:21:36.960
<v Speaker 6>am like like a total expert on this case. I

1352
01:21:37.000 --> 01:21:40.079
<v Speaker 6>find what's most fascinating is the fact that even at

1353
01:21:40.079 --> 01:21:45.079
<v Speaker 6>this point in time, you have two camps of people

1354
01:21:45.159 --> 01:21:48.439
<v Speaker 6>that are absolutely sure of their own opinion. And I

1355
01:21:48.600 --> 01:21:53.319
<v Speaker 6>wondered why you think that is that people still to

1356
01:21:53.359 --> 01:21:56.640
<v Speaker 6>this day are so divided with as much information that

1357
01:21:56.760 --> 01:22:01.359
<v Speaker 6>is out in the ether. Hah, Why are people so

1358
01:22:02.600 --> 01:22:04.439
<v Speaker 6>strong in their points of view?

1359
01:22:05.840 --> 01:22:09.159
<v Speaker 5>Wow? I mean, but do you want me to answer that?

1360
01:22:09.239 --> 01:22:09.439
<v Speaker 1>Kate?

1361
01:22:09.520 --> 01:22:11.720
<v Speaker 5>It's so nice to meet you, but I'm sure even

1362
01:22:11.800 --> 01:22:13.960
<v Speaker 5>DJ and Bia have their own answers to that.

1363
01:22:14.119 --> 01:22:15.840
<v Speaker 2>Well, let me set the table for what's about to

1364
01:22:15.840 --> 01:22:18.439
<v Speaker 2>happen here. We are turning this over to Kate. I

1365
01:22:18.479 --> 01:22:21.039
<v Speaker 2>want to get her questions in there for nance so

1366
01:22:21.119 --> 01:22:24.119
<v Speaker 2>she can get a sense of exactly she just framed

1367
01:22:24.159 --> 01:22:26.800
<v Speaker 2>it up beautifully right there, So Bia and I are

1368
01:22:26.800 --> 01:22:28.600
<v Speaker 2>stepping aside. Please take it away, Kate.

1369
01:22:28.640 --> 01:22:30.560
<v Speaker 5>And now, oh okay, all right, so you guys are

1370
01:22:30.600 --> 01:22:33.279
<v Speaker 5>just voyeurs. All right, Well, it's very nice to meet you, Kate.

1371
01:22:34.119 --> 01:22:36.880
<v Speaker 5>So at this point in time, why I think both

1372
01:22:36.920 --> 01:22:41.520
<v Speaker 5>sides are so polar opposite and divided? Is probably because

1373
01:22:42.039 --> 01:22:47.359
<v Speaker 5>of the continuing revelation of more and more evidence that

1374
01:22:47.439 --> 01:22:51.479
<v Speaker 5>has come out even post first trial. So since that

1375
01:22:51.520 --> 01:22:57.399
<v Speaker 5>first trial, there has been late productions of additional videos

1376
01:22:57.479 --> 01:23:02.079
<v Speaker 5>that are arguably exculpatory to Karen. There's new video that

1377
01:23:02.199 --> 01:23:06.159
<v Speaker 5>was produced of one of the alleged third party culprits

1378
01:23:06.279 --> 01:23:08.800
<v Speaker 5>on the phone in the middle of the night at

1379
01:23:08.800 --> 01:23:12.359
<v Speaker 5>the outside of the police station where he previously testified

1380
01:23:12.760 --> 01:23:17.199
<v Speaker 5>that he didn't talk to anyone that night. There's evidence

1381
01:23:17.239 --> 01:23:20.560
<v Speaker 5>being revealed that the I'm going to get this wrong.

1382
01:23:20.600 --> 01:23:25.960
<v Speaker 5>I think he's a Lieutenant Fanning had a role of

1383
01:23:26.319 --> 01:23:31.680
<v Speaker 5>oversight the commander to oversee this jury. Meanwhile, he had

1384
01:23:32.159 --> 01:23:38.960
<v Speaker 5>connections with the investigating lead investigator, former Trooper Proctor. So

1385
01:23:39.279 --> 01:23:44.600
<v Speaker 5>why this Lieutenant Fanning had any oversight whatsoever, whether he

1386
01:23:45.119 --> 01:23:48.680
<v Speaker 5>had first hand contact with jury or not, But that's

1387
01:23:48.720 --> 01:23:52.119
<v Speaker 5>come to light. He was involved with some of the

1388
01:23:52.159 --> 01:23:59.520
<v Speaker 5>text messaging of that for former investigator Proctor that were

1389
01:23:59.680 --> 01:24:04.079
<v Speaker 5>selectacious and inappropriate in nature. So this Fanning, who has

1390
01:24:04.199 --> 01:24:08.119
<v Speaker 5>also had ties I believe to the Sandra Birchmore case.

1391
01:24:08.119 --> 01:24:12.199
<v Speaker 5>Although I might be wrong, that's a tangential case in

1392
01:24:12.800 --> 01:24:17.640
<v Speaker 5>that geographic zone, which is also problematic if you don't

1393
01:24:17.640 --> 01:24:19.399
<v Speaker 5>know anything about that case, Kate.

1394
01:24:19.880 --> 01:24:21.279
<v Speaker 6>No, I'm familiar with that good.

1395
01:24:21.359 --> 01:24:23.720
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I was going to say that we should definitely

1396
01:24:23.720 --> 01:24:28.560
<v Speaker 5>make you aware of it. Also, there's there has been

1397
01:24:29.000 --> 01:24:33.159
<v Speaker 5>more and more chicanery, I guess I would call it

1398
01:24:33.199 --> 01:24:39.520
<v Speaker 5>with the new specially appointed prosecutor Hank Brennan in terms

1399
01:24:39.520 --> 01:24:43.399
<v Speaker 5>of misrepresentations as for my observation that he's made to

1400
01:24:43.479 --> 01:24:47.479
<v Speaker 5>the court and some very imbalanced rulings coming down from

1401
01:24:47.560 --> 01:24:52.000
<v Speaker 5>the court that even contravene her prior rulings in the

1402
01:24:52.039 --> 01:24:56.920
<v Speaker 5>first trial. So while there was two different camps, there's

1403
01:24:57.079 --> 01:25:01.359
<v Speaker 5>now it's like throwing gasoline on a fire because with

1404
01:25:01.560 --> 01:25:04.560
<v Speaker 5>all of and those are just some examples that I've

1405
01:25:04.640 --> 01:25:07.520
<v Speaker 5>just laid out to you, With all of that happening,

1406
01:25:08.000 --> 01:25:11.439
<v Speaker 5>we're now in a position where we're the people who

1407
01:25:11.520 --> 01:25:15.279
<v Speaker 5>feel so strongly for Karen Reid and civil rights and

1408
01:25:15.359 --> 01:25:20.239
<v Speaker 5>her right to a fair trial. They now feel validated

1409
01:25:20.399 --> 01:25:24.279
<v Speaker 5>from the sense I'm getting that there's really something going

1410
01:25:24.359 --> 01:25:28.000
<v Speaker 5>on wrong. And then the other side of the camp,

1411
01:25:28.159 --> 01:25:33.479
<v Speaker 5>the anti free Karen readers there, from my observation, getting

1412
01:25:34.039 --> 01:25:43.079
<v Speaker 5>very agitated at the groundswell of frustration and the kind

1413
01:25:43.079 --> 01:25:46.399
<v Speaker 5>of uproariousness of the free Karen Reid movement in the

1414
01:25:46.439 --> 01:25:49.119
<v Speaker 5>wake of all of these developments that it's just kind

1415
01:25:49.159 --> 01:25:55.960
<v Speaker 5>of caused more of a just a chasm between both sides,

1416
01:25:56.119 --> 01:25:59.560
<v Speaker 5>and I don't see it getting any better anytime soon.

1417
01:26:00.439 --> 01:26:01.439
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, what do you what do.

1418
01:26:01.399 --> 01:26:04.279
<v Speaker 6>You think is an attorney is going to be the

1419
01:26:04.359 --> 01:26:07.720
<v Speaker 6>plight for the defense in trial number two?

1420
01:26:08.880 --> 01:26:11.760
<v Speaker 5>The plight for the defense in trial number two, meaning

1421
01:26:11.800 --> 01:26:12.800
<v Speaker 5>what is going.

1422
01:26:12.680 --> 01:26:17.319
<v Speaker 6>To be what is their biggest obstacle, biggest obstacles.

1423
01:26:17.600 --> 01:26:20.239
<v Speaker 5>That's a good question. So the biggest obstacle as I

1424
01:26:20.319 --> 01:26:24.119
<v Speaker 5>see it, for the defense in trial two point zero who.

1425
01:26:24.479 --> 01:26:26.399
<v Speaker 5>I don't know if I want to say that publicly

1426
01:26:26.439 --> 01:26:29.239
<v Speaker 5>because I don't want to signal to the commonwealth because

1427
01:26:29.279 --> 01:26:32.039
<v Speaker 5>I make no secret of what side I fall on.

1428
01:26:32.119 --> 01:26:35.520
<v Speaker 5>But you know, to answer your question, my my, my

1429
01:26:35.640 --> 01:26:39.479
<v Speaker 5>feeling is the biggest obstacle will be the.

1430
01:26:41.960 --> 01:26:46.199
<v Speaker 1>Put it on screen here? What is that the judge?

1431
01:26:47.399 --> 01:26:49.399
<v Speaker 5>Do I not see? Do I not see her on

1432
01:26:49.479 --> 01:26:53.079
<v Speaker 5>the screen? Oh? Yeah, I just can't judge. I mean, well,

1433
01:26:53.119 --> 01:26:57.239
<v Speaker 5>the judge, the judge is the biggest plight she this case.

1434
01:26:57.840 --> 01:26:59.880
<v Speaker 5>I mean I I do agree with you, DJ, she

1435
01:27:00.000 --> 01:27:02.960
<v Speaker 5>she is the biggest plight, but she's more of a proceduralist.

1436
01:27:03.039 --> 01:27:05.800
<v Speaker 5>She's the one that's supposed to properly be calling balls

1437
01:27:05.800 --> 01:27:11.039
<v Speaker 5>and strikes from a factual standpoint. The biggest bad fact

1438
01:27:11.159 --> 01:27:16.279
<v Speaker 5>that I think she has to Karen, meaning Karen and

1439
01:27:16.319 --> 01:27:19.880
<v Speaker 5>her team have to surmount, is the fact that she

1440
01:27:20.199 --> 01:27:26.640
<v Speaker 5>has been speaking to publications and giving her statements, none

1441
01:27:26.720 --> 01:27:30.560
<v Speaker 5>of which I feel are inculpatory to her. But I

1442
01:27:30.600 --> 01:27:33.880
<v Speaker 5>can understand why some people feel that they are either

1443
01:27:33.960 --> 01:27:39.560
<v Speaker 5>inconsistent with her position as throughout the defense, as has

1444
01:27:39.640 --> 01:27:43.479
<v Speaker 5>been communicated in testimony or statements of her attorneys. So

1445
01:27:44.399 --> 01:27:47.359
<v Speaker 5>what she's been saying to some of these publications has

1446
01:27:47.640 --> 01:27:52.000
<v Speaker 5>at least caused people to suspect that you know she

1447
01:27:52.159 --> 01:27:55.760
<v Speaker 5>did something wrong and is trying to cover it up.

1448
01:27:55.880 --> 01:27:59.079
<v Speaker 5>I disagree with that. I can reconcile all of her

1449
01:27:59.119 --> 01:28:02.920
<v Speaker 5>public statements to journalists and say no, no, no. This

1450
01:28:02.960 --> 01:28:06.000
<v Speaker 5>would have been the mindset of a woman who had

1451
01:28:06.079 --> 01:28:09.159
<v Speaker 5>been consuming alcohol, which she makes no secret of the

1452
01:28:09.239 --> 01:28:12.720
<v Speaker 5>night before, and wakes up after a few hours of sleep,

1453
01:28:12.760 --> 01:28:15.319
<v Speaker 5>and her boyfriend's not in the house, and your mind

1454
01:28:15.359 --> 01:28:17.439
<v Speaker 5>is in a tizzy. You're trying to piece it together.

1455
01:28:18.840 --> 01:28:22.279
<v Speaker 5>I think it's her statements. If they do come into evidence,

1456
01:28:22.319 --> 01:28:25.439
<v Speaker 5>and there's different ways for them to come into evidence,

1457
01:28:25.880 --> 01:28:28.800
<v Speaker 5>those will be a challenge. And then also there is

1458
01:28:29.279 --> 01:28:31.880
<v Speaker 5>going to be and I don't know what it says

1459
01:28:31.920 --> 01:28:36.000
<v Speaker 5>in it, a new accident reconstruction. So presumably if they

1460
01:28:36.079 --> 01:28:40.800
<v Speaker 5>have and again this is a presumption, if they have

1461
01:28:41.119 --> 01:28:46.279
<v Speaker 5>a better expert outlay on how this accident could have

1462
01:28:46.399 --> 01:28:51.479
<v Speaker 5>taken place within the very limited parameters of Apple phone

1463
01:28:51.520 --> 01:28:56.960
<v Speaker 5>health data, GPS data, the key cycles, the data from

1464
01:28:57.079 --> 01:29:01.760
<v Speaker 5>the chip off of the lexus. If the Commonwealth, through

1465
01:29:01.840 --> 01:29:07.640
<v Speaker 5>its reconstruction expert can present a more credible explanation than

1466
01:29:07.680 --> 01:29:11.359
<v Speaker 5>they did in one point zero as to how her

1467
01:29:11.479 --> 01:29:14.800
<v Speaker 5>vehicle could have caused this accident, that would be a

1468
01:29:14.840 --> 01:29:17.399
<v Speaker 5>bad fact. But I just don't know it to be

1469
01:29:17.479 --> 01:29:18.039
<v Speaker 5>true yet.

1470
01:29:19.159 --> 01:29:21.600
<v Speaker 6>And then conversely, what's the plight of the prosecution.

1471
01:29:22.600 --> 01:29:26.359
<v Speaker 5>That's a good question. So the plight of the prosecution is,

1472
01:29:27.199 --> 01:29:31.000
<v Speaker 5>I mean, it's everything, it's every single thing. All of

1473
01:29:31.079 --> 01:29:35.079
<v Speaker 5>the different facts amount to reasonable doubt from a legal standpoint.

1474
01:29:35.560 --> 01:29:41.439
<v Speaker 5>So from the prosecutorial standpoint, you have got a corncopia

1475
01:29:41.880 --> 01:29:46.520
<v Speaker 5>of issues down to there's Apple phone health data that

1476
01:29:46.640 --> 01:29:51.199
<v Speaker 5>shows he surmounted he meaning John O'Keeffe surmounted, went up

1477
01:29:51.239 --> 01:29:54.279
<v Speaker 5>and down three flights of stairs. You've got the fact

1478
01:29:54.319 --> 01:30:00.760
<v Speaker 5>that Karen's vehicle hit the or connect did with his

1479
01:30:00.920 --> 01:30:06.279
<v Speaker 5>home WiFi at one Meadows by twelve thirty six am.

1480
01:30:06.399 --> 01:30:11.159
<v Speaker 5>As that is not subject to debate. That came from

1481
01:30:11.199 --> 01:30:17.000
<v Speaker 5>the testimony of the Commonwealth's own witness, Nicholas Guarino. So

1482
01:30:17.039 --> 01:30:20.279
<v Speaker 5>as far as this officer is concerned, and he's kind

1483
01:30:20.279 --> 01:30:23.399
<v Speaker 5>of entangled himself up into some other snares in the

1484
01:30:23.439 --> 01:30:28.680
<v Speaker 5>Birchmore case for example, but he puts her connected to

1485
01:30:28.760 --> 01:30:32.439
<v Speaker 5>the Wi Fi at one Meadows by twelve thirty six am.

1486
01:30:32.720 --> 01:30:36.039
<v Speaker 5>And if that's the case, there is no way unless

1487
01:30:36.039 --> 01:30:41.119
<v Speaker 5>she is Mario Andretti or someone out of a Jetson's episode,

1488
01:30:41.479 --> 01:30:45.359
<v Speaker 5>she would be able to fly her way from thirty

1489
01:30:45.359 --> 01:30:49.720
<v Speaker 5>four fair View Drive to one Meadows in a matter

1490
01:30:49.840 --> 01:30:54.520
<v Speaker 5>of minutes. And the minutes don't track with the other evidence.

1491
01:30:54.720 --> 01:30:57.600
<v Speaker 5>You know, when the other car which was driven by

1492
01:30:57.760 --> 01:31:01.199
<v Speaker 5>I want to say it was Ryan Nagel was driving,

1493
01:31:01.239 --> 01:31:04.880
<v Speaker 5>it might have been Dantano, but chat forgive me. But

1494
01:31:04.960 --> 01:31:08.359
<v Speaker 5>when they were at the scene by the time Karen

1495
01:31:08.479 --> 01:31:11.640
<v Speaker 5>was there and was spotted alone in her vehicle by

1496
01:31:11.800 --> 01:31:17.399
<v Speaker 5>three fact witnesses d'antano, Ryan Nagel and Heather Maxon being

1497
01:31:17.439 --> 01:31:20.399
<v Speaker 5>alone in that car uh and then the time that

1498
01:31:20.479 --> 01:31:24.039
<v Speaker 5>she would have left the scene and got into one meadows.

1499
01:31:24.239 --> 01:31:27.760
<v Speaker 5>It does it. It's impossible for that to have happened.

1500
01:31:28.239 --> 01:31:33.399
<v Speaker 5>Then you couple the fact that just the messier stupid facts,

1501
01:31:33.439 --> 01:31:38.239
<v Speaker 5>like the third party culprits, none of their testimony is

1502
01:31:38.439 --> 01:31:43.279
<v Speaker 5>credible on key issues ranging from why phones were discarded

1503
01:31:43.319 --> 01:31:48.760
<v Speaker 5>by Brian Albert Brian Higgins, why the same day and

1504
01:31:48.800 --> 01:31:51.840
<v Speaker 5>on the wake of news breaking at least in a

1505
01:31:51.880 --> 01:31:55.479
<v Speaker 5>small circle that their phones were going to be requested

1506
01:31:55.560 --> 01:31:56.800
<v Speaker 5>to be they got word.

1507
01:31:56.560 --> 01:31:59.000
<v Speaker 2>That there was going to be a cord order to

1508
01:31:59.079 --> 01:32:02.159
<v Speaker 2>retain their phone one day in advance. So that's the

1509
01:32:02.239 --> 01:32:04.119
<v Speaker 2>day they both got rid of their phones.

1510
01:32:04.159 --> 01:32:07.119
<v Speaker 5>Right, So the same day that happens, and it's right

1511
01:32:07.199 --> 01:32:09.159
<v Speaker 5>when they get word that it's going to happen. You've

1512
01:32:09.199 --> 01:32:13.960
<v Speaker 5>got self curated texts from Brian Higgins and a decorated dude,

1513
01:32:14.039 --> 01:32:17.640
<v Speaker 5>a self proclaimed decorated dude, you know, but you've got

1514
01:32:17.319 --> 01:32:21.439
<v Speaker 5>text texts that he curated on his own between him

1515
01:32:21.560 --> 01:32:25.600
<v Speaker 5>and the defending Karen Reid that he you know, for

1516
01:32:25.640 --> 01:32:28.479
<v Speaker 5>what it's worth. He procures them through a kiosk, a

1517
01:32:28.520 --> 01:32:32.199
<v Speaker 5>federal kiosk at the Canton Police Department, But he selected

1518
01:32:32.239 --> 01:32:34.760
<v Speaker 5>what text he was going to hand over to the

1519
01:32:34.800 --> 01:32:38.880
<v Speaker 5>investigating officers as opposed to handing over his entire phone.

1520
01:32:38.920 --> 01:32:41.880
<v Speaker 5>He knows how these investigations work, and he testified that

1521
01:32:41.960 --> 01:32:45.159
<v Speaker 5>he knows how these investigations work. So there's something suspicious there.

1522
01:32:45.439 --> 01:32:49.800
<v Speaker 5>You've got a panoply of butt dials. I mean, I

1523
01:32:49.840 --> 01:32:53.600
<v Speaker 5>don't know if the laws of physics seek to exist

1524
01:32:54.000 --> 01:32:58.079
<v Speaker 5>or the laws of telephonics seek to exist in Canton

1525
01:32:58.359 --> 01:33:01.319
<v Speaker 5>or on that night, but by my count, it was

1526
01:33:01.359 --> 01:33:05.279
<v Speaker 5>like ten different butt dials between back and forth between

1527
01:33:05.399 --> 01:33:11.920
<v Speaker 5>Brian Albert, Brian Higgins, Jennifer McCabe, John O'Keefe, to the

1528
01:33:11.960 --> 01:33:16.479
<v Speaker 5>point where technologically speaking, it certainly doesn't track because these

1529
01:33:16.520 --> 01:33:19.319
<v Speaker 5>calls would have gone to voicemail. There would have been

1530
01:33:19.319 --> 01:33:23.920
<v Speaker 5>no callbacks. I know, I'm missing very important facts.

1531
01:33:24.000 --> 01:33:28.640
<v Speaker 2>So, uh, Nicholas Borrows So the one officer in the town.

1532
01:33:29.039 --> 01:33:31.279
<v Speaker 2>I think I told you this when we spoke on

1533
01:33:31.319 --> 01:33:35.319
<v Speaker 2>the phone, Kate, that Nicholas Borrows was a Dyton police

1534
01:33:35.319 --> 01:33:38.199
<v Speaker 2>officer where Karen's mom and dad lived, which is not

1535
01:33:38.359 --> 01:33:42.159
<v Speaker 2>close to Canton, So when the state police asked him

1536
01:33:42.199 --> 01:33:45.359
<v Speaker 2>to join in the seizure of the vehicle, he described

1537
01:33:45.359 --> 01:33:49.079
<v Speaker 2>the tail light as having a crack with a piece

1538
01:33:49.119 --> 01:33:52.239
<v Speaker 2>fallen down inside. And then when they took it back

1539
01:33:52.239 --> 01:33:55.640
<v Speaker 2>to Canton and brought it to their police sally Port,

1540
01:33:56.399 --> 01:33:59.920
<v Speaker 2>the photograph. They didn't photograph the car as it sat

1541
01:34:00.359 --> 01:34:02.960
<v Speaker 2>when they seized it, they didn't have a photographer come,

1542
01:34:02.960 --> 01:34:05.560
<v Speaker 2>they didn't do any of that. They photographed it after

1543
01:34:05.720 --> 01:34:07.760
<v Speaker 2>they got it to the police sally Port, and it

1544
01:34:07.840 --> 01:34:11.920
<v Speaker 2>was a completely smashed tail light in forty five pieces.

1545
01:34:12.640 --> 01:34:16.119
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and that actually helps me DJ because now I'm

1546
01:34:16.159 --> 01:34:22.800
<v Speaker 5>remembering the other parts of the plight because not only

1547
01:34:23.119 --> 01:34:26.680
<v Speaker 5>not only that, where you have the officer from Dighton

1548
01:34:26.800 --> 01:34:29.680
<v Speaker 5>who basically said it the tail light was cracked but

1549
01:34:29.760 --> 01:34:33.640
<v Speaker 5>not completely broken, and he has no dog in this fight,

1550
01:34:33.680 --> 01:34:36.199
<v Speaker 5>I mean, and not his pig, not his farm. But

1551
01:34:36.439 --> 01:34:43.680
<v Speaker 5>the lack of documentation, whether it's photographic written in written

1552
01:34:43.760 --> 01:34:48.640
<v Speaker 5>form by law enforcement, of key pieces of evidence or

1553
01:34:48.720 --> 01:34:52.960
<v Speaker 5>key interviews of witnesses. So the fact that there were

1554
01:34:53.000 --> 01:34:56.000
<v Speaker 5>no pictures taken, like how many people just take a

1555
01:34:56.039 --> 01:34:59.079
<v Speaker 5>picture when you're pulling into a parking garage to say, okay,

1556
01:34:59.079 --> 01:35:01.319
<v Speaker 5>this is where I parked me. Remember what floram on.

1557
01:35:01.720 --> 01:35:04.479
<v Speaker 5>He didn't take a picture of the tail light. There's

1558
01:35:04.560 --> 01:35:09.680
<v Speaker 5>no picture of that tail light that is anywhere has

1559
01:35:09.720 --> 01:35:15.720
<v Speaker 5>been produced since it until after that that vehicle had

1560
01:35:15.720 --> 01:35:19.079
<v Speaker 5>been within the custody of the Massachusetts State Police. The

1561
01:35:19.159 --> 01:35:26.000
<v Speaker 5>fact that there were multiple other locations that this vehicle

1562
01:35:26.079 --> 01:35:29.479
<v Speaker 5>could have been taken and were passed by, but only

1563
01:35:29.680 --> 01:35:32.439
<v Speaker 5>was taken. It was taken further to the Canton PD,

1564
01:35:32.960 --> 01:35:34.840
<v Speaker 5>where there's a conflict of interest.

1565
01:35:35.279 --> 01:35:35.520
<v Speaker 1>Yee.

1566
01:35:35.560 --> 01:35:38.199
<v Speaker 2>That's what Clerk Jim Clown is saying here, is that

1567
01:35:38.319 --> 01:35:43.439
<v Speaker 2>although the the so because Brian Albert's brother was a

1568
01:35:43.479 --> 01:35:47.000
<v Speaker 2>detective on the camp in the Canton Police Department, and

1569
01:35:47.079 --> 01:35:48.960
<v Speaker 2>because it was a murder, so there was actually two

1570
01:35:49.039 --> 01:35:52.039
<v Speaker 2>reasons for the recusal. One is because I don't think

1571
01:35:52.439 --> 01:35:55.079
<v Speaker 2>cant and PD handles murder cases. They give it over

1572
01:35:55.399 --> 01:35:59.720
<v Speaker 2>to the detectives within the Norfolk County DA's office, which

1573
01:35:59.760 --> 01:36:00.760
<v Speaker 2>are troopers.

1574
01:36:01.079 --> 01:36:04.000
<v Speaker 1>They did not bring it to an MSP barracks.

1575
01:36:04.039 --> 01:36:07.479
<v Speaker 2>In fact, there were two closer to Dighton where they

1576
01:36:07.479 --> 01:36:10.760
<v Speaker 2>could have brought the vehicle, but instead they brought it

1577
01:36:10.800 --> 01:36:15.000
<v Speaker 2>to Canton. The one police organization that had recused itself

1578
01:36:15.199 --> 01:36:16.239
<v Speaker 2>from the investigation.

1579
01:36:16.640 --> 01:36:17.319
<v Speaker 1>And this way.

1580
01:36:17.560 --> 01:36:20.640
<v Speaker 2>I actually called Peter Murry, officer Peter Murphy today and

1581
01:36:20.720 --> 01:36:24.000
<v Speaker 2>ask him this very question, and I said they had

1582
01:36:24.039 --> 01:36:27.880
<v Speaker 2>to have called if someone from the Norfolk Diezo had

1583
01:36:27.880 --> 01:36:30.319
<v Speaker 2>have called the police barracks and those guys said, hey, man,

1584
01:36:30.640 --> 01:36:31.359
<v Speaker 2>don't bring.

1585
01:36:31.159 --> 01:36:33.800
<v Speaker 1>That car here. We know about o'keep. We don't want

1586
01:36:33.840 --> 01:36:34.600
<v Speaker 1>any part of this.

1587
01:36:35.319 --> 01:36:38.520
<v Speaker 2>And they must have been told that because they weren't

1588
01:36:38.520 --> 01:36:41.640
<v Speaker 2>going to participate in any because now we had a

1589
01:36:41.760 --> 01:36:44.439
<v Speaker 2>video expert on and she said that the video copy

1590
01:36:44.520 --> 01:36:48.600
<v Speaker 2>is not original. What Nan was referring to as the

1591
01:36:49.439 --> 01:36:52.000
<v Speaker 2>copies of the cell phones that they got. They could

1592
01:36:52.039 --> 01:36:56.479
<v Speaker 2>see that not one of them were a genuine forensic

1593
01:36:56.640 --> 01:36:57.880
<v Speaker 2>cell phone extraction.

1594
01:36:58.479 --> 01:36:59.960
<v Speaker 1>All of them had been altered.

1595
01:37:00.319 --> 01:37:03.560
<v Speaker 2>And Olivia Niles in the chat right now and she

1596
01:37:03.680 --> 01:37:06.760
<v Speaker 2>explains this better than I can. The hash values were

1597
01:37:06.800 --> 01:37:10.399
<v Speaker 2>missing and data was missing because they had been altered.

1598
01:37:10.760 --> 01:37:14.159
<v Speaker 2>That is what they turned over to the defense in

1599
01:37:14.279 --> 01:37:16.039
<v Speaker 2>August or something like that.

1600
01:37:16.560 --> 01:37:17.159
<v Speaker 1>I don't remember.

1601
01:37:17.199 --> 01:37:19.680
<v Speaker 2>It was a long time after the event. So Olivia,

1602
01:37:19.680 --> 01:37:22.880
<v Speaker 2>if you're there, you could explain hashvalag But essentially that's

1603
01:37:22.920 --> 01:37:26.119
<v Speaker 2>what happened. They monkeyed with everything from the computer on

1604
01:37:26.279 --> 01:37:31.479
<v Speaker 2>Karen's car, to the tail light, to the cell phones. Everything,

1605
01:37:31.600 --> 01:37:36.239
<v Speaker 2>it's just it it defies You just can't believe this

1606
01:37:36.319 --> 01:37:37.159
<v Speaker 2>actually happened.

1607
01:37:38.439 --> 01:37:38.720
<v Speaker 5>I know.

1608
01:37:38.880 --> 01:37:39.680
<v Speaker 1>That's all I have for you.

1609
01:37:40.000 --> 01:37:42.239
<v Speaker 5>That's so true, though, you know, it's one of those

1610
01:37:42.279 --> 01:37:45.920
<v Speaker 5>things where in trying to boil down all of the

1611
01:37:46.039 --> 01:37:49.840
<v Speaker 5>challenges that the Commonwealth has to face, there's just so

1612
01:37:50.000 --> 01:37:52.800
<v Speaker 5>many like I cannot believe all of the things that

1613
01:37:52.880 --> 01:37:56.000
<v Speaker 5>I know that I'm even forgetting, Like, thank you DJ,

1614
01:37:56.199 --> 01:38:00.399
<v Speaker 5>thank you Olivia for just adding that on. So the

1615
01:38:00.439 --> 01:38:04.439
<v Speaker 5>bigger picture of it all, Kate is it's just some

1616
01:38:04.520 --> 01:38:08.640
<v Speaker 5>of these things are on their own amount to reasonable

1617
01:38:08.680 --> 01:38:12.039
<v Speaker 5>doubt under the legal standard, and then when you put

1618
01:38:12.119 --> 01:38:15.600
<v Speaker 5>them all together, you're like, what's going on here? Which

1619
01:38:15.680 --> 01:38:17.840
<v Speaker 5>is one of the reasons why like a lawyer like

1620
01:38:17.920 --> 01:38:21.479
<v Speaker 5>myself not from that jurisdiction has among others, have chosen

1621
01:38:21.520 --> 01:38:24.640
<v Speaker 5>to speak up because we just don't see it working

1622
01:38:24.680 --> 01:38:28.600
<v Speaker 5>that way. And I'm assuming you had heard that one

1623
01:38:28.640 --> 01:38:32.640
<v Speaker 5>of the alternate jurors who didn't fit now she's working

1624
01:38:32.680 --> 01:38:36.119
<v Speaker 5>for the defense. That's a very telling to someone like me.

1625
01:38:36.720 --> 01:38:38.319
<v Speaker 5>Well I did.

1626
01:38:38.560 --> 01:38:41.760
<v Speaker 6>My last question is do you think this is going

1627
01:38:41.840 --> 01:38:44.760
<v Speaker 6>to be a precedent setting verdict. Do you think that

1628
01:38:45.279 --> 01:38:47.680
<v Speaker 6>or what is the legacy of this case?

1629
01:38:48.199 --> 01:38:53.680
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, so a precedent setting verdict. I can't say that

1630
01:38:53.880 --> 01:38:57.439
<v Speaker 5>just because if it's not I mean, if she's acquitted

1631
01:38:58.600 --> 01:39:02.239
<v Speaker 5>or she's convicted, I think it's just the conviction or

1632
01:39:02.239 --> 01:39:06.439
<v Speaker 5>the acquittal is just going to get lost in the sauce.

1633
01:39:06.520 --> 01:39:08.399
<v Speaker 5>It's going to be. The verdict is going to be

1634
01:39:08.439 --> 01:39:10.680
<v Speaker 5>what it is. But in terms of the legacy of

1635
01:39:10.720 --> 01:39:14.239
<v Speaker 5>the case, I'm hopeful she will be acquitted. So I'm

1636
01:39:14.239 --> 01:39:19.319
<v Speaker 5>going to answer your question from that perspective. When she's acquitted,

1637
01:39:20.439 --> 01:39:24.720
<v Speaker 5>when a jury applies the correct legal standard, and when

1638
01:39:24.800 --> 01:39:28.399
<v Speaker 5>there is what I describe as a future reckoning. A

1639
01:39:28.520 --> 01:39:32.760
<v Speaker 5>look back of all of the missteps down ranging from

1640
01:39:33.439 --> 01:39:36.399
<v Speaker 5>how it was investigated from the moment it was reported

1641
01:39:36.920 --> 01:39:41.520
<v Speaker 5>to the continuing investigation that went on thereafter, to the

1642
01:39:41.560 --> 01:39:46.079
<v Speaker 5>missteps in terms of the law enforcement hierarchical structure two,

1643
01:39:46.159 --> 01:39:50.640
<v Speaker 5>then the involvement by the District Attorney's office and the

1644
01:39:50.760 --> 01:39:53.600
<v Speaker 5>up charging of her when what appears to me that

1645
01:39:53.640 --> 01:39:56.760
<v Speaker 5>she wasn't going to plee and she was going to

1646
01:39:56.800 --> 01:39:59.439
<v Speaker 5>put up a fight, then she gets up charged. To

1647
01:39:59.720 --> 01:40:05.560
<v Speaker 5>the the additional factors of all of the missteps of

1648
01:40:05.680 --> 01:40:09.319
<v Speaker 5>trial one point zero and the judge. The judge factor,

1649
01:40:09.399 --> 01:40:12.800
<v Speaker 5>because this judge clearly is making rulings that are inequal

1650
01:40:13.319 --> 01:40:16.920
<v Speaker 5>to both sides and they just continue to this day.

1651
01:40:17.560 --> 01:40:20.319
<v Speaker 5>That when there is that reckoning, it is my feeling

1652
01:40:20.399 --> 01:40:24.720
<v Speaker 5>that there is going to be a complete overhaul of

1653
01:40:25.000 --> 01:40:28.319
<v Speaker 5>the law enforcement up in that neck of the woods,

1654
01:40:28.600 --> 01:40:31.520
<v Speaker 5>the Massachusetts State Police as well. And that was a

1655
01:40:31.520 --> 01:40:35.520
<v Speaker 5>good start that Trooper Proctor, former Trooper Proctor was fired,

1656
01:40:35.680 --> 01:40:39.239
<v Speaker 5>and he was fired partially in relation to his investigation

1657
01:40:39.399 --> 01:40:43.520
<v Speaker 5>and bias exhibited in this case. But in addition to that,

1658
01:40:44.079 --> 01:40:47.000
<v Speaker 5>I think there's going to be While well, I cannot

1659
01:40:47.119 --> 01:40:53.720
<v Speaker 5>forecast robust future prosecutions of those who really committed this crime, because,

1660
01:40:53.840 --> 01:40:57.199
<v Speaker 5>as we all know, when you pursue one defendant so hard,

1661
01:40:57.640 --> 01:41:00.720
<v Speaker 5>you're shooting yourself in the foot if you're wrong, because

1662
01:41:00.720 --> 01:41:05.600
<v Speaker 5>you're then giving other future potential culprits an easy person

1663
01:41:05.680 --> 01:41:09.000
<v Speaker 5>to point to and to get themselves out of future

1664
01:41:09.079 --> 01:41:12.680
<v Speaker 5>charges related to the murder or killing of John o'keef.

1665
01:41:13.479 --> 01:41:17.239
<v Speaker 5>But I think that there will be a reckoning and

1666
01:41:17.359 --> 01:41:22.000
<v Speaker 5>an overhaul of all of those systems from judiciary all

1667
01:41:22.039 --> 01:41:25.159
<v Speaker 5>the way down to law enforcement, and I hope that

1668
01:41:25.199 --> 01:41:28.039
<v Speaker 5>does happen, and I do truly hope that one day

1669
01:41:28.239 --> 01:41:32.920
<v Speaker 5>Karen decides to file a civil rights action and to

1670
01:41:33.079 --> 01:41:36.159
<v Speaker 5>point out all of the different ways that she and

1671
01:41:36.279 --> 01:41:40.000
<v Speaker 5>her due process rights have been abused throughout the course

1672
01:41:40.079 --> 01:41:45.079
<v Speaker 5>of the last three years, and ones that go far

1673
01:41:45.119 --> 01:41:49.720
<v Speaker 5>beyond the fact that she was wrongfully prosecuted, because this

1674
01:41:49.880 --> 01:41:55.479
<v Speaker 5>case also has that additional element of confirmation bias and

1675
01:41:56.520 --> 01:41:59.720
<v Speaker 5>complete violation of her civil rights as it relates to

1676
01:41:59.800 --> 01:42:07.199
<v Speaker 5>the lead investigator objectifying her and speaking with about her

1677
01:42:07.359 --> 01:42:12.199
<v Speaker 5>in such an inappropriate manner, exhibiting nothing but bias as

1678
01:42:12.239 --> 01:42:15.359
<v Speaker 5>to her, to his buddy's end, to some of his

1679
01:42:15.479 --> 01:42:20.000
<v Speaker 5>fellow law enforcement officers. So there's a different level to

1680
01:42:21.720 --> 01:42:25.359
<v Speaker 5>a future civil rights action that they all should be

1681
01:42:25.399 --> 01:42:30.039
<v Speaker 5>concerned about, but most notably former Trooper Proctor because his conduct,

1682
01:42:30.199 --> 01:42:34.000
<v Speaker 5>especially if he's not aware of this now, he should

1683
01:42:34.079 --> 01:42:37.439
<v Speaker 5>be soon, which is his conduct as it relates to

1684
01:42:37.479 --> 01:42:40.880
<v Speaker 5>how he spoke about her in those text communications, and

1685
01:42:40.920 --> 01:42:42.960
<v Speaker 5>I'm sure there were more, and I'm sure there were

1686
01:42:42.960 --> 01:42:46.239
<v Speaker 5>also private communications where he said it as well verbally.

1687
01:42:46.560 --> 01:42:51.359
<v Speaker 5>That is, those are things that are not covered by insurance.

1688
01:42:51.399 --> 01:42:55.479
<v Speaker 5>They're not uncovered by self insurance programs or captive programs

1689
01:42:55.520 --> 01:43:04.119
<v Speaker 5>that different public entities have, different municipalities have, different states have.

1690
01:43:04.600 --> 01:43:07.399
<v Speaker 5>Those are things that are wilful and wanton levels of

1691
01:43:07.479 --> 01:43:11.039
<v Speaker 5>conduct that would never be covered by insurance. So he's

1692
01:43:11.079 --> 01:43:16.239
<v Speaker 5>got a lot of personal financial exposure to her as well. Well.

1693
01:43:16.479 --> 01:43:19.720
<v Speaker 6>Thank you for letting me jump in. I think I'm

1694
01:43:19.720 --> 01:43:23.840
<v Speaker 6>gonna have I think I'm gonna have a former FBI

1695
01:43:24.039 --> 01:43:28.319
<v Speaker 6>agent on my show this week to talk about their investigations.

1696
01:43:28.399 --> 01:43:30.680
<v Speaker 6>So if you want to jump over and check out

1697
01:43:30.680 --> 01:43:34.399
<v Speaker 6>my podcast, please do so. And grateful for your time.

1698
01:43:34.640 --> 01:43:36.239
<v Speaker 6>Thank you so much, thank you.

1699
01:43:37.399 --> 01:43:40.760
<v Speaker 2>Yes, we will have you in the show notes and everything, Kate,

1700
01:43:40.880 --> 01:43:43.439
<v Speaker 2>and you on your substack as well.

1701
01:43:43.600 --> 01:43:46.680
<v Speaker 1>And oh thank you ma'am, thank you, thank you for

1702
01:43:46.760 --> 01:43:47.399
<v Speaker 1>joining by.

1703
01:43:49.640 --> 01:43:52.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's so difficult to explain you because there's so

1704
01:43:52.920 --> 01:43:57.880
<v Speaker 2>many elements of this case, you know, I we hadn't

1705
01:43:57.880 --> 01:44:01.880
<v Speaker 2>even gotten to how the uh I think her name

1706
01:44:01.920 --> 01:44:05.640
<v Speaker 2>was Katie McLoughlin was a fan of Caitlin Albert and

1707
01:44:05.800 --> 01:44:07.680
<v Speaker 2>is the one that says I heard her say I

1708
01:44:07.760 --> 01:44:10.279
<v Speaker 2>did it. So there's just so many elements to this

1709
01:44:10.359 --> 01:44:14.000
<v Speaker 2>that that it's just uh, can you check and see

1710
01:44:14.000 --> 01:44:14.960
<v Speaker 2>what's dropped by better?

1711
01:44:15.079 --> 01:44:19.239
<v Speaker 5>Oh, oh, that's right, I still haven't seen I didn't

1712
01:44:19.279 --> 01:44:20.880
<v Speaker 5>look at that while I've been streaming.

1713
01:44:21.720 --> 01:44:26.520
<v Speaker 2>I appreciate you n CSHP retire. We're about out of time.

1714
01:44:26.560 --> 01:44:30.399
<v Speaker 2>We're very appreciative of Nan giving so much of her

1715
01:44:30.399 --> 01:44:34.439
<v Speaker 2>time to us tonight, and I appreciate all your questions.

1716
01:44:34.520 --> 01:44:38.399
<v Speaker 2>The super chats, the gifts of the memberships is really cool.

1717
01:44:38.479 --> 01:44:42.479
<v Speaker 2>This is probably like the most energetic episode we've had

1718
01:44:42.640 --> 01:44:43.760
<v Speaker 2>in months.

1719
01:44:43.479 --> 01:44:45.159
<v Speaker 1>Probably really so yeah.

1720
01:44:45.239 --> 01:44:47.800
<v Speaker 2>I mean, let me tell you, I don't know. I

1721
01:44:47.840 --> 01:44:50.439
<v Speaker 2>haven't seen these kind of numbers. It's been a while,

1722
01:44:50.520 --> 01:44:53.720
<v Speaker 2>so you're definitely drawing them in Nan despite the fact.

1723
01:44:53.800 --> 01:44:55.439
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, thank you so much.

1724
01:44:55.960 --> 01:44:59.119
<v Speaker 5>Thanks everyone for joining. But you guys should show up

1725
01:44:59.159 --> 01:45:01.880
<v Speaker 5>all the time for all beings, whether I'm here or not.

1726
01:45:02.119 --> 01:45:03.680
<v Speaker 5>These two are sweethearts.

1727
01:45:05.039 --> 01:45:07.800
<v Speaker 1>We really appreciate you. I know that you know you're

1728
01:45:07.840 --> 01:45:09.079
<v Speaker 1>a very wanted commodity.

1729
01:45:09.119 --> 01:45:12.880
<v Speaker 2>I know you've already appeared on air today and the

1730
01:45:12.960 --> 01:45:16.159
<v Speaker 2>community here, all these folks in here, I'm seeing them

1731
01:45:16.159 --> 01:45:19.479
<v Speaker 2>in lemon pickets, timely manner are new.

1732
01:45:19.399 --> 01:45:21.439
<v Speaker 1>Cat, I'm retired teacher.

1733
01:45:21.479 --> 01:45:25.319
<v Speaker 2>There's so many of you, AJK, You've been incredibly incredibly

1734
01:45:25.359 --> 01:45:28.520
<v Speaker 2>generous tonight. All of us appreciate what you've done, man,

1735
01:45:28.840 --> 01:45:30.399
<v Speaker 2>because without you, we.

1736
01:45:30.359 --> 01:45:32.479
<v Speaker 1>Don't understand what the hell's going on in this case.

1737
01:45:32.920 --> 01:45:37.439
<v Speaker 5>Thank god. Oll. I plan to keep showing up, maybe

1738
01:45:37.479 --> 01:45:40.359
<v Speaker 5>not so much on YouTube, but people should ask if

1739
01:45:40.439 --> 01:45:45.039
<v Speaker 5>I'm around and enable and motivated, I'm happy to pop in,

1740
01:45:45.119 --> 01:45:49.560
<v Speaker 5>and definitely if anyone is interested. I'm quite active on

1741
01:45:49.600 --> 01:45:53.239
<v Speaker 5>Twitter and on like a it's more of like a

1742
01:45:53.319 --> 01:45:57.520
<v Speaker 5>Facebook page, not my personal Facebook, so if anyone wants

1743
01:45:57.560 --> 01:46:02.600
<v Speaker 5>to follow my thoughts there, but otherwise, let's just all

1744
01:46:02.760 --> 01:46:06.680
<v Speaker 5>be on the same team and work together and watch

1745
01:46:06.720 --> 01:46:10.159
<v Speaker 5>and support and spread the word because Karen needs all

1746
01:46:10.159 --> 01:46:12.560
<v Speaker 5>the help she's going to get. You know, she needs it.

1747
01:46:13.039 --> 01:46:14.760
<v Speaker 1>She does, she does.

1748
01:46:14.800 --> 01:46:19.800
<v Speaker 2>Anybody I don't know that, you know, emotionally or mentally, me,

1749
01:46:20.000 --> 01:46:23.079
<v Speaker 2>myself or a lot of us could handle what she has,

1750
01:46:23.319 --> 01:46:28.039
<v Speaker 2>knowing how dishonest and how they're really just trying to

1751
01:46:28.119 --> 01:46:30.239
<v Speaker 2>ruin her because they know they can't convict her.

1752
01:46:30.960 --> 01:46:32.439
<v Speaker 1>They don't have the evidence.

1753
01:46:32.039 --> 01:46:34.000
<v Speaker 2>To get that, to get twelve people to say that,

1754
01:46:34.399 --> 01:46:38.079
<v Speaker 2>unless they literally hire twelve people, they're not going to

1755
01:46:38.159 --> 01:46:41.840
<v Speaker 2>get that. So, yeah, she's carrying a heavy load, and

1756
01:46:42.039 --> 01:46:45.319
<v Speaker 2>people like you and you know Beatrice here help her

1757
01:46:45.399 --> 01:46:46.640
<v Speaker 2>kind of bear that load.

1758
01:46:46.800 --> 01:46:50.199
<v Speaker 3>So Nan, can I ask you one final question?

1759
01:46:50.920 --> 01:46:53.439
<v Speaker 5>Do you think there's anything.

1760
01:46:53.319 --> 01:46:56.560
<v Speaker 4>Odd about the fact that she's pushing for this set

1761
01:46:56.600 --> 01:47:03.000
<v Speaker 4>of April first jury pool? You find it anything wonky there?

1762
01:47:03.600 --> 01:47:09.479
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I do, because every attorney who does trial work,

1763
01:47:09.640 --> 01:47:14.399
<v Speaker 5>whether it's civil or criminal, will tell you in normal jurisdictions,

1764
01:47:14.800 --> 01:47:18.199
<v Speaker 5>everything's fungible. So even if Karen needs to have her

1765
01:47:18.279 --> 01:47:23.079
<v Speaker 5>trial her retrial before July first to comport with mistrial

1766
01:47:23.159 --> 01:47:25.920
<v Speaker 5>rules up there. Even if that's true, and I've only

1767
01:47:25.920 --> 01:47:28.199
<v Speaker 5>heard that to be true, I didn't read the statue,

1768
01:47:28.279 --> 01:47:31.840
<v Speaker 5>but let's assume that's true. There's time between April first

1769
01:47:31.920 --> 01:47:35.560
<v Speaker 5>and July first for that to take place. But beyond

1770
01:47:35.600 --> 01:47:39.760
<v Speaker 5>that they can. It seems a little suspicious that she

1771
01:47:39.840 --> 01:47:43.479
<v Speaker 5>wants this jury pool in by in an April first

1772
01:47:43.479 --> 01:47:46.720
<v Speaker 5>start date, But many attorneys will tell you you can

1773
01:47:46.760 --> 01:47:50.800
<v Speaker 5>bring those jurors in and you can stagger them, and

1774
01:47:50.880 --> 01:47:53.439
<v Speaker 5>you can even tell them report back on May first.

1775
01:47:53.600 --> 01:47:56.800
<v Speaker 5>You can tell them report back on May fifteenth, so

1776
01:47:57.000 --> 01:48:01.920
<v Speaker 5>you're not wasting the jurors. Feel like it seems a

1777
01:48:01.960 --> 01:48:07.000
<v Speaker 5>little pushed for me, a little too, sus As my

1778
01:48:07.119 --> 01:48:10.520
<v Speaker 5>kids say, you know something sus about that. I can't

1779
01:48:10.520 --> 01:48:14.319
<v Speaker 5>put my finger on it, but yeah, she wants to

1780
01:48:14.319 --> 01:48:17.560
<v Speaker 5>go to her cottage, as I've heard her somewhat cottage.

1781
01:48:17.960 --> 01:48:21.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's that. You could see the way she thinks.

1782
01:48:22.079 --> 01:48:25.239
<v Speaker 2>She thinks not like the best of civil servants, but

1783
01:48:25.359 --> 01:48:30.920
<v Speaker 2>like the worst, the laziest sort of connotation of civil servants,

1784
01:48:30.920 --> 01:48:33.760
<v Speaker 2>and thinks about stuff, you know, these long launch breaks

1785
01:48:33.800 --> 01:48:37.079
<v Speaker 2>and you know, just making people jump to her thing

1786
01:48:37.159 --> 01:48:40.239
<v Speaker 2>because she can not being a servant of the people.

1787
01:48:40.359 --> 01:48:43.199
<v Speaker 2>Is like, Okay, I'll stay late so that this this,

1788
01:48:43.600 --> 01:48:46.600
<v Speaker 2>so that we can hear all these motions today, I

1789
01:48:46.640 --> 01:48:49.199
<v Speaker 2>can make a ruling from the bench and then maybe

1790
01:48:49.239 --> 01:48:51.920
<v Speaker 2>these people can go back to Los Angeles and that

1791
01:48:52.039 --> 01:48:55.000
<v Speaker 2>this defendant doesn't have to shell out more money. Bev

1792
01:48:55.079 --> 01:48:58.079
<v Speaker 2>cares about Bev and she is not fooling anybody.

1793
01:48:58.159 --> 01:48:58.760
<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry.

1794
01:48:58.920 --> 01:49:01.680
<v Speaker 5>I mean that may be it. I've even heard there's

1795
01:49:01.720 --> 01:49:05.439
<v Speaker 5>suspicions that there are plants, you know, people, I was

1796
01:49:05.439 --> 01:49:09.199
<v Speaker 5>getting that people planted in this jury pool. I don't know.

1797
01:49:09.439 --> 01:49:15.439
<v Speaker 5>Conspiracy theorists might be able to better articulate it for me.

1798
01:49:15.640 --> 01:49:18.319
<v Speaker 5>Other it might be she wants her summer. It might

1799
01:49:18.359 --> 01:49:21.359
<v Speaker 5>be there's planted people in the pool. It might be

1800
01:49:21.960 --> 01:49:25.359
<v Speaker 5>a whole slew of different factors. What I can tell

1801
01:49:25.399 --> 01:49:28.640
<v Speaker 5>you is I know, as other lawyers do that in

1802
01:49:28.680 --> 01:49:31.920
<v Speaker 5>the real legal world, this trial did not have to

1803
01:49:31.960 --> 01:49:35.840
<v Speaker 5>take place April first. So it just feels unnatural to

1804
01:49:35.920 --> 01:49:40.760
<v Speaker 5>me and inflexible, especially when, at least up until a

1805
01:49:40.760 --> 01:49:45.039
<v Speaker 5>few days ago, there were pending appeals of her convictions

1806
01:49:45.119 --> 01:49:47.560
<v Speaker 5>and I have heard, although I didn't see that, she

1807
01:49:47.840 --> 01:49:49.800
<v Speaker 5>Karen may want to go to the Supreme Court and

1808
01:49:49.880 --> 01:49:53.479
<v Speaker 5>apply for cert before the Supreme Court, which you know,

1809
01:49:53.720 --> 01:49:55.800
<v Speaker 5>I'm not saying. There's a lot of hope to be

1810
01:49:55.920 --> 01:50:00.319
<v Speaker 5>held in that avenue, but something just doesn't ad up

1811
01:50:00.359 --> 01:50:01.960
<v Speaker 5>be as far as I'm concerned.

1812
01:50:03.720 --> 01:50:07.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, ladies and gentlemen, Thank you, mods, Thank you guests

1813
01:50:07.720 --> 01:50:09.960
<v Speaker 2>on behalf of Nan Gallagher BIA.

1814
01:50:10.640 --> 01:50:16.239
<v Speaker 1>This is DJ and calling all beings guys, see you

1815
01:50:16.279 --> 01:50:16.840
<v Speaker 1>down the road.

1816
01:50:17.359 --> 01:50:19.960
<v Speaker 5>Thanks guys. Everyone has a great night. It's been a

1817
01:50:20.000 --> 01:50:23.439
<v Speaker 5>pleasure being here and keep showing up. Thank you, love

1818
01:50:23.800 --> 01:50:24.359
<v Speaker 5>bye guys.