WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>Oh, just content warning up top. We talked about all

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<v Speaker 1>kinds of things in this sex of course. Things may

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<v Speaker 1>not want to eat things you might.

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<v Speaker 2>It gets gross, it's discussed. What can I tell you enjoy?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh hey, so it's your friend who offered you a mint,

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<v Speaker 2>and now you're overthinking?

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<v Speaker 1>Why Ali Ward? Here we are.

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<v Speaker 2>We're about to experience something together. It guess wild friends

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<v Speaker 2>come along. This is one that's been sitting in.

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<v Speaker 1>The stacks for a bit.

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<v Speaker 2>It's kind of been fermenting because it was recorded over

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<v Speaker 2>the summer, right before I got really sick, and getting

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<v Speaker 2>into it this week I realized I had forgotten how

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<v Speaker 2>absolutely unhinged this one is in terms of subject matter,

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<v Speaker 2>like you're in for a treat, you'in.

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<v Speaker 1>For a treat. But first, thank you to Patreon.

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<v Speaker 2>You've submitted thoughtful questions for this revolting romp, and to

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<v Speaker 2>join you could submit your questions before our interviews to

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<v Speaker 2>stop over to patreon dot com slash ologies, where it

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<v Speaker 2>costs one hot dollar a.

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<v Speaker 1>Month to join.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you also to everyone wearing ologies merch from ologies

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<v Speaker 2>merch dot also said note thanks for all the really

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<v Speaker 2>really really sweet supportive messages after last week's field trip

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<v Speaker 2>episode of my getting surgery. It ran more to me

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<v Speaker 2>than you know. And I even got some notes in

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<v Speaker 2>our reviews. And to prove that I read every review,

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<v Speaker 2>I pick a fresh, non rotting one each week, such

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<v Speaker 2>as this one from r n rg LSLC, who said,

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<v Speaker 2>love the theme song, love the tangents and secrets, love

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<v Speaker 2>the rawness. I love that review, r nrg LSLC. And

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<v Speaker 2>thank you to everyone who left reviews, including another user

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<v Speaker 2>by the name of Poopoop Peepe, who is right on

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<v Speaker 2>target for this episode. Because disgustology, it's a real term.

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<v Speaker 2>It stems from the word gusto, which is taste, so

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<v Speaker 2>it means a distaste or to put off one's appetite.

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<v Speaker 2>So if you are hoping to stop snacking for at

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<v Speaker 2>least an hour, you have arrived at the right place.

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<v Speaker 2>I interviewed a Harvard trained cultural psychologist who is now

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<v Speaker 2>a professor at University of Pennsylvania. I got myself to

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<v Speaker 2>this beautiful building in the heart of the metropolis, and

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<v Speaker 2>I was warmly invited into his high rise home.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh what a great building.

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<v Speaker 1>Should I take my shoes off?

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<v Speaker 4>What a bed? Oh my gosh.

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<v Speaker 2>His windows were a panoramic vista cast in blue gray

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<v Speaker 2>as this afternoon summer thunderstorm churned over the city.

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<v Speaker 3>What's cozy for you?

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<v Speaker 4>Anything you like?

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<v Speaker 2>So I got settled in a deep chair next to

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<v Speaker 2>the couch and we had a lovely, just casual kind

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<v Speaker 2>of chit chat about spit, body training, fork sharing, spoiled meat, senophobia, sex, kinks,

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<v Speaker 2>funereal experiments, perfume that you may or may not want

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<v Speaker 2>to buy food you may not want to eat, the

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<v Speaker 2>aic nipples, world War two, and so much more. It

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<v Speaker 2>gets spicy, So face your fears and get to know

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<v Speaker 2>the emotion that keeps you alive with psychology professor, researcher,

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<v Speaker 2>lauded expert, and he who bears the title officially of disgustologist,

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<v Speaker 2>doctor Paul Rodnon.

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<v Speaker 5>My first name is pretty Easy's Paul. Her last name

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<v Speaker 5>is Rosen, my Russian name. My father came from from

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<v Speaker 5>Bellow Goose. When he came to Ellis Island, my father said,

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<v Speaker 5>I want my Russian name.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh so I.

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<v Speaker 4>Don't have the same name as many of my.

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<v Speaker 2>Relatives, but you can call him doctor disgusted.

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<v Speaker 1>Several news outlets have so in.

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<v Speaker 5>Setting emotion, disgust turns out to be very convenient toilet training,

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<v Speaker 5>which is a very interesting things essential issue of Freud,

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<v Speaker 5>but it's disgusting. There's two things. People don't want to

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<v Speaker 5>set anything Freud was interested in, because you know, we've

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<v Speaker 5>gotten past him. He wasn't really a scientist and we're

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<v Speaker 5>a real science now. I mean, it's a fascinating area

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<v Speaker 5>where he takes something that kids love.

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<v Speaker 4>They love poop.

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<v Speaker 5>Do you get them to hate it? We're really upset

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<v Speaker 5>by it. And that's an amazing transformation. Yeah, and nobody's

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<v Speaker 5>really seriously looked at that.

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<v Speaker 2>Do you think that in psychology people think of Freud

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<v Speaker 2>as a contaminant and they don't want that contagion of

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<v Speaker 2>being a sci Well.

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<v Speaker 5>I'm not quite sure he's a contaminant, but certainly they

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<v Speaker 5>don't want to be associated with Freud because Freud was

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<v Speaker 5>not a scientist. He had a lot of interesting ideas,

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<v Speaker 5>he didn't pursue them as a scientific well, he thought

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<v Speaker 5>of himself as a scientist. By the way, the psychology

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<v Speaker 5>has been fighting to be called a science ever since.

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<v Speaker 5>I've been in the field since the middle of the

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<v Speaker 5>twentieth century, and they wanted to be with biology and chemistry,

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<v Speaker 5>not with sociology. And anthropology, and shedding Freud was part

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<v Speaker 5>of that. I wrote this paper on the seven poles

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<v Speaker 5>of the body and how the psychology will each told.

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<v Speaker 2>For more on this, you can see doctor Rosin's two

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<v Speaker 2>thousand and seven address exploring the Landscape of Modern Academic Psychology,

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<v Speaker 2>Finding and Filling the Holes, in which he explains, in

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<v Speaker 2>the presence of holes, the clear demarcation between self and

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<v Speaker 2>others is blurred, and each bodily hole offers both vulnerability

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<v Speaker 2>and promise. Which is so true for what is our

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<v Speaker 2>bodily self without access to that which surrounds us, without

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<v Speaker 2>a hole for snacks, our bodies really hungry and probably dead.

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<v Speaker 5>I did one study showing that medical students that sus

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<v Speaker 5>sect the cadaver. Oh okay, So after they dissect the cadaver,

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<v Speaker 5>they're much less disgusted by cadavers, huh okay, But they're

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<v Speaker 5>not less disgusted.

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<v Speaker 4>By fresh dead bodies. Really, it's very specific.

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<v Speaker 2>Shall we enjoy reading from the book of Cambridge University

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<v Speaker 2>Press twenty twenty three titled Hedonic adaptation is specific habituation

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<v Speaker 2>to discuss slash death elicitors as a result of dissecting

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<v Speaker 2>a cadaver, so In this, Paul writes that by using

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<v Speaker 2>the discussed scale as a metric, they find a significant

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<v Speaker 2>reduction in discuss responses to death and quote body envelope

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<v Speaker 2>violation elicitors don't know what that means, but I can imagine.

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<v Speaker 2>So maggots or a dirty kleenex might still be gross

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<v Speaker 2>to a med student, but a cold corpse just becomes

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<v Speaker 2>no biggie. So if you're scared of doing something new,

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<v Speaker 2>like taking the bus or wearing baggier but more fashionable pants,

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<v Speaker 2>just think, with exposure therapy, we can get more comfy

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<v Speaker 2>slicing into dead people.

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<v Speaker 1>So try the pants, do it? You got this?

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<v Speaker 2>Have you ever had to interview anyone that works at

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<v Speaker 2>a morgue and see why they're able to eat their

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<v Speaker 2>lunch around dead bodies, whereas well another person would.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, first of all, some people can't do that, Okay,

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<v Speaker 5>but they're not like you to become workers in morgues,

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<v Speaker 5>of course.

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<v Speaker 1>Good point.

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<v Speaker 5>So you have a lot of selection. But people get

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<v Speaker 5>used to almost everything, that's the story. You get used

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<v Speaker 5>to it all kinds of getting old. Yeah, and you

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<v Speaker 5>get used to the environment you're in. I had a

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<v Speaker 5>case where I we were doing a discuss study one

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<v Speaker 5>of my favorite studies, and we were looking at actual

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<v Speaker 5>exposure to real discuss things with people. Our instructions were

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<v Speaker 5>we had thirty two tasks I think, yeah them to do.

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<v Speaker 5>One of them was take a glass and spit in it,

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<v Speaker 5>and then would you drink the glass?

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<v Speaker 1>Even though that's it was just in my mouth. I

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<v Speaker 1>don't want to do that, that's right.

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<v Speaker 4>Isn't that interesting? But yeah, it was just in your mouth? Okay.

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<v Speaker 5>And we got a freshly cut pig's head with a

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<v Speaker 5>butcher and we said, we have a pighead in the refrigerator.

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<v Speaker 5>Would you be willing to pull it out and look

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<v Speaker 5>at it?

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 5>Would you be willing to touch it? Would you be willing

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<v Speaker 5>to stick a pin in its eye? And we asked

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<v Speaker 5>that people listen.

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<v Speaker 4>People didn't. Some people didn't. Then we said, no problem,

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<v Speaker 4>you don't do it. Fine.

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<v Speaker 2>More on human relationships with animals in terms of food

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<v Speaker 2>not other stuff in a bit.

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<v Speaker 4>And we had them do all these crazy things.

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<v Speaker 5>We also had a starter's pistol, but we showed them

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<v Speaker 5>what it was and there's no bullets in it.

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<v Speaker 4>Would you hold it to your head and pull the trigger? No?

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<v Speaker 5>No, So we had all these dead tasks. We had

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<v Speaker 5>a Nazi, a true Nazi hat from World War Two,

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<v Speaker 5>and we said would you look at it, would you

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<v Speaker 5>touch it?

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<v Speaker 4>Would you put it on your head? Oh? Boy? Okay.

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<v Speaker 4>So we went through this whole thing and one thing

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<v Speaker 4>we wanted to do was get ashes, cremated ashes. Okay,

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<v Speaker 4>everything we gave them was absolutely true. We said, everything

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<v Speaker 4>was what the Nazi at was a real Nazi at.

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<v Speaker 4>And we decided we couldn't really do cremated ashes.

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<v Speaker 1>People donate their bodies.

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<v Speaker 5>But we did want to get something that looked just

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<v Speaker 5>like it. So we went through a crematorium a student.

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<v Speaker 1>That I field trip.

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<v Speaker 5>And we visited the guy who does this and we

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<v Speaker 5>explained what we wanted and he said, oh, he said,

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<v Speaker 5>you want to see cremated ashes.

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<v Speaker 4>And he said yeah.

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<v Speaker 5>He said oh, come here, and he had this boom

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<v Speaker 5>full of you know, like shoe boxes filled with creamade.

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<v Speaker 5>He says, here's one, here's another one, and he started

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<v Speaker 5>showing us if like he was selling them to us. Okay,

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<v Speaker 5>and he was so thrilled. No one had ever come

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<v Speaker 5>to him and said, I want to see what you do.

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<v Speaker 5>He said, you want to see your body burning? And

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<v Speaker 5>he went on this whole thing, and we learned from

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<v Speaker 5>him how to make from a dog bone mash a

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<v Speaker 5>dog round bone, and some a couple of things how

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<v Speaker 5>we could make it look.

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<v Speaker 2>So instead of someone's abandoned cremaines, they opted for mashed

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<v Speaker 2>up beef bones from a pet food store. And maybe

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<v Speaker 2>they got creative with like some fireplace ash or some

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<v Speaker 2>corn starch or something. But it was a convincing craft project,

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<v Speaker 2>and we got an urn.

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<v Speaker 5>We bought an urn from him, so we have this

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<v Speaker 5>thing which we said with cremated ashes. It's the only

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<v Speaker 5>lie we told. And we asked people where they look

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<v Speaker 5>at the urn, where they open the urn, where they

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<v Speaker 5>touched the ashes with their hands.

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<v Speaker 4>So we had people doing all these things, and we

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<v Speaker 4>measured how willing they were to do it. And we

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<v Speaker 4>had previously they had already taken the discussed.

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<v Speaker 5>Scale months before, so we had measures of an indirect measure,

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<v Speaker 5>and now we had a direct measure about disgust, and

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<v Speaker 5>so we could compare them.

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<v Speaker 4>And the interesting thing.

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<v Speaker 5>About the study is after the study was over, there

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<v Speaker 5>they've been do all these things.

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<v Speaker 4>People said this was terrific.

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<v Speaker 5>They would say, I want to get my friends to

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<v Speaker 5>do this because you know, the sort of playing.

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<v Speaker 4>With disgust that's safe. Yeah, sort of actually sort of fun.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, it's like Halloween is a hunted house to them,

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<v Speaker 2>but with real disgusting.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, that's right.

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<v Speaker 5>So that's one of the interesting things about Discuss that

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<v Speaker 5>it's always interested me is how central it is in humor. Oh,

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<v Speaker 5>for sure, all these discussed jokes. I mean there's loads

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<v Speaker 5>of them.

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<v Speaker 2>Toilet humor got its name for a reason. Toilet humor schatological.

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<v Speaker 5>That's right, and people can laugh at it as long

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<v Speaker 5>as it isn't in their face. That is, they're not

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<v Speaker 5>facing the discuss, right, somebody else is.

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<v Speaker 2>And if you'd like more on everything from chuckles to

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<v Speaker 2>hysterics to roast comedy and slapstick. Early in ologies, I

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<v Speaker 2>interviewed doctor Lieberg, who's a renowned professor and a gelatologist

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<v Speaker 2>who studies laughter's effect on the body. And he says

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<v Speaker 2>he's the guy who's serious about studying comedy, and he's

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<v Speaker 2>not wrong, and he's a darling. Going back a little

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<v Speaker 2>bit in terms of defining disgust, is discussed an emotion?

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<v Speaker 2>Is it a reaction? Where does disgust fall in the

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<v Speaker 2>spectrum of things that we can feel. How is it classified?

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<v Speaker 5>Well, it's classified as an emotion, and it's even classified

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<v Speaker 5>as one of the big six emotions in psychology along

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<v Speaker 5>with fear, anger, said, happy, surprise. I don't like that

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<v Speaker 5>when I discussed and there are there are the taxonomies

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<v Speaker 5>as an Indian taxonomy which has ten emotions, but discussed

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<v Speaker 5>as one of those two.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's explore a few extra emotions via the turn of

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<v Speaker 2>the century two thousand paper exploring Hindu Indian emotional expressions

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<v Speaker 2>Evidence for accurate recognition by Americans and Indians, which list

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<v Speaker 2>the culturally recognized emotions. This is via a rough translation

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<v Speaker 2>from the Sanskrit as get ready for this anger, disgust, fear, heroism,

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<v Speaker 2>humor or, amusement, love, peace, sadness, shame or embarrassment, and wonder.

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<v Speaker 2>I love that range, and I also love that wonder

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<v Speaker 2>is an emotion. I'm just I'm in wonder about that.

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<v Speaker 2>And I got to say, if you're not familiar with

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<v Speaker 2>the emotions wheel, look it up.

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<v Speaker 1>It's this thing. It's like a color wheel.

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<v Speaker 2>But it has Western psychologies recognized six emotions, which are fear, anger,

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<v Speaker 2>discusst surprise, happiness, and sadness. With these subsets and variations

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<v Speaker 2>under each of them, like underhappy, there's peaceful, or remorse

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<v Speaker 2>is undersad and discussed emotions can vary from judgmental to

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<v Speaker 2>hesitant or disappointed. And if you must know, I have

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<v Speaker 2>a laminated copy of this wheel up in my office,

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<v Speaker 2>and I also purchased a throw pillow for the couch.

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<v Speaker 2>And if Jarrett and I are pissy to each other,

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<v Speaker 2>we literally bust out the emotion's wheel pillow and we

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<v Speaker 2>point to what we're really feeling, which is, honestly usually fear,

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<v Speaker 2>which has underlying feelings of anxious, inadequate.

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<v Speaker 1>Or even overwhelmed. How about that?

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<v Speaker 2>And surprise emotions can include amazed or awestruck, startled or

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<v Speaker 2>shocked or dismayed. Now, so what if you hate surprises?

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<v Speaker 2>What if you hate I'm not one of those people,

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<v Speaker 2>but some personality psychologists say that this is in line

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<v Speaker 2>with higher prefrontal cortex activity in a part of the

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<v Speaker 2>brain called the anterior cingulate gyrus, which handles thinky tasks

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<v Speaker 2>like decision making and attention to deal and avoiding mistakes.

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<v Speaker 2>And according to this book, you happier. These types of

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<v Speaker 2>folks who hate surprises tend to be a little more stubborn,

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<v Speaker 2>but they like routines and they have a lot of perseverance.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe they're a little more anxious, maybe they hang on

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<v Speaker 2>to grudges, but they really get shit done. And for

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<v Speaker 2>more on personality psychology, we have an excellent episode with

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<v Speaker 2>doctor Semine Vizier, which I hope surprises you with energetic

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<v Speaker 2>awe and amazement and eager astonishment. According to the wheel

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<v Speaker 2>that I just looked up, but let's roll on backwards

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<v Speaker 2>to discuss.

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<v Speaker 5>So it's got most of the properties of an emotion.

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<v Speaker 5>It's got a facial expression, and that's clear. It's an

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<v Speaker 5>acute feeling. You don't feel disgusted for a month, you

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<v Speaker 5>feel disgusted. It's almost always tied to some events.

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<v Speaker 1>And where does that facial expression come from.

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<v Speaker 5>I think discussed is originally about rejecting offensive foods. That's

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<v Speaker 5>where it starts, and that's how I think where we

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<v Speaker 5>see it first and children, and it's closing of the nose,

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<v Speaker 5>opening in the mouth, gaping sometimes thinking your tongue out.

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<v Speaker 5>That's all getting rid of things. It's expelling it.

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<v Speaker 2>And you're closing off your palette really right to not

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<v Speaker 2>let anything down there.

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<v Speaker 4>You're basically spitting out or closing it off. That's right.

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<v Speaker 5>So that's what it looks like, and that's that is

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<v Speaker 5>functionally what it is. Now when you say, when you

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<v Speaker 5>show that there's something else, like I say Adolf Hitler, people, well,

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<v Speaker 5>that's of course an extension of that same discussion.

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<v Speaker 4>It's not about eating Hitler, but it's the same system

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<v Speaker 4>that's applied to moral things.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, how can you tell that that is discussed and

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<v Speaker 2>not anger, say, for example, well.

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<v Speaker 4>Okay, so first of all, anger is an approach emotion.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh what's an approach emotion?

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<v Speaker 4>The emotion that.

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<v Speaker 5>When you experience it, you want to engage with whatever

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<v Speaker 5>stimulated you're angry at it, whereas discussed is a withdrawal emotion.

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<v Speaker 5>So it's very different. It's the opposite. They're both negative,

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<v Speaker 5>but one is a negative approach, the other is a

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<v Speaker 5>negative withdrawal. Now there is some overlap and the facial

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<v Speaker 5>because this disgust thing also bears your teeth.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, you're right.

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<v Speaker 4>One anger face is also a disgust space, and this

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<v Speaker 4>a disgust space is not at.

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<v Speaker 2>All aga and that's just you're not bearing your teeth,

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<v Speaker 2>you're just tongue out let's turn our attention briefly to

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<v Speaker 2>the varieties of disgust faces and the structure of disgust,

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<v Speaker 2>which was co authored by Yes doctor Paul Rowson. In it,

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<v Speaker 2>you're going to learn that the nose wrinkle is associated

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<v Speaker 2>with either irritating or offensive smells and to some extent,

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<v Speaker 2>bad tastes and gape and tongue excrusion like are associated

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<v Speaker 2>with food offense, disgust, and oral irritation. But a raised

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<v Speaker 2>upper lip correlates to boundary violations like bodily or personal

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<v Speaker 2>space or certain moral offenses, and so humans evolve these

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<v Speaker 2>signals way back prehistorically, and this study was authored just

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<v Speaker 2>a scant thirty years ago by Paul. But I'm thinking

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<v Speaker 2>with the number of like selfie camera monologues we deliver

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<v Speaker 2>to AI equipped social media biometric capturing platforms, I'm sure

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<v Speaker 2>we have more data than we could ever use to

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<v Speaker 2>analyze just what our faces are doing when we're grossed out.

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<v Speaker 2>Someone out there, work with an evil social media company

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<v Speaker 2>and figure this out. They'll do it for the sake

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<v Speaker 2>of profit and coercion. You might not even have to

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<v Speaker 2>get a grant. Just thinking about that curls my lip the.

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<v Speaker 5>Up raised upper lip is part of both anger and discussed.

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<v Speaker 5>When discussed is a moral reaction to like Adolf Hitler.

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<v Speaker 5>It's sometimes difficult to distinguish from anger because psychologically you're

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<v Speaker 5>disgusted by Hitler, but you also want.

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<v Speaker 1>To hit them, right.

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<v Speaker 2>Ah, that's an interesting notion. Is it discussed? Is it

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<v Speaker 2>a lot about threat abatement? Is it really your Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>it's a threat.

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<v Speaker 4>You could say it's a threat, but it's not a

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<v Speaker 4>threat that's that's direct it at you. So it's one

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<v Speaker 4>that you can withdraw up up. Here's an example. If

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<v Speaker 4>you're watching someone on the street, the dressed in a

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<v Speaker 4>formal wear, a man and a woman, and the man

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<v Speaker 4>steps in dog do on the street, that's really funny.

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<v Speaker 4>But if you step in dog dough.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a funny funny Oh not funny.

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<v Speaker 2>I will say that it matters profoundly who steps in it,

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<v Speaker 2>and if I hate them, And if it's like a

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<v Speaker 2>sweet couple that celebrated their anniversary because it might be

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<v Speaker 2>the last one before one of them dies because they

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<v Speaker 2>have cancer, and like the nice man wants to take

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<v Speaker 2>his beautiful wife out to this special dinner as she

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<v Speaker 2>feels like herself in a wig and a fancy dress,

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<v Speaker 2>and then he steps and dog to you, left by

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<v Speaker 2>some jerk who doesn't clean up after his expensive purebred

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<v Speaker 2>dog from a backyard breeder. Then no, that's not very funny,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm having too many emotions. But yeah, let's suppose

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<v Speaker 2>that the pooh stepper. Let's just pretend that that is

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<v Speaker 2>your childhood bully who you later dated, but then they

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<v Speaker 2>cheated on you with your boss, and the two of

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<v Speaker 2>them are going to fancy dinner using your stolen credit card,

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<v Speaker 2>and then one of them stepped in doc dow and

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<v Speaker 2>you see it from across the street because you're hiding

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<v Speaker 2>in a bush getting video footage for a court case.

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<v Speaker 2>That's funny and why Okay, so I look this up

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<v Speaker 2>in terms of humor theory, this example, this one example

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<v Speaker 2>touches on a few basic concepts. These have been noted

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<v Speaker 2>by philosophers going back like thousands of years, and one

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<v Speaker 2>of them is the relief theory, where something absurd happens

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<v Speaker 2>to break tension in a situation. But there's also this

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<v Speaker 2>superiority theory, where someone with power over you is humbled,

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<v Speaker 2>and that's funny.

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<v Speaker 1>And then there's this.

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<v Speaker 2>Theory of disposition where we can enjoy when good things

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<v Speaker 2>happen to people we like, but then when bad things

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<v Speaker 2>happen to assholes. So in this example, though, it's best

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<v Speaker 2>to see it and not to smell it.

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<v Speaker 5>A lot of discussed humor, it requires that you be

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<v Speaker 5>away from it.

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<v Speaker 4>It's not really threatening you.

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<v Speaker 5>That's true of a lot of things that I have

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<v Speaker 5>a concept of coll benign masochism, which is that people

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<v Speaker 5>all around the world seem to enjoy the arousal of

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<v Speaker 5>negative emotions fear discussed as long as they're not really

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<v Speaker 5>threatened by them. And that includes a roller coaster where

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<v Speaker 5>you're not really falling to your death, but you think

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<v Speaker 5>you are, and the fear becomes part of the pleasure

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<v Speaker 5>and discussed that someone else's disgusting situation is you feel it,

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<v Speaker 5>but it's not about you.

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<v Speaker 4>You didn't step in the dog thell.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, so that's part of why they discussed humor works.

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<v Speaker 5>It's a third party who dropped his lunch in the

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<v Speaker 5>outhouse and has to go down and pull it out.

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<v Speaker 2>You know it's not you again, that's your ex who

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<v Speaker 2>cheated on you. So that's hilarious and the most tension

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<v Speaker 2>and release I feel isn't in like a three dollars

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<v Speaker 2>airport massage share, but it's probably watching the television sketch

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<v Speaker 2>comedy program called I Think You Should leave every episode.

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<v Speaker 2>Every sketch hurts my soul, and I love it. I

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<v Speaker 2>keep going back for more. What about cringe humor where

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<v Speaker 2>you're watching someone have a really uncomfortable, awkward interaction and

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<v Speaker 2>you're not even involved, but it just is like like

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<v Speaker 2>hurts to watch.

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<v Speaker 4>It hurts to watch, but the hert is.

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<v Speaker 1>Pleasant, right right?

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<v Speaker 5>You initiated, right, because that's the same thing. So benign

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<v Speaker 5>masochism is the idea that we enjoy these innately negative

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<v Speaker 5>things because when we're secure that we're not threatened by

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<v Speaker 5>not even includes jumping out of a plane for you know,

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<v Speaker 5>on a possure, it includes the taking cold showers.

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<v Speaker 4>There are a lot of things where your body is

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<v Speaker 4>not really threatened, but your body thinks it's me.

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<v Speaker 2>But when we're disgusted or when we evade the threat

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<v Speaker 2>that discuss us, do we get any pleasure from surviving it?

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<v Speaker 5>We might get pleasure from surviving it. So the pleasure,

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<v Speaker 5>for example, of pain from running a mile or ten miles,

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<v Speaker 5>there may be some feeling of overcoming. But it's also

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<v Speaker 5>that the actual pain can become pleasant, not just the

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<v Speaker 5>success but the experience of the bab.

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<v Speaker 2>And if you need scholarly justification from remaining EMO, you

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<v Speaker 2>can see the twenty twenty three study Glad to Be

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<v Speaker 2>Sad and Other Examples of Benign Masochism, co authored by

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<v Speaker 2>one Paul Rowson, which explains that hedonic reversals can be

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<v Speaker 2>a major source of pleasure, and they can range from

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<v Speaker 2>liking sad experiences like music or novels, or tear jerker

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<v Speaker 2>movies or like my entire college CD collection, to enjoying

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<v Speaker 2>food that's spicy or the strong taste of coffee or alcohol.

424
00:22:33.119 --> 00:22:35.319
<v Speaker 1>Now, how bad is good? That's the question.

425
00:22:35.599 --> 00:22:39.519
<v Speaker 2>So this study concludes that the favored level of initially

426
00:22:39.640 --> 00:22:43.839
<v Speaker 2>negative experiences is something that's just below the level that

427
00:22:43.960 --> 00:22:46.640
<v Speaker 2>can be tolerated. So I guess it's kind of like edging,

428
00:22:46.839 --> 00:22:50.279
<v Speaker 2>but with a bummer. Speaking of does this include kinks?

429
00:22:50.480 --> 00:22:51.960
<v Speaker 2>We're going to get to that later. But back to

430
00:22:52.000 --> 00:22:54.960
<v Speaker 2>his history and what about when when your family came over.

431
00:22:55.000 --> 00:22:57.680
<v Speaker 2>I was wondering, because you've done studies with Nazi EFEMERI,

432
00:22:57.880 --> 00:23:00.400
<v Speaker 2>did you have members of your family who were Jewish?

433
00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:04.359
<v Speaker 4>Or who were my families and both sides are Jewish.

434
00:23:04.920 --> 00:23:09.480
<v Speaker 5>No one in my family was in Europe during the

435
00:23:09.599 --> 00:23:10.519
<v Speaker 5>Nazi period.

436
00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:12.880
<v Speaker 4>I've done studies on that.

437
00:23:13.240 --> 00:23:16.559
<v Speaker 5>I know two people who are victims of the Holocaust

438
00:23:17.200 --> 00:23:20.079
<v Speaker 5>who were in camps. They were anti Nazi, but they

439
00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:23.599
<v Speaker 5>had no problem going to Germany. And I know lots

440
00:23:23.640 --> 00:23:26.599
<v Speaker 5>of American Jewish who never had anything to do with Holocausts,

441
00:23:26.599 --> 00:23:30.079
<v Speaker 5>who wouldn't ride in the Folkswagen and I wouldn't you know,

442
00:23:30.400 --> 00:23:33.680
<v Speaker 5>I wouldn't eat saurbat all sort of stuff. And I

443
00:23:33.799 --> 00:23:36.440
<v Speaker 5>was really puzzled that. I get puzzled by the how

444
00:23:36.440 --> 00:23:39.559
<v Speaker 5>could someone who was in Auschwitz for two years not

445
00:23:39.720 --> 00:23:43.359
<v Speaker 5>be anti German and someone who's just sitting here and

446
00:23:43.400 --> 00:23:45.799
<v Speaker 5>none of their relatives even were in German, but they're

447
00:23:45.799 --> 00:23:49.640
<v Speaker 5>so anti German. And it turns out, just like we're discussed,

448
00:23:49.839 --> 00:23:52.599
<v Speaker 5>theres an enormous range of anti.

449
00:23:52.359 --> 00:23:55.240
<v Speaker 4>Germanists in Jewish people.

450
00:23:55.599 --> 00:23:57.720
<v Speaker 5>So we found that quite a few people who are

451
00:23:57.960 --> 00:24:00.400
<v Speaker 5>you know, in the Holocaust were not anti German.

452
00:24:00.599 --> 00:24:03.359
<v Speaker 4>That's interesting. Yeah, And there's a lot of reasons.

453
00:24:03.400 --> 00:24:06.599
<v Speaker 5>For one reason, very simple one is that the German

454
00:24:06.680 --> 00:24:11.160
<v Speaker 5>ones were had experienced nice Germans before the Holocaust. Germany

455
00:24:11.279 --> 00:24:14.880
<v Speaker 5>was not the most anti Semitic country in Europe actually,

456
00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:18.000
<v Speaker 5>and there were lots of successful Jewish and Germany, so

457
00:24:18.039 --> 00:24:20.720
<v Speaker 5>they knew nice Germans. And then they met in the

458
00:24:20.839 --> 00:24:24.200
<v Speaker 5>pants in the Nazis, and so we got interested in that.

459
00:24:24.519 --> 00:24:26.920
<v Speaker 4>We studied about forty survivors.

460
00:24:26.960 --> 00:24:29.799
<v Speaker 5>Wow, and we got them to tell us would they

461
00:24:30.039 --> 00:24:33.759
<v Speaker 5>go in a Folkswagen, could they listen to the German

462
00:24:33.839 --> 00:24:35.359
<v Speaker 5>language spoken?

463
00:24:35.599 --> 00:24:35.799
<v Speaker 4>You know?

464
00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:39.039
<v Speaker 5>Would they be upset about living in an apartment house

465
00:24:39.519 --> 00:24:42.319
<v Speaker 5>which had a grandson of a Nazi living in that

466
00:24:42.440 --> 00:24:45.640
<v Speaker 5>house and some of them all that's terrible, and other people.

467
00:24:45.920 --> 00:24:46.680
<v Speaker 4>That's no problem.

468
00:24:46.839 --> 00:24:47.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, oh that's interesting.

469
00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:51.960
<v Speaker 5>But anyway, yeah, I mean they're about puzzling things about

470
00:24:52.279 --> 00:24:58.640
<v Speaker 5>people go to terrible drama and come out opposite, you know,

471
00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:01.079
<v Speaker 5>and we don't underst.

472
00:25:00.519 --> 00:25:03.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but it's great to be asking the questions and

473
00:25:04.920 --> 00:25:08.960
<v Speaker 2>what about you? What drove you to this particular niche?

474
00:25:08.960 --> 00:25:12.759
<v Speaker 2>How did you find yourself as the godfather of disgusted

475
00:25:13.119 --> 00:25:13.759
<v Speaker 2>a discussion.

476
00:25:13.759 --> 00:25:15.680
<v Speaker 4>It's actually a very simple story.

477
00:25:15.839 --> 00:25:16.200
<v Speaker 1>Okay.

478
00:25:17.440 --> 00:25:20.839
<v Speaker 5>I was studying what people eat and why they eat it.

479
00:25:21.160 --> 00:25:25.640
<v Speaker 5>Perhaps the favorite food of humans around the world is meat.

480
00:25:26.480 --> 00:25:29.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, so yes, this is true, and we discussed

481
00:25:29.559 --> 00:25:32.559
<v Speaker 2>hunter gatherer diets in the Metabolism episode in January, and

482
00:25:32.599 --> 00:25:35.920
<v Speaker 2>our lead editor, Mercedes Maitland, also has an anthropology background

483
00:25:35.920 --> 00:25:37.960
<v Speaker 2>and chimed in letting me know that meat and honey

484
00:25:38.279 --> 00:25:40.160
<v Speaker 2>not to say that's what people actually manage to eat

485
00:25:40.160 --> 00:25:42.440
<v Speaker 2>the most, she says, but that's what are historically the

486
00:25:42.440 --> 00:25:45.519
<v Speaker 2>most prized foods. And she continues, for example, in hunter

487
00:25:45.599 --> 00:25:48.119
<v Speaker 2>gatherer societies, people will tend to put more time and

488
00:25:48.240 --> 00:25:51.680
<v Speaker 2>energy into getting X number of calories for meat than

489
00:25:51.680 --> 00:25:54.000
<v Speaker 2>they would into getting X number of calories.

490
00:25:53.640 --> 00:25:54.400
<v Speaker 1>From plant foods.

491
00:25:54.480 --> 00:25:58.119
<v Speaker 2>Now, how does this translate to you wandering indecisively at

492
00:25:58.119 --> 00:26:00.720
<v Speaker 2>the mall food court as your lunch to break minutes

493
00:26:00.839 --> 00:26:03.880
<v Speaker 2>dwindle away. Well, according to the United States Food and

494
00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:08.960
<v Speaker 2>Agriculture Organization, globally, pork is the most consumed meat and

495
00:26:09.000 --> 00:26:11.839
<v Speaker 2>it makes up over a third of the world's meat consumption.

496
00:26:12.200 --> 00:26:13.079
<v Speaker 1>I wouldn't have guessed that.

497
00:26:13.359 --> 00:26:15.319
<v Speaker 2>Next is birds, and yes we have a whole episode

498
00:26:15.319 --> 00:26:18.359
<v Speaker 2>about chickens, and yes it's called Chickenology. I didn't make

499
00:26:18.400 --> 00:26:20.440
<v Speaker 2>that up. It is what it is. Do not call

500
00:26:20.480 --> 00:26:24.279
<v Speaker 2>me a fool. However, if you listen to the Hydrochoreology

501
00:26:24.279 --> 00:26:28.000
<v Speaker 2>episode recently, about Cafe Barras, you'd know that those big

502
00:26:28.319 --> 00:26:31.440
<v Speaker 2>mammalian rodents are actually fish happy Easter.

503
00:26:32.200 --> 00:26:35.039
<v Speaker 5>But then it turns out that meat is also the

504
00:26:35.039 --> 00:26:39.880
<v Speaker 5>most tabooed food. You don't get vegetable taboos very often,

505
00:26:40.119 --> 00:26:43.680
<v Speaker 5>right now, Why is this food that is so desirable

506
00:26:43.759 --> 00:26:47.839
<v Speaker 5>often prohibited? Sometimes they're tabooed for everybody. And if you

507
00:26:47.880 --> 00:26:51.880
<v Speaker 5>think of say Americans, there are four thousand species of mammals.

508
00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:57.119
<v Speaker 5>We three pigs, cows, maybe.

509
00:26:57.480 --> 00:27:01.839
<v Speaker 2>Sheep, right right, Wow, yeah, that's a good point. I

510
00:27:01.880 --> 00:27:02.759
<v Speaker 2>kept thinking of birds.

511
00:27:02.960 --> 00:27:06.200
<v Speaker 4>What about the other three thousand and nine? We are

512
00:27:06.480 --> 00:27:08.880
<v Speaker 4>meat eaters that we love our meat, but we are

513
00:27:08.920 --> 00:27:09.759
<v Speaker 4>discussed not.

514
00:27:09.799 --> 00:27:12.640
<v Speaker 5>Only by almost every species of mammal and all the

515
00:27:12.720 --> 00:27:15.559
<v Speaker 5>other kind of species, but we're also discussed by most

516
00:27:15.559 --> 00:27:16.200
<v Speaker 5>parts of them.

517
00:27:16.359 --> 00:27:19.920
<v Speaker 4>We don't need eyeballs, we don't eat skin. We don't

518
00:27:19.960 --> 00:27:21.759
<v Speaker 4>need fat, oh, your.

519
00:27:22.039 --> 00:27:24.440
<v Speaker 5>Masses of fat. We don't need a lot of things.

520
00:27:25.039 --> 00:27:27.880
<v Speaker 5>We eat basically muscle. We don't need brain. In the

521
00:27:28.000 --> 00:27:31.039
<v Speaker 5>United States, we don't eat most visor. Yeah, we just

522
00:27:31.079 --> 00:27:32.160
<v Speaker 5>eat muscle.

523
00:27:32.440 --> 00:27:36.400
<v Speaker 2>Again, this is in Western or US culture and fun fact,

524
00:27:36.640 --> 00:27:39.839
<v Speaker 2>so the way that I met my spouse, Jarrett, was

525
00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:43.960
<v Speaker 2>by walking into this organic nose to tail butcher shop,

526
00:27:44.039 --> 00:27:46.799
<v Speaker 2>and he was behind the counter because wearing a chain

527
00:27:46.880 --> 00:27:50.599
<v Speaker 2>mail apron. Oh but that's smile. And I remember he

528
00:27:50.759 --> 00:27:55.200
<v Speaker 2>used to tell these tales of all these upscale Hollywood

529
00:27:55.240 --> 00:27:59.799
<v Speaker 2>clients that just wanted either pork belly or a skinless

530
00:28:00.079 --> 00:28:03.039
<v Speaker 2>chicken breast and no other part of the animal. They

531
00:28:03.079 --> 00:28:06.079
<v Speaker 2>had to convince people to, like try chicken thighs, but

532
00:28:06.920 --> 00:28:10.359
<v Speaker 2>just not a lot of people tossing pig kidneys into

533
00:28:10.400 --> 00:28:11.319
<v Speaker 2>their air fryers.

534
00:28:11.599 --> 00:28:15.200
<v Speaker 4>So we're eating one kind of thing from only a

535
00:28:15.240 --> 00:28:17.799
<v Speaker 4>few animals, and the rest of them are all disgusting.

536
00:28:18.240 --> 00:28:20.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, why is that? Why? Culturally are Americans rus Well?

537
00:28:20.960 --> 00:28:23.599
<v Speaker 5>I would say that the story is, first of all,

538
00:28:23.640 --> 00:28:27.799
<v Speaker 5>almost all food discuss our animal products, almost.

539
00:28:27.559 --> 00:28:31.839
<v Speaker 1>All, huh except for Durian maybe, yeah, but yes.

540
00:28:32.039 --> 00:28:36.920
<v Speaker 4>And Durian because smells like it's rotting meat. Yes, that's right.

541
00:28:37.160 --> 00:28:40.359
<v Speaker 5>So the question is why do we find most meat disgusting?

542
00:28:40.720 --> 00:28:43.039
<v Speaker 5>And that includes earthworms and you know, all the other

543
00:28:43.440 --> 00:28:46.160
<v Speaker 5>rats and all the things that we find disgusting. But

544
00:28:46.279 --> 00:28:47.880
<v Speaker 5>another way to ask the question is why do we

545
00:28:47.920 --> 00:28:48.640
<v Speaker 5>eat any meat?

546
00:28:49.359 --> 00:28:49.599
<v Speaker 1>Right?

547
00:28:49.839 --> 00:28:52.720
<v Speaker 5>So we eat this tiny percentage of all the animal

548
00:28:52.839 --> 00:28:56.160
<v Speaker 5>food we could eat, and because is how we made

549
00:28:56.160 --> 00:28:57.119
<v Speaker 5>an exception to that.

550
00:28:57.160 --> 00:29:00.200
<v Speaker 4>You could ask the question either way. Yeah, but the import.

551
00:29:00.000 --> 00:29:02.839
<v Speaker 5>One point is that there's all this great animal protein

552
00:29:02.880 --> 00:29:05.480
<v Speaker 5>out there and we don't want to go have anything

553
00:29:05.480 --> 00:29:08.680
<v Speaker 5>to do with anybody. And even traditional cultures, which is

554
00:29:08.759 --> 00:29:11.160
<v Speaker 5>much more meat than we do and more parts of

555
00:29:11.240 --> 00:29:15.200
<v Speaker 5>the animal, still find many animals disgusting.

556
00:29:15.519 --> 00:29:17.880
<v Speaker 2>And he says in different parts of the world, different

557
00:29:17.880 --> 00:29:22.039
<v Speaker 2>cultures eat different types of protein sources.

558
00:29:22.079 --> 00:29:25.200
<v Speaker 5>They still don't eat at all, and they tend to

559
00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:30.960
<v Speaker 5>not like decayed meat, which is generally disgusting. Now there

560
00:29:31.000 --> 00:29:34.640
<v Speaker 5>are exceptions to that, but they're very special. You know,

561
00:29:34.680 --> 00:29:39.519
<v Speaker 5>there are cultures that he brotten meat, but only certain cases,

562
00:29:39.640 --> 00:29:43.440
<v Speaker 5>and it's generally not consumed. So that's what got me going,

563
00:29:43.640 --> 00:29:46.240
<v Speaker 5>was here is this most favorite food of.

564
00:29:46.279 --> 00:29:49.880
<v Speaker 1>Humans again talking meat, and people.

565
00:29:49.640 --> 00:29:53.240
<v Speaker 5>Are rejecting almost all instances of it, and then not

566
00:29:53.319 --> 00:29:55.559
<v Speaker 5>just saying I won't eat it like you might say

567
00:29:55.559 --> 00:29:56.240
<v Speaker 5>about paper.

568
00:29:56.680 --> 00:30:00.519
<v Speaker 4>They're actually offended by eating. So that SI what's going

569
00:30:00.519 --> 00:30:03.480
<v Speaker 4>on there, And that's how I got going.

570
00:30:03.839 --> 00:30:06.119
<v Speaker 2>And what do you think about types of meat that

571
00:30:06.160 --> 00:30:09.680
<v Speaker 2>we'll readily eat, such as a hot dog even though

572
00:30:09.720 --> 00:30:14.599
<v Speaker 2>we know there's buttholes in it? But we wouldn't eat

573
00:30:13.720 --> 00:30:17.680
<v Speaker 2>just buttholes. We know that it's full of venuses. A

574
00:30:17.720 --> 00:30:25.759
<v Speaker 2>hot dog is full of well, well sure it's fair trails.

575
00:30:25.799 --> 00:30:27.880
<v Speaker 2>I mean I love hot dogs, don't get me wrong,

576
00:30:27.960 --> 00:30:29.720
<v Speaker 2>but I know that hot dogs are full of things

577
00:30:29.720 --> 00:30:35.400
<v Speaker 2>that if they weren't like macerated and emulsified, I probably.

578
00:30:35.119 --> 00:30:38.400
<v Speaker 5>Got an actual fact I never looked at this year.

579
00:30:38.440 --> 00:30:40.680
<v Speaker 5>It's a good question, what's in a hot dog?

580
00:30:41.079 --> 00:30:43.960
<v Speaker 2>Do we want to know? Should we learn this? You

581
00:30:43.960 --> 00:30:46.599
<v Speaker 2>know what, some wieners, you gotta look straight in the face.

582
00:30:46.920 --> 00:30:49.799
<v Speaker 2>So I googled the sentence what's in a hot dog?

583
00:30:50.079 --> 00:30:52.400
<v Speaker 1>Just level with me? And I got to say.

584
00:30:52.559 --> 00:30:56.240
<v Speaker 2>The image search returns had had a lot of appetizing

585
00:30:56.279 --> 00:31:01.240
<v Speaker 2>photos of like crusty buns, taught meat ling and mustard

586
00:31:01.519 --> 00:31:04.119
<v Speaker 2>squiggles and the like. But let's give it up for

587
00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:07.279
<v Speaker 2>people for the other gold treatment of animals just busted

588
00:31:07.319 --> 00:31:11.559
<v Speaker 2>out the disgust with photos of a vat containing what

589
00:31:11.680 --> 00:31:16.279
<v Speaker 2>looked like giant ribbons of milk, chocolate, frozen yogurt, but

590
00:31:16.440 --> 00:31:21.119
<v Speaker 2>what actually contained whipped an emulsified muscle. And I found

591
00:31:21.160 --> 00:31:23.680
<v Speaker 2>myself knee deep in a clip on the YouTube channel

592
00:31:23.720 --> 00:31:24.599
<v Speaker 2>for how It's.

593
00:31:24.400 --> 00:31:28.799
<v Speaker 6>Made Traditional hot dogs are made from a mix of pork, beef,

594
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:33.240
<v Speaker 6>and chicken. The cuts they start with are called trimmings,

595
00:31:33.599 --> 00:31:37.079
<v Speaker 6>pieces of meat left over from cutting steaks or pork chops.

596
00:31:37.599 --> 00:31:40.160
<v Speaker 2>And I realized, this is an you're working with an

597
00:31:40.200 --> 00:31:42.880
<v Speaker 2>audio only format, and you're welcome for that right now.

598
00:31:42.920 --> 00:31:44.839
<v Speaker 2>But I'm going to have you visualize this because I

599
00:31:44.880 --> 00:31:45.240
<v Speaker 2>just see it.

600
00:31:46.079 --> 00:31:46.839
<v Speaker 1>Just think of like.

601
00:31:46.799 --> 00:31:51.079
<v Speaker 2>An industrial stainless steel tub about the size of a

602
00:31:51.200 --> 00:31:57.160
<v Speaker 2>mini van, and in it is a churning, fluffy, grayish

603
00:31:57.200 --> 00:32:00.599
<v Speaker 2>brown substance. And it stared at it.

604
00:32:00.519 --> 00:32:01.880
<v Speaker 1>And I was like, what does it look like? And

605
00:32:01.880 --> 00:32:02.720
<v Speaker 1>I realized.

606
00:32:02.400 --> 00:32:06.000
<v Speaker 2>It it resembled a job of the hut, just rolling

607
00:32:06.119 --> 00:32:09.039
<v Speaker 2>over in a sleep, just over and over that in

608
00:32:09.079 --> 00:32:09.519
<v Speaker 2>a vat.

609
00:32:09.559 --> 00:32:11.920
<v Speaker 1>But it's liquid ish, I.

610
00:32:11.880 --> 00:32:14.119
<v Speaker 5>Mean, and some of the things like that sausages are

611
00:32:14.160 --> 00:32:18.920
<v Speaker 5>actually encased in and testine skin, you know, right, Yeah,

612
00:32:18.960 --> 00:32:22.839
<v Speaker 5>So there's all sorts of ways that we work around

613
00:32:22.920 --> 00:32:25.480
<v Speaker 5>a lot of these things. I mean, after all, people

614
00:32:25.519 --> 00:32:28.200
<v Speaker 5>are breathing everyone else's air and when they walk around,

615
00:32:28.200 --> 00:32:30.000
<v Speaker 5>and they don't seem to be upset by that. Right

616
00:32:30.119 --> 00:32:32.359
<v Speaker 5>you go to a theater, you're sitting right next to someone.

617
00:32:32.880 --> 00:32:36.039
<v Speaker 5>They're breathing you're breathing their air, and unless you're worried

618
00:32:36.079 --> 00:32:38.880
<v Speaker 5>about COVID, you don't think about it. People aren't too

619
00:32:38.960 --> 00:32:43.039
<v Speaker 5>upset about being in the same room as something disgusting,

620
00:32:43.480 --> 00:32:46.480
<v Speaker 5>but they don't want to touch it, right, So the

621
00:32:46.680 --> 00:32:49.240
<v Speaker 5>touch and I need it. Oh, that's terrible.

622
00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:51.240
<v Speaker 1>It's just exponential contact.

623
00:32:51.359 --> 00:32:53.519
<v Speaker 4>Yes, and eating is the worst thing.

624
00:32:54.720 --> 00:32:56.319
<v Speaker 5>And no one, by the way, I don't think anyone's

625
00:32:56.359 --> 00:33:00.640
<v Speaker 5>ever done discussed sensitivity of the vagina. Well, I assume

626
00:33:00.640 --> 00:33:03.720
<v Speaker 5>it's somewhat like the mouth. I mean the idea of

627
00:33:03.720 --> 00:33:06.799
<v Speaker 5>being of touching a piece of raw.

628
00:33:06.599 --> 00:33:10.839
<v Speaker 2>Meat to the I mean, it doesn't appeal, but then again,

629
00:33:10.880 --> 00:33:13.680
<v Speaker 2>it depends on if the raw meat is alive and

630
00:33:13.720 --> 00:33:14.839
<v Speaker 2>a person you know.

631
00:33:15.039 --> 00:33:17.559
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, Well, I mean, if you look at what you

632
00:33:17.599 --> 00:33:20.039
<v Speaker 5>don't want to put in your mouth, it's probably not

633
00:33:20.119 --> 00:33:20.839
<v Speaker 5>unrelated to.

634
00:33:20.759 --> 00:33:22.240
<v Speaker 4>It which you don't want to put you for sure.

635
00:33:22.359 --> 00:33:24.839
<v Speaker 5>Wellas I mean a lot of people wouldn't mind touching

636
00:33:24.880 --> 00:33:27.759
<v Speaker 5>it to their ear. I mean they don't want to

637
00:33:27.759 --> 00:33:29.839
<v Speaker 5>touch it to anything, but the ear is not it's

638
00:33:29.880 --> 00:33:32.960
<v Speaker 5>a hole, but you know, it's a neutral hole sort of.

639
00:33:33.319 --> 00:33:35.920
<v Speaker 2>So would I touch a piece of raw pork to

640
00:33:36.079 --> 00:33:36.559
<v Speaker 2>my mouth?

641
00:33:36.960 --> 00:33:38.480
<v Speaker 1>No?

642
00:33:38.480 --> 00:33:42.839
<v Speaker 2>No, would I touch it to my newly surgically altered vagina.

643
00:33:43.039 --> 00:33:44.319
<v Speaker 1>Hell no, brother, And if.

644
00:33:44.200 --> 00:33:46.240
<v Speaker 2>You're like, excuse me, what do you get done to war?

645
00:33:46.279 --> 00:33:49.440
<v Speaker 2>You can see last week's episode Field Trip, Ali's mystery surgery.

646
00:33:49.440 --> 00:33:51.359
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to leave you hanging. Just got to go listen.

647
00:33:51.799 --> 00:33:55.680
<v Speaker 2>Now, would I let raw pork touch my ear? Which

648
00:33:55.720 --> 00:33:56.720
<v Speaker 2>is a neutral hole?

649
00:33:56.839 --> 00:33:57.680
<v Speaker 1>I think I would.

650
00:33:57.920 --> 00:34:00.119
<v Speaker 2>I think I would because an ear canal is totally

651
00:34:00.119 --> 00:34:04.480
<v Speaker 2>different in terms of consistency. It's not a blank canvas

652
00:34:04.799 --> 00:34:08.760
<v Speaker 2>for contamination like a mouth, a butt, or a couter.

653
00:34:09.599 --> 00:34:12.599
<v Speaker 2>Is it epithelial tissue that makes a squeamish?

654
00:34:12.800 --> 00:34:15.159
<v Speaker 4>Is its epithelial tissue in the ear too?

655
00:34:15.239 --> 00:34:16.960
<v Speaker 1>Is there epithet I didn't know that.

656
00:34:17.199 --> 00:34:20.400
<v Speaker 5>Well, there's an internal epithelium, okay, which is a little different.

657
00:34:20.400 --> 00:34:22.280
<v Speaker 5>Which is the moist one that you have in the

658
00:34:22.360 --> 00:34:23.320
<v Speaker 5>vagina in the mouth.

659
00:34:23.719 --> 00:34:26.039
<v Speaker 2>I fact check this and yeah, it checks out. If

660
00:34:26.039 --> 00:34:28.320
<v Speaker 2>you still don't believe me, you can skip over to

661
00:34:28.400 --> 00:34:31.639
<v Speaker 2>the twenty nineteen paper single origin of the epithelium of

662
00:34:31.679 --> 00:34:35.000
<v Speaker 2>the human middle ear, like I did. But epithelial tissue,

663
00:34:35.079 --> 00:34:37.239
<v Speaker 2>it's all over the body, okay. It comes in a

664
00:34:37.320 --> 00:34:42.039
<v Speaker 2>variety of cellular shapes like scale or squay mass or

665
00:34:42.199 --> 00:34:46.079
<v Speaker 2>tube shaped cells and even cubic shaped cells, and this

666
00:34:46.199 --> 00:34:49.519
<v Speaker 2>type of epithelial tissue, it's all over our organs, our

667
00:34:49.639 --> 00:34:52.559
<v Speaker 2>blood vessels, It lines cavities. And if you're like, what

668
00:34:52.599 --> 00:34:55.320
<v Speaker 2>does epithelial even mean? I'm glad you asked, because I

669
00:34:55.440 --> 00:34:58.719
<v Speaker 2>just learned that it's etymology and Greek means on the

670
00:34:58.800 --> 00:35:03.519
<v Speaker 2>nipple or of the teat, And apparently even the epidermis

671
00:35:03.800 --> 00:35:05.559
<v Speaker 2>is a type of epithelial tissue.

672
00:35:05.599 --> 00:35:06.559
<v Speaker 1>So this is news to me.

673
00:35:06.679 --> 00:35:09.400
<v Speaker 5>I'm all yours, Yeah, a little bit in the nose,

674
00:35:09.960 --> 00:35:13.679
<v Speaker 5>so it could be the moisture that's moisture sort of

675
00:35:13.760 --> 00:35:15.079
<v Speaker 5>makes things more conductive.

676
00:35:15.400 --> 00:35:17.519
<v Speaker 1>Right, what do you think of the word moist?

677
00:35:17.800 --> 00:35:18.880
<v Speaker 4>What do I think of the word?

678
00:35:19.039 --> 00:35:21.159
<v Speaker 1>People hate the word moist? How do you feel about.

679
00:35:20.960 --> 00:35:21.800
<v Speaker 4>That moist is?

680
00:35:22.119 --> 00:35:24.599
<v Speaker 5>Well, you know a lot of disgusting things are damp,

681
00:35:25.079 --> 00:35:29.599
<v Speaker 5>ye wet, and the and viscera are wet. Well, moist

682
00:35:29.800 --> 00:35:33.559
<v Speaker 5>in English has a certain negative. If you ask people,

683
00:35:33.599 --> 00:35:35.519
<v Speaker 5>this's moist the positive or negative word?

684
00:35:35.719 --> 00:35:36.719
<v Speaker 1>Right or damp?

685
00:35:37.199 --> 00:35:39.840
<v Speaker 5>They would say negative. So mois is a feature of

686
00:35:40.000 --> 00:35:43.880
<v Speaker 5>solids that's often associated with decay. And there are plenty

687
00:35:43.920 --> 00:35:47.960
<v Speaker 5>of foods that are moist. So moist is fascinating. It

688
00:35:48.079 --> 00:35:51.559
<v Speaker 5>has a negative overtone. I think you're right.

689
00:35:52.039 --> 00:35:54.039
<v Speaker 4>In English, Oh, I wish.

690
00:35:53.800 --> 00:35:55.920
<v Speaker 2>We had a language expert to explain why we hate

691
00:35:55.920 --> 00:35:59.159
<v Speaker 2>the word moist among others. But I stumbled upon an

692
00:35:59.280 --> 00:36:03.159
<v Speaker 2>article type a language expert explains why you hate the

693
00:36:03.199 --> 00:36:06.280
<v Speaker 2>word moist among others in vice, and that pointed me

694
00:36:06.320 --> 00:36:10.800
<v Speaker 2>to a twenty sixteen scholarly article called I moist crevice

695
00:36:11.039 --> 00:36:14.760
<v Speaker 2>for a word aversion in semantics, not sounds, and they

696
00:36:14.760 --> 00:36:17.960
<v Speaker 2>concluded that around ten to twenty percent of the population

697
00:36:18.360 --> 00:36:22.000
<v Speaker 2>gets the creepy crawleys at the mention of moist. Now,

698
00:36:22.000 --> 00:36:26.199
<v Speaker 2>if you listened to our Rhinology and our Hagfishology episodes,

699
00:36:26.239 --> 00:36:29.320
<v Speaker 2>both bangers in the past, I left all the shits

700
00:36:29.320 --> 00:36:32.519
<v Speaker 2>in the fucks in, but I bleeped any mention of

701
00:36:32.559 --> 00:36:36.800
<v Speaker 2>the word mucus for sensitive listeners, mostly myself, and I

702
00:36:36.880 --> 00:36:40.280
<v Speaker 2>have since matured and though the word mucus very much

703
00:36:40.320 --> 00:36:42.320
<v Speaker 2>still on my shit list, I'm just I grit my

704
00:36:42.360 --> 00:36:44.360
<v Speaker 2>teeth and I get through it, but know that it

705
00:36:44.440 --> 00:36:44.800
<v Speaker 2>hurts me.

706
00:36:45.039 --> 00:36:45.800
<v Speaker 1>I don't like it.

707
00:36:46.400 --> 00:36:48.840
<v Speaker 2>But anyway, back to that twenty sixteen study, which continued

708
00:36:48.880 --> 00:36:52.800
<v Speaker 2>that word aversion is more prevalent among younger and more

709
00:36:52.800 --> 00:36:56.760
<v Speaker 2>neurotic people, and it's more commonly reported by females than males,

710
00:36:56.800 --> 00:36:58.079
<v Speaker 2>which personally.

711
00:36:59.079 --> 00:37:03.440
<v Speaker 1>It tracks. That's making sense for me. But this is

712
00:37:03.480 --> 00:37:05.920
<v Speaker 1>all just when it comes to words. At least, what

713
00:37:06.000 --> 00:37:06.880
<v Speaker 1>about culturally?

714
00:37:07.679 --> 00:37:12.639
<v Speaker 2>Do certain cultures tend to be quicker to discuss than others?

715
00:37:13.000 --> 00:37:15.679
<v Speaker 5>We do know that women are more sensitive to discuss

716
00:37:15.719 --> 00:37:18.280
<v Speaker 5>than men, at least in Japan and the United States.

717
00:37:18.440 --> 00:37:20.000
<v Speaker 4>Okay, at least two places.

718
00:37:20.039 --> 00:37:23.119
<v Speaker 5>I know, maybe more than that, because there are discussed

719
00:37:23.159 --> 00:37:28.000
<v Speaker 5>scales measuring sensitivity. There's an enormous range of discuss sensitivity.

720
00:37:28.159 --> 00:37:30.960
<v Speaker 5>There are people who are almost almost shown no disgust.

721
00:37:31.599 --> 00:37:32.559
<v Speaker 1>Who are those people?

722
00:37:33.559 --> 00:37:34.320
<v Speaker 4>Regular people?

723
00:37:34.440 --> 00:37:35.000
<v Speaker 1>Regular people?

724
00:37:35.039 --> 00:37:38.199
<v Speaker 2>But are there certain like neurodivergences, like are people with

725
00:37:38.320 --> 00:37:40.679
<v Speaker 2>ADHD less likely to be disgusted?

726
00:37:40.800 --> 00:37:44.719
<v Speaker 5>Or I have no idea about ADHD. But in our

727
00:37:45.159 --> 00:37:48.559
<v Speaker 5>normal population you find people who are hyper sensitive to discuss.

728
00:37:48.639 --> 00:37:48.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

729
00:37:48.960 --> 00:37:52.480
<v Speaker 5>So for example, one thing we criteria used, would you

730
00:37:52.559 --> 00:37:55.199
<v Speaker 5>blow your nose and a brand new piece of toilet

731
00:37:55.280 --> 00:37:58.280
<v Speaker 5>paper coming right out of the sure package?

732
00:37:58.480 --> 00:37:59.760
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, but there are people that won't do that.

733
00:38:00.079 --> 00:38:03.239
<v Speaker 2>Okay, oh, okay, oh because it's toilet Oh yeah, I

734
00:38:03.239 --> 00:38:04.039
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't care about that.

735
00:38:04.079 --> 00:38:05.559
<v Speaker 4>Well, you see, but you're probably somewhere in.

736
00:38:05.559 --> 00:38:06.840
<v Speaker 1>The somewhere in the middle.

737
00:38:07.280 --> 00:38:08.199
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, And there are.

738
00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:10.760
<v Speaker 5>Other people who can't believe that anybody would be like that.

739
00:38:11.280 --> 00:38:13.639
<v Speaker 5>And I really don't fight Fece's disgusting.

740
00:38:13.920 --> 00:38:15.880
<v Speaker 2>Well thing, I mean, it also depends on whose dog

741
00:38:15.880 --> 00:38:17.079
<v Speaker 2>it is. I don't want to pick up my friend's

742
00:38:17.119 --> 00:38:18.360
<v Speaker 2>dogs poop, but i'll pick up my own.

743
00:38:18.360 --> 00:38:21.639
<v Speaker 5>Well, that's an interesting issue there too. Why, I mean,

744
00:38:22.039 --> 00:38:25.400
<v Speaker 5>relatively insensitive to our own poop. Yeah, and of course

745
00:38:25.400 --> 00:38:28.000
<v Speaker 5>you better be, because otherwise you're carrying.

746
00:38:27.800 --> 00:38:29.199
<v Speaker 4>Around with you all the time, is it.

747
00:38:29.480 --> 00:38:33.639
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, So the people are definitely much less sensitive to

748
00:38:33.679 --> 00:38:37.559
<v Speaker 5>their own pom. Sometimes it extends to your lover's poop.

749
00:38:38.119 --> 00:38:43.000
<v Speaker 5>Sometimes it doesn't. Your baby's poop. Yes, mother's typically fine.

750
00:38:43.599 --> 00:38:47.320
<v Speaker 5>Their baby's poop much less disgusting than some other babies.

751
00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:48.159
<v Speaker 4>Then you said it with the.

752
00:38:48.239 --> 00:38:50.800
<v Speaker 2>Dog, right, Yeah, I'll pick up my dog's poop all day,

753
00:38:50.800 --> 00:38:52.880
<v Speaker 2>but do not ask me to pick up another person's

754
00:38:52.880 --> 00:38:53.360
<v Speaker 2>dog poop.

755
00:38:54.039 --> 00:38:54.519
<v Speaker 1>Oh man.

756
00:38:54.639 --> 00:38:57.519
<v Speaker 2>I just had the cringiest feeling because I remember during

757
00:38:57.719 --> 00:39:00.639
<v Speaker 2>that soare I had with my girlfriends before surgery. I

758
00:39:00.679 --> 00:39:02.639
<v Speaker 2>talked about it in the field trip episode. My friend

759
00:39:02.719 --> 00:39:04.960
<v Speaker 2>Daylyn was over early and she's like, anything I can do,

760
00:39:05.039 --> 00:39:07.199
<v Speaker 2>And I was like, can you take Grammy for a walk?

761
00:39:07.320 --> 00:39:09.159
<v Speaker 2>My hands are so full right now. And I had

762
00:39:09.199 --> 00:39:13.360
<v Speaker 2>completely forgotten until right now that Daylan cannot stand picking

763
00:39:13.440 --> 00:39:14.440
<v Speaker 2>up other dogs poop.

764
00:39:14.639 --> 00:39:15.320
<v Speaker 1>And she did it.

765
00:39:15.360 --> 00:39:16.679
<v Speaker 2>She didn't say a word about it, but I just

766
00:39:16.679 --> 00:39:19.440
<v Speaker 2>remembered it, and now I want to die. Also that night,

767
00:39:19.719 --> 00:39:22.159
<v Speaker 2>I suggested my friend Sarah. I was like, you got

768
00:39:22.159 --> 00:39:24.719
<v Speaker 2>to try one of these grapes. These are such good grapes.

769
00:39:25.079 --> 00:39:27.800
<v Speaker 2>And she reminded me that to eat a grape is

770
00:39:27.840 --> 00:39:31.719
<v Speaker 2>incredibly difficult for her because if it were squishy, it

771
00:39:31.760 --> 00:39:34.559
<v Speaker 2>would signify a little bit of rot and she would gag.

772
00:39:34.800 --> 00:39:37.639
<v Speaker 2>So I'm over here, I'm just doing amazing. Like anyone

773
00:39:37.719 --> 00:39:40.119
<v Speaker 2>want to come see the pig head in my refrigerator,

774
00:39:40.360 --> 00:39:43.159
<v Speaker 2>or you touch this bowl of bone dust, let's party.

775
00:39:43.800 --> 00:39:44.079
<v Speaker 4>Now.

776
00:39:44.400 --> 00:39:47.760
<v Speaker 5>You could say about yourself your own poop, that that's,

777
00:39:47.800 --> 00:39:51.920
<v Speaker 5>of course you're not threatened by your own poop biologically

778
00:39:51.920 --> 00:39:53.440
<v Speaker 5>because you already have all.

779
00:39:53.400 --> 00:39:54.559
<v Speaker 4>Those organisms in you.

780
00:39:54.719 --> 00:39:57.239
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, that's true, where someone else's might have something that

781
00:39:57.280 --> 00:39:59.880
<v Speaker 5>you don't have. But everyone agrees that discuss that's something

782
00:40:00.039 --> 00:40:03.360
<v Speaker 5>to do. With infection and avoiding infection. So there's no

783
00:40:03.519 --> 00:40:07.119
<v Speaker 5>question about that. So you could say that your own

784
00:40:07.199 --> 00:40:11.559
<v Speaker 5>poop is less threatening and that's why you are less disgusted.

785
00:40:11.800 --> 00:40:15.239
<v Speaker 5>I don't think that's the reason myself, but your dog's example,

786
00:40:15.280 --> 00:40:18.880
<v Speaker 5>which I think is not atypical. There's no way that

787
00:40:18.960 --> 00:40:21.840
<v Speaker 5>you're less threatened by your dog spoop than by someone

788
00:40:21.880 --> 00:40:22.800
<v Speaker 5>else other dogs.

789
00:40:23.239 --> 00:40:26.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's maybe it's the devil, you know, you know

790
00:40:26.280 --> 00:40:26.960
<v Speaker 2>what I mean, Like.

791
00:40:26.960 --> 00:40:30.239
<v Speaker 5>Well, it's it's a familiarity. But you love your dog,

792
00:40:30.559 --> 00:40:33.760
<v Speaker 5>that is correct. So you could try to show, for example,

793
00:40:34.079 --> 00:40:37.760
<v Speaker 5>the more you love your dog, the less you're upset

794
00:40:37.800 --> 00:40:38.599
<v Speaker 5>about it spoop.

795
00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:39.239
<v Speaker 4>Now.

796
00:40:39.800 --> 00:40:42.360
<v Speaker 5>I once tried to do a study like that. It

797
00:40:42.400 --> 00:40:46.519
<v Speaker 5>was about looking at how intimate people are with their

798
00:40:46.559 --> 00:40:49.440
<v Speaker 5>dog as in relation to disgust, so that they sleep

799
00:40:49.440 --> 00:40:51.960
<v Speaker 5>in bed with it, so on things like that. We

800
00:40:52.000 --> 00:40:54.679
<v Speaker 5>wanted to look at that, so we went to the

801
00:40:54.760 --> 00:40:57.239
<v Speaker 5>vets school here, we have a great vet school at

802
00:40:57.239 --> 00:41:00.360
<v Speaker 5>PET and we went into the clinic waiting here and

803
00:41:00.360 --> 00:41:03.480
<v Speaker 5>we inter people with their dogs. Yeah that's some of

804
00:41:03.559 --> 00:41:06.519
<v Speaker 5>these things, and we found, much to our distress, that

805
00:41:06.599 --> 00:41:10.639
<v Speaker 5>almost everybody there sleeps with their dog, talks to their

806
00:41:10.639 --> 00:41:13.440
<v Speaker 5>dog as if it's a child and basically makes it

807
00:41:13.519 --> 00:41:17.039
<v Speaker 5>into a member of their family. They treat it essentially as.

808
00:41:16.880 --> 00:41:18.599
<v Speaker 4>A human being, iply guilty.

809
00:41:18.920 --> 00:41:21.360
<v Speaker 5>And so we didn't get these people where dogs are

810
00:41:21.440 --> 00:41:24.800
<v Speaker 5>kept mostly for protection or something, and they're not really

811
00:41:25.320 --> 00:41:25.920
<v Speaker 5>cuddled with.

812
00:41:27.000 --> 00:41:27.880
<v Speaker 1>Caddle those pups.

813
00:41:27.920 --> 00:41:31.719
<v Speaker 2>Because according to the twenty twenty Frontiers paper household pet

814
00:41:31.719 --> 00:41:34.920
<v Speaker 2>ownership and the microbial Diversity of the human gut, microbiotic

815
00:41:35.039 --> 00:41:38.559
<v Speaker 2>pets do increase the diversity of our microbiome, with dogs

816
00:41:38.880 --> 00:41:41.800
<v Speaker 2>contributing more types of bacteria than kiddies. And a twenty

817
00:41:41.800 --> 00:41:45.199
<v Speaker 2>seventeen New York Times article, are Pets the New Probiotic

818
00:41:45.519 --> 00:41:49.239
<v Speaker 2>reports that epidemiological studies show that children who grow up

819
00:41:49.280 --> 00:41:52.519
<v Speaker 2>in households with dogs have a lower risk for developing

820
00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:57.079
<v Speaker 2>autoimmune illnesses like asthma or allergies. And of course, animals

821
00:41:57.159 --> 00:42:01.039
<v Speaker 2>can bring in the nasties like toxoplasmosis or salmonilla if

822
00:42:01.039 --> 00:42:04.480
<v Speaker 2>you cuddle with turtles. So doctors advise washing your damn

823
00:42:04.519 --> 00:42:07.719
<v Speaker 2>hands before you eat. But what if the animal itself

824
00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:10.400
<v Speaker 2>touches your food? Let's check out the twenty twenty paper

825
00:42:10.719 --> 00:42:14.000
<v Speaker 2>Bugs are butterflies are beautiful? But both are bad to bite.

826
00:42:14.159 --> 00:42:17.400
<v Speaker 2>Admired animals are disgusting to eat, but are themselves neither

827
00:42:17.480 --> 00:42:21.239
<v Speaker 2>disgusting nor contaminating. Co authored by you guess did doctor

828
00:42:21.320 --> 00:42:24.639
<v Speaker 2>discussed Paul Rowsen and it found that the more you

829
00:42:24.800 --> 00:42:27.760
<v Speaker 2>like an animal, the less bothered you are by touching

830
00:42:27.800 --> 00:42:32.639
<v Speaker 2>your food. So imagine a butterfly that alights upon your sandwich,

831
00:42:32.840 --> 00:42:35.760
<v Speaker 2>just blessing it with peace and beauty. Would you want

832
00:42:35.800 --> 00:42:39.119
<v Speaker 2>to eat the actual butterfly? Heaven snow? But what if

833
00:42:39.159 --> 00:42:43.880
<v Speaker 2>a cockroach with the big wings landed on your sandwich,

834
00:42:43.920 --> 00:42:46.440
<v Speaker 2>one of those big flying ones and licked your meat?

835
00:42:46.599 --> 00:42:48.039
<v Speaker 2>Would you want to eat anything?

836
00:42:48.079 --> 00:42:48.280
<v Speaker 4>Ever?

837
00:42:48.400 --> 00:42:49.559
<v Speaker 1>Again? Maybe not.

838
00:42:50.000 --> 00:42:55.199
<v Speaker 2>However, cockroaches are fastidious groomers, and according to our Lepidopterology

839
00:42:55.239 --> 00:42:59.360
<v Speaker 2>episode with Filterus, butterflies love to slurp shit and they're

840
00:42:59.400 --> 00:43:03.480
<v Speaker 2>often off rotting fruit. So you would think that studying

841
00:43:03.480 --> 00:43:07.760
<v Speaker 2>butterflies would be this hazy rainbow of bliss, just set

842
00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:11.039
<v Speaker 2>to like an Enny soundtrack. But Phil explains in that

843
00:43:11.119 --> 00:43:14.559
<v Speaker 2>episode that in order to lure butterflies, sometimes scientists have

844
00:43:14.599 --> 00:43:17.840
<v Speaker 2>to pee on cans of rotting tuna in the rainforest,

845
00:43:18.119 --> 00:43:21.239
<v Speaker 2>So butterfly expertise necessitates a pretty strong stomach.

846
00:43:21.760 --> 00:43:25.800
<v Speaker 5>Now there are people occasional cases neurological bases of people

847
00:43:25.800 --> 00:43:27.280
<v Speaker 5>who have no disgust.

848
00:43:27.440 --> 00:43:30.679
<v Speaker 1>Where what part of their brain is not firing.

849
00:43:31.280 --> 00:43:33.960
<v Speaker 4>It mostly involves.

850
00:43:33.440 --> 00:43:37.400
<v Speaker 5>The insula okay, at the base of the brain, but

851
00:43:37.719 --> 00:43:41.960
<v Speaker 5>related to the olfactory system, which is not surprising Ray.

852
00:43:42.000 --> 00:43:44.880
<v Speaker 5>It's disgust is about basically smell and taste.

853
00:43:45.079 --> 00:43:48.239
<v Speaker 2>Again see our gastology episode about taste, which is linked

854
00:43:48.280 --> 00:43:51.320
<v Speaker 2>in the show notes. And right now, take inventory. If

855
00:43:51.320 --> 00:43:54.320
<v Speaker 2>you're snacking on a chocolate cover banana or a sausage

856
00:43:54.440 --> 00:43:57.599
<v Speaker 2>or chocolate covered sausage, just set it down for a sec.

857
00:43:58.559 --> 00:43:59.480
<v Speaker 1>It's gonna get rough.

858
00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:03.119
<v Speaker 4>By the way, we've worked with chocolate dog does of

859
00:44:03.199 --> 00:44:06.079
<v Speaker 4>course we use Oh.

860
00:44:05.880 --> 00:44:09.039
<v Speaker 5>We've made chalklate dog does that look just like Oh,

861
00:44:09.440 --> 00:44:14.159
<v Speaker 5>they know, and they even We've made it with stinky cheese, oh,

862
00:44:14.199 --> 00:44:18.199
<v Speaker 5>sneaky cheese and chocolate, so it smells like shit and

863
00:44:18.360 --> 00:44:20.639
<v Speaker 5>we and we'd ask people if they would eat it.

864
00:44:21.000 --> 00:44:22.079
<v Speaker 4>Now we no.

865
00:44:22.280 --> 00:44:24.840
<v Speaker 1>Just the thought of it is closing my throat out.

866
00:44:24.920 --> 00:44:27.360
<v Speaker 5>But a simple thing to do is just take smelted

867
00:44:27.440 --> 00:44:29.679
<v Speaker 5>chocolate and make it into a dog terry.

868
00:44:30.119 --> 00:44:32.360
<v Speaker 4>It's solid chocolate, per right.

869
00:44:32.320 --> 00:44:35.440
<v Speaker 2>Right, Just a reminder, this is a job. Once again,

870
00:44:35.519 --> 00:44:37.559
<v Speaker 2>this is a job that pays money and you need

871
00:44:37.599 --> 00:44:38.920
<v Speaker 2>a PhD for it.

872
00:44:39.039 --> 00:44:41.920
<v Speaker 4>Amazing, And you ask people, you show them that what

873
00:44:41.960 --> 00:44:44.760
<v Speaker 4>it's made of is it's solid chocolate. Would you eat it?

874
00:44:44.800 --> 00:44:46.400
<v Speaker 4>And a lot of people won't bite it.

875
00:44:46.480 --> 00:44:48.320
<v Speaker 2>I know, I just the thought of it as making

876
00:44:48.320 --> 00:44:51.639
<v Speaker 2>my throat clothes. What's happening. My brain is just thinking

877
00:44:51.639 --> 00:44:54.880
<v Speaker 2>about it and saying, do not put that in your stomach.

878
00:44:55.039 --> 00:44:55.840
<v Speaker 1>Don't put it in your.

879
00:44:55.719 --> 00:44:58.719
<v Speaker 5>Stomach's And the thing about it is that we are

880
00:44:58.760 --> 00:45:01.280
<v Speaker 5>built in a way that says that if it looks

881
00:45:01.320 --> 00:45:03.800
<v Speaker 5>like an ex, it's an ex. Because in the real

882
00:45:03.800 --> 00:45:06.039
<v Speaker 5>world that's true. In the old days, if it looked

883
00:45:06.079 --> 00:45:08.440
<v Speaker 5>like a tiger, it was a tiger. So you have

884
00:45:08.519 --> 00:45:10.360
<v Speaker 5>something in your head that said, looks like dog do,

885
00:45:10.480 --> 00:45:13.119
<v Speaker 5>it is dog do? Now you know, and you bring it.

886
00:45:13.159 --> 00:45:15.599
<v Speaker 5>That's not dog do, that's chocolate. But that piece of

887
00:45:15.679 --> 00:45:17.920
<v Speaker 5>your head is saying that it looks like dog doo

888
00:45:18.039 --> 00:45:20.400
<v Speaker 5>is dog do And you know you don't want to

889
00:45:20.400 --> 00:45:20.800
<v Speaker 5>touch it.

890
00:45:21.119 --> 00:45:22.639
<v Speaker 1>How disgusted are you?

891
00:45:22.679 --> 00:45:27.159
<v Speaker 2>Because your home is immaculate, and so I wouldn't go

892
00:45:27.239 --> 00:45:31.440
<v Speaker 2>that far. Your home is beautiful and it's so well decorated.

893
00:45:31.480 --> 00:45:33.840
<v Speaker 2>Everything is in place, there's not a speck of dust anywhere.

894
00:45:33.880 --> 00:45:34.880
<v Speaker 2>You're well dressed.

895
00:45:35.519 --> 00:45:40.000
<v Speaker 4>You seem like a my home, doesn't You're resonate with me?

896
00:45:39.840 --> 00:45:44.599
<v Speaker 5>Immaculated, It's not immaculate, It's okay, yeah.

897
00:45:44.119 --> 00:45:47.239
<v Speaker 2>But are you do you fall on like the cleaner

898
00:45:47.280 --> 00:45:48.320
<v Speaker 2>side the more meticulous.

899
00:45:50.360 --> 00:45:54.000
<v Speaker 5>Generally speaking, you expect that most of the people who

900
00:45:54.039 --> 00:45:57.760
<v Speaker 5>are work in this area are relatively insensitive. Otherwise they

901
00:45:57.760 --> 00:45:59.920
<v Speaker 5>would be disgusted by their work and not do it.

902
00:46:00.440 --> 00:46:02.639
<v Speaker 5>I had a colleague who worked with me was very

903
00:46:02.679 --> 00:46:07.360
<v Speaker 5>discussed sensitive, But generally speaking, I'm not particularly discussed sensive.

904
00:46:08.119 --> 00:46:10.360
<v Speaker 5>There are some things that I don't like that are

905
00:46:10.440 --> 00:46:13.400
<v Speaker 5>a little bit disgusting, But no, I'm not discussing.

906
00:46:13.840 --> 00:46:16.440
<v Speaker 2>What's the most reliable test a lay person could take

907
00:46:16.480 --> 00:46:18.480
<v Speaker 2>to find out where they fall on the scale.

908
00:46:18.559 --> 00:46:21.800
<v Speaker 5>Well, we can start with I'm just making this up now, Okay,

909
00:46:22.320 --> 00:46:24.840
<v Speaker 5>brand new toilet paper at one end, Would you be

910
00:46:24.920 --> 00:46:26.400
<v Speaker 5>upset about blowing your.

911
00:46:26.239 --> 00:46:26.800
<v Speaker 4>Nose and that?

912
00:46:27.239 --> 00:46:31.199
<v Speaker 5>No? No, but that's one way in the extreme. Are

913
00:46:31.239 --> 00:46:34.320
<v Speaker 5>you willing to use a public toilet?

914
00:46:34.760 --> 00:46:35.119
<v Speaker 1>Sure?

915
00:46:35.400 --> 00:46:37.360
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, but there are people who are really very upset

916
00:46:37.400 --> 00:46:37.800
<v Speaker 4>about that.

917
00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:38.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

918
00:46:38.639 --> 00:46:40.599
<v Speaker 4>How about used clothing?

919
00:46:41.599 --> 00:46:44.519
<v Speaker 1>Oh sure, well I'm just wash it. Yeah, I'm just

920
00:46:44.519 --> 00:46:45.360
<v Speaker 1>thinking for myself.

921
00:46:45.440 --> 00:46:47.760
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, I don't mind any of those things.

922
00:46:48.320 --> 00:46:53.400
<v Speaker 5>But then you can get to more difficult things, some

923
00:46:53.480 --> 00:46:57.119
<v Speaker 5>things that almost everybody's disgusted by, like a fresh piece

924
00:46:57.159 --> 00:46:57.960
<v Speaker 5>of dog shit.

925
00:46:58.800 --> 00:47:01.119
<v Speaker 4>On the one hand, and the other one the other end,

926
00:47:01.159 --> 00:47:01.519
<v Speaker 4>you have.

927
00:47:01.480 --> 00:47:05.119
<v Speaker 5>This brand new toilet paper mm hm. And you could

928
00:47:05.199 --> 00:47:09.000
<v Speaker 5>just see where you stand. But there's a very wide range.

929
00:47:09.280 --> 00:47:12.880
<v Speaker 5>This is something that people are all over the place

930
00:47:12.960 --> 00:47:13.920
<v Speaker 5>on just.

931
00:47:13.840 --> 00:47:17.480
<v Speaker 2>This morning, the same morning this will air. Because we hustle,

932
00:47:17.519 --> 00:47:20.000
<v Speaker 2>our bustles here, Jarrett and I went to a park

933
00:47:20.079 --> 00:47:22.880
<v Speaker 2>and we decided to spend some special married romantic time

934
00:47:23.199 --> 00:47:27.280
<v Speaker 2>sipping coffee and taking this discussed scale quiz, which was

935
00:47:27.320 --> 00:47:30.119
<v Speaker 2>co authored by this week's guest in nineteen ninety four.

936
00:47:30.159 --> 00:47:31.920
<v Speaker 1>So we sat down at a park table. We got

937
00:47:31.920 --> 00:47:32.280
<v Speaker 1>to work.

938
00:47:32.480 --> 00:47:36.719
<v Speaker 3>All right, are you ready?

939
00:47:37.039 --> 00:47:40.679
<v Speaker 7>Yes, let's gree r. Are you recording this?

940
00:47:41.119 --> 00:47:42.360
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? You are you recording?

941
00:47:42.639 --> 00:47:44.119
<v Speaker 4>Okay? You guys sign up? Great?

942
00:47:44.920 --> 00:47:45.719
<v Speaker 3>Okay.

943
00:47:46.119 --> 00:47:48.159
<v Speaker 2>Please indicate how much you agree with each of the

944
00:47:48.159 --> 00:47:51.000
<v Speaker 2>following statements, or how true it is about you. Right,

945
00:47:51.000 --> 00:47:55.119
<v Speaker 2>a number zero four zero strongly disagreed for strongly agreeing.

946
00:47:55.159 --> 00:47:57.800
<v Speaker 3>Okay, So the higher the number, the more you agree.

947
00:47:58.400 --> 00:48:03.199
<v Speaker 2>I might be willing to eating monkey meat under some circumstances.

948
00:48:04.440 --> 00:48:09.440
<v Speaker 8>M I would I would say, I guess three. I'm

949
00:48:09.519 --> 00:48:11.519
<v Speaker 8>really opposed to eating monkey meat.

950
00:48:12.400 --> 00:48:14.679
<v Speaker 7>But I can Oh. That squirrel just did a backward

951
00:48:14.679 --> 00:48:16.480
<v Speaker 7>summersault while he was trying to eat a stick. It

952
00:48:16.559 --> 00:48:17.280
<v Speaker 7>was really cute.

953
00:48:17.360 --> 00:48:21.679
<v Speaker 8>Sorry, I can imagine circumstances.

954
00:48:21.920 --> 00:48:22.760
<v Speaker 4>Don't say that.

955
00:48:24.800 --> 00:48:28.039
<v Speaker 7>Because I'm adhd and I can't find my pills this morning. Squirrel,

956
00:48:28.880 --> 00:48:30.159
<v Speaker 7>Oh my god, dude.

957
00:48:34.599 --> 00:48:40.519
<v Speaker 8>Okay, I can't imagine a circumstance. Or someone would be like,

958
00:48:40.719 --> 00:48:43.239
<v Speaker 8>we're eating this monkey. It's, you know, a thing that

959
00:48:43.280 --> 00:48:46.480
<v Speaker 8>we do. And I go, I guess when? And round?

960
00:48:46.840 --> 00:48:49.440
<v Speaker 3>Okay, I had a three too, all right, we can't

961
00:48:49.480 --> 00:48:50.039
<v Speaker 3>go through all.

962
00:48:49.960 --> 00:48:51.239
<v Speaker 7>Of these bothers me.

963
00:48:51.320 --> 00:48:55.360
<v Speaker 8>To hear someone clear throat full of mucus, strongly strongly

964
00:48:55.400 --> 00:48:56.480
<v Speaker 8>agree weird.

965
00:48:57.679 --> 00:48:59.519
<v Speaker 7>I would go out of my way to avoid walking

966
00:48:59.559 --> 00:49:00.880
<v Speaker 7>through a great m.

967
00:49:03.480 --> 00:49:03.719
<v Speaker 4>Two.

968
00:49:04.599 --> 00:49:07.000
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I used to have panic attacks when I

969
00:49:07.039 --> 00:49:09.840
<v Speaker 2>was a kid going through graveyards driving eye one because

970
00:49:09.880 --> 00:49:11.639
<v Speaker 2>I used to have nightmares with bodies coming out of

971
00:49:11.679 --> 00:49:12.039
<v Speaker 2>the ground.

972
00:49:12.079 --> 00:49:13.360
<v Speaker 3>Anyway, watch culture.

973
00:49:14.280 --> 00:49:16.639
<v Speaker 8>Seeing a cockroach in someone else's house doesn't bother me.

974
00:49:17.480 --> 00:49:19.840
<v Speaker 8>Mildly disagree, strongly.

975
00:49:19.519 --> 00:49:22.039
<v Speaker 2>Disagree It would bother me tremendously to touch a dead

976
00:49:22.079 --> 00:49:23.360
<v Speaker 2>body too.

977
00:49:24.079 --> 00:49:25.119
<v Speaker 3>Strongly disagree.

978
00:49:25.199 --> 00:49:27.920
<v Speaker 2>If you have been raised Catholic, you have touched I've

979
00:49:27.960 --> 00:49:30.519
<v Speaker 2>touched so many dead bodies because you you know, kiss

980
00:49:30.679 --> 00:49:31.800
<v Speaker 2>their cheek or put your.

981
00:49:31.719 --> 00:49:34.079
<v Speaker 3>Hand on them. Really an open casket thing. Yeah, I've

982
00:49:34.119 --> 00:49:35.800
<v Speaker 3>touched at least three or four dead bodies.

983
00:49:35.960 --> 00:49:37.920
<v Speaker 8>I probably would not go to my favorite restaurant if

984
00:49:37.920 --> 00:49:39.840
<v Speaker 8>I found out that the cook had a cold.

985
00:49:40.039 --> 00:49:41.639
<v Speaker 7>A cold or COVID.

986
00:49:41.960 --> 00:49:43.440
<v Speaker 3>Because that's real different.

987
00:49:44.000 --> 00:49:45.639
<v Speaker 2>It would not upset me at all to watch a

988
00:49:45.639 --> 00:49:47.719
<v Speaker 2>person with a glass eye take the eye out of

989
00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:48.480
<v Speaker 2>the socket.

990
00:49:48.519 --> 00:49:50.480
<v Speaker 3>It would not upset me. It would bother me to

991
00:49:50.519 --> 00:49:52.719
<v Speaker 3>see a rat run across my path and apart.

992
00:49:53.000 --> 00:49:54.719
<v Speaker 7>Strongly disagree, don't give a shirt.

993
00:49:55.800 --> 00:49:59.519
<v Speaker 2>Mildly disagree. I would rather eat a piece of fruit

994
00:49:59.519 --> 00:50:00.559
<v Speaker 2>that a piece paper.

995
00:50:00.880 --> 00:50:02.639
<v Speaker 7>I strongly agree with that.

996
00:50:08.639 --> 00:50:10.280
<v Speaker 2>At the end, it's gonna be like, please eat the

997
00:50:10.280 --> 00:50:12.880
<v Speaker 2>piece of paper. Okay, even if I was hungry, I

998
00:50:12.880 --> 00:50:14.840
<v Speaker 2>would not drink a bowl of my favorite soup if

999
00:50:14.840 --> 00:50:18.199
<v Speaker 2>it had been stirred by a used but thoroughly washed

1000
00:50:18.239 --> 00:50:18.920
<v Speaker 2>fly swater.

1001
00:50:19.320 --> 00:50:22.039
<v Speaker 7>I strongly I would do it. If it was washed,

1002
00:50:22.599 --> 00:50:23.880
<v Speaker 7>I would not drink it.

1003
00:50:23.880 --> 00:50:25.480
<v Speaker 8>It would bother me to sleep in a night hotel

1004
00:50:25.599 --> 00:50:26.840
<v Speaker 8>if I knew that a man had died of a

1005
00:50:26.840 --> 00:50:28.559
<v Speaker 8>heart attack in that room the night before.

1006
00:50:31.559 --> 00:50:33.199
<v Speaker 3>Wildly agree, mildly agree.

1007
00:50:33.320 --> 00:50:36.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you see maggots on a piece of meat in

1008
00:50:36.639 --> 00:50:38.239
<v Speaker 2>an outdoor garbage pail.

1009
00:50:39.599 --> 00:50:43.880
<v Speaker 7>Moderately that's very disgusting. It's still very disgusting.

1010
00:50:43.920 --> 00:50:44.639
<v Speaker 4>It just dands.

1011
00:50:45.079 --> 00:50:47.519
<v Speaker 3>I would say moderately disgusting because I like bugs.

1012
00:50:47.559 --> 00:50:49.679
<v Speaker 8>While you're walking through a tunnel under a railroad track,

1013
00:50:49.719 --> 00:50:51.320
<v Speaker 8>you smell urine.

1014
00:50:52.000 --> 00:50:54.440
<v Speaker 7>That's just living in the city, babe. But it's still moderately.

1015
00:50:54.480 --> 00:50:58.960
<v Speaker 8>Discussing your friend's pet cat dies and you have to

1016
00:50:58.960 --> 00:51:01.599
<v Speaker 8>pick up the dead body with your bare hands.

1017
00:51:01.599 --> 00:51:04.320
<v Speaker 7>Slightly disgusting. Well, how recently dead is it?

1018
00:51:04.559 --> 00:51:07.079
<v Speaker 2>I would say, not disgusting at all, because it's my

1019
00:51:07.119 --> 00:51:08.800
<v Speaker 2>friend's cat, and so it's an act of love.

1020
00:51:09.159 --> 00:51:09.480
<v Speaker 4>That's fine.

1021
00:51:09.480 --> 00:51:11.079
<v Speaker 7>I'm do zero too. I think I'm gonna go with

1022
00:51:11.159 --> 00:51:12.079
<v Speaker 7>a resently dead cat.

1023
00:51:12.159 --> 00:51:15.960
<v Speaker 2>Look at this next one. You see someone put ketchup

1024
00:51:15.960 --> 00:51:17.760
<v Speaker 2>on vanilla ice cream and eat it. That, to me

1025
00:51:17.880 --> 00:51:20.800
<v Speaker 2>is one of the most disgusting things that I've seen here.

1026
00:51:21.280 --> 00:51:21.840
<v Speaker 7>That's a funny.

1027
00:51:22.280 --> 00:51:22.800
<v Speaker 3>That's a four.

1028
00:51:23.639 --> 00:51:26.239
<v Speaker 8>A four for you because I appreciate how weird it is,

1029
00:51:26.280 --> 00:51:27.920
<v Speaker 8>but I'd be like, I ve a lot of weird stuff.

1030
00:51:28.039 --> 00:51:31.000
<v Speaker 3>It's jam. It's jam because it's fruit, sugar and spices.

1031
00:51:31.119 --> 00:51:32.199
<v Speaker 7>It's like strawberry syrup.

1032
00:51:32.639 --> 00:51:33.760
<v Speaker 3>It's disgusting to me.

1033
00:51:34.000 --> 00:51:36.360
<v Speaker 2>You discover that a friend of yours changes underwear only

1034
00:51:36.400 --> 00:51:37.840
<v Speaker 2>once a week, that's a three.

1035
00:51:37.920 --> 00:51:38.760
<v Speaker 7>That's very disgusting.

1036
00:51:38.880 --> 00:51:44.639
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I hope that it's I hope it's circumstantial and

1037
00:51:44.679 --> 00:51:47.000
<v Speaker 2>not habitual or philosophical.

1038
00:51:47.360 --> 00:51:50.320
<v Speaker 3>You're walking barefoot on concrete and you step on an earthworm.

1039
00:51:50.440 --> 00:51:52.000
<v Speaker 7>I do find that extremely disgusting.

1040
00:51:53.199 --> 00:51:55.920
<v Speaker 3>Okay, so here we go. Finally add up all your

1041
00:51:55.960 --> 00:51:58.360
<v Speaker 3>responses to all twenty five, and the total will be

1042
00:51:58.400 --> 00:52:06.679
<v Speaker 3>a number between zero in one. Ah, I'm so curious.

1043
00:52:06.880 --> 00:52:07.920
<v Speaker 4>Okay, what's yours?

1044
00:52:08.119 --> 00:52:08.960
<v Speaker 7>I got forty one.

1045
00:52:09.079 --> 00:52:11.000
<v Speaker 3>Oh, I got forty eight, pretty.

1046
00:52:10.760 --> 00:52:12.920
<v Speaker 7>Close, pretty close. Thus we're in the lower end of

1047
00:52:13.000 --> 00:52:13.920
<v Speaker 7>disgusted people.

1048
00:52:14.400 --> 00:52:16.280
<v Speaker 2>Those sirens are not coming from the road if you're

1049
00:52:16.360 --> 00:52:17.159
<v Speaker 2>driving that was in the.

1050
00:52:17.079 --> 00:52:22.840
<v Speaker 8>Park's Yeah, they're coming for us for being gross.

1051
00:52:25.480 --> 00:52:28.599
<v Speaker 2>So forty eight to forty one. Perhaps we're gonna make

1052
00:52:28.639 --> 00:52:31.760
<v Speaker 2>it in this big disgusting adventure we call life.

1053
00:52:32.239 --> 00:52:36.000
<v Speaker 5>And it's important to know this because, for example, if

1054
00:52:36.000 --> 00:52:37.519
<v Speaker 5>you marry someone.

1055
00:52:37.719 --> 00:52:38.920
<v Speaker 4>Right, are you married?

1056
00:52:39.119 --> 00:52:43.400
<v Speaker 2>I am, and I'm married to an absolutely gorgeous, wonderful slob.

1057
00:52:43.960 --> 00:52:46.000
<v Speaker 2>I'm an. I would say I'm normal. I've got normal

1058
00:52:46.039 --> 00:52:49.440
<v Speaker 2>to net and my beautiful, amazing husband. It looks like

1059
00:52:49.440 --> 00:52:51.480
<v Speaker 2>a bomb went off in his car. And for more

1060
00:52:51.519 --> 00:52:54.599
<v Speaker 2>on ADHD, you can see the Attention Deficit Neuropsychology two

1061
00:52:54.639 --> 00:52:59.159
<v Speaker 2>part episode with World ADHD expert doctor Russell Barkley, as

1062
00:52:59.199 --> 00:53:02.320
<v Speaker 2>well as part two two which has how to adhds

1063
00:53:02.440 --> 00:53:05.920
<v Speaker 2>Chesscome a Cave and Renee Brooks of Black Girl Lost Keys,

1064
00:53:05.960 --> 00:53:08.519
<v Speaker 2>and we also discuss really great resources and books for

1065
00:53:08.559 --> 00:53:11.199
<v Speaker 2>folks who have ADHD and how their family and friends

1066
00:53:11.239 --> 00:53:12.920
<v Speaker 2>can learn to stop getting mad at them all the

1067
00:53:12.960 --> 00:53:15.159
<v Speaker 2>time for the way that their brain works. He says

1068
00:53:15.199 --> 00:53:17.559
<v Speaker 2>he's messy, but he's not dirty. He hates filth, but

1069
00:53:17.599 --> 00:53:18.199
<v Speaker 2>he doesn't mind.

1070
00:53:18.239 --> 00:53:25.000
<v Speaker 5>Well, that's right, Messiness is not really disgusting, Okay. I

1071
00:53:25.039 --> 00:53:27.760
<v Speaker 5>mean to most people who are not that sensitive that

1072
00:53:28.199 --> 00:53:31.559
<v Speaker 5>you see that as disorder, but it's not the same thing.

1073
00:53:32.079 --> 00:53:36.039
<v Speaker 2>Like he changes into inside slippers when he gets in

1074
00:53:36.039 --> 00:53:38.000
<v Speaker 2>the house. He will not wear outside things into the house.

1075
00:53:38.039 --> 00:53:39.559
<v Speaker 2>And as soon as he gets home from the gym,

1076
00:53:40.000 --> 00:53:41.760
<v Speaker 2>he washes his clothes and takes a shower.

1077
00:53:42.159 --> 00:53:44.400
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, okay, but you see so there are lots of

1078
00:53:44.440 --> 00:53:48.039
<v Speaker 5>people who are disordered in their possessions but very.

1079
00:53:47.880 --> 00:53:48.639
<v Speaker 4>Clean m hm.

1080
00:53:49.079 --> 00:53:50.639
<v Speaker 1>I prefer everything orderly.

1081
00:53:50.840 --> 00:53:54.519
<v Speaker 2>But my office shed is home to at least seven

1082
00:53:54.760 --> 00:53:57.920
<v Speaker 2>a live spiders live in their best lives, just in

1083
00:53:57.960 --> 00:54:01.800
<v Speaker 2>these dusty webs full of dead bug husks. And my

1084
00:54:01.960 --> 00:54:06.119
<v Speaker 2>husband he does a much better job of scrubbing dishes

1085
00:54:06.440 --> 00:54:09.760
<v Speaker 2>and floors and vacuuming. Yet he does not mind at

1086
00:54:09.800 --> 00:54:12.119
<v Speaker 2>all if his desk looks like it was rated by

1087
00:54:12.199 --> 00:54:14.119
<v Speaker 2>vikings who are looking for a pen.

1088
00:54:14.800 --> 00:54:17.280
<v Speaker 5>If you're married to somebody who's very different from you

1089
00:54:17.360 --> 00:54:21.440
<v Speaker 5>and discuss, you'll have great problems with sharing a bathroom, right.

1090
00:54:21.599 --> 00:54:24.280
<v Speaker 5>For example, that's the you are not discussed that you'll

1091
00:54:24.360 --> 00:54:28.039
<v Speaker 5>use is now sure, and he would never use yours,

1092
00:54:28.119 --> 00:54:29.639
<v Speaker 5>right and gets really.

1093
00:54:29.480 --> 00:54:30.440
<v Speaker 4>Upset when you do that.

1094
00:54:30.559 --> 00:54:33.159
<v Speaker 5>And there's a lot of areas where you could have

1095
00:54:33.239 --> 00:54:35.920
<v Speaker 5>difficulty with people. It's all having to do with washing

1096
00:54:35.960 --> 00:54:39.119
<v Speaker 5>dishes and all kinds of stuff. Where I mean, if

1097
00:54:39.159 --> 00:54:42.320
<v Speaker 5>the extreme, you'd want your own silverware, hm, not to

1098
00:54:42.360 --> 00:54:44.039
<v Speaker 5>have anyone else's mouth, that's sure.

1099
00:54:44.320 --> 00:54:46.159
<v Speaker 2>It's interesting that We go out to eat all the

1100
00:54:46.199 --> 00:54:48.000
<v Speaker 2>time and don't even think about the fact that this

1101
00:54:48.039 --> 00:54:49.760
<v Speaker 2>fork was in someone else's mouth an hour ago.

1102
00:54:49.840 --> 00:54:50.760
<v Speaker 1>We don't even think about it.

1103
00:54:50.880 --> 00:54:53.559
<v Speaker 5>That's right, Well, that's the way we get around this. Yeah,

1104
00:54:53.599 --> 00:54:55.480
<v Speaker 5>we don't think about it. We don't think about the

1105
00:54:55.599 --> 00:54:57.920
<v Speaker 5>chair that we're sitting in in the restaurant at a

1106
00:54:57.920 --> 00:55:02.119
<v Speaker 5>butt of someone else's stuff against it. We don't think

1107
00:55:02.159 --> 00:55:05.119
<v Speaker 5>of the people in the kitchen, right and what they're

1108
00:55:05.119 --> 00:55:08.159
<v Speaker 5>doing with the food, you know, are they sweating into it?

1109
00:55:08.199 --> 00:55:10.920
<v Speaker 5>Who knows what they're doing unless something it hits us

1110
00:55:10.960 --> 00:55:13.519
<v Speaker 5>in the face, we don't think about it too much.

1111
00:55:13.960 --> 00:55:17.400
<v Speaker 2>Well, what about disorders like obsessive compulsive disorder And I

1112
00:55:17.440 --> 00:55:20.880
<v Speaker 2>know we people throw around OCD like I'm so OCD,

1113
00:55:20.960 --> 00:55:23.039
<v Speaker 2>but it's an actual, real disorder that doesn't.

1114
00:55:22.920 --> 00:55:25.760
<v Speaker 4>Absolutely but a lot right discuss sensitivity.

1115
00:55:25.800 --> 00:55:29.199
<v Speaker 5>There's a wide range of sensitivity and a lot of

1116
00:55:29.199 --> 00:55:31.079
<v Speaker 5>people are OCD.

1117
00:55:30.880 --> 00:55:31.840
<v Speaker 4>Ish, but they're not really.

1118
00:55:31.880 --> 00:55:34.639
<v Speaker 5>They don't meet clinical criteria, but they have some of

1119
00:55:34.679 --> 00:55:38.360
<v Speaker 5>the features, one of the features being cleanliness. It's not

1120
00:55:38.559 --> 00:55:41.679
<v Speaker 5>the only thing. One form of OCD has to do

1121
00:55:41.800 --> 00:55:43.800
<v Speaker 5>with hyper cleanliness.

1122
00:55:43.239 --> 00:55:45.400
<v Speaker 2>And fun fact, that's not the only type of OCD.

1123
00:55:45.679 --> 00:55:48.440
<v Speaker 2>This is a giant misconception. So there are other subtypes

1124
00:55:48.480 --> 00:55:53.320
<v Speaker 2>that involve symmetry and relationship questioning and sexuality questioning or

1125
00:55:53.400 --> 00:55:57.840
<v Speaker 2>intrusive or distressing thoughts like imagining violen scenarios or strict

1126
00:55:57.880 --> 00:56:01.840
<v Speaker 2>adherence to a moral code, and a distressing level of

1127
00:56:01.880 --> 00:56:06.559
<v Speaker 2>perfectionism is under that OCD umbrella as an obsession and

1128
00:56:06.679 --> 00:56:09.599
<v Speaker 2>compulsions are the behaviors repeated to try to feel better

1129
00:56:09.679 --> 00:56:12.199
<v Speaker 2>or to mitigate the anxiety, and those can range from

1130
00:56:12.639 --> 00:56:15.679
<v Speaker 2>washing hands to checking on things like locks or stoves,

1131
00:56:15.880 --> 00:56:20.519
<v Speaker 2>to just avoidance that looks like procrastination or seeking reassurance

1132
00:56:20.599 --> 00:56:22.920
<v Speaker 2>to make sure that you're not an asshole. And a

1133
00:56:22.960 --> 00:56:25.559
<v Speaker 2>lot of people have OCD behaviors that they may not

1134
00:56:25.599 --> 00:56:28.559
<v Speaker 2>even recognize because we're so used to just thinking of like, oh,

1135
00:56:29.039 --> 00:56:31.800
<v Speaker 2>everything has to be really clean, but it's encouraging to

1136
00:56:31.840 --> 00:56:34.079
<v Speaker 2>know that it can get better with the right help.

1137
00:56:34.480 --> 00:56:36.440
<v Speaker 2>Is there something Is there a part of the brain

1138
00:56:36.480 --> 00:56:40.880
<v Speaker 2>that's firing excessively in folks who are afflicted with OCD.

1139
00:56:41.320 --> 00:56:43.480
<v Speaker 5>I don't know, yeah, And I don't know if you

1140
00:56:43.480 --> 00:56:46.440
<v Speaker 5>could separate clean versus I mean, there are people who

1141
00:56:46.440 --> 00:56:50.039
<v Speaker 5>are OCD about nothing to do with discussed about the

1142
00:56:50.519 --> 00:56:51.199
<v Speaker 5>door being.

1143
00:56:51.039 --> 00:56:53.760
<v Speaker 4>Locked, you know, six times to make sure.

1144
00:56:54.159 --> 00:56:58.760
<v Speaker 5>That's very different in its manifestation from a discussed kind

1145
00:56:58.760 --> 00:57:01.519
<v Speaker 5>of OCD, but I both have the property of being

1146
00:57:02.079 --> 00:57:04.039
<v Speaker 5>repetitive overwhelming concern.

1147
00:57:04.519 --> 00:57:06.840
<v Speaker 2>I was looking at some brand new research from June

1148
00:57:06.880 --> 00:57:09.199
<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty three out of the University of Cambridge which

1149
00:57:09.239 --> 00:57:12.960
<v Speaker 2>found that OCD sufferers had higher levels of glutamate and

1150
00:57:13.039 --> 00:57:16.599
<v Speaker 2>lower levels of GABBA in the interior singular cortex part

1151
00:57:16.639 --> 00:57:19.440
<v Speaker 2>of the brain compared to people without OCD, and the

1152
00:57:19.519 --> 00:57:22.800
<v Speaker 2>severity of symptoms correlated to the amount of glutamate in

1153
00:57:22.840 --> 00:57:23.159
<v Speaker 2>the brain.

1154
00:57:23.320 --> 00:57:24.599
<v Speaker 1>And they also found that.

1155
00:57:24.519 --> 00:57:28.760
<v Speaker 2>Those with OCD like behaviors but not clinical OCD, have

1156
00:57:29.000 --> 00:57:31.760
<v Speaker 2>increased glutamate levels in one of the brain regions. Now,

1157
00:57:31.920 --> 00:57:36.400
<v Speaker 2>exposure and response prevention and more general cognitive behavioral therapy

1158
00:57:36.440 --> 00:57:39.599
<v Speaker 2>as well as SSRIs have shown to be effective treatments,

1159
00:57:39.760 --> 00:57:42.880
<v Speaker 2>but some psychiatrists are starting to use limchdahl or its

1160
00:57:43.000 --> 00:57:47.079
<v Speaker 2>generic form lamotrogen, which is an anti seizure medication, as

1161
00:57:47.119 --> 00:57:51.159
<v Speaker 2>an off label OCD therapy because it inhibits the release

1162
00:57:51.320 --> 00:57:54.280
<v Speaker 2>of glutamate in the brain, which is interesting stuff either way.

1163
00:57:54.400 --> 00:57:56.880
<v Speaker 2>I love my brain, I love your brain. And for

1164
00:57:57.000 --> 00:58:00.360
<v Speaker 2>other neurodivergent folks. This other study recently came out titled

1165
00:58:00.440 --> 00:58:04.559
<v Speaker 2>Disgust Processing and Potential Relationships with behaviors in Autism, and

1166
00:58:04.599 --> 00:58:08.320
<v Speaker 2>that explains that in autism there is evidence for differences

1167
00:58:08.360 --> 00:58:12.320
<v Speaker 2>in physical disgust processing, and research indicates that autistic folks

1168
00:58:12.599 --> 00:58:17.280
<v Speaker 2>may have higher more much lower sensory capabilities around certain things.

1169
00:58:17.320 --> 00:58:20.159
<v Speaker 2>So if you're on the spectrum and there are specific

1170
00:58:20.239 --> 00:58:23.320
<v Speaker 2>textures or tastes that like really give you the squicks

1171
00:58:23.519 --> 00:58:26.719
<v Speaker 2>and then others you're totally chilled with, that's common and

1172
00:58:26.920 --> 00:58:29.239
<v Speaker 2>it may make you more in depth at certain activities.

1173
00:58:29.280 --> 00:58:32.280
<v Speaker 2>And we all have individual thresholds and we can use

1174
00:58:32.320 --> 00:58:35.360
<v Speaker 2>them to our advantage instead of just being shamed to conforming.

1175
00:58:35.880 --> 00:58:39.599
<v Speaker 5>Doctors are probably and nurses are probably less discussed sensitive

1176
00:58:39.840 --> 00:58:41.159
<v Speaker 5>because they wouldn't have gone.

1177
00:58:40.960 --> 00:58:41.880
<v Speaker 4>Into that right.

1178
00:58:41.880 --> 00:58:45.639
<v Speaker 5>We want to deal with bodies. Yeah, so you get

1179
00:58:45.679 --> 00:58:50.840
<v Speaker 5>a lot of preselection. Extensive experience can make you more

1180
00:58:50.920 --> 00:58:53.159
<v Speaker 5>tolerance or more sensitized.

1181
00:58:53.320 --> 00:58:56.079
<v Speaker 1>Because you overcame it, your sensitivity could go down.

1182
00:58:56.280 --> 00:58:59.800
<v Speaker 5>And that's one of the issues in treating phobias. One

1183
00:59:00.079 --> 00:59:03.920
<v Speaker 5>treatment is to desensitize you to keep exposure to very

1184
00:59:03.920 --> 00:59:06.760
<v Speaker 5>weak forms of your phobia graduated. You know, there is

1185
00:59:07.159 --> 00:59:11.159
<v Speaker 5>exposure to a maximum form which could be dramatic in it,

1186
00:59:11.400 --> 00:59:14.280
<v Speaker 5>but in some cases at least it makes you, you know,

1187
00:59:14.719 --> 00:59:18.280
<v Speaker 5>you overcome the wobia, so you know you can go

1188
00:59:18.320 --> 00:59:21.679
<v Speaker 5>into a room full of spiders if you're spiderphobic.

1189
00:59:22.400 --> 00:59:24.440
<v Speaker 2>I would love a room full of spiders. I have

1190
00:59:24.519 --> 00:59:26.159
<v Speaker 2>put myself in a room full of spiders.

1191
00:59:26.480 --> 00:59:27.599
<v Speaker 1>See my office.

1192
00:59:28.039 --> 00:59:28.920
<v Speaker 4>You like to love it?

1193
00:59:29.000 --> 00:59:29.440
<v Speaker 1>I love them.

1194
00:59:29.480 --> 00:59:32.599
<v Speaker 2>I volunteered at a spider pavilion at the museum, free

1195
00:59:32.679 --> 00:59:33.599
<v Speaker 2>range spiders everywhere.

1196
00:59:33.599 --> 00:59:36.760
<v Speaker 5>We spiders run by the way. Because spiders and snakes

1197
00:59:37.119 --> 00:59:39.039
<v Speaker 5>are a mixture of fear and disgust.

1198
00:59:39.679 --> 00:59:41.400
<v Speaker 1>Oh that's a lot of point people.

1199
00:59:41.800 --> 00:59:44.320
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, an earthworm is sort of discussed.

1200
00:59:44.679 --> 00:59:47.719
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, it's not threatening, but a spider and snakes are

1201
00:59:48.320 --> 00:59:50.880
<v Speaker 5>dry sort of you know, they don't have that moist

1202
00:59:50.960 --> 00:59:53.559
<v Speaker 5>quality that goes along with disgusted.

1203
00:59:54.000 --> 00:59:55.760
<v Speaker 4>Anyway, are we discussing what you want?

1204
00:59:56.039 --> 00:59:57.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Can I ask you questions from listeners?

1205
00:59:58.719 --> 00:59:59.039
<v Speaker 4>Sure?

1206
00:59:59.199 --> 01:00:02.679
<v Speaker 2>They know that you're coming on, and they submitted questions

1207
01:00:02.719 --> 01:00:03.400
<v Speaker 2>for me to ask you.

1208
01:00:03.519 --> 01:00:05.639
<v Speaker 4>Oh sure, gods it's just spun on doing.

1209
01:00:05.559 --> 01:00:06.440
<v Speaker 1>Okay, good, okay.

1210
01:00:06.440 --> 01:00:08.039
<v Speaker 2>But before we get to questions, a quick break and

1211
01:00:08.079 --> 01:00:10.320
<v Speaker 2>a donation to a cause of the ologists choosing, and

1212
01:00:10.400 --> 01:00:12.800
<v Speaker 2>doctor Rosin would like it to go to Philadelphia's Interact

1213
01:00:12.840 --> 01:00:16.880
<v Speaker 2>Theater Company, which is dedicated to commissioning, developing, and processing

1214
01:00:16.960 --> 01:00:20.880
<v Speaker 2>new and contemporary plays that explore the social, political, and

1215
01:00:20.920 --> 01:00:23.599
<v Speaker 2>cultural issues of our time. So they're doing great work,

1216
01:00:23.639 --> 01:00:25.679
<v Speaker 2>so we'll send a donation in there. And we'll also

1217
01:00:25.679 --> 01:00:27.960
<v Speaker 2>send a donation to the International OCD Foundation, since we

1218
01:00:28.039 --> 01:00:29.800
<v Speaker 2>talked about them so much, who's working to clear up

1219
01:00:29.840 --> 01:00:33.199
<v Speaker 2>misconceptions about obsessive compulsive disorder, saying we know it can

1220
01:00:33.239 --> 01:00:35.800
<v Speaker 2>be difficult for members of the OCD and related disorders

1221
01:00:35.800 --> 01:00:39.239
<v Speaker 2>community to hear the term OCD misused, which can belittle

1222
01:00:39.320 --> 01:00:42.559
<v Speaker 2>the disorder and contribute to stigma that prevents many people

1223
01:00:42.559 --> 01:00:45.559
<v Speaker 2>from seeking treatment. And the International OCD Foundation provides resources

1224
01:00:45.559 --> 01:00:47.519
<v Speaker 2>for learning and treatment. So donations will go to both

1225
01:00:47.559 --> 01:00:49.639
<v Speaker 2>of those groups. Thank you to sponsors of the show

1226
01:00:49.679 --> 01:00:52.280
<v Speaker 2>for making that possible. Now, if you're a patron at

1227
01:00:52.320 --> 01:00:54.679
<v Speaker 2>patreon dot com slash ologies, you get the inside track

1228
01:00:54.760 --> 01:00:57.719
<v Speaker 2>to send questions before we record, and many of you

1229
01:00:58.079 --> 01:01:03.039
<v Speaker 2>had this insider question, including Andrew Devlin, Caitlin Palall, Scott Sheldon, TJ.

1230
01:01:03.119 --> 01:01:04.320
<v Speaker 1>McKenna and Nicole climb In.

1231
01:01:04.719 --> 01:01:07.880
<v Speaker 2>Okay, several wanted to know if you've seen the movie

1232
01:01:07.960 --> 01:01:10.920
<v Speaker 2>Inside Out by Pixar, which has a character named disgust.

1233
01:01:11.599 --> 01:01:13.119
<v Speaker 1>No, you gotta see it.

1234
01:01:13.119 --> 01:01:14.760
<v Speaker 4>It's inside Out.

1235
01:01:15.119 --> 01:01:19.480
<v Speaker 5>This is discussed, whether advising on your social life or

1236
01:01:19.559 --> 01:01:22.519
<v Speaker 5>on life little messes discussed?

1237
01:01:22.639 --> 01:01:23.280
<v Speaker 6>Is there too?

1238
01:01:23.880 --> 01:01:30.920
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, it's a Pixar movie, and they represent emotions

1239
01:01:31.639 --> 01:01:34.159
<v Speaker 2>and one of the I think one of the emotions

1240
01:01:34.199 --> 01:01:36.840
<v Speaker 2>is discussed. Sorry everyone, okay, but I did look up

1241
01:01:37.159 --> 01:01:40.760
<v Speaker 2>that Pixar artists wanted really strong colors to represent those

1242
01:01:40.800 --> 01:01:43.519
<v Speaker 2>six core emotions, and that red seemed like a winner

1243
01:01:43.719 --> 01:01:44.280
<v Speaker 2>for anger.

1244
01:01:44.800 --> 01:01:46.119
<v Speaker 1>Sadness was blue, of.

1245
01:01:46.000 --> 01:01:48.639
<v Speaker 2>Course, and then discussed, which was voiced by Mindy Kayling,

1246
01:01:49.039 --> 01:01:51.719
<v Speaker 2>was a green color because, as the designers put it,

1247
01:01:51.760 --> 01:01:54.519
<v Speaker 2>when you see green food, it kind of indicates that

1248
01:01:54.559 --> 01:01:57.079
<v Speaker 2>it's gone bad. So let this be a reminder right

1249
01:01:57.119 --> 01:01:59.679
<v Speaker 2>now to just go grab your leftovers from the office

1250
01:01:59.719 --> 01:02:02.400
<v Speaker 2>for before it starts to smell like Satan's out house

1251
01:02:02.400 --> 01:02:04.519
<v Speaker 2>in there. Do it for everyone. But of course, not

1252
01:02:04.639 --> 01:02:08.440
<v Speaker 2>all disgusted is food related, and not all things trigger

1253
01:02:08.519 --> 01:02:11.920
<v Speaker 2>disgust in everyone. And then I raise my eyebrows at you.

1254
01:02:12.320 --> 01:02:14.840
<v Speaker 1>Jadine Lannon wants to know what's the deal with things

1255
01:02:14.840 --> 01:02:17.880
<v Speaker 1>that are normatively disgusting or taboo, like you're in blood

1256
01:02:17.880 --> 01:02:19.880
<v Speaker 1>feces becoming sexual fetishes.

1257
01:02:20.079 --> 01:02:23.480
<v Speaker 5>Okay, Well, first of all, we have the phenomenon, which

1258
01:02:23.599 --> 01:02:28.480
<v Speaker 5>really hasn't been studied much of disgusting features of a

1259
01:02:28.559 --> 01:02:35.280
<v Speaker 5>person becoming attractive in romantic relationships. Now, when you kiss,

1260
01:02:35.360 --> 01:02:40.559
<v Speaker 5>things exchanged saliva. But that's not salient. I mean, if

1261
01:02:40.559 --> 01:02:42.960
<v Speaker 5>you think about it, it's happening, but that's not what

1262
01:02:43.159 --> 01:02:47.400
<v Speaker 5>makes it, m M a pleasure generally speak. Well, okay,

1263
01:02:47.679 --> 01:02:52.599
<v Speaker 5>so let's just take something imagineal odor Okay, is appealing

1264
01:02:52.719 --> 01:02:55.480
<v Speaker 5>to some people, sure, disgusting to others.

1265
01:02:56.039 --> 01:02:59.280
<v Speaker 4>There are people who will not do kind of lingus

1266
01:03:00.360 --> 01:03:03.840
<v Speaker 4>males feel bad and.

1267
01:03:03.800 --> 01:03:07.199
<v Speaker 5>There are others who love it. And similarly, I think

1268
01:03:07.440 --> 01:03:11.559
<v Speaker 5>of females with falatio. Not only it's more interesting discust wise,

1269
01:03:11.679 --> 01:03:18.199
<v Speaker 5>because it's voice. Yeah, so that's a big difference right off.

1270
01:03:18.440 --> 01:03:19.679
<v Speaker 4>In response to this.

1271
01:03:19.599 --> 01:03:22.360
<v Speaker 2>Question, Listen, you can do whatever you're comfortable with. It's

1272
01:03:22.400 --> 01:03:25.159
<v Speaker 2>your body. But if you're very famous and you talk

1273
01:03:25.440 --> 01:03:28.920
<v Speaker 2>about it on a morning Zoo radio program, don't expect

1274
01:03:28.920 --> 01:03:30.679
<v Speaker 2>people to hold their opinions.

1275
01:03:30.840 --> 01:03:32.360
<v Speaker 1>DJ Collin, I don't.

1276
01:03:32.199 --> 01:03:33.800
<v Speaker 4>Do that I don't do that.

1277
01:03:34.360 --> 01:03:37.000
<v Speaker 1>I don't not even like for her birthday. Now, if

1278
01:03:37.039 --> 01:03:38.760
<v Speaker 1>she told you she don't do that, is that okay?

1279
01:03:39.719 --> 01:03:42.360
<v Speaker 4>I'm not It's not okay.

1280
01:03:42.840 --> 01:03:44.840
<v Speaker 2>So either silence is golden, or you can go by

1281
01:03:44.840 --> 01:03:47.239
<v Speaker 2>the golden rule of doing unto others what you would

1282
01:03:47.280 --> 01:03:50.920
<v Speaker 2>like done to you, Or maybe what's golden the most

1283
01:03:51.039 --> 01:03:51.639
<v Speaker 2>is showers.

1284
01:03:52.159 --> 01:03:54.880
<v Speaker 5>Now you get more into the kinky side with people

1285
01:03:54.880 --> 01:03:59.960
<v Speaker 5>who are interested in being urinated on or maybe defecated on.

1286
01:04:00.119 --> 01:04:03.559
<v Speaker 5>That's not that common in the area where something becomes

1287
01:04:03.559 --> 01:04:08.880
<v Speaker 5>that unusual fetish, certainly that includes body products. Why that's true,

1288
01:04:08.880 --> 01:04:11.360
<v Speaker 5>we don't know, and how it happens we don't know.

1289
01:04:11.719 --> 01:04:14.960
<v Speaker 2>And echoing doctor Rosen's thoughts is the opening statement of

1290
01:04:14.960 --> 01:04:17.480
<v Speaker 2>the twenty twenty one study the Psychology of Kink, a

1291
01:04:17.519 --> 01:04:20.719
<v Speaker 2>cross sectional survey study investigating the roles of sensation seeking

1292
01:04:20.760 --> 01:04:25.119
<v Speaker 2>and coping style in BDSM related interests, which size upon opening.

1293
01:04:26.119 --> 01:04:30.480
<v Speaker 2>Empirical research on the motives and underlying psychological mechanisms driving

1294
01:04:30.599 --> 01:04:32.840
<v Speaker 2>BDSM practitioners is scarce.

1295
01:04:33.360 --> 01:04:34.519
<v Speaker 1>Not a lot out there, But.

1296
01:04:34.519 --> 01:04:37.199
<v Speaker 2>Then I found this twenty twenty two study titled Current

1297
01:04:37.280 --> 01:04:42.280
<v Speaker 2>Biopsychosocial Science on Understanding Kink which off the bat answers

1298
01:04:42.320 --> 01:04:46.719
<v Speaker 2>are burning. What exactly is kink curiosity with this tight definition,

1299
01:04:47.000 --> 01:04:50.679
<v Speaker 2>so they say that kink practices can include administering or

1300
01:04:50.719 --> 01:04:55.840
<v Speaker 2>receiving intense sensation, including but not limited to pain, eroticizing,

1301
01:04:55.960 --> 01:04:59.760
<v Speaker 2>the expression of power and authority differences, being aroused by

1302
01:05:00.039 --> 01:05:05.159
<v Speaker 2>usual sensual stimuli, including specific non genital body parts or

1303
01:05:05.239 --> 01:05:11.280
<v Speaker 2>inanimate objects quote fetish, perhaps engaging in roleplay of erotic scenarios,

1304
01:05:11.519 --> 01:05:16.239
<v Speaker 2>and engaging in activities that induce shifts and changes in consciousness,

1305
01:05:16.320 --> 01:05:20.639
<v Speaker 2>which is called headspace in kink subcultures. It clues us

1306
01:05:20.639 --> 01:05:23.360
<v Speaker 2>in with and if you're like oh freaks. The study

1307
01:05:23.800 --> 01:05:26.519
<v Speaker 2>continues to say that research finds forty five to sixty

1308
01:05:26.519 --> 01:05:29.920
<v Speaker 2>percent of people fantasize about kink, but only twenty to

1309
01:05:30.000 --> 01:05:32.800
<v Speaker 2>forty seven percent act on those desires, and that the

1310
01:05:32.840 --> 01:05:37.519
<v Speaker 2>literature suggests that participants remain highly stigmatized, including by some clinicians,

1311
01:05:37.760 --> 01:05:42.800
<v Speaker 2>although no studies have found any psychopathological conditions that distinguish

1312
01:05:42.880 --> 01:05:45.239
<v Speaker 2>a group of people involved in kank from those who

1313
01:05:45.239 --> 01:05:49.360
<v Speaker 2>are not involved, generally showing that the prevalence of previous

1314
01:05:49.440 --> 01:05:53.239
<v Speaker 2>trauma and abuse experiences, especially by those who enjoy masochism

1315
01:05:53.480 --> 01:05:56.800
<v Speaker 2>is slightly lower in kink E folks than the general population,

1316
01:05:57.079 --> 01:05:59.519
<v Speaker 2>So big shrug here. Let people do what they want

1317
01:05:59.679 --> 01:06:03.039
<v Speaker 2>if they're not hurting anyone else unless that person asked

1318
01:06:03.079 --> 01:06:05.800
<v Speaker 2>them to hurt them and gave enthusiastic consent. But on

1319
01:06:05.840 --> 01:06:10.559
<v Speaker 2>the topic of rooting around past childhood experiences bass cliffs,

1320
01:06:10.599 --> 01:06:14.440
<v Speaker 2>you see third Bridge Shakira Alahi, Gen Pompeo, Edward McGregor

1321
01:06:14.440 --> 01:06:17.880
<v Speaker 2>and Earl of Grammagan asked, in Vass's words, why are

1322
01:06:17.920 --> 01:06:20.280
<v Speaker 2>we not grossed out by things when we're kids, but

1323
01:06:20.360 --> 01:06:22.199
<v Speaker 2>they become really off putting as adults.

1324
01:06:22.639 --> 01:06:25.239
<v Speaker 4>Well, because I'm the great example of that.

1325
01:06:25.840 --> 01:06:26.239
<v Speaker 1>Mm hmm.

1326
01:06:26.559 --> 01:06:31.400
<v Speaker 5>Species, Right, little kids one year olds like agree and

1327
01:06:31.519 --> 01:06:35.599
<v Speaker 5>something about toilet training. Contagion is a major feature of

1328
01:06:35.599 --> 01:06:39.760
<v Speaker 5>discussed when something touches something else something discussed and touches

1329
01:06:39.800 --> 01:06:42.519
<v Speaker 5>something else that renders it in edible. Right, you would

1330
01:06:42.679 --> 01:06:47.719
<v Speaker 5>need your favorite food of a cockroach across it or species. Now,

1331
01:06:48.199 --> 01:06:51.480
<v Speaker 5>that doesn't appear until about four years of age. Toilet

1332
01:06:51.519 --> 01:06:54.559
<v Speaker 5>training occurs in our culture well before four, not in

1333
01:06:54.679 --> 01:06:58.199
<v Speaker 5>all cultures, but in our cultures, so that a kid

1334
01:06:58.199 --> 01:07:01.960
<v Speaker 5>who's at three years of age in our culture who

1335
01:07:02.239 --> 01:07:03.800
<v Speaker 5>doesn't who says PC.

1336
01:07:03.880 --> 01:07:06.800
<v Speaker 4>You know, you show them PC, they say, ooh, but

1337
01:07:06.960 --> 01:07:12.960
<v Speaker 4>if it touches something that they like, they'll still eat it. Really,

1338
01:07:13.079 --> 01:07:14.880
<v Speaker 4>so that that comes in at about.

1339
01:07:14.639 --> 01:07:17.320
<v Speaker 1>Four maybe they're establishing their microbiome.

1340
01:07:17.360 --> 01:07:21.199
<v Speaker 5>Still, well, then that's a that's a different kind of account. Okay,

1341
01:07:21.440 --> 01:07:23.880
<v Speaker 5>you're trying to show what's how it might serve you

1342
01:07:24.000 --> 01:07:27.599
<v Speaker 5>a function that doesn't explain how it actually happens. But yes,

1343
01:07:27.679 --> 01:07:30.599
<v Speaker 5>you could make a statement like that. But you know,

1344
01:07:30.639 --> 01:07:33.599
<v Speaker 5>there are people who are much less concerned about this

1345
01:07:33.679 --> 01:07:36.599
<v Speaker 5>sort of thing, sharing food all and stuff like that,

1346
01:07:36.639 --> 01:07:40.239
<v Speaker 5>which many people find disgusting at a dinner table.

1347
01:07:40.639 --> 01:07:43.320
<v Speaker 4>Some people don't want to share other people's food. Right,

1348
01:07:43.559 --> 01:07:45.559
<v Speaker 4>If you bite something no one or someone else doesn't

1349
01:07:45.559 --> 01:07:47.360
<v Speaker 4>want other people, that's fine.

1350
01:07:47.480 --> 01:07:51.239
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, never mind if they love you, that's yet another thing.

1351
01:07:51.280 --> 01:07:53.239
<v Speaker 5>But even if they don't love you, or you know,

1352
01:07:53.280 --> 01:07:56.159
<v Speaker 5>if somebody at the next table in a restaurant is

1353
01:07:56.199 --> 01:07:59.039
<v Speaker 5>eating something you think it's what I'm looking But you

1354
01:07:59.079 --> 01:08:00.239
<v Speaker 5>would you mind them out piece?

1355
01:08:00.320 --> 01:08:02.400
<v Speaker 4>You wouldn't know it. I know people have done it.

1356
01:08:02.440 --> 01:08:04.039
<v Speaker 4>At the point is you don't want their cutting a

1357
01:08:04.079 --> 01:08:04.559
<v Speaker 4>piece of it.

1358
01:08:04.639 --> 01:08:07.679
<v Speaker 5>Given right, it might make a big difference to some

1359
01:08:07.880 --> 01:08:12.400
<v Speaker 5>people whether they cut it off with a knife, so

1360
01:08:12.440 --> 01:08:14.719
<v Speaker 5>they cut them a piece that they've just never touched

1361
01:08:14.719 --> 01:08:19.880
<v Speaker 5>their lips right, well, they used therefore, which would be contaminating.

1362
01:08:20.239 --> 01:08:22.479
<v Speaker 5>So there's some people who be very sensitive to that

1363
01:08:23.159 --> 01:08:25.479
<v Speaker 5>and other people who wouldn't even pay attention.

1364
01:08:26.199 --> 01:08:28.279
<v Speaker 2>As we've evolved as a species, do you think that

1365
01:08:28.359 --> 01:08:31.319
<v Speaker 2>our discuss tolerance has changed? And a lot of people

1366
01:08:31.359 --> 01:08:34.159
<v Speaker 2>wanted to know how much of it is learned versus extinctive,

1367
01:08:34.159 --> 01:08:36.479
<v Speaker 2>how much is nature versus nurture, which was on the

1368
01:08:36.520 --> 01:08:40.399
<v Speaker 2>minds of Justiny, Richie Brook Hicks, Anthony Willis, Alliameyer's, Brit Klein,

1369
01:08:40.640 --> 01:08:44.640
<v Speaker 2>Mariah Walser, Patricia Evans, Heather Horton, Whedon, Samantha and Earl

1370
01:08:44.640 --> 01:08:47.600
<v Speaker 2>of gramblcan Oh and Marie Strombum Johnson for stop question,

1371
01:08:47.640 --> 01:08:48.920
<v Speaker 2>Jaska and Nico Price.

1372
01:08:49.359 --> 01:08:52.119
<v Speaker 5>There's a sense in which it's all nurtured, a sense

1373
01:08:52.119 --> 01:08:54.720
<v Speaker 5>in which in the sense that little babies don't show

1374
01:08:54.760 --> 01:08:55.880
<v Speaker 5>any distuff.

1375
01:08:56.600 --> 01:08:57.920
<v Speaker 4>Discussed as universal.

1376
01:08:58.359 --> 01:09:03.760
<v Speaker 5>Probably the original discuss is something to be avoided, you know,

1377
01:09:04.079 --> 01:09:05.119
<v Speaker 5>for health reasons.

1378
01:09:05.760 --> 01:09:08.680
<v Speaker 4>My guess is we're predisposed, yeah.

1379
01:09:08.319 --> 01:09:12.920
<v Speaker 5>Biologically to avoid things that for example, smell bad, spoil

1380
01:09:12.960 --> 01:09:14.600
<v Speaker 5>it smell is the smell of disgust.

1381
01:09:15.520 --> 01:09:19.439
<v Speaker 2>And is that why bodies smell like inherently so disgusting

1382
01:09:19.439 --> 01:09:22.000
<v Speaker 2>to people like I always read that once you smell

1383
01:09:22.039 --> 01:09:24.039
<v Speaker 2>a dead body, you never forget the odor.

1384
01:09:24.359 --> 01:09:28.079
<v Speaker 5>Well, it depends when the body died, right the king?

1385
01:09:28.199 --> 01:09:32.880
<v Speaker 5>Human flesh? Does it smell different from de kaying other

1386
01:09:32.960 --> 01:09:33.760
<v Speaker 5>animals flesh?

1387
01:09:33.800 --> 01:09:35.079
<v Speaker 4>I don't know, but.

1388
01:09:35.520 --> 01:09:39.000
<v Speaker 5>I'm quite ready to believe that there's a tendency where

1389
01:09:39.000 --> 01:09:44.319
<v Speaker 5>it's predisposed to learn that that kind of smell is bad.

1390
01:09:44.600 --> 01:09:47.279
<v Speaker 2>Oh shoot, I had long notes here for a hole acide,

1391
01:09:47.279 --> 01:09:48.840
<v Speaker 2>but I'll cut to the chase. So there are these

1392
01:09:48.880 --> 01:09:51.880
<v Speaker 2>two compounds that are notable in dead flesh smell, and

1393
01:09:51.920 --> 01:09:56.520
<v Speaker 2>they are wonderfully named cadaverine and putresine. And then there's

1394
01:09:56.560 --> 01:09:59.920
<v Speaker 2>another compound benzaldehyde, and that also comes off a core.

1395
01:10:00.359 --> 01:10:02.319
<v Speaker 2>And the last one is said to have like the

1396
01:10:02.439 --> 01:10:06.840
<v Speaker 2>sickeningly sweet, almost almond like smell, And apparently bath and

1397
01:10:06.920 --> 01:10:10.199
<v Speaker 2>bodywork scent Cherry Crisp smells a lot like a dead

1398
01:10:10.239 --> 01:10:14.279
<v Speaker 2>person or a dying person because it has this benzalde hide,

1399
01:10:14.319 --> 01:10:17.920
<v Speaker 2>and so does Tom Ford's very high end scent Lost Cherry,

1400
01:10:18.119 --> 01:10:20.840
<v Speaker 2>because they both have Benzalda hide in them, and folks

1401
01:10:20.880 --> 01:10:24.159
<v Speaker 2>on TikTok were up in dead arms about this, and

1402
01:10:24.239 --> 01:10:26.640
<v Speaker 2>I was comment surfing and I saw some great opinions

1403
01:10:26.640 --> 01:10:29.319
<v Speaker 2>such as, OMG, I've smelled a deceased person and I

1404
01:10:29.319 --> 01:10:31.960
<v Speaker 2>know exactly what the sweet smell she's talking about is.

1405
01:10:32.199 --> 01:10:35.439
<v Speaker 2>It's the worst sweet smell ever. And another person said, interesting,

1406
01:10:35.560 --> 01:10:37.359
<v Speaker 2>I remember someone died in my apartment building and it

1407
01:10:37.359 --> 01:10:40.079
<v Speaker 2>smelled like rotten meat with old period blood in my opinion.

1408
01:10:40.119 --> 01:10:42.079
<v Speaker 2>And then another person weighed in and said that dead

1409
01:10:42.119 --> 01:10:45.239
<v Speaker 2>people smell like rotting meat, bad armpit stink, and a

1410
01:10:45.279 --> 01:10:48.199
<v Speaker 2>weird sweet cologne. In that the sweet smell is the

1411
01:10:48.239 --> 01:10:51.000
<v Speaker 2>creepiest because it smells human. So if you would like

1412
01:10:51.079 --> 01:10:53.920
<v Speaker 2>to get a whiff, if you have a dark sensibility,

1413
01:10:54.199 --> 01:10:58.119
<v Speaker 2>I guess start with the sprits of tom Ford lost cherry. Apparently,

1414
01:10:58.359 --> 01:11:02.600
<v Speaker 2>on one post about it TikTok, Savannah simply commented tomb

1415
01:11:02.880 --> 01:11:04.560
<v Speaker 2>forward nice.

1416
01:11:04.880 --> 01:11:06.800
<v Speaker 5>Well, then you think of all these people you know,

1417
01:11:06.880 --> 01:11:09.000
<v Speaker 5>many of them who like stinky cheese.

1418
01:11:09.760 --> 01:11:12.199
<v Speaker 4>Now they like that smell, but only.

1419
01:11:12.000 --> 01:11:14.920
<v Speaker 5>If it's coming from cheese. If you say to them,

1420
01:11:14.960 --> 01:11:18.800
<v Speaker 5>here's something sniff and they smells, it's cheese.

1421
01:11:18.840 --> 01:11:19.760
<v Speaker 4>That's say. They don't know that.

1422
01:11:20.640 --> 01:11:23.920
<v Speaker 5>If you say this is a piece of limburger, Oh

1423
01:11:24.079 --> 01:11:26.199
<v Speaker 5>smells great, you say, oh, I'm sorry, that's catchit.

1424
01:11:26.279 --> 01:11:29.640
<v Speaker 4>You said, oh my god, that's the same smell.

1425
01:11:30.000 --> 01:11:30.439
<v Speaker 1>So s I know.

1426
01:11:30.520 --> 01:11:33.239
<v Speaker 2>If you wonder why some feet smell like cheese, you

1427
01:11:33.239 --> 01:11:36.880
<v Speaker 2>can think the teeny tiny tiny brevibacteria, which both lives

1428
01:11:36.880 --> 01:11:39.720
<v Speaker 2>on our skin to gobble up dead skin cells like

1429
01:11:39.760 --> 01:11:43.840
<v Speaker 2>its own charcuterie board, and it also ripens many cheeses,

1430
01:11:44.079 --> 01:11:48.079
<v Speaker 2>such as munster and limburger. So it's not that your

1431
01:11:48.079 --> 01:11:51.119
<v Speaker 2>feet smell cheesy. It's probably that your cheese smells footy.

1432
01:11:51.439 --> 01:11:54.199
<v Speaker 2>Have you ever seen those sketches where someone says, oh

1433
01:11:54.199 --> 01:11:56.640
<v Speaker 2>this smells awful, smell this, hey, Kevin.

1434
01:11:56.439 --> 01:11:58.680
<v Speaker 7>Kevin, you've got to try this, milk man. It's so

1435
01:11:58.880 --> 01:11:59.479
<v Speaker 7>far gone.

1436
01:11:59.479 --> 01:12:07.159
<v Speaker 4>It's on real. Oh stop the music.

1437
01:12:06.960 --> 01:12:09.880
<v Speaker 1>That is bad. Why do you think we do that?

1438
01:12:10.000 --> 01:12:14.680
<v Speaker 5>Yes, that's a very very common thing. People like this

1439
01:12:14.840 --> 01:12:18.319
<v Speaker 5>is what I was talking about before about an audion masochism.

1440
01:12:18.560 --> 01:12:23.279
<v Speaker 5>People like to experience negative things in a safe context.

1441
01:12:23.479 --> 01:12:26.680
<v Speaker 4>Now that's a very safe context. They're saying your smell it.

1442
01:12:26.960 --> 01:12:29.760
<v Speaker 4>They're not going to kid you with doctson or anything.

1443
01:12:29.840 --> 01:12:33.960
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, people are very complicated, so they're enjoying what's negative.

1444
01:12:34.279 --> 01:12:37.439
<v Speaker 5>Some people probably enjoy defecating, other people don't.

1445
01:12:38.000 --> 01:12:40.319
<v Speaker 4>If you said to some everyone, No.

1446
01:12:40.279 --> 01:12:42.600
<v Speaker 5>One's asked this question as far as I know, would

1447
01:12:42.640 --> 01:12:44.840
<v Speaker 5>you rather have be a person who didn't.

1448
01:12:44.600 --> 01:12:46.319
<v Speaker 4>Have to have the deficate?

1449
01:12:46.760 --> 01:12:47.319
<v Speaker 1>Oh?

1450
01:12:47.439 --> 01:12:49.760
<v Speaker 4>Some people would say no, and some people would say.

1451
01:12:49.640 --> 01:12:51.680
<v Speaker 1>Yes they might some people might say, don't take that

1452
01:12:51.720 --> 01:12:52.159
<v Speaker 1>away from me.

1453
01:12:52.479 --> 01:12:57.000
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, there's a pleasure of expelling stuff. So we differ

1454
01:12:57.079 --> 01:12:59.399
<v Speaker 5>on all these things. Yes, I assume it's the less

1455
01:12:59.439 --> 01:13:04.039
<v Speaker 5>discussion instead of people who are more likely to enjoy deification,

1456
01:13:04.560 --> 01:13:05.560
<v Speaker 5>well even urination.

1457
01:13:06.159 --> 01:13:09.560
<v Speaker 2>Right, Sometimes being feels great, You're like, but maybe that's

1458
01:13:09.600 --> 01:13:12.039
<v Speaker 2>the relief thing of being like, ah, I'm no longer

1459
01:13:12.079 --> 01:13:12.640
<v Speaker 2>in danger.

1460
01:13:12.840 --> 01:13:16.159
<v Speaker 5>Well, first of all, you're getting rid of heated stuff,

1461
01:13:16.920 --> 01:13:18.880
<v Speaker 5>so that that could be a positive thing.

1462
01:13:19.680 --> 01:13:21.760
<v Speaker 4>And in addition, there's a there is a pleasure.

1463
01:13:22.399 --> 01:13:25.640
<v Speaker 5>I mean, you know, the actual actentification producers and put

1464
01:13:25.680 --> 01:13:30.159
<v Speaker 5>to your brain from your ainus, and that could be positive.

1465
01:13:30.800 --> 01:13:32.520
<v Speaker 5>And there are people who you know, sit on the

1466
01:13:32.640 --> 01:13:35.520
<v Speaker 5>pod for half an hour reading the newspaper and they

1467
01:13:35.560 --> 01:13:38.319
<v Speaker 5>love it, and other people who just want to do

1468
01:13:38.359 --> 01:13:39.680
<v Speaker 5>it and get it over with it. I wish I

1469
01:13:39.760 --> 01:13:43.039
<v Speaker 5>didn't have to do it. These are fascinating issues. They're

1470
01:13:43.520 --> 01:13:45.439
<v Speaker 5>discussed on a day to day basis.

1471
01:13:46.359 --> 01:13:49.600
<v Speaker 2>I have two more listener questions. Now, there's something called

1472
01:13:50.640 --> 01:13:52.720
<v Speaker 2>and I'm not sure if you've heard of this. You

1473
01:13:52.720 --> 01:13:54.479
<v Speaker 2>don't strike me as someone who spends a lot of

1474
01:13:54.520 --> 01:13:55.399
<v Speaker 2>time on TikTok.

1475
01:13:56.119 --> 01:13:59.079
<v Speaker 5>No, I've never been on tico exactly, or by the way,

1476
01:13:59.319 --> 01:14:03.920
<v Speaker 5>I've never been on face face Facebook.

1477
01:14:04.159 --> 01:14:07.920
<v Speaker 4>On Facebook, don't bother garbage.

1478
01:14:08.880 --> 01:14:11.079
<v Speaker 2>It's all garbage. Your life is so much better. But

1479
01:14:11.199 --> 01:14:14.560
<v Speaker 2>there is something on TikTok that is called the ick.

1480
01:14:14.880 --> 01:14:15.600
<v Speaker 1>Have you heard of this?

1481
01:14:16.199 --> 01:14:20.279
<v Speaker 2>It is the ick is when you're attracted to someone

1482
01:14:20.439 --> 01:14:22.840
<v Speaker 2>or maybe you like them, and then suddenly they do something.

1483
01:14:22.600 --> 01:14:25.039
<v Speaker 1>That just just the ick like.

1484
01:14:25.199 --> 01:14:26.800
<v Speaker 2>It might be the way they eat a sandwich. It

1485
01:14:26.880 --> 01:14:28.760
<v Speaker 2>might be the way that they ride a bike.

1486
01:14:28.920 --> 01:14:31.840
<v Speaker 4>So it's not always disgusting, it's the way they ride

1487
01:14:31.880 --> 01:14:32.239
<v Speaker 4>a bike.

1488
01:14:33.680 --> 01:14:37.399
<v Speaker 2>There's something in Laurel's words and also from Naomi Jane

1489
01:14:37.439 --> 01:14:40.800
<v Speaker 2>and Migile's, Isabel Brooks, Hannah Michael, and Yes, Laurel asked,

1490
01:14:41.039 --> 01:14:43.199
<v Speaker 2>when it comes to dating and relationships, why is there

1491
01:14:43.199 --> 01:14:48.239
<v Speaker 2>such a sudden irreversible trigger that's sometimes so arbitrary, And

1492
01:14:48.520 --> 01:14:52.680
<v Speaker 2>I'm wondering where is discussed and contempt. You said, anger

1493
01:14:52.840 --> 01:14:54.880
<v Speaker 2>draws you close because you want to maybe hurt or

1494
01:14:54.880 --> 01:14:57.119
<v Speaker 2>engage with someone. But what is it that you just

1495
01:14:57.119 --> 01:15:01.319
<v Speaker 2>say no with a the person or a situation.

1496
01:15:01.439 --> 01:15:02.399
<v Speaker 4>Okay, so you.

1497
01:15:02.359 --> 01:15:08.960
<v Speaker 5>Could ask people, here's this person you like, m you

1498
01:15:09.279 --> 01:15:11.359
<v Speaker 5>it turns out he drinks is your.

1499
01:15:12.720 --> 01:15:17.520
<v Speaker 4>Now does that kill it? I'm just asking you. You

1500
01:15:17.600 --> 01:15:20.840
<v Speaker 4>see that could be that could contaminate the person.

1501
01:15:21.399 --> 01:15:24.680
<v Speaker 2>Sure, yeah, No, that makes me say the guy's got

1502
01:15:24.720 --> 01:15:26.399
<v Speaker 2>to do a lot of toothbrushing and a lot of

1503
01:15:27.000 --> 01:15:29.840
<v Speaker 2>liistering for me to be drawn in.

1504
01:15:30.560 --> 01:15:34.279
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, but suppose you're even not even in a romantic

1505
01:15:35.000 --> 01:15:38.479
<v Speaker 5>friend your friend gives animates the people in the.

1506
01:15:38.479 --> 01:15:41.680
<v Speaker 2>Hospital or something that doesn't bother me as much as

1507
01:15:41.680 --> 01:15:45.199
<v Speaker 2>someone who like over pronounces something in a language in

1508
01:15:45.199 --> 01:15:48.199
<v Speaker 2>which they're not fluent. You know, someone who does cringey

1509
01:15:48.239 --> 01:15:50.479
<v Speaker 2>behaviors that are just like like.

1510
01:15:50.600 --> 01:15:53.399
<v Speaker 4>Well, there's there's cringey behavior. There's a lot of cringey

1511
01:15:53.439 --> 01:15:55.880
<v Speaker 4>things that have nothing to do with discuss Okay.

1512
01:15:56.279 --> 01:15:59.720
<v Speaker 2>So the ITGG has been described by some psychologists as

1513
01:15:59.760 --> 01:16:05.680
<v Speaker 2>a shame anger disgust and embarrassment. And some people say

1514
01:16:05.880 --> 01:16:08.319
<v Speaker 2>it is a gut reaction that that person is not

1515
01:16:08.479 --> 01:16:11.800
<v Speaker 2>right for you, and others say that's not true. It's

1516
01:16:11.800 --> 01:16:15.920
<v Speaker 2>a manifestation of avoidant attachment issues that you should work through.

1517
01:16:16.079 --> 01:16:19.159
<v Speaker 2>So your mileage may vary, but don't talk yourself into

1518
01:16:19.159 --> 01:16:21.840
<v Speaker 2>something you don't want. But also keep in mind we

1519
01:16:21.960 --> 01:16:25.239
<v Speaker 2>all have x I ick myself daily and I just

1520
01:16:25.279 --> 01:16:26.920
<v Speaker 2>have to deal with it. I'm never going to break

1521
01:16:26.960 --> 01:16:27.600
<v Speaker 2>up with myself.

1522
01:16:27.960 --> 01:16:30.119
<v Speaker 5>By the way, you get used to everything, right, But

1523
01:16:30.239 --> 01:16:32.760
<v Speaker 5>you know, when you make a decision right now, might

1524
01:16:32.960 --> 01:16:35.439
<v Speaker 5>I wouldn't deal with that person, and then it might

1525
01:16:35.479 --> 01:16:37.159
<v Speaker 5>turn out that if you after you get.

1526
01:16:37.039 --> 01:16:37.439
<v Speaker 4>Used to it.

1527
01:16:38.039 --> 01:16:39.680
<v Speaker 2>Well, you know, we talked a lot in the beginning

1528
01:16:39.720 --> 01:16:43.520
<v Speaker 2>about Hitler being a disgusting figure, but where does xenophobia

1529
01:16:44.520 --> 01:16:47.479
<v Speaker 2>come into play when it comes into disgust and people

1530
01:16:47.479 --> 01:16:51.359
<v Speaker 2>who might have racist or xenophobic tendencies. This was also

1531
01:16:51.399 --> 01:16:55.840
<v Speaker 2>asked by listener Gemma, who wanted to know about decolonizing disgust.

1532
01:16:56.359 --> 01:16:58.880
<v Speaker 2>Are they finding disgusted in things that they're at.

1533
01:16:58.880 --> 01:17:02.439
<v Speaker 5>It might be finding this For example, if someone from

1534
01:17:02.439 --> 01:17:06.039
<v Speaker 5>the despised group could be a race, could be anything,

1535
01:17:06.279 --> 01:17:09.880
<v Speaker 5>touch something, would they not want to hold it? Would

1536
01:17:09.880 --> 01:17:12.159
<v Speaker 5>they would be unwilling to weigh use blowing that was

1537
01:17:12.199 --> 01:17:14.880
<v Speaker 5>worn by an X, where an X is.

1538
01:17:14.840 --> 01:17:19.199
<v Speaker 1>Someone that group to take Yeah, really too right.

1539
01:17:19.000 --> 01:17:23.079
<v Speaker 5>And we can use that as a criterion for discuss

1540
01:17:23.159 --> 01:17:27.199
<v Speaker 5>then certainly, I'm sure some xenophobia manifests.

1541
01:17:26.760 --> 01:17:29.319
<v Speaker 4>That way that you don't want anything.

1542
01:17:29.000 --> 01:17:32.720
<v Speaker 2>To do with their bodies or lightning that's exciting, Yeah,

1543
01:17:32.720 --> 01:17:35.520
<v Speaker 2>that's good lightning. And there is some research to be had,

1544
01:17:35.680 --> 01:17:39.239
<v Speaker 2>like the twenty twenty three paper Body Odor discuss sensitivity

1545
01:17:39.359 --> 01:17:44.520
<v Speaker 2>is associated with xenophobia, evidence from nine countries across five continents,

1546
01:17:44.880 --> 01:17:48.680
<v Speaker 2>and the twenty nineteen address how and why discussed responses

1547
01:17:48.880 --> 01:17:54.560
<v Speaker 2>underlie prejudice, which notes that people treat an atypical appearance

1548
01:17:54.800 --> 01:17:57.920
<v Speaker 2>as a stronger sign of unfamiliar pathogens.

1549
01:17:58.039 --> 01:17:59.680
<v Speaker 1>And then there's also this paper that came out.

1550
01:17:59.520 --> 01:18:02.960
<v Speaker 2>Discussed is a factor in Extreme prejudice, which notes that

1551
01:18:03.159 --> 01:18:06.960
<v Speaker 2>bigotry may be distinguished by high levels of disgust.

1552
01:18:07.199 --> 01:18:08.279
<v Speaker 1>So we've learned.

1553
01:18:08.279 --> 01:18:12.119
<v Speaker 2>That disgust crops up in situations where things won't actually

1554
01:18:12.159 --> 01:18:17.119
<v Speaker 2>harm us, but bigotry is harmful. Hence, bigotry is worthy

1555
01:18:17.159 --> 01:18:20.960
<v Speaker 2>of disgust much more so than discussed over touching an earthworm.

1556
01:18:21.239 --> 01:18:25.079
<v Speaker 2>What about Julia Taylor and me want to know what's

1557
01:18:25.079 --> 01:18:27.319
<v Speaker 2>the most disgusting thing you've ever encountered, and was it

1558
01:18:27.359 --> 01:18:31.279
<v Speaker 2>smelly or gory or psychologically upsetting? What is the grossest

1559
01:18:31.560 --> 01:18:34.520
<v Speaker 2>thing about your work or the thing that you like

1560
01:18:34.600 --> 01:18:35.119
<v Speaker 2>the least.

1561
01:18:36.319 --> 01:18:39.640
<v Speaker 5>I have not experienced this, but a rotting human body

1562
01:18:40.359 --> 01:18:46.279
<v Speaker 5>would probably be about his disgusting, as I've fortunately not

1563
01:18:46.520 --> 01:18:50.079
<v Speaker 5>experience that. Knock on wood on the battlefield, you might

1564
01:18:50.159 --> 01:18:53.159
<v Speaker 5>run into it. At a hospital, you might run into it,

1565
01:18:53.239 --> 01:18:57.520
<v Speaker 5>but not normally because your body isn't rotten when you

1566
01:18:57.720 --> 01:19:01.479
<v Speaker 5>first died. It's put into the freezer, whether figureat.

1567
01:19:01.079 --> 01:19:01.640
<v Speaker 4>It right away.

1568
01:19:02.520 --> 01:19:06.800
<v Speaker 5>But of course the police run into this buried bodies

1569
01:19:06.840 --> 01:19:09.439
<v Speaker 5>and stuff. I would suspect that that would be the

1570
01:19:09.439 --> 01:19:12.359
<v Speaker 5>the most and you might expect that it should be.

1571
01:19:13.079 --> 01:19:16.720
<v Speaker 5>I mean, because it's it's about meat, and it's about decay,

1572
01:19:17.359 --> 01:19:20.119
<v Speaker 5>and there's nothing more sensitive than human meats.

1573
01:19:20.199 --> 01:19:20.960
<v Speaker 1>And just buckle up.

1574
01:19:21.000 --> 01:19:22.920
<v Speaker 2>We got a casual revelation coming here.

1575
01:19:23.399 --> 01:19:28.000
<v Speaker 5>I'm not terribly disgusted personally by the prospect of eating

1576
01:19:28.079 --> 01:19:28.760
<v Speaker 5>human flesh.

1577
01:19:29.079 --> 01:19:31.159
<v Speaker 4>If I knew that someone wasn't killed for this.

1578
01:19:32.039 --> 01:19:36.159
<v Speaker 2>Oh, if someone say donated their body to like a barbecue.

1579
01:19:36.720 --> 01:19:40.560
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, if a person died and right after that some

1580
01:19:40.640 --> 01:19:46.000
<v Speaker 5>of their muscle was harvested, I would be interested in

1581
01:19:46.159 --> 01:19:49.520
<v Speaker 5>just tasting it. By the way, I'm saying that, when

1582
01:19:49.560 --> 01:19:51.520
<v Speaker 5>I actually faste it.

1583
01:19:51.079 --> 01:19:52.199
<v Speaker 4>I might not be right.

1584
01:19:52.600 --> 01:19:55.920
<v Speaker 5>But I think that I'm curious about that, and I

1585
01:19:55.920 --> 01:19:57.920
<v Speaker 5>don't feel widely disgusted by that.

1586
01:19:58.720 --> 01:19:59.920
<v Speaker 1>And you know, it's interesting.

1587
01:20:00.079 --> 01:20:03.159
<v Speaker 2>I do feel like a lot of say, campaigns towards

1588
01:20:03.439 --> 01:20:06.760
<v Speaker 2>having a plant based diet and eliminating meter campaign's pro

1589
01:20:06.880 --> 01:20:13.800
<v Speaker 2>vegetarianism use disgusted as a factor in maybe discouraging meat consumption.

1590
01:20:14.000 --> 01:20:17.840
<v Speaker 5>Yes, and and showing people pictures of the way animals

1591
01:20:17.880 --> 01:20:21.960
<v Speaker 5>are treated that can be a form of disgust. Absolutely,

1592
01:20:22.479 --> 01:20:26.640
<v Speaker 5>And since going toward a plant based diet is agreed

1593
01:20:26.680 --> 01:20:30.079
<v Speaker 5>by most people who are worried about the environment to

1594
01:20:30.159 --> 01:20:32.319
<v Speaker 5>be a very good idea, I do it will work

1595
01:20:32.319 --> 01:20:36.920
<v Speaker 5>on sustainability, Oh yes, psychology of sustainability. So yeah, I

1596
01:20:37.319 --> 01:20:41.920
<v Speaker 5>think that discust is working in the favor of sustainability

1597
01:20:42.159 --> 01:20:46.119
<v Speaker 5>because it's animal foods that are disgusting, and so we

1598
01:20:46.239 --> 01:20:49.439
<v Speaker 5>have this funny ambivalence about animal foods. We don't have

1599
01:20:49.520 --> 01:20:50.960
<v Speaker 5>ambivalence about vegetables.

1600
01:20:51.399 --> 01:20:53.279
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I mean, I like their taste.

1601
01:20:53.079 --> 01:20:57.119
<v Speaker 5>But we don't feel is anything deeply wrong with eating

1602
01:20:57.199 --> 01:21:00.840
<v Speaker 5>a piece of asparagus, right, We're not upset about pain

1603
01:21:00.960 --> 01:21:01.760
<v Speaker 5>that it might produce.

1604
01:21:01.920 --> 01:21:05.000
<v Speaker 2>Right, as someone who may have gotten salmonella from a

1605
01:21:05.079 --> 01:21:08.119
<v Speaker 2>cantelope a month or so ago, I should be forever

1606
01:21:08.279 --> 01:21:12.479
<v Speaker 2>disgusted by melons, we should have not a good relationship.

1607
01:21:12.600 --> 01:21:17.000
<v Speaker 2>But no, I had some honeydew yesterday. No ancestors warned

1608
01:21:17.239 --> 01:21:21.039
<v Speaker 2>or forbade me from diner fruit cup salmonella outbreaks. So

1609
01:21:21.119 --> 01:21:24.000
<v Speaker 2>thanks for nothing. And the Bible doesn't have any passages

1610
01:21:24.039 --> 01:21:27.439
<v Speaker 2>about like definitely don't eat broccoli on a Sunday, you

1611
01:21:27.479 --> 01:21:27.760
<v Speaker 2>know what I mean.

1612
01:21:27.800 --> 01:21:30.039
<v Speaker 5>I feel like you almost all prohibitions, as I said,

1613
01:21:30.079 --> 01:21:30.760
<v Speaker 5>are about meat.

1614
01:21:31.039 --> 01:21:32.760
<v Speaker 4>Mm hmm, yeah that's right.

1615
01:21:32.880 --> 01:21:36.680
<v Speaker 5>So discuss this working in favor of sustainability. Yeah, a

1616
01:21:36.760 --> 01:21:37.960
<v Speaker 5>favorite vegetarian.

1617
01:21:38.520 --> 01:21:40.000
<v Speaker 1>You know, I'm not mad at that.

1618
01:21:40.039 --> 01:21:42.039
<v Speaker 2>I feel like if you asked me to go kill

1619
01:21:42.079 --> 01:21:44.119
<v Speaker 2>a hog, I would say, O, absolutely not. But if

1620
01:21:44.119 --> 01:21:45.880
<v Speaker 2>you asked me to have a piece of bacon, I'd

1621
01:21:45.920 --> 01:21:48.600
<v Speaker 2>say sure or not. So I think it's maybe coming

1622
01:21:48.600 --> 01:21:52.680
<v Speaker 2>to terms with exactly what we're willing to do based

1623
01:21:52.680 --> 01:21:54.359
<v Speaker 2>on what we see or smell or you know what

1624
01:21:54.439 --> 01:21:56.319
<v Speaker 2>I mean, Like I think it's a.

1625
01:21:56.399 --> 01:22:00.960
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I'm a partial vegetarian. Yeah, I become that in

1626
01:22:01.000 --> 01:22:02.199
<v Speaker 5>the last ten years.

1627
01:22:02.319 --> 01:22:02.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

1628
01:22:02.960 --> 01:22:06.399
<v Speaker 5>There are three kinds of vegetarians sort of. I mean

1629
01:22:06.399 --> 01:22:09.479
<v Speaker 5>some people are all three. There's health vegetarians, which I

1630
01:22:09.520 --> 01:22:12.920
<v Speaker 5>am not. Then there is there are environmental vegetarians. There

1631
01:22:12.960 --> 01:22:16.680
<v Speaker 5>are sustainability vegetaria. I'm sympathetic with that, but that's not

1632
01:22:16.760 --> 01:22:20.319
<v Speaker 5>my hormotive. My chrmotive is compassionate. I don't like the

1633
01:22:20.359 --> 01:22:21.600
<v Speaker 5>idea of killing animals.

1634
01:22:21.720 --> 01:22:22.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I feel you.

1635
01:22:23.079 --> 01:22:24.760
<v Speaker 5>I don't want to be a party to that by

1636
01:22:24.760 --> 01:22:28.039
<v Speaker 5>eating meat. Now, I do eat fish, and I do

1637
01:22:28.159 --> 01:22:31.640
<v Speaker 5>eat the shellfish, and so I'm a little bit hypocritical

1638
01:22:32.119 --> 01:22:34.560
<v Speaker 5>and I'm sensitive to that. I don't like that either.

1639
01:22:34.880 --> 01:22:38.399
<v Speaker 5>But a lobster or shrimp that's a moving animal.

1640
01:22:38.479 --> 01:22:39.640
<v Speaker 1>No, they can live forever.

1641
01:22:40.199 --> 01:22:42.399
<v Speaker 5>In terms of sustainability, if you cut your meat and

1642
01:22:42.479 --> 01:22:44.880
<v Speaker 5>take fifty percent, you're doing a good job.

1643
01:22:44.960 --> 01:22:45.319
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

1644
01:22:45.359 --> 01:22:47.680
<v Speaker 2>That's great to know and it's great to hear it.

1645
01:22:47.680 --> 01:22:51.159
<v Speaker 2>It's something that I'm moving toward as well. But last

1646
01:22:51.199 --> 01:22:52.880
<v Speaker 2>question I always have to ask is what's your favorite

1647
01:22:52.880 --> 01:22:53.800
<v Speaker 2>thing about your work?

1648
01:22:54.039 --> 01:22:55.399
<v Speaker 1>What do you love the most well.

1649
01:22:55.479 --> 01:22:56.920
<v Speaker 4>I love teaching.

1650
01:22:58.159 --> 01:23:01.760
<v Speaker 5>I love exposed not so much about discuss but I

1651
01:23:01.800 --> 01:23:03.960
<v Speaker 5>do teach you a little about that. But I like

1652
01:23:04.000 --> 01:23:07.920
<v Speaker 5>to open student size to the wonders of the world

1653
01:23:08.319 --> 01:23:10.920
<v Speaker 5>and to how we can actually find out things like

1654
01:23:11.000 --> 01:23:14.279
<v Speaker 5>what's going on in the head without looking without looking

1655
01:23:14.279 --> 01:23:16.880
<v Speaker 5>in the head indirectly, I'd love to show them that.

1656
01:23:17.720 --> 01:23:21.119
<v Speaker 5>So I care a lot about teaching preparing people to

1657
01:23:21.319 --> 01:23:23.159
<v Speaker 5>be good thinkers in the modern world.

1658
01:23:23.319 --> 01:23:24.600
<v Speaker 4>I like to find things out.

1659
01:23:24.720 --> 01:23:28.720
<v Speaker 5>I enjoy being puzzled by something and then saying I

1660
01:23:28.760 --> 01:23:31.760
<v Speaker 5>wonder what's going on there, and being able to say, well, here,

1661
01:23:31.800 --> 01:23:34.399
<v Speaker 5>I have some idea, Now what what's going on? I

1662
01:23:34.479 --> 01:23:36.760
<v Speaker 5>love to look at the world and see something that

1663
01:23:36.840 --> 01:23:39.680
<v Speaker 5>doesn't make sense to me. My first study on food

1664
01:23:39.840 --> 01:23:42.399
<v Speaker 5>was why would people eat hot pepper when it tastes

1665
01:23:42.439 --> 01:23:42.800
<v Speaker 5>so bad?

1666
01:23:42.920 --> 01:23:43.880
<v Speaker 1>Oh, that's a great question.

1667
01:23:44.000 --> 01:23:46.279
<v Speaker 2>Have you ever seen You probably haven't seen this on YouTube,

1668
01:23:46.279 --> 01:23:49.520
<v Speaker 2>but it's called hot Ones. It's celebrity interviews with people

1669
01:23:49.520 --> 01:23:53.319
<v Speaker 2>who are you know, great actors and serious Oscar winning actors.

1670
01:23:53.399 --> 01:23:55.680
<v Speaker 2>And they're in a room with a bunch of hot wings.

1671
01:23:55.760 --> 01:23:59.159
<v Speaker 2>Then they go from mild to call an ambulance, and

1672
01:23:59.199 --> 01:24:01.039
<v Speaker 2>they see how far can get and it's people like

1673
01:24:01.119 --> 01:24:04.239
<v Speaker 2>Kate Blanchett and Paul Rudd and you. They're in so

1674
01:24:04.359 --> 01:24:07.159
<v Speaker 2>much pain. But it's something that once again we hate

1675
01:24:07.159 --> 01:24:09.720
<v Speaker 2>to have it after us. We don't mind watching it then, but.

1676
01:24:09.840 --> 01:24:11.720
<v Speaker 4>No, but we like it until it gets to paint.

1677
01:24:11.920 --> 01:24:12.119
<v Speaker 8>Yeah.

1678
01:24:12.239 --> 01:24:16.079
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, that was what got me onto Benign Massive. It

1679
01:24:16.119 --> 01:24:18.640
<v Speaker 5>was eating hot chili pepper and I worked. I did

1680
01:24:18.680 --> 01:24:21.520
<v Speaker 5>some work in a Mexican village on it, and everyone

1681
01:24:21.600 --> 01:24:24.760
<v Speaker 5>in the village over four or five eats hot pepper

1682
01:24:24.800 --> 01:24:26.880
<v Speaker 5>and likes it. And none of the animals in the

1683
01:24:26.960 --> 01:24:30.119
<v Speaker 5>village though, even though they eat it because they eat

1684
01:24:30.159 --> 01:24:32.399
<v Speaker 5>the garbage. Yeah, so they eat hot pepper, but they

1685
01:24:32.439 --> 01:24:35.279
<v Speaker 5>don't get to like it. So that was to me saying,

1686
01:24:35.359 --> 01:24:39.000
<v Speaker 5>there's something about humans here, and it turns out it

1687
01:24:39.039 --> 01:24:39.840
<v Speaker 5>is about humans.

1688
01:24:39.880 --> 01:24:41.920
<v Speaker 1>We have too much brains for our own good. Huh.

1689
01:24:42.000 --> 01:24:45.840
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, well these are these are sort of side effects

1690
01:24:45.840 --> 01:24:46.840
<v Speaker 5>of having a big brain.

1691
01:24:47.119 --> 01:24:49.319
<v Speaker 4>There are many side effects of having a big brain.

1692
01:24:49.960 --> 01:24:52.560
<v Speaker 5>I mean, you know, once once you've got this brain

1693
01:24:52.600 --> 01:24:55.880
<v Speaker 5>that can do all sorts of things and imaginations, all

1694
01:24:55.960 --> 01:24:56.800
<v Speaker 5>kinds of things.

1695
01:24:56.600 --> 01:24:58.560
<v Speaker 1>Happen and they're fascinating.

1696
01:24:58.920 --> 01:25:01.039
<v Speaker 2>Just to heads up, there's a new Mexico chili pepper

1697
01:25:01.079 --> 01:25:03.600
<v Speaker 2>scientist very much on my list. I'm coming for you.

1698
01:25:03.800 --> 01:25:06.119
<v Speaker 2>I'm coming in hot, but that is in the future

1699
01:25:06.159 --> 01:25:08.760
<v Speaker 2>and right now, let's shutt up our discust.

1700
01:25:09.359 --> 01:25:11.399
<v Speaker 1>What a great time. Thank you so much for talking

1701
01:25:11.399 --> 01:25:11.640
<v Speaker 1>to me.

1702
01:25:13.960 --> 01:25:18.680
<v Speaker 2>So ask delightful people disgusting questions because you might find

1703
01:25:18.680 --> 01:25:23.920
<v Speaker 2>yourself chatting about hot peppers and hopefully consensual cannibalism just

1704
01:25:23.960 --> 01:25:26.720
<v Speaker 2>in the middle of a thunderstorm. Now we have linked

1705
01:25:26.760 --> 01:25:28.760
<v Speaker 2>more about doctor Rosin in the show notes. Thank you

1706
01:25:28.800 --> 01:25:31.359
<v Speaker 2>doctor Rosin so much for doing this along with the

1707
01:25:31.439 --> 01:25:33.840
<v Speaker 2>Charities of Choice. And no, you will not find his

1708
01:25:33.880 --> 01:25:35.840
<v Speaker 2>handle on TikTok anytime soon if you want to be

1709
01:25:35.880 --> 01:25:39.479
<v Speaker 2>online friends. But we are at Ologies on Twitter and Instagram.

1710
01:25:39.560 --> 01:25:41.760
<v Speaker 2>I'm on both as Ali Ward. Ali has one l

1711
01:25:42.479 --> 01:25:44.720
<v Speaker 2>I'm doing a terrible job on TikTok, but i am there.

1712
01:25:45.039 --> 01:25:48.319
<v Speaker 2>We also have Smologies episodes, which are filth free. They're

1713
01:25:48.359 --> 01:25:51.000
<v Speaker 2>cleaned up for kids. They're shorter versions of our classics.

1714
01:25:51.119 --> 01:25:54.039
<v Speaker 2>To join the Ologies Patreon and leave questions for guests,

1715
01:25:54.039 --> 01:25:56.000
<v Speaker 2>you can head over to patreon dot com slash Ologies,

1716
01:25:56.039 --> 01:25:58.199
<v Speaker 2>where it costs one dollar a month to join. Ology

1717
01:25:58.239 --> 01:25:59.680
<v Speaker 2>s merch is available at the link in the show

1718
01:25:59.720 --> 01:26:02.159
<v Speaker 2>notes to thank you to Aaron Talbert for managing the

1719
01:26:02.159 --> 01:26:04.920
<v Speaker 2>Ologies podcast Facebook group, Aveline Maleick and the word to

1720
01:26:04.960 --> 01:26:08.680
<v Speaker 2>remake our professional transcripts. Noel Dilworth is scheduling producer. Susan

1721
01:26:08.720 --> 01:26:12.159
<v Speaker 2>Hale is our managing director. Kelly ar Dwyer makes the website.

1722
01:26:12.199 --> 01:26:15.319
<v Speaker 2>We welcome brand new second editor Jake Chaffee into the fold.

1723
01:26:15.399 --> 01:26:18.359
<v Speaker 2>Jake is amazing. We're getting ready for a little exciting

1724
01:26:18.439 --> 01:26:21.960
<v Speaker 2>shift and an addition in programming, debuting on May sixteenth,

1725
01:26:22.000 --> 01:26:24.920
<v Speaker 2>Summer calendars for that folks, our lead editor is a

1726
01:26:25.039 --> 01:26:28.680
<v Speaker 2>very palatable Mercedes Maitland of Maitland Audio. Nick Thorburn made

1727
01:26:28.680 --> 01:26:30.199
<v Speaker 2>the theme music. And if you stick around un till

1728
01:26:30.199 --> 01:26:31.520
<v Speaker 2>the end of the episode, I tell you a secret.

1729
01:26:31.520 --> 01:26:33.840
<v Speaker 2>And this is one of the most disgusting things that

1730
01:26:33.880 --> 01:26:37.039
<v Speaker 2>has ever happened to me ever, and I'm going to

1731
01:26:37.119 --> 01:26:37.800
<v Speaker 2>tell you about it.

1732
01:26:39.159 --> 01:26:39.760
<v Speaker 1>So, during this.

1733
01:26:39.720 --> 01:26:42.520
<v Speaker 2>Trip to Philly, I overscheduled myself in a way that

1734
01:26:42.640 --> 01:26:45.560
<v Speaker 2>could have actually killed me. I'm surprised it. I did

1735
01:26:45.640 --> 01:26:48.079
<v Speaker 2>ten interviews in like three or four days. I did

1736
01:26:48.119 --> 01:26:51.000
<v Speaker 2>a keynote to five thousand people, I had a ton

1737
01:26:51.039 --> 01:26:53.159
<v Speaker 2>of meetings, and then I had an immediate flight to

1738
01:26:53.199 --> 01:26:55.479
<v Speaker 2>Catalina Island to teach this symposium.

1739
01:26:55.720 --> 01:26:59.159
<v Speaker 1>Stress was high, sleep was little. I was not doing well.

1740
01:26:59.239 --> 01:27:01.199
<v Speaker 2>So when I got home, I started to come down

1741
01:27:01.239 --> 01:27:04.720
<v Speaker 2>with pneumonia, as you may remember I had in July. Now,

1742
01:27:04.760 --> 01:27:08.920
<v Speaker 2>at the same time, flies started appearing in our house,

1743
01:27:09.399 --> 01:27:13.680
<v Speaker 2>like not tiny fruit flies, not cute fruit flies, like big, hairy,

1744
01:27:13.760 --> 01:27:17.800
<v Speaker 2>gross flies. No idea where they came from. First there's

1745
01:27:17.840 --> 01:27:19.560
<v Speaker 2>just one or two and we're like, ohh. And then

1746
01:27:19.600 --> 01:27:21.800
<v Speaker 2>over the course of a week we were killing like

1747
01:27:22.000 --> 01:27:25.560
<v Speaker 2>thirty flies a day. I couldn't take it. Jarrett has

1748
01:27:25.600 --> 01:27:28.119
<v Speaker 2>this thing called an assault rifle, and it shoots like

1749
01:27:28.199 --> 01:27:30.880
<v Speaker 2>a high powered mist of table salt.

1750
01:27:31.359 --> 01:27:35.800
<v Speaker 1>This thing is deadly and effective against bugs. I'm it's

1751
01:27:35.840 --> 01:27:36.760
<v Speaker 1>not humane. I'm sorry.

1752
01:27:36.760 --> 01:27:40.119
<v Speaker 2>I couldn't deal with them inside. Does it aerosolize flyguts

1753
01:27:40.159 --> 01:27:41.920
<v Speaker 2>and then you breathe them in. We're not going to

1754
01:27:42.000 --> 01:27:45.720
<v Speaker 2>think about it. But my anxiety was through the roof,

1755
01:27:45.840 --> 01:27:49.640
<v Speaker 2>being so sick of with these disgusting, iridescent bottle flies everywhere.

1756
01:27:49.720 --> 01:27:51.439
<v Speaker 2>We kept all the door shut, we sealed up all

1757
01:27:51.439 --> 01:27:54.079
<v Speaker 2>the cracks, and they kept finding their way in, and

1758
01:27:54.119 --> 01:27:56.920
<v Speaker 2>we eventually we killed them all and about a week later,

1759
01:27:57.000 --> 01:27:59.479
<v Speaker 2>I took out our swiffer from the broom closet and

1760
01:27:59.520 --> 01:28:02.680
<v Speaker 2>I saw fly egg cases in the back corner.

1761
01:28:03.239 --> 01:28:05.199
<v Speaker 1>And what had happened was this one.

1762
01:28:05.079 --> 01:28:08.920
<v Speaker 2>Bitch fly laid eggs in a swiffer wet Jet maxi

1763
01:28:09.000 --> 01:28:11.439
<v Speaker 2>pad thing, and I hadn't taken off the dirty one

1764
01:28:11.479 --> 01:28:14.479
<v Speaker 2>before shoving in the closet, so they just nested in there.

1765
01:28:14.600 --> 01:28:16.800
<v Speaker 2>That's where they were coming from. They were hatching out

1766
01:28:16.800 --> 01:28:20.039
<v Speaker 2>of a swiff wet Jet maxipad. And anyway, it was

1767
01:28:20.159 --> 01:28:22.520
<v Speaker 2>truly a blight on my mental health. I think about

1768
01:28:22.560 --> 01:28:26.000
<v Speaker 2>it and I start choking with anxiety. Anyway, remove the

1769
01:28:26.039 --> 01:28:28.960
<v Speaker 2>old swiffer thing before storing it, because I didn't know

1770
01:28:29.279 --> 01:28:32.039
<v Speaker 2>that this horror show was even possible. Also, we have

1771
01:28:32.079 --> 01:28:34.880
<v Speaker 2>a whole episode on flies, and I try to get

1772
01:28:34.920 --> 01:28:37.039
<v Speaker 2>us to light flies. We're doing our best over here,

1773
01:28:37.039 --> 01:28:39.000
<v Speaker 2>all right. Also, I can't remember if I've told you

1774
01:28:39.039 --> 01:28:41.239
<v Speaker 2>the secret before, but I feel like it's so embarrassing.

1775
01:28:41.239 --> 01:28:43.279
<v Speaker 2>I probably haven't. If I have, I hope you got

1776
01:28:43.359 --> 01:28:46.760
<v Speaker 2>the detail that you've been craving. Anyway, I'm sorry, flies,

1777
01:28:47.159 --> 01:28:49.720
<v Speaker 2>Just please go find a dead possum or something instead

1778
01:28:49.760 --> 01:28:51.960
<v Speaker 2>of a mop. If only I was able to make

1779
01:28:52.039 --> 01:28:58.640
<v Speaker 2>hot dogs out of the flies. I'm gonna actual gagging.

1780
01:28:58.760 --> 01:29:00.359
<v Speaker 1>I took that too far. I took it too Pull

1781
01:29:00.359 --> 01:29:01.000
<v Speaker 1>it back, okay for.

1782
01:29:01.079 --> 01:29:10.000
<v Speaker 2>By hacadermatology, homiology or doo zoology, lithology, technology, meteorology, pole

1783
01:29:10.039 --> 01:29:14.640
<v Speaker 2>of metatology, nathology, seriology, selenology.

1784
01:29:20.520 --> 01:29:21.239
<v Speaker 4>That's gross.

1785
01:29:21.319 --> 01:29:21.800
<v Speaker 1>I love it.