Speaker 1: We're Tom and Lorenzo and this is the Pop Style
Speaker 1: Opinion Fest. Hell look it and walk back to another
Speaker 1: edition of the Pso I am the Tea and you're
Speaker 1: Telow Tom Fitzgerald, and I'm here with the low and
Speaker 1: your te lot. Lorenzo my cousin husband, and you're.
Speaker 2: Here we tab Hunter on the table.
Speaker 1: Tab Hunter a twenty five pound cat who has been
Speaker 1: drawing blood lately. Oh my god, yeah, fit me the
Speaker 1: other night in bed because he got very excited. I
Speaker 1: was rubbing his belly in the wrong spot. And this boy,
Speaker 1: you have to understand, he is a big cat, and
Speaker 1: he's got teeth like a dog's teeth, and cats they
Speaker 1: will nip when they want you to stop doing something,
Speaker 1: and you know they're usually pretty good at the Tab's
Speaker 1: teeth are so freaking huge that he wound up drawing blood.
Speaker 1: It was like one in the morning, and I had
Speaker 1: to get out of bed to wash because you don't
Speaker 1: want to get cats scratch fever or anything like that.
Speaker 1: And then yesterday he wanted to jump in my seat
Speaker 1: while I was He loves when I do my duo
Speaker 1: lingo lessons. Whenever he hears duo lingo, he comes running.
Speaker 1: It's so cute because he wants to sit in my
Speaker 1: lap and learn Portuguese with me. And he tried to
Speaker 1: jump in my lap and I was wearing a pair
Speaker 1: of shorts, and he's getting old, which means he can't
Speaker 1: make jumps as quickly as gracefully as he once did.
Speaker 1: So he dug his massive sabertoothed tiger claws right into
Speaker 1: my bare thigh and then slid. I know, yeah, so
Speaker 1: I have a slash on my lap.
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: I don't know why we're starting off the podcast with
Speaker 1: this nonsense. Anyway, we have a pod porie of topics
Speaker 1: to discuss. We actually once again relate with this because
Speaker 1: we really couldn't pull together an entire podcast, and then
Speaker 1: ultimately we said, all right, well, it's just been five
Speaker 1: minutes on a bunch of different podcasts, like this is
Speaker 1: some sort of weekend update. So but what I do
Speaker 1: like about these pod pori things is that we don't
Speaker 1: get stuck in one thing. We're not just talking about
Speaker 1: a TV show or just talking about celebrity gossip. We
Speaker 1: have a bunch of things to talk about here. I
Speaker 1: want to start off with a red carpet topic, especially
Speaker 1: because this one's a little late. We're getting to this one,
Speaker 1: and it's a holdover from the Met collar A couple
Speaker 1: of weeks back, we were contacted by Lamonde, the French newspaper,
Speaker 1: to give our thoughts on theme dressing and cosplay dressing
Speaker 1: and everything. And I kind of love that our dislike
Speaker 1: of that sort of thing has reached an international audience.
Speaker 1: And I did say I don't think it wound up
Speaker 1: in the final piece, but I did say one of
Speaker 1: the things I don't like about this move away from
Speaker 1: fashion on the Red Carpet is that we're going to
Speaker 1: get more and more into spectacle and costumes. And sure enough,
Speaker 1: a couple of days later, the Metgala happened, and here
Speaker 1: comes Heidi Cloom in her Halloween costume, and here comes
Speaker 1: bed Bunny in his old man makeup. And I hate it.
Speaker 1: I hate it so much that people are starting to
Speaker 1: use prosthetics for events that are entirely about fashion.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it was. The Hollywood Reporter had an
Speaker 2: article this week about the whole The Devil's Wear product
Speaker 2: preparation for the for the Red Carpet everything, and how
Speaker 2: much they thought about all those things like right wearing costumes.
Speaker 2: They're wearing things that no costumes, you know, wearing things
Speaker 2: that the characters would wear, Yes, exactly, that would remind
Speaker 2: people of the costumes in the movie and all that.
Speaker 2: And it was just like, yeah, that that's the direction.
Speaker 1: Now I hate it, and I'm going to use my
Speaker 1: platform to rail against it. And if Lamon wants to
Speaker 1: call me up, I'll yell about that too. Listen. I
Speaker 1: don't think we're likely to see a lot of costume,
Speaker 1: a lot of makeup effects or prosthetics going forward on
Speaker 1: the Red carpet, but I do feel like I need to,
Speaker 1: you know, sound the alarm a little bit. The met
Speaker 1: Gala is not like a Marvel movie promotional event or
Speaker 1: something like that. It is not about people going out
Speaker 1: and promoting projects. It's literally about elevating fashion. It is
Speaker 1: an entire night devoted to fashion. It is the one
Speaker 1: red carpet that we cover every year that is only
Speaker 1: about fashion. It's not about awards, it's not about premieres,
Speaker 1: it's not about debut albums or anything like that. It
Speaker 1: is strictly a bunch of people getting together in the
Speaker 1: most outrageous outfits they can devise to celebrate fashion. And
Speaker 1: to raise money for a costume institute. And for me,
Speaker 1: it's very alarming. On this the premiere fashion event of
Speaker 1: the year, people are showing up in freaking rubber masks
Speaker 1: and fake noses and shit like that. And I hate
Speaker 1: that Anna Winter has lost control of this sort of thing.
Speaker 1: I think she's trying so hard to soften her image.
Speaker 1: That's why she sort of embraced the Devilwares product too,
Speaker 1: even though she wouldn't even talk about the first film.
Speaker 1: That's true, it's and now she's like letting just anybody
Speaker 1: walk onto that Macalla red carpet in anything, like Troy
Speaker 1: Savann was wearing jeans, and I was like, you know what,
Speaker 1: I've been covering this for fifteen years and she never
Speaker 1: would have allowed that. Even five years.
Speaker 2: People weren't even allowed to take pictures inside, licking the
Speaker 2: basket or anything like that. I mean, but.
Speaker 1: It's she's you know, and I get it, because this
Speaker 1: event is, you know, you invite all of these celebrities
Speaker 1: to generate the kind of press that you know this
Speaker 1: event generates, and you kind of have to let celebrities
Speaker 1: do whatever they want to do otherwise they're not going
Speaker 1: to show up well.
Speaker 2: And they have new owners. Yeah, what do you mean
Speaker 2: the Macala has new owners, you know, so to speak.
Speaker 2: I mean you have the Amazon people knowing.
Speaker 1: Well, they don't own it.
Speaker 2: They just well, if you give money, you own it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess anyway, I just wanted to rail against
Speaker 1: that because I feel like, if they're doing this at
Speaker 1: the Metgala, then yes, someone's going to show up at
Speaker 1: the next Marvel movie or DC movie or Star Wars
Speaker 1: movie work in some sort of goofy ass makeup effect.
Speaker 1: That is not what the Red Carpet is about. I know.
Speaker 2: I think I think you're going to We're gonna see
Speaker 2: that more and more.
Speaker 1: I hate it. I'm going to make such an issue
Speaker 1: out of it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I think there's always going to be people
Speaker 2: who will say no to it because they're they're too
Speaker 2: self aware of how they look on the red carpet,
Speaker 2: and they don't want to look a certain way that
Speaker 2: doesn't go with whatever they think if their view.
Speaker 1: Yes, but the reason that I am somewhat fearful of
Speaker 1: this is that a lot of celebrities hate the red carpet.
Speaker 1: They hate the idea of fashion, they hate the idea
Speaker 1: of putting themselves on display. And I am not unsympathetic
Speaker 1: to that perspective, but I really hate the idea of
Speaker 1: stepping out in a frickin rubber mask because you don't
Speaker 1: like being photographed. Like, suck it up, Just suck it up.
Speaker 1: You don't have to wear tour or whatever. You pose
Speaker 1: for five pictures and walk off. But I think it
Speaker 1: depends on Mary in a Halloween costume is a no.
Speaker 2: I agree, And I think it depends on the person
Speaker 2: and how they feel on the red carpet. I'll give
Speaker 2: you an example of mars Ree. You could tell that
Speaker 2: she was loving all those gigantic coats on her because
Speaker 2: it's a.
Speaker 1: Weird, dumpy Yeah, it's coffee.
Speaker 2: You don't have to worry about anything.
Speaker 1: Not wearing shape wear. She probably didn't shave her let.
Speaker 2: You're completely covered up.
Speaker 1: And I fully I am not standing here saying. You know,
Speaker 1: everyone needs a manny petty. You know everyone has to
Speaker 1: be tanned and moisture and now cover yourselves up. That's
Speaker 1: the beauty of fashion. Fashion is not just about exposing
Speaker 1: the body. It's about, you know, obscuring the body, if
Speaker 1: that's what you want. Fashion isn't just about standing out.
Speaker 1: Sometimes it's about receding in a way that is eleg
Speaker 1: and the strain.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but people do like look at the kardash and
Speaker 2: they're like, all right, I can't show I can't show
Speaker 2: my real nipple, so I'm gonna show a plastic one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, fake nipple. Anyway, that was my one takeaway from
Speaker 1: the Macala was like, oh shit, they're gonna start wearing
Speaker 1: this shit on regular red carpet. Not that I think honestly,
Speaker 1: if only Heidi had showed up like that, I would
Speaker 1: have rolled my eyes and said, yeah, this is what
Speaker 1: we said in the in the post about her, which
Speaker 1: was this this isn't a Halloween party. But when bad
Speaker 1: money shows up, I'm like, oh no, you were opening
Speaker 1: the door. You are a trendsetter. Heidi Klum is not
Speaker 1: a trends I.
Speaker 2: Think it's people again watering down a great idea. I
Speaker 2: go back to the Barbie movies. That was clever because
Speaker 2: he was like, all right, let's pay homage to old barbiees,
Speaker 2: giving a new giving a twist, you know, giving every
Speaker 2: look a twist. That's what he did. He Andrew Komo, Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's what he did. I mean, every look wasn't exactly
Speaker 2: what the dog looked like, but it was some sort
Speaker 2: of like you know, interpretation of it. So that was clever.
Speaker 2: But then we're just like, now we're just going with
Speaker 2: you know, you know, with tennis both.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I hate it anyway, that's my little rant. Yeah,
Speaker 1: why don't we move on to your little rant about
Speaker 1: costume design or do you want to No, No, let's
Speaker 1: talk about costume design.
Speaker 2: And I thought I thought it was interesting. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's it's very common that people watch TV, especially the
Speaker 2: young generation. They watch shows and they love monsters. The
Speaker 2: youngsters on TikTok and social media, they they love to
Speaker 2: watch what the you know, the characters are wearing, and
Speaker 2: they're going they go after the items, they want to
Speaker 2: buy the items, and they complain that the items are
Speaker 2: too expensive, blah blah blah. So the latest conversation was
Speaker 2: about Aria, which is a horrible season by the way, terrible,
Speaker 2: terrible season anyway, So what they're they were complaining that
Speaker 2: Jacob or LORDI, the character Nate Jacobs, has been wearing
Speaker 2: nothing but but tiga Veneda, very expensive items and it
Speaker 2: doesn't go with the character. So they were all there
Speaker 2: was like a huge backlash against it because he was
Speaker 2: wearing this plaid fannel flannel and the shirt is like
Speaker 2: six dollars, So which is.
Speaker 1: This is something that's been going on for a while
Speaker 1: in costume design.
Speaker 2: Go ahead.
Speaker 1: I just want to note that this was also an
Speaker 1: issue in the last season of The Bear when they
Speaker 1: were working in that kitchen wearing like Louis Vuitton jackets
Speaker 1: and Montclair and stuff like that.
Speaker 2: And her uniform was Tom Brown.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I mean, I don't want to jump in
Speaker 1: this is your rant, but this is a thing that's
Speaker 1: been happening with costume design for a while, and you
Speaker 1: see it in Like, You saw it in Like and
Speaker 1: just like that, where when you go back to Sex
Speaker 1: and the City, when Pat Fields was doing that that series,
Speaker 1: she was pulling from vintage shops and boutiques. The items
Speaker 1: were high label items, but she did not have a
Speaker 1: rolodex of contacts at all of the cature house, so
Speaker 1: she had to go out and shop for that stuff.
Speaker 1: And subsequently, those characters wardrobes had real personality. They felt
Speaker 1: like real New York stylish New Yorkers, New Yorkers with
Speaker 1: a lot of money. And then you come to and
Speaker 1: just like that, where Pet Fields was not involved. Pet Field.
Speaker 1: People always put anss on the end of her it
Speaker 1: is Field, I think anyway, she was not involved. And
Speaker 1: in the years since the show, the franchise had become
Speaker 1: this like fantasy fashion franchise, which is not what it
Speaker 1: was back in the day. And subsequently, all the characters
Speaker 1: in and just like that were tottering around in high
Speaker 1: heels on New York City sidewalks, six thousand dollars shoes,
Speaker 1: ten thousand dollars bags. The outfit, every outfit was you
Speaker 1: could have bought a house with it, and there was
Speaker 1: nothing realistic about it. And these are wealthy New Yorkers
Speaker 1: and even those characters, those people are not walking around
Speaker 1: in on the street with a cup of coffee in
Speaker 1: ten thousand dollars shoes exactly. That's the kind of stupidity
Speaker 1: that I don't like.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry so because if is a show for the
Speaker 2: young generation that I see again, they were very outspoken,
Speaker 2: very loud on on TikTok and everywhere, talking about how
Speaker 2: ridiculous that is that a character like you know, Nate
Speaker 2: Jacobs is wearing a six thousand dollar shirt. So bad.
Speaker 2: Excuse me that the custom designer Natasha Newman Thomas for
Speaker 2: the show came out with a statement. She gave an
Speaker 2: interview and everything that she said, you know, HBO had
Speaker 2: a very tight budget. We're very happy that. But take
Speaker 2: up and Aida you know, came and help us with
Speaker 2: the you know, gave us you know, support, blah blah blah.
Speaker 2: But it doesn't go with a character. And then she
Speaker 2: tried to defend the character, say, well, the character is
Speaker 2: trying very hard to look a certain way because he
Speaker 2: has all these investors and he wants to look like
Speaker 2: you know, he's wearing expensive clothes. But he's in I
Speaker 2: forget office someplace in his house wearing just a basic
Speaker 2: plaid flannel. You know, It's not like he's wearing a
Speaker 2: suit to go to a meeting or something. So they
Speaker 2: all complained about it. They said, it's ridiculous. But the
Speaker 2: whole the thing with the whole show is that the
Speaker 2: show this isn't really bad. And the feeling that I
Speaker 2: get is that nobody wanted to go back, Zendy Jacob
Speaker 2: I mean, they all have incredible careers now, they didn't
Speaker 2: want to go back. I think they were forced to
Speaker 2: go back. And I think Jacob El already pretty much said, fine,
Speaker 2: I'll go back, but I'm gonna wear but Tikavania, you know.
Speaker 2: And that's what he's doing and which is so against
Speaker 2: everything that we talk about when he comes to costume design.
Speaker 2: You know, we interview custom designers and they talk about
Speaker 2: the process of creating these looks and how much, you know,
Speaker 2: all the research they do, everything they do to to
Speaker 2: come up with those costumes, when in this case, you
Speaker 2: just go to the store and you pick what.
Speaker 1: You're not even going to the story. You're just you're
Speaker 1: calling up a design house and saying send pieces. Oh,
Speaker 1: and we'll just say exactly, and this is not costume design,
Speaker 1: this is you're servant. You're a stylist. At that point.
Speaker 1: The difference between being a stylist and being a costume
Speaker 1: designer is that a stylist is there to project an
Speaker 1: image on a client, whereas a costume designer is there
Speaker 1: to build a character right exactly and to make sure
Speaker 1: that all the choices that they are making for that
Speaker 1: character makes sense for that character and tell you something
Speaker 1: about that character. Just calling up Botega Vanetta and saying
Speaker 1: send over some shirts, you're not doing that. And that
Speaker 1: is and the reason I brought up in just like
Speaker 1: that is because this has been a trend in costume
Speaker 1: design for years now. You can go back to like
Speaker 1: crazy rich Asians. Because I was doing research on the
Speaker 1: costumes in that film for something I was working on,
Speaker 1: and the costume designer said, we just had you know
Speaker 1: once once everything was set in place, that it was
Speaker 1: you know that we were making this film based on
Speaker 1: this book. They just all called her, all of the
Speaker 1: fashion houses called her, and she just had to pick dresses.
Speaker 1: That's all she had to do. And at least in
Speaker 1: that instance, those people do there for that they were
Speaker 1: like the one percent they do wear those clothes. I agree,
Speaker 1: but I use that as an example of I think
Speaker 1: that opened up a floodgate of like, let's just let's
Speaker 1: just call up design houses and have them even Devil
Speaker 1: Wear's product too. For the most part, because I did
Speaker 1: think when we were covering the shoots and everything, I
Speaker 1: did think, I'm like, oh my god, they're all going
Speaker 1: to be in clown clothes. They're going to look ridiculous.
Speaker 1: And for the most part, they didn't look ridiculous. But
Speaker 1: I could tell that Andy was wearing some very expensive
Speaker 1: items and supposedly that's not who she is, right, And
Speaker 1: I don't mean the stuff that she was pulling from
Speaker 1: the closet. I mean like she was showing up on
Speaker 1: her first day at Runway in what was a very
Speaker 1: expensive at.
Speaker 2: Her excuse was that she was going to Vinture store
Speaker 2: and whatever and buying those items. That's yeah, such bullshit.
Speaker 1: That is such bullshit. It's lazy costumes.
Speaker 2: People have had the same complete with Blake Lively in
Speaker 2: her movie that she was wearing Chanel bags or whatever,
Speaker 2: you know, Louis Vuittone bags or whatever, when.
Speaker 1: Her character was not wealthy, no owns a shop. That's
Speaker 1: I hate that. It's not character work, it's not costume design.
Speaker 1: It's just lazy styling. Yeah, all right, are we done
Speaker 1: with that anyway?
Speaker 2: I just think it's an interesting conversation. I wonder what
Speaker 2: you guys think. Do you care if they're wearing those items?
Speaker 2: Do you think you know it's at all? I mean,
Speaker 2: I guess you should love fashion. You see these items
Speaker 2: right away when you watch a movie you know, or
Speaker 2: a TV show, you recognize those items. Does it bother you?
Speaker 2: Do you care? Anyway?
Speaker 1: All right, let's take a sharp break and we'll be
Speaker 1: back to talk. About more things that have piste us
Speaker 1: off this week. We'll be right back. We're back, and
Speaker 1: Lorenzo has a whole bunch of TikTok stuff about Billie Eilish,
Speaker 1: and I gotta say he started telling me about it.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't, I don't understand. What the We'll
Speaker 1: just save it for the mic, So go Lorenzo.
Speaker 2: Billy Eilish, bless her heart. She has good intentions and
Speaker 2: and she but she always makes those statements that people
Speaker 2: are always talking about it. And you know, like when
Speaker 2: she said that you all look like me, you know,
Speaker 2: and or she talked about the billionaires, why don't you
Speaker 2: give you money to everybody? You know? Or the illegal
Speaker 2: immigrants you know, talking about that, you know, you know,
Speaker 2: that's not your land.
Speaker 1: That's little, all these things. You're just talking and you
Speaker 1: look like me.
Speaker 2: You look like me. It's when she was on stage
Speaker 2: in Ireland and she said that she looked at the
Speaker 2: crowd and she said, wow, you all look like me.
Speaker 2: And there was a huge backlash against that because people were.
Speaker 1: Like, all right, they thought it was racist. Talked I
Speaker 1: thought it was racist.
Speaker 2: We talked about that one the I know, some of
Speaker 2: the other ones The other one is she was at
Speaker 2: the ws the Washington what is it, the w s
Speaker 2: J magazine, Wester Journay, Thank your magazine, Uh Innovator Awards,
Speaker 2: and she said, you know, she looked at the crowd
Speaker 2: and she said, oh, you were a bunch of billionaires.
Speaker 2: Why are you a billionaire? Give your money away? And
Speaker 2: they all again backlash, You are a millionaire yourself, so
Speaker 2: why aren't you giving you money away? As well? I'm
Speaker 2: just repeating what people were saying.
Speaker 1: Then I think that's bullshit.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I thought the Ireland thing was bullshit too, but okay,
Speaker 1: go ahead.
Speaker 2: The other thing was the Grammy Awards two tenty twenty six.
Speaker 2: She said no one is illegal on stolen land f
Speaker 2: ice and then against again. The backlash was like, well,
Speaker 2: you live in a mansion. Why don't you give you
Speaker 2: a mention to the immigrants?
Speaker 1: These are all very I know. I'm sorry. I don't
Speaker 1: agree with any of these.
Speaker 2: I agree, but they just go after those statements and
Speaker 2: I see where she's going with this. Well, let me
Speaker 2: go to the glass. That's pretty much it. And then
Speaker 2: the last one lately, because she's promoting her documentary, is
Speaker 2: that she said she was asked about because she is
Speaker 2: vegan and she's been vegan for a long time, since
Speaker 2: she was a little girl. And then she said something
Speaker 2: about you cannot love animals if you eat meat at
Speaker 2: the same time, something like that, and that one has
Speaker 2: really exploded. All that one is because you can't talk
Speaker 2: about meat without having a huge discussion about it. So anyway,
Speaker 2: and then she wasn't finished. She went to her Instagram
Speaker 2: account and she kept saying, you know, you know, stay
Speaker 2: fucking mad at me. I don't give a fuck, and
Speaker 2: those are her words. And then that she wasn't done,
Speaker 2: she started posting on her story all these horrible images
Speaker 2: of animals and getting tortured and stuff like that. So anyway, so.
Speaker 1: People I respond to number one, I think, oh, people
Speaker 1: are made of Billie Eilish. I'm like, oh, it's a
Speaker 1: day that ends in wide. A female pop star is
Speaker 1: getting backlash, like true, and she's an outspoken female pop star,
Speaker 1: so anything she says is going to get backlash. That's
Speaker 1: number one. Number one too. I do think the animal
Speaker 1: thing is inflammatory as hell. I mean, you can't go
Speaker 1: around it's one thing to advocate for veganism or vegetarianism
Speaker 1: or to talk about the cruelty of the meat industry.
Speaker 1: But you if you go around saying you can't claim
Speaker 1: to love animals like ooh girl, no, no, that doesn't fly.
Speaker 1: I eat burgers and I love my cats, and there's
Speaker 1: no I don't have any sort of problem with I.
Speaker 2: Don't eat meat. I understand what she's saying. I understand,
Speaker 2: and it is a very touchy subject, even when I
Speaker 2: talk to my family or my brother loves meat and he.
Speaker 1: Looked at me like he's crazy.
Speaker 2: We were we were in the Netherlands and he was
Speaker 2: preparing dinner and I said I don't eat meat, and
Speaker 2: he looked at me like, no, no meat at all.
Speaker 2: You should want that anyway. So I tend to avoid
Speaker 2: these discussions because they're they're heated, and I understand why.
Speaker 2: And the point people were making very mad at her
Speaker 2: is that not everyone has the money to be vegan
Speaker 2: or vegetarian. It's very expensive to buy food, you know,
Speaker 2: vegetarian food or vegan food. That's what people were saying.
Speaker 2: I'm repeating what people were saying. They were also saying
Speaker 2: that you should go after the animal farming industry, not
Speaker 2: people who actually eat meat. And also the cultural part
Speaker 2: of it. That there there are many many countries, many
Speaker 2: many places where people eat a lot of meat. It's
Speaker 2: part of their culture.
Speaker 1: Now I agree with that. I mean it was a
Speaker 1: very anytime you have these discussions, they almost always come
Speaker 1: from a place of privilege. To deny yourself, you know, meat,
Speaker 1: to have a meat free diet. Pardon me. It's indicative
Speaker 1: of privilege for most people.
Speaker 2: Right, And I just want to make one more point
Speaker 2: before you make your argument. People were also saying, which
Speaker 2: is true. I went and checked that she has to
Speaker 2: deal with cosmetic companies that test on animals. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: mean that's I mean, it's out there. I mean I.
Speaker 1: Didn't think cosmetics companies did that much testing on animals.
Speaker 2: And do what are you talking about this?
Speaker 1: I do think got rid of most of them.
Speaker 2: I don't think so anyway. So that's what they were saying,
Speaker 2: that she's a hypocrite, that she has a lot of money,
Speaker 2: and that she throws these things out there, uh, to
Speaker 2: create this kind of backlash and then you know it
Speaker 2: doesn't have much to back it up.
Speaker 1: Okay, what I hate about this is that it, uh,
Speaker 1: it's just the same old celebrity should not speak up, right,
Speaker 1: and they should just count their money. And I don't
Speaker 1: believe that. I don't believe that. She has always been
Speaker 1: an artist who has convictions about certain things, and she's
Speaker 1: always been outspoken about certain things. And the idea that, oh,
Speaker 1: you're a millionaire, you shouldn't talk about veganism, well, that's
Speaker 1: just bullshit. That's stupid. And the other thing is, uh,
Speaker 1: I really dislike the idea, like you can't listen. The
Speaker 1: whole thing about you know, being on stolen land and
Speaker 1: everything is it's so easy to turn that against someone
Speaker 1: who makes those comments, you know, land acknowledgments and that
Speaker 1: sort of thing. It's so easy to paint people who
Speaker 1: may those sort of comments as just out of touch
Speaker 1: liberals or whatever. But there's nothing wrong with pointing out,
Speaker 1: you know, the colonialist history of America. And the idea
Speaker 1: that she shouldn't because she lives in a mansion. That's
Speaker 1: that when people say you shouldn't talk about that because
Speaker 1: you live, well, that's bullshit. That has nothing to her.
Speaker 1: Living in a mansion does not have anything to do
Speaker 1: with us stealing land from indigenous people. That's not the
Speaker 1: same thing, right, And it's fine for her or anybody
Speaker 1: else to talk about it. It's like that cartoon that
Speaker 1: you see on social media all the time where it's
Speaker 1: it's like a peasant saying we should, you know, improve
Speaker 1: society someone and then the person is like, curious, you
Speaker 1: you're but you're part of society, you can't you know.
Speaker 1: I guess this goes back to certain things like when
Speaker 1: we when we spoke out against Dulchankabana for for all
Speaker 1: the racism that was in their work, or when we
Speaker 1: spoke when we spoke out we wouldn't for Johnny Depp
Speaker 1: because you know, his divorce case got so ugly and everything,
Speaker 1: and we made statements to that effect, we're not going
Speaker 1: to cover this, you know, blah blah blah. We're standing
Speaker 1: on principles, and then we were attacked for the routinely
Speaker 1: to this day. Oh you people will just pick something
Speaker 1: and say, oh, you spoke out against this, but you
Speaker 1: won't speak out against I remember that a bunch of
Speaker 1: people went to Dubai for some event and we made
Speaker 1: some comment about, you know, the human rights abuses against
Speaker 1: LGBTQ people in you know, the UAE, and we got
Speaker 1: a bunch of comments about, well, I guess you don't
Speaker 1: care about how they treat women. So it's one of
Speaker 1: those things where if you speak out against something, someone
Speaker 1: will eventually well immediately say, well, why aren't you speaking
Speaker 1: out against everything?
Speaker 2: Yeah, my experience, go ahead, My experience would no, no,
Speaker 2: go go. My experience would Celebrities in general saying anything
Speaker 2: is that it's fine when you agree with them, it's
Speaker 2: not okay when you don't agree with him. Uh. In general,
Speaker 2: that's how people, wow, the public reacts.
Speaker 1: Listen, if some celebrity wants to make some maga conservative commentary,
Speaker 1: that's not the right to do it. I don't think
Speaker 1: they shouldn't do That's.
Speaker 2: Where I'm getting it. Like, you know, we can't be
Speaker 2: mad when people support Trump or or anything and then
Speaker 2: talk about all these things horrible things, you know, and then.
Speaker 1: At I can be mad at them.
Speaker 2: I can be mad at them, but my point is
Speaker 2: that they have the right the right to say it.
Speaker 2: That's my point. They have the right to say that
Speaker 2: these horrible things in my opinion. Yeah, and then you know,
Speaker 2: she means the only problem that I have here a
Speaker 2: little bit is that she throws the line and that's it.
Speaker 1: She's young and she's young. Yeah, yeah, I'm not saying
Speaker 1: she's some yeah that she's well considered or anything. I
Speaker 1: think she's an artist. I don't think as a spokesperson
Speaker 1: she's the first person I would turn to. But she's young,
Speaker 1: she's outspoken, and as far as I'm concerned, I think
Speaker 1: her politics are largely in the right place. The other
Speaker 1: thing I wanted to point out was the her calling
Speaker 1: out billionaires and people saying, well, why are you doing that?
Speaker 1: You're a millionaire and people, the difference between a million
Speaker 1: dollars and a billion dollars is just almost unfathomable, and
Speaker 1: the power that billionaires hold is not even comparable to
Speaker 1: what your average millionaire pop star holds. Like, I don't
Speaker 1: even know in twenty twenty six, with Elon Musk out
Speaker 1: in the world, Jeff Bezos out in the world, how
Speaker 1: you could possibly think that they are comparable to Billy
Speaker 1: Freakin Eilish right.
Speaker 2: I agree, I totally agree. I just think that in
Speaker 2: her case, specifically, she tends to just throw one line there,
Speaker 2: you know, it's just one liners and then okay.
Speaker 1: But I guess my hackles are up whenever some young
Speaker 1: female star is suddenly getting slammed for having, you know,
Speaker 1: saying something or saying the wrong thing or doing the
Speaker 1: wrong thing. I just have a tendency that like, all right,
Speaker 1: let's take a step back here. I don't think she's
Speaker 1: anybody should be looking at her for their politics. Not really.
Speaker 1: I don't think you should be looking to celebrities for
Speaker 1: that sort of thing. But I do think they have
Speaker 1: the right to talk about the world as they see it.
Speaker 1: They are artists. That is their job.
Speaker 2: I agree with all that, but you can't, Okay, I'm
Speaker 2: gonna be brutal here. You can't phrase something like you
Speaker 2: cannot love animals.
Speaker 1: I agree. That to me is she shoots her mouth up.
Speaker 1: That's stupid. It is stupid.
Speaker 2: I see your point. I love animals, I don't eat meat.
Speaker 2: I know where you're coming from, but that's not well.
Speaker 1: It's sort of like the Ireland statement. I know exactly
Speaker 1: where she was coming from. It was a stupid thing
Speaker 1: for her to say on stage. But we talked about
Speaker 1: this the last time. When we were in Dublin. I
Speaker 1: turned to Lorenzo and said, I feel like I'm at
Speaker 1: a family reunion. We're walking down the street and literally
Speaker 1: everybody looks like me. But I'm not a publisher. She
Speaker 1: didn't say that on stage. I didn't say it on stage, okay,
Speaker 1: and I agree that's the difference. I know where she
Speaker 1: was coming from that, but it was not smarter her
Speaker 1: to say.
Speaker 2: I just want to add one more thing. There's another
Speaker 2: video of her talking about how much she she took
Speaker 2: pr lessons or whatever, Yeah, and how much she hated
Speaker 2: it and she stopped taking them.
Speaker 1: Well, there you go, there you go, all right? Have
Speaker 1: we yes? Yes, we're beat her up.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: I'm glad that we took opposing sides on this, because yeah,
Speaker 1: I didn't want us to do a hole this, this
Speaker 1: young girly is wrong. Now I'm actually going to defender
Speaker 1: she should say these things, and people need to back off.
Speaker 1: Just be whatever. Who cares if she's a millionaire, she's
Speaker 1: led to speak. Anyway, Why don't we take a break
Speaker 1: and come back, and we have a few things to
Speaker 1: say about the Camp Film Festival. We'll be right back.
Speaker 1: We're back, and we might be ending this very quickly
Speaker 1: because the freaking workmen next door have started banging.
Speaker 2: Nightmare. Oh my god, I hate them so much, and
Speaker 2: I'm sure some of you have experienced something similar, but
Speaker 2: my god, I hate.
Speaker 1: It's this massive building project that has been going on
Speaker 1: for a year and a half. They are way behind
Speaker 1: schedule and I don't even think they're not. I mean
Speaker 1: it'll be another nine months probably. I hate them.
Speaker 2: I'm so annoying anyway.
Speaker 1: Can't film this. The cam Film Festival is underway. And
Speaker 1: when you know, in our line of work, there is
Speaker 1: a calendar that you look at in terms of when
Speaker 1: when the red carpet's going to be heavy and when
Speaker 1: it's going to be light, and you you know, we
Speaker 1: have these discussions every single month, and every April we
Speaker 1: always say the same thing. We've got the met Pala
Speaker 1: in the beginning of the month, and then we'll have
Speaker 1: the cam Film Festival. The CAM Film Festival used to
Speaker 1: be later than May. But you go into these things
Speaker 1: knowing when the major events are, when the vent Is
Speaker 1: Film Festival is, when Toronto is, when all the awards
Speaker 1: ceremonies are, when the big blockbusters are coming out.
Speaker 2: And because of what we do, we get excited about
Speaker 2: these things because we're going to have more more red card.
Speaker 1: This means money, money, money for your uncles. And it
Speaker 1: came out this this month that and there was an
Speaker 1: article in The Hollywood Reporter this week that most of
Speaker 1: the American studios are not coming to camp and there
Speaker 1: will not be any major American releases that Can, which
Speaker 1: means there won't be a lot of major American movie
Speaker 1: stars at CAN and that frick I.
Speaker 2: Don't understand that. What is the what is there the
Speaker 2: reason behind it?
Speaker 1: From what I read was that, well, first off, they
Speaker 1: didn't like they talked about that last Indiana Jones movie,
Speaker 1: which apparently got a lot of booze at CAN, and
Speaker 1: I mean they boo movies all the time, and then
Speaker 1: it did poorly. There were a couple other like big Blockbuster.
Speaker 1: I think was it Mission Impossible or maybe it was
Speaker 1: Top Gune one of those. Anyway, that these big amusement
Speaker 1: park movies that American American studios do now are not
Speaker 1: getting the kind of reception American studio executives would like
Speaker 1: to get at the Can Film Festival, and so they
Speaker 1: they think that, you know, well we should just skip it,
Speaker 1: and you know whatever. It's not for me to say
Speaker 1: whether that's the correct way. I mean, I'm not a
Speaker 1: studio executive. I don't know.
Speaker 2: I don't care about real movies anymore. I a real
Speaker 2: discussion about movies.
Speaker 1: I did think I don't know if this is related
Speaker 1: or not, but I remember when the devilwaar Is productwo
Speaker 1: thing was fully underway, and I said to you again,
Speaker 1: because you always think of these things, I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: they'll be going to Paris next. I'm sure we'll be
Speaker 1: covering them. And they didn't go to Paris. No, they
Speaker 1: didn't go anywhere. Yeah, And they did a London one
Speaker 1: and that was it. And they did Tokyo and Seoul
Speaker 1: and Mexico City, and I think they did Berlin, but
Speaker 1: most of those were just photocols. I was actually really surprised,
Speaker 1: but about Paris, I was like, it's a fashion movie.
Speaker 1: How are you not opening in Paris? But I am
Speaker 1: starting to get the impression that a lot of these
Speaker 1: international premieres and stuff are just not looking lucrative enough
Speaker 1: or worth the I will say these massive ones, like
Speaker 1: when they do the big London premieres, premieres in the
Speaker 1: UK or massive, I'm always like, how much did that
Speaker 1: cost to pull on?
Speaker 2: What I have noticed lately, because I look for pictures
Speaker 2: every day, is that they're doing more fan events.
Speaker 1: Because that's easier.
Speaker 2: Because it's easier, it's smaller. You know, everybody's gonna love
Speaker 2: the movie there because they're fans and no celebrities.
Speaker 1: No one's going to start yeah, yeah, yeah, and yeah,
Speaker 1: you only need like two or three cast members to
Speaker 1: show up to a fan event.
Speaker 2: Or even sometimes they don't have anybody.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So it's just interesting. And then the other thing
Speaker 1: I just wanted to tie it to, uh, Colbert is
Speaker 1: ending next week and the whole late night talk show
Speaker 1: thing is up in the air as to how long
Speaker 1: it's going to continue. I don't think they're all going
Speaker 1: to get canceled anytime soon, but they are embattled. And again,
Speaker 1: it's one of those things where that leaves a hole.
Speaker 1: Colbert not existing actually leaves a hole in our coverage
Speaker 1: because we probably cover at these three or four appearing
Speaker 1: is a week on his show. It's not going to
Speaker 1: be some sort of massive financial hit for us, but
Speaker 1: it's just one of the many ways in which you know,
Speaker 1: we kind of constantly have to shift our expectations or
Speaker 1: what we're One of the major things that are being
Speaker 1: talked about right now with celebrity promotion is the fact
Speaker 1: that so many of them are going onto podcasts now,
Speaker 1: but they're not going on to talk shows. And part
Speaker 1: of the reason they're going onto podcasts is because they
Speaker 1: don't well. Part of the reason these podcasts are becoming
Speaker 1: so popular is because you don't need unions to pull
Speaker 1: them off, so you don't like you would with a
Speaker 1: television show. So now you can go out and promote
Speaker 1: your work and you don't have to pay a union,
Speaker 1: and you don't have to get dressed up, because who
Speaker 1: gets dressed up for a podcast. That's the kind of
Speaker 1: stuff that sucks for us because if you start removing
Speaker 1: fashion or pulling away from it, I don't know how
Speaker 1: much of that stuff we could possibly.
Speaker 2: I don't think that's sustainable because I don't think it
Speaker 2: is easy. I don't think so. Because the only reason
Speaker 2: why we pay attention to things is when we see them,
Speaker 2: actually visually see them in front of us. Right, you
Speaker 2: have to see the actor all the time so that
Speaker 2: you go like, oh, maybe I should see this movie. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, that's what happens.
Speaker 1: It has been the way Hollywood and even the theater
Speaker 1: world and the music world has promoted itself for one
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty years is that you get performers in
Speaker 1: outfits in front of crowds to drum up excitement so
Speaker 1: I don't have anything to say about this except it's
Speaker 1: one of the many, many ships that we're constantly dealing
Speaker 1: with in our line of work. And it's because the
Speaker 1: industry itself, the fashion industry and the entertainment industry are
Speaker 1: in so much flux at the moment that nobody understands
Speaker 1: or knows what works and what doesn't. I think all
Speaker 1: of the studios skipping Can is a huge mistake for
Speaker 1: the studios. But what do I know?
Speaker 2: I mean, why would you eliminate one of the places
Speaker 2: where you're going to promote yourself.
Speaker 1: I mean I don't understand why. I know it's already opened,
Speaker 1: but why wouldn't you want the Double Wears product to
Speaker 1: a big splashing moment? I can with that cast, I
Speaker 1: still get it. I don't get it. Whatever, do you
Speaker 1: have anything else you want to add to that?
Speaker 2: That's it. That's it. It's just and again it's it's
Speaker 2: I see that with the fashion industry and the movie
Speaker 2: and lazy it's just like, oh, let's go with this
Speaker 2: and it doesn't work, and then to go back to
Speaker 2: the old fashion, you know, the old ways, and it's
Speaker 2: just yeah, it's people, it's people with money making this
Speaker 2: stupid decision.
Speaker 1: It's people with money getting lazier and lazier, like we
Speaker 1: shouldn't have to do this, we shouldn't have to put
Speaker 1: the effort in, and you know, they take control whatever
Speaker 1: is the cheapest, easiest route.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like leadership, you know, one oh one. That's
Speaker 2: the basics. I'm in charge. Now, let's change everything.
Speaker 1: And this is a good segue into our next topic,
Speaker 1: which also is related to CAN, which suddenly everyone that
Speaker 1: CAN is talking about AI and apparently embracing it. To
Speaker 1: me more. During the press conference for the jewelry came
Speaker 1: out with these very pro AI kind of I mean
Speaker 1: it set people off because again it's the way people
Speaker 1: talk about AI that that because she talked about this
Speaker 1: battle that we're not going to win and we have
Speaker 1: to just succumb to it and everything. And that's the
Speaker 1: kind of thing that makes people panic because you're not
Speaker 1: talking about this this you know, this technology in a
Speaker 1: way that's like this is how it's going to improve
Speaker 1: your life, this is what it can do for you. No,
Speaker 1: it's you have to succumb to this because it's coming
Speaker 1: whether you want. And I have never heard a technology
Speaker 1: spoken about in that way not the Internet, not social media,
Speaker 1: not computers on art phones.
Speaker 2: I was listening to someone talk about AI this morning
Speaker 2: on NPR and I and he was right when he said,
Speaker 2: we don't really understand the whole thing yet.
Speaker 1: That's what's scary about it.
Speaker 2: That's what's scary about it. We're embracing it. We're investing
Speaker 2: all this money on something that we're not know.
Speaker 1: It's everywhere. It's it's in your emails, it's in your
Speaker 1: Google it's a listen.
Speaker 2: I'm I'm on social media at the time, TikTok, Instagram,
Speaker 2: and I have the hardest time trying to figure out, Okay,
Speaker 2: is this real or fake? It's like a constant battle
Speaker 2: now that you're like, all right, is this real that
Speaker 2: you know? Is this a real picture?
Speaker 1: And the only thing I want to say about this
Speaker 1: is when then Peter Jackson came out yes, and he
Speaker 1: was he made some very I've read his comments like
Speaker 1: five times now and I'm like, Okay, this is a
Speaker 1: very confusing point. And that's the thing. It's like, whenever
Speaker 1: someone tries, especially in the creative community, tries to make
Speaker 1: a pitch as to why we should accept AI, their
Speaker 1: reasoning is always kind of muddled, and he made some
Speaker 1: bullshit point about Andy serkis never getting an oscar for
Speaker 1: playing Gollum, and I'm like, what does that have to
Speaker 1: do with AI? That wasn't AI anyway. He made similar
Speaker 1: comments about embracing AI, and he said something that is
Speaker 1: very very illuminating to me, at least where he said it.
Speaker 1: To me. It's just it's another special effect, that's all
Speaker 1: it is. And if you look at it from that perspective, like, oh,
Speaker 1: this is just another way to jazz up filmmaking, to
Speaker 1: make things. Sure, that's but the problem that so many
Speaker 1: people have with AI, especially when it's injected into creative endeavors,
Speaker 1: is that it's putting people out of work, right, Like, Okay, yes,
Speaker 1: it's a special effect that is putting your special effects
Speaker 1: department out of work. And I know that's alarmist because
Speaker 1: what's going to happen is a lot of special effects
Speaker 1: artists are going to become AI special effects artists.
Speaker 2: That's the same reason why we scan our items, we
Speaker 2: beg our items when we go to every store because
Speaker 2: they don't want to pay people, not because it makes
Speaker 2: it more practical or easier for us. No, they're just eliminating.
Speaker 1: They're eliminating jobs and pushing it onto right in the
Speaker 1: case of creative use of AI, they're eliminating jobs. And
Speaker 1: what they're putting out so far from what I have
Speaker 1: seen about like AI videos and stuff like that. They're
Speaker 1: putting out stuff that looks subpar to me. It does
Speaker 1: not look as good as the best digital special effects
Speaker 1: I have ever seen on film. It never does. The
Speaker 1: people never look fully believable, the backgrounds don't work, the
Speaker 1: voices sound weird so.
Speaker 2: As of now.
Speaker 1: But my point is, you're so pushing this thing on us,
Speaker 1: and none of us can say why. The idol's and
Speaker 1: the only reason the people with the power are pushing
Speaker 1: this on us is because it's going to eliminate jobs,
Speaker 1: because it's going to make things cheaper.
Speaker 2: And they're going to make more money.
Speaker 1: And people like to mean more. You see actors embracing
Speaker 1: it now, Ben Affleck and Matt Damon Reese, Witherspoon to
Speaker 1: me more all coming out and making these you know
Speaker 1: why money because they're investing.
Speaker 2: Because the all the names you mentioned are producers and
Speaker 2: they create shoes and they have their own companies.
Speaker 1: So they're cutting jobs. They're cutting jobs and making subpar products.
Speaker 1: But I also want to say, the reason you're seeing
Speaker 1: so many people I think in Hollywood make these comments
Speaker 1: more and more is because they're scared and they know
Speaker 1: that they can't I mean, they have to embrace that
Speaker 1: otherwise you know the future's coming. And I think this
Speaker 1: is what to me, Moore was trying to say. The
Speaker 1: future is coming whether you want it or not. So
Speaker 1: people need to figure out how to get on board
Speaker 1: with something.
Speaker 2: It's not going to go away. It's not going to
Speaker 2: go maybe you will get reshaped or something, but but
Speaker 2: it's not gonna go away. It's it's part of the future. Now.
Speaker 1: I mean, I agree, and saying this is just acknowledging reality.
Speaker 1: It's not. I am not advocating that we should embrace AI.
Speaker 1: I don't use it in my search results, I don't
Speaker 1: use it in my emails and my pledge to you
Speaker 1: never never will we use it on the site. Nothing
Speaker 1: on the site has ever been written by AI or
Speaker 1: anything like that. But it is an inevitability. And I
Speaker 1: do think sometimes when people I think the backlash against
Speaker 1: it is sometimes as poorly informed as the people who
Speaker 1: were advocating for it. And that's really all I wanted
Speaker 1: to say is that it's coming for Hollywood. Hollywood is
Speaker 1: going to embrace it, and honestly, it'll be up to
Speaker 1: us as the consumers too. You know, if you see
Speaker 1: some shitty Lord of the Rings movie that was done
Speaker 1: with AI, don't buy a ticket, don't support this stuff.
Speaker 1: That's the only way it's going to It's never going
Speaker 1: to go away, but we can force it as consumers
Speaker 1: to be used in a way that we want it
Speaker 1: to be used, and not to have it forced on
Speaker 1: us with shitty special effects and stuff like that. That's
Speaker 1: the end of my rant. I'm sorry, No.
Speaker 2: I totally agree with you. Yeah, I think you can
Speaker 2: use all this stuff to help humans to do a
Speaker 2: better job. But when you take the work of.
Speaker 1: The human using it as a shortcut for human labor,
Speaker 1: I mean, all technology provided shortcuts to human labor, but
Speaker 1: the product has to be as good. It's sort of
Speaker 1: a lot of people aren't going to like this, but
Speaker 1: it's sort of like cake mixes. Cake mixes made it
Speaker 1: so that everybody could bake a cake, but no cake
Speaker 1: mix is as good as a cake from a bakery,
Speaker 1: and you sort of have to make that, you know.
Speaker 1: I'm not arguing against cake mixes, but I just want
Speaker 1: to make sure that we still have access to really
Speaker 1: good baked goods. I guess that's what I'm trying to say.
Speaker 2: The same thing the typewriter. We don't have typewriters anymore.
Speaker 2: We have you know, keyboards, but but you're.
Speaker 1: It's still the writing long hand anymore.
Speaker 2: But it's still your brain writing this stuff.
Speaker 1: It's just what's scary about it is that the people
Speaker 1: who are most invested in this literally in every sense
Speaker 1: of the word, are the ones that are pushing it
Speaker 1: the most, and they don't seem to care about the
Speaker 1: effects that we'll have on the people who aren't going
Speaker 1: to make money off of this.
Speaker 2: It's always people trying to make more money. They don't care.
Speaker 2: It's the same thing, I mean, the people will benefiting
Speaker 2: from destroying the environment and all those things. You know,
Speaker 2: they just want to make more money.
Speaker 1: All right. I think we have ranted and they're grinding
Speaker 1: or something's going on next door, and I apologize for
Speaker 1: the noise, but we're going to end it here. We
Speaker 1: will be back on Friday with the Bitterkin Movie Club.
Speaker 1: We are doing. My name is Dolomite, Dolomite is my name.
Speaker 1: I always get that wrong. Dolomite is my name. We're
Speaker 1: doing that on Friday, and then we'll be back next
Speaker 1: week with whatever crosses rise, it crosses our does. Until then,
Speaker 1: take care of yourselves, love you mean it.
Speaker 2: Bye bye bye