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<v Speaker 1>As we predicted right here on the nonprofits. A federal

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<v Speaker 1>judge has put a hold on Louise's Louisiana's recently passed

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<v Speaker 1>law HB seventy one, which makes it mandatory to display

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<v Speaker 1>the Ten Commandments in all classrooms, ruling that the laws

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<v Speaker 1>opponents actually have shown sufficient reason for why it may

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<v Speaker 1>be unconstitutional. Alana Odoms, the executive director of the ACLU

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<v Speaker 1>of Louisiana, responded to the ruling by saying, with so

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<v Speaker 1>many aspects of democracy I think in peril, it feels

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<v Speaker 1>really reassuring and affirming that the federal court really articulated

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<v Speaker 1>a very clear and strong First Amendment right that shall

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<v Speaker 1>not be violated. However, Louisiana's Attorney General has appealed to

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<v Speaker 1>stay order and added that he strongly disagrees with the

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<v Speaker 1>court's decision and will immediately repeal, saying this is far

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<v Speaker 1>from over now. One of the major concerns about the

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<v Speaker 1>laws are the dangers of overturning the establis establishment clause

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<v Speaker 1>and the dangers of overturning the establishment clause of the

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<v Speaker 1>Constitution and opening the possibility of people being discriminated against

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<v Speaker 1>because of their religion by the very government that was

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<v Speaker 1>supposed to protect them.

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<v Speaker 3>Now.

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<v Speaker 1>This story is from CNN by Lauren mass Courinus and

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<v Speaker 1>Isabelle Rosaliz. I'm hoping I got the first woman's name correctly.

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<v Speaker 1>It was published November twelfth, twenty twenty four and I

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<v Speaker 1>want to hand it off to Cindy. Are you worried

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<v Speaker 1>that American judges will ignore the Constitution in lieu of

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<v Speaker 1>religious doctrine?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, I'm not feeling very optimistic about this one, to

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<v Speaker 2>be honest. It looks designed to go to the Supreme Court,

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<v Speaker 2>and it probably will. And when it's there, I suspect

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<v Speaker 2>the very radicalized judges will find a way to undermine

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<v Speaker 2>the current president for as far as they think they

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<v Speaker 2>can get away with. In twenty fourteen, I said that

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<v Speaker 2>the US would be theocracy in the next three years,

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<v Speaker 2>and I got loved at at that time. Now I'm

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<v Speaker 2>afraid it won't take even half that time. There is

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<v Speaker 2>a concerted effort from some states to do the same

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<v Speaker 2>thing Louisiana is trying to do, like Oklahoma, for example.

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<v Speaker 2>I recently watched the superintendent in that Oklahoma state express

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<v Speaker 2>extremely similar views in an interview, and what I find

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<v Speaker 2>interesting is that in the last ten years where I

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<v Speaker 2>started looking into the US from the outside, I noticed

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<v Speaker 2>that despite its image of one united country, there is

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<v Speaker 2>a constant struggle like some kind of try to find

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<v Speaker 2>a balance between federal and state power. And I'm afraid

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<v Speaker 2>that the current balance is going to shift significantly in

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<v Speaker 2>the next four years. Because you have a Supreme Court

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<v Speaker 2>that cannot be trusted and losing pretty much all legitimacy.

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<v Speaker 2>You have a president pushing an authoritarian agenda, which means

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<v Speaker 2>very very much centralized power, which means very small federal government,

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<v Speaker 2>which means that the states will have to compensate. You

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<v Speaker 2>have an extreme polarization from state to state on fundamental issues.

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<v Speaker 2>You have a large difference between what the Republican Party

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<v Speaker 2>is trying to implement and what the population actually wants,

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<v Speaker 2>even the people who identify as Republicans. And you have states,

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<v Speaker 2>especially governors, who are trying to organize themselves already right

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<v Speaker 2>now today. So because of all this, it feels like

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<v Speaker 2>this balance is about cheap in very different way than

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<v Speaker 2>it does today. So I think it's something to watch

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<v Speaker 2>in the next next week's, next month, because yeah, I

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<v Speaker 2>think it's going to change.

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<v Speaker 1>And jen since we're talking about the courts and religious rulings.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you think that they've overlooked obvious religious violations of

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<v Speaker 1>the constitutions, And if so, why do you think that is?

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<v Speaker 3>I know for sure that they have been violating the

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<v Speaker 3>Constitution and federal laws and regulations on a regular basis.

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<v Speaker 3>A lot of these lawsuits are obviously unconstitutional. I'm glad

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<v Speaker 3>that the judge saw the obvious in this particular case.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not at all a sure thing anymore, depending on

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<v Speaker 3>whether you're in the Eleventh Circuit or you're in the

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<v Speaker 3>Fifth Circuit. It just depends on who you're judge shopping

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<v Speaker 3>for to get these up before a and obviously corrupt

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<v Speaker 3>Supreme Court. So you know, I'm kind of heartsick that

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<v Speaker 3>this judge was true to his oath. But the Conservatives

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<v Speaker 3>are not true to their oaths and have destroyed the

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<v Speaker 3>credibility of the court system on top of it, mainly

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<v Speaker 3>due to the machinations of the federalist society. So I'm

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<v Speaker 3>just really, really heartsick that our constitutional republic, is our

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<v Speaker 3>constitutional democracy, i should say, is failing to uphold its

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<v Speaker 3>own rules. This used to be a country governed by laws.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm not so sure that's true anymore. If this is overturned,

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<v Speaker 3>I will be more than heartbroken. That will destroy the

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<v Speaker 3>last shread of integrity the Supreme Court has, which it

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<v Speaker 3>doesn't have much left, and I will lose any trust

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<v Speaker 3>I have in the fairness of our courts and the

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<v Speaker 3>rule of law as it stands in this country. So,

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<v Speaker 3>and that's saying a lot for me, because I'm a patriot.

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<v Speaker 3>I've always been a patriot. I served my country and

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<v Speaker 3>I love country. That's why it's tearing me up to

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<v Speaker 3>see this kind of bullshit actually be propagated as the

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<v Speaker 3>right stuff to do. It's not. But this decision is

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<v Speaker 3>the right decision. I am not excited that he did

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<v Speaker 3>what it was obvious. In other words, I'm not patting

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<v Speaker 3>him on the back for doing his duty. I would

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<v Speaker 3>be excited and angry if he had not. I celebrate

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<v Speaker 3>the ACLU and the FFRF and their constant visual to

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<v Speaker 3>challenge these kinds of un American activities. I'll give them

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<v Speaker 3>a bravo Zulu well done. But I can't express any

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<v Speaker 3>more disgust for the people trying to destroy this country

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<v Speaker 3>and turn it into what they want it to be

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<v Speaker 3>rather than what it's been for two hundred and fifty years.

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<v Speaker 1>AJ, there's been another battle in courts over government vouchers

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<v Speaker 1>being used to pay tuitions at religious schools. Now, how

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<v Speaker 1>do you think this Ten Commandments law relates to that?

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<v Speaker 4>It's all about advancing religion, not just any religion, but

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<v Speaker 4>Christian nationalism specifically. And Louisiana's Republican governor, Jeff Landry, he's

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<v Speaker 4>a Roman Catholic, but he seems to want his state

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<v Speaker 4>to be at the forefront of this Christian nationalist movement.

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<v Speaker 4>That was his goal when he signed the Ten Commandments Law,

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<v Speaker 4>recording all public schools and all state funded university classrooms

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<v Speaker 4>to display this, you know, poster sized state version of

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<v Speaker 4>the Ten Commandments in very large and easily readable fonts,

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<v Speaker 4>because obviously it has to be out there frontal center. Right.

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<v Speaker 4>It seems that they can't get the voucher programs to

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<v Speaker 4>funnel all these children into religious educational facilities, so they're

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<v Speaker 4>trying to bring religion into the public schools. Now, and

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<v Speaker 4>I'm class to see that these non secular families are

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<v Speaker 4>fighting for the separation of church and state in public exchools,

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<v Speaker 4>especially in other public spaces.

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<v Speaker 1>You mentioned Catholics and the Landry was a Catholic, and

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<v Speaker 1>I just wanted to point out that six of the

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<v Speaker 1>judges on the Supreme Court are Catholic as well. Six,

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<v Speaker 1>So I mean.

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<v Speaker 3>It's five five conservatives and one liberal. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Cindy as a non American, thankfully for you in

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<v Speaker 1>this in this instance, What are your impressions of the

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<v Speaker 1>battles between Oh, well, you actually just gave that to

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<v Speaker 1>you know, where you're from, you don't get that. Uh,

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<v Speaker 1>you have departments, not states, as I recall, And do

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<v Speaker 1>they have any kind of power at all or are

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<v Speaker 1>they completely reliant on the federal government there.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, the religion is completely completely separated from from from

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<v Speaker 2>the state. Uh, there there is, so they have uh,

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<v Speaker 2>some funding, but it's uh, it's it's the same for

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<v Speaker 2>all religions, but it's very limited influence. In any case.

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<v Speaker 2>The seventeenth and eighteenth century in France have been very

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<v Speaker 2>hard for Christianity in general because you know, all those

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<v Speaker 2>philosophers they were not very very friends with Christianity. So

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<v Speaker 2>religion in France is very much limited to the private circle.

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<v Speaker 2>It's still alive, but it's it's really really limited in there. Also,

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<v Speaker 2>it doesn't have much strength in terms of political force.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's the same in Belgium, where I currently live.

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<v Speaker 2>I discovered recently that some of my soccer players in

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<v Speaker 2>my team, they are Christians, but uh, their belief that

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<v Speaker 2>doesn't uh enforce anything into their life there. They're not

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<v Speaker 2>entire abortion they not, they're not. It's it's unlike anything

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<v Speaker 2>you can see in the US. It's mostly cultural theists.

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<v Speaker 2>Uh some of them believe in God and go to church,

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<v Speaker 2>but it's it's very limited and it's more about the community.

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<v Speaker 2>The beliefs themselves. They are very much in the background,

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<v Speaker 2>and so they don't have any impact. The beliefs, I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>they don't have any impact on the society, and nothing

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<v Speaker 2>is decided on whether or not it agrees with religion

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<v Speaker 2>or not. It's just not in in the discussions.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, John, Do you feel let's go back to

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<v Speaker 1>what I kind of what I actually before. Do you

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<v Speaker 1>feel the courts have been or will betray your trust

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<v Speaker 1>in the future, And how do you think the America

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<v Speaker 1>can public as a whole sees that problem.

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<v Speaker 3>I can't speak for the American public, but I can

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<v Speaker 3>take a guess. As far as me, I think that

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<v Speaker 3>the courts will of course break my trust because they're

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<v Speaker 3>supposed to enforce the first ten Amendments, all the Amendments

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<v Speaker 3>as well as the Constitution, and it looks like they're

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<v Speaker 3>prepared to overstep that that bounds again in order to

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<v Speaker 3>save themselves from whatever scrutiny on the conservative side that

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<v Speaker 3>they might get for doing something that would support the

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<v Speaker 3>actual United States. So I don't have a lot of

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<v Speaker 3>faith that I'm not going to have a problem with

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<v Speaker 3>just about anything they've decide. They have surprised me on

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<v Speaker 3>occasion they've actually done the right thing. What really got

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<v Speaker 3>my goat was residential immunity. There's an actual passage in

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<v Speaker 3>the Constitution that says exactly the opposite. So you know,

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<v Speaker 3>that kind of tells me that they really don't care

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<v Speaker 3>what they're looking at. They're just going to make up

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<v Speaker 3>their minds and think of some obtuse reason why they

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<v Speaker 3>should think that way. It's actually almost criminal, given that

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<v Speaker 3>they're all you know, at least two of them we

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<v Speaker 3>know are on the take for a millionaire billionaires. You know,

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<v Speaker 3>it's like, I have no more faith in the court system.

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<v Speaker 3>I see all the time people being railroaded, police not

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<v Speaker 3>being held accountable for violations of the constitutional rights of citizens.

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<v Speaker 3>I just see that a lot. And I'm just I

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<v Speaker 3>worked in a sheriff's department, you know, and none of

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<v Speaker 3>the people I worked with thirty years ago would even

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<v Speaker 3>dream of doing the kinds of things I'm hearing about now.

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<v Speaker 3>They were. They were all legitimately good people and legitimately

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<v Speaker 3>good cops, you know, and some great deputies they you know,

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<v Speaker 3>and some really difficult call and they always seem to

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<v Speaker 3>be able to figure them out. Sometimes I couldn't figure

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<v Speaker 3>them out. And I'm not I'm not, I'm not dull,

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<v Speaker 3>but you know, these guys were, they were really knew

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<v Speaker 3>their their stuff. I am not so sure that we

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<v Speaker 3>have too many, especially the higher ranking police officers, the

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<v Speaker 3>sheriffs themselves and the police chiefs, who are really thinking

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<v Speaker 3>through what is going on with their particular things, and

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<v Speaker 3>that the justice system itself, the courts, are not reliable

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<v Speaker 3>as a stop to political mayhem. So we are in

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<v Speaker 3>for a rough ride. And you know, I'm sorry to

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<v Speaker 3>be so Debbie Downer on this stuff, but I really feel,

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<v Speaker 3>deep in my heart facsimile, that there is a serious

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<v Speaker 3>problem that needs to be fixed, and the Conservatives are

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<v Speaker 3>not going to fix it. They're making it worse.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I want to get back to the actual story

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<v Speaker 1>that we're talking about for a moment. About the law

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<v Speaker 1>that we're talking about. The similar Ten Commandments law was

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<v Speaker 1>passed and or was struck down in Kentucky back in

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen eighty three other states currently have proposed a similar law.

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<v Speaker 1>None have been implemented, possibly because it's a playtant violation

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<v Speaker 1>of the Constitution. But those three states are Texas of course,

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<v Speaker 1>Utah of course, and Oklahoma of course. So I am

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<v Speaker 1>always worried when we're pushing something like this in a classroom,

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<v Speaker 1>what are the Jewish kids going to say? What are

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<v Speaker 1>the Muslim kids in the school going to say? Why

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<v Speaker 1>aren't we putting up the five Pillars of Islam on

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<v Speaker 1>the law for those students? Why isn't there a law

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<v Speaker 1>for that? And from what I really see is this

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<v Speaker 1>is not an attempt to do anything but push a

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<v Speaker 1>religious agenda and a religious morality on young minds that

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<v Speaker 1>are open to suggestion. So this to me is really heinous.

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<v Speaker 1>It's really heinous. And I want to ask aj. In

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<v Speaker 1>the past, you've expressed for you think religion should be taught.

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<v Speaker 1>Can you share those thoughts with us.

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<v Speaker 4>Now, for me, there is a place for religious education

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<v Speaker 4>and it's definitely not school, and there is a place

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<v Speaker 4>for secular education, and you know, we don't bring that

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<v Speaker 4>to church.

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<v Speaker 3>Right.

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<v Speaker 4>So, in this specific case, the families of several students

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<v Speaker 4>of different faiths, some of them were families that had

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<v Speaker 4>more than one faith within the same family, right, multi

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<v Speaker 4>failed families, and these families reached out to ACLU to

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<v Speaker 4>help them with the fight because they felt that it

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<v Speaker 4>was a direct infringement of religious freedom and a violation

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<v Speaker 4>of the First Amendment, which, as we've mentioned, is very

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<v Speaker 4>clear as far as violations. This should protect all US

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<v Speaker 4>citizens' freedom of religion, and to me, more important then

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<v Speaker 4>freedom of religion is freedom from religion, okay, because we

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<v Speaker 4>want these places to stay secular. One of the family

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<v Speaker 4>members from one of the students said, as an interfaith family,

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<v Speaker 4>we expect our children to receive their secular education in

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<v Speaker 4>public school and their religious education at home and within

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<v Speaker 4>our faith communities, not from the government officials. And I

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<v Speaker 4>absolutely love this sentiment. I would be happy to stop

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<v Speaker 4>talking about the harms of religion if people follow this

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<v Speaker 4>type of thought process. You know, religious education belongs at home.

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<v Speaker 4>You know what we can even do without the church teachings,

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<v Speaker 4>keep it at home behind closed doors. Obviously, there are

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<v Speaker 4>instances where this can become a problem, like if we

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<v Speaker 4>have religious homeschoolers, But if we're talking about a publicly

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<v Speaker 4>schooled child who is being taught the basics of religion

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<v Speaker 4>at home, then it's generally a lot less harmful than

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<v Speaker 4>school and church indoctrination happening at once. Because these kids

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<v Speaker 4>are in public school, they're being the religion at home.

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<v Speaker 4>So yeah, I think that we absolutely need to separate

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<v Speaker 4>the religious education the secular education. Just keep the religion

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<v Speaker 4>out our schools. Please.

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<v Speaker 1>It always seems like it's members of the Republican Party

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<v Speaker 1>trying to pass these laws, and I'm not sure that

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<v Speaker 1>the majority of their voters would agree with many of these,

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<v Speaker 1>Nor do I think those voters have fully caught on

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<v Speaker 1>to what a lot of these politicians want to change

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<v Speaker 1>this country into a right wing Christian theocracy. I know

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<v Speaker 1>there's a lot of people that go along with it,

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<v Speaker 1>but I think a lot of the people who are

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<v Speaker 1>voting for the GOP are not really okay with this

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<v Speaker 1>type of policy. So I want to ask everybody and

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to I'm going to ask everybody real quick answer.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you think that the GOP voters are eventually to

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<v Speaker 1>catch on to what their leaders are, their politicians are

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<v Speaker 1>doing here? At least some of their politicians are doing here.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'll start with because she's farthest from me, you.

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<v Speaker 2>Know, I let the other respond because there's something I

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<v Speaker 2>want to say on a different topic. So I let

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<v Speaker 2>the the other ones respond to your question. K.

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<v Speaker 4>You're next further away.

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<v Speaker 3>So could you re say the question please?

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<v Speaker 1>I wanted to. Do you need me to?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>I was talking about how I don't think a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of the GOP voters are okay with this Christian agenda,

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<v Speaker 1>and I whatever, if you thought that you were going

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<v Speaker 1>to wake up to this idea, or or if some

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<v Speaker 1>of the voters because some of them are for it,

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<v Speaker 1>let's face it.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, well, yeah, a lot of the evangelical churches are

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<v Speaker 3>the ones that are shouting this the loudest. However, I

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<v Speaker 3>think a lot of Republicans, and I know a few

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<v Speaker 3>of them actually, who are going to or have already

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<v Speaker 3>decided that this isn't the direction they want to go in.

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<v Speaker 3>And I'm afraid they're they're going to be there will

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<v Speaker 3>be more of them as things progress, but you know,

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<v Speaker 3>let's just hope it's not too late, you know, And

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<v Speaker 3>there's always hope, I mean, you know, there's always hope

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<v Speaker 3>that one day they'll wake up. But you see, there's

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<v Speaker 3>an awful lot of the base that has that's turned

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<v Speaker 3>into the base that wasn't there fifteen years ago or

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<v Speaker 3>sixteen years ago, that was brought into the party since then,

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<v Speaker 3>that are poorly educated, easily swayed by conspiracy theories in

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<v Speaker 3>other way. And that group, that base is not going

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<v Speaker 3>to change, you know, until they have been totally destroyed politically,

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<v Speaker 3>then they'll change. But as far as the actual Republicans,

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<v Speaker 3>there's lots of Republican groups that are now in opposition.

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<v Speaker 3>So it's like, you know, let's wait and see where

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<v Speaker 3>that goes.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, it's supposed to be a quick answer, John Aj.

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<v Speaker 3>I think.

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<v Speaker 4>Gonna get quick. I think there's going to be a

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<v Speaker 4>mixed bag. I think there's going to be people that

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<v Speaker 4>were all for it and are going to be very

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<v Speaker 4>happy that all of these things are being enacted. But

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<v Speaker 4>I think there's also going to be a lot of

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<v Speaker 4>people who are going to be very disappointed in the

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<v Speaker 4>more strict Christian nationalist ideals that are going to be

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<v Speaker 4>put in place, and yeah, they're not going to be

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<v Speaker 4>happy with that when when their liberties are taken away

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<v Speaker 4>that they don't agree with.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, thanks, and I think Cindy had some she

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<v Speaker 1>wanted to say on a different topic, so I'm going

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<v Speaker 1>to give her the last word.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, we've talked about several people who who were trying

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<v Speaker 2>to impose their religion and we one of them was Catholic,

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<v Speaker 2>and some of the are Evangelical. So let's get back

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<v Speaker 2>in history a little bit. There was one religion pretty

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<v Speaker 2>much the press was invented, and that was the Catholic religion.

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<v Speaker 2>And when people started to read the Bible, they started

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<v Speaker 2>to realize that, yeah, they didn't like what the Catholics

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<v Speaker 2>were trying to teach because it was too different from

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<v Speaker 2>the Bible. And that's when the keys in between Catholic

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<v Speaker 2>and Protestants started to appear. So when people were able

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<v Speaker 2>to read themselves the Bible, they started to disagree. And

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<v Speaker 2>then in the early nineteen tens, there was this movement

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<v Speaker 2>in the US called the Fundamentals, where about fifty intellectuals

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<v Speaker 2>decided that they thought the the evangelical movement, the Protestants

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<v Speaker 2>weren't strict enough, so they went to the fundamentals. And

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<v Speaker 2>that's where the word fundamentalism comes from and applies to

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<v Speaker 2>religion oppressions. So what happens when Catholics decide that Catholicism

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<v Speaker 2>is the state religion in the US. What happens to evangelicals?

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<v Speaker 2>I don't say nothing that happens in that happened through history.

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<v Speaker 2>There's no reason why it doesn't happen again, exactly. And

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<v Speaker 2>so it's so frustrating that the education system, the public

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<v Speaker 2>education system in the US, has been destroyed because that's

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<v Speaker 2>information that would be very, very relevant to teach today.

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<v Speaker 1>I've been kind of saying that all along because because,

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<v Speaker 1>as I mentioned, the Supreme Court has six Catholics on it,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think you're going to get a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>products and evangelicals that go to scot Is thinking they're

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<v Speaker 1>going to get rulings in their favor, and of course

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<v Speaker 1>they will get some, but I don't think they're going

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<v Speaker 1>to get everything that they want because of the Catholicism

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<v Speaker 1>ruling the courts. Yeah, I thought this was a really

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<v Speaker 1>good segment