Speaker 1: It's Nightside with Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2: Thanks very much, Nicole. As always, yeah, quiet sports night.
Speaker 2: The Bruins need a little time to recoup here. My
Speaker 2: name is Dan Ray. I don't need any time to recoup.
Speaker 2: It's only been twenty hours since we were last together
Speaker 2: just before midnight last night, and here we are for
Speaker 2: a Wednesday night vision of Nightside. We have four great guests,
Speaker 2: interesting topics coming up in the eight o'clock hour. Before
Speaker 2: we get to them, let me tell you Rob Brooks
Speaker 2: is back in the control room. And my name is
Speaker 2: Dan Ray, the aforementioned Dan Ray of Knightside with Dan Ray.
Speaker 2: Very appropriate. I guess we were in our eighteenth year
Speaker 2: here on wb Z, which is a proud iHeartRadio station,
Speaker 2: a legendary radio station on the year since nineteen twenty one,
Speaker 2: not twenty twenty one, but nineteen twenty one. And by
Speaker 2: the way, we will do our eighteenth annual college admissions panel.
Speaker 2: We've done that now. This will be our eighteenth consecutive
Speaker 2: year with Bill Fitzsimmons, the legendary admissions director from Harvard University.
Speaker 2: In Grant Goslin, a Boston College dean of admissions admissions director.
Speaker 2: The titles change a little bit. But if you have
Speaker 2: anyone who is beginning to think about going to college, Okay,
Speaker 2: I'm talking kids freshman, sophomore, they should be listening and
Speaker 2: their parents should be listening to but they'll get all
Speaker 2: sorts of tips on how to get into the school
Speaker 2: that you would prefer, what different type schools are out there,
Speaker 2: what schools are looking for, and also how to finance
Speaker 2: that education. So that will be on Monday night, December ninth.
Speaker 2: That's not the first Monday after thanks after Thanksgiving, but
Speaker 2: the second Monday. Now we are going to go to
Speaker 2: our first hour tonight, which is the night Side News Update,
Speaker 2: and joining us to talk about people who are dealing
Speaker 2: with either mental illness or get depressed around the holidays.
Speaker 2: Most people enjoy the holiday and they look forward to
Speaker 2: the holidays, but not everyone. So with us is doctor
Speaker 2: Mark Longs Joe. He is a licensed social worker program
Speaker 2: director at McLain Hospital. Dr Longs Joe, Welcome to NIGHTSID.
Speaker 2: How are you tonight, sir?
Speaker 3: Hello Dan Ray, nice to talk with you, and please
Speaker 3: just refer to me as Mark. I know doctor with
Speaker 3: my name. I'm a social worker and proud of it.
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, when it says doctor on the the piece
Speaker 2: of paper that I have, I always But that's fine,
Speaker 2: we'll leave it at Mark as well. You call me Dan, Okay,
Speaker 2: tell us what's going on here, because I know that
Speaker 2: over the course of my lifetime, particularly you know, when
Speaker 2: I was single, you have a breakup with a girlfriend
Speaker 2: or something like that and be a lonely Christmas time.
Speaker 2: But there are people who every year, as they go
Speaker 2: through life, have a tougher time dealing with the holidays.
Speaker 2: And I read that article that you folks had produced
Speaker 2: from McLean's and found that it was not only sixty
Speaker 2: four percent of individuals, according to the National Alliance of
Speaker 2: Mendale Illness living with mental Illness that believe that their
Speaker 2: conditions worseen around the holidays, but thirty eight percent of
Speaker 2: the entire population. I had no idea that many people
Speaker 2: we're having that sort of reaction. As the year was
Speaker 2: ending and the bells were ringing and people were singing
Speaker 2: and all that. It's counterintuitive.
Speaker 3: Mark tell us, why, Oh, that's right, Dan, that's right.
Speaker 3: It is counterintuitive. You'd like to think of this as
Speaker 3: the merriest time of year, but when really it's filled
Speaker 3: with some of the most pressure. If you really think
Speaker 3: about what we have to deal with during this time
Speaker 3: of year. There's so many expectations. Everybody wants the perfect
Speaker 3: holiday season, and we're reminded of all of the expectations
Speaker 3: as we go through life and think about, well, this
Speaker 3: is going to be the best holiday ever. But we
Speaker 3: know that the expectations have to be set in reality
Speaker 3: and oftentimes, especially like at this particular time, just a
Speaker 3: week before Thanksgiving, it's a really important time to think
Speaker 3: about how to plan ahead for what really is a
Speaker 3: very pressure filled season. As happy as it is, there
Speaker 3: are a lot of different pressures, whether it be you know,
Speaker 3: go ahead in but you know.
Speaker 2: I can identify with what you're saying. There's pressures depending
Speaker 2: upon who you need to consider buying gifts for. And
Speaker 2: you know, if you purchase a gift for if you're
Speaker 2: a single and you purchase a gift for someone that's
Speaker 2: over the top, does that send them? You know, you've
Speaker 2: got to find the gift that fits the moment in time.
Speaker 2: How many gifts do you get for your kids when
Speaker 2: you have kids? What do you do about gifts for grandchildren,
Speaker 2: which we're beginning to think about or are thought about
Speaker 2: now for a couple of years. Some parents will say, well, no, no,
Speaker 2: one gift is so you have all of that, and
Speaker 2: people who who don't have that family that surrounds them
Speaker 2: and that has to be difficult as well. I mean,
Speaker 2: this is much more complicated that I think I anticipated
Speaker 2: when I was discussing this with my producer today, and
Speaker 2: obviously you've studied it for a long time. What can
Speaker 2: people do if they're feeling down? I mean, do they
Speaker 2: just accept it and say, Hey, that's the circumstances that
Speaker 2: I'm in and next year it might be better. Or
Speaker 2: did they just say, hey, here's what I can do.
Speaker 2: I can watch the Three Stooges marathon all day or
Speaker 2: something or bad Santo kind of a cultural.
Speaker 3: Well, you're right, you're right, and there are so many
Speaker 3: people who are stuck in loneliness and it's a very
Speaker 3: sad situation. And what we encourage to do is really
Speaker 3: take an inventory of what are the activities that make
Speaker 3: them happy? And sometimes it's hard to find one or two,
Speaker 3: but if we can, if we can find one or
Speaker 3: two activities and really surround ourselves with people, places and
Speaker 3: things that just make us feel a little bit better.
Speaker 3: That's one place to start. And you know, it is
Speaker 3: a really difficult season because you look around and sometimes
Speaker 3: when when somebody's lonely and they look around and they
Speaker 3: see all these other people happy, it makes them feel
Speaker 3: like they're an outcast, that this is not normal. Well,
Speaker 3: I'm here tonight to also talk about how it is
Speaker 3: normal to feel like that. It is difficult to sometimes
Speaker 3: get into that holiday spirit, and so I try to
Speaker 3: encourage people to really check themselves, take an inventory of
Speaker 3: what is it about the holiday season, What is it
Speaker 3: about the holiday season that makes you happy, and really
Speaker 3: try to drill down and figure out specific things. Is
Speaker 3: it putting up the decorations, is it driving around and
Speaker 3: looking at lights? Is it singing in the choir? But
Speaker 3: I think we also have to do the exact other task,
Speaker 3: and that is taking an inventory of what are the
Speaker 3: things that are really triggering What are some of the
Speaker 3: things that really make it difficult to get through this season?
Speaker 3: And you know, you can go down that list too,
Speaker 3: of feeling lonely, feeling isolated, missing a loved one, grieving
Speaker 3: the loss of somebody that that has passed away, and
Speaker 3: then of course you know the idea of while other
Speaker 3: years I've really spent too much, I've really eaten too much,
Speaker 3: and oftentimes I've really drank too much. And so now's
Speaker 3: the time, just before Thanksgiving, we're about to enter this season.
Speaker 3: There's a lot of planful things that you can do
Speaker 3: to really make sure that you identify how can I
Speaker 3: make this a happier time for me?
Speaker 2: Well, just such great advice, really, Mack. That's I hope
Speaker 2: people hear this, and I hope if they have someone
Speaker 2: who may find themselves in a difficult spot, particularly during
Speaker 2: the upcoming few weeks of the year, they can listen
Speaker 2: to this interview at nightside and demand tomorrow it'll be
Speaker 2: posted at the top of the eight o'clock hour. And
Speaker 2: I was joking with you, and so I want to
Speaker 2: end on an upbeat note. And one of the movies
Speaker 2: that they then some friends of mine, including my son,
Speaker 2: insists as a Christmas tradition is watching Bad Sand with
Speaker 2: Billy Bob Thornton. If you have seen the movie.
Speaker 4: Have you seen that movie?
Speaker 3: Yes, it's a good one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's a classic movie in many respects,
Speaker 2: not what we call it traditionally classic movie. But anyway,
Speaker 2: I wanted to end on an upbeat note, and Mark,
Speaker 2: I really enjoyed the conversation and I'd love to have
Speaker 2: you back at some point.
Speaker 3: Okay, Oh good, thank you so much, Dan. I really
Speaker 3: appreciate it. Good to talk with you. And seems a
Speaker 3: little bit strange to say, but let's enjoy a rainy
Speaker 3: day tomorrow finally.
Speaker 2: Well, you know that's exactly it. I'm going to get
Speaker 2: up and I get to go tomorrow to the dentist.
Speaker 2: So it's gone. I hate going to the dentist, you know,
Speaker 2: it's just terrified. My hope is so it'll be. It
Speaker 2: will set the mood. As with the Windshiel wipers. You
Speaker 2: can probably explain that to me what my issues are here,
Speaker 2: but we'll let you. We'll let go.
Speaker 3: Hey, it's on your shopping list of self care, right,
Speaker 3: your shopping list of self care.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, Mark, thanks again, and let's love to have you
Speaker 2: back anytime. You You were really a great guest. You
Speaker 2: dealt with a tough issue and you did it well.
Speaker 2: Mark launch License, Sosal, work and program director at McLain Hospital.
Speaker 2: Thanks Mark, we'll talk again. Okay, Happy Thanksgiving yours by
Speaker 2: the way, Okay, thank you and to you thank you.
Speaker 2: All right, coming up another part of the holiday season
Speaker 2: that can be kind of a downer, as things like
Speaker 2: lysteria and food born illness. We're going to talk with
Speaker 2: an expert, a us DA food safety specialist when we
Speaker 2: come back, Sooya Satar, about how to avoid it's a
Speaker 2: good plan to avoid listeria and food born illness. This
Speaker 2: is not something that you want to have a tradition
Speaker 2: in your holidays. We'll get back to you right here
Speaker 2: on Nightside after this very quick break.
Speaker 1: Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
Speaker 1: night Side Studios on WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 2: As we approach Thanksgiving and of course later on Honekah
Speaker 2: and Christmas, the holiday season into the New Year's lots
Speaker 2: of food, lots of activities, but one thing you have
Speaker 2: to be worried about is the risk of listeria and
Speaker 2: food born illness during the holidays. With us is a
Speaker 2: USDA US Department of Agriculture food Safety specialist, Soya Satar. Soya,
Speaker 2: I've never had listeria. I'm not exactly sure what it is,
Speaker 2: but it doesn't sound good. How do we prevent the
Speaker 2: risk of listeria and food borne illness? Particularly at this
Speaker 2: very special time of year.
Speaker 5: Hello, Dan, it's a pleasure to be on your show today.
Speaker 5: So I just want sorry, I should have.
Speaker 2: I should have said hello, but I wanted to get
Speaker 2: right to the issue. So thank you, thank you great,
Speaker 2: thanks you so much. And so yeah, you know what
Speaker 2: I'm trying to understand here is what's the problem and
Speaker 2: how do we prevent falling into this problem?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 5: So, when it comes to food born onness, we have
Speaker 5: a few key tips that we offer here at the USDA,
Speaker 5: especially with a busy holiday season like Thanksgiving. So one
Speaker 5: of those is washing your hands and avoiding cross contamination.
Speaker 5: So you want to make sure that you're cleaning your
Speaker 5: hands any services utensils that come into contact with ROM
Speaker 5: the impultry products both and after you're cooking with soap
Speaker 5: and water. You also want to make sure that you're
Speaker 5: keeping your lommi and pultry products separate from any other
Speaker 5: items like vegetables. So when you're cooking, so you want
Speaker 5: to make sure that you're using different cutting boards, different
Speaker 5: knives and such, just prevents that costs intamination. Another really
Speaker 5: big tip that we give is when you are serving
Speaker 5: your foods to your guests or things getting you want
Speaker 5: to make sure you're not leaving it outside for too long.
Speaker 5: So you want to make sure your food is not
Speaker 5: at room temperature, so that would be between forty degrees
Speaker 5: fahrenheit and one hundred degrees fahrenheit for more than two hours,
Speaker 5: because when your food is in at the temperature for
Speaker 5: more than two hours, you run the risk of getting
Speaker 5: food born illness. So what you want to do is
Speaker 5: keep your hot foods hot. So that can include a
Speaker 5: shaping dish, a warmer and such that keeps the food
Speaker 5: temperature at above one hundred and forty degrees fahrenheit, or
Speaker 5: cold fruits cold. That would be putting items like your
Speaker 5: dips in a bowl on ice in order to keep
Speaker 5: them below forty degree fahrenheit. So that way you can
Speaker 5: keep your food out longer and enjoy it with no worries.
Speaker 2: Boy, I'll tell you that's a lot to digest. Pardon
Speaker 2: the pun, but it's really good advice. And one of
Speaker 2: the things that I'm I guess I'm probably a little,
Speaker 2: I don't know, a little overly cautious. I love to
Speaker 2: rinse things with hot water, put them in the dishwasher,
Speaker 2: and clean up and uh and not leave stuff around
Speaker 2: because the worst to talk about. You know, you have
Speaker 2: a nice to get together with friends and you find
Speaker 2: out that someone that the next day or maybe even yourself,
Speaker 2: ended up getting sick because some mistake was made. The
Speaker 2: point that you made about keeping the meats, whether it's
Speaker 2: turkey or ham, different cutting boards, different utensils to use,
Speaker 2: and to wash them frequently. I suspect that that is
Speaker 2: probably the best, best subject, best suggestion, and it should
Speaker 2: be more of this congestion. It should be a mandate
Speaker 2: that people should.
Speaker 5: Follow, right, So we definitely recommend, you know, using those
Speaker 5: separate utensils. Well, like you said, the cleaning is also
Speaker 5: really big aspect. So what we recommend is for a
Speaker 5: few clean any surfaces that were used with in the
Speaker 5: cooking period with soap and water and then apply a sanitizer.
Speaker 5: So an easy homide version is to use a solution
Speaker 5: of one tablespoon of liquid chlorine bleach per gallon of water,
Speaker 5: or you can use the commercial sanitizer or sanitizing wavee
Speaker 5: just so you can have peace of mind that everything
Speaker 5: really is clean.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I how long have we known all about these?
Speaker 2: You know, it's great now that there's food experts like
Speaker 2: you who'll come and do a radio show and remind
Speaker 2: people of this. But what were people doing one hundred
Speaker 2: years ago, you know, or or even more one hundred
Speaker 2: and fifty years ago. They were celebrating Thanksgiving, they were
Speaker 2: celebrating the holidays. Did they have better discipline than we do,
Speaker 2: did or were people getting sick back then? I'm just
Speaker 2: trying to understand how this has evolved. I mean, everybody
Speaker 2: now should know a lot of the things that you
Speaker 2: said they should They should take really seriously if they
Speaker 2: want to make sure that their guests have a pleasant
Speaker 2: time or they have a pleasant time when they go
Speaker 2: out somewhere. But when did this focus and this concern
Speaker 2: about listeria and food born illnesses? How did that bubble
Speaker 2: up to the surface or just was it always there?
Speaker 5: I'd say it's definitely a huge priority, of course for
Speaker 5: our agency. While I don't know exactly what people may
Speaker 5: have been doing one hundred years ago, the reason we
Speaker 5: do our work today is because it is a bigger
Speaker 5: issue than people might think. So the CDC estimates that
Speaker 5: around forty million people do get sick from food born
Speaker 5: illnesses every year, and around one hundred and twenty eight
Speaker 5: thousand of those people end up in the hospital and
Speaker 5: around three thousand of those may result in depth annually
Speaker 5: from food borne illness. So it is a really large
Speaker 5: issue and that's why we, you know, do the work
Speaker 5: that we do speaking with people like yourself to try
Speaker 5: and get our message out there of just keeping your
Speaker 5: food safe, keeping yourself safe, your community safe. And also
Speaker 5: we have a great resource through our Meat Impultry hotline.
Speaker 5: So this is a hotline that's staffed by food safety
Speaker 5: experts who are able to answer any questions that public
Speaker 5: may have about food safety around meat and poultry products.
Speaker 5: So you're able to call them actually at one what's that?
Speaker 2: What's that? What's that number?
Speaker 4: So you.
Speaker 5: Yes, the number is one triple eight six seven four
Speaker 5: six eight five four or one triple eight MP hotline,
Speaker 5: the food safety specialists. You can speak to them ten
Speaker 5: am to six pm Monday through Friday, and they're actually
Speaker 5: open on Thanksgiving Day from eight am to two pm Eastern.
Speaker 2: Okay, so again, let's just do that number one more time,
Speaker 2: a little more slowly. I was trying to write it
Speaker 2: down and people give people thirty seconds though, so to
Speaker 2: get themselves a piece of paper and a pen, because
Speaker 2: this might be a number that you want to have
Speaker 2: available in the kitchen. If there's any questions, it's a
Speaker 2: it's one triple eight, and then what's the actual phone number?
Speaker 5: Of course, one triple eight six seven four six eight
Speaker 5: five four. An easy way to remember that is also
Speaker 5: one triple eight MP hotline, MP hotline.
Speaker 2: Okay, that's that's a great suggestion, one triple eight six
Speaker 2: seven four six eight five four. Soya, thank you very much.
Speaker 2: A lot of good information there. You know, it's funny
Speaker 2: coming on earlier this week we had that whole e
Speaker 2: coli outbreak from of all things organ organic carrots, and
Speaker 2: you know, you look at stuff in the store now
Speaker 2: and it says organic, Casika. Well, that's got to be safe.
Speaker 2: Because it says organic. You just never know, You just
Speaker 2: never know. Thank you so much. Hope you and your
Speaker 2: family have great holidays starting with Thanksgiving right through the
Speaker 2: new year.
Speaker 3: You as well.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much.
Speaker 2: By say okay, thank you very much. Well, we get
Speaker 2: back to talk about something called soulmate parenting. I had
Speaker 2: never heard of soulmate parenting, but we're going to be
Speaker 2: talking with doctor Joshua Coleman. He's a clinical psychologist, a
Speaker 2: senior fellow with a Council on Contemporary Families. I learned
Speaker 2: a little bit about this in the last hour or
Speaker 2: so as reading some prep notes for the show, a
Speaker 2: piece out of the Washington Post soul made parenting. It
Speaker 2: might be it may be misnamed, I'll or maybe not
Speaker 2: or maybe not. We'll leave you with that tease. Coming
Speaker 2: back on Nightside right after the News at the bottom
Speaker 2: of the hour.
Speaker 1: It's night Side with Boston's News Radio.
Speaker 2: All right, welcome back, Thank you very much, Nicole. As
Speaker 2: we move ahead, we are talking about a concept of
Speaker 2: soulmate parenting and we're talking with doctor Joshua Coleman. Doctor Coleman,
Speaker 2: Welcome to Nightside, Welcome to Boston. How are you, sir,
Speaker 2: I'm good.
Speaker 4: Thank you for having me on your show.
Speaker 2: You were more than welcome, that is for sure. When
Speaker 2: I read soulmate parenting, that's the first time I've heard
Speaker 2: the term. I thought it was parents not giving enough
Speaker 2: attention to their children, that maybe the parents were still
Speaker 2: considered themselves first soulmates and second parents. But that's not
Speaker 2: quite what it is. So why don't you explain what
Speaker 2: it actually is that I just thought that the title
Speaker 2: kind of led me in a different direction. Of what
Speaker 2: it was when I finally figured out I was wrong,
Speaker 2: Go right ahead.
Speaker 4: Sure, Yeah, well, so maate parenting is this new idea
Speaker 4: that parents were of supposed to be everything for their children.
Speaker 4: They're supposed to be therapists, they're supposed to be learning
Speaker 4: disability specialist. They're supposed to be coaches, they're supposed to
Speaker 4: be best friends and psychological diagnosticians. And if they're not,
Speaker 4: then their kids later in life can go well, I
Speaker 4: had a learning disability and you didn't see it, or
Speaker 4: I had add and you didn't see it. Or I
Speaker 4: was depressed when I was younger and you didn't see it.
Speaker 4: Therefore I don't have a relationship with you. So it's
Speaker 4: this idea now that parents have to basically do everything
Speaker 4: in order to earn an ongoing relationship with their children
Speaker 4: when their children become adults. And I think it's a
Speaker 4: very problematic concept.
Speaker 2: Okay, how does soul made parenting as you, as you
Speaker 2: act very clearly and distinct distinctively, describe it, How does
Speaker 2: that differ from another concept that I had heard about
Speaker 2: called helicopter parenting?
Speaker 4: Right? Well, so all made parenting is not only helicopter parenting,
Speaker 4: but it's the idea that you're supposed to know all
Speaker 4: these things about your child that you couldn't necessarily know.
Speaker 4: Like helicopter parenting is kind of giving your child, you know,
Speaker 4: the best life that you can give them in terms
Speaker 4: of tutor ring and the like. But soul my parenting
Speaker 4: is that your souls is supposed to be their best friend.
Speaker 4: You're supposed to be psychological, you're supposed to have a
Speaker 4: bunch of other aspects to who you are as a
Speaker 4: parent person and as a parent in order to earn
Speaker 4: a continued place in your child's life. And that's right.
Speaker 2: So to keep it simple, soul made parenting is sort
Speaker 2: of helicopter parenting on steroids.
Speaker 4: You're right, yeah, exactly right.
Speaker 2: Okay, So how do parents when they're in it, they
Speaker 2: can look back twenty years later or thirty years later
Speaker 2: when the kid says something to them, like is in
Speaker 2: the article that out of the Washington Post that we
Speaker 2: looked at. You never noticed this, so you didn't see
Speaker 2: that you will, and by the way, it's your column.
Speaker 2: It was your column which appeared earlier this month in
Speaker 2: the Washington Post. Uh. And you started off by saying
Speaker 2: that this is not autobiographical, but you. It's someone who
Speaker 2: said that this son sent them a no contact letter
Speaker 2: saying that he realized in therapy that he'd been depressed
Speaker 2: in his childhood and was angry at the parent for
Speaker 2: not recognizing it. How many people have fallen into this
Speaker 2: this this circumstance or this situation. That's got to be
Speaker 2: a tough, tough letter for a no contact letter from
Speaker 2: your kid because you paid too much attention to the kid,
Speaker 2: I guess is what this the bottom line is here?
Speaker 4: Well there they're not saying that you paid too much
Speaker 4: attention like this child that. And I see these letters
Speaker 4: every day because I specialize in printal estrangement parents whose
Speaker 4: adult children have cut them off, and I every daisy
Speaker 4: letters like this from adult children. Well, you didn't see
Speaker 4: that I was depressed, You didn't get me the right
Speaker 4: kind of help for my add or you didn't do
Speaker 4: recognize other parts of me. And if you had, I'd
Speaker 4: be a very different person today. And I just think
Speaker 4: it's a guilt trip.
Speaker 2: What a huge guilt trip. Well no, I'm serious, what
Speaker 2: a guilt trip. No, you would think you would think
Speaker 2: that any rational person. And I want to defend the
Speaker 2: parent here, just in theory right, and i'd let to
Speaker 2: get your reaction. You would think that any rational person,
Speaker 2: even if they felt that way, would not put the
Speaker 2: burden on the parent, but would say, look, maybe the
Speaker 2: school system failed him. Maybe that this should have been
Speaker 2: a teacher who should have said, gee, he doesn't seem
Speaker 2: to be able to pay attention in class. Does he
Speaker 2: have ADHD? Maybe there's a school counselor this is like
Speaker 2: throwing it all on the parent. And I talk about
Speaker 2: this is a guilt trip on steroids.
Speaker 4: Well it's a guilt trip. But yeah, you're absolutely right,
Speaker 4: And it's also to your point, kind of making the
Speaker 4: parent responsible for all kinds of things that they're not
Speaker 4: necessarily responsible for. I mean, you can come into adults
Speaker 4: and with significant depression or anxiety or lack of confidence
Speaker 4: or problems with relationships and still come from a really good, loving,
Speaker 4: decent home. Either you could have problems because of genetics
Speaker 4: or the era that you're growing up in, which is
Speaker 4: by being particularly challenging, like right now, for gen z
Speaker 4: those born between nineteen nine, I forgive the age, but.
Speaker 2: Nineteen ninety six in twenty twelve, I'm not a Genzer,
Speaker 2: as you probably can tell, right, right, And they have
Speaker 2: a little to make sure I know what I have.
Speaker 2: I'm a baby boomer. Okay, so yeah, me too.
Speaker 4: So right, So that goods is they're especially vulnerable to
Speaker 4: depression and anxiety. And it's not because their parents have
Speaker 4: all failed them. It's because they're growing up with cell
Speaker 4: phones and they're constantly having to compare themselves to other
Speaker 4: kids who supposedly are doing better. But we've developed as
Speaker 4: very therapeutic culture. And I'm a psychologist, but we're sort
Speaker 4: of making young people feel like, well, if you have problems,
Speaker 4: that you just need to look back on the ways
Speaker 4: that you were traumatized, you know, in childhood. And yeah,
Speaker 4: a lot of people are traumatized. A lot of people,
Speaker 4: you know, really have a right to be upset that
Speaker 4: their parents didn't treat them well. But a lot of
Speaker 4: parents today, perfectly good, normal, loving parents are getting cut
Speaker 4: off by their adult children for reasons that any other
Speaker 4: generation would have considered absurd.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, it's funny. I think you and I
Speaker 2: probably are from the same school and probably had similar experiences.
Speaker 2: But when I read a story about some gen zs,
Speaker 2: and I'm not anti gen Z, but when I read
Speaker 2: some story about gen zs being upset because in a
Speaker 2: freshman class of college there was some professor who talked
Speaker 2: about a subject that made them feel uncomfortable, and they
Speaker 2: want some sort of you know, a safe space, a
Speaker 2: safe room, maybe at a comfort pet. And I'm thinking
Speaker 2: to myself, how did these eighteen year old olders, young
Speaker 2: people today, how did they come here with the eighteen
Speaker 2: year old kids in nineteen forty four who hit the
Speaker 2: beaches at Normandy. Well, I wasn't born despite, I wasn't
Speaker 2: born in nineteen forty four. Okay, so let me make
Speaker 2: that very clear. But what the hell I mean? You
Speaker 2: talk about a tough problem, and so you've got some
Speaker 2: professor who's giving you a B minus because right, well,
Speaker 2: how do we get that generation out? Right?
Speaker 4: Well, a lot of younger adults are coming into therapy
Speaker 4: and they're saying, well, you emotionally abused me for things
Speaker 4: that in the parents' generation certainly would have would have
Speaker 4: been considered abusive in any way. And the parents want
Speaker 4: to say, and they offer do to say, you know, abuse,
Speaker 4: what I gave you a childhood I would have killed for.
Speaker 4: If you want to see an abusive childhood, you should
Speaker 4: have seen what I grew up in and which, of course,
Speaker 4: isn't the best way to start a conversation. No, happy,
Speaker 4: we become wait, wait to protect of our red children.
Speaker 4: We've become way too worried about the world being dangerous.
Speaker 4: So younger generations just haven't been exposed to the kind
Speaker 4: of things that older generations have, so the world just
Speaker 4: does feel more dangerous and threatening to them.
Speaker 2: Hey, I remember when I was a twelve year old kid,
Speaker 2: ten year old kid. Uh, we had we literally had
Speaker 2: drills at our small little uh Boston. Get under your desk,
Speaker 2: you were under attack. Yeah, that's kind of traumatizing. Second
Speaker 2: roll right, yeah, right, yeah, just unbelievable. Look, I really
Speaker 2: enjoyed this conversation. It probably seemed a little irreverent to you,
Speaker 2: but I'm kind.
Speaker 4: Of now guy. Yeah, No, I think this topic deserves
Speaker 4: a certain degree of irreverence. I'm with you on Matt.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you sound to me like the sort of psychologist,
Speaker 2: a psychiatrist that can actually help people becau because people
Speaker 2: at different times during your life, everyone needs help. But
Speaker 2: for all the gender ors who are thinking about how
Speaker 2: tough it is out there in the world. When you
Speaker 2: didn't get that date on Saturday night, or your date
Speaker 2: didn't show up. Just think about Normandy and Utah Beach
Speaker 2: and Sword Beach and June sixth, nineteen forty four, if
Speaker 2: you want to talk about kind of being in a
Speaker 2: tough sort of situation where you really did need a
Speaker 2: safe place of.
Speaker 4: Safe room, right right exactly.
Speaker 2: I enjoyed. I enjoyed our conversation very much. Is there
Speaker 2: any sort of a book? Sometimes many of my guests
Speaker 2: have written a book and they like to refer to
Speaker 2: our clinical psychologist and a senior fellow with the Council
Speaker 2: and contemporary Families and your articles in the Washington Post
Speaker 2: how soul may parenting hurts parent child relationships tell us
Speaker 2: about Is there somewhere that people can will get more information?
Speaker 2: Sure that?
Speaker 4: Yeah. My newest book is called Rules of the Strange, Right,
Speaker 4: Why I Don't children cut ties? And how to Heal
Speaker 4: the conflict? And they can learn more about me and
Speaker 4: my services at my website TRIPLEW dot doctor Joshua Coleman
Speaker 4: dot com. And I'm all over the internet, so I'm
Speaker 4: really easy to find.
Speaker 2: Doctor Joshua Cooleman dot dot com. Okay, great, Doctor Coleman
Speaker 2: really really enjoyed it and hope to have you, have
Speaker 2: to have you on again. And I actually wrote one
Speaker 2: piece for the Washington Post many many years ago on
Speaker 2: the a tribute to Tip O'Neil when he retired as speaker.
Speaker 2: The Post actually allowed to cover him for many years
Speaker 2: as a political reporter here in Boston, and they wanted
Speaker 2: a sort of a piece from a Boston perspective in
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty six. So I had one piece at the
Speaker 2: Washington Post that was it.
Speaker 4: Well, that's that's impression. And those are the days when
Speaker 4: the government sort of worked, as you know, the Republicans
Speaker 4: and Democrats actually kind of collaborated together.
Speaker 2: So and that was kind of at a better time
Speaker 2: in many respects. Doctor Joshua Coleman loved the interview. Love
Speaker 2: you you you. I think you're a philosophical soul made
Speaker 2: here man. We'll talk soon.
Speaker 4: Thank you for having me on. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2: You're more than welcome. Thank you. We get back when
Speaker 2: we talk about gen Z and they now are going
Speaker 2: for TikTok videos as opposed to resumes. My instinct on
Speaker 2: that is basically good luck with that kids. We'll be
Speaker 2: back with Julie Balki, President and Chief Career strategist at
Speaker 2: the Buki Group. We'll talk about this back on Nightside.
Speaker 1: Now back to Dan ray Line from the Window World
Speaker 1: nights Stand Studios on w b Z News Radio.
Speaker 2: Want to welcome back Julie Balki. Julie's the president and
Speaker 2: chief career strategist at the Balkie Group career coaching firm. Julie,
Speaker 2: welcome back to Nightside.
Speaker 6: How are you hey, Thanks, thanks for having me.
Speaker 2: Great to have you back, and we're talking again about
Speaker 2: gen Z. I just ended up talking with a clinical psychologist,
Speaker 2: doctor Joshua Coleman, last hour about what they call soulmate parenting,
Speaker 2: where a lot of young people, I guess gen z
Speaker 2: Is are are blaming their parents because their parents weren't
Speaker 2: you know, had a relationship which was very supportive, but
Speaker 2: they didn't diagnose problems. And the doctor who we just
Speaker 2: have was a little skeptical of, you know, finger pointing
Speaker 2: by members of Generation gen Z, but they But the
Speaker 2: area that we're going to talk about is that when
Speaker 2: you and I were young, back in the well, at
Speaker 2: least when I was young in the last century, uh,
Speaker 2: you polished your resume and maybe you even sent a
Speaker 2: cover letter with the resume resume when you were applying
Speaker 2: for a job or inquiring if there were jobs available.
Speaker 2: But gen Z now has decided they're going TikTok baby
Speaker 2: all the way, TikTok videos and forget this resume stuff.
Speaker 2: It's a much much too old school. What's going on?
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, and not only did we polish up our resumes,
Speaker 6: do you remember going to the store and buying high
Speaker 6: quality paper and envelopes that match so you could then
Speaker 6: put them in the mailbox. Yeah, it has changed. And
Speaker 6: I've been in this world of like career coaching since
Speaker 6: you know, the very late nineties, and so I have
Speaker 6: seen I remember that time and then still doing it
Speaker 6: now and it's literally in some ways a one to
Speaker 6: eighty and some ways it isn't. The essence of it
Speaker 6: is still the same. If you are looking for a role,
Speaker 6: you want people, you want the decision makers to understand
Speaker 6: who you are, and limiting that to a two page
Speaker 6: resume is always hard. It's hard, but it's always the
Speaker 6: way it was done. So now we have social media,
Speaker 6: we have ai is writing our resumes for us, and
Speaker 6: so we have all these things that in some ways
Speaker 6: make it harder for people to get to know us
Speaker 6: in some ways make it easier. So let's go through
Speaker 6: an example. Let's say that you're applying for a job.
Speaker 6: An employer is interested in you. Smart employers are going
Speaker 6: well beyond typical reference checking, just calling the people whose
Speaker 6: names should give them, and they're googling you. They're seeing
Speaker 6: what is your social media presence? How do you show
Speaker 6: up in the world? And you and I are listening
Speaker 6: to that, going, oh heavens, I'm so glad that wasn't
Speaker 6: a thing, right, I mean, I I'd hate to have,
Speaker 6: like twenty something.
Speaker 2: Thought dodge that bullet dodge that we did.
Speaker 6: We certainly did so, so they're like, okay, so who
Speaker 6: is this person? You know, what is their social media presence?
Speaker 6: So and when you're applying for a job, you may
Speaker 6: not know they do that. All you know is you
Speaker 6: never get a callback. So some savvy gen zers, and
Speaker 6: this is where you have to start really thinking about
Speaker 6: what type of job are you applying for and what's
Speaker 6: the best way to show who you are. So this example,
Speaker 6: this story was telling the stories about these gen zers
Speaker 6: who said, I'm going to hopefully catapult myself to the
Speaker 6: top of the pile and do something different and you know,
Speaker 6: even twenty years ago, job seekers did things to stand
Speaker 6: out that weren't always appropriate, weren't always appreciated. So we've
Speaker 6: got in this case, we've got let's say you're applying
Speaker 6: to be an accountant at an insurance company. I absolutely
Speaker 6: do not recommend you make a TikTok video. You know
Speaker 6: it's not. So you've got to know where you're applying to.
Speaker 7: You have to know, don't make a TikTok video contextum
Speaker 7: with some sort of a rap song about adding int
Speaker 7: attracting and convinced your numbers.
Speaker 2: Guy, I got it, Okay, I got that all right.
Speaker 6: So I looked at a couple of these videos that
Speaker 6: these gen zs made applying for a talk, and they
Speaker 6: were very well done. And making a TikTok video is
Speaker 6: a lot harder than people think it is, and so
Speaker 6: it's a way to show your personality in a way
Speaker 6: that it does make you stand out. But in both
Speaker 6: of these cases, they were applying for jobs in which
Speaker 6: social media was a big part of the company's presence,
Speaker 6: the big part of the company's marketing.
Speaker 3: It was.
Speaker 6: One was an internship with Barstool Sports, which is Dave
Speaker 6: Portnoy he's everywhere on social media, so you have to
Speaker 6: make sure that you're matching your approach to applying for
Speaker 6: a job, to the to the culture.
Speaker 2: The saw that TikTok video that you're referring to. I
Speaker 2: saw the TikTok videos you're referring referring to, and I
Speaker 2: thought to some extent that the young woman was kind
Speaker 2: of trying a little too hard.
Speaker 6: If you get my drift, you thought, yes, see interpretation. Yeah,
Speaker 6: So it's you know, you have to be careful, is
Speaker 6: all I'm saying. You have to think. So if the
Speaker 6: people making the decision are boomers or gen X, you're
Speaker 6: not going to get the same reaction as if they
Speaker 6: are peers of yours and they're super impressed with your creativity.
Speaker 6: So it's it's it's a really tricky line to walk.
Speaker 6: We haven't completely crossed over yet to the point where
Speaker 6: a resume typical resumes are obsolete, but we may someday.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess. I mean probably at some point in
Speaker 2: the future, we will be able to time travel and
Speaker 2: basically materialize inside the office of the person who's interviewing you.
Speaker 2: Just materialized magically or something. I don't know.
Speaker 6: I do think you know what I'm still waiting for.
Speaker 6: I'm still waiting for the flying car from the Jetsons
Speaker 6: that we were.
Speaker 2: Prob Oh's on the way. Don't worry, Elon's working on that.
Speaker 4: Probably.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guarantee you. Look. It's always your great guest
Speaker 2: and I enjoyed it much. I still think time resume
Speaker 2: and a discreete photograph, headshot or whatever you want to
Speaker 2: call it is good. And also, you know, being good
Speaker 2: in the telephone I think is a really lost skill.
Speaker 6: That the communication skills are drastically missing, and companies are
Speaker 6: even saying they're having to retrain their new employees and
Speaker 6: basic communication skills.
Speaker 2: You got it, You've got it, doctor Julie Blkie, thank
Speaker 2: you so much, as always one of our favorite guests.
Speaker 2: How can folks get in touch with you with the Bulkie.
Speaker 6: Group, Well, the Balkiegroup dot com it's b a u
Speaker 6: k E. But I'm also on Instagram and TikTok as
Speaker 6: Julie on the job and your.
Speaker 2: Career coaching firms, and that's important. So maybe people who.
Speaker 6: Want to help to get career happy.
Speaker 2: Oh that's all we're trying. I've been trying that for
Speaker 2: a long time. No, I never give up, never quit,
Speaker 2: never quit trust me, Thanks very much. We won't quit
Speaker 2: you either, because we got the news coming up. And
Speaker 2: on the other side, we're going to inform you of
Speaker 2: the the no school status in Gloucester, Beverly and Marblehead.
Speaker 2: I think you probably know what it's gonna be, but
Speaker 2: we'll let you know right after the nine. And I
Speaker 2: want to talk more seriously, very seriously about the spate
Speaker 2: of school strikes. I think it's improper. I think something
Speaker 2: should be done. And the Globe editorial page was fabulous today.
Speaker 2: Mark that down. Might be one of the few times
Speaker 2: I'll have a site the Globe editorial editorial as being fabulous.
Speaker 2: Back on Nights side right after this