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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for tuning in to another show in the next

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<v Speaker 1>real family of film podcasts, I.

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<v Speaker 2>Want to skip those ads and get early access.

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<v Speaker 1>Become a member at true story dot fm, slash Joint,

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<v Speaker 1>and discover all the other great perks that come with it.

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<v Speaker 2>The Film Board gathers. The Gang of Thugs has come

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<v Speaker 2>together to talk about a film currently in theaters, and

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<v Speaker 2>this week we take on the great bun. June Hose

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<v Speaker 2>return to sci fi with his own stamp on multiplicity.

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<v Speaker 2>It's Mickey seventeen. Hi, Mickey, are you.

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<v Speaker 3>Experiencing any vertigo?

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<v Speaker 1>I guess I am feeling a little dizzy. Oh wow,

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<v Speaker 1>did you see that?

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<v Speaker 2>I wouldn't be surprised if you were thinking at this point,

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<v Speaker 2>what have I done? Oh? Doctor is your one? God?

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<v Speaker 2>Nothing was working out and I wanted to get off

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<v Speaker 2>of her. You're planning to be inexpendable.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you read through the whole application.

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<v Speaker 2>Is that a kick in there? I should have read

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<v Speaker 2>through it. Once you die would print a new version

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<v Speaker 2>of your body.

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<v Speaker 1>They made me work my ass off on one mission

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<v Speaker 1>after another.

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<v Speaker 2>Every time you die, we learned something new that humanity

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<v Speaker 2>moves forward. Oh, it's life is fine, My life, Biggie

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<v Speaker 2>it's not looking very good for you. Yeah no, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>sure you're used to it by now, But what's itf

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<v Speaker 2>you like to die? Even on my seventeenth go around?

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<v Speaker 1>I hate dying?

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<v Speaker 2>Why aren't you dead? With multiples? Shine up this friendic

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<v Speaker 2>case of this month, we're staring down direct our Bong

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<v Speaker 2>June host follow up to Parasite with Mickey seventeen film

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<v Speaker 2>that esks what if your job literally killed you? Who

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<v Speaker 2>still couldn't quiet quit? We follow an expendable space colonists

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<v Speaker 2>played by the Roberts Pattinson, who die repeatedly on dangerous missions,

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<v Speaker 2>only to be reprinted and reprogrammed with his own memories.

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<v Speaker 2>Looked for it coming soon in your corporate wellness program.

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<v Speaker 2>Joining me for this existential nightmare are three film fans who,

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<v Speaker 2>unlike Mickey, cannot be replaced despite what we put them through.

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<v Speaker 2>Justin Yeger, Tommy Meds the Third and Andy Nelson, our

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<v Speaker 2>very own Mickey's eight twelve and fifteen joined me to

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<v Speaker 2>explore a film about a man who literally cannot escape

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<v Speaker 2>his job even through dad.

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<v Speaker 3>Hello gents, Hello, hello you, And it's so exciting to

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<v Speaker 3>have Andy Nelson back.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, here on bord it's a little weird. I need

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<v Speaker 2>to be a call. There was like a cold wind

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<v Speaker 2>blew through arm microp.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, last time I was here, I think it was Megan.

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<v Speaker 1>So I'm only coming for them movies.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, Oh, outstanding. At least I know what the what

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<v Speaker 2>the fuss is If it's an f movie, Andy is summoned.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we'll see that. Maybe it's also has to be

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<v Speaker 1>someone's name.

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<v Speaker 2>This is a fascinating movie because I saw JJ for

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<v Speaker 2>real in real life yesterday and we both had a

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<v Speaker 2>little kibbutz about how much we did actually enjoy this movie,

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<v Speaker 2>and we both said the same thing, Gosh, when we

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<v Speaker 2>were watching this movie, we sure were thinking about Andy.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think as we go into one of the

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<v Speaker 2>things that I've learned that that is Sackri saying to

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<v Speaker 2>the show is dark opening thoughts segment. So I'm not

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<v Speaker 2>going to get rid of opening thoughts, but I am

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<v Speaker 2>going to ask Andy to go first on his opening thoughts,

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<v Speaker 2>and I will add to this something that we bring

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<v Speaker 2>in from sitting in the dark, access to grind opening

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<v Speaker 2>thoughts and access to grind on this film, Andy, what

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<v Speaker 2>do you think.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it's funny that that I was in both

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<v Speaker 1>of your thoughts. It's like, I'm You're both Timo and

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<v Speaker 1>I'm I'm the Mickey, and you're both trying to figure

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<v Speaker 1>out how can we how can we best exploit him?

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<v Speaker 4>Yes, what does it feel like to die?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? Right?

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<v Speaker 1>You know this is it's a it's a frustrating film

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<v Speaker 1>for me because I generally am.

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<v Speaker 4>Just starting with the acts, just going too you know, but.

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<v Speaker 1>It's it's frustrating. It's like I enjoyed Bong June Hoe

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<v Speaker 1>when he's telling films that that are done with I

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<v Speaker 1>don't want to say just like a serious a more

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<v Speaker 1>serious tone, but there's something about when he has a

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<v Speaker 1>much more comedic style in his films that I really

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<v Speaker 1>struggle with his his comedy stylings. And so this was

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<v Speaker 1>a hard one for me. And there's a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>really interesting ideas in the film, but on the whole,

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<v Speaker 1>I just had a hard time getting through this film.

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<v Speaker 2>It was just a rough watch.

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<v Speaker 1>And it didn't help that I was in an audience

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<v Speaker 1>that largely completely silent through it, like Narry Alas it

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<v Speaker 1>was not, and it was it was like i'd say,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe third full auditorium, and so it is pretty quiet,

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<v Speaker 1>and so it just you know, it just didn't make

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<v Speaker 1>for a great watching experience.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, well that's a huge bummer, and you've really harshed

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<v Speaker 2>our buzz. So let's see it's gonna pile on.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, the word that I was going to use, and

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<v Speaker 3>I'm not kidding because I have it in my notes

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<v Speaker 3>right here, is frustrating. It is a movie where I

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<v Speaker 3>like and agree with so many of the ideas. There's

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<v Speaker 3>a lot of really great parts in it. I just

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<v Speaker 3>and I feel bad saying this. I wish it wasn't

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<v Speaker 3>so much movie. It took on nine different topics and

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<v Speaker 3>kind of lowly or shallowly talked about all of them,

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<v Speaker 3>and I would have really liked to deep dive into

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<v Speaker 3>one or two. Also, the fact I don't know when

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<v Speaker 3>they made this, but the fact who we have in

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<v Speaker 3>office as the president makes Mark Ruffalo, who I love

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<v Speaker 3>that kind of character, kind of a tough watch right now.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not fun. It's hard to just sort of poke

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<v Speaker 3>fun and laugh at it. And one of my biggest

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<v Speaker 3>things is I like voiceover to be extremely.

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<v Speaker 2>Detailed.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, now, I'm fine with voiceover as long as it's

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<v Speaker 3>not just sort of meandering, and this film is wall

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<v Speaker 3>to wall voiceover, to the point that it makes me

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<v Speaker 3>wonder how much of it was added later on, because

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<v Speaker 3>entire scenes are just voiceover when you're seeing people have

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<v Speaker 3>conversations and we can't hear it. So I like a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of it. I'm glad to have seen it. Overall,

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<v Speaker 3>I really felt it's running time and it just felt

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<v Speaker 3>way too.

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<v Speaker 2>Spread out, sort of sharp act, says JJ Rebuttal.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, well, I don't think it is a complete Rebuttal

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<v Speaker 4>because I definitely agree with the amount of time there,

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<v Speaker 4>I think. So I have many questions for all of you,

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<v Speaker 4>but in particular Andy, like this thing about and Pete

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<v Speaker 4>actually the thing that he warned me about or told

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<v Speaker 4>me about in regards to your feelings about Bong jun Ho.

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<v Speaker 2>Is war about in particular the entire and I did.

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<v Speaker 4>Actually find this movie very funny. I do think that

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<v Speaker 4>my theater was more silent than I would like to,

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<v Speaker 4>not like me laughing at Marvin getting his head shot

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<v Speaker 4>off in pulp fiction and nobody else in the theater

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<v Speaker 4>joining me kind of, but it was closer to that, right,

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<v Speaker 4>But so I get that, But I really would like

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<v Speaker 4>to hear sort of more on your feelings about that

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<v Speaker 4>when we get to it, especially because the reason why

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<v Speaker 4>I thought of you so much is because this movie

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<v Speaker 4>the first half of the movie, which I really liked.

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<v Speaker 4>I really really enjoyed the first half of the setup

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<v Speaker 4>and the sort of and I don't want to call

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<v Speaker 4>it shorthand, but the quick pace in world building, in

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<v Speaker 4>explaining the story and the way that they did it.

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<v Speaker 4>I really enjoyed that. There was a point in the

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<v Speaker 4>early parts of this movie, in the first half where

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<v Speaker 4>I was like, this is a five star movie for me.

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<v Speaker 4>It definitely started falling off as we continued into things forward,

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<v Speaker 4>but I was laughing, and those early pieces really made

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<v Speaker 4>me think of Brazil a lot, and that's why I

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<v Speaker 4>was thinking of you, Eddie. I was like, Oh, Andy's

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<v Speaker 4>really gonna like this because it's this dystopian future thing

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<v Speaker 4>that has the sort of lighthearted thing to it. So

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<v Speaker 4>I totally want to hear more about your piece there.

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<v Speaker 4>And Tommy, my question for you would be to I

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<v Speaker 4>would really like to hear the multiple things that you

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<v Speaker 4>would like to go further on in this movie, because

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<v Speaker 4>I agree with that I think it does get a

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<v Speaker 4>little long in the tooth for lack of a better word,

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<v Speaker 4>and the pieces that you are interested in going deep

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<v Speaker 4>on I would really like to hear.

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<v Speaker 2>For me, I super enjoyed those first parts.

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<v Speaker 4>It took me by surprise a lot in that I

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<v Speaker 4>thought it was going to be kind of strictly multiplicity

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<v Speaker 4>kind of movie, strictly about cloning and duality, and there

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<v Speaker 4>ended up to be applications of that concept. That felt

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<v Speaker 4>really kind of prime Bong Juneo to me in that

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<v Speaker 4>like thinking of these futuristic things and then translating it

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<v Speaker 4>to things that may have to do with politics and these,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, all of these things that I thought was great.

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<v Speaker 4>It did the acts to grind for me is a

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<v Speaker 4>very specific thing about story. So I don't know how

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<v Speaker 4>much you want me to go here, but the big like,

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<v Speaker 4>this is all ultimately in spoiler territory. But the fact

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<v Speaker 4>that they choose to destroy the printing machine makes absolutely

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<v Speaker 4>no sense because the only reason why they could have

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<v Speaker 4>survived is because of the printing machine. So they chose

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<v Speaker 4>to vilify the single thing that made it possible for

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<v Speaker 4>them to survive, which doesn't make any sense.

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<v Speaker 2>So that was so ideologically focused there. Well, and this is.

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<v Speaker 4>Where we get into these different ideologies, right, like and

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<v Speaker 4>I really love how the story told us the backstory

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<v Speaker 4>of why multiples are a terrible thing, but they didn't

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<v Speaker 4>evolve to see how they could also be a positive thing.

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<v Speaker 4>And that was a really interesting thing for me to

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<v Speaker 4>consider in the film. So yeah, So I loved the

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<v Speaker 4>movie and I was surprised by it. And I think

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<v Speaker 4>one of the interesting things about the political aspect of

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<v Speaker 4>it is I wonder how we would feel about it

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<v Speaker 4>because it was definitely being made before the election. If

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<v Speaker 4>the election had gone the other way, how would we

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<v Speaker 4>feel about the statements of this movie. And I just

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<v Speaker 4>want to put that out there to maybe talk about

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<v Speaker 4>it at some point too. So those are all my first impressions,

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<v Speaker 4>and I was just really excited to talk to you

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<v Speaker 4>guys about it because I think your opinions are going

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<v Speaker 4>to be super awesome.

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<v Speaker 1>Definitely some points to discuss. Yeah, I hope somebody was

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<v Speaker 1>taking notes.

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<v Speaker 3>So I.

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<v Speaker 2>Realized immediately that Andy wasn't going to like this movie.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh and it's because Andy didn't like The Host, which

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<v Speaker 2>is one of my favorite long you know movies. I

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<v Speaker 2>just love, love, love it. And so the fact that

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<v Speaker 2>this movie sort of reclaims a little bit of that territory.

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<v Speaker 2>For me, it lands strictly in Armando Yanucci territory, Like

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<v Speaker 2>I'm a huge Armando Nucci fan. I absolutely adore the

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<v Speaker 2>Death of Stalin. I loved Viep. I love just the

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<v Speaker 2>personal history of David Copperfield. Extraordinary Avenue five is the

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<v Speaker 2>cruise ship in space series he did for HBO, and

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<v Speaker 2>that's this movie. It has kind of a good premise,

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<v Speaker 2>but it's it goes so far into this other territory

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<v Speaker 2>in the second half that I think it completely loses

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<v Speaker 2>its thread. So I think it's safe to say this

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<v Speaker 2>movie was a five star film for me for a

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<v Speaker 2>good half of it and falls apart in the second

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<v Speaker 2>half with just straight up predictability. It is like the

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<v Speaker 2>oldest tale that he could possibly choose to tell, and

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<v Speaker 2>he told it with the alien Roly Polleys, and I

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<v Speaker 2>thought that was I just lost interest. I knew so

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<v Speaker 2>I knew so far in advance, how far this movie

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<v Speaker 2>had called it shot, and how they were gonna make

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<v Speaker 2>which characters diabolical and the standout, like I feel like

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<v Speaker 2>I could have written it at that point, and I

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<v Speaker 2>was really frustrated. It's also kind of a Luke Best

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<v Speaker 2>Song movie, right like it is visually stunning, and then

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<v Speaker 2>it becomes lucy and I don't I don't need to relitigate. Well, okay,

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<v Speaker 2>I hear, you heard heard.

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<v Speaker 4>What just happened.

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<v Speaker 1>You've been talking for while.

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<v Speaker 3>When I said in the loop when you were talking

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<v Speaker 3>about Armando and no one ignored that, I said, yes,

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<v Speaker 3>I like what you're saying about. I forgot how much

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<v Speaker 3>I was enjoying it, and then how crazy I felt

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<v Speaker 3>at the end when both mickeys are being surrounded by

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<v Speaker 3>all of these shrieking cgi blobs.

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<v Speaker 1>I was like, wait, how did we get here? Again?

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<v Speaker 3>Like I feel crazy because that movie was a lot

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<v Speaker 3>of and then it decided to be about everything, which

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<v Speaker 3>was yeah, everything.

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<v Speaker 2>It really did, and it didn't feel at that point

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<v Speaker 2>like I was in capable hands. That's my biggest acts

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<v Speaker 2>was that this is the second half of the movie

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<v Speaker 2>practically isn't a Bong June home movie for me. And

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<v Speaker 2>the first half I think retained much of what I

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<v Speaker 2>feel like I expected from his previous comedic work, which

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<v Speaker 2>I genuinely like. I think what I wanted was more

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<v Speaker 2>snow piercer, and I didn't. I didn't get that. I

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<v Speaker 2>started to get that and then I didn't get that

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<v Speaker 2>at the end, and I was very very frustrated by that.

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<v Speaker 2>So let's go down some of those points, j J.

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<v Speaker 2>They're really really good points. We don't need to go.

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<v Speaker 2>So where do you want to start with? I think

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<v Speaker 2>you had addressed the first to Andy.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, let's start there, because honestly, like that's the comedy thing, Like,

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<v Speaker 4>I just want to learn more Andy from you about

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<v Speaker 4>Like the reason why I thought Brazil immediately is because

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<v Speaker 4>there were these things that were definitely intense and intense

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<v Speaker 4>as an audience member to take in in a futuristic

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<v Speaker 4>sort of way, but they were definitely played for laughs.

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<v Speaker 4>And so I want to hear more about your distinction

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<v Speaker 4>between your love for a film like Brazil and then

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<v Speaker 4>this where it fails you in terms of Bank jun

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<v Speaker 4>Ho's version of humor.

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<v Speaker 1>And you know, that's a tricky thing to just answer simply,

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<v Speaker 1>I suppose, because I feel like so much of that

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<v Speaker 1>also is just how the script is written, in how

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<v Speaker 1>the director is shaping the film, and I think Gilliam

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<v Speaker 1>and Bong have very different kind of ways that they're

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<v Speaker 1>approaching stuff. I think that and yeah, I mean there's

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<v Speaker 1>definitely a lot of that kind of absurdist comedy throughout

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<v Speaker 1>Gilliam's films, and Brazil certainly has a lot of it.

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<v Speaker 1>I think the line is there's it still feels maybe

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<v Speaker 1>like there's a like a serious thread going on, and

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<v Speaker 1>there are times here where like Mark Ruffalo and just

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<v Speaker 1>so many of the actors are just like so over

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<v Speaker 1>the top and so like big and bombastic that it's

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<v Speaker 1>just like it's just so far down this comical direction

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<v Speaker 1>that is I don't feel like there's anything serious to

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<v Speaker 1>be played there, you know, Like I had a really

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<v Speaker 1>hard time buying anything that Mark Ruffalo did. It was

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<v Speaker 1>just so it was so big. Same thing with Tony

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<v Speaker 1>Collette as his wife, like the two of them, I

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<v Speaker 1>had a hard time with. I think that the comedy,

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<v Speaker 1>I think for me that that works so well in

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<v Speaker 1>something like Brazil is like comedy and a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>the moments and things like that, And there were there

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<v Speaker 1>were moments that I found genuinely funny in this film.

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<v Speaker 1>It's more of those moments about like the reactions like

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<v Speaker 1>when maybe an example is like when another version of

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<v Speaker 1>him is printing out and they've all completely forgotten to

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<v Speaker 1>pay attention to the fact that he's printing and the

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<v Speaker 1>woman has to come running over and she's trying to

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<v Speaker 1>hold up his body as the guy's trying to or

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<v Speaker 1>the second time where he just falls to the floor

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<v Speaker 1>and nobody even notices love it, Like those those are

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<v Speaker 1>the moments that I think worked better for me in

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<v Speaker 1>the comedy of just kind of like the absurdity of

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<v Speaker 1>this society as it's been created, and the ways that

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<v Speaker 1>things are happening in this society because people just don't care,

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<v Speaker 1>Like they don't care about the fact that this person

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<v Speaker 1>is an actual person. They're just like, you know, he's

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<v Speaker 1>he's inexpendable. If if he dies, so be it. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>Like those those are the moments that worked better for

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<v Speaker 1>me in the comedy elements. It's it's when we get

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<v Speaker 1>those characters that just are so and it's it's a

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<v Speaker 1>funny thing because I was thinking about this in relation

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<v Speaker 1>to snow Piercer. Tilda Swinton was pretty big and over

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<v Speaker 1>the top and that one too, but there was something

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<v Speaker 1>about her there that I could buy into a little more.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm not exactly sure where that line is, but

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<v Speaker 1>there's just something about the way that these characters were

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<v Speaker 1>that I just I couldn't I couldn't buy into these

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<v Speaker 1>characters in the way that they were being portrayed.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, and there is a it is a subtle line,

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<v Speaker 4>but it's an important line, and it's it's not easy

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<v Speaker 4>to define. So I like the way that you started

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<v Speaker 4>the answer and saying that it might not be simple

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<v Speaker 4>to figure out. I think so for me in particular,

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<v Speaker 4>thinking about Mark Ruffalo here, like, this movie harkened to

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<v Speaker 4>me for the movie that was my favorite of last year,

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<v Speaker 4>which was Poor Things, And it's the kind of thing of.

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<v Speaker 2>Like exactly what I thought of with him.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, So there's so much here where he's you know,

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<v Speaker 4>he's such a cad in Poor Things, and he's strangely

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<v Speaker 4>diabolical and over the top here too. You know, I

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<v Speaker 4>loved Poor Things, And I think I could argue, based

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<v Speaker 4>on the criticisms you guys have, which I actually think

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<v Speaker 4>are really valuable, that like I was really pulling for

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<v Speaker 4>this movie because I wanted it to be as good

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<v Speaker 4>as some of these other things, and I felt like

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<v Speaker 4>that first half really had the opportunity to be that way.

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<v Speaker 2>Sure, yeah, and I agree with that too.

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<v Speaker 4>Sure, I mean, what are some of those concepts that

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<v Speaker 4>you really wanted them to go deeper on.

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<v Speaker 3>The idea of what is individuality, the idea of the

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<v Speaker 3>fact that he's getting the same brain dump, but that

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<v Speaker 3>Mickey seventeen and Mickey eighteen were so different that like

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<v Speaker 3>explorations of like if we have all of these different

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00:18:17.799 --> 00:18:23.000
<v Speaker 3>types within us just naturally, how do certain things bubble up?

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<v Speaker 3>And when how can we really talk about someone being expendable?

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<v Speaker 3>Where does any kind of value of life matter? I mean,

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<v Speaker 3>we saw a zillion Mickeys. We saw a lot of

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<v Speaker 3>Mickeys throughout the movie. We only got to know two

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<v Speaker 3>of them, but like during the nerve gas and stuff,

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<v Speaker 3>those were Mickeys that were dying, dying, dying, and so

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<v Speaker 3>I would have wanted to spend more time about that.

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<v Speaker 3>And I like the idea while the alien stuff got

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<v Speaker 3>way too encompassing or over rock for the film. I

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<v Speaker 3>like the idea that the one guy that everyone thinks

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<v Speaker 3>is expendable is the only one that is able to

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<v Speaker 3>contact this alien being that we also now are about.

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<v Speaker 1>To make expendable. That's interesting. I like that.

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<v Speaker 3>But when you're doing that, and then imperialism and colonialism

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<v Speaker 3>and the rich versus poor, like you know, like Pete

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<v Speaker 3>brought up snow Piercer, and I love that comparison because

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<v Speaker 3>snow Piercer, Nope, it's not supposed to be a joke,

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<v Speaker 3>but really was more of a straight line of like

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00:19:22.839 --> 00:19:28.519
<v Speaker 3>class distinction, class warfare, and this one is about nine

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<v Speaker 3>things all at once.

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<v Speaker 1>I just wanted more.

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<v Speaker 3>I wanted more time to spend with the idea of

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<v Speaker 3>individuality and what does it mean to make a copy

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<v Speaker 3>of yourself and those kind of things.

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<v Speaker 1>Like Tony, you brought up that point. Sorry, JJ, you

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<v Speaker 1>brought up that point about that individuality. And one of

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<v Speaker 1>the things that they talk about with that is that

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<v Speaker 1>initial person who had they actually had multiple versions of

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<v Speaker 1>him that had killed those other people. And they talked

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<v Speaker 1>about like the the court cases about well does one

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<v Speaker 1>person serve do each of the three serve a third

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<v Speaker 1>of the sentence? Do they each serve the same sentence?

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<v Speaker 1>Like that sort of stuff. I'm like, this, this is

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<v Speaker 1>what one person's food?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah right, how yeah, exactly?

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<v Speaker 1>Fact is that's the stuff that I found so interesting

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<v Speaker 1>and yeah, like it was exciting, and then but the

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<v Speaker 1>movie kind of got bored with that. It was sort

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<v Speaker 1>of like isn't this funny?

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<v Speaker 3>And I was like, oh no, that's the movie for me, right, well,

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<v Speaker 3>that was the point.

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<v Speaker 4>The moment in the film when I said this is

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<v Speaker 4>a five star movie. Again reflecting on the first half,

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<v Speaker 4>is when Mickey seventeen is chasing up the stairs to

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<v Speaker 4>follow Nasha and Mickey eighteen and I'm like, oh, we're

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<v Speaker 4>going to get that interaction. We're going to challenge that

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<v Speaker 4>concept of multiples, and like, that's really good to me.

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00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:43.039
<v Speaker 4>This is what I want to do. And again it

388
00:20:43.079 --> 00:20:45.200
<v Speaker 4>went crazy in the second end. The thing that I

389
00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:47.160
<v Speaker 4>really like that you said to Tommy is this concept

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00:20:47.160 --> 00:20:51.559
<v Speaker 4>of identity or this individuality is I think what you said.

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<v Speaker 4>It's clear that Bong Juneo or some other people in

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00:20:56.480 --> 00:21:02.559
<v Speaker 4>the filmmaker community with this movie believed that the identity

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00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:06.319
<v Speaker 4>of Mickey Barnes was something to celebrate, which I think

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00:21:06.640 --> 00:21:09.920
<v Speaker 4>potentially the movie isn't actually that story. But when you

395
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<v Speaker 4>see that the flip from instead of moving to numbers,

396
00:21:13.640 --> 00:21:16.799
<v Speaker 4>like all of a sudden, he has a name, It's like, oh,

397
00:21:17.039 --> 00:21:19.359
<v Speaker 4>but again this goes to again back to my axe

398
00:21:19.359 --> 00:21:22.240
<v Speaker 4>to gride, Like that's not the story here. The story

399
00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:26.119
<v Speaker 4>is about like so much more than that about having

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00:21:26.400 --> 00:21:29.799
<v Speaker 4>an individual identity. There's much more to go deep on

401
00:21:29.960 --> 00:21:31.240
<v Speaker 4>than that, and that's why I think it kind of

402
00:21:31.279 --> 00:21:32.599
<v Speaker 4>contributes to my acts as well.

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00:21:33.000 --> 00:21:36.480
<v Speaker 2>I think that's a great point, jj that the fact

404
00:21:36.519 --> 00:21:39.079
<v Speaker 2>that by the end of the movie they want me

405
00:21:39.160 --> 00:21:41.240
<v Speaker 2>to celebrate something that I didn't know I should be

406
00:21:41.319 --> 00:21:44.799
<v Speaker 2>looking forward to, right right. And I think part of

407
00:21:44.839 --> 00:21:47.000
<v Speaker 2>that is that we never got to know any of

408
00:21:47.000 --> 00:21:51.960
<v Speaker 2>the other Mickeys before seventeen eighteen, and so having this

409
00:21:52.039 --> 00:21:58.759
<v Speaker 2>sort of individual identity versus continuity of consciousness argument becomes

410
00:21:58.759 --> 00:22:02.519
<v Speaker 2>something that is frail because it makes Mickey eighteen the

411
00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:05.480
<v Speaker 2>abnormal one, when in fact, what we probably would have

412
00:22:05.519 --> 00:22:10.920
<v Speaker 2>expected is the first sixteen actually had individual consciousnesses. Two.

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<v Speaker 2>And then the movie kind of falls apart, right if

414
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<v Speaker 2>you're if you're now only discussing this with Mickey's one

415
00:22:17.559 --> 00:22:20.519
<v Speaker 2>and two and the setup to Andy's point, like the

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00:22:20.559 --> 00:22:23.400
<v Speaker 2>setup was it was a bunch of guys who were

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<v Speaker 2>all in on the murdering gambit, right, they were all

418
00:22:26.359 --> 00:22:30.319
<v Speaker 2>a part of it, and uh, and I thought that

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00:22:30.319 --> 00:22:33.599
<v Speaker 2>that sort of that just fell apart too fast to

420
00:22:33.640 --> 00:22:35.759
<v Speaker 2>the to the the one of the I think you

421
00:22:35.799 --> 00:22:39.160
<v Speaker 2>and I lost our five stars at the same point

422
00:22:39.759 --> 00:22:42.440
<v Speaker 2>when they finally bring the three of them together, the

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00:22:42.480 --> 00:22:47.640
<v Speaker 2>two Mickeys and Nasha, it becomes a sex joke and

424
00:22:47.960 --> 00:22:53.160
<v Speaker 2>nothing more. Right, It's like you missed the point. You

425
00:22:53.319 --> 00:22:57.839
<v Speaker 2>missed the point, and we brought him oxy. Yeah, and

426
00:22:57.920 --> 00:23:00.599
<v Speaker 2>what what was that you brought it off? This drug

427
00:23:00.680 --> 00:23:02.720
<v Speaker 2>that is I mean this drug that is shortened to

428
00:23:03.119 --> 00:23:08.319
<v Speaker 2>it's yeah. Yeah, pick three of your nineteen lanes, Yeah,

429
00:23:08.359 --> 00:23:10.000
<v Speaker 2>there were, There were an awful lot of lanes. I

430
00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:12.720
<v Speaker 2>think one of the higher one of the higher lanes

431
00:23:12.920 --> 00:23:19.680
<v Speaker 2>is is potentially corporate utility versus human dignity. But I

432
00:23:19.759 --> 00:23:25.319
<v Speaker 2>struggled with corporate utility because this is a church. Does

433
00:23:25.359 --> 00:23:28.039
<v Speaker 2>that muddy the story for even the parts of the

434
00:23:28.079 --> 00:23:30.880
<v Speaker 2>story that we liked, knowing that there are actses flying

435
00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:33.880
<v Speaker 2>all over the place for this movie. Does the fact

436
00:23:33.920 --> 00:23:39.559
<v Speaker 2>that we are munging the church and and corporate utility

437
00:23:41.559 --> 00:23:42.759
<v Speaker 2>muddy the story for you guys?

438
00:23:42.960 --> 00:23:46.519
<v Speaker 4>Isn't it art imitating life? I mean, yes, it does,

439
00:23:46.839 --> 00:23:49.680
<v Speaker 4>but it's that's that's real. Yeah right, I mean that's

440
00:23:49.680 --> 00:23:52.079
<v Speaker 4>what we're dealing with right now. Yeah, Like, I think

441
00:23:52.119 --> 00:23:54.559
<v Speaker 4>I think it's a good It's an apt reflection of

442
00:23:55.799 --> 00:23:58.279
<v Speaker 4>what it takes to buy into a movement, whether it

443
00:23:58.400 --> 00:24:01.400
<v Speaker 4>happens to be a business or a spirituality. Or a

444
00:24:01.440 --> 00:24:04.480
<v Speaker 4>political leaning, and that's so much of that. It feels

445
00:24:04.559 --> 00:24:08.519
<v Speaker 4>muddy because we're being faced with people who are actively

446
00:24:08.599 --> 00:24:12.319
<v Speaker 4>messaging that muddy message to us every day right now.

447
00:24:12.920 --> 00:24:15.559
<v Speaker 4>I love how ok, yeah, and I love how you

448
00:24:15.559 --> 00:24:18.960
<v Speaker 4>brought it up. I hadn't even thought of the aspect

449
00:24:19.039 --> 00:24:21.640
<v Speaker 4>of the job that you mentioned in the intro. I

450
00:24:21.680 --> 00:24:23.640
<v Speaker 4>think that's such a great thing to talk about about,

451
00:24:23.640 --> 00:24:27.160
<v Speaker 4>how literally dying on the job like this, there is

452
00:24:27.200 --> 00:24:29.720
<v Speaker 4>an aspect of the worker here, which is just another

453
00:24:29.759 --> 00:24:31.160
<v Speaker 4>one of the ones that you know that could be

454
00:24:31.200 --> 00:24:33.079
<v Speaker 4>listed on Tommy's list of things that they could talk

455
00:24:33.119 --> 00:24:35.480
<v Speaker 4>about if they chose to focus on. Yeah, that is

456
00:24:35.519 --> 00:24:37.799
<v Speaker 4>a great thing to look at. Here is what's the

457
00:24:37.839 --> 00:24:40.920
<v Speaker 4>commentary of working here and what you're doing for your

458
00:24:41.000 --> 00:24:42.920
<v Speaker 4>job too. I don't know, there's a lot to it,

459
00:24:42.960 --> 00:24:44.480
<v Speaker 4>but I think it is muddy. I agree, And that

460
00:24:44.519 --> 00:24:46.400
<v Speaker 4>could be a criticism, but it might be on purpose.

461
00:24:46.960 --> 00:24:49.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, I think it came back to something you

462
00:24:49.799 --> 00:24:54.119
<v Speaker 2>were you posed in your opening thoughts, which was I

463
00:24:54.160 --> 00:24:57.720
<v Speaker 2>think around Ruffalo and talking about the current state of

464
00:24:57.759 --> 00:25:02.440
<v Speaker 2>our politics in the United States. But this being the norm,

465
00:25:02.519 --> 00:25:05.279
<v Speaker 2>the muddiness of the political state, I mean, every one

466
00:25:05.319 --> 00:25:10.839
<v Speaker 2>of the major themes of this movie are quite literally

467
00:25:10.880 --> 00:25:14.720
<v Speaker 2>playing out in real life. Right, it is art imitating

468
00:25:14.720 --> 00:25:17.920
<v Speaker 2>life imitating art maybe, so chapter and verse that that's

469
00:25:17.960 --> 00:25:20.279
<v Speaker 2>the problem that I may have with the second half

470
00:25:20.279 --> 00:25:21.720
<v Speaker 2>of this movie, and it may be the problem that

471
00:25:21.759 --> 00:25:23.559
<v Speaker 2>the second half of the movie has with the first half.

472
00:25:23.599 --> 00:25:25.920
<v Speaker 2>It's like, oh, we leaned into hard, let's talk about

473
00:25:25.960 --> 00:25:28.599
<v Speaker 2>the creatures. Now, we're afraid of answering all of these

474
00:25:28.680 --> 00:25:32.599
<v Speaker 2>questions because this is terrible. We've set ourselves up. And

475
00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:36.400
<v Speaker 2>the word is like, there was a lot of fusing

476
00:25:36.559 --> 00:25:39.039
<v Speaker 2>with this movie to make up finished movies.

477
00:25:39.119 --> 00:25:42.640
<v Speaker 3>So I don't know, is that I mean, I brought

478
00:25:42.640 --> 00:25:45.799
<v Speaker 3>that up with the vo Yeah, that the voiceover seems

479
00:25:45.799 --> 00:25:48.160
<v Speaker 3>to be plugging leaks or something like that.

480
00:25:48.440 --> 00:25:51.240
<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm guessing none of us have read the original story,

481
00:25:51.359 --> 00:25:54.880
<v Speaker 1>right Yeah, Yeah, I'm wondering. I mean, but it sounds

482
00:25:54.920 --> 00:25:56.799
<v Speaker 1>like that they had other people come on boards to

483
00:25:56.839 --> 00:25:59.480
<v Speaker 1>help add really flesh the whole thing out, So I'm

484
00:25:59.480 --> 00:26:02.440
<v Speaker 1>guessing that they I'm just curious, like what's in the

485
00:26:02.480 --> 00:26:05.960
<v Speaker 1>original story that they expanded upon, because it feels like

486
00:26:06.000 --> 00:26:09.400
<v Speaker 1>they went in a lot of different directions just to

487
00:26:09.440 --> 00:26:10.359
<v Speaker 1>get to this result.

488
00:26:11.319 --> 00:26:14.640
<v Speaker 2>There is okay, I don't know which lane this is now,

489
00:26:14.759 --> 00:26:17.359
<v Speaker 2>but I feel like we've got to talk about the

490
00:26:17.440 --> 00:26:21.480
<v Speaker 2>sauce and the act of making a sauce out of

491
00:26:21.519 --> 00:26:25.960
<v Speaker 2>the indigenous creatures and offering them up on fingertips for

492
00:26:26.559 --> 00:26:27.039
<v Speaker 2>this seating.

493
00:26:27.240 --> 00:26:30.119
<v Speaker 1>It's another lane, and I think it just goes into

494
00:26:30.640 --> 00:26:34.160
<v Speaker 1>like I was, like, I kind of lose track of

495
00:26:34.160 --> 00:26:37.519
<v Speaker 1>all the different things that they're potentially speaking to, but

496
00:26:38.279 --> 00:26:40.960
<v Speaker 1>the idea of like it it goes to like, are

497
00:26:40.960 --> 00:26:43.960
<v Speaker 1>we now talking about the plight of the pangolins and

498
00:26:44.440 --> 00:26:48.440
<v Speaker 1>the fact that people are you know, driving this animal

499
00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:51.920
<v Speaker 1>to extinction because they can grind down their scales and

500
00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:54.920
<v Speaker 1>use it for some health cure or something like that. Like,

501
00:26:55.279 --> 00:26:58.559
<v Speaker 1>we just keep going down these different different lanes, and

502
00:26:58.599 --> 00:27:01.759
<v Speaker 1>I'm just like, I'm why are we now into this

503
00:27:01.839 --> 00:27:04.599
<v Speaker 1>particular story here? I mean, I feel like Bong jun

504
00:27:04.640 --> 00:27:08.200
<v Speaker 1>Ho took every possible thing that he's interested in as

505
00:27:08.200 --> 00:27:11.400
<v Speaker 1>far as what he wants to change with the world,

506
00:27:11.480 --> 00:27:14.279
<v Speaker 1>and shoved it into this movie because that was exactly

507
00:27:14.279 --> 00:27:15.440
<v Speaker 1>where he was going with this one.

508
00:27:15.559 --> 00:27:17.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's a good point, especially when we get the

509
00:27:17.920 --> 00:27:21.319
<v Speaker 2>dinner sequence and we have him actually eating what was

510
00:27:21.359 --> 00:27:24.960
<v Speaker 2>that thing that he was eating it's a steak.

511
00:27:25.000 --> 00:27:26.839
<v Speaker 1>It was like bio engineered steak.

512
00:27:29.720 --> 00:27:29.960
<v Speaker 2>Raw.

513
00:27:30.119 --> 00:27:33.480
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, it was revolting that Okay, so that is the

514
00:27:33.480 --> 00:27:36.519
<v Speaker 4>scene though, Like aspects of that scene is what reminds

515
00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:38.400
<v Speaker 4>me of Brazil, right, where we get these sort of

516
00:27:38.559 --> 00:27:41.160
<v Speaker 4>layers in that, like he's been invited to this dinner,

517
00:27:41.400 --> 00:27:43.799
<v Speaker 4>but really the dinner is just another experiment, and then

518
00:27:43.880 --> 00:27:45.319
<v Speaker 4>all of the doctors come in and they're like, oh,

519
00:27:45.400 --> 00:27:48.200
<v Speaker 4>that's this is amazing. Like that's where really I got

520
00:27:48.200 --> 00:27:50.880
<v Speaker 4>into the sort of Brazil aspect of it. But yeah,

521
00:27:50.920 --> 00:27:54.359
<v Speaker 4>that was disgusting, really hard to deal with for sure.

522
00:27:54.200 --> 00:27:57.079
<v Speaker 2>But legitimately funny when the doctors are hiding behind a

523
00:27:57.160 --> 00:28:00.759
<v Speaker 2>hidden panel, a hidden door, and the president's dining room,

524
00:28:00.839 --> 00:28:02.240
<v Speaker 2>Like I thought that was that.

525
00:28:02.400 --> 00:28:04.960
<v Speaker 1>I laughed at that, like yew that there were a

526
00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:07.119
<v Speaker 1>lot of funny moments with that one. The food itself

527
00:28:07.200 --> 00:28:10.839
<v Speaker 1>is funny and how disgusting it is. Yeah, he starts vomiting,

528
00:28:10.880 --> 00:28:14.440
<v Speaker 1>and just how they resolve the vomiting uh, and and

529
00:28:14.480 --> 00:28:16.400
<v Speaker 1>the chaos of do we care about the fact that

530
00:28:16.440 --> 00:28:18.880
<v Speaker 1>he's vomiting or should we just shoot him? Like that

531
00:28:18.960 --> 00:28:21.680
<v Speaker 1>gets back to the utility of this character and what

532
00:28:21.720 --> 00:28:25.559
<v Speaker 1>purpose he serves and how complacent everyone around him is

533
00:28:25.920 --> 00:28:30.839
<v Speaker 1>because they'll just reprint him. The rug was the rug

534
00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:34.640
<v Speaker 1>was more important exactly exciting the concept of the sauce

535
00:28:35.119 --> 00:28:38.079
<v Speaker 1>reminds me of again Yogo s Lanthromos in that I

536
00:28:38.119 --> 00:28:41.160
<v Speaker 1>think about the rabbits in the Favorite and it feels

537
00:28:41.200 --> 00:28:43.519
<v Speaker 1>like this sort of like it's not behind the scenes,

538
00:28:43.559 --> 00:28:47.240
<v Speaker 1>but it's like an under an undercurrent of what we're

539
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:50.880
<v Speaker 1>thinking about in terms of imperialism and all these things.

540
00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:54.279
<v Speaker 4>Is like really like how can we use people to

541
00:28:55.319 --> 00:28:57.920
<v Speaker 4>feed us or to you know, fuel us? And and

542
00:28:57.920 --> 00:29:00.519
<v Speaker 4>I shouldn't say people because she's talking about these beings,

543
00:29:00.559 --> 00:29:02.680
<v Speaker 4>but it's like all of that felt like it was

544
00:29:02.680 --> 00:29:05.880
<v Speaker 4>something that was just kind of riding beneath what's going

545
00:29:05.880 --> 00:29:09.200
<v Speaker 4>on because she was so obsessed with calories and eating.

546
00:29:09.319 --> 00:29:11.880
<v Speaker 4>Like that's the vibe that I got from the concept

547
00:29:11.920 --> 00:29:14.279
<v Speaker 4>of the sauce there too well, And so is bang

548
00:29:14.319 --> 00:29:14.599
<v Speaker 4>jun Ho.

549
00:29:14.759 --> 00:29:17.079
<v Speaker 2>He's a session with the things we put in our mouths,

550
00:29:17.119 --> 00:29:19.960
<v Speaker 2>and it's you know, it's snow piercer, it's oakcha, it's

551
00:29:20.240 --> 00:29:22.599
<v Speaker 2>like you name it. He's been talking about how we

552
00:29:22.680 --> 00:29:24.680
<v Speaker 2>handle food for years. Right.

553
00:29:25.000 --> 00:29:27.000
<v Speaker 1>All I could think about was the was the uh

554
00:29:27.400 --> 00:29:31.400
<v Speaker 1>that commercial or psa that Taikawa TD did where he

555
00:29:31.480 --> 00:29:34.759
<v Speaker 1>was like the animated rabbit talking about like the torture

556
00:29:34.960 --> 00:29:38.000
<v Speaker 1>that that rabbits went through in these perfume factories to

557
00:29:38.559 --> 00:29:42.039
<v Speaker 1>you know, like to test, you know, the putting the

558
00:29:42.079 --> 00:29:44.079
<v Speaker 1>stuff in their eyes to see how they reacted and

559
00:29:44.160 --> 00:29:46.960
<v Speaker 1>all this stuff like that's that's like, that's where my

560
00:29:47.000 --> 00:29:50.119
<v Speaker 1>brain went when that was anything with that with the sauce.

561
00:29:51.079 --> 00:29:53.240
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I think bang jun Ho will look at our

562
00:29:53.279 --> 00:29:56.759
<v Speaker 4>conversation when when Bong jun Ho looks at our conversation,

563
00:29:57.079 --> 00:30:01.680
<v Speaker 4>like the shell as a success, it's like a wild

564
00:30:01.720 --> 00:30:04.920
<v Speaker 4>success of like, oh my gosh, all of these things

565
00:30:05.000 --> 00:30:09.039
<v Speaker 4>are now in that planted seeds in your psyche. So

566
00:30:09.160 --> 00:30:11.839
<v Speaker 4>even though we had trouble or we have these like

567
00:30:12.000 --> 00:30:14.119
<v Speaker 4>I feel like this as an artist, this is what

568
00:30:14.200 --> 00:30:16.400
<v Speaker 4>he is setting out to do. And you could argue

569
00:30:16.440 --> 00:30:19.200
<v Speaker 4>that the other films that he's done, you know, not

570
00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:21.920
<v Speaker 4>necessarily snow Piercer, but Parasite and all these are are

571
00:30:21.960 --> 00:30:24.279
<v Speaker 4>this sort of thing to sort of open up the

572
00:30:24.359 --> 00:30:27.119
<v Speaker 4>discourse about all the different things that he wants us

573
00:30:27.119 --> 00:30:29.599
<v Speaker 4>to be talking about and thinking about and all this stuff.

574
00:30:29.599 --> 00:30:32.839
<v Speaker 4>And yeah, they signify loose ends here, but I think

575
00:30:33.200 --> 00:30:35.559
<v Speaker 4>this is his art for better.

576
00:30:35.480 --> 00:30:39.960
<v Speaker 2>Or for worse, even parasite. Right, it is about sort

577
00:30:39.960 --> 00:30:43.720
<v Speaker 2>of gluttony versus stolen nutrition. Right, there is a whole

578
00:30:43.759 --> 00:30:49.599
<v Speaker 2>of how food is acquired and film fascinating things that

579
00:30:50.039 --> 00:30:52.960
<v Speaker 2>worked really well. I want to talk about production of

580
00:30:53.000 --> 00:30:59.000
<v Speaker 2>the film because for me, I never once questioned the

581
00:30:59.119 --> 00:31:05.960
<v Speaker 2>multiple Pattinson's, never did a question two Pattinson's on screen

582
00:31:05.960 --> 00:31:06.559
<v Speaker 2>at the same.

583
00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:09.160
<v Speaker 3>Time, at the same time. That was incredibly well done.

584
00:31:09.240 --> 00:31:11.920
<v Speaker 3>And I think that's where all the CGI or whatever

585
00:31:11.960 --> 00:31:12.440
<v Speaker 3>money went.

586
00:31:13.119 --> 00:31:16.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yea, yeah, well yeah, I think digital stitching obviously,

587
00:31:16.680 --> 00:31:20.079
<v Speaker 2>but they did the old tricks, right, body doubling, motion control,

588
00:31:20.160 --> 00:31:22.480
<v Speaker 2>multiple takes, like, they did all the tricks to do it,

589
00:31:22.519 --> 00:31:26.640
<v Speaker 2>and really favored practical when they could. And I think

590
00:31:26.640 --> 00:31:29.240
<v Speaker 2>it just plays so so very well.

591
00:31:29.359 --> 00:31:30.160
<v Speaker 1>Incredibly well.

592
00:31:30.319 --> 00:31:33.000
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, and I think he Pattinson in particular did a

593
00:31:33.039 --> 00:31:36.799
<v Speaker 4>great job of getting us into that. I mean, he

594
00:31:36.799 --> 00:31:39.680
<v Speaker 4>he his performance was part of that all. I mean

595
00:31:39.680 --> 00:31:41.880
<v Speaker 4>we're talking about the technological aspects of it, but he

596
00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:44.920
<v Speaker 4>did a fantastic job of helping us buy into what

597
00:31:45.000 --> 00:31:46.519
<v Speaker 4>he was experiencing as a character.

598
00:31:46.680 --> 00:31:49.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we really I never doubted that there were two

599
00:31:49.759 --> 00:31:53.720
<v Speaker 1>different versions of him, both personality wise and just on screen.

600
00:31:53.759 --> 00:31:56.759
<v Speaker 1>In my field of sight, it always felt real, and

601
00:31:56.799 --> 00:31:59.319
<v Speaker 1>that was really impressive that they that they pulled off,

602
00:31:59.319 --> 00:32:02.880
<v Speaker 1>and that he just delivered such great, uh kind of

603
00:32:02.880 --> 00:32:05.960
<v Speaker 1>subtle nuances in those two versions of himself.

604
00:32:06.279 --> 00:32:09.240
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I thought he did. He played both of them

605
00:32:09.359 --> 00:32:13.599
<v Speaker 3>so consistently. I personally wish that our main Mickey wasn't

606
00:32:13.640 --> 00:32:16.480
<v Speaker 3>such a boy a boy kind of a guy. That

607
00:32:16.559 --> 00:32:19.319
<v Speaker 3>little of that goes kind of a long way with me.

608
00:32:19.680 --> 00:32:22.119
<v Speaker 3>But that's just a personal feeling of like sort of

609
00:32:22.119 --> 00:32:25.400
<v Speaker 3>a sad sack. I didn't read all the paper stuff.

610
00:32:26.839 --> 00:32:29.599
<v Speaker 3>I don't know about this. This cake looks weird. I

611
00:32:29.599 --> 00:32:32.599
<v Speaker 3>don't know, like, I don't like I don't like following

612
00:32:32.640 --> 00:32:35.200
<v Speaker 3>around kind of dumb dumbs, even if they're sweet.

613
00:32:35.960 --> 00:32:38.480
<v Speaker 1>Is like because of all the narration though, or do

614
00:32:38.519 --> 00:32:41.000
<v Speaker 1>you think that it would have been the same problem

615
00:32:41.200 --> 00:32:41.519
<v Speaker 1>if you?

616
00:32:41.920 --> 00:32:44.279
<v Speaker 3>If you, I think the air reagion is a huge

617
00:32:44.319 --> 00:32:46.599
<v Speaker 3>part of it because the voice he picked was so

618
00:32:47.119 --> 00:32:50.599
<v Speaker 3>wa wah wah kind of a thing that it's you

619
00:32:50.640 --> 00:32:52.640
<v Speaker 3>can't because then every once in a while when it's

620
00:32:52.680 --> 00:32:56.000
<v Speaker 3>not voiceover, he's like super charming and cute, Like you

621
00:32:56.039 --> 00:32:59.960
<v Speaker 3>see him as I'm sorry, Nasha. Yeah, yeah, as Nasha

622
00:33:00.119 --> 00:33:02.559
<v Speaker 3>sees him, because at first you're like, why would anyone

623
00:33:02.559 --> 00:33:05.759
<v Speaker 3>ever pick this goofball? And he's cute and kind of

624
00:33:05.799 --> 00:33:07.799
<v Speaker 3>like messy haired and ever like this, But then his

625
00:33:07.920 --> 00:33:10.880
<v Speaker 3>voiceover makes more like, I don't know, like a big

626
00:33:11.000 --> 00:33:13.759
<v Speaker 3>Lebowski kind of a loser.

627
00:33:14.400 --> 00:33:16.359
<v Speaker 2>That's not a good comparison. I will say.

628
00:33:16.400 --> 00:33:20.559
<v Speaker 4>The scene where explaining their relationship, where they go into

629
00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:24.880
<v Speaker 4>somewhat of ret conning or rewriting for the audience to

630
00:33:24.960 --> 00:33:27.720
<v Speaker 4>understand their bond because you don't write the way that

631
00:33:27.720 --> 00:33:30.319
<v Speaker 4>they sell it to you early is very is very superficial.

632
00:33:30.559 --> 00:33:32.759
<v Speaker 4>But the scene where she I'm going to get emotionally

633
00:33:32.799 --> 00:33:34.440
<v Speaker 4>you're talking about it, but when she climbs into the

634
00:33:34.519 --> 00:33:36.839
<v Speaker 4>chamber to sit with him and if he dies, it

635
00:33:36.960 --> 00:33:38.039
<v Speaker 4>was like so.

636
00:33:38.119 --> 00:33:38.880
<v Speaker 2>Powerful for me.

637
00:33:39.039 --> 00:33:41.599
<v Speaker 4>And that's and I want to just highlight for me,

638
00:33:41.720 --> 00:33:43.279
<v Speaker 4>that's in the second half of the movie. So even

639
00:33:43.279 --> 00:33:45.000
<v Speaker 4>though we're going crazy at this point, I was like,

640
00:33:45.319 --> 00:33:48.559
<v Speaker 4>oh my gosh, this is this is the human relationship

641
00:33:48.599 --> 00:33:50.920
<v Speaker 4>part that this is the story that I want to

642
00:33:50.920 --> 00:33:53.359
<v Speaker 4>go deep on right like about identity and about the

643
00:33:53.359 --> 00:33:54.480
<v Speaker 4>connection and all this stuff.

644
00:33:54.559 --> 00:33:57.039
<v Speaker 1>So I love that would have been great to go

645
00:33:57.079 --> 00:33:59.440
<v Speaker 1>deeper on all that because it's such an interesting aspect

646
00:33:59.519 --> 00:34:02.359
<v Speaker 1>to her story. But again, I wanted a little bit

647
00:34:02.359 --> 00:34:06.519
<v Speaker 1>more of her backstory, Like was she initially interested in

648
00:34:06.640 --> 00:34:08.960
<v Speaker 1>him because she was kind of fascinated by the idea

649
00:34:09.039 --> 00:34:11.920
<v Speaker 1>of him being inexpendable, like what drew her to him?

650
00:34:11.920 --> 00:34:15.000
<v Speaker 1>And like that moment right there is a perfect example

651
00:34:15.039 --> 00:34:19.039
<v Speaker 1>of somebody who like, you know, wants to save you know,

652
00:34:19.320 --> 00:34:20.280
<v Speaker 1>Nepal or whatever.

653
00:34:20.360 --> 00:34:22.199
<v Speaker 2>Right it's it's like I've.

654
00:34:21.880 --> 00:34:25.000
<v Speaker 1>Got my my thing that I'm going to champion and

655
00:34:25.000 --> 00:34:25.480
<v Speaker 1>this is it?

656
00:34:25.760 --> 00:34:26.360
<v Speaker 2>Like is that it?

657
00:34:26.400 --> 00:34:28.440
<v Speaker 1>But then she falls for him? I don't know, And

658
00:34:28.440 --> 00:34:30.599
<v Speaker 1>that's I guess my problem with the relationship is because

659
00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:33.639
<v Speaker 1>I never like Tommy as It's like it's hard to

660
00:34:33.679 --> 00:34:37.800
<v Speaker 1>connect with that character because he's is kind of a

661
00:34:38.320 --> 00:34:39.480
<v Speaker 1>sad sack, dumb dumb.

662
00:34:39.679 --> 00:34:42.079
<v Speaker 3>And JJ I loved that part too, and I thought

663
00:34:42.119 --> 00:34:46.719
<v Speaker 3>that was which, hey, come on, I'm doing my best.

664
00:34:48.800 --> 00:34:51.599
<v Speaker 3>That part I also loved JJ, But I remember thinking

665
00:34:51.639 --> 00:34:55.559
<v Speaker 3>why now, why didn't we have this before? Right, I've

666
00:34:55.599 --> 00:34:58.920
<v Speaker 3>been told to believe this company and this stunning, stunning

667
00:34:59.239 --> 00:35:03.559
<v Speaker 3>woman was all power and this sad sack week guy

668
00:35:03.760 --> 00:35:07.280
<v Speaker 3>that were just like over and over again. I don't know,

669
00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:10.599
<v Speaker 3>like why. It's almost like the movie was like, oh,

670
00:35:10.639 --> 00:35:13.199
<v Speaker 3>they're not. But I like to think of like the making.

671
00:35:13.360 --> 00:35:16.679
<v Speaker 3>Everything is made chronologically, and so they're like making it,

672
00:35:16.760 --> 00:35:18.559
<v Speaker 3>making it, make it Like I don't think they're buying

673
00:35:18.599 --> 00:35:22.159
<v Speaker 3>the couple, boss, And he's like, Okay, say earlier she

674
00:35:22.280 --> 00:35:23.360
<v Speaker 3>got in the container.

675
00:35:23.599 --> 00:35:24.480
<v Speaker 1>I know that's not.

676
00:35:25.920 --> 00:35:27.400
<v Speaker 2>That's just like give us the foundation.

677
00:35:28.800 --> 00:35:32.119
<v Speaker 3>Really, the way that they gave us the bond was

678
00:35:32.199 --> 00:35:36.639
<v Speaker 3>purely through It seemed like sexual contact, right. There was

679
00:35:36.679 --> 00:35:39.760
<v Speaker 3>also her sticking up for him, but I mean they

680
00:35:39.880 --> 00:35:44.079
<v Speaker 3>made it a physical bonding. Yeah, and I just didn't

681
00:35:44.199 --> 00:35:45.039
<v Speaker 3>quite understand it.

682
00:35:46.199 --> 00:35:48.519
<v Speaker 2>What wait, what part didn't you understand about the physical

683
00:35:48.519 --> 00:35:52.679
<v Speaker 2>bonding that she would be attracted to sad sack dumb dumb, No, that.

684
00:35:52.239 --> 00:35:59.159
<v Speaker 3>That more more of the emotional connection and the reason

685
00:35:59.239 --> 00:36:02.440
<v Speaker 3>that she liked versus I mean, they just immediately start

686
00:36:03.000 --> 00:36:05.920
<v Speaker 3>their sexcapade, and I.

687
00:36:06.519 --> 00:36:08.760
<v Speaker 2>Was just sort of wondering, why, Well, I do think

688
00:36:08.800 --> 00:36:11.159
<v Speaker 2>we should we should talk a little. Let's let's make

689
00:36:11.199 --> 00:36:14.360
<v Speaker 2>this a film sex podcast just for a segment, because

690
00:36:15.199 --> 00:36:19.800
<v Speaker 2>I think that they have already set the table for

691
00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:24.920
<v Speaker 2>sex being foreboten while on the ship. Because they're counting calories,

692
00:36:25.320 --> 00:36:29.159
<v Speaker 2>and immediately they go into a sexual relationship, which to

693
00:36:29.199 --> 00:36:31.880
<v Speaker 2>me felt like a bit of a too tidy a

694
00:36:31.960 --> 00:36:36.199
<v Speaker 2>transition to well, we're you know, we can't help it.

695
00:36:36.239 --> 00:36:40.079
<v Speaker 2>We're human organisms and we copulate, and that's going to

696
00:36:40.119 --> 00:36:46.000
<v Speaker 2>be the what we do now to start rebelling against

697
00:36:46.079 --> 00:36:47.239
<v Speaker 2>the authoritative hand.

698
00:36:47.559 --> 00:36:51.000
<v Speaker 4>So I love I understand that perspective, but my take

699
00:36:51.079 --> 00:36:53.960
<v Speaker 4>on it is a little bit opposite in this regard

700
00:36:54.039 --> 00:36:56.960
<v Speaker 4>because of exactly what we experience experience together, is this

701
00:36:57.280 --> 00:37:00.159
<v Speaker 4>that it's verboten? But my favorite Black Mirror episode of

702
00:37:00.199 --> 00:37:02.840
<v Speaker 4>all time is Hang the DJ, And the concept in

703
00:37:02.880 --> 00:37:06.000
<v Speaker 4>Hang the DJ is that it is an algorithm that

704
00:37:06.119 --> 00:37:09.840
<v Speaker 4>is designed to figure out which pairing is most likely

705
00:37:09.880 --> 00:37:13.239
<v Speaker 4>to break the rules, and that is the evidence of

706
00:37:13.280 --> 00:37:16.599
<v Speaker 4>true love. And so like, when I get this in

707
00:37:16.639 --> 00:37:20.239
<v Speaker 4>this movie, I'm like, oh, of course they're told they cannot,

708
00:37:20.320 --> 00:37:23.119
<v Speaker 4>but they love each other so greatly that they do it. Now,

709
00:37:23.199 --> 00:37:25.639
<v Speaker 4>it's thin, you know, It's it's a leap that you

710
00:37:25.719 --> 00:37:27.400
<v Speaker 4>have to take as an audience member, and it's thin.

711
00:37:27.480 --> 00:37:29.840
<v Speaker 4>I will agree, but and you could easily have the

712
00:37:29.880 --> 00:37:33.320
<v Speaker 4>interpretation that you just mentioned. But for me, especially then,

713
00:37:33.400 --> 00:37:36.000
<v Speaker 4>of course, when we ret con with these additional emotional things.

714
00:37:36.039 --> 00:37:40.000
<v Speaker 4>Later on, I'm like, oh, okay, great, and I bought it,

715
00:37:40.280 --> 00:37:42.000
<v Speaker 4>so but again, like I said, I was.

716
00:37:41.960 --> 00:37:44.920
<v Speaker 2>Pulling for it as well, So but were you?

717
00:37:45.159 --> 00:37:47.760
<v Speaker 1>I guess one other element with that is like are

718
00:37:47.760 --> 00:37:50.159
<v Speaker 1>we thinking are we supposed to think that they're the

719
00:37:50.199 --> 00:37:51.440
<v Speaker 1>only couple that's.

720
00:37:51.280 --> 00:37:52.079
<v Speaker 2>Actually doing this?

721
00:37:52.360 --> 00:37:55.039
<v Speaker 1>Well, I think because you're right, but we were never

722
00:37:55.159 --> 00:37:58.119
<v Speaker 1>shown that. And that's the thing, like when that edict

723
00:37:58.199 --> 00:38:00.480
<v Speaker 1>comes down that no sex, no sex until we have

724
00:38:00.519 --> 00:38:03.760
<v Speaker 1>this big sex party day whatever the thing is, it's like,

725
00:38:04.639 --> 00:38:07.599
<v Speaker 1>so I don't know. My assumption was like everybody's probably

726
00:38:07.599 --> 00:38:10.280
<v Speaker 1>secretly having sex. It's like what you're going to do.

727
00:38:10.400 --> 00:38:13.800
<v Speaker 1>It's like, you know the way the humans operate and so,

728
00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:17.320
<v Speaker 1>but we're only ever shown them, and so it just

729
00:38:17.320 --> 00:38:19.800
<v Speaker 1>makes it harder to figure out like are they doing

730
00:38:19.800 --> 00:38:22.280
<v Speaker 1>this just because of that or is there like you

731
00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:23.320
<v Speaker 1>just don't really know, you know.

732
00:38:24.119 --> 00:38:27.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean even the the two women, one of

733
00:38:27.840 --> 00:38:31.400
<v Speaker 2>them is crushed by ice, the survivor, like they even

734
00:38:31.639 --> 00:38:36.119
<v Speaker 2>had were written and blocked and had emotional connection that

735
00:38:36.199 --> 00:38:40.480
<v Speaker 2>indicated these are these two people are in a physical

736
00:38:40.480 --> 00:38:44.960
<v Speaker 2>relationship and they are not counting calories when they do it,

737
00:38:46.440 --> 00:38:49.800
<v Speaker 2>and I think that's the like, I think that's to

738
00:38:49.880 --> 00:38:52.559
<v Speaker 2>your point. Everybody's doing it, and we get a few hints,

739
00:38:53.480 --> 00:38:56.400
<v Speaker 2>but really the only one that we get to see

740
00:38:56.559 --> 00:38:59.320
<v Speaker 2>is all is both of the Mickeys at some point

741
00:38:59.440 --> 00:39:02.800
<v Speaker 2>or another doing drugs and having sex and wanting threesomes.

742
00:39:03.239 --> 00:39:05.840
<v Speaker 4>And again, like again, as a apologist for this movie,

743
00:39:05.880 --> 00:39:08.920
<v Speaker 4>what a great commentary on the repression of sex and society.

744
00:39:08.960 --> 00:39:12.440
<v Speaker 4>But go ahead, go ahead, go wherever you want with

745
00:39:12.440 --> 00:39:13.159
<v Speaker 4>your interpretation.

746
00:39:13.280 --> 00:39:16.559
<v Speaker 1>But I'm into JJ wants the full eight hour cut

747
00:39:16.559 --> 00:39:18.960
<v Speaker 1>that actually has full stories of all of these things

748
00:39:19.000 --> 00:39:20.039
<v Speaker 1>where everything's wrapped up.

749
00:39:20.320 --> 00:39:22.840
<v Speaker 4>Yes, imssion, give me the gates. I want it all.

750
00:39:23.320 --> 00:39:28.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Okay, there's a guy in a pigeon suit. Sidebar.

751
00:39:29.039 --> 00:39:31.119
<v Speaker 2>If there's a guy in a pigeon suit, what we

752
00:39:31.159 --> 00:39:32.840
<v Speaker 2>make of the pigeon suit guy anything?

753
00:39:33.960 --> 00:39:36.599
<v Speaker 1>All I could say is I have seen him so

754
00:39:36.679 --> 00:39:38.880
<v Speaker 1>many times in the trailer for that other movie that's

755
00:39:38.920 --> 00:39:42.360
<v Speaker 1>coming out soon, the whatever, the Something Island where it's

756
00:39:42.840 --> 00:39:45.719
<v Speaker 1>the two singers who are invited to that island, Something

757
00:39:45.760 --> 00:39:49.039
<v Speaker 1>Wallace Island. Anyway, I have seen that trailer before so

758
00:39:49.079 --> 00:39:51.239
<v Speaker 1>many movies in the last two months that as soon

759
00:39:51.280 --> 00:39:52.800
<v Speaker 1>as he came up. That's the only thing I could

760
00:39:52.800 --> 00:39:54.079
<v Speaker 1>think of. It's like, oh, it's a guy from the

761
00:39:54.679 --> 00:39:56.639
<v Speaker 1>movie that I've seen the whole movie in the trailer

762
00:39:56.719 --> 00:39:57.599
<v Speaker 1>like fifty times.

763
00:39:58.280 --> 00:40:00.880
<v Speaker 2>That is the Ballad of Wallace Island, and I never

764
00:40:00.920 --> 00:40:02.320
<v Speaker 2>even heard of it either.

765
00:40:03.159 --> 00:40:05.679
<v Speaker 1>Watch the trailer, you'll see him, and you'll go to just.

766
00:40:05.639 --> 00:40:11.199
<v Speaker 3>Showing you the trailer directly, an algorithm has decided I

767
00:40:11.960 --> 00:40:14.760
<v Speaker 3>am the one person who I'm still somehow getting the

768
00:40:14.840 --> 00:40:17.840
<v Speaker 3>Speak No Evil trailer even though they left.

769
00:40:21.559 --> 00:40:24.360
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so we don't have an answer on Pigeon man anybody.

770
00:40:24.440 --> 00:40:27.360
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I'll take the thinnest of reasons to have

771
00:40:27.400 --> 00:40:28.039
<v Speaker 2>a pigeon guy.

772
00:40:28.760 --> 00:40:32.039
<v Speaker 4>It's just idiocracy, right, I Mean, there's so much of

773
00:40:32.079 --> 00:40:34.440
<v Speaker 4>the film that that is talking about that of the

774
00:40:34.559 --> 00:40:39.800
<v Speaker 4>ridiculousness of ways to anesthetize fear, and it just really

775
00:40:39.800 --> 00:40:42.719
<v Speaker 4>feels like another one of those aspects of what they're

776
00:40:42.719 --> 00:40:43.360
<v Speaker 4>trying to do.

777
00:40:43.559 --> 00:40:48.800
<v Speaker 1>And the portrayal of fervent followers, fervant blind followers of

778
00:40:48.840 --> 00:40:52.119
<v Speaker 1>a particular politician. Like that's really where my head went

779
00:40:52.159 --> 00:40:52.519
<v Speaker 1>with them.

780
00:40:52.800 --> 00:40:54.639
<v Speaker 2>Oh I like that. I like both of those things.

781
00:40:54.800 --> 00:40:55.400
<v Speaker 2>I'll take it.

782
00:40:55.840 --> 00:40:58.280
<v Speaker 1>I want to JJ mentioned earlier well, I'm thinking of

783
00:40:58.280 --> 00:41:00.119
<v Speaker 1>things that JJ brought up. He also brought up the

784
00:41:00.119 --> 00:41:02.159
<v Speaker 1>idea of destroying the machine, and I wanted to chat

785
00:41:02.159 --> 00:41:05.000
<v Speaker 1>a little bit about that because that was another interesting

786
00:41:05.039 --> 00:41:07.079
<v Speaker 1>element that I thought they could have done so much

787
00:41:07.119 --> 00:41:09.960
<v Speaker 1>more with, because I actually like the idea of destroying

788
00:41:09.960 --> 00:41:14.360
<v Speaker 1>the machine. But the thing is that it speaks to

789
00:41:14.440 --> 00:41:18.519
<v Speaker 1>the nature of humans trying to find the easy way

790
00:41:18.559 --> 00:41:22.440
<v Speaker 1>to do stuff, and you see it all through any

791
00:41:22.519 --> 00:41:25.119
<v Speaker 1>industry that we have. It's like, hey, it's so much

792
00:41:25.119 --> 00:41:26.960
<v Speaker 1>easier if we just dump all of our waste into

793
00:41:26.960 --> 00:41:28.960
<v Speaker 1>this river that's right next to us. Let's just do that,

794
00:41:29.519 --> 00:41:32.119
<v Speaker 1>And so they'll do the easy thing, and then someone's like, Eh,

795
00:41:32.280 --> 00:41:34.400
<v Speaker 1>well we really shouldn't do that. We're killing everything, and

796
00:41:34.440 --> 00:41:36.599
<v Speaker 1>you know, the rivers are on fire, and they put

797
00:41:36.599 --> 00:41:39.039
<v Speaker 1>policies in place that keep us from actually doing the

798
00:41:39.079 --> 00:41:41.960
<v Speaker 1>things that are wrong but that are easy. And what

799
00:41:42.079 --> 00:41:45.199
<v Speaker 1>I like about the idea here is like, yeah, there

800
00:41:45.320 --> 00:41:48.599
<v Speaker 1>is perhaps a side of looking at destroying the machine

801
00:41:48.679 --> 00:41:52.840
<v Speaker 1>as it's not right. We shouldn't be doing this, But

802
00:41:53.239 --> 00:41:59.000
<v Speaker 1>that's because it's representative of us being lazy when they

803
00:41:59.039 --> 00:42:01.199
<v Speaker 1>could be doing all of the same stuff. They could

804
00:42:01.239 --> 00:42:04.679
<v Speaker 1>be you know, figuring out the toxin in the air

805
00:42:04.880 --> 00:42:07.960
<v Speaker 1>on Niffelheim and all of that through a yeah, it

806
00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:10.280
<v Speaker 1>might be harder, it might take longer, but through things

807
00:42:10.320 --> 00:42:13.639
<v Speaker 1>that are a little more ethically responsible in how they

808
00:42:13.719 --> 00:42:17.320
<v Speaker 1>actually do it, rather than this process. And so I

809
00:42:17.320 --> 00:42:19.159
<v Speaker 1>don't know that was my response to you as far

810
00:42:19.199 --> 00:42:21.760
<v Speaker 1>as like my reasoning as to like buying into the

811
00:42:21.760 --> 00:42:23.960
<v Speaker 1>fact that they're destroying it, like that's what they were saying,

812
00:42:24.039 --> 00:42:26.960
<v Speaker 1>is like, we still need to think ethically and responsibly

813
00:42:26.960 --> 00:42:29.039
<v Speaker 1>and find better ways, because there's probably a way we

814
00:42:29.039 --> 00:42:31.159
<v Speaker 1>can do it without killing these clones off.

815
00:42:31.400 --> 00:42:33.559
<v Speaker 4>So the interesting thing is that my question for that,

816
00:42:33.639 --> 00:42:36.519
<v Speaker 4>it's really a philosophical question in like what could be

817
00:42:36.559 --> 00:42:41.079
<v Speaker 4>more ethically responsible than someone consenting to doing this and

818
00:42:41.159 --> 00:42:44.719
<v Speaker 4>improving humanity. Let's just say, like, like let's make it

819
00:42:44.840 --> 00:42:48.679
<v Speaker 4>huge through this process. Nothing about the process in and

820
00:42:48.679 --> 00:42:53.320
<v Speaker 4>of itself seems irresponsible or contrary to it doesn't feel bad.

821
00:42:54.400 --> 00:42:56.719
<v Speaker 4>For example, the idea that you brought up of like

822
00:42:57.239 --> 00:42:59.760
<v Speaker 4>pouring waste into rivers, Like clearly, all of a sudden

823
00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:03.320
<v Speaker 4>we have and all these things. But like for Mickey's experience,

824
00:43:04.320 --> 00:43:07.400
<v Speaker 4>there wasn't anything bad about his thing in that he

825
00:43:07.440 --> 00:43:10.880
<v Speaker 4>did exactly what he signed up for. He became immortal,

826
00:43:11.119 --> 00:43:16.000
<v Speaker 4>like as as a testing hamster for the human race,

827
00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:20.119
<v Speaker 4>as we explored, potentially his consent and this what we

828
00:43:20.159 --> 00:43:23.679
<v Speaker 4>go on. If we don't separate his individuality or identity

829
00:43:24.039 --> 00:43:27.840
<v Speaker 4>in the eighteen mickeys that we meet, and we consider

830
00:43:27.920 --> 00:43:32.360
<v Speaker 4>his consciousness as complete throughout, this could be the best

831
00:43:32.519 --> 00:43:36.000
<v Speaker 4>way for us to do this because there really isn't

832
00:43:36.039 --> 00:43:39.000
<v Speaker 4>anything unethical about that if we think of it that way.

833
00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:42.159
<v Speaker 4>So that's the that's the hard part, I guess, as.

834
00:43:43.039 --> 00:43:45.039
<v Speaker 1>Ethics are a little fuzzy in that statement.

835
00:43:45.079 --> 00:43:45.719
<v Speaker 2>I think, well.

836
00:43:45.559 --> 00:43:49.440
<v Speaker 4>Completely, But I mean it's whether mickeys are different set

837
00:43:49.440 --> 00:43:50.800
<v Speaker 4>in different mickeys. I don't, but.

838
00:43:50.840 --> 00:43:53.760
<v Speaker 1>It's all the same. But you're saying, as long as

839
00:43:53.760 --> 00:43:56.960
<v Speaker 1>he ethically signed up for it, then it's fine. But

840
00:43:57.119 --> 00:43:59.960
<v Speaker 1>like that's the thing, Like the ethical responsibility is like

841
00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:02.639
<v Speaker 1>not allowing people to sign up or something like that,

842
00:44:02.760 --> 00:44:07.119
<v Speaker 1>because that like that's the line. I think that, Well,

843
00:44:07.840 --> 00:44:10.199
<v Speaker 1>you're across the other line and saying it's ethical because

844
00:44:10.199 --> 00:44:11.639
<v Speaker 1>he signed up, but.

845
00:44:11.639 --> 00:44:14.320
<v Speaker 2>He signed up under duress, Like he signed up because

846
00:44:14.320 --> 00:44:16.159
<v Speaker 2>he was running away from something else.

847
00:44:16.159 --> 00:44:18.519
<v Speaker 3>There's nothing ethical about that, and he didn't know what

848
00:44:18.559 --> 00:44:20.280
<v Speaker 3>he was signing up for very true.

849
00:44:20.400 --> 00:44:24.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, but because again aside the fact that this

850
00:44:24.719 --> 00:44:27.239
<v Speaker 1>is here, the fact that this system is in place

851
00:44:27.280 --> 00:44:30.760
<v Speaker 1>saying hey, we've got the paperwork here, as long as

852
00:44:30.760 --> 00:44:33.400
<v Speaker 1>they're signing up for it, it's totally okay. Like, I

853
00:44:33.480 --> 00:44:36.440
<v Speaker 1>just think that the fact that that paperwork exists is

854
00:44:36.480 --> 00:44:39.639
<v Speaker 1>the ethical problem, not the fact that somebody actually signed it.

855
00:44:40.119 --> 00:44:41.119
<v Speaker 4>Totally iet.

856
00:44:41.159 --> 00:44:44.599
<v Speaker 2>It's ninety pages long, right, Like, this is an end

857
00:44:44.719 --> 00:44:46.639
<v Speaker 2>user license agreement. Nobody reads.

858
00:44:47.639 --> 00:44:50.159
<v Speaker 4>What I would challenge in this, I agree with what

859
00:44:50.199 --> 00:44:52.239
<v Speaker 4>you're saying, but what I would challenge with you is

860
00:44:52.280 --> 00:44:56.800
<v Speaker 4>that Mickey is the brick. Mickey is not the Clones, right,

861
00:44:56.840 --> 00:44:58.920
<v Speaker 4>So what he actually signed up to be was a

862
00:44:58.920 --> 00:45:05.280
<v Speaker 4>superhero and potentially the great savior of civilization. So the

863
00:45:05.280 --> 00:45:08.400
<v Speaker 4>only stakes that Mickey truly has for going through all

864
00:45:08.400 --> 00:45:12.440
<v Speaker 4>the suffering is the elimination of the brit Everything else

865
00:45:12.719 --> 00:45:15.639
<v Speaker 4>allows him to experience these things in a way that

866
00:45:15.880 --> 00:45:20.000
<v Speaker 4>furthers creation and furthers are development as a species. So

867
00:45:20.239 --> 00:45:25.159
<v Speaker 4>my point, yes, these things are ethically flexible, But potentially

868
00:45:25.440 --> 00:45:27.719
<v Speaker 4>the point that I'm making about the breaking of the

869
00:45:27.760 --> 00:45:32.960
<v Speaker 4>machine is that very very close mindedly, they chose to

870
00:45:33.079 --> 00:45:36.519
<v Speaker 4>focus on Mickey seventeen as the real Mickey, and are

871
00:45:36.559 --> 00:45:39.599
<v Speaker 4>denying all of the great things that happened to them

872
00:45:39.840 --> 00:45:41.679
<v Speaker 4>that allowed them to do the things that they do

873
00:45:41.760 --> 00:45:44.719
<v Speaker 4>because they had Mickey's I don't want to say consent,

874
00:45:44.719 --> 00:45:48.199
<v Speaker 4>because I agree with your point. They had Mickey's buy

875
00:45:48.280 --> 00:45:51.000
<v Speaker 4>in to this as the way to do it. He

876
00:45:51.280 --> 00:45:55.559
<v Speaker 4>was the great savior of this civilization. And them killing

877
00:45:55.599 --> 00:45:59.760
<v Speaker 4>the machine could be possibly limiting their chance to grow

878
00:45:59.800 --> 00:46:01.239
<v Speaker 4>firm there and become more.

879
00:46:01.159 --> 00:46:04.079
<v Speaker 1>Because if they're if they think in a lazy way,

880
00:46:04.159 --> 00:46:06.760
<v Speaker 1>if they start going, well, now we're cutting ourselves off

881
00:46:06.760 --> 00:46:09.719
<v Speaker 1>from that. We have to now think smarter and do

882
00:46:09.760 --> 00:46:11.480
<v Speaker 1>it the hard way. But we can still get there.

883
00:46:11.960 --> 00:46:15.039
<v Speaker 2>But I mean it goes back to on a mission

884
00:46:15.239 --> 00:46:20.199
<v Speaker 2>like this, Let's say we're thinking completely authentically about survival

885
00:46:21.800 --> 00:46:27.679
<v Speaker 2>when gestation of nine months is, you know, a questionable

886
00:46:27.760 --> 00:46:32.119
<v Speaker 2>thing for reproducing and growing the population, being able to clone,

887
00:46:33.239 --> 00:46:38.559
<v Speaker 2>you know, mortally wounded representatives to keep to stabilize the

888
00:46:38.599 --> 00:46:42.679
<v Speaker 2>population seems like an ethical thing to do. That seems

889
00:46:43.159 --> 00:46:46.239
<v Speaker 2>actually pretty cool. Yeah, I'd sign up for being a break.

890
00:46:47.800 --> 00:46:49.599
<v Speaker 2>That's really what I've come to as this conversation.

891
00:46:50.000 --> 00:46:52.840
<v Speaker 1>I mean, it boils down to just ethics of cloning period.

892
00:46:52.880 --> 00:46:54.920
<v Speaker 1>I mean, the whole thing really is just, you know,

893
00:46:54.960 --> 00:46:57.239
<v Speaker 1>a Dolly the Sheep sort of situation that we're going

894
00:46:57.320 --> 00:47:00.280
<v Speaker 1>to be circling here. I don't know if there's really

895
00:47:00.280 --> 00:47:03.480
<v Speaker 1>a clean way to to, you know, figure out the

896
00:47:03.519 --> 00:47:07.559
<v Speaker 1>actual what's right and what's wrong in this sort of situation,

897
00:47:07.639 --> 00:47:12.119
<v Speaker 1>but it is very I mean, it's it's very tricky,

898
00:47:12.159 --> 00:47:14.639
<v Speaker 1>and you know, they they again they start touching on

899
00:47:14.679 --> 00:47:18.960
<v Speaker 1>these things, like we're seeing differences in character between seventeen

900
00:47:18.960 --> 00:47:20.679
<v Speaker 1>and eighteen. He talks about how.

901
00:47:20.639 --> 00:47:24.440
<v Speaker 4>It's development by the way, like there's not a argument there,

902
00:47:24.519 --> 00:47:27.320
<v Speaker 4>like right exactly this way, and he talks about how

903
00:47:27.480 --> 00:47:30.159
<v Speaker 4>NASA had said version I don't know three or something

904
00:47:30.239 --> 00:47:31.719
<v Speaker 4>was really cranky or something like.

905
00:47:31.760 --> 00:47:34.719
<v Speaker 1>There were clearly other differences in some of the other

906
00:47:35.239 --> 00:47:37.440
<v Speaker 1>iterations as well. So it just speaks to the fact

907
00:47:37.440 --> 00:47:42.840
<v Speaker 1>that there is this sense of individual identities within these characters. Sure,

908
00:47:42.920 --> 00:47:45.159
<v Speaker 1>and so it and I don't know, maybe it's just

909
00:47:45.199 --> 00:47:48.039
<v Speaker 1>the fact that we're seeing it in a situation where

910
00:47:48.039 --> 00:47:50.079
<v Speaker 1>that happened to be two at a time out in

911
00:47:50.159 --> 00:47:54.480
<v Speaker 1>the world that makes it suddenly seem a lot more gray.

912
00:47:54.679 --> 00:47:56.559
<v Speaker 1>But again, then we we spend half the movie with

913
00:47:56.599 --> 00:47:58.519
<v Speaker 1>the bugs, and well.

914
00:47:58.400 --> 00:48:01.679
<v Speaker 2>That's yeah, and that's the that's the central criticism of

915
00:48:01.719 --> 00:48:03.840
<v Speaker 2>the film is that it touches on so many things

916
00:48:03.840 --> 00:48:07.360
<v Speaker 2>that are fascinating and could make for a really interesting movie,

917
00:48:07.719 --> 00:48:10.960
<v Speaker 2>and doesn't commit to the bit to the bits, any

918
00:48:11.000 --> 00:48:15.119
<v Speaker 2>of the bits I don't know, And I think that

919
00:48:15.280 --> 00:48:20.000
<v Speaker 2>destroying the printer at the end is tying a knot

920
00:48:20.000 --> 00:48:22.400
<v Speaker 2>on one of the weaker bits that the movie could

921
00:48:22.480 --> 00:48:26.159
<v Speaker 2>have actually explored. That I think is a frustrating piece.

922
00:48:26.440 --> 00:48:31.039
<v Speaker 2>It's frustrating piece. We haven't mentioned Stephen Yun as Timo

923
00:48:32.159 --> 00:48:37.079
<v Speaker 2>apart from joking, what do you think of Stephen's performance here?

924
00:48:37.320 --> 00:48:40.280
<v Speaker 2>Was how useful was the character for.

925
00:48:40.199 --> 00:48:45.679
<v Speaker 3>You other than motivation for setting him on this expendable journey.

926
00:48:46.079 --> 00:48:49.000
<v Speaker 3>I feel like you can take that entire plotline out

927
00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:51.639
<v Speaker 3>of the movie and the movie still works. And I

928
00:48:51.639 --> 00:48:54.800
<v Speaker 3>feel like the script even knows that because he's not

929
00:48:54.920 --> 00:48:58.239
<v Speaker 3>really written that great, Like he's fine, but he's also

930
00:48:58.360 --> 00:49:00.840
<v Speaker 3>just sort of like talking because there's not a lot

931
00:49:00.880 --> 00:49:02.559
<v Speaker 3>of depth to his character.

932
00:49:02.639 --> 00:49:03.280
<v Speaker 2>He sort of.

933
00:49:05.599 --> 00:49:08.760
<v Speaker 3>Has no empathy. He sort of is just a scrounger,

934
00:49:08.760 --> 00:49:11.840
<v Speaker 3>but it doesn't lean anywhere too far. He's just sort

935
00:49:11.840 --> 00:49:15.480
<v Speaker 3>of a plot development, and so I didn't if we're

936
00:49:15.480 --> 00:49:20.360
<v Speaker 3>talking about simplifying things, I didn't need really any of that.

937
00:49:19.800 --> 00:49:22.519
<v Speaker 4>That it makes or that makes complete sense. And I

938
00:49:23.440 --> 00:49:26.199
<v Speaker 4>agree with that when I look at it objectively, we

939
00:49:26.239 --> 00:49:29.559
<v Speaker 4>could make the case that his experience going on this

940
00:49:29.679 --> 00:49:33.239
<v Speaker 4>journey shows us that Mickey didn't have to do what

941
00:49:33.320 --> 00:49:35.920
<v Speaker 4>he did. That he could have lied, or he could

942
00:49:35.960 --> 00:49:39.880
<v Speaker 4>have done these other things too. So potentially the presence

943
00:49:39.920 --> 00:49:42.079
<v Speaker 4>of this other character and his life through this is

944
00:49:42.079 --> 00:49:47.320
<v Speaker 4>becoming a drug dealer. All this nonsense is more put

945
00:49:47.320 --> 00:49:50.559
<v Speaker 4>in the story to show us the stakes of Mickey's

946
00:49:51.280 --> 00:49:51.760
<v Speaker 4>through line.

947
00:49:51.840 --> 00:49:54.719
<v Speaker 2>Okay, well the stakes of Mickey's through line, but also

948
00:49:54.880 --> 00:50:00.719
<v Speaker 2>the difference between seventeen and eighteen right, because Mickey the

949
00:50:00.760 --> 00:50:04.880
<v Speaker 2>first one was more of a seventeen Right. He's kind

950
00:50:04.880 --> 00:50:08.960
<v Speaker 2>of a dufist, dumb dumb, and he was being taken

951
00:50:09.159 --> 00:50:11.840
<v Speaker 2>advantage of, right, Sadzak dumb dumb. He was being taken

952
00:50:11.840 --> 00:50:16.360
<v Speaker 2>advantage of as a non clone, right, and that is

953
00:50:17.239 --> 00:50:19.320
<v Speaker 2>that's ultimately what happened. Look at this, Look at this

954
00:50:19.400 --> 00:50:21.880
<v Speaker 2>class argument, where you have this guy who's just a

955
00:50:21.880 --> 00:50:24.840
<v Speaker 2>little bit sharper and was able to manipulate his way

956
00:50:24.840 --> 00:50:29.679
<v Speaker 2>into becoming a pilot and not a great one, while

957
00:50:29.920 --> 00:50:33.079
<v Speaker 2>Mickey had no choice and ended up, you know, essentially

958
00:50:33.079 --> 00:50:33.760
<v Speaker 2>in stowage.

959
00:50:34.239 --> 00:50:37.440
<v Speaker 4>Their relationship reminded me of Pillboy and Jason from The

960
00:50:37.440 --> 00:50:37.920
<v Speaker 4>Good Place.

961
00:50:38.679 --> 00:50:40.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, who's pill Boy?

962
00:50:41.000 --> 00:50:43.559
<v Speaker 4>It's his buddy back home that like leads him down

963
00:50:43.559 --> 00:50:44.760
<v Speaker 4>all these crazy ideas.

964
00:50:44.880 --> 00:50:47.159
<v Speaker 1>Okay, yeah, got it.

965
00:50:47.199 --> 00:50:51.280
<v Speaker 2>Didn't he end up being his dad anyway something like that. Yeah, yeah,

966
00:50:51.320 --> 00:50:54.599
<v Speaker 2>it's very confusing. But but that's a really good point.

967
00:50:54.599 --> 00:50:57.760
<v Speaker 2>But I don't think I think that the relationship between

968
00:50:57.880 --> 00:51:01.119
<v Speaker 2>characters like that. I don't know that Stephen really captured

969
00:51:01.679 --> 00:51:04.440
<v Speaker 2>the depth of that what that relationship could have been.

970
00:51:04.760 --> 00:51:06.920
<v Speaker 2>And I found myself a little bit heartbroken for it.

971
00:51:07.000 --> 00:51:10.679
<v Speaker 2>I thought that they were giving us that prologue as

972
00:51:10.719 --> 00:51:13.599
<v Speaker 2>a way to set up how these buddies, you know,

973
00:51:13.800 --> 00:51:18.519
<v Speaker 2>grow together and and you know, hell they their relationship

974
00:51:18.519 --> 00:51:21.760
<v Speaker 2>falls apart. Fine, but there was just no substance to

975
00:51:21.840 --> 00:51:25.360
<v Speaker 2>the character of Timouh in the story. And I think

976
00:51:25.360 --> 00:51:27.840
<v Speaker 2>you're right, I could I could have tossed.

977
00:51:27.679 --> 00:51:30.440
<v Speaker 1>Even later, it's just brought back up again that these

978
00:51:30.480 --> 00:51:33.039
<v Speaker 1>people are trying to kill him. It's like that was

979
00:51:33.119 --> 00:51:35.039
<v Speaker 1>that's like the only thing that we keep getting with

980
00:51:35.119 --> 00:51:36.480
<v Speaker 1>him is like, now they're going to kill me, you

981
00:51:36.480 --> 00:51:38.360
<v Speaker 1>got to help me, and it's like we're back in

982
00:51:38.400 --> 00:51:40.559
<v Speaker 1>the same story that we had with him before. It

983
00:51:40.639 --> 00:51:45.840
<v Speaker 1>was just it was, yeah, frustrating character that I wish

984
00:51:45.920 --> 00:51:47.519
<v Speaker 1>that they had done more with.

985
00:51:48.119 --> 00:51:52.119
<v Speaker 2>Right well, and a frustrated character that like it's not

986
00:51:52.239 --> 00:51:55.000
<v Speaker 2>like I wanted Requiem for a Dream, but like, I

987
00:51:55.440 --> 00:51:57.519
<v Speaker 2>do feel like there's a little bit of room to

988
00:51:57.639 --> 00:52:00.920
<v Speaker 2>explore this whole drug situation. If you're going to put

989
00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:04.079
<v Speaker 2>the drug situation in play, you got to tell me

990
00:52:04.119 --> 00:52:06.639
<v Speaker 2>a little bit more about it. And again, that's just

991
00:52:06.679 --> 00:52:09.639
<v Speaker 2>a lane that they that they put in here and

992
00:52:09.719 --> 00:52:13.800
<v Speaker 2>just did not pave. That metaphor is really Maank dividends.

993
00:52:14.000 --> 00:52:18.719
<v Speaker 3>She liked the actress that played Nasha, and I liked

994
00:52:18.760 --> 00:52:21.960
<v Speaker 3>the character of Nasha. I don't like being said, And

995
00:52:22.000 --> 00:52:24.079
<v Speaker 3>then she decided to run against the government.

996
00:52:23.719 --> 00:52:26.920
<v Speaker 1>And she just won. Like do people like her? Does

997
00:52:26.960 --> 00:52:29.199
<v Speaker 1>she have any agency? What is she? I know what

998
00:52:29.280 --> 00:52:29.679
<v Speaker 1>she does?

999
00:52:29.760 --> 00:52:32.079
<v Speaker 3>She was an enforcer, but like all of a sudden,

1000
00:52:32.119 --> 00:52:35.320
<v Speaker 3>she's wearing the robes and is talking and she's in

1001
00:52:35.400 --> 00:52:38.079
<v Speaker 3>charge of everything, and we're just told that. We're just

1002
00:52:38.159 --> 00:52:41.760
<v Speaker 3>keep being told things. This is what happened next, and

1003
00:52:42.119 --> 00:52:44.719
<v Speaker 3>it's because she remember when she got in that tube.

1004
00:52:45.079 --> 00:52:46.760
<v Speaker 1>I forgot to tell you that the first time, but

1005
00:52:46.760 --> 00:52:48.280
<v Speaker 1>then later I told you she got the due that,

1006
00:52:48.360 --> 00:52:49.920
<v Speaker 1>so therefore we should elect her.

1007
00:52:49.960 --> 00:52:53.400
<v Speaker 4>I don't know that poor things. I mean, that's the

1008
00:52:53.440 --> 00:52:56.119
<v Speaker 4>thing where it's like, oh, there's just some wild developments

1009
00:52:56.119 --> 00:52:59.440
<v Speaker 4>that have happened. So now rejoining our broadcast, we're now

1010
00:52:59.480 --> 00:53:01.239
<v Speaker 4>in France, you know, like this kind of thing. So

1011
00:53:01.559 --> 00:53:03.239
<v Speaker 4>that's what reminded me of that, and so it can

1012
00:53:03.280 --> 00:53:04.760
<v Speaker 4>bother me. But I understand why it would.

1013
00:53:05.719 --> 00:53:09.159
<v Speaker 1>I wonder if the book had the was I don't know,

1014
00:53:09.280 --> 00:53:11.599
<v Speaker 1>just some'm curious now, like was it first person? Is

1015
00:53:11.599 --> 00:53:14.880
<v Speaker 1>that why this story needed such narration in it? Because

1016
00:53:14.880 --> 00:53:17.039
<v Speaker 1>I can't help but feel like they could have been

1017
00:53:17.199 --> 00:53:19.880
<v Speaker 1>found a way to tell the story without narrating it

1018
00:53:19.920 --> 00:53:22.199
<v Speaker 1>from beginning to end, where we could have had those

1019
00:53:22.280 --> 00:53:25.400
<v Speaker 1>character moments that would have actually given us some more information,

1020
00:53:25.719 --> 00:53:31.280
<v Speaker 1>like finding more out about Nasha and her her fact

1021
00:53:31.280 --> 00:53:33.280
<v Speaker 1>that people really liked her so much that you know,

1022
00:53:33.360 --> 00:53:35.559
<v Speaker 1>I mean, things that could have really helped the story out.

1023
00:53:36.039 --> 00:53:38.199
<v Speaker 2>I agree with that. I want to read the book now.

1024
00:53:38.559 --> 00:53:40.360
<v Speaker 2>If it's not the book that I want it to be,

1025
00:53:40.519 --> 00:53:43.119
<v Speaker 2>I feel like I need to write it. Holy cow,

1026
00:53:43.800 --> 00:53:44.599
<v Speaker 2>you're right eight.

1027
00:53:45.079 --> 00:53:48.159
<v Speaker 4>I think he could just eliminate the narration and it

1028
00:53:48.239 --> 00:53:49.960
<v Speaker 4>might be even a more interesting movie.

1029
00:53:50.360 --> 00:53:53.880
<v Speaker 2>What's so fascinating about that? About Naomi's character, Naomi Aki,

1030
00:53:54.800 --> 00:53:57.880
<v Speaker 2>Nasha's character at the end becoming the robed one, I didn't.

1031
00:53:57.920 --> 00:53:59.679
<v Speaker 2>I never felt like she was set up to become

1032
00:53:59.679 --> 00:54:02.199
<v Speaker 2>the power politician. And yet they did have a character

1033
00:54:02.280 --> 00:54:04.519
<v Speaker 2>that was sort of set up to become the politician,

1034
00:54:04.920 --> 00:54:08.880
<v Speaker 2>which was Dorothy, the science person who kept rescuing and

1035
00:54:09.559 --> 00:54:14.719
<v Speaker 2>like she kept taking tiny actions that add up to activism,

1036
00:54:14.960 --> 00:54:18.639
<v Speaker 2>and I felt like that would have been more believable that.

1037
00:54:18.599 --> 00:54:22.280
<v Speaker 1>She becomes she and Mickey people in the whole place one.

1038
00:54:22.199 --> 00:54:24.400
<v Speaker 2>Hundred percent, And I feel like that's just a whiff.

1039
00:54:24.440 --> 00:54:25.719
<v Speaker 2>It's a missed opportunity.

1040
00:54:26.119 --> 00:54:28.960
<v Speaker 4>Or even the like operatives that were on the science team, right,

1041
00:54:29.039 --> 00:54:31.840
<v Speaker 4>like the Asian doctor that was behind the science team,

1042
00:54:31.880 --> 00:54:36.199
<v Speaker 4>like leading the resistance, Like there were potentially better characters

1043
00:54:36.199 --> 00:54:38.039
<v Speaker 4>to choose for that development.

1044
00:54:38.320 --> 00:54:40.559
<v Speaker 2>And would have supported the metaphor better right that that

1045
00:54:40.760 --> 00:54:45.679
<v Speaker 2>science becomes, you know, lauded as leadership versus essentially a

1046
00:54:45.679 --> 00:54:47.639
<v Speaker 2>military a member of the military.

1047
00:54:48.079 --> 00:54:53.119
<v Speaker 4>Well, maybe that's the point, even with science making this

1048
00:54:53.239 --> 00:54:56.639
<v Speaker 4>huge stand that military or strength is still the leadership

1049
00:54:56.679 --> 00:54:57.599
<v Speaker 4>as we move forward.

1050
00:54:58.159 --> 00:55:01.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you're exactly right, they're right. I don't like that.

1051
00:55:01.559 --> 00:55:02.280
<v Speaker 4>I don't want to be ready.

1052
00:55:02.400 --> 00:55:04.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't like it either, Right, give me something.

1053
00:55:04.960 --> 00:55:07.519
<v Speaker 1>That's a great point, though, And I would like to

1054
00:55:07.559 --> 00:55:10.519
<v Speaker 1>have seen them like do something with that.

1055
00:55:10.679 --> 00:55:17.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, I would like that have been surprised, all right,

1056
00:55:18.440 --> 00:55:20.280
<v Speaker 2>there were no creepers.

1057
00:55:20.760 --> 00:55:22.679
<v Speaker 4>Really, what would they have done instead?

1058
00:55:23.159 --> 00:55:26.280
<v Speaker 1>The creepers took so much time and effort that later,

1059
00:55:26.400 --> 00:55:28.760
<v Speaker 1>when it's like six months later or whatever, that they

1060
00:55:28.800 --> 00:55:31.760
<v Speaker 1>seem more set up and Nache is in charge, they're

1061
00:55:31.760 --> 00:55:34.519
<v Speaker 1>still just outside on this big snow field.

1062
00:55:34.599 --> 00:55:36.760
<v Speaker 3>Like I don't get the feeling of like are they

1063
00:55:36.800 --> 00:55:39.000
<v Speaker 3>still just living on the ship, Like it just wasn't

1064
00:55:39.000 --> 00:55:39.400
<v Speaker 3>that clear.

1065
00:55:39.440 --> 00:55:41.239
<v Speaker 1>I think there was like a now in development sign

1066
00:55:41.360 --> 00:55:43.559
<v Speaker 1>behind her or something. There's more to do.

1067
00:55:44.960 --> 00:55:47.480
<v Speaker 4>For me, the creepers were just a physical manifestation of

1068
00:55:47.519 --> 00:55:51.239
<v Speaker 4>fear in general, right, Like we fear what we don't

1069
00:55:51.280 --> 00:55:53.519
<v Speaker 4>know about these places that we are going, and so

1070
00:55:53.599 --> 00:55:56.039
<v Speaker 4>they created that. I don't disagree with you, Tommy. I

1071
00:55:56.039 --> 00:55:58.400
<v Speaker 4>think I think potentially you could have done a more

1072
00:55:58.480 --> 00:56:01.960
<v Speaker 4>artful way of manifesting fear that didn't have to do

1073
00:56:02.079 --> 00:56:05.199
<v Speaker 4>with these these things, but this was This made it

1074
00:56:05.239 --> 00:56:07.559
<v Speaker 4>tangible and probably made it a little bit more simple

1075
00:56:07.639 --> 00:56:09.480
<v Speaker 4>to be able to say, Okay, I'm afraid of this thing.

1076
00:56:09.519 --> 00:56:12.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to kill this thing. Yeah. So interesting though,

1077
00:56:12.440 --> 00:56:14.559
<v Speaker 2>when you look at the rest of the lanes leftover,

1078
00:56:14.679 --> 00:56:17.280
<v Speaker 2>I think the movie it ends up being sort of

1079
00:56:17.360 --> 00:56:21.320
<v Speaker 2>an avatar unobtainingum kind of a story, And what it

1080
00:56:21.400 --> 00:56:27.480
<v Speaker 2>could have been is a, Hey, we're leaving the civilization

1081
00:56:27.559 --> 00:56:30.440
<v Speaker 2>as we know it to create something new. But actually

1082
00:56:31.119 --> 00:56:33.400
<v Speaker 2>all we're doing is bringing with us all of the

1083
00:56:33.400 --> 00:56:37.199
<v Speaker 2>problems that we had because those things are inescapable. And

1084
00:56:37.400 --> 00:56:41.000
<v Speaker 2>that's the that's like the cycle of despair that the

1085
00:56:41.039 --> 00:56:43.840
<v Speaker 2>movie gets to explore is look, oh there's drugs, and

1086
00:56:43.880 --> 00:56:47.159
<v Speaker 2>there's sex, and there's betrayal, and there's rebellion and all

1087
00:56:47.199 --> 00:56:49.159
<v Speaker 2>the stuff we can't get away from. Whether you're a

1088
00:56:49.239 --> 00:56:53.800
<v Speaker 2>church or or you know, or a military government, whatever,

1089
00:56:54.800 --> 00:56:57.280
<v Speaker 2>you can't get away from it. And how do we

1090
00:56:57.519 --> 00:57:01.880
<v Speaker 2>move forward? That's the central question that I think might

1091
00:57:01.960 --> 00:57:03.960
<v Speaker 2>have been answered in a movie with no creepers.

1092
00:57:04.400 --> 00:57:04.840
<v Speaker 4>I love it.

1093
00:57:04.880 --> 00:57:06.239
<v Speaker 2>I'd watched that movie. I'd watch the hell.

1094
00:57:06.360 --> 00:57:09.599
<v Speaker 1>I'd watched that movie too. Yeah, it becomes any of

1095
00:57:09.639 --> 00:57:14.599
<v Speaker 1>these science fiction movies where we are a defending species

1096
00:57:14.599 --> 00:57:17.840
<v Speaker 1>on Earth because some invading alien has come to take

1097
00:57:17.880 --> 00:57:21.239
<v Speaker 1>over our planet because they've destroyed all of their own

1098
00:57:21.280 --> 00:57:23.800
<v Speaker 1>planets and so they're coming to take all of our resources.

1099
00:57:24.159 --> 00:57:26.880
<v Speaker 1>That's exactly the story. But now we're that alien coming

1100
00:57:26.920 --> 00:57:28.440
<v Speaker 1>in to destroy the planet.

1101
00:57:28.559 --> 00:57:34.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeastically, any love for Jung Jail's score or of course

1102
00:57:34.480 --> 00:57:36.320
<v Speaker 2>Darius Kanji behind the camera.

1103
00:57:36.679 --> 00:57:39.159
<v Speaker 4>I really enjoyed the camera again focusing on the first

1104
00:57:39.159 --> 00:57:42.800
<v Speaker 4>half of the movie when we were and this maybe

1105
00:57:42.880 --> 00:57:44.440
<v Speaker 4>is a positive towards the narration, so I don't know

1106
00:57:44.440 --> 00:57:45.840
<v Speaker 4>how much I want to lean into it, but when

1107
00:57:45.880 --> 00:57:49.960
<v Speaker 4>we were experiencing the world as Mickey was, the camera

1108
00:57:50.000 --> 00:57:53.800
<v Speaker 4>did a great job of shifting and making us feel

1109
00:57:53.840 --> 00:57:57.800
<v Speaker 4>sort of isolated. What I'm thinking about, in particular is

1110
00:57:57.880 --> 00:58:00.559
<v Speaker 4>when he's in the ice cave and he's looking around

1111
00:58:00.599 --> 00:58:03.920
<v Speaker 4>and trying to understand what has happened to him and

1112
00:58:03.960 --> 00:58:06.880
<v Speaker 4>what is about to happen, and the camera is what

1113
00:58:07.000 --> 00:58:09.000
<v Speaker 4>leads us that way. So it's this sort of first

1114
00:58:09.000 --> 00:58:12.760
<v Speaker 4>person perspective that's done in a very interesting way that

1115
00:58:13.519 --> 00:58:16.199
<v Speaker 4>I really liked. And I'm not usually a first person

1116
00:58:16.320 --> 00:58:19.519
<v Speaker 4>perspective kind of advocate, but in this movie, I think

1117
00:58:19.559 --> 00:58:21.679
<v Speaker 4>it worked really well because of how little we knew

1118
00:58:21.719 --> 00:58:24.239
<v Speaker 4>at that point in the story, and they were very

1119
00:58:24.360 --> 00:58:26.920
<v Speaker 4>creative and interesting choices. So I'll just say that about

1120
00:58:26.920 --> 00:58:27.320
<v Speaker 4>the camera.

1121
00:58:28.320 --> 00:58:30.440
<v Speaker 3>Pretty late in the film, it's when they're all in

1122
00:58:30.480 --> 00:58:36.639
<v Speaker 3>their little individual prison boxes and she tells Mickey, wait,

1123
00:58:36.719 --> 00:58:39.519
<v Speaker 3>the aliens they were helping you. They were kicking you

1124
00:58:39.599 --> 00:58:42.440
<v Speaker 3>out of their cave. The movie treated that like a

1125
00:58:42.519 --> 00:58:47.480
<v Speaker 3>really big revelation. That was not a revelation. No, like

1126
00:58:47.760 --> 00:58:51.119
<v Speaker 3>did the movie think that we were all like, oh no,

1127
00:58:51.159 --> 00:58:53.079
<v Speaker 3>we were all like, you idiot, they're helping you? Because

1128
00:58:53.079 --> 00:58:56.199
<v Speaker 3>he was like, Herry, Jerks, what does my meet smell bad?

1129
00:58:56.480 --> 00:58:58.519
<v Speaker 3>I thought the joke was he's so dumb he doesn't

1130
00:58:58.519 --> 00:59:00.440
<v Speaker 3>know that they're helping him, and the.

1131
00:59:00.599 --> 00:59:02.360
<v Speaker 2>Joke was over. Should have been over.

1132
00:59:02.599 --> 00:59:04.760
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, But then that was like a real I always

1133
00:59:04.920 --> 00:59:09.800
<v Speaker 3>get nervous when you're ahead of movies like that. Yeah yeah, right,

1134
00:59:09.880 --> 00:59:14.079
<v Speaker 3>right right, So that was just another extra grind apparently.

1135
00:59:16.320 --> 00:59:17.199
<v Speaker 2>A nothing.

1136
00:59:18.239 --> 00:59:21.199
<v Speaker 1>I just want to shout out the production design and

1137
00:59:21.519 --> 00:59:24.159
<v Speaker 1>costume design because I will say, while there was a

1138
00:59:24.199 --> 00:59:26.599
<v Speaker 1>lot that was frustrating. I really enjoyed the look of

1139
00:59:27.480 --> 00:59:31.159
<v Speaker 1>you know, Nifflheim itself wasn't great, but the ship, the earth,

1140
00:59:31.199 --> 00:59:34.320
<v Speaker 1>everything like I enjoyed, like the the queue that they

1141
00:59:34.360 --> 00:59:36.679
<v Speaker 1>had in that building that spiraled down when they were

1142
00:59:36.719 --> 00:59:39.719
<v Speaker 1>waiting in line, like some great moments like that. I

1143
00:59:39.760 --> 00:59:42.480
<v Speaker 1>loved the printer, like how it it would put them

1144
00:59:42.480 --> 00:59:44.960
<v Speaker 1>out and then kind of like to like in a

1145
00:59:44.960 --> 00:59:47.719
<v Speaker 1>little bit, is like old school printing, Like I just

1146
00:59:47.800 --> 00:59:50.719
<v Speaker 1>I loved so many of those little elements and touches

1147
00:59:50.760 --> 00:59:53.000
<v Speaker 1>that really were kind of throughout it. So I mean, yeah,

1148
00:59:53.000 --> 00:59:55.840
<v Speaker 1>there was a lot of really interesting things that that

1149
00:59:56.000 --> 00:59:59.079
<v Speaker 1>made this world feel real to me. I bought into

1150
00:59:59.119 --> 01:00:01.800
<v Speaker 1>the space, even if it was one that I found frustrating.

1151
01:00:02.440 --> 01:00:05.599
<v Speaker 2>It seems a little unfair because we didn't actually like

1152
01:00:05.679 --> 01:00:09.239
<v Speaker 2>them to completely dismiss the creatures. So I do want

1153
01:00:09.280 --> 01:00:11.400
<v Speaker 2>to say, if we take the creatures out of this

1154
01:00:11.519 --> 01:00:14.480
<v Speaker 2>movie but put them in another movie, there are some

1155
01:00:14.599 --> 01:00:17.679
<v Speaker 2>cool things about the creature design. Like I actually thought

1156
01:00:17.719 --> 01:00:21.920
<v Speaker 2>the creatures were cool creatures, and I really enjoyed the

1157
01:00:22.440 --> 01:00:26.079
<v Speaker 2>way their behavior was portrayed, that sort of we grow

1158
01:00:26.159 --> 01:00:32.000
<v Speaker 2>from puppy to wooly mammoth kind of energy and their

1159
01:00:32.199 --> 01:00:35.559
<v Speaker 2>defensive mechanism of swirling on top of the big one.

1160
01:00:36.280 --> 01:00:41.599
<v Speaker 2>I thought that was just generally very cool. So insofar

1161
01:00:41.639 --> 01:00:43.920
<v Speaker 2>as I don't think they should have even been in

1162
01:00:43.960 --> 01:00:46.119
<v Speaker 2>the movie since they are, they looked good.

1163
01:00:46.719 --> 01:00:50.039
<v Speaker 1>Sure, Yeah, I loved the creatures, like everything about them,

1164
01:00:50.079 --> 01:00:52.960
<v Speaker 1>the way that they their tongue would like they'd ulate

1165
01:00:53.000 --> 01:00:55.000
<v Speaker 1>when they were howling, and everything like. There was some

1166
01:00:55.000 --> 01:01:00.280
<v Speaker 1>pretty fantastic designs with the creatures in the film, even

1167
01:01:00.280 --> 01:01:06.480
<v Speaker 1>if they like you said, all.

1168
01:01:06.440 --> 01:01:11.679
<v Speaker 2>Right, let us then turn our attention to this message

1169
01:01:12.079 --> 01:01:16.880
<v Speaker 2>from our sponsor. Are you tired of being an expendable

1170
01:01:16.920 --> 01:01:20.199
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1171
01:01:20.320 --> 01:01:24.159
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1172
01:01:24.239 --> 01:01:28.880
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1173
01:01:28.920 --> 01:01:33.800
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1174
01:01:34.519 --> 01:01:38.039
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1175
01:01:38.119 --> 01:01:41.880
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1176
01:01:41.920 --> 01:01:46.440
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1177
01:01:46.519 --> 01:01:50.880
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1178
01:01:50.880 --> 01:01:54.039
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1179
01:01:54.079 --> 01:01:57.519
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1180
01:01:58.000 --> 01:02:02.960
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1181
01:02:03.039 --> 01:02:06.159
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1182
01:02:06.159 --> 01:02:09.320
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1183
01:02:09.320 --> 01:02:12.519
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1184
01:02:12.599 --> 01:02:16.800
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1185
01:02:17.679 --> 01:02:20.360
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1186
01:02:20.400 --> 01:02:23.480
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1187
01:02:23.519 --> 01:02:27.320
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1188
01:02:27.360 --> 01:02:31.920
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1189
01:02:32.000 --> 01:02:37.000
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1190
01:02:37.079 --> 01:02:40.559
<v Speaker 2>today at true story fm slash Join and become part

1191
01:02:40.559 --> 01:02:43.840
<v Speaker 2>of the next real collective consciousness. Can't member editions of

1192
01:02:43.880 --> 01:02:47.360
<v Speaker 2>the next reel movies. We like CinemaScope and sitting in

1193
01:02:47.400 --> 01:02:52.599
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1194
01:02:52.920 --> 01:02:56.639
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1195
01:02:56.679 --> 01:03:01.159
<v Speaker 2>repeatedly to get better. Join today true story dot fm

1196
01:03:01.360 --> 01:03:10.800
<v Speaker 2>slash join. Okay, it's time we need to abortion our

1197
01:03:10.840 --> 01:03:14.440
<v Speaker 2>stars and hearts, and I'm very excited to see this

1198
01:03:14.559 --> 01:03:17.840
<v Speaker 2>letterbox dot com slash the next reel. That's where we

1199
01:03:17.840 --> 01:03:21.199
<v Speaker 2>put our reviews and share our love of movies. What

1200
01:03:21.360 --> 01:03:23.639
<v Speaker 2>or where are you going to take your stars and

1201
01:03:24.760 --> 01:03:29.239
<v Speaker 2>put them? For this movie? JJ as the possibly the

1202
01:03:29.239 --> 01:03:32.079
<v Speaker 2>most enthusiastic of us, Why don't you kick us off?

1203
01:03:32.519 --> 01:03:32.679
<v Speaker 1>Well?

1204
01:03:32.719 --> 01:03:35.320
<v Speaker 4>I did start coming to the show today with the

1205
01:03:35.320 --> 01:03:38.000
<v Speaker 4>four and a half stars because of everything that I

1206
01:03:38.000 --> 01:03:39.639
<v Speaker 4>talked about from the first half of this movie. And

1207
01:03:39.960 --> 01:03:42.320
<v Speaker 4>I think I realized really in talking to you guys,

1208
01:03:42.320 --> 01:03:44.760
<v Speaker 4>that a lot of that is about potential, and that

1209
01:03:45.199 --> 01:03:50.000
<v Speaker 4>much of the weirdness that ensued after into the second

1210
01:03:50.039 --> 01:03:55.400
<v Speaker 4>half of the film is it requires some analysis as well.

1211
01:03:55.440 --> 01:03:57.400
<v Speaker 4>So I went back down to four stars. I still

1212
01:03:57.519 --> 01:04:00.559
<v Speaker 4>think conceptually and I keep bringing it back to four things.

1213
01:04:00.639 --> 01:04:04.360
<v Speaker 4>I love snow Piercer, I love the things that ban

1214
01:04:04.440 --> 01:04:06.760
<v Speaker 4>Jinhoe is doing. I love the Yorgus Lanthemos, the fact

1215
01:04:06.760 --> 01:04:09.400
<v Speaker 4>that this harkened to that to me, it's in that

1216
01:04:09.519 --> 01:04:12.239
<v Speaker 4>category of movies that I really like. So I want

1217
01:04:12.239 --> 01:04:14.639
<v Speaker 4>to still give it four stars, and I do give

1218
01:04:14.679 --> 01:04:16.800
<v Speaker 4>it a heart as well, because I enjoyed so much

1219
01:04:16.800 --> 01:04:18.519
<v Speaker 4>of the creativity and the approach.

1220
01:04:19.920 --> 01:04:20.320
<v Speaker 2>Awesome.

1221
01:04:20.760 --> 01:04:26.400
<v Speaker 3>Thomas me, Yeah, I think probably if I were to

1222
01:04:26.599 --> 01:04:27.280
<v Speaker 3>quantify it.

1223
01:04:27.320 --> 01:04:30.079
<v Speaker 1>And I didn't realize it at the time until this conversation,

1224
01:04:30.199 --> 01:04:32.360
<v Speaker 1>but I think I really loved half of this movie.

1225
01:04:33.119 --> 01:04:35.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah overall, And so I'm going to give it right

1226
01:04:36.000 --> 01:04:38.519
<v Speaker 3>down the middle three stars but a heart because I'm

1227
01:04:38.519 --> 01:04:40.519
<v Speaker 3>really glad that it exists.

1228
01:04:41.000 --> 01:04:42.239
<v Speaker 1>I like swings like this.

1229
01:04:42.320 --> 01:04:45.079
<v Speaker 3>I'll always be more interested in new stuff versus IP

1230
01:04:45.360 --> 01:04:49.239
<v Speaker 3>and so I am really happy for it. I'm glad

1231
01:04:49.280 --> 01:04:53.440
<v Speaker 3>that Robert Pattinson continues to make such interesting choices of

1232
01:04:53.440 --> 01:04:56.599
<v Speaker 3>which directors to work with. And so yeah, I'll give

1233
01:04:56.599 --> 01:04:58.559
<v Speaker 3>it right down the middle, three but a heart. So

1234
01:04:58.639 --> 01:05:00.119
<v Speaker 3>it's like three plus.

1235
01:05:00.000 --> 01:05:01.840
<v Speaker 2>All right, Andy, there's a lot of good will in

1236
01:05:01.880 --> 01:05:03.079
<v Speaker 2>the room. What are you gonna do?

1237
01:05:04.599 --> 01:05:07.199
<v Speaker 1>Well, Unlike Tommy, I'm literally gonna go right down the

1238
01:05:07.199 --> 01:05:09.400
<v Speaker 1>middle and do two and a half.

1239
01:05:09.960 --> 01:05:18.800
<v Speaker 3>Oh oh, that sucks. I'm going to keep it with

1240
01:05:18.840 --> 01:05:23.920
<v Speaker 3>a three, but I'm giving myself two point five. I

1241
01:05:24.079 --> 01:05:26.800
<v Speaker 3>you know, everything Tommy said is where I am like.

1242
01:05:26.840 --> 01:05:29.679
<v Speaker 3>It was so frustrating of a watch. It was, it

1243
01:05:29.719 --> 01:05:33.679
<v Speaker 3>was too long, but I loved the ideas that they

1244
01:05:33.679 --> 01:05:38.639
<v Speaker 3>were playing with. I just wish that they actually landed

1245
01:05:38.840 --> 01:05:40.800
<v Speaker 3>with any of them. And I just don't feel like

1246
01:05:40.840 --> 01:05:43.719
<v Speaker 3>they did, as it was a very frustrating watch for me,

1247
01:05:45.039 --> 01:05:47.719
<v Speaker 3>like you know, like oak Jaw and you know for

1248
01:05:47.760 --> 01:05:51.920
<v Speaker 3>me snow Piercer I think probably works the best of

1249
01:05:52.000 --> 01:05:55.639
<v Speaker 3>the of the Bong June Ho of the English language

1250
01:05:55.639 --> 01:05:59.239
<v Speaker 3>films that he's done. I don't think even with Tilda

1251
01:05:59.280 --> 01:06:03.360
<v Speaker 3>Swinton's character, I don't think it ever felt as silly

1252
01:06:03.400 --> 01:06:04.159
<v Speaker 3>as this one did.

1253
01:06:04.440 --> 01:06:06.719
<v Speaker 1>So I struggled with a lot, but I do still

1254
01:06:07.559 --> 01:06:11.280
<v Speaker 1>I I enjoy watching bongh june Hoe and what he's doing,

1255
01:06:11.320 --> 01:06:13.480
<v Speaker 1>and so I'll still give it a heart. So two

1256
01:06:13.480 --> 01:06:14.960
<v Speaker 1>and a half, but with a heart.

1257
01:06:15.079 --> 01:06:19.199
<v Speaker 2>That is more enthusiasm than I expected. I'm really pleased

1258
01:06:19.800 --> 01:06:22.239
<v Speaker 2>to hear that, Andy, I am right in there with

1259
01:06:23.360 --> 01:06:25.320
<v Speaker 2>with Tommy. I am three stars and a heart. I

1260
01:06:25.400 --> 01:06:29.199
<v Speaker 2>really I love yeah right in the middle, right smack

1261
01:06:29.239 --> 01:06:33.159
<v Speaker 2>in the middle and three stars and a heart. I

1262
01:06:33.239 --> 01:06:36.960
<v Speaker 2>feel like there there are too many allusions to so

1263
01:06:37.119 --> 01:06:40.639
<v Speaker 2>much of my other favorite kind of satire and and

1264
01:06:40.719 --> 01:06:43.599
<v Speaker 2>this this fits too well in the Terry Gilliam in

1265
01:06:43.639 --> 01:06:46.639
<v Speaker 2>the Luke Bason in the Armando Nucci for me not

1266
01:06:46.719 --> 01:06:49.639
<v Speaker 2>to at least, you know, give it, give it the

1267
01:06:49.719 --> 01:06:52.119
<v Speaker 2>credit that it's due for. Again, that swing, I think

1268
01:06:52.159 --> 01:06:54.880
<v Speaker 2>it's it's taking a big swing and I think it's fun.

1269
01:06:56.079 --> 01:06:59.079
<v Speaker 2>So that's it. We made a podcast about a movie

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01:06:59.119 --> 01:07:02.719
<v Speaker 2>that we marginally liked and are glad that it exists.

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01:07:02.719 --> 01:07:05.719
<v Speaker 2>Thank you everybody for hanging out with us. What are

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01:07:05.719 --> 01:07:10.800
<v Speaker 2>we gonna do next month? I we just decided it

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01:07:10.840 --> 01:07:18.119
<v Speaker 2>and I've already forgotten. So someone else has the sinners.

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01:07:18.239 --> 01:07:20.800
<v Speaker 3>You like blues music, you like old tiny cabins, you

1275
01:07:20.920 --> 01:07:22.920
<v Speaker 3>like vampires.

1276
01:07:24.039 --> 01:07:25.719
<v Speaker 1>It's like from us till done, but.

1277
01:07:26.960 --> 01:07:30.039
<v Speaker 2>You already know the twist, like like Ryan Coogler.

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01:07:30.119 --> 01:07:30.840
<v Speaker 4>Does that count?

1279
01:07:31.159 --> 01:07:33.440
<v Speaker 2>Yes? Okay, good? Yeah?

1280
01:07:33.800 --> 01:07:39.039
<v Speaker 1>I actually the trailer seems like Black Snake Moon with vampires.

1281
01:07:39.199 --> 01:07:40.519
<v Speaker 1>I love it a lot of trailer.

1282
01:07:40.639 --> 01:07:43.960
<v Speaker 2>So I'm excited for you. Me too, very excited for it.

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01:07:44.000 --> 01:07:48.119
<v Speaker 2>So that'll be our April film and we're excited to

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01:07:48.199 --> 01:07:53.400
<v Speaker 2>do that. Thank you uh Andy for coming back after this.

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01:07:55.239 --> 01:08:01.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm looking forward to the next m titled movie.

1286
01:08:03.000 --> 01:08:06.960
<v Speaker 2>And of course, JJ Tommy has always great to podcast

1287
01:08:06.960 --> 01:08:11.119
<v Speaker 2>with peoples. Thank you, dear listener, for your time and attention.

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01:08:11.199 --> 01:08:13.599
<v Speaker 2>Whether you agreed, disagreed, or just came here to shout

1289
01:08:13.599 --> 01:08:16.600
<v Speaker 2>at your phones, we appreciate you. If you had fun,

1290
01:08:16.640 --> 01:08:18.680
<v Speaker 2>don't forget to join the conversation on our discord at

1291
01:08:18.680 --> 01:08:21.880
<v Speaker 2>true story dot fm, slash Discord, and you know, as

1292
01:08:21.920 --> 01:08:24.960
<v Speaker 2>you heard from that old timey mystery guy. If you

1293
01:08:25.000 --> 01:08:26.720
<v Speaker 2>really love what we do, become a supporting member at

1294
01:08:26.720 --> 01:08:30.039
<v Speaker 2>true story dot fm, slash Join for all those exclusive

1295
01:08:30.560 --> 01:08:34.000
<v Speaker 2>perks whatever you do. Now, watch more movies, don't let

1296
01:08:34.079 --> 01:08:35.960
<v Speaker 2>them get you angry, and remember just because it has

1297
01:08:35.960 --> 01:08:38.439
<v Speaker 2>a post credit scene doesn't mean it's any good. Meeting

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01:08:39.119 --> 01:08:39.560
<v Speaker 2>a jerk