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<v Speaker 1>Talk Station.

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<v Speaker 2>Eight oh five on Tuesday. Regular listeners know to be

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<v Speaker 2>tuned in at this time. It's appointment listening because we

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<v Speaker 2>get the inside scoop. With bright Bart News joining us today,

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<v Speaker 2>Capitol Hill reporter Nick Gilbertson returns to talk about what

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<v Speaker 2>I've been mentioning all morning, the Pennsylvania vote counting, which

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<v Speaker 2>is in violation of the law. There, I just remind

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<v Speaker 2>my listeners, as I do with the outset of every

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<v Speaker 2>inside Scoop segment, Bright Bart Bookmarket, b R E I

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<v Speaker 2>T B A RT dot Com. Great reporting there and

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<v Speaker 2>of course, notably by Nick Gilbertson, the Capitol Hill Reporter.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome back.

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<v Speaker 2>Nick's great to have you on the fifty five Cadsey

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<v Speaker 2>Morning Show as always.

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<v Speaker 3>Hey, Brian, great to be here, Thanks for having me.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, I am a lawyer.

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<v Speaker 2>I continue I maintain my law license, although I have

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<v Speaker 2>not practiced. This is my eighteenth year in radio concluding it,

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<v Speaker 2>so I'm no longer an active practitioner of the law.

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<v Speaker 2>But I have a profound respect for the law. I

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<v Speaker 2>understand it. I understand the constitutional framework, the separation of

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<v Speaker 2>powers and the separate but equal branches of government, including

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<v Speaker 2>the Supreme court, and that's the federal level, but the

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<v Speaker 2>states are all set up the same way. Apparently the

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<v Speaker 2>people counting the votes in Pennsylvania, least in a couple

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<v Speaker 2>of counties, didn't get the memo. They actively and out

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<v Speaker 2>loud intentionally violated the law in trying and continuing to

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<v Speaker 2>count votes that did not qualify to be counted under

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<v Speaker 2>Pennsylvania law. This was mind blowing the defiance that came

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<v Speaker 2>out of one of these officials. It doesn't matter anymore,

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<v Speaker 2>this woman said. I think we all know that precedent

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<v Speaker 2>by a court doesn't matter in this country, and people

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<v Speaker 2>violate laws anytime they want. So for me, if I

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<v Speaker 2>violate the law, it's because I want a court to

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<v Speaker 2>pay attention to it, So say a commissioner, Elise Marzilla,

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<v Speaker 2>a woman named Ellis Margallia. I mean, I couldn't believe

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<v Speaker 2>my eyes when I was reading this. Well, what's your

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<v Speaker 2>response on all this, Nick, You've been following it?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Brian, I was absolutely shocked when I saw that

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<v Speaker 3>board meeting there in Bucks County last week. And yes,

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<v Speaker 3>it's mind you. This is the party, by the way,

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<v Speaker 3>that screamed about threats of democracy. You know, an election

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<v Speaker 3>integrity here for four years after twenty twenty and now

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<v Speaker 3>we have this going on. But yeah, this all comes

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<v Speaker 3>down to two really a couple types of ballots here

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<v Speaker 3>that we're getting talented in Bucks County and other counties

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<v Speaker 3>throughout the state in defiance of these Supreme Court rulings

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<v Speaker 3>from you know this year and President that was said

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<v Speaker 3>that decided, you know, these votes shouldn't count. So the

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<v Speaker 3>first type that are in question are these misdated ballots

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<v Speaker 3>and you know they're missing signatures, are misdated or undated ballots,

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<v Speaker 3>and the court had already ruled, you know that you

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<v Speaker 3>can't count these. There's no way to you know, verify

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<v Speaker 3>these in the state election law. There's really no wiggle

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<v Speaker 3>room right on this stuff. And you know, these people,

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<v Speaker 3>they go ahead last Tuesday ls mar there and her

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<v Speaker 3>fellow board member Robert Harvey Jr. They vote two to

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<v Speaker 3>one to count the votes even though there's an existing

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<v Speaker 3>Supreme Court order. Then on Thursday there's again there's two

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<v Speaker 3>types of ballots again that are in question. On provisional

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<v Speaker 3>ballots and whether you know, if they're they have to

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<v Speaker 3>be signed in two places, one on the affidavit and

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<v Speaker 3>one on the on the ballot or on the envelope itself.

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<v Speaker 3>If they're missing a sat nature in one of those

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<v Speaker 3>two places. The court ruled in September, you can't count them.

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<v Speaker 3>They cannot be counted. And again, these people knew this

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<v Speaker 3>on Thursday, their own legal council, the county solicitors, now,

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<v Speaker 3>we are advising you not to counties. And they're basically

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<v Speaker 3>making the same argument their Republican council was making. And

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<v Speaker 3>they go ahead and count them anyway. And she gives

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<v Speaker 3>that really extremely defiant statement that shows a lack of press,

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<v Speaker 3>lack of value for precedent and the rule of art

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<v Speaker 3>and interpretation of the law. So really interesting. And Bran,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm not sure if you saw this, but in the decision,

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<v Speaker 3>one of these justices they wrote and a com being

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<v Speaker 3>concurring statement to agree with the decision. And he specifically

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<v Speaker 3>went after these local elections.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Justice Justice Robson.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, Kevin Brobson. He goes, I want to quote disabuse

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<v Speaker 3>local election officials of the notion that they have the

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<v Speaker 3>authority to ignore election code provisions that they believe are

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<v Speaker 3>un constitutional. It's just one paragraph, but really straight to

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<v Speaker 3>the point. Yeah, you guys don't have this power.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, The follow up is almost even more comically. Indeed,

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<v Speaker 2>this court has held the administrative agencies like county boards

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<v Speaker 2>of elections lack the authority to declare unconstitutional the very

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<v Speaker 2>statutes from which they derive their existence and which they

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<v Speaker 2>are charged to enforce.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, you know that was a I may be

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<v Speaker 1>so bold, be slap.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean they were all over this, and the order

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<v Speaker 2>itself even has in capitalizations shall comply shall not be counted.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like, how hard over the head can you hit him?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah? I laughed out loud at that second part there,

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<v Speaker 3>the statutes from which they derived their existence. Yeah, no,

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<v Speaker 3>really really incredible stuff. And it's good to, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>see the Supreme Court coming in here and coming on this,

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<v Speaker 3>because of course this all ties into the tight Senate

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<v Speaker 3>race there between McCormick and Case. Obviously McCormick is won,

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<v Speaker 3>and Democrats are just looking for any way they can't

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<v Speaker 3>you know, overcome this, this these eighteen seventeen thousand votes

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<v Speaker 3>that McCormick leads by.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, it is awfully nice of the Governor of Pennsylvania

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<v Speaker 2>to back the Court and their their conclusions that they

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<v Speaker 2>had already reached previously in two separate cases. Democrat Governor

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<v Speaker 2>Josh Shapiro said, yeah, okay, we need to go ahead

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<v Speaker 2>and not count them. Well, thanks, buddy, appreciate you. You

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<v Speaker 2>following the law yours. It's it's nice support you've given

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<v Speaker 2>your own constitution.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, right, comes out of uh yeah, yeah put yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>Shapiro joining in it. Of course, it comes after the

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<v Speaker 3>court basically ruling right, he couldn't he couldn't Well, things

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<v Speaker 3>were kind of hanging limbo there. He couldn't come out

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<v Speaker 3>and advocate for their rule of law.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, well, if the county's own judicials are owned advocates,

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<v Speaker 2>their own lawyers already told them that they could not

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<v Speaker 2>count these votes. I would like to think that the

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<v Speaker 2>attorney general the state of Pennsylvania would have echoed the

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<v Speaker 2>same sentiments.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and well that's the most darring thing to me too,

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<v Speaker 3>is that that and the fact that these people were

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<v Speaker 3>warning her that we're going to get sued, You're going

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<v Speaker 3>to bring a lawsuit on the county that's going to

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<v Speaker 3>cost the taxpayers dollars, to the fact that their counsel

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<v Speaker 3>is literally advising against that, and you know, she's up

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<v Speaker 3>there kind of using the sport of elections as you know,

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<v Speaker 3>just however she wants to is just really staggering.

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<v Speaker 1>It is. Now someone had asked me this earlier.

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<v Speaker 2>And I don't know Pennsylvania very well or law very

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<v Speaker 2>well at all. I mean, only would I come across

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<v Speaker 2>in the news that makes these types of profound points

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<v Speaker 2>and very important national topics. But do you know by

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<v Speaker 2>any chance, Nick, and I don't want to put you

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<v Speaker 2>on the spot. If you don't know, just say so.

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<v Speaker 2>Can they be charged for violating the law and putting

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<v Speaker 2>the putting the taxpayers through this process? Because I pivot

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<v Speaker 2>over to Minnesota and there is a guy served as

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<v Speaker 2>the head election judge in Minnesota which has been charged

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<v Speaker 2>with two felony counts for letting eleven people vote even

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<v Speaker 2>though they were not registered to vote. Do you know

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<v Speaker 2>if there's a corollary provision that might hold these two

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<v Speaker 2>nut jobs accountable in Pennsylvania.

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<v Speaker 3>So I honestly, I don't know off the top of

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<v Speaker 3>my head, Brian, I'm not a lawyer, but I do know.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean, I was on a press call yesterday with

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<v Speaker 3>the rn T A R and C chairman Michael Michael

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<v Speaker 3>Wattley was very oudamant that you know, he said it's

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<v Speaker 3>a parrot quote. It is imperative that these officials who

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<v Speaker 3>are engaged in such conduct face serious consequences for their

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<v Speaker 3>brazen betrayal of the public trust. This is the kind

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<v Speaker 3>of conduct that undermines faith and elections. When election officials

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<v Speaker 3>pick and choose at the last minute which rules to

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<v Speaker 3>follow and which to ignore, it naturally leads voters to

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<v Speaker 3>lose trust in the process. End quote. So certainly, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>we we have the r n C calling for severe

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<v Speaker 3>consequences for the likes of Ellis mar Seglia and and

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<v Speaker 3>and and Harvey Junior, and you know, if this was

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<v Speaker 3>going on in other counties to these board members there.

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<v Speaker 3>But again, that's that's a little out of my.

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<v Speaker 2>Night's okay right now, Well, it's out of my league too.

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<v Speaker 2>I wasn't going to answer the question either. I hadn't

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<v Speaker 2>seen anything written on that. I just knew that there

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<v Speaker 2>was another article out there about this guy that has

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<v Speaker 2>been charged for these letting unregistered vote people to vote,

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<v Speaker 2>obviously in violated and violation of state law there. But

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<v Speaker 2>you know, it really boiled and I would argue that

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<v Speaker 2>it really just it surprises me that they would be

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<v Speaker 2>so bold as to utter statements like that out loud,

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<v Speaker 2>even if they held them dear in their heart. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>screw the law, it doesn't matter. I'm counting the votes.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, this shouldn't come down to a question of

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<v Speaker 2>whose ox is being gorg You know, Democrats shouldn't be

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<v Speaker 2>cheering that type of statement from a Democrat elected official,

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<v Speaker 2>because everyone, as you point out, is going to start

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<v Speaker 2>questioning the integrity the election. Well, if they feel that way,

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<v Speaker 2>if the Republicans are in charge of all, the Republican's

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<v Speaker 2>gonna be doing the same damn thing. Nobody should be

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<v Speaker 2>doing it, and everyone should be celebrating the SmackDown that

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<v Speaker 2>they got from both sides of the political ledger.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and that's that's the major problem too, is if

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<v Speaker 3>there's no uniform if everybody decides, every county board decides

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<v Speaker 3>to make up their own rules, not follow Supreme Court

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<v Speaker 3>precedents in the state and count ballots however they choose,

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<v Speaker 3>you really don't have a uniform st elections statewide, you

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<v Speaker 3>know what I mean, We're you're valuing ballots the exact

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<v Speaker 3>same way. And yeah, it's good. Good on everybody coming

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<v Speaker 3>out now and admonishing this this woman and you know,

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<v Speaker 3>the right and Republicans have been really shining a light

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<v Speaker 3>on this, and it's a I don't think this this

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<v Speaker 3>woman ever thought that that those words when she said them,

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<v Speaker 3>would turn into a national news story. But you know,

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<v Speaker 3>here here we are, and uh yeah, I think I

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<v Speaker 3>think it's a good lesson for you know, not she's

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<v Speaker 3>learning it the hard way, but it's a good lesson

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<v Speaker 3>for other you know, county county boards and these people

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<v Speaker 3>and at pretty much activists in these positions that you

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<v Speaker 3>can't get away with this.

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<v Speaker 1>You can't.

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<v Speaker 2>They can't, No one can. Republicans can't cheat, they can't

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<v Speaker 2>send in un you know, filled out ballots. They can't

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<v Speaker 2>go around and violate Pennsylvania, remember, Nick, And I'm sure

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<v Speaker 2>you can because it wasn't that long ago. We were

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<v Speaker 2>counting votes in the twenty twenty election during COVID, and

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<v Speaker 2>Pennsylvania was the most lawless state and union almost. They

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<v Speaker 2>were just shooting from the hip, changing laws that were

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<v Speaker 2>on the books already and ignoring them and extending here

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<v Speaker 2>and I mean, to me, it was just insanity. They

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<v Speaker 2>were creating on the fly new rules for voting while

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<v Speaker 2>the process was going on. You need legislative action and

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<v Speaker 2>a loss sign in or a bill signed in a

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<v Speaker 2>law by a governor to change the election laws. And

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<v Speaker 2>yet we all wat to kind of have a pass.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. No, yeah, twenty twenty, there's twenty twenty was you know,

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<v Speaker 3>it was so crazy with COVID and the mail in

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<v Speaker 3>ballot and how we kind of really changed the culture

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<v Speaker 3>of our election and moved that way. And yeah, it

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<v Speaker 3>was so disorganized that it was hard to make heads

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<v Speaker 3>and tails of what was going on in Pennsylvania four

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<v Speaker 3>years ago. And it's you know, this time around, I mean,

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<v Speaker 3>it's it's good to see how things are working out

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<v Speaker 3>in the court and the legal system playing out correctly

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<v Speaker 3>to this point anyway. But yeah, it's entirely hypocritical of

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<v Speaker 3>Democrats as a party to be engaged in this election denialism,

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<v Speaker 3>especially how everything they did after twenty twenty. They brought

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<v Speaker 3>two cases against the leading Republican presidential candidate months after

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<v Speaker 3>he announced had never been in any criminal trouble before,

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<v Speaker 3>and two of those cases were over his election challenges

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<v Speaker 3>in twenty twenty. Now, sentence, they're beyond Pennsylvania in Georgia

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<v Speaker 3>and other states, of course, but it just goes to

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<v Speaker 3>show just the hypocrisy here of Democrats and you know,

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<v Speaker 3>Dave mcgri Bob Casey's election denialism here in Pennsylvania's pretty striking.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean, I just want to contrast this with Mike Rodgers.

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<v Speaker 3>He was a Republican candidate in Michigan and he ran

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<v Speaker 3>a really close race with delicious luck and lost by

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<v Speaker 3>like nineteen twenty thousand votes. Last night I saw more

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<v Speaker 3>than ninety five percent was in. He conceded the moment

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<v Speaker 3>with the Associated Press called the race and he was real,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, humble and gracious in his defeat. And I

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<v Speaker 3>think that just illustrates a little difference here. That's that's

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<v Speaker 3>kind of going on here between the two parties that

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<v Speaker 3>you can see right now.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I guess she just did.

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<v Speaker 2>These two election officials just didn't get the memo, and

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<v Speaker 2>obviously they were hoping. I think the strategy was it

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<v Speaker 2>was only four hundred and five votes here would not

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<v Speaker 2>have changed the outcome of the election. I think they

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<v Speaker 2>were hoping if they gathered enough bits and pieces by

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<v Speaker 2>engaging in a violation of law in amongst various counties,

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<v Speaker 2>they could close the gap between the two candidates less

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<v Speaker 2>than point five percent. That would result in a recount,

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<v Speaker 2>during which time they could cheat again and maybe let

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<v Speaker 2>the Democrat win.

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<v Speaker 3>That's one seems to be the strategy to me. You know,

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<v Speaker 3>it's four hundred and five votes doesn't much if you're

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<v Speaker 3>talking one county, you know, but if you're talking all

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<v Speaker 3>sixty seven counties in Pennsylvania, a couple hundred votes here,

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<v Speaker 3>a couple hundred votes there, you know, get them through

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<v Speaker 3>and close the gap, get the recount. You know that

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<v Speaker 3>that seems to be certainly be the game plan to me.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's not just you know that those four hundred

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<v Speaker 3>and five misdated or or ballots missing or missing dates

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<v Speaker 3>altogether in Bucks County, and then there were another one

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<v Speaker 3>hundred and twenty five that had the signature issues. So

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<v Speaker 3>it's not just uh so it's as many ballots. It

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<v Speaker 3>looks like they're trying to get across the finish line here,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, in every as many counties as possible to

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<v Speaker 3>try and close that gap. That's one hundred percent right.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, Well, you know, take multiple bites at the apple,

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<v Speaker 2>even if the first bite settled the entire issue. Tell

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<v Speaker 2>you what I mean, Nick Gilbertson, it's been a real

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<v Speaker 2>pleasure having having back on the fifty five Caresey Morning Show.

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<v Speaker 2>He is the Capitol Hill Reporter, Bright Bart Bookmarket, Brightbart

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<v Speaker 2>dot Com or line on the information. They provide great

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<v Speaker 2>reporting every single day. Keep up the great work, Nick

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<v Speaker 2>and the entire crew at Bite Bart. Best of health

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<v Speaker 2>to all of you, and I'll look forward to another

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<v Speaker 2>inside scoop next Tuesday. The here on the fifty five

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<v Speaker 2>Kars Morning Show.

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<v Speaker 3>Hey, thanks for having me, Brian. Great to be here.

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<v Speaker 1>Always a pleasure. Nick.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a twenty right now stick around. We're going to

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<v Speaker 2>get a Daniel Davis deep dive and it is going

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<v Speaker 2>to be a good one because we're talking about Russia,

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<v Speaker 2>Ukraine and a little tidbit of information on that. Pewtin

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<v Speaker 2>just announced a revised nuclear doctrine just today saying that

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<v Speaker 2>any attack on Russian supported by a country with nuclear

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<v Speaker 2>power could be grounds for a nuclear response. We being

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<v Speaker 2>a nuclear power supporting a country that's not Ukraine, them

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<v Speaker 2>shooting into the depths of Russia now justifies in the

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<v Speaker 2>hearts and minds of Vladimir Putting and the people there,

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<v Speaker 2>a nuclear weapon response. Frightening stuff. Eight twenty one to

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<v Speaker 2>fifty five KRC Detalk Station he's coming up next to.

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<v Speaker 1>Stick around fifty five KRC.

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<v Speaker 2>The holidays mean more travel, more shopping, and more personal

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<v Speaker 2>info in more places that could expose you more