Speaker 1: You are listening to a Fonds Media Network production.
Speaker 2: Welcome to episode sixty one of World Ablaze. On this episode,
Speaker 2: I have Tamina Watson. Tamina Watson is the founder of
Speaker 2: Watson Immigration Law, where she has an expertise in investor
Speaker 2: business and family based immigration. She is a published author
Speaker 2: of multiple books and a strong advocate for immigration reform.
Speaker 2: We spend some time discussing the various work Jesus how
Speaker 2: they relate to a person's immigration status, as well as
Speaker 2: touched on some other immigration issues that relate to the
Speaker 2: United States and how that may affect immigrants around the world.
Speaker 2: I hope you find this conversation informative and I hope
Speaker 2: that it opens the door for having further conversations with you,
Speaker 2: your friends, and your family about this sensitive issue. Well, firstly,
Speaker 2: I thank you for being here or taking the time
Speaker 2: to be here. I know that you're busy. I was
Speaker 2: reading up a little bit on you and you're an
Speaker 2: published author, have another book coming out, Which is what's
Speaker 2: an achievement for I mean, just doing one is an achievement.
Speaker 2: But I mean which which number book is this? It's
Speaker 2: like number.
Speaker 1: Let's see six, sixty six or seven. Yeah, I mean Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, I love saying I've lost count I went
Speaker 1: to ninety two, like Deepak Chopra or something. How did
Speaker 1: get to ninety something? What are they doing that? I
Speaker 1: don't know how to do? So yeah, I'm working on it.
Speaker 1: But it's interesting. Every book has journey and life of
Speaker 1: its own, and this is at the early stages of
Speaker 1: its life.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's crazy. That's something I've never done, never achieved,
Speaker 2: And so hats off to you for that. And you
Speaker 2: specialize in immigration law, correct or did you practice any
Speaker 2: other types of law before then?
Speaker 1: I practice immigration US immigration law now for my entire
Speaker 1: career in the United States, But when I lived in London,
Speaker 1: I was born and raised in London, and I was
Speaker 1: a lawyer there. In my early days, I did criminal
Speaker 1: defense law, some amounts of civil law practice.
Speaker 2: Okay, So one of the reason I want to well,
Speaker 2: one of the bigger reasons I reached out to you
Speaker 2: is because one you're an authority on this. Two you
Speaker 2: are published, and you do have a law firm that
Speaker 2: specializes in this, namely immigration and immigration law. And with
Speaker 2: everything going on, I wanted a perspective from someone who's
Speaker 2: actually in it, who can actually interpret law and can
Speaker 2: explain what's really going on and what rights there are
Speaker 2: for those that are considered illegal or undocumented that are
Speaker 2: coming into our country. And from what I understand, there's
Speaker 2: always like there's a difference versus when they're on one
Speaker 2: side of the border and when they cross over. And
Speaker 2: of course there's the other situation where airports are kind
Speaker 2: of like Switzerland or neutral if they don't really have
Speaker 2: any borders, like they're not a country right until they
Speaker 2: actually cross over into the destination they're going to. So
Speaker 2: there's a lot of that, And I also want to
Speaker 2: get your opinion on how things are being handled by
Speaker 2: the administration. And we don't have to get too political
Speaker 2: per se, but I do want to get some better
Speaker 2: explanation of the laws, the rights and is the administration
Speaker 2: going about this the correct way. Because I have my opinions,
Speaker 2: I know other people have their opinions. Again, you know,
Speaker 2: I talk to like people in the intelligence community. I
Speaker 2: have other journalists I speak with, and not a lawyer
Speaker 2: though that specializes in this particular subject matter. So with
Speaker 2: that being said, I thought, hey, to me, and maybe
Speaker 2: you can help us with this, Maybe you can explain
Speaker 2: a little bit you know would.
Speaker 1: I would be honored. My question for you is who
Speaker 1: is your primary audience?
Speaker 2: Well, our audience is pretty much I don't know everyone
Speaker 2: whoever is willing to listen. To be quite honest, if
Speaker 2: we have worldwide audience, multiple countries, hundreds of thousands of downloads,
Speaker 2: so I'm not really sure exactly who everyone is.
Speaker 1: But a great problem top Yeah, well.
Speaker 2: I don't know about that. I just I just try
Speaker 2: to keep things going and make sure everybody is satisfied
Speaker 2: whoever does like my particular brand anyway, and I think
Speaker 2: everybody who is listening to this episode now, which is great,
Speaker 2: but you know, regardless, again, I'll be honest, this show
Speaker 2: can get political, but there's times where it's not. It's just, hey,
Speaker 2: let's talk about the facts. Let's talk about what's going on.
Speaker 2: Let's talk about what's happening from a factual standpoint, from
Speaker 2: the standpoint backed by data. And that's one thing that
Speaker 2: I'm hoping that you can do for us, you know.
Speaker 2: And one of the things that were that was in
Speaker 2: well contested for a while or people didn't understand and
Speaker 2: even I'm still foggy on was was the right to
Speaker 2: work as in you know, the h H one H
Speaker 2: two A visas or H two B visas. Can you
Speaker 2: explain how that works and how that relates to someone
Speaker 2: who has one of those visas and works in the
Speaker 2: United States.
Speaker 1: Sure, so, thank you so much again, George for having
Speaker 1: me and asking some of these brilliant questions, because when
Speaker 1: people hear sound bites in the news, it gets even
Speaker 1: more confusing because one side it says one thing and
Speaker 1: another says another, and then you know, the listener or
Speaker 1: the layperson doesn't know really where anything stands. So just
Speaker 1: back basics for a moment. The United States immigration system
Speaker 1: was created in nineteen ninety and the current system that
Speaker 1: we work with, and it created a family based system,
Speaker 1: element based system. In the employment based system, we have
Speaker 1: temporary work visas and we have green card options. But
Speaker 1: the temporary work visas or the temporary visa programs are
Speaker 1: in the employment based system. There's no temporary visa in
Speaker 1: the family based system. The family system is primarily get
Speaker 1: a green card you with misfah with you, and so
Speaker 1: in the employment based pre visa categories there are various
Speaker 1: different types of visa categories which are labeled as ault
Speaker 1: and then a number and so H one B, H
Speaker 1: two B, H two A one A one B. And
Speaker 1: so there are these letters and numbers and then letters
Speaker 1: again that signa for specific categories of visas. And when
Speaker 1: it comes to these visas, they're really defined by the
Speaker 1: type of work somebody is going to be doing. So
Speaker 1: if you're a priest coming here to be a priest
Speaker 1: to add a church, you would get a religious visa
Speaker 1: R one. If you are quote unquote a genius, one
Speaker 1: of the top people in your profession, be getting an
Speaker 1: old visa, And that was a matter of controversy see
Speaker 1: during the first time President Trump was in office because
Speaker 1: the first Lady had that visa. So the H one
Speaker 1: B visa is a work visa as well. And the
Speaker 1: basic premise of the H one B visa is that
Speaker 1: you must have a bachelor's degree in a specific subject
Speaker 1: matter that gives you the academic training and theoretical training
Speaker 1: to do a particular job that requires that training. So
Speaker 1: even though I'm a lawyer, i would not be eligible
Speaker 1: for a job in the computer industry because my degree
Speaker 1: is not in computer science. Okay, so the specific degree
Speaker 1: has to match a specific job. Any work visa has
Speaker 1: three primary requirements to show number one that there is
Speaker 1: an employer. Number two, there's a job, and number tho,
Speaker 1: there's an employee that you're going to sponsor. The employer
Speaker 1: is going to sponsor. Now, the employer has to make
Speaker 1: specific promises number one that they are going to pay
Speaker 1: the prevailing wage for that type of job in that
Speaker 1: type of breer. So an entry level doctor in Kansas
Speaker 1: City may get let's call it, fifty thousand dollars a year,
Speaker 1: but the entry level doctor in New York might be
Speaker 1: getting seventy thousand dollars a year. So the prevailing wage
Speaker 1: is determined by the Department of Labor and they decide
Speaker 1: what the salary will be, and the employer has to
Speaker 1: essentially promise that they will pay that salary. So that's
Speaker 1: the number one promise and number two promise is that
Speaker 1: they are they have the finances to pay that salary
Speaker 1: for a job that actually truly exists. Okay. And so
Speaker 1: when we hear debates in the news, often the debate
Speaker 1: is about bringing in cheap labor, particularly on the H
Speaker 1: one B front. You might remember around Christmas twenty twenty
Speaker 1: four was major you by controversial disctions where Elon Musk
Speaker 1: supports the H one B, and Steve Bannon does not
Speaker 1: support the H one B, and then President Trump that yes,
Speaker 1: he supports the H one B, And so there's controversy
Speaker 1: among leadership about the benefits of an H one B.
Speaker 1: But what are the facts. The facts are that employers
Speaker 1: in the United States, such as Microsoft, Amazon, Boeing, you
Speaker 1: name the big corporation, they use H one B visas
Speaker 1: because they generally cannot find enough talent to take those jobs.
Speaker 1: Why is that is because our education system is not
Speaker 1: producing sufficient talented minds or people for our workforce. Now,
Speaker 1: the question that comes up from that is, well, they're
Speaker 1: cheap labor, You're paying them less, And the answer is no,
Speaker 1: if anything, it costs more to hire somebody on an
Speaker 1: H one B. And the reason is not only are
Speaker 1: they they the employer making the promise as per the
Speaker 1: Department of Labour's guidance, but they also have to be
Speaker 1: competitive because the people that they are trying to recruit
Speaker 1: are being courted by multiple companies, and so they have
Speaker 1: to make sure that the employer's offer is attractive enough
Speaker 1: for somebody to say, yes, I would like to join you.
Speaker 1: So they are often being competitive in the market. But secondly,
Speaker 1: the employer has to then pay for legal fees, HI fees,
Speaker 1: compliance fee go forth. And so for anybody listening, each
Speaker 1: one B is an important visa in our immigration system
Speaker 1: because often people behind the scenes that are managing important
Speaker 1: parts of our lives. And you just need to look
Speaker 1: at your telephone, your cell phone, the hardware, the network,
Speaker 1: the software often are being managed by high skilled immigrants
Speaker 1: who might be working at some of these telephone companies
Speaker 1: or the wireless companies, or the you know, the technology companies.
Speaker 1: All the apps that you have on your phone by
Speaker 1: a lot of high skilled immigrants.
Speaker 2: Okay, so that was that was great on clarifying the
Speaker 2: H one B I have. I also have further questions
Speaker 2: as the differences between classification H one versus H two.
Speaker 2: But I want to back up a bit, because you're right,
Speaker 2: a lot of people were thinking this is just cheap labor,
Speaker 2: and I want, I want to want to say something
Speaker 2: about that, and I'm kind of I'm not saying I'm
Speaker 2: correcting this, but I'm kind of thinking where this argument
Speaker 2: possibly may have come from. And I know this from
Speaker 2: the construction industry and various other businesses that I've owned
Speaker 2: also throughout the years, and I will say that sometimes
Speaker 2: there's a difference between prevailing wage and the market value
Speaker 2: of a job in a certain area. So let's say
Speaker 2: construction work, for example, if you're a framer, prevailing wage
Speaker 2: I've just thrown this out there could be twenty five
Speaker 2: dollars an hour, but due to the market demand and
Speaker 2: what usually pays an experienced framer in that particular area,
Speaker 2: they're actually getting paid let's say upwards of forty five
Speaker 2: dollars an hour, especially if they're in the union. So
Speaker 2: I'm wondering if that may have contributed to the misunderstanding
Speaker 2: of you know, as you said, cheap labor was it
Speaker 2: was it Could it have been a difference between what
Speaker 2: was considered a market value for a job and what
Speaker 2: was considered a standard prevailing wage.
Speaker 1: That's a really, really astute question, and that could be
Speaker 1: a perception that a lot of people have. But I
Speaker 1: come back to competitiveness of the limited amount of talent
Speaker 1: that there is in this country. And so when I now,
Speaker 1: I live in Washington State, so it's very easy for
Speaker 1: me toly talk about Microsoft and Amazon. But when there
Speaker 1: is somebody both these companies might want to hire, and
Speaker 1: the startup smaller companies want to hire the same person,
Speaker 1: they have to be competitive with competitive market rates, otherwise
Speaker 1: they will not have that talented person join them. So
Speaker 1: while there is perception, that actually is probably widespread, George,
Speaker 1: So great question. Thank you for asking that the pool
Speaker 1: of people that these companies can draw from are still
Speaker 1: limited and so you have to pay market value. And
Speaker 1: in addition to that, there are you know, no no
Speaker 1: secret if you go look at any job ad for
Speaker 1: Monster dot com or Indeed dot com or wherever salaries
Speaker 1: are posted, and these salaries when somebody promises a salary
Speaker 1: that is through a form on the Department of Labor's website,
Speaker 1: and the Department of Labour's website will have a lot
Speaker 1: of data that can be accessed by the public. And
Speaker 1: so it it is again coming back to you, George.
Speaker 1: It's a good question, But the reality is these companies
Speaker 1: pay the market value.
Speaker 2: Right, And I was just asking the question because I'm
Speaker 2: wondering if that's where that perception came from, and they
Speaker 2: probably because I've seen it myself, you know. And I'm
Speaker 2: not saying that applies to the situation for example, when
Speaker 2: we're talking about engineers, but just wondering if the public
Speaker 2: may have I don't know if someone out there probably
Speaker 2: came across out data and they thought, well, yeah, they're
Speaker 2: getting cheap labor, and of course it has to be competitive,
Speaker 2: especially and you know, again I have been an employer,
Speaker 2: and I do know that. Listen, if you stay a
Speaker 2: salary in publicly and is plubbly available, everybody has to
Speaker 2: be you know, offered the same wage, at least the
Speaker 2: same starting wage, and then you know, move up from there.
Speaker 2: So I understand that I was just wondering if you
Speaker 2: thought that might that that issue that I brought up
Speaker 2: may have been part of that misperception. Is I guess
Speaker 2: how I should have worded it as to whether or
Speaker 2: not they're really paying for cheap labor. I don't believe
Speaker 2: that's the case. Is but I do want to ask
Speaker 2: you this, is there a myth? Is it okay? Is
Speaker 2: this a myth with with an H one visa, for example?
Speaker 2: Is is there a contract between the employer employee as
Speaker 2: for a certain amount of time? Is that true?
Speaker 1: Sure? Yes, that's that's actually part of the application process
Speaker 1: where you have an off letter or a contract that
Speaker 1: spells out the terms of the employment. H one vs
Speaker 1: can be part time, and the contract would specify that,
Speaker 1: but the actual application form would also specify if it's
Speaker 1: part time of full time. The boxes on the forms
Speaker 1: ask specifically full time, part time wages, hourly, annual, monthly,
Speaker 1: whatever the way it is. And so that's a contract
Speaker 1: and the employer actually has to contract with whatever else
Speaker 1: they're doing they have. There's a lot of compliance involved
Speaker 1: where if they are applying for a NACHU one B,
Speaker 1: the employer has to post a copy of the quote
Speaker 1: unquote wage promise that we just talked about in an
Speaker 1: inconspicuous place in their office for ten days so everybody
Speaker 1: can see it. So if anybody is, you know, feeling
Speaker 1: like there's an issue, they can most definitely complain. But
Speaker 1: it's there is a process for this and it has
Speaker 1: to be open and that posting is a very important
Speaker 1: part of it to make sure there's visibilit and compliance
Speaker 1: and then all of those forms get signed by them.
Speaker 2: But I guess my question was more about the time.
Speaker 2: I guess I should have been more clear about the
Speaker 2: question in my questioning was, Okay, does the employer enter
Speaker 2: contract with the person who is to be contracted under
Speaker 2: this H one visa? As in their sponsor them. So
Speaker 2: does that mean that they're committed to this company like
Speaker 2: that person's also committed this company and working for them
Speaker 2: for let's say two years, three years, four years, five years.
Speaker 2: Is that true of an H one as well?
Speaker 1: Very good question. So, uh, the employment contract will look
Speaker 1: exactly the same as it would for you and me
Speaker 1: if we were hired. Gotcha, So the employment contract wouldn't
Speaker 1: look necessarily different. It might have an additional couple of
Speaker 1: paragraphs saying subject to approval of your H one B,
Speaker 1: but H one b's initially will be or any any
Speaker 1: H one can be issued for up to three years, okay,
Speaker 1: but total time that we can have on an H
Speaker 1: one B is six years. So they can they have
Speaker 1: to first get into a lottery, and the lottery period
Speaker 1: is opening up March seventh to twenty fourth this year,
Speaker 1: and if somebody is selected in the lottery, then they
Speaker 1: don't have to be in the lottery again once you
Speaker 1: know Employer A has has gone through the lottery. HAN
Speaker 1: sponsored them and they worked for Company A, even if
Speaker 1: it's for one day. You know, we're looking at a
Speaker 1: lot of layoffs these days, which are you know, bringing
Speaker 1: up different types of nuanced problems. But as long as
Speaker 1: they worked for company A, they can move to company
Speaker 1: BCDEFG as many times as they want without being in
Speaker 1: the lottery. But only up to six years in total.
Speaker 1: And there are people in the US who have been
Speaker 1: on H one b's for much longer than six years,
Speaker 1: but only if some technical steps have been taken towards
Speaker 1: the cards.
Speaker 2: So okay, let's go over that then. So when they're
Speaker 2: six years is up, for example, what's the process for
Speaker 2: them to be able to remain in the United States
Speaker 2: for a longer period and continue to work.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Really, this is something that employers struggle with because
Speaker 1: planning has to happen way in advance of the six years. Okay,
Speaker 1: in the don't have to necessarily test the market. You're
Speaker 1: making the wage promise and you're having certain compliance issues,
Speaker 1: but you're not testing the market because it's a temporary position.
Speaker 1: But if you are going to sponsor that person for
Speaker 1: a permanent position, you have to test the market to
Speaker 1: ensure that no American worker has been left out before
Speaker 1: you offer that job for a foreign worker. Now, to
Speaker 1: test the market, there are many steps that have to
Speaker 1: be taken. First, you have to ensure or the Department
Speaker 1: of Labor believes that this is the right wage job.
Speaker 1: So you have apply and Department of Labor might take
Speaker 1: eight nine to twelve months give permission on that wage.
Speaker 1: Then in your local area with the main newspaper of
Speaker 1: that area, including three other ways of advertising. So the
Speaker 1: government wants to see that you've made a bona fide effort,
Speaker 1: a real effort to advertise the position, and that has
Speaker 1: to be advertised for at least thirty days, and then
Speaker 1: you have to wait thirty days to applications. Now, if
Speaker 1: somebody applies for the job who has the minimum experience required,
Speaker 1: the employer cannot move forward with the application unless he
Speaker 1: hires this person or they hire this person and continue
Speaker 1: with the other position. So if you've tested the market
Speaker 1: and somebody exists, you can't go forward with that application.
Speaker 2: And so there you can't go forward with the H
Speaker 2: one B application.
Speaker 1: Not the H one B. It's called a permanent labor certification,
Speaker 1: a permanent.
Speaker 2: Application, ah, got it.
Speaker 1: And so there are many steps that the employer has
Speaker 1: to take to test the market before they can make
Speaker 1: that permanent application.
Speaker 2: Okay, so they can't they can't convert this into a
Speaker 2: permanent status of work unless they can prove that, yeah,
Speaker 2: we literally couldn't find any other candidate in the marketplace
Speaker 2: to fill the position.
Speaker 1: That's correct. That's correct, And when that application gets to
Speaker 1: it has many steps, many different timelines, and many different
Speaker 1: points of potential failure.
Speaker 2: Okay, so, so how soon should should an employee a
Speaker 2: non employe, I'm sorry, an employer, I mean, how soon
Speaker 2: should an employer be taking these necessary steps to make
Speaker 2: sure that they're doing the right thing before they get
Speaker 2: to the point of that person or that said employee
Speaker 2: they're H one expiring.
Speaker 1: Really great question, George B. A lot of employers will
Speaker 1: wait until the first three years have gone by, and
Speaker 1: then they'll start thinking about it. Because if the green
Speaker 1: card application, the permanent labor certification application has not been
Speaker 1: pending for one year or more, they cannot extend the
Speaker 1: H one B beyond the six years. So there's a
Speaker 1: lot of counting back and counting forwards to see when
Speaker 1: you do these steps. And because it's very complicated and
Speaker 1: not cheap, the process is expensive, employers don't necessarily want
Speaker 1: to do this until they have to. But there are
Speaker 1: a lot of employees chainly start the process as soon
Speaker 1: as the H one B application has been approved because
Speaker 1: they know all of these steps will take time, and
Speaker 1: often these timelines can't be controlled. So for example, when
Speaker 1: during the first Trump presidency, everything was backlogged significantly and
Speaker 1: it took four years for the Biden administration to reduce
Speaker 1: timelines in various different application processes. And so employers have
Speaker 1: to be mindful that these timelines can can change and
Speaker 1: go back and forth. And this is not just the timeline,
Speaker 1: this is just the processing to get the green card.
Speaker 1: That's a different type of calculation and an assessment altogether.
Speaker 1: If you're from India, China, Philippines, Mexico, the waiting time
Speaker 1: for people born in these countries is signif longer for
Speaker 1: people who than people who are born in a or
Speaker 1: somewhere in Europe.
Speaker 2: Can you repeat that? It kind of dropped, So people
Speaker 2: born in India, Mexico, you know, basically China or China, Okay,
Speaker 2: so longer period for them than it would be for
Speaker 2: someone born in Canada and where else anywhere else in
Speaker 2: the world, Oh, just anywhere.
Speaker 1: Yes. What happens is the United States Green Card system
Speaker 1: has a limit every year, and the annual limit is
Speaker 1: one hundred and forty thousand Green cards each year for
Speaker 1: employment based applications?
Speaker 2: Is that total for the United States or per employer?
Speaker 1: It's a total for anybody trying to get an employment
Speaker 1: based green card. So an employer might sponsor you, you
Speaker 1: might sponsor yourself. There are one you categories in which
Speaker 1: you can do that, but they all fall under one
Speaker 1: hundred and forty thousand, which is never enough for Green
Speaker 1: card applications. And so these one hundred and forty green
Speaker 1: cards are then divided into seven percent quotas for each
Speaker 1: country in the world.
Speaker 2: Ah okay, And so if.
Speaker 1: You have a country with a large population, there's a
Speaker 1: longer waiting time because they're all fitting into the seven
Speaker 1: percent quota.
Speaker 2: So then okay, So the permanent right to work, Let's
Speaker 2: say someone gets that status, what does that do for
Speaker 2: their immigration status or here in the United States, because
Speaker 2: it sounds like you still have to go through the
Speaker 2: process of even getting a green card? What does that
Speaker 2: do for that person? And still are they then could
Speaker 2: they be considered a permanent resident? Because I'm foggy on that.
Speaker 2: So can are you able to explain that?
Speaker 1: You're asking some really fantastic questions, George? Until somebody gets
Speaker 1: their green card in their hands. They are not a
Speaker 1: permanent resident here, got it? And you have to maintain
Speaker 1: your visa status throughout that time and that green card
Speaker 1: application with the technicalities I mentioned about certain times and
Speaker 1: certain applications unless you get to and approved what's called
Speaker 1: I one forty, where the employer has fulfilled their market
Speaker 1: testing exercise and proven to the Department of Homeland Security
Speaker 1: saying I couldn't find somebody. I'm sponsoring Joe blog. Until
Speaker 1: somebody gets to that point, they cannot extend their H
Speaker 1: one bs for three years at a time, and a
Speaker 1: lot of people in this country are in that situation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so you have to have that employer continuously sponsor
Speaker 1: you for the H one B. Now, one of the scenarios, George,
Speaker 1: you might have seen over the last few years is
Speaker 1: the technology industry has seen a lot of layoffs. And
Speaker 1: California's seen the layoffs, Washington stat has seen them over
Speaker 1: the country. People have been laving.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Google and Apple just got rid of a lot
Speaker 2: of people a couple of years ago.
Speaker 1: That's right. And it actually happened in twenty twenty five
Speaker 1: already too.
Speaker 2: It did. I didn't realize that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's happening, it's not necessarily hitting the news in
Speaker 1: the same way because there are so many other things
Speaker 1: that I keeping you distracted.
Speaker 2: It's a chaotic twenty twenty five right now, Oh.
Speaker 1: My gosh, so much chaos. But if you have lost
Speaker 1: that job, your H one B has gone, but also
Speaker 1: that green cut application that your employer filed has also gone.
Speaker 2: Right, So what happens to that person who because this
Speaker 2: person who's working is doing so legally right, they're legally
Speaker 2: here because their employer has sponsored them to be here,
Speaker 2: and they it's been determined that, look, we can't find
Speaker 2: anyone in the market with your skills, so we need
Speaker 2: you here. Well, what happens to that person when they
Speaker 2: get stuck in this in between status where you know,
Speaker 2: like you said, there's only so many green cards available, right,
Speaker 2: one hundred and forty seven percent divided by seven percent
Speaker 2: among other countries, et cetera. But then what happens to
Speaker 2: that individual where they get stuck in that middle where
Speaker 2: it's like, oh, well, you know, we're kind of stuck.
Speaker 2: We can't get you the green card, or or they
Speaker 2: couldn't make it happen to where they could extend to
Speaker 2: a permanent work status. What happens to that individual.
Speaker 1: Really complicated, And interestingly enough, I appear in a New
Speaker 1: York Times story, so if anybody is interested, they can
Speaker 1: google my name in New York Times and there's a
Speaker 1: story about some people who were laid off and what
Speaker 1: they had to do. So there are some more details
Speaker 1: in that particular article. But in essence, remember we talked
Speaker 1: about the temporary visa and the permanent visa. Yes, the
Speaker 1: temporary visa is what allows you to remain in the
Speaker 1: United States, so one must always have if you're on
Speaker 1: a work visa or employment based in a greation system,
Speaker 1: you want to maintain status with a temporary visa, the
Speaker 1: green card application that the employer might have filed and
Speaker 1: you met that certain stage, you can keep your position
Speaker 1: in that quote unquote line. But a new employer has
Speaker 1: to go through the entire exercise all over again.
Speaker 2: A new employer so different, so that person would have
Speaker 2: to work for somebody else at that point.
Speaker 1: Yes, or I, or if if the current employer is
Speaker 1: giving you a new job because they're shuffling or restructuring
Speaker 1: within their own you know, entity and organization, they too
Speaker 1: have to file a new application. Because these permanent positions
Speaker 1: are for specific positions, there could be some slight changes
Speaker 1: to keep that green.
Speaker 2: It does sound like someone could get caught in the
Speaker 2: middle of the timing though, right, because yes, you know
Speaker 2: up to six years, as you said earlier on in
Speaker 2: h one, and even if even by year three, let's
Speaker 2: say they're already working on working on trying to get
Speaker 2: that employee to be a permanent worker status, but then
Speaker 2: there's only one hundred and forty thousand green cards. I'm
Speaker 2: just I'm just in my mind seeing where this can
Speaker 2: be an issue at times, it is an issue.
Speaker 1: All the time.
Speaker 2: Totally.
Speaker 1: You've hit the nail exactly where it matters, and that
Speaker 1: waiting time is incredibly important to understand because that gets
Speaker 1: that becomes part of the assessment of when you file
Speaker 1: somebody's green card because people from India, for example, they
Speaker 1: there are calculations and many reports written. One if anybody's looking,
Speaker 1: you can look up Cato c Ato which is a
Speaker 1: think tank and they have done a lot of studies
Speaker 1: and so you will look in one of their reports,
Speaker 1: just google it and the reports go through a lot
Speaker 1: of different you know, methods of doing these analysis and
Speaker 1: they found that anybody in from India in this backlog,
Speaker 1: often will have to wait seventy plus years to get
Speaker 1: their green cards.
Speaker 2: Yeah that's crazy, Yeah, that's crazy. What's really really quickly though,
Speaker 2: let's let's define the difference because I wanted to know
Speaker 2: the difference also between you were talking about the categories.
Speaker 2: So what's difference between one and two? Like H one
Speaker 2: H two.
Speaker 1: Really good question. So H one B is, as I
Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, you must have a degree to do the
Speaker 1: job that that degree allows you to do, and the
Speaker 1: employer has that degree.
Speaker 2: So a degree within a particular discipline, right.
Speaker 1: Exactly, that's exactly right. And the H two B and
Speaker 1: the H two A these are seasonal visas where you
Speaker 1: don't need a degree. The H two A is essentially
Speaker 1: for agriculture. And so when you see people coming here
Speaker 1: to pick our apples, you know, potatoes, you know, get
Speaker 1: salmon for example. Picture.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was very familiar with H two A and
Speaker 2: and and how it was used, but I was always
Speaker 2: unfamiliar with how they classify, you know, one versus two.
Speaker 2: And then there's there's there's one a.
Speaker 1: H one B is the one that we talked about, right.
Speaker 2: There is there an H one A or is it
Speaker 2: just H one there.
Speaker 1: Is you know there is H one C okay, which
Speaker 1: is the nurses. It's not something I have generally used.
Speaker 1: The HB is typically the one that is used the most,
Speaker 1: but the H three as well. So the H two
Speaker 1: A is agriculture. H two B is for seasonal, intermittent
Speaker 1: or one time work. So if you see people at.
Speaker 2: So as you said earlier that the letter denotes the
Speaker 2: type of field.
Speaker 1: That's it exactly right. So the H two B has
Speaker 1: three types seasonal work, intermittent work, or one time work.
Speaker 1: And if you look at the ski resorts, for example,
Speaker 1: they likely use the H two B. It's very commonly
Speaker 1: known that President Trump at is mar A Lago Estate
Speaker 1: uses H to B for you know a lot of
Speaker 1: the workers that come to the resort, and these are
Speaker 1: seasonal workers, and these two have quotas. The H two
Speaker 1: B has quotas and so and the age three visa
Speaker 1: is for people training who don't have training in their
Speaker 1: home country are coming to the United States to learn
Speaker 1: a skill that they wouldn't have otherwise. But proving whether
Speaker 1: it's H two A or B or three or H
Speaker 1: one B, it's all about the paperwork. And all of
Speaker 1: the various complicated procedures. So you said you're familiar with
Speaker 1: the H two A. There are times for it. I
Speaker 1: must have done, you know, things in advance to be
Speaker 1: able to jump into the you know, application process for
Speaker 1: the H to be or H u A. It's it's
Speaker 1: not simple, and there aren't that many lawyers who file
Speaker 1: AH to be an HUOA compared to the H one BS.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's I mean, so there, there's there's a lot
Speaker 2: going on to what what an H one or H
Speaker 2: two visa does for somebody. And I needed I needed
Speaker 2: you to mean to explain all this because especially when
Speaker 2: you go on social media, people don't understand what they're
Speaker 2: used for. It's it's a legal right for someone to work,
Speaker 2: and there's a reason why that person's being brought in
Speaker 2: for this particular type of work, and everybody, everybody just
Speaker 2: seems to automatically think the worst. You know, it's always
Speaker 2: a negative forever for the United States, for example, when
Speaker 2: it's not the case, but it can be a negative
Speaker 2: for the person gets stuck in the middle or gets
Speaker 2: caught in between those timelines that you were talking about.
Speaker 1: So yeah, totally, and you know, one of the reasons
Speaker 1: that there is a lot of concern is the the
Speaker 1: people who come to the United States on the H
Speaker 1: two A or H two B visa program are similar
Speaker 1: to the people who often undocumented doing this work. And
Speaker 1: so if you look at some of the agricultural workers
Speaker 1: and farm workers, you may find people who are not
Speaker 1: on actual H two visas, and that's where a lot
Speaker 1: of the controversy it's from. But A, we don't have
Speaker 1: enough of those visas, and b there aren't enough American
Speaker 1: workers to go and do back in the sun rain,
Speaker 1: you know, on farms, and so you know, if you
Speaker 1: were to ever think about doing a follow up podcast
Speaker 1: on these issues, maybe interviewed somebody who owns a farm
Speaker 1: and will tell you they see every day.
Speaker 2: Well so, but that opens up an entirely different conversation
Speaker 2: because now we're talking about Now we're talking about not
Speaker 2: necessarily whether people want to do the jobs, is whether
Speaker 2: they want to do them for the wages being offered,
Speaker 2: and so now we're talking about competitiveness in the market.
Speaker 2: And the other reason why people have been upset is
Speaker 2: because you know, look, there's many people who said, sure,
Speaker 2: I'll go pick cherries, for example, if it paid thirty
Speaker 2: five dollars an hour for you know, we know that's
Speaker 2: not the wage for that particular position, but that's been
Speaker 2: the argument. And so once we started outsourcing labor again,
Speaker 2: That's why I said, this is a different conversation. And
Speaker 2: you're bringing in labor from outside while they're getting they
Speaker 2: are getting paid the wages according to the market, and
Speaker 2: what is a standard wage in the guidelines of how
Speaker 2: the government says you should pay someone for a particular position.
Speaker 2: Those positions in of themselves have been watered down and
Speaker 2: degraded to a lower pain. That is, versus if they
Speaker 2: were paying for somebody else, like you said, you know,
Speaker 2: someone someone here. Let's just say a white guy. You know,
Speaker 2: some white guy wants to go Picturey's. You know that
Speaker 2: he's probably not gonna go do it because he doesn't
Speaker 2: he's not gonna do it for that amount of money.
Speaker 2: So I don't know if I don't know if it's
Speaker 2: an argument of whether or not people are afraid to
Speaker 2: do the work or they just don't want to do
Speaker 2: the work because they don't think it's worth what it's paying.
Speaker 2: My job, Okay, so for my business, I'll bring this up.
Speaker 2: For example, we're in the events industry. So there's times
Speaker 2: I work with everybody. I don't care what race country
Speaker 2: you're from. You know, if you're a professional and you
Speaker 2: know your stuff, and I don't have to hold your hand,
Speaker 2: we're good. I just don't want to worry about whether
Speaker 2: or not you're getting the job done. And I have
Speaker 2: people that are extremely good at their jobs. I mean
Speaker 2: no way more than I do, and they should. And
Speaker 2: I'm a white guy and I and I know people
Speaker 2: that are Mexican, I know people that are Indian that
Speaker 2: are all in this particular industry, and we all network
Speaker 2: with each other. We keep each other going, and we
Speaker 2: keep each other paid. But we are working hard. Okay, now, now,
Speaker 2: what I'm I'm trying to get at is all summer.
Speaker 2: I am in one hundred and five plus weather for
Speaker 2: sixteen eighteen hours every day working. I'm doing it because
Speaker 2: I'm getting paid to do it. I'm getting paid well,
Speaker 2: and I pay everybody who works for me well because
Speaker 2: they're specialists within that that industry. But when we're talking
Speaker 2: about people in the fields, they're not treated the same.
Speaker 2: And I think that is the issue that we have,
Speaker 2: and that's why most people say, yeah, I'm not going
Speaker 2: to go pick those cherries or cut that lawn because
Speaker 2: I'm not getting paid enough for me to go out
Speaker 2: there and sweat. And maybe we need to change the
Speaker 2: perception of how people view hard work and labor in
Speaker 2: the United States. Maybe it's just a matter of retraining
Speaker 2: people or holding the industries accountable for making the wages livable.
Speaker 2: What do you think of that?
Speaker 1: That's a really I mean, it's such a complicated mulant
Speaker 1: situation that not just America but probably other countries grapple with.
Speaker 1: It's about the industry, right, I mean, let's say you know,
Speaker 1: you're a farm owner. Let's just take an example of
Speaker 1: a farm owner and he's, you know, he's got a
Speaker 1: seasonal sort of cherry picking and he's got to make
Speaker 1: sure the cherries hit the grocery store where we're you
Speaker 1: and I are gonna go buy, you know, a pound
Speaker 1: of cherries for maybe six ninety nine. How much is
Speaker 1: he actually making? You know that that business there's a
Speaker 1: common misconception, and there are different businesses, different issues. Okay,
Speaker 1: but what does the standard farm business make and what
Speaker 1: is the salary that's necessary to do that? Now, if
Speaker 1: they're paying thirty five dollars an hour for a particular
Speaker 1: position in which they're actually losing forty dollars an hour.
Speaker 1: How are they actually going to keep that business going.
Speaker 1: You know, it's it's very it's a very complicated situation.
Speaker 1: We do need livable wages in this country. The Liverpool
Speaker 1: wages question comes up in childcare, in teaching, in construction.
Speaker 1: It's not related to the farm, farm workers and the farm.
Speaker 1: But the answer, you know, I don't necessarily have a
Speaker 1: good answer for you, because you know, it's just it's
Speaker 1: way it's way too complicated to go into. But I
Speaker 1: will say this to you. I have had clients who
Speaker 1: own construction companies and home care, you know, nursing homes
Speaker 1: where people are trying to get into hospice care, so
Speaker 1: to speak. Because you know, our medical industry has its
Speaker 1: own very big problems. And so when they want to
Speaker 1: hire people for the construction industry or the you know,
Speaker 1: nursing home that he cannot find American workers. And one
Speaker 1: particular business owner said to me, to me, now, I
Speaker 1: was going to pay him exactly what he wanted. He
Speaker 1: showed up, he didn't know which side the hammer was
Speaker 1: up or down.
Speaker 2: I've seen that I've seen that.
Speaker 1: So so you're going to pay somebody, you know, a
Speaker 1: very high wage for not knowing how to do the
Speaker 1: job you just said.
Speaker 2: True, But that's also that I think that also has
Speaker 2: that also is a reflection of how our culture has
Speaker 2: changed over the years. It went from it went from
Speaker 2: being proud of working hard and using your hands to
Speaker 2: playing video games and doing other things to make a living.
Speaker 2: So that could just be generational or cultural shift versus
Speaker 2: what it used to be able to say back in
Speaker 2: the forties and fifties and so on. But I'm not
Speaker 2: I'm not arguing. I'm just I'm just asking the question,
Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying that I think.
Speaker 1: It's a great question because these are provocative thought thought
Speaker 1: provocative issues that if we don't discuss them in an amicable,
Speaker 1: you know, loving way, how would listeners even think about it? Twice?
Speaker 1: You know? And the correlation to that is are we
Speaker 1: really developing the workforce that we need for this country?
Speaker 1: Do we have enough vocation, no training for people who
Speaker 1: can't go to our schools they can't afford, you know,
Speaker 1: the education costs that are required. Are we giving them
Speaker 1: vocational tools and schools? You know, plumbing or becoming electician.
Speaker 1: You know, are we doing enough of that? Are we
Speaker 1: putting enough emphasis on stam education at kindergarten level so
Speaker 1: that the next generation of workforce can do the jobs
Speaker 1: that H one B workers are doing well?
Speaker 2: The other questions, are we going out of our way
Speaker 2: to make those certain positions, whether they be the hands
Speaker 2: on positions you mentioned earlier or the professional positions, or
Speaker 2: are we doing enough to make them attractive to people
Speaker 2: to want to do it? I mean, is it a
Speaker 2: marketing issue?
Speaker 1: Well, totally, it's so complex, George.
Speaker 2: What it is it is we really need.
Speaker 1: The entire society to come together and say we see
Speaker 1: a solution this way. If we don't find the solutions ourselves,
Speaker 1: and we're not invested in the solutions that we're not
Speaker 1: speaking up about what each group of people needs, we're
Speaker 1: never going to have the solution, and we're going to
Speaker 1: get railroaded by executive orders by a handful of people
Speaker 1: who have the money and power to influence everybody else
Speaker 1: and point out these are the problems, but not necessarily
Speaker 1: come up with real working solutions.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and the problem with the solution it needs
Speaker 2: a solutions aren't overnight then it needs a very well
Speaker 2: thought out, tested, qualified plan that needs to be put
Speaker 2: in place. And actually when that is put in place,
Speaker 2: you need to stick to it and not be distracted
Speaker 2: and go off course. And I don't think that's something
Speaker 2: that has been done. It's we seem very reactionary when
Speaker 2: it comes to when it comes to the workforce in
Speaker 2: America and to the markets in general, we're reactionary. There's
Speaker 2: not a lot of planning really. I mean, you could
Speaker 2: argue that. Sure, in a business, you have you plan
Speaker 2: your finances, your income versus your overhead. You know, like
Speaker 2: you know your net versus your gross, et cetera, how
Speaker 2: much margin you're making on a sale bunch, your percentages
Speaker 2: of this and that, and you can go through your
Speaker 2: sales cycles versus so you know, hey, in Christmas, I
Speaker 2: know this is going to be huge for me, and
Speaker 2: then after Christmas it's gonna die down. We're gonna take
Speaker 2: some hits because it returns and it's et cetera. Now
Speaker 2: that's just data. You're just taking all that in strapolading
Speaker 2: it and you're analyzing it and then you can make
Speaker 2: certain predictions. But are you truly truly planning for the future?
Speaker 2: Of the actual industry or the workforce down the road,
Speaker 2: because fast forward here we are. Now we're finding less
Speaker 2: and less qualified individuals in the United States to do
Speaker 2: these positions that we need.
Speaker 1: Filled totally, totally, and it's a conversation that everybody should
Speaker 1: be having. And so I'm so glad you're leading the way,
Speaker 1: and I'm trying to make sure people get to hear
Speaker 1: some of these things. It's just imperative, you know.
Speaker 2: I just I just look at things. I'm just, you know,
Speaker 2: nothing special about me, Okay, I'm just an individual that
Speaker 2: I take it in. I look at what's going on,
Speaker 2: and I'm in quisitive. I have to ask these questions.
Speaker 2: I think most people have these questions on their mind,
Speaker 2: but they don't speak out. They don't ask, they don't
Speaker 2: talk about it. They just kind of go, well, that's sad,
Speaker 2: and they sweep it under the rug and they just
Speaker 2: keep moving on with their life. Nobody's really having these
Speaker 2: conversations except for maybe people like you, because this is
Speaker 2: what you do for a living and you see it
Speaker 2: all the time, especially when it relates to you know,
Speaker 2: immigrants and having to deal with these these work visas.
Speaker 2: So you see it first hand. But most people, most
Speaker 2: average people do not see this or even deal with this.
Speaker 2: They just rely on what's going on in social media
Speaker 2: to tell them what's going on. And unfortunately that's not
Speaker 2: the way to go about getting your information.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know, love people to just think about
Speaker 1: for a second. You might not need you might not
Speaker 1: visibly be seeing the high skilled workers in your life,
Speaker 1: but the high skilled workers are behind almost everything that
Speaker 1: you're doing. If you're at the office working on Zoom,
Speaker 1: a high skilled immigrant founded Zoom. If you're on your
Speaker 1: phone using WhatsApp or Instagram, uh, these are you know,
Speaker 1: as I mentioned before, the hardware software network in your phone,
Speaker 1: they're being managed immigrants. You know, if you go to
Speaker 1: the grocery store and you're seeing the shiny apples on
Speaker 1: the shelves, immigrants are likely picking them. If you're getting
Speaker 1: the milk seamlessly appearing on your table on your shelf,
Speaker 1: immigrants are likely milking the cow or however they operate
Speaker 1: dairy stuff. If you're finding the toilet paper in the
Speaker 1: grocery store, is because an immigrant is likely driving that truck,
Speaker 1: which you know, obviously was very very prevalent as or
Speaker 1: exposed was exposed during the pandemic. Immigrants are actually the
Speaker 1: fabric of our society, and because it's much of it
Speaker 1: is invisible, those who are just living lives and you know,
Speaker 1: day to day doing or whatever they're doing. It's not apparent,
Speaker 1: but if we didn't have the immigrants, life would be
Speaker 1: falling apart, and that day may be coming soon. Who knows.
Speaker 1: I hope I haven't jinxed us, but it doesn't take
Speaker 1: me to jinx us. You know that the executive orders
Speaker 1: alone will do it.
Speaker 2: I think what gets a little convoluted and everything is
Speaker 2: people trying to trying to throw a blanket over the
Speaker 2: word immigrant, you know, versus those who I don't know
Speaker 2: how you want to phrase it. I know everyone does
Speaker 2: it differently, undocumented, legal, whatever, But I'm just gonna say
Speaker 2: legal immigrants versus legal people were legally here. And I'm
Speaker 2: not sure your feelings because you see firsthand families that
Speaker 2: have to go through this, But what what how do
Speaker 2: we how do we move forward in handling those who
Speaker 2: are here illegally but are trying to be here because
Speaker 2: they're trying to make a better life for themselves. And again,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm gonna keep the politics out of it because
Speaker 2: I know, I know that there are other conversations we
Speaker 2: had with this, to be quite honest, and I've done
Speaker 2: a lot of research that comes straight from the Border
Speaker 2: Patrols data. So I've seen it all, and I've done
Speaker 2: more than one show on this. So there's not much
Speaker 2: you can say about it that I probably wouldn't know
Speaker 2: or could tell you. But yeah, but for those who
Speaker 2: are trying to do it the right way. And and
Speaker 2: this brings me back to a story of a friend
Speaker 2: I have who had to come to this country due
Speaker 2: to I'll just I'll just say he had to come over.
Speaker 2: Grandfather was already here, grandfather was legally here for many years.
Speaker 2: Brought his grandson over to protect him. And he's been
Speaker 2: here for a long time. He actually worked for me
Speaker 2: for a while. He went to university. He's a computer
Speaker 2: science major. He works for a utility company. Guy's brilliant,
Speaker 2: you know, and he's going through a situation. He did
Speaker 2: it the way. He and his family did it the
Speaker 2: right way. They stuck to it the whole deal, even
Speaker 2: if in the beginning he had to just get him
Speaker 2: out to save him, right, his grandfather had to save him.
Speaker 2: But after all that time, legally. He's here illegally period,
Speaker 2: and he's trying to get his wife over here at
Speaker 2: right now. But he's battling this like no matter what
Speaker 2: he does. He's hired multiple lawyers, he's gone through every
Speaker 2: scenario you could think of, and it just keeps getting
Speaker 2: delayed and pushed back. And it's been years and so
Speaker 2: those people, I think some people or most people these days,
Speaker 2: look at every single illegal immigrant. Ask someone who's trying
Speaker 2: to do something bad or they're a bad person. Technically, yeah,
Speaker 2: you're breaking the law, But at the same time, not
Speaker 2: every or person is here for nefarious reasons. How are
Speaker 2: you handling that? Or in your experience, how have you
Speaker 2: seen the perception of people when it comes to that
Speaker 2: distinction of illegal versus those who are legally here or
Speaker 2: do people just not even see the difference.
Speaker 1: Well, this administration, the new one, is not just making
Speaker 1: orders about undocumented immigrants. A lot of the executive orders
Speaker 1: are affecting legal immigrants too. But coming to a very
Speaker 1: basic answer to this very complicated situation is that we
Speaker 1: need immigration reform. Oh we have not had immigration laws,
Speaker 1: comprehensive immigration laws to keep up with the modern society
Speaker 1: that we live. In since the nineteen nineties. And now
Speaker 1: think about how many times over the world has changed
Speaker 1: and evolved, and how many you know, evolution we've had.
Speaker 1: We've you know, industrial revolution, we've had you know the
Speaker 1: Y two K now the AI globalization. The world is
Speaker 1: so much smaller. The laws have not kept up with that.
Speaker 1: In addition to that, America is part of many international treaties,
Speaker 1: including the Human Rights Convention. And you know, nobody is illegal.
Speaker 1: They could be undocumented, but human rights are an incredibly
Speaker 1: important part of American values, and so our laws are
Speaker 1: not necessarily keeping up with what we need for this
Speaker 1: country and what we need for the future. There are
Speaker 1: jobs that need to be done in this country, and
Speaker 1: there are people who want jobs from different countries. There
Speaker 1: are people who want to just stay alive. You know,
Speaker 1: today you talk about cartels and that's a lot. That's
Speaker 1: one of the issues for some of the Latin American countries,
Speaker 1: but other countries are going through wars. There are climate
Speaker 1: change issues that are displacing people. You know, the entire
Speaker 1: world needs to come together and find solutions. But in America,
Speaker 1: we need comprehensive immigration reform to make sure that our
Speaker 1: laws are keeping up with the times.
Speaker 2: Okay, so in your mind, what would that look like?
Speaker 2: Because if we look at it from as you said,
Speaker 2: a humanitarian standpoint, and we do need a reform, we
Speaker 2: absolutely do. It's crazy how long it takes to get
Speaker 2: things done in the system, and there's no reason anybody
Speaker 2: has to wait ten years, fifty years, seventy years. I mean,
Speaker 2: that's just stupid. It makes no sense to me. But
Speaker 2: with your statement of there's no illegal, there's just undocumented, right,
Speaker 2: it's all about humanity. So by that statement, does that
Speaker 2: mean the entire world every country should accept everyone equally?
Speaker 2: Should it just be an open system for anyone want
Speaker 2: to just travel in and out of each country without restriction?
Speaker 1: No, I don't. I think there should be agreements between
Speaker 1: countries to make sure that there are global solutions. When's
Speaker 1: you know, climate change that is you know, wiping away
Speaker 1: you know, land for people to live in. You know,
Speaker 1: my my heritage is from Bangladesh. It's a small country
Speaker 1: next to India. It's probably going to be under the
Speaker 1: ocean in the next fifty two hundred years. Maldives might
Speaker 1: be one of those. I'm just saying there has to
Speaker 1: be both solutions. World leaders go to you know, Davos
Speaker 1: or wherever. There has to be world solutions. But for
Speaker 1: our immedia issue, we are in America, we are at
Speaker 1: the we have borders, we are bordering Canada and Mexico.
Speaker 1: You know, there has to be solutions that come from Legypt,
Speaker 1: that take into the taken into account the values that
Speaker 1: we live by and finding common solutions. And do I
Speaker 1: have an answer? No, you know, I'm just one person
Speaker 1: who advocates for what is what I feel is right
Speaker 1: for the highest good. But the people that hold the
Speaker 1: power can't seem to agree on anything. It's become a
Speaker 1: very divisive issue. But if we could go back to
Speaker 1: love as a source of energy in our world, that
Speaker 1: every human being deserves love, and every human being deserve
Speaker 1: a way to just live, why can't we come up
Speaker 1: with solutions that that can actually everybody and everybody does
Speaker 1: their own share. I'm not saying America should take everybody
Speaker 1: in anybody. I'm saying that we need to have comprehensive
Speaker 1: immigration reform actually can find some solutions, and right now
Speaker 1: we have nothing. Oh sorry, it's three o'clock. I have
Speaker 1: to go this. This type of conversation can go on
Speaker 1: all day long. And so I'm so sorry I have
Speaker 1: to leave at three because I have a call coming up,
Speaker 1: but I just wanted to make sure that you knew
Speaker 1: that before we dive into something else.
Speaker 2: Right, Well, if we have to cut it off for now,
Speaker 2: we'll just have to pick up on another show if
Speaker 2: we're available.
Speaker 1: So sure, totally, totally, But you know, I so appreciate it, George,
Speaker 1: because these are the conversations that need to happen.
Speaker 2: And yeah, I mean there's there's still so much for
Speaker 2: us to talk about in regard to just immigration law
Speaker 2: and everything. But regardless, why don't you just quickly let
Speaker 2: everybody know where they can find you and whatnot. And
Speaker 2: I'm sure you and I will be talking again, I hope,
Speaker 2: and we can do this again.
Speaker 1: I would love that. I would love that. Well, George,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for having me. If they want
Speaker 1: to connect with LinkedIn, you can find me there to
Speaker 1: Mina Watson, and my website at my law firm is
Speaker 1: what immigration Law dot com. And I am an author.
Speaker 1: Thank you for mentioning mentioning that My author page is
Speaker 1: Tamina Watson dot com. And I have a couple of
Speaker 1: podcasts that are all you can't you can't miss me,
Speaker 1: you know, just google me or find me.
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, well, thanks for your time and again,
Speaker 2: let's let's please do this again. I think we have
Speaker 2: to pick up and do this again and just have yes,
Speaker 2: just for this conversation.
Speaker 1: It's good. Okay, that sounds good. Thank you again, George
Speaker 1: for finding me. Take care.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks, okay, thanks, thank you for listening. And I
Speaker 2: hope you found that conversation informative. Please like, subscribe and
Speaker 2: share the show with others, and don't forget to turn
Speaker 2: on notifications for world Ablaze. Also visit us at our
Speaker 2: website world Ablaze podcast dot com and you could buy
Speaker 2: me a coffee as well. That link is also on
Speaker 2: our website. Have a great day.