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No purchase necessary board. 18 00:00:56.520 --> 00:00:59.159 We're prohibited by lock eight team plus terms and conditions applaing. 19 00:00:59.200 --> 00:01:00.240 See website for out. 20 00:01:08.040 --> 00:01:11.480 You are now listening to True Murder, the most shocking 21 00:01:11.560 --> 00:01:14.599 killers in true crime history and the authors that have 22 00:01:14.640 --> 00:01:21.959 written about them Gasey, Bundy Dahmer, The Nightstalker VTK Every 23 00:01:22.000 --> 00:01:25.680 week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and 24 00:01:25.760 --> 00:01:29.959 infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your 25 00:01:29.959 --> 00:01:33.200 host journalist and author Dan Zufanski. 26 00:01:42.359 --> 00:01:47.200 Good Evening at daybreak on January sixth, nineteen eighty six, 27 00:01:47.599 --> 00:01:50.159 a couple on a camping trip in the Mohave Desert 28 00:01:50.439 --> 00:01:53.799 set out for a stroll and never returned. The local 29 00:01:53.879 --> 00:01:57.959 sheriff's office eventually discovered that Barry and Louise Burman had 30 00:01:58.000 --> 00:02:02.799 been murdered. As years passed and the double homicide remained unsolved, 31 00:02:03.000 --> 00:02:09.120 the Burman case spawned speculation and conjecture despite extensive investigation 32 00:02:09.360 --> 00:02:13.120 by local and federal authorities. To date, there's never been 33 00:02:13.280 --> 00:02:16.439 an arrest made in the case, let alone a conviction, 34 00:02:16.919 --> 00:02:20.960 but this doesn't mean the crime is unsolvable. After years 35 00:02:21.000 --> 00:02:25.479 of investigation, research and interviews, Kerrie was able to link 36 00:02:25.520 --> 00:02:29.319 the Berman murders to a Cambodian sex crimes and trafficking 37 00:02:29.360 --> 00:02:33.919 case involving a former marine. This is the first book 38 00:02:34.039 --> 00:02:36.960 to tell the full story of the Burman murders and 39 00:02:37.240 --> 00:02:41.000 uncover the likely suspect. The books that were featuring this 40 00:02:41.080 --> 00:02:45.759 Evening is The Burman Murders, Unraveling the Mohabi Desert's most 41 00:02:45.840 --> 00:02:51.360 mysterious unsolved crime with my special guest, investigative journalist and 42 00:02:51.439 --> 00:02:55.280 attorney and author, Doug carry Good evening and welcome to 43 00:02:55.319 --> 00:02:57.039 the program, Doug Carrey. 44 00:02:57.199 --> 00:02:58.680 Dan, it's a pleasure to be here. 45 00:02:58.719 --> 00:03:01.719 Thank you, Thank you so much, and congratulations on this 46 00:03:01.840 --> 00:03:05.319 upcoming book, The Berman Murders. It's been a long road 47 00:03:05.400 --> 00:03:08.120 getting to hear Dan, as you do in the you 48 00:03:08.159 --> 00:03:10.719 talk about a long road. Can you just tell us 49 00:03:10.759 --> 00:03:13.520 a little bit about how long a project this was 50 00:03:13.639 --> 00:03:16.560 for you, and you talk about it in the introduction. 51 00:03:17.080 --> 00:03:19.960 Just the mysteries of the Mohave Desert has been one 52 00:03:19.960 --> 00:03:23.360 of your passions, instilled by your grandmother, Dale King, and 53 00:03:23.479 --> 00:03:26.520 in the eighties you became involved in desert conservation and 54 00:03:26.560 --> 00:03:30.319 co founded a wilderness group, Desert Survivors, And one of 55 00:03:30.319 --> 00:03:33.120 the places you cherished the most was a pristine and 56 00:03:33.240 --> 00:03:37.120 channing locale, Saline Valley. So tell us a little bit 57 00:03:37.159 --> 00:03:41.080 about just your interest in this case. Tell us a 58 00:03:41.080 --> 00:03:45.120 little bit about your background in this area and how 59 00:03:45.120 --> 00:03:48.520 you became involved in this extraordinary book project. 60 00:03:48.719 --> 00:03:52.919 Well, Dan, I was enamored of the area. Saline Valley 61 00:03:53.159 --> 00:03:56.840 is one of the most remarkable locations on the planet. 62 00:03:57.000 --> 00:04:01.280 It lies about two hundred miles north of Law, Los Angeles, 63 00:04:01.319 --> 00:04:05.159 and it's kind of in between the Sierra Nevada Mountain 64 00:04:05.240 --> 00:04:09.759 Range and Death Valley, ringed by high mountains. The access 65 00:04:09.800 --> 00:04:13.520 into that area is extraordinarily difficult. You have to go 66 00:04:13.719 --> 00:04:16.439 on rough dirt roads. And in the middle of this 67 00:04:16.720 --> 00:04:22.399 enchanting valley, where there's rippling sand dunes and a shimmering 68 00:04:23.040 --> 00:04:28.800 saltwater lake is a palm tree oasis of hot springs 69 00:04:28.920 --> 00:04:31.959 that have been developed over the years into a kind 70 00:04:32.000 --> 00:04:37.639 of counterculture oasis. It's just a remarkable spot with interesting energy, 71 00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:41.800 unique and eccentric people. And I've been going there for 72 00:04:42.000 --> 00:04:45.600 years and it was one of my favorite spots. And 73 00:04:45.720 --> 00:04:50.399 so when these folks disappeared, i mean, through the small 74 00:04:50.439 --> 00:04:53.759 community of people that are interested in Saline Valley, this 75 00:04:53.879 --> 00:04:58.360 news rippled. And then almost three years later, when their 76 00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:03.519 bodies turned up in a cutbank grave, a shallow grave 77 00:05:03.639 --> 00:05:07.920 in a far away desert drywash, miles from the oasis, 78 00:05:08.240 --> 00:05:11.639 everybody wondered what happened. It was clear they had been murdered, 79 00:05:11.759 --> 00:05:16.319 and the case was never solved. So fast forward twenty fourteen. 80 00:05:17.040 --> 00:05:20.319 I just I thought about the case, and I decided 81 00:05:20.360 --> 00:05:22.120 I just want to go back and see what I 82 00:05:22.160 --> 00:05:25.639 can find out. And that started the nine year journey 83 00:05:26.160 --> 00:05:29.600 to unravel the case of the Burman murders. 84 00:05:29.839 --> 00:05:32.639 Now, tell us where this Saline Valley is. You say 85 00:05:32.639 --> 00:05:36.759 about two hundred miles from north of Los Angeles, but 86 00:05:36.839 --> 00:05:38.959 you write about that it has more in common with 87 00:05:39.040 --> 00:05:44.279 small town Wyoming than any kind of urban connection to California. 88 00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:47.600 So wait, Dan, When people think of California, a lot 89 00:05:47.639 --> 00:05:50.399 of times they think of urban California, or the coast, 90 00:05:50.639 --> 00:05:54.439 or perhaps Yosemite. But there's a whole part of California 91 00:05:54.519 --> 00:05:58.199 that really has more in common with Nevada in terms 92 00:05:58.199 --> 00:06:01.839 of the culture, the land escape than it does with 93 00:06:02.040 --> 00:06:05.199 what you would traditionally think of as California. And it's 94 00:06:05.399 --> 00:06:09.279 commonly called the East Sierra. The Sierra Mountain Nevada Range 95 00:06:09.319 --> 00:06:13.079 is this hundreds of mile long mountain spine, And when 96 00:06:13.079 --> 00:06:17.160 you go east of that mountain range, between the mountains 97 00:06:17.240 --> 00:06:20.560 and the Nevada border, there's a part of California that's 98 00:06:20.600 --> 00:06:25.480 really quite rural and unspoiled, Inio County, which is where 99 00:06:25.519 --> 00:06:29.839 this took place. Is about ten thousand square miles, about 100 00:06:29.839 --> 00:06:32.360 the size of the state of Connecticut, yet it has 101 00:06:32.399 --> 00:06:35.680 a population of only about fifteen thousand people. 102 00:06:35.720 --> 00:06:36.959 And the little. 103 00:06:36.680 --> 00:06:41.120 Towns are very a rural in character and not like 104 00:06:41.240 --> 00:06:44.720 you would expect to find in California. And it's the 105 00:06:45.319 --> 00:06:50.879 it's the officials the Sheriff's office in Inio County and 106 00:06:51.839 --> 00:06:56.480 seated in these small towns that took responsibility for trying 107 00:06:56.560 --> 00:07:01.519 to solve the disappearance and then later the apparent homicide 108 00:07:01.800 --> 00:07:02.879 of the Burmans. 109 00:07:03.240 --> 00:07:08.560 You take us immediately to Sheriff's headquarters in Inyo County. 110 00:07:09.040 --> 00:07:14.000 January tenth, nineteen eighty six, Deputy Leon boyer As was 111 00:07:14.040 --> 00:07:17.560 a call from Robert Pollard, commonly known as Chili Bob, 112 00:07:18.399 --> 00:07:22.279 a campground host at the Hot Springs in Saline Valley. 113 00:07:22.839 --> 00:07:26.319 Tell us about what Chili Bob has to say and report. 114 00:07:26.639 --> 00:07:30.360 Chili Bob was quite a character. He was known for 115 00:07:30.519 --> 00:07:35.120 his fondness for beer, and if you went out to 116 00:07:35.399 --> 00:07:39.680 Saline Valley, he was the campground host. He lived in 117 00:07:39.759 --> 00:07:43.240 a little trailer out there, and he had been anointed 118 00:07:43.319 --> 00:07:47.240 by the US Department of Interior Bureau of Land Management 119 00:07:47.319 --> 00:07:51.639 that putatively managed this area to kind of watch over things. 120 00:07:51.639 --> 00:07:54.360 And the reason they anointed him as the campground host 121 00:07:54.399 --> 00:07:55.959 is because he had a two way radio. 122 00:07:56.000 --> 00:07:56.879 He was the only one. 123 00:07:56.759 --> 00:07:58.959 That could communicate outside of the valley and he was 124 00:07:59.000 --> 00:08:02.439 able to summon authorities if something came up. So he 125 00:08:02.600 --> 00:08:06.240 put in a call to the Sheriff's office and Independence, 126 00:08:06.279 --> 00:08:09.720 which is this little town population six hundred and seated 127 00:08:09.720 --> 00:08:13.560 at the Sheriff's headquarters. Fielding the call was a guy 128 00:08:13.600 --> 00:08:17.519 who was a rancher, part time deputy named Leon Boyer. 129 00:08:17.879 --> 00:08:22.279 Just classic rancher type, kind of slow talking, common sense, 130 00:08:22.439 --> 00:08:26.600 big hands, piercing, blue eyes kind of a guy, and 131 00:08:26.680 --> 00:08:31.639 who had a real good common sense for crime and criminals. 132 00:08:31.920 --> 00:08:35.840 And he becomes the guy that, over the course of 133 00:08:35.919 --> 00:08:38.399 this case is the one who's stuck with it more 134 00:08:38.440 --> 00:08:41.600 than anybody else, a remarkable individual. 135 00:08:41.759 --> 00:08:45.120 Well, tell us what Deputy Boyer does. He talks to 136 00:08:45.399 --> 00:08:49.799 his Larry fresh Hour, another deputy, and expects him to 137 00:08:49.840 --> 00:08:54.200 go check out the situation at the campground near Palm Springs. 138 00:08:54.360 --> 00:08:57.399 But tell us what does happen and when they get 139 00:08:57.440 --> 00:09:01.480 around to going and finding out about this from Chili Bob. 140 00:09:01.480 --> 00:09:05.080 Yes, Dan, just to clarify in Saline Valley, what people 141 00:09:05.120 --> 00:09:08.799 call Palm Springs or sometimes the singular Palm Spring is 142 00:09:08.799 --> 00:09:12.519 a tiny little oasis of its own, not the city 143 00:09:12.559 --> 00:09:15.759 of Palm Springs, hundreds of miles away. So when Chili 144 00:09:15.799 --> 00:09:19.440 Bob calls in radios into the Sheriff's office, leon Boyer 145 00:09:19.519 --> 00:09:23.799 then dispatches a deputy to go and check out what's 146 00:09:23.879 --> 00:09:26.759 going on. There's an abandoned vehicle. These people haven't been 147 00:09:26.840 --> 00:09:30.159 seen for days, but the deputy, for reasons known only 148 00:09:30.200 --> 00:09:32.840 to him, he's passed away. So I wasn't able to 149 00:09:32.840 --> 00:09:35.559 get his comment. He just kind of sits on the call. 150 00:09:35.960 --> 00:09:40.320 Maybe he thinks they probably wandered off, whatever his reasoning was. 151 00:09:40.720 --> 00:09:43.480 He got the call midday on a Friday, and it 152 00:09:43.559 --> 00:09:47.320 wasn't until Monday that when leon Boyer called him back 153 00:09:47.360 --> 00:09:50.399 and said, get on this, that he finally made the 154 00:09:50.440 --> 00:09:53.399 truck out into Saline Valley, which is not an easy 155 00:09:53.480 --> 00:09:56.799 trek at any time, but especially in the winter when 156 00:09:56.840 --> 00:10:00.480 those roads can get pretty rough. So he got the 157 00:10:00.519 --> 00:10:04.480 department's four wheel drive Ford Bronco and finally had it 158 00:10:04.519 --> 00:10:07.639 out there hours on a dirt road, you have to 159 00:10:07.720 --> 00:10:10.200 drive first on a two lane highway that might be 160 00:10:10.240 --> 00:10:14.440 fairly characterized as the middle of nowhere, halfway to Death Valley, 161 00:10:14.480 --> 00:10:16.720 and then from there you have to take a fifty 162 00:10:16.840 --> 00:10:20.200 mile very rough dirt road in order to get into 163 00:10:20.279 --> 00:10:23.879 the Hot Springs. So that's what Deputy fresh Hour does 164 00:10:23.960 --> 00:10:29.240 and finds this abandoned vehicle without any clue what happened 165 00:10:29.600 --> 00:10:30.600 to the owners. 166 00:10:30.919 --> 00:10:33.480 Now you say, in nineteen eighty six the Hot Springs 167 00:10:33.480 --> 00:10:37.039 had become the site of a cultural phenomena. Tell us, 168 00:10:37.120 --> 00:10:37.919 what do you mean by that? 169 00:10:38.320 --> 00:10:41.759 Well, it remains that way today, and it was especially 170 00:10:41.840 --> 00:10:45.679 so back then. This Hot Springs area was just a 171 00:10:45.759 --> 00:10:49.039 place that drew unique kind of characters that are drawn 172 00:10:49.080 --> 00:10:51.519 to the desert. My grandmother was one of them, so 173 00:10:51.600 --> 00:10:54.320 I'd had some familiarity with this growing up. But you 174 00:10:54.399 --> 00:10:57.080 get all kinds of people from all walks of life. 175 00:10:57.759 --> 00:11:02.320 It's one of the places where you might find firefighters 176 00:11:02.399 --> 00:11:05.240 or police officers who are just on a getaway trip 177 00:11:05.480 --> 00:11:08.720 and next to a magic bus full of pot smoking hippies, 178 00:11:08.720 --> 00:11:11.720 and nobody seems to mind each other. It's a place 179 00:11:11.759 --> 00:11:16.159 where the normal bounds of civilization just don't seem to apply. 180 00:11:16.639 --> 00:11:19.679 It's not uncommon when you first drive into camp to 181 00:11:19.720 --> 00:11:23.000 see somebody walking with a big broad brimmed hat on, 182 00:11:23.440 --> 00:11:27.320 maybe a pair of sunglasses and sandals, and that's it. 183 00:11:28.279 --> 00:11:29.000 Buck naked. 184 00:11:29.440 --> 00:11:34.360 And it's not because it's a place of licentiousness. It's 185 00:11:34.399 --> 00:11:36.639 not a hookup side. It's more of just a back 186 00:11:36.679 --> 00:11:41.879 to nature kind of a place and people are more freewheeling. Yeah, 187 00:11:42.000 --> 00:11:43.720 that's the nature of the culture there. 188 00:11:44.000 --> 00:11:47.759 When the deputies get to the campground near this Wizard 189 00:11:47.799 --> 00:11:51.559 Pool soaking pool, they find the nineteen eighty two Thatt's 190 00:11:51.600 --> 00:11:54.600 in king cab where we'll drive. What do they find 191 00:11:54.720 --> 00:11:57.840 inside the truck and what do they find in terms 192 00:11:57.879 --> 00:11:59.879 of clues in and around the truck. 193 00:12:00.399 --> 00:12:03.320 Very little in and around the truck except for a 194 00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:06.240 couple of towels that had been thrown over some bushes 195 00:12:06.279 --> 00:12:09.519 after the Burmans arrived in camp and soaked in one 196 00:12:09.519 --> 00:12:12.639 of the soaking pools. And just to set the stage 197 00:12:12.639 --> 00:12:15.559 a little bit more so, there's hot springs. But over 198 00:12:15.600 --> 00:12:19.000 the years, the folks, the regulars they're called, who come 199 00:12:19.039 --> 00:12:22.960 out there, had piped the water to these amazing stone 200 00:12:23.000 --> 00:12:26.879 and cement bathing pools that are still there, and that 201 00:12:27.039 --> 00:12:29.799 becomes the focal point of the camp. People gather, and 202 00:12:29.879 --> 00:12:32.159 especially on a cold night because it was winter when 203 00:12:32.200 --> 00:12:34.960 they disappeared, you climb into the tub and you're soaking 204 00:12:34.960 --> 00:12:39.120 in this wonderfully hot water. Anyway, when the sheriff's office 205 00:12:39.159 --> 00:12:41.679 got out there and really started digging into what happened, 206 00:12:41.720 --> 00:12:44.399 they jimmied open the door of the truck. They found 207 00:12:44.840 --> 00:12:48.120 some cowboy boots. They found the kinds of things that 208 00:12:48.159 --> 00:12:51.919 you'd bring on a car camping trip, like bedding and clothes. 209 00:12:52.240 --> 00:12:56.720 But interestingly, they didn't find their day packs. They didn't 210 00:12:56.759 --> 00:13:01.759 find any hiking type shoes. They did find a pair 211 00:13:01.759 --> 00:13:06.840 of cameras that was interesting, and the indication was pretty 212 00:13:06.879 --> 00:13:10.200 quickly that what had happened is they had the sheriff's 213 00:13:10.200 --> 00:13:12.399 office got a report that these folks had gotten up 214 00:13:12.399 --> 00:13:15.759 and taken a morning walk and had not come back. 215 00:13:16.200 --> 00:13:19.200 So they identify the vehicle, and they identify the people 216 00:13:19.240 --> 00:13:22.840 that are missing and apparently walked from this campground. Tell 217 00:13:22.919 --> 00:13:26.720 us who they identify these people as, and then how 218 00:13:26.720 --> 00:13:29.840 do they proceed in terms of getting breaks, in terms 219 00:13:29.840 --> 00:13:33.519 of finding out what happened to these people in at 220 00:13:33.559 --> 00:13:35.879 just after New Year's nineteen eighty six. 221 00:13:36.120 --> 00:13:39.120 So Dan, if you'd been out there when these folks arrived, 222 00:13:39.279 --> 00:13:42.519 you would have just thought they were campers like anybody else, 223 00:13:42.720 --> 00:13:46.600 very unassuming. The truck that they drove was a good truck. 224 00:13:46.679 --> 00:13:49.039 It was a good dots in four wheel drive truck, 225 00:13:49.279 --> 00:13:51.720 but not you know, some kind of a remarkable or 226 00:13:51.759 --> 00:13:55.879 ostentatious type vehicle. They just looked like hippie types. But 227 00:13:56.120 --> 00:14:00.440 Barry Berman was actually the era apparent to the Aluah 228 00:14:00.440 --> 00:14:04.759 Liqueur fortune. His father, Jules Berman, was just an extraordinary 229 00:14:04.799 --> 00:14:09.240 Southern California entrepreneur who was into real estate and oil. 230 00:14:09.360 --> 00:14:13.240 But had made his fortune because early in his life 231 00:14:13.240 --> 00:14:16.399 he got into the liquor business, and after World War 232 00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:20.000 Two he spotted a trend. He saw that people seemed 233 00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:23.240 to be interested in imported products. It was attributed to 234 00:14:23.279 --> 00:14:25.159 the fact that a lot of boys had come back 235 00:14:25.200 --> 00:14:27.440 from the war and they were kind of interested in 236 00:14:27.519 --> 00:14:30.200 things from overseas. So he thought, well, maybe this would 237 00:14:30.200 --> 00:14:34.080 apply to liquor. So the first place he dove in 238 00:14:34.360 --> 00:14:38.919 was with a with an interesting tasting beer called Heineken, 239 00:14:39.399 --> 00:14:42.720 and he got involved in bringing Heineken to the United States, 240 00:14:42.799 --> 00:14:45.320 made a fortune from that, and then kept going. 241 00:14:45.120 --> 00:14:45.519 J and B. 242 00:14:45.639 --> 00:14:48.919 Scotch, Bass, Plao and others. And then when he had 243 00:14:48.960 --> 00:14:53.559 the opportunity to buy an obscure Mexican liqueur called Kalua. 244 00:14:54.120 --> 00:14:57.320 He ponied up, bought that brand and built it into 245 00:14:57.399 --> 00:15:01.000 a million case a year international busines to the point 246 00:15:01.039 --> 00:15:05.200 where Jules Berman had a mansion in Beverly Hills staffed 247 00:15:05.200 --> 00:15:09.519 by servants. He had a big home in Acapulco. He 248 00:15:09.559 --> 00:15:12.480 had a ten thousand acre hunting preserve. He had a 249 00:15:12.559 --> 00:15:16.440 yacht named Kalua. He had a garage full of exotic cars. 250 00:15:16.480 --> 00:15:20.240 I mean he was rolling at the highest levels. His 251 00:15:20.519 --> 00:15:25.200 only child, Barry, though, was of a different stripe and 252 00:15:25.399 --> 00:15:31.080 rejected his father's materialism. And Barry was married to Louise Burman, 253 00:15:31.120 --> 00:15:33.279 who was actually seventeen years older. 254 00:15:33.559 --> 00:15:35.279 Barry was thirty five when. 255 00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:39.279 He vanished, Louise was fifty two. Kind of a mismatch 256 00:15:39.320 --> 00:15:42.200 in a way. He was apparently a virgin. You know, 257 00:15:42.279 --> 00:15:47.000 this was his first first lover, whereas Louise had had 258 00:15:47.039 --> 00:15:50.000 many lovers and Barry was her fourth husband. 259 00:15:50.240 --> 00:15:54.000 You write about how they met, but first how Barry 260 00:15:54.159 --> 00:15:57.720 issuing his father's lifestyle and that being a materialism and 261 00:15:57.799 --> 00:16:00.919 that wealth. What he was searching for and what he 262 00:16:01.120 --> 00:16:02.480 found and where. 263 00:16:02.559 --> 00:16:05.840 So after high school, Barry decided not to go to 264 00:16:05.919 --> 00:16:08.879 college he just didn't feel the call of academia, and 265 00:16:08.919 --> 00:16:11.639 he had the means if he wanted, and the opportunity 266 00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:14.159 to join his father's business or just be an air 267 00:16:14.240 --> 00:16:18.080 too well. His father indulged him, but Barry wanted something more. 268 00:16:18.159 --> 00:16:21.159 He was a man of deeply held convictions, and so 269 00:16:21.200 --> 00:16:24.360 he went on a seeker's journey, and that brought him 270 00:16:24.840 --> 00:16:29.200 into northern India, into Punjab Province, and he walked into 271 00:16:29.240 --> 00:16:32.679 an ashrama. When I say in ashram, it's a sprawling 272 00:16:32.720 --> 00:16:35.720 in the size of a town, and it's the center 273 00:16:35.879 --> 00:16:41.159 of a practice called Radasoamia, a transcendental meditation practice. And 274 00:16:41.360 --> 00:16:44.879 the reigning SatGuru at that time was a man named 275 00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:50.000 Charen Singh, very charismatic, well spoken, and when Barry saw 276 00:16:50.120 --> 00:16:53.320 him and looked into his eyes, he felt this connection. 277 00:16:53.960 --> 00:16:58.120 And Barry became a devotee of char and Singh and 278 00:16:58.559 --> 00:17:01.000 decided that he was going to what was called the 279 00:17:01.080 --> 00:17:05.039 path to spiritual Enlightenment, which meant things like shunning drugs 280 00:17:05.079 --> 00:17:10.119 and alcohol, leading an ethical life, not killing or eating meat, 281 00:17:10.160 --> 00:17:13.400 and meditating for two and a half hours every day. 282 00:17:13.640 --> 00:17:18.160 And Barry was very diligent about adhering to the path, 283 00:17:18.279 --> 00:17:22.559 and he met Louise because she was also somebody who 284 00:17:22.599 --> 00:17:26.440 had become after a wild child type existence, had become 285 00:17:26.759 --> 00:17:28.160 a devtee of char and singh. 286 00:17:28.680 --> 00:17:31.279 And that's how they met in a more practical way 287 00:17:31.720 --> 00:17:35.160 through the religion. She was looking for a place, and 288 00:17:35.240 --> 00:17:37.440 he had a place to rent as well. 289 00:17:37.200 --> 00:17:38.039 That's true. 290 00:17:38.200 --> 00:17:42.599 So they met at what's called a satsung imagine a 291 00:17:42.680 --> 00:17:47.079 gathering of adherence to this faith, somewhat like Sunday service. 292 00:17:47.480 --> 00:17:49.960 And they met at a satsung, and she mentioned she 293 00:17:50.079 --> 00:17:53.039 was looking for a place to live. Well, Barrie's dad 294 00:17:53.079 --> 00:17:56.680 at that time owned a place called the El Capitan Ranch, 295 00:17:57.000 --> 00:18:01.319 a thirty five hundred acre coastal front ranch north of 296 00:18:01.359 --> 00:18:06.599 Santa Barbara, an exquisite and extraordinary piece of property that 297 00:18:06.680 --> 00:18:09.880 he had purchased. And there was a slice about a 298 00:18:09.920 --> 00:18:13.200 twelve acre slice of that ranch that lay right on 299 00:18:13.240 --> 00:18:16.640 a little cove, very private piece, and there were three 300 00:18:16.680 --> 00:18:21.200 cottages there, and Barry and some of the other adherents 301 00:18:21.200 --> 00:18:25.680 of Radasoami end up moving into these three cottages and 302 00:18:26.279 --> 00:18:30.279 essentially having like a little Enclaver or a hamlet of 303 00:18:30.640 --> 00:18:35.599 people who practice a transcendental meditation. Just as a side note, 304 00:18:35.720 --> 00:18:41.039 Dan years later when that parcel finally changed hands, that 305 00:18:41.119 --> 00:18:44.599 twelve acre piece, it was purchased by Brad Pitt and 306 00:18:44.960 --> 00:18:48.559 Angelina Jolie. Just kind of of an interesting twist there. 307 00:18:48.640 --> 00:18:54.079 So let's get back to nineteen eighty six January. Their relationship. 308 00:18:54.440 --> 00:18:58.240 They've been married a few years. What does it characterize 309 00:18:58.279 --> 00:19:01.759 by and what happened? What did they decide around New 310 00:19:01.839 --> 00:19:03.839 Year's nineteen eighty six as a couple. 311 00:19:03.920 --> 00:19:07.640 Yeah, so Barry and Louise had gone through a rocky phase. 312 00:19:07.720 --> 00:19:09.640 I mean they were always a bit of a mismatch, 313 00:19:09.799 --> 00:19:13.440 and Barry himself was a very solitary person as far 314 00:19:13.480 --> 00:19:14.000 as we know. 315 00:19:14.279 --> 00:19:15.720 Louise was his first lover. 316 00:19:15.920 --> 00:19:19.440 So here's a young man with an older woman. They's 317 00:19:19.480 --> 00:19:23.000 somewhat different in personality. She's very bubbly and engaging. He's 318 00:19:23.119 --> 00:19:26.720 much more withdrawn, more like monk like is how he's 319 00:19:26.759 --> 00:19:32.880 been described by his friends. And he would sometimes conduct marriages. 320 00:19:32.920 --> 00:19:35.359 Even people really looked up to him. He was a 321 00:19:35.359 --> 00:19:38.559 man of few words. She was much more engaging in chatty, 322 00:19:38.960 --> 00:19:41.039 and they had just gone through a patch where they 323 00:19:41.119 --> 00:19:43.640 just weren't They didn't seem to be jibing, they just 324 00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:48.559 weren't doing well. They stopped sharing a bed, and then 325 00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:52.799 something happened. We're not sure how it was that they 326 00:19:52.839 --> 00:19:55.960 got back together, but at the end of nineteen eighty 327 00:19:55.960 --> 00:19:59.440 five they reconnected and they decided to celebrate by going 328 00:19:59.480 --> 00:20:02.680 on to make trip, and that was the trip that 329 00:20:02.839 --> 00:20:04.880 led them into Saline Valley. 330 00:20:05.000 --> 00:20:08.200 It's interesting to you write about a friend named Arthur Korb, 331 00:20:08.960 --> 00:20:13.079 and even though the couple Barry and Louise, or Barry 332 00:20:13.160 --> 00:20:16.519 especially was familiar with the area and Death Valley, Arthur 333 00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:20.640 Korb gave them a little hint about something that they 334 00:20:20.759 --> 00:20:22.720 might do if they're in the area. 335 00:20:22.880 --> 00:20:23.039 Right. 336 00:20:23.200 --> 00:20:25.680 Barry was very interested in going to a place in 337 00:20:25.759 --> 00:20:31.359 Death Valley National Park called Scotty's Castle. Barry was a craftsman. 338 00:20:31.480 --> 00:20:35.799 He chose for his trade to handcraft iron like wrought 339 00:20:35.839 --> 00:20:39.640 iron gates and lamps and things like that, and out 340 00:20:39.680 --> 00:20:42.960 at Scotty's Castle there's extraordinary iron work and he wanted 341 00:20:42.960 --> 00:20:45.079 to go there and look at it and take pictures. 342 00:20:45.559 --> 00:20:48.839 And when Arthur Korb, who was a close friend who 343 00:20:48.839 --> 00:20:54.000 had actually sponsored a Barry for initiation into the faith 344 00:20:54.279 --> 00:21:00.279 Rodasoami Faith under the Sat Guru char and Sing, Arthur said, oh, oh, well, 345 00:21:00.279 --> 00:21:02.759 if you're going out there. You got to check out 346 00:21:02.759 --> 00:21:05.960 these hot springs and Sailing Valley. And just to step back, 347 00:21:06.640 --> 00:21:09.519 Barry was an outdoorsy guy. He could handle himself, and 348 00:21:09.640 --> 00:21:13.960 he and Arthur would sometimes go on vacation trips to 349 00:21:14.039 --> 00:21:16.839 explore remote hot springs. So this was in keeping with 350 00:21:17.200 --> 00:21:19.880 past pattern and practice. And Barry was a guy who 351 00:21:19.960 --> 00:21:22.680 knew his way around, and so he and Louise packed 352 00:21:22.759 --> 00:21:25.000 up the truck and that they found their way into 353 00:21:25.160 --> 00:21:26.079 Sailing Valley. 354 00:21:26.359 --> 00:21:29.519 Now you take us to the scene. I'm not certain 355 00:21:29.559 --> 00:21:31.480 of the date. You can tell us the date did, 356 00:21:31.839 --> 00:21:33.559 but they. 357 00:21:33.000 --> 00:21:34.160 Arrive at the Wizard Pool. 358 00:21:34.480 --> 00:21:36.960 They go to Scottie's Castle, I believe tell us about 359 00:21:37.440 --> 00:21:40.559 their arrival and who they find at the pool. Once 360 00:21:40.640 --> 00:21:42.640 they arrive at that campsite. 361 00:21:43.000 --> 00:21:47.119 So it's Sunday night, January five, nineteen eighty six, and 362 00:21:47.359 --> 00:21:50.960 they come rolling in after dark. But they find their 363 00:21:51.000 --> 00:21:54.319 way up to the Palm Spring, which is the more 364 00:21:54.440 --> 00:21:59.200 isolated of the soaking pools that are in this part 365 00:21:59.240 --> 00:22:02.599 of Sailing Valley. There's a more larger set of soaking 366 00:22:02.680 --> 00:22:05.359 pools and more of a social scene about three quarters 367 00:22:05.359 --> 00:22:07.880 of a mile away down the hill. Up at Palm Spring, 368 00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:11.000 there's two soaking pools and it tends to draw a 369 00:22:11.000 --> 00:22:12.079 little more of a back. 370 00:22:11.920 --> 00:22:12.880 To nature crowd. 371 00:22:13.319 --> 00:22:16.200 So they roll in after dark and they actually put 372 00:22:16.240 --> 00:22:19.720 on their bathing suits. They were rather modest, modest people, 373 00:22:20.119 --> 00:22:23.359 even though the most people out at the hotsprings don't barn. 374 00:22:23.960 --> 00:22:26.440 They come slipping into the water. And at the time 375 00:22:26.480 --> 00:22:29.640 they got into the tub, there were three men in 376 00:22:29.720 --> 00:22:33.920 the tub. Two of them were dirt bike riders, motorcycle guys, 377 00:22:34.000 --> 00:22:37.960 young guys from Modesto, California, who were out there. They'd 378 00:22:37.960 --> 00:22:40.160 brought their dirt bikes out and they were kind of 379 00:22:40.240 --> 00:22:43.039 enjoying that kind of thing. They'd been motoring around on 380 00:22:43.480 --> 00:22:47.839 their dirt bikes. The other fellow was in the military. 381 00:22:48.039 --> 00:22:50.799 They didn't know a lot about him. People hadn't talked 382 00:22:50.799 --> 00:22:54.279 with him much. He was traveling alone. Seemed like a 383 00:22:54.319 --> 00:22:57.640 bit of a laid back guy, had a resonant voice. 384 00:22:58.160 --> 00:23:02.039 He was an officer, Marine Corps officer or captain. He 385 00:23:02.160 --> 00:23:04.200 mentioned that he was in the military and they had 386 00:23:04.200 --> 00:23:06.799 gone to school in New Mexico. And so the three 387 00:23:07.200 --> 00:23:11.160 men and young men and then Barry and Louise chat 388 00:23:11.160 --> 00:23:13.319 in the hot tub for a while. The two dirt 389 00:23:13.359 --> 00:23:15.799 bike riders get up and head off to bed at 390 00:23:15.799 --> 00:23:20.839 some point, leaving this military man named Mike in the 391 00:23:21.519 --> 00:23:24.880 soaking tub with Barry and Louise, and then at some 392 00:23:25.039 --> 00:23:28.359 point they go their separate ways and go to bed. 393 00:23:29.160 --> 00:23:33.400 Yeah, you take us to Monday, January sixth, and likely 394 00:23:33.519 --> 00:23:36.079 because of their faith, they would be up very very 395 00:23:36.119 --> 00:23:38.200 early to do that two and a half hour meditation. 396 00:23:38.279 --> 00:23:40.519 But they'd be up very very early, and it was 397 00:23:40.599 --> 00:23:44.759 indications that looked like they had before everyone else got up, 398 00:23:45.200 --> 00:23:48.200 left the camp for some sort of hike. What is 399 00:23:48.279 --> 00:23:50.920 the what did the bikers do that day? And what 400 00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:55.960 do they the dirt bikers witness this mic preparing to 401 00:23:56.000 --> 00:23:56.559