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Speaker 1: Hi everyone. I'm Stephanie Wilder Taylor and this is Drunkish,

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the podcast based on the book Drunkish, where I told

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my whole sobriety story because I can't keep anything back.

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But now I have this podcast so I can hear

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other people's stories. And today's guest is, oh, this was

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a really fun interview. This is my friend Tara Matter.

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She's the mom of a teenager and she has a

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pretty new baby. She's also a writer a speaker, and

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she has a substack called Recovering from Something. And by

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the way, if you want to watch this episode, please

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go to Drunkish pod on YouTube and watch away. And

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here's Sarah and here we are with Tara Matter.

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Speaker 2: Hi, Tara, Hi, how are you?

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Speaker 1: It looks like a reunion for us.

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Speaker 2: I know we're sober due it's like a girlfriend catch up,

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but like on air, so.

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Speaker 1: I know, I know I started. I saw your sober

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content on the GRAM. I don't learn what to call

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it if I you know, I want to sound really

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young like the kids.

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Speaker 2: I know, but I'm like, yeah, do I call it

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ig do? I I don't know, like whatever, we.

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Speaker 1: Gotta be cool. But but you are posting sober content

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and I met you, well you have you'll tell the

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story of free But when I met you, we're both

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sober people.

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Speaker 2: Yes, at that in common. Yes, yeah, So we met

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when I was like going through some rounds of IVF

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and then I took your class during my pregnancy and

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then yeah, so that was super fun. But so yeah, No,

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I years ago when you wrote your first book to

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pick Ups for Not for Sardinay, somebody gifted it to

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me and I was like, this is this is my

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new bible, Like I'm going to be a drunkie fun mom,

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Like this is great. It was like the og mommy

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wine culture and I was like signed up for it.

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I bought everyone in the book. And then I got like,

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you know, nap time is the new happy hour, and

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I'm like this is this is me, Like we are

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the same. And then life goes on got drunk her

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and you know, I was like in and out of

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recovery rooms and I don't and then like moved to

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California when I was eighteen months sober, maybe seven eight

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years ago. And then yeah, I was at lunch with

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a friend and at the last minute she was like,

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can I invite another friend. I'm like, sure, whoever, I

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don't care more than marror. And we got to talking

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and she said she was in a writing group and

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I'm like, oh, I got to get back to writing,

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like you know, and she she was like, yeah, it's

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with this gal. She's not theirs friend of mine. You

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know said your name. I'm like wait, what, Like she's

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your friend and she's sober. I'm like yeah, so I'm

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like I want in on this class. And so it's

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just so full circle to be like because we're both like,

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ew mommy wine culture. I don't know that anymore, but

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you know, to like be on a better path and

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you know, So it's funny because for a long time.

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Speaker 1: I look the whole edgy wine mom thing. It's still

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a personality, like if you separate it from the actual drinking, right, Like,

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this is the thing I was so afraid of when

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I got sober, was that I would lose my personality

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and I wouldn't be fun And if I even if

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you look back at that book, yes, there are so

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many alcohol references and so much of me being like

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you're not cool if you don't drink like me, which

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is ridiculous. I was you know, in my late thirties

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writing that, okay, but there were also a lot of

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jokes that were just like, it's just like, it's important

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to find your tribe, and it's sad that a lot

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of people found their tribe by going like, drinking is

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my tribe. And I do feel a little guilty that

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I somehow gave everyone permission to be a drunk mom,

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which was obviously not my intention, but it's where my

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had was at you.

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Speaker 2: I've gotta let that go, for sure, because you know,

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people are going to choose to be like that or not,

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whether they got the idea from you or a book

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or like whatever. And and hopefully some of those people

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like me follow your career and your directory and are like, hey,

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maybe I want to take a look at my own

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drinking now, you know. And but I also think you

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like gave everyone permission who used to be like that

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to you know, look at their relationship with alcohol now.

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So if you haven't thought about it that way, for sure,

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because because it's like, yeah, if we thought we were

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like the cool girl drunks you know before, Like now

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it's like this whole sober movement, sober curious, like all

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this stuff like especially living in La Right, It's like

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it's okay to be sober here, like, which I'm so

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grateful for, right because I, you know, got drunken lots

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of other cities. So it's funny. I'm going, Like I

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was telling you before, I'm going on my first college

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tour with my son next week. And I used to

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live in New York City. It was like the scene

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of the crime, like literally figured and I haven't been

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in New York sober ever. I'm coming up a nine

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year sober next month. If if all goes well, thank you,

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I plan on it. So it'll be interesting to just

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see like what memories come up and like literal memory

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lane of like oh gosh, I don't think I'm allowed there.

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Hopefully I must those ways have closed, I don't know,

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but you know, we.

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Speaker 1: Should get into some of that because one of the

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things that I love about you and your writing is

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your bottom is kind of low, right, I mean, if

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we're if we're being honest, oh yeah, it's like everybody,

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like everybody, it can't be low enough, right. It's like

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you still had that thing that I love that you

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discussed so honestly in your writing, which is like okay,

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but just because this is going on, that doesn't mean

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that I can never drink again. Like, let's be realistic.

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Like every it's that thing that happens a lot that

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we talk about a lot in meetings where it's always

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sort of everybody else's fault and what I love that

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I want to get to but I want you to

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take me through it is the moment where you're finally like, okay, okay,

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that gives up time is up right, So take this, sue,

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what was going on in your life and how that

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came to pass.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So, I mean my bottom maybe wasn't even my

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last bottom, wasn't even necessarily my worst, but it was,

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you know, it was just like another in a series

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of wake up calls. I you know, to be totally honest,

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and I don't think I've spoken about this on camera.

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I you know, I woke up in jail after our

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first date, not for the first time, you know, as

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I've joked with you, it was also our last date.

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Poor guy wherever he is. He's like some high school

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football coach or something in Chicago. Anyway, it was, you know,

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it was a Wednesday night, Like that's what I do

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on a Wednesday night, like I irish goodbye in the

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middle of our date. As the story goes, I don't know,

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I don't remember. It was not a brownout. It was

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a full blackout. They explained to me what happened the

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next day. I believe them sounds like something I would do,

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but I had no zero recollection. So I wake up

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and I again had been there before, so I was like,

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I don't need my phone call. I'm sure I'll be

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out by noon. And I was not. I was definitely

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not out by noon. A whole series of events. You know,

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I've written about it before, but what that day was like,

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and I just was like stealing in my own shit

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and trying to figure out how I was going to

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get out of this mess. Like it wasn't like I

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woke up and was like, I'm ready take me, you know,

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I and I and I went to me before, ye before,

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so that I could talk about that too. So I mean,

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I mean, starting back when I was seventeen years old,

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the first time I ever got drunk, I gotten a

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massive car accident. I had had a couple of wine

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coolers before dabbling in that, but it was I had

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had my car for three days, just like my thousand

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dollars car. And I was at a party with my

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with my cousin, and I left in the middle of it.

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Didn't tell on a day one where I was going.

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I had got this is how old I am. Somebody

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had paged me and I called back on a house phone.

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Whoever that is still remains a mystery. I have some ideas.

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But I left and it was like a Wednesday night

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the summer before I was going to be a senior

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in high school, and uh, yeah, Wednesday apparently no, Oh

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my gosh, right, Oh my gosh, that's so funny. I

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had never made that. Nowhere Wednesdays for me? But yeah,

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I got in horrible cross and I had two hundred

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eighties stitches in my face. I ran into a van

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full of school children on their way home from a

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soccer game, and everyone was okay except for me. My

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seatbelt broke across my chest. I hit my face on

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the on the the glass, and I woke up, and

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once they finally told me like what happened and everything,

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I was immediately indignant. I was like, what's the big deal?

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Nobody else got hurt? Why is everyone so concerned? So

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can I have a mirror, and they're like, no, no,

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you cannot have a mirror. You're gonna be a little horrified.

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I'm like, and I had to go to the bathroom

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at some point, right, so I like the foggy little

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mirror in the in the hospital bathroom, and I was

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a monster, Like this eye was swollen, shot, this eye

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I could barely see out of And I knew I

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would drink again. Like I just was like I had

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really bad luck. Like who does that happen to on

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their first time getting like fully drunk? No one, right,

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but I'll tell you I graduated with five hundred and

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eighty kids. No one else had that story. On day

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one of you know, our senior year, I thought the

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rumors of like, oh Tara always did this, and people

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were hanging off the freeway overpast they were not like

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it wasn't all that serio. I mean, it was serious,

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it was very serious, but I just like was like

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I did not take it seriously whatsoever. They made me

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go to meetings because I was not yet eighteen, and

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so my parents could have made me go to like

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an alcoholic treatment program, but my dad made the decision,

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like he's like it was just like a fluke thing.

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She's not like she has some problem. It's not like

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she's like has a pattern of things. And we talked

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about this all these years later because he's like, I

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felt so guilty, like your life would have been so

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different if I would have made you do X, Y

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and Z, And I was like, oh no, no, no, wouldn't.

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I would have hated you, I would have drank at you,

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and I still would have kept going, Like so as

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soon as I could get to college, so I'd probably

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calmed down for a few months until maybe the bandages

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were off my face. But I drank like that from

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day one. I was always an alcoholic. It's no one's fault,

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but it's my decision if I want to do anything

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about it. But it took me years. So those were

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like my first meetings. Like people have these clear memories

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of their first meetings. I don't. I don't know. I

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probably was like signed my card, I gotta leave, and

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I was seventeen. They were probably what are you doing here?

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So then I proceeded to get to duys in college

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six months apart, and when when I went in front

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of the judge for the second he was like and

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they I had barely blown right, Like, I was like,

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you know, eight for both. So I was like, oh,

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you guys were overreacting. I two glasses of wine, but like,

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don't forget about all the times I drove in a

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blackout right, like, didn't get caught for those. These are

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just the two that I was on the hook for.

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So the judge I remember him saying, it was it

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was three months til I graduated, and he was like, ma'am,

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I don't get a lot of people in here who

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look like you. So that I took like, yeah, I'm special.

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And he's like, I it's your lucky day. I'm going

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to let you go back to class, go continue with

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your I was interning at the Minnesota Senate at the

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time for first state senator. My life was a dichotomy,

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like walking to economy. So he's like, you are going

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to graduate. I don't want to mess up your college.

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He's like, but you will report to jail the day

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you graduate or the day after you graduate. You know,

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no passing, go to now two hundred dollars, you get

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your weight eight yep, because it was two in.

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Speaker 1: The second one. Okay, So the second one he's said.

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Speaker 2: He's like, obviously you haven't learned your lesson. You think

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you're above the law. I'm like, I did think I

240
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was a law but so then I so after so

241
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you graduate and everyone's off going party and having their fun,

242
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and I like literally reported to jail for ten days

243
00:11:52,679 --> 00:11:54,080
the day after I graduated college.

244
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Speaker 1: Ten days you must have been. So you must have

245
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been like twenty one.

246
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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was. I was exactly twenty one. And I

247
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was exhausted because like I had what was people have

248
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like twelve to fifteen credits in the college. I had

249
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twenty one that last semester from my internship and all

250
00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:11,840
these things, and I didn't have a license so to

251
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to try and get around to like my college was

252
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an hour and a half from where the state Senate was,

253
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and so it was just a it was a mad mess.

254
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So I slept for ten days, grated people's hair, like

255
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read Daniel Steel novels that were in my cell and

256
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that was that. And then I'm like, well, maybe I'll

257
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move to New York because you don't I can't get

258
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a d Y if I don't have to drive.

259
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Speaker 1: Oh my god, that is the best alcoholic thinking. I

260
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can't tell you how many people I talked to that

261
00:12:36,120 --> 00:12:38,120
went to New York because they're like, less, no.

262
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Speaker 2: Driving, let's go like it.

263
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Speaker 1: Let me just ask you this, What did your parents say? Okay,

264
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so they they they thought it was a fluke when

265
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you were seventeen, but when you got two more did

266
00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:50,799
they know about it? Did you tell them?

267
00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:53,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, they definitely know it, knew about it. I didn't call.

268
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They were not my calls. I remember one of them

269
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was my professor because I was like, got arrested at

270
00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:00,320
college and I was like, you, I had to call

271
00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:02,559
someone sober and that you have their phone number. Well,

272
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I don't have anyone's fun number. I don't have anyone's

273
00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:06,799
like number memorized who does? And cell phones were just

274
00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:09,480
starting to be a thing then, and so I had

275
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to use the phone book and I'm like, my friends,

276
00:13:12,159 --> 00:13:14,200
your college addresses not listened to your phone book. Okay.

277
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I didn't know any of this. But she had a

278
00:13:16,159 --> 00:13:19,279
very unique class name. I'm like, certainly she's in, and

279
00:13:19,320 --> 00:13:21,519
she to her and I had two finals in her class.

280
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The next day she came and picked me up and

281
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I was like, I'm not drunk, like I'm like doctor.

282
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I won't say her name. I'm like, I'm not drunk.

283
00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:30,720
I'm like it was just bad luck again bad luck.

284
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And she like put me to bad and gave me

285
00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:35,639
saltine crackers and water and she's just like, don't come

286
00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:38,200
to class tomorrow. Like I was, like, I was up

287
00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:40,080
studying late and I just had two glasses of wine

288
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like and she's like, uh huh okay, but like we'll

289
00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:45,639
figure it out later. And we did. We figured it

290
00:13:45,639 --> 00:13:50,279
out later. I took my finals eventually, but not that day. Wow.

291
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Speaker 1: Okay, see this is I didn't even know about this,

292
00:13:54,039 --> 00:13:59,039
so this is this is good indications. But you're only

293
00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:01,360
twenty one. You're like, there's just no way.

294
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:02,559
Speaker 2: That's there's no way.

295
00:14:02,919 --> 00:14:03,799
Speaker 1: It's all a fluke.

296
00:14:04,159 --> 00:14:06,679
Speaker 2: Yeah. Like in meetings when I see people get sober

297
00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:08,600
before they're twenty one or they're just barely twenty one,

298
00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:10,080
I used to be like resentful at them, like you

299
00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:13,159
don't even know, like you don't know what life is

300
00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:15,200
like and how things. I'm like, Okay. Meanwhile, you hear

301
00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:16,799
them talk and they're like, well i've been drunk since

302
00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:18,679
thirteen and this and this and this happened. I'm like

303
00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:21,519
then I'm like, oh baby, thank God, like thank God,

304
00:14:21,639 --> 00:14:23,720
I'm like this baby. It was just jealous that like

305
00:14:23,879 --> 00:14:26,200
my life couldn't I couldn't get my shit together sooner.

306
00:14:26,759 --> 00:14:28,480
But then all these other things wouldn't have happened if

307
00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:30,159
I didn't go in the right order, right, So like

308
00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:33,960
you know, proceed to like be persona non grata places

309
00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:35,600
in New York, and I worked at a big law firm,

310
00:14:35,639 --> 00:14:38,159
and so we worked hard, played hard, like partied hard

311
00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:41,159
and all the things. And when I started feeling like

312
00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:42,799
I was wearing out my welcome, and I you know,

313
00:14:43,039 --> 00:14:45,960
got arrested two times there just just being drunk, like

314
00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:49,080
like you know, trying to like be rude to a

315
00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:52,360
cabby or whatever, and I mean all the things. So

316
00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:55,000
I decided that I wanted to be jacketing.

317
00:14:55,159 --> 00:14:57,919
Speaker 1: Rude to a cabby doesn't get you arrested, no.

318
00:14:58,080 --> 00:15:01,039
Speaker 2: Like it was like I think, what was the second one?

319
00:15:01,039 --> 00:15:03,039
I don't even remember, Like I did literally have to

320
00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:05,279
like look myself up. I mean, that's how many times

321
00:15:05,399 --> 00:15:07,600
these things have happened. Like one time I punched abound

322
00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:12,399
her like just I mean had no business, like well,

323
00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:15,240
my like this big giant dude like and my friends

324
00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:17,679
were visiting. One of them was a bridesmate of my

325
00:15:17,679 --> 00:15:21,360
wedding this year too, which we you know, have conversations

326
00:15:21,399 --> 00:15:23,120
about that night. But she was like she had just

327
00:15:23,159 --> 00:15:26,320
got married at twenty one, like came to New York

328
00:15:26,360 --> 00:15:28,080
with her in law, like her sister in law and

329
00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:30,039
stuff to like have a fabulous weekend with her like

330
00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:33,639
college roomy, and I get arrested and they didn't know,

331
00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:36,039
so like We're supposed to meet for brunch the next

332
00:15:36,159 --> 00:15:38,279
day and I'm a no show, so like I ruined

333
00:15:38,279 --> 00:15:40,200
their weekend because they were just like searching for me,

334
00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:42,559
like wondering if I was okay, and they finally like,

335
00:15:43,399 --> 00:15:45,840
thankfully she knows me. She like eventually called jails or

336
00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:48,919
whatever and figured out where I was, and it was awful,

337
00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:51,600
Like so it was like so embarrassed, Like.

338
00:15:52,279 --> 00:15:55,120
Speaker 1: But you're twenty one again, that's the theme, Right, You're

339
00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:59,519
only twenty one, so you continue drinking. Now you're law firm.

340
00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:04,600
Things are good. I'm I'm guessing people drink like you drink.

341
00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:07,360
Speaker 2: And I think something. I didn't want to be around them, right,

342
00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:09,639
Like I thro out of myself, Like I just posted

343
00:16:09,679 --> 00:16:12,480
about this too, like I surrounded myself with people who

344
00:16:12,559 --> 00:16:15,080
drank like I did, and especially at least one or

345
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:17,320
two people who I deemed were like worse than me,

346
00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:19,879
because like, I can't be an alcoholic. They she is

347
00:16:19,879 --> 00:16:23,960
the alcoholic. Like please like and and god love anyone

348
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:26,519
who dared to try to like even mention like maybe

349
00:16:26,519 --> 00:16:28,360
taking a look at my drinking, I will cut you.

350
00:16:28,399 --> 00:16:30,480
I will cut you out of my life bye. Like

351
00:16:30,879 --> 00:16:31,279
that's it.

352
00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:33,840
Speaker 1: I had a friend that I talked about in my

353
00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,960
book Drunkish, Uh who were? Who is my person that

354
00:16:38,039 --> 00:16:41,879
I was like, okay, when whenever he would drink. After

355
00:16:42,039 --> 00:16:45,559
two drinks, his personality changed. He started kind of slurring,

356
00:16:45,559 --> 00:16:47,879
and it was like, oh god, there he goes, here goes,

357
00:16:47,919 --> 00:16:50,960
he's such an alcoholic. Whereas I could look at myself

358
00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:53,639
and go, well, I didn't. My personality doesn't change, Like

359
00:16:53,679 --> 00:16:56,799
I get friendlier, like I make out with random guys. Yes,

360
00:16:56,840 --> 00:17:00,440
I do some stuff I regret. Yeah, I some times

361
00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:03,159
get in arguments with people or you know, and throw

362
00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:08,240
up the whole next day. But that's not alcoholism. That's alcoholism.

363
00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:10,480
Isn't that so classic that we all do that?

364
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:13,720
Speaker 2: Well? I always said, I'm like, like, you're two kinds.

365
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:16,319
Like when you drink, it's like you either puke or

366
00:17:16,359 --> 00:17:18,759
you black out. I was a blacker outer. I never puked,

367
00:17:18,759 --> 00:17:20,359
and I was like, I just wish I was a

368
00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:22,319
puker because then I could like keep the party going

369
00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:25,759
and understand and like know what's going on. Hello, Hello everyone.

370
00:17:25,759 --> 00:17:27,920
There's a third type of person who drinks, a normal

371
00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,119
person who like whatever that is, I guess, but like

372
00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:32,160
can have two glasses of wine. It didn'tven occur to me.

373
00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:34,039
I was like, there's two, there's two. No, no, no, there's

374
00:17:34,079 --> 00:17:36,880
three and four and five, Like there's people gonna have

375
00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:38,599
a glass of wine or two and just be done

376
00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:41,240
like it was, And it wasn't every time, So that's

377
00:17:41,279 --> 00:17:43,559
for me. Like I had like an alter ego. Her

378
00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:45,759
name was t Rex Deemed in college. That was like

379
00:17:45,759 --> 00:17:47,839
who's coming out tonight? Like if t Rex is coming out,

380
00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:50,680
she is not invited. This is like an ongoing joke

381
00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:54,880
in my friend group still still is and I'm like, okay, well,

382
00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:57,160
because we didn't know, like if it was two drinks

383
00:17:57,279 --> 00:17:59,440
or the twentieth drink. Sometimes I would just have a

384
00:17:59,480 --> 00:18:03,240
blast and not ruin your wedding. Or I would just

385
00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:06,039
tie it on and just be a clown like in

386
00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:10,440
everything was about me, you know, just making a scene

387
00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:13,000
telling people they weren't good enough to talk to my friends,

388
00:18:13,079 --> 00:18:15,079
like I would dress them down, like if you didn't

389
00:18:15,079 --> 00:18:17,599
make my drink fast enough, I would let you know

390
00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:19,559
that you probably should should have gone to college and

391
00:18:19,559 --> 00:18:21,799
maybe you wouldn't have to be a bartender. Who am

392
00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:24,759
I to say that stuff? I was a bartender server

393
00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:27,839
for years, like even after college. My first job in

394
00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:30,039
New York was like at Elbeck steak House in Chelsea,

395
00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:32,960
Like it's like not memorous. Yes, there is an oltback

396
00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:35,839
in New York or there was. That's the next question

397
00:18:35,839 --> 00:18:37,319
I always get is like there was an outback in

398
00:18:37,319 --> 00:18:38,519
New York going there was sto.

399
00:18:40,839 --> 00:18:41,079
Speaker 1: And that.

400
00:18:43,319 --> 00:18:45,079
Speaker 2: Oh who doesn't must.

401
00:18:45,319 --> 00:18:48,359
Speaker 1: Okay, So you're so so you get arrested a couple

402
00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:50,200
of times while you're at a law firm, do you

403
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:51,200
almost get fired?

404
00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:55,000
Speaker 2: No, not that one that's later. That's my last drunk.

405
00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:57,319
I was working at a labor and employment law firm

406
00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:01,160
and they were like they I know later that they

407
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:03,319
did know where I was at the two days that

408
00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:06,480
I know called no show to work, but they didn't.

409
00:19:06,759 --> 00:19:10,039
It couldn't fire me because it's like they'd already run

410
00:19:10,079 --> 00:19:14,200
background tracks on me, like all these things. So but

411
00:19:14,319 --> 00:19:17,119
so I moved to Chicago, so like fast forward. I

412
00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:18,680
was like, Okay, I'm done with New York. You know,

413
00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:20,200
everything's fine. I'm like, I want to move back to

414
00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:22,200
the Midwest, but not I'm from Minneapolis. I'm like, I

415
00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:24,440
don't want to move like home to the Twin Cities

416
00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:26,640
because that's too close. So I'm like, the guys are

417
00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:28,680
really tall in Chicago, Like let's go.

418
00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:32,920
Speaker 1: There, like public transportation on the public transportation.

419
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:35,480
Speaker 2: Not as short as the guys in New York. Sorry

420
00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:39,440
starting my short kings in New York. But uh and

421
00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:43,519
you know, I I just fell into like a total

422
00:19:43,559 --> 00:19:45,880
party group, like that's what it was like. It was

423
00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:48,160
like they weren't like real friends for the most part

424
00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:51,640
except for one and it just started it all over there.

425
00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:58,880
And then uh my, then I became pregnant and had

426
00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,480
my son when I was I got pregnant twenty nine,

427
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:03,599
had him at thirty, and I was like, Okay, I'm

428
00:20:03,599 --> 00:20:06,119
going to be an adult now, like I'm in a serious,

429
00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:10,519
committed relationship with an amazing person and let's let's let's see.

430
00:20:10,519 --> 00:20:12,960
And so he didn't really we weren't dating all that long,

431
00:20:13,039 --> 00:20:17,920
so he really didn't know like a past as she

432
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:21,640
had not met t Rex yet and not and so

433
00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:23,680
you know, he knew I was a party girl, but

434
00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:26,559
like I'm a proper mother now, so like let's not

435
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,440
do that. And and like, you know, two weeks after

436
00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:31,119
I gave birth, when my girlfriends came to town, it

437
00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:33,079
was just like off to the races a little bit.

438
00:20:33,079 --> 00:20:34,720
And he probably just thought that was a one time

439
00:20:34,799 --> 00:20:36,039
thing because you know whatever.

440
00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:39,079
Speaker 1: So like blowing off steam. Knew mom, she's under a

441
00:20:39,119 --> 00:20:40,880
lot of pressure, exactly.

442
00:20:41,559 --> 00:20:44,640
Speaker 2: Someone was. Yeah, my son was born in early December,

443
00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:47,200
and so for Easter through that year, we were going

444
00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:51,680
home to see my family and and he hadn't met

445
00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:53,640
all my friends yet honestly at this point. So like

446
00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:55,279
we were gonna have one night to go out with

447
00:20:55,279 --> 00:20:57,440
the friend group while my parents were watching the baby.

448
00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:01,160
I mean, we all know what happened, right. It's like

449
00:21:01,599 --> 00:21:04,519
it's like I total t Rex to the point where

450
00:21:04,519 --> 00:21:06,519
I couldn't even tell him my parents address because like

451
00:21:06,759 --> 00:21:08,519
he was gonna drive us back, so like one of

452
00:21:08,559 --> 00:21:10,400
my friends had to tell him the address. I was

453
00:21:10,559 --> 00:21:13,519
like just berating everyone, just being horrible. And he had

454
00:21:13,519 --> 00:21:16,240
never seen me like that, and so and my parents.

455
00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:20,559
When he told my parents, they were like, well, yeah,

456
00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,759
so the next morning they sent me down Easter morning.

457
00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,319
She's not in jail though, so this is right exactly,

458
00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:28,200
so this is just like not that bad, but so

459
00:21:28,319 --> 00:21:30,160
like my son's like four or five months old, and

460
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,279
they all like have like a mini like it wasn't

461
00:21:32,279 --> 00:21:34,240
an intervenure, but it was like a conversation that morning

462
00:21:34,279 --> 00:21:35,640
before we went on our Easter ig hunt with the

463
00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:39,200
family and everything, and they were like, last night was unacceptable.

464
00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:41,279
You have a week. You have a week to get

465
00:21:41,279 --> 00:21:46,119
into a program something, or there's gonna be consequences, you know,

466
00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:48,200
Like this is just like it's my it's my boyfriend

467
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:50,440
and my parents, right, just the two of them, or

468
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,200
my dad and my step mom. And then I'm like,

469
00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:56,000
you guys are overreacting. Let's like, let's not ruin his easter, okay,

470
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:59,440
like honestly, like I again like not owning anything, like

471
00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:02,400
like I'm the one who ruined it, obvious very clearly now.

472
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,440
But so we just went out with the day and

473
00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:05,839
I'm like, I can't believe everyone's so mad at me,

474
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:08,839
Like this is crazy. And fast forward a week later

475
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:12,680
the next Sunday, that morning, my boyfriend is like, hey, honey,

476
00:22:12,799 --> 00:22:15,079
like you haven't gone to a meeting yet, like were

477
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,680
you gonna are you gonna do that? And I'm like, yeah,

478
00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:20,200
I have all day, Like calm down. So I like

479
00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:23,400
waltz into the like wicker Park allan Oak club, like

480
00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:26,440
I own the place, and oh man, it was like

481
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:29,279
me and four dudes and they were so nice, so kind,

482
00:22:29,319 --> 00:22:31,559
thank god, thank god. It wasn't like a creepy bunch

483
00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:33,640
or a weird bunch. They were just like there wasn't

484
00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:35,200
even a meeting. They just like let me cry for

485
00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,279
an hour and tell my story and whatever. And they

486
00:22:38,279 --> 00:22:40,680
were like we we want women to stick with women

487
00:22:40,759 --> 00:22:42,160
and men to stick with men, so we're not gonna

488
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,440
give you our phone numbers again, great move. Not everybody

489
00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:46,680
does that. And they're like, but we don't think you're

490
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:49,200
gonna call anyone so here like Michelle whoever was on

491
00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:51,359
the phone. So I'm like, oh, you know, and like

492
00:22:51,599 --> 00:22:53,480
maybe my sponsor. You know. It's like all this stuff.

493
00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,119
And that lasted a couple months, Like I was in

494
00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:59,319
and out, in and out for a while, like and

495
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:04,279
I don't wish that on anyone, Like it was so awful.

496
00:23:04,319 --> 00:23:05,640
I mean it was so awful, like I would leave

497
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:07,200
meetings and go to the bar like I would like.

498
00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:11,079
You know, we our relationship ended, you know, we co

499
00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:14,720
parented very well since then, but only since I've been sober.

500
00:23:14,759 --> 00:23:17,880
I guess, like there was other incidences and then I

501
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,000
was sober for I was going to meetings for about

502
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:23,119
two and a half years, had nine months sober and

503
00:23:23,799 --> 00:23:27,720
uh and and blew it. And then after that I

504
00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:30,680
couldn't get any time for like four years. And so

505
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:32,400
fast forward to tell me.

506
00:23:32,319 --> 00:23:34,359
Speaker 1: About because I feel like a lot of people have

507
00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:39,319
this experience, you know, tell me about getting nine months,

508
00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:41,599
And I know that getting nine months for a lot

509
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:44,599
of people, especially if you're going to meetings is like hardcore,

510
00:23:44,799 --> 00:23:47,680
Like you're in nowise right, So what was the what

511
00:23:47,759 --> 00:23:49,559
was the thing that made you just go fuck it?

512
00:23:49,599 --> 00:23:53,440
Speaker 2: I don't care, So I'll say in between that when

513
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:55,440
my son's father and I split up, we moved to

514
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:57,240
my son and I moved back to Minnesota so I

515
00:23:57,279 --> 00:24:00,279
could be closer to a family and more record more

516
00:24:00,279 --> 00:24:06,200
destruction happened there and got arrested again, not kidding, And

517
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:10,559
it was like a really dangerous situation that I don't

518
00:24:10,559 --> 00:24:12,920
really want to like go into that like fine today,

519
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:15,680
but it was. It was. It was awful and but

520
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:18,640
again not my last bottom as we know. And so

521
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:21,720
then I was like hardcore in a like doing the thing,

522
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:23,839
and we were in a custody battle because he was

523
00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:25,680
like okay, like I let you kind of move home

524
00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:28,319
closer to your family so he could be like safe,

525
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:30,960
and that's not what happened. So what's the point. So

526
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:32,640
like we were going back and forth, back and forth,

527
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,200
and our son was like living with me for three

528
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:38,119
weeks in Chicago in Minnesota and then his dad for

529
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:40,680
three weeks in Chicago when he was like between eighteen

530
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:43,720
months and three years old. Is awful. So it's pure

531
00:24:43,759 --> 00:24:46,079
hell to like not have my toddler for three weeks

532
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:47,960
at a time, Like, I mean, it was just sad.

533
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:49,519
It was like the hardest time of my life. Like,

534
00:24:51,599 --> 00:24:53,759
so we ended up like the court was just going

535
00:24:53,839 --> 00:24:55,319
to drag on, and the judge at one point was

536
00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:56,759
like I'm either going to make a decision today or

537
00:24:56,759 --> 00:24:58,240
we're going to have to like take this to trial,

538
00:24:58,240 --> 00:24:59,799
and if we go to trial, it's going to be

539
00:24:59,799 --> 00:25:01,599
all your family involved all this stuff. And I was

540
00:25:01,599 --> 00:25:03,160
like out of money. I was paying more money to

541
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,880
my attorney than I was to rent. At that point,

542
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:08,960
I had borrowed from family, taken out loans, like I

543
00:25:09,039 --> 00:25:11,400
was done. So I knew that if he said we're

544
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,240
going to trial, I was just going to give in

545
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:15,319
with like kind of like a list of demands, like

546
00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:16,920
you pay for us to move back, you pay for

547
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:19,720
his furniture, whatever, and so yeah, the judge was like, yeah,

548
00:25:19,759 --> 00:25:21,319
I know, we're going to keep this going, and I

549
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,680
was like nope. So my attorney gave his attorney a

550
00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:26,200
list and we moved back. So I was really like

551
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:28,279
on shaky ground because that was definitely the scene of

552
00:25:28,319 --> 00:25:30,079
the crime. Like I did not want to move back

553
00:25:30,079 --> 00:25:33,200
to Chicago. I just did not want to move back.

554
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:35,960
I moved back kicking and screaming. Got a great job.

555
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:37,319
It was like the highest paid job I ever had

556
00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:40,079
at the time. And at the end of week one

557
00:25:40,279 --> 00:25:42,440
was going to be their summer outing to take a

558
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:46,160
bus to see the Cubs play the Brewers in Milwaukee.

559
00:25:46,519 --> 00:25:48,759
So I had my Red Bulls Stephanie. I was ready,

560
00:25:48,839 --> 00:25:51,039
like I was prepared, except for I brought one of

561
00:25:51,039 --> 00:25:54,359
my old party friends with me instead of like somebody safe,

562
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:57,079
somebody from the program something like that, and so like

563
00:25:57,279 --> 00:25:58,880
before we even got on the highway, I was like,

564
00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:01,000
I can have a beer. I'm like, I mean, what's

565
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:03,559
a beer? Who cares? And like my friend she knew

566
00:26:03,599 --> 00:26:05,240
I was over, but she's like are you sure, Like,

567
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:07,559
oh yeah, yeah, I'm like that I'm not that person anymore.

568
00:26:07,599 --> 00:26:11,759
She's like, okay, let's go blackout ended up where I

569
00:26:11,799 --> 00:26:13,960
did not need to be. They had They were so

570
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:15,640
concerned about me because I just like left the game

571
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,279
at some point and they were like, we have to

572
00:26:17,279 --> 00:26:18,759
get her on the bus to go back to Chicago,

573
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,359
my brand new job that I have five days and

574
00:26:21,799 --> 00:26:23,680
like woke up where I shouldn't, had tick train back

575
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:25,920
by myself the next day, and then I was in

576
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,319
and out, in and out for two and a half years.

577
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,920
Speaker 1: That sounds so reasonable, though, I mean, you know, I

578
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:36,839
was talking to somebody or somebody said maybe like in

579
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,920
a meeting, that relapse, like what you think of as

580
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,359
a relapse is usually after you've had a period of

581
00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:46,519
sobriety and then you make the decision to drink again.

582
00:26:47,079 --> 00:26:51,160
But really, for somebody who has a drinking issue like

583
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:54,039
I did, I had a million relapses. A relapse can

584
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:55,720
just be that you go like I'm never going to

585
00:26:55,799 --> 00:26:57,920
drink again. Oh you know what, this is my last

586
00:26:58,279 --> 00:27:01,319
episode mm hmm. With Sean Daniels. That's what we were

587
00:27:01,319 --> 00:27:05,680
talking about. But like the quiz, but I've had so

588
00:27:05,759 --> 00:27:09,079
many because I used to really separate that in my mind, like, well,

589
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:12,400
I haven't had a relapse, but I have many times

590
00:27:12,519 --> 00:27:16,559
I've tried to get sober very hard and then been

591
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,440
like this is too hard or this is stupid, or

592
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:21,519
I'm not really I don't really have a problem, and

593
00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:25,480
drink again, And it is very hard to get the

594
00:27:25,559 --> 00:27:27,960
your mojo back up. You know. It's like anything. It's

595
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,160
like if you're on a diet and then you go

596
00:27:30,279 --> 00:27:33,640
like screw it up having some cookies. Yeah, sometimes like

597
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:37,039
for me because I'm also a cookie aholic, then I'm

598
00:27:37,079 --> 00:27:39,319
off to the races. Then it could be a year

599
00:27:39,519 --> 00:27:42,400
before I can like grow cookies again.

600
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:46,680
Speaker 2: Well, like it was like a personality, Yeah, it's same, right,

601
00:27:46,799 --> 00:27:48,960
And this is kind of like this is where I

602
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:50,440
want my writing to take me, and this kind of

603
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:52,279
like I have a substack about it and everything, and

604
00:27:52,319 --> 00:27:56,599
it's like that we're all recovering from something, right, like everyone,

605
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:59,799
whether it's food, lot of sex workoholism. People forget that

606
00:27:59,799 --> 00:28:03,599
that's a real thing, right, sugar, Like and if you

607
00:28:03,759 --> 00:28:06,960
really don't have any of these with that phone phones,

608
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:12,440
oh my gosh, one hundred percent percent addiction, all of it,

609
00:28:12,519 --> 00:28:15,240
and so like it's like, even if you really have

610
00:28:15,319 --> 00:28:16,960
never suffered from any of those things, we all know

611
00:28:17,000 --> 00:28:19,440
someone who has. Like you don't have to know someone

612
00:28:19,519 --> 00:28:23,000
who is necessarily an alcoholic who's like in the drugs

613
00:28:23,039 --> 00:28:25,559
whatever it is. But like that like to have to

614
00:28:25,599 --> 00:28:29,119
save space for people who you don't know what they're

615
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:32,000
going through right the whole, Like like just because somebody

616
00:28:32,039 --> 00:28:33,599
looks a certain way or whatever, Like you have no

617
00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:36,519
idea what people are walking around with. Like I don't

618
00:28:36,519 --> 00:28:38,799
think people would like look at me and be like

619
00:28:39,279 --> 00:28:43,160
multiple arrests or you know, all the things. And it's

620
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,640
like that's that's where my story took me. And and

621
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:48,599
it could have certainly it could have been worse. But

622
00:28:50,039 --> 00:28:52,319
you know, I I you're in the rooms too. Like

623
00:28:52,359 --> 00:28:54,400
people are like, well, you know, I never got in trouble,

624
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,200
I never gotten youtuis. I'm like I had to have consequences.

625
00:28:57,440 --> 00:28:59,720
I knew about two months before I got sober, I

626
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:01,039
said my best friend at the time, I was like,

627
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:03,079
I feel like I need to get back to a

628
00:29:03,359 --> 00:29:06,640
and like meetings and stuff. And she's like, well, go ahead,

629
00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:08,400
Like why what's stopping you. I was like, I don't know.

630
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:10,519
I just like I feel like I'm waiting for something

631
00:29:10,519 --> 00:29:12,640
to happen. And she's like why you know, And then

632
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:16,680
something happened. Right, It's like had I just and I coincidentally,

633
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,000
this is what a lot of us too. I had

634
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:21,200
been going to therapy. I had my first therapy session

635
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:25,200
the week before that that night, and she's like tell

636
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:26,759
me everything, and tell me how much you drink. And

637
00:29:26,759 --> 00:29:29,319
I'm like, oh, just like same as everyone else, like whatever,

638
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:33,480
downplaying it and yeah. And then like fast forward a

639
00:29:33,519 --> 00:29:35,680
week later, I had a session that morning and got

640
00:29:35,759 --> 00:29:37,319
arrested that night because she's like, yeah, I think you

641
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,559
might have PTSD and I was like, I've never seen war,

642
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:45,519
you know. It's like that's not don't have to say more,

643
00:29:45,839 --> 00:29:48,279
you know. And I was diagnosed with ADHD too, so

644
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:53,039
no shocker. So anyway, so it was like I was

645
00:29:53,119 --> 00:29:55,079
kind of like dealing with all that, had a headful

646
00:29:55,119 --> 00:29:57,400
of that and then just like burn my life down

647
00:29:57,480 --> 00:29:57,880
that night.

648
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,640
Speaker 1: You know, you're living okay, so take us you that

649
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:02,799
so this is the bottom bottom.

650
00:30:03,039 --> 00:30:05,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're lot, you know, So what actually happened?

651
00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:09,599
Speaker 1: Yeah, although I think he did you drink again after that? Nope,

652
00:30:09,759 --> 00:30:12,519
I was in jail, okay, but you were still weren't sure,

653
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:14,759
so you I still wasn't shore on this date with

654
00:30:14,839 --> 00:30:17,039
a guy and then you're like, I don't like this guy.

655
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:19,759
They didn't get in an argument with an Uber driver.

656
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 2: I believe it was a regular taxi because at that

657
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,799
point I was literally banned from Uber and left because

658
00:30:25,839 --> 00:30:29,000
my rating was so low. That's that's the thing, guys,

659
00:30:29,039 --> 00:30:31,559
that can happen. It's no longer I have a great

660
00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:34,880
score now. But yeah, so I was trying to get

661
00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:36,759
into a regular tax and he's like sorry, man, I'm like,

662
00:30:36,839 --> 00:30:38,519
I'm actually here for someone else. And I was like,

663
00:30:38,559 --> 00:30:40,440
your light was on, like this, these are the rules,

664
00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:41,799
Like I thought. I was like in New York or

665
00:30:41,839 --> 00:30:45,039
something back ten years before, and I remember I had

666
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:47,720
red hunter boots on because it was raining, and I

667
00:30:47,799 --> 00:30:49,599
was like kicking his door like like my rubber boots

668
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:51,640
are going to do anything, but like these and we're

669
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:53,519
was like in the Gold Coast of Chicago. It was

670
00:30:53,519 --> 00:30:55,799
like right outside of Italy on Ohio Street, and like

671
00:30:56,079 --> 00:30:58,480
these cops were like noticing a commotion and they walk

672
00:30:58,519 --> 00:31:01,000
over and be like, what's going on and were like, sorry, sir,

673
00:31:01,119 --> 00:31:02,920
you go on with your night, like we got her

674
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:04,279
like and they were just they were just trying to

675
00:31:04,319 --> 00:31:05,640
be helpful and wanted to get me where I needed

676
00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:08,559
to go, which was probably home to bed and so

677
00:31:08,839 --> 00:31:10,279
it was pouring rain, so they're like, just at the

678
00:31:10,319 --> 00:31:12,839
back of our squad, you're not in trouble, you're not arrested, like,

679
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:15,720
just calm down a little, which women love to be

680
00:31:15,759 --> 00:31:17,920
told that, And so I get in the back and

681
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:19,799
then I just had like a panic, I guess, because

682
00:31:19,839 --> 00:31:22,640
I realized the doors like did not open. And again

683
00:31:22,759 --> 00:31:25,559
I wasn't really in any trouble then, but while they

684
00:31:25,559 --> 00:31:27,960
were talking I and I they weren't deciding what to

685
00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:29,359
do with me fast enough I guess. I don't know.

686
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,599
Again I don't remember, but I spit through the partition,

687
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,000
like how gross, and so a little bit a spit

688
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:38,079
gone on both of them. So that was two felony

689
00:31:38,079 --> 00:31:43,359
assaults and from there I was definitely arrested and it

690
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:44,440
was not looking good for me.

691
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 1: So then You're like you needed to call work, Well

692
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:50,599
you needed to call your ex husband or your boy.

693
00:31:50,559 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, because so my what we were never married, but yeah,

694
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,720
he it was a Wednesday, and he used to have

695
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:58,400
my son on Wednesday and Thursday nights, and so we

696
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,640
would do like five days on, two days off, two

697
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:02,599
days on, five days off. So this was going into

698
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,759
his five day on stretch. So in my mind, but

699
00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:08,559
like our if son was still young, so we would

700
00:32:08,559 --> 00:32:10,599
still text every single day, like he got to school,

701
00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:13,759
this happened, homework, whatever, and so it would be really

702
00:32:13,759 --> 00:32:15,599
weird if I'm not texting him back, like if he's

703
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:17,680
telling me whatever, or if my text were going on red,

704
00:32:17,799 --> 00:32:19,880
or or if his text were to me we're going

705
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:24,559
on red. So yeah, so like I didn't do my

706
00:32:24,559 --> 00:32:26,559
phone call that day because I thought I was gonna

707
00:32:26,559 --> 00:32:29,279
be getting out, And so I'm in line. Everyone's lined

708
00:32:29,359 --> 00:32:31,680
up waiting to talk to the judge, and every single

709
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:33,559
person before me came out in tears and I was

710
00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:35,839
in there. They were like, you know, he's so brutal

711
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:37,680
today and like and like they had all been there,

712
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:40,000
like they knew the guy I don't know. And so

713
00:32:40,799 --> 00:32:44,640
I go in and and my quarter pointed attorney, like

714
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:46,359
she told me what happened. She was like, oh, and

715
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:47,839
you have a job and you do this and whatever.

716
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:49,480
She's like, do you have five hundred dollars in your

717
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:52,599
bank account? I was like, yeah, yes, barely. She's like,

718
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:54,680
you'll probably have a five thousand dollars bond five hundred

719
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:56,480
to get out. You're fine, Like you're gonna be fine.

720
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:58,880
I'm like, okay, okay. So I was like, my turn,

721
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,480
and you you get like twenty seconds, thirty seconds, and

722
00:33:01,519 --> 00:33:04,200
he's like, ma'am, looks like you didn't take care of

723
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:06,599
all your stuff in New York, so we think you

724
00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:09,279
might be a flight risk and a fifty thousand dollars bond.

725
00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:12,680
Next I was like what, Like I had no idea

726
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:14,720
what I was talking about because I thought I had

727
00:33:14,759 --> 00:33:16,559
cleaned up all my stuff in New York and so

728
00:33:16,559 --> 00:33:18,200
it would have cost five thousand dollars to get out,

729
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:21,200
which I did not have. And you also can't get

730
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:22,720
out on your own. You have to have someone come

731
00:33:22,759 --> 00:33:25,799
get you. And it was like if you're not out

732
00:33:25,839 --> 00:33:29,319
by like eight pm, you're there overnight. And so it

733
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,880
was like this, it's like a movie really like so

734
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:34,119
then we but it was totainly like two in the afternoon,

735
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:35,319
so I'm like, I have plenty of time now, i

736
00:33:35,319 --> 00:33:38,839
will take my phone call, thank you. But they put

737
00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:40,640
us through this metal detector and all this stuff, and

738
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:42,240
if you had a wired bra, you had to take

739
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:44,400
it off and all this whatever. So like anyone with

740
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:46,440
the sports bra was like in luck. I did not

741
00:33:46,599 --> 00:33:48,920
because I was on a date. So I'm like still

742
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,160
in my red boots and the whole thing. And this

743
00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:54,000
girl like kind of like ruined it for everyone. She

744
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:56,599
whispered to me that like she's still was keeping her

745
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:58,200
braun or I don't know what it was. But they

746
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:01,119
sent us all back through. It took hours, like hours

747
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:02,680
and hours, and I was the dead last one to

748
00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:05,039
have a phone call because all the numbers I had

749
00:34:05,039 --> 00:34:07,039
memorized were long distance and they're like, you can't call

750
00:34:07,119 --> 00:34:09,239
long distance. I'm like, I don't know any local numbers.

751
00:34:09,679 --> 00:34:11,280
So it was just it was just drama, and so

752
00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:14,280
I had to stay overnight, get issued the clothes, shower

753
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:17,960
with everyone, the whole thing, and the next.

754
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:20,559
Speaker 1: Morning I feel like I would have elected not to shower,

755
00:34:21,039 --> 00:34:24,519
like I'm always telling you, you, oh they make you shower?

756
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:30,519
Speaker 2: Why because I don't know. I don't know, but.

757
00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:33,079
Speaker 1: They can't be that concerned with cleanliness.

758
00:34:33,159 --> 00:34:35,280
Speaker 2: Well, I you would think, but like they don't. They

759
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:37,440
also don't want anything to break out, like if somebody

760
00:34:37,519 --> 00:34:41,039
has like lice or so. I don't know, like I

761
00:34:41,079 --> 00:34:43,360
assume it's because if you have some kind of communical

762
00:34:43,679 --> 00:34:45,679
disease or like something on your body. I don't. I

763
00:34:45,679 --> 00:34:46,440
have no idea.

764
00:34:46,679 --> 00:34:47,599
Speaker 1: Okay, they make.

765
00:34:47,519 --> 00:34:50,039
Speaker 2: They make you, they make you, and like so I

766
00:34:50,119 --> 00:34:51,320
was like, oh my god, I hope I get out

767
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:53,239
the next Oh. So when I did finally finally get

768
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:55,199
my phone call, they did let me call my father

769
00:34:56,119 --> 00:34:59,679
long distance in Minnesota and at that time, but by

770
00:34:59,679 --> 00:35:02,280
that time, everyone on the outside had figured out where

771
00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:04,199
I was and what it was going on. And so

772
00:35:04,599 --> 00:35:06,440
when I called, and I know this though, right, So

773
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,480
I call and he's like are you kidding me? You know,

774
00:35:09,519 --> 00:35:10,840
just starts laying into me, and I was like, Dad,

775
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:12,760
I have less than three minutes. Everyone else got as

776
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:14,360
much time as they wanted, but they were like, you

777
00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:16,320
you get three minutes. So I was like, please, we

778
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:17,840
can talk about all this later. I need you to

779
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:19,199
write some things down. So I was like, gave him

780
00:35:19,199 --> 00:35:21,239
my boss's email address. I'm like, send her an email,

781
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,440
tell her family emergency boom. I'm like, message my friend

782
00:35:24,760 --> 00:35:26,840
on Facebook, who I know looks at her messages. She's

783
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:29,920
in town. Send her the money, get me out please,

784
00:35:30,079 --> 00:35:32,760
like like all this stuff. And because he doesn't have Facebook,

785
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,360
my stepmom did, and so like like and they and

786
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:37,159
like I'm still friends with this person to this day.

787
00:35:37,199 --> 00:35:38,760
And she came to my wedding this year, and so

788
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,280
she so she knows my parents in this really weird way,

789
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:43,440
and they obviously they make jokes about it now, but

790
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:47,280
it's very funny like that, Like I coordinated all this

791
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:49,840
in my head before I even got the call, and

792
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:51,519
I still didn't know then. And then he's still talking

793
00:35:51,519 --> 00:35:53,039
me in the phone, hangs up, So I don't know

794
00:35:53,559 --> 00:35:57,559
is he coming, is my friend coming? Is anyone coming?

795
00:35:57,599 --> 00:35:59,360
I don't know. So it was a Friday morning, So

796
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:01,719
that was Wednesday night, was late late that I got arrested,

797
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:03,280
and so I was in jail that night. Then I

798
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:07,360
was in jail Thursday night, Friday morning. They like, I'm

799
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:10,239
sitting at the table eating like you know, warm milk

800
00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:12,480
and cereal or I don't know whatever, and and there's

801
00:36:12,559 --> 00:36:14,239
nothing to do and there was like a stack of books,

802
00:36:14,239 --> 00:36:16,639
but they're all big books. That's it, just big books.

803
00:36:16,639 --> 00:36:20,320
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, so books, big book of Alcoholics is

804
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:21,639
what you're talking about, Like.

805
00:36:22,079 --> 00:36:23,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, reading.

806
00:36:25,159 --> 00:36:27,559
Speaker 1: Jackie Daniel Steel of books.

807
00:36:27,599 --> 00:36:30,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, exactly number Daniel Steel. And then they called

808
00:36:30,519 --> 00:36:32,639
my name, they butchered my name over the loud speaker,

809
00:36:32,639 --> 00:36:34,440
and all the girls were like, we knew you're getting

810
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:36,280
out of here today. And like I'll tell you though,

811
00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:38,880
there was girls in there who had like been there

812
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:41,039
for two months because they wrote a bad track, because

813
00:36:41,079 --> 00:36:43,239
they needed to buy formula or stuff for their for

814
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:46,039
their kids. And I'm just like, I'm just horrified, Like

815
00:36:46,079 --> 00:36:48,360
it's just it's just horrifying that because they couldn't afford

816
00:36:48,519 --> 00:36:51,159
the bail there, they're still there. I'm like, is that

817
00:36:51,159 --> 00:36:53,800
that's what we're doing with I don't know. I could

818
00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:54,559
go on about that, but.

819
00:36:55,079 --> 00:36:57,719
Speaker 1: Why did I think you were there for nine days?

820
00:36:57,840 --> 00:36:59,159
Or had that been a different story?

821
00:36:59,199 --> 00:37:02,559
Speaker 2: Fridays was my college around had reports to jail after

822
00:37:02,639 --> 00:37:05,920
college and you know, I went to school in like,

823
00:37:06,519 --> 00:37:08,880
you know, north of the Twin Cities and it was

824
00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:12,639
like you know, Hicksville, uh jail. So it wasn't like

825
00:37:12,679 --> 00:37:14,880
anyone serious, wasn't there all.

826
00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:18,159
Speaker 1: Right, So then you get you get picked up picked

827
00:37:18,199 --> 00:37:18,920
a friend.

828
00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 2: By my friend, and she's she's like the opposite of me.

829
00:37:22,519 --> 00:37:24,880
She's like Pollyanna. She's like a public school teacher, is

830
00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:27,280
the sweetest person. Our kids like went to like elementary

831
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:29,400
school together. And she and I was like and then

832
00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:30,679
it dawned on me. I was like, are you supposed

833
00:37:30,679 --> 00:37:33,119
to be at work? She's like, yeah, I called in today,

834
00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:35,280
I'm here for you. I'm like, oh my god. Finally,

835
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:36,559
so we had to go back to the jail that

836
00:37:36,599 --> 00:37:39,679
I got first was like like pross the stat to

837
00:37:39,679 --> 00:37:42,679
get my belongings. I had like one hundred and eighty

838
00:37:42,679 --> 00:37:45,639
three missed calls, like two hundred text messages because I

839
00:37:45,679 --> 00:37:47,119
was like supposed to go to lunch with people. My

840
00:37:47,159 --> 00:37:50,400
boss was wondering where I was. Everybody everybody. So I

841
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:53,920
was just overwhelmed and I just felt disgusting and nasty.

842
00:37:54,119 --> 00:37:57,239
And I get home and I went to go shower

843
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:01,320
and uh and before I got that, I was warming

844
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,599
up the shower and I called my one friend and

845
00:38:03,639 --> 00:38:05,639
she wouldn't care if I said her name, Kristen that

846
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:07,719
was still in the program that I knew from Chicago

847
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:10,119
because I hadn't been a meeting since so long. And

848
00:38:10,159 --> 00:38:12,800
I was like, hates me, you know, told you know?

849
00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:15,480
And I was like, stuff happened and you know, I

850
00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:17,440
had to go to jail. And she's like, uh huh,

851
00:38:17,599 --> 00:38:19,239
she remember that meeting. We used to go to and

852
00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:22,239
Andersonville on Friday nights. Like Jason was her boyfriend at

853
00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:23,480
the time. She's like, Jason and I will be there

854
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,360
like we always are. We you know, I'll see you there.

855
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:26,960
I'm like, did you hear me? I just got out

856
00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:28,360
of jail. I can't go to a I can't go

857
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:30,440
to a meeting tonight. She's like, do you have some

858
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:32,440
what's else to be? And then hung up on me.

859
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:36,599
I was like what what? So I showered, took a

860
00:38:36,599 --> 00:38:38,159
little nap, and then I went. I went to the

861
00:38:38,159 --> 00:38:42,639
meeting and I'm going ever since. Wow, she was a

862
00:38:42,679 --> 00:38:44,639
brands made at my wedding and I know I would.

863
00:38:44,679 --> 00:38:47,320
And then we both met like our husbands like two

864
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:49,400
months apart. They have rhyming names. So I got to

865
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:53,599
see her get married and it it's been it's been lovely.

866
00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:57,679
Speaker 1: So when you went to that meeting, you were just

867
00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,000
beaten down enough.

868
00:38:59,199 --> 00:39:01,719
Speaker 2: Right me, I was done. I was out of options,

869
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:06,559
so sick of my shit, like I I didn't know. Oh. Also,

870
00:39:06,679 --> 00:39:09,199
while I was in jail, my ex got to order

871
00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:11,440
a temper order of protection against me, and he was like,

872
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:13,840
get your shit together or don't. Either way, you won't

873
00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:18,559
see our son for five weeks. So that you know

874
00:39:18,599 --> 00:39:20,440
I did not get sober for my child. I'll say

875
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:23,199
that I got sober for me, and lots of people

876
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:27,719
have benefited from it, obviously my son. But when I

877
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:29,159
tried to get sober for him in the past, it

878
00:39:29,159 --> 00:39:31,480
didn't work. So like I can't make my child my

879
00:39:31,559 --> 00:39:35,199
hower power or my parents or anyone else, right like,

880
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:37,280
it was like it was for me. But so I

881
00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:39,360
just I didn't mean too. I didn't really know what

882
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:41,599
a ninety and ninety is, which is ninety meetings and

883
00:39:41,679 --> 00:39:43,920
ninety days, but I started doing that because I'm like,

884
00:39:44,079 --> 00:39:46,760
what else do I have to do. I'm facing criminal charges,

885
00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:50,400
I might lose my job, i might lose custody of

886
00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:53,199
my son, and I just didn't. I was like, okay,

887
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,239
Like the only thing I know how to do is

888
00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:57,079
go to meetings. So I just kept going to meetings

889
00:39:57,119 --> 00:39:59,960
and Three days later, on a Monday night, I met

890
00:40:00,159 --> 00:40:03,360
might then sponsor at a women's meeting that she spoke

891
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:04,960
and I was like, I want what she has. Let's

892
00:40:05,039 --> 00:40:08,440
let's talk. And then when I moved to California, she

893
00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:10,760
moved to Florida and where she's still like a guardian

894
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:12,920
angel in my life and I love her dearly. That

895
00:40:13,039 --> 00:40:15,760
was before COVID, when like you, you wanted to have a

896
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:17,760
sponsor that you can meet with in person and like

897
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,239
see and now lots of people have long doescent sponsors

898
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:24,679
it doesn't matter. But so I credit her thoroughly for

899
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:26,559
not being she She was exactly what I needed. She

900
00:40:26,599 --> 00:40:29,800
was kind and gentle and not like super pushy where

901
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:34,639
I used to sponsor hop and had like I don't know, yeah,

902
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:36,679
I was all over the place before, but she kind

903
00:40:36,679 --> 00:40:39,119
of set me on a good path, and the thing

904
00:40:39,199 --> 00:40:40,920
is started working out.

905
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:44,639
Speaker 1: I was looking at something on Reddit the other day

906
00:40:44,679 --> 00:40:48,920
that was somebody just like trashing twelve step meetings, and

907
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,880
I was thinking, you know, what else do you have

908
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:54,320
to do? I mean, it's yeah, it's not for everyone,

909
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:57,400
you know, and I can see people feeling it's very culty.

910
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:59,599
And somebody was like, it's so bad for you? You know,

911
00:40:59,639 --> 00:41:04,159
then i'll you're doing is going to meetings. It's like, yeah,

912
00:41:04,199 --> 00:41:09,440
and the alternative is getting arrested or you know, being.

913
00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:11,599
Speaker 2: Those hospitals and institutions as we say, and.

914
00:41:11,639 --> 00:41:15,360
Speaker 1: It's like, it's what I don't understand. I guess what's

915
00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:19,960
so bad about the idea? I mean, and listen, I'm

916
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,840
not somebody who went to meetings all day long, but

917
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:26,760
even if I did, who cares like, But at the beginning,

918
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:29,280
I was so doing like four or five times a week,

919
00:41:29,599 --> 00:41:32,920
and I made friends and yeah, so yeah, you know,

920
00:41:33,119 --> 00:41:36,599
I never got super religious, I mean, or even that spiritual.

921
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:38,480
So what so you say a prayer at the end,

922
00:41:38,519 --> 00:41:42,000
you're you're basically here's what it is. For anybody that

923
00:41:42,199 --> 00:41:44,639
feels that way or scared of it, It's like it's

924
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:49,559
people telling their story. And for me, it was the

925
00:41:49,639 --> 00:41:52,199
ability to exhale and go, oh my god, I'm not

926
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,599
the only one like other people I feel like this,

927
00:41:55,679 --> 00:41:58,960
And then it makes you feel better and supported. And

928
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:02,440
it's people that are like, nobody's pushy, nobody's coming to

929
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:05,480
your house. Listen. I almost joined a cult before where

930
00:42:05,559 --> 00:42:07,760
people literally showed up at my house. It was the

931
00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:11,079
nam Mia horangue Ko people and they really want you

932
00:42:11,119 --> 00:42:15,840
to join up. And they came to my apartment where

933
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:17,719
I was staying and tried to make me go to

934
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:20,960
like a meeting. No one's gonna do that. Nobody cares.

935
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,679
Nobody really cares that much if he stay sober or

936
00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:24,599
don't know.

937
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:27,519
Speaker 2: And that's the thing. It's so funny, you say. So

938
00:42:27,679 --> 00:42:30,400
when I went back to what was my old home group,

939
00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:32,760
it was like a seven to fifteen am meeting that

940
00:42:33,159 --> 00:42:36,639
met on Michigan Avenue. You know, everyone gets it in

941
00:42:36,679 --> 00:42:39,039
before work. So I crawled back there. I hadn't been

942
00:42:39,079 --> 00:42:41,639
there in two and a half years, and I'm like,

943
00:42:41,679 --> 00:42:43,679
I wonder if I'm going to know anyone. And they're like, hey,

944
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:45,840
good to see, glad to see you didn't die. I

945
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:48,159
have a seat. You're like, no, I wasn't special. They

946
00:42:48,199 --> 00:42:50,920
weren't like, oh my god, welcome back, like I had

947
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:53,599
your seat waiting. They're just like cool, like they were

948
00:42:53,639 --> 00:42:55,880
just happy that I was alive. And I sat in

949
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:57,519
the corner and just like cried for ten days. And

950
00:42:58,119 --> 00:43:00,719
finally this old timer she was like are you gonna

951
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:02,519
like are you gonna talk? Are you going to share?

952
00:43:02,599 --> 00:43:04,360
And like let people get to know you again and

953
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:06,199
like tell us what's going on so you can help

954
00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:07,719
other people. I'm like, oh, you think they want to

955
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:14,360
hear my story get herself, but you know, it's like,

956
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,199
here's my thing? Is it? Like? Does does that twelve

957
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:20,199
step program have the monopoly on sobriety? Absolutely not. There's

958
00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:25,039
she recovers, there's uh, you know, so many different things. Yes, yes,

959
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:30,599
the smart recovery and what's her name? The man? I

960
00:43:30,599 --> 00:43:31,559
love her. She's an author too.

961
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:34,719
Speaker 1: She's uh naked mind.

962
00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:37,280
Speaker 2: I love Naked Mind too. Her best friend and not

963
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:39,639
Holly you but the other one. You got her name?

964
00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:42,039
Speaker 1: Yes, we are the lucky ones.

965
00:43:42,119 --> 00:43:46,119
Speaker 2: We are the luckiest. So so she has a horror community. Yeah,

966
00:43:46,119 --> 00:43:49,800
and so I did some of that. No, no, no, no, no,

967
00:43:50,039 --> 00:43:52,280
it's oh my god, it's gonna drw me. Her book

968
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:54,360
is like on my shelf. I can see it. It's fine.

969
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:56,199
Speaker 1: It's we are the luckiest though, right.

970
00:43:56,079 --> 00:43:59,239
Speaker 2: Wait, yes, but her name is because I just literally

971
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:01,119
just got an email for this morning because I'm on

972
00:44:01,199 --> 00:44:04,599
her female thing. Now it's gonna bug me. Oh.

973
00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:10,519
Speaker 1: Laura McCowan, Laura McCowan, Laura McKenna, Laura McCallen. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yes.

974
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:13,800
Speaker 2: So I'm just saying it's like it's like it's fine

975
00:44:13,840 --> 00:44:16,119
if people want to hoopoose something they don't know, but

976
00:44:16,159 --> 00:44:18,480
like that's also literally in the book Big Book, right,

977
00:44:18,519 --> 00:44:21,320
it's like contempt prior to investigation, Like you know nothing

978
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:24,559
about it, but yet you're gonna trash it. And because

979
00:44:24,559 --> 00:44:26,400
you met one person who turned into a crazy person

980
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:28,239
because they went into meetings or something, like one thing

981
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:31,320
does not necessarily have to do with the other. And

982
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:34,960
I don't know, I'm like the alternative was much worse

983
00:44:35,159 --> 00:44:35,440
for me.

984
00:44:36,039 --> 00:44:37,960
Speaker 1: Nobody goes and I've tried to stay.

985
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:42,519
Speaker 2: Sober without meetings and I was crunchy af like it

986
00:44:42,599 --> 00:44:45,280
was I was not my best self, okay.

987
00:44:45,199 --> 00:44:49,239
Speaker 1: And honestly, like people don't do something as drastic as

988
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:52,079
sit in a room and go I'm a strangers polick

989
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:56,360
to a groom full of strangers unless they are done,

990
00:44:56,599 --> 00:45:00,599
unless they feel desperate. I mean that's why we say,

991
00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:03,239
like I wish you desperation. I wish you to get

992
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:06,280
to a point where, even if it's a high bottom,

993
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:09,599
even if it's just like like you can not go

994
00:45:09,679 --> 00:45:12,079
to jail. I've never been to jail. I've never had

995
00:45:12,079 --> 00:45:14,440
the threat of having my kids taken away. My husband

996
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,960
didn't leave me. I didn't have any of those things

997
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:20,719
that people might look at and go but nothing bad

998
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:24,079
has happened to me. But I felt disgusting, and I

999
00:45:24,159 --> 00:45:27,719
knew for a fact that I would drive drunk again

1000
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,920
because I was like, I have proven to myself. At

1001
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:33,119
this point, I was forty two, and I was like,

1002
00:45:33,519 --> 00:45:36,360
that's much like you, but in a different way. I

1003
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:38,480
was like, but that's what I do when I when

1004
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:42,280
I drink, I make bad decisions. When I drink, I

1005
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:46,079
think I'm fine, and I think it's fine for me

1006
00:45:46,119 --> 00:45:49,639
to drive, even though if I was sober and saw

1007
00:45:49,679 --> 00:45:52,199
someone else do that, I'd be like, are you kidding

1008
00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:56,880
me right now? Like this person's like so I was like, well,

1009
00:45:57,039 --> 00:45:59,599
I know that when I drink that something takes over

1010
00:45:59,639 --> 00:46:03,440
my personersonality. Maybe not t Rex, but something happens where

1011
00:46:03,559 --> 00:46:07,519
I go. I'm better than you. How dare you question

1012
00:46:07,679 --> 00:46:10,800
my drinking Like you're the asshole, not me? Like that

1013
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:14,360
thing happens where I go. No, it's everybody else, woe

1014
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:17,360
is me? Like, and I have to get home, so

1015
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:20,199
of course I'm going to drive because I'm fine. And

1016
00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:24,239
then because obviously the last time I drank and drove

1017
00:46:25,159 --> 00:46:27,719
was not the only time I've ever driven drunk, obviously

1018
00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:31,960
far from it. And also once I had kids, and

1019
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:34,400
once I had three kids, I wasn't going that far

1020
00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:37,079
or going out that much. So you know what I mean,

1021
00:46:37,119 --> 00:46:39,960
I'm like, at the one opportunity that I have that

1022
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:45,119
I'm somewhere with my kids, I drive drunk, like who

1023
00:46:45,159 --> 00:46:47,039
knows what's next for me? And when I woke up

1024
00:46:47,039 --> 00:46:51,159
that next day, I felt that incomprehensible demoralization, and then

1025
00:46:51,239 --> 00:46:56,360
I knew I was done. So that's why it works,

1026
00:46:56,519 --> 00:47:00,480
because you already feel like I need help, I give up, right,

1027
00:47:00,559 --> 00:47:04,800
And I think that it's a miracle, no matter no

1028
00:47:04,840 --> 00:47:08,400
matter what, like I said, no matter if you've gone, damn.

1029
00:47:08,159 --> 00:47:11,639
Speaker 2: Matter how far down the scale we have gone, Yes

1030
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:14,320
we have gone, you know. I mean that's why, like

1031
00:47:14,639 --> 00:47:15,960
you know, the Big Book we were talking about, like

1032
00:47:16,000 --> 00:47:18,800
it's split up into three sections in the back about

1033
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:21,039
stories of like like they got it in time, or

1034
00:47:21,039 --> 00:47:22,960
like they almost didn't get or whatever the three things are.

1035
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:25,159
But it's like I don't want people to have to

1036
00:47:25,159 --> 00:47:28,079
go all the way down the ladder that I went right,

1037
00:47:28,559 --> 00:47:32,000
And and if somebody wants to just call themselves sober

1038
00:47:33,079 --> 00:47:35,519
and not alcoholic, like lots of people, I think one

1039
00:47:35,559 --> 00:47:38,320
of the biggest barriers for people to take a look

1040
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:41,599
at their own drinking or to stop for an extended

1041
00:47:41,639 --> 00:47:43,519
period of time or forever or forever one day at

1042
00:47:43,519 --> 00:47:45,480
a time, it's because they don't want to call themselves

1043
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:47,840
an alcoholic because it has the stigma. Still, I'm like,

1044
00:47:48,079 --> 00:47:52,760
that's fine, y'all can call yourself whatever you want, Like,

1045
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,599
like it's like substance use disorder. Yeah, yeah, I have

1046
00:47:55,639 --> 00:47:59,119
that too, right, it's also called alcoholism. It's like whatever,

1047
00:47:59,199 --> 00:48:01,800
I don't care. I'm not in labels. I for myself

1048
00:48:01,880 --> 00:48:04,519
call myself an alcoholic. I go to meetings with people

1049
00:48:04,519 --> 00:48:07,679
who say my name is Tara and I'm sober. That's fine.

1050
00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:09,079
I don't judge you. Like, if you don't want to

1051
00:48:09,159 --> 00:48:11,800
use that label, cool, Like is your life better today

1052
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:14,280
because you don't have alcohol in it? Great? But like

1053
00:48:14,320 --> 00:48:17,800
don't let that stop you from like like please, for

1054
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:19,320
the love of God, don't let that stop you. Because

1055
00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:21,280
it's like there's a saying right like that, I'd rather

1056
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:24,760
spend I'd rather spend my whole life calling myself an

1057
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:27,480
alcoholic than than trying to than than the rest of

1058
00:48:27,480 --> 00:48:30,519
my life trying to prove that I'm not. It's exhausting.

1059
00:48:30,559 --> 00:48:32,760
I do not miss the mental gymnastics that it took

1060
00:48:33,199 --> 00:48:34,960
to like plan my nights out. Who am I going

1061
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:36,119
to drink with? How am I going to pay for it?

1062
00:48:36,119 --> 00:48:37,719
When's that going to be? When can I get out

1063
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:41,320
of here to go drink some more? Or I O.

1064
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,760
Speaker 1: One thing that helps me to stay sober? And I

1065
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:47,440
you know, I love I love talking about the staying

1066
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:50,679
sober part because a lot of people can get sober,

1067
00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:54,320
can quit, right, it's the staying quit that's really hard.

1068
00:48:54,639 --> 00:48:57,159
And what one of the things that I do is

1069
00:48:57,239 --> 00:48:59,760
I look at how often I've gone back and forth

1070
00:48:59,800 --> 00:49:02,519
with sugar, right, So for me, sugar is are real addiction.

1071
00:49:02,599 --> 00:49:05,400
And if I have cookies or cake or whatever, I

1072
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:09,280
really can't stop at one piece of cake like or

1073
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:13,800
I can. But it's that moderation, it's the mental gymnastics.

1074
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:16,239
It's the but the cake still in the house, so

1075
00:49:16,519 --> 00:49:19,079
like maybe I'll just have like maybe I'll just have

1076
00:49:19,159 --> 00:49:21,320
one more bite of a second piece, but I won't

1077
00:49:21,360 --> 00:49:23,119
eat the whole second piece. I'm not going to do that,

1078
00:49:23,159 --> 00:49:24,880
I'll just have a I'll just have one more bite

1079
00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:27,559
because I don't feel full enough yet, right, And then

1080
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:30,440
it's okay, I'm just gonna have the second piece. And

1081
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:32,000
then I have the second piece, and it's like, well,

1082
00:49:32,039 --> 00:49:34,920
now you had two pieces of cake being picked, so

1083
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:36,719
what it might as well just eat the rest of

1084
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:39,400
the freaking cake. You know. It's that thinking. Okay, So

1085
00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:42,960
what I do is I take that and whenever I go,

1086
00:49:43,519 --> 00:49:47,000
you know, it's been sixteen years since I've had a

1087
00:49:47,119 --> 00:49:50,440
drink or whatever. My life is so different now, like

1088
00:49:51,480 --> 00:49:54,440
I could have if I think maybe I could have

1089
00:49:54,480 --> 00:49:56,079
a glass of wine, you know, or if I see

1090
00:49:56,119 --> 00:49:58,480
somebody enjoying a glass of wine and I go, I

1091
00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:01,960
wouldn't it be nice to just like chill in bed

1092
00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:04,000
with my husband and I watching TV and have like

1093
00:50:04,039 --> 00:50:06,199
one glass of wine like he has one drink. I

1094
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:10,599
just remind myself, you've never ever, even when you have

1095
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:15,119
had one glass of wine, you aren't happy because this

1096
00:50:15,199 --> 00:50:17,320
is what your brain does. And I go, I have

1097
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:20,719
more recent examples of how I eat sweets, and I go,

1098
00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:25,079
this is what how you do substances. Why do you

1099
00:50:25,239 --> 00:50:28,880
think it's suddenly going to be different with alcohol, like

1100
00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:31,440
why do you think your brain will revert from being

1101
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:34,599
that person? And I go, yeah, you're right. I can't

1102
00:50:34,639 --> 00:50:36,840
eat candy. I can't eat one piece of candy, so

1103
00:50:37,039 --> 00:50:39,000
I won't be able to have half a glass of

1104
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:41,400
wine or one glass of wine. And even if I can,

1105
00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:45,280
it'll be hard and I'll be overthinking it and I'll

1106
00:50:45,320 --> 00:50:47,840
be like white knuckling it and I'll be like, nope,

1107
00:50:47,920 --> 00:50:50,239
you already had a glass of wine. If you break

1108
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:52,360
that and you have two, then I'm gonna be You're

1109
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:54,320
gonna be worried about your you know who wants to

1110
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:55,840
get back into all that When I could just be

1111
00:50:55,920 --> 00:50:57,960
like I'll just not have it.

1112
00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:01,559
Speaker 2: It's exact. It's so so so exhausting, and I you know,

1113
00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:04,440
I when I was in my relapse mode, where like

1114
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:06,800
I'd like have a week, two weeks, three weeks, I

1115
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:09,599
would like lie about my time. I mean, I accepted

1116
00:51:09,639 --> 00:51:12,039
chips when I didn't have the time. That was because

1117
00:51:12,039 --> 00:51:13,920
I was just so sick of my own shit. But

1118
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:18,239
I like like the more time I got, and the

1119
00:51:18,239 --> 00:51:19,480
more time I got, I'm like, oh my god, this

1120
00:51:19,559 --> 00:51:21,320
is how many more people I'd have to be accountable too,

1121
00:51:21,639 --> 00:51:24,320
as well, so like that was that was a big

1122
00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:27,000
part of it for me, Like I would say, like

1123
00:51:27,039 --> 00:51:30,400
the mental obsession was lifted like fairly early, and for me,

1124
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:32,239
it wasn't like a physical addiction. And that's one of

1125
00:51:32,239 --> 00:51:34,480
the other reasons that kept me coming out or coming

1126
00:51:34,519 --> 00:51:36,159
back to the rooms too, because I'm like, I'm like,

1127
00:51:36,159 --> 00:51:38,400
I don't drink every day, Like I can't be an alcoholic.

1128
00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:40,199
I don't drink every day, Like there are also people who

1129
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:42,440
can have a glass of wine every day or something

1130
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:44,760
to drink every day and not at all being an alcoholic. Right,

1131
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:46,880
it's like what happens to you or you could you

1132
00:51:46,880 --> 00:51:49,360
could drink four times a year and absolutely being an alcoholic.

1133
00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:51,079
If it's like the reasons that you drink, right, it's

1134
00:51:51,119 --> 00:51:53,599
like if you're drinking to get drunk, you're drinking to

1135
00:51:53,639 --> 00:51:56,760
oblivion because you think this is your safe space or

1136
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,280
you deserve it, or like if you had my life,

1137
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:01,679
you drink too, Like all these things we tell ourselves,

1138
00:52:02,119 --> 00:52:05,360
Like it's like, you know, I don't, I don't. I

1139
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:07,800
don't miss any of that, and and I don't care

1140
00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:10,199
if people like think it's weird that I don't drink,

1141
00:52:10,239 --> 00:52:13,000
like what but I tried to like try starting dating sober.

1142
00:52:13,719 --> 00:52:16,599
I like toyed with like putting it on my profile

1143
00:52:16,880 --> 00:52:19,400
or like whatever, and like finally I made a decision

1144
00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:21,159
at one point that I'm like, you forced someone goes

1145
00:52:21,159 --> 00:52:22,679
on a first day with me, they but they better

1146
00:52:22,679 --> 00:52:24,159
know that I'm sober. And then I'm a single mom,

1147
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:27,079
Like I don't want that to be an issue. I

1148
00:52:27,079 --> 00:52:28,360
don't want that to come up. I don't want to

1149
00:52:28,400 --> 00:52:31,199
be awkward, Like that's just that's who I am, you know.

1150
00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:35,280
Speaker 1: So, and then you met a boy, a guy.

1151
00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:38,239
Speaker 2: I met a boy, Yeah, a boy.

1152
00:52:37,880 --> 00:52:39,239
Speaker 1: And then he accepted you.

1153
00:52:40,079 --> 00:52:45,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, he rex it's great. He definitely like it's funny,

1154
00:52:45,800 --> 00:52:48,239
Like not funny, it's awesome that I have like my

1155
00:52:48,239 --> 00:52:50,599
group of college friends who've seen me through it all,

1156
00:52:51,039 --> 00:52:52,880
and like we're on like a text chain. It's like

1157
00:52:53,039 --> 00:52:55,400
twelve to fifteen girls deep, like and he's just like,

1158
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:57,960
what is this even? And so they'll they'll tell stories

1159
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:01,800
and it's like, yeah, I could see that. I'm cool.

1160
00:53:01,840 --> 00:53:04,199
He always says, I'm glad I met you in this chapter, right,

1161
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:07,440
Like he's like, I'm sure you were lots of fun, honey,

1162
00:53:08,039 --> 00:53:10,159
but like he's like super glad to have met me

1163
00:53:10,559 --> 00:53:13,199
here and like we say, like you know, he's enormy,

1164
00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:15,760
like he can take her leave alcohol. He barely drinks,

1165
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:18,039
like and when he has like half a Guinness, I'm like,

1166
00:53:18,079 --> 00:53:20,239
why are you not finishing it? What are we doing?

1167
00:53:20,280 --> 00:53:22,559
Why are you not ordering another one? Like you're almost done?

1168
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:28,199
Because I'm good? Same, Like what is that? Like that's

1169
00:53:28,199 --> 00:53:30,440
how I know too, because it's like it doesn't bother

1170
00:53:30,559 --> 00:53:32,840
me when he drinks. Like you know, we got married

1171
00:53:32,840 --> 00:53:35,119
in Mexico earlier this year at an all inclusive resort

1172
00:53:35,159 --> 00:53:36,960
and I had some friends in sobriety be like, oh

1173
00:53:37,039 --> 00:53:39,000
my god, are you gonna let people drink at your wedding?

1174
00:53:39,039 --> 00:53:41,800
I'm like, oh, and I don't have a choice because

1175
00:53:41,800 --> 00:53:44,159
it's like it's like open season at these places. I'm like,

1176
00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:45,920
I got so drunk at all their weddings. It's the

1177
00:53:46,039 --> 00:53:48,039
least I could do to put the bell at mine,

1178
00:53:48,199 --> 00:53:51,920
like come on, Like, but yeah, he's uh, you know,

1179
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:54,599
I maybe I think he's seen flashes of t REX

1180
00:53:54,599 --> 00:53:57,199
when I get like mad, you know, or just like

1181
00:53:57,519 --> 00:54:00,000
when I was on like hormones for the IVF and stuff,

1182
00:54:00,239 --> 00:54:03,960
like the nurse one said to us, like you might

1183
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:06,440
be a little spicy when you take these and and

1184
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:08,159
I was like, what She's like, you know what I mean.

1185
00:54:08,199 --> 00:54:10,639
He's like, oh, I know what you mean. So whenever

1186
00:54:10,679 --> 00:54:12,840
I got like that was like, oh spicy, Mama's coming.

1187
00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:15,800
But so that that's a little cuter than t Rex.

1188
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:18,880
And you know, I always remember what happened the next day.

1189
00:54:19,039 --> 00:54:23,079
Speaker 1: So yeah, and you have a baby, no, and you

1190
00:54:23,239 --> 00:54:27,639
got to experience like new motherhood sober, like you get

1191
00:54:27,679 --> 00:54:29,800
and I's present at all.

1192
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:31,800
Speaker 2: It's fun. And you know, I got sober when my

1193
00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:36,199
son was seven and he so for one month only, Stephanie,

1194
00:54:36,280 --> 00:54:39,079
I have a seventeen month old and a seventeen year

1195
00:54:39,079 --> 00:54:41,519
old because he just turned seventeen last week and so

1196
00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:45,840
and she just turned seventeen months. So you know, I

1197
00:54:45,880 --> 00:54:48,199
when people, like when people get sober, they're like, what

1198
00:54:48,199 --> 00:54:49,679
do you hope for your life or whatever? Like you're

1199
00:54:49,679 --> 00:54:51,360
talking to your sponsor, and I'm like, oh, I hope

1200
00:54:51,360 --> 00:54:53,039
I don't get fired, Like I hope I don't lose

1201
00:54:53,079 --> 00:54:55,400
custining my son. This wasn't like I've never had a

1202
00:54:55,440 --> 00:54:57,239
vision board in my life, but this was this would

1203
00:54:57,239 --> 00:54:59,280
not have been on my vision board to like get married,

1204
00:55:00,119 --> 00:55:04,239
have a baby, at forty four, Like no, like I

1205
00:55:04,360 --> 00:55:07,199
just so It's like I couldn't dream big enough, Like

1206
00:55:07,480 --> 00:55:09,599
I couldn't dream big enough of the life I have now.

1207
00:55:09,639 --> 00:55:12,280
I tripled my salary in the first three years because

1208
00:55:12,519 --> 00:55:14,639
they say, like, oh, alcoholics have like a higher than

1209
00:55:14,639 --> 00:55:17,039
an average earning potential. It's like, yeah, when you put

1210
00:55:17,039 --> 00:55:19,159
the shit away and you focus on your career and

1211
00:55:19,199 --> 00:55:22,639
you get stuff done, you know, the sky's the limit.

1212
00:55:22,760 --> 00:55:25,679
Really so so my courr took off.

1213
00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:26,880
Speaker 1: You know.

1214
00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:28,960
Speaker 2: We moved to California when I was eighteen months sober,

1215
00:55:29,440 --> 00:55:32,039
and my son's father moved here too. When we moved

1216
00:55:32,039 --> 00:55:34,320
here together separately, we both transferred with our jobs at

1217
00:55:34,320 --> 00:55:36,239
the time, he lived five blocks away with his partner.

1218
00:55:37,079 --> 00:55:38,920
You know, we got to have them over to celebrate

1219
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:41,920
my son's birthday last week and got takeout and played

1220
00:55:41,920 --> 00:55:44,639
board games, and you know, it's such a different like

1221
00:55:44,679 --> 00:55:47,519
it's like this is definitely the easier, softer way. It's

1222
00:55:47,920 --> 00:55:49,840
you know, as much as like there was ups and

1223
00:55:49,880 --> 00:55:53,760
downs with fertility and in things like our personal life,

1224
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:55,760
Like none of the problems I have today I would

1225
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:59,119
ever trade for the problems I had before. Like you know,

1226
00:55:59,159 --> 00:56:01,440
I was just I just put this on like you know,

1227
00:56:01,880 --> 00:56:04,280
social media whatever I was saying, like there's a trend

1228
00:56:04,360 --> 00:56:08,440
right now that's like I like, I'm not sorry. I

1229
00:56:08,559 --> 00:56:10,000
and then it's like all these things. It's like, I'm

1230
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:11,760
not sorry. I have like the highest credit score I've

1231
00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:13,440
ever had in my life, Like I'm not you know,

1232
00:56:13,519 --> 00:56:16,679
like I've made all the amends financial and otherwise, you know.

1233
00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:20,000
And so it's just it's just I feel like I

1234
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:23,320
can breathe whenever I wake up and don't take a drink.

1235
00:56:23,440 --> 00:56:26,159
Like I just feel like any problem I have is

1236
00:56:26,159 --> 00:56:28,719
definitely solvable. It's never gonna be as bad as it was.

1237
00:56:29,639 --> 00:56:34,079
Speaker 1: So where are you posting all this fabulous sober content

1238
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:36,679
to sort of find you? Where we can read your

1239
00:56:36,719 --> 00:56:37,360
sub stack?

1240
00:56:38,079 --> 00:56:41,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I have. I'll put it in the in

1241
00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:43,920
I'm sure you'll put it in the links here. But

1242
00:56:44,199 --> 00:56:51,920
my substack is at recovering from something. Also that's my Instagram.

1243
00:56:52,079 --> 00:56:55,360
But my my TikTok, which I just started like last week,

1244
00:56:55,400 --> 00:56:58,400
and I am this is a hilarious experience for me.

1245
00:56:58,440 --> 00:56:59,679
I think I'm too old for TikTok. I don't know

1246
00:56:59,679 --> 00:57:06,039
what's happ happening, but it's at Tara Underscore a and

1247
00:57:06,559 --> 00:57:09,440
Underscore seven nine. But like my name on there is

1248
00:57:10,199 --> 00:57:11,840
Tara so Cal sober mom.

1249
00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:14,880
Speaker 1: Okay, well I'll put all these links in the descriptions.

1250
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:16,320
So yeah, So.

1251
00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:18,239
Speaker 2: I'm just trying to like I and you know, on

1252
00:57:18,280 --> 00:57:20,519
the side, I'm trying to build like a public speaking career,

1253
00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:22,440
like just like as a side hustle, Like I want

1254
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:25,039
to go to corporations and talk about like you know,

1255
00:57:25,079 --> 00:57:27,519
how to support sober employees and like that all events

1256
00:57:27,559 --> 00:57:31,280
don't have to be focused and centered around drinking, right,

1257
00:57:31,400 --> 00:57:33,639
Like it's like our reward in society. We do it

1258
00:57:33,639 --> 00:57:35,400
when we're happy, we do it when we're sad, we

1259
00:57:35,480 --> 00:57:37,480
do it after funerals and weddings, and like it just

1260
00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:40,039
doesn't have to be And even if even if you're

1261
00:57:40,079 --> 00:57:42,039
not a sober person, like if you have to speak

1262
00:57:42,039 --> 00:57:43,719
on stage because you're at a conference and you just

1263
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:46,000
want an option for a mocktail, Like why is it

1264
00:57:46,119 --> 00:57:48,320
just sprite? Why is it like oh, you get your

1265
00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:50,639
drink coupon and it's like you can have a dia cooke,

1266
00:57:50,800 --> 00:57:52,960
like make something fun for people, Like it doesn't have

1267
00:57:53,039 --> 00:57:57,960
to be like all alcoholic. You know, it's say corporations

1268
00:57:58,039 --> 00:58:01,199
just don't like I'll do a jobble. I'm sending you

1269
00:58:01,199 --> 00:58:04,039
a bottle of wine. Please don't, I would. I will

1270
00:58:04,039 --> 00:58:09,559
absolutely take a coffee being gift card you know, like yes,

1271
00:58:09,079 --> 00:58:10,880
all good thoughts.

1272
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 1: Thank you so much everybody. What a great conversation, so fun.

1273
00:58:16,679 --> 00:58:19,920
And you and I will talk soon, and I will

1274
00:58:19,920 --> 00:58:24,239
talk to everybody else. Thank you, thank you worked out.

1275
00:58:24,719 --> 00:58:29,760
Speaker 2: Bye, honey, Lie