Speaker 1: Welcome to Macroaggressions. I'm your host, Charlie Robinson. If you're
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Speaker 1: Baby back on the show to promote his new movie
Speaker 1: Our friend, director writer Lely. What's going on? Man, Good
Speaker 1: to see you again. How are you?
Speaker 2: What's going on? Charlie's good to be on your show again.
Speaker 2: And we got a lot of things to talk about.
Speaker 2: This movie is a passion project of mine and it's
Speaker 2: called a Clockwork Shining. It is on Amazon Prime and
Speaker 2: on Apple TV.
Speaker 1: Plus, I know something that the audience doesn't know. Because
Speaker 1: I've watched this movie. You're gonna love it. It's gonna
Speaker 1: really mess with you.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: I've watched a Clockwork Orange and I've watched The Shining,
Speaker 1: of course, as most of us have, and you know
Speaker 1: that there's some weird parts to it. And as a kid,
Speaker 1: you know when I when it first came out and
Speaker 1: I watched these, I must confess I did not understand.
Speaker 1: I didn't get the I didn't get all of the
Speaker 1: layers here, and it probably didn't get many of the layers.
Speaker 1: To be honest with you, this is sort of a
Speaker 1: these are movies that you need to watch a couple
Speaker 1: of times. It seems to be a theme with the
Speaker 1: Kubrick films, right, You kind of sort of have to
Speaker 1: watch it and then watch it again and see if
Speaker 1: you can decipher what he's getting into. But man, I
Speaker 1: had no idea. I had no idea what the subtle
Speaker 1: sort of subtext of The Shining was really about. I
Speaker 1: probably should have now that I think about it. It's
Speaker 1: one of those things you guys, you and Jay Widen
Speaker 1: are lay out a case that is so like you
Speaker 1: just kind of go, oh, of course this is what
Speaker 1: it's about. Why didn't I figure this out sooner? How
Speaker 1: did you? What were what led you to this? And
Speaker 1: you mentioned it as a as a passion project, like
Speaker 1: you just the Kubrick geek or Shining in particular, Like
Speaker 1: what was it about this?
Speaker 2: Well? I'd watched this Shining several times over and over again,
Speaker 2: and I was like, Hey, what am I going to
Speaker 2: find in this movie that people haven't already seen? There's
Speaker 2: been hundreds and hundreds of the worries about what The
Speaker 2: Shining is really about, and I'm rewatching it over and
Speaker 2: over again and I'm like, what am I? What am
Speaker 2: I getting here? What am I looking at?
Speaker 1: Here?
Speaker 2: Like, the movie really doesn't make a lot of sense.
Speaker 2: Charlie the first if you've never watched it before and
Speaker 2: it's your first time watching through it, you're like, what
Speaker 2: is going on here? I don't really understand because there's
Speaker 2: so many plot holes, there's so many continuity eras within
Speaker 2: the movie. There's over seventy five continuity as in The Shining.
Speaker 2: We would be here all day if we would just
Speaker 2: go through, one by one all the continuity as within
Speaker 2: The Shining, and no one has really ever been able
Speaker 2: to explain why those continuity ors are there. Like Kubrick
Speaker 2: is a master filmmaker. He is a perfectionist. He make
Speaker 2: sures that everything is spot on all the time, everything
Speaker 2: is in frame, So it's unlike him to have all
Speaker 2: of these continuity eras in there. And I'm watching it
Speaker 2: and watching it over and over again, and then I
Speaker 2: find a few things that no one has ever seen before.
Speaker 2: It's bran new for this movie, and it connects to
Speaker 2: other things that people have seen within The Shining that
Speaker 2: I wasn't the first person to see, but it connects
Speaker 2: all together. And one of those really big ones was
Speaker 2: that there's a Nazi swastika in the background of the
Speaker 2: gold room whenever they Olmen is giving them a tour,
Speaker 2: whenever Jack first shows up, and there's a swastika that's
Speaker 2: in the background of the gold room, and I was like, oh, wow,
Speaker 2: well this this relates to, you know, what other people
Speaker 2: have seen. At the end of The Shining, when the
Speaker 2: camera pans to that picture of the far away shot
Speaker 2: and then it fades into a close up shot of
Speaker 2: Jack and then it says July fourth, nineteen twenty one,
Speaker 2: which people think that it's you know, about ghosts and reincarnation,
Speaker 2: but it's really not. It's it's an an experiment. The
Speaker 2: whole thing is a giant experiment that's going on up there,
Speaker 2: and Kubrick is not only doing it as an exam
Speaker 2: on the audience, but it's also an experiment within the
Speaker 2: film itself and upon the actors, which I'm sure we'll
Speaker 2: touch upon here later on. But other people have pointed
Speaker 2: out that when that picture fades, you can make out
Speaker 2: a little tiny Hitler mustache on the on Jack's face,
Speaker 2: and that also relates with you know what we believe
Speaker 2: that The Shining is really about, and all the continuity
Speaker 2: rors in the movie. There's so many that I that
Speaker 2: we could have put in there that we just didn't
Speaker 2: really have time for. There's things that will just disappear
Speaker 2: and then reappear later in the frame. In the beginning
Speaker 2: of the movie, when Allman is talking to Jack, this
Speaker 2: is one of the most interesting parts of The Shining
Speaker 2: because it's so unlike Qubrick to really give away what
Speaker 2: the entire movie is about in that first ten minutes
Speaker 2: between Alman, Bill Watson, and Jack that are sitting in
Speaker 2: his office before Jack gets the job, and Olmen is
Speaker 2: basically explaining to Jack, like, hey, this is not a
Speaker 2: physically demanding job. This is a psychological job because of
Speaker 2: the isolation that people go through up here at the
Speaker 2: Overlook Hotel. And then he goes on to explain Grady
Speaker 2: and the things that happened with Grady. So he's telling
Speaker 2: Jack exactly what's going to happen throughout the rest of
Speaker 2: the movie. But it's really subtle, and there's several things
Speaker 2: that happened during that conversation with Jack. There's continuitairs all
Speaker 2: over the place. There's a pin that's on Almond's desk
Speaker 2: that just bounces around the table throughout all the different
Speaker 2: frames and all the cuts of the movie. There's also
Speaker 2: a ashtray on the desk that with a cigarette butt
Speaker 2: in it that disappears in one frame and then reappears
Speaker 2: and then disappears again. So there's continuity errors literally all
Speaker 2: throughout the movie, and no one has ever really been
Speaker 2: able to explain those. And I think that we explain
Speaker 2: the reason why perfectly in our film. Now. We don't
Speaker 2: really come out and tell you, like why, We leave
Speaker 2: it up to you to figure out why.
Speaker 1: I liked I liked I mean, I liked the part
Speaker 1: when you were talking about the Overlook Hotel and Lookout
Speaker 1: Mountain and I just started, fine, I hadn't heard of
Speaker 1: Lookout Mountain until like three years ago. And someone's like, hey,
Speaker 1: did you know that Jared Leto bought it? And I
Speaker 1: was like, what why you buy it? It's like this
Speaker 1: crazy like compound in the Hollywood Hills. I was like,
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? Is he starting a cult?
Speaker 1: You know, kind of jokingly and they're like, maybe, you know,
Speaker 1: I think so possibly he looks like a cult leader.
Speaker 1: And and then you find out about it through like
Speaker 1: the Laurel Canyon years and what was going on? Oh,
Speaker 1: it has a whole history of the Laurel Canyon And
Speaker 1: you go, well, I remember that Dave McGowan wrote about that,
Speaker 1: and and wait a second, wasn't there some other thing
Speaker 1: going on in Laurel Canyon that wasn't necessarily just about
Speaker 1: a bunch of hippies making music? But there was some
Speaker 1: darker components to that, involving, of course, as we know,
Speaker 1: Charles Manson and and his his group and and and
Speaker 1: what was the common denominator there? It's like, well, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of mind control happening, Like okay, so you
Speaker 1: start to wonder as you guys kind of pointed out
Speaker 1: these similarities like Lookout Mountain Overlook Hotel. I don't know,
Speaker 1: I mean there's there's are we talking about?
Speaker 2: Uh?
Speaker 1: Are we talking about a mind control factory? Like? What
Speaker 1: is this place? What's going on here?
Speaker 2: Yeah? That's one of the really interesting things about Lookout
Speaker 2: Mountain because Lookout Mountain was a well, was a military base,
Speaker 2: but there used to be a hotel that sat on
Speaker 2: the exact same spot as Lookout Mountain did. And you're right,
Speaker 2: Jared Letto now owns it, and he supposedly rumored to
Speaker 2: be running some kind of quas a weird cult thing
Speaker 2: out of it, which is rumor and speculation. I would
Speaker 2: like to interview Jared Lettle. We actually, me and Jay
Speaker 2: Widener we actually went up to Laurel Canyon to film
Speaker 2: some stuff and I was like, man, we need to
Speaker 2: get Jared leto in this film. Dude. I'm sure he
Speaker 2: knows all about what this was actually being used for.
Speaker 2: But there used to be a hotel there that looked
Speaker 2: very similar to Stanley Kubrick's Overlook Hotel within the Shining
Speaker 2: It's like almost verbatim what it was, and that hotel
Speaker 2: ended up burning to the ground. And what's interesting is
Speaker 2: that we don't have this in our movie, but in
Speaker 2: the sequel to The Shining, which is Doctor Sleep, at
Speaker 2: the end of the film, the overlook burns of the ground.
Speaker 2: So that's another correlation between this Lookout Mountain Hotel and
Speaker 2: the Shining movie. So whenever the hotel Lookout Mountain Hotel
Speaker 2: burned to the ground, I was in the early nineteen hundred's,
Speaker 2: the Air Force came in and built a studio Air
Speaker 2: Force base right at the exact same spot where this
Speaker 2: Lookout Mountain Hotel used to be, and several movies were
Speaker 2: filmed there by the military. Several are still classified to
Speaker 2: this very day. Nobody really knows exactly what was going
Speaker 2: on up there. People had high ranking, top secret military
Speaker 2: clearance for it. Ronald Reagan high clearance for it. Marilyn Monroe,
Speaker 2: James Stewart, carry Grant, all these high up A list
Speaker 2: actors had top secret security clearance for this military base
Speaker 2: where they were shooting a bunch of movies. And we
Speaker 2: show a lot all the footage that's in our documentary
Speaker 2: is real footage of Lookout Mountain and you just see
Speaker 2: them coming in with like giant like fork cliffs of
Speaker 2: movie reels to go out and be processed. There were
Speaker 2: several recording studios there, there were several films stages. There
Speaker 2: was a nuclear bunker there, there was a helicopter pad,
Speaker 2: and nobody really knows exactly what was happening up there,
Speaker 2: but we do know that that's where the miniature sets
Speaker 2: for the atomic bomb testing videos took place. Those weren't
Speaker 2: actual filming of you know, real atomic bombs dropping and exploding.
Speaker 2: Several people are familiar with this, but they weren't familiar
Speaker 2: with exactly where it was filmed. But it was filmed
Speaker 2: to look Out mountin studios right on top of Laurel Canyon,
Speaker 2: and several people have pointed that fact out that, well,
Speaker 2: you know, if you have a camera that's set up
Speaker 2: and an atomic bomb drops and it destroys the house
Speaker 2: and destroys the surrounding area, then how did the camera
Speaker 2: not get destroyed? I mean, several people have brought that
Speaker 2: up before. It is nothing new, but for the people
Speaker 2: that had don't know about it, I would imagine that
Speaker 2: that's really shocking. But that was filmed that Lookout Mountain.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we get not just the visual inconsistencies that are
Speaker 1: unusual for a Kubrick film, but you also get the
Speaker 1: symbolism that runs throughout the whole thing, which is very
Speaker 1: indicative of a Kupert film. The hand print, the red
Speaker 1: handprint on the ass of the woman that walks by,
Speaker 1: wouldn't have meant anything to me had I noticed it,
Speaker 1: which I didn't, But had I noticed it, it wouldn't have
Speaker 1: meant anything to me until just recently, over the last
Speaker 1: you know, ten years or so, where you start to
Speaker 1: see this symbolism of you know, like Wilson the volleyball,
Speaker 1: the red handprint, Wilson on the volleyball, the you've seen
Speaker 1: Ellen DeGeneres where the red handprint sort of thing. There's
Speaker 1: some sort of child trafficking component to it that I
Speaker 1: think is not great. And when I say the lady
Speaker 1: with the you guys sort of brought it to the
Speaker 1: viewers attention, I was like, first of all, you feel
Speaker 1: kind of stupid for not recognizing it because you've you
Speaker 1: watched the movie, you've seen it, you just maybe weren't
Speaker 1: paying attention. It's like, Okay, how did I miss that?
Speaker 1: But then it's like, well, why did that's a specific
Speaker 1: thing to do. Well, she didn't just some extra on
Speaker 1: the set didn't smack her on the ass. That was
Speaker 1: done on purpose, knowing that Kubrick comes out of this
Speaker 1: world or has interaction with this world. What do we
Speaker 1: make of that handprint?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was one of the things that I seen
Speaker 2: that I seen before events, and I was really the
Speaker 2: first thing a couple of years ago, whenever I brought
Speaker 2: him on the show, before we even decided to make
Speaker 2: this document, and I was like, hey, I was watching
Speaker 2: this movie and there's a lady. Whenever Jack is in
Speaker 2: the Gold Roup and he stands up, he takes an
Speaker 2: alcoholic drink from Lloyd the bartender. The second time when
Speaker 2: the party is going on, he stands up and there's
Speaker 2: lady that walks right behind him, and she's actually the
Speaker 2: one that bumps into Grady to make Grady spill the
Speaker 2: alcohol on Jack. And she has a hanmdprint on her ass.
Speaker 2: Now people have contested this and said that it's not
Speaker 2: really a handprint, that it's a part of the dress.
Speaker 2: But regardless if it's not really a handprint or if
Speaker 2: it's a part of the dress, it still looks like
Speaker 2: a handprint, So regardless if Kubrick actually made it a
Speaker 2: part of the dress, or the costume designer made it
Speaker 2: a part of the dress, or if it's actually a handprint,
Speaker 2: it looks and identifies like a handprint. And it's very
Speaker 2: similar to Wilson on the on the volleyball as well,
Speaker 2: And that kind of relates to this the sexual undertones
Speaker 2: of the Shining because there's a lot of them in there.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of sexual tension between Jack and Danny
Speaker 2: within the movie. It's kind of theorized that it was
Speaker 2: not even theorized, but Jack has abused Danny in the past.
Speaker 2: We have it in the movie where Wendy is talking
Speaker 2: to the doctor in the very beginning of the movie
Speaker 2: and the doctor is essentially like, well, when did he
Speaker 2: first start having these visions, these psychic abilities, And she's like, well,
Speaker 2: it was pretty soon after he broke his arm. And
Speaker 2: the doctor was like, well, how did he break his arm?
Speaker 2: And she was like, oh, well, Jack came home late
Speaker 2: one night, he was drunk and Danny has thrown all
Speaker 2: of his papers all over through the house. So he
Speaker 2: yanked him up, pulled him up by his arm really hard,
Speaker 2: and broke his arm, and then later on when Jack, Well,
Speaker 2: the weird thing about that is that Whindy says, I believe,
Speaker 2: she says five months ago, this happened, right, But whenever
Speaker 2: Jack is talking to Lloyd at the at the bar,
Speaker 2: he says that it was two years ago. So that's
Speaker 2: another really weird continuity in there. Wendy says that it
Speaker 2: was months ago, and Jack when he's confessing to Lloyd
Speaker 2: that he broke Danny's arm, it was two years ago.
Speaker 2: So it's uh. But there's a lot of sexual winding
Speaker 2: window in the shining as well. The things that j
Speaker 2: Jay has pointed out before in his earlier movies, which
Speaker 2: is also in our movie, is whenever Jack first goes
Speaker 2: in to meet Almond and shake his hand, there's a
Speaker 2: clipboard on the table that makes it look like Olman
Speaker 2: has a hard on towards Jack. Later on, whenever Danny,
Speaker 2: Danny and Windy is sitting at a table in their
Speaker 2: apartment room in the hotel, there's a fire truck in
Speaker 2: the background that has the ladder of the fire truck
Speaker 2: like giving the Teddy Bear an erection, which I didn't
Speaker 2: even realize until I was rewatching it and going back
Speaker 2: and uh, you know, trying to find some of these
Speaker 2: photos to you know, use for promotion and like you know,
Speaker 2: take screenshots and put you know, the arrows in the
Speaker 2: circles to put things together so people get a good
Speaker 2: idea so that they'll you know, go and watch the film.
Speaker 2: But after that scene scene where the fire truck is
Speaker 2: and the latter is sticking up from the teddy Bear,
Speaker 2: which is symbolizing you know, the teddy bear is getting
Speaker 2: a hard on, that the bat that Wendy uses is
Speaker 2: also right beside the teddy Bear, and she actually gets
Speaker 2: up and go goes and grabs the bat off of
Speaker 2: the couch. And then the next scene is whenever she's
Speaker 2: going down with the bat, and the famous scene where
Speaker 2: she walks in on Jack and sees that he's not
Speaker 2: really writing a book. He's just writing the same sentence
Speaker 2: over and over. And I hadn't seen that before, which
Speaker 2: is so interesting, Charlie, because every time you watch this
Speaker 2: freaking movie, dude, it's like you find something different. And
Speaker 2: it's been watched so many times, so many people have
Speaker 2: had many different theories. But I really think that the
Speaker 2: theory that we present in this movie is correct theory
Speaker 2: and it is very difficult and hard to argue with
Speaker 2: once you see how everything is laid out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we brought in somebody who has some unfortunate experience
Speaker 1: with ritualistic abuse. Kathy O'Brien came on to the film
Speaker 1: and explained her situation. I just had an interview with
Speaker 1: a woman named Annelie who I was connected with through
Speaker 1: Rich Willett over at Iconic and she's an MK ultra survivor,
Speaker 1: and she tells a story of how she was trafficked
Speaker 1: and where she was trafficked and how that went. It
Speaker 1: lines it pretty comparably with what Kathy O'Brien talks about.
Speaker 1: How what was that relationship like working with her on this.
Speaker 2: Well, I had her on my show several times in
Speaker 2: the past. We had become pretty good friends, and I
Speaker 2: was like, hey, I would really like you to be
Speaker 2: in this movie because I've been planning on making this
Speaker 2: movie for a really long time now, and we decided
Speaker 2: to do jfk X first so we could really cut
Speaker 2: our teeth on something else and then we would be
Speaker 2: able to do this one. Because this required a lot
Speaker 2: of travel and uh more money for the production. As
Speaker 2: you see, because there's several people in this movie you
Speaker 2: got Me.
Speaker 1: It's well done, by the way, it's it's really well done.
Speaker 1: You guys did a good, great job with it, So
Speaker 1: I encourage people to check it out.
Speaker 2: People.
Speaker 1: Mark Devlin's Mark Devlin, So he got on my radar.
Speaker 1: In twenty nineteen, I saw him in an Arkapolco. He
Speaker 1: did a presentation called No More Heroes. I watched that
Speaker 1: with only Damna Guard. We were like, we like made like, Okay,
Speaker 1: we're gonna go to this for sure, We've got to
Speaker 1: watch it. And we gave him a half an hour.
Speaker 1: He needed like three hours to unpack all his stuff
Speaker 1: I had. Then he DJed the parties at Night too,
Speaker 1: which was great. So we got to see his presentation
Speaker 1: on all the rock stars and their ties to intelligence,
Speaker 1: which will blow your mind. And I've had him on
Speaker 1: the show before to talk about that's fantastic. Then we
Speaker 1: got a chance to see what his His other job
Speaker 1: is is a it's always been a DJ. So great
Speaker 1: to see him make an appearance in this film as well,
Speaker 1: because if anyone would know the overlap between government secret
Speaker 1: programs and Hollywood, it would be Mark Devlin.
Speaker 2: Right. Absolutely, Mark was fantastic. He's super articulate, and he
Speaker 2: hit a home run in our movie. I think that
Speaker 2: it's one fantastic and that's one of the things that
Speaker 2: really shocked me. Even as I was making it. Charlie,
Speaker 2: I was like sitting there and he's because we did
Speaker 2: a really long interview with him, and I'm going through
Speaker 2: all this and I'm trying to cut it down because
Speaker 2: you know, when you're making a movie, like you gotta
Speaker 2: cut things out. You just can't let it run on
Speaker 2: forever and ever it doesn't make any sense. So I'm
Speaker 2: sitting there cutting it down and I'm like, holy shit,
Speaker 2: this is the reason why you can be the best
Speaker 2: singer in the world. You could be the best musician
Speaker 2: in the world. You can be the best podcast in
Speaker 2: the world. It's not going to make a difference. You know,
Speaker 2: it doesn't matter how good you can play guitar if
Speaker 2: you don't have the right connections, if you're not connected,
Speaker 2: if you're not a part of the group, if you're
Speaker 2: not in the family, you're not you know, if you
Speaker 2: don't have the right backing behind you, it's not going
Speaker 2: to make a difference. It's not going to matter. And
Speaker 2: Mark Devlin really puts that to the forefront in this
Speaker 2: movie at Clockwork, shining that that is really the case
Speaker 2: because all of the famous musicians, all the bands that
Speaker 2: came up in the nineties all had fathers and or
Speaker 2: family members that were high ranking military officers. Some of
Speaker 2: the ones that he brings up in the movie is,
Speaker 2: of course Jim Morrison. Everyone already knows about Jim Morrison
Speaker 2: that his dad was pretty much responsible while he was
Speaker 2: responsible for the Gulf of Talking Falls flag ins and
Speaker 2: then that got us into the Vietnam War that killed
Speaker 2: thousands of people. But not only that, Bob Marley's father
Speaker 2: was a naval British an officer. Sharon Tate's dad was
Speaker 2: a high ranking military officer. Like all these people, all
Speaker 2: these bands, all these famous musicians, all had families that
Speaker 2: were high up military officers. And it's so strange because
Speaker 2: and Mark talks about it in our film, like you
Speaker 2: never find anybody that just has a normal, normal, regular job,
Speaker 2: Like you don't find any electricians or like plumbers, Like
Speaker 2: there's nobody that has regular everyday jobs. And that really
Speaker 2: stuck with me hardcore because I was like, holy shit,
Speaker 2: this is this is the reason why you can be
Speaker 2: the best at any given thing, any anything, it doesn't
Speaker 2: matter what it is. But if you don't have the
Speaker 2: right connections, you're probably not going to go very far.
Speaker 2: And that's that's a really big realization that I think
Speaker 2: really smacks people over the head within our movie.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, especially when they start to tie into that
Speaker 1: Laurel Canyon acid scene Jim Morrison with the Doors. You
Speaker 1: guys talk about the Beatles. I mean, obviously Tavistock plays
Speaker 1: a role in shaping culture, and there's these these these
Speaker 1: bands are sort of created as opposed to just you know,
Speaker 1: organically coming together. I mean not all of them, of course,
Speaker 1: but the ones that go on to have big social impact.
Speaker 1: Even we start to look at members of the Grateful Dead,
Speaker 1: I mean we've we've I've done shows on that in
Speaker 1: the past too. You almost don't want to look sometimes,
Speaker 1: you if you can't separate the art from the artist,
Speaker 1: you know, you're gonna be like, God, damn it, I
Speaker 1: want I love you too, but I can't deal with Bono,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So you almost like you might.
Speaker 1: That's one rabbit hole that some people might want to
Speaker 1: stop themselves out there, Like I'm gonna just I'm gonna
Speaker 1: hate all of my old music if I do this, well, yeah, maybe,
Speaker 1: but there's some good guys out there too. But for
Speaker 1: the most part.
Speaker 2: How people are you know, kind of upset about the
Speaker 2: you know, the kids TV shows that they were watching
Speaker 2: whenever they grow up, and all this stuff is coming
Speaker 2: out about you know, how horrible Nickelodeon was and like,
Speaker 2: and they don't want to watch it because they don't
Speaker 2: they don't want to have their favorite shows growing up ruined.
Speaker 2: But I mean, that's the that's the hardcore truth about this.
Speaker 2: And the LSD scene and the hippie scene, which again
Speaker 2: we talk about in our movie, was really started by
Speaker 2: the CIA in order to stomp out the anti war movement,
Speaker 2: which then they were like, okay, well this whole thing
Speaker 2: just got completely one hundred percent out of control. How
Speaker 2: do we stop this other monster that we've created? And
Speaker 2: then you get the Sharon taint Manson murders, and that
Speaker 2: really just, you know, quoting Mark Dovlin in the film,
Speaker 2: puts a nail in the coffin of the entire hippie
Speaker 2: scene because after that time it was just completely over.
Speaker 2: So what they did is they just interjected serial killers,
Speaker 2: murders and stuff into the whole scene, so people will
Speaker 2: kind of step back and like, what, well, is this
Speaker 2: really a good thing that I should be a part of,
Speaker 2: And it just completely diminishes it and destroys it, which
Speaker 2: they had created it. So they not only created it,
Speaker 2: then they had to get rid of it and discard
Speaker 2: it after it had basically squashed and destroyed the anti
Speaker 2: war movement, which was really what they were trying to stop.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, one of the things that we see through
Speaker 1: out the film, and I would suggest through multiple Kubrick films,
Speaker 1: is trauma based mind control, right, It's sort of a
Speaker 1: theme you of course, clockwork Orange, of course, I mean
Speaker 1: that's sort of the known scene with his eyes held
Speaker 1: open being forced to watch movies. But I would say
Speaker 1: that eyes wide Shut has trauma based mind control all
Speaker 1: throughout that as well the shining. Of course, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of this. You can be dismissive of things like
Speaker 1: backgrounds that say Monarch and you know, the posters over
Speaker 1: your shoulder that say Monarch. But for those who with
Speaker 1: the eyes to see it, this is coded messaging right
Speaker 1: all throughout that movie about about mind control or or
Speaker 1: experiments with people's minds.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and that was a big reason that we brought
Speaker 2: Kathy O'Brien in because she's an MK ultra mind control
Speaker 2: Monarch mind control survivor, and her congressional testimony was censored
Speaker 2: under national security in nineteen ninety five. And in the
Speaker 2: background whenever Danny sees the twins, whenever they first get
Speaker 2: to the hotel, he's in the games room, and this
Speaker 2: wasn't something that I had seen, So I'm being having
Speaker 2: integrity and honorability here as you're listening the people that
Speaker 2: are listening. But there's a poster in the background. Whenever
Speaker 2: Danny turns around and he grabs the darts off of
Speaker 2: the board, already turns around and he sees the two twins,
Speaker 2: there's a poster in the back left hand corner that
Speaker 2: is of what it looks like somebody like on skis,
Speaker 2: and then below it it says Monarch. Now the difference
Speaker 2: between what we are interpretation of what that poster means
Speaker 2: and what other people's interpretation of that poster means, because
Speaker 2: again I wasn't the first person to see this, but
Speaker 2: the people that have seen it before interpreted it wrong,
Speaker 2: it's my opinion, right. They they interpret it as that
Speaker 2: it's like maybe that the ski The guy on the
Speaker 2: skis isn't really a guy on the skis that it's
Speaker 2: more of like a minotaur looking character or a figure.
Speaker 2: And Kubrick has a lot of minataur type of symbolism
Speaker 2: throughout his movies. We showed that side by side in
Speaker 2: the opening credits of the movie between a clockwork Orange
Speaker 2: and The Shining and how Alex has that you know
Speaker 2: minatar look, But it's throughout all of Kubrick's movies. Is
Speaker 2: in Metal Jacket, is in the Shining, It's it's really everywhere.
Speaker 2: But they related to that, and then some other people
Speaker 2: are like, oh, well, it's he's referencing Monarch Mountain in Colorado.
Speaker 2: But he could have put anything back there. It could
Speaker 2: have been whatever he wanted back there. But he put
Speaker 2: a poster that says Monarch. And immediately as soon as
Speaker 2: I seen it, I was like, this is Monarch MK
Speaker 2: Ultra mind Control, and that is exactly what this entire
Speaker 2: movie is about. That was the first thing that I
Speaker 2: seen that put me down this rabbit hole of finding
Speaker 2: other things throughout The Shining that confirm that the movie's
Speaker 2: really about MK Ultra Monarch mind Control.
Speaker 1: Well, let's talk about Capturing the Rye. Then jahweit because
Speaker 1: because you want to talk about a trigger for mind control,
Speaker 1: I take it out. You know that that's not even
Speaker 1: associated with the Shining in any way, right, that's all
Speaker 1: John Hinckley Junior, that's all. I'm gonna go shoot the
Speaker 1: president or you know what I mean, or John Lennon
Speaker 1: or whatever I forget, which maybe both Mark David Jumpy. Yeah.
Speaker 1: The the idea that that there's a book out there,
Speaker 1: a book that I was required to read in school.
Speaker 1: If I recall, that might be a trigger book that
Speaker 1: sets people off into some sort of like psychotic rage.
Speaker 1: That sounds crazy on the surface, and it sounds like
Speaker 1: it has nothing to do with the Shining. But it's
Speaker 1: in there, isn't it.
Speaker 2: It's in there, and it was in there a year
Speaker 2: before both of the assassinations happened.
Speaker 1: Oh that's right, because that movie came out in nineteen
Speaker 1: eighty yep.
Speaker 2: So when we first see Went into Any and the Shining,
Speaker 2: Windy is reading the book Catcher in the Rye by
Speaker 2: an intelligence officer named J. D. Solinger, and that book
Speaker 2: has been identified by many researchers in this field as
Speaker 2: a MK ultra mind control assassination trigger. Now, there can
Speaker 2: be many triggers for MK ultra style mind control. We
Speaker 2: also show another one within the film of Britney Spears
Speaker 2: where she's talking to Diane Sawyer and Diane utters a
Speaker 2: phrase and Brittany just loses it. She starts crying and
Speaker 2: like going into like seeing like random words, acting like
Speaker 2: she's talking to somebody that isn't even there. And but
Speaker 2: there can be many triggers for these these types of
Speaker 2: MK ultra assassins or just mind control in general. It
Speaker 2: can be callers, it can be a phrase, it can
Speaker 2: be certain em or dream that can trigger these these
Speaker 2: types of mind control victims. But there were two assassinations
Speaker 2: that happened within a year after The Shining was released,
Speaker 2: which was the Mark David Chapman murder of John Lennon
Speaker 2: and the attempted assassination of Ronald Reagan by John Hinckley Junior. Now,
Speaker 2: Mark David Chapman is a really interesting one because I
Speaker 2: actually have a book here that's the one hundred most
Speaker 2: Infamous Criminals, right, and there's a whole chapter on Mark
Speaker 2: David Chapman. So Mark David Chapman basically came out and
Speaker 2: he was he was a really big John Lennon fan,
Speaker 2: and he loved them and everything, and then he he
Speaker 2: decided to basically kill him. And after he had killed him,
Speaker 2: he sat on the sidewalk and waited for police to arrive,
Speaker 2: and he had Catcher in the Rye open, and he
Speaker 2: was reading it when the police showed up. And then
Speaker 2: in court later on when he was being prosecuted for
Speaker 2: the murder, he stood up and said, well, if you
Speaker 2: if you want to know why I did this, then
Speaker 2: all you gotta do is read Catcher in the Rye.
Speaker 2: And at the end of the chapter in this book
Speaker 2: it said that a psychiatrist went to visit Mark David
Speaker 2: Chapman in in uh In prison two years later after
Speaker 2: the assassination, and he was still reading Catcher in the Rye.
Speaker 2: And it's been. It was also identified on the scene
Speaker 2: at the John Hinckley attempted assassination of Ronald Reagan, which
Speaker 2: we showed the footage in our in our documentary as well.
Speaker 2: So yes, it has been that is in the shining
Speaker 2: a year before those assassinations took place. You also have
Speaker 2: the psychic driving aspect of this whole thing with you know,
Speaker 2: because Jack is supposedly reading. I mean, he's a writer.
Speaker 2: In the movie, it's high possibility that it was Jack's
Speaker 2: book that Wendy was reading in their apartment in Boulder,
Speaker 2: and then he's writing his own novel, right supposedly, he
Speaker 2: tells Wendy, and he tells omen in the beginning of
Speaker 2: the film like, I'm a writer and this would be
Speaker 2: perfect amount of time for five months is just what
Speaker 2: I need to finish and write this book, which is
Speaker 2: really interesting because it really wouldn't be five months. It
Speaker 2: would be seven months. It would be the winner time.
Speaker 2: But he says five months, which is another weird con
Speaker 2: new or within the movie. But he's supposedly writing this book.
Speaker 2: He Wendy, uh, you know the first time when he
Speaker 2: tries to come in and see what he's writing. He's like,
Speaker 2: whenever when I'm in this office, you you don't bother me.
Speaker 2: And she was like, oh, well, I just wanted to
Speaker 2: bring you lunch. I'll make you a sandwich then and
Speaker 2: goes on, which is one of another really big continuity
Speaker 2: her is because there's a chair of that's behind Jack
Speaker 2: that is in the first shot, then it disappears in
Speaker 2: the next shot, and then it reappears again in the
Speaker 2: shot after that.
Speaker 1: But what do you make of that? Like, because again
Speaker 1: like he's a he's an attention to detailed type of guy.
Speaker 1: I get it when there's some things like a monarch
Speaker 1: sign that means monarch, but like a chair that's there
Speaker 1: and then gone and then back again. Is there is
Speaker 1: he telling you to pay attention? Or I mean when is?
Speaker 1: I wonder what the trigger with the signal movie?
Speaker 2: And obviously if you you know, please watch the movie.
Speaker 2: Is what I think is going on is that Q
Speaker 2: Break is purposely putting these continuity errors in there to
Speaker 2: have the audience slowly start to try and question their
Speaker 2: reality on a subconscious level as they're watching Jack go
Speaker 2: into his delusions and go and go down the rabbit
Speaker 2: hole of his hallucinations and everything that's going on to him.
Speaker 1: With Okay, so it's a it's a film making technique,
Speaker 1: like the way in Goodfellas when when the walls are
Speaker 1: closing in on Henry and he's he's and they're in
Speaker 1: that restaurant, that diner sort of talking DeNiro's character and
Speaker 1: Henry Hill and and and he's like tightening in, He's
Speaker 1: tightening in, and it feels like the walls are closing
Speaker 1: in on you, is the viewer because you can tell
Speaker 1: that the walls are closing in on the character, right,
Speaker 1: and they sort of create that k So are they
Speaker 1: trying to make the viewer a little bit like questioning reality?
Speaker 1: Like did that was that chair just there? Or like
Speaker 1: am I losing my okay? That's a oh shit okay.
Speaker 2: And it's so subliminal and it's very difficult to notice
Speaker 2: some of the things like there's which is not in
Speaker 2: the film. But like we said that, like I said
Speaker 2: in the beginning, if we just talked about all the
Speaker 2: connuit areas, we could be here for three hours because
Speaker 2: there's so many of them throughout the movie, and the
Speaker 2: movie would I had to have been like four or
Speaker 2: five hours, which is I think this is a perfect
Speaker 2: amount of time. It clocks in at around an hour
Speaker 2: and fifty minutes on Amazon Prime. But another one is
Speaker 2: when Jack is uh, you know, following Windy up the stairs,
Speaker 2: there's a rug that can be seen in front of
Speaker 2: the fireplace that is there in one shot, then when
Speaker 2: it cuts back, it's gone, and then whenever it goes,
Speaker 2: the next scene is back again, so it just disappears
Speaker 2: and reappears. There's several of those throughout the entire movie,
Speaker 2: and it's that's what I believe is going on, because
Speaker 2: there's no way that there's that many continuity errors in
Speaker 2: this movie and that they're not done on purpose. And
Speaker 2: it makes sense to me because the way that we
Speaker 2: you know, what we talk about in the movie as
Speaker 2: to what The Shining is really about, that will that
Speaker 2: should really click with you. But when Windy walks in
Speaker 2: on Jack and he's she discovers that he's not writing
Speaker 2: a book this entire time. He's just writing the same
Speaker 2: sentence over and over again, which is all work and
Speaker 2: no play. Makes Jack adull Boy's the most famous scene
Speaker 2: in The Shining. He becomes triggered once she finds that out,
Speaker 2: and then he starts to do you know, violence against Wendy,
Speaker 2: and then the whole movie takes a completely different turn.
Speaker 2: But what he's writing out over and over again is
Speaker 2: strikingly similar to us. Sir Hans Sirhan wrote out whenever
Speaker 2: he assassinated RFK in sixties sixty eight, I have sixty
Speaker 2: seven or sixty eight somewhere around in their mid sixties.
Speaker 2: It was found that Sir Hans Sirhan had a notebook
Speaker 2: that was that he had just wrote over and over again,
Speaker 2: RFK must die, RFK must die, RFK must die. So
Speaker 2: Jack is doing the same version of his own version
Speaker 2: of psychic driving within the shining, just like Sir Hans
Speaker 2: Sirhan was doing before he assassinated RFK.
Speaker 1: And then we get into room two thirty seven, right,
Speaker 1: and this is a real interesting This has got to
Speaker 1: be code for something else. I mean, I've seen the
Speaker 1: the way that they tie this into explaining the moon
Speaker 1: landing was faked. Right with the Danny's got the the
Speaker 1: Apollo eleven sweater that he wears. We've got two room
Speaker 1: two thirty seven, two hundred and thirty seven thousand miles
Speaker 1: allegedly to the to the moon, these numbers that sort
Speaker 1: of play in there, And I'm and I'm down for that.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm I'm fully prepared to go have him explain
Speaker 1: to me the moon and landing was faked. Encoded language.
Speaker 1: But that isn't where you guys went. You guys took
Speaker 1: this a whole different route. What do we what do
Speaker 1: we make of what Room two thirty seven is? Is it?
Speaker 1: It's got to be code for something else.
Speaker 2: Well, that is the theory that Jay Weiiner basically proposed
Speaker 2: in his first two movies on the topic. He he
Speaker 2: believed that it is that the Shining was Stanley Cuper's
Speaker 2: confession to faking the moon landing. And this theory doesn't
Speaker 2: our theory in a clockwork shining. Shining doesn't negate that theory.
Speaker 2: I think that it's all it's all wrapped up into
Speaker 2: one thing. And mind control is definitely related to the
Speaker 2: moon landing. If it was indeed fake, that would be
Speaker 2: a giant mind control operation on the entire world. So
Speaker 2: the first time that Jack experiences anything strange in the
Speaker 2: movie The Shining is only after he takes that first
Speaker 2: drink of alcohol provided to him by Lloyd the bartender.
Speaker 2: Whndy comes into the Gold Room and is like, hey,
Speaker 2: there's a lady upstairs that assaulted Danny. She's in one
Speaker 2: of the empty rooms upstairs. So Jack goes up there,
Speaker 2: goes into one of the empty rooms, which is there's
Speaker 2: another connuity. Right whenever whenever Windy see whenever Danny sees
Speaker 2: room two thirty seven for the first time, whenever he's
Speaker 2: looking like he wants to go in there, there's a
Speaker 2: door that's right beside of it that's closed, and then
Speaker 2: in the next shot it's open. Weird conuity are there.
Speaker 2: But the first time that Jack experiences anything is after
Speaker 2: he takes that first drink provided to him by Lloyd
Speaker 2: and he goes in the room too thirty seven to
Speaker 2: try and figure out what had happened to Danny. When
Speaker 2: he walks in the room two thirty seven. Room two
Speaker 2: thirty seven is unlike anything else in the hotel. It's different.
Speaker 2: The callers are very vivid throughout the room. The carpeting
Speaker 2: is different. It's got these weird purple and greens. The
Speaker 2: couch is different, the blinds on the windows or the
Speaker 2: curtains are different. The bathroom is completely different than anything
Speaker 2: that we've seen. It's all like greened out. So it's
Speaker 2: a really psychedelic type of feel when you go into
Speaker 2: Room two thirty seven. So what we propose is that
Speaker 2: Lloyd is really an actor. He's set there for the
Speaker 2: experiment at the overlook. All the things that are, you know,
Speaker 2: said to kind of be ghost aren't really ghost. It's
Speaker 2: set up to where they're actually ill human beings and
Speaker 2: they're doing they're LARPing, they're LARPing this entire scenario. I
Speaker 2: don't know if you've seen the movie Shutter Island, but
Speaker 2: it's sort of almost identical to Shutter Island with Leonardo DiCaprio.
Speaker 2: With Shutter Island is a movie where a detective, which
Speaker 2: is Leonardo DiCaprio, goes to this mental asylum to try
Speaker 2: and solve a murder. And spoiler alert for Shutter Island,
Speaker 2: I think it came out in like twenty eleven or
Speaker 2: twelve or something. It's been out for a long time.
Speaker 2: If you haven't seen it, sorry, But at the end
Speaker 2: of the movie, we find out that the entire scenario,
Speaker 2: in the entire investigation has been a setup for Leonardo
Speaker 2: DiCaprio's character within the movie, and he's actually a patient
Speaker 2: at the asylum and they've set up this entire larp
Speaker 2: for him to try and snap him out of his delusions.
Speaker 2: So that's what we propose is actually happening in the
Speaker 2: shining and we have real life evidence of the within
Speaker 2: the movie because it's on numerous occasions the CIA has
Speaker 2: spiked alcoholic drinks with LSD. There's an entire documentary on
Speaker 2: it on Netflix which revolves around Frank Olsen where Sidney
Speaker 2: gottlieb unknowingly spiked Frank Olsen's drink with LSD and Frank
Speaker 2: Olson went out of his mind and jumped out of
Speaker 2: the high up story in a hotel room and died.
Speaker 2: Several examples of that happening in real life. Some of
Speaker 2: the very first army experiments that went on in MK Ultra,
Speaker 2: that same thing happened, like people would you know, go
Speaker 2: out of their minds. And it was this drug called
Speaker 2: b Z and bz's one hundred times more powerful than LSD,
Speaker 2: and the army personnel wasn't told what you know, they
Speaker 2: were going to be experimented on that, just that it
Speaker 2: was going to be a chemical agent. And then they
Speaker 2: would go in there and they would inhale all this
Speaker 2: smoke which was really this high powered hallucinogenic drug, which
Speaker 2: we also talk about in the movie that it's been
Speaker 2: reported that the CIA would literally just spray LSD aerosol
Speaker 2: on entire groups of unsuspecting people. The people would, you know, then,
Speaker 2: you know, lose their mind, because it's one thing, Charlie
Speaker 2: to take a hallucinogenic drug and know that you're taking
Speaker 2: a hallucinogenic drug, like you're going to expect the change.
Speaker 2: You're going to know the change. You're going to expect
Speaker 2: that feeling to come. But when you don't know, when
Speaker 2: you're unknowingly dosed with LSD, that is a different story.
Speaker 2: You're going to think that you're losing your mind. And
Speaker 2: that's what we propose happens. Lloyd's spikes Jack's drink with
Speaker 2: some sort of hallucinogenic He goes into the room and
Speaker 2: hallose Neate's the lady that's in room two thirty seven.
Speaker 2: And the evidence for that is that whenever he goes in,
Speaker 2: whenever he leaves room two thirty seven, he gets freaked
Speaker 2: out by the attractive woman turning into an elderly lady,
Speaker 2: which is very vindicative of a hallucinogenic trip. He then
Speaker 2: goes into the apartment where Windy is and then Wendy
Speaker 2: comes to the door and asks him if he had
Speaker 2: found anything, and he said, no, I didn't see anything.
Speaker 2: So why would he not say anything? He didn't see
Speaker 2: anything if he thought that it was he wouldn't say
Speaker 2: anything if he thought that it was a hallucination, Right,
Speaker 2: what you said.
Speaker 1: The drug, the hallucinogenic drug is called Beezy, Yes Bezy.
Speaker 2: It's like a short name for a longer version of
Speaker 2: it than I can't pronounce. It's like beIN Benz above,
Speaker 2: something that's really long name.
Speaker 1: So I just was curious because in the spars pandemic
Speaker 1: document that that they role played COVID, the COVID rollout,
Speaker 1: the fictional rapper in that who gets everybody to take
Speaker 1: the vaccine, his name is Bezy. So I was wondering
Speaker 1: if there's any sort of connection right there. It's like
Speaker 1: maybe they're giving us a little subtle hint that there's
Speaker 1: a mind control component going on to COVID. Maybe I'm
Speaker 1: reading something into that where there's nothing. Maybe it's just
Speaker 1: a coincidence, right, But I don't know.
Speaker 2: I wonder because that was the main drug that was
Speaker 2: you know, tested on. They would do open air field
Speaker 2: testing as well, like they would just have like simulation testing,
Speaker 2: like they would simulate a battle scenario. They would have
Speaker 2: gallons and gallons of Beezy just dispersed in a mist
Speaker 2: out on the battlefield and all of these soldiers would
Speaker 2: be hit with this hallucinogenic drug. They wouldn't be able
Speaker 2: to operate, they would be falling over. People would have
Speaker 2: to help them, and then they would take them back
Speaker 2: to the facility that the army owns and asked them
Speaker 2: all these questions about what they're feeling, and the effects
Speaker 2: of this drug lasted for weeks. This wasn't just something
Speaker 2: that like with a normal LSD trip where they can
Speaker 2: last for a maximum of like some people like a
Speaker 2: day or maybe twelve hours or something like that, and
Speaker 2: even lower like six hours with psilocybin and things like that. No,
Speaker 2: this lasted for long periods of time, long stretches of time.
Speaker 1: This reminds me of Jacob's Ladder, the movie where where
Speaker 1: the characters are experimenting on when they're in Vietnam. They're
Speaker 1: in the They're like, what then they can't remember what
Speaker 1: happened that night when they were they were they were
Speaker 1: sprayed with something by the military, and they all went
Speaker 1: crazy and started killing each other, and and and they
Speaker 1: were taking him into the experimental hospitals as well. I'm
Speaker 1: sure that there's and by the way, I think Jacob's
Speaker 1: Ladder is one of the scariest movies I've ever watched
Speaker 1: in my life. Easily one of the most terrifying movies,
Speaker 1: in part because you get the feeling that it could
Speaker 1: be real. You know that that that that they're not
Speaker 1: too far that it's fictional in a sense that maybe
Speaker 1: the dialogue is made up, but not the theme that
Speaker 1: the military would experiment on people to see if they
Speaker 1: can turn their soldiers into you know, perfect super soldiers
Speaker 1: that are just filled with rage and will murder anybody
Speaker 1: in there in their path. Right, if they could perfect
Speaker 1: that and get the soldiers to do it, then you know,
Speaker 1: then they'll have the ultimate warriors that they can send
Speaker 1: into battle and with mind control and hallucinogenic drugs. But
Speaker 1: of course in the movie it goes totally wrong, and
Speaker 1: these guys all have real long term psychological damage as
Speaker 1: a result of that, and you know, I just can't
Speaker 1: help roll.
Speaker 2: There's several examples of like Jock Ruby was visited by
Speaker 2: uh Jolly West in prison, and it's theorized the Jolly
Speaker 2: West gave him some kind of LSD that made him
Speaker 2: go out of his mind, because then he started talking
Speaker 2: about fairies and like all kinds of crazy shit after
Speaker 2: he'd assassinated and killed Lee Harvey Oswald. You know, there's
Speaker 2: so many and that's a standard thing with like Kubrick
Speaker 2: as well, Like there's so many things that real life
Speaker 2: imitates through Kubrick's work, and one of those is A
Speaker 2: Clockwork Orange, which in the UK and some other countries
Speaker 2: after the film was released, real life crime started to
Speaker 2: pick up after the movie had come out and people
Speaker 2: went to see the movie, so that one was not
Speaker 2: only like a mind control a movie about mind control
Speaker 2: by feeding someone hallucinogenic drugs and forcing them to watch
Speaker 2: movies to influence them to create a certain behavior, it
Speaker 2: was also having an effect on real life. It got
Speaker 2: so bad that Kubrick had to pull it from several
Speaker 2: countries and not show it anymore. He banned it, and
Speaker 2: I think that the government of some other countries actually
Speaker 2: banned it on their own, but Kubrick pulled it from
Speaker 2: quite a few different countries after its release. And then
Speaker 2: you get into Lolita as well, which we talk about
Speaker 2: in the movie at Clockwork Shining, which is another real
Speaker 2: life example of reality mimicking film and movies, which is
Speaker 2: Sue Lyon, which Lolita is about pedophilia, basically a grown
Speaker 2: man having sex with an underage girl that is thirteen,
Speaker 2: and Sue Lyon, which is in the movie and is
Speaker 2: playing that role and playing that character, is having that
Speaker 2: exact same thing happened to her in real life as
Speaker 2: she's making the movie with one of Kubrick's producers, and
Speaker 2: then you look at the Shining and the things that
Speaker 2: are happening there. The same thing that happened to Sue
Speaker 2: Lyon whenever he was making Lolita is almost identical to
Speaker 2: what happened to Shelley Duvall within the making of The
Speaker 2: Shining Later Insane.
Speaker 1: He kept he kept tormenting her and making her redo
Speaker 1: takes over and over again, and cutting her off and
Speaker 1: pretending like she didn't exist. He was gaslighting her like crazy.
Speaker 1: And his excuse, I guess in the aftermath of that,
Speaker 1: was that he was trying to get her into that
Speaker 1: character that's just completely on edge, and I guess it worked.
Speaker 1: But she was never the same after that. Was she
Speaker 1: she was psychologically traumatized by him during the making of
Speaker 1: this movie. So in some respects, real life is mimicking
Speaker 1: the art, right.
Speaker 2: That's right, instead of you know, artmicking real life in
Speaker 2: this case of uh, you know Stanley Kubrick, it's uh,
Speaker 2: it's the opposite. And with Shelley Duvall, we show it
Speaker 2: in the movie where you know Kubrick is basically just
Speaker 2: beraiding her and telling her that she's you know, worthless,
Speaker 2: and that she's uh, you know that it doesn't that
Speaker 2: she's what. The thing is that I don't think that
Speaker 2: Kubrick thought that she was a really good actor, which
Speaker 2: I believe the excuse is that she was trying to
Speaker 2: He was trying to, you know, invoke this performance out
Speaker 2: of her that nobody else was really getting, but it
Speaker 2: really didn't. It just traumatized her to the degree that
Speaker 2: she couldn't really even like go there. And he would
Speaker 2: tell the people on the set like, don't empathize with
Speaker 2: Shelley Duvall, don't don't tend to her, don't listen to her.
Speaker 2: There was a point that in the docum Memory by
Speaker 2: Vivian Kubrick on the making of The Shining, Shelley Duval
Speaker 2: says to Stanley Kubrick that her hair is falling out,
Speaker 2: and we have a clip it's one of my favorite
Speaker 2: parts of our movie at Clockwork Shining, where you know,
Speaker 2: Jay Widener is talking about how Stanley Kubrick thought that
Speaker 2: Stephen King's novel was coming up short, so he went
Speaker 2: in there and started changing things and making it his
Speaker 2: own story. And when Jay says that it's coming up short.
Speaker 2: I have a clip of Stanley Kubrick having one of
Speaker 2: these little baby hairs from Shelley Duval and he's putting
Speaker 2: it up into the camera like that. It's just as
Speaker 2: a filmmaker. Is something really symbolic that's within our film
Speaker 2: as well. But yeah, he was not treating Shelley Duvall.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 2: I believe that it was over a hundred takes that
Speaker 2: Jack and Wendy had to do of the staircase scene,
Speaker 2: and Shelley Duvall was really traumatized by that and she
Speaker 2: did not have a very well life after that. She
Speaker 2: didn't act in anything same way with Sue Lions. Sue
Speaker 2: Lyon's life was just completely destroyed after her experiences on
Speaker 2: the side of Lolita and Shelley Devau didn't. I think
Speaker 2: she did a few things after that, but nothing. You know,
Speaker 2: that's actually really big. And that's another thing about Cubrick
Speaker 2: is he either breaks the person like completely and like
Speaker 2: ruins their career, like ruins them like psychologically, or he
Speaker 2: like turns them into like a freaking superstar. So it's
Speaker 2: so strange, it's so weird, but it's either one or
Speaker 2: the other with Kubrick.
Speaker 1: He did a great job of you guys also did
Speaker 1: a great job of of mentioning like what that isolation
Speaker 1: and cabin fever really does to somebody's mind. I mean,
Speaker 1: we've read the studies of solitary confinement for prisoners being
Speaker 1: extremely detrimental to their mental health, that people that have
Speaker 1: been in there for long periods of time tend to
Speaker 1: disassociate and whatnot, and and they mentioned it. It's so
Speaker 1: it's sort of the theme of it. You're going to
Speaker 1: go to this hotel that's way up on a mountain,
Speaker 1: far away from everybody, You're going to be snowed in.
Speaker 1: You're basically not going to see people for for months
Speaker 1: at a time, right, and what that does to people Obviously,
Speaker 1: if we want to talk about that, you know, the
Speaker 1: Kubrick's connections to the to the space program, they had
Speaker 1: always talked about when you know, the astronauts are going
Speaker 1: to lose their mind out there in space with with
Speaker 1: all this time to do nothing, think about everything, and
Speaker 1: do nothing that what did you guys make of that,
Speaker 1: the role of isolation in creating just mental chaos for
Speaker 1: these characters.
Speaker 2: Well, there's another point that we bring up in the
Speaker 2: movie that there's a there's a book called the coup
Speaker 2: Bark counter Intelligence Manual which I have, which kup bark
Speaker 2: sounds a lot like Q break, right, But the whole
Speaker 2: thing was designed for sensory deprivation. Like they would put
Speaker 2: you know, blindfolds on their victims, like the subjects. They
Speaker 2: would put these like cardboard things so that they couldn't
Speaker 2: be touched, so that they couldn't feel any kind of
Speaker 2: you know, stimulation anywhere on their body. So isolation is
Speaker 2: a really big technique to be used in. Another really
Speaker 2: strange coincidence is there's another documentary on Netflix. It's called Cults,
Speaker 2: cons and Kidnapping and it's about the uh, the troubled
Speaker 2: teen industry. It's a really good documentary. But watch watch
Speaker 2: my documentary first before you watch that one. Okay. Netflix
Speaker 2: is already super big and huge. Okay, you can you
Speaker 2: can spare three dollar dollars rented or ten dollars to
Speaker 2: buy my documentary. And we're independent filmmakers. Netflix is a
Speaker 2: huge corporation, so please watch our documentary. But in that
Speaker 2: cons Cults and Kidnapping documentary on Netflix, the girls that
Speaker 2: were a part of this troubled teen industry is basically
Speaker 2: talking about mind control and how they were basically mind controlled,
Speaker 2: and they said that every morning the theme song to
Speaker 2: two thousand and one A Space Odyssey would play throughout
Speaker 2: the entire facility. They would be forced to listen to
Speaker 2: the opening theme song of two thousand and one A
Speaker 2: Space Odyssey every single day. Which is another really interesting
Speaker 2: aspect of this whole thing too, is like when it
Speaker 2: comes to the moon landing and stuff, because two thousand
Speaker 2: and one of Space Odyssey was being filmed during the
Speaker 2: exact time that we supposedly went to the Moon, So
Speaker 2: it's you know, plausible that if Stanley Kubrick did indeed
Speaker 2: fake the moon landing and the footages you know of
Speaker 2: Stanley Kubrick, then that would be the way that you
Speaker 2: would do it. You would film the moon landing under
Speaker 2: the guise of actually filming a movie. Because two thousand
Speaker 2: and one Space Odyssey was had brand new effects in it.
Speaker 2: It was front screen projection, it was things that had
Speaker 2: never been seen before. So the easiest way to do
Speaker 2: it and not have all these people involved, because that's
Speaker 2: one of the you know, grievances of people not believing
Speaker 2: that the moon landing footage was faked? Is that they say, Well,
Speaker 2: so many hundreds and thousands of people would have had
Speaker 2: to have been in on it. No, they wouldn't have.
Speaker 2: All Kubrick would have had to have done has been
Speaker 2: like had his actors out there, and he filmed this
Speaker 2: scene that the actors thought, and the production crew and
Speaker 2: everyone thought was a part of two thousand and one
Speaker 2: of Space Odyssey, when it really wasn't. It was going
Speaker 2: to be used for the moon landing. And then they
Speaker 2: broadcast that pre recorded footage to everyone's TV and present
Speaker 2: it as live on the mount Yeah.
Speaker 1: I wonder if they filmed anything at Lookout Mountain.
Speaker 2: High possibility.
Speaker 1: I mean, as it is a military film production studio, right,
Speaker 1: it'd be a good place to do it. You'd have security,
Speaker 1: you'd have technology if you're shooting fake Adam Baum explosions
Speaker 1: in that studio showing what that would look like, you
Speaker 1: could most definitely shoot some front screen projection, maybe filmed
Speaker 1: in a Hollywood basement. As the Chili Peppers said.
Speaker 2: Right now, Chili Peppers, do you love that song Californication?
Speaker 1: Well, we'll we'll leave the audience wanting a little bit more.
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what if you guys want to go
Speaker 1: and get into we didn't even talk about those. But
Speaker 1: if the people that want to go and dig into
Speaker 1: the free Masonic components of this movie as well, go
Speaker 1: get crazy over there on Amazon Prime and take a
Speaker 1: look at this I watched it last night. It's great.
Speaker 1: I texted you right after. I was like, I've watched it,
Speaker 1: let's talk. We need to talk immediately. Well, it's fresh
Speaker 1: in my mind. I highly recommend this movie. It will
Speaker 1: really mess with you in a good way. What's the
Speaker 1: best place for people to get it and to support
Speaker 1: you in your outstanding work that continues to grow movie
Speaker 1: after movie.
Speaker 2: They can purchase the movie on Amazon Prime. If you're
Speaker 2: in the UK or in the United States, you can
Speaker 2: watch it on Amazon Prime. If you're in a different country,
Speaker 2: unfortunately it is not available yet, but if the country
Speaker 2: of your origin has Apple TV Plus, you can also
Speaker 2: get it on Apple tv Plus. And we will be
Speaker 2: making it available to everyone worldwide in a few months
Speaker 2: as well. So please go out there and and support
Speaker 2: independent filmmaking. You know, Hollywood is dead. They're just retreading
Speaker 2: the same garbage over and over and over again. They're
Speaker 2: making remake after remake the TV industry is about to
Speaker 2: be compromised as well, because it's just nothing but recognizable IP.
Speaker 2: The Office is being remade on two different streaming platforms.
Speaker 2: Amazon just did a remake of the Office, and The
Speaker 2: Peacocks doing a remake of the Office. There's there's just
Speaker 2: so many no one really has original ideas anymore, and
Speaker 2: this is one and original idea. And even if you
Speaker 2: don't like Queebreak, or if you don't like The Shining,
Speaker 2: or if you haven't seen The Shining, you're still going
Speaker 2: to find something within this movie that is going to
Speaker 2: be shocking to you. In this put a lot of
Speaker 2: things in perspective, because it's not only about Stanley Kubrick
Speaker 2: in The Shining and The Clockwork Orange, but it's also
Speaker 2: about the music industry, it's about the film industry in general.
Speaker 2: We didn't even get into talking about all the influence
Speaker 2: between the military and these intelligence communities in filmmaking. We
Speaker 2: show several documents in our movie at Clockwork Shining that
Speaker 2: were sent through four your Request that shows the military
Speaker 2: and the intelligence communities direct involvement in a lot of
Speaker 2: these film productions. And in the credits, the original credits
Speaker 2: for two thousand and one of Space Odyssey, Kubrick thinks
Speaker 2: all every single one of the intelligence communities.
Speaker 1: Air force.
Speaker 2: Contractors, like everyone all the military agencies are thinked in
Speaker 2: their original credits, and then later on I one Believe
Speaker 2: because it's not in the credits anymore, it was cut
Speaker 2: out that somebody from one of these intelligence communities saw
Speaker 2: that he had had all of these thinks and special
Speaker 2: recognitions in the end of his movie, and they were like,
Speaker 2: what are you doing, bro, You can't be having you
Speaker 2: can't be thinking air Force intelligence and like all of
Speaker 2: these different intelligence communities and military and at the end
Speaker 2: of your movie. So they made him take it out.
Speaker 2: And also in you know, Doctor Strangelove, there was several
Speaker 2: things that you know, Kubrick was afraid that he was
Speaker 2: going to be investigated for getting almost identically to what
Speaker 2: a B two bomber, the inside of a B two
Speaker 2: bomber looks like, and we had to we have the
Speaker 2: interview of Kubrick's production designer. They're talking about that, and
Speaker 2: the kubric caught him up and was like, hey, you
Speaker 2: need to find you know, make sure you got all
Speaker 2: all of your references and everything all in line, or
Speaker 2: we're going to be investigated by the FBI. They think
Speaker 2: that we got leaked some kind of classified information. So
Speaker 2: there's so much in this movie, and I really hope
Speaker 2: people check it out, and if you watch it and
Speaker 2: you like it, please leave a rating and a review
Speaker 2: on Amazon Prime. That really helps out as well. But
Speaker 2: thanks so much for having me on, Charlie. Really appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Brother, Well, we appreciate you coming back on to talk
Speaker 1: about this because we're into it and we're fans of
Speaker 1: supporting independent filmmaking. It's Hollywood's dead, like you said, they have.
Speaker 1: Nobody blamed it themselves. They went, well, they're going broke
Speaker 1: Disney's pedophile farm. But there's a lot of people out
Speaker 1: there that are actually doing interesting work and this film
Speaker 1: is fantastic. I highly recommend a Clockwork Shining. Go to
Speaker 1: Amazon Prime and check it out, or Apple TV and
Speaker 1: get it. That's right early. If you want to connect
Speaker 1: with me, you can do so through the website Macroaggressions
Speaker 1: dot Io. Thanks everybody talked against som